Re: CF Hotfix

[Judah McAuley]

The Adobe site lists end of "core support" for CF 8 as being 7/31/2012 (5
years from date of release). They also list a date for ending "extended
support" as being 7/31/2014, so perhaps they are providing security patches
still. I just remember CF 8 no longer being "officially supported", so I
wouldn't take a lack of patch availability as being an indication that it
is not vulnerable.

http://www.adobe.com/support/products/enterprise/eol/eol_matrix.html#63

Cheers,
Judah


On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 11:13 AM, John M Bliss  wrote:

>
> Adobe released a CF8 update on (approx) 9/12/2012. They stopped supporting
> it since then?
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 1:06 PM, Judah McAuley 
> wrote:
>
> >
> > Adobe no longer supports CF 8, so I don't believe that they would
> certify a
> > security fix for it.
> >
> > For info on which versions of which products Adobe supports, see:
> > http://www.adobe.com/support/programs/policies/supported.html
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Judah
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 10:58 AM, John M Bliss 
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > I thought issue affected ACF8 also? Not true?
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Steve 'Cutter' Blades <
> > > cold.fus...@cutterscrossing.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Ben Forta just pushed this:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> http://helpx.adobe.com/coldfusion/kb/coldfusion-security-hotfix-apsb13-03.html
> > > >
> > > > This addresses the recent security issues.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Steve 'Cutter' Blades
> > > > Adobe Community Professional
> > > > Adobe Certified Expert
> > > > Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
> > > > 
> > > > http://cutterscrossing.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Co-Author "Learning Ext JS 3.2" Packt Publishing 2010
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js-3-2-for-building-dynamic-desktop-style-user-interfaces/book
> > > >
> > > > "The best way to predict the future is to help create it"
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:353886
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CF Hotfix

[Judah McAuley]

Adobe no longer supports CF 8, so I don't believe that they would certify a
security fix for it.

For info on which versions of which products Adobe supports, see:
http://www.adobe.com/support/programs/policies/supported.html

Cheers,
Judah


On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 10:58 AM, John M Bliss  wrote:

>
> I thought issue affected ACF8 also? Not true?
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 12:56 PM, Steve 'Cutter' Blades <
> cold.fus...@cutterscrossing.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Ben Forta just pushed this:
> >
> >
> >
> http://helpx.adobe.com/coldfusion/kb/coldfusion-security-hotfix-apsb13-03.html
> >
> > This addresses the recent security issues.
> >
> > --
> > Steve 'Cutter' Blades
> > Adobe Community Professional
> > Adobe Certified Expert
> > Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
> > 
> > http://cutterscrossing.com
> >
> >
> > Co-Author "Learning Ext JS 3.2" Packt Publishing 2010
> >
> >
> https://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js-3-2-for-building-dynamic-desktop-style-user-interfaces/book
> >
> > "The best way to predict the future is to help create it"
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:353884
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Question about using AJAX with Authorize.net

[Judah McAuley]

Ah, gotcha. The key there is definitely the "merchant defined" fields.
They do not want you to send them personally defined information that
they then post back to you (the x_ fields that you mentioned).

I think you are on target with your ajax option. The other option is
to post back to your server, capture the response in memory (just the
Form collection), do a cfhttp post to Auth.net to do the transaction
with the subset of information they need and then redirect to the
receipt page (if successful) or back to the submission page if the
transaction errors. This is what I've done in the past and it allows
you to do the server side validation and any custom processing.

The downside to this method is that it carries a higher PCI compliance
because the CC details are transmitted to your server even if they are
never stored anywhere other than memory. If you use Ajax calls
directly from the client-side form, you can avoid some of the PCI
compliance stuff because the information never hits your server.
However, you would have to include the transaction key and password in
your client-side form at that point which makes that information
publicly available. Off the top of my head, the only thing I can think
of that that would do is make it so that other people could charge
credit cards and give you money from them but there may be other
attack vectors that aren't obvious to me right away. If you bypassed
client-side validation, maybe you could charge a negative number and
refund money to the card? Probably not, but it would warrant
investigation at the very least. I would also think that the fact that
the client side would be doing the HTTP call would mean that you could
set up a Hosts file entry for the Auth.net gateway and provide a reply
on the client side that said it was successful and then your page
would submit back to you assuming that the call was successful and
therefore allow them to fake a transaction. I don't know if that is
important in your situation or not, but fundamentally, I do no trust
validation that is only performed on a machine I do not control.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 2:25 PM, Rick Faircloth
 wrote:
>
> Thanks, everyone, for the comments...
>
> Judah, I'm using the Advanced Integration Method (AIM),
> since I'm hosting my own form.
>
> Here's what I'm referring to in the Authorize.net info
> about personally identifying information:
>
> From the Advanced Integration Method docs:
>
> --
>
> Merchant-defined data fields are not intended to and must not be used
> to capture personally identifying information. Accordingly, the merchant
> is prohibited from capturing, obtaining, and/or transmitting any
> personally identifying information in or by means of the merchant-defined
> data fields. Personally identifying information includes, but is not limited
> to,
> name, address, credit card number, social security number, driver's license
> number,
> state-issued identification number, passport number, and card verification
> numbers
> (CVV, CVC2, CVV2, CID, CVN). If Authorize.Net discovers that the merchant is
> capturing and/or transmitting personally identifying information by means of
> the merchant-defined data fields, whether or not intentionally, CyberSource
> will immediately suspend the merchant's account, which will result in a
> rejection
> of any and all transaction requests submitted by the merchant after the
> point of suspension.
>
> --
>
> That seems clear to me, that in the AIM method, I can't use the
> "merchant-defined"
> x_ fields to capture any of the info mentioned above.
>
> My plan was just to send to them what they require for the processing and
> use
> the other fields from the form for the in-house emailing, thank-you's, "in
> honor of",
> "in memory of", etc., data.  I don't think that kind of data can go through
> Authorize.net's server and back to me.
>
> Rick
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Judah McAuley [mailto:ju...@wiredotter.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 3:31 PM
> To: cf-talk
> Subject: Re: Question about using AJAX with Authorize.net
>
>
> You have to send Auth.net personally identifying information in order
> to use AVS (the address verification service), so I know they don't
> forbid that. Maybe it depends on the integration method you are using.
> Are you doing the simple integration method where you send the user to
> auth.net and then they come back or are you using a behind the scenes
> post to their api to do the auth?
>
> Judah
>
> On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 10:40 AM, Rick Fairc

Re: Question about using AJAX with Authorize.net

[Judah McAuley]

You have to send Auth.net personally identifying information in order
to use AVS (the address verification service), so I know they don't
forbid that. Maybe it depends on the integration method you are using.
Are you doing the simple integration method where you send the user to
auth.net and then they come back or are you using a behind the scenes
post to their api to do the auth?

Judah

On Tue, Sep 18, 2012 at 10:40 AM, Rick Faircloth
 wrote:
>
> I'm implementing my first donation form using Authorize.net.
>
> I've found in their fine-print that I cannot submit any personally
> identifiable information to their servers.
>
> We have a form which includes personally identifiable information
> for emailing thank-you's, etc.
>
> Therefore, I'm planning to implement an AJAX solution to
> intercept the formfield data that is applicable to the transaction
> and is required by Authorize.net and submit that via AJAX to a method
> in a cfc, which will send the pertinent data to Authorize.net.
>
> In the success section of the AJAX solution to Authorize.net, I'll
> implement a further submission of the rest of the form data (the
> personally identifiable information) to another method in a cfc,
> which will process that data for in-house (non-Authorize.net) use.
> (Or something similar to this process...)
>
> Any warnings, cautions, or gotcha's in this approach?
>
> Thanks for any feedback!
>
> Rick
>
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:352662
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: if logging is turned off? how do i

[Judah McAuley]

I've not done it before, myself. I'd probably just use CreateObject
and instantiate log4j and then start with the log4j docs. I believe
the class you'd be most likely to use is
org.apache.log4j.DailyRollingFileAppender

It also just occurred to me that you could use LogBox. It is part of
the ColdBox framework but is also a standalone application that you
could easily integrate. If you go that route, you've got a native CF
solution and it also supports a huge number of logging options, like
logging to email, to db, to file, to twitter, based on pattern
matching, based on severity, etc.

http://wiki.coldbox.org/wiki/LogBox.cfm

Download and api docs are available about 2/3rds of the way down this
page: http://www.coldbox.org/download

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Sep 14, 2012 at 8:35 AM, morchella
 wrote:
>
> are there any articles you could recomend.
> my solution works but that sounds pretty slick.
> i am googling "log4j ColdFusion"
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:352619
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: if logging is turned off? how do i

[Judah McAuley]

If you feel like getting fancy, you should be able to invoke the log4j
package that comes with CF and then config it to write out to where
you want.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 12:29 PM, morchella
 wrote:
>
> Thanks Dave.
> I dont have access to log dit.
> i just did a little cffile and apended data i needed to a new line.
> simple. would have rather used the mailsent.log format.
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 1:55 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>>
>>> is there a way that if logging is truned of for a cf site to recreate
>>> say, mailsent.log just through cfm in say, an include in
>>> application.cfm?
>>> dosnt need to be fancy.
>>> just would like the same info for an application. but the place it is
>>> sitting has logs disapbled,.
>>>
>>> "Severity","ThreadID","Date","Time","Application","Message"
>>
>> You can use the CFLOG tag.
>>
>> Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
>> http://www.figleaf.com/
>> http://training.figleaf.com/
>>
>> Fig Leaf Software is a Veteran-Owned Small Business (VOSB) on
>> GSA Schedule, and provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
>> instruction at our training centers, online, or onsite.
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:352598
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: automated screen capture of web pages

[Judah McAuley]

Selenium supports that functionality.

http://seleniumhq.org/docs/04_webdriver_advanced.html#taking-a-screenshot

There is also a CF wrapper for Selenium called cfselenium but I have
not used it yet, so I'm not sure if it support Webdriver and
screenshots. It looks like it may only support Selenium-RC at this
point. https://github.com/bobsilverberg/CFSelenium

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 12:50 PM, Dave Jemison  wrote:
>
> A recent project involves removing over a thousand folders from a site and 
> archiving them. There is also a requirement to create an image of each 
> archived page.
>
> Rather than manually going to each page (e.g., archived.example.com/folder1/ 
> and manually take a screenshot then save it), I am hoping to find something 
> more automated.
>
> My boss suggested snagit, but I don't see how to create an automated process 
> like this with it.
>
> I suppose an option may be to loop through the folder and do a cfhttp request 
> and use cfdocument to make a .pdf file of each page?
>
> Other suggestions?
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:352558
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CF DDos update released

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Sep 11, 2012 at 7:48 PM,  <> wrote:
>
>  >>i already read tha adobe bulletin, it doesn't really say much.
>
> I doubt you will ever see details and description about any possible attack.
> It would be too easy for those looking for ideas...

Publication of details of an attack are pretty common. Good guys will
typically find an attack, alert the people who are in a position to
fix the product(s), wait for them to confirm it and start on a fix and
then publish the details of the attack after the vulnerability patch
has been released. The reason for this is so other researchers (and
people wanting to protect their own systems) have an idea of the types
of issues that a product has been vulnerable to so they can poke
around the edges and see if there are similar issues that may have
been missed, thereby strengthening the overall security of the
product.  So, yes, the details are for people looking for ideas but
that includes all the good people as well as the bad guys (tm).
Security through obscurity isn't really security at all.

cheers,
Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:352519
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Re[2]: cfscript zip example?

[Judah McAuley]

CF11: Code name Magic Pony!

On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 11:35 AM, Raymond Camden
 wrote:
>
> Errr, yes, so sorry we couldn't do _everything_ people wanted in CF10.
> CF11 will have every feature requested. Ever.
>
> (Yes, I'm being sarcastic.)
>
> On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Matt Quackenbush  
> wrote:
>>
>> It's called Railo. :D
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 25, 2012 at 12:52 PM, Michael David 
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Seriously!
>>>
>>> I sure wish that Adobe would provide a cfscript solution for every
>>> cftag, for those of us who prefer the former.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Cheers!
>>> Michael David
>>>
>>>
>>> -- Original Message --
>>> From: "Andrew Scott" 
>>> To: "cf-talk" 
>>> Sent: 6/25/2012 11:05:08 AM
>>> Subject: Re: cfscript zip example?
>>> >Hmmm, for some reason I thought there had been some functions for zip...
>>> Oh
>>> >well, more tags not converted to script that adobe think we don't use :-(
>>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351700
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: SOT...who do I direct suggestions to the LiveDocs?

[Judah McAuley]

On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 12:59 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> You can add comments to the lovesick themselves.

But the lovesick still won't pay any attention to you.

Damn emo kids. Get off my lawn!

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351658
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: detecting mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

Out of curiosity, how are you accounting for desktops with touch interfaces?

cheers,
Judah

On Sun, Jun 10, 2012 at 5:25 PM, .jonah  wrote:
>
> All the projects I'm working on now are "responsive" e.g. using flexible
> layouts and media queries.
>
> However, there are always going to be certain elements or features that
> you can't just reflow and have be an optimal experience for both mobile
> and desktop. (e.g. touch and mouse/keyboard) so, being able to know what
> kind of device you're serving to allows you to optimize things further
> by serving up the appropriate stuff.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351530
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: intermittant problems

[Judah McAuley]

That can be a tricky one. We had a problem with that recently where
some customers were complaining that they would take an action on the
site and then get "logged out". Turns out that there were some http
calls to cdns for jquery on an otherwise https site. On certain
configurations of IE it would trigger mixed content warnings that
would show a little button down at the bottom of the page that they
didn't notice while the main page would be showing our non-logged in
content because it was stopped by the browser mid-redirect. D'oh.

Judah

On Fri, Jun 8, 2012 at 5:19 AM, Scott Stewart  wrote:
>
> We fixed it, there was a point in one of the YUI calls where it was
> calling a fully qualified URL that was an "http" instead of an "https".
> On 6/7/2012 2:07 PM, Judah McAuley wrote:
>> Have you tried firebug to see what is failing in the JS? I'm presuming
>> an ajax call. And have you tried doing a traceroute from that machine
>> to see if there is a problem upstream from your server?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Judah
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 10:42 AM, Scott Stewart
>>  wrote:
>>> Here's a weird one,
>>> One of our client sites works fine on every computer in our office (and
>>> no these arent terribly fast machines), and for most of the users that
>>> access it.
>>> However, certain users (we havent been able to establish a pattern yet)
>>> are having issues trying to save data. We've made no changes to the
>>> code, but we have done a couple of database restores in the past few days.
>>>
>>> We've managed to reproduce the problem by remoting into one of our
>>> webservers (we have multiple providers) and running the process. The
>>> only failure I can find is a javascript failure, there's a crapload of
>>> bulky YUI code in here.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351511
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: intermittant problems

[Judah McAuley]

You should be able to see what O is by running Firebug in a spot where
the request is successful. 100ms isn't really that slow. Is it
dropping packets at all? And what is the HTTP Response code of the
ajax call? A 504 timeout? 503 Not Available? If you can correlate the
connection response in Firebug with the the connection in the web
server logs, you might be able to come up with a reason why.

Judah

On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 11:40 AM, Scott Stewart
 wrote:
>
> Yeah, we've looked through firebug and it says O is not defined (I
> didn't write this).
> I can only assume that O contains a recordset...
>
> The traceroute times look pretty slow once it gets into the provider's
> network (84 - 100ms vs. 6 - 10ms)
>
> We've got a call into our provider to see if there's anything that
> they're willing to tell us.
> On 6/7/2012 2:07 PM, Judah McAuley wrote:
>> Have you tried firebug to see what is failing in the JS? I'm presuming
>> an ajax call. And have you tried doing a traceroute from that machine
>> to see if there is a problem upstream from your server?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Judah
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 10:42 AM, Scott Stewart
>>  wrote:
>>> Here's a weird one,
>>> One of our client sites works fine on every computer in our office (and
>>> no these arent terribly fast machines), and for most of the users that
>>> access it.
>>> However, certain users (we havent been able to establish a pattern yet)
>>> are having issues trying to save data. We've made no changes to the
>>> code, but we have done a couple of database restores in the past few days.
>>>
>>> We've managed to reproduce the problem by remoting into one of our
>>> webservers (we have multiple providers) and running the process. The
>>> only failure I can find is a javascript failure, there's a crapload of
>>> bulky YUI code in here.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351493
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: intermittant problems

[Judah McAuley]

Have you tried firebug to see what is failing in the JS? I'm presuming
an ajax call. And have you tried doing a traceroute from that machine
to see if there is a problem upstream from your server?

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 10:42 AM, Scott Stewart
 wrote:
>
> Here's a weird one,
> One of our client sites works fine on every computer in our office (and
> no these arent terribly fast machines), and for most of the users that
> access it.
> However, certain users (we havent been able to establish a pattern yet)
> are having issues trying to save data. We've made no changes to the
> code, but we have done a couple of database restores in the past few days.
>
> We've managed to reproduce the problem by remoting into one of our
> webservers (we have multiple providers) and running the process. The
> only failure I can find is a javascript failure, there's a crapload of
> bulky YUI code in here.
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351489
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CF v5 - need to find files / CD

[Judah McAuley]

If finding a copy of CF5 doesn't work out, you might consider trying
the code out on one of the free CFML engines like Railo or OpenBD. If
the code is pretty straight forward, vanilla, CF it should work with
few tweaks. If they have heavy use of C++ custom tags and such, might
be more pain that it is worth.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Jun 7, 2012 at 8:40 AM, Paul Silver  wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> A real blast from the past this one - I've got a client who wants to
> move server and has lost their original install CD for ColdFusion v5.
> Yes, that's right: 5.
>
> I've got the license key, and I know they're legit as I used to work
> for them ~10 years ago when v5 was current and remember them buying it
> (I wasn't stuck with v4.5 and rebooting the server every night, woo!)
>
> Is there a repository I can download such an old version from, or
> could some kind soul zip up a copy of the files and get them to me
> somehow? They don't have the budget to upgrade to CF10, sadly.
>
> Thanks
>
> Paul
> --
> Paul Silver
> Freelance Web Developer
> Tel: 01273 906020 (UK)
> http://www.paulsilver.co.uk and http://webpositioningcentre.co.uk
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351479
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Wait for File to Get Written

[Judah McAuley]

You could also use cfthread. Spawn the execution off into another
thread, then use the cfthread join action to make current processing
wait until the child thread is finished and rejoined. Put your logic
to check for file existence in the child thread where the execution of
the external app is. Then you have a timeout on the join so that it
won't wait around forever. Might be a bit cleaner separation.

Judah

On Wed, May 30, 2012 at 9:55 AM, Mary Jo Sminkey  wrote:
>
>>maybe use cfdirectory and look at 'dateLastModified' to wait for it to be
>>2~5 old (so you know it has finished writing to it)
>
> Well, not sure that has any benefit by itself versus just checking if the 
> file exists.
>
>
>>I would make a retry loop, say 5 times with a sleep in between
>>and break out if file found
>
> Okay, yeah this is more the piece I was looking for, a way to find the file 
> quickly if it is there, while also ensuring that the page won't hang waiting 
> for it if it doesn't complete. Yeah, this should work nicely, thanks!
>
> Mary Jo
>
>
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351365
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Holy sweet mother of Jeremy Allaire...

[Judah McAuley]

On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 12:34 PM, Justin Scott  wrote:
> (Creative Suite sales are probably an order of magnitude greater than
> CF sales, so while CF is profitable, it's likely a drop in the bucket
> compared with the heavy hitters that have a broader market appeal).  A
> mention on the homepage would be nice though. :)

And this is the chicken and egg conundrum that has been going round
and round ever since Adobe acquired CF. In order to improve the
broader market appeal of CF, you have to invest in marketing and sales
of the product. But if the product is not already a big hitter in a
rather large portfolio, it is unlikely to be deemed worthy of that
level of marketing and sales...wash, rinse, repeat.

Still, fine engineering.

Cheers,
Juda

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351229
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Holy sweet mother of Jeremy Allaire...

[Judah McAuley]

Big public announcements at conferences are a great thing. And pretty
common. However, when companies do that, they usually also release the
damn product at the same time. At least they build a good product.

Coldfusion: great engineering, crappy marketing.

Judah

On Tue, May 15, 2012 at 3:21 PM, Wil Genovese  wrote:
>
> Again - maybe the BIG public announcement will be at CF.Objective() key note 
> this week.  Who knows what goes through the minds of marketing people ;-)


~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351213
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: after a long hiatus back to talk about frameworks

[Judah McAuley]

As an example of this, learning MVC and DI in Coldbox made it much
easier to dive into .Net MVC when I was working in a .Net/C# shop.
There were certainly some differences in how things were done in each
framework (Coldbox was better than .Net MVC in pretty much every way,
though .Net MVC got much better in later versions) but the concepts
were mostly the same. I understood models, controllers, views, helper
functions, dependency injection, etc and it became a matter of picking
up the particulars of the new framework and the differences in
underlying language (CF vs C#).  Definitely helpful to me as a
developer.

Judah

On Wed, May 9, 2012 at 9:49 AM, John M Bliss  wrote:
>
> My comment still applies. Even if you learn and forget all of those
> frameworks in succession, because most of them feature MVC/OO/ORM/etc, that
> stuff should stick.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:351090
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: hash collision

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 1:06 PM, Jochem van Dieten  wrote:
>
> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 8:36 PM, Judah McAuley wrote:
>> Thanks, Leigh, looks like that verifies that it is the same issue. Now
>> I'm curious why it took Adobe til the middle of March to fix a
>> vulnerability that everyone else fixed by early January at the latest.
>
> Just like with their other software Adobe tries to stick to a 3-month
> release cycle for ColdFusion. The 2011Q4 update was December 13, the
> 2012Q1 update is March 13.

I knew that that was the release cycle for bug fixes but I didn't
realize that that applied to security fixes as well. That surprises
me.

Thanks,
Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:350425
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: hash collision

[Judah McAuley]

Thanks, Leigh, looks like that verifies that it is the same issue. Now
I'm curious why it took Adobe til the middle of March to fix a
vulnerability that everyone else fixed by early January at the latest.
At least it is fixed.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Leigh  wrote:
>
>> The vulnerability they are describing seems to be the one described here
>
> From the comment below, I think it is the same issue
>
>  http://forums.adobe.com/message/4264032#4264032
>
>
> -Leigh
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:350422
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: hash collision

[Judah McAuley]

That's very curious. The CVE that Adobe references in their release (
CVE-2012-0770 ) doesn't seem to be a valid CVE number, though it comes
up in some google searches. But it isn't in the National Vulnerability
Database or at cvedetails.com

The vulnerability they are describing seems to be the one described

Here: http://www.kb.cert.org/vuls/id/903934
And here: http://www.ocert.org/advisories/ocert-2011-003.html

However, that was a known vulnerability in a bunch of languages and
was fixed everywhere else last year. In the first link, it says Adobe
was notified in November 2011. If the release they put out today is
really regarding the issues I linked to (since the credited CVE entry
doesn't seem to exist) then that means they are a couple months behind
every other vendor. That is worrisome.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 9:05 AM, John M Bliss  wrote:
>
> FYI: Adobe warns of hash collision in #ColdFusion | ZDNet
> http://zd.net/ymjDEy
>
> --
> John Bliss - http://about.me/jbliss
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:350420
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Rialo or Open Blue Dragon

[Judah McAuley]

The Railo 3.3/Tomcat 7 installers are available to download from here:
http://www.getrailo.org/index.cfm/download/

I won't be around this evening, I think, but it sounds like a
potentially interesting idea. I'm guessing you are talking about a way
wrapper that knows how to fetch and install custom tags?

Judah

On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 9:25 AM, Michael Stemle  wrote:
>
> So you have a link? I'm mobile at the moment.
>
> By the way, would anybody be up for a Skype call this evening (us central 
> time)? I had an idea I sent over the list a bit ago that I wanted to bounce 
> off f some other folks for creating an open source repository of components 
> similar to CPAN (search.cpan.org) for Perl.
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349333
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Rialo or Open Blue Dragon

[Judah McAuley]

Railo has fairly new installers done by Jordan Michaels at Vivotech (a
great place to host, btw). If you haven't tried them out, you ought
to. They work quite nicely on Windows and Linux (and OS X I believe,
though I've not used them there). It takes care of the Apache setup
and installs Tomcat as the J2EE servlet container.

OpenBD has been quite active recently pushing out new releases. I
haven't used it extensively, just some basic compatibility testing. It
seems to work just fine as far as I can tell, but I'm not running any
Fusebox apps. In terms of inexpensive hosting, it should be noted that
OpenBD runs on Google App Engine, so that might be an interesting
option to look into.

Cheers,
Judah

On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 8:30 AM, Michael Stemle  wrote:
>
> Railo claims that Fusebox is compatible from what I can see. I've only
> played with Railo so far, but both of them seem like a bit of a pain to
> install on anything but Windows. That said, I run regular apache, so maybe
> that's what makes it complicated.
>
> I'm running my CCFAN development stuff on cfmldeveloper.com for now.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349331
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: (ot) Music Podcast - anyone done one?

[Judah McAuley]

Hit up Scott Stroz, who does the CF Hour podcast or any of the folks
behind the CodeBass Radio station (pretty much all CF/Adobe tech
folks).

If you can't easily find their email addresses, they are all active on Twitter.

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 6:48 PM, Mike Kear  wrote:
>
> REPLY OFF LIST PLEASE 
>
>
> I'm sorry for posting off - topic  but I'm looking for someone who can give
> me some help getting a podcast going of a music show and I suspect there
> might be some people here who've done it.
>
> One of the hosts at my radio station wants to set her show up as a podcast,
> and she's getting conflicting stories about the amount she has to pay for
> licencing and royalties.
>
> Has anyone done it, and can point me at the right place for accurate and
> intelligent information?   the Australian rights outfit,  APRA is not being
> at all realistic or reliable.   Ask one person you get one answer, ask
> another you get an answer that's double the price.
> --
> Cheers
> Mike Kear
> Windsor, NSW, Australia
> Adobe Certified Advanced ColdFusion Developer
> AFP Webworks
> http://afpwebworks.com
> ColdFusion 9 Enterprise, PHP, ASP, ASP.NET hosting from AUD$15/month
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349325
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: ColdFusion - Long Running Processes - Garbage Collection - structDelete

[Judah McAuley]

Not sure what kind of page you're doing, but have you looked at
cfflush? That flushes out the request buffer which can be a
significant overhead, especially in terms of perceived responsiveness,
on long running pages. I don't know for 100% certain but I believe
that that would often trigger a garbage collection as well.

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 12:40 PM, Ryan Duckworth
 wrote:
>
> We used a trick in *ColdFusion 8* that does not seem to work in *ColdFusion
> 9*.
>
> Inside of loops in heavy lifting / long running processes ( scheduled pages
> ), we would use:
>
> structDelete( variables, "foo" );
> This would, in theory, remove the pointer to the location in memory and
> allow for garbage collection.
>
> I have tried moving the processing inside of a cffunction and using a
> similar trick on the local scope.
> var objOrder = 
> 
> structDelete( local, "foo" );
>
> structDelete on variables and local do *not work* in *ColdFusion 9*.
>
> Another trick, that is less than ideal, and would require re-writing a
> significant amount of code is to have 2 pages:
> The 1st page would contain the loop and use cfhttp to call the 2nd page
> that actually does the processing.
>
> This, in theory, would be a solution if ColdFusion 9 only allows Garbage
> Collection at the *end of each request*. ( I sure hope this isn't true )
>
> Any Ideas?
> Maybe cfthread?
>
> I know that others out there must have encountered this same problem and
> come up with a solid solution.
> Please share your tricks.
>
> Best,
> Ryan
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349208
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Very disappointing statis

[Judah McAuley]

Hey, I just heard Ray say that CF is dead! OMG, it must be true,
spread the word!!!

On Wed, Dec 14, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Raymond Camden  wrote:
>
> *checks watch*
> Yep, about time for another CF is dead thread.
> *goes back to work*
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349118
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Get text value from xmlsearch()

[Judah McAuley]

Sure, some functions work on multiple nodes and they are awesome for
all sorts of things. I just hesitate to use a function that will blow
up if more than one node is returned when you can write a function
that will always return the first node and therefore not blow up. I've
just had two many times where I've written code that assumes that a
query/search/whatever will only return one record and it works fine
with all my test cases (because there is only supposed to be one
record so that's what I put in my test case) and then lo and behold,
someone inserts a second matching record and things start throwing
errors because of that assumption I made.

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 2:24 PM, Raymond Camden  wrote:
>
> The poster asked about getting a text value, so obviously he was using
> a xpath search that matched one value. So... don't do it on ones that
> would return multiple. You can use functions on multiple things
> though. For example:
>
> 
> 
>  200
>  100
> 
> 
>
> 
> 
>
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 4:06 PM, Judah McAuley  wrote:
>>
>> But what happens if there is more than one node that matches your
>> search?  Searches expect to return one or more results, which is why
>> it returns an array. Trying to turn what may be a complex result into
>> a simple string with no logic seems like an unstable approach, unless
>> I'm misunderstanding the question (which happens plenty).
>>
>> Instead, I'd write a UDF called FirstXMLNodeText or some some such
>> that you pass an XPath value to along with an xml doc and then have it
>> return the XmlText of the first array result returned.
>>
>> What you are doing with the array is correct, in my opinion. If it is
>> too much typing and you are doing it a lot, build a function to do it.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Judah
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:56 PM, Raymond Camden  
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> You can use functions to get values:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>>  09-09-2009
>>> 
>>> 
>>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>>
>>> Docs: http://www.w3schools.com/xpath/xpath_functions.asp#string
>>>
>>> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Dominic Watson
>>>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's getting old in the tooth and could do with some JavaLoader love,
>>>> but this project can help with that sorta thing:
>>>>
>>>> http://betterxml.riaforge.org
>>>>
>>>> Dominic
>>>>
>>>> On 7 December 2011 21:09, Christophe Maso  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there any way to get the "09-09-2009" string using xmlSearch() for the 
>>>>> below xml?
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>>   09-09-2009
>>>>> 
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been doing something like this, which is a real pain:
>>>>>
>>>>> arrDate = xmlSearch(xml, "//employee/startDate");
>>>>> strDate = arrDate[1].XmlText;
>>>>>
>>>>> It seems that xmlSearch() must always return an array and is unable to 
>>>>> return a string, which makes sense, but using the above code has gotten 
>>>>> old, real fast.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349019
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Get text value from xmlsearch()

[Judah McAuley]

Yay for XPath 2, that's good news.  Just today I was wrestling with
XSLT that needed a Replace function which XPath 2 supports but XPath 1
(for some reason) does not. What kind of language doesn't have a
Replace function?

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 2:03 PM, Raymond Camden  wrote:
>
> Actually, you want to limit yourself to these - since CF9 is still
> xpath1 (Zeus is adding xpath2)
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XPath_1.0
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:56 PM, Raymond Camden  
> wrote:
>> You can use functions to get values:
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>>  09-09-2009
>> 
>> 
>>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> Docs: http://www.w3schools.com/xpath/xpath_functions.asp#string
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Dominic Watson
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> It's getting old in the tooth and could do with some JavaLoader love,
>>> but this project can help with that sorta thing:
>>>
>>> http://betterxml.riaforge.org
>>>
>>> Dominic
>>>
>>> On 7 December 2011 21:09, Christophe Maso  wrote:

 Is there any way to get the "09-09-2009" string using xmlSearch() for the 
 below xml?

 
   09-09-2009
 

 I've been doing something like this, which is a real pain:

 arrDate = xmlSearch(xml, "//employee/startDate");
 strDate = arrDate[1].XmlText;

 It seems that xmlSearch() must always return an array and is unable to 
 return a string, which makes sense, but using the above code has gotten 
 old, real fast.


>>>
>>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349016
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Get text value from xmlsearch()

[Judah McAuley]

But what happens if there is more than one node that matches your
search?  Searches expect to return one or more results, which is why
it returns an array. Trying to turn what may be a complex result into
a simple string with no logic seems like an unstable approach, unless
I'm misunderstanding the question (which happens plenty).

Instead, I'd write a UDF called FirstXMLNodeText or some some such
that you pass an XPath value to along with an xml doc and then have it
return the XmlText of the first array result returned.

What you are doing with the array is correct, in my opinion. If it is
too much typing and you are doing it a lot, build a function to do it.

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 1:56 PM, Raymond Camden  wrote:
>
> You can use functions to get values:
>
>
>
> 
> 
>  09-09-2009
> 
> 
>
> 
> 
>
> Docs: http://www.w3schools.com/xpath/xpath_functions.asp#string
>
> On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Dominic Watson
>  wrote:
>>
>> It's getting old in the tooth and could do with some JavaLoader love,
>> but this project can help with that sorta thing:
>>
>> http://betterxml.riaforge.org
>>
>> Dominic
>>
>> On 7 December 2011 21:09, Christophe Maso  wrote:
>>>
>>> Is there any way to get the "09-09-2009" string using xmlSearch() for the 
>>> below xml?
>>>
>>> 
>>>   09-09-2009
>>> 
>>>
>>> I've been doing something like this, which is a real pain:
>>>
>>> arrDate = xmlSearch(xml, "//employee/startDate");
>>> strDate = arrDate[1].XmlText;
>>>
>>> It seems that xmlSearch() must always return an array and is unable to 
>>> return a string, which makes sense, but using the above code has gotten 
>>> old, real fast.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:349015
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: DirectoryExists sometimes returning incorrect value

[Judah McAuley]

A path that starts with \\ is a UNC path. UNC paths can be funky as
they are not necessarily real physical paths on your server but rather
logical paths on a mapped device, like SAN.

UNC paths should work, in general. Sometimes permissions will be
problematic with UNC paths but that shouldn't cause it to be an
intermittent failure. You might have your sysadmin look at what
account CF is running as and then try logging into the server as that
account and look at permissions and visibility on those UNC paths from
the point of view of the CF service.

Judah

On Wed, Dec 7, 2011 at 9:16 AM, Shannon Rhodes  wrote:
>
> I honestly don't know; it's coming from the global variable for all of our 
> applications. I guess I always assumed it had to do with mappings or 
> something, since we can't have a relative path here.  I can definitely strip 
> it out and see if that solves the problem.
>
>>  >>The specified directory attribute value
>> \\blah\AppDev\ParisDocs\blah\docs\
>>
>> What is the double \\ for?
>> Sometimes it is taken as equivalent as one single \, but some other
>> time it may not.
>> This could explain why DirectoryExists says it doesn't but it is found
>> when being create

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348999
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Changing Application settings at runtime

[Judah McAuley]

In CF9, there is the ApplicationStop() method which will restart the
application on the next request, thus reinitializing the application
scope.

Ben Nadel wrote up an investigation of this awhile back:
http://www.bennadel.com/blog/1667-Learning-ColdFusion-9-Resetting-Applications-With-ApplicationStop-.htm

One thing to note is that calling ApplicationStop() does not reset the
Session scope. This could be viewed as either a bug or a feature.

So if you are ok with restarting the application while leaving the
session scope in place, I'd place the smtpserversettings in your
OnApplicationStart() method and make a call to whatever service you
have that knows what the currently valid server settings should be.

Of course you still have to figure out how to trigger the fact that
you need to reset the application because of a downed smtp server.

Hope this helps,
Judah

On Mon, Dec 5, 2011 at 5:30 PM, Brook Davies  wrote:
>
> So I have something like this at the top of application.cfc:
>
>   server="mail.yourmama.com",
>  username="b...@yourmama.com",
>  password="issofat"
> }>
>
> But I want to be able to change these settings when I (somehow) detect that
> the server is down. From what I have read the only way to do this would in
> onRequestStart or onRequestEnd. So I can set up a request scoped flag that
> triggers the update, fine, but is that really the only way? Is there no way
> to call a method of application.cfc within the scope of the application?
>
> Broo

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348981
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Weird SQL Query happenings...

[Judah McAuley]

If you run the profiler and it says that it is returning the correct
number of records in the sp that was run,  you could also take a look
at FusionReactor and use their JDBC wrappers to see if something is
going on at the JDBC level.

Judah

On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 1:33 PM, Leigh  wrote:
>
> Other than that the only thing I can think of would be tracing it or using 
> the profiler to see what is happening.at a db level. Because it does not make 
> sense the same parameters would return different results.
>
> -Leigh

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348919
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Weird SQL Query happenings...

[Judah McAuley]

Is it returning multiple recordsets perhaps? Or possibly returning a
cursor to the recordset?

Judah

On Wed, Nov 30, 2011 at 11:18 AM, DURETTE, STEVEN J  wrote:
>
> Hi all,
>
> Here is a little background... CF: ColdFusion Server Enterprise 8,0,1,195765
> SQL: Microsoft SQL Server 2008 R2
>
> I have a stored procedure that when I run from SSMS it runs perfectly and 
> returns 2000 rows. When I run it from a cfstoredproc tag it returns no rows 
> at all. I just changed the cfstoredproc to a cfquery using exec inside the 
> cfquery and it returned the same 2000 rows. The system is using sql user ids, 
> and in all three cases the user name and password were exactly the same.
>
> One other thing, I am using the Fusion Reactor SQL Server driver and the 
> Fusion Reactor version is 3.5.0.
>
> Anyone have any ideas why this might happen?
>
> Steve
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348913
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe Abandons Flex

[Judah McAuley]

There is most certainly variation when it comes to standards
conformance with regards to both time and browser. None the less,
there are fairly well understood subsets that are supported (and were
back then) that form a comfortable base for most development to start.
Hence why the website I wrote more than 15 years ago renders exactly
the same today in Chrome as it did in NCSA Mosaic.

That being said, I also wrote fancy Admin UIs years later using
customer HTC behaviors that were IE-only because that was the only way
to get the look/feel/behavior that those customers demanded at that
time. There was a clear understanding, however, that it would not be
future proof and that there would probably be substantial changes in
the future.

So, yeah, you really can write substantially future proof websites and
have them work just fine years and years down the line. That
limitations imposed by that, however, doesn't always meet the business
requirements, so it is a set of tradeoffs as usual.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:37 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> standards is of course a good thing, but not all browsers follow
> standards, they certainly did not several years ago in anyway shape or
> form, and that is really the time period we are talking about in this
> thread, not the present.
> It you write using standards now then the chances of your app being
> being future proof are pretty high as even Microsoft have bowed down,
> and these days you do not need to use browser specific features when
> you have JQuery.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 8:34 PM, DURETTE, STEVEN J  wrote:
>>
>> HTML 4.01 is a standard, HTML 5 is an emerging standard.
>>
>> What you don't want to do is code to IE6, IE7, IE8, FireFox, Chrome, unless 
>> you are directed that you have no choice.
>>
>> If you code to the standard, then the browser *SHOULD* render it the right 
>> way. If it doesn't, now then it may after a fix is put out.
>>
>> Steve

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348802
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe Abandons Flex

[Judah McAuley]

Oh, I agree Russ, but you were making absolutist statements, not using
common sense. Common sense says: write to standards, tweak as required
for individual customer needs, plan periodic refreshes to better take
advantage of improving/changing technology.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 12:13 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> you have to use a bit of common sense here, obviously every app in the
> world was not written by you and does not work the same as yours, if
> they did then this thread would not exist nor would the previous
> comments.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 7:01 PM, Judah McAuley  wrote:
>>
>> Not at all true, Russ.
>>
>> Here's a website that I wrote in 1994 that is archived (archive.org
>> only has it back through 1996) that works just fine in Chrome 16, IE 9
>> and FireFox 8 on a Windows 7 box.
>>
>> http://web.archive.org/web/19961018091409/http://babel.uoregon.edu/yamada/guides.html
>>
>> None of those browsers even existed when I started that in 94. I was
>> targeting HTML specs and, lo and behold, still works fine 15+ years
>> later on browsers I could not have imagined at the time.
>>
>> Judah
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>>>
>>> not exactly true.
>>> If you have a 5 year old app that was written for the browsers of the
>>> time, it wont matter whether it was written for just 1 browser or for
>>> all browsers, it will still be out of date now and will still need
>>> updating for the latest browsers.
>>> If however it was only written to work for say IE then it only needs
>>> to be fixed for IE, much less work/time and cost.
>>> Making an app cross browser does not magically make it future proof.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348797
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe Abandons Flex

[Judah McAuley]

Not at all true, Russ.

Here's a website that I wrote in 1994 that is archived (archive.org
only has it back through 1996) that works just fine in Chrome 16, IE 9
and FireFox 8 on a Windows 7 box.

http://web.archive.org/web/19961018091409/http://babel.uoregon.edu/yamada/guides.html

None of those browsers even existed when I started that in 94. I was
targeting HTML specs and, lo and behold, still works fine 15+ years
later on browsers I could not have imagined at the time.

Judah

On Thu, Nov 17, 2011 at 9:45 AM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> not exactly true.
> If you have a 5 year old app that was written for the browsers of the
> time, it wont matter whether it was written for just 1 browser or for
> all browsers, it will still be out of date now and will still need
> updating for the latest browsers.
> If however it was only written to work for say IE then it only needs
> to be fixed for IE, much less work/time and cost.
> Making an app cross browser does not magically make it future proof.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348794
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe Abandons Flex

[Judah McAuley]

That's what I was saying, Ray :)

On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 6:55 PM, Raymond Camden  wrote:
>
> We don't just use jQuery, we put engineering time into it - and jQuery
> UI and jQuery Mobile. That doesn't get enough press so spread the
> word. ;)
>
> On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 7:36 PM, Emmit Larson  wrote:
>>
>>>> it is my understanding that Adobe is getting more of the JQuery love in
>> its life a
>>
>> I looked under the hood of Adobe Edge, the HTML5 animation tool and it uses
>> jQuery and stores data for the animations as JSON. jQuery is wildly popular
>> for good reason. In many ways it is like CFML, it makes hard things easy.
>>  Write less do more etc. Same concept in many ways... Like easy is a
>> bad thing.
>>
>> G!
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 5:06 PM, Judah McAuley  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 1:32 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>>> > This doesn't entirely make sense to me, though - they're not getting
>>> > rid of Flash Builder. I also suspect that they'll subsidize some of
>>> > the open-source development, as they've done many times in the past -
>>> > the Ajax library in CF is open-source, but several of the developers
>>> > on it were paid by Macromedia (at the time) to work on it.
>>>
>>> The CF javascript libraries for UI work (cfdiv, cfwindow, etc) were
>>> based on the ExtJS library (which then merged with Sencha).
>>> Adobe/Macromedia, as far as I'm aware, never contributed any work to
>>> that project but did license it. Going forward, it is my understanding
>>> that Adobe is getting more of the JQuery love in its life and they
>>> have definitely contributed resources to some of those projects,
>>> JQuery Mobile in particular. The Railo community implementation of the
>>> equivalent CF UI functions such as cfwindow are based on the JQuery
>>> library (and were done by Andrea Campolonghi). I expect Adobe to
>>> likely move to JQuery-based components in the future given their
>>> investment in JQuery Mobile.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Judah
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348741
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe Abandons Flex

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 1:32 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
> This doesn't entirely make sense to me, though - they're not getting
> rid of Flash Builder. I also suspect that they'll subsidize some of
> the open-source development, as they've done many times in the past -
> the Ajax library in CF is open-source, but several of the developers
> on it were paid by Macromedia (at the time) to work on it.

The CF javascript libraries for UI work (cfdiv, cfwindow, etc) were
based on the ExtJS library (which then merged with Sencha).
Adobe/Macromedia, as far as I'm aware, never contributed any work to
that project but did license it. Going forward, it is my understanding
that Adobe is getting more of the JQuery love in its life and they
have definitely contributed resources to some of those projects,
JQuery Mobile in particular. The Railo community implementation of the
equivalent CF UI functions such as cfwindow are based on the JQuery
library (and were done by Andrea Campolonghi). I expect Adobe to
likely move to JQuery-based components in the future given their
investment in JQuery Mobile.

Cheers,
Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348732
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

I don't know, Wil, I think that the topic of tone and tenor of
responses to mailing lists (empathy vs correctness in Rick's
terminology) is an excellent discussion for a community to have.

In general, I agree with Rick that empathy is a very positive trait to
bring to the table (in all aspects of life) and that sometimes being
"correct" or "right" can end up with you being viewed as a jerk.

However, in this particular case, I disagree that anyone was not
treating Irvin with empathy. Several people, myself included, agreed
with the empathetic part...that we wish Adobe would spend more time
and money promoting CF.  Where the disagreement was was in the area of
whether CF is dying, what that means, how it should be viewed. At
first this was done with respect, by and large, which is surprising
since this topic comes up with regularity. Then Irvin came back with
bones to pick and decided that Dave was putting up straw man arguments
(which was untrue) and perhaps that I didn't like him (which was true
by the end of the conversation but I tried not to let that affect my
answers).

I think that empathy is important and the empathetic reaction to "CF
is dying!" is the one that was given here: It is not dying in a sudden
and unreasonable fashion, don't panic. Take the skills that you've
learned here and learn other languages. This will not only enhance
your ability to find work in the future, it will make you a better CF
programmer today and a more well rounded person in general.

If the sort of empathy that Rick is looking for is more of the "I need
to rant about something and have everyone just kinda nod and let it
go", then I'd suggest cf-community as a better suited venue.

I do think that looking at civility, empathy and tenor of responses on
a list is a good subject to muse upon though.

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Nov 11, 2011 at 3:36 PM, Wil Genovese  wrote:
>
> ENOUGH ALREADY
>
>
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348687
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 10:37 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
> Perhaps he's alone because he didn't ask anyone to help him. Did you
> volunteer to help him? I think Judah did in this very thread, so maybe
> the queue will move a bit faster.

That was actually .jonah (easy to get us confused) but I'll volunteer
as well and ping Ray offlist. Just to further confuse everyone :)

Cheers,
Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348667
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Quitting the list

[Judah McAuley]

Good luck, God speed Irvin. So long and thanks for all the Flsh.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 10:26 PM, Irvin Gomez  wrote:
>
> Just a brief note to announce that I'm quitting the list immediately. My mail 
> box has received quite a bit of truly nasty stuff as a result of my debate 
> (with Dave Watts, mostly) over CF's future.
>
> There is no need for this type of unprofessional behavior, so I'd rather quit 
> - even though I have enjoyed being a member for several years.
>
> It should be mentioned that Dave Watts is NOT one of the people sending the 
> emails.
>
> Good luck, everyone. No hard feelings. Life goes on.
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348632
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 9:45 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
> But that's not even an attack! It's just good advice! It's the same
> thing I'd tell anyone working with CF! Learning how other languages
> work makes you a better developer, even if you're going to just use CF
> most or all of the time.

And to reinforce what Dave just said...I stay active on cf-talk, the
ColdBox list and the Railo list and I'm not even a CF dev by and large
right now. Hell, I'm not even a developer for the most part, I'm
managing a .Net engineering team. You know why I keep up on these
lists and try to answer questions and read the threads? Because there
are smart people that I can learn from. And new people that I can
help.  And when I read about Gems in a Ruby discussion, it makes me
realize that I can use NuGet to do some cool things on our .Net
projects. And when I look at how the ColdBox project is using
environmental overrides and AOP in their projects, I realize that I
can do some similar things with Unity or AutoFac in my .Net MVC stuff.
And as I see the Akka project in Scala, I think about how cool it
would be use to the Actor/Producer pattern in a CF framework and how
it could be a really nifty open source project.

Instead of lamenting the death of the ColdFusion, get out there and
learn some other languages and bring the best of it back. And then go
take the best of CF and spread the ideas to other languages. If you
like being a programmer, stop bitching and go out there and do cool
stuff, damn it.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348627
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 9:27 PM, Irvin Gomez  wrote:
>
> I never used the word "wins". That's your perception. And no, no language 
> ever 'wins', but some DO die out, and that more like the argument that is 
> often made about CF.

Every language dies out. It is just a matter of time. Things change
and morph. C and Perl were the most widely used Web dev languages when
I started. Both are still around but neither is used much for web
development. Others have stayed web languages but become even more
niche. My first web language (other than HTML) was Lasso.  Good chance
you've never even heard of it, but if you were into Macs and FileMaker
Pro in 1995, you'd have know it. And you know what? It is actually
still in active development and being sold. And there are developers.
And CF looks like a juggernaut comparison. I think you just lack
perspective.

>>Coldfusion is a solid and respected product. It continues to evolve.
>>It won't be around forever, but then again, nothing will be. Continue
>>to explore and learn, if you have jobs that don't need a specific
>>tool, use the ones you love and get the job done quick. Then go out
>>and learn some more and see what options you have for the next job.
>
>
> Luckily for me, I have a very stable working environment.

Good for you. You should still go out and learn new languages and
paradigms and environments. It is good for your soul and helps ward
off old age.

>>Theoretically, that's why people hire us, because we learn and think
>>and adapt and figure out how to solve problems.  So, with that in
>>mind, put that thinking cap on apply a bit more broad minded look at
>>the world around you and you might get a better appreciation of where
>>you, CF and the big wide world of application development really
>>stands.
>>
>
> No amount of veiled attacks will make my argument any less compelling - but I 
> guess that's the only resource you have, so you have to use it. I fully 
> expected the personal attacks, but it's ok. It's your opinion and I respect 
> it :-)
>

Well, it wasn't a veiled attack. It wasn't personal. It was a
discussion about software development, the evolution of computers and
languages and how to deal with a dynamic, growing profession.

But now that you put it your way, yeah, I agree that I think you're a jerk.

Cheers,
Juda

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348625
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

I, for one, learned to get off Dave's lawn years ago :)

Btw, Dave, if I haven't mentioned it recently, thank you for all you
do for the community and I definitely owe you a beverage of your
choice if we happen to find ourselves in the same part of the country
at the same time one of these days.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 9:19 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> I wish the Pollyanna approach were productive, but it is not. If there are 
>> no new adopters of the language, it will die out. As simpe as that.
>
> That is certainly true. However, there are new CF developers all the
> time. I know, because my company hires people to do CF work. One nice
> thing about this is, you don't have to hire people with CF experience
> - if you know PHP or .NET or whatever, you can certainly do CF
> development. So, I expect things will continue in this vein just as
> they have in the past. I wouldn't characterize this as a "Pollyanna"
> approach, just an observation made after reading the same arguments
> you're making EVERY DAMN YEAR ON THIS LIST FOR THE LAST TEN YEARS. At
> this rate, I expect that your kids will be making the same argument to
> Ray's kids some day.
>
>> That's not a good strategy as seen by the stagnant CF community. Perhaps if 
>> Adobe made CF more attractive (not better - my argument
>> is not against CF or its capabilities), people would feel paying for it was 
>> a good idea. I know - I paid for it as a beginner. I'm optimistic that
>> there are many others like me.
>
> Adobe will do what they will do. I don't really have any control over
> that, do you? Unless you're a secret majority shareholder, I'm
> guessing the answer is no.
>
> Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
> http://www.figleaf.com/
> http://training.figleaf.com/
>
> Fig Leaf Software is a Veteran-Owned Small Business (VOSB) on
> GSA Schedule, and provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
> instruction at our training centers, online, or onsite.
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348620
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 8:45 PM, Irvin Gomez  wrote:
>
> The reason Coldfusion is dying a slow death has nothing to do with Coldfusion 
> itself or its capabilities (I'm a convert, remember). Coldfusion is fine. The 
> problem is one of perception: the overwhelming majority of people entering 
> the programming arena will  - rightfully so - go with .Net or PHP instead of 
> Coldfusion. For a few very simple reasons:
>
> 1. They are more popular, especially PHP.
> 2. Because they are more popular, the person feels that employment/income 
> opportunities will be better with those languages.
> 3. The resources available to beginners are more numerous or simply visible 
> (PHP).
> 4. For whatever the reason, Coldfusion is perceived as something of a 
> 'has-been' language.
>
> And, yes, you would not hire guys without great expertise. But that's not 
> what pays the bills at Adobe. It is the great 'unwashed masses' who will 
> ultimately dictate whether Coldfusion thrives or just continues on life 
> support until the current generation of diehards dies out. It is a reality. 
> 99% of the guys doing PHP are just WordPress hackers - but who cares? I wish 
> Coldfusion  - as good as it is - could say the same.
>
> That's my perspective.

I don't know as much about the PHP world these days as I do .Net land,
but I can assure you that the CF community runs veritable circles
around .Net when it comes to blogs, mailinglists, Twitter, irc
channels, etc. It is way easier to learn CF than C#/.Net. The reason
that people do go out and learn .Net is that they want a job in that
area. So to the extent that .Net has more new people learning it
(which I assume is true but do not know), I can almost certainly
assure you it is because the jobs are there.  As far as I am aware,
there has been no major decrease in the number of CF jobs (though I
could be wrong). We'd all like to see a push from Adobe that helps
market CF to companies around the globe but as it is, CF has a solid
market niche that does not seem to be going away anytime soon. If
people want to follow the jobs, they will to CF, just like to .Net
though in fewer numbers.

Then there is the other argument, about "zazz" and "excitement". Quite
frankly, PHP is not exciting. It has been around the block for many a
year. 99% of the guys doing PHP, as you say, may just be WordPress
hackers...which means that they may be eaking out a living but not
really producing anything of substance and certainly not rocking the
world. There are a number of up and coming languages. Ruby, Scala,
server side JS (Node and Backbone), maybe Clojure, sorta-kinda Python.
Ruby, Scala and server side JS are doing cool, hip things. They ought
to, they are young. That's why I'm also learning them. Some of them
will gain more traction or lose some, settle in and be in the place
that CF and .Net are in several years.  New languages will appear and
flourish and find their own niches.

I don't know how long you've been working with computers, Irvin, but
no language "wins". We develop and evolve. The problems we try to
solve change. We figure out new ways of tackling old problems. Best
practices come and go.

Coldfusion is a solid and respected product. It continues to evolve.
It won't be around forever, but then again, nothing will be. Continue
to explore and learn, if you have jobs that don't need a specific
tool, use the ones you love and get the job done quick. Then go out
and learn some more and see what options you have for the next job.
Theoretically, that's why people hire us, because we learn and think
and adapt and figure out how to solve problems.  So, with that in
mind, put that thinking cap on apply a bit more broad minded look at
the world around you and you might get a better appreciation of where
you, CF and the big wide world of application development really
stands.

Cheers,
Jud

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348611
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

To give a littler perspective, Irvin, I'm hiring developers currently
in one language and working on learning a couple others myself.

Right now I'm in a .Net shop and hiring a dev or two for some
projects. A number of them are web apps that need:

MVC knowledge
IOC/DI container understanding
Solid OOP

I got acquired by the company I work for and, having never done
C#/.Net development, I had to figure out how I was going to take my
apps and start porting them from CF over to C#/.Net.  Fortunately for
me, I'd kept up with developments in the CF world and had already
started learning OOP, had started picking up ColdBox (an MVC
framework), had already started figuring out IOC. So it was a matter
of learning a new language more than it was learning fundamentally new
concepts.

Some things are different for sure, like duck typing vs static typing,
interfaces, etc, but the concepts you are referring to as the
"complicated stuff that 99% of people don't need to know" are actually
concepts that span most languages are deal with organizational
constructs that are common to creating solid, reusable, maintainable
code for real projects.

There is no way I'd hire a developer, in any language, at this point
that didn't understand OOP. They don't have to use it for every little
thing, but they need to understand what it is and when to use it. If
it is a web project, they should know what MVC is and when/why to use
that. If it is more of a RIA app, I'd expect them to understand MVVM
and similar paradigms.

The same concepts about separation of concerns, reusable code, unit
testing, design patterns, fundamental architectural concerns and
decisions, those are the sorts of things that make good programmers.
Some languages make some bits easier and some make other bits easier.
And some languages just "feel" right and make it a pleasure to express
yourself in. But most of the things I know about creating good
software are the same in CF as in .Net and Ruby and Scala and
Javascript. And, yes, even in PHP (though it's been awhile since I
done any PHP).

In my opinion, CF happens to allow me to do a lot of the good stuff in
less code than I'd use in most other languages and to do so in a way
that makes me feel comfortable. CF may, or may not, be dying a slow
death, but as some one who codes and hires in other languages, I can
tell you that having the community talking about how to write better,
more maintainable, testable, extensible code will never be one of
those reasons.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 3:44 PM, Irvin Gomez  wrote:
>
>>On 11/10/2011 8:39 AM, Gerald Guido wrote:
>>
>>> Wait.. does that mean that CF is undead? And part of the impending zombie
>>> Apocalypse? Sweet!
>>
>
> CF is dying - no matter what the usual suspects say. The sad part is that CF 
> is dying because potential newcomers to the language do not have a thriving 
> community with support for bebinner's issues. Most of the material for 
> beginners is outdate, abandoned or just plain old/ugly.
>
> CFLib has been semi-dead (even Ray Camden wrote yesterday how behind he is on 
> queue). Ben Forta's site is despicably ugly - why won't Adobe pay a bit of 
> money to give the man a nice site
>
> The current CF talk is about OOP and complicated stuff that 99% of the users 
> don't need or understand. The experts have gone "too hard core", scaring away 
> people who could embrace Coldfusion's greatest asset: getting the basics 
> quickly. That's what 99% of sites need: a little procedural code to get the 
> website going without problems.
>
> I know I'll be insulted, but the truth must be said: Coldfusion is dying a 
> slow death and there is absolutely no reason why a person entering the web 
> programming arena should go with Coldfusion instead of PHP, for example. I 
> write these words with pain, because I love CF, but the truth is the truth. 
> Now I must go back to finishing my Begineer PHP book (shame on me!).
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348598
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Adobe drops Flsh for mobile devices

[Judah McAuley]

I think that there would be some intentional obfuscation by other
parties regardless of how they announced it but I do also think that
the "Flash is dead" message comes across more clearly when the
announcement is coupled with a significant layoff announcement.

None the less, I'm really glad that they are reiterating their support
of Flash/Flex within Air, I really do think that it is a great
development/deployment model.

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 11:46 AM, Ben Forta  wrote:
>
> And thank you for making that distinction, Bryan. It's amazing how the
> masses have chosen to ignore that little fact. We're backing away from Flash
> in-browser, but we're still hard at work on Flash for apps.
>
> --- Ben
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348553
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: word doc to PDF

[Judah McAuley]

What versions of Office do you have to support? If you can get away
with only supporting Open XML doc files, you'll be able to do a lot
more. They are zip files of xml docs and resources and MS has an SDK
for working with them. You can convert them into a number of formats
through XSLT and other options. If you have to support older, binary,
DOC versions then you'll need to look at the various commercial
options like ActivePDF and some of the non-commercial options like
OpenOffice.

Judah

On Tue, Nov 8, 2011 at 10:53 AM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> anyone got any recommendations for DOC to PDF conversion ?
> CFDOCUMENT requires OpenOffice to be on the server, which I don't
> really want to do, so looking for an alternative.
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:348528
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: MAX and CF

[Judah McAuley]

Not making keynotes, but Ray Camden has a MAX presentation on Zeus
posted the Adobe TV site:

http://tv.adobe.com/watch/max-2011-develop/whats-next-in-coldfusion/

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 12:39 PM, Alan Rother  wrote:
>
> DISCLAIMER -
>
> I DO NOT WORK FOR ADOBE - I AM JUST GUESSING LIKE EVERYONE ELSE
>
> 
>
> Odds are we'll see some sneak peeks tonight at the event. Based on the
> development cycle of CF, it's not due out for another 6 months or so, so
> they really have no reason to show it off yet.
>
> =]

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:347907
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Can JS read CGI Environmental Variables?

[Judah McAuley]

Not natively that I'm aware of, however, it is easy to deal with.



var referer = #cgi.http_referer#;

referer = referer.slice('/').pop();
if ( referer == 'index.cfm' )
etc




On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 10:30 AM, Rick Faircloth
 wrote:
>
> Ok... I'm tired of searching.
>
> Can JS read CGI variables?
>
> e.g.
>
> var referer = cgi.http_referer.slice('/').pop();
>
> if ( referer === 'index.cfm' )
>
> etc.
>
> Rick

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:347800
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Generating Bar Codes

[Judah McAuley]

I haven't done it myself but I've seen several people recommend the
CFBarbecue project at RiaForge

http://cfbarbecue.riaforge.org/

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Sep 28, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Michael Grant  wrote:
>
> Anyone had any experience with this either via CF or PHP?
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:347773
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Sessions failing due to multiple CFID / CFTOKEN cookies

[Judah McAuley]

Are you maybe thinking about the setting that says use J2EE sessions
and changes the CFID and CFTOKEN combo to a jsessionid token?

Judah

On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 12:57 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> So whats this cfmagic var I'm remembering ?
>
> Regards
> Russ Michaels
> From my mobile
> On 12 Sep 2011 18:42, "Dave Watts"  wrote:
>>
>>> I believe setting the useUUID setting in the cfadmin can help with
>>> such issues, if I recall correctly this also avoids the use of CFID
>>> and CFTOKEN, and uses an alternate variable instead, CFMAGIC or
>>> somehting? its been a while since I looked at this as I use UUID as
>>> default for years now so I might be completely wrong and i'm sure Dave
>>> will correct me if I am.
>>
>> I think this just uses a UUID for CFTOKEN, actually.
>>
>> Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
>> http://www.figleaf.com/
>> http://training.figleaf.com/

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:347420
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Programming for an iPod - OT javascript/HTML question

[Judah McAuley]

Without any examples, it is tough to help out.

Couple things I'll toss out as starting points:

1. Validate your HTML and your JS. It won't cure every problem but it
is an easy step and gets rid of a lot of easy to miss sources of
error.
2. If you are really looking at a mobile device (as opposed to the
desktop version of Safari), look into one of the mobile-optimized JS
libraries like JQuery Mobile or Sencha Mobile. There are also mobile
device emulators that may help you debug.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 11:25 AM, Stephens, Larry V  wrote:
>
> I'm working on a form in CF that displays just fine on a desktop/laptop but 
> the javascript breaks in Safari once I introduce a .
>
> If anyone has a clue about this, please contact me off-list at 
> steph...@indiana.edu
>
> Thanks.
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:347250
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: (ot) Need info on attempted acquisition by MS in 1995

[Judah McAuley]

For historical perspective, you might also want to mention Lasso which
was contemporaneous with the origin of CF and shared very much the
same ideas. The biggest difference was that Lasso was Mac-focused and
intended to integrate with FileMaker Pro. I did Lasso dev prior to
learning CF and it was a fairly easy transition.

Note, however, that I didn't get into CF until 1998, so I was a late
bloomer there, whereas I started with Lasso in 96. ASP didn't come
around til 98.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 10:05 PM, Billy Cravens  wrote:
>
> Thanks Dave. I guess authoritative isn't the correct word, as much as I'm 
> looking for details (who, when, etc). Probably won't be that big a deal, 
> since the focus of the talk is "why .NET developers should care about CF", 
> but I like to be prepared, since I'll definitely bring predating ASP. :-)
>
>>
>> I don't think you're going to find a more authoritative source for
>> the
>> acquisition attempt than Jeremy Allaire and Adam Berrey. The other
>> information is accurate as well, as I remember it. I tried out dbWeb,
>> and it wasn't as good as CF 1.5. Microsoft did acquire Aspect,
>> released DBWeb, then dumped it for ASP 1.0 (I don't know anything
>> about the ASP 1.0 codebase coming from i-Whatever).
>>
>> Oddly enough, there's still dbWeb documentation on the MS support
>> site:
>> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/155412
>>
>> Dave Watts, CTO, Fig Leaf Software
>> http://www.figleaf.com/
>> http://training.figleaf.com/
>>
>> Fig Leaf Software is a Veteran-Owned Small Business (VOSB) on
>> GSA Schedule, and provides the highest caliber vendor-authorized
>> instruction at our training centers, online, or onsite.
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346990
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: coldfusion deployment

[Judah McAuley]

Decrypting the code might be a violation of the DMCA, it depends on
who owns the code. If it was compiled with cfcompile, instead of being
encrypted, it probably isn't going to do the OP any good.

The problem with compilation in this scenario is that cfml gets turned
into java classes which get compiled down to java byte code. You could
use a java decompiler on the end results but you'll get the java
classes out of that, not the cfml code. As far as I'm aware, there is
no existing way to generate cfml from java classes, only cfml to java.

Judah

On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 6:57 AM, Larry Lyons  wrote:
>
> I'm fully expecting to be shot down here, but couldn't you use the cf 
> encryption, then grab the compiled jars?
>
> regards,
> larry
>
>> Akos,
>>
>> It's common enough for me to have seen it a few times. If you are
>> expected to work with the site you will need the unecrypted files OR
>> you will need to decrypt them. I suspect the developer is talking
>> about encrypted source files.
>>
>> CF encryption is pretty trivial and you can unencrypt them back into
>> source but make sure you have the right to do so (from whoever hired
>> you or owns the code or whatever).
>>
>> -mark
>>
>>
>> Mark A. Kruger, MCSE, CFG
>> (402) 408-3733 ext 105
>> www.cfwebtools.com
>> www.coldfusionmuse.com
>> www.necfug.com
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Akos Fortagh [mailto:akos.fort...@yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2011 3:30 AM
>> To: cf-talk
>> Subject: coldfusion deployment
>>
>>
>> hi there, I have been developing with CF for almost ten years and I'm
>> not classing myself as an advanced developer, I'm still learning so do
>> apologise if this sounds amateurish...
>> I have some new site modification work coming in and the existing
>> developers sent me this message.
>>
>> "The files that constitute the site are stored in a binary format –
>> not editable text. This protects the source code and is standard
>> deployment practice amongst developers."
>>
>> I have talked to other developers and nobody has never come across
>> such thing so not too sure about the claim its standard practice.
>> Am I missing an important thing here?  Anybody worked like that
>> before?
>>
>> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> Thanks in advance...
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346458
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: coldfusion deployment

[Judah McAuley]

The bit the original poster quoted didn't say it was necessarily
encrypted, just binary, so I would guess that they just mean
pre-compiled. I've done pre-compiled deployments before but it can be
a bit of a pain. The only real reason was a compile step that told me
that I wouldn't run into any compilation errors.

As usual though, Dave is right: if you need to work on the source
code, you'll need the source code.

Judah

On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 6:16 AM, Mark A. Kruger  wrote:
>
> Akos,
>
> It's common enough for me to have seen it a few times. If you are expected to 
> work with the site you will need the unecrypted files OR you will need to 
> decrypt them. I suspect the developer is talking about encrypted source files.
>
> CF encryption is pretty trivial and you can unencrypt them back into source 
> but make sure you have the right to do so (from whoever hired you or owns the 
> code or whatever).
>
> -mark
>
>
> Mark A. Kruger, MCSE, CFG
> (402) 408-3733 ext 105
> www.cfwebtools.com
> www.coldfusionmuse.com
> www.necfug.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Akos Fortagh [mailto:akos.fort...@yahoo.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 02, 2011 3:30 AM
> To: cf-talk
> Subject: coldfusion deployment
>
>
> hi there, I have been developing with CF for almost ten years and I'm not 
> classing myself as an advanced developer, I'm still learning so do apologise 
> if this sounds amateurish...
> I have some new site modification work coming in and the existing developers 
> sent me this message.
>
> "The files that constitute the site are stored in a binary format – not 
> editable text. This protects the source code and is standard deployment 
> practice amongst developers."
>
> I have talked to other developers and nobody has never come across such thing 
> so not too sure about the claim its standard practice.
> Am I missing an important thing here?  Anybody worked like that before?
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346451
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Committing Line by Line Changes?

[Judah McAuley]

On Wed, Jul 27, 2011 at 10:08 AM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> With Git and Mercurial, you can "shelve" changes. So if you are part
>> way through a big change and something important comes in, you can
>> tell the source control system to stash the current changes out of the
>> way, go back to your version prior to the current changes, make the
>> new important changes and commit them, then pull the uncommitted stuff
>> you were working on back into your working branch and go on your merry
>> way.
>
> But you're still going to have to be able to incorporate the changes
> that were made since your last checkout line-by-line, right? For
> example, if you check out somefile.cfm and change lines 50-75, then
> the important change affects lines 20-30, you're going to have to go
> back and diff the files before you can commit the changes you made
> before you shelved the file.

Of course, but if you are going to be changing the same line in each
of the commits you want to put out, you're going to have to do a merge
no matter what, even if you commit line by line.  The way I
interpreted the question is that the poster is looking for an easy way
to stop part way through some changes, switch over to do something
else in the same code area, then come back to finish up and
incorporate the changes they made during the digression.

In Git or Mercurial, I actually wouldn't probably use changeset
shelving either, though it is certainly possible. I'd create a new
branch from the last common point, switch to the new branch, make
changes and push/build/whatever, then merge that branch back to your
main development branch. If the changes were in a different section of
code, even in the same file, Git or Mercurial should be able to do the
merge automatically for you. If you changed the same line in both
change sets, you'll need to resolve the merge conflict with the
merge/diff tool of your choice.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346370
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Committing Line by Line Changes?

[Judah McAuley]

With Git and Mercurial, you can "shelve" changes. So if you are part
way through a big change and something important comes in, you can
tell the source control system to stash the current changes out of the
way, go back to your version prior to the current changes, make the
new important changes and commit them, then pull the uncommitted stuff
you were working on back into your working branch and go on your merry
way.

Judah

On Wed, Jul 27, 2011 at 9:28 AM, Shannon Rhodes  wrote:
>
> Yeah, what Dave said...I'm talking about committing part of a file, not part 
> of a project.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346364
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Total Execution Time

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 4:33 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> > That's not much different from what happens with ASP.NET pages. They
>> > start as text, and have to be compiled into bytecode (MSIL, I think
>> > it's called), then executed by the .NET runtime. And JRun using more
>> > system resources shouldn't make a performance difference.
>>
>> On .NET in an MVC app you have two different types of dynamic
>> resources, the compiled C# code for your model and the .aspx pages for
>> the views. Your model code gets compiled down to a dll, just like any
>> other windows app and runs on the CLR (common library runtime). The
>> views will be compiled the first time you hit them, like in CF, if you
>> just copy them over.  On the other hand, you can ship them precompiled
>> (my installer build task does this) which takes away that first time
>> hit but you can also do that with CF and use cfcompile to produce the
>> java byte code and then distribute that.
>
> Right, but my point is that overall they're just not all that
> different. You can also use Java for your model if you really want to,
> rather than CF, in which case it'll work the same way as the Microsoft
> MVC design framework.
>
>> Have to know the limitations of your tools.
>
> Sure, there will always be occasional edge cases where one environment
> does something significantly better than another. But for the average
> web application, this doesn't come into play.
>

Agreed on all accounts, just giving others some insight into what
happens on the .Net side of things.  All things considered, I'll still
use CF if given a chance for most projects for it's simplicity and RAD
features.

Juda

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346211
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Total Execution Time

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Jul 12, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> remember, that cfml has to be compiled into java byte code, processed by
>> JRUN and then executed by the JRE, so more steps involved and JRUN certainly
>> uses far more system resources than ASP.
>
> That's not much different from what happens with ASP.NET pages. They
> start as text, and have to be compiled into bytecode (MSIL, I think
> it's called), then executed by the .NET runtime. And JRun using more
> system resources shouldn't make a performance difference.

On .NET in an MVC app you have two different types of dynamic
resources, the compiled C# code for your model and the .aspx pages for
the views. Your model code gets compiled down to a dll, just like any
other windows app and runs on the CLR (common library runtime). The
views will be compiled the first time you hit them, like in CF, if you
just copy them over.  On the other hand, you can ship them precompiled
(my installer build task does this) which takes away that first time
hit but you can also do that with CF and use cfcompile to produce the
java byte code and then distribute that.

> I think the biggest reason for this performance difference is that CF
> is quite a bit different from Java - loosely-typed vs strictly-typed,
> etc. Whereas, if you write C# code, you're already telling the
> compiler a lot more about what to do.

And there are different ways of turning the same CF code into Java
code. Adobe and Railo both produce different Java code for the same CF
code in many cases and those choices have impacts on performance.

>> The advantage of CF was never its execution speed, but rather its RAD speed.
>
> Exactly. And when most web applications spend most of their time on
> database queries (which will likely be the same on various platforms)
> who really cares that you can run 1 iterations of something you'd
> never actually do faster on platform A vs platform B?

Database query speed is certainly a big element as is your approach to
caching. Normal database queries will probably be similar in speed on
.Net versus CF but there are some differences. The JDBC driver for SQL
Server, for instance, doesn't support Table Valued Parameters which
allows you to pipeline large numbers of statements in one connection.
We had an import process that was doing on the order of 50,000
inserts/updates. In CF, even with connection pooling, it was taking
hours. We switched to using TVP statements through an ADO.Net
connection and dropped it down to a minute or two. Have to know the
limitations of your tools.

judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:346208
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Problem with pound signs

[Judah McAuley]

I thought you were doing a Fibonacci series.

On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 8:26 AM, Peter Boughton  wrote:
>
> ( Although the management can probably at least count to three correctly. :$ )
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:345910
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CF vs. Java Web Developer

[Judah McAuley]

I'm one of those, probably relatively few, devs that went the opposite
route, starting off in CF and then picking up C#. I didn't do CS in
college, actually any programming at all, but got a math degree so I
had the analytical skills at least and algorithmic thinking. I picked
up CF starting with 3.1 and then later on started picking up OO, AOP,
DI and other fun design patterns in the last couple of years, all in
CF. My (pretty much just me) company got acquired by a shop that is
all .NET in C# and so I've also spent part of the 2 or so years
getting up to speed in C#.

It's been interesting to see what transfers over and what doesn't. I
was ahead of a number of my coworkers when it came to things like
doing dependency injection, using MVC, using generics and using
delegates. But I didn't really have a sense of designing using
Interfaces and typing and type conversion frequently bites me in the
ass.

Anyway, in the end, I think that the important part is finding people
who are able to learn and have a desire to. Then give them the
opportunity and expose them to whatever the evolving best practices
are in that particular language/framework and make sure they have the
resources to keep learning. If you have all that, you'll end up with
good devs.

Judah

On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 6:48 AM, Tariq Ahmed  wrote:
>
> Taking developers from other backgrounds has been one of our strategies:
>
> http://riarockstars.com/2011/03/10/a-managers-take-on-the-state-of-cf-the-scarcity-talent/
>
> The bare minimum effort to get something loosely working is way easier
> in CF vs. Java. Unfortunately the majority of CF developers leave their
> skills at that - thus finding true CF experts is extremely difficult.
>
> Advanced Java/.NET folk pick CF up in two seconds, and they bring their
> formal software development OO theory & design with them. So we don't
> even look specifically for CFers anymore, just strong developers in
> general. Though the flip side to that is Sr. developers of another
> language probably want to stick with their language of choice. So
> finding people who are in-between intermediate and sr. is the sweet spot. :)

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:345537
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Encrypt/Decrypt

[Judah McAuley]

No, not really as long as you're using a cipher that hasn't been
broken. Encryption uses a special class of functions that are easy to
perform one direction but prohibitively hard to perform the other
direction. For instance, if you take two very large prime numbers and
multiply them together to produce a really big number, that's pretty
easy to do. However, it is really really really difficult to take a
really big number and figure out which two large prime numbers were
used to compose the new number.

You can look up the details of a particular algorithm if you want to
get a better understanding of how it is implemented. There are
differences between public/private key systems, straight up
encryption/decryption with a single key and then one way hashing, but
essentially, if the private key is kept safe, knowing the input text
and the output of the cipher will not generally tell anyone enough to
be able to guess the key.

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Jun 17, 2011 at 10:00 AM, Steve Reich  wrote:
>
> If I have Encrypt(x,y) which equals z OR Decrypt(x,y) which equals z, can z
> be determined (encrypted or decrypted) without having both x and y?
>
> Example:
>
>  "dj0yJmk9TTJOUXFnakphWjVlJmQ9WVdrOVVtMU9jak5rTjJNbWNHbzlPREV4TVRrNE5EWXkmcz1jb25zdW1lcnNlY3JldCZ4PWQx">
> 
>
> if you output variables.value, you get:
>  *<'Y^MZ!]F;*=V@
>
> So... if someone gets my MYPASSWORD and *<'Y^MZ!]F;*=V@, can they figure out
> the value of variables.secretKey?
>
> Thanks,
> Steve


~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:345412
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: scoping

[Judah McAuley]

On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 8:47 AM, Matt Robertson  wrote:
>
> On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 4:54 AM, Aaron Rouse  wrote:
>>
>> I know people who have horrible code readability and been in the same teams
>> for 5-10 years.
>
> Granted.  I should have said 'my' team.  If they're working for me
> they get educated quick or they're gone.
>

Code readability is a bit of a personal preference though. I have a
friend/co-worker who writes very terse code and does a lot of things
like nested use of the ternary operator three levels deep and closures
within closures. I can read it fine but a lot of other people find it
terribly unreadable. It is nicely indented and structured and such but
not what a lot of people would consider "readable".

Standards a good thing though on any team.

Jud

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344796
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Re: scoping

[Judah McAuley]

Hmm.. I sort of get what you are saying, Cutter, but then it seems
like Variables is a scope that can only exist within another scope. If
there was a variables.myvars struct in session, I would say that the
myvars struct really lives in Session. Yes, it also technically lives
inside another structure called variables, but is that a real "scope"?
I think of a scope as having a stronger boundary, perhaps a separate
memory pool. Variables, as far as I know, can't persist beyond a
single request unless you put it inside some other scope, like Session
or Application.

Though I do suppose that if you set variables.instance in
onSessionStart it would sort of create a pointer in Session that says
"make variables.instance available in each request tied to this
session"? Or maybe not. I'll have to give this some more thought. It
seems to me that you're right, Variables can be different than Request
though often treated the same. Something to ponder when I inevitably
wake up in the middle of the night thinking about weird things like
this. :)

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, May 19, 2011 at 8:29 AM, Steve 'Cutter' Blades
 wrote:
>
> There's some great stuff here, though not entirely technically correct.
>
> Key/values placed in the Variables scope are not a part of the Request
> scope. You can see this by dumping the Request scope and the Variables
> scope. You will see that they are two entirely different animals (BTW,
> you should also scope query names). Items placed in the Variables scope
> can exist beyond the request. An example of this might be within a
> persistent object. Say you have a User object that you initialize in
> your Session during onSessionStart(). Within this object you have a
> struct, Variables.instance, containing several key/value pairs (first
> name, last name, userid, etc). This is maintained from request to
> request, being globally available to every method within the User object.
>
> Some time back, I started some debate on proper usage of Request vs
> Variables, basically stating that you should only use the Variables
> scope within a cfc or custom tag. In those use case scenarios, items in
> the Variables scope only exist within those objects, and only within the
> lifetime of those objects. If you use the Variables scope within a
> custom tag, items in that scope are only available to the tag itself,
> just as items in the Variables scope of a cfc are only available to the
> cfc. The Request scope, however, is available to all objects called in a
> request (though I would not suggest direct reference, ever, but rather
> passing in data that might be needed).
>
> http://blog.cutterscrossing.com/index.cfm/2009/8/6/Scope-Usage-and-Application-Scaling
> http://blog.cutterscrossing.com/index.cfm/2009/8/10/Request-vs-Variables--Which-is-right
>
> The comment threads on each provide a lot of insight as well.
>
> Steve 'Cutter' Blades
> Adobe Community Professional
> Adobe Certified Expert
> Advanced Macromedia ColdFusion MX 7 Developer
> 
> http://blog.cutterscrossing.com
>
>
> Co-Author "Learning Ext JS 3.2" Packt Publishing 2010
> https://www.packtpub.com/learning-ext-js-3-2-for-building-dynamic-desktop-style-user-interfaces/book
>
> "The best way to predict the future is to help create it"
>
>
> On 5/18/2011 7:03 PM, Judah McAuley wrote:
>>  I'm going to jump in on the side of variable scoping for another
>>  excellent reason: programmers don't tend to use words precisely and
>>  that ends up with confusion. When we say:
>>     variables.foo = 'bar';
>>
>>  we are not setting a "local" variable. We're setting a key and value
>>  in the variables scope which lives in the request scope.
>>
>>  When we say (in CF9 and Railo 3.x):
>>     var foo = 'bar';
>>  or
>>     local.foo = 'bar';
>>
>>  we are setting a key and value in a scope that is local to the
>>  function (if we are inside one) that cannot be seen outside of that
>>  function. If we set variables.foo (I believe) inside a function it
>>  will be a request scoped variable and available to access outside that
>>  function.
>>
>>  And if we just say:
>>    foo = 'bar';
>>
>>  the behavior depends on whether you are inside a function or outside a
>>  function and which version of CF/Railo you are on and, if I recall my
>>  Railo settings correctly, the default behavior can be switched around
>>  in the administrator as to what scope unscoped variables will end up
>>  in. Which, of course, means that your code may not even run the same
>>  on a production server as it does on your dev box.

Re: scoping

[Judah McAuley]

I'm going to jump in on the side of variable scoping for another
excellent reason: programmers don't tend to use words precisely and
that ends up with confusion. When we say:
  variables.foo = 'bar';

we are not setting a "local" variable. We're setting a key and value
in the variables scope which lives in the request scope.

When we say (in CF9 and Railo 3.x):
  var foo = 'bar';
or
  local.foo = 'bar';

we are setting a key and value in a scope that is local to the
function (if we are inside one) that cannot be seen outside of that
function. If we set variables.foo (I believe) inside a function it
will be a request scoped variable and available to access outside that
function.

And if we just say:
 foo = 'bar';

the behavior depends on whether you are inside a function or outside a
function and which version of CF/Railo you are on and, if I recall my
Railo settings correctly, the default behavior can be switched around
in the administrator as to what scope unscoped variables will end up
in. Which, of course, means that your code may not even run the same
on a production server as it does on your dev box.

So, in short: If you scope your variables, they should work the same
everywhere. If you do not, they *may* work the same but then again
they may not. So scope your variables so they aren't so variable :)

Judah

On Wed, May 18, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Mike Chabot  wrote:
>
> Always scope your variables, unless you have a specific reason not to. It
> reinforces a good habit and demonstrates to anyone reviewing your code that
> you know what scoping variables is all about. I would estimate that roughly
> 100% of experienced CF programmers would agree that scoping local variables
> does more good than harm. Even though scoping local variables doesn't add
> much value to the Web site, it does help separate you from the masses of
> inexperienced CF programmers, and that is enough of a reason to do it.
>
> -Mike Chabot

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344630
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Using CFTHREAD on CF PRO

[Judah McAuley]

Instead of going the route of using cfthread, I would suggest that you
might looking into using a queue to handle this. There are a lot of
queue options out there ( I believe that Railo uses ActiveMQ for a
bunch of things internally, don't know about Adobe) but the essential
idea is that you push a message onto the queue at the end of your
request (onRequestEnd) and then you have an asynchronous worker
process that monitors the queue, pulls messages off as they show up
and then processes them. If you start seeing a big spike in traffic
and need to pull the messages off the queue more quickly, you can
increase the number of workers. If time isn't a particularly big
issue, you can just let the one worker go and the messages will all be
dealt with eventually.

Cheers,
Judah

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 7:56 AM, Brook Davies  wrote:
>
> Hi Guys,
>
>
>
> I am considering spawning a new thread via the onRequestEnd event to do some
> post processing. Basically its going to record some stats (a couple quick DB
> queries) and possibly send an email based on some criteria. I am considering
> CFTHREAD because the user does not need to wait for any results of this
> processing.
>
>
>
> I've read some things about CFTHREAD being a bottle neck and that CF
> Proffesional has limited threads. Would I be asking for trouble trying to do
> this? Should I just let the user wait for the processing to finish? It would
> really like only be 100-200 milliseconds or so
>
>
>
> Brook
>

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344618
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: ISP blocking port 25

[Judah McAuley]

If you have a VM or something outside of their network, then you could
set up an SSH tunnel and do port forwarding, having your local port 25
get tunneled over to the remote machine and then sent out from there.

Judah

On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Al Musella, DPM
 wrote:
>
> Big problem..
>      I use verizon fios for my Internet connection. It is a business
> class - static IPs and specifically allows web and email servers.
>   Was working really nice.. then today around 1pm, I couldn't send
> email. My mail server (smartermail) log said couldn't connect to
> server.. mostly AOL servers.. so at first I thought aol was blocking
> me.. then I figured out that I couldn't telnet to any server on port
> 25 outside of my network.
>
> I called tech support and had to escalate way up before someone
> understood. They kept telling me to change the port to something
> else. But that can't work..
> Finally I found someone who understood the problem. He first said
> that I can not  use port 25.. I have to figure out a way around it.
>  After a lot of arguing, he understood and said he will check into
> it.. 6 hours later, I just hear back.. other people are reporting the
> same problem. Looks like they misconfigured a router but the people
> who know how to fix it won't be in until tomorrow morning.
>
> So - anyone have any ideas on what I can do from now until it is fixed?
> I changed the retries on my mail server to 6,12,18,24 hours so
> hopefully the mail in the queue will go out when it is fixed and I
> won't lose anything... but of course this is for a brain cancer
> charity and we are in the middle of the national walk to end brain
> tumors for brain tumor awareness month and were getting a lot of
> action on the server.
>
>
> 2 times before they messed up and changed my static IPs without
> telling me.  Each time took about 24 hours to fix. You would think
> they would tell you before changing IPs or blocking a port.  I need
> to find a better ISP... anyone know of a good one?
>
> Al
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344389
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Migrating a DB from MS SQL 2000 into MySQL latest release

[Judah McAuley]

MySql is free though licensing is a bit complicated because of a
dual-license model. The community edition includes many "enterprise"
sorts of features like replication and partitioning. If I recall,
there are additional backup tools and monitoring in the paid
enterprise edition. If you want to go completely free from the weird
Oracle ownership stuff (which I think is wise, personally), there is
the MariaDB fork which is entirely FOSS as far as I know. What
"enterprise" features are you thinking aren't in the community
edition?

MySql community edition has none of the limitations present in MS SQL
Express edition. Honestly, not taking advantage of more than a gig of
RAM or 1 cpu core is just stupid. Why would you even have a database
server? I suppose if you are housing the db on the same machine as
your app server then...well, you have plenty of other problems at that
point.

Sql Express is great for development (though I prefer developer
edition myself). It is not meant for production websites, period.
That's why Microsoft has a Web edition. I like SQL Server and use it
but it is wrong to try and compare Sql Express and MySql community
edition, they are completely different classes of software.

That being said, I still think people should check out PostGres. A
feature set comparable to Oracle/MS SQL/Sybase and genuinely FOSS,
unlike MySql. Tasty DB goodness.

Cheers,
Judah

On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 4:57 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> Many people often wrongly assume that MySQL is simply FREE, which is not
> correct. Many people are also completely unaware that there is a FREE MSSQL
> Express edition.
> The FREE version is the community edition, which also has limitations, look
> them up, If you want enterprise features then you have to pay i'm afraid,
> even with MySQL.
> The FREE editions of both will meet most peoples needs even with their
> limitations, it is really not very common to have databases of 10GB that
> needs more than 1GB RAM or more than 1CPU, then you probably be using the
> FREE editions anyway.
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 12:26 AM, Judah McAuley wrote:
>
>>
>> Or possibly Jordan has needed a database that runs on more than 1 CPU,
>> uses more than 1GB of RAM or has a db size of more than 10GB :)
>>
>>
>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>> >
>> > Perhaps you tried to run MSSQL on linux Jordan, that would certainly
>> > be humorous I imagine :-)
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 12:12 AM, Gerald Guido > >wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >>  > Russ Michaels wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than
>> mysql
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >Jordan Michaels  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>> >>
>> >> This should be fun to watch :) I am making some popcorn. Anyone want
>> some?
>> >>
>> >> G!
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:52 PM, Jordan Michaels > >> >wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>> >> >
>> >> > SQL Express limits are here:
>> >> > http://www.microsoft.com/sqlserver/2008/en/us/editions-compare.aspx
>> >> >
>> >> > Migration from MS SQL to MySQL documentation is here:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/migration-toolkit/en/mysql-migration-toolkit-indepth-sourcedb-mssql.html
>> >> >
>> >> > I've done it several times with no issues.
>> >> >
>> >> > -Jordan
>> >> >
>> >> > On 05/09/2011 03:38 PM, Russ Michaels wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than
>> >> mysql
>> >> > > community edition so there is no need to migrate to MySQL unless
>> your
>> >> > also
>> >> > > moving to Linux.
>> >> > > There are however free migration tools on the mysql site that will
>> do
>> >> it
>> >> > for
>> >> > > you.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Jenny Gavin-Wear<
>> >> > > jenn...@fasttrackonline.co.uk>  wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> I'm interested in any info.  Pit falls to avoid, best practises,
>> etc.
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> Many thanks,
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> Jenny
>> >> > >> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> >> > >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> >> > >> Version: 9.0.900 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3625 - Release Date:
>> >> 05/08/11
>> >> > >> 19:34:00
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344388
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Migrating a DB from MS SQL 2000 into MySQL latest release

[Judah McAuley]

Or possibly Jordan has needed a database that runs on more than 1 CPU,
uses more than 1GB of RAM or has a db size of more than 10GB :)


On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> Perhaps you tried to run MSSQL on linux Jordan, that would certainly
> be humorous I imagine :-)
>
>
> On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 12:12 AM, Gerald Guido wrote:
>
>>
>>  > Russ Michaels wrote:
>> >
>> > don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than mysql
>>
>>
>> >Jordan Michaels  wrote:
>>
>> > I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>>
>> This should be fun to watch :) I am making some popcorn. Anyone want some?
>>
>> G!
>>
>> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:52 PM, Jordan Michaels > >wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>> >
>> > SQL Express limits are here:
>> > http://www.microsoft.com/sqlserver/2008/en/us/editions-compare.aspx
>> >
>> > Migration from MS SQL to MySQL documentation is here:
>> >
>> >
>> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/migration-toolkit/en/mysql-migration-toolkit-indepth-sourcedb-mssql.html
>> >
>> > I've done it several times with no issues.
>> >
>> > -Jordan
>> >
>> > On 05/09/2011 03:38 PM, Russ Michaels wrote:
>> > >
>> > > don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than
>> mysql
>> > > community edition so there is no need to migrate to MySQL unless your
>> > also
>> > > moving to Linux.
>> > > There are however free migration tools on the mysql site that will do
>> it
>> > for
>> > > you.
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Jenny Gavin-Wear<
>> > > jenn...@fasttrackonline.co.uk>  wrote:
>> > >
>> > >>
>> > >> I'm interested in any info.  Pit falls to avoid, best practises, etc.
>> > >>
>> > >> Many thanks,
>> > >>
>> > >> Jenny
>> > >> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> > >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> > >> Version: 9.0.900 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3625 - Release Date:
>> 05/08/11
>> > >> 19:34:00
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344374
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Migrating a DB from MS SQL 2000 into MySQL latest release

[Judah McAuley]

Well, it is pretty damn funny.

I've migrated from MS SQL to MySql before and it generally isn't too
bad. There are various migration tools available, I like the ones from
Red Gate. MySql has some funkiness that comes into play if you want to
combine foreign keys and full text indexing from what I recall, though
that may have gone away in more recent versions. There are also data
type differences that you might want to take a look at, like you would
think that timestamp (in mysql) would be a datetime type but it isn't,
so be sure to read up on them and you should be fine.

If you are still looking at options, you might also want to look at
PostGres. PostGres is a solidly enterprise-level db (hot swap backup,
all sorts of replication options, partitioning, etc), is free, truly
open source and doesn't have the strangeness that comes along with
MySql being governed by Oracle. It's good stuff.

Cheers,
Judah

On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 4:12 PM, Gerald Guido  wrote:
>
>  > Russ Michaels wrote:
>>
>> don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than mysql
>
>
>>Jordan Michaels  wrote:
>
>> I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>
> This should be fun to watch :) I am making some popcorn. Anyone want some?
>
> G!
>
> On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 6:52 PM, Jordan Michaels wrote:
>
>>
>> I find the "more powerful" comment humorous.
>>
>> SQL Express limits are here:
>> http://www.microsoft.com/sqlserver/2008/en/us/editions-compare.aspx
>>
>> Migration from MS SQL to MySQL documentation is here:
>>
>> http://dev.mysql.com/doc/migration-toolkit/en/mysql-migration-toolkit-indepth-sourcedb-mssql.html
>>
>> I've done it several times with no issues.
>>
>> -Jordan
>>
>> On 05/09/2011 03:38 PM, Russ Michaels wrote:
>> >
>> > don't forget that MSSQL express is also free and more powerful than mysql
>> > community edition so there is no need to migrate to MySQL unless your
>> also
>> > moving to Linux.
>> > There are however free migration tools on the mysql site that will do it
>> for
>> > you.
>> >
>> > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:29 PM, Jenny Gavin-Wear<
>> > jenn...@fasttrackonline.co.uk>  wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> I'm interested in any info.  Pit falls to avoid, best practises, etc.
>> >>
>> >> Many thanks,
>> >>
>> >> Jenny
>> >> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>> >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>> >> Version: 9.0.900 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3625 - Release Date: 05/08/11
>> >> 19:34:00
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344373
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: (ot) Ram usage for 64 bit Windows server 2k3 VS the 32 bit version

[Judah McAuley]

64-bit OS only comes into play if you are going to be taking advantage
of a lot of ram. If you are doing under 4 gigs for the box, there is
no reason for a 64-bit OS, go with 32-bit.

Judah

On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 4:08 PM, Gerald Guido  wrote:
>
> Quick question: Does the 64 bit Windows server 2k3 (and CF server 8.x 64
> bit) use enough extra RAM than the 32 bit version for it to be significant?
>
> I am looking @ a Windows server 2k3 VPS with one gig of ram and was
> wondering if getting the 64 bit version would make any difference in terms
> of RAM.
>
>
> As always, many TIA,
>
> G!
>
> --
> Gerald Guido
> http://www.myinternetisbroken.com
>
> "ONE  TWO  THREE  FOUR!!!"
> -- Dee Dee Ramone
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344369
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Bless

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, May 2, 2011 at 11:10 AM,  <> wrote:
>
>  >>cfqueryparam creates bound sql parameters, which improve query performance.
>
> This is purely theoretical, in practice, the gain in performance is 
> neglectible.
> I prefer have a query to take 11 ms and see the values submitted in case of 
> error, than having the same query take 10 ms, but no information in errors.

The gains are not purely theoretical but like most things, it depends
on your situation. If you are using very simple queries, the benefit
very well may be negligible. If you are using more complex queries
that require more time to compute the query plan and are under load
the benefits are much more obvious.

If you are optimizing for errors, you are doing it wrong. It isn't
that difficult to do proper error handling and debugging with cfquery,
you just have to plan for it. I wrote up a quick blog article on the
subject last year.
http://judah.posterous.com/debugging-with-prepared-statements-with-cfque

If you provide a result attribute on your cfquery you'll get a struct
returned that includes not only the results but also the parameterized
query that was run, the parameters that were passed in and whether or
not the query was cached.

Hope that helps,
Juda

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:344137
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: I hate CFScript and I'm willing to pay for a CFScript --> CFtag parser

[Judah McAuley]

Start here, Michael:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/224722/new_commodore_64_is_finally_herefor_real.html

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 4:36 PM, Michael Grant  wrote:
>
> And I'm willing to pay for a C-64 version of Halo 3.
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Jeff Gladnick wrote:
>
>>
>> I actually don't hate cfscript, but I do hate that we have both tags and
>> script based syntax for CFML.  And since it started off as tags, I firmly
>> believe that's the way it should stay.
>>
>> I understand lots of people feel differently, but it really sucks (for me)
>> seeing all the new great open source projects being released in cfscript.
>>
>> Therefore I have created a $1000 bounty (I have pledged $250) to the first
>> developer who can deliver a working cfscript --> cftag based parser for
>> eclipse.
>>
>> http://www.pledgebank.com/CFScriptSucks
>>
>> People can still write in cfscript if they want to, but people who feel
>> like me won't have to deal with it anymore.
>>
>> Please post flames below

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343631
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Button

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 11:45 AM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> security measures that block cross domain communication would also block
> XmlHttpRequest as well, otherwise it would be pointless.
>

Yes, in general, but with XmlHttpRequest you can get around some of
the restrictions by the use of JSONP.  That gets into a lot more than
most people want to do and JSONP may be subject to the "same origin"
rules in the future but browser security is definitely an evolving
area. Something you push out there today that works may be blocked a
month from now.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343537
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Button

[Judah McAuley]

And while there isn't anything inherently bad about iframes, people
considering that route should look into the potential security issues
involved. Browsers have really tightened up their security around
hidden iframes, cross domain http communication, cross domain cookies,
etc. Once again, not necessarily wrong, per se, but you very well
wander into an annoying set of problems that you might be able to
avoid using an ajax framework like JQuery or Dojo.

Cheers,
Judah

On Mon, Apr 4, 2011 at 9:53 AM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> I just want to make sure my understanding is correct in that
>> true AJAX doesn't involve an iFrame and the only time one need
>> make use of an iFrame for ajax is when a file has to be transferred.
>>
>> Note, that I said the only time an iFrame is "needed" is for the
>> transfer of a file, not that it can't be used for "faux" ajax all the time.
>>
>> Would this be correct?  I just don't want my understanding to
>> be incorrect...
>
> Your understanding is correct. The "A" in AJAX stands for
> asynchronous, and is used to refer to using XmlHttpRequest to make
> requests "in the background" rather than by changing the location of a
> window. XmlHttpRequest doesn't support file uploads, which is why you
> have to handle file uploads differently.
>
> Before XmlHttpObject was introduced, web developers used iframes and
> frames to do all the same sorts of things

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343535
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Button

[Judah McAuley]

I would use jQuery (or javascript framework of your choice like dojo,
mootools, etc). Have an image on your page. Attach an OnClick event to
it. Inside the OnClick, do an ajax post to the remote server. On
success, swap out the image with another image indicating success. On
failure, probably swap out the image with another image indicating
failure.

Cheers,
Judah

On Fri, Apr 1, 2011 at 1:53 PM, Rick T  wrote:
>
> I am looking to put a image on a page, when you click it, it sends 
> information to another site that records the data, then the image on the 
> original page changes to a different image (to show it was recorded)
>
> Any direction will be helpful.
>
> Thanks

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343482
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Open source ColdFusion forums

[Judah McAuley]

I think you linked to the Beta 1.5 release.

Here is the blog article for Beta 2:
http://www.bryantwebconsulting.com/blog/index.cfm/2011/3/30/Neptune-Framework-in-Beta-2

Good job, Steve, this looks like an interesting project. I shall have
to check it out.

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Mar 30, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Steve Bryant
 wrote:
>
> For anyone interested, the near future has arrived and the second beta of 
> Neptune is out.
>
> http://www.bryantwebconsulting.com/blog/index.cfm/2011/1/18/Neptune-Beta-15
>
> I look forward to any and all feedback!
>
> Thanks,
>
> Steve
>
>> Take a look at the Neptune framework and see if it doesn't come close
>> to what you are thinking (in full disclosure, I am the primary author).
>>
>> http://www.bryantwebconsulting.com/docs/neptune/
>>
>> This page, in particular, may be of interest to you:
>> http://www.bryantwebconsulting.com/docs/neptune/manage-data.cfm
>>
>> Hoping to have the second beta of this out in the *very* near future.
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343432
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Open source ColdFusion forums

[Judah McAuley]

On Sun, Mar 27, 2011 at 11:47 AM, Al Musella, DPM
 wrote:
>
>   I would love to see a good open source CF medical office
> management program that includes electronic medical records as well as 
> billing.
> There is a php based attempt going on at
> http://www.oemr.org/
> They did an amazing job on some parts, but dropped the ball on
> others. The user interface sucks. Not well laid out.

Do you have any idea how huge a project that is? Medical billing alone
is a huge pain, what with RVUs, the upcoming switch to IDC-10, EDI for
getting Insurance payments. Add in all the up and coming requirements
from the HITECH act with HIPPA and your EMR/PM system is a giant set
of requirements. There is a reason the software is so expensive.

Juda

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343351
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Persisting query data across cflocation

[Judah McAuley]

If you are using CF 9 or Railo, I'd look into the new caching
functions. CF9 uses ehCache if I recall. Railo can use ehCache,
memcached and a couple of others. You can serialize your query, do an
SHA1 hash of the serialized object to use as a key, put the query into
the cache with the hash as the key name, relocate and pass along the
key name and then fetch it back out of the cache via the key name.

This is a very scalable and high performance solution. Read up on
caching, it rocks. The functions you'll want to look up, btw, are
CachePut, CacheGet and related items.

Cheers,
Judah

On Wed, Mar 23, 2011 at 7:56 AM, Eric Cobb  wrote:
>
> Given the following scenario, what would be the best way to persist the
> data across the cflocation call?
>
> I have page A, which includes page B, which does a cflocation to page
> C.  Query results returned in page A need to be available in page C.
> Since we're doing a cflocation, which starts a new request, storing the
> query results in the request scope doesn't work, and a query result set
> can't be passed as a url variable in the cflocation tag.
>
> Is storing the query results in the session scope on page A, then
> retrieving it on page C my best option?  Either that or calling the
> query on both page A and page C?  I was really hoping there was an
> easier way (like storing it in the request scope!), but I can't seem to
> figure it out.
>
> --
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric Cobb
> http://www.cfgears.com
> Help me make a difference this summer.http://bit.ly/i8dJvQ
>
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343233
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CF and GIS? [spamtrap bayes][spamtrap heur]

[Judah McAuley]

You might also take a look at the GIS capabilities that are now baked
into sever DB systems. MS SQL 2008 and the newer versions of PostGres
come to mind as having native support for geographic data. A lot of it
will come down to figuring out your actual requirements, which seem to
be rather fuzzy at the moment. But as much as possible, I'd suggest
using a tool (like a GIS system or spatial-aware DB) that is more
purpose-driven and hooking into it with CF. CF is a great tool for
acting as the glue for disparate systems. Use the best tools for the
job if you can.

Judah

On Wed, Mar 16, 2011 at 10:07 AM, Bryan Stevenson
 wrote:
>
> Thanks Rob/Paul,
>
> Rob, you confirmed what I thought.this shouldn't be rocket science.
>
> Paul...yes I'd certainly prefer to let the right tool do the job.
>
> This is an initial check to see what is available.  I'm in no way
> married to any ideas about what tools would be involved.
>
> Currently, I can say these things:
>
> 1) No data structure defined as of yet
> That said, access to the definition of these shapes as defined in  a
> proper GIS system may be possiblebut maybe not the functionality of
> the GIS system (i.e. I assume someone might be able to give me "shape
> files" or whatever may define these shapes)
>
> 2) May not have access to the GIS system
> As I mentioned above.I probably wouldn't be able to simply pass the
> location to the GIS system and ask if it's inside of a shape.  I am
> wondering if there is such a utility?  perhaps a light weight doohickey
> that can be pointed at a shape and given the location and it spits out a
> result (in or out).
>
> I'll check those links Paul
>
> Cheers
>
> On Wed, 2011-03-16 at 23:38 +0700, Paul Hastings wrote:
>
>> On 3/16/2011 11:12 PM, Bryan Stevenson wrote:
>> > I'm wondering if anyone has any advice on performing a task that
>> > involves determining if a given lat/long is within a given oddly shaped
>> > (not a simple rectangle) area/box?
>>
>> that (point-polygon searches) is actually the GIS's job. what are you using 
>> for
>> that? how are you storing the spatial data?
>>
>> i would rally justletthe GIS do what it was designed for but if you insist on
>> doing it manually i guess start with:
>>
>> http://www.geotools.org/
>> http://sourceforge.net/projects/jts-topo-suite/
>>
>>
>>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343073
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: nested hierarchical query question

[Judah McAuley]

Are you looking for help on the db part or constructing the UI display or both?

When it comes to the DB part, I listen to Joe Celko. That dude knows
way more about databases and SQL than any person ought to. Here's an
article of his on messing with hierarchical data in SQL:
http://onlamp.com/pub/a/onlamp/2004/08/05/hierarchical_sql.html

I know that SQL Server 2008 added in a new datatype for working with
hierarchical data. It's called HierarchyID but I've never used it.
Here's an MSDN article on using it:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/cc794278.aspx and what seems
to be a slightly more readable blog post about it:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/manisblog/archive/2007/08/17/sql-server-2008-hierarchyid.aspx

As for the UI creation, sounds like a case for either recursive
function calls or else dynamic loops, depending on whether the data
you bring out of the db is presorted or not.

Judah



On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 3:56 PM, LRS Scout  wrote:
>
> I have a table departments with the fields departmentID, parentDepartmentID,
> departmentName.
>
> I'm trying to build a nested ul li structure out of this.  Currently this
> can be nested n deep.
>
> I'm not sure how best to even approach this.  SQL Server 2008.
>
> god this sounds dumb even to me.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:343013
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Text to voice

[Judah McAuley]

On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 1:36 PM, Robert Harrison
 wrote:
>
>> There's the rub. We can't send the police a text and they don't monitor 
>> email. It has to be a voice message. It could even be a canned message.
>
> The concept is very cool, but whatever your message is how are you going to 
> tell when they actually answer? If they put you on hold how will the system 
> know? I suggest putting your message in a never ending loop, but if they 
> answer on a part of the message that sound like a recording they might just 
> hang up.
>
> How do you plan to deal with that part of the problem?

Determining when a call is answered is pretty straight forward as it
generates a SIP event and whether you got a human or an answering
machine/voicemail is done through a process called CPA (Call Progress
Analysis).

Getting put on hold is more complicated scenario. I'd say that the
best way to deal with that is to have a loop in your voice xml dialog
that waits for user feed back in terms of either listening for a
spoken phrase, "Say 'OK' when this message has been successfully
delivered" or a dtmf tone "Press 1 to confirm that the message has
been delivered". I'd also make sure that CPA detection happened
continuously during the call and have a new CPA event kick off a
restart of the dialog. That way if the call gets put on hold, it will
be looping in the background, but when it gets pulled out of the hold
queue and someone says, "Hello?" it will trigger a Human CPA event and
restart your dialog that plays the "we really need help" message.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342940
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Text to voice

[Judah McAuley]

There are lots of options out there for making phone calls and
utilizing a text to speech engine or pre-recorded wav file. I use a
company called Voxeo to generate automated outbound reminder calls and
such. They have purchased a couple new providers in the last year or
two and added a lot of capabilities to their system that I have yet to
use. I highly recommend them and they do already have some existing
Coldfusion code examples in their documentation.

Judah

On Fri, Mar 11, 2011 at 11:24 AM, Stephens, Larry V
 wrote:
>
> We are working on an application that requires us to make a telephone call. 
> It is an electronic allegory for a dead man's switch. We have a location with 
> night watchmen who work alone. Worrying about them, since they work alone, we 
> are developing a small application that will have the watchman log in at set 
> intervals. If they fail to login, the app will send them a text reminder. If 
> they still fail to login it will then contact our police department.
>
> There's the rub. We can't send the police a text and they don't monitor 
> email. It has to be a voice message. It could even be a canned message.
>
> Can anyone point us to something that will do this that we can program from 
> CF or VB?
>
>
> Larry V. Stephens
> Office of Risk Management
> Poplars 705
> 812-855-9758
> steph...@indiana.edu

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342934
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: CFC argument best practice question

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Mar 7, 2011 at 9:24 AM, Matt Quackenbush  wrote:
> That's the beauty of refactoring, though.  Unless you need to, don't.  And
> if no other method is calling it (or expected to call it), then it is not
> needed.  If it becomes needed, refactor and add it in.  :-)

I generally agree with this notion but I think it starts to fall apart
with more complex methods. You might have a whole routine that only
gets called one place but is complex enough that there are benefits to
breaking it up into multiple methods that have single concerns. Doing
so makes it easier to debug (the method names provide helpful clues to
follow the chain of execution) and makes it much easier to unit test.

> Either way, though, the arguments should be clearly defined.

Agreed.

J

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342807
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Re: Change in ColdFusion management

[Judah McAuley]

Fascinating. I guess things work differently there than anywhere else
I've been. Thank you for clearing that up.

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 10:57 AM, Brian Kotek  wrote:
>
> Only if said employee was posting in the context of their position, and not
> responding personally to a personal accusation or comment.
>
> So, yes, you have a misunderstanding of the Adobe corporate culture. Glad to
> help clear that up for you!

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342305
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Re: Change in ColdFusion management

[Judah McAuley]

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 10:42 AM, Brian Kotek  wrote:
>
> That's one way to look at it. But the much more likely view (and the one
> Adobe sees) is that the people who think he's guilty of "bad behavior" are
> not only a tiny minority, but are also wrong.

Perhaps I have a misunderstanding of the Adobe corporate culture, but
if I was acting in an official capacity for my company and called one
of our customers a dick on a public mailing list, I'm pretty sure that
my boss would consider that bad behavior.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342300
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Change in ColdFusion management

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Feb 14, 2011 at 11:30 PM, Matt Quackenbush  wrote:
>
> Damn!  Mike Kear and Michael Grant, both?  In the same thread?!?!?!
>
> THE HEAVENS HAVE OPENED!  :-)

For what it's worth, I think that the move seems pretty reasonable to
me. I appreciate the hard work that Adam has done on the product
roadmap even if I have had issues with the way in which he interacts
with the community. More resources and product management that is more
closely located to development seem like positive moves to me.

The only things that gave me pause were the fact that CF is now in a
Print division and the suggestion that CF X will have a longer release
cycle. I don't know anything about how Adobe divides their business
groups, so it very well may be that the new division is a perfect home
for the product, albeit with a name that does really shout "web
development". And as for the longer release cycle, that's really a
judgment call. I worry about perceived "stagnation" in the product
development but I think that there are ways to combat that perception
from a marketing point of view. Solid, exciting releases tend to erase
those fears regardless.

Here's hoping that the transition goes smoothly and that exciting
things are in store.

Cheers,
Ju

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:342295
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 4:54 PM, Adrocknaphobia
 wrote:
> If you think we are in a better place, then please ignore me. Just please
> don't get bent out of shape when Adobe recognizes Railo/OpenBD as a
> direct competitor. I think Judah provided a perfect example of why that's
> so.

I am a perfect example of why Railo is a competitor, yes. You also
seem to fail to acknowledge any of the reasons *why* Railo is a
competitor in my situation. If you want to look at the problems Adobe
has, you might start there instead of complaining.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341760
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 4:19 PM, Adrocknaphobia
 wrote:
>
> Judah,
>
>>You can complain all you want about a small faction trying to recklessly
> tear down the
>>community but that's bullshit.
>
> All I did was explain what's at risk for CFML developers. You didn't argue
> any of what I said other than to cal it bullshit. I'd say that's fairly
> abusive.

Then you have my apologies, Adam. I find your entire behavior in this
thread to be disturbing but if salty language directed at your
discussion points (not at you) are deemed abusive, then I shall
attempt to refrain from using such language in your direction in the
future.  I can now see how you feel that there has been abuse heaped
on Adobe.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341759
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 4:25 PM, Brian Kotek  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 6:23 PM, Judah McAuley  wrote:
>
>>
>> You have it exactly backwards, Brian. Adam accused the Open Source
>> cfml community of being abusive toward Adobe.
>>
>
> Actually, Judah, I don't have it backwards. You do. That's why I'm pointing
> this out and asking if anyone knows what the point of this discussion is any
> longer. Adam was RESPONDING to this:

Dave pointed out Russ' comment, which I missed as it was not part of
Adam's rant. Thank you for pointing it out as well. My call out of
Adam still stands, however. The open source community, as far as I can
tell, is not abusive of Adobe.


Cheers,
Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341757
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

Thank you, Dave, I missed that bit. When I read Adam's post he wasn't
directly quoting another post so I had not connected his statement to
that of Russ'

Personally, I don't think that anyone has been terribly mean to anyone
else by historic tech debate standards. I did challenge Adam on his
statement and I've yet to see where he has identified the "abuse"
being heaped on Adobe from people involved with the other engines. It
seemed rather unprofessional to me but that is neither here nor there.

I cannot make a comment about the OS engines cannibalizing sales or
creating new cfml developers and such, I don't have the data. I can
comment on my perceptions of Railo versus Adobe as a developer and
have. I think that some things get rather personal rather too quickly
on mailing lists and that is a shame. And I do agree with you about
Adobe dropping CF if they don't make money on it, that's just a fact
of business life.

Thanks again, Dave.

Judah

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 3:40 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
>
>> You have it exactly backwards, Brian. Adam accused the Open Source
>> cfml community of being abusive toward Adobe.
>>
>> And I quote from Adam: "The "open CF" side of the community couldn't
>> be more abusive
>> towards Adobe. It's laughable to think that the community holding the OS
>> vendors accountable would make someone leave CF."
>>
>> I called Adam out on this statement and will continue to do so. The
>> Railo and CFEclipse lists, at least, are quite far from abusive toward
>> Adobe. I do not monitor the OpenBD lists, so perhaps there is
>> something going on there that I am unaware of. But the accusation of
>> abuse came from Adam, not the other way around.
>
> That's a response from Adam to a post by Russ. You may want to read
> that post. To save you the trouble of finding it, here's the relevant
> line:
>
> "Attitude of the CF community (mainly caused by certain people being abusive
> to Railo/BD)
> Attitude of Adobe"
>
> Now, I don't really have a dog in this fight - while I'm an Adobe
> partner, and resell Adobe products, I simply haven't seen any impact
> on that business from the open-source engines. But I haven't seen
> anything I'd qualify as "abuse" coming from either Adobe or anyone
> speaking on Adobe's behalf, even indirectly. It's not abuse to point
> out the cannibalistic effect that competing open-source engines may
> have on the ColdFusion market. It strikes me as kind of absurd for the
> people arguing in favor of these engines to say that they'll draw new
> developers to CF; perhaps they'll keep people on CF who would
> otherwise leave, but those are two different things. To me, really
> only one thing is certain - if ColdFusion does not continue to make
> money for Adobe, they'll drop it like yesterday's news.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341750
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

You have it exactly backwards, Brian. Adam accused the Open Source
cfml community of being abusive toward Adobe.

And I quote from Adam: "The "open CF" side of the community couldn't
be more abusive
towards Adobe. It's laughable to think that the community holding the OS
vendors accountable would make someone leave CF."

I called Adam out on this statement and will continue to do so. The
Railo and CFEclipse lists, at least, are quite far from abusive toward
Adobe. I do not monitor the OpenBD lists, so perhaps there is
something going on there that I am unaware of. But the accusation of
abuse came from Adam, not the other way around.

Judah

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 3:12 PM, Brian Kotek  wrote:
>
> What are we actually debating, again? The original issue at the root of all
> this was that Adobe is being "abusive" to the OSS engines. Highlighting the
> competitive advantages that Adobe feels they have over Railo or OpenBD, or
> the negative impact they feel it those engines have on the Adobe or CF
> community, is not abuse. It is exactly what competitors do. Everyone is free
> to agree or disagree with what Adobe is saying. But to call it "abuse"
> reveals, at best, a lack of understanding of what the word means, and at
> worst, an intentional misrepresentation.
>
> I keep asking for some examples of the horrible abuse that Adobe (or anyone,
> really) are directing at the OSS engines, but no one seems to be bothering
> to provide any.
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341745
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

You want to know why I've been moving my projects from Adobe CF to
Railo, Adam? It's quite simple, really. Railo is a better product for
me. I've not had a very good experience with Adobe as a cfml developer
and I've had a much better experience with Railo as a cfml developer.
Yes, even with a support contract with Adobe. You can complain all you
want about a small faction trying to recklessly tear down the
community but that's bullshit.

Railo performs faster as a product and the company is more responsive
to developers. That's why I use it. If you want me as a developer (and
it certainly seems like you don't), now you know how to get me back. I
don't have anything against Adobe as a company, I'm not an angry,
ranting open source purist. I'm happy for Adobe to make money off it's
products and I'm glad of the things they have already done in the open
source space (like the Flex SDK).

End of the day, though, I'm here to develop great applications and
hopefully to enjoy the process of doing so. Make developers more
productive, their applications perform faster and be responsive to
their concerns and I'm sure Adobe will do wonderfully.  Complaining
about open source projects isn't the way to woo me though, gotta say.

Judah

On Mon, Jan 31, 2011 at 1:47 PM, Adrocknaphobia
 wrote:
>
> Denny,
>
> I think you see the world as you would hope it to be, not for the reality
> that it is. A commendable quality, but not one Adobe can choose to share
> with so many CFML careers on the line. It's been 3 years since OpenBD/Railo
> went open source and removed the price barrier to CFML adoption. 3 years
> since they gave up their attempts to compete with Adobe commercially. 3
> years since they proclaimed "CFML is not worth paying for".
>
> At any time Adobe could have made (or will make) ColdFusion free. Problem
> is, cost is not the only barrier to adoption -- a reality many seem to
> ignore. So, 3 years later, our community for all intensive purposes seems to
> be shrinking (we have more CF jobs than developers). On top of losing CFML
> developers, we now have a large amount a fragmentation. It would seem that
> anything Adobe does in the CFML space is directly combated by the "Open CF"
> movement. Because of this, CFML has increasingly become more and more toxic
> for Adobe. I can't tell you how hard it is to fight for this community
> within Adobe when a small external faction is recklessly trying to tear it
> down.
>
> How can I ask Adobe to invest $$$ into growing the CFML developer community
> when our ability to get a return is dramatically reduced? The fact is, the
> Donna Bing's of the world (and the rest of the Open CF community) have all
> but written off Adobe and ColdFusion. They've decided to no longer invest
> any money in CFML and won't even give Adobe guidance to change.
>
> This is an honest and genuine question: Are CFML developers better off today
> than they were 3 years ago? At the rate of which things are progressing,
> will they be better off in 2014? Would they be better of w/o Adobe
> ColdFusion?
>
> -Adam
>
> PS. Sorry to make this all about money, but that's one of the realities we
> have to face about our current ecosystem.

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341743
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: why is cf_builder so expensive?

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 7:44 PM, Dave Watts  wrote:
> And if you go on mailing lists for those other products,
> you don't find developers talking about what's used on what web sites,
> and how that reflects on anything meaningful.

This isn't actually true at all, Dave. To give one high profile
example, take Hotmail. Microsoft got a huge amount of shit for the
fact that Hotmail ran on Linux (or BSD? I think BSD) with Apache.
Sure, they bought Hotmail and that was the primary reason. But people
kept saying "oh, Windows and IIS can't handle the load so they have to
stick with BSD".  There were plenty of tech articles about whether
Microsoft could actually run Hotmail on Windows, how expensive it
would be, etc.  Finally, MS eventually moved it over but they had to
put significant time and energy into the project. They even announced
that they had moved it to Windows only to have to retract that
statement a couple days later, admitting that some of the bits still
ran on BSD. I seem to recall that MS totally fucked up Hotmail in the
move as well but that could have been some of their other major screw
ups.

Eating your own dogfood is still an important concept in the tech
world and I think you sell it short.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341604
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

I've seen plenty of anti-commercial software vitriol out there in OSS
communities but I haven't seen it in the open cfml community.  I would
say that many (probably most?) people who are participating in open
source side of CF (Railo, CFEclipse, OpenBD, projects on RIAForge,
etc) have been cfml developers long enough that they were developing
when there were no alternatives other than the closed-source
ColdFusion engine. I've been a cfml developer since the early days
with Allaire (wearing an Allaire tshirt right now actually) and so I
have no problems using a commercial, closed source product. I suspect
that most other folks are in the same boat. That makes the community
different than, say, apache, php, ruby on rails, etc who may have
spent most of their development lives using F/OSS and have more of a
fundamental philosophical approach.

I've switched most of my development to Railo. Why? For a variety of
reasons but primary one isn't that Adobe ColdFusion is not open
source. I don't mind, at all, that they are a commercial company
putting out commercial software. And, I'd say, the pricing is fairly
reasonable, all in all. Instead, I find Railo to be a lot more
responsive as a company, have better communication with the community
and produce higher quality software that is more performant and better
meets my needs as a developer. The fact that it is open source is a
bonus and the other things that have come along with that (like the
community provided extensions) are an appealing selling point as well.

In other communities, I'd say that you might be right about OSS
backers directing vitriol toward a commercial company, like Adobe,
based on philosophy. I'd challenge you, however, to point to that sort
of thing happening in the cfml community though.

Cheers,
Judah

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 3:22 PM, Mark A. Kruger  wrote:
>
> But wouldn't it be somewhat fair to say that commercial vendors (in general)
> see a role for OSS while OSS people see little value in commercial products?
> Most avid OSS folks I know think that commercial products gum up the
> works... and yes, they are often full of vitriol about it on lists, blogs
> etc. No one get's their ire up quite like a geek who feels like he has the
> answers. Maybe I'm shielded but I don't see near the level of anti-OSS
> verbiage out there. Do you?
>
> -Mark

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341073
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

Who has been abusive toward Adobe? I've seen some people question
their commitment to the product because of a perceived lack of
marketing muscle. And there was a big discussion about pricing on
CFBuilder. Most of both of those discussions, however, came from Adobe
CF license holders. The folks I've seen on the Railo lists and the
CFEclipse lists tend to mostly ignore Adobe except in such instances
where they need to discuss compatibility, language choices made by
Adobe, etc.  Go take a look at the archives of the lists for those
groups and you'll see that almost none of the discussion has anything
to do with Adobe, let alone be negative about them. Those groups are
all about moving open source CFML offerings forward, not slagging off
on Adobe.

Judah

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 2:36 PM, Russ Michaels  wrote:
>
> Well it may be laughable or ridiculous but happens none the less. I don't
> think anyone is holding the vendor responsible for the behaviour of the
> community (unless those people worked for Adobe perhaps), certainly the
> people I have spoken to just want a community that will help them rather
> than be abusive to them and didn't want to get dragged into the arguments.
> PHP, ASP users will always slag off Coldfusion, ColdFusion users will always
> slag off PHP, ASP etc, but it has always been directed at the language
> rather than the person, but now it seems to be cfml developers attacking
> other cfml developers because of what engine they use. MADNESS
>
>
> Russ
> -Original Message-
> From: Adrocknaphobia [mailto:adrocknapho...@gmail.com]
> Sent: 20 January 2011 21:35
> To: cf-talk
> Subject: Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?
>
>
> Russ,
>
> You're preaching to the choir... well except for that last part which is
> ridiculous. The "open CF" side of the community couldn't be more abusive
> towards Adobe. It's laughable to think that the community holding the OS
> vendors accountable would make someone leave CF.
>
> -Adam
>
> --
> Sent from my open, capable and downright awesome Android-powered device that
> browses the _entire _ web!
> On Jan 20, 2011 10:17 PM, "Russ Michaels"  wrote:
>>
>> I know this has been said before as we have had previous discussions with
>> Adobe and have suggested this and they agreed it was a good idea and I
> know
>> some others have done the same. And I understand this is even being
> trialled
>> in Australia with some products (not CF).
>> SPLA type licensing like Microsoft (or SAAS) would make ColdFusion much
>> more affordable to all the non enterprise customers, and we have confirmed
>> this with many of our own customers.
>>
>> The top reason we hear for customers migrating away from CF is the cost. I
>> don't think this is entirely because of the cost of CF in general as most
>> companies can come up with the cash for a single CF Std license, but the
>> cost of ongoing upgrades or the cost to move to enterprise if they need
> to.
>>
>> The other reasons I hear :-
>>
>> Lack of decent developers (for companies that use contractors primarily)
>> Lack of off the shelf or open source software (can't compete with PHP on
>> that front)
>> Attitude of the CF community (mainly caused by certain people being
> abusive
>> to Railo/BD)
>> Attitude of Adobe
>>
>> Russ
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 11:33 AM, Adrocknaphobia
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Donna,
>>>
>>> Oh, it's not so awkward for us at Adobe. As I mentioned before, we've
> seen
>>> increased adoption for ColdFusion in the public sector. Of course, I have
> a
>>> bit of a different perspective since I talk to so many different agencies
>>> and departments as part of my job.
>>>
>>> What agency do you work for?
>>>
>>> I'm scheduling some CF customer meetings in DC the week of Feb 21. One of
>>> my
>>> managers will be in town and I would like to expose him to some CFML
> shops
>>> that chose to migrate away form ColdFusion. I think getting your teams
>>> perspective would greatly help increase the quality (and business model)
>>> for
>>> ColdFusion.
>>>
>>> -Adam
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 9:46 PM, Donna Bing  wrote:
>>>
>>> >
>>> > Yes I attended CFUnited twice and was very disappointed they had to
> close
>>> > up shop. That's why I was asking about for an alternative at the top of
>>> the
>>> > thread.
>>> >
>>> > I am definitely very interested in what's coming in August. What space
>>> > should I watch, as I gather it hasn't been formally announced?
>>> >
>>> > For now I think we'll be going to the Open CF Summit in Dallas, for the
>>> > emphasis on Open Source.
>>> >
>>> > I think you're completely wrong about open source being a small
> movement
>>> in
>>> > federal government. In fact, I think that was one of Obama's first
>>> > executive actions. Maybe it hasn't taken off yet, but everyone I know
> in
>>> > USDA, Treasury, State and the contractor community is working furiously
>>> at
>>> > slashing IT budgets by moving to OSS and cloud computing.
>>> >
>>> > I know 

Re: Anyone know anything about this new ColdFusion conference?

[Judah McAuley]

On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 1:35 PM, Adrocknaphobia
 wrote:
>
> Russ,
>
> You're preaching to the choir... well except for that last part which is
> ridiculous. The "open CF" side of the community couldn't be more abusive
> towards Adobe. It's laughable to think that the community holding the OS
> vendors accountable would make someone leave CF.

Wait a moment, Adam. Am I misreading you or are you saying that the
"open CF" community is being abusive toward Adobe? Really? Not the
other way around?  I've seen what you guys did with the attempts at a
CFML spec. And I've seen the Railo community be nothing but respectful
toward Adobe. Same with the CFEclipse project. I'm not an OpenBD guy,
so I'm not really familiar with what has gone down there. Maybe you
are talking about the days of New Atlanta? If so, that wasn't "open
CF" but yeah, there were some abusive things.

Maybe this was just a badly phrased email but you seem like you are
putting out a really irresponsible and baseless accusation and I'd
like to get some clarification from you.

Judah

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:341068
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm

Re: Beta Tester Wanted for new CF (MVC) Framework

[Judah McAuley]

No, it's fucking close to water.

An old Monty Python joke. Hollywood Bowl if I recall.

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Mark A. Kruger  wrote:
>
> You mean not so fun when you do it but a great story to tell later??
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Judah McAuley [mailto:ju...@wiredotter.com]
> Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 11:48 AM
> To: cf-talk
> Subject: Re: Beta Tester Wanted for new CF (MVC) Framework
>
>
> It's like making love in a canoe.
>
> On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:42 AM, Mark A. Kruger 
> wrote:
>>
>> On behalf of my friends in Wisconsin... what's wrong with Old Milwaukee?
>>
>
>
>
> 

~|
Order the Adobe Coldfusion Anthology now!
http://www.amazon.com/Adobe-Coldfusion-Anthology/dp/1430272155/?tag=houseoffusion
Archive: 
http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/message.cfm/messageid:340574
Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/subscribe.cfm
Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-talk/unsubscribe.cfm