Re: [RCSE] New radio good bye to an old friend
--- Karlton Spindle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Many of you have asked about the new Multiplex Radio Karlton, does Multiplex contemplate making a radio on 50 or 53 Mhz? __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games http://sports.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] TD contest thoughts.
I can assure you there is no way that that poly can compete! You need a Dark Star. http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/dark_star2.htm It cannot be launched anywhere near the height of the composites (not strong enough!) The Dark Star and numerous other poly ships can be zoomed as hard as any unlimited plane and has nowhere near the legs to search out the thermals same answer. The number of dihedral breaks or control surfaces has nothing to do with the strength of the wings or the plane's penetration. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] 1st Slope! Wow! (long story)
--- John Gossett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ...the last I saw as she descended below the hill crest was that she was heading for a landing in the trees... ...To get flying again, all I would have needed was a spare link, spare arm, and some more weights. But I didn't have that stuff with me, so my first slope flying lasted all of five minutes... Man! I can't get over how much fun flying is! John, you have a good attitude!! __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] SWC
--- FRED SAGE [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd also like to congratulate Skip Miller for his exceptional landing performance at the SWC The next time you're out practicing landings on a windy day, put a 14 circle out as your target and see... Which again brings to mind my favorite RCSE quote, The purpose of the landing score is to determine the winner of the contest. A word of wisdom from none other than -- Fred Sage. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Comments on the 100 Big Bird from Sky Bench Aerotech ?
--- Graeme Andrew [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just interested if anyone has any experience with the 100 Big Bird from Sky Bench Aerotech ? For our club's season championship the Big Bird was picked as the most-desired merchandise prize. The parts fit, the design is good, and it flies great. A typical production from master craftsman Ray Hayes. __ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] The saga of Hard Luck Gomez
The Saga of Hard Luck Gomez At some point each of us comes to one of those moments in life that change everything, where the future course of one's whole existence can take this path or that, and there's no ducking it. When that moment came for Hard Luck Gomez, he may have made the wrong choice; or maybe not. See what you think. He could see it creeping up on him as the seasons came and went. He used to chat about it with his old buddy Chris Aliss as they hung around the dusty shop. Chris hadn't been out to the field for a long time, and was begining to recognize that his own career was over. Sometimes when HLG would come back from the field, he would fill Chris in with stories of what was happening out there, and HLG's stories made Chris nervous. HLG, said Chris Aliss, don't talk to me about those new guys spinnin' around and whirlin' up in the air outa sight. If I'm gonna launch, I want to see where I'm goin' and no spinnin' or none of that new-fangled stuff for me. Hard Luck didn't argue, but he was tempted to point out that Chris hadn't left his shelf for over a year. Still, Hard Luck was himself sticking to the old ways, and had never spun or whirled in his life. The very thought of it made him dizzy. He saw how the others did it, how excited they looked when they came down, and heard their chatter; but he clung to the idea that it just wasn't for him. It wasn't for him, that is, until the fateful sunny spring day when he met Daisy Lee. Hard Luck was lounging in the pits, trying to spit out a bit of grass that had slipped into his hatch, when a slinky composite with six servos sat down next to him. She was so close that she was almost touching him, and HLG felt a quiver in his boom. His mind raced. How could he start a conversation with this fox? Finally, he just blurted it out. Whoo, you look sleek! I'm Hard Luck Gomez. What's your name? She answered in a soft purr. Hi. I'm Daisy Lee Glitz, she murmured. My friends call me Diz. Pleased to meetcha, HLG offered. The ensuing silence was deafening. He had to think of something So, Diz, I have to ask. What is it like? What's what like, Hardy? she said in her throaty voice. I mean, what's -- what's it like to do all that spinning and zooming? Why Hardy, she replied. Are you one of those straight-ahead Boy Scouts? Not that there's anything wrong with that, she added quickly. Hey, big guy, if you've never tried it, you should. I mean -- it's a rush. She flicked her flaps demurely. Look, she volunteered. Watch me. I'm about to take off. Oh Hardy, just watch. See how I do it. It's so wonderful. Really. HLG stared transfixed as DLG stretched her wings and began to spin. Faster, faster -- zowie, what velocity! And then, with just the slightest fetching wiggle of her shapely tail, she was gone. Whooof! Look at that! Adrenalin surged through HLG's skinny frame. He knew that there was no turning back. When Daisy Lee returned, she was flushed with excitement. Her servos were buzzing. HLG could stand it no longer. Mustering up his courage, he whispered to her excitedly. Diz, can you show me? Do you think I can do it? It's easy, she assured him. Come on to the disco with me, Hardy. We'll spin together. It'll be fabulous. I dunno, Diz he faltered. Nobody has ever touched my tip -- that way, you know his voice trailed off. HardyHardygive me your tipspin with me Daisy Lee's voice was entreating, very soft, but Hard Luck heard nothing else. Let's get high, Hardy, really really high. Let me take you up. HLG felt his fears melting, replace by a sudden resolve, a passionate desire... Okay, he said forcefully. His spar was as stiff as carbon. Let's give it a whirl. The rest was just a blur. He seemed to see the world revolving at the speed of light, the horizon rising and falling like a carnival ride, and then -- just when he thought his body would fly apart -- he felt himself rising, not like before, but rocketing, zooming, far above the floodlights where he used to level off, up, up, up --- whh!! Back in the shop the next day, HLG slumped next to Chris Aliss. He ruefully surveyed his body. He had a break at one poly joint and incipient cracks in numerous other places. His tail was ragged, his horns were partly pulled out, and his fuse was blown. I guess I just wasn't made for it, Chris, he groaned. He waited for the burst of disapproval that he was sure Chris would register. But to his surprise, Chris gave him a kind look. Oh, what the hell, Hard Luck, he said in a reassuring voice. Never regret it, old friend. You did what all of us ought to do. You went out with one last great fling. And he raised his tail and gave HLG the V-sign. __ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Glue in or Mount Wing Servos
I bought an obechi-sheeted plane a couple of years ago. The previous owner had glued the servos in with Zapadapagoo (similar to shoe-goo) and generally botched the installation. The only remedy was to cut the whole mess out in a big circle and install Chris's servo cans. Last year I acquired another plane with the servos glued in but they were attached to balsa plates. Grabbed the servos with vise-grips, twisted, and out they came with minimal carnage. This allowed me to rescue a plane that had been unflyable due to linkage slop. However, glued-in servos can never be good and they can be really bad. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Glue in or Mount Wing Servos
--- David Shanks [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Who is Chris, and where do I find these servo cans? Can they be used in very shallow wings? Thank you! Check 'em out at: http://www.scrollsander.com/Soaring-ServoCans.htm __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: Contests; why?
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dudes Attending contests has simply become a matter of economics for me. ...guys like Anker and Tom and Phil have taken to giving me Show money ...I can cover travel expenses and make enough besides to go out Saturday night with one of those adoring Glider Groupies that are so predominant in our sport. Note that Denny has the same agent as Alex Rodriguez. That's why he can get this deal and YOU CAN'T! __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Hard data on L/D values for models
--- Anker Berg-Sonne [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Flying at max L/D is great when looking for thermals in relatively still air. However, where flying at best L/D is really, really important is when you are trying to return to the field from downwind in a stiff breeze, or a howling hurricane. The problem is that flying at max L/D isn't optimal. Some higher speed is. Right. For the math of this, see http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/penetrate.htm As you feed in downtrim, airspeed, ground speed, and sinking speed all increase. The sinking speed is airspeed / (L/D), and the ground speed is airspeed - wind velocity. An easy way to figure out how far upwind you can fly from a given altitude at a given speed is to calculate the associated sinking speed, then figure out how long the plane can stay in the air; once you know that, you can get how far the plane can fly over the ground by multiplying time in the air * ground speed. To do this, you need the plane's polar. As Anker points out, best penetration typically occurs at a lower CL (i.e. at a faster speed) than does max L/D. For my simulated 3M plane loaded to 13 oz., best penetration comes at a CL of 0.5 if the wind is 10 mph, 0.4 if it's 15 mph, and 0.3 if it's 20 mph. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Hard data on L/D values for models
--- Paul Breed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Cool data, what does your simulation predict for minimum sink for these aircraft? For my hypothetical 3M plane, minimum sink at 10 oz./sq ft is 1.2 ft/sec. That's at an airspeed of about 17 - 18 mph. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Contests - why?
It's no different from 25 cent skins when you're playing golf with your buddies. It adds purpose to your flying - as much or as little as you want to make it. It can't hurt to try to do your best in anything. Contests make you pay more attention to detail in trimming your plane and make you work on flying skills, neither of which is a bad thing. And you get some memorable moments, for better or worse. I've got some wood and a Nats trophy from days when things went right, and some rueful stories to tell from the (many more) days when they didn't. I always urge our new club members to come out and try contest flying. Some do, a larger number don't. But for those who do, I think it adds another dimension to a hobby that offers so much richness of experience. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: What is a Rahm winch?
--- silentfilght [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Would anyone happen to have plans for building a winch? You can get nice ones at: http://members.aol.com/laserartco/page13.htm Be sure you have your speakers on when you access the page. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE video emails in Yahoo! Mail! http://promo.yahoo.com/videomail/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Re: How long is yours?
Re still-air times: Suppose that you can launch to 600 feet (pretty good for still air with a 600 foot line). If your plane's loading is 9 oz/sq ft, at a CL of 0.9 it will fly 23 ft/sec. Therefore if the L/D at that speed is 23 the sink rate will be 1 ft/sec. That's 10:00 from 600 feet. BUT -- there are a lot of moving parts in this test. It's hard to get consistent flights with the same launch height and to keep the plane flying at minimum sink throughout the flight. And of course it doesn't take much air movement to change the results dramatically. If the air is rising at even 10 ft/min, you'll stay up 12 minutes instead of 10! This sort of air movement is easily possible even after dark. So it's mighty hard to be sure you're drawing the right conclusions about a plane's performance from still-air testing. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Beefing Up Wing
--- Rick Van Clief [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Shouldn't the thicker carbon go on top? Carbon being poorer in compression than in tension and all. Yes. Carbon uni has compression strength of, say, 100k psi but strength in tension is double that or more. Typical carbon spar arrangement for a 3M ship has .060 * 1/2 on top and .030 * 1/2 on bottom with end-grain balsa core (see http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/dark_star2.htm for an example). The carbon is so much stronger than the spruce that the spruce serves no purpose once the carbon is on, so you can shave the supplied spruce down to make the laminated spar fit into the rib slot. Also, the typical kit's box-spar arrangement with the shear webs on the sides of the spar caps is less effective than a solid end-grain web between top and bottom spars. __ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] 7037 vs. MH32 Discussion
--- Art Mcnamee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some are afraid to fly the RG15 as they say it won't thermal. They are wrong. Yep. RG15 is a great thermal airfoil. In fact, an RG15-equipped Pike won the F3J WC if I remember right. __ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] S3010
For the answer to these and many other questions, see: http://www.nasg.com/afdb/list-polar-e.phtml --- Zbigniew Michalczyk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello Everybody! looking for AOA @ zeroCl for S3010 and any other data like polar curve Cm is there any web site I would get hooked on. __ Do You Yahoo!? Check out Yahoo! Shopping and Yahoo! Auctions for all of your unique holiday gifts! Buy at http://shopping.yahoo.com or bid at http://auctions.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Im looking to buy an Airfoil Program?!?!?!?
for airfoil plotting and rib or core templates, nothing beats compufoil (http://www.compufoil.com/). For airfoil design and analysis, nothing beats xfoil (http://raphael.mit.edu/xfoil/) --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi there, Does anyone know where to ethier buy a good airfoil program or have a copy for sale? Or have any good web sites with that kind of information on them. I really appreciate any advice to help me out. Thanks, Jason RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] ESC for S400 (off subject)
--- Don Stackhouse @ DJ Aerotech [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Switches in general are also passe these days... This seems particularly applicable on higher power systems. If the resistance of your switch plus leads is only .002 ohm and your motor is drawing 50 amps, the voltage drop across the switch is .1V; on a 10-cell pack this reduces power to the motor by 10 watts. __ Do You Yahoo!? Find the one for you at Yahoo! Personals http://personals.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] RES vs unlimited
As always, Chuck knows what he's talking about (see below)! If you had the old spot landing task, RES ships would be fully competitive in Unlimited, at least in the hands of a good flyer. This would open up a lot of interesting possibilities for design improvements, potentially bring in some new blood, lower the average cost of planes, and possibly have other benefits as well. As I've said on here before, I dream of the day when an RES ship wins unlimited in a big contest. However, if the contest is decided by landing points on a runway or shuffleboard landing task, that ain't gonna happen. There is no practical difference in the thermaling performance between the full house model and RES. The only real difference is in the ability to float down the landing string at very low speed and spike the spot when the time runs out. Flaps will always have a landing advantage but the advantage can be minimized by getting rid of landing on a string as done at the nats. Since RES models do not have the precise lateral control near touchdown, landing exactly on the string is much more difficult. Going back to the L4 landing option would reduce the penalty for slight lateral deviations and eliminate the ability to slowly float down the string waiting for the countdown to reach zero. Chuck Anderson __ Do You Yahoo!? Find a job, post your resume. http://careers.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Challenger kit
The Challenger is a great-flying plane if you're a good flyer. I haven't seen the Skybench kit of the Challenger, but Skybench stuff is top-notch; all of it bears the stamp of Ray Hayes, master craftsman and expert flyer. Ray flew his Challenger for the first time at the Nats in Nostalgia, and after a shaky start he wound up placing in the money. --- Andy Page [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: www.skybench.com click on the Nostalgia/RES link... Challenger is at the top of the page. __ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Re: RES
Do it! Design and build an RES plane with all the knowledge that has accumulated and all the new materials and techniques available since the heyday of the nostalgia planes. You'll have a great-flying plane and a lot of fun! --- Bob Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is a class in which the Sagitta and a lot of other Neo-Stalgia planes can be flown. It is called RES (Rudder-Elevator-Spoilers) and you don't have to fly a $1,000+ moldie to be competitive Join the fun; build a kit, modify a kit, or design your own. Regards, Bob Johnson Fond du Lac, WI __ Do You Yahoo!? Listen to your Yahoo! Mail messages from any phone. http://phone.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] The year's most significant development in R/C soaring?
Ah Jim, great post! I'm an RES partisan and a lover of cruciform tails, but for long-term impact on the sport I'd say that there were three biggies: DS, sidearm, and the release of Xfoil into the public domain. And ya know, three big developments in a single year is pretty cool! What was the most significant development in R/C soaring this year and why? Was it: - The resurgence of cruciform tails. - The development of the sidearm launch. - The F3J stake issue. - Breaking the $1000 barrier for a competitive molded sailplane. - The popularity of RES. - Dynamic Soaring. From: James C Deck [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help? Donate cash, emergency relief information http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] A shocking experience
Lee Trevino's other law is: You CAN use your 1-iron in a lightning storm, because even God can't hit a 1-iron. --- Tom H. Nagel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is known as Lee Trevino's Law : don't stand at the highest point holding a metal rod over your head when there is lightning around. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email alerts NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger http://im.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Fults Hill
My mention of Fults Hill drew some queries. It's a public park in rural Illinois about 45 minutes from downtown St. Louis Mo. South on Rt 3 to Waterloo, right on 156, make hairpin turn at abandoned gas station onto Bluff Rd., past village of Fults, look for sign on right that sez Fults Hill. Hike up the left-hand trail (not the wooden stairs). Et voila. It's a pretty spot. A few pix are at http://www.mvsaclub.com/fults_hill.htm The flying is best with southwest winds, which luckily are the prevailing winds at the site. For best info, check with Paul Luebke [EMAIL PROTECTED] who is our club's most active Fultsian. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email alerts NEW webcam video instant messaging with Yahoo! Messenger http://im.yahoo.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] moldie distributors?
A couple of others who I haven't seen mentioned yet are Hobby Club (www.hobbyclub.com), distributors of various imported moldies, and rnr (http://www.rnrproducts.com/airframes/gliders/glider3.htm), U.S. manufacturers. __ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] F3B plane size
--- Jason Werner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You see, Joe is getting a little older. So he felt a little safer plane is better for him. One that is a little bigger... Since I'm twice as old as Joe, I'm going for a plane that's twice as big. __ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Eye Problems
Just remember, all you guys, that Brian can beat the stuffing out of just about everybody on here. --- Andrew E. Mileski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Brian Iva Smith wrote: ThanksHave done all that, except last one..How do you get a max when your having to fly in close..:o) Brian __ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
--- Bill Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I noted that the TWO 5/32 rods have the same cross-sectional area as the ONE 1/4 wingrod. 2 5/32 rods have a combined cross-sectional area of 0.0383 sq in, and a single 1/4 rod has a cross-sectional area of 0.0491 sq in. If you can obtain 9/32 and get it to fit, use that. __ Do You Yahoo!? Make international calls for as low as $.04/minute with Yahoo! Messenger http://phonecard.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
--- Bill Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: how do you calculate the winch load from the speed of the plane? --Bill The lift on a wing is: L = (.00237/2) * CL * S * V^2 where .00237 = density of air S = area in sq ft V = velocity in ft/sec CL = coefficient of lift, which during the launch is roughly 1.0 The tension in the line = the lift generated by the wings, so you can solve for V, which is where I get the 125 mph for my 2-meter plane to create 150 lbs of line tension. As Joe Wurts points out in a recent post on launch tension, a wind gust or a strong thermal will add lift. However, the Brits measuring launch tension on their F3B planes got nothing over 40 kg, about 88 lbs. This jibes with my 72 mph conjecture (for a 3M plane) based on the maximum speed at which my winch can pull in line when unloaded. Now 2 guys pulling a line in via a pulley certainly don't make the plane fly faster than 72 mph. However, if the wind up there is 20 mph and the plane is hanging there with no forward velocity, just kiting, and the line is stretchy, and there's a thermal, and the flaps are down allowing the CL to rise to, say, 1.2, and then they run like hell -- who knows? Due to the plane's inertia, the tension in the line can spike to a level much greater than that sustainable by wing lift. The line stretches in response to the increased tension. Then the pilot resolves this unstable situation by pointing the nose straight down. Let's say that there's 150 lbs of tension in the line, and that the plane weighs 5 lbs. That's 30 g. So the plane accelerates downward with an initial acceleration of 30 times the acceleration of gravity (!!!). The acceleration declines linearly as the tension is taken up, until it equals the acceleration of gravity. By that time the plane can be going _fast_ (see http://www.mvsaclub.com/zoom.htm) Now when you pull the nose up you can generate a lot of wing-busting force. Joe's layups.xls spreadsheet allows you to design for maximum load both due to line tension and to the high-speed pullout. If the plane doesn't explode, you also generate a lot of altitude. Dennis Phelan sez he has measured F3B launch altitude at about 1000 feet when everything goes just right. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Composite wingrods
--- Bonfiglio Tullio [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, guys, Has any of you ever tried to build and use a composite wingrod ? By composite I mean a rod made by a carbon tube with a steel bar (closest diameter) epoxied inside, sorta of case hardened steel. Is the reverse (steel tube outside and carbon rod glued inside) also convenient ? I made a wingrod by filling a stainless tube with carbon filaments + epoxy. It was not as good as a carbon rod, in the sense that a bending moment that would not have broken a carbon rod did bend the composite rod. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] It's here... Chris Kaiser's Kahu DLG plans are waiting for you!
This is an outstanding and admirable design embodying a lot of knowledge and good ideas. Have a look, everybody! Thanks to Chris for the pix and plans, and as always thanks to Joel and Charles River for disseminating this cool and valuable info. --- Joel A. Foner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Chris has kindly offered to put his design up for all to see, and after a little web fooling around it's up. The page has a description and construction notes, along with an Acrobat PDF of both a 3-view and the wing bagging layup details. Thanks for sharing, Chris! This kind of community spirit makes a lot of people happy, and helps to brew even more great ideas. The Kahu DLG page is at (this next URL should be all on one line): http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/kahudlg/chriskaiser_kahudlg.htm Also see our Articles Tips index page for more online plans and other information. The left column of the index is the online plans, including Mark Drela's Apogee updates (now available in a handy 30 version ;). http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles.htm Regards, Joel Joel Foner Webmaster - Charles River Radio Controllers http://www.charlesriverrc.org/ IRCHA #1458 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] JR R700 rx
I worry about the same thing, but FMA 6 meter receivers work fine as far as I can tell. I don't think they have either an AGC or RF stage, but I've never had any trouble and Tom Hoopes who has some fancy test eqpt and the inclination to do the world a service has given them his seal of approval. I sorta think/hope that JR and FMA will keep doing it as long as the marginal cost is near zero and they serve a little market niche. --- Len Revelle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Tony, Lack of receivers may eventually take me back to 72 and likely Multiplex gear if the trend continues. Unfortunately ham radio growth isn't enough to sustain the RC manufacturers interest. Len Revelle N9IJ AMA 60055 LSF 7492 [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Practical application...
Well Bill, you already know my response: what you refer to as option 2 is worth it becuz it is stronger, lighter, and easier to build. I've done it both ways and I'll never go back to option 1. I'd be interested in others' experiences and comments. The difference between Mark's spar and mine is that mine is built externally and fitted into the wing; the spar goes thru the ribs, whereas in his design the ribs go through the spar. His would probably turn out marginally lighter. After accounting for the difference in joiner systems, my 2-piece 2M Dark Star wing weighs about 10% more than Mark's Allegro-lite wing. Both will take the fullest-pedal zoom your nerves can stand. --- Bill Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here are a couple of practical applications of techniques to strengthen wing spars, and some questions. You start out with a built-up wing. The spar is conventional and is made of 1/8x3/8x48 spruce top and bottom spar caps with 1/8x 3/8 vertical-grain balsa shear webs. It is built around 1/8 balsa ribs with 1/16 balsa D-tube sheeting. You want to strengthen the spar so that stronger winch launches can be made; full pedal zoom launches would be dandy, but not necessary. Two approaches: 1. Strengthen the existing spar. You laminate carbon fiber laminate onto the spruce spar caps: .007 on bottom, .014 on top. Substitute 3/8x3/8 vertical grain balsa core for the shear webs; as the ribs are glued to the bottom spar, this 3/8 wide balsa core is glued in between ribs. The top spar cap is glued in, and the high-stress areas (around the wingrod tubes and 6 out) get an additional shear web of 1/16 ply. The space between the ribs is wrapped with Kevlar tow (which is epoxied) to provide a shear skin and to provide burst strength as the spar is flexed. The leading and trailing edges are attached, and the D-tube sheeting is applied. Although somewhat heavier than the stock wing, this strengthened wing ought to be much stronger. Question is, how much stronger? Is it worth the effort? 2. Make a Balsa-Core Carbon spar, per Mark Drela's Allegro-Lite http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/allegrolite2m/markdrela_allegrolite2m.htm or Tonly Estep's Dark Star http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/dark_star.htm . You start with a 3/8x3/8x48 vertical-grain (end-grain) balsa core, glue on the carbon fiber laminate spar caps (.014 bottom, .028 top). Epoxy on a fiberglas or carbon cloth shear skin to complete the spar. The wingrod tube gets the 1/16 ply box, plus Kevlar wrap, as above. The ribs are attached to the spar and the LE, TE and D-tube sheeting are added. This ought to be stronger than the stock wing and lighter than the modified wing in #1 since you are not adding to the spruce spar caps. Question is, how much lighter, and would it be worth the effort? --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Reinforcing poly and other wing joints
Before you put the tape on, put a strip of carbon tow across the joint along top and bottom of the sheeting in line with the spar. This helps quite a bit with the stiffness of the joint. --- Bill Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would suppose that the reinforcment needs be be strongest on the top or bottom, and less so on the LE. The stress is going to be strongest on the top and bottom surfaces. And the tape is most critical on the bottom surface and less so on the top surface. Assuming that the highest stress occurs during winching, the bottom tape is in tension, where it is the strongest, and the top tape is in compression, where it is less strong. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] JR R700 rx
JR does have one double-conversion rx, the R940 D/C (stands for double conversion -- costs 200 bux). The rest of them have some AGC circuitry and extra filtering which make the rx perform well in every respect except image rejection. Image rejection doesn't matter on 72 mhz because there's nothing transmitting on the image frequency, except for ch 11 (I think it's 11), so they don't supply their single-conversion rxs with that crystal; but on 6 meters you never know what might be on the image frequency, so you gotta go with double conversion. --- Tom Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Horizon catalog doesn't have many details on the 700, but I believe JR stuff is single-conversion with their proprietary filtering system, which supposedly yields dual-conversion like performance. This has not, however, been my experience (at least on the channels I fly). Your mileage may vary. Tom - Original Message - From: Len Revelle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: tony estep [EMAIL PROTECTED]; James V. Bacus [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2001 11:19 AM Subject: RE: [RCSE] JR R700 rx Their ads says the 700 is to replace the 600. Though I've not been able to find specs on the 700 would it not be safe to assume at least double conversion? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Skegs on RES planes
In the true spirit of RES we should all attempt to emulate the great Otto Heithecker. I have a vivid memory of Otto's mighty 12' Challenger barreling toward the landing spot, touching down at the far edge of the circle that they used in those days, and sliding toward the bulls-eye; at the crucial moment, Otto yelled STOP!! and the plane's nose halted on the dime. When you can do that, you don't need a skeg. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Prism
I have a couple of T-tail Prisms with RG-15 airfoil. They fly great and are still quite competitive in TD (no slopes around here). The only negative I would mention is that mine have 3/8 steel wing rods which are rather short -- they only stick into the wing about 5. Therefore I'm pretty sure that if I subjected them to a lot of hard launches they would eventually delaminate. --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One of my old Northeast Sailplanes catalogs shows 3 Prisms, including a Prism Racer slope plane, and the 2V and 2T thermal planes. It says it was originally designed by Ron Vann, and NSP bought the the rights to mfg it. At 02:14 AM 6/22/01 EDT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, Can someone please tell me about a Prism? Who designed and mfg. the kit? Has it done well? TIA, Christopher, in Omaha RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brett Jaffee: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Brett's Slope and Power Home Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~jaffee OnTheWay Quake 2 server utility: http://www.planetquake.com/ontheway The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page: http://members.nbci.com/bjaffee/extra300/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] cg questions again.
cg location depends on a bunch of things, but for the purposes of modelers the best idea is to make a lot of simplifying assumptions, use a shorthand formula, and then adjust by flight trimming. Howard Chevalier offers a workable rule of thumb (Model Aerodynamics, p. 109) neutral point = location of wing aero center + tail volume * (1-4/AR) where AR = the wing's aspect ratio, and tail volume = (stab area/wing area)*(TM / C) where TM = distance from wing a.c. to stab a.c. and C = wing's mean aerodynamic chord after you figure the neutral point, locate the c.g. about 20% of the wing's mean aerodynamic chord forward of that point. Then trim to taste. This formula gives results that usually (though not always) are within striking distance of the correct value as computed with all the relevant variables. The DA program written by Helmut Lelke, found at http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/design/helmutlelkedesignanalysis.htm will give you estimates of the TM and C I have a spreadsheet that will do the complete computation, but it is undocumented and unruly -- a one-man dog. --- Bill Johns [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Greetings! A couple of questions about cg's. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Luddites, technology, progress, competition and general malaise
Suppose that a few years ago somebody said, It'd be neat to have a plane you could throw 150 feet high, one that weighed only 9 ounces but would withstand launch speeds of 100 mph, one that would thermal, roll, do an outside loop, and stop dead in the air -- well, I guess that's pretty far-fetched. So now we've got 'em. They contain slick IC-based digital electronics, maybe NiMH or Lithium batteries, carbon fiber, fiberglass, aramid, teflon, nylon, machine-shaped balsa, and a lot of computer hours that probably got charged to some project that was not identified as model-airplane related. Not surprisingly, they are expensive. Today's HLG is quite a sophisticated little system, but this doesn't mean that something bad has happened to us or our hobby. Whenever you confront a competitive task, it's pretty unlikely that you'll be able to find a solution that simultaneously produces better results and is also requires less effort or resources. The same thing has happened in just about every kind of man/machine competition; it has gone to something of an extreme in bicycling, Wakefield, drag-racing, and ocean sailing. There's a perception that the participant who doesn't want to go to the limit to be a world-class competitor loses something in this. But all that has happened is that the competitive gap between him and the guys who really are world-class competitors is now bigger and more obvious. This is not really a loss, since the gap was always there. And it's offset by the real gain in knowledge of how he too can have a better-flying machine. Put another way, why should I be bent outa shape if my X-Bird, once apparently so competitive, now seems to be obsoleted by the latest TyrannoRaptor? The X-Bird still flies as well as it ever did. And now if I want to, I could have something that flies even better. So I have to consider myself better off, because I have all the choices and opportunities I had before, plus more. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Need ARF Trainer Suggestions
Our club has sponsored an ARF-only class. The Spirit ARF is indeed a good plane for beginners. If you can tolerate a 1-piece wing, you can glue the joiner in and fiberglass the joint, which gives a pretty strong wing. Once launched, it thermals well, is very hard to tip stall, and generally is well-mannered. --- David Cole [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Great Planes Spirit 2-meter ARF is a good choice. For anything but a light winch launch, you might want to replace the balsa in the wing joiner with some good plywood of the same thickness (ARF kit comes with two pieces of aluminum which you sandwich over a piece of balsa and glue with expoxy). Otherwise, this plane is easy for beginners to fly, fairly durable (there are still no good EPP trainers that come in an ARF as far as I know), and will still be fun to fly even after the training period if it survives. They do take some time for a beginner to complete (probably at least 8-12 hours unless the person has some other building experience) but of course a lot less time than the non-ARF kit takes. I hear the Aspire 2-meter ARF is also a good choice, but have never seen one myself. Good luck! David Cole Fort Worth, Texas http://msinow.com/rc/ - R/C Sailplane site for beginners - Original Message - From: Clarkson, Tom [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, June 08, 2001 4:36 PM Subject: [RCSE] Need ARF Trainer Suggestions Looking for a poly trainer to teach a couple of people how to fly. Any suggestions for good winch launch strength, adequate performance, but most of all very very low building time? Thanks RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] RES Sapphire
Make it 5 bends. Figure your effective dihedral angle as explained at http://www.rc-soar.com/tech/spiral_eda.htm Make it about 9 degrees. If you want a really heavy-duty analysis, get Blaine Rawdon's design spreadsheet from [EMAIL PROTECTED] and figure out the right combo of effective dihedral plus tail volume. --- Danny C Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am building a Sapphire as a RES ship, and I was looking for some help on how much diheredal to put into the wings outer panels, and if I should make it a three bend wing or a five bend wing. Any insight or input will be greatly appreciated. Dr. Dan Williams Broomfield, Co RMSA/PPSS Bad roads bring good people and good roads bring bad people. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Wanted: Pictures of Bird of Time (and cousins)
If you haven't already, be sure to check out http://www.skybench.com/ where there are numerous pix of various flavors --- Andrew E. Mileski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've scoured the net for pictures of the Bird of Time and its cousins like the Big Bird and Lil'Bird, but I couldn't find many :( If you have any pictures available of these, I'd appreciate a pointer to them, or e-mail them to me direct. A short description of the picture(s) would be nice too :) All pictures will end up on my BoT web page: http://www.netwinder.org/~andrewm/rc/bot/ Thanks. -- Andrew E. Mileski RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] molding nosecones
try http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/construction/noseconesmadeeasier.htm and let us know if it works. --- Douglas, Brent [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: anyone ever do this without using a 2 piece approach? eg, can you mold a nosecone on the end of a plug and hope to get it off in 1 piece? brent RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Celebs in RC Soaring
And Mark Smith flew the seagulls in the movie Jonathan Livingston Seagull. --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are several others who have done movies, way back. Back in the early 1970's Russ McCracken of the SFVSF at Pierce College did the Glider for the movie The Birdmen about a group that escaped from a Germany POW castle by building a glider in the attic of the castle/palace. And for Jon Erikson and other, you should recall that Bill Watson did the Pterdactyl for the Mathew Broderick film War Games __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] motorcycles
YMMV! --- Cottrill, Flash [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After 35 years of motorcycling it seem that one major accident for every 10,000 miles ridden is a good (bad) average. Gordon. __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Gatewa Open, June 9-10 -- another crack at TNT hotshots
Fly in the Gateway Open (near St. Louis) June 9 - 10 and have another shot at MVSA's own Nelson Itterly, winner of RES at the TNT, and maybe also at Jeff Naber, 2nd in Unlimited at TNT. Getcher registration forms and other info at http://www.mvsaclub.com/soapp.pdf __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] CF or GF spars
Check out http://www.cstsales.com/SparBuilding.htm and http://www.favonius.com --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can someone give me sites with techniques/tips to use CF or GF spars in foam sheeted wings? __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Camber/Reflex Settings?
The sinking speed in a turn = straight line sinking speed / (cos(theta)^(3/2)) where theta is the bank angle -- provided that the L/D for a given angle of attack is the same while circling as when flying straight. Straight line sinking speed, in turn, is forward speed / (L/D). Now if you're flying straight and you decrease the L/D by skidding along in a yaw, your sinking speed goes up. Similarly, if you fly a circle in a skid, you sink faster than you would in a nicely coordinated turn of the same diameter. Of course, for some planes it might still be true that if you're going to input only aileron or only rudder, you could be better off using only rudder -- not because you want a skidding turn, but because that particular plane gives a more nearly coordinated turn with rudder alone than it would with aileron alone; the skid is less with rudder only than it would be with aileron only. This depends on dihedral and force arrangement. However, an ideally coordinated turn (which for most planes requires inputs from both rudder and aileron) is best. I took a full scale glider ride with a pretty experienced competition pilot a while back, and noticed that all the thermal turns we made were coordinated, with the little yaw string dealie straight up the canopy. They also seemed to be at a fairly high bank angle. The primary purose for the rudder seemed to be to prevent the huge amount of adverse yaw, not for flattening out the turn. So why is it that r/c gliders do flat thermal turns in small thermals when the big guys do coordinated turns in big thermals __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Spiral stability
Ok, I grant you that the Allegro has a good margin, and that circling CL is, let's say, 0.7 - 0.8. But I'm still wondering about, let's say, a Bird of Time, which has a short tail moment and EDA 10, or a Grand Esprit which has a very low EDA -- and of course there are others. For these planes the quotient drops below 5, and therefore the CL for spiral stability drops well below the actual CL at which you fly. In such a case, what can you conclude about the handling qualities of the plane? And how do those qualities differ from those of a plane that maintains spiral stability all the way up to the maximum flyable CL? I guess that's the question I meant to ask in the first place. --- Mark Drela [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The actual EDA (of the Allegro) is 12.1 degrees, which is a comfy 23% margin. - Mark __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] How Fast?
Glide speed in ft/sec = sqrt(loading in lbs/sq ft / (2/(CL*.00237))) For a typical HLG, CL when you're flying slowly might be about 0.9. For a 10 oz plane with 350 sq in area flying at CL = 0.9, glide speed turns out to be about 15 1/2 ft/sec. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] M.A.C. ? again
Compufoil figures it out for you in Planform view. --- Bill Swingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Calculating the mean geometric chord (MGC) is where a CAD program becomes very helpful. __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/?.refer=text RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] A note of interest for the F3J guys ( gals, if appropro.)
Suppose one guy holds the pulley and the other the end of the line, and they run in opposite directions? --- Les Grammer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Off of the FAI exchange came the following announcement: _ British Association of Radio Control Soarers Thanks to Nick Neve UK delegate to CIAM Meeting for the information and to Chris Bishop, Chairman of BMFA SFTC who wrote the following:- Major change. With immediate effect as of Monday 26th March the F3B F3J rules will prohibit the tethering to the ground of any hand towline while towing. Two man towing is still is OK, as is the use of pulleys. Winch turnaround pulleys and bungee stakes are not affected by this ruling. Although this was not on the published CIAM agenda it was obvious that the subject of stakes and pulley towing was going to be discussed following the tragic death last year in Slovakia. This change has been introduced on the grounds of safety following that event. There had been late proposal from the Swiss backed by various other countries to introduce winches. It was unanimously (nearly) felt that banning the stake was a better solution and that F3J would not loses it's identity as a hand towed only event. For those able to get out and practice it gives you something to think about. Quite a few fliers have already come to realise that in windy conditions there is little to be gained from using a pulley and that a straight two man tow gives equal if not better results. In calm/light wind conditions one tower will now act as the stake but with the option of increasing the line speed by moving away from the tower with the pulley. There were no other major changes. Full details will be posted on the FAI web-site next week. There will also be a statement issued on participation in non FAI sanctioned International events. There's nothing new here but it will clarify the situation. Chris Bishop Chairman SFTC -Les Grammer, NWSS RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Bird of Time spoilers
Andrew is right. You can't close the spoilers by pushing on a string. I close my spoilers with magnets (available at Radio Shack). The whole setup is somewhat heavy and old-fashioned but very easy to build and absolutely foolproof to adjust. The spoilers close exactly right every time with a satisfying click, and nothing ever gets out of whack. --- "Andrew E. Mileski" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The only problem with Kevlar cord is that you can't push it. Sullivan cables work great for avoiding springs and things. -- Andrew E. Mileski RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Club newsletters vs computers....
The Mississippi Valley Soaring Association (WWW.MVSACLUB.COM) is trying to get the membership to check the info on the website regularly. We post the newsletter there, along with other club stuff and items of general interest (check it out). However, we definitely intend to keep sending out hard copy newsletters. Of course it's true that a substantial number of our members don't want to receive newsletters via email or by checking our site. Moreover, a printed letter provides meeting reminders and increase meeting attendance, and because a tangible bit of club communication in the hands of members has proven to be a good thing in terms of increasing members' involvement. --- Bill Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What we are doing is making the "snailmail" Newsletter optional. By default, everyone gets it in the mail, but we also upload the current newletter to our WebSite and you can "opt" to not receive a mailed newsletter. On Wed, 7 Feb 2001 12:06:18 EST [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is a troubling matter that seems to be growing as time goes by. It is the movement to computerize club newsletters. If you are in such a club, please IMMEDIATELY make arrangements to provide hard copy for any member who wants one Folks there are so few of us modelers TIA Jimbo in NM __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] MVSA challenges your club to do something cool
check out the following page: http://www.mvsaclub.com/seethrmal.htm On it there is a scheme for a cool club project, and a challenge to see which club will be the first to come up with a thermal detector. The rules are simple: no prizes, just bragging rights; any club, U.S. or otherwise, is eligible; build a thermal detector using the design proposed on our web page... ...or any other design for that matter (ours may be full of hot air); devise some credible tests for demonstrating that it works; send some pictures and a description of your system that we can post on our web page; post drawings and descriptions in the public domain (your web site or ours) so that others can learn from your success; assuming that your description is posted on your web site, link your description to our web site and let us link ours to yours. Go for it! __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] tom hoopes' posting re receivers
Ain't it a pleasure to get some commentary based on empirical and valid tests?! Thanks, Tom. __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] New Receiver Standard
Well, at the very least we should band together and do the following: ask all the mfrs to release and swear to their specs for bandwidth at -6 and -60 db, sensitivity for 10 db s/(s+n), current drain, low voltage limit (and maybe more that others more savvy than I might propose). Maybe we could strike a blow for the good cause. __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online! http://photos.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
