RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
Now, now... the OSI model DOES have a purpose. It is a reference model - the key word being reference. It isn't the model so much as the fact that it makes it alot easier to look at the various processes discretely rather than as a whole. The OSI model gets you used to the idea that a process is actually multiples processes that are hierarchically dependent (more or less). When one of those little processes breaks down, you have a better idea of where to look. Its like knowing that coughing is generally a sign that the problem is with those funny sacks in your chest that pump air, not the entire body (depending on other symptoms of course). I've never felt that is any use knowing that a specific protocol belongs to a certain layer. Its far more useful to know that a specific protocol performs X duties and that those duties depend on other things being done by something else. The OSI model just gives you a way of keeping those duties/processes in their proper perspective, as parts, not the whole. just my 2 cents... Karen *** REPLY SEPARATOR *** On 12/13/2001 at 10:57 PM Chuck Larrieu wrote: I once had an interesting, if heated argument with someone off list about this. IIRC, I was told by that person that Cisco, in its current CCNP study materials, is saying just that - that something operates at the OSI layer above which it functions. I.e. if a routing protocol uses an IP protocol number, then it is operating at transport layer. Since BGP uses TCP port 179, it is operating at the session layer, along with RIP, which uses UDP port 520. ( BTW, I have also read in a reputable source that UDP is application layer because it is not reliable, and therefore cannot be transport layer, and there is no place else it really fits ) I recognize that Cisco just LOVES the OSI model in the lower level certifications, but the fact is that in terms of how things work it is crap, and tends to cause more confusion and add no value. Every vendor of content switches is calling them layer 4-7 switches. what kind of crap is that? I dare anyone to justify switching as a layer 5 or a layer 6 activity. Yet there it is. Also, to judge from what content switches do, the marketers are saying the OSI layer 7 is user application, not a service application, something Howard takes great pain to differentiate in his writings on the subject, again IIRC. TCP/IP is NOT OSI compliant, never has been, never will be. OSI is a reference model, and not necessarily related to anything in real life. End of rant. Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jose Luis De Abreu Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 12:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Routing protocols [7:29139] Just an open question ? We read, learn and teach Routing protocols are at the NETWORK layer of the famous OSI model... But they have PROTOCOLS NUMBERS - TRANSPORT LAYER(such as IGRP protocol 9, EIGRP protocol 88 and OSPF protocol 89)and APPLICATION PORTS values - APPLICATION LAYER (RIP uses port 520 and BGP4 uses port 179) indicating they work in the upper layers and not in the network layer, although the result is shown int the NETWORK layer... So may question is... Do they really operate at LAYER 3 ? Warm regards, Jose Luis De Abreu __ Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29173t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: The old how to get routes into IGRP qu [7:29021]
the rule of thumb is do what they say, but if something is not expressly forbidden, it is fair game. True.. the idea that some successful Lab takers all tend to agree on, is that going into the Lab you want to have a lot of tools at your disposal. So you can filter redistribution using route tagging, or distribute lists or route maps, for example. the Lab is notorious for presenting you with some underhanded or devious requirement, one which is inside out from the way you might normally do things. after two times through, I am also under the impression that there comes a point where the CCIE Lab designers realize that something is being analyzed to death in the study materials and newsgroups, so they take it out, and put in something else. I have study materials that emphasized things like gateway discovery protocol, and other obscure things. I presume a lot of this kind of stuff shows up in the study materials because of loose lips. Well, they certainly aren't treating the Written Qualification test the same way, otherwise they would really like to change all Que's since most of what cisco tests you on already appears on more popular practice tests. to get back to your question, your Lab book will present you with a general instruction that will say something like do not do A, B, or C, unless otherwise instructed Then a particular requirement might say you may do C to accomplish this or do not do X to accomplish this In the case of the particular practice lab, the instruction was do not use the default-network command which got me to wondering what are some other ways to get a default network into IGRP. Can't use quad zero. can't use a default network. policy routing, and in particular local-policy was the only other thing I could come up with. and it is a real hack. or rather, it can take some real planning. True again. If its not asking for too much, can you let me know a plan that I can follow to crack the lab (already passed the written) I know its difficult to create a plan without actually knowing what I know, and you might say that one size doesnt fit all thats true as well, but there would be a list of Do's donts and a sequence where one should begin and where to end (if there is one :) Also, a list of absolute must technologies that one must know back to front (specially ATM Voice, how much should we concentrate on, isnt Cisco ATM solutions an overkill ?) Thanx Nick -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Nick S. Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 8:11 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: The old how to get routes into IGRP qu [7:29021] Chuck Just curious, from what I have read/heard, we are not supposed to use Static/Default routes (unless explicitly mentioned/specified). I agree that in some cases of VLSM/FLSM redistributions, it may be required and may be asked for as well. So using a glorified default/static route in the form of policy route wouldnt be a violation, would it ? Thanks Nick _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29174t=29021 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
ADSL question [7:29175]
I sould give support to a customer who is testing DHCP out of his local lan. He has a cisco 1750 and he provided me the configuration. In my humble opionion there is something wrong in the configuration I'm sending you below, and I'd like to have your opinion. I don't understand the ADSL solution. It is not RFC1483 bridging or routing, it is not PPPoA or PPPoE. Can anybody give me his/her opinion? Thanks in advance. TP interface ATM0 mtu 1024 no ip address no ip mroute-cache atm vc-per-vp 256 no atm ilmi-keepalive pvc 1/40 vbr-rt 64 64 4 encapsulation aal5mux ppp dialer dialer pool-member 1 ! dsl operating-mode auto bridge-group 1 ! interface FastEthernet0 ip address x 255.255.255.240 no ip redirects no ip mroute-cache speed auto no cdp enable ! interface Dialer0 mtu 1024 bandwidth 128 ip unnumbered FastEthernet0 encapsulation ppp no ip route-cache ip tcp header-compression iphc-format no ip mroute-cache no keepalive dialer pool 1 dialer-group 1 fair-queue 64 256 1000 no cdp enable bridge-group 1 ip rtp header-compression iphc-format ip rtp priority 16384 16383 48 ! ip classless ip route 0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 Dialer0 no ip http server ip pim bidir-enable ! ! bridge 1 protocol ieee call rsvp-sync ! voice-port 1/0 cptone GR timeouts initial 5 timeouts interdigit 3 ! voice-port 1/1 ! no mgcp timer receive-rtcp ! mgcp profile default ! dial-peer cor custom ! ! ! gateway ! ! line con 0 speed 115200 line aux 0 line vty 0 4 login ! no scheduler allocate ntp clock-period 17180542 ntp server source FastEthernet0 prefer end Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29175t=29175 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Cisco lab equipment [7:29079]
pray, how much is too much :) anyway, you can try ccbootcamp aka NLI. I would suggest getting the basic stuff to do routing(and routing and routing), frame relay (4 port serial) etc. and then get rack time to do the more advanced stuff (and obscure ISDN etc.), for 3920 try the 80$ s/w from ccbootcamp (seems really good). hth Nick Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29177t=29079 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Virtual lease-line service over MPLS using DS-TE [7:29176]
Hello there, Has anyone in this group have any experience or tested the virtual lease-line service over MPLS using the DS-TE feature. Cisco has a whitepaper on the service description but no sample config. or design guide for this. Would appreciate it very much if someone can share your experience or any doc. on this. Cheers and MERRY CHRISTMAS!! Mohan Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29176t=29176 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: boot sequence on router [7:29029]
I could possibly list all the options but this url does a better job :) http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/product/access/acs_mod/cis4000/4000m/4000sig/vconfig.htm Nick Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29178t=29029 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: network utilization [7:29051]
There was a problem with riderection so a working address is http://www.nevcos.com/net/ Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29179t=29051 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Router Simulators software [7:29147]
hi rodel, i saw your write up and i just want to let you know that the routerSim 3.0 is the better option. this is because it comes with more functionalities that enables you to practice more complex scenarios. with more routers and switches inside it. ___festus. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29180t=29147 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Router Simulators software [7:29147]
does the router sim 3.0 for the CCNA cert cover the topics covered in the CCNP cert.. CCNA didn't cover EIGRP, OSPF, BGP, route summarization, CIDR, or VLSM. I just bombed the hell out of my cisco netacad sem 5 practical tonight... I'd like to pick up a sim, but I'd rather not waste money on something that's not going to give me the full functionality... Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29181t=29147 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
This may sound like a dumb quesion, but if I send a packet to a different host, where is the subnet mask? Where does a host get the subnet mask info to do an AND operation? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29182t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Correction - about multicast address! [7:29057]
Priscilla, I have a feeling that this type of post is a preview of the sequel to Top Down Network Design, right? Elmer -Original Message- From: Priscilla Oppenheimer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 9:18 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Correction - about multicast address! [7:29057] And you probably also meant to say that the MAC header only has room for one data-link-layer address also. So the IP multicast address is converted to a single MAC multicast address. Applications on end systems register with the NIC to receive packets addressed to particular multicast addresses. The application may also use the Internet Group Management Protocol (IGMP). IGMP allows a host to join a group and inform routers of the need to receive a multicast data stream. When a user (or software) starts a process that requires the host to join a multicast group, the host transmits an IGMP Membership Report message to inform routers on the segment that traffic for the group should be multicast to the host's segment. Although it is possible that a router is already sending data for the group, the IGMP specification states that a host should send a Membership Report in case it is the first member of the group on the network segment. The router does not need to know how many or which specific hosts on a segment belong to a group. The router just needs to recognize that a group has at least one member on a segment so that the router will forward group traffic to that segment using the IP and MAC multicast addresses for the group. By default, a data-link-layer switch floods multicast frames out every port. The Cisco Group Management Protocol (CGMP) and the IETF IGMP Snooping method allow switches to participate in the process of determining which segments have hosts in a particular multicast group. CGMP is a Cisco-proprietary method that lets a router send a message to switches to tell the switches about Membership Reports and Leaves occurring on their segments. IGMP is an IETF standard that causes no extra traffic, but allows a switch to learn from the IGMP messages sent to routers. In addition to determining which local network segments should receive traffic for particular multicast groups, a router must also learn how to route multicast traffic across an internetwork. Multicast routing protocols provide this function. Multicast routing protocols extend the capabilities of a standard routing protocol, which learns paths to destination networks, to include the capability of learning paths to multicast destination addresses. There are numerous multicast routing protocols, some of which are considered obsolescent at this time. The most commonly-used multicast routing protocol today is the Protocol-Independent Multicast (PIM) protocol. Just wanted to add to your excellent explanations. Priscilla At 05:10 PM 12/13/01, Karen E Young wrote: Reding this over I realize that I should have explained a little better... What I should have said is An IP header only has room for one destination address, therefore a MAC must be manufactured for the group rather than a specific device so that the layer-2 protocol (ethernet, token-ring, etc.) can deliver to those routers/switches that belong to the group. The routers/switches can then forward to those group members it has listed if necessary. I should also have mentioned that this means that the NIC needs to be able to recognize the MAC address associated with any multicast groups the device belongs to. Just shows what happens when you try to do too many things at once Karen *** BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE *** On 12/13/2001 at 3:27 PM Karen E Young wrote: Elmer, In fact I have done soem teaching, however, it was the months spent doing phone-tech-support for an ISP that honed the explanation skills. Most of our customers didn't know much about computers and felt alot more confident doing what you tell then to do if you explain WHY in a manner that they can understand. As far as the you can't fit multiple destination MAC addresses into an IP header... I was just explaining why a special multicast MAC address is required for messages sent to a specific Multicast group address. An IP header only has room for one dest. MAC, therefore a MAC must be manufactured for the group rather than a specific device. Glad I was able to help, Karen *** REPLY SEPARATOR *** On 12/13/2001 at 3:27 PM Elmer Deloso wrote: (Corrected message for an earlier posting.) Karen, I have a feeling that you've been in some kind of teaching role before based on how you explain concepts. This makes the picture complete especially when revisiting the previous post by Shawn Kaminski. However, when you say you can't fit multiple destination MAC addresses into an IP header it seems you're referring to the device's mapping of the IP-to-MAC address, since there is no place in the IP header itself
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
good question. if i understand you, you are wondering how the remote device knows your subnet mask? the answer is it does not and it doesn't care either. when you send a packet from your PC to another host in the same network for instance you are saying, according to my network, defined by my netmask, send this packet to the correct host in the ARP table or send out an ARP broadcast to find the destination for my packet. The packet knows if its destined for a local network or a different network simply by comparing the IP address with its subnet mask. This is what your default GW is for. If it sees by the subnet mask that this address is local it strips MAC info and the netmask and forwards the packet to the default gateway. Then the router uses its routing table to find the correct destination for the packet. A receiving host doesn't care about the netmask, only the IP number from which the packet was received. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29185t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
good question. if i understand you, you are wondering how the remote device knows your subnet mask? the answer is it does not and it doesn't care either. when you send a packet from your PC to another host in the same network for instance you are saying, according to my network, defined by my netmask, send this packet to the correct host in the ARP table or send out an ARP broadcast to find the destination for my packet. The packet knows if its destined for a local network or a different network simply by comparing the IP address with its subnet mask. This is what your default GW is for. If it sees by the subnet mask that this address is local it strips MAC info and the netmask and forwards the packet to the default gateway. Then the router uses its routing table to find the correct destination for the packet. A receiving host doesn't care about the netmask, only the IP number from which the packet was received. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29184t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
The sending host uses its own address and mask to decide whether the destination host is on the local subnet or not. If not then the packet is forwarded to the default gateway (unless the host is running dynamic routing). When the packet reaches the router, the router checks the destination IP against it's routing table and forwards it accordingly. I have mist a stage or two out and not followed it through to delivery or explored failure scenarious but I hope answered your question Regards, RB Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29187t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
sorry for the double post, and i meant to say that If it sees by the subnet mask that this address is not local, it strips the MAC info and the netmask and forwards the packet to the default gateway. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29186t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
hidden commands [7:29189]
Hi I know this has been posted here before but anyhow does any one have any hidden commands they what to share. Thanks Jim Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29189t=29189 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
I love to argue, even with myself. One of the problems, ignoring your completely correct statement that TCP/IP has never and will never be OSI compliant, is that the OSI reference model itself has evolved since the original 1984 publication of document ISO 7498 without appendices. Around 1988 or so, the view of the upper layers changed considerably, and there was movement to an object-oriented model among functions in layer 5-7 rather than strict layering. The network layer was also revised so it overlapped into the data link layer, and cleanly dealt with such things as ARP. There were supplemental architecture documents on routing and on management that cleared up a number of the confusions that come from the simplistic model that people are given. By simplistic model, I will merely point out that there is a time in life where it is useful to tell children the daddy has the seed and gives the seed to the mommy. That model doesn't hold up in adolescence, and the classic 7 layer model doesn't hold up in real networking. Unfortunately, some of the more important concepts that have held up are abstract -- the idea of services versus protocols, the idea of service information encapsulated in protocol data units, a convenient notation for showing the hierarchical layering of protocols, etc., are rarely taught outside graduate-level computer science programs. I once had an interesting, if heated argument with someone off list about this. IIRC, I was told by that person that Cisco, in its current CCNP study materials, is saying just that - that something operates at the OSI layer above which it functions. I.e. if a routing protocol uses an IP protocol number, then it is operating at transport layer. The fallacy in this argument is it assumes that management and control follows exactly the same stack as does user data. Since BGP uses TCP port 179, it is operating at the session layer, along with RIP, which uses UDP port 520. ( BTW, I have also read in a reputable source that UDP is application layer because it is not reliable, and therefore cannot be transport layer, and there is no place else it really fits ) Your source, by its own logic, is an application layer function, because it is not reliable. I recognize that Cisco just LOVES the OSI model in the lower level certifications, but the fact is that in terms of how things work it is crap, and tends to cause more confusion and add no value. Every vendor of content switches is calling them layer 4-7 switches. what kind of crap is that? Arguing with myself a bit, I can make a reasonable argument for layer 4 switching, as in TCP load distribution in schemes such as NAT with port translation and load sharing. Using layer 7 (e.g., URL) to do additional resolution of the destination IP address could be called relaying, as it is a little more direct than a directory lookup. NFS portmapper is sort of a host-based switching function. Layer 6 switching makes no sense. I suppose something like a RPC load distributor could do layer 5 switching, but the reality is that distinct layer 5 and 6 protocols are very rare in IP practice. I dare anyone to justify switching as a layer 5 or a layer 6 activity. Yet there it is. Also, to judge from what content switches do, the marketers are saying the OSI layer 7 is user application, not a service application, something Howard takes great pain to differentiate in his writings on the subject, again IIRC. TCP/IP is NOT OSI compliant, never has been, never will be. OSI is a reference model, and not necessarily related to anything in real life. End of rant. Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jose Luis De Abreu Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 12:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Routing protocols [7:29139] Just an open question ? We read, learn and teach Routing protocols are at the NETWORK layer of the famous OSI model... But they have PROTOCOLS NUMBERS - TRANSPORT LAYER(such as IGRP protocol 9, EIGRP protocol 88 and OSPF protocol 89)and APPLICATION PORTS values - APPLICATION LAYER (RIP uses port 520 and BGP4 uses port 179) indicating they work in the upper layers and not in the network layer, although the result is shown int the NETWORK layer... So may question is... Do they really operate at LAYER 3 ? Warm regards, Jose Luis De Abreu __ Send your holiday cheer with http://greetings.yahoo.ca Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29188t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29190t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
To Chuck, I do not agree that the OSI model is crap. Sometimes it can add confusion, but for the most part it is fairly well defined. Also, no one ever said TCP/IP follows the OSI model 100%. The concept of layering is just very easy to see with the OSI model. TCP/IP generally has only layers such as the application, network, transport, and physical. You could throw in datalink in there I suppose. It certainly helps people understand networks. Without the OSI model, it seems like a lot of random musings. TCP/IP has a very clear transport and network and application layer. Then how is it that the TCP/IP suite was developed before the OSI reference model was finished, largely by people that, at the time, were very hostile to the OSI work and vice versa. I was there at the time, and remember European delegates to ISO making comments like we will never use protocols developed by the bomb-crazed American military. Not sure if there was sarcasm or an attack on the reputable source that UDP is an application layer part. I am going to assume so, because it's spot as a transport is very clear. So, it is wrong for me to say that ftp clients and telnet clients use layer 7? (referencing user application vs service application)? Then where would it go? No where? (hence why you say the OSI model is crap?) Client/server is again one of those concepts that sometimes needs to be used precisely. In protocol theory, a client initiates request and a server responds to them, as opposed to a peer-to-peer implementation in which either end can initiate requests. The term client has been overloaded to include user applications _from_ which requests initiate. In formal OSI terminology, any given layer (N) provides a service to an (N)-user entity above it. In the case of the application layer, the (N)-user, where N is equal to layer 7, is above the OSI stack. The point of interface between the application service user and the application service provider is the Application Service Access Point (although this evolved further around 1988). You mention a UNIX background. Isn't the definition of a daemon a process that has no tty-equivalents directly attached? The application layer is the daemon; the user application is the tty-equivalent. To Jose, I feel they do not work at the network layer, and work at the application layer. If it uses protocols, (EIGRP and OSPF) it uses IP RAW which means it skipped the transport component, ultimately I still feel it is at the application layer. In my sophomore year of high school, I _felt_ that a girl named Gail _should_ have reciprocated my affections and lust. She didn't. Just because, Carroll, you feel something, doesn't make it right. Ignoring the TCP/IP work, ISO says you are wrong in its OSI Routeing Framework document, in which routing protocols for layer N are defined as layer management protocols for and of layer N. The transport they use is irrelevant, because their payloads affect layer N directly. Perhaps it is just my roots that routing daemons are still just daemons, programs which run on a box. They dynamically insert information into a routing table. Unix machines still do it, a Cisco router is just an appliance version of a unix box with a routing daemon with multiple interfaces. (without extraneous baggage of course) Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29191t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RFC 1058 RIP ? [7:29192]
Hi all, Just reading the above RFC and have come across the following snag. Looking at the packet format it states that The portion of the datagram from 'address family identifier' through 'metric' may appear upto 25 times On the next page it also states that The maximum datagram size is 512 octets. This includes only the portions of the datagram described above. It does not count the IP or UDP headers. Now, from the 'address family identifier' to the 'metric' field inclusive of each is 20 octets, which when we have 25 entries yields 25 x 20 or 500 octets. Add on the 4 octets from the 'command' field to the 'must be zero' field and we have 504 octets only. Obviously if we add the UDP header we can get 512 octets. So something appears to be amiss or am I missing something ? Phil. __ Do You Yahoo!? Everything you'll ever need on one web page from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my.yahoo.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29192t=29192 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MAC Cookie problems with RSP7000 in a 7000 router [7:29098]
The Reason I think the 7000 is the same is back when they first came out in 95 I had installed one. One of the ethernet IP cards went bad. Got a replacement and I installed it. I then noticed the MAC was the same which thru me off and I thought I reinstalled the wrong card, put the original card back in, same MACs. I then learned, after digging, that the MACs were derived from a chip on the backplane. Don't have a URL to prove anything though just my memory which can be hit or miss;) Dave Daniel Cotts wrote: The RSP7000 contains the following components: A bank of hardware (Media Access Control [MAC]-layer) addresses for the interface ports sniped from: http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/product/core/cis7000/7000_him/7000po vr.htm#xtocid1950512 I can't find proof - but suspect that Dave is thinking of the 7507 which can have two RSPs. Associating the MAC addresses with the chassis makes sense in that case. So it appears that we are back to Paul's original question. BTW is the chip in question soldered on the circuit board? My thought is that if it is removable then one could be sent to Paul to copy. -Original Message- From: MADMAN [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 11:57 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MAC Cookie problems with RSP7000 in a 7000 router [7:29098] If I remember correctly the 7000's maintained the MAC addresses for any potential interface cards on the Dallas chip that is part of the backplane. This way when you replace a line card the MAC address stayed the same. Dave Paul Lalonde wrote: Hi, I've recently installed an RSP7000 upgrade kit into an older 7000-series router. It appears that the EEPROM that maintains the MAC address table for this unit has gone south. The archives mentioned that the RSP7000 would need to be replaced. Is there an easier way? I have access to EEPROM programming equipment.. could this be easily rectified on my own? Paul Lalonde -- David Madland Sr. Network Engineer CCIE# 2016 Qwest Communications Int. Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 612-664-3367 Emotion should reflect reason not guide it Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29193t=29098 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: hidden commands [7:29189]
Jim, look at http://www.boerland.com/dotu/ Regards, Maurizio -Original Message- From: Jim Keny [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 14 December 2001 14:55 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: hidden commands [7:29189] Hi I know this has been posted here before but anyhow does any one have any hidden commands they what to share. Thanks Jim Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29194t=29189 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
He is infected with a virus and is sending that worm to everyone that posts. He probably does not even know that he is infected. Just every message he receives gets a little thank-you note from the virus. You are probably now going to start a backlash on GroupStudy that we do not need. Frankly I think you owe him and the Arab community an apology. Last week, I removed him from the list. But any message sent before the removal will still receive the virus. Of course he is more then welcome to return once the virus has been cleaned. Paul - Original Message - From: Jon Street Newsgroups: groupstudy.cisco Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 8:56 AM Subject: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29198t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: hidden commands [7:29189]
http://www.elemental.net/~lf/undoc/ http://www.nthelp.com/cisco_undoc.htm -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jim Keny Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 7:55 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: hidden commands [7:29189] Hi I know this has been posted here before but anyhow does any one have any hidden commands they what to share. Thanks Jim Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29200t=29189 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
At 09:10 AM 12/14/01 -0500, Howard C. Berkowitz wrote: To Chuck, I do not agree that the OSI model is crap. Sometimes it can add confusion, but for the most part it is fairly well defined. Also, no one ever said TCP/IP follows the OSI model 100%. The concept of layering is just very easy to see with the OSI model. TCP/IP generally has only layers such as the application, network, transport, and physical. You could throw in datalink in there I suppose. It certainly helps people understand networks. Without the OSI model, it seems like a lot of random musings. TCP/IP has a very clear transport and network and application layer. Then how is it that the TCP/IP suite was developed before the OSI reference model was finished, largely by people that, at the time, were very hostile to the OSI work and vice versa. I was there at the time, and remember European delegates to ISO making comments like we will never use protocols developed by the bomb-crazed American military. OSPF and ISIS have some similarities, yet one came out earlier than the other. The similarities were taken as they were developed. Just because it was not set it stone yet, does not mean it did not exist. The standards were not atomically created, they are developed as time goes on. As some parts were done, they probably took it and ran with it. Plus it only seemed like a logical separation. It was mainly for insulation of different layers (as you mentioned, good programming practices) which created these divides. So, I think it is reasonable to still say as a reference model, tcp/ip matched some parts of the osi model. Who stole who, does not matter, they still follow a similar layering for transport and network. And the network layer for the most part, could care less what it runs over as long as that is insulated from them. That seems very real in both practical and theory cases. That is what tcp/ip does, that is what the osi model references. To Jose, I feel they do not work at the network layer, and work at the application layer. If it uses protocols, (EIGRP and OSPF) it uses IP RAW which means it skipped the transport component, ultimately I still feel it is at the application layer. In my sophomore year of high school, I _felt_ that a girl named Gail _should_ have reciprocated my affections and lust. She didn't. Just because, Carroll, you feel something, doesn't make it right. Ignoring the TCP/IP work, ISO says you are wrong in its OSI Routeing Framework document, in which routing protocols for layer N are defined as layer management protocols for and of layer N. The transport they use is irrelevant, because their payloads affect layer N directly. I did not mean I was being definitive. That is why I said I felt. I was not sure, and told him my perspective since he was asking for one. All of us seem to agree that the result / payload affects the network layer. As long as we understand that part, I think that is pretty good. Semantics aside. (That seems to be what Chuck is getting at. Screw the OSI model and semantics, as long as we know what it is doing. However, I think some people are not at that level to even know since we have no semantics to work at all. The important key here is that we understand it resides perhaps at another layer, but affects layer 3. As opposed to it itself being at layer 3.) Anyway, I guess I am totally wrong on this. Sorry for wasting everyone's time I will try not to respond anymore. I just felt that it seemed like a good way to learn, and as a baseline, the OSI model seemed ok, and I thought TCP/IP matched some of it. I guess it does not match it at all, so learn the layering of tcp/ip elsewhere. -Carroll Kong Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29202t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: DLSW on PIX515 [7:29170]
Chris, If your asking how your configure a PIX to allow DLSW to pass through it to a router beyond the PIX, just configure a static nat and conduit/access-list to allow the traffic the way you would any other inbound service. (DLSW uses TCP port 2065) If your asking how you configure DLSW _on_ the PIX, the answer is you don't. The PIX IOS does not have DLSW as a feature. HTH, Kent -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of chris fong Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 10:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DLSW on PIX515 [7:29170] Does anyone have any links on configuring DLSW on a PIX firewall with IOS 6.1 and running NAT? I tried Cisco's website and couldn't find any. Thanks. __ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29201t=29170 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MAC Cookie problems with RSP7000 in a 7000 router [7:29098]
After a couple of off-line emails I think the concensus is that the MAC's are on the RP/RSP but part of the backplane of the 7500! Dave MADMAN wrote: The Reason I think the 7000 is the same is back when they first came out in 95 I had installed one. One of the ethernet IP cards went bad. Got a replacement and I installed it. I then noticed the MAC was the same which thru me off and I thought I reinstalled the wrong card, put the original card back in, same MACs. I then learned, after digging, that the MACs were derived from a chip on the backplane. Don't have a URL to prove anything though just my memory which can be hit or miss;) Dave Daniel Cotts wrote: The RSP7000 contains the following components: A bank of hardware (Media Access Control [MAC]-layer) addresses for the interface ports sniped from: http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/product/core/cis7000/7000_him/7000po vr.htm#xtocid1950512 I can't find proof - but suspect that Dave is thinking of the 7507 which can have two RSPs. Associating the MAC addresses with the chassis makes sense in that case. So it appears that we are back to Paul's original question. BTW is the chip in question soldered on the circuit board? My thought is that if it is removable then one could be sent to Paul to copy. -Original Message- From: MADMAN [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 11:57 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MAC Cookie problems with RSP7000 in a 7000 router [7:29098] If I remember correctly the 7000's maintained the MAC addresses for any potential interface cards on the Dallas chip that is part of the backplane. This way when you replace a line card the MAC address stayed the same. Dave Paul Lalonde wrote: Hi, I've recently installed an RSP7000 upgrade kit into an older 7000-series router. It appears that the EEPROM that maintains the MAC address table for this unit has gone south. The archives mentioned that the RSP7000 would need to be replaced. Is there an easier way? I have access to EEPROM programming equipment.. could this be easily rectified on my own? Paul Lalonde -- David Madland Sr. Network Engineer CCIE# 2016 Qwest Communications Int. Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 612-664-3367 Emotion should reflect reason not guide it -- David Madland Sr. Network Engineer CCIE# 2016 Qwest Communications Int. Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 612-664-3367 Emotion should reflect reason not guide it Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29204t=29098 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help with IP Addressing/VLSM- work project [7:29160]
Hi Sarah, Since all you need is just five usable subnets, the way I go about it is: 2 raise to the power of 3=8 subnets. (You cannot use 2 raise to the power of 2, cos that would give me 4 subnets but I need at least 5 subnets). It means you can not get exactly five subnets, you will have 3 extra subnets for future use. From above you borrowed 3-bits from the last octet of the given IP address for subnet purposes, then going by the last octet the eight bit have these weights (128, 64, 32, 16, 8, 4, 2, 1), since you are using the first three bits then it add up to be 128+64+32=224, now to get the number of IP addresses in each subnet, 256-224=32. It also means your IP addresses would be multiples of 32. The 8 subnets would now be: 1. 65.85.105.0 255.255.255.224 2. 65.85.105.32 255.255.255.224 3. 65.85.105.64 255.255.255.224 4. 65.85.105.96 255.255.255.224 5. 65.85.105.128 255.255.255.224 6. 65.85.105.160 255.255.255.224 7. 65.85.105.192 255.255.255.224 8. 65.85.105.224 255.255.255.224 It is now up to you which five to utilize first. For documentation purposes and ease of troubleshooting, it will be appropriate you use the first five and leave the rest for future development and expansion. Regards Oletu - Original Message - From: Sarah Parker To: Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 8:15 PM Subject: Help with IP Addressing/VLSM- work project [7:29160] Hello Everyone, I am working on a small IP address project and trying to figure out VLSM. Since I am not very good and do not have much experience with IP addressing, I wanted to send this to make sure what I have is correct or if I am really wrong on this one. Thanks in advance for any feedback or corrections!! This is a new network- Current IP Address=65.85.105.0 Mask=255.255.255.0 I need a total of 5 subnets. What I did Took 65.85.105.0, 255.255.255.128 to subnet into 2 networks, This gave me Subnet 1= 65.85.105.0, hosts 1-126, broadcast 127 Subnet 2=65.85.105.128, hosts 129-254, broadcast 255 Took 65.85,105.128 255.255.255.192 to subnet into 4 subnets This gave me Subnet 1=65.85.105.0. hosts 1-62, broadcast 63 Subnet 2=65.85.105.64, hosts 54-126, broadcast 127 Subnet 3=65.85.105.128, hosts 129-190, broadcast 190 Subnet 4=65.85.105.192, hosts 193.254, broadcast 255 So this would give me to use on the network 1=65.85.105.0 255.255.255.128 (17 mask?) 2=65.85.105.0 255.255.255.192 (18 mask?) 3=65.85.105.64 255.255.255.192 4=65.85.105.128 255.255.255.192 5=65.85.105.192 255.255.255.192 Did I do this correctly? This is based on using subnet zero. I am using a public class A but for security reasons I did change the actual real address. Thanks again for everyones feedback. __ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29205t=29160 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: DLSW on PIX515 [7:29170]
If you're asking how to get DLSw+ traffic *through* a PIX, remember that in later IOS releases DLSw+ will attempt to use UDP instead of TCP. If your firewall is allowing TCP traffic into your network for DLSw+ connections, they will suddenly break if you upgrade to an IOS that uses UDP. This can be remedied by either allowing incoming UDP or using 'dlsw udp-disable' on the routers. I have no idea if that helps because I don't know what you're trying to accomplish. I just thought I'd throw it out just in case. John Kent Hundley 12/14/01 8:12:05 AM Chris, If your asking how your configure a PIX to allow DLSW to pass through it to a router beyond the PIX, just configure a static nat and conduit/access-list to allow the traffic the way you would any other inbound service. (DLSW uses TCP port 2065) If your asking how you configure DLSW _on_ the PIX, the answer is you don't. The PIX IOS does not have DLSW as a feature. HTH, Kent -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of chris fong Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 10:21 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: DLSW on PIX515 [7:29170] Does anyone have any links on configuring DLSW on a PIX firewall with IOS 6.1 and running NAT? I tried Cisco's website and couldn't find any. Thanks. __ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29206t=29170 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CCIE R/S Written changing in 2002? [7:29168]
At 12:20 AM 12/14/2001 -0500, you wrote: Does anyone know if the exam format will change in January? More questions, longer exam? Here's the response I got when I asked that question to someone who knows... Hi Berry, While we do plan on revising the RS written exam no date has been set on when these revisions will be completed. However, it will be released in a beta version prior to it's final release. Regards, Melody At 06:50 AM 12/4/2001 -0800, you wrote: Original-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi. I'm currently planning to take the CCIE qualification exam in February, but I'm hearing rumors that the exam is being changed or updated. Can you give me any real information? Thanks, Berry Mobley - Melody Green Cisco Systems - CCIE Lab 7025 Kit Creek Road RTP, NC 27709 Phone: (919) 392-0210 Facsimile: (919) 392-0166 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Check out our CCIE Website at: http://www.cisco.com/go/ccie/ Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29207t=29168 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
PIX 501 Question [7:29208]
I am wondering if I can use Pix 501 for a web server firewall? It says that it can handle 3500 Concurrent connections (I wont have 3500, but i dont want to be cut off). I am wondering if I will come into any issues when doing this. If get the 10 pack license, that only restricts my outbound traffic. I know it has presets to allow ports, but I am wondering can you customize access lists in it, say if I wanted to allow inbound port 85, cause my ISP blocks 80 etc, that is not a preset. Also if anyone is selling a new one, i would be interested in getting a price list. Thanks! Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29208t=29208 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
At 09:10 AM 12/14/01 -0500, Howard C. Berkowitz wrote: To Chuck, I do not agree that the OSI model is crap. Sometimes it can add confusion, but for the most part it is fairly well defined. Also, no one ever said TCP/IP follows the OSI model 100%. The concept of layering is just very easy to see with the OSI model. TCP/IP generally has only layers such as the application, network, transport, and physical. You could throw in datalink in there I suppose. It certainly helps people understand networks. Without the OSI model, it seems like a lot of random musings. TCP/IP has a very clear transport and network and application layer. Then how is it that the TCP/IP suite was developed before the OSI reference model was finished, largely by people that, at the time, were very hostile to the OSI work and vice versa. I was there at the time, and remember European delegates to ISO making comments like we will never use protocols developed by the bomb-crazed American military. OSPF and ISIS have some similarities, yet one came out earlier than the other. The similarities were taken as they were developed. Just because it was not set it stone yet, does not mean it did not exist. Huh? The standards were not atomically created, they are developed as time goes on. Yes, I know. I was there. Were you? As some parts were done, they probably took it and ran with it. Plus it only seemed like a logical separation. It was mainly for insulation of different layers (as you mentioned, good programming practices) which created these divides. So, I think it is reasonable to still say as a reference model, tcp/ip matched some parts of the osi model. Who stole who, does not matter, they still follow a similar layering for transport and network. And the network layer for the most part, could care less what it runs over as long as that is insulated from them. Quoting Winston Churchill when challenged by an indignant dowager, Prime minister, you are drunk, drunk, very drunk, and disgustingly drunk, WSC replied, Madam, I am indeed drunk, drunk, very drunk, and disgustingly drunk. And, Madam, you are ugly, ugly, very ugly, and disgustingly ugly. And further, Madam, in the morning, I shall be sober. In this case, what is definitive are specific ISO or IETF architectural documents about the placement of routing protocols, not textbooks that paraphrase standards or personal opinions without direct experience with the protocol standards development process. This is not to say that some of these issues are quite subtle. Believe me, these are being very actively examined in the IETF (or more specifically the Internet Research Task Force) as we look at the routing architecture to follow BGP. I'm coauthor of one early document in this area, http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-davies-fdr-reqs-01.txt This paper has lots of holes in it and is intended to stimulate debate, which mostly is going on in the IRTF-RR working group. (routing research) That seems very real in both practical and theory cases. That is what tcp/ip does, that is what the osi model references. similar doesn't cut it when you are dealing with abstract models (in the sense of abstract algebra, which DOES apply to protocol design). To Jose, I feel they do not work at the network layer, and work at the application layer. If it uses protocols, (EIGRP and OSPF) it uses IP RAW which means it skipped the transport component, ultimately I still feel it is at the application layer. In my sophomore year of high school, I _felt_ that a girl named Gail _should_ have reciprocated my affections and lust. She didn't. Just because, Carroll, you feel something, doesn't make it right. Ignoring the TCP/IP work, ISO says you are wrong in its OSI Routeing Framework document, in which routing protocols for layer N are defined as layer management protocols for and of layer N. The transport they use is irrelevant, because their payloads affect layer N directly. I did not mean I was being definitive. That is why I said I felt. I was not sure, and told him my perspective since he was asking for one. All of us seem to agree that the result / payload affects the network layer. As long as we understand that part, I think that is pretty good. Semantics aside. May I politely suggest that feelings aren't necessarily going to suppport success either with Cisco exams or operational practice, if there are more definitive references that contradict it? (That seems to be what Chuck is getting at. Screw the OSI model and semantics, as long as we know what it is doing. However, I think some people are not at that level to even know since we have no semantics to work at all. The important key here is that we understand it resides perhaps at another layer, but affects layer 3. As opposed to it itself being at layer 3.) Anyway, I guess I am totally wrong on this. Sorry for wasting everyone's time I will try not to respond
RE: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Worm? If I said that about all the viruses I have had pop up here in the last few months, I'd have no friends left at all. I personally think he got tagged and that it was unintentional on his part. MikeS Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29203t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
I have received numerous viruses from people on this list including the individual you mentioned. I do not consider them personal attacks. This message on the other hand. This type of nonsense just feeds ignorance and hatred and is inappropriate for this forum. On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Jon Street wrote: Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29199t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Cisco lab equipment [7:29079]
Stephane, Let me know what you're looking for, or how much you'd like to spend and we can help you out. We typically recommend 7-9 routers, and ISDN simulator, a cat5k switch, and accessories. If you can come up with a budget amount, I can help you put a lab together we've helped quite a few groupstudy members already. thanks, -Brad Ellis CCIE#5796 (RS / Security) Network Learning Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] used Cisco gear: www.optsys.net CCIE Labs, racks, and classes: http://www.ccbootcamp.com/quicklinks.html Stephane Wantou Siantou wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... Hi everyone, Does anybody know where and how to get Cisco equipment cheap? I would like to invest in a Cisco lab to prepare for the CCIE lab but I don't have too much money. Stephane Wantou Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29210t=29079 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Token Ring and Mainframe computer [7:25167]
yes , it can be connected directly with a token-ring adapter installed on it , this adapter is called OSA card and you could use it for both IP and SNA. John Tafasi a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Group, Can the IBM mainframe computer be connected directly to the token ring? Thanks John Tafasi ___ watch your phone call records on the web at: http://www.freedomstar.com/sh1885969 Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29211t=25167 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
Just a message to those who (like me!) thinking that reading, doing labs and taking multiple choice test will prepare you for the real world and (hopefully)the CCIE lab need to be exposed to cisco's network accademy semester 5 skills final . I just took it yesterday and failed . In fact the whole class failed. One of our students who scored high on most test and blazed through the final written exam in 10 mins, walked out in frustration . Another student who works as an administrator, was are best chance of having someone pass missed it . I myself knew after an hour that if you don't have those commands down cold with a solid understanding of how to implement them your GOOSE is cooked !!! . You do have the option to have your own written notes to help but that might weigh you down if too much is in front of you . Working on idividual labs is one thing but putting the whole environment together is a whole different animal . Once given the actual skills asessment designing, implementing and trouble shooting you assume that this ones in the bag . The environment wasn't large and looking back at the running config's there wasnt much to them other than having MED and CBAC . Ah!!! but how wrong I was!!! I'll spare the details and say that this was an eye opener . It showed me what I really don't know and to do the job in the real world will take a lot work on my part . Buyer Beware !!! Overall it was good to go through and to be pushed just shows the weak areas FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CID: Token Ring and Mainframe computer [7:25166]
it can be connected also directly by using an OSA token-ring adapter in the HOST and its configuration in the mainframe is similar to the CIP card on the router , they are both generated by an XCA node . there many types of OSA cards that work with both SNA and IP , they use Token Ring or Ehternet or even Fast Ethernet and GigaEthernet. their behaviour is the same as the CIP router , but the diffirent is with the router you can move some processor intsensive tasks in the router from the mainframe such as TN3270e and TCP offload. off course for both CIP router and OSA card there are some funtion that you can not use such as SNI function of FEP wich consists of routing between tow FEPs in SNA subarea environment.This needs migration from Subarea to APPN. Priscilla Oppenheimer a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] The mainframe would probably attach to the Token Ring network via a Front End Processor (FEP) which would have a Token Ring Interface Card (TIC). The FEP could be replaced with a router with a CIP. Priscilla At 12:25 AM 11/3/01, John Tafasi wrote: Hi Group, Can the IBM mainframe computer be connected directly to the token ring? Thanks John Tafasi ___ watch your phone call records on the web at: http://www.freedomstar.com/sh1885969 Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29213t=25166 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
Are you referring to the CCNP academy? -junovtv Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29215t=29212 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CCNP exam [7:29216]
Hi All, Does anyone know the difference between these 2 sets from Cisco Press? -CCNP Certification Library -CCNP Preparation Library Which one is better to study to CCNP exam? Regards Luiz Olivieri CCNA Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29216t=29216 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
A bit OT: HSRP troubles.... [7:29217]
Hi all, At this particular site I have 2 1750's. One has an ISDN WIC, the other has WIC-1T. The serial router has a frame connection, the ISDN router is the backup. Both routers' ethernet interfaces are plugged in to the same hub, not sure of speed or brand. The IP addresses are 172.16.10.10 for the serial router 172.16.10.11 for the ISDN router 172.16.10.12 for the HSRP address. The priority on the serial router is set to 255, and 10 on the isdn router. I have since found that these numbers are not optimal (I am tracking the serial interface), and they will be changed. The problem is (or possibly was) that all of the users and the server at this site had their default gateways incorrectly set to the ip address of the serial router, instead of the HSRP address. This worked fine, except that every 3 days or so, a huge amount of collisions would happen, and the network would stop. To fix it, they unplug the ethernet from the serial router, and plug it back in. I have not had the luxury of a packet sniffer to see exactly what was happening, and since the clients and the server had their DG's changed to the HSRP address, the problem no longer exists. I have another site with the same config (different hub, or may be a switch), same router types and same IOS revisions, and they have never had the problem. The IOS revisions are different on the two routers. Anyone seen this before? I intend to log a call with Cisco, but thought I would ask here first. Cheers, Symon Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29217t=29217 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Can we just invest in a decent mail reader? Or maybe download pegasus..it's free! Anyone for elm? Chris White 12/14/01 11:55AM I have received numerous viruses from people on this list including the individual you mentioned. I do not consider them personal attacks. This message on the other hand. This type of nonsense just feeds ignorance and hatred and is inappropriate for this forum. On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, Jon Street wrote: Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29214t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
V92 dial in problems (microsoft) [7:29218]
Hi all, I seem to remember someone providing a link to a page which gave information regarding a microsoft problem with dialling in using V92. This was a problem which was attributable to Microsoft and configurable. I think Paul may still be doing some work on the server, so I am unable to search the archives and I can't find anything about it at Microsoft. Has anybody got the link or the information please? Thanks, Gaz Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29218t=29218 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
At 10:57 PM 12/13/01 -0500, Chuck Larrieu wrote: I once had an interesting, if heated argument with someone off list about this. IIRC, I was told by that person that Cisco, in its current CCNP study materials, is saying just that - that something operates at the OSI layer above which it functions. I.e. if a routing protocol uses an IP protocol number, then it is operating at transport layer. Since BGP uses TCP port 179, it is operating at the session layer, along with RIP, which uses UDP port 520. ( BTW, I have also read in a reputable source that UDP is application layer because it is not reliable, and therefore cannot be transport layer, and there is no place else it really fits ) Chuck, This is obviously nonsense, as I know that you know. I'm not criticizing you, since you are quoting someone else, but this was a quote that should have been routed directly to the null interface! ;-) I recognize that Cisco just LOVES the OSI model in the lower level certifications, but the fact is that in terms of how things work it is crap, and tends to cause more confusion and add no value. I disagree. I think the OSI model adds a lot of value for understanding the functions of a protocol. It helps one understand what types of services a protocol provides and what services it uses from the layer below. Every vendor of content switches is calling them layer 4-7 switches. what kind of crap is that? Switching of messages happens at all layers. That's the point of networking! But the methods for doing it and the data used to do it differs with each layer. Routing protocols are in the management and control side of the network layer. They allow routers to learn how to switch packets based on network-layer addresses. People get themselves in trouble when they characterize the layer that a protocol works at by which protocols run below it and the number of protocols that run below it. Routing protocols are not the only weird ones. NetBIOS is a session-layer protocol, for example, but in a NetBEUI implementation, it runs above LLC. That's doesn't change which OSI layer it fits into best. Consider ISDN. ISDN has three layers. Running above ISDN may be the Point-to-Point Protocol (PPP), which is usually considered a data-link-layer protocol, although it has four layers of its own. Its top layer provides a set of Network Control Protocols (NCPs) that are used to establish and configure upper-layer protocols such as IP and IPX. Trying to force all these layers into seven layers, especially when you need to anchor IP at Layer 3, because you know it's a network-layer protocol, can lead to frustration. It's best to just consider what services ISDN and PPP offers and how they are used in typical networks, and stuff them into the data-link layer. With routing protocols, the important thing is that when you configure and troubleshoot them, you aren't going to spend too much time considering transport or application-layer issues. You aren't going to analyze sequence numbers, ACKs, retransmissions, etc. You are going to focus on network-layer issues such as addressing, forwarding, routing, router configs, VLSM, classful versus classless, IP subnet zero, etc. This is another one of those issues that is simply not worth debating. Routing protocols clearly work at the network layer. I said all this much better the last time this came up. ;-) See the archives. Priscilla I dare anyone to justify switching as a layer 5 or a layer 6 activity. Yet there it is. Also, to judge from what content switches do, the marketers are saying the OSI layer 7 is user application, not a service application, something Howard takes great pain to differentiate in his writings on the subject, again IIRC. TCP/IP is NOT OSI compliant, never has been, never will be. OSI is a reference model, and not necessarily related to anything in real life. End of rant. Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jose Luis De Abreu Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 12:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Routing protocols [7:29139] Just an open question ? We read, learn and teach Routing protocols are at the NETWORK layer of the famous OSI model... But they have PROTOCOLS NUMBERS - TRANSPORT LAYER(such as IGRP protocol 9, EIGRP protocol 88 and OSPF protocol 89)and APPLICATION PORTS values - APPLICATION LAYER (RIP uses port 520 and BGP4 uses port 179) indicating they work in the upper layers and not in the network layer, although the result is shown int the NETWORK layer... So may question is... Do they really operate at LAYER 3 ? Warm regards, Jose Luis De Abreu Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29220t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info:
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
From its own local config. The mask isn't in the IP packet, which does come as a surpise to some people! If this isn't what you're getting at, just let us know... Priscilla At 08:20 AM 12/14/01, you wrote: This may sound like a dumb quesion, but if I send a packet to a different host, where is the subnet mask? Where does a host get the subnet mask info to do an AND operation? Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29221t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Correction - about multicast address! [7:29057]
It does help to have the option of copy and pasting from one's current work! ;-) A few people have asked, and I responded a couple times, but I think they all got filtered (hmm what does that mean?), but I am working on a new book on troubleshooting and protocol analysis. It will cover all Cisco Support test topics and many topics for the Routing Switching CCIE written test. The writing is almost done, but the production, editing, etc. takes forever, so stay tuned. Thanks for asking! Priscilla At 08:37 AM 12/14/01, Elmer Deloso wrote: Priscilla, I have a feeling that this type of post is a preview of the sequel to Top Down Network Design, right? Elmer -Original Message- From: Priscilla Oppenheimer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2001 9:18 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Correction - about multicast address! [7:29057] And you probably also meant to say that the MAC header only has room for one data-link-layer address also. So the IP multicast address is converted to a single MAC multicast address. Applications on end systems register with the NIC to receive packets addressed to particular multicast addresses. The application may also use the Internet Group Management Protocol (IGMP). IGMP allows a host to join a group and inform routers of the need to receive a multicast data stream. When a user (or software) starts a process that requires the host to join a multicast group, the host transmits an IGMP Membership Report message to inform routers on the segment that traffic for the group should be multicast to the host's segment. Although it is possible that a router is already sending data for the group, the IGMP specification states that a host should send a Membership Report in case it is the first member of the group on the network segment. The router does not need to know how many or which specific hosts on a segment belong to a group. The router just needs to recognize that a group has at least one member on a segment so that the router will forward group traffic to that segment using the IP and MAC multicast addresses for the group. By default, a data-link-layer switch floods multicast frames out every port. The Cisco Group Management Protocol (CGMP) and the IETF IGMP Snooping method allow switches to participate in the process of determining which segments have hosts in a particular multicast group. CGMP is a Cisco-proprietary method that lets a router send a message to switches to tell the switches about Membership Reports and Leaves occurring on their segments. IGMP is an IETF standard that causes no extra traffic, but allows a switch to learn from the IGMP messages sent to routers. In addition to determining which local network segments should receive traffic for particular multicast groups, a router must also learn how to route multicast traffic across an internetwork. Multicast routing protocols provide this function. Multicast routing protocols extend the capabilities of a standard routing protocol, which learns paths to destination networks, to include the capability of learning paths to multicast destination addresses. There are numerous multicast routing protocols, some of which are considered obsolescent at this time. The most commonly-used multicast routing protocol today is the Protocol-Independent Multicast (PIM) protocol. Just wanted to add to your excellent explanations. Priscilla At 05:10 PM 12/13/01, Karen E Young wrote: Reding this over I realize that I should have explained a little better... What I should have said is An IP header only has room for one destination address, therefore a MAC must be manufactured for the group rather than a specific device so that the layer-2 protocol (ethernet, token-ring, etc.) can deliver to those routers/switches that belong to the group. The routers/switches can then forward to those group members it has listed if necessary. I should also have mentioned that this means that the NIC needs to be able to recognize the MAC address associated with any multicast groups the device belongs to. Just shows what happens when you try to do too many things at once Karen *** BEGIN FORWARDED MESSAGE *** On 12/13/2001 at 3:27 PM Karen E Young wrote: Elmer, In fact I have done soem teaching, however, it was the months spent doing phone-tech-support for an ISP that honed the explanation skills. Most of our customers didn't know much about computers and felt alot more confident doing what you tell then to do if you explain WHY in a manner that they can understand. As far as the you can't fit multiple destination MAC addresses into an IP header... I was just explaining why a special multicast MAC address is required for messages sent to a specific Multicast group address. An IP header only has room for one dest. MAC, therefore a MAC must be manufactured for the group rather than a specific device. Glad I was able to help, Karen
Re: CCNP exam [7:29216]
At 12:42 PM 12/14/01, Olivieri Luiz-Q14637 wrote: Hi All, Does anyone know the difference between these 2 sets from Cisco Press? -CCNP Certification Library These are the actual courses, ported to book format. The authors were really editors who put the course into book format, which is not a huge effort because Cisco courses have tons of text (not just PowerPoint bullets). -CCNP Preparation Library These are written by a (non-Cisco) author to help you study and really understand the material. They may go beyond the course, but they may also leave things out of the course. The assumption is that you have taken the course or that you are advanced enough that you didn't need the course. Which one is better to study to CCNP exam? Regards Luiz Olivieri CCNA Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29223t=29216 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
I like your humble spirit and your admission that you need to learn more to do well in the real world (and CCIE), but I would also recommend that you not beat yourself up about this particular test. It doesn't sound like a good test. The test should match what you learned in the semester. Newer educational theories say that the goal should be for everyone to pass a final exam. If everyone passes, then the class worked. It sounds like some old-fashioned meanie wrote this test. Don't get too upset by it. Priscilla At 12:32 PM 12/14/01, brian hall wrote: Just a message to those who (like me!) thinking that reading, doing labs and taking multiple choice test will prepare you for the real world and (hopefully)the CCIE lab need to be exposed to cisco's network accademy semester 5 skills final . I just took it yesterday and failed . In fact the whole class failed. One of our students who scored high on most test and blazed through the final written exam in 10 mins, walked out in frustration . Another student who works as an administrator, was are best chance of having someone pass missed it . I myself knew after an hour that if you don't have those commands down cold with a solid understanding of how to implement them your GOOSE is cooked !!! . You do have the option to have your own written notes to help but that might weigh you down if too much is in front of you . Working on idividual labs is one thing but putting the whole environment together is a whole different animal . Once given the actual skills asessment designing, implementing and trouble shooting you assume that this ones in the bag . The environment wasn't large and looking back at the running config's there wasnt much to them other than having MED and CBAC . Ah!!! but how wrong I was!!! I'll spare the details and say that this was an eye opener . It showed me what I really don't know and to do the job in the real world will take a lot work on my part . Buyer Beware !!! Overall it was good to go through and to be pushed just shows the weak areas FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29224t=29212 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
At 08:52 AM 12/14/01, Howard C. Berkowitz wrote: Layer 6 switching makes no sense. I suppose something like a RPC load distributor could do layer 5 switching, but the reality is that distinct layer 5 and 6 protocols are very rare in IP practice. At Layer 5, I would say that RPC switches the packet to the correct process by using the transaction ID. I agree that switching at Layer 6 doesn't make sense. Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29225t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29226t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
By the way, for what it's worth, which is not much ;-), client/server postdates a lot of protocols too. FTP uses the terms user process and server process. SMB uses the terms consumer and server. Priscilla At 09:10 AM 12/14/01, Howard C. Berkowitz wrote: To Chuck, I do not agree that the OSI model is crap. Sometimes it can add confusion, but for the most part it is fairly well defined. Also, no one ever said TCP/IP follows the OSI model 100%. The concept of layering is just very easy to see with the OSI model. TCP/IP generally has only layers such as the application, network, transport, and physical. You could throw in datalink in there I suppose. It certainly helps people understand networks. Without the OSI model, it seems like a lot of random musings. TCP/IP has a very clear transport and network and application layer. Then how is it that the TCP/IP suite was developed before the OSI reference model was finished, largely by people that, at the time, were very hostile to the OSI work and vice versa. I was there at the time, and remember European delegates to ISO making comments like we will never use protocols developed by the bomb-crazed American military. Not sure if there was sarcasm or an attack on the reputable source that UDP is an application layer part. I am going to assume so, because it's spot as a transport is very clear. So, it is wrong for me to say that ftp clients and telnet clients use layer 7? (referencing user application vs service application)? Then where would it go? No where? (hence why you say the OSI model is crap?) Client/server is again one of those concepts that sometimes needs to be used precisely. In protocol theory, a client initiates request and a server responds to them, as opposed to a peer-to-peer implementation in which either end can initiate requests. The term client has been overloaded to include user applications _from_ which requests initiate. In formal OSI terminology, any given layer (N) provides a service to an (N)-user entity above it. In the case of the application layer, the (N)-user, where N is equal to layer 7, is above the OSI stack. The point of interface between the application service user and the application service provider is the Application Service Access Point (although this evolved further around 1988). You mention a UNIX background. Isn't the definition of a daemon a process that has no tty-equivalents directly attached? The application layer is the daemon; the user application is the tty-equivalent. To Jose, I feel they do not work at the network layer, and work at the application layer. If it uses protocols, (EIGRP and OSPF) it uses IP RAW which means it skipped the transport component, ultimately I still feel it is at the application layer. In my sophomore year of high school, I _felt_ that a girl named Gail _should_ have reciprocated my affections and lust. She didn't. Just because, Carroll, you feel something, doesn't make it right. Ignoring the TCP/IP work, ISO says you are wrong in its OSI Routeing Framework document, in which routing protocols for layer N are defined as layer management protocols for and of layer N. The transport they use is irrelevant, because their payloads affect layer N directly. Perhaps it is just my roots that routing daemons are still just daemons, programs which run on a box. They dynamically insert information into a routing table. Unix machines still do it, a Cisco router is just an appliance version of a unix box with a routing daemon with multiple interfaces. (without extraneous baggage of course) Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29227t=29139 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
At 10:57 PM 12/13/01 -0500, Chuck Larrieu wrote: I once had an interesting, if heated argument with someone off list about this. IIRC, I was told by that person that Cisco, in its current CCNP study materials, is saying just that - that something operates at the OSI layer above which it functions. I.e. if a routing protocol uses an IP protocol number, then it is operating at transport layer. Since BGP uses TCP port 179, it is operating at the session layer, along with RIP, which uses UDP port 520. ( BTW, I have also read in a reputable source that UDP is application layer because it is not reliable, and therefore cannot be transport layer, and there is no place else it really fits ) Chuck, This is obviously nonsense, as I know that you know. I'm not criticizing you, since you are quoting someone else, but this was a quote that should have been routed directly to the null interface! ;-) I recognize that Cisco just LOVES the OSI model in the lower level certifications, but the fact is that in terms of how things work it is crap, and tends to cause more confusion and add no value. I disagree. I think the OSI model adds a lot of value for understanding the functions of a protocol. It helps one understand what types of services a protocol provides and what services it uses from the layer below. Priscilla, I agree the layering concepts, not the layers themselves, are what is important. For whatever reason, however, a great many sources, including Cisco, completely ignore the architecturally critical difference between services and protocols. Your comment above, in a way, is that of an expert that has internalized the idea of service provision and service use, but most OSI discussions focus completely on protocol exchange. Every vendor of content switches is calling them layer 4-7 switches. what kind of crap is that? Switching of messages happens at all layers. That's the point of networking! But the methods for doing it and the data used to do it differs with each layer. Routing protocols are in the management and control side of the network layer. They allow routers to learn how to switch packets based on network-layer addresses. People get themselves in trouble when they characterize the layer that a protocol works at by which protocols run below it and the number of protocols that run below it. Routing protocols are not the only weird ones. NetBIOS is a session-layer protocol, for example, but in a NetBEUI implementation, it runs above LLC. That's doesn't change which OSI layer it fits into best. Consider ISDN. ISDN has three layers. Running above ISDN may be the Point-to-Point Protocol (PPP), which is usually considered a data-link-layer protocol, although it has four layers of its own. Its top layer provides a set of Network Control Protocols (NCPs) that are used to establish and configure upper-layer protocols such as IP and IPX. Trying to force all these layers into seven layers, especially when you need to anchor IP at Layer 3, because you know it's a network-layer protocol, can lead to frustration. It's best to just consider what services ISDN and PPP offers and how they are used in typical networks, and stuff them into the data-link layer. Especially with ISDN, the differentiation among management/control and user planes is important. The D channel stack, of course, is control oriented (I shall, with lordly disdain, ignore X.25 over LAP-D and V.120). Current practice tends to blur the distinction between control (host-to-network) and management (intranetwork), although I still find that useful. NCP, as of course you know, are control plane protocols for PPP, not necessarily seen at the data link service interface. In the updated OSI Internal Organization of the Network Layer, NCP also could be considered Subnetwork Dependent Access Protocols. With routing protocols, the important thing is that when you configure and troubleshoot them, you aren't going to spend too much time considering transport or application-layer issues. You aren't going to analyze sequence numbers, ACKs, retransmissions, etc. You are going to focus on network-layer issues such as addressing, forwarding, routing, router configs, VLSM, classful versus classless, IP subnet zero, etc. Users are test programs for user applications. User applications are test programs for upper layer protocols. Upper layer protocols are test programs for the network layer, which is interesting. Protocols below the network layers are its slaves, unruly slaves at times. This is another one of those issues that is simply not worth debating. Routing protocols clearly work at the network layer. I said all this much better the last time this came up. ;-) See the archives. Priscilla I dare anyone to justify switching as a layer 5 or a layer 6 activity. Yet there it is. Also, to judge from what content switches do, the marketers are saying the OSI layer 7 is user application, not a
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
For your genral culture I m ARABIC , somtimes I receive viruses from messages in this board and other messages from many people in multiple countries , I do not consider them personal attacks and I m not angry with no body , this board is for arabs , Jews , US citzens , chineese ..to share their technical knowlege and exchange experiences , not for off topics. If you have problems with this guy , please treat with him directly and let this board for Cisco subjects. Jon Street a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29219t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes into [7:29229]
It occurs to me that there is another answer to this problem. So as a Friday Follies question: what is the other answer I came up with? Remember, the IGRP domain is /28 the OSPF domain contains routes /27 and shorter. You must assure reachability to all interfaces in the OSPF domain. You are not allowed to use a default network or any static routes to attain this end. for extra credit - make it funny. I will be needing a good laugh after the dentist is through with me this afternoon. :-O Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Chuck Larrieu Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 7:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The old how to get routes into IGRP question again - possible [7:29021] (REPOST) I've been fighting with one of my practice labs the last couple of days. The problem is one of those OSPF to IGRP redistribution with a twist. The IGRP domain is /28. So how to get those shorter /24 prefixes advertised. Oh yeah, you can't use the default-network command to create an IGRP default route. So let me offer this possibility. IP local policy route-map the route map then goes something like this: route-map igrp-default permit 10 set default interface [whatever the interface is] I also suspect that set ip default next-hop x.x.x.x works also, but at the time I was testing I hadn't thought through all the implications, and my test failed. In any case, the local policy would have to be implemented on all routers in the IGRP domain. A bit of planning, then, is required. I found out something else that was interesting. Local policy packets seem to have a particular way they are constructed. the first time I looked at my debug ip packet, the source address was one of my loopback addresses, which I was not advertising under IGRP. So of course my pings failed, because the distant end did not have a route back. So I deleted the loopback, tried again, and this time the source address was a LAN interface, this too not advertised under IGRP. I am assuming that Cisco has a hierarchy of interfaces. Usually a ping is sourced at the interface out which the packets are headed. But for local policy, it was different. Any case, I am offering these observations for consideration. Wish I hadn't turned my routers off last night. Or I could gather some screen shots. Chuck Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29229t=29229 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
** PRIVATE ** The problem here is that your premise is incorrect. 172.16.0.0/16 *includes* 172.16.2.0/24 so they are *not* different networks. If you configure your VLSM correctly you will not have this problem. Let's say you had a router with two ethernet interfaces. You would not want to configure one with the 172.16.0.0/16 network and the other with the 172.16.2.0/24 network. In fact, the router might not let you. That wouldn't stop you from trying to do this using two different routers, though. Still, the point is that in your example you have incorrectly configured overlapping networks. HTH, John Steven A. Ridder 12/14/01 12:07:04 PM Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29230t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
H, interesting! I am taking this class and any help you can give me, would be much appreciated! I have heard it's a bear too. Doug Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29231t=29212 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
Because the major network was subnetted, it includes all networks under it. Therefore it's the same network, just subnetted. Do I have it right? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29232t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
A host on the 172.16.x.x/16 network would have to have a specific route for 172.16.2.x/24, or the packet would not be directed to a router, and (Ignoring proxy arp) the communication would fail. If proxy arp was enabled on the local router, and the router was configured with a mask smaller than /16, it would work. ejh -Original Message- From: Steven A. Ridder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 2:07 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182] Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29233t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
You can't do that, it's a no no, network 1 thinks he's connected to 172.16.0.1 - 172.16.255.254 which obviouly OVERLAPS network 2, see: http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/cisintwk/ito_doc/ip.htm Dave Steven A. Ridder wrote: Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? -- David Madland Sr. Network Engineer CCIE# 2016 Qwest Communications Int. Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 612-664-3367 Emotion should reflect reason not guide it Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29234t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
Right off the bat, you're talking about a disfunctional network. I'll get to that in a second. Your two hosts are never going to acknowledge each others' existence. In fact, if you look at the internal routing table of either host by doing a route print you'll see (among other things) this entry: Network Address Netmask Gateway Address 172.16.2.1 255.255.255.255 127.0.0.1 So if host A tries to ping host B, it's just going to ping itself (remember, 127.0.0.1 is a loopback). Granted, it may keep host A from feeling lonely (kinda like sending yourself flowers on Velentine's Day) but host A won't communicate with host B on its best day. Now ask yourslf this: when a host from a different network tries to send traffic to 172.16.2.1, will it go to host A or host B? Answer that question and come up with a solid justification for your answer, and much of your confusion will vanish in a poof of one's and zero's. hth, Hal Logan Network Specialist / Adjunct Faculty Computing and Engineering Technology Manatee Community College -Original Message- From: Steven A. Ridder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 2:07 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182] Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29235t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Routing protocols [7:29139]
In regards to certification is where the problem lies. I enjoy learning and trying to apply the theories associated with the OSI model. But, when facing questions during certification exams things can get sticky. If faced with a question about whether ARP is Layer 2 or Layer 3, what does the exam taker do? I took Chuck's post to be a vent on such situations. Perhaps I misunderstood Chuck. But that certainly is my concern. Having accomplished NA, NP, DP and now studying for IE, I've found that not only am I learning new information, I'm also re-visiting material I've already covered but having to do so in much more detail. I'm really enjoying it all. But, when dealing in such a technical and precise field it's difficult to see that such matters aren't easily explained. The irony is that the discussions/arguments often lead me to understand something much better. But when it comes to answering a A,B,C,D type question, it can become annoying. Chris -Original Message- From: Priscilla Oppenheimer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:33 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Routing protocols [7:29139] At 10:57 PM 12/13/01 -0500, Chuck Larrieu wrote: I once had an interesting, if heated argument with someone off list about this. IIRC, I was told by that person that Cisco, in its current CCNP study materials, is saying just that - that something operates at the OSI layer above which it functions. I.e. if a routing protocol uses an IP protocol number, then it is operating at transport layer. Since BGP uses TCP port 179, it is operating at the session layer, along with RIP, which uses UDP port 520. ( BTW, I have also read in a reputable source that UDP is application layer because it is not reliable, and therefore cannot be transport layer, and there is no place else it really fits ) Chuck, This is obviously nonsense, as I know that you know. I'm not criticizing you, since you are quoting someone else, but this was a quote that should have been routed directly to the null interface! ;-) I recognize that Cisco just LOVES the OSI model in the lower level certifications, but the fact is that in terms of how things work it is crap, and tends to cause more confusion and add no value. I disagree. I think the OSI model adds a lot of value for understanding the functions of a protocol. It helps one understand what types of services a protocol provides and what services it uses from the layer below. Every vendor of content switches is calling them layer 4-7 switches. what kind of crap is that? Switching of messages happens at all layers. That's the point of networking! But the methods for doing it and the data used to do it differs with each layer. Routing protocols are in the management and control side of the network layer. They allow routers to learn how to switch packets based on network-layer addresses. People get themselves in trouble when they characterize the layer that a protocol works at by which protocols run below it and the number of protocols that run below it. Routing protocols are not the only weird ones. NetBIOS is a session-layer protocol, for example, but in a NetBEUI implementation, it runs above LLC. That's doesn't change which OSI layer it fits into best. Consider ISDN. ISDN has three layers. Running above ISDN may be the Point-to-Point Protocol (PPP), which is usually considered a data-link-layer protocol, although it has four layers of its own. Its top layer provides a set of Network Control Protocols (NCPs) that are used to establish and configure upper-layer protocols such as IP and IPX. Trying to force all these layers into seven layers, especially when you need to anchor IP at Layer 3, because you know it's a network-layer protocol, can lead to frustration. It's best to just consider what services ISDN and PPP offers and how they are used in typical networks, and stuff them into the data-link layer. With routing protocols, the important thing is that when you configure and troubleshoot them, you aren't going to spend too much time considering transport or application-layer issues. You aren't going to analyze sequence numbers, ACKs, retransmissions, etc. You are going to focus on network-layer issues such as addressing, forwarding, routing, router configs, VLSM, classful versus classless, IP subnet zero, etc. This is another one of those issues that is simply not worth debating. Routing protocols clearly work at the network layer. I said all this much better the last time this came up. ;-) See the archives. Priscilla I dare anyone to justify switching as a layer 5 or a layer 6 activity. Yet there it is. Also, to judge from what content switches do, the marketers are saying the OSI layer 7 is user application, not a service application, something Howard takes great pain to differentiate in his writings on the subject, again IIRC. TCP/IP is NOT OSI compliant, never has been, never will be. OSI is
RE: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Hey you left out us Mexicans! I agree. We must get 100's of virus sent to us that are caught, we even get them sent from our LAWYERS.well go figure on that. It's NOT a personal attack, although that has happened, but it's what we have to live with these days. Anyway, just go with the flow, keep your signatures updated, filter like a murf and all should be fine. Now back to our previously scheduled discussion..IPSEC, what does it stand for and how do I use it. : -Original Message- From: Hehdili Nizar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] For your genral culture I m ARABIC , somtimes I receive viruses from messages in this board and other messages from many people in multiple countries , I do not consider them personal attacks and I m not angry with no body , this board is for arabs , Jews , US citzens , chineese ..to share their technical knowlege and exchange experiences , not for off topics. If you have problems with this guy , please treat with him directly and let this board for Cisco subjects. Jon Street a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29238t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Hey you left out us Mexicans! I agree. We must get 100's of virus sent to us that are caught, we even get them sent from our LAWYERS.well go figure on that. It's NOT a personal attack, although that has happened, but it's what we have to live with these days. Anyway, just go with the flow, keep your signatures updated, filter like a murf and all should be fine. Now back to our previously scheduled discussion..IPSEC, what does it stand for and how do I use it. : -Original Message- From: Hehdili Nizar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] For your genral culture I m ARABIC , somtimes I receive viruses from messages in this board and other messages from many people in multiple countries , I do not consider them personal attacks and I m not angry with no body , this board is for arabs , Jews , US citzens , chineese ..to share their technical knowlege and exchange experiences , not for off topics. If you have problems with this guy , please treat with him directly and let this board for Cisco subjects. Jon Street a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29238t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
2 different networks ??? Actually network 1 would encompass network 2. Host A would thinks Host B is on the same segment as Host A is. If Host A and Host B were separated by a router, Host A would not be able to talk to Host B (not counting the fact that the 2 hosts have the same IP address). The address range of Network 1 is 172.16.0.1 to 172.16.255.254. The address range of network 2 is 172.16.2.1-172.16.2.254. This is not a valid network configuration. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:07 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182] Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29239t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CID: Token Ring and Mainframe computer [7:25166]
it can be connected also directly by using an OSA token-ring adapter in the HOST and its configuration in the mainframe is similar to the CIP card on the router , they are both generated by an XCA node . there many types of OSA cards that work with both SNA and IP , they use Token Ring or Ehternet or even Fast Ethernet and GigaEthernet. their behaviour is the same as the CIP router , but the diffirent is with the router you can move some processor intsensive tasks in the router from the mainframe such as TN3270e and TCP offload. off course for both CIP router and OSA card there are some funtion that you can not use such as SNI function of FEP wich consists of routing between tow FEPs in SNA subarea environment.This needs migration from Subarea to APPN. Priscilla Oppenheimer a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] The mainframe would probably attach to the Token Ring network via a Front End Processor (FEP) which would have a Token Ring Interface Card (TIC). Unless there have been recent upgrades, the CIP emulates a PU type 2 3172 device controller, not a PU type 4 3745 (i.e., the true FEP). There are some software functions, usually dealing with very weird legacy protocols but also some multi-mainframe software (e.g., CMC) for which you need a true FEP. For most applications, a CIP will serve nicely. The FEP could be replaced with a router with a CIP. Priscilla At 12:25 AM 11/3/01, John Tafasi wrote: Hi Group, Can the IBM mainframe computer be connected directly to the token ring? Thanks John Tafasi ___ watch your phone call records on the web at: http://www.freedomstar.com/sh1885969 Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29240t=25166 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
What you have just described is commonly referred to as A Duplicate IP Address, and is considered in some circles to be bad practice. ;) Let's see if I can explain this well... A host device knows two categories of addresses... Those that are local, and those that are not. When a host attempts to send a packet to another host, it decides based on it's own address and locally configured subnet mask whether or not it will have to send the packet to a router in order to get the packet to the destination. To modify your scenario: Let's say Host A (172.16.1.1/16) wants to send a packet to Host B (172.16.2.1/24). Host A believes that his local network is 172.16.0.0, and that every other host with an IP address that begins with 172.16 is locally attached. Host A would send the packet out as though Host B were local, instead of sending it to a router. In the reverse case, where Host B wants to send a packet to Host A, Host B believes that his local network is 172.16.2.0 (And that the third octet, the '2', is part of the network identifation), and that Host A, with an address of 172.16.1.1, is not local. He would send the packet to a router. Subnet masks are a Local thing. I hope this helps... Alan~ - Original Message - From: Steven A. Ridder To: Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 2:07 PM Subject: Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182] Say I have 2 networks: Network 1. 172.16.x.x/16 and Network 2. 172.16.2.x/24 We all agree that they are two different networks, right? Now if Host A on Network 1 is 172.16.2.1/16 and Host B is on Network 2 is 172.16.2.1/24, How does the host know that the second host is on a different network? Are they differnt addresses because of the mask, or are they considered the same address regardless of mask, and therefore illegal? I understand ANDing on the local host. It's just if 2 hosts had the same numbers, only marked differently by the mask, are they the same or not? [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29241t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CCNP exam [7:29216]
Good point. The Certification Library contains the guides. These are the ones that aren't the course text, but are review material to help you gauge your readiness. The Preparation Library is the courses ported to book format. This should have been sent to the group, not to me personally. Priscilla At 03:04 PM 12/14/01, Berry Mobley wrote: Good descriptions - but backwards. :-) The Certification library has exam certification guides for Routing, Switching, Remote Access, and Support. The Preparation library has the course text - Building Scalable Cisco Networks, Building Cisco Multilayer Switched Networks, etc. The Certification library texts are also more recent. Berry At 01:49 PM 12/14/2001 -0500, you wrote: At 12:42 PM 12/14/01, Olivieri Luiz-Q14637 wrote: Hi All, Does anyone know the difference between these 2 sets from Cisco Press? -CCNP Certification Library These are the actual courses, ported to book format. The authors were really editors who put the course into book format, which is not a huge effort because Cisco courses have tons of text (not just PowerPoint bullets). -CCNP Preparation Library These are written by a (non-Cisco) author to help you study and really understand the material. They may go beyond the course, but they may also leave things out of the course. The assumption is that you have taken the course or that you are advanced enough that you didn't need the course. Which one is better to study to CCNP exam? Regards Luiz Olivieri CCNA Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29242t=29216 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
Yes, the major network prefix includes all of its subnets. But once you've subnetted a prefix, you can't assign that prefix to an interface because you'll end up with overlapping network addresses. For example, let's say you have the address 172.16.1.0/24 and want to split it into two subnets. This would give you 172.16.1.0/25 and 172.16.1.128/25. Now you take those two /25 prefixes and assign them to two separate ethernet segements. Once you've done that, you should never use the original prefix--172.16.1.0/24--because it overlaps the two new prefixes and would cause all sorts of routing problems. Each network prefix assigned to a subnet must be unique. Steven A. Ridder 12/14/01 12:51:25 PM Because the major network was subnetted, it includes all networks under it. Therefore it's the same network, just subnetted. Do I have it right? Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29243t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
switching the router from one IPLC(fiber Link) To Radio link [7:29244]
Hi, I got two IPLC one Fiber Link and another one Radio Link.and most of the time we work on fiber link,but now i want whenever my fiber link goes off,them my router automatically switched to Radio Link.Please help me out to solve this problem. Regards Rajneesh Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29244t=29244 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
test [7:29245]
test Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29245t=29245 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: test [7:29245]
ha... at least we know he's not using outlook to read his mail : ) root 12/14/01 03:37PM test Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29248t=29245 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Bandwidth Management [7:27408]
Can you elaborate on what you mean by bandwidth management ? What is it exactly that you are trying to do, are we talking about a QoS provisioning tool ? - Original Message - From: Ken Diliberto Newsgroups: groupstudy.cisco Sent: Monday, November 26, 2001 8:36 PM Subject: Bandwidth Management [7:27408] Does anyone know of any free bandwidth management software? Maybe something for a flavor of Unix? Thanks Ken Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29247t=27408 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MISSED THE WRITTEN BY 3 POINTS [7:29249]
I JUST MISSED THE WRITTEN TEST BY A WHOLE 3 POINTS.WHAT BOTHERS ME THE MOST IS THAT IT WAS SO EASY...WELL I GUESS IT WAS DECENT FOR ONLY STUDYING FOR THREE DAYS...I WILL GET IT NEXT TIME CAUSE I DONT FEEL LIKE MAKING ANOTHER $300 DONATION. P. NEIL BORNE CCNP, CCDA, AND C-VOICE _ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29249t=29249 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: PIX 501 Question [7:29208]
You shouldn't have any problems at all unless you exceed 3500 concurrent or 10Mb of traffic ;) You can allow any inbound port you like as long as the end user is being directed to port 85 rather than 80. Allen - Original Message - From: Brian To: Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 10:41 AM Subject: PIX 501 Question [7:29208] I am wondering if I can use Pix 501 for a web server firewall? It says that it can handle 3500 Concurrent connections (I wont have 3500, but i dont want to be cut off). I am wondering if I will come into any issues when doing this. If get the 10 pack license, that only restricts my outbound traffic. I know it has presets to allow ports, but I am wondering can you customize access lists in it, say if I wanted to allow inbound port 85, cause my ISP blocks 80 etc, that is not a preset. Also if anyone is selling a new one, i would be interested in getting a price list. Thanks! Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29250t=29208 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CCIE techniques [7:29251]
I have read about many techniques that people are using to improve in their lab studies. I was wondering if anybody would like to share their techniques? What do you do to improve speed, accuracy, troubleshooting,etc? If you have any ideas or advice, please share your thoughts. Thanks! -junovtv Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29251t=29251 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OT... PDF on PalmOS [7:28296]
Mike thanks for the tip. I just wish my Palm stored more than just 2 MB data (Palm V). I would love to put some of my cisco press stuff on it. This makes me seriously consider a new Palm or a Pocket PC device. Mike Sweeney wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... I just found this.. doesnt mean it's new but I got pretty excited about it. I use a Palm Pilot for alot of things.. one is notes about network stuff. I'v tried several ways to get tech docs into the palm but none have really worked well for what I wanted. Today I found a Palm PDF reader at Acrobat. This is a very slick palm application. Graphics are supported to a degree but they are usable in my testing. This is version 1 so it can use some improvements but.. hey, the price is right (free).. Windows only for now.. but it converts a normal PDF to a PalmPDF format. Why do I like this? because now I've uploaded the most common Cisco docs in PDF that I refer to all the time as a ready reference. Couple this with the custom doc link I posted in another thread, you have have custom docs from Cisco on your Palm/Visor etc. Handy item in my mind :) Just passing the news. MikeS www.packetattack.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29254t=28296 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: CCIE techniques [7:29251]
I find that if I write things down as I discover them I remember them better. I have a binder with separators, each separator is a different topic. As I find a solution to different things, I write them down immediately so that I remember them. It is also nice if you forget something, you just go to the OSPF tab, for example, and see if you have run across it before. Just my 2 cents. -Original Message- From: juno vtv [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 4:18 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: CCIE techniques [7:29251] I have read about many techniques that people are using to improve in their lab studies. I was wondering if anybody would like to share their techniques? What do you do to improve speed, accuracy, troubleshooting,etc? If you have any ideas or advice, please share your thoughts. Thanks! -junovtv Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29255t=29251 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
FXO to FXO - Disconnect Problem [7:29256]
MC-3810 with 6 FXO, some 1740-2V with FXO also. After a connection from an FXO to another FXO is established, it never ends after any end hangs up. I found this document: Voice - Understanding FXO Disconnect Problem at http://www.cisco.com/warp/public/788/signalling/fxo_disconnect.html#2b Updated both IOS to 12.2(2).T and tried also 12.2(4).T. Now, after using the statement supervisory disconnect anytone at the interface level, it works ONLY if the voice connection begins from the 3810 to the 1750. In the reverse, the connection never ends after anyone hangs up. Any suggestion instead of upgrade to EM? Thanks, Hugo Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29256t=29256 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CCIE techniques [7:29251]
For the one-day lab, you have to be FAASSSTT!!! Your speed and knowledge is a huge factor in the one-day flavor due to the limited amount of time you have to get a good grasp of the network. The best way to improve your skills is by PRACTICING! Practice either on a home rack or a remote rack. LOTS of hands on time seems to be the biggest difference between passing the lab and failing. The more comfortable you are in the environment, the better you will do (I guess that's pretty much understood, but I just wanted to re-emphasize). thanks, -Brad Ellis CCIE#5796 (RS / Security) Network Learning Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] juno vtv wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... I have read about many techniques that people are using to improve in their lab studies. I was wondering if anybody would like to share their techniques? What do you do to improve speed, accuracy, troubleshooting,etc? If you have any ideas or advice, please share your thoughts. Thanks! -junovtv Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29257t=29251 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes [7:29259]
Chuck, Seems appropriate that you are due for some pain from the dentist after screwing up my day (and more than likely, my weekend) with this question. It is a very good question tho. Have been thinking about it for awhile and have it set up on my home lab. Obviously, if the masks were reversed on the routing protocols, it with be a trivial matter w/ an OSPF summary. How many routers are you using in this scenario? I am currently using three with the middle being the re-dist point (have 6 in my lab so I can make in larger). I recall the post from John N regarding the use of a tunnel for a situation like this. I believe the problem is that in this case it would require using a /27 mask in the IGRP domain. If the scenario calls for only /28 masks in IGRP, then this would be a violation. So, are the rules : 1. No default-network 2. No static 3. No policy routing 4. Only /28 in IGRP, /27 in OSPF Thanks, Gregg Chuck Larrieu wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... It occurs to me that there is another answer to this problem. So as a Friday Follies question: what is the other answer I came up with? Remember, the IGRP domain is /28 the OSPF domain contains routes /27 and shorter. You must assure reachability to all interfaces in the OSPF domain. You are not allowed to use a default network or any static routes to attain this end. for extra credit - make it funny. I will be needing a good laugh after the dentist is through with me this afternoon. :-O Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Chuck Larrieu Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 7:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The old how to get routes into IGRP question again - possible [7:29021] (REPOST) I've been fighting with one of my practice labs the last couple of days. The problem is one of those OSPF to IGRP redistribution with a twist. The IGRP domain is /28. So how to get those shorter /24 prefixes advertised. Oh yeah, you can't use the default-network command to create an IGRP default route. So let me offer this possibility. IP local policy route-map the route map then goes something like this: route-map igrp-default permit 10 set default interface [whatever the interface is] I also suspect that set ip default next-hop x.x.x.x works also, but at the time I was testing I hadn't thought through all the implications, and my test failed. In any case, the local policy would have to be implemented on all routers in the IGRP domain. A bit of planning, then, is required. I found out something else that was interesting. Local policy packets seem to have a particular way they are constructed. the first time I looked at my debug ip packet, the source address was one of my loopback addresses, which I was not advertising under IGRP. So of course my pings failed, because the distant end did not have a route back. So I deleted the loopback, tried again, and this time the source address was a LAN interface, this too not advertised under IGRP. I am assuming that Cisco has a hierarchy of interfaces. Usually a ping is sourced at the interface out which the packets are headed. But for local policy, it was different. Any case, I am offering these observations for consideration. Wish I hadn't turned my routers off last night. Or I could gather some screen shots. Chuck Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29259t=29259 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: PPTP through PIX [7:28287]
Are you using NAT ? Save yourself a few hours of study and realize that PPTP and NAT don't mix ? Since there is no way to identify GRE and forward it to a given end host (at least none that I know of) you cannot use PPTP to connect to a PATd box (It may be possibly to PPTP to a statically NATd box). Emil wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... Hello Is this possible to use Microsoft PPTP connection from PC client to Windows 2000 VPN server through Internet and PIX Firewall? I set up PIX to allow connection to 1723 port and allow GRE protocol, but this is sth wrong. Did anybody make it, what else should I allow on PIX? Regards Emil Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29260t=28287 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MISSED THE WRITTEN BY 3 POINTS [7:29249]
sorry to hear that u missed it by 3 points... Better luck next time, btw what troubled u most on the test, that you think would have caused u to lose those points. Thanks Nick Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29261t=29249 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182]
If the sending host strips the netmask how does the gateway know which route to use. - Original Message - From: Tangled Up in Blue To: Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 5:49 AM Subject: RE: Mask in L3 Packet [7:29182] sorry for the double post, and i meant to say that If it sees by the subnet mask that this address is not local, it strips the MAC info and the netmask and forwards the packet to the default gateway. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29253t=29182 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
IPSEC stands for a standard for IP encryption , it uses multiple algorithms for encrypting IP data . you can use it in routers , firewalls , dedicated hardware boxes and with some software clients. with IP sec you can use encrypted tunnels to send your traffic over internet or intranet and you can use it between any type of the last devices. You need a good design to use it well , tell us more what are your needs and what is your environment and we would try to find the best suitable solution for you. Steve Smith a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hey you left out us Mexicans! I agree. We must get 100's of virus sent to us that are caught, we even get them sent from our LAWYERS.well go figure on that. It's NOT a personal attack, although that has happened, but it's what we have to live with these days. Anyway, just go with the flow, keep your signatures updated, filter like a murf and all should be fine. Now back to our previously scheduled discussion..IPSEC, what does it stand for and how do I use it. : -Original Message- From: Hehdili Nizar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] For your genral culture I m ARABIC , somtimes I receive viruses from messages in this board and other messages from many people in multiple countries , I do not consider them personal attacks and I m not angry with no body , this board is for arabs , Jews , US citzens , chineese ..to share their technical knowlege and exchange experiences , not for off topics. If you have problems with this guy , please treat with him directly and let this board for Cisco subjects. Jon Street a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29252t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
IP Security! Isn't that a contradiction in terms? :) Prof. Tom Lisa, CCAI Community College of Southern Nevada Cisco Regional Networking Academy Steve Smith wrote: Hey you left out us Mexicans! I agree. We must get 100's of virus sent to us that are caught, we even get them sent from our LAWYERS.well go figure on that. It's NOT a personal attack, although that has happened, but it's what we have to live with these days. Anyway, just go with the flow, keep your signatures updated, filter like a murf and all should be fine. Now back to our previously scheduled discussion..IPSEC, what does it stand for and how do I use it. : -Original Message- From: Hehdili Nizar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 1:29 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] For your genral culture I m ARABIC , somtimes I receive viruses from messages in this board and other messages from many people in multiple countries , I do not consider them personal attacks and I m not angry with no body , this board is for arabs , Jews , US citzens , chineese ..to share their technical knowlege and exchange experiences , not for off topics. If you have problems with this guy , please treat with him directly and let this board for Cisco subjects. Jon Street a icrit dans le message : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29263t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes [7:29266]
The other issue if you try to use my tunneling method is that you'd need a different tunnel for each mask length! My method works very well with one or two masks. Beyond that it would just be a mess! Last night I was playing with a variation of the tunnel technique where I put the tunnel in an entirely different major network. This would cause the redistributing router to summarize to the major net before advertising to the IGRP router. It works great except for the major net that already exists on the IGRP router. For example A---(igrp)---B This link is 172.16.1.0/28. You then create a tunnel and assign it 4.0.0.0/8. On B--which is also running OSPF-- you add network 4.0.0.0 to IGRP and then redistribute OSPF into IGRP. B will advertise 172.16.0.0/16 to A via the tunnel interface. Unfortunately, A ignores it. I found no way to make A use that route. Perhaps I'm headed in the right direction but just on the wrong track. ;-) I'm hoping this idea that doesn't work will spark an idea that does work. Regards, John Gregg Malcolm 12/14/01 3:31:45 PM Chuck, Seems appropriate that you are due for some pain from the dentist after screwing up my day (and more than likely, my weekend) with this question. It is a very good question tho. Have been thinking about it for awhile and have it set up on my home lab. Obviously, if the masks were reversed on the routing protocols, it with be a trivial matter w/ an OSPF summary. How many routers are you using in this scenario? I am currently using three with the middle being the re-dist point (have 6 in my lab so I can make in larger). I recall the post from John N regarding the use of a tunnel for a situation like this. I believe the problem is that in this case it would require using a /27 mask in the IGRP domain. If the scenario calls for only /28 masks in IGRP, then this would be a violation. So, are the rules : 1. No default-network 2. No static 3. No policy routing 4. Only /28 in IGRP, /27 in OSPF Thanks, Gregg Chuck Larrieu wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... It occurs to me that there is another answer to this problem. So as a Friday Follies question: what is the other answer I came up with? Remember, the IGRP domain is /28 the OSPF domain contains routes /27 and shorter. You must assure reachability to all interfaces in the OSPF domain. You are not allowed to use a default network or any static routes to attain this end. for extra credit - make it funny. I will be needing a good laugh after the dentist is through with me this afternoon. :-O Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Chuck Larrieu Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 7:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The old how to get routes into IGRP question again - possible [7:29021] (REPOST) I've been fighting with one of my practice labs the last couple of days. The problem is one of those OSPF to IGRP redistribution with a twist. The IGRP domain is /28. So how to get those shorter /24 prefixes advertised. Oh yeah, you can't use the default-network command to create an IGRP default route. So let me offer this possibility. IP local policy route-map the route map then goes something like this: route-map igrp-default permit 10 set default interface [whatever the interface is] I also suspect that set ip default next-hop x.x.x.x works also, but at the time I was testing I hadn't thought through all the implications, and my test failed. In any case, the local policy would have to be implemented on all routers in the IGRP domain. A bit of planning, then, is required. I found out something else that was interesting. Local policy packets seem to have a particular way they are constructed. the first time I looked at my debug ip packet, the source address was one of my loopback addresses, which I was not advertising under IGRP. So of course my pings failed, because the distant end did not have a route back. So I deleted the loopback, tried again, and this time the source address was a LAN interface, this too not advertised under IGRP. I am assuming that Cisco has a hierarchy of interfaces. Usually a ping is sourced at the interface out which the packets are headed. But for local policy, it was different. Any case, I am offering these observations for consideration. Wish I hadn't turned my routers off last night. Or I could gather some screen shots. Chuck Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29266t=29266 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CCIE techniques [7:29251]
The effective use of aliases regular expressions can probably provide opportunities for the most drastic improvement in the ratio between characters typed relevant output returned/desired configuration achieved. juno vtv @groupstudy.com on 12/14/2001 05:06:06 PM Please respond to juno vtv Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc:(bcc: Kevin Cullimore) Subject: Re: CCIE techniques [7:29251] So what do you recommend for improving your speed? -junovtv This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose or take any action based on this message or any information herein. If you have received this message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29267t=29251 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
I resemble that remark! Prof. Tom Lisa, CCAI Community College of Southern Nevada Cisco Regional Networking Academy Priscilla Oppenheimer wrote: It sounds like some old-fashioned meanie wrote this test. Priscilla At 12:32 PM 12/14/01, brian hall wrote: Just a message to those who (like me!) thinking that reading, doing labs and taking multiple choice test will prepare you for the real world and (hopefully)the CCIE lab need to be exposed to cisco's network accademy semester 5 skills final . I just took it yesterday and failed . In fact the whole class failed. One of our students who scored high on most test and blazed through the final written exam in 10 mins, walked out in frustration . Another student who works as an administrator, was are best chance of having someone pass missed it . I myself knew after an hour that if you don't have those commands down cold with a solid understanding of how to implement them your GOOSE is cooked !!! . You do have the option to have your own written notes to help but that might weigh you down if too much is in front of you . Working on idividual labs is one thing but putting the whole environment together is a whole different animal . Once given the actual skills asessment designing, implementing and trouble shooting you assume that this ones in the bag . The environment wasn't large and looking back at the running config's there wasnt much to them other than having MED and CBAC . Ah!!! but how wrong I was!!! I'll spare the details and say that this was an eye opener . It showed me what I really don't know and to do the job in the real world will take a lot work on my part . Buyer Beware !!! Overall it was good to go through and to be pushed just shows the weak areas FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Priscilla Oppenheimer http://www.priscilla.com Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29269t=29212 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
Oh, I feel so much better now! Only 60% of my class failed the practical exam. I must be an exceptional teacher (or do I have exceptional students; nah, it must be me). :) :) Prof. Tom Lisa, CCAI Community College of Southern Nevada Cisco Regional Networking Academy brian hall wrote: Just a message to those who (like me!) thinking that reading, doing labs and taking multiple choice test will prepare you for the real world and (hopefully)the CCIE lab need to be exposed to cisco's network accademy semester 5 skills final . I just took it yesterday and failed . In fact the whole class failed. One of our students who scored high on most test and blazed through the final written exam in 10 mins, walked out in frustration . Another student who works as an administrator, was are best chance of having someone pass missed it . I myself knew after an hour that if you don't have those commands down cold with a solid understanding of how to implement them your GOOSE is cooked !!! . You do have the option to have your own written notes to help but that might weigh you down if too much is in front of you FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes [7:29270]
I just discovered another method that is easier than tunnels. Again, you have Router A connected to Router B: A--(igrp /28)-B-(ospf /24)--C Instead of creating a tunnel between A and B, use frame relay interfaces. Configure either A or B as frame-relay intf-type dce and then configure your IP address on subinterfaces, one for each mask length you need. This is still a kludge, though. If you have a bunch of different masks then you're going to have a bunch of subinterfaces and burn up a few network prefixes. But, it works. I still haven't found what I think is a good way to do this yet. I've tried secondary IP addresses but that does not work reliably. Still thinking John On Sat, 15 Dec 2001, John Neiberger ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: The other issue if you try to use my tunneling method is that you'd need a different tunnel for each mask length! My method works very well with one or two masks. Beyond that it would just be a mess! Last night I was playing with a variation of the tunnel technique where I put the tunnel in an entirely different major network. This would cause the redistributing router to summarize to the major net before advertising to the IGRP router. It works great except for the major net that already exists on the IGRP router. For example A---(igrp)---B This link is 172.16.1.0/28. You then create a tunnel and assign it 4.0.0.0/8. On B--which is also running OSPF-- you add network 4.0.0.0 to IGRP and then redistribute OSPF into IGRP. B will advertise 172.16.0.0/16 to A via the tunnel interface. Unfortunately, A ignores it. I found no way to make A use that route. Perhaps I'm headed in the right direction but just on the wrong track. ;-) I'm hoping this idea that doesn't work will spark an idea that does work. Regards, John Gregg Malcolm 12/14/01 3:31:45 PM Chuck, Seems appropriate that you are due for some pain from the dentist after screwing up my day (and more than likely, my weekend) with this question. It is a very good question tho. Have been thinking about it for awhile and have it set up on my home lab. Obviously, if the masks were reversed on the routing protocols, it with be a trivial matter w/ an OSPF summary. How many routers are you using in this scenario? I am currently using three with the middle being the re-dist point (have 6 in my lab so I can make in larger). I recall the post from John N regarding the use of a tunnel for a situation like this. I believe the problem is that in this case it would require using a /27 mask in the IGRP domain. If the scenario calls for only /28 masks in IGRP, then this would be a violation. So, are the rules : 1. No default-network 2. No static 3. No policy routing 4. Only /28 in IGRP, /27 in OSPF Thanks, Gregg Chuck Larrieu wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]... It occurs to me that there is another answer to this problem. So as a Friday Follies question: what is the other answer I came up with? Remember, the IGRP domain is /28 the OSPF domain contains routes /27 and shorter. You must assure reachability to all interfaces in the OSPF domain. You are not allowed to use a default network or any static routes to attain this end. for extra credit - make it funny. I will be needing a good laugh after the dentist is through with me this afternoon. :-O Chuck -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Chuck Larrieu Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2001 7:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: The old how to get routes into IGRP question again - possible [7:29021] (REPOST) I've been fighting with one of my practice labs the last couple of days. The problem is one of those OSPF to IGRP redistribution with a twist. The IGRP domain is /28. So how to get those shorter /24 prefixes advertised. Oh yeah, you can't use the default-network command to create an IGRP default route. So let me offer this possibility. IP local policy route-map the route map then goes something like this: route-map igrp-default permit 10 set default interface [whatever the interface is] I also suspect that set ip default next-hop x.x.x.x works also, but at the time I was testing I hadn't thought through all the implications, and my test failed. In any case, the local policy would have to be implemented on all routers in the IGRP domain. A bit of planning, then, is required. I found out something else that was interesting. Local policy packets seem to have a particular way they are constructed. the first time I looked at my debug ip packet, the source address was one of my loopback addresses, which I was not advertising under IGRP. So of course my pings failed, because the distant end did not have
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Who ever you are.I have never sent you any virus.I myself has been receiving spams(mails that have never sent). Muhammad Alkhattab - Original Message - From: Jon Street To: Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 8:56 AM Subject: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190] Muhammad Alkhattab e-mail address [EMAIL PROTECTED] must have taken offence to my statments about those who said on this fourm about us needing to understand the terrorists issues and why they are so angry with us. This little worm tried sending me viruses to screw up my computer. I just wanted to let everyone know who this person is. Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29265t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
*** VPN IPSec Client *** Urgent Please reply [7:29271]
Hi, I have to configure Cisco 801 with IP/Fw plus IPSec feature pack as a VPN client for PIX 6.0 What details and information do I need from the PIX side to configure 801. Swapnil Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29271t=29271 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
sh counters on 6500 [7:29272]
Greetings, Anyone knows where I can get more information on the command sh counters mod/port? also what do the numbers on the far left mean when issuing this command? I'm assuming its snmp index. No much on Cisco's page. ThanksNabil Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29272t=29272 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262]
Has any one out there used this module (nm-1e1r2w) on the 2600 router ? I cannot seem to find on cco whether this module is supported on this platform and what the minimum IOS would be. Any help would be appreciated...thanks Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29262t=29262 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: This Arab tried to attack me. [7:29190]
Hey it happens to the best of us. Read this news article about how Cisco recently sent a virus to the NANOG mailing list. The title is Cisco Release of Goner Worm Raises Eyebrows. http://www.newsbytes.com/news/01/172978.html Paul Borghese Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29273t=29190 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262]
This link shows, it doesn't support 2600 series routers. Regds, Balvindar Sabarwal Sr. Consultant - Solution Engineering Group InnerFrame Microland Group No. 201 / A wing, Phoenix House, Senapati Bapat Marg, Lower Parel, Mumbai 400013. Tel : +91 22 4604132 / 33 /34 Fax : +91 22 4604135 Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: DB [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2001 4:29 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262] Has any one out there used this module (nm-1e1r2w) on the 2600 router ? I cannot seem to find on cco whether this module is supported on this platform and what the minimum IOS would be. Any help would be appreciated...thanks Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29274t=29262 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes [7:29275]
Thought we were down for the count tonite. Good to see a few new messages. John, by stability w/ secondaries did you mean re-loads? My config is working fine w/ secondaries on the tunnels even after I reload. I'll admit that the routing table is a little strange tho. IGRP only router has IGRP routes w/ both /27 and /28 masks as well as a directly connected route to get to the OSPF only router via the tunnel. Gregg Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29275t=29275 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: cisco academy's routing skills final ,tough!!! [7:29212]
the best thing to do is follow your reading with the labs meaning as you read chapter 4 do chapter 4 labs . Concepts sink in better when you can implement them. Study only cisco academy's material for the testing and exams. There is great material out there but will only take time away from doing well in the course. Trust me on this one!! As I started to take sem 5 I was allready half way through getting my ccnp certification . I was more focused on that certification than taking care in learning the course well. Just because I pass the routing 640 exam didnt mean that I would coast through the course. In fact it was my weakest semester score wise. Work on vlsm and summarization Its something that you will learn in the begining and wont see until you need it for the skills final. Stay on top of it . Everyone I know was so focused on getting good scores that the labs would almost take a backseat. Bad mistake!!! What is an employer going to hire you on good scores or on the fact that you can design, implement and troubleshoot. A no brainer for sure but the smart ones seem to miss this one. I have my certifications which can impress for a good 5 seconds but quickly wain when it gets down to doing the work. An instructor responded to my original message and had only 40% of his class pass the skills test. Yes it is a Bear of a test !!! If I was an employer looking for someone to hire I would take the ccna who passed the skills final over a ccnp show couldnt. Not to bash myself but it is an honest assessment. good luck!! Study hard!!! P.S. Not to scare you even more but sem 5 is considered the hardest of the 4 semesters and why do they teach it first is beyond me! The good news!! once your over the hump its down hill(at least for the remaining semesters) So I'm told!! Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29276t=29212 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262]
I dont know link is not showing in the last mail. http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/pcat/mxne__p1.htm Regds, Balvindar Sabarwal Sr. Consultant - Solution Engineering Group InnerFrame Microland Group No. 201 / A wing, Phoenix House, Senapati Bapat Marg, Lower Parel, Mumbai 400013. Tel : +91 22 4604132 / 33 /34 Fax : +91 22 4604135 Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Balvindar Sabarwal Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2001 11:00 AM To: 'DB'; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262] http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/pcat/mxne__p1.htm This link shows, it doesn't support 2600 series routers. Regds, Balvindar Sabarwal Sr. Consultant - Solution Engineering Group InnerFrame Microland Group No. 201 / A wing, Phoenix House, Senapati Bapat Marg, Lower Parel, Mumbai 400013. Tel : +91 22 4604132 / 33 /34 Fax : +91 22 4604135 Email : [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: DB [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2001 4:29 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: NM-1E1R2W on a cisco 2600 router [7:29262] Has any one out there used this module (nm-1e1r2w) on the 2600 router ? I cannot seem to find on cco whether this module is supported on this platform and what the minimum IOS would be. Any help would be appreciated...thanks Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29277t=29262 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: RE: Friday Follies Returns: WAS The old how to get routes [7:29279]
When using secondary IP addresses, IGRP seems to ignore one of the addresses but I can't tell how it chooses which one to ignore. A few nights ago I configured this and it ignored the secondary. Tonight when I did it it ignored the primary and used the secondary for updates. Odd, and the end result was that the IGRP-only router would not have a complete routing table. When I use tunnels or frame relay subinterfaces it seems to work correctly. John Get your own 800 number Voicemail, fax, email, and a lot more http://www.ureach.com/reg/tag On Sat, 15 Dec 2001, Gregg Malcolm ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Thought we were down for the count tonite. Good to see a few new messages. John, by stability w/ secondaries did you mean re-loads? My config is working fine w/ secondaries on the tunnels even after I reload. I'll admit that the routing table is a little strange tho. IGRP only router has IGRP routes w/ both /27 and /28 masks as well as a directly connected route to get to the OSPF only router via the tunnel. Gregg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message Posted at: http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7i=29279t=29279 -- FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.html Report misconduct and Nondisclosure violations to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
