Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[William Robb]

--
From: "steve harley"
Subject: Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?


On 2010-07-24 03:42 , Cotty wrote:

<http://tinyurl.com/friendbarvideo>


i think i saw that some time previously; this time i didn't have the 
patience to wait through the ad, but as i recall, it was supposedly great




Hilarious, and at the same time, I suspect ironically possible given how Mac 
users tend to be rather cult like.


William Robb 



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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-24 03:42 , Cotty wrote:




i think i saw that some time previously; this time i didn't have the 
patience to wait through the ad, but as i recall, it was supposedly great


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Cotty]

On 23/7/10, steve harley, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Path Finder is burdened with some "kid stuff" but thankfully most of it
>is off by default; i use it for a few not so kiddy things:
>
>   - the NeXT-like shelf
>   - tabbed windows
>   - recent documents in sidebar
>   - the more detailed and Unixy file info display
>   - built in shell (though i keep coming back to iTerm)
>   - the ability to apply labels*
>   - the back button*
>   - the sorting in column view*
>
>my favorite Path Finder Feature ever, though it was removed in newer
>versions, is outline-style disclosure triangles within column view --
>this was a big win for file management, but tabs and the dual browser
>feature almost make up for it

Steve, I have just the thing for you:



I had a great time there ;-)))

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  Cotty


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 19:10 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

Sorry, I'm totally uninterested in Path Finder.


i'm certainly not trying to convince you to use it, just pointing out a 
few things, such as the features Finder later adopted, since you 
actively argued against others using it


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 5:44 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:

> You've opened my eyes to possibilities with Finder I didn't know about, that 
> if I'd known about I might not have gone looking for a replacement. Also my 
> mind to the possibility that it's far more versatile than I realized.
>
> That said, I find it interesting that it's been extremely easy for me to 
> discover and use Path Finder's features, whereas with Finder they remained 
> hidden. I don't know if there's a manual for Path Finder, if there is I never 
> read it. Have hardly ever even used help. And I think I posted to its support 
> forum only once.
>
> I agree Path Finder may be cluttered up with features that few use. With a 
> little instruction I might even come to prefer Finder's more zen-like 
> approach compared to Path Finder's clutter. But I would need some instruction 
> to get me started.

I'm glad to help.

The hallmark of the Finder, like most Apple software, is that it is
subtle. Most Apple software is subtle in that most people can easily
figure out the basics and get most of what they need done without
looking at or reading a manual. And most Apple software is much deeper
than that surface appearance and takes a some study to unlock and
understand all the things that it can do. The reason for this design
is to decrease visual noise and make the operating system basics easy
to remember for people who prefer to concentrate on their work rather
than on operating the computer ... a sparse minimalism with broad
functionality. It's the Apple corporate aesthetic.

I happen to like it. That's why I the Apple Macintosh in 1984, and why
I continue to use Mac OS X systems now.

People write books like "Mac OS X: The Missing Manual" to expose
verbosely what the system can do for people who can't discover it on
their own. Nothing wrong with that. Others write more explicitly
verbose applications to do things that the provided system already
does, like Path Finder.

But most of what's in books like "The Missing Manual" is already
documented in the Mac OS X Help system ... just like most of what's in
Path Finder  is already in the Finder and the other tools built into
the system ... but most people never look into the help system for
help.

Just like few ever read the manuals that come with their cameras... to
return this back to a photographic footing. ;-)
-- 
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 5:11 PM, steve harley  wrote:

> Path Finder is burdened with some "kid stuff" but thankfully most of it is
> off by default; i use it for a few not so kiddy things:
>
>  - the NeXT-like shelf
>  - tabbed windows
>  - recent documents in sidebar
>  - the more detailed and Unixy file info display
>  - built in shell (though i keep coming back to iTerm)
>  - the ability to apply labels*
>  - the back button*
>  - the sorting in column view*
>
> my favorite Path Finder Feature ever, though it was removed in newer
> versions, is outline-style disclosure triangles within column view -- this
> was a big win for file management, but tabs and the dual browser feature
> almost make up for it

I find all of these things to be visual clutter. None of them are pose
any opportunity to get my work done more efficiently or make it more
convenient to do so.

Sorry, I'm totally uninterested in Path Finder. I'm glad you find it useful.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 23, 2010, at 7:40 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> It would have been good if he'd mentioned that when he asked the
> question. It would have made the answer almost instantaneous. This is
> what happens when you are providing support and people are using
> non-standard bits in place of the normal ways of doing things: it
> slows down the ability to help.

You've opened my eyes to possibilities with Finder I didn't know about, that if 
I'd known about I might not have gone looking for a replacement. Also my mind 
to the possibility that it's far more versatile than I realized.

That said, I find it interesting that it's been extremely easy for me to 
discover and use Path Finder's features, whereas with Finder they remained 
hidden. I don't know if there's a manual for Path Finder, if there is I never 
read it. Have hardly ever even used help. And I think I posted to its support 
forum only once.

I agree Path Finder may be cluttered up with features that few use. With a 
little instruction I might even come to prefer Finder's more zen-like approach 
compared to Path Finder's clutter. But I would need some instruction to get me 
started.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 12:41 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

I don't use Finder "file navigator" alternatives because in the 26
years I've been using Apple Mac OS systems I have yet to find one that
was as intuitive and sensible to use as the Finder. Most of them are
heavily laden with yakity-yak nonsense that the Finder does with far
more subtlety.


Path Finder is burdened with some "kid stuff" but thankfully most of it 
is off by default; i use it for a few not so kiddy things:


  - the NeXT-like shelf
  - tabbed windows
  - recent documents in sidebar
  - the more detailed and Unixy file info display
  - built in shell (though i keep coming back to iTerm)
  - the ability to apply labels*
  - the back button*
  - the sorting in column view*

my favorite Path Finder Feature ever, though it was removed in newer 
versions, is outline-style disclosure triangles within column view -- 
this was a big win for file management, but tabs and the dual browser 
feature almost make up for it


all of the above are features i find very sensible and would like to see 
in Finder; there is hope based on the ones Finder has already adopted(*)


i use one Path Finder window with multiple tabs alongside a few more 
transient Finder windows; often i use the Finder contextual menu to open 
the same folder in Path Finder



These products have a ridiculously small market
penetration, considering the size of the Mac OS installed base.


doesn't mean they are bad, just means a lot of people use their Macs 
just for basic stuff; Pentax has a small market penetration too ...



And in
doing consulting the past six years as an independent, I've discovered
that the vast majority of problems on most people's systems are solved
by removing all these poorly designed and implemented add-on things,
and teaching them how to do what they want with the Finder.


naive people can get in trouble when seduced by the promises of things 
they don't have, but the answer i think is prudence, not abstinence; 
that policy has served me well, via a handful of carefully chosen tools 
and techniques; i don't teach them to newbies though




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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 17:23 , Eric Weir wrote:

Only discovered, after the responses to my initial post on this thread, how 
items are sorted in Path Finder, i.e., at least on my setup, applications, 
packages, folders, then files. I do like having folders near the top, though, 
rather than distributed alphabetically with files, as they are in Finder. It 
makes it navigating through the directory a little easier.


in case i wasn't clear, that is a setting "Smart Sorting" than you can 
change; while i liked the idea some years ago when i first tried it, i 
turned it off after a while; in certain folders with many items where i 
want certain subfolders to be always handy, i add an underscore to the 
subfolder names to sort them to the top


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 4:16 PM, steve harley  wrote:
> On 2010-07-23 14:27 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>>
>> And it might be a bit off-putting
>> for Eric Weir, who was just trying to figure out what had happened to
>> a file on his computer.
>
> except it was Eric who was using Path Finder, so presumably he (together
> with me constituting the less than 1%, i guess) is more open than most to
> considering the ins and outs of built-in and add-on tools for Mac OS X

It would have been good if he'd mentioned that when he asked the
question. It would have made the answer almost instantaneous. This is
what happens when you are providing support and people are using
non-standard bits in place of the normal ways of doing things: it
slows down the ability to help.

But as they say, "de gustibus non disputandem." I get what I need done
efficiently and without any problems, and I'm happy with how my system
works. May it be the same for you.
-- 
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 23, 2010, at 12:20 PM, steve harley wrote:

> consider turning off Path Finder's "Smart Sorting" (in the View menu) -- i 
> gave up on it long ago, for perhaps the same reason that had you missing 
> something that was in plain sight

I'll check into it, Steve. Only discovered, after the responses to my initial 
post on this thread, how items are sorted in Path Finder, i.e., at least on my 
setup, applications, packages, folders, then files. I do like having folders 
near the top, though, rather than distributed alphabetically with files, as 
they are in Finder. It makes it navigating through the directory a little 
easier.

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 13:02 , Charles Robinson wrote:

Is there a way to make Finder show you the SIZE of a file when you have a 
search results window open?


Finder's search results windows frustrate me a lot ... Path Finder can 
search in various ways including with Spotlight, and can show file sizes 
and a lot more that Finder can't in the result window, and you can sort 
any of those columns; it doesn't slow things down







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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 14:27 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

And it might be a bit off-putting
for Eric Weir, who was just trying to figure out what had happened to
a file on his computer.


except it was Eric who was using Path Finder, so presumably he (together 
with me constituting the less than 1%, i guess) is more open than most 
to considering the ins and outs of built-in and add-on tools for Mac OS X



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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-23 14:02 , Bruce Walker wrote:

Godfrey, how does this compare to Disk Inventory X ? I've been use that
to spelunk the fs.


i'm not Godfrey, but i've used several such tools including Disk 
Inventory X, Filelight (looks a lot like DaisyDisk), WhatSize and 
OmniDiskSweeper; while the graphical view of the former two can be 
illuminating i prefer the column view of the latter two for productivity 
in managing disk space; i slightly prefer WhatSize, but OmniDiskSweeper 
is free





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Charles Robinson]

On Jul 23, 2010, at 16:05, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
> 
> I agree that it would be useful. However, the search might find things
> that require an arbitrary amount of processing to determine a size
> (eg: a folder full of folders full of folders full of folders of files
> ... tons of recursive directory search processing, etc ... you get the
> idea) so I think they are reluctant to put in a Size column in the
> display so as not to degrade responsiveness.
> 

File sizes for files, nothing for folders...  it wouldn't be hard I would 
think.  But nevermind...

> It's kind of like the lack of filtering by focal length in Lightroom.
> Focal length is encoded in the EXIF data a number of different ways,
> manufacturer to manufacturer, and up to Lightroom v2.7 Adobe didn't
> want to provide the "filter and sort by focal length" because of the
> amount of processing it could entail. (I haven't checked LR3 to see
> whether it's in there yet.) I've submitted several feature request for
> it. ;-)

They do now!  It's nice.

 -Charles

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:
> ...which is the one tiny little thing I miss with Finder vs. Windows.  Not 
> enough to make me go back, but yeah... I can't fathom why this is not an 
> option to just display in the list of found files in OSX.  Its omission seems 
> to be clearly the result of a conscious decision on someone's part to "leave 
> it out".  Or there is some black magic going on somewhere which makes it 
> impossible to add???

I agree that it would be useful. However, the search might find things
that require an arbitrary amount of processing to determine a size
(eg: a folder full of folders full of folders full of folders of files
... tons of recursive directory search processing, etc ... you get the
idea) so I think they are reluctant to put in a Size column in the
display so as not to degrade responsiveness.

It's kind of like the lack of filtering by focal length in Lightroom.
Focal length is encoded in the EXIF data a number of different ways,
manufacturer to manufacturer, and up to Lightroom v2.7 Adobe didn't
want to provide the "filter and sort by focal length" because of the
amount of processing it could entail. (I haven't checked LR3 to see
whether it's in there yet.) I've submitted several feature request for
it. ;-)

> So I use "Disk Inventory X" to give me the graphical display of files on the 
> drive and the space they occupy.  Much like the freeware "SpaceMonger.EXE" 
> for Windows.  Almost identical, actually.

As mentioned to Bruce Walker, it's the equivalent of the app I
recommended and use, Daisy Disk. Not as nicely finished UI-wise, but
it works fine.
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 4:55 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:04 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:
>
>
>> opps, should be right-click the colour header bar, not click on it.
>
> LOL ... so much for clear and intuitive. ;-)
>
>
> --
> Godfrey

Of course the problme here is my poor description, not the UI. You
always right-click in Explorer to get contextual menus which this is
and the column headers are always visible so you can select which
options you want visible in Details view even when not in Details
view. The fact I adopted some Brooksian spelling here too (Colour for
Column) doesn't help.




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Explorations of the City Around Us.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:04 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:


> opps, should be right-click the colour header bar, not click on it.

LOL ... so much for clear and intuitive. ;-)


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Bruce,

They do much the same thing. Disk Inventory X is freeware and a little
less innovative in its UI approach, and operates more slowly. I don't
think it's been updated since Mac OS X v10.3. Daisy Disk is commercial
for $20, has a more useful and informative UI, well supported by its
makers, and is up to date for Snow Leopard.

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:02 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>>
>> If your interest is overall volume space management ... that is, you
>> want to find out what's taking up space in your system in relation to
>> everything else and where it is, trim out the things that don't need
>> to be there, etc, there is a very well designed third party utility
>> application to do that. It's named "Daisy Disk" and is available from
>>
>> http://www.daisydiskapp.com/
>>
>> This is an excellent, specialist tool with a very useful way of
>> displaying how files are laid out in the file system, with resolution
>> right down to the individual file. You can do this type of thing with
>> the Finder too, but it's not specifically tuned to this kind of
>> large-scale volume space analysis/management task efficiently.
>
> Godfrey, how does this compare to Disk Inventory X ?  I've been use that to
> spelunk the fs.
>
> -bmw
>
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Charles Robinson]

On Jul 23, 2010, at 15:04, Adam Maas wrote:
> 
> Or in Windows Explorer, set the view in the Search Window to Details,
> click on the column header bar, select Size (if it isn't already),
> click the size column to sort by file size. Displays file sizes for
> all found files, no need to select them to see it.
> 

...which is the one tiny little thing I miss with Finder vs. Windows.  Not 
enough to make me go back, but yeah... I can't fathom why this is not an 
option to just display in the list of found files in OSX.  Its omission seems 
to be clearly the result of a conscious decision on someone's part to "leave it 
out".  Or there is some black magic going on somewhere which makes it 
impossible to add???

So I use "Disk Inventory X" to give me the graphical display of files on the 
drive and the space they occupy.  Much like the freeware "SpaceMonger.EXE" for 
Windows.  Almost identical, actually.

 -Charles

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:00 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:
>> It's been there since 10.3.
>
> It's not there on either my 10.3 machine or my 10.4 machine. May be
> somewhere else but I just checked and I'm not seeing the setting
> anywhere. It's certainly not at View->Show Path bar and Help on 10.3
> pulls up nothing for Path Bar.

My mistake. I thought you meant the path tool drop down:

http://homepage.mac.com/godders/Finder_path_tool-Tiger.jpg

The View->Show Path Bar was added in Leopard. I never use it, more
yakity-yak that I don't need to see all the time. ;-)

> Also Finder as 'intuitive and sensible to use'? If you continuously
> have to teach people to use it, it ain't.

"Continuously" is a bit of an overstatement, Adam, perhaps a biased
misinterpretation to support your opinion. Most of my consulting has
nothing to do with the Finder or users' expertise in using it
properly. And given there are 60-70 million Apple systems out there
and the sum total of users using add-on Finder replacements is
something significantly less than 1% of that total, I'd say the Finder
does ok.

But as I said way upthread, before that mindless homophobic imbecile
William Robb interjected, this isn't a useful discussion for a Pentax
camera equipment discussion forum. And it might be a bit off-putting
for Eric Weir, who was just trying to figure out what had happened to
a file on his computer.

Let's be sensible and agree to disagree. I will not change my opinions
and you won't change yours ... and it makes not one wit of difference
to anything in the universe. :-)

-- 
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 4:04 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:50 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
>> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 12:02 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:
>>
>>> Is there a way to make Finder show you the SIZE of a file when you have a 
>>> search results window open?
>>>
>>> I would love to be able to use it to find overly-large ISO or ZIP files 
>>> from my downloads and various other sources... but I can't see the file 
>>> sizes until I open a NEW finder window in whatever folder contains the file.
>>
>> There are two ways to obtain additional information about files
>> included in a Finder search window:
>>
>> - If you want to find and compare a few files at a time, select those
>> files and use the "File->Get Info.." command (command-i). This will
>> open a static information window for each file selected which allows
>> you to compare them easily.
>>
>> - If you want to look at size information one at a time, select one
>> file, hold the Option key down, and use the "File->Show Inspector"
>> command. The inspector window which opens is dynamic ... as you click
>> through the files in the search window it will change to show the Get
>> Info detail on each file. If you Shift- or Command-Select a group of
>> files, it will  display the number of files and the aggregate of their
>> sizes.
>>
>
> Or in Windows Explorer, set the view in the Search Window to Details,
> click on the column header bar, select Size (if it isn't already),
> click the size column to sort by file size. Displays file sizes for
> all found files, no need to select them to see it.
>
> -Adam
>

opps, should be right-click the colour header bar, not click on it.

-Adam

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 3:50 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 12:02 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:
>
>> Is there a way to make Finder show you the SIZE of a file when you have a 
>> search results window open?
>>
>> I would love to be able to use it to find overly-large ISO or ZIP files from 
>> my downloads and various other sources... but I can't see the file sizes 
>> until I open a NEW finder window in whatever folder contains the file.
>
> There are two ways to obtain additional information about files
> included in a Finder search window:
>
> - If you want to find and compare a few files at a time, select those
> files and use the "File->Get Info.." command (command-i). This will
> open a static information window for each file selected which allows
> you to compare them easily.
>
> - If you want to look at size information one at a time, select one
> file, hold the Option key down, and use the "File->Show Inspector"
> command. The inspector window which opens is dynamic ... as you click
> through the files in the search window it will change to show the Get
> Info detail on each file. If you Shift- or Command-Select a group of
> files, it will  display the number of files and the aggregate of their
> sizes.
>

Or in Windows Explorer, set the view in the Search Window to Details,
click on the column header bar, select Size (if it isn't already),
click the size column to sort by file size. Displays file sizes for
all found files, no need to select them to see it.

-Adam

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Bruce Walker]

Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:


If your interest is overall volume space management ... that is, you
want to find out what's taking up space in your system in relation to
everything else and where it is, trim out the things that don't need
to be there, etc, there is a very well designed third party utility
application to do that. It's named "Daisy Disk" and is available from

http://www.daisydiskapp.com/

This is an excellent, specialist tool with a very useful way of
displaying how files are laid out in the file system, with resolution
right down to the individual file. You can do this type of thing with
the Finder too, but it's not specifically tuned to this kind of
large-scale volume space analysis/management task efficiently.


Godfrey, how does this compare to Disk Inventory X ?  I've been use that 
to spelunk the fs.


-bmw

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 2:41 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 10:27 AM, Adam Maas  wrote:
>> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
>>>
>>> It's off by default ...
>>>
>>>  View -> Show Path Bar
>>>
>>>
>>> -bmw
>>
>> Ah, useful to note. Thanks for the info. That would go a long way to
>> making Finder nicer to work with.
>
> It's been there since 10.3.

It's not there on either my 10.3 machine or my 10.4 machine. May be
somewhere else but I just checked and I'm not seeing the setting
anywhere. It's certainly not at View->Show Path bar and Help on 10.3
pulls up nothing for Path Bar.

>
> Another thing you're likely unaware of is that Command-clicking on any
> Finder window's title will reveal a drop-down menu with the entire
> folder path from that window to the volume root. You can open a window
> to any folder on that path by picking it from the menu. This has been
> there since 1991 on all versions of Mac OS. (It also works with most
> application document windows too, a service provided by the Finder.)

That is new to me. Not as useful as the Path/Address bar since it
requires keyboard intervention but still useful, especially since my
machines are older and not running 10.5 or newer.

>
> I don't use Finder "file navigator" alternatives because in the 26
> years I've been using Apple Mac OS systems I have yet to find one that
> was as intuitive and sensible to use as the Finder. Most of them are
> heavily laden with yakity-yak nonsense that the Finder does with far
> more subtlety. These products have a ridiculously small market
> penetration, considering the size of the Mac OS installed base. And in
> doing consulting the past six years as an independent, I've discovered
> that the vast majority of problems on most people's systems are solved
> by removing all these poorly designed and implemented add-on things,
> and teaching them how to do what they want with the Finder.

Of course Finder isn't immune to these problems either, as the
show-stopping Move bug in 10.5 showed. And frankly, regardless of the
quality of the replacements, they wouldn't be there if you could do
what they do in Finder easily. And yes, they've added features to the
point of getting crufty. So has OS X and Windows (Expose and its
Windows clone?). We hit the point where adding features over improving
basic usability is a given in each OS update. OS X hit that at 10.5,
arguably at 10.4, Windows did with Vista (Win7 is a downgrade in
usability over Vista, regardless of the backend changes).

Also Finder as 'intuitive and sensible to use'? If you continuously
have to teach people to use it, it ain't. Apple's damned good on
usability, but Finder's just about the least intuitive aspect of the
main OS X UI. Especially if you've used a modern 2-pane or 3-pane file
manager before. Columns View in particular is a real WTF moment the
first time you see it, it's also painful if you're used to a
filesystem tree view.

-Adam

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 12:02 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:

> Is there a way to make Finder show you the SIZE of a file when you have a 
> search results window open?
>
> I would love to be able to use it to find overly-large ISO or ZIP files from 
> my downloads and various other sources... but I can't see the file sizes 
> until I open a NEW finder window in whatever folder contains the file.

There are two ways to obtain additional information about files
included in a Finder search window:

- If you want to find and compare a few files at a time, select those
files and use the "File->Get Info.." command (command-i). This will
open a static information window for each file selected which allows
you to compare them easily.

- If you want to look at size information one at a time, select one
file, hold the Option key down, and use the "File->Show Inspector"
command. The inspector window which opens is dynamic ... as you click
through the files in the search window it will change to show the Get
Info detail on each file. If you Shift- or Command-Select a group of
files, it will  display the number of files and the aggregate of their
sizes.

Of course, you can do a Finder search including a Size parameter (eg:
find all .ZIP files + Size > NN Megabytes) to find overly-large .ZIP
files in the file system too. The search results will then be just
those that you might consider purging.

If your interest is overall volume space management ... that is, you
want to find out what's taking up space in your system in relation to
everything else and where it is, trim out the things that don't need
to be there, etc, there is a very well designed third party utility
application to do that. It's named "Daisy Disk" and is available from

http://www.daisydiskapp.com/

This is an excellent, specialist tool with a very useful way of
displaying how files are laid out in the file system, with resolution
right down to the individual file. You can do this type of thing with
the Finder too, but it's not specifically tuned to this kind of
large-scale volume space analysis/management task efficiently.
-- 
Godfrey
  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Charles Robinson]

On Jul 23, 2010, at 13:41, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
> 
> Most people never read the extensive Mac OS X help that is included
> right in the standard system installation and never understand more
> than a quarter of the features included with the Finder. Sometimes it
> seems that I spend my consulting life reading people the Mac OS X help
> file that is on the system in front of their noses. ;-)

Is there a way to make Finder show you the SIZE of a file when you have a 
search results window open?

I would love to be able to use it to find overly-large ISO or ZIP files from my 
downloads and various other sources... but I can't see the file sizes until I 
open a NEW finder window in whatever folder contains the file.

(I figure since you seem to know quite well how it all works...)

 -Charles

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http://charles.robinsontwins.org
http://www.facebook.com/charles.robinson


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 10:27 AM, Adam Maas  wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
>> Adam Maas wrote:
>>>
> The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
> adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
> it's clickable

 look closer ... it's been there since 2007; of course Path Finder has had
 it
 for much longer

>>>
>>> It's not in any screenshot of the Leopard or Snow Leopard finder I can
>>> find.
>>>
>>> -Adam
>>
>> It's off by default ...
>>
>>  View -> Show Path Bar
>>
>>
>> -bmw
>
> Ah, useful to note. Thanks for the info. That would go a long way to
> making Finder nicer to work with.

It's been there since 10.3.

Another thing you're likely unaware of is that Command-clicking on any
Finder window's title will reveal a drop-down menu with the entire
folder path from that window to the volume root. You can open a window
to any folder on that path by picking it from the menu. This has been
there since 1991 on all versions of Mac OS. (It also works with most
application document windows too, a service provided by the Finder.)

I don't use Finder "file navigator" alternatives because in the 26
years I've been using Apple Mac OS systems I have yet to find one that
was as intuitive and sensible to use as the Finder. Most of them are
heavily laden with yakity-yak nonsense that the Finder does with far
more subtlety. These products have a ridiculously small market
penetration, considering the size of the Mac OS installed base. And in
doing consulting the past six years as an independent, I've discovered
that the vast majority of problems on most people's systems are solved
by removing all these poorly designed and implemented add-on things,
and teaching them how to do what they want with the Finder.

Most people never read the extensive Mac OS X help that is included
right in the standard system installation and never understand more
than a quarter of the features included with the Finder. Sometimes it
seems that I spend my consulting life reading people the Mac OS X help
file that is on the system in front of their noses. ;-)
-- 
Godfrey
  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 8:47 AM, William Robb  wrote:
> ... [lots more typical William Robb horse manure snipped ...] I've already 
> killfiled your boring ass picture posts, I suppose it's time to
> send you to jco/marnie/matyolaville.

I think it would be best to just nail your testicles to a board and
hit yourself over the head with them for all the anguish being
killfiled by you causes me.

Go expire stupidly and enjoy knowing that I appreciate you more in death.

You've been killfiled, woo hoo. What a wuss.
-- 
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 1:21 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> Adam Maas wrote:
>>
 The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
 adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
 it's clickable
>>>
>>> look closer ... it's been there since 2007; of course Path Finder has had
>>> it
>>> for much longer
>>>
>>
>> It's not in any screenshot of the Leopard or Snow Leopard finder I can
>> find.
>>
>> -Adam
>
> It's off by default ...
>
>  View -> Show Path Bar
>
>
> -bmw

Ah, useful to note. Thanks for the info. That would go a long way to
making Finder nicer to work with.


-Adam

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Bruce Walker]

Adam Maas wrote:



The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
it's clickable

look closer ... it's been there since 2007; of course Path Finder has had it
for much longer



It's not in any screenshot of the Leopard or Snow Leopard finder I can find.

-Adam


It's off by default ...

  View -> Show Path Bar


-bmw

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 12:24 PM, steve harley  wrote:
> On 2010-07-22 20:11 , Adam Maas wrote:
>>
>> While I can
>> understand Godfrey's choice not to use a replacement as he needs to be
>> familiar offhand with the basic Finder UI for professional reasons, I
>> thoroughly understand why any user who doesn't need to walk others
>> through basic file mangement steps would quickly move up to a Finder
>> replacement.
>
> one can be familiar with Finder (to help others) _and_ use other tools

Indeed you can, but it's a lot easier to do it with the UI you use natively.

>
>> Unfortunately OS X seems to be stuck in the paradigm that pervasive
>> search is an adequate replacement for a decent file manager.
>
> i don't see any sense of replacement, just two complementary paradigms, and
> i don't feel Finder is indecent -- QuickLook, for one, is a fantastic
> feature; i disliked Spotlight for a long time, but being able to quickly
> find one email out of hundreds of thousands won me over; i still haven't
> mastered Spotlight's query language, but given how much i use Google it's
> only natural to expect the same kind of ability from an OS

Oh, I can see the value of pervasive search, I simply dislike it as a
replacement for file management, which is the way Apple was going for
a while.

Note that since I don't store things like email on my drive, it's much
less useful for me (Search facilities in email are a must, no matter
how good your file organization, due to volume. It's less useful when
you're dealing with smaller filesets). Note Windows has the same
functionality as of Vista, although unlike on the Mac you can turn it
off and just use traditional search tools (slower, but they don't eat
CPU cycles in the background either. of course Windows Indexing is a
much bigger resource pig than Spotlight).

>
>> Coincidentally it's also the only major OS which has a steady market
>> for replacements file management apps.
>
> first of all, the market for Mac OS X file manager replacements seems rather
> weak to me; Path Finder (which i have used for years) is really the only
> major contender, but is a niche player; there are many tools to enhance
> _navigation_ on Mac OS X, but not so many to enhance _management_
>
> secondly, your statement seems contradicted by the proliferation of GUI file
> managers on Linux and the fact that there are numerous Windows file manager
> replacements (though i don't know the market well)

Linux is a strange beast, if one guy with some programming skill wants
a different file manager, you get one. Even then, there are only two
File Managers in common use anymore, Nautilus for GNOME and Konqueror
for KDE.

As to Windows, there isn't a single Explorer replacement with anything
approaching the uptake or press of Path Finder. Most of the oens I've
run across are used only in the custom UI scene, where they need thm
since they're replacing the Windows UI entirely anyways.

>
> and in a followup message:
>>
>> The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
>> adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
>> it's clickable
>
> look closer ... it's been there since 2007; of course Path Finder has had it
> for much longer
>

It's not in any screenshot of the Leopard or Snow Leopard finder I can find.

-Adam

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-22 20:11 , Adam Maas wrote:

While I can
understand Godfrey's choice not to use a replacement as he needs to be
familiar offhand with the basic Finder UI for professional reasons, I
thoroughly understand why any user who doesn't need to walk others
through basic file mangement steps would quickly move up to a Finder
replacement.


one can be familiar with Finder (to help others) _and_ use other tools


Unfortunately OS X seems to be stuck in the paradigm that pervasive
search is an adequate replacement for a decent file manager.


i don't see any sense of replacement, just two complementary paradigms, 
and i don't feel Finder is indecent -- QuickLook, for one, is a 
fantastic feature; i disliked Spotlight for a long time, but being able 
to quickly find one email out of hundreds of thousands won me over; i 
still haven't mastered Spotlight's query language, but given how much i 
use Google it's only natural to expect the same kind of ability from an OS



Coincidentally it's also the only major OS which has a steady market
for replacements file management apps.


first of all, the market for Mac OS X file manager replacements seems 
rather weak to me; Path Finder (which i have used for years) is really 
the only major contender, but is a niche player; there are many tools to 
enhance _navigation_ on Mac OS X, but not so many to enhance _management_


secondly, your statement seems contradicted by the proliferation of GUI 
file managers on Linux and the fact that there are numerous Windows file 
manager replacements (though i don't know the market well)


and in a followup message:

The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
it's clickable


look closer ... it's been there since 2007; of course Path Finder has 
had it for much longer


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-22 16:26 , Eric Weir wrote:


On Jul 22, 2010, at 10:56 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:


Ah, you've got the Finder view of the Applications window set to sort
by "Kind". If you set it to sort by "Name" the 'Adobe Lightroom 3'
application will sort with the rest of the Adobe products in their
folders. ;-)


Actually, I don't use the Finder. I use Path Finder.


consider turning off Path Finder's "Smart Sorting" (in the View menu) -- 
i gave up on it long ago, for perhaps the same reason that had you 
missing something that was in plain sight


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Fri, Jul 23, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 10:56 PM, William Robb  wrote:
>> In Windows, click on Windows Explorer, and there is your computer.
>> You can even customize it's start location (or could in everything up to XP,
>> I haven't bothered to try with Win7 yet).
>> If it isn't that easy ion a Mac, they have some work to do.
>
> It's easier.
>
> In Mac OS X, you don't have to "click on Finder" or anything to find
> your computer. The Finder is started up by the operating system as
> soon as you login, it is always available. It presents the Desktop
> folder in whatever account you're logged in on as the backdrop screen.
> You can configure whatever file system location you want it to present
> as default, in whichever of its display modes is most useful to you,
> whenever you open a new Finder window to navigate the file system. It
> stays running while you have other applications running so that you
> have immediate and easy access to the file system at all times.


That is in fact exactly how it works in Windows, KDE and Gnome as
well. In all cases the file browser is always running, but you need to
open a window for it if it's not already open. On the Mac you have a
window open by default on startup unless you tell it not too, Windows
doesn't open a window unless you tell it to (but you can tell it to
open one simply by dragging that folder to the startup folder in the
start menu).

Apple has improved the Finder significantly with Leopard, it's not the
absolutely atrocious app that it was up through 10.4, but it's still
not up to the capabilities of the current Windows Explorer for
navigation (or Nautilus and Konqueror, which MS copied heavily in the
updates to Explorer introduced in Vista).

The one simple change Apple could do to make Finder more usable is
adding an Address Bar with the current folder path in it, bonus if
it's clickable like it is on Vista and later (Or Nautilus and
Konqueror, Konqueror introduced this idea) which massively speeds up
jumping around the filesystem. Having full directory trees in the
sidebar is also a major advantage, the multi-pane view that Apple uses
instead only provides limited equivalence as you can see multiple
filesystem trees from one window with Explorer from all locations.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[William Robb]

--
From: "Godfrey DiGiorgi"
Subject: Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?




Jeez, you're such a goddam pill. Having another stupid pissing match
over Windows vs Mac OS X must be a special pleasure to you.



And you're a fucking asshole as soon as someone has the temerity to disagree 
with you.

Where, Mr. Shithead, do you figure you get off at being the list police.
Maybe when you buy the thing, you'll have some say, but until then your just 
another little prigfucker.
I've already killfiled your boring ass picture posts, I suppose it's time to 
send you to jco/marnie/matyolaville.


William Robb 



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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 10:56 PM, William Robb  wrote:
> In Windows, click on Windows Explorer, and there is your computer.
> You can even customize it's start location (or could in everything up to XP,
> I haven't bothered to try with Win7 yet).
> If it isn't that easy ion a Mac, they have some work to do.

It's easier.

In Mac OS X, you don't have to "click on Finder" or anything to find
your computer. The Finder is started up by the operating system as
soon as you login, it is always available. It presents the Desktop
folder in whatever account you're logged in on as the backdrop screen.
You can configure whatever file system location you want it to present
as default, in whichever of its display modes is most useful to you,
whenever you open a new Finder window to navigate the file system. It
stays running while you have other applications running so that you
have immediate and easy access to the file system at all times.

>> But this isn't a useful discussion for a Pentax camera equipment
>> discussion forum.
>
> Of course it isn't, but most of what is discussed here isn't, so why play
> traffic cop?

Jeez, you're such a goddam pill. Having another stupid pissing match
over Windows vs Mac OS X must be a special pleasure to you.

-- 
Godfrey
  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[William Robb]

--
From: "Godfrey DiGiorgi"
Subject: Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?


On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 7:11 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:

Finder is quite awful as a filesystem navigation/file management tool,
it remains inferior to the file management UI's on classic Mac OS, KDE
and Gnome, BeOS and any vaguely recent version of Windows.


I disagree completely. I find the Windows, KDE and other file browser
UIs to be just about completely unusable. One of the reasons I
continue to choose Mac OS X for all my work is that I *like* the
Finder quite a lot and find it exceptionally useful for file finding,
management, etc.


That's quite amazing.
In Windows, click on Windows Explorer, and there is your computer.
You can even customize it's start location (or could in everything up to XP, 
I haven't bothered to try with Win7 yet).

If it isn't that easy ion a Mac, they have some work to do.



But this isn't a useful discussion for a Pentax camera equipment
discussion forum.



Of course it isn't, but most of what is discussed here isn't, so why play 
traffic cop?


William Robb 



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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 7:11 PM, Adam Maas  wrote:
> Finder is quite awful as a filesystem navigation/file management tool,
> it remains inferior to the file management UI's on classic Mac OS, KDE
> and Gnome, BeOS and any vaguely recent version of Windows.

I disagree completely. I find the Windows, KDE and other file browser
UIs to be just about completely unusable. One of the reasons I
continue to choose Mac OS X for all my work is that I *like* the
Finder quite a lot and find it exceptionally useful for file finding,
management, etc.

But this isn't a useful discussion for a Pentax camera equipment
discussion forum.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[paul stenquist]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 10:11 PM, Adam Maas wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 9:53 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>> 
>> On Jul 22, 2010, at 8:16 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>> 
>>> I never use stuff like that. It makes it difficult to help other
>>> people when the basics of user experience in a system are changed.
>> 
>> That's very generous of you, Godfrey. When I moved over from Windows I just 
>> found the Finder to be counter-intuitive to my way of accessing and managing 
>> files and folders, to the point of finding it extremely frustrating. But my 
>> understanding is that it really is an enhanced Finder.
>> 
>> --
>> Eric Weir
> 
> Finder is quite awful as a filesystem navigation/file management tool,
> it remains inferior to the file management UI's on classic Mac OS, KDE
> and Gnome, BeOS and any vaguely recent version of Windows. While I can
> understand Godfrey's choice not to use a replacement as he needs to be
> familiar offhand with the basic Finder UI for professional reasons, I
> thoroughly understand why any user who doesn't need to walk others
> through basic file mangement steps would quickly move up to a Finder
> replacement.
> 
> Unfortunately OS X seems to be stuck in the paradigm that pervasive
> search is an adequate replacement for a decent file manager.
> Coincidentally it's also the only major OS which has a steady market
> for replacements file management apps.

I'm surprised to read that. Perhaps it's all a matter of to what one has become 
accustomed. I have hundreds of thousands of files organized in Finder, and I 
can retrieve any of them in  moments. On the other hand, I have no idea of how 
to find a single file on my daughter's PC. It's a mystery.

 But we certainly don't need another Mac/PC discussion. To each his own.
Paul


> -Adam
> Who actually seriously dislikes pervasive search and disables anything
> beyond basic locate on his *NIX machines as well as Indexing on his
> Windows machines. The current Macs don't get enough use right now to
> waste time disabling Sherlock, but it never gets used either.
> 
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 9:53 PM, Eric Weir wrote:

> But my understanding is that it really is an enhanced Finder.

That should've been that "Path Finder is an enhanced Finder." 

[By the way, Path Finder can be found here: http://www.cocoatech.com/]

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Adam Maas]

On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 9:53 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>
> On Jul 22, 2010, at 8:16 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>
>> I never use stuff like that. It makes it difficult to help other
>> people when the basics of user experience in a system are changed.
>
> That's very generous of you, Godfrey. When I moved over from Windows I just 
> found the Finder to be counter-intuitive to my way of accessing and managing 
> files and folders, to the point of finding it extremely frustrating. But my 
> understanding is that it really is an enhanced Finder.
>
> --
> Eric Weir

Finder is quite awful as a filesystem navigation/file management tool,
it remains inferior to the file management UI's on classic Mac OS, KDE
and Gnome, BeOS and any vaguely recent version of Windows. While I can
understand Godfrey's choice not to use a replacement as he needs to be
familiar offhand with the basic Finder UI for professional reasons, I
thoroughly understand why any user who doesn't need to walk others
through basic file mangement steps would quickly move up to a Finder
replacement.

Unfortunately OS X seems to be stuck in the paradigm that pervasive
search is an adequate replacement for a decent file manager.
Coincidentally it's also the only major OS which has a steady market
for replacements file management apps.


-Adam
Who actually seriously dislikes pervasive search and disables anything
beyond basic locate on his *NIX machines as well as Indexing on his
Windows machines. The current Macs don't get enough use right now to
waste time disabling Sherlock, but it never gets used either.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 8:16 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> I never use stuff like that. It makes it difficult to help other
> people when the basics of user experience in a system are changed.

That's very generous of you, Godfrey. When I moved over from Windows I just 
found the Finder to be counter-intuitive to my way of accessing and managing 
files and folders, to the point of finding it extremely frustrating. But my 
understanding is that it really is an enhanced Finder.

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Charles Robinson]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 19:16, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 3:26 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>> Actually, I don't use the Finder. I use Path Finder. But thanks for the 
>> explanation. Perhaps Path Finder has the same directory sort options. It is, 
>> after all, an enhanced Finder.
> 
> What you wish ...
> I never use stuff like that. It makes it difficult to help other
> people when the basics of user experience in a system are changed.
> 

Same reason I always use the command prompt on a Windows box.  (Or a Mac, if I 
can).  It's the same (mostly) on every machine!

 -Charles

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Thu, Jul 22, 2010 at 3:26 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
> Actually, I don't use the Finder. I use Path Finder. But thanks for the 
> explanation. Perhaps Path Finder has the same directory sort options. It is, 
> after all, an enhanced Finder.

What you wish ...
I never use stuff like that. It makes it difficult to help other
people when the basics of user experience in a system are changed.

-- 
Godfrey
  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Bruce Walker]

Eric Weir wrote:

On Jul 21, 2010, at 3:50 PM, Eric Weir wrote:

Following up on this, the Adobe Updater just asked if I wanted to update Adobe Camera Raw 4.6. I said yes. Then the Updater said it was "unable to locate the product to be updated." I take it the product to be updated was Lightroom 3. 


So not only can I not find it, neither can the Adobe Updater. Yet it's here 
somewhere. Gotta be. It runs.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net


Eric, this is a well-known Updater bug that dates back quite a while 
(2008). The Adobe KB suggests getting a copy of the ACR 4.6 install 
package/image from the Adobe site and installing it manually.  I've hit 
this bug a couple of times in the past and following the Adobe 
suggestion fixes it.


Try here:
http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/detail.jsp?ftpID=4033

BTW: Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) is a part of the PS Elements installation.

Cheers!

-bmw

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 12:40 PM, Christine Aguila wrote:

> Just teasting, Eric.  We do that a lot on the list.  Hope you don't mind. 
> Everybody has given you good explanations of cloning, so no need of me to add 
> anything.  Just hang on to Elements.  Could be useful in the future. 
> Remember, you're going to improve, and your skills and photographic vision 
> will become more sophisticated, and you may need what Elements can offer to 
> aid in that journey.

Yes, as I said in a note yesterday, I was initially overwhelmed by the volume 
of messages generated by this group, but I've come to understand that a lot of 
the volume -- a lot, like well over 50 percent in my estimation -- is joshing. 
[Just to be clear, I am not making this observation as a criticism. To the 
contrary.]

I am very much a novice, even though I started dabbling in photography -- with 
the purchase of a K1000 -- in 1990. I've learned a lot here in a short time, 
and that is due to the patient generosity of people who are way, way, WAY 
beyond me, probably beyond where I'll ever get in the time that's left to me, 
as photographers. 

I'm still getting my toe in the water with digital photography, but I love my 
camera and the few lenses I have, and I really love the luxury of being able to 
take a lot of pictures and get immediate feedback. 

One of my sessions has generated a few interesting photos. Most have generated 
none. But that's OK. I don't considered it wasted effort. I'm learning. 

So thanks to everyone,
--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 11:01 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> I'd keep Photoshop Elements around for the potential capability it
> provides. It's not all that big, doesn't waste much space, and in a
> pinch may be exactly what you need to get some small thing done that
> would otherwise be difficult.

Thanks, Godfrey. Others have suggested the same, so I'll be hanging onto 
Elements.

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 10:56 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> Ah, you've got the Finder view of the Applications window set to sort
> by "Kind". If you set it to sort by "Name" the 'Adobe Lightroom 3'
> application will sort with the rest of the Adobe products in their
> folders. ;-)

Actually, I don't use the Finder. I use Path Finder. But thanks for the 
explanation. Perhaps Path Finder has the same directory sort options. It is, 
after all, an enhanced Finder.

Thanks again,
--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Christine Aguila]

From: "Eric Weir" 


Thanks, Brian. . . . Wouldn't want do anything "nefarious," though.


Oh dear, no sense of mischief  :-).

Just teasting, Eric.  We do that a lot on the list.  Hope you don't mind. 
Everybody has given you good explanations of cloning, so no need of me to 
add anything.  Just hang on to Elements.  Could be useful in the future. 
Remember, you're going to improve, and your skills and photographic vision 
will become more sophisticated, and you may need what Elements can offer to 
aid in that journey.  Cheers, Christine




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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 7:50 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
> Based on what people here have said about how they use Lightroom, I suspect 
> that I'll never really use Elements. I generally don't like to clutter my 
> system up with stuff I don't use. Is there any reason to keep it installed?

While I do most of my image editing work in Lightroom nowadays, it is
occasionally important to have a pixel editing tool like Photoshop
available. I use Photoshop CS4 nowadays and use it to do graphics
oriented things (like adding borders, annotation, etc) that are
outside of the domain of image editing capable in Lightroom alone.

I'd keep Photoshop Elements around for the potential capability it
provides. It's not all that big, doesn't waste much space, and in a
pinch may be exactly what you need to get some small thing done that
would otherwise be difficult.
-- 
Godfrey
  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Ah, you've got the Finder view of the Applications window set to sort
by "Kind". If you set it to sort by "Name" the 'Adobe Lightroom 3'
application will sort with the rest of the Adobe products in their
folders. ;-)

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 7:47 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:14 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>
>> Is Lightroom in the Dock? If it is, click and hold on its icon, a
>> popup menu will appear. Pick "Show In Finder" and a window will open
>> with the application icon highlighted.
>
> Thanks, Godfrey. Mystery solved. It was there all along. All the other Adobe 
> applications have folders in the Applications folder, which appear at the 
> bottom of the applications list in the Applications folder. Lightroom 3 
> appears as a separate file, "Adobe Lightroom 3.app," at the top of the 
> applications list.
>
> Never woulda found it if you hadn't pointed out that I could go through the 
> icon in the dock to force the finder to reveal it's location.
>
> Thanks much,
> --
> Eric Weir
> Decatur, GA  USA
> eew...@bellsouth.net
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 22, 2010, at 5:43 AM, Brian Walters wrote:

> Within Elements (and most image editing applications) there is a tool
> called the 'cloning brush' which allows you to take a take a bit of your
> image and 'clone' it over another bit.
> 
> It can be used for lots of nefarious deeds such as removing unwanted
> elements of an image (perhaps an ex girlfriend or boyfriend...) but it
> has practical use as well such as removing dust spots.  And, you will
> eventually get dust spots on your camera's sensor.  Believe me...

Thanks, Brian. I can see it might be useful. Wouldn't want do anything 
"nefarious," though.

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Cotty]

On 21/7/10, Godfrey DiGiorgi, discombobulated, unleashed:

>My work is done in a user account, which has no privileges to
>write into the applications and other system-only locations.

I like to work on live rails ;-)

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Brian Walters]

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 23:46 -0400, "Eric Weir" 
wrote:
> 
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 11:00 PM, Christine Aguila wrote:
> 
> > I know I said I hate Elements, and I still hold by that, but if I have to 
> > do serious cloning, I use Elements for that. 
> 
> Thanks, Christine. I won't be doing any cloning soon, since I don't know
> what it is. Never even heard it mentioned before. At first I thought it
> might have to do with duplicating your originals, but that wouldn't be.
> what is it?


Within Elements (and most image editing applications) there is a tool
called the 'cloning brush' which allows you to take a take a bit of your
image and 'clone' it over another bit.

It can be used for lots of nefarious deeds such as removing unwanted
elements of an image (perhaps an ex girlfriend or boyfriend...) but it
has practical use as well such as removing dust spots.  And, you will
eventually get dust spots on your camera's sensor.  Believe me...



Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/
-- 


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-21 20:44 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

Sorry, your meaning was unclear. But the logic of the situation is
simple: Lightroom runs therefore it's not in the Trash


yeah, a lot unclear -- the logic of my interpretation of "I'm running 
Lightroom 3 on a MacBook" was that he'd used it, but that he couldn't 
find it to launch it again, therefore if he couldn't launch it 
indirectly, it might be in the Trash


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 11:12 PM, Brian Walters wrote:

> I know you said earlier that you don't want to get too involved in image
> editing but later on you might find Elements' layers and layer masks
> features extremely useful (even if only occasionally).
> 
> I don't use Lightroom but I have another image management program that I
> use for keeping track of images, and the ability to open the image in
> Photoshop for further work is invaluable.

Thanks, Brian. Recommendation well-taken.

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 11:00 PM, Christine Aguila wrote:

> I know I said I hate Elements, and I still hold by that, but if I have to do 
> serious cloning, I use Elements for that. 

Thanks, Christine. I won't be doing any cloning soon, since I don't know what 
it is. Never even heard it mentioned before. At first I thought it might have 
to do with duplicating your originals, but that wouldn't be. what is it?

--
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Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Brian Walters]

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 22:50 -0400, "Eric Weir" 
wrote:
> 
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:17 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
> 
> > I don't know where Photoshop Elements (or which version of Photoshop
> > Elements) puts the Camera Raw file because I don't use Photoshop
> > Elements. Either PSE or Adobe Reader might have triggered the Adobe
> > Updater ... no way to know. I have seen weirdnesses with the Adobe
> > Updater, however. Lightroom has its own updating mechanism built in,
> > it would not have triggered the Adobe Updater AFAIK.
> 
> Based on what people here have said about how they use Lightroom, I
> suspect that I'll never really use Elements. I generally don't like to
> clutter my system up with stuff I don't use. Is there any reason to keep
> it installed?



I think so.

I know you said earlier that you don't want to get too involved in image
editing but later on you might find Elements' layers and layer masks
features extremely useful (even if only occasionally).

I don't use Lightroom but I have another image management program that I
use for keeping track of images, and the ability to open the image in
Photoshop for further work is invaluable.


Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://members.westnet.com.au/brianwal/SL/

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 9:46 PM, steve harley wrote:

> 3b) in answer to the question about uninstalling, i said yes, assuming LR 
> uses activation -- which i now see it doesn't, so the uninstall is probably 
> something to try only if a reinstall doesn't work (i know uninstalling 
> doesn't really "fix" activation problems, but activation correlates with 
> "making a mess on the disk")

Hmm. I'm not familiar with the concept of "activation." Maybe it's something I 
don't need to/want to know about, but I'm curious.

>> I see more problems and errors
>> created by the obsessive uinstall/reinstall stuff than I see cures.
> 
> um, who's obsessive? i'd only consider uninstalling if one was sure 
> reinstalling was necessary, and then only with certain types of apps like 
> those from Adobe; i can count on one or two fingers the number of 
> uninstallers i've run in the last few years

I think Godfrey was referring to me, Steve. He may have suspected I was one of 
those obsessive "uninstaller/reinstallers." Not exactly, but as a last straw, 
and after checking with folks who're more knowledgeable than me.

Regards,
--
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Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 9:23 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:
>> Could it be in the user\Applications folder, rather than the general system 
>> one?
> 
> That would presume that Eric made an Applications folder in his user
> account. It does not exist by default.

Actually, I do have an applications folder in my user account, but I didn't 
create it. An application I use to run a Windows-only application that I can't 
live without -- CrossOver, the commercial version of Wine -- created it and put 
a folder in it when it installed. It's the only folder in the user/applications 
folder.

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eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Christine Aguila]

- Original Message - 
From: "Eric Weir" 

To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" 
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 9:50 PM
Subject: Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?




On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:17 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:


I don't know where Photoshop Elements (or which version of Photoshop
Elements) puts the Camera Raw file because I don't use Photoshop
Elements. Either PSE or Adobe Reader might have triggered the Adobe
Updater ... no way to know. I have seen weirdnesses with the Adobe
Updater, however. Lightroom has its own updating mechanism built in,
it would not have triggered the Adobe Updater AFAIK.


Based on what people here have said about how they use Lightroom, I 
suspect that I'll never really use Elements. I generally don't like to 
clutter my system up with stuff I don't use. Is there any reason to keep 
it installed?



Yes, you might consider keeping Elements for very serious cloning 
situations.  Click on Photo, then look for *Edit In* you should see 
Photoshop Elements.  I know I said I hate Elements, and I still hold by 
that, but if I have to do serious cloning, I use Elements for that.  It's 
better than Lightroom. But Lightroom is good for quick spot removal and 
minor cloning.  I used to do more cloning than now.  I hate doing it, so I 
try to shoot so I don't have to.  Still, there might come a time when I'll 
have a big cloning job.  I still have Elements 5 installed on my computer. 
Cheers, Christine 




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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:23 PM, steve harley wrote:

> first try double-clicking a catalog file as Godfrey suggested; also check for 
> the application in the Trash; if you have indeed somehow wiped Lightroom off 
> your computer, i would try to run the uninstall before reinstalling -- Adobe 
> does very messy installations; given that you have a trial activation, you 
> may have trouble after reinstalling either way

Thanks, Steve. Fortunately, Godfrey's suggestion help me find it, right where 
it was supposed to be, right where I was looking for it, all along.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:17 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> I don't know where Photoshop Elements (or which version of Photoshop
> Elements) puts the Camera Raw file because I don't use Photoshop
> Elements. Either PSE or Adobe Reader might have triggered the Adobe
> Updater ... no way to know. I have seen weirdnesses with the Adobe
> Updater, however. Lightroom has its own updating mechanism built in,
> it would not have triggered the Adobe Updater AFAIK.

Based on what people here have said about how they use Lightroom, I suspect 
that I'll never really use Elements. I generally don't like to clutter my 
system up with stuff I don't use. Is there any reason to keep it installed?

--
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 7:14 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> Is Lightroom in the Dock? If it is, click and hold on its icon, a
> popup menu will appear. Pick "Show In Finder" and a window will open
> with the application icon highlighted.

Thanks, Godfrey. Mystery solved. It was there all along. All the other Adobe 
applications have folders in the Applications folder, which appear at the 
bottom of the applications list in the Applications folder. Lightroom 3 appears 
as a separate file, "Adobe Lightroom 3.app," at the top of the applications 
list.

Never woulda found it if you hadn't pointed out that I could go through the 
icon in the dock to force the finder to reveal it's location.

Thanks much,
--
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Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Sorry, your meaning was unclear. But the logic of the situation is
simple: Lightroom runs therefore it's not in the Trash and it still
exists in the file system according to what Eric has reported. There's
no need to uninstall, re-install, or hunt around under the coffee
table.  ;-)

Run it to get it in the Dock if it isn't there already, use the Dock's
features to locate it. Then put it where it belongs.


On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 6:46 PM, steve harley  wrote:
> On 2010-07-21 17:35 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
>>
>> Not double-click ... click and hold.
>
> i meant double-click to open a catalog meaning it as an echo of your
> statement "open the catalog however you normally do"; certainly one could
> also use Open With; my thinking was, LR was missing, but a catalog was at
> hand, use the latter to open (and thus find) the former
>
>> The Finder will not launch applications from the Trash,
>
> i guess i didn't make my distinct suggestions clear --
>
> 1) find a catalog, double click to see if it launches Lightroom, if it does,
> the app is somewhere (and the Dock will help you find it)
> 2) *failing that* look for LR in the Trash (and if you find it there, drag
> it back to /Applications
> 3) *failing that* (and based on the other posts) it looks like LR is
> actually gone, a reinstall will be necessary,
> 3b) in answer to the question about uninstalling, i said yes, assuming LR
> uses activation -- which i now see it doesn't, so the uninstall is probably
> something to try only if a reinstall doesn't work (i know uninstalling
> doesn't really "fix" activation problems, but activation correlates with
> "making a mess on the disk")
>
>>  If it's running on the system, it's in some location in
>> the file system outside of the Trash.
>
> from the sound of things, LR wasn't running -- if it were it would be in the
> Dock
>
>> I see more problems and errors
>> created by the obsessive uinstall/reinstall stuff than I see cures.
>
> um, who's obsessive? i'd only consider uninstalling if one was sure
> reinstalling was necessary, and then only with certain types of apps like
> those from Adobe; i can count on one or two fingers the number of
> uninstallers i've run in the last few years
>
>
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-21 17:35 , Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

Not double-click ... click and hold.


i meant double-click to open a catalog meaning it as an echo of your 
statement "open the catalog however you normally do"; certainly one 
could also use Open With; my thinking was, LR was missing, but a catalog 
was at hand, use the latter to open (and thus find) the former



The Finder will not launch applications from the Trash,


i guess i didn't make my distinct suggestions clear --

1) find a catalog, double click to see if it launches Lightroom, if it 
does, the app is somewhere (and the Dock will help you find it)
2) *failing that* look for LR in the Trash (and if you find it there, 
drag it back to /Applications
3) *failing that* (and based on the other posts) it looks like LR is 
actually gone, a reinstall will be necessary,
3b) in answer to the question about uninstalling, i said yes, assuming 
LR uses activation -- which i now see it doesn't, so the uninstall is 
probably something to try only if a reinstall doesn't work (i know 
uninstalling doesn't really "fix" activation problems, but activation 
correlates with "making a mess on the disk")



 If it's running on the system, it's in some location in
the file system outside of the Trash.


from the sound of things, LR wasn't running -- if it were it would be in 
the Dock



I see more problems and errors
created by the obsessive uinstall/reinstall stuff than I see cures.


um, who's obsessive? i'd only consider uninstalling if one was sure 
reinstalling was necessary, and then only with certain types of apps 
like those from Adobe; i can count on one or two fingers the number of 
uninstallers i've run in the last few years



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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Charles Robinson  wrote:
> Could it be in the user\Applications folder, rather than the general system 
> one?

That would presume that Eric made an Applications folder in his user
account. It does not exist by default.

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Charles Robinson]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 17:09, Eric Weir wrote:

> 
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 4:42 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
> 
>> If you installed Lightroom using the Adobe installer and without
>> changing the default setting, the Lightroom application will be in the
>> Mac OS X path
>> "/Applications/Adobe Lightroom 3.app"
> 
> I'm not absolutely certain. I think I did what I always do when installing 
> software: Download the disc image, click on it, drag the image of the 
> application folder to the Application folder. For certain, if it went any 
> differently than that it's because that's what the installation package did. 
> I can't recall a case in which an installation package installed software 
> anywhere else. But Lightroom is definitely not there.
> 

Could it be in the user\Applications folder, rather than the general system one?

 -Charles

--
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Not double-click ... click and hold.

The Finder will not launch applications from the Trash, so that isn't
a possibility. If it's running on the system, it's in some location in
the file system outside of the Trash.

Lightroom is quite simple compared to Photoshop and doesn't need to be
constantly installed and uninstalled to work out problems. Eric just
needs to find where the .app file bundle has gotten to and drop it
back into the Applications directory. I see more problems and errors
created by the obsessive uinstall/reinstall stuff than I see cures.

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 4:23 PM, steve harley  wrote:
> On 2010-07-21 16:25 , Eric Weir wrote:
>>
>> Should I uninstall and redo the install? I have an application that will
>> clean out all the files associated with the original application.
>
> first try double-clicking a catalog file as Godfrey suggested; also check
> for the application in the Trash; if you have indeed somehow wiped Lightroom
> off your computer, i would try to run the uninstall before reinstalling --
> Adobe does very messy installations; given that you have a trial activation,
> you may have trouble after reinstalling either way
>
> --
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[steve harley]

On 2010-07-21 16:25 , Eric Weir wrote:

Should I uninstall and redo the install? I have an application that will clean 
out all the files associated with the original application.


first try double-clicking a catalog file as Godfrey suggested; also 
check for the application in the Trash; if you have indeed somehow wiped 
Lightroom off your computer, i would try to run the uninstall before 
reinstalling -- Adobe does very messy installations; given that you have 
a trial activation, you may have trouble after reinstalling either way


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>> Adobe Camera Raw is a plugin located in different places depending on
>> which version of Photoshop or Photoshop Elements you have installed.
>> It is not used by Lightroom at all. Lightroom's raw processing engine
>> is organized internally within the Lightroom application bundle and
>> only updated with updates to the Lightroom application.
>
> I only have Elements. It's weird that the updater didn't find it -- if that 
> is what it was looking for, and I don't have anything else that would use it 
> -- it's in the Applications folder. [Something triggered the updater, but 
> then the updater couldn't find the application that triggered it??]

I don't know where Photoshop Elements (or which version of Photoshop
Elements) puts the Camera Raw file because I don't use Photoshop
Elements. Either PSE or Adobe Reader might have triggered the Adobe
Updater ... no way to know. I have seen weirdnesses with the Adobe
Updater, however. Lightroom has its own updating mechanism built in,
it would not have triggered the Adobe Updater AFAIK.

-- 
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  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

The "/Pictures/Lightroom" folder is the default "Lightroom" catalog
that the LR application created when you first started it. The "
~/Library/Application Support/Adobe/Lightroom" folder is the normal
location for user specific files (presets, configurations, settings,
etc).

Is Lightroom in the Dock? If it is, click and hold on its icon, a
popup menu will appear. Pick "Show In Finder" and a window will open
with the application icon highlighted.

If LR is not in the dock, open your catalog however you normally do
(??), and it will appear in the dock. Now do the same as above.



On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 3:25 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 5:16 PM, Cotty wrote:
>
>> Eric's best bet is simple: hit Command (the apple key) + F and enter
>> 'Lightroom' into the text field. If there's lot's of things with
>> 'lightroom' in the title, sort the 'kind' to 'application'. It will tell
>> you where the application is hiding on your Mac.
>
> Thanks, Cotty. This is weird. There are two Lightroom folders. As I mentioned 
> before one is in ~/pictures. One is in ~/library/application 
> support/adobe/lightroom. It has folders for presets, some of which are empty, 
> some of which contain templates for various records. I don't see a 
> "Lightroom.app" or "Lightroom 3.app" file anywhere.
>
> As I said in response to Godfrey, I still have the disk image and haven't 
> done any editing that I would lose by uninstalling and reinstalling. Just 
> imported a couple folders containing a few images, none of which are mine, or 
> important in any other way.
>
> Should I uninstall and redo the install? I have an application that will 
> clean out all the files associated with the original application.
>
> --
> Eric Weir
> Decatur, GA  USA
> eew...@bellsouth.net
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 5:16 PM, Cotty wrote:

> Eric's best bet is simple: hit Command (the apple key) + F and enter
> 'Lightroom' into the text field. If there's lot's of things with
> 'lightroom' in the title, sort the 'kind' to 'application'. It will tell
> you where the application is hiding on your Mac.

Thanks, Cotty. This is weird. There are two Lightroom folders. As I mentioned 
before one is in ~/pictures. One is in ~/library/application 
support/adobe/lightroom. It has folders for presets, some of which are empty, 
some of which contain templates for various records. I don't see a 
"Lightroom.app" or "Lightroom 3.app" file anywhere.

As I said in response to Godfrey, I still have the disk image and haven't done 
any editing that I would lose by uninstalling and reinstalling. Just imported a 
couple folders containing a few images, none of which are mine, or important in 
any other way.

Should I uninstall and redo the install? I have an application that will clean 
out all the files associated with the original application.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 4:42 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

> If you installed Lightroom using the Adobe installer and without
> changing the default setting, the Lightroom application will be in the
> Mac OS X path
> "/Applications/Adobe Lightroom 3.app"

I'm not absolutely certain. I think I did what I always do when installing 
software: Download the disc image, click on it, drag the image of the 
application folder to the Application folder. For certain, if it went any 
differently than that it's because that's what the installation package did. I 
can't recall a case in which an installation package installed software 
anywhere else. But Lightroom is definitely not there.

I still have the disk image. I haven't done any work to speak of that I would 
lose if I uninstalled Lightroom and started over. Should I do that -- to make 
sure it's properly installed before I start using it?

> Adobe Camera Raw is a plugin located in different places depending on
> which version of Photoshop or Photoshop Elements you have installed.
> It is not used by Lightroom at all. Lightroom's raw processing engine
> is organized internally within the Lightroom application bundle and
> only updated with updates to the Lightroom application.

I only have Elements. It's weird that the updater didn't find it -- if that is 
what it was looking for, and I don't have anything else that would use it -- 
it's in the Applications folder. [Something triggered the updater, but then the 
updater couldn't find the application that triggered it??]

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

That's true. It's easy to move it back to the Applications folder by
dragging and dropping too, once you find it.

You can prevent this from happening by not working while logged in on
an administrator account. I have an administrator account that I use
to configure the system, install and de-install software packages,
etc. My work is done in a user account, which has no privileges to
write into the applications and other system-only locations.

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 2:16 PM, Cotty  wrote:
> On 21/7/10, Godfrey DiGiorgi, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>
>>If you installed Lightroom using the Adobe installer and without
>>changing the default setting, the Lightroom application will be in the
>>Mac OS X path
>>"/Applications/Adobe Lightroom 3.app"
>
> I think Eric's problem is that he las looked in the Applications folder
> and Lightroom is not there. It is possible to inadvertently move the
> application out of the Applications folder by mistake - for instance
> when making a dock alias - accidently dropping the application on the
> desktop by mistake will do this - I have seen it done.
>
> Eric's best bet is simple: hit Command (the apple key) + F and enter
> 'Lightroom' into the text field. If there's lot's of things with
> 'lightroom' in the title, sort the 'kind' to 'application'. It will tell
> you where the application is hiding on your Mac.
>
> --
>
>
> Cheers,
>  Cotty
>
>
> ___/\__
> ||   (O)  |     People, Places, Pastiche
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> _
>
>
>
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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Cotty]

On 21/7/10, Godfrey DiGiorgi, discombobulated, unleashed:

>
>If you installed Lightroom using the Adobe installer and without
>changing the default setting, the Lightroom application will be in the
>Mac OS X path
>"/Applications/Adobe Lightroom 3.app"

I think Eric's problem is that he las looked in the Applications folder
and Lightroom is not there. It is possible to inadvertently move the
application out of the Applications folder by mistake - for instance
when making a dock alias - accidently dropping the application on the
desktop by mistake will do this - I have seen it done.

Eric's best bet is simple: hit Command (the apple key) + F and enter
'Lightroom' into the text field. If there's lot's of things with
'lightroom' in the title, sort the 'kind' to 'application'. It will tell
you where the application is hiding on your Mac.

--


Cheers,
  Cotty


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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

On Wed, Jul 21, 2010 at 1:16 PM, Eric Weir  wrote:
>
> On Jul 21, 2010, at 3:50 PM, Eric Weir wrote:
>
>> Anybody know where the Lightroom folder/app is on my machine?
>
> Following up on this, the Adobe Updater just asked if I wanted to update 
> Adobe Camera Raw 4.6. I said yes. Then the Updater said it was "unable to 
> locate the product to be updated." I take it the product to be updated was 
> Lightroom 3.
>
> So not only can I not find it, neither can the Adobe Updater. Yet it's here 
> somewhere. Gotta be. It runs.

If you installed Lightroom using the Adobe installer and without
changing the default setting, the Lightroom application will be in the
Mac OS X path
"/Applications/Adobe Lightroom 3.app"

Adobe Camera Raw is a plugin located in different places depending on
which version of Photoshop or Photoshop Elements you have installed.
It is not used by Lightroom at all. Lightroom's raw processing engine
is organized internally within the Lightroom application bundle and
only updated with updates to the Lightroom application.
-- 
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  godfreydigiorgi.posterous.com

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Doug Brewer]

Eric Weir wrote:

On Jul 21, 2010, at 3:50 PM, Eric Weir wrote:


Anybody know where the Lightroom folder/app is on my machine?


Following up on this, the Adobe Updater just asked if I wanted to update Adobe Camera Raw 4.6. I said yes. Then the Updater said it was "unable to locate the product to be updated." I take it the product to be updated was Lightroom 3. 


So not only can I not find it, neither can the Adobe Updater. Yet it's here 
somewhere. Gotta be. It runs.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net







is it in your dock?

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Re: Where is Lightroom hiding?

[Eric Weir]

On Jul 21, 2010, at 3:50 PM, Eric Weir wrote:

> Anybody know where the Lightroom folder/app is on my machine?

Following up on this, the Adobe Updater just asked if I wanted to update Adobe 
Camera Raw 4.6. I said yes. Then the Updater said it was "unable to locate the 
product to be updated." I take it the product to be updated was Lightroom 3. 

So not only can I not find it, neither can the Adobe Updater. Yet it's here 
somewhere. Gotta be. It runs.

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net





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