Re: What's New in SeaMonkey 2.53.7

[NFN Smith]

Bret Busby wrote:




Depending on which operating system platform you are using, and, how it 
is done for the operating system that you use, in Ubuntu Linux, I have 
added the sourceforge  ubuntuzilla repository to my sources file, for 
upgrades, so that, whenever I perform a system upgrade, that repository 
is checked for upgrades to Seamonkey, and, in performing a system 
upgrade on my other computer, at present, I have observed that it is 
performing an upgrade to Seamonkey.




For Ubuntu-related stuff, I concur on Ubuntuzilla.  Part of it is that I 
have a strong bias towards getting updates via repositories, and I 
consider the methodology of manual download and install to be something 
to be relegated to Windows.  Plus, working via repository makes it easy 
to review version numbers, as well as uninstall, if needed, via the 
package manager.


I started using Ubuntuzilla several years ago when Ubuntu's maintainers 
quit supporting Seamonkey.  I've found it to be reliable, and pretty 
quick -- enough that when a new version of Seamonkey is released, it 
often gets updated on my Ubuntu installation before I get around to 
doing the manual process of download and install in Windows.  And for 
what it's worth, since my Ubuntu installation is still 18.04 and the 
officially-supported version of Thunderbird is still 68.10, I used 
Ubuntuzilla to upgrade to the current 78.x installations.


I have Mint on a VM, and I haven't tried Ubuntuzilla on the Mint 
installation, because I don't run Seamonkey there, but I have no reason 
to believe that it shouldn't behave the same way there as it does in Ubuntu.


On Windows, there are tools for maintaining package updates that I'm 
aware of.  PatchMyPc and Ninite don't include Seamonkey. SUMo (Software 
Update Monitor -- not to be confused with SUpport.MOzilla.org) does 
include Seamonkey, but an unpaid version only shows available updates, 
and it takes a paid copy to be able to download/install.


I also checked chocolatey -- it's the most Linux-like in its approach 
(and takes a little more configuration work), and it's been a couple of 
years since I played with it, but the support web page does report that 
they can do Seamonkey.


Smith

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Re: Google.com difference with SeaMonkey compared to Firefox

[NFN Smith]

no...@nonospam.org wrote:
For the last couple of months, the appearance of the main Google website 
on SeaMonkey has been different from what it has been for years. Search 
results are presented in individual boxes, and the website just looks 
strange.


I haven't seen any changes recently, but I rarely go to google.com, and 
I also normally leave the scripting for google.com inactive (via 
NoScript) unless I encounter something that requires it (most often, 
other sites that offer search and use Google's searching).


That said, I've found that at www.google.com, if using a standard 
Seamonkey User Agent display, the search bar's display is a little odd, 
where cursor and text is displayed about half a line offset above where 
it should be.  I found that that goes away if I show a stock Firefox UA 
string (rather than Seamonkey's UA of Firefox with Seamonkey's ID tagged 
at the end).


Even though I'm a fan of changing UA with PrefBar, I've found that this 
is one site (among several) where I'd rather not have to remember to 
change the UA when I visit, then remember to change back when I'm done, 
because UA spoofing also changes the User-Agent header in mail.  (I 
notice that your message shows Firefox 86, rather than Seamonkey). 
Thus, for this one, I prefer to do permanent site-specific spoofing, and 
in about:config, I have a line in prefs.js that sets 
general.useragent.override.google.com to show:


   Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/78.0


This is another example of a website which works differently with 
SeaMonkey than it does with Firefox. Changing the user agent string is a 
workaround, but why should this be required?


It's something specific to Google, and why they do it isn't obvious. 
I've heard indications of issues at YouTube that require similar 
spoofing.  I haven't seen that myself, but I don't do a lot at YouTube.


Although my observation is that a Firefox UA string that includes 
additional text (which is normal for browsers that are derived from 
Firefox but not actually Firefox, such as Seamonkey, PaleMoon and 
Waterfox) seems to confuse Google, I haven't actually tested either 
PaleMoon or Waterfox.


In the grand scheme of things, I think it's one of those places where 
the number of people running Firefox browsers is small enough (the 
function equivalent of a rounding error), that Google doesn't really 
care, one way or another.  They'll do the necessary work to make Firefox 
behave correctly, and if it's not Firefox, not worth the effort.


Smith


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Re: Change of Topic ... Wildcards Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

Ray Davison wrote:

Daniel wrote:

So, if I had my profile at 
H:\here\there\anywhere\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\Seamonkey\Profiles


would the %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey command locate my Profile??


Putting profiles anywhere you want is easy and does not require editing 
any existing files.


Definitely easiest to do with the Profile Manager.



It helps if you understand sub-directories, and work in them rather than 
the Win overlay "folders".


Create a sub-directory, anywhere Win has access, give it any name you 
chose that is valid and compatible with surrounding files.


Put none, part, or all of an existing profile in the new sub-directory.


I'm not even sure that you have to do that.  Run the Profile Manager, 
create a new profile, and make sure you use the Choose Folder button. 
That pops up an Explorer dialog, where you can choose the precise 
location (and name, without the random characters).




Create a new or edit an existing shortcut so that the target is in the 
form of; "Y:\SM2495\seamonkey.exe -Profilemanager".


Run the shortcut.  SM will open to profile manager. Select "create 
profile".  Pause and study each page.  Profile manager is going to 
suggest a default type profile in the default location.  Scrap that. 
Enter the name you wish to show on your profile menu.  Lead SM to where 
you created the new sub-directory.


As noted, you can do the directory creation in the Profile Manager, 
without having to do it separately.




When you finish, a profile menu will appear, with your new profile.  Run 
that profile.  SM will create whatever it needs for that version.  If in 
your new profile you put an entire profile from a previous version, SM 
will just update it.  If you left the new profile empty, SM will create 
a complete profile.  If you just put a few files, maybe passwords, SM 
will use what it can and create the rest.


By having SM always open to profile manager, you can add an new version 
along side the old, and keep the old until you decide you like the new 
better.  And you can have as many profiles as you chose.  I always have 
several test profiles.  That way if I want to try something I an not 
concerned about breaking a working profile.


I fully concur on that one.  I do that with both Seamonkey and Firefox 
(and even Thunderbird) on several machines.  I have my primary Seamonkey 
profile fairly heavily tweaked, especially with limits on cookie 
handling, ad blocking and script blocking.  I'm used to a lot of web 
sites not working correctly when first visit (and me having to adjust 
temporary permissions in NoScript).  But I can't always get things to 
behave correctly, and a lot of times (especially with sites related to 
e-commerce), it's faster and easier to simply use a profile that's 
mostly untweaked for that one transaction.


But there's also use for all sorts of testing. In both Seamonkey and 
Firefox, I maintain profiles that have no tweaking other than settings 
to clear all history at the end of a session. I title those "bare 
metal". Thus, if Seamonkey isn't working the way I want it, restarting 
with the bare metal profile helps me to quickly determine whether I have 
a generic problem with Seamonkey, or that there's something that's amiss 
with my primary profile.  Nearly always, it's the latter.  With Firefox, 
I have a profile that I use to evaluate new extensions. And on a virtual 
machine, I have both a beta of Seamonkey 2.53.8 and an alpha of 2.57 
installed (separate directories) where I can watch developments of both. 
 Because profiles aren't backward-compatible, I have separate profiles 
for each version of Seamonkey, where the 2.53 installation uses a 
profile that I use only with that, and where the 2.57 installation uses 
its own profile, and doesn't touch the 2.53 profile.


Smith

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Re: Change of Topic ... Wildcards Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

Dirk Fieldhouse wrote:

On 17/03/2021 06:12, Daniel wrote:

Jonathan N. Little wrote on 16/3/21 11:03 pm:
...>

%APPDATA% is an environmental variable in Windows like $HOME is for
Linux. In Windows the profile is in a hidden directory off of the user
directory  C:\Users\USERNAME\Appdata\Mozilla\SeaMonkey whereas in Linux
it is in the hidden directory /home/USERNAME/.mozilla/seamonkey


So, if I had my profile at

H:\here\there\anywhere\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\Seamonkey\Profiles

would the %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey command locate my Profile??


Only if the APPDATA environment variable were set to 
'H:\here\there\anywhere\AppData\Roaming'.


Then the string '%APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey' would identify where your 
Profiles directory is, in a context where environment variables are 
expanded; one of those is a script (CMD or PowerShell); another is 
reading a string from a Windows registry setting of type REG_EXPAND_SZ 
(the normal way APPDATA is used).


Plus, if you have %APPDATA% set to something other than what Microsoft 
provides, it means that *all* your application data would be located 
there, and nearly anything you have installed on your computer is going 
to have a folder there.  There may be specific reason that you might 
want to do that, but if you do, you had better know exactly what you're 
doing, as you run a real risk of screwing up your computer, especially 
if H: is on removable media.  Even H: as a networked location is 
questionable.


If you think you might want to relocate your Seamonkey data, then the 
way of doing that is by editing your profiles.ini file, and changing the 
location that it points to (and not touching other application data).


Environment variables can be set system-wide as well as per-user in 
Windows (and, somewhat differently, in Unix-like OSs). The settings are 
inherited down the process hierarchy. See 
.


Really useful, if you know what to do with them.

As noted previously, on my primary working machine, I typically set 
several for my own use, including the location of a folder that's fairly 
far down in the directory hierarchy, making it easy to get to quickly, 
both through the Windows Explorer and from a command prompt. The value 
to the command prompt is getting to that data quickly without having to 
manually enter the entire path to get there.  I also have a couple of 
command-based utilities, where use of environment variables allows me to 
set a couple of default conditions, so that I don't have to remember 
those settings when I'm using them.


Smith


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Re: Change of Topic ... Wildcards Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

Jonathan N. Little wrote:

Daniel wrote:

Smithy, would it be fair to suggest that Windows treats the %APPDATA% as
a sort of Wildcard, and just concentrates on looking all over the disk
for the bit that follows the %APPDATA%??


%APPDATA% is an environmental variable in Windows like $HOME is for
Linux. In Windows the profile is in a hidden directory off of the user
directory  C:\Users\USERNAME\Appdata\Mozilla\SeaMonkey whereas in Linux
it is in the hidden directory /home/USERNAME/.mozilla/seamonkey


And to complete the loop, the Linux reference is normally 
$HOME/.mozilla/seamonkey .  On a Mac, it's ~/Library/Application 
Support/SeaMonkey .


In Windows, if you go out to a command window and enter  SET  you'll see 
a list of all the currently-set environment variables.  On a typical 
system, there are several dozen -- many are pointers to specific 
folders, but others contain useful information, which is often useful to 
programmers. On my own machine, I also have several variables that I set 
myself, to allow for quick access.


You can also get to the list of environment variables via the System 
Properties. That's in the Advanced tab, and then clicking the 
Environment Variables button.



For individual users, there are a handful that are worth knowing about 
(and using):


  %HOMEPATH%  The location of your home directory.  As with %APPDATA% 
this allows you to not have to reference the Windows user name directly.


  %TEMP% and %TMP%  The location of the Temporary folder within your 
user profile.  This allows for all sorts of temporary information.  In 
Seamonkey, my experience is if I open an attached file (e.g., PDF, Word, 
Excel, etc.) then the file is actually copied here.  Thus, if I open an 
attached file in its associated application, then close, I can re-open 
by navigating to %TEMP% and opening the file from there.  If I repeat 
the opening of the attachment in Seamonkey, then the effect is that 
there's a duplicate copy in %TEMP .


  %USERNAME% can also be a useful variable to know about, as it quickly 
gets you the actual name used for your Windows login ID.



Going back to at least tangentially on-topic point about Seamonkey 
(actually all Mozilla apps) is that the use of environment variables is 
part of what makes profiles portable across platforms.  Thus, if I have 
Seamonkey data in %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey in Windows, I can copy it 
to $HOME/.mozilla/seamonkey on Linux or ~/Library/Application 
Support/SeaMonkey on a Mac . The only thing that needs to done in the 
transfer is editing the profiles.ini file of changing directory names 
from the back slashes that Windows uses to forward slashes that are used 
on UNIX-derived systems.


Stepping back one further step, for moving from one Windows system to 
another a straight copy is possible, although as described previously, I 
prefer copying the entire Seamonkey folder, to keep all the paths 
correct in profiles.ini.  Otherwise, you have to edit profiles.ini to 
make sure the paths specified there match what's actually on your drive.


(And as a separate thing, with editing profiles.ini, it is possible to 
locate your profile in a non-standard location.  I know that there's a 
few people who do that kind of thing, usually the ones who like keeping 
all their user data on a separate partition.  But you could also do 
something as simple as locating your profiles in somewhere like 
Documents (a non-hidden folder) to make it easier to make backups, 
whether a one-off backup when you're tinkering inside your profile, or 
making it easier to include your data in routine data backups).


Smith


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Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

DoctorBill wrote:

OK - I found the SeaMonkey FOLDER in the Program(x86) directory on my Win 7
compuker and copied it 'intoto' to a Thumb Drive.  I cannot find 
profile.ini anywhere

on this machine (used "Searcheverything"  program) !

Now - do I transfer it to my Win 10 machine and OVERWRITE the SeaMonkey 
Folder

on the Win 10 machine ?

Wonder WHY there is no profile.ini file on the Win 7 machine ! ?



Stay out of Program Files and Program Files (x86) .  Those are the 
Seamonkey binaries, and you don't want to touch those.  Your data is 
elsewhere.


As noted, what you do is to enter %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey into the 
Explorer address bar.


%APPDATA% is a system variable which resolves to the correct location 
every time, and using is a productive shorthand. (It also is how Mozilla 
apps interact with the computer.  Thus, even though Microsoft relocated 
the standard location of your AppData folder in Windows in the 
transition from XP to Windows 7, it didn't take any adjustments, because 
the Mozilla coding isn't looking at the raw path, but working through 
the environment variable.


Thus if your Windows user name is "Doctor Bill", then the raw path to 
the Seamonkey Profiles folder would be:


  C:\Users\Doctor Bill\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\Seamonkey\Profiles

I frequently see instructions ambiguated as something like:

  C:\Users\[Your ID]\AppData\Roaming\Mozilla\Seamonkey\Profiles

but that's kind of clumsy, because it takes an instruction of "replace 
[Your ID] with your Windows user name", and beyond that, not everybody 
even knows their Windows user name (especially if it was pre-defined in 
Windows setup).


Thus, by directing to %APPDATA% the path name is shorter, and you don't 
have to make adjustments to get the user name correct.



And as noted separately, the correct name is profiles.ini, not 
profile.ini.  Mea culpa.



Smith


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Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

Ray Davison wrote:

NFN Smith wrote:


(even just one, because the names of profile folders are deliberately
cryptic).

Is "cryptic" supposed to hide them from somebody?


Not really.  I don't fully get the reason for that, but in all Mozilla 
apps (Firefox, Thunderbird and Seamonkey), the profile manager will 
prepend a random 8 alphanumeric characters and a dot before the 
user-defined profile name, as the name of the folder.


With this particular context, that's why I advocate copying the entire 
Profiles folder and accompanying profiles.ini file, so that all the 
folder names are identical.


On the new machine, if you let the Profile Manger create a new profile 
(including a default when you start Seamonkey for the first time), even 
if you have only one Default profile, the folder names won't be 
identical, because of those first 8 characters.


At that point, you have to choose between one of:

- Copy the content of the old profile folder into the new profile folder
- Copy the new profile folder into the Seamonkey folder then edit 
profiles.ini, to make sure that the pointer resolves to the correct 
folder name.


If you copy the entire Seamonkey folder before you start Seamonkey for 
the first time, then the Profile Manager won't try to create a new 
default profile.



If you put them all together in a tree with your choice of names and 
location, you won't need to go looking for them.


And then a desktop shortcut to a batch file makes periodic backup trivial.


That works, although for me, I'm keyboard-centric enough that I don't 
have a problem with entering %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey into an address 
bar.


Smith

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Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

Ray Davison wrote:

Ray Davison wrote:

Jonathan N. Little wrote:

DoctorBill wrote:


Wonder WHY there is no profile.ini file on the Win 7 machine ! ?


By default it is in the %APPDATA%\Mozilla\SeaMonkey directory

I currently have six SM profiles.  I just searched five partitions 
where a SM "profile.ini" could be located.  I found only one, which 
had nothing to do with SM.



I do find a "profiles.ini" in each profile.

Ray



My bad.  The correct is profiles.ini (plural).  I was working quickly 
and I always forget whether there's an "s" there or not.  There 
definitely is.


Sorry for the confusion.

Smith
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Re: Transfer SM files from Win 7 to Win 10 machine

[NFN Smith]

DoctorBill wrote:

Sorry to have to ask this AGAIN, but I have forgotten how to transfer my
Bookmarks, Passwords, and Mail Files from my failing Windows 7 'system'
to my Windows 10 computer.  "The whole Ball of Wax" as Kalifornians say.

I have SeaMonkey working on a DELL Win 10 machine.
I want to copy the appropriate files on the 7 machine to a Thumb Drive and
deposit them in the 10 Machine's SM profile.
The Win 7 has become unstable - I guess it is time to 'face the music' 
and go

over to Win 10 (I hate it!)...

I got to %APPDATA%\Mozilla\SeaMonkey\Profiles\ via "RUN", but don't
remember just what is what !  Give me a break !  I'm 78 and going down 
hill


You're almost there.

Don't use Run, use the Windows Explorer.  In the address bar, enter 
%APPDATA%\Mozilla then copy the entire Seamonkey folder (including the 
profile.ini file) to your transfer media.  You want profile.ini, because 
that's where all the pointers are for your profiles (even just one, 
because the names of profile folders are deliberately cryptic).


Then, on the new machine, do the same thing in reverse, copying the 
Seamonkey folder to %APPDATA%\Mozilla .


I do this one routinely, each time I install an upgraded version of 
Seamonkey, i.e., copy my profile data to a temporary folder, then 
install the latest update. And if there's problems with the update, I 
can copy the data back in from the temporary folder.


I've never had problems with upgrades, but making a backup this way is 
prudent, and it is quick.  As soon as I'm satisfied that the upgrade has 
worked correctly, then I discard the backup (and where I include 
%APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey as a part of my normal daily backups cycle.


Smith
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Re: Password managers

[NFN Smith]

Norman Fuchs wrote:
I have never used a password manager, but I am being pushed to use one. 
But I'd like to know if any of them are compatible with SeaMonkey. Can 
someone help me, please?



I use a mix of KeePass and the manager that's built into Seamonkey.  I 
consider my KeePass store to be primary, but I let the built-in one 
remember passwords for sites that I use regularly.  If you use the 
Seamonkey mail client and let it remember passwords, you're already 
using the Seamonkey password manager, especially for sending mail.


If you're using the password manager, then you do want to make sure you 
have the master password set, using a non-trivial password. With the 
master set, then you'll get prompted to enter it once per session, the 
first time you do anything that requires a password.


The value of an external password tool is portability, and there's a 
variety of ways that you can use it, and you don't necessarily have to 
use the cloud.


With KeePass, I don't put my password store on a cloud server, but I do 
keep one copy on my main work computer, and I keep a second copy on my 
LAN, where I can get to that from any of the computers in my LAN. 
KeePass does have a synchronization tool where I can sync any time I need.


A good intro to KeePass: 
https://www.techrepublic.com/article/how-to-manage-your-passwords-effectively-with-keepass/


Because KeePass is a separate program (rather than a browser extension, 
as many are/try to be) it also allows me a lot of ability to get to my 
content from outside of Seamonkey. The UI allows me to open a saved URL 
on a couple of mouse clicks, whether my default browser (Seamonkey), or 
to choose another browser.  Additionally, with scripting support built 
in, it allows me to do logins in places where user ID and password are 
separate screens (not just consecutive form entries), and I can even use 
it to do a cert-based login in an SSH session.


Personally, I choose not to keep stuff on the cloud, but if your store 
has a strong access password, then I think you're pretty safe, whether 
you're using KeePass or something else.  There may be variants, but I 
have investigated LastPass, and I'm convinced that they are a 
zero-knowledge setup, where they don't have access to encryption keys. 
Several years ago, LastPass was hacked, but from the reports I saw, all 
the intruders had access to was encrypted files.  The only people who 
were vulnerable were ones using weak passwords.


Under ownership of LogMeIn, LastPass has recently announced that they're 
limiting use of unpaid access to only one or two devices, and for wider 
use, requires upgrade to a paid tier of service.


The place where many want a cloud-based service is if they're trying to 
coordinate access over multiple devices (especially the mix of 
computer/tablet/phone).


However, with a little effort on your part, you can still synchronize a 
computer and phone without going through the cloud to get there.


The primary negative on KeePass is with the user interface.  It's an 
open-source project, and has many of the common things, both in the 
quality of graphical display (XP-vintage graphics), and that there are 
so many advanced features, that it can be a little intimidating for a 
newbie to get started with.  In this context, it's worth noting that 
there is a companion project -- KeePassXC. It's not actually KeePass, 
but a separate work interacts seamlessly with KeePass files.  KeePassXC 
has a softer feel to the UI, less of the case-specific advanced 
features, and also supports both Mac and Linux.


Another possible option to consider could be Password Safe. I haven't 
looked at it in detail, but it's similar to KeePass as stand-alone tool 
that's not normally integrated with a cloud-based service. I don't 
believe that Password Safe is quite as extensive in its feature set. 
The other thing about Password Safe is that it originated with security 
researcher Bruce Schneier (also the originator of the blowfish 
encryption algorithm), although it's now also an open source project.


Smith

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Re: Item on CAPTCHA handling

[NFN Smith]

Ray_Net wrote:


Since I do quite a bit with on-the-fly spoofing of user agents with 
PrefBar, I've been playing with CAPTCHA handling.  Right now, if I see 
a CAPTCHA, before I start interacting with the picture puzzles, I 
change my UA from Seamonkey to a UA string for a recent version of 
Chrome, and I'm finding that I see less CAPTCHA puzzles, two or three 
at the most, and sometimes, only one.  For good measure, I've found 
the same experience showing a UA string for Opera. I haven't yet 
checked a stock Firefox string, but I suspect that it will also cause 
fewer CAPTCHA puzzles than Seamonkey.


Once I get past the CAPTCHA dialog, then I remove spoofing, returning 
to my normal Seamonkey UA.



Anyway, it's nice to see that there's an apparent way for us Seamonkey 
users to make the CAPTCHAs less intrusive.


Smith


I have the same problem when signing in to zoom to create webinars ...
With Seamonkey I need 4 or 5 captcha success before able to work.
When I do the same with Google-Chrome - there is NO captcha at all


Zoom is the most frequent place I encounter that.

Today, I got a login that took about 7 or 8 tries and I was spoofing 
Opera, but a couple of days ago, I got through on 1, also spoofing 
Opera.  For this one, after about the 4th try, I should have cleared 
cookies and tried a new login session.


Spoofing helps some, but isn't always a magic bullet.

One other observation is that Google's handling is predominantly based 
on what it's seeing in UA strings (although perhaps not exclusively) 
rather than a lot of work to decipher the browser's capacities 
otherwise.  Showing some variant of a Chrome UA seems to satisfy it more 
quickly than stock Seamonkey that shows Firefox 60.


Smith

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Re: [ SOLVED ] Re: Blocking spam

[NFN Smith]

Ray_Net wrote:
I agree with you. Another good idea to not delete them is the fact, 
that when the spamming ends, I will see it.
BUT I think that my e-mail adresse will be present in their 
sending-list FOREVER 


No spam anymore ... because the stupid spammer use another list of 
victims ? Or because the forged domain has been black-listed ?


By my experience, it's likely that the campaign has ended.  That's 
really common, especially when you get bursts of spam that obviously 
originate from the same source.  They will blast the world for a few 
weeks, and then completely disappear.  Unfortunately, it's far more 
often that they simply shut down a campaign rather than being taken out 
by blacklisting or provider shutdowns of spammer infrastructure.


Smith
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Re: An important site that doesn't work with SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

David H. Durgee wrote:


Actually not spoofing other than Chase, I simply have the preference set 
to identify as Firefox under HTTP Networking.  Perhaps that preference 
should be ignored in the news/mail component of SeaMonkey.


I agree -- that's probably something that should have been addressed 
years ago, although I'm not optimistic that it's something that might 
get much attention from a Bugzilla filing for a feature change.


That's precisely the reason why I don't do permanent spoofing, because I 
don't want to mess up my mail client.


Besides doing stuff on the fly with PrefBar, I do make a little use of 
spoofing through site-specific settings with general.useragent.override 
entries. I do this for sites that I visit often enough that I don't want 
to bother with remembering to have to turn off spoofing when I'm done 
using them (and not always desirable when I have lots of tabs open). 
Plus, I do google.com to show a stock Firefox, as a way of fixing a 
small, but annoying display issue with their search bar.


Smith

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Item on CAPTCHA handling

[NFN Smith]

One of the things that I've noticed about sites that use Google's 
CAPTCHA tool is that if I'm working in Seamonkey, sometimes it takes as 
many as 7 or 8 solved puzzles before I can get past the CAPTCHA, and of 
course, that's really annoying.


Something that I came across a week or so back is that that handling is 
unusual for users that use Chrome.  And I haven't checked, but it 
apparently more than a couple is unusual for Firefox users. It seems 
that the CAPTCHA is more critical of Firefox UA strings that show 
another browser name, as being more likely evidence of bot activity.


Since I do quite a bit with on-the-fly spoofing of user agents with 
PrefBar, I've been playing with CAPTCHA handling.  Right now, if I see a 
CAPTCHA, before I start interacting with the picture puzzles, I change 
my UA from Seamonkey to a UA string for a recent version of Chrome, and 
I'm finding that I see less CAPTCHA puzzles, two or three at the most, 
and sometimes, only one.  For good measure, I've found the same 
experience showing a UA string for Opera. I haven't yet checked a stock 
Firefox string, but I suspect that it will also cause fewer CAPTCHA 
puzzles than Seamonkey.


Once I get past the CAPTCHA dialog, then I remove spoofing, returning to 
my normal Seamonkey UA.



Anyway, it's nice to see that there's an apparent way for us Seamonkey 
users to make the CAPTCHAs less intrusive.


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Re: An important site that doesn't work with SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

David H. Durgee wrote:


It tells me >  Firefox 60 on Windows 10

✗ Your web browser is out of date
Out of date web browsers can have security problems and may cause 
websites to not work properly.

You have version 60, why not upgrade to 86?



Well, Firefox 60 is out of date. The current version is 86 and the ESR 
version is 78.something.something.




The only site I have to switch user agents for at present is Chase, and 
they accept Firefox 68 there.  In general I believe it best to stay as 
close to reality as possible, as a site might attempt to use features 
only implemented in later releases if it thinks they are available.



Chase is long known to be especially unfriendly to Seamonkey, but where 
spoofing is generally enough to get around problems.  Although rejection 
errors are often phrased as "outdated" and imply that older versions of 
Firefox may not have sufficient capacity, most of the time, the only 
thing compelling about newer versions of Firefox is fixes of security 
holes.  However, with Firefox, virtually every x.0.0 release has 
security fixes, often holes introduced within the last one or two 
release cycles.  Thus, I don't believe that any site will reject a 
connection that shows Firefox 78 (implied, 78 ESR), even if there are 
security fixes for each version since 78, all the way up to the current 
86.0.  Thus, I believe concerns about security holes to be mostly overblown.


I've noted before that the most frequent places I see objections to 
Seamonkey (and older Firefox UA strings) tends to be at financial 
institutions, and where their objections to Seamonkey mostly come from 
their unwillingness to invest any effort other than stock Firefox (and I 
suspect that there's a growing number that would ignore Firefox entirely 
and standardize on Chrome, if they could get away with it).  Chase is 
merely one of the most aggressive out there.


I know that one of the things that drives UA sniffing is server 
scripting.  With NoScript active, I've found that I less frequently get 
barks about aged or unsupported browsers (as well as things like EU 
cookie warnings).  However, for sites that require logins, it's frequent 
that User Agent sniffing is done by scripting from the same servers that 
are used to process login credentials. Therefore, if you block the 
particular scripting host, you won't get UA complaints, but you can't 
log in, either.


Not all UA handling relies on scripting.  On my own server, I do 
filtering of UA settings through the server's .htaccess file, as a way 
of defending against bot activity.  Besides stuff that's obvious 
(never-valid versions, and UA strings with syntax errors) I generally 
use .htaccess rules to reject really old versions (e.g. IE versions 
before 11, Chrome versions before 70, etc.) because a connection showing 
those UAs is far more likely to be a bot than a live user.  But if 
connection is rejected that way, the user merely gets a 403 error 
("Access Denied". The only way it's possible to display a plea/demand 
for an acceptable browser is via scripting.


To my knowledge, other Mozilla-derived browsers that use the same syntax 
of UA strings (particularly PaleMoon and Waterfox) tend to have the same 
issues that we Seamonkey users do, although I haven't examined 
extensively.  And for some reason, sites tend not to complain about 
non-Google Chromium browsers, such as Opera, Iron or Brave.


All that said, if you're resorting to spoofing, there's nothing that 
*requires* using a valid UA string.  If a site is simply looking for a 
particular version, it's common that they're not looking for anything 
else.  I haven't tried it, and handling likely varies from site to site, 
but a lot of the time, I don't see a reason why you can't spoof, showing 
something like:


   Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:86.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/86.0 
SeaMonkey/2.53.7


This one happens to be a Linux string and the most current version of 
Firefox, but I think that most sites don't really care what platform 
you're showing.  Most of the time, they're merely looking for a minimum 
version of Firefox that follows the slash.  Some may pay attention to 
"Seamonkey" following "Firefox", but few do.  And in my experience, what 
you show following rv: is irrelevant. Notice that I've also rendered 
Seamonkey as 2.53.7 (which is still beta), but I don't think that really 
matters, either.


If you want to do it with Windows (and with Firefox ESR) you can use:

   Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/78.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.7


One additional consideration of spoofing is that if you resort to this 
kind of thing, it very clearly identifies you, and pretty much uniquely. 
 If you're sensitive to that kind of tracking, your best bet would be 
to stay under the radar, and show just string from Firefox 78 ESR:


   Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/78.0


With Seamonkey, remember also tha

Re: Blocking spam

[NFN Smith]

CC D wrote:

UPDATED: How do I block email addresses from unwanted spam. When I
get these emails I hit the spam button but they keep coming back. I
called them and I cant filter them by address because they change it
all the time. But I CAN filter it to spam when I filter out the
subject line or certain words in the subject line. Also if I include
keys words in the body of the email.


This is why blocking with filters is frustrating, and often futile.  The 
spammers randomize as much as they can, to make filtering difficult.


It's not just sender addresses, but relay server and wording in subject 
lines and message bodies.  Plus obfuscation of content, of things that 
are visually similar, but different, such as substituting numeric "0" 
for capital "O", numeric "1" and lower-case "l" or vertical bar "|". 
For the purposes of filters, they're all entirely different, and as 
such, make filter construction difficult.


If you want to make the effort for trying filters, your best bet is to 
do a lot of them that are individually focused, rather than a single 
filter that as a lot of "match any" conditions.  The more conditions 
you're checking for, the more complex the filter is, and 
correspondingly, difficult to debug, and where you run significant risks 
of both false positives and false negatives. And it's going to take a 
lot of time to get things working properly.  And given that many spam 
operations tend to work in campaigns, where they blast you incessantly 
for a few weeks, those campaigns usually end, and by the time you have 
gotten your filtering mostly working, there's no more traffic for them 
to filter.  You're really not doing much more than playing "whack a mole".


In my view, the rules engine that is built into Mozilla mail clients 
(both Thunderbird and Seamonkey) isn't especially robust, and where it's 
hard to do a lot with Boolean conditions:  AND, OR, NOT and grouping 
withing parentheses.


I'm guessing that the bulk of your spam content is originating from a 
single source. In you message headers there may be patterns that are 
more easily recognizable (and more easily addressed with filters), but 
it's probable that you're working against an experienced spamming 
operation that knows how to cover their tracks well enough to make it 
very difficult for you to try to defend yourself with client-based 
filters. This is why using the Spam button provided by your mail 
provider is usually more effective, because it enlists the power of the 
server, and where processing can be done when messages are being 
received by the server.


There is a lot of variance of how server spam filters are implemented 
from provider to provider, and as has transpired in this discussion, 
some providers' tools are more effective than others.  One thing to be 
aware of is that with server-based filters, the standard is that in 
order to be adequately effective, a filter must be exposed to a minimum 
of 100 samples of both spam and ham.  It's entirely possible that your 
server is seeing your spam designations and applying those to additional 
traffic, but where each designation only increments the threshold by a 
small amount.  If this is the case, and you've marked a relatively small 
number (even as many as a couple of dozen), you should keep marking the 
messages as spam, and it's likely that eventually, the server will be 
more severe in its evaluation of incoming messages from that source.


Beyond that, your only other options are to try to interact with your 
mail provider's tech support -- for some providers, they may be able to 
block identified sources if you give them sufficient samples to identify 
-- or to abandon that email address entirely.  Unfortunately, once a 
spammer has your address, there's no way to prevent them from sending to 
you.



One netiquette note: in this particular discussion, you've had lots of 
responses to your original question.  It's not necessary to reply to 
each poster individually (especially with the same response).  A simple 
reply to your original post is sufficient.


Smith

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Re: Blocking spam

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:

Frosted Flake wrote:

NFN Smith wrote:

CC D wrote:

How do I block email addresses from unwanted spam. When I get these
emails I hit the spam button but they keep coming back.



Are you trying to block this content from inside Seamonkey?  If so, I 
recommend that you don't bother.


These days, most servers have user-tunable spam filters active.  If 
you're getting unwanted content, the first thing to do is to check 
your webmail client, and use the offered tool for marking messages as 
Spam there.





Sounds good EXCEPT - - this does not work with comcast/xfinity.


Handling varies from provider to provider.  Some do things well, some 
not so well. (more below)


In about mid March I'm going to delete that email account and create a 
new one with a different name that my correspondents can use.  (This 
one gets very little useful/real/non-SPAM so it should not be too 
difficult to notify this that use it to contact me.)




I have had to do this once or twice.
I created the new address, told all my legitimate correspondents to use 
it, monitored the old one for a few weeks, told all remaining legitimate 
correspondents to USE THE NEW ONE and then nuked the old one altogether. 
  There was no reason to do it all at once.
 This is one reason (among several) that I tend to discourage people 
from making significant use of email done by a connectivity provider 
(e.g., "no extra charge"). For the connectivity providers, email is 
merely an added on service, and they often don't have sufficient 
commitment to do it well.  The better approach is to do your email 
through a provider that specializes in email (and has a commitment to 
support it).  There are some free providers out there that may be 
adequate -- from the little bits that I've seen, both GMX and mail.com 
seem to be OK.  You don't have to resort to doing something like Gmail, 
Hotmail or Yahoo.  However, for paid providers, prices are often in the 
range of $30 US to $50 per year.


Besides better service, the another advantage of using a separate mail 
provider is that it means that you're not tied to the connectivity 
provider.  Years ago, when I moved to a new location, I found that my 
then-current ISP couldn't serve me at the new location, and I had to 
change ISPs (and do it quickly enough that it was disruptive).  Later 
on, I had moved to a separate mail provider, and when I found it useful 
to switch ISPs, it had no effect on my mail. Thus, I don't even bother 
with the mail that is provided by my current ISP.  And I've found that 
with travel, a lot of ISPs won't let you send mail unless you're sending 
from their IP addresses -- you can send from their web client, but not 
an external client.


Smith

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Re: Blocking spam

[NFN Smith]

CC D wrote:

How do I block email addresses from unwanted spam. When I get these
emails I hit the spam button but they keep coming back.



Are you trying to block this content from inside Seamonkey?  If so, I 
recommend that you don't bother.


These days, most servers have user-tunable spam filters active.  If 
you're getting unwanted content, the first thing to do is to check your 
webmail client, and use the offered tool for marking messages as Spam there.


There are multiple benefits to using the server's tools as your primary 
spam filter. The major one is that the server is better able to handle 
spam based on your stated preferences, and where the handling is focused 
on the entire message content (including all headers and body), rather 
than specific content.  From there, those preferences are applied at the 
time the message is being received by the server.  And if a specific 
message is designated as spam (or not spam), then similar message will 
be handled in the same way.  And tagging a message as spam is generally 
enough to get content delivered to a spam folder, and depending on 
server implementation, enough to cause future content that's 
sufficiently similar to be rejected by the server entirely.


Therefore, even if an incoming message purports to be being sent by 
somebody you know, if it's spam, it's safe to designate as spam, because 
the filter is applied to the entire message, not just the From: or 
Subject: lines.


As a general thing, it's not worth the effort to do spam-filtering in 
Seamonkey. It's common for spammers to randomize as much as possible, 
and if you're trying to create filtering rules, by the time you figure 
out a usable pattern to block a specific message or two, it's unlikely 
that you'll ever see another message that matches that pattern.


In other words, it's not worth the effort to do spam-filtering from 
Seamonkey unless you're getting content from a source that's unusually 
constant in flow and consistent in content.


Smith
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Re: Best size for SM Cache ?

[NFN Smith]

DoctorBill wrote:



THANK YOU for spending SO MUCH effort to assist me !
I must study what you have written !


Glad to contribute.



My Hard Drive being 82% full is, I would guess from your comments,
my main concern.  I am transferring much to another USB SS hard Drive from
COSTCO.  I will free up as much as I can and see if THAT improves my 
situation

- First.


Storage space was kind of an afterthought, but with further feedback 
from you, it makes sense that that could be a contributor your problems.




I do A LOT of photographic work with Paint.net and GraphicsWorkshop Pro
(Alchemy Mindworks out of Canada - NICE Program!).  My hobby is antique 
Black Powder
Firearms and I Reload and correspond with others with the same Interest 
on Forums and via E-Mail.
Then there is Gardening and Plants.  I like to Teach what I know to 
others on various FORUMS, so I edit a lot of photos and Insert Labels 
and Comments via Paint.net and post

"How-To" Threads.

Long Story Short - Lot of Photo Editing  


That's a lot more graphical content than a typical business user, and 
256 G isn't a lot of space to work with.  It's not impossible, but for 
that kind of work, you have to be really disciplined about keeping only 
the stuff that you're actively working on on your main storage device, 
and being aggressive about either moving stuff to other storage, as well 
as deleting interim copies of things.


Most often, I'm aware of low storage space being an issue for overall 
performance, especially if you're short enough on memory that Windows is 
doing a lot of swapping.  And while 8 GB may be sufficient for normal 
business use, it's entirely possible that it's not enough for the photo 
editing work that you're doing, which would also


In this context, I'm inclined to believe that Seamonkey is only the 
bearer of bad news (inadequate storage and inadequate RAM), and where 
there's not much you can tweak.  If you get your system resources 
increased, then i think Seamonkey will likely be a lot happier (as well 
as the rest of your computer)


BTW - I am 78 and know just 
enough to be
dangerous to myself.   Retired Biochemist and later Teacher of Chemistry 
at a Com College.


Thanks again for you time and efforts !  It is much appreciated !

DoctorBill




Glad to help.


Smith
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Re: Best size for SM Cache ?

[NFN Smith]

DoctorBill wrote:



So - is a possible of 4 GB of Cache Good ?

Any suggestions of why Cursor freezes up.  Usually when I am viewing
 graphics files or about to save them.  Always happens when using
SMand Paint.net and GraphicsWorkShop Pro (Alchemy Mindworks).
Usually Windows Explorer on, too.



Several thoughts, with indirect reference to other comments made in this 
thread...


Overall, your hardware specs are fine, and if you have broadband access, 
you don't really need much in the way of cache.  Personally, I run my 
own at 10 MB, and I sometimes do Firefox configs as low as 5 MB.  And as 
has been suggested, even setting to zero isn't necessarily a problem.


I'm inclined to believe that your problem is something that's not 
Seamonkey itself, but where Seamonkey issues are symptoms of something else.


As a common troubleshooting thing, I frequently suggest clearing cache 
and cookies.  Remember that with broadband connections and Web 2.0, the 
browser is seen as much as a tool for running scripts, as it is for 
simply rendering HTML content.  If there's stuff in the cache that's 
causing freezes, it could be a script that's confused, by trying to take 
content from the cache when it should be grabbing new stuff. I think 
that clearing the cache is more likely to address your problem than 
increasing the cache, and unless you're using dialup connections, I 
don't think you gain anything by making the cache larger than the 
Seamonkey defaults.


I'm assuming that you've already tried Safe Mode, to see what happens if 
you disable all your extensions, but I'll at least note here.


Another step to try would be trying an alternate user profile, where all 
the settings are default.  If you get better handling there, then it is 
indicative that something in your current profile is amiss.


Some discussion elsewhere in the thread suggests issues with video 
handling.  I have found that there are times when it can be appropriate 
to disable hardware acceleration for video -- not system-wide (and I not 
your stated discomfort with doing Windows registry tweaks), but 
disabling acceleration in Seamonkey.  (To do that,  go to  Edit -> 
Preferences -> Appearance / Content", uncheck "Use hardware acceleration 
when available).


It's possible (although probably not likely) that there could be issues 
that relate to your Windows user profile.  As with changing out a 
profile in Seamonkey, you could also try seeing if you get the same 
issues with a different user ID.


If that's not giving you the results you want, especially if you're 
seeing similar issues with freezing in other applications, then I think 
you're probably seeing system-related issues.  The first thing that 
comes to mind is drivers.  You didn't mention how long you've been 
having issues, but if it's within a week or two, a driver update is 
definitely a candidate.  Take a look at your history for updates, and if 
there's anything that has updated there related to video, you may want 
to consider backing out that update, or even going to the Device Manager 
and deleting your video driver, and letting Windows redetect.


Even further, it's possible that the last Patch Tuesday update might 
have something that's interfering, and you might want to have Windows 
uninstall that one.


On additional review of discussion, I see that you're using Win 7, so 
that would appear to eliminate Patch Tuesday updates, but drivers could 
still be an issue. Win 7 itself isn't an issue.  Besides differences in 
drivers and changes in UI, Win 7 isn't significantly different from 
either Vista or Win 10.


Given a machine of that apparent vintage, your symptoms might be 
indications of hardware issues, especially a failing video card.


One final thought: if you're running your storage at 18% available 
capacity, it's effectively full. Although an SSD may be a little more 
forgiving than a traditional hard drive, when you're that close, there's 
inadequate space for burst demand, and you will be seeing performance 
issues with your computer.  I'm doubtful that that is causing your 
reported problems, but it's not impossible either.  If you're running a 
256 GB drive, then the expectation is that the drive is predominantly 
used for system and applications, and that you have minimal amounts of 
user data stored there.  You can probably do up to about 50 GB of your 
own storage, but very little for digital media content (photos, music, 
videos) or archival storage of stuff you want to keep, but that you 
don't need to get to every day.  For a 250 GB drive, you'll find much 
better overall performance if you get the amount of free space increased 
to at least 75 GB, and if you can get to 100 GB of free space, that's 
even better.


Freeing space might or might not affect your video issues, but doing so 
will help overall performance. In that context, expanding your cache 
might actually compound problems by increasing the demand on your storage.


Smith


_

Re: about:config can I delete some entries

[NFN Smith]

Daniel wrote:
Hmm! I always thought "about:config" and "prefs.js" were just two 
different ways to see, basically, the same information, one with-in the 
program, one outside the program.


Am I wrong??
--



That's correct, although I think remember that there may be a few 
settings that are visible only by direct access to prefs.js


Smith

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Re: about:config can I delete some entries

[NFN Smith]

Danny Kile wrote:
About:config can I delete some entries? I was in about:config making a 
new entry. I then scrolled thru the complete file and I saw some some 
old printer settings a printed that I have not had for may years. There 
where 150 entries for that printer that no longer in use. The entry are 
like this "print.printer_HP_Photosmart_C6200_IP.print_bgcolor ;false", 
and print.print_printer;HP Photosmart C6200 series, can I just delete 
them? And if I can delete them how do I go about it, I see that you can 
modify, copy, or create new but no delete.



Yes, it's safe to delete entries for printers that you don't use.

You more or less have the necessary info in other responses to your 
post, but to summarize, the route I would go:


First, make a copy of your prefs.js file, so that you have a fall-back, 
if something isn't quite right.


From there,  If you're comfortable with doing that with a text editor 
(e.g., Notepad, and not something that designed for word processing), 
you can do it that way.  Personally, I'd go via about:config, where it's 
easier to use the search tool to filter all the entries related to a 
particular printer (e.g., "6200").  To me, that gives you a little more 
protection against accidental deletion of something that you don't want 
to delete.


For any direct interaction you do with prefs.js (both backup, and if you 
decide to work with a text editor), make sure you do that with Seamonkey 
closed.


Smith

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Re: Getting back to 2.49.5, but for how long ?

[NFN Smith]

David E. Ross wrote:

On 2/4/2021 10:52 AM, Rubens wrote:


Today I upgraded to 2.53.6.

But half of my dear extensions used for years stopped working.

Some of them have new WebEx-compatible updates though.

Does anybody know which future Seamonkey version is planned to support WebEx ?



Would it be possible to get a list showing what Webextensions and newly
internal SeaMonkey features are available that are equivalent to the old
xul extensions?  I am still with SeaMonkey 2.49.5 because I have some 28
extensions that I either really like or else truly depend upon.





Actually, in my other reply, I didn't really answer the gist of this 
question.


With WebExtensions, it's an entirely different API than was what was 
used originally in XUL.  With WebExtensions, that's a Google creation. 
The plus to WebExtensions is that it allows for extensions to be used 
interchangeably by both Firefox and Chrome (and I suspect, a way of 
keeping extension developers from completely defecting from Firefox 
work).  However, at the core, what WebExtensions is capable of doing is 
still primarily focused on what Google wants to do with Chrome.


The two are radically different, enough where for any extension, it has 
to be re-coded in WebExtensions from the ground up.  For many XUL 
extensions, that's not possible, for a variety of reasons.  For some, 
the old extensions have been done by hobbyists (often, only a single 
developer) and where the last of what was available in XUL represents a 
lot of years of evolutionary development. Many have been unable or 
unwilling to invest that kind of time to start over again. However, a 
different issue is that there's some number of things in XUL that simply 
don't exist in WebExtensions, and where it's simply not possible to do 
that function with the limitations imposed, as much as an extension 
developer would want to.


David, I know that you're a long-time enthusiast of PrefBar, and that's 
one of the extensions that has died.  The author indicates that many of 
the functions of PrefBar are now available in other WebExtensions work, 
but not all of them, and I think that was a factor of the author 
deciding not to continue.  For me, the most compelling thing about 
PrefBar is the control that allows for changing UA strings quickly. 
I've seen 3 or 4 in Firefox, and one that is sufficiently similar that 
I'm happy with that.  But it is different, and there's other functions 
in PrefBar that I use occasionally enough that it's not a problem, even 
if I still wish they were there.


With other extensions, I've seen some new ones that have the same name 
as old ones, but with "-WE" appended, indicating that it performs the 
same function as the old one, but that it's coded in WebExtensions.  And 
I've found plenty of other extensions that are more or less the same 
function of what I've had in XUL, but where they're not the same.  Some 
of it is simply new UI, but sometimes, capacities are different (both 
new things and loss of old things), as dictated by what's possible with 
the tool set provided by WebExtensions.


From my experiences with Firefox (and I do keep a profile with as many 
functional equivalents as I have with my preferred set in Seamonkey as 
possible), most of the capacities that I want in extensions are there, 
although not necessarily in the same way as I'm accustomed to seeing in 
Seamonkey.  And where some of the functions will never be there, because 
WebExtensions doesn't make it possible.


It's also worth noting that this is where Thunderbird struggled up until 
about 78.3, in handling the Enigmail extension.  Enigmail relies on 
functions that were included in XUL, but are not in WebExtensions, and 
there's enough Thunderbird users that want the PGP integration that the 
Thunderbird developers decided to bundle the capacity into Thunderbird 
directly.  I didn't follow things closely enough to know why Thunderbird 
chose to do the 68.x branch based on Gecko 56, the way that Seamonkey 
continues to do, but in retrospect, it could be that one of the major 
factors was that Thunderbird releases based on Gecko 68 continued to 
support XUL, because Thunderbird was simply not ready for supporting PGP 
directly.


As I suggested in another posting of experimenting with betas, something 
that might be worth doing is setting up a profile in an ESR version of 
Firefox (possibly a portable apps installation), and then seeing how you 
can replicate the functionality of your Seamonkey extensions there -- 
and what you can't.  That won't do anything for immediate issues with 
Seamonkey, but it's a pointer of where the future is of what you will or 
will not be able to do with extensions, and how they behave.


On my main working machine, besides my Seamonkey installation, I do 
maintain an installation with a current version Firefox, where I keep 
one profile that is there just to check extensions, both in replicating 
what I currently have with Seamonkey, as wel

Re: Getting back to 2.49.5, but for how long ?

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:


I find 2.53.x levels slower than 2.49.x levels, but - as you say - 
compatible with more websites.  My 2.53.5 has an unfortunate tendency to 
lock up one of my processors if I visit certain websites.  The only way 
out is to quit the program, restart and then "Restore Previous Session". 
  Of course I lose my "Private Browsing" session.



I'm having good performance with 2.53.*  In 2.49.x (and several versions 
before that, and I don't remember how far), I had problems, where if I 
leave Seamonkey open overnight, the next morning, there's a lot of 
sluggishness, and where active memory usage is often in excess of a GB. 
Sometimes I was seeing as much as 1.5 GB, and I think I've seen nearly 2 
GB once or twice.


However, with 2.53.* those problems are considerably less.  Leaving 
Seamonkey open overnight, I rarely see too much above a GB, and even 
then, performance degradation is much less.  Before, 2.53, a restart was 
essential.  Since 2.53, a restart isn't a bad idea, but by the same 
token, Seamonkey isn't unusable, either.


Smith

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Re: Getting back to 2.49.5, but for how long ?

[NFN Smith]

David E. Ross wrote:

Would it be possible to get a list showing what Webextensions and newly
internal SeaMonkey features are available that are equivalent to the old
xul extensions?  I am still with SeaMonkey 2.49.5 because I have some 28
extensions that I either really like or else truly depend upon.



I don't have a list.

What you could do is to install 2.53 to a separate directory (e.g., 
c:\Program Files\Mozilla\Seamonkey-25.3 and then launch with a separate 
profile (not your main profile).  Then install the extensions you want 
to verify.


Although I do it on a test machine, I do exactly this, with a beta of 
2.53 (2.53.7 right now) as well as an alpha of 2.57 (and I also have the 
latest betas of Firefox and Thunderbird).  Besides having a general idea 
of feature set changes that are coming, one of the useful things with 
having the betas is in tracking what's working or not with extensions.


Personally, I have 25+ extensions installed. Only the first dozen or so 
are ones that I consider to be essential.  The only ones that I've found 
that don't work in 2.53.6 are AdBlock Plus (and I found uBlock Origin to 
be an acceptable substitute), and Duplicate This Tab (which was never 
well supported, anyway).


Smith

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Re: SeaMonkey Upgrade 2.39 to 2.53.6

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:
If you look at the "Lightning/Calendar in SM 2.53.6" thread you will see 
someone - Daniel - who shares a profile between 2.49.1 and 2.53.6.
Not something I'd ever want to do, but it shows that it is theoretically 
(and practically) possible.  BUT NOT IF YOU HAVE A MASTER PASSWORD.

He's also having problems with Lightning.
The upgrade instructions say that you can't fall back from a 2.53.x to a 
2.49.x but Daniel is doing just that, regularly.  No way am I going to 
try it.


Doing something like that *might* work (or not), it's just that there's 
no promises.


Smith

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Re: Getting back to 2.49.5, but for how long ?

[NFN Smith]

Rubens wrote:


Today I upgraded to 2.53.6.


Did you back up your profile?  If not, you may have difficulties 
reverting, without data loss.  I forget where it started happening 
(perhaps 2.53.0), but as with Firefox, profiles are now no longer 
backward compatible.




But half of my dear extensions used for years stopped working.


Extensions are becoming increasingly difficult.  Firefox abandoned use 
of XUL-based extensions beginning at Firefox 57 (in favor of Google's 
WebExtensions), and Thunderbird has now done that since 78.0.


To a large degree, most extension developers have also abandoned support 
of the older structure, and all XUL content has been removed from 
addons.mozilla.org.  Many (but not all) Seamonkey extensions can still 
be found at addons.thunderbird.net/seamonkey.


There is also an extensive collection of Firefox, Thunderbird and 
Seamonkey extensions through the Classic Add-Ons Archive at 
https://github.com/JustOff/ca-archive .


As for what may work or not is going to depend on the extension.  I've 
found that I can continue to run pretty much everything I want, from one 
of these sources.


It's also worth noting that for several of the most popular extensions, 
the release notes 
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.6/ indicate 
current status, and links for download.  These include uBlock Origin, 
NoScript, Session Manager and Enigmail.  I've also found that PrefBar 
still works, but that the only source for that is from the developer's 
web site, and not any of the sources noted above.


The release notes also indicate that for some extensions, the coding may 
be fine to run in 2.53.6, but that in the underlying .XPI file, they may 
have a max version setting that won't allow for running past a certain 
version.  It's been a long time since I've needed to do it, but it is 
possible to edit a .XPI to set max version to be compatible with the 
version you're running.




Some of them have new WebEx-compatible updates though.

Does anybody know which future Seamonkey version is planned to support 
WebEx ?


WebEx is planned for 2.57, but isn't imminent, and developer notes 
indicate that there hasn't been any serious work started on implementation.


I do have an alpha of 2.57 installed, and in the current status, the 
browser pretty much works, but that's it.  The Mail and News client is 
not working, and there's no support for extensions, whether XUL or 
WebEx, and I don't expect any changes any time soon.


Smith
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Re: SeaMonkey Upgrade 2.39 to 2.53.6

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:



Looking at https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/#old_unofficial 
I'd say things are not as bad as they look.  The releases after 2.39 
were: 2.40, 2.46, 2.48, 2.49.x and 2.53.x.
Lemuel Johnson points out that the current release notes suggest 
installing 2.49.5 first and then upgrading, none of the levels between 
2.39 and 2.49.5 made any such recommendation.


I concur that doing 2.49.5 as an intermediary is something that you want 
to do.



Can we assume she did not have a master password set?


As a general thing, before upgrading, make sure you get a backup of your 
user profile.  In Windows, the fastest way of doing that is copying the 
contents of %APPDATA%\Seamonkey to another location.


2.39 was only available as a 32-bit version, 2.49.5 was the very first 
level which also came as a 64-bit version (talking Windows here).  In 
order to move from a 32-bit to a 64-bit version you will need to 
uninstall the old one and then install the new one.  This does not hurt 
the profile.  (I'm assuming a 64-bit Windows 8).




If moving from 32 to 64, you definitely want to uninstall the 32 bit 
version first.  32 and 64 install to different directories (\Program 
Files (x86) and \Program Files, respectively), and it is possible to 
have both versions installed simultaneously, which you don't want.  An 
uninstall will give you the option of keeping your existing profile, 
which you do want.


One other caution -- as with Firefox, Seamonkey profiles are now no 
longer backward compatible.  Firefox started doing that at around 
version 55.  I forget where Seamonkey started doing that -- perhaps with 
2.53.  Thus, if a profile has been touched by a newer version of 
Seamonkey, you can't downgrade to an older version without risk of data 
loss.  Thus, it's always good to get a backup of your profile before 
upgrading (even 2.53.5 to 2.53.6), just in case.


Smith




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Re: adblock ?

[NFN Smith]

rjkrjk wrote:





you email reminded me
I have AVG and Malwarebytes running
those may be interpreted as ad block



Those don't really block ads.

A couple of things you might want try:

1) See what happens when you run in Safe Mode -- that will disable any 
extensions, but should leave personal preference settings (such as 
cookie blocking).


2) Create a new profile in the Profile Manager, and see how things 
behave with completely default settings.


Both of those will help you verify whether your malware tools are 
interfering (I'm guessing no).


Smith
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Re: adblock ?

[NFN Smith]

rjkrjk wrote:

SM 2.53.4   win7

some websites I visit seem to indicate  Im suing some version of Adblock
and want me to update it, and allow me to continue

I check my Ad On Manger, there are no pgms installed

why is this happening



A known issue.

For 2.53.4, if you go to the release notes, 
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.4/ , the 
section titled "Extensions (Add-ons) and Themes" explicitly notes:


"Adblock Plus 2.9.1 may cause huge memory and CPU consumption and is not 
recommended or officially supported in this SeaMonkey version. Consider 
switching to uBlock. "


The following note includes a link of where to find the most current 
version of uBlock.


This note is repeated in release notes for all versions of 2.53.  For 
practical purposes, consider Adblock Plus to be dead.


The underlying issue is with where Mozilla has gone with Extensions, 
replacing the XUL API with WebExtensions, as used by Chrome. 
WebExtensions was introduced in Firefox 55.0, and XUL was completely 
dropped in 57.0.  I believe that the core of Seamonkey 2.55 is still 
based on 2.56 (and with many security fixes backported from later 
releases), but I know from reading the notes of the developers' meetings 
that there hasn't yet been any serious work of implementing 
WebExtensions in alphas of Seamonkey 2.57.  I do have a beta of 2.57 
installed, and in that copy, the Mail and News client is not 
functioning, nor is there any capacity of running any extensions. 
That's not intended as a permanent thing, just a limitation that is the 
result of having only a few volunteer developers.


With extensions, development/support of the old XUL versions has pretty 
much ended, although there are a handful that still have developer 
support, and the release notes have links to some of the more popular 
ones.  Adblock Plus is in the former group, uBlock Origin is in the latter.


Smith

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Re: Fwd: Seamonkey 2.53.6 - why does it block ad blocking and tracking blocking

[NFN Smith]

NFN Smith wrote:
As noted earlier in this discussion, an extension is exclusively inside 
the browser.  And extensions are platform-neutral, since the code is all 
scripting (JavaScript, I believe).  Thus, download the .XPI file, then 
go to the Add-Ons Manager, click the gear icon, select "Install Add-On 
from file...", and select the downloaded .XPI.


One other note -- you can bypass the Add-ons Manager to install an 
extension.  In the browser, using File -> Open to open the downloaded 
.XPI file will also install the extension.


Smith
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Re: Fwd: Seamonkey 2.53.6 - why does it block ad blocking and tracking blocking

[NFN Smith]

Bret Busby wrote:

On 30/01/2021, NFN Smith  wrote:

Bret Busby wrote:



ublock origin is not found in searching in Add Ons, Extensions, or
Plug Ins for Seamonkey 2.53.6 for the build I previously specified.



If you check the Release Notes
(https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.6/), there's a
link there that resolves to
https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock-for-firefox-legacy/releases

Smith



Both that and the previously mentioned (by other people, I believe)
classic add-ons archive, both hosted at github, have only XPL (?)
files and source code files.

I am running Seamonkey on UbuntuMATE Linux.


I have the same setup of Seamonkey on Ubuntu, and running a MATE desktop.



These applications are not shown as having .deb packages or packages
otherwise installable on Ubuntu Linux, and, Seamonkey does not locate
them, in searching for add-ons to install.

I am not capable of building packages for installation, from source code.

So, how do I get either this version of ublock, or, the classic
add-ons thingy, installed into Seamonkey, to make it operable?


This is the difference between plug-in and extension.  In a 
Debian-derived environment, a plugin-is something that you install from 
a .deb, and where you can remove with various APT-based tools, such as 
apt-get, aptitude or dpkg.


As noted earlier in this discussion, an extension is exclusively inside 
the browser.  And extensions are platform-neutral, since the code is all 
scripting (JavaScript, I believe).  Thus, download the .XPI file, then 
go to the Add-Ons Manager, click the gear icon, select "Install Add-On 
from file...", and select the downloaded .XPI.


I will note that for most of the extensions that I run (including 
uBlock, NoScript, Session Manager, Cookies Exterminator, Display 
MailUserAgent, and several more), my habit is to download the .XPI file, 
and then save a copy to my LAN.  From that single download, I can 
install in Seamonkey on any platform (including Windows, Linux and Mac) 
and in any profile.


The key here is that a .XPI file is scripting that's expected to run in 
an Mozilla application.


Unfortunately, at that level, there isn't any differentiation between 
XUL and the newer WebExtensions.  Thus, if you try to install a 
WebExtensions extension in Seamonkey, you'll get an error, in the the 
same way that current versions of Firefox and Thunderbird will reject 
installation of extensions based on XUL.  Thus you have to pay attention 
to version numbers at the distribution site.


For uBlock Origin, the current WebExtensions version is 1.32.4, and the 
most recent XUL version (and is still being updated ) is 1.16.4.28.  For 
Seamonkey use, you don't want version numbers that are 1.17 or later.


One other note about uBlock -- once you have it installed, it will 
automatically update itself, when new versions are released.  I notice 
that my last downloaded copy is 1.16.4.25, but a check of Seamonkey 
reveals that I'm running 1.16.4.28, and I haven't done anything specific 
to update.


One other note -- when you're playing in this area, one old extension 
that I find useful is Add-ons Manager - Version Number.  That one will 
show you the specific version that you're running, and I find that one 
useful. Unfortunately, it's an XUL extension that got dropped in the 
Firefox move to WebExtensions, and I think the only source for this one 
now is if you have installed the Classic Add-Ons Archive.


Smith
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Re: Fwd: Seamonkey 2.53.6 - why does it block ad blocking and tracking blocking

[NFN Smith]

Bret Busby wrote:



ublock origin is not found in searching in Add Ons, Extensions, or
Plug Ins for Seamonkey 2.53.6 for the build I previously specified.



If you check the Release Notes 
(https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.6/), there's a 
link there that resolves to 
https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock-for-firefox-legacy/releases


Smith
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Re: Seamonkey 2.53.6 - why does it block ad blocking and tracking blocking

[NFN Smith]

Bret Busby wrote:

Hello.

I am running
"
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/60.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.6

Build identifier: 20210118013008
"
on UbuntuMATE Linux 20.10.

Seamonkey does not allow ad blocking plugins like Adblock Plus and 
Adblock Ultimate, etc, that are allowed by Firefox, and, a plugin name 
"Bluehell Firewall" that apparently does ad blocking and tracking 
blocking, is "not compatible with your version of Seamonkey.


The difference between "plugin" and "extension" is important.  A plugin 
is something that is installed as a stand-alone tool through the normal 
software installation processes of your operating system, and then makes 
itself available to run from inside Seamonkey.  An extension is 
something that's installed from inside the browser.  As far as I'm 
aware, the only plugin that Seamonkey 2.53.6 supports is Adobe Flash, 
and I believe that the developers are planning to remove that support in 
an upcoming version (perhaps as early as 2.53.7).


For extension problems, I believe that you're bumping into the Mozilla 
architectural changes made to extensions handling.  Those were 
introduced with Firefox 2.55 (where 2.55 and 2.56 allowed for both old 
and new), and since Firefox 57, only the newer structure is available in 
Firefox.


The specific changes that happened were that Mozilla has shifted from 
using the XUL API to WebExtensions, as used by Google Chrome.  I haven't 
actually tried it, but my understanding is that both Chrome and Firefox 
can now run the same extensions.  Thunderbird also supported both APIs 
up until 78.0, but now supports only the newer WebExtensions.


With this development, Mozilla has removed all the older XUL extensions 
from addons.mozilla.org.  With the transition of Seamonkey (and 
Thunderbird) away from Mozilla's support infrastructure, you can find 
some extensions that work in Seamonkey at 
https://addons.thunderbird.net/en-US/seamonkey/ .


If you take a look at the Release Notes at 
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.6/ and go to 
the Extensions section, there are notes about some of the most popular 
extensions, particularly Enigmail, uBlock Origin, NoScript Classic, and 
Session Manager, which include links to the most recent versions that 
are working in Seamonkey.


As noted in a separate response, you can get access to a much wider 
selection of XUL extensions by installing the Classic Addons Archive.




Why is Seamonkey blocking the ad blocking and he tracking blocking?


Make sure you're running extensions that are still compatible with 
Seamonkey.  The Release Notes explicitly note that AdBlock Plus does not 
work well with Seamonkey, and recommend use of uBlock Plus, instead.



I will note that I do follow the notes from the Developers' regular 
meetings, and that adding support for WebExtensions is intended, but 
that it's a big enough undertaking for the limited number of 
contributors, that that's not going to happen any time soon.



Smith
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Re: Redirect Loop with https://www.tennessean.com;s stories.

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:
https://www.tennessean.com's stories (e.g., 
https://www.tennessean.com/story/money/2020/12/29/at-t-outage-after-nashville-explosion-caused-challenges-retailers/4067046001/) 
shows:


"Redirection limit for this URL exceeded. Unable to load the requested 
page. This may be caused by cookies that are blocked.



I've seen similar behavior in a Firefox profile on other sites that are 
owned by Gannett. (For me, it's just a redirect loop that never 
resolves, but no error message) The profile is on a computer that I 
can't check immediately, so I don't know the specifics of that profile 
(especially with ad blocking and cookie handling), but I know that my 
standard suggestion of clearing cache and cookies doesn't have any effect.


I do find it interesting that Gannett-owned sites are remarkably similar 
in configuration, including overall display format, and extensive list 
of scripting hosts used, both for content delivery (such as 
gannett-cdn.com and gcion.com) and tracking/ad delivery (kxrd.com, 
newrelic.com, onetrust.com, urbanairship.com, etc.) It's remarkably 
centralized, and you see the same behavior whether you're at USA Today, 
Nashville Tennessean, Reno Gazette, Arizona Republic, Indianapolis Star, 
El Paso Times or any other Gannett property.


I haven't had problems in my primary Seamonkey profile (2.53.5.1), so I 
haven't taken the effort to try to figure out. For normal usage in 
Seamonkey, I have NoScript set to disallow nearly all the domains in 
question, and disallow third-party cookies.


Smith
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Re: Best Agent.Override String?

[NFN Smith]

Thomas Pamin wrote:
What is currently the best agent.override string to use to get into most 
sites without complaints about SM being out-of-date?


Reading between the lines, it looks like you're wanting a one-time 
set-and-forget setting that's set globally.  You can do that by going to 
about:config and setting general.useragent.override, and for that, I 
suggest using the stock UA for Firefox 78 ESR:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/78.0


This shows that you're using a 64-bit version of Windows 10, but if 
you're using something else, I don't think it really matters.  If you 
spoof the ESR version of Firefox (i.e. 78) , that should be adequate for 
most sites. If you use the most current version of Firefox, then you'll 
need to update each time Firefox does a new version.


However, there is nuance, and a few trade-offs, because how sites handle 
thing varies by site.  Consider:


1) If you do a global setting, then that applies to everything, 
including the mail client, if you use that.  The result is that your 
email messages show whatever you're spoofing, via the User-Agent: 
header.  It may not make any practical difference, but in the Grand 
Scheme of Things, it is odd if an email message shows that it was 
composed/sent with Firefox, rather than a mail client.


2) As a general thing, I want sites to know that I'm using Seamonkey 
(via what turns up in their logs), and where they're fine if I'm showing 
an acceptable version of Firefox.  Thus, by using site-specific settings 
via general.useragent.override.[example.com], I use:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/68.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.5


There are sites that are beginning to complain about Firefox versions 
earlier than 78.0, and if I need, I can change 68.0 to 78.0.  Using this 
construct, I can spoof the sites that need it, without doing it globally 
(including not touching my email).


3) For www.google.com, I've found that when I'm using the normal 
Seamonkey UA, there's a display quirk, where google's search bar causes 
the cursor to display about half above the bottom of the search bar. 
The way around that is to set general.useragent.override.google.com to 
standard Firefox (without indication of Seamonkey), as noted above.  The 
effect of the quirk is minor, but it's nice to know that there's an easy 
workaround.  My impression is that there's other Google-related pages 
that don't like a Seamonkey UA (and where it's useful to do similar 
spoofing) but I don't use Google services often enough that I have any 
first-hand experience to know which they are.


4) I have seen evidence of sites not working with current versions of 
Seamonkey, regardless of what kind of spoofing you do.  A couple of 
months back, there was discussion of rottentomatoes.com, and in the 
context, I did check there, and found problems that I couldn't bypass 
with spoofing.  Apparently, they really do use some feature that's been 
added to more recent versions of Firefox.



Smith

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Re: SeaMonkey support

[NFN Smith]

David Keith wrote:

Hi, I am running SeaMonkey 2.49.4 on my MacBook Pro Late 2011 - OS X
ElCapitan version 10.11.6.  Will the SeaMonkey 2.53.5 update work on my
computer?  Is there anything I need to do before downloading the update?
Thanks for your assistance.



I don't see any reason why it won't.

I have a similar vintage MacBook Pro (actually Mid 2010) that is 
currently running 2.53.5 on High Sierra.  No issues that I can see, 
although I haven't done much more with that combination than ensure that 
it installs correctly, and I can do some basic browsing.  I do have a 
bunch of extensions, particularly uBlock Origin and Cookies 
Exterminator, although I haven't bothered with NoScript, as I do on most 
of my installations.  I also don't use this setup for mail.


As a general rule, before you do an upgrade, it's a good idea to get 
your profile backed up. If there's problems, and you want to revert to a 
previous version, profiles are now no longer backward-compatible.  On a 
Mac, the normal location of your profile is in  	~/Library/Application 
Support/SeaMonkey  - copy the entire contents of that folder to another 
location, such as your Downloads folder.


I don't know if there's a compelling reason or not, especially on a Mac, 
but it may also be useful to uninstall the previous copy of Seamonkey 
(which won't touch your profile data) before installing the newer version.


Smith


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Re: Change in password retention in MailNews?

[NFN Smith]

David E. Ross wrote:

I was having a similar problem but with Thunderbird.  It turned out that
the problem was NOT in Thunderbird but in the authentication software in
the ISP's mail server.  Have you tried contacting your ISP about this?


A useful question, but this is happening with multiple mail service 
providers (and widely divergent server software).


Smith
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Re: Is there a problem with this Newsgroup?

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:
I'm trying to look at some of the threads from March and April this year 
and am getting nowhere.  If I show enough patience I can get the

     Article not found
page which also offers the "Remove All Expired Articles" button, but 
clicking on it does not change the total number shown in the index or 
fix the problem.
It is (obviously) not the thread which interested me, but I get this 
effect on both of the test/Test posts from Frog on 7th and 8th of April 
(your timezone may vary).

Older threads work ok, as do newer ones.



I've seen this kind of thing happen occasionally, and it's not the 
newsgroup itself, but how it's handled within your profile, possibly 
with indexing.


What you probably should do is go to the Properties of the newsgroup, 
and in the General Information, select Repair Folder.  That one should 
force downloading of all the headers (or as many as you choose) and 
re-indexing.


Given the size of this newsgroup (my display shows a little over 114,000 
messages), that will take some time to do, and in my experience, if you 
do all of them, you're likely to see scripting timeout errors, where you 
have to grant permission for scripts to continue to run.


Although I'm enthusiastic about advising users moving to a new machine 
to simply copy the entire profile from one to another, I found that the 
last time I made a move myself, newsgroups with large histories were 
problematic following the move, and for most of them, I generally had to 
go through the task of repairing folders, sometimes more than once, and 
on a couple of groups, I ended up having to unsubscribe and resubscribe. 
 In retrospect, I probably should have maximized downloading at 
something on the order of 10,000 or 20,000 messages, and lessened both 
the time it took to download headers, and the frequency of scripting 
timeouts.


Smith

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Re: Change in password retention in MailNews?

[NFN Smith]

Lemuel Johnson wrote:

On 11/21/2020 1:23 PM, NFN Smith wrote:


Seamonkey seems to be 
forgetting the entered passwords, and where I have to manually 
re-enter to check for new mail.  I just upgraded to 2.53.5.1 it's 
still happening.  I haven't watched closely, but this seems to have 
started happening since 2.53.4.  Is there some change to Seamonkey 
that would cause the difference in handling?





I noticed similar behavior beginning in 2.53.4.  I'm now entering IMAP 
passwords several times a day instead of when first opening SeaMonkey Mail.


This one seems to be intermittent.  Sometimes, I'm re-entering passwords 
a couple of times per day.  On the other hand, I left Seamonkey open 
overnight, and my accounts show alerts of new mail received.


It also seems that the pattern applies to all my accounts, and isn't 
server-specific.  If I have to re-enter a password for one account, I 
have to re-enter for the other, as well.


I may file a Bugzilla report on this one...

Smith


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Change in password retention in MailNews?

[NFN Smith]

This one may be a little bit of a personal quirk, but my handling of 
email going to my work account and primary personal account is done 
where I let the Seamonkey password manager remember my password for SMTP 
and LDAP access, but where I don't allow it to remember for POP access. 
To me, because I have complex passwords, it's useful to have to enter 
those regularly, as a way of ensuring that I never forget them -- and 
there are occasions where it is useful to know that I have them 
memorized, without having to rely on my external password manager.


I'm used to the idea that a password needs to be entered once per 
session, and since I have Seamonkey open all day, entering those 
passwords once per day is an acceptable intrusion, if I don't have need 
to restart Seamonkey.


However, I'm seeing that after a few hours open, Seamonkey seems to be 
forgetting the entered passwords, and where I have to manually re-enter 
to check for new mail.  I just upgraded to 2.53.5.1 it's still 
happening.  I haven't watched closely, but this seems to have started 
happening since 2.53.4.  Is there some change to Seamonkey that would 
cause the difference in handling?


I checked my server settings, and I have one set to check for new 
messages every 15 minutes and the other every 30 minutes. I've 
experimented with lowering both to 5 minute intervals, and I'm still 
seeing the same effect. I'm not sure how frequently I have to re-enter 
passwords, but over the course of about 9 hours, I have to re-enter at 
least twice.


Should I just accept things, and let Seamonkey remember my POP passwords?

Smith
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Re: SeaMonkey 2.53.5 released!

[NFN Smith]

Frank-Rainer Grahl wrote:


Are others on Windows 10 getting this?



Donwloaded again and compared with the one I did get directly from the 
build server. 100% identical. After building I installed it in several 
of my Windows 10 vms and two laptops without Windows defender making 
even a little beep. Has 
now been a few days ago but looks like a 99.9% false positive.


SHA256: fb546afd5d674e69a717a2d742c7b507c585a818ce2f025637d49da917d0be0c 
*seamonkey-2.53.5.en-US.win64.installer.exe



For what it's worth, I took my own download of that file (taken from the 
normal location at 
https://archive.mozilla.org/pub/seamonkey/releases/2.53.5/win64/en-US/ 
), and I confirm the same SHA256 value.


I submitted to https://www.virustotal.com/gui/ .  On scanning, 
VirusTotal confirms the same SHA256 value, and reports all-clean reports 
from 71 scanners (including Microsoft), although it reports that Cylance 
considers the file to be unsafe.


The only time I've ever heard of Cylance is when using VirusTotal, and 
if I recall, their scanner tends to be exceptionally aggressive, and 
where they're more likely to flag things that nearly every other scanner 
considers to be clean.


I consider that consensus to be overwhelming, and where the response I 
see with Cylance, and what was reported with Microsoft to be false 
positives.


Smith
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Re: Can I stop all the "Flipping & Flopping" on FoxNews ?

[NFN Smith]

David E. Ross wrote:

On 11/12/2020 4:46 PM, DoctorBill wrote:

I used to visit "FoxNews" web site, but it is so filled with THIS & THAT
loading and the screen never settles down due to krap loading constantly !

Is there some way to stop that ?  Ad Blocking just causes more "Please
Turn Off Ad Blocker" prompts.   A good web site is now TRASHED UP with
so many ads, it is worthless !   Everything else is trash.

DoctorBill



Try disabling JavaScript (which is NOT Java).  I have PrefBar 7.1.1
installed with SeaMonkey 2.49.5.  PrefBar has two JavaScript controls.


Or consider managing scripting with NoScript.

I haven't seen foxnews, but most media sites have a significant number 
of sites serving scripts.  Some scripting sites are essential for seeing 
content, especially the site's own scripting host, content delivery 
networks (often with "cdn" in the name), and external sites used for 
defense against DDoS attacks such as cloudfront and cloudflare -- those 
are all things you generally want/need to keep enabled.  Beyond that, 
there's numerous hosts that are used for tracking and ad delivery.


I tend to be aggressive about blocking scripting hosts, and whitelisting 
when necessary to get what I want.  For sites that I trust, I will 
permanently whitelist, but there's a lot of sites that I will whitelist 
only when it's necessary to get to what I want.  And in some cases, 
blocking is enough that it's disruptive to graphical content, either 
completely suppressing things like photographs, or where graphical 
content is distorted (e.g., thumbnails that are expanded to much larger 
size) or odd layout.  For me, that's mostly OK, because often, I don't 
really care about the photos, anyway.


However, with blocking, I also don't see a lot of animated content, and 
that's usually enough to block most EU cookie notifications. On the 
latter, I assume sites are setting cookies, and I don't really care, 
because I have Seamonkey set to flush cookies at the end of a session, 
anyway.


Doing the amounts of temporary whitelisting I do is probably not for 
most people, but for many users, with a little tinkering it is possible 
to come up with a mix of what's allowed and what's permanently blocked, 
in way that you find satisfactory.


For foxnews, I suggest starting off with blocking everything, and then 
enabling hosts one at a time, especially the ones that aren't obviously 
ad or tracking related.


However, with the NoScript approach enabling/blocking is something that 
is global, and your permissions grants or denials apply to all sites, 
not just one site.


Thus, if you block google-analytics (which I've found is safe to do), 
that blocks for all sites.  On the other hand, there's several Google 
scripting sites that you may need to leave unblocked, such as Google Tag 
Manager, Google's API and AJAX servers and Gstatic (which serves fonts 
and other static content).


Smith
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Re: MozBackup-1.5.2 & SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

Daniel wrote:


If one were to use MozBackUp on my SeaMonkey 2.49.5 profile, prior to 
updating to SM 2.53.4, where would MozBackUp put the profiles back-up file?? 



If I remember correctly, that's something you can choose in the UI.

If I'm making backups by simply copying the profiles folder, I've gotten 
in the habit of copying to my Downloads folder.


On the other hand, since my backup tool supports it (and I don't do 
full-image backups), I make sure that my daily data backups include 
%APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey, and as a result, I get backups every day.


For what it's worth, a couple of years ago, I was having problems with 
Seamonkey crashes that were corrupting my POP inbox in the mail client, 
and it was nice to be able to go to my backups and recover just the 
inbox and index, as well as the POPSTATE.DAT file.


Smith

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Re: MozBackup-1.5.2 & SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:
I still use it on 2.53 and 2.54. I do not see why it would not work, 
all is does is take you profile and zip and compress is in to a single 
file. It does allow you to decide want you want to backup or restore.


I guess you could just use a WinZip program although not as quick and easy. 



If that is all it does then you have to ask yourself the question: Why 
did the developer abandon it citing "too many Firefox releases"?


Some may depend on how you try to use it. If you're doing complete 
backup and restore, you might be OK.


All we know for sure about reasons for abandonment is what is listed on 
the developer's page.


I can speculate that the issues being caused by Mozilla's Rapid Release 
scheduling is frequent changes to data files being used by individual 
components, and where it was becoming increasingly difficult to do a 
partial data restore from a backup, without risking loss of data.


I believe that work on MozBackup stopped sometime around Firefox 50 
(give or take a couple of versions), but before changes happened around 
Firefox 54 that ended up killing backward compatibility of profiles, and 
both Thunderbird and Seamonkey are now doing that, as well.


(Recently, I've discovered that Thunderbird does allow a downgrade, 
where you can do a one-time launch from command with a command switch, 
-allow-downgrade or something similar.)


As noted, if you're backing up a full profile, and all that is happening 
is that the data is being copied into a .ZIP, and a recovery is merely 
extracting from the .ZIP for the same version of Seamonkey, you still 
may be safe. But don't try to do a partial recovery, of something like 
just your saved passwords or your bookmarks.


If you're just trying to get copies of your full profile, it's just as 
easy to copy %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey to another location, or use a 
tool like 7-Zip or PeaZip to put it into a compressed archive.


Smith
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Re: Chase now blocking SeaMonkey 2.53.4 with default UA

[NFN Smith]

For spoofing, there's a couple of ways of doing it, depending on what 
you want to accomplish. You can do it either via settings in 
about:config, or use an extension to do it.


1) To change your UA globally (including what is shown in your mail 
client, you would go to about:config and create an entry for 
general.useragent.overrride and set it to show something like:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like 
Gecko) Chrome/86.0.4240.75 Safari/537.36


That's an almost-current version of Chrome.  86.0.4240.111 was released 
today, and I don't know if that causes changes to the designations of 
either AppleWebKit or Safari, but I think not.


2) If you want to spoof for a particular site, say, chase.com, you can 
do site-specific spoofing.  Create general.useragent.override.chase.com 
and then set the UA string, as above.


I do that kind of thing with a handful of sites that don't like 
seamonkey.  One of them happens to be google.com, where I set 
general.useragent.override.google.com to show a stock UA string for 
Firefox ESR:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/78.0


This one gets me around a display glitch that's a minor annoyance, where 
the main search bar at Google doesn't show correctly if it sees a 
Firefox UA string that includes Seamonkey.


3) Use the PrefBar extension. That one allows you to spoof on the fly, 
where you can turn on spoofing when you want it, and then turn off 
again, when you don't.  This one sets general.useragent.override, and 
where the scope is global.  When I use this, I have to remember to turn 
off spoofing when I'm done with the need.  PrefBar also takes a little 
setup/maintenance of browser versions, although for me, I have nearly a 
dozen different spoofs I've set up.  Some of that is useful for testing 
web page handling (including my own) against a variety of browsers. I 
also find spoofing to be useful if I'm downloading Mac versions of 
software from sites that support Windows and Mac, and will only offer 
the version they detect in the UA string. Thus, temporarily spoofing a 
Mac allows me to get Mac downloads from Windows.



In my own use, I do a mix of options 2 and 3. Most of the time, I will 
enable spoofing when needed (and as noted, I have multiple things that I 
may spoof). However, for sites that I visit frequently, where I always 
need to spoof, it's easier to do that permanently for the site.


Personally, I don't like global spoofing, because it also applies to 
what is put into the User-Agent: header in email and news.  For most 
people, it's mostly trivial, but that's something that I pay attention 
to with my mail (and there are times that it's useful to easily see what 
client was used for composition). I use the Display Mail User Agent for 
that, and if a message purports to have been composed with Firefox or 
Chrome as a mail client, then that's definitely odd. For mail servers, 
it is possible to track that information, and showing a browser as a 
mail client stands out as unusual.  In a context where I'm interacting 
with other Seamonkey users, I know that it means that the sender is 
doing UA spoofing, and doing it globally.


Smith

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Re: Chase now blocking SeaMonkey 2.53.4 with default UA

[NFN Smith]

Dirk Fieldhouse wrote:
If I were Chase and wanting to ensure a stable platform for my customers 
I'd advise them to install an ESR browser version, but that rules out 
Chrome ...


I don't think they care about a stable platform, just minimizing the 
customer support effort.  Since Chrome is dominant, that's their 
preference. I haven't seen what they're doing with Chrome and IE, and 
there's enough Mac users that they can't really ignore Safari. But if 
Firefox usage drops too much further, it's possible that the could 
eventually drop that, in the idea of "cult product that's not widely used".


In the meantime, I was at a financial site yesterday that claims to 
accept *only* Chrome or IE.  I was able to get in by spoofing Chrome, 
but things were not working well, and I had to resort to using a 
portable version of Chrome to get to what I needed. I'll have to see if 
another Chromium browser works.


Unfortunately, we're now to the point where Chrome is dominant enough 
that it is the de facto standard, and where devs and support ops don't 
care anything else.



Smith

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Re: Chase now blocking SeaMonkey 2.53.4 with default UA

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:

On 10/19/2020 2:51 PM, NFN Smith wrote:

Ant wrote:
Dave, others and I ran into this back in the end of September 2020 in 
"Cannot Access Verizon.com LogIn OR Chase.com SM 2.53.4 W10 Pro" 
newsgroup thread in this newsgroup. More and more web sites are 
annoyingly doing this. :(


Yep.  I find financial institutions in general to have this issue, and 
Chase seems to be the most aggressive.


Yeah, I'm seeing more non-financial ones too like 
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/ that takes me to 
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/unsupported-browser?err=custom-elements,shadow-dom 
(at least, it still supports Firefox). I had a specific thread about 
this issue in my 9/2/2020 9:38 PM PDT newsgroup post titled 
"RottenTomatoes.com rejects SeaMonkey even with fake UAs."


I remember being a part of that discussion.  It looks like that site's 
scripting is querying something deeper in the browser than the UA.





I went as far as the login screen, and there's the usual drivel about 
security issues.  Earlier today, I was reading the meeting notes from 
Seamonkey devs, and they're pretty current on getting updates backported.


It really comes down to the people at Chase don't want to be bothered 
with anything other than Chrome, current versions of Firefox, Safari, 
and maybe Edge.


Yep. This had been around when Internet Explorer (IE) was winning the 
web browser war before Chrome joined the fight. Now, IE is way down like 
Firefox and SeaMonkey with Chrome being the top. Developers are lazy, 
don't want to work more, and don't care. Argh. :(


Devs may be lazy, but with financial institutions, it's actually the 
problem of the people who do support.  Consider the following scenarios:


Me: I'm having problems getting logged into my Chase account from the web.
Chase: What browser are you using?
Me: Firefox 73 on Windows
Chase: Go to the hamburger menu, select Options, and then click on [x and y]

- or -


Me: I'm having problems getting logged into my Chase account from the web.
Chase: What browser are you using?
Me: Mozilla Seamonkey on Windows
Chase: We don't support Seamonkey [dialtone]

It's not just Seamonkey they're doing this to. I'm sure that the same 
applies to things like PaleMoon and Waterfox.  I haven't heard of it 
applying to Chrome derivatives such as Iron, Epic or Opera, but it may 
be that their UA is close enough to stock Chrome to not disrupt 
interaction. However, if you have problems and talk to tech support, 
it's a good guess that saying something that's not "Chrome" will give 
you the same figurative dialtone.


I think it comes down to the institution wanting to minimize operator 
time spent on customer service, and if they can't tell you what to do 
with what they have on their own desks, they're not going to take the 
time to try to figure it out. It would not surprise me that Chase has a 
corporate standard of clearing customer support calls in less than 5 
minutes, and preferably faster, if they can.  And once a call goes over 
5 minutes, there's real heat on the operators to get the call wrapped 
within seconds.  And I'll bet there's an internal metric that measures 
that very closely.


They're in too big of a hurry to end the call that they have any 
patience or willingness to facilitate anything outside of the 
mainstream, as they define it.




For what it's worth, I was just at Constant Contact, and they 
explicitly complained about Seamonkey, but didn't prevent me from 
logging in.


Hmm, we all should complain. Is there a specific contact method you 
used? Did they answer back yet?


No direct interaction, just a boilerplate that they pop up after I log in:


Constant Contact does not officially support SeaMonkey.

You may close this message and continue to use Constant Contact with SeaMonkey,
but we cannot guarantee that it will work.

In order to provide you with the fastest, most secure experience,
we encourage you to switch to one of our officially supported browsers.



Although I can get the idea that a UA that identifies itself as Firefox 
60 is something they may consider "insecure" if they're not familiar 
with Seamonkey, I have yet to see a site (rottontomatoes 
notwithstanding) that makes this kind of complaint that doesn't perform 
the way that I want it to if spoof a UA.  Maybe it's the various 
tracking and ad delivery mechanisms that don't work, but I'm aggressive 
enough with NoScript that those generally don't run anyway.  Yes, I 
often have to manually enable the site's own scripting, and things like 
googleapis and gstatic (although not google-analytics) and various CDN 
and anti-DoS mirrors to get the essential features, but that's still on 
me and not the site.


If I really can't wrestle my Seamonkey configs to do what I want, I may 
sim

Re: Chase now blocking SeaMonkey 2.53.4 with default UA

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:
Dave, others and I ran into this back in the end of September 2020 in 
"Cannot Access Verizon.com LogIn OR Chase.com SM 2.53.4 W10 Pro" 
newsgroup thread in this newsgroup. More and more web sites are 
annoyingly doing this. :(




Yep.  I find financial institutions in general to have this issue, and 
Chase seems to be the most aggressive.


I went as far as the login screen, and there's the usual drivel about 
security issues.  Earlier today, I was reading the meeting notes from 
Seamonkey devs, and they're pretty current on getting updates backported.


It really comes down to the people at Chase don't want to be bothered 
with anything other than Chrome, current versions of Firefox, Safari, 
and maybe Edge.


For what it's worth, I was just at Constant Contact, and they explicitly 
complained about Seamonkey, but didn't prevent me from logging in.


Smith

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Re: MozBackup-1.5.2 & SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

🐴 Mr. Ed 🐴 wrote:


True, but it was working up to 2.48.  I used it to copy when installing 
SM on a laptop.
A friend asked because he wanted to do the same and I wasn't sure if it 
worked after that since I've been doing a backup doing the same as you 
suggested each night using a batch file to get all my daily work backed up.


You may be OK if you're doing a backup of your entire profile, and where 
any recovery you do is for all the data. From the notes I've seen (and 
problems with keeping up with frequency of Mozilla changes), my 
suspicion is that problems are likely to be related to partial recoveries.


Using MozBackup to copy a profile to a new machine may have minimal 
risk, if you're not asking it to do more than write/read to a .ZIP archive.


In any case, the place you want to be careful about is overwriting 
existing files. To me, the risk of data loss may be greater than zero.


I will note that there's a recent development of a Firefox backup tool 
https://www.sordum.org/12298/simple-firefox-backup-v1-2/ . I know that 
it exists, but haven't tried anything with it, and I don't know if you 
can use it with Seamonkey or not. However, the notes on that page are 
definitely worth reading, where they give adequate detail of their approach.


Smith
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Re: MozBackup-1.5.2 & SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

🐴 Mr. Ed 🐴 wrote:

Anyone still using "MozBackup-1.5.2-beta1-EN" for back up in the 2.50.x
SeaMonkey's?




If you're referring to http://mozbackup.jasnapaka.com/ , that one has 
been abandoned since 2012.  That's before Mozilla went to Rapid Release 
for Firefox, and it's my understanding that the developer stopped 
because even then, there were too many changes to Firefox to keep up 
with maintenance.


I would not trust it for backups of Seamonkey 2.48 or 2.53.

Ultimately, making backups is merely a matter of getting the contents of 
%APPDATA\Mozilla\Seamonkey copied to another location.


Smith
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Re: how do i backup my profile

[NFN Smith]

Jim wrote:
I am using version 2.49.4 -- I stopped doing updates, because they 
seemed to be getting worse.  I see that SM has released version 2.53.4.
The instructions warn:  "You MUST absolutely do a full backup of your 
profile before trying SeaMonkey 2.53.4."


How do I do that?  I want to keep my emails, bookmarks, and passwords 
intact.


Assuming Windows (any version, even 2000 or XP):

Use the Explorer and enter %APPDATA%\Mozilla into the address bar.  Copy 
the Seamonkey folder to another location, such as your downloads folder. 
 If you need to recover a backup, simply reverse, copying from 
Downloads back to %APPDATA%\Mozilla .


Done


Because Mozilla data is not intended to be interacted with directly at 
file level, it's located in a hidden folder, and you won't find the 
folder by simple browsing unless you set the Explorer to show hidden 
files and folders.  However, the %APPDATA% construct ignores hidden folders.


One aside -- unless you are in the habit of doing full-image backups, 
it's likely that you're not getting backups of your Seamonkey profile. 
If your backup tool supports environment variables, you should make sure 
you include %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey in what is getting backed up. 
If your backup tool won't let you do that, then I suggest the same 
procedure as above, where you copy the Seamonkey folder to a location 
that is normally included in backups.


Smith

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Re: Cannot Access Verizon.com LogIn OR Chase.com SM 2.53.4 W10 Pro

[NFN Smith]

Samuel S wrote:

Hello all -

Having issues with verizon.com login stalling and not connecting and

Chase indicating that the browser is no longer supported...


They both work like a charm in chrome...

TIA for your input and assistance - bo1953



I haven't seen verizon.com, but chase.com has a long history of being 
exceptionally fussy about demanding *only* current versions of Firefox, 
Chrome or Safari (or I guess, now, Chrome-based Edge).  Check the 
archives of this newsgroup, there's several threads that explicitly 
mention Chase.


I find this to be somewhat common at the web sites for various financial 
institutions. Although objections may be framed as making sure you have 
the latest features of a browser, it's pretty rare (and I'm not sure 
I've ever encountered myself) a site that requires features that weren't 
included with Firefox 52.x.


The real issue tends to be a matter of technical support. Using Chase as 
example, if you're having problems, and you tell them you're using 
Firefox 78.3, they'll tell you "click here, here, here and then select 
this option".  If you tell them that you're running Seamonkey, you'll 
get the equivalent of a dialtone.  It's not that the site requires 
something that Seamonkey won't do, but that the UI for getting to 
specific settings is different, and they are unwilling to spend the time 
guessing about where to locate the same setting.  It would not surprise 
me if Chase has a corporate guideline to try to limit all customer 
support sessions to less than something like 4 minutes (or less, if 
possible).  Allowing users to use something does serious damage to those 
metrics.


As noted elsewhere in this thread, the best work-around is through 
spoofing, and setting an entry in about:config


 general.useragent.override.chase.com

set to

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:81.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/81.0


At this stage, showing 68.0 is sufficient, although I would probably 
recommend 78.0 (which is shown by all current versions of Firefox ESR 
78.x) and you don't have to change it as often.


I will note that I do the same thing with a couple of my own financial 
institutions (even if they're less extreme than Chase about demanding 
preferred browsers).  Also, I do this for google.com, as a way of fixing 
a display quirk that shows up in Google's search bar.  If I show a stock 
Firefox UA string to Google, then their display works correctly.  If I 
show a UA string that includes both Seamonkey and Firefox, then the 
problem persists.


For what it's worth, this issue applies to all Firefox-derived browsers, 
not just Seamonkey.  I've seen it with PaleMoon, and I assume that it's 
also an issue in Waterfox, although I haven't seen that.


It's not that they're persecuting Seamonkey specifically, just that they 
want "Firefox or nothing". With spoofing, you can show them what they 
want to see (and where you assume that you're not going to need their 
support help), and continue using the browser you want to.


Smith
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Re: Changing mail server

[NFN Smith]

Dirk Fieldhouse wrote:

On 22/09/2020 22:18, NFN Smith wrote:

My mail provider just changed to a new server -- same email address, ...

Thus the question is of whether there's an easy way of copying 
existing filters from one account to another, or if I'm stuck with 
re-creating all the filters by hand.  Or doing another messy 
transition of changing the server name for the existing account.


In your profile, specifically the folders that store mail and news, you 
should find text files called msgFilterRules.dat (and also 
.dat). Not having tested, I imagine that a bit of 
judicious copying and editing of the contents (while SM is not running) 
will achieve what you want.


Good to know.

I ended up simply changing server names after all. In this particular 
case, the provider is still the same even if the hostname is a different 
provider. Besides changing the POP connection, I also had to create a 
new SMTP connection to go through the new server.


For my use, I know what is happening, and can do it without undue 
confusion, especially since I've been watching the details in-process.


Several years ago, for another account, I made a complete change of 
mail, moving from my connectivity provider to a dedicated mail provider. 
 For that, changing server names and email address was enough that it 
was more confusing ongoing. Since the whole setup was brand new, in 
retrospect, I should have simply created a new account (and that one 
didn't have nearly as many filtering rules in place).


For this transition, once I changed the server names, I had no problems 
with connecting for either POP or SMTP.  The only minor glitch (and 
expected) was a batch of duplicate messages that Seamonkey didn't 
recognize as having been seen, because they came from a different 
server. Not a real problem to discard a couple hundred duplicates.


Thanks for the feedback.

Smith

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Changing mail server

[NFN Smith]

My mail provider just changed to a new server -- same email address, 
just a new hostname (and domain), but from a user standpoint, otherwise 
the same, including support for POP connections.


I'm trying to figure what the best way of handling the update is.

I know that in the past, when I changed email providers (including email 
address) on a different account, I merely updated the hostname, email 
address and password in the existing account, although that made my 
profile pretty ugly, with a mix of host/provider names, even if it all 
worked correctly.


For this change, I'm inclined to keep things cleaner by setting up a new 
account, but on this one I have a rather extensive set of message 
filters defined -- this address subscribes to a lot of mailing lists, 
and it's helpful to use filters to put list traffic into specific 
folders (both in keeping the inbox clean, as well as topic-specifc folders).


Thus the question is of whether there's an easy way of copying existing 
filters from one account to another, or if I'm stuck with re-creating 
all the filters by hand.  Or doing another messy transition of changing 
the server name for the existing account.


Smith
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Re: Backup of Seamonkey

[NFN Smith]

Barbara Burns wrote:

I am new to Seamonkey and when installing was told to backup. Not sure if that 
is only for prior versions. Thank you




That's useful to do for all versions, especially just before updating.

Assuming Windows, what you need is to get a copy of %APPDATA%\Seamonkey. 
 If using the Windows Explorer, you can enter that into the address 
bar, to find the necessary data.  Or if your backup tool supports 
specifying things by environment variable, make sure you include that 
folder.


Smith

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Re: Website seems to work in Google Chrome only- HELP!!!

[NFN Smith]

Daniel wrote:


Hmm! Ray, I just clicked on your link, with, I believe, my stock 
standard SM 2.49.5 UA showing, and basically got a Blank Screen ... 
with a scroll-bar down the right hand side. So I scrolled waaa down, 
and got an ad for the Pixel 4a "Your Pixel 4a comes with 3 months of 
Google One.".


Is this what people are missing?? Or is there supposed to be something 
in all that blank screen??


I just took another look at that link, and I confirm that content is 
showing if you do a lot of scrolling, I do see the expected content, 
even if not quite rendering in the way that Google expects it.


I'm running 2.53.3.

Smith
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Re: Website seems to work in Google Chrome only- HELP!!!

[NFN Smith]

Ray_Net wrote:

You said: "If you show *just* Firefox, then that problem goes away. "

I have: user_pref("general.useragent.override.google.com", "Mozilla/5.0 
(Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:67.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/67.0");


And the https://store.google.com/us/product/pixel_4a
doesnot work.



I should have qualified by noting that the problem goes away at 
www.google.com.  I haven't dug far enough into Google's other sites to 
know just how widely that will work.


Google is heavy on scripting use, and beyond what can be done with the 
User Agent, there may be other things that don't work as intended, where 
Google is trying to make use of things that don't exist in Seamonkey.  I 
alluded to that in my note about YouTube, but it's entirely possible 
that similar issues may turn up at somewhere like store.google.com.


My suggestion works for some parts of Google, but it's entirely possible 
that it doesn't work for everything at Google.


Smith

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Re: Website seems to work in Google Chrome only- HELP!!!

[NFN Smith]

Danny Kile wrote:

Tried to access the following website
https://store.google.com/us/product/pixel_4a

Would not run in SeaMonkey no matter what I used for a User Agent. Then 
I tried Pale Moon and it would not run with it. I then tried Internet 
Explorer and it was a no go also. Then I tried it with Google Chrome and 
it works with it. So what is so different about Chrome? How do I get it 
to run in SeaMonkey?


Google has its own way of how they want to do things.

For simple interaction, I've found that even the search bar at 
google.com has a display quirk. However, if set the User Agent to show 
*only* Firefox, the quirk goes away.  Thus, in about:config, I have 
added an entry:



 general.useragent.override.google.comMozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; 
Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/68.0


I can't speak for Internet Explorer, but with Mozilla-derived browsers, 
it seems that Google doesn't handle things well if the UA string shows 
both "Firefox" and the name of the true browser.  I've tested with both 
Seamonkey and PaleMoon, and I presume the same applies to Waterfox, as 
well.  If you show *just* Firefox, then that problem goes away.


You could probably get the same effect if you spoof a Chromium browser, 
whether Chrome proper, or a Chromium derivative, such as the new Edge, 
Opera, etc.


On the other hand, I've seen developer notes that indicate that where 
Google is going with YouTube, there's beginning to appear some things 
that work properly only in Chromium browsers, and even some stuff that 
may not work as well in Firefox, especially versions older than 78.x ESR.


Although you don't' have to abandon Seamonkey, you may want to get used 
to the idea that you don't necessarily use Seamonkey for everything 
(remember, there's nothing that requires you to commit to exclusive use 
of a single browser), and be prepared to use something other than 
Seamonkey to interact with certain sites.


Smith
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Re: Is SeaMonkey using too much RAM

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:
However, since the time I upgraded to Seamonkey 2.53.2, I'm finding it 
relatively rare that I see these issues. Although I haven't seen 
anything in release notes indicating fixes related to possible memory 
leaks, but things are much cleaner now.


Do you use LinkedIn, Facebook, Google Maps, Gmail, Twitter, YouTube, 
etc.? Those definitely hog a lot of resources on my PCs. :(


No on several, infrequently on others.  I use NoScript fairly 
aggressively, and tend to enable only when it's necessary to get to 
things I want, and also frequently (but not always) disable scripting 
when I'm done.


Yes, I know that there's a lot of web site scripting, and if I've left a 
browser open overnight, some of the high CPU and memory usage comes from 
that kind of scripting that I may have left enabled.  However, even if I 
tell NoScript to revoke all temporary permissions grants, I don't see 
any evidence of lowered demands on processor or memory, even after 
running a full memory cleanup in about:memory.


I mentioned previously that examination of the detail in about:memory 
shows the highest memory usage coming from Mail and News, where I do 
make use of message filters.  Sometimes I do see evidence of scripting 
from script-heavy web pages, but not nearly as much as I would expect.


Logically, I agree that the script-heavy sites should show the highest 
resource demand, but that's not what I'm seeing in my monitoring, and I 
do find that a bit puzzling.


However, as also noted, I'm seeing far less performance issues since I 
moved to 2.53.2.


Smith

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Re: Is SeaMonkey using too much RAM

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:

Ant wrote:

On 8/21/2020 1:55 PM, Edward wrote:

Ant wrote:

I have seen my seamonkey.exe process go up to 3 GB in my decade old, 
updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 PC. :(


I wonder if there is a memory issue? This particular desktop is nine 
years old, runs Linux exclusively and has 3.6Gb of memory, using LXDE 
desktop.


Yes, current stable SeaMonkey (old Gecko engine) leaks and hogs a lot 
due to many bloated web sites like LinkedIn, Twitter, Facebook, Google 
Maps, etc.  :(


I have had Seamonkey (2.49.4, as most of you can see) open for around 13 
hours now and it has been getting slower and slower for an hour or two. 
When things got too bad to ignore, I closed the Google Maps tab (in a 
private window) that had been open for pretty much all that time.

Seamonkey was back to its responsive best immediately.
I'd checked about:memory - and memory usage generally - shortly before 
doing this and things looked pretty much normal, there was little 
difference between Before and After.  The Swapfile was not in use.

It was amazing what a difference one Google Maps tab made.


I've had this issue for some time in Windows implementations of 
Seamonkey, especially after leaving Seamonkey open overnight.  My 
suspicion is with script-heavy web sites (despite my use of NoScript) 
although checks of about:memory indicate quite a bit of usage in Mail 
and News, where I do make some use of message filters.  When things 
start bogging down, a check of the Windows Task manager shows a lot of 
CPU use for seamonkey.exe, and occasionally, I start seeing script 
timeout errors.  Sometimes, memory usage may be a little a GB, and 
sometimes, I've seen it as high as around 2.5 GB.  My computer isn't 
trivial -- this is an 8th Gen Intel i5, where I have 16 GB of RAM, and 
working from an SSD with adequate space.


However, since the time I upgraded to Seamonkey 2.53.2, I'm finding it 
relatively rare that I see these issues. Although I haven't seen 
anything in release notes indicating fixes related to possible memory 
leaks, but things are much cleaner now.


Smith


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Re: Seeking replacement for Firefox... considering Seamonkey

[NFN Smith]

Bob wrote:



(1):  Can I LOCK OUT automatic installation of updates?  I MUST be
able to choose when updating happens.


Right now, the internal capacity for updates is broken.  The only way to 
update is a manual download/install, at least for Windows/Mac.


On my Ubuntu box, I do have the ubuntuzilla repository enabled, and it 
happens frequently enough that that installation gets updated through 
package updating processes before I get around to updating Windows or Mac.




(2): How up-to-date is Seamonkey kept?  I already have strong
security on my system, but need to avoid security holes.


I believe that security updates up through Firefox ESR 68.10 have been 
backported, and developer notes indicate that there's a little bit of 
stuff from 78.0 ESR that have been backported, as well.




(3) How easy is it now to migrate Bookmarks, passwords, and so on?


Not sure.  For Bookmarks, you can probably start with export to HTML, 
and then import that into Seamonkey, but I've never tried that.  That 
process is pretty much standard for moving stuff from one profile to 
another, whether Firefox or Seamonkey.


As an aside, one of the things that I do with Seamonkey is to make use 
of the tool that allows for automatic export of bookmarks at the end of 
the session.  From there, with other browsers and profiles, I tend to 
set them to use that file as their home page, and as a result, all of my 
browsers have access to all of my bookmarks, at least as of the end of 
my last Seamonkey session.  The visual layout isn't great, but it's an 
easy way to share bookmarks.


I haven't tried to migrate passwords, so I can't comment there.  There 
might be something in an article at mozillazine.org


You probably can't copy files from one profile to another, even if 
they're all the same file name.  In the same way that Firefox versions 
after about 57.0 are not backward-compatible, the same applies to 
Seamonkey since 2.53.0. If you want to test, you probably can copy files 
(e.g., bookmarks, passwords) from a Firefox profile to a Seamonkey 
profile where you understand that what Seamonkey is interacting with is 
test copies (and you still consider your Firefox data to be 
authoritative), it might work, but if it doesn't, then you'll see the 
effects of what "not backward portable" looks like.


Ultimately, for live data, you're going to want to export/import, rather 
than trying to copy.




(4): "Bonus" question - is the composer still part of Seamonkey?


It's still there, usable, but unsupported.  I have a handful of HTML 
files that I used to maintain with the composer -- I really like the 
convenience of viewing something, and pressing CTRL-E to be able to 
edit.  However, a couple of years ago, I moved to using the stand-alone 
Kompozer, which has a little more capacity.  It's also unsupported, but 
it's newer than using the bundled composer.  Much newer (and supported, 
I think) is Blue Griffon, but I find that has enough UI quirks to it 
that I prefer Kompozer.




I use Ubuntu 18:04 LTS - switched to it around the time I abandoned
Office and IE (for security and other valid reasons).


Although I primarily work in Windows 10, I do use Seamonkey on an 
installation that I just upgraded to Ubuntu 18.04 from 16.04, and it 
pretty much behaves the same way in Ubuntu as it does in Windows. 
Because I have a strong preference for doing package maintenance by 
repository and APT, and since Ubuntu's maintainers no longer distribute 
Seamonkey, I'm getting my updates from ubuntuzilla.



The one thing to be aware of is that there's a growing number of sites 
that claim not to be able to handle Seamonkey, and demand Firefox. 
Seamonkey 2.53.3 is set to show compatibility with Firefox 60, but 
that's now old enough that more sites are objecting unless they see 
Firefox levels at at least 68.0.  Most sites are satisfied if they see 
"Firefox 68.0" and you can do that with making one or more entries in 
about:config (either global or site-specific).  It's not so much that 
sites *can't* handle Seamonkey, by making use of features that Firefox 
78 has and Seamonkey 2.53.3 does not, so much as site operators that 
don't want users to run browsers that they deem to be "old" or 
"insecure" or just "not Firefox" (the latter for purposes of user support).


Smith

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Re: Accessing Xfinity Support Page SM 2.53.3 Win 10 Pro

[NFN Smith]

Samuel S wrote:


I apologize for the delayed response:

1) https://internet.xfinity.com/unsupported-browser.html

2) Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0 



That's one that you can get around with browser spoofing.

I just checked, and it complains about default Seamonkey settings. 
However, with spoofing, you can get around it.  If xfinity sees:



  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/78.0


I'm having no problems getting through.  (For what it's worth, I have no 
problems even if I use a UA string that claims that I'm running Firefox 
78 on a Mac.)


Two ways of spoofing:

1) Extension -- I use PrefBar, which allows me to do spoofing on demand, 
but that spoofs for all sites, including the mail client.  Thus for the 
message I'm replying to, my use of the Display MUA extension shows that 
you composed your message with Firefox 60.


In this context, I know that you're spoofing Firefox 60 for your 
browser, but it does look odd when that turns up in your mail.


When I'm spoofing this way, it's normally for one-time things, and I 
have to remember to turn off when I'm done.  Occasionally, I forget, and 
sometimes I see my own messages purporting to have been sent by Firefox.


2) about:config settings .

You can go to about:config, and set general.useragent.override to show 
the string you want to show, but as with above, that sets things 
globally (and permanently).


You can also do site-specific spoofing.  For this, you would want to do 
the same thing, by setting 
general.useragent.override.internet.xfinity.com with the same value. 
That causes spoofing for only that site for browser connections, and 
doesn't touch your mail client.


I do exactly this with the main search page at google.com (where there's 
an annoying display quirk if Google sees a UA string that includes 
"Seamonkey", even if the remainder is a valid Firefox string).  I also 
do that with a couple of financial institutions that are aggressive 
about demanding Firefox. By doing the site-specific spoofing via 
about:config, that allows me to spoof for those sites when I go there, 
and not have to remember to enable/disable.


Smith

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Re: RottenTomatoes.com rejects SeaMonkey even with fake UAs.

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:
https://www.rottentomatoes.com takes me to 
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/unsupported-browser?err=custom-elements,shadow-dom 
that says "To enjoy RottenTomatoes.com, try using a newer browser like 
Google Chrome, or Mozilla Firefox." I tried changing SeaMonkey v2.53.3's 
UA to Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:80.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/80.0, but that didn't work. :(


What else to try? Thank you for reading and hopefully answering. :)



Check the recent thread "More and more sites don't accept Seamonkey". 
That was a discussion that focused on issues with Rottentomatoes.


I did some testing there, and I found that there's no capacity of 
browser spoofing that will get you past their demands for current 
Firefox or Chrome, although I did find that if using NoScript to block 
scripting, I can get through to their content.


I believe that what's happening is that their scripting is explicitly 
checking for the capabilities of the browser itself, rather than simply 
sniffing the UA string.


I know also that I've seen posts from FRG (one of the developers) that 
indicate that there's a lot of stuff that Google is doing with YouTube, 
and where it's becoming increasingly difficult for browsers that are not 
Chrome (or even not Chromium) to keep up, even if Firefox versions at 78 
and later are apparently not a problem.


I don't normally interact with that site, but given that its focus is 
movie reviews, I presume that there's a lot of interaction with YouTube 
streaming, and that's probably the reason for the objection.


Moving forward, it seems that you have two choices:

- If you're just interested in reading the static content (reviews and 
commentary, although probably not the ability to contribute to 
discussion), you can find most of that, if you use NoScript to block the 
site's scripting host, so that it can't query your browser.


- If you want the full capacity of the site, including streaming from 
YouTube, it's not going to be possible in Seamonkey.  That doesn't 
require you to abandon Seamonkey generally, but to interact with that 
particular site, you will need to use a browser that they will accept.



As a general aside, I've seen a number of threads in this newsgroup 
recently that note that people are abandoning Seamonkey, and sometimes, 
the issue is conflict with sites that don't like Seamonkey.  Although 
there are issues there (and sometimes, spoofing is a work-around), 
there's definitely a few sites (as you're seeing with Rotten Tomatoes) 
that it's beyond anything you can do.


However, it doesn't mean that you have to abandon Seamonkey, even if you 
do need to be prepared to make occasional use of another browser.  For 
me, I make extensive use of NoScript, as well as blocking of third-party 
cookies, and there are times when I simply can't tweak settings enough 
to get the site to behave.  I find this to be especially the case with 
some e-commerce sites.


To get around this issue, I keep a Firefox profile that is pretty much 
default settings -- the only tweaks that I have there is to flush all 
user data, cache, history and cookies at the end of a session.  Thus, if 
I can't get a site to work, I'll launch Firefox with that profile to 
facilitate the transaction, and then close out, and resume my regular 
work in Seamonkey.


Smith

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Re: Accessing Xfinity Support Page SM 2.53.3 Win 10 Pro

[NFN Smith]

Samuel S wrote:

Hello all,

I just changed my provider to Xfinity from Fios and am having an issue 
with accessing Xfinity's Support pages.


I get the message that I must update my browser, despite using HTTP 1.1 
and the UAS in SM to Identify as Firefox.


Is there something more I can do to sidestep this besides using Chrome 
or Firefox?


TIA - bo1953



Two questions:

1) What's the specific URL that is giving you the demand for something 
other than Seamonkey:


2) What UA are you showing (e.g., if you go to Help -> Troubleshooting), 
what is shown for User Agent?


If you're advertising Firefox compatibility, Comcast may be complaining 
about the presence of "Seamonkey" in the UA, and where they want to see 
_only_ Firefox.


Switching the setting for Firefox compatibility might work. If it 
doesn't, you may need to go the route of spoofing, whether using a tool 
that supports that such as PrefBar or User Agent Switcher, or manually 
putting an entry in about:config for general.useragent.override, whether 
globally or for just Comcast.


Smith


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Re: More and more sites do not accept Seamonkey

[NFN Smith]

WaltS48 wrote:

On 8/27/20 6:35 AM, Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:





But it is happening that there's at least a few sites out there that 
may start having problems with Seamonkey.  For that, you don't have 
to abandon Seamonkey, but it may be useful to have an alternate 
browser for getting to sites that may have issues (whether real, or 
just annoying sites that don't want to deal with it) with Seamonkey.


Smith


The problem is usually - as in this case - that a site has javascript 
identifying the various browsers and catering for them individually. 
Not a particularly good idea in the first place and it tends to fail 
when confronted with a browser it does not recognise.


I this case it seems to be where they're explicitly rejecting anything 
that's not on their internal whitelist.


I saw a posting in this forum (I think) around a year ago where 
someone posted a link to Google's suggestions for resolving the 
problem - the javascript should test for browser *capabilities* 
instead of browser/level combinations, examples were provided on the 
Google-page. Unfortunately Google themselves don't follow that advice, 
some of their pages are/were broken for Seamonkey.

Edward's suggestion should help, although it requires 2.53.3 or higher.



Depending on the site, it could be *Feature* detection or browser sniffing.

 



From the testing I did, it looks like their scripting is explicitly 
querying browser capabilities, rather than simply looking at what's 
presented in the User Agent string.


Technically, that's the correct thing to be doing, even if Google isn't 
following their own advice, at least not strictly.


In the case of a movie site like Rotten Tomatoes, I'm assuming that 
there's a lot of direct connection to content and delivery mechanisms 
related to YouTube, so it makes sense that they're going to demand use 
of a browser that supports YouTube's current capacities, and that they 
enforce that demand based on data that they extract through querying the 
contents of the browser.


For what it's worth, I did check that site with other browsers, 
including Firefox 80, legacy Edge, PaleMoon, Safari and Opera.  I had no 
problems with any of those browsers except Edge. I don't yet have the 
new Chrome version of Edge and PaleMoon, but if Safari and Opera are OK, 
then it seems to be that any current Chromium browser is OK, rather than 
Google Chrome, as the site demands.  And for Firefox 80, it does look 
like they've implemented something that uses the current Google 
offerings.  I don't have a copy of Firefox 68.x ESR handy, so I don't 
know if that will handle this situation, but with the 68 branch nearly 
EOL, it probably doesn't much matter.


Smith

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Re: Yahoo email server changes and SeaMonkey

[NFN Smith]

Edward wrote:

David H. Durgee wrote:


My problem with option 3 is the phrase "one-time" and "unless you sign
out" which imply to me the need to go through this rigamarole every time
I need to restart SeaMonkey. That is a non-starter for me when the POP3
constipated email issue sometimes means multiple restarts in a day.  If
all they want to do is generate me a new password once then fine, but
NOT every time I restart SeaMonkey.

Dave
I generated one, one week ago and am still using it. I believe the 
e-mail is incorrect. It would be ridiculous having to generate a new 
password each time.


Think of it as a second, more secure password. One for the web site, one 
for third-party applications.






Or perhaps a rudimentary form of 2-factor authentication.

I found this with my primary email provider a couple of years ago, when 
I configured a mail client on my phone.  The regular password works fine 
for an interactive login, but I had to generate a separate password for 
setting up a new client connection.


For some reason, that provider didn't make me change my password in 
Seamonkey, and for that, although I have an SMTP password remembered, I 
purposely don't save the POP password.  Because I have to enter that 
once per session, I use it often enough that it's one that I always 
remember.


As for my Yahoo, I just followed the Option 3 instructions to create a 
new password, and then put into the password manager for both IMAP and 
SMTP.


Smith

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Re: More and more sites do not accept Seamonkey

[NFN Smith]

AK wrote:

I am finding more and more sites not accepting Seamonkey.

The latest is Rotten Tomatoes.

I do not understand as Seamonkey is almost identical to Firefox?

Andy



The differences are less than they want you to believe.

I run NoScript, and with the RottenTomatoes scripting host blocked, I 
have no problems with getting to their content, at least stuff that 
isn't delivered by script. However, if I unblock that one, I'm not 
finding any spoofing options, even the most current version of Google 
Chrome that this site will accept.


It seems that their browser sniffing script is exceptionally aggressive.

Most of the time, sites that complain about Seamonkey may say that the 
issue is compatibility, but I have yet to see a site that relies on 
something that is more current than I have in Seamonkey. There's a 
variety of reasons that sites may not want Seamonkey, but frequently it 
comes down to them wanting to simplify, and by rejecting old or odd (to 
them) browsers, they change things from being Their Problem to being 
Your Problem.


On the other hand, one of the Seamonkey devs has noted that there are 
things that Google is doing with YouTube that may make things difficult 
for any browser that's not Chromium-derived. I haven't seen that myself, 
although at Google's main search page, there's a display quirk that goes 
away if I show a stock Firefox User Agent string.  Thus, for google.com, 
I have an about:config entry that shows Google that I'm a Firefox user.


My own use of NoScript gets me around a lot of script-based browser 
sniffing issues, although there are trade-offs, and that might not work 
for you. And I also use PrefBar, which allows me to do quick on-the-fly 
spoofing, when I need to.


But it is happening that there's at least a few sites out there that may 
start having problems with Seamonkey.  For that, you don't have to 
abandon Seamonkey, but it may be useful to have an alternate browser for 
getting to sites that may have issues (whether real, or just annoying 
sites that don't want to deal with it) with Seamonkey.


Smith
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Re: SeaMonkey mail and Gmail - starting today

[NFN Smith]

Geoff Welsh wrote:
So, my mom, has an "upstairs Mac" and "downstairs Mac" both set-up for 
SeaMonkey to "get messages" from the same @gmail.com  address.


They both retrieve all the same messages every day (for years now), to 
help her remember things, and save her the precariousness of carrying a 
computer up or down stairs.


Today she tells me the downstairs Mac didn't get any of the messages 
that the upstairs one did.


Did Google change something or was this a glitch in the matrix today, 
Sat Aug 22, 2020?



Are you using IMAP or POP?  If IMAP, then both machines should be seeing 
the exact same thing.


If you're using POP, it is possible for sharing among multiple machines 
(at least for the Inbox), but if you're doing that, you really want to 
adjust your mail retention settings so that one POP client isn't 
deleting stuff from the server when downloading, and the other machine 
doesn't get to see that stuff.  I do POP on my primary profile, and set 
mail retention to not delete for 2 weeks, which allows any other 
profiles I use (all IMAP) to always have the last 2 weeks of received 
mail available.


Although it's possible that Google may have have had some sort of 
temporary glitch, the other possibility would be that the upstairs 
machine may have gotten its mail retention settings changed, somehow.


It's also possible that somehow, on the downstairs machine, the tracking 
of POP status got confused.  I don't remember the file name for that, so 
I won't suggest what you could do to check.



At this point, you do want to take a look at the mailbox from a web 
client, and see what's on the server.


Smith

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Re: Is SeaMonkey using too much RAM

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:

On 8/21/2020 1:55 PM, Edward wrote:

Ant wrote:

I have seen my seamonkey.exe process go up to 3 GB in my decade old, 
updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 PC. :(


I wonder if there is a memory issue? This particular desktop is nine 
years old, runs Linux exclusively and has 3.6Gb of memory, using LXDE 
desktop.


Yes, current stable SeaMonkey (old Gecko engine) leaks and hogs a lot 
due to many bloated web sites like LinkedIn, Twitter, Facebook, Google 
Maps, etc.  :(



I have seen Seamonkey exceed 2 GB on a relatively new Win 64 machine 
with 16 GB of RAM and an SSD drive, especially if I've used Seamonkey 
all day, and then forget to shut down overnight. Even though I do a lot 
with NoScript, I suspect the primary culprit being script-heavy sites. I 
also have a lot of filters for mail handling.


However, since I upgraded to 2.53.3, I have noticed minimal 
memory/performance issues, even after leaving things active overnight. 
I don't know if it's that I haven't been in the condition of active 
all/day use and left active overnight, or that 2.53.3 is better on 
memory handling, or what...


I also use Seamonkey on a desktop Linux box of unknown vintage. I bought 
the base configuration about 11 years ago, and the original 
configuration was with an AMD Athlon processor. I just upgraded the 
motherboard and case when the motherboard failed, where the CPU is a 
little more recent AMD, but definitely older than anything Ryzen.


This machine has 8 GB of RAM, and I don't use the browser heavily, but 
I've never seen memory issues there.


Smith

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Re: Selecting/displaying desired messages conveniently - Feasible feature request?

[NFN Smith]

NFN Smith wrote:


I honestly don't know where I saw that you could just use the number 
keys to toggle tags without going through the menu.  I've been using 
them for a long time as a quick way to toggle tags on messages in the 
thread/message panes of the main window, or from a separate message window. 



Now that I think of it, I don't know where I found that, either. 
There's no indication of keyboard shortcuts in Message -> Tag.



I happened to be looking at Thunderbird, and there Message -> Tag does 
show the keyboard shortcuts.  I don't know why that's in Thunderbird, 
but not Seamonkey.


Smith

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Re: Selecting/displaying desired messages conveniently - Feasible feature request?

[NFN Smith]

mozilla-lists.mbou...@spamgourmet.com wrote:

Richard Owlett wrote:




If you look on the Message > Tag menu (in the main window), there is a 
number next to each tag.  Although it looks like just the key to select 
the option from the menu, you can also use it as a separate shortcut key 
to add/remove the tag from a message (like how "M" toggles read/unread 
status).  e.g. with the default set of tags, pressing "1" will 
add/remove the red "Important" tag on selected messages, pressing "2" 
will add/remove the orange "Work" tag, etc.  Only the first 9 tags get 
shortcut keys (1 to 9) - I just added a few more tags to confirm last 
night's guess since I don't usually have that many.


It's definitely possible to give a message multiple tags, although in 
the display of message summaries, only the lowest-numbered color is visible.


Also, pressing 0 will clear all tags.



I honestly don't know where I saw that you could just use the number 
keys to toggle tags without going through the menu.  I've been using 
them for a long time as a quick way to toggle tags on messages in the 
thread/message panes of the main window, or from a separate message window.


Now that I think of it, I don't know where I found that, either. 
There's no indication of keyboard shortcuts in Message -> Tag.


One minor annoyance is that tag descriptions are global, and for me, for 
certain folders, the scheme that I use is specific to the folder.  I've 
learned to simply accept that, where I know what I mean by a certain 
tag, even if the displayed name doesn't reflect that. Maybe something 
for an extension, but I doubt if anybody will ever do that.




As far as I can tell, you can only apply the first 9 tags from the 
advanced search results, since they're the only ones with shortcut keys 
(1 to 9) and the menus aren't available there.  So if you want to be 
able to apply your frequently-used custom tags from the advanced search 
results, they need to be in the first 9 tags, and you need to remember 
which numbers they are to use the shortcuts.  You can change the order 
of existing tags at Edit > Preferences > Mail & Newsgroups > Tags or 
Message > Tag > Customise (select a tag and use the Raise/Lower 
Importance buttons).


That's correct.  See above.

I do make a little bit of use of tagging with filters.  For my Inbox, I 
have a filter that assigns the 1 tag ("Urgent") to messages that the 
sender has set Priority: to be urgent.  Although use of the Priority: 
header is now mostly passe', it's still useful to get my attention if 
the sender has taken the effort to designate a message as urgent.


For newsgroups, I have also a filter that flags with a 4 tag (where I've 
renamed the flag as "Mine") so that I can easily see messages I've 
contributed, or if the thread is collapsed, which threads I've 
contributed to.  I also subscribe to a bunch of mailing lists, where I 
keep a lot of the back traffic in list-specific folders, and I do the 
same thing with that traffic.



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Re: Verizon.com Web Site SM 2.53.3 Win10Pro

[NFN Smith]

bono1...@gmailo.com wrote:
Hello all when trying to access verizon.com website, it hangs using 
usually after the the first page.


I have no issues when using Chrome 84.0.44147.125.

Any ideas or suggestions as to the issues and how to overcome?


You're talking https://verizon.com/ right?  I'm not finding any problems 
there or on a couple of the links that I tried.


See what happens when you clear your cache and cookies.

Smith

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Re: Does your SM v2.53.3 get very slow and unresponsolve after using & logging off Gmail.com?

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:

On 8/18/2020 11:24 AM, NFN Smith wrote:
...

UO Legacy here too. Yeah. :(


As noted, see what happens when you turn off uBlock, at least 
temporarily.


If disabling uBlock doesn't change anything, I'm inclined to believe 
that you're seeing something that's system related, rather than 
Seamonkey itself.


Interesting. That made a difference for a minute Gmail.com session, but 
I hate Google invading my privacy and showing its ads.


I fully agree about not liking Google, although that does indicate that 
uBlock may be a part of your problem.  Still, it's hard to tell if 
that's the true source of the problem, or something else, where uBlock 
is merely the symptom.


One other thought comes to mind -- how big is your cache, and how 
frequently do you clear it?  


I use its defaults (currently 350 MB) and clear it a few times per 
month. Last one was last week.


Also, how full is your hard disk?  




I have 805 GB free out of 933 GB in my 2 TB SATA 7200 RPM HDD's C: 
drive. I do clear out its mess at least once a month. :)


That removes obvious sources, but worth verifying.

I'm wondering if your hard disk may be an issue, although that's getting 
out of the realm of anything specific to Seamonkey.


I know that several years ago, I saw more than one machine that was 
really struggling on performance with Firefox, and when all my standard 
performance troubleshooting techniques didn't turn up anything, I found 
that when I ran a SMART check of the hard drive, I was getting errors 
there. In each case, replacement of the hard drive cleared the errors.


Smith
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Re: Does your SM v2.53.3 get very slow and unresponsolve after using & logging off Gmail.com?

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:

On 8/18/2020 10:41 AM, NFN Smith wrote:



How much RAM do you have?


6 GB of RAM.


Also, if you look at the Task Manager, what's the memory demand coming 
from Seamonkey?


Like 1 GB with seamonkey.exe.



To me, that combination should be OK, but has been noted elsewhere, it 
does indicate that there's memory swapping happening.




What extensions do you have active, and do you run any mail processing 
filters?


Last updated: Tue Aug 18 2020 10:50:00 GMT-0700 (Pacific Standard Time)
User Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:60.0) 
Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.3


Extensions (enabled: 6)
* ColorfulTabs 31.1.9 (http://www.addongenie.com/colorfultabs)
* DOM Inspector 2.0.17.2 (http://www.mozilla.org/projects/inspector/)
* Expire history by days [converted] 1.2.0
* Open With 6.8.6 (https://github.com/darktrojan/openwith)
* PrefBar 7.1.1 (http://prefbar.tuxfamily.org/)
* uBlock Origin 1.16.4.24 
(https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock-for-firefox-legacy)


I'm a PrefBar fan, but I've never seen that to cause issues. Beyond 
uBlock Origin, I'm not familiar with the others, but none look like they 
should be a problem.


On uBlock, how many subscriptions do you have, especially more than the 
default?  You might want to see what happens when you temporarily 
disable that one.




Mailing filters? No, I don't use any in http://gmail.com's web site.
Also, I am only there for just quick sessions (up to ten minutes).


That's the way I use gmail, as well. Log in, see what I want to see, log 
out again. With NoScript, I'm aggressive about blocking scripts, but at 
an official Google site, I've found that it's necessary to not block any 
Google scripting hosts (including gstatic) if I want things to behave 
properly.  The only exceptions I've found is that it's safe to block 
google-analytics, and if I'm not explicitly trying to get something from 
YouTube, it's safe to block that, as well.


Now that I think of it, I know that FRG has noted that there's an 
increase of issues between Seamonkey and Google, especially 
video-related stuff, and things that Google is doing that aren't 
compatible.  I think I've seen commentary about issues with YouTube, 
although I haven't had any issues there, but I don't make a lot of use 
of YouTube.


OTOH, the one thing that I've encountered is that at Google's main 
search page, the cursor display in the search bar is about half a line 
offset. I also don't use that page regularly, and the offset of cursor 
and text is mostly annoyance, but I found that when I use PrefBar to 
show a User Agent string that's stock Firefox (and no mention of 
Seamonkey) that fixes the problem.  Rather than using PrefBar to do 
temporary spoofing (and having to remember to remove spoofing when I'm 
done), I found that it's easier to simply tell Google that I'm running 
Firefox ESR, by going to about:config and setting 
general.useragent.override.google.com to show Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 
10.0; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/68.0 .


Although UA spoofing may not fix this particular problem, it does seem 
that google is happier if you don't confuse them with the presence of 
Seamonkey in your UA.






If I take a look at about:memory, there's indications of active 
scripting from message filters in the mail client, as well as 
scripting from previously-opened tabs in the browser.  I've found that 
sometimes running a "Free Memory" can lower memory usage, and 
sometimes improve performance a little.


I tried to do that after Gmail's sessions, but so dang slow and 
unresponsive!


Definitely painful.




I know that a couple of months ago, I was filling in a form on a 
morning after I had left Seamonkey open overnight, and this was one of 
those forms that launches a script for every single field.  Everything 
was really slow, and by the time I got to the end of the form, I was 
getting scripting timeout errors, and it was pretty painful.  The only 
reason I didn't restart Seamonkey was that I didn't want to start the 
form over from the beginning again.


Oh, I hate those!!


Yep. One of the effects of NoScript is that if I'm at a purchasing site, 
and I get to the end of a form, and find that there's an essential 
scripting host that hasn't been enabled, enabling that extra host causes 
the form to clear, and I have to start over.  Maybe I should see what 
happens if I adjust NoScript to not do a form reload if permissions get 
changed.





I will note that I'm a long-time user of NoScript and uBlock Origin 
(and Adblock Plus before that), and it seems that uBlock may be the 
culprit for me, especially since I have a lot of user-crafted rules (I 
tend to block annoying graphics that I don't want to see, even if 
they're not ads).


All that sai

Re: Does your SM v2.53.3 get very slow and unresponsolve after using & logging off Gmail.com?

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:


Mine does in my decade old, 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 PC. My quad core CPU's 
single CPU goes bonker to its max. SM just freezes and doesn't respond 
for a minute or so. Doing anything, like quitting SM, is delayed big 
time. I noticed this for weeks too. Did Google change something recently 
again? :( What about your computer(s)?


Thank you for reading and hopefully answering soon. :)



How much RAM do you have?

Also, if you look at the Task Manager, what's the memory demand coming 
from Seamonkey?


What extensions do you have active, and do you run any mail processing 
filters?



It could be that there may be some sort of script that's active, 
although I've never seen anything hammer just one core.


I've long suspected that there's some sort of memory leak issue in 
Seamonkey, but I've never gotten any further than that.  I know that 
when I leave it on for a long time (especially overnight) I often see 
relative high memory use (sometimes, in excess of 2 GB), really slow 
performance, and more frequent warnings of timeouts on scripts.  A 
restart of Seamonkey normally clears that problem.


If I take a look at about:memory, there's indications of active 
scripting from message filters in the mail client, as well as scripting 
from previously-opened tabs in the browser.  I've found that sometimes 
running a "Free Memory" can lower memory usage, and sometimes improve 
performance a little.


I know that a couple of months ago, I was filling in a form on a morning 
after I had left Seamonkey open overnight, and this was one of those 
forms that launches a script for every single field.  Everything was 
really slow, and by the time I got to the end of the form, I was getting 
scripting timeout errors, and it was pretty painful.  The only reason I 
didn't restart Seamonkey was that I didn't want to start the form over 
from the beginning again.


I will note that I'm a long-time user of NoScript and uBlock Origin (and 
Adblock Plus before that), and it seems that uBlock may be the culprit 
for me, especially since I have a lot of user-crafted rules (I tend to 
block annoying graphics that I don't want to see, even if they're not ads).


All that said, I've noticed that since I upgraded to 2.53.3, I notice a 
lot less performance issues, especially if I leave Seamonkey active 
overnight.


Smith
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Re: start over

[NFN Smith]

Manfred Fedorczuk wrote:

Folks,

my Seamonkey (SM) installation has deteriorated over the years and I 
intend to start over.


I will install a new copy of SM and create the needed profiles (no 
problem).

I will locate the old and the new profile directories (no problem).


I agree with Don Spam.  There really is nothing to accomplish with a 
reinstall.  Unless you're convinced (with hard evidence) that there's 
corruption of either program binaries or registry entries, a reinstall 
is a waste of time.  The only reason to consider a reinstall is if 
you're shifting from 32-bit to 64-bit. Otherwise, things that are 
frustrating are a part of your user profile.


Although I have rebuilt a Seamonkey profile, I'm not sure how productive 
it was.


I think that a better approach is a profile reset.  Help -> Restart with 
Add-ons disabled, and follow the dialogs there.  That will reset 
preferences back to default, as well as disabling all extensions, but 
not touch any of your other data you want to keep.


That one doesn't necessarily clear all problems (especially if there's 
issues in some of the underlying databases), but I have occasionally 
seen improved performance even with a one-time restart in Safe Mode.



My question:
Which parts/files from the old profiles do I need to copy over into the 
new profile directories to keep

  + e-mails
  + bookmarks
  + stored passwords
but nothing else?

In particular, I do not want the old configuration settings or 
add-on-settings to survive.


Profile reset is the easiest way of doing that.

Besides what you're mentioning here, if you're using Seamonkey for 
email, then you probably also want to preserve your server configs, 
especially if you have more than one email address.  That's all stored 
in the prefs.js file, along with most of your other preferences 
settings.  I will also suggest that you want to preserve your address books.


If you really want to do a more elaborate starting over, I suggest 
creating a new profile with the Profile Manager, although as noted, for 
mail, you'll need to choose between copying your entire prefs.js file, 
or re-configuring your mail accounts by hand.


If your mail accounts are POP, then I strongly suggest that in both 
profiles, you adjust your mail retention settings, so that new messages 
are not deleted from the server immediately after download.  If you have 
two profiles, you want the ability of both profiles to see the same 
messages.


As for what to transition to a new profile (make sure that Seamonkey 
isn't open when you're working on files inside a profile), take a look 
here for what you might want to transfer: 
http://kb.mozillazine.org/Transferring_data_to_a_new_profile_-_SeaMonkey 
. Ignore the content describing transition from Seamonkey 1, and look 
further down for the Seamonkey 2 info.


One other suggestion -- if you are setting up a new profile, consider 
the possibility of transition from POP to IMAP.  Although there's 
specific reasons to use POP, because IMAP leaves mail on the server, it 
makes things a lot easier to get to the server from multiple points, 
whether multiple profiles, different computers, or from the web, and 
where the status of the mailbox (including folders) is identical, no 
matter which access you use.


Smith
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Re: Eyeball icon on _SOME_ USENET threads that I've replied to.

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:

On 8/15/2020 8:20 AM, Edward wrote:

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/1125945

One of the comments states that it is 'set' when Message/Watch Thread 
is selected.


Maybe accidental "W" hotkey to watch the thread?
--



That's possible, although if more than occasionally, there may be some 
other source, typically a filter.


Years ago, I did a filter to mark threads that I've contributed to as 
watched, but I found that it's more effective to tag my own 
contributions with a color, and where, when collapsed, those threads 
show up. To me, it's visually more effective than using watching.


Smith

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Re: SM 2.53.3: Some sites not displaying correctly

[NFN Smith]

Chuck wrote:


I use SeaMonkey primarily for mail client, primarily FF as my browser.

Version 2.46
User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:49.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/49.0 SeaMonkey/2.46

Build identifier: 20161213183751

Should I install 2.53 (I know backup profile, etc)


I would, just to get current security updates. And when going from 2.49 
to 2.53, it's a good idea to uninstall 2.49, first, especially if you 
intend to install a 64 bit version.




Recently, I'm having same problem with Ebay - in browser and email 
notices and deal alerts.   The browser site only shows hyperlink line 
items no pictures.   The inline pics on emails only show empty boxes.


I'm not seeing any issues in 2.53.3, even with aggressive use of 
noScript and uBlock Origin (at least in the home page). I think if I'm 
actually shopping at eBay, I tend to have to enable at least some of 
their scripts.


If you're not running these extensions, I'm going to suggest that it 
would be a good idea to clear your cache and cookies, and let Seamonkey 
get a clean download of all the content.


These days, so much content is based on scripting that I think that 
sometimes the scripts get confused, and don't download new stuff when 
they need to.


Smith



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Re: Installing Seamonkey 2.53.3

[NFN Smith]

Don Spam's Reckless Son wrote:

Be warned that "running both versions at once" is a very dangerous - ok, 
suicidal - thing to do with those two versions.


When you move from a 2.49.x (or older) version to a 2.53.x version, the 
profile undergoes some migration reformatting which renders part of it 
useless for 2.49.x levels.  That is the reason for THOSE BIG WARNINGS IN 
RED IN THE RELEASE NOTES which you should have seen.


Something that I neglected to mention when I noted that I have had two 
versions installed simultaneously is that it's essential that each 
version have its own profile.


This is something that comes from Firefox since about version 54 or 55, 
in that profiles are not backward-compatible. In Seamonkey, that means 
that if a profile has been used 2.53.x, then if you try to use the same 
profile again in 2.49.x, there is significant chance for data loss.


Although I may be annoyed that the upgrade-in-place tool has been broken 
for several releases, I still consider that to be something of a 
positive thing. If I have to manually download and install a new 
version, then it's a good reminder to make a backup of a profile before 
I install.  Then, if it turns out that there's a reason to revert to the 
earlier version, I still have a copy of a profile that's known to work 
with that version.


Smith
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Re: Installing Seamonkey 2.53.3

[NFN Smith]

Bill Spikowski wrote:
I'm trying to update my Seamonkey 2.49.5 installations on Win10 and Win7 
computers.


The installations seem to work fine; but then a couple hours later, I 
see that SM has regressed to version 2.49.5. This has happened twice 
each on two different Win10 computers. I've looked at the various 
warnings about this update but can't find any that would explain this 
behavior.


What might I be missing???


I'm not aware of specific issues, but I know that when I upgraded to 
2.53.1, I uninstalled 2.49.5 first (as well as backing up my profiles by 
copying the contents of %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey to another location).


I'm wondering if there's a possibility of you having problems with 32 
and 64 bit versions.  If your 2.49.5 is 32 bit and you're running a 64 
bit installer for 2.53.3, I'm pretty sure the release notes instruct you 
to uninstall the 32 bit version first. In Windows, 32 bit files are 
normally put in c:\program files (x86) and 64 bit files are normally put 
in c:\program files.


Technically, it is possible to install multiple versions of Seamonkey 
side by side (as long as you don't run them simultaneously), and I have 
done this on a virtual machine.


My suspicion is that you may have two versions installed, and where the 
shortcut you're using for launching Seamonkey points to the installation 
of 2.49.5.


If you want to dig further, two things to look at:

1) Right-click on a Seamonkey icon, look at the Properties and go to the 
Shortcut tab, and in the Target line, note the name/location of what 
binary file is being opened.


2) Use the Explorer to check your Program Files and Program Files (x86) 
folders. Check to see which (or both) have Seamonkey folders. Check the 
properties (Details tab) of any Seamonkey.exe files to verify version 
numbers.


If you're seeing any indication of Seamonkey installed in multiple 
locations, I suggest making sure you uninstall all copies of Seamonkey 
(and Windows will probably also report two versions active), and then 
install a new copy.


Smith

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Re: US BANK HAS STOPPED SUPPORTING MY BROWSER

[NFN Smith]

Marion Walther wrote:

Haven't heard back from UB yet but just noticed this. Clicked on SM
help and about has this:  User agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1;
Win64; x64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.3 Can
that be my problem? I don't find that UA when I go the
my about:config



about:config is just a UI to settings that are in the underlying 
prefs.js file.  Unless you're using general.useragent.override settings, 
you won't see any version information there.


Take a look at about:support instead.

One other possible thing that could be happening is that default 
settings for Seamonkey include "advertise Firefox compatibility", and 
that gets around most of the sites that are looking for Firefox. 
However, there's a few sites that will complain about an unsupported 
browser if the presented User Agent string shows anything except stock 
Firefox.


I've found that effect at Google's home page, where there's a display 
quirk, where the search bar shows a cursor a half line offset.  It's not 
really a problem, so much as an annoyance, and through on-the-fly 
spoofing that I do with PrefBar, I've confirmed that Google's display 
comes from seeing the combination of Firefox and Seamonkey, and if I 
show just a stock Firefox string, then the display is correct.


Thus I have general.useragent.override.google.com set to show only Firefox.

As noted separately, I suspect that for any response you get fro USBank 
support, "Seamonkey" is likely to cause them to end the conversation. As 
far as they're concerned, they're supporting Firefox (and it's likely 
that they prefer Chrome and support Firefox and Safari, and maybe IE or 
Edge, and reluctantly, only because the others are too widely used to 
ignore), and they draw the line there.  In their view, if you want to 
use something else, it's up to you to figure it out, and they're not 
going to spend time helping you.


Smith
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Re: US BANK HAS STOPPED SUPPORTING MY BROWSER

[NFN Smith]

Marion Walther wrote:

I can sign in but my cursor just sits there. I cannot access
anything. Cannot even log out. How can I resolve that? I have to go
to Firefox to do my banking. I have used SeaMonkey since NetScape and
have my own domain so I want to continue my email client in SM.



After a quick glance-through of other responses, I'll put a response here...

1) Make sure you clear your cache and cookies.  Sites that are heavy on 
scripting sometimes can have difficulties displaying properly, and 
clearing your cache can help by forcing new copies of everything. This 
may not do anything for you, but it's something that's quick to do.  I 
will note that I can get to usbank.com, with no obvious problems, but 
that's only the front page, and I can't see what's happening with login 
processes.


2) You note that you have both NoScript and uBlock Origin installed.  I 
have both myself, and while I don't see frequent problems with uBlock, I 
frequently fight with NoScript, because I have it set to block 
everything as a default, and then temporarily whitelist.  At some sites, 
it can take multiple rounds of enabling scripting hosts, before the 
essential script will run.  One that I've found is Google's gstatic for 
rendering fonts often doesn't run until I've enabled numerous other 
scripting hosts.  And with enabling hosts, it's often not easy to tell 
which are essential for displaying a page, and which are are related to 
advertising networks.


As an experiment, you may want to temporarily disable both of these 
add-ons, just to see what difference there is.  Restarting Seamonkey in 
Safe Mode (Help -> Reatart with Add Ons Disabled) can also do that, if 
you haven't tried already.


3) Browser identity could be a problem, and since that's been discussed 
down-thread, I won't put a lot of detail here.


This is a place where financial institutions tend to be more aggressive 
about demanding certain browsers (typically IE, Chrome, Firefox and 
Safari). If you get a complaint about your browser, even if the message 
is worded to indicate that your browser has inadequate capacity, I've 
found that to be bogus. If I spoof something that's current, I rarely 
have problems getting through.  The real reason is a matter of tech 
support coming from the site.  They want "Firefox", not "like Firefox" 
or "Firefox derived". If you're interacting with their tech support, 
they want you to be running what their support people see on their own 
screens, where they can be done with interacting with you as quickly as 
possible. Seamonkey's different UI (especially for config settings) is a 
a non-starter, and if you tell them that you're running something else, 
they'll end the conversation right there with "we don't support that".


But I will encourage you to add an entry to about:config, setting 
general.useragent.override.usbank.com, to show a version of Firefox 
they're likely to accept.  Either of these is likely to work for you:


   Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/60.0
   Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/68.0


Don't worry about the differences between Win 7 and Win 10, they're 
unlikely to be significant.  I do quite a bit of browser spoofing, 
including places where I spoof that I'm using Mac or Linux, as well as 
Windows, and also other browsers, such as Chrome.  The only thing that 
the browser sniffers are looking for (usually) is Firefox version that 
they consider to be acceptable -- that is, the version following "Firefox/".


4) One other thing that could be causing you problems is your cookie 
handling policy. Personally, I allow all first-party cookies, and then I 
discard all cookies at the end of my browsing session.  I disallow 
third-party cookies, and there are occasions that sites will refuse to 
work unless third-party cookies are allowed.  You can try whitelisting 
sites, but that takes some work to figure out.  Basically, you have to 
temporarily accept all cookies, to find out which sites are setting 
cookies, and then you have to guess which sites to whitelist.



In my own usage, I have a second profile in Seamonkey that I call "bare 
metal", where the only non-default settings are to flush user data at 
the end of the session.  If a site is giving me problems in such a way 
that I can't find the necessary tweaks to get it to work, it's useful to 
use the bare metal profile, to see how things work in default 
conditions.  That's good for figuring out if the site is really 
objecting to Seamonkey, or if it's something in my normal profile that 
isn't working quite correctly.


With that in mind, I also have Firefox installed, where I have multiple 
profiles, including one with all my personal preference settings, and 
another with bare metal default settings.  If I'm having problems with a 
site (especially e-commerce related), and I don't want to take the time 
to restart Seamonkey, I tend to launch Firefox on the ba

Re: Reset email passwords

[NFN Smith]

Richard Owlett wrote:


I was thinking along those lines. I'm setting up another physical 
machine for doing a test install of SeaMonkey after asking my provider 
for their preferences.



That's a lot of effort.  Unless you have reason to believe system 
corruption, you can get the same effect by using the Profile Manager to 
set up a new profile.


Getting a list of preferences from the provider isn't a bad thing, 
especially if there's any possibility that they've made changes. One 
easy place to trip up can be the methodology of user ID on the server 
side.  It's common that mail servers use email address as the user ID, 
but it's not universal, and if the server uses a different ID, that can 
be harder to figure out.


The one twist that I've found is that some providers are doing more 
things with 2-factor authentication.  I found that with my provider, 
when I set up a mail client on my phone, and I couldn't authenticate. 
It turns out that there is a different password that is used for 
POP/IMAP/SMTP than the normal password.


In that setup, I can use my normal password if I'm accessing via a web 
client, but if I've configured a new account in an offline client, I 
have to use the alternate password. The thing that confused me is that 
it looks like my account has been grandfathered, where I have not have 
to reconfigure any existing connections. Among other things, I do have 
my POP and IMAP settings (but not SMTP) set not to save passwords, where 
I have to enter the password once per session (to ensure frequent-enough 
usage that I don't forget a fairly long password), and I use the 
password that I know.  The alternate password is randomly-generated, and 
I have no idea of what that is.  Additionally, when I changed the 
user-facing password, that's still the password that I enter when 
prompted, and it's still the password that I use for SMTP.



From further discussion up-thread, I do see mention of use of ports 110 
or 995 for POP.  Even if you've used 110 forever, SSL connections are 
getting to be very common, and it's not impossible that your provider is 
requiring use of SSL and port 995.  If that's the case, then for port 
995, you generally want to set Connection Security to use SSL/TLS and 
Authentication method to "Normal Password".  The same applies for 
outbound mail on port 465 or 587 (depending on which the provider uses). 
 Although there's other methods for encrypting credentials exchange, if 
you have SSL active, the connection is encrypted, and there's no need to 
encrypt transmission of the password -- and any setting other than 
"normal" will cause the server to not see a valid password.


Smith
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Re: changing to IMAP from POP3

[NFN Smith]

Ant wrote:
What I did was use POP3 as my primary/local e-mail storage since I don't 
really like keeping my personal e-mails on the servers. I use IMAP once 
in a while. I move all its remote e-mails to my POP3 account to keep 
locally by dragging and dropping between accounts' folders in 
SeaMonkey's e-mail client.



I do something similar.  I prefer keeping my primary storage on my local 
drive, and I have email archives now going back to close to 30 years. 
I've also found that searching goes faster/easier on POP (or local 
folders) than it does on an IMAP account.


With my POP accounts, I set the mail retention settings to leave 
messages on the server for 14 days after download.  From there, if I'm 
using other email settings, whether alternate clients or profiles on the 
same machine, or other machines, I set up IMAP profiles. Nearly all the 
time, having the last 14 days of accumulated mail is enough for what I 
need immediately.  If I happen to send any messages from an IMAP 
connection, I go to the Sent folder, and then move the copy into the 
Inbox, where the message can then be downloaded in my normal POP 
profile, for long-term storage.


This method allows me to get the mail access I need from any place I may 
want access (including occasional use of a web client, as well as the 
mail client on my cell phone), while keeping everything for long-term 
storage in my primary POP profile.  The key idea is that I consider my 
POP profile to be the authoritative collection, and accesses anywhere 
else are merely copies.


Smith



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Re: Banking sites do not display entire page

[NFN Smith]

AK wrote:

On 2 different banking sites, the whole page is not displayed using Seamonkey.

Same with Firefox.

I have some screenshots as you can only see it after logging in.

I have to hit F11 to see everything.

Is that common?

Is it fixable?

Andy



What sites?

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Re: Are Filters supposed to work in SM 2.49.5??

[NFN Smith]

Daniel wrote:

Are Filters supposed to be working in SM 2.49.5??

On several of my UseNet groups, I see posts offering "Solution Manuals" 
so I have made Filters, with various combinations of capital 'S' and 
'M', to 'Mark as Read' and 'Ignore Thread' across ALL of my UseNet 
groups, but, still, I'm finding these Subjects appearing, not daily but 
probably more than weekly.



Filters work fine.  I'm currently running 2.53.2, and virtually all of 
my filters (both mail and newsgroups) were created long before the 
release of any 2.49 versions.


As a background, filters have two parts -- the section that identifies 
specific messages, and the section that performs action(s) on identified 
messages.


If you have filters that seem to be getting ignored, then chances are 
likely that the logic is flawed, and not correctly identifying messages. 
My experience is that it's easy to try to put too many logical 
conditions into a single filter.  A particular limitation is that there 
isn't robust support for Boolean AND, OR and NOT conditions, especially 
in combination. If you need complex conditions, it often takes a 
combination of several filters running in sequence, rather than trying 
to put all the conditions into a single filter.


A couple of suggestions:

1) Make sure you have logging enabled. That won't tell you when a filter 
misses something that you want, but it will at least tell you when a 
filter identifies a message.  This is another reason to go with multiple 
simple filters over a few larger, complex filters; if you have a filter 
with a bunch of conditions in it, the log will show which filter was 
tripped, but it won't tell you which condition caused the filter to trip.


2) If your existing filters aren't hitting anything, chances are pretty 
good that your logic is too complex. Discard those filters, and start 
over with new filters.  As you build a new filters, keep them simple -- 
start with *one* condition. Only when you've confirmed that that is 
working the way you want to, then you can either add conditions to that 
filter (and make sure you're careful to distinguish between "Match All 
of the following" (Boolean AND, where all conditions must be true), and 
"Match any of the following" (Boolean OR, where one or more of the 
conditions must be true). It's easy to get the wrong one, and when that 
happens, the filter won't do what you want it to do.


If you haven't done so already, take a look at 
http://kb.mozillazine.org/Filters_%28Thunderbird%29 - this one does a 
good job of walking you through building filters.


I will note that on this newsgroup, mozilla.support.seamonkey, I have 4 
filters active.  One looks for the "SupportTheFork" auto-notification 
messages, and marks those as Read, where I don't see them, and "ignore 
subthread" is chosen, where I also don't see any follow-up discussion. 
Another filter has a bunch of commonly-used terms in subject lines used 
by the Italian spammer, and is also set to ignore subthread.  I don't 
see any of the Italian spam. Another filter looks for my name as the 
poster, and then tags the message, so that the display of that message 
(and the thread) makes it easy to find messages I've posted, and threads 
that I've participated in.  I have a similar filter in place that tags 
(with a different color) of topics I want to follow.


The bottom line is that filters do work, but they take some effort to 
set up correctly, and it's essential to make sure that the logic portion 
works.  Keeping the logic simple will help a lot.


Smith



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Address book handling: Collected Addresses

[NFN Smith]

I happen to be running Seamonkey 2.53.2, but I'm realizing that I've 
been seeing this for some time -- certainly in various releases of 2.49, 
and possibly further back than that.


I make periodic visits to my Collected Addresses address book, and 
generally move the addresses I want to keep permanently into other 
address books, and discard most of the rest.


Usually, I don't pay attention to handling until much later when I 
repeat the exercise (sometimes months apart), but more than once, I've 
noticed addresses in Collected Addresses with a deja vu feeling of "I 
thought I had moved or deleted that address a long time ago".


What's happening is that once I move or delete addresses, and Seamonkey 
restarts, a re-visit to Collected Addresses shows those addresses still 
there, although for moved addresses, they are being correctly copied to 
other folders.


As far as I can tell, I'm only seeing this on the Collected Addresses 
folder, although I don't frequently delete addresses from other folders.


If I was seeing this kind of effect on a mail folder, I would normally 
re-index the folder, but I'm not aware of a similar capacity for doing 
that with an address book.



Any idea of how to get around this problem?

Smith
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Re: What is YouTube doing!?

[NFN Smith]

meagain wrote:


Will SeaMonkey fans ('SM lovers' didn't sound right) really have to 
use a different User-Agent for each and every web sight?


- meagain


I use a user-agent override that claims to be Firefox 62.  That works 
well for me.




What is a user-agent override and how do I get (and use/install) it?


Unfortunately, for a growing number of web sites, Seamonkey is regarded 
as dead (or at least irrelevant). There's just not enough users for the 
sites to care about.  It doesn't help when Seamonkey 2.53 is still based 
on Firefox versions older than 57.0 -- there's a growing number of sites 
that are rejecting connections Firefox versions that are 56 and older. 
To that end, I know that the User Agent string for Seamonkey 2.53.2 is 
set to show Firefox 60.


Google has been a problem for some time, where the normal Seamonkey UA 
string causes a funny display in the search bar at www.google.com.  Not 
really a problem, but annoying.  I can get around that with browser 
spoofing, where I have an entry in about:config where I set 
general.useragent.override.google.com to show:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/68.0


(with no mention of Seamonkey).  I've done similar with a couple of 
other sites don't like a stock Seamonkey UA, where I show:


  Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 
Firefox/60.0 SeaMonkey/2.53.2


where I did site-specifics general.useragent.override entries.  I did 
these sites before Seamonkey configs were updated to show Firefox 60, so 
they may not be necessary now.


As for Google, they have their own ideas of what they want to do with 
their content (especially YouTube), and you should assume that a lot of 
it is going to be optimized to run in Chrome.  I don't do a lot with 
YouTube, so I haven't seen problems.  On the other hand, I know that 
I've seen Frank-Rainier Grahl note that for stuff he does with YouTube, 
it's faster/easier to just use Chrome for that, rather than fighting 
with known limitations of Seamonkey.


Remember, there's nothing that requires you to use one browser 
exclusively for everything. Although I don't like Chrome, I can 
certainly see a valid approach in using Chrome for YouTube, if that's 
what it takes to get YouTube to do what I want.


In a similar way, because I do a lot of tweaking to my primary Seamonkey 
profile, with strict handling on cookies, and liberal use of uBlock 
Origin and NoScript, there's a number of sites (especially eCommerce) 
that I can't get to behave adequately without an undue amount of 
wrestling.  I generally assume that those kinds of problems are 
predominantly related to my profile, rather than more general problems 
with Seamonkey, and for that I have a Firefox profile that's mostly 
untweaked, where I will use that for a one-off session to get done what 
I need.


Smith
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Re: Home Depot videos don't play

[NFN Smith]

flyguy wrote:

Windows 10, SM 2.49.4

The videos on this Home Depot page do not play for me, but they do play 
if I use Chrome. What's wrong?


Best guess is that the developers are only paying attention to Chrome, 
and don't really care about other browsers, especially ones considered 
to be "obsolete" like Seamonkey.


I tried going there with an untweaked profile in 2.53.3, and no success 
on getting the videos to play.  I also tried spoofing Chrome, and 
nothing there, either.


I did find it interesting that when I right-click and select "view 
image", I get a view of a control box: 
https://assets.homedepot-static.com/p/static/images/inlinePlayerDwarfs.png


To me, that's something that's happening with scripting.

It's entirely possible that the site developers are making use of 
features that aren't supported in Seamonkey 2.53.


Smith
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Re: Large memory usage by email ... or is SM in general?

[NFN Smith]

flyguy wrote:

Windows 10, SM 2.49.4

Task Manager showed SM using 32% memory with email and one browser 
window open. The browser had only one tab with the Washington Post front 
page. Closing the browser reduced memory use to 24%; after closing the 
email then reopening it, it used only 7%. I've noticed this high memory 
usage before. Is there a way to avoid it, or to reduce it without 
closing the program? I don't mind closing/reopening the email, but often 
I have several windows and tabs open, so it's a nuisance to close the 
browser, too.


I've found this effect on my own machines, although I haven't tried to 
do any serious work of digging in to figure out if it's something 
related to the browser, the mail client, one of my extensions, a 
combination of things, or something else that I haven't thought of.  My 
suspicion is that there's a memory leak somewhere, but the symptoms 
aren't always consistent.


Something that I've noticed is that sometimes, I get really laggy 
response and the Windows Task Manager showing Seamonkey using a lot of 
cycles, and the memory allocation is only about 850 MB (and slow 
perfomance), and sometimes, I can see memory usage above 1.5 GB, and no 
obvious performance issues.


Several weeks ago, I was interacting with a form with multiple screens 
that had a ton of scripting in it (where every single input required 
script interaction), and I noticed that the further I got into the form, 
the slower the response was.  By the time that I got to the last few 
inputs on the form, Seamonkey was giving me scripting timeouts. I had 
left Seamonkey open overnight, after a full day of usage the previous 
day, and IIRC, checks of Windows Task Manager showed that Seamonkey was 
using around 2.2 GB of RAM, and heavy CPU usage. Normally, for that kind 
of slowness of response, I would have restarted Seamonkey, but by the 
time the performance got beyond tolerable, I was far enough into the 
form that I didn't want to have to start over at the beginning of the form.


I live in Seamonkey all day, and I generally don't have any issues if I 
have launched it at the beginning of the day.  Most often, if I see 
issues, it tends to be if I've left it open overnight. I know that 
yesterday, at the end of the day, I had Seamonkey open with light usage, 
and I forgot to shut down, and when I came in this morning, it was still 
open.  Memory usage was a little more than 1 GB. I didn't check for 
performance before I restarted.


In my experience, I don't see evidence that Seamonkey is hardware 
restrained. I currently run 16 GB of RAM, and even when it's slow, 
there's still plenty of RAM available. And about a year ago, I moved to 
a to a new machine with an SSD in it. Thus, it appears that there aren't 
issues with swapping happening. Since I moved to this machine, I think I 
see the performance issues a little less frequently, but not 
dramatically, The most constant thing seems to be where it's been 
running for more than 16 hours at a time.


A lot of the time, I'm content to simply restart Seamonkey, but there 
are times when that's inconvenient.  I have more than one mailbox set 
where I don't allow Seamonkey to remember the password for POP and IMAP 
connections (I do that to ensure that by having to enter those passwords 
once per session, I don't forget them), and I also have Seamonkey set to 
discard all my cookies at the end of a session.  Thus, if I do a 
restart, I have to re-enter passwords for email, and sometimes for open 
sessions in the browser.


One of my favorite extensions is Session Manager.  I have that one set 
to keep a list of all open tabs when the browser shuts down, and when I 
restart, I have the last 8 sessions available (along with other sets of 
tabs that I've saved).  Thus, if I have a bunch of tabs open at the end 
of the day, I can shut down Seamonkey, and then when I start up the next 
day, I can re-open all of those tabs (even if I have to log into any 
open browser sessions).


Since I have a spare machine available, I might try seeing what happens 
if I build up a profile from scratch, starting with just a browser, and 
then adding one or more mail accounts as well as extensions, to see if I 
can find any pattern to where performance begins to lag.



Smith
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Re: SM2.53.2 portable?

[NFN Smith]

WaltS48 wrote:

On 5/8/20 5:13 AM, jcteyssier wrote:

jcteyssier a écrit :

Hello folks,

does seamonkey 2.53.2 / win 10 64 portable version exist somewhere?
I use to have portable edition with 2.49.x and did not find 
equivalent in 2.53.x


Jean-Charles

Found:

https://archive.mozilla.org/pub/seamonkey/releases/2.53.2/win64/fr/seamonkey-2.53.2.fr.win64.zip 



But no direct link  here:
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/#2.53.2


SeaMonkey doesn't make the portable versions.

You get those from 

There is a Support link there where you could probably ask for an update.


In the past, portableapps.com has been pretty good about having current 
copies of Seamonkey, although at the moment, the most recent version 
offered is 2.49.5.  I don't know how soon the developer is likely to 
update, although https://portableapps.com/development/outdated does 
indicate that 2.53.2 is being built.


Smith
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Re: Ping FRG: following development releases

[NFN Smith]

Frank-Rainer Grahl wrote:



They are more or less profile compatible at the moment. If you use it 
only for testing you can use the same profile. Just need to reinstall 
Lightning if you used 2.57 and did go back. Actually 2.53.3 has even 
some later stuff in.


With extensions I would recommend separate profiles. Older ones can hang 
2.57 at shutdown or produce funny results.


Basically only the browser works right in 2.57. Various problems with 
the other components. Usually use it only when I encounter a web site 
broken in 2.53 to check, when I find some time for a few 2.57 fixes or 
test 2.53 to 2.57 ports.


Thanks for the feedback.

I will go with separate profiles, because I do want to monitor status 
with extensions.  I found that to be really useful when watching 
Firefox, then Thunderbird make the transition to WebExtensions.  I'm not 
making any use of Lightning, so I'm not concerned about that.


From the developer meeting notes, I do know that mail/news is not 
working in 2.57, but that's one of the things I want to keep an eye on, 
so that when the notes indicate there's changes, I can see the effects.


And somewhere along, I may be able to do some bug reporting, as well.

Smith
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Ping FRG: following development releases

[NFN Smith]

I have a virtual machine where I have the betas for 2.53.3 installed.  I 
don't make a lot of use of that setup (and not enough to do any serious 
bug testing or reporting), although it's useful to see how progress is 
coming along.


I do follow the notes of the developer meetings, and would be interested 
in taking a look at current status of the 2.57 version, as well.


Is there any problem with installing 2.57 to a separate directory, if 
I'm not trying to share a profile between the two releases?


Smith
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Re: How to access my AOL mail account using SeaMonkey.

[NFN Smith]

Daniel wrote:


I am starting to wonder if I should delete both of the accounts I have 
on SeaMonkey and start all over with one new account.  I make this 
comment based on selecting SeaMonkey to provide everything I 
need...Mail - News - Feeds.


Be aware, Frog, that if you delete both your accounts on SeaMonkey, you 
will be deleting all the e-mails you have sent and received on those two 
accounts!


Least that's what happened to me! ;-(



I haven't been following this thread closely, but at this point, a 
couple of thoughts...


Something that Frog might want to do is consider doing some playing in a 
different user profile, rather than his current profile.  That way, 
there's more capacity to experiment, without risking damage to existing 
setups or data.


One way to do that would be to create a new profile in Seamonkey, and 
try setting up a new connection there. The idea is to figure out the 
mechanics of what works or not, where you're not trying to work around 
your existing data.  Once you get that working, you can replicate those 
settings in your normal profile.


Going a step further, consider the possibility of a temporary install of 
Thunderbird -- its account setup wizard works pretty well (more 
extensive than Seamonkey), and I've found that for most providers, all 
it takes to get a workable connection is specifying your email address, 
password and whether you want POP or IMAP, and the wizard is pretty good 
about figuring out the rest of the settings. There are exceptions, 
especially if a provider requires a different password for external 
clients, as a way of doing a form of multi-factor authentication, but 
absent that, the setup wizard should be able to do most of the work in 
figuring things out. As with the suggestion above, once you have a 
working connection, you can tweak your configs in Seamonkey to match.


However, it is possible that Verizon/AOL is doing something like 
alternate password, and if so, the only source of information of how to 
do your configs will be information that you get directly from them.  My 
own mail provider does this, and when I was setting up my phone to be 
able to check my mail, I found that they required me to do a one-time 
configuration of a separate password that's used in a mail client 
(although somehow, they seem to have grandfathered my long-time 
connection in Seamonkey, where I've never had to adjust that.)


Item of caution: if you're working with a POP connections on a test 
setup, before you commit to downloading mail from a server, I do 
encourage you to check the advanced settings, to adjust the mail 
retention preferences.  In Seamonkey, the default setting is to delete 
mail from the server after it's downloaded, and if you're using a test 
configuration, it's a good idea to set it to not delete from the server, 
so that the test connection isn't grabbing mail that you want to go into 
your normal mail.


Another consideration: if you're changing server names, it's generally 
better to create a new account anyway, and not try to tinker with the 
name in an existing account.  I have done that in the past, even in 
changing providers, but the result is that you get a lot of messiness at 
folder and file level within your user profile, and it's worse when you 
have multiple accounts.  Some of the naming includes server names when 
created, and if you're digging at that level, it can be really confusing 
to be seeing old names that don't correspond with current usage.  With 
this in mind, having a new account in place is probably a good idea.


As for making sure that you don't lose any of your mail archives, I 
recommend either (or both) of the following:


1) Before you do any additional tinkering, make sure you get a backup of 
your existing profile.  In Windows, you want to get the entire contents 
of %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey .  The AppData folder is normally hidden, 
where you can't find it in the Windows explorer, but if you put that 
path (with the environment variable) in the Explorer's address bar, it's 
no problem to find.  And depending on what backup tool you use, some 
allow you to use that construct in what you're including in your 
backups.  For me, if I'm doing a data backup, besides all the normal 
libraries in Windows, I include that designation, so that I get all my 
Seamonkey data, and I do the same with my data for Firefox and 
Thunderbird (%APPDATA%\Mozilla\Firefox and %APPDATA%\Thunderbird, 
respectively -- Thunderbird's designation is slightly different, for 
some reason).


Even if you don't do this for your regular backups, getting a copy of 
your Seamonkey data *somewhere* is a really good idea, even if you 
simply copy %APPDATA%\Mozilla\Seamonkey to your Documents library.


2) If you anticipate the possibility of deleting your existing POP 
account, copy all you mail data into Local Folders, where it can stay, 
even if the account gets deleted. There's a number of useful things that 
you can do wit

Re: Help me upgrading to 2.53.1

[NFN Smith]

Hawker wrote:

thanx. That is great advise.
I was wondering, rather than a different profile, if I could just have 
both installed and disable in the add on manager the one i am not using. 
this way I can disable ABP, try uBlock and if I don't like it or it 
needs more work to make me happy just revert back to disable uBlock and 
ABP. This way I get to try it in my real profile, which is probably more 
real world anyway.


Yes, that's doable.  I considered mentioning the previously, but was 
trying to keep things brief.


As FRG has noted, make sure that you don't try to have both active 
simultaneously, as they're likely to conflict.


Now that I think of it, when I switched to uBlock, I did exactly that, 
of keeping ABP inactive, before I eventually discarded it.


Smith

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Re: Help me upgrading to 2.53.1

[NFN Smith]

Frank-Rainer Grahl wrote:


I always ended up added custom filters to ABP. I seldom need to tweak 
uBlock and memory usage did go down alot.



That's been my experience, as well.  I did a lot more tweaking of ABP 
than I've ever done with uBlock.


Smith

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Re: Help me upgrading to 2.53.1

[NFN Smith]

Hawker wrote:




Not sure why you cling to ABP and 2.49.1 (this one is even more 
obsolete).


Clinging to ABP for me is because it took me several days to get it 
working the way I wanted years ago. I had to find various lists, see 
which ones worked better than others. Deal with broken websites (which 
often required different lists). lots of research and configurations 
work I don't particularly like to do and would rather use my time for 
other things.  I know I need to move on but don't want to invest the 
time right now to do the same with uBlock



Something you might want to try

When I was running AdBlock Plus, I had also done quite a bit of tuning, 
but I when I moved to uBlock Origin, I didn't need to do an unreasonable 
amount of work.  uBlock can pretty much subscribe to the same lists that 
ABP does.  Yes, it does take a little bit of time getting to uBlock's 
different UI, and it is a little more effort to dig into individual 
blocking rules.  However, with uBlock, I find that I spend less time 
tinkering with the rules than I did with ABP, and ultimately, that's 
time I can spend doing what I want to do.


What you might want to do is to create a new profile and install uBlock 
in that -- add all the subscriptions you want (and for that matter, any 
other extensions you consider to be essential), and see what things look 
like.  You might find that you get enough blocking immediately, without 
having to spend much more time, at least not initially. It's likely that 
a lot of the fine-tuning that you want is probably better done as tweaks 
that are done in the context of of the moment.


If initial setups of uBlock do enough for you in the second profile, 
then that will tell you if you can replace ABP in your primary profile 
without an unreasonable amount of work.


Smith

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Re: YouTube Problems

[NFN Smith]

EE wrote:
How?  I used to do that until Firefox dropped the coding supporting 
the setting of Permissions and Seamonkey had to follow suit.



I bookmarked chrome://communicator/content/permissions/cookieViewer.xul
You can use that to make exceptions to cookie permissions.  I am 
actually using a cookie manager extension (written for Firefox but run 
through the converter) that can make cookie permission exceptions for 
the site I am currently viewing.  I patched it so that it would also 
access cookieViewer.xul.



I've found that bookmarking the cookieViewer is useful.  Although I 
normally flush my cookies at the end of a session, it's the fastest way 
of getting to cookie data quickly, and to me, the UI works better than 
going through the Data Manager.


Smith

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Re: Help me upgrading to 2.53.1

[NFN Smith]

Ray_Net wrote:

I want to go from SM 2.49.1 to 2.53.1 ...
But I see that:
- FireBug is not available anymore. so what ?
- AdBlock-Plus is not available anymore. so what ?
- What about this addon "true-full-screen-in-seamonkey" not needed 
anymore ?



For FireBug and true-full-screen-  if you don't know why you need them, 
chances are pretty good that you don't need them. You might try 
disabling and seeing how Seamonkey behaves.  I suspect you'll never know 
the difference.


If you read the 2.53.1 release notes 
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.53.1/ , the 
Extensions section not only notes that AdBlock Plus is problematic, but 
there is still a version of uBlock Origin that is working (and 
supported), and there is a link offered.


For AdBlock, the issue is that they've stopped supporting XUL 
extensions, and at version 2.53.x Seamonkey does not support 
WebExtension extensions.


I will note that I'm quite content with what I'm getting out of uBlock.

Smith

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