Re: [OSM-talk] Flash cookies
On 23 June 2011 03:55, Steve Bennett wrote: > On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 9:01 PM, Markus Lindholm > wrote: >> But there's no need to store them on the client, as all users have to >> log in the preferences can be stored server-side. Atleast I throw away >> all cookies when I close the browser. > > So out of curiosity, the proposed law says it's ok to store user > preferences server side, but not in the browser? That doesn't make any > sense at all, from a privacy perspective. Not exactly. What the proposal says is that you need to tell people you're using a cookie and why you're using it and presumably let them know they can opt out. At which point you can probably tell them that they'll just get the default settings every time. You only need to ask them once. (though how you're going to track that without a cookie I have no idea). When you store data about a person on the server you're also supposed to tell the user you're doing that and allow them to view/delete it. This new proposal is the kind of law you get when you let people who know little about technology decide things. They somehow got the idea that only advertisers use cookies, and they use them to track people Mvg, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Slim mode in osm2pgsql and out of memory error
On 9 June 2011 08:38, Saphy Mo wrote: > The file is the same Europe.osm.bz2 directly downloaded from geofabrik. I > will decomprese it and try to see the order of Nodes, Ways and relation. > But the error happens while pending_ways query. It occurs to me you can see this during import, by seeing which counters go up first. The reason that this is a problem is that in a normal import while importing the nodes there are no way so pending_ways is empty. Since yours is not empty the question is why. There are two possibilities: 1. The database wasn't empty to start with, But with create mode that seems unlikely. 2. The ways come before the nodes, which means all ways get marked as pending when the nodes are imported. And it barfs on this query when there are a lot of them. Note you can als get a quick answer with just: $ bzcat |head Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Slim mode in osm2pgsql and out of memory error
On 8 June 2011 17:11, Martijn van Oosterhout wrote: > Actually, it looks like it's breaking on the pending_ways query. It's > possible there's a lot of those, perhaps it's just running out of > memory there. The code was designed that pending would only be for > changes, and I wouldn't have expected that code to be used for an > initial import. but I haven't look at the code recently so maybe that > changed? > > If it is the intention that this code is used for initial imports it > really needs to be changed to use cursors. Actually, it occurred to me that the system is optimised to the case where the file contains nodes, then ways, then relations. What you're seeing could be caused by the file having the ways first, then the nodes. Can you examine the file to see how it looks? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Slim mode in osm2pgsql and out of memory error
On 8 June 2011 16:44, Saphy Mo wrote: > Dear friend, > I am trying to import whole Europe.os.bz2 in a Postgis database named > EuropeLl as you see in the script below. > CPU: Dual Coe 3 Ghy > RAM: 3 GB > HDD: 1 TB > osm2pgsql.exe -d EuropeLL --latlong --slim -c -C 500 -H localhost -P 5432 -U > osm -W -S default.style europe.osm.bz2 How much memory did you give postgresql? How much is it using? Actually, it looks like it's breaking on the pending_ways query. It's possible there's a lot of those, perhaps it's just running out of memory there. The code was designed that pending would only be for changes, and I wouldn't have expected that code to be used for an initial import. but I haven't look at the code recently so maybe that changed? If it is the intention that this code is used for initial imports it really needs to be changed to use cursors. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] coastline error checker stalled
Hmm, ok. I've done than we'll see if it helps. Thanks, On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 1:48 PM, Lennard wrote: > Martijn van Oosterhout wrote: >> >> Interesting, hadn't noticed. I'll see if I can work out what's happening. > > Increase 600M to 700M and you're set for another few months. > > Also, the MAX_NODES_PER_WAY can now be dropped from 12000 to 2000, now that > no 2000+ node ways are left in OSM, and none can be created. Unless avar > finds a way around that too, actually. :) > > -- > Lennard > -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] coastline error checker stalled
Interesting, hadn't noticed. I'll see if I can work out what's happening. Have a nice day, On Tue, Jan 19, 2010 at 11:29 PM, Lennard wrote: > David Groom wrote: >> >> The date of the last update of the coastline error checker is shown as 27 >> Dec 2009. > > That was what I found when looking for new coastline shapefiles for the > Haiti map. I'm now running the coastline checker for myself to get new > shapefiles. > > Cc'ing Martijn van Oosterhout, as he's the author of the coastline error > checker. > > -- > Lennard > -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] buffer overflow with osm2pgsql
On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 12:40 PM, Andy Allan wrote: > On Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 11:15 AM, janes huff wrote: >> Hi, I tried like this >> <http://blog.geoserver.org/2009/01/30/geoserver-and-openstreetmap/> to >> import osm-data into Postgresql. I used EPSG 25833 (but I also tried >> 900913). >> >> Same with "ja...@dellmo3:/usr/share/osm2pgsql$ osm2pgsql -s -C 2000 -E >> 25833 -U janes -W -d gis planet.osm" >> >> I run Postgresql 8.3, Postgis 1.3.5.1 and osm2pgsql 0.66 with Kubuntu 9.10 >> >> Could somebody help? Merci! The easiest way to get a response is to run the command you gave under valgrind, which will pinpoint the exact line where it breaks. It looks like it goes pretty early on. Or at the very least running it under gdb, which will give you a more readable stack trace. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline error checker shapefiles
Sure, on that page now is all the information used to generate the coastline checker output. Does this answer your question? On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 10:57 AM, David Groom wrote: > Coastline error checker shapefiles are available at > http://hypercube.telascience.org/~kleptog/ > > Is there any way that these can include self-intersection and inverted > polygon type errors? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Patch to render names from routes and custom highway shields on a per country basis
On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 5:45 AM, John Smith wrote: > 2009/9/20 Martijn van Oosterhout : > >> I suppose it would be possible to get osm2pgsql to assign columns >> based on country locations, if the relevant polygons were available in >> another table. Handling diffs is not the problem, osm2pgsql knows >> exactly which things have changed and can do the relevent query to >> supplement the data. > > Any thoughts on osm2pgsql patches to do this? > > Would be be able to use a shape file for this instead of trying to use > information that may or may not already exist in the DB? On the whole I'm not a great fan of shapefile during processing, it means you have to converts shapes back and forth between various formats the whole time. What I was thinking is: 1. Provide a process to read a defined shapefile into the database or something like that (mind you shp2pgsql already exists ofcourse). Perhaps the data could be copied from the polygons table depending on the tag? The thing is you need more attributes, and shapefiles provide a nice way bundle the extra data (shield types, colours, whatever). 2. Once the data is there, osm2pgsql can use joins to match the shapes and given the shapes, copy the values with those shapes into extra columns on the main table. Alternatively, give each shape a number, store the number with the shapes and let mapnik do the join (saves tons of disk space, thus time and memory). As for patches, I don't have time right now, but maybe in the future (a month or three). Do you want the country to be determined for all objects, or just some, like roads? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Patch to render names from routes and custom highway shields on a per country basis
On Wed, Sep 16, 2009 at 4:46 PM, Lennard wrote: > OTOH, if osm2pgsql will only run some queries and let postgis handle the > stamping of features with a proper field to filter on in the stylesheet, > it can be done at the end of the import. The challenge to this method is > in how to handle diffs. You wouldn't want to run through every geometry > in your database everytime you import diffs, but only the changed ones. I suppose it would be possible to get osm2pgsql to assign columns based on country locations, if the relevant polygons were available in another table. Handling diffs is not the problem, osm2pgsql knows exactly which things have changed and can do the relevent query to supplement the data. > One more issue I see is what to do with features that cross these > boundaries? Which style will/should they get? Should the import split > them into 2 features, each on one side of the boundary? Tricky, not something that's going to be solved the first try. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline
On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 9:43 AM, Andre Hinrichs wrote: > Am Samstag, den 01.08.2009, 22:45 +0200 schrieb Martijn van Oosterhout: >> It's still on hypercube and it's not super fast, but it does appear to >> work. Let me know if you see something odd. > > It seems that there is a problem with very small islands. They are > reported as buggy even if they seem to be ok. I've reported such an > error a while ago on WIKI: > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Coastline_error_checker Yeah, basically, there is some rounding done to simplify the polygons so that stuff that makes no difference in rendering gets filtered away. If the island is really small the end effect is that the simplification leaves an area consisting of a single point, and so it complains. I could ofcourse stop it complaining, but the islands wont appear in the output anywhere... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline
On Tue, Jul 28, 2009 at 2:26 PM, David Groom wrote: >>> FWIW, I'm trying to get it working again (it was pointed out to me a >>> few days ago that hypercube was back online) however I keep running >>> into problems with corrupted planet dumps and daily diffs. I hope to >>> have it working again soon. > > Thanks Martijn > > Its such a useful tool to have available Well, I managed to get something working. http://dev.openstreetmap.nl/coastlines.html (thanks to whoever put the page on dev, it's a much better place). All the data is now based on 0.6 inputs and it's quite obvious that since the 0.6 changeover the data is much much cleaner (many less errors). It's still on hypercube and it's not super fast, but it does appear to work. Let me know if you see something odd. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline
Forward to ML. On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 5:45 PM, Martijn van Oosterhout wrote: > On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 11:37 AM, David Groom wrote: >> Yes. For mapnik, at high zoom levels the coast polygons used are generated >> from shapefiles created by the coastline error checker. >> >> The coastline error checker has been offline since sometime before mid June, >> so no updated shapefiles have been created. > > FWIW, I'm trying to get it working again (it was pointed out to me a > few days ago that hypercube was back online) however I keep running > into problems with corrupted planet dumps and daily diffs. I hope to > have it working again soon. > > Have a nice day, > -- > Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ > -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] coastline
On Sat, Jun 13, 2009 at 10:38 PM, Jon Burgess wrote: >> We wrote kleptog to please take a look at it, but having no access to >> the original machine should make things harder. >> >> I don't know when he'll have time to work on it. Who else has past >> knowledge about the coastline checker processes, and can work on this as >> well? > > There have been several recent issues in the coastcheck code which would > have prevented it working, I have fixed all these in SVN so the server > might just need an update & rebuild of osm2coast to get things working > again That should do it, the process is not particularly magical, you just need up-to-date planet dumps to make it work. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Corine Land Cover becomes a potential OSM data source...
On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 3:05 PM, Steve Singer wrote: > On Thu, 14 May 2009, Pieren wrote: > > For the Canadian GeoBase road import I've been using a plugin to JUMP called > RoadMatcher[1] to that detects common roads between two datasets. I've then > been excluding ones that aren't likely to not cause conflicts. > > A few more details at: > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Geobase_NRN_-_OSM_Map_Feature Wow, this looks really promising. During the time of the original import a tool like this was discussed but we didn't know if it existed and didn't want to write it ourselves. However, for future reference it would be *really* nice to be able to automatically generate diffs between OSM and external datasets and be able to "merge" them somehow. I'm thinking of the interface where the two dataset appear next to eachother with differences higlights and you can select which one is "correct". Have a nice dat, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Osm2pgsql and column names with two underscores
On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 2:08 PM, Jukka Rahkonen wrote: > Hi, > > An osm2pgsql user writes on the forum about importing special tags > into PostGIS. > He has defined for example these tags: > node openGeoDB:telephone_area_code text > node openGeoDB:license_plate_code text > > Import fails and error message is: > CREATE TABLE planet_osm_point ( osm_id int4,"access" text, > "admin_level" text, Ok, it's got nothing to do with the underscores and more to do with the fact that the field names are limited to 23 characters by osm2pgsql. I don't really know where this restriction comes from, does anyone else have ideas? It should be easy to fix in output-pgsql.c. Fix the read_style_file() function to increase the length of the buffers. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Multipolygons in Mapnik
On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 7:53 PM, Jon Burgess wrote: > You are correct, the hourly diff imports can not handle the multipolygon > relation properly. These will fix themselves after the weekly import > each Wednesday. Any edit to the nodes or ways in the relation will > probably break it again. Does anyone have a grip on the actual problem? When I wrote the diff handling code I thought I covered all the bases, so I'd be interested to know the failure mode. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Problem with osm2pgsql
On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 10:00 AM, Peter Childs wrote: > I've been trying to import the Planet file into postgres using > osm2pgsql, Using the current SVN version, it seams to be segmenting > when processing the first Way (Under Ubuntu Hardy). Does any one have > any ideas, or shall I try and import a subset (The UK would fit my > purpose) and try and get more details By "segmenting" you mean "segmentation faulting"? Tip for the future: if you're getting an error message you want help with, cut and paste the message in your email, that way we don't have to read your mind. At a guess you're not using --slim mode and are running out of memory (you probably don't have 2GB+ in that machine, right?). Importing a subset is generally better if it's good enough for you. Importing the whole world will easily take 10+ hours, whereas just europe can be done much much quicker. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM license change: A license to kill? -> How to make a nightmare come true!
On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Russ Nelson wrote: > I think it would be > extremely helpful if the licenses themselves included an explanation for > non-lawyers, in the way the gpl always did. > > Not always a good idea. If your license has any ambiguities, then a judge > will go outside your license to see if you've said anything else about the > meaning of the license. Potentially, anything you say about the license > could become part of the license. So your non-legal explanation actually > may have legal import. On the other hand, it's a good thing. In AU you have the Acts Interpretation Act which explicitly states that any accompanying rationale documents/discussions/etc to an act/bill must be taken into account when considering it. The reason is that people aren't gods and occasionally screw up and it's useful if the judge has the rationale document saying what the *intended* ramifications were. Yes, the rationale document is binding but it's often much more readable than the act itself. If there's a contradiction, well that's what a judge is for. Given this licence is breaking new ground I think it's doubly important to have an official FAQ/rationale/etc so that any future judge has some proper source explaining the intended end results (as opposed to the licence itself which only describes the means). You don't want a judge who knows nothing about computing trying to *guess* what you're trying to achieve, surely? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM license change: A license to kill? -> How to make a nightmare come true!
On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 9:28 PM, Nop wrote: > Pay attention to what? There was no attempt to inform a wider number of > people. That is exactly the point. I have been around for 6 months, I am > subscribed to talk and talk-de and until two weeks ago I was completely > unaware that there was a planned change of licence at all. And then it > was not some official information but mentioned in a private discussion. Out of curiosity, what would have been better? The licence has been recognised to be a problem for years, it was known well before I joined. It's been discussed at almost every OSM meeting I've been at. But you're right, we didn't plaster a huge banner on the front page advertising it because frankly that would be pointless. How many people knew wikipedia had a licence problem before they changed? I thought there was a message added while creating an account along the line of "the data is under CC-BY-SA but may be changed at some later date". hmm, looks like that never happened, oh well. I'm just wondering what kind of notification would have been appropriate for you. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Fwd: It's all too fast...
On Tue, Mar 3, 2009 at 11:08 PM, Peter Miller wrote: > -- Forwarded message -- > From: Peter Miller > Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 22:04:57 + > Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] It's all too fast... > To: Frederik Ramm > > Even now we are getting no explanations from the foundation to our > questions. Either this is because they dont know or it is because they > dont think they need to contribute. I understand that most directors > have not been in the loop so cant contribute. I really don't want to get into a long discussion about the licence, but what I'm really missing is a rationale document, going through each paragraph explaining why it says what it says. Because there are things in there that I don't understand why they're there. As an aside, Can we get something into the user accounts that allows people to tick a box saying they agree to some kind of licence change. ISTM the easiest way to finish the discussion about deleted data is to get some actual figures as to how much of a problem it is. If it turns out 99.8% of people agree then the question becomes moot. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] License plan
On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 5:20 PM, Russ Nelson wrote: > I think that the reason that the US only protects creativity and not facts > is because the US doesn't want to give out a monopoly on a set of facts > about the world. I'm unfamiliar with how "sweat-of-the-brow" works. Does > it actually give a monopoly on a listing of facts? For example, in the US, > you could make a listing of every postcode, and your only claim to > copyrightability would be any judgement your exercised on which postcodes > you listed and which you chose to not list. It seems like in the UK, you > could do the same thing and have a copyright on it -- but another person > could exercize the same brow-sweating and claim a copyright on EXACTLY the > same facts. Which then brings up the interesting possibility of a third > party infringing two copyrights. Whether you infringe on copyright depends on where you copied it from. If you copied from both datasets then quite possibly you infringe both. If you don't copy form someone else then there's no problem. It's the means that matter, not the results. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Maritme borders
boundary=maritime? They are not political boundaries in the way countries are, since you can't actually physically mark them in any useful way. It's more like, "in this area we consider you subject to our laws". Whether anyone cares is quite another issue. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Tiny island coastline errors
On Tue, Nov 25, 2008 at 6:19 AM, Cartinus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > A while ago (last spring?) the coastline error checker displayed an error for > the coastlines of very small islands where there was actually nothing wrong > with the coastline. I thought this bug in the coastline error checker was > fixed then, because the Great Lakes area has once been completely error free. > But now the same error is back: > > <http://tile.openstreetmap.nl/coastlines.html?zoom=16&lat=41.74778&lon=-83.43057&layers=0B0T> Not sure if it was exactly this problem, but it is due to the size. I don't know if the word "island" is appropriate, more likely a large rock :) Did someone actually get on to the thing to measure it? It's certainly way smaller that you can accurately measure with a GPS device. I'm looking for the cause. The bit of code I thought it would be doesn't appear to be it after all. Does it actually make sense to tag such things as coastline anyway? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Make Messaging public, or other changes?
On Sun, Nov 23, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > I'd like to ask for a quick show of hands on the idea of making the > whole built-in OSM messaging system public (not retroactively of course, > but change it so that anyone can ready any message written in the future). > > I am not sure whether this is a good idea myself, that's why I ask. The > rationale behind this is the following: We suspect that there is quite a > bit of "new user intimidation" going on here in Germany, where people > sometimes almost obsessively "protect" their area against changes and > might, sometimes rather impolitely, challenge newcomers. A halfway option? Show that user X sent a message to user Y but don't reveal the content? It would at least give you some kind of handle on it, if it's a problem. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wanted: Osm2pgsql.exe developer
On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 12:06 PM, Rahkonen Jukka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Some findings: > - Old program gave positive OSM_IDs for features created from relations while > the new seems to give them negative values. Obviously the code has been > changed in between. I guess and hope that this change makes OSM_ID as unique > identifier so it can be used as a primary key in the imported PostGIS tables. > Until now I have been forced to create a new OID field for primary key. Nope, because some OSM features translate to more than one postgis feature and so they get the same OSM id. > - There are some features that are not imported at all by the new version. At > least areas with tag shop=supermarket and no other tags except name (way > 4881398). It does not appear on Mapnik map either, so the program works for > me in the similar way than in Mapnik slippy map production. Is the shop tag mentioned in the style config? > For me it looks like it is safe to use the new osm2pgsql.exe, but only in > slim mode. Non-slim mode is basically fine as long as you don't need anything with relations, otherwise... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Why is JOSM upload so slow?
On Sat, Nov 15, 2008 at 9:49 AM, Keith Ng <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I am currently uploading fixed coastline from JOSM and I notice that the > upload is excruciatingly slow. The maximum speech achievable is around > 1.5KB/s and the average speed is around 800 byles/s. > > I am uploading data from Melbourne, Australia. There's nothing wrong with my > Internet. My maximum upload bandwidth is 256KB/s. Yet, JOSM notifies me that > my current upload will take around 95 minutes. The problem is not speed, it's latency. I'm not sure what your ping time is to the server (I'm guessing near 350ms), but remember that any single update done by JOSM will take at least a whole HTTP request to do which is at least 4*RTT so maybe 1.5 seconds. Multiply by number of objects... The 0.6 API wil have a bulk upload stream which can significantly reduce the overhead. Another possibility is do a Save in JOSM and you bulk_upload from a machine closer to the server. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wanted: Osm2pgsql.exe developer
On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 3:03 PM, Rahkonen Jukka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Conclusion: Jon's osm2pgsql.exe works, but something in the system is perhaps > too sensible for OSM data errors. If error is something Windows related > could be verified if somebody who has osm2pgsql on a Linux box could have a > try with Finnish data from Geofabrik > (http://download.geofabrik.de/osm/europe/finland.osm.bz2 > <http://download.geofabrik.de/osm/europe/finland.osm.bz2> )? It takes about > five minutes to run. Just tried it here and it works fine (Linux). Mist be something windows specific. Maybe someone put in an asserts build or something? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wanted: Osm2pgsql.exe developer
On Thu, Nov 13, 2008 at 7:24 AM, Jukka Rahkonen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I made a quick test with the program and yesterdays Finland.osm.bz2 from > Geofabrik.de. Program starts OK and reading in data is perhaps faster than > with > the older osm2pgsql.exe. However, import was not successful because of some > error in the data. Message is this: > > terminate called after throwing an instance of 'geos::util::TopologyException' > what(): TopologyException: found non-noded intersection between 2.68304e+006 > 8.95213e+006, 2.68415e+006 8.95259e+006 and 2.68415e+006 8.95259e+006, > 2.68391e+ > 006 8.95307e+006 2.68415e+006 8.95259e+006 That's, uh, wierd. Never seen that message before. We do use geos but I didn't think we did anything to trigger this... There's no other helpful information? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Wanted: Osm2pgsql.exe developer
On Tue, Nov 11, 2008 at 9:54 AM, Jukka Rahkonen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would like to make clear that I do not demand any special services for the > Windows users. I understand that this project is running on Linux and that > osm2pgsql is done for Mapnik rendering and it is not meant to be used as a > general OSM data conversion tool. For that purpose having an ogr2ogr driver > would be a better solution. Osm2pgsql.exe is just damn fast in importing OSM > data into PostGIS in Windows environment and therefore I am, if not so very > willing, but anyway ready to pay for the kind developer who would add those > two > missing features. I have in the past asked for anyone who got osm2pgsql to compile under windows to send the patches needed to make it work. However, there seems to be a lack of windows developers out there :( It's quite probable that over time some gcc specific features have snuck in, but I can't tell what will work on windows. There has to be someone out there which a windows devel environment would can spend an afternoon fixing any issues Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] barrier=gate
On Sun, Nov 9, 2008 at 1:32 PM, Gerald A <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Renderers should be following the project. If the community decides one tag > over the other, or both, or even neither, the renders will catch up > eventually. Or we should allow tagging for renderers, which I would be > against. The discussions about tags should focus on the merits of the data, > not outside factors. Two problems with your argument: 1. "The community" as no coherent opinion. On any issue you're going to get significant chunks of the "community" taking opposite sides. 2. The renderers are part of the community too. Also, we are beginning to reach the point where renderers are not the only output. There are people out there tagging because they want routing program to produce better output. There tags rarely appear on renderers but are equally important. "Merits of data" discussions tend to get bogged down by the fact that every gate in the world is unique and no amount of tagging will change that. So we focus on practical issues of getting maximum information for minimum tagging which is a much easier goal. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik rendering of paths + place=locality in general
On Wed, Nov 5, 2008 at 8:47 PM, sylvain letuffe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yeah, I know there are strong oppositions on this list to that way of doing, > some guys that "have the power" by the fact they own the renderer might be > unappy of changes they have to do on their styles and software and I > completly understand them Yeah, we have soo much power. We actively prevent people from learning how to change things. Not. Come on. There is no "the renderer", you can set up your own if you like. Anyone can. You just need to realise that putting something on a wiki page doesn't obligate anybody to support it. And forget just the renderers, there are dozens of programs that have lists of supported tags. Next you'll be complaining that certain tags are not supported by routing programs... Supporting a new tag has a significant cost and I don't think anyone is in a position to force someone to support it anywhere. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Lake rendering
On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 3:36 PM, Sven Rautenberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What if the "inner" way marks something other than "nothing"? Simply tag > it as such. This works great, too. Example: Lake with wood island. > > What if this "inner" way has holes by itself? Example: Wood with lake > inside, which has an island with wood. > > You can tag the wood as "outer", tagging the way of the lake as "inner", > which renders fine. The lake too is a "outer", with the island as an > "inner" way. With two seperate relations I presume, one for the wood, one for the lake. Offhand I think osm2pgsql should get this right in slim mode (non-slim has its own problems). Do you have an example? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] A super quick poll
On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 10:09 AM, OJ W <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Nov 3, 2008 at 7:59 AM, Joseph Gentle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> The public domain will benefit OSM. > > What incentive would anyone have to add datasets to OSM if it were PD? > Surely it would be easier and less risky for them to keep their own > work in a separate database and combine it with OSM later so they get > a better map than everyone else, hence competitive advantage. Why > would they bother to share their work unnecessarily? This suggests that merging two datasets is low cost, which I think we know from experience simply isn't true. The situation you suggest isn't feasable simple because combining data privately isn't cost-effective in any way. OSM will win because it's got a community that contributes and fixes stuff, not because we have a viral licence. OSM would simply outdevelop any competitor, even if it was under PD. Oops, this discussion shouldn't be here, sorry :) Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql & planet: frustrations, cutoffs, and idempotence
On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Now that I think about it though, I think what I did was take one of >> the planet dumps from http://hypercube.telascience.org/planet/ (which >> *are* consistant snapshots), and run the dailies from there. > > Is there any reason to not use those? They seem to be more frequent > than the planet.openstreetmap.org ones - is there some disadvantage? > How are they created? Umm, they are created by taking the planet dumps and applying the daily diffs every day. They are used to produce consistant snapshots of for example, NL and by the coastline checker (which really likes having consistant snapshots to work with). Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql & planet: frustrations, cutoffs, and idempotence
On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 9:39 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm liking Jochen Topf's suggestion here: > >"If the planet dump plus the diff from the same day is what everybody > wants anyway, why not do this on the server side and hold the planet > back after the first diff is available, run this over the planet and > then publish that as the planet?" 1. Because there are plenty of uses for the planet dump that don't need consistant snapshots. 2. Because such consistant snapshots have been available elsewhere for quite a while now and people who need them can get them. There's no particular reason why it has to be on the same site as the normal planet dumps. > Probably what I need to do is get a fresh update of osm2pgsql. I can > see now that the revision I'm using is older than #10464, where some > inconsistency resilience was added. Umm, yeah. I was ofcourse assuming you were running the latest version, otherwise anything is possible, The creates-as-modifies fix was done two months ago. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql & planet: frustrations, cutoffs, and idempotence
On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 1:10 AM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The final event in each weekly planet dump does not fall on an even > day boundary. In the case of the most recent Oct. 22nd planet.osm, it > was necessary to experiment with hourly diffs from that day to find > that the boundary was approx. 2:00pm. Hourlies up to and including > 2008102213-2008102214.osc.gz failed, hourlies after that succeeded. I > could go more granular here, checking the minute diffs as well for a > more precise breakpoint, but it seems odd that the planet dump does > not break cleanly on a midnight boundary so that it's possible to pick > up the differences moving forward. As I recall, osm2pgsql did support this kind of operation (or at least it did last time I tried, it was discussed on the list). All creates in diffs are treated as delete+insert. You don't actually say what the error was you ran into though so I can't be sure if you're talking about the same problem. Now that I think about it though, I think what I did was take one of the planet dumps from http://hypercube.telascience.org/planet/ (which *are* consistant snapshots), and run the dailies from there. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] New Mapnik Style
On the whole I prefer no casing, it does mean the actual road colours need to be stronger to avoid the washed out look.. Have a nice day, On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 6:49 PM, Chris Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Patrick Weber wrote: >> Hi >> >> Just noticed that the Wednesday Mapnik update has introduced a >> considerable change in cartography style. Seems like lots of changes >> have been applied, which has considerably changed the look of the >> Mapnik Layer. I wondered if there is a summary of changes explained >> somewhere, and even maybe some of the motivations for those changes? >> >> I really like some of the new POI icons, which seem to be more >> consistent now. >> >> I am not so shure about the rendering of roads (primary,secondary) at >> Zoom layers 10-11-12. Overall, the contrast of map features seems >> reduced to me. While this can be a good thing if you want to overlay >> other layers of information, on its own, I think it makes it less easy >> on the eye in terms of making out features and so on. >> >> Anyone else feels like that? > I agree that some of the roads look washed-out. I think part of the > problem is that there doesn't seem to be a casing any more for trunk, > primary and secondary. I do like the icons. > > Cheers, Chris > > _______________ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Greenland coastline looks good
Looking at the coastline checker it looks like greenland is looking good. I think that's the last major landmass. Very nice. Eurasia is looking a bit sick, nothing a little bit of editting won't fix. http://tile.openstreetmap.nl/coastlines.html Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Code of conduct for automated (mass-) edits
On Mon, Sep 29, 2008 at 1:48 PM, Hugh Barnes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> No, because the user agent is not recorded as part of the edits. Nor is >> it planned to record it as a property of the changeset in API 0.6. > > Right, that's surprising, it's a pretty handy thing. I was about to ask how > you know the editor in the history, but the penny's dropped that you actually > use a tag to record it. I guess that's a legacy of editors existing outside > of the API. Well, when I was at the hackathon it was certainly intended to include the user agent in the changeset. As a replacement for the created_by tag. JOSM in API 0.6 will include it's version number in the changeset for example. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline error checker not working?
On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 8:36 AM, Gustav Foseid <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Neither the 'coastline' base layer or the 'coastline errors' overlay >> seem to be showing any tiles. > > Anyone know the status of the coastline error checker? I was going to clean > up some coastlines this week, but is a bit hesitant to start messing around > with the coastlines without somewhere to check for errors. Well, thanks for mentioning there was a problem. Turns out that hypercube is having difficulties and that OAM is using all the database connections so tilecache is broken. And a network drive is unreachable. Not sure what can be done about that in the short term. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql password for non-interactive use
On Tue, Sep 16, 2008 at 9:57 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > It appears that osm2pgsql (SVN version 0.55-20080901) does not have a > way to specify the db password on the command line. Is this true? > > It'd be nice to be able to run it without needing to babysit the > password prompt at the beginning. Can this be added a flag? I suggest you setup a pgpass file so you don't have to give a password. Or just setup ident auth, which solves the problem entirely. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql.exe for win32/windows| found !
On Fri, Sep 12, 2008 at 5:04 PM, Jukka Rahkonen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Keep in mind that [the windows version of] osm2pgsql has not been updated > since February 2008 and it > lacks some new features which exist in Linux version. For example you cannot > select the PostGIS user name not connect to any remote PostGIS server, and you > cannot select which tags will be transferred. Indeed. It is known the version is SVN doesn't work with Windows, but no-one with a windows machine has spent the time working out why. Artem got it to work, but never posted the relevent patches anywhere. There's no particular reason why windows isn't support, just no-one has taken the effort. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Need help!
I'm not the person to ask, so I've forwarded to the list to see if someone can help. On Wed, Sep 10, 2008 at 9:06 AM, Kostik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Greetings! > I`m OSMer from Russia. Checking yesterday's changes, I have noticed, that all > my work has been spoiled by user Dmitry Olyenyov. And not only mine. For last > two days this user has made "Simplify way" in huge territory almost on half > of Russia. Therefore a question: whether it is possible to roll away all > changes made by this user for these two days? > > Thankful in advance for the help in this question. > -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline?
On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 7:47 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> It's not immediately obvious from the wiki. Could those shapefiles be >>> available via the planet directory? >> >> Which planet directory, on which server? > > Is this not officially sanctioned in some way? >http://planet.openstreetmap.org/ What's officially sanctioned? Who would officially sanction it? This is an open project. Stuff get hosted wherever it needs to be ususally. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline?
On Sat, Sep 6, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Thanks, > > Is this the main site? >http://hypercube.telascience.org/~kleptog/ That's the spot. > It's not immediately obvious from the wiki. Could those shapefiles be > available via the planet directory? Which planet directory, on which server? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline?
The coastline checker as a side effect produces the shapefiles for mapnik. The reason is that the coastline in the database isn't a geometry, but a collection of ways. The checker joins all the segments into several million node linestrings and then chops it into peices again and makes shapes mapnik can render. It's possible the main site hasn't updated the shape in a while, so if you've added stuff recently and it isn't appearing you might need to prod someone. Have a nice day, On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 3:12 AM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > I'm trying to understand how OSM generates coastlines in Mapnik, to > render my own tiles. > > I'm reading this: >http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Coastline#Main_Mapnik_Layer > > It sounds as though there should be some presence of natural=coastline > in the osm.xml stylesheet: > > http://trac.openstreetmap.org/browser/applications/rendering/mapnik/osm.xml > > Instead, I see shapefiles. Are those derived from data in pgsql, or > are they obtained from elsewhere? Why are they shapefiles instead of > geometries from the database? > > -mike. > > > michal migurski- [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 415.558.1610 > > > > > ___________ > talk mailing list > talk@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk > -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Bug in using osm2pgsql to keep up with dailies
Did you see the patch posted a few days ago about making creates into modifies?
Otherwise I'll just commit it to SVN.
Have a nice day,
On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 7:00 PM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I'm revisiting the planet.osm stuff this week, from below.
>
> If the planet.osm file is from 2008-08-27, do I start running daily
> diffs at 20080827-20080828 or 20080828-20080829?
>
> I would assume the former, but I get duplicate key errors when I try:
>
>"ERROR: duplicate key value violates unique constraint
> "osm_bayarea_ways_pkey"
>(7)
>Arguments were: 26580292, {26469086,11080906,165095606,11080816},
> {"ref","A232","highway","trunk","name","Croydon Road"}, f,
>Error occurred, cleaning up"
>
> Am I correct to go in this order?
>
>create planet-080827.osm.bz2
>ignore 20080827-20080828.osc.gz
>append 20080828-20080829.osc.gz
>append 20080829-20080830.osc.gz
>etc.
>
> -mike.
>
> On Aug 12, 2008, at 12:30 PM, Jon Burgess wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 2008-08-10 at 18:45 -0700, Michal Migurski wrote:
>>>>> So I'm definitely doing the bbox thing - I ran out of space on the
>>>>> volume when doing a slim import of planet.osm with a box that
>>>>> covered
>>>>> only the extended SF Bay Area. Seems like that should be fairly
>>>>> reasonable, right?
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the slim mode is not taking the bounding box into account.
>>>> I'll take a look.
>>>
>>> Any news?
>>>
>>
>> The news is mixed. The slim mode code does correctly exclude nodes
>> outside of the bounding box when reading them in from the file.
>> Unfortunately all the ways and relations still make it to the
>> intermediate tables. It isn't until the code tries to extract the
>> geometries from the ways that it can discover if the nodes for the way
>> are outside the bounding box.
>>
>> It may be possible to improve this but it would need to make the
>> assumption that all the nodes are in the file. I don't have time to
>> look
>> at this right now though.
>
>
>
>
>
> michal migurski- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 415.558.1610
>
>
>
>
> ___
> talk mailing list
> talk@openstreetmap.org
> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>
--
Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/
___
talk mailing list
talk@openstreetmap.org
http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Connecting ferry routes to roads?
On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 4:29 PM, Dan Karran <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I fixed up the Isle of Man Steam Packet ferry route so that it goes > all the way into Douglas harbour in the Isle of Man again. While I was > at it, I connected it up with the road network so that routing > programmes could route traffic through it as well. Is this common > practice, and is there a standard way of linking them in? I've just > linked the route to a service road which is connected to the rest of > the road network. The imported AND data had this also, we mapped it to highway=virtual, for lack of a better tag at the time... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline not updated on the cycle map ?
On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Dave Stubbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> I understand that you have shapes for the sea rather than land? Do you >> postprocess the existing data or did you change the code? > > Just changed the osm2coast program to reverse all the ways, and insert > a global bbox. Then I just stick that file through closeshp. The > result is that closeshp still thinks it's making land polygons (so no > logic changes needed), but its actually producing sea. Brilliant. Easy enough to make it an option at runtime May do that at some point. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline not updated on the cycle map ?
On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 2:07 PM, Dave Stubbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yep, eventually. > We have to run the coastline building script ourselves due to some > changes to make the hillshading work. I understand that you have shapes for the sea rather than land? Do you postprocess the existing data or did you change the code? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Coastline checker / NL-tileserver / planet extracts not updated
On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 7:41 PM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > If this helps anybody, a manually repaired version of the broken daily diff > is here: > > http://www.remote.org/frederik/tmp/20080828-20080829.osc.gz Yes, that did help. Thanks. Everything should catch up some time today. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Coastline checker / NL-tileserver / planet extracts not updated
To avoid getting too many question: due to the recently discovered UTF-8 problems in the daily diffs, the daily planet dumps on hypercube won't be updated for a while. As a consequence the NL tile server and the coastline checker won't update either. It will start working after the next planet dump wednesday (assuming it dumps properly) or when the daily diff is fixed, whichever comes first. Have a nice day -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik handling of highways that are also landuse...
On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 8:47 PM, Jon Burgess <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> FWIW, I've been planning to implement just that at some point, just >> havn't gotten around to it yet. The biggest problem is that the style >> file needs to contain information like "tag X applies only to >> nodes/ways/areas" and this information simply does not exist. >> Collecting this information is a project in itself. > > I did something similar to put the features into multiple tables but I > didn't do any tag filtering. The tag filtering was not important at one > time because there were no common rendering styles shared between linear > and area features. Now some combinations like > highway=pedestrian,area=yes make things things more complicated. In case anybody is wondering, if you know tag X does not apply to nodes ever, osm2pgsql supports that now. For the distinction between lines and polygons there is an attempt but it doesn't quite work right. What I want to do extend it to is that highway=traffic_signals is only for nodes and highway=pedestrian only for ways. > My personal opinion is that features like a road around an area should > use different ways. When mapping features myself I don't even share the > nodes. I find it much clearer to leave a small gap between the area and > surrounding ways. For stuff like name which can be applied to anything it will always get copied to all objects. Being able to have multiple features out of a single OSM object isn't ever going to be easy. But we can do things much better than now... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik handling of highways that are also landuse...
On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 1:14 PM, Dave Stubbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, technically, there are ways of handling this case (the way would > need duplicating on import, with some clever tag stripping). But they > aren't pretty, or I think, desirable. FWIW, I've been planning to implement just that at some point, just havn't gotten around to it yet. The biggest problem is that the style file needs to contain information like "tag X applies only to nodes/ways/areas" and this information simply does not exist. Collecting this information is a project in itself. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Why OpenStreetMap is not Wikipedia
On Sat, Aug 2, 2008 at 8:45 PM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > >> For the last few months I've been wondering if OSM isn't more of a >> software project than a database. > > An interesting aspect. What I actually find interesting is that OSM as a project has subsequently lead to develeopment spurts in related projects, like Mapnik, OpenLayers, Marble (to greater or lesser extent) and all sorts of routing and mapping programs written from scratch. Mobile applications are also starting to appear. So to me it seems the dataset is a catalyst for a huge about of programming work. Basically, open-source GIS is waking up due to the availability of the dataset Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Using osm2pgsql to keep up with dailies?
On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 2:24 AM, Michal Migurski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I just did my first successful import of planet.osm using osm2pgsql. > Excellent. > > Now I have a bunch of daily and hourly diffs I'd like to use to keep > the DB up to date, but osm2pgsql doesn't seem to understand the > and elements. Which version is this? > What to do? Periodic downloads of planet aren't going to work for what > I'd like to use it for. I'm using the Debian Lenny package, not sure > exactly of the version. Well, we need to know the version because it's a fairly recent feature. You did use --slim and -a, right? Note that tests so far have shown that its not very fast at applying diffs. There's probably a lot of room for improvement but I wrote the code and havn't been able to load up the whole DB myself, so I'm completely unsure about where the speed is going. If you can try it on a minute diff first that would be nice, then at least we have an idea how much time it will take... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] House numbers... One more suggestion
On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 7:12 PM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I find that very confusing. > > I'm using the "Karlsruhe Schema" > http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Proposed_features/House_numbers Ok, I've looked at this and I'm missing the case where a building has a number of street numbers attached to it. An example: for most of the street there'd be just houses with numbers, the easy case: they'd be 1-31 (odd). Then there'd be a block of flats with say: 33-279 (odd), followed by some more houses: 281-299 (odd). I suppose you could cover the building with linear features to approximate the individual apartments, but I suppose the suggestion would be a simple linear between the road and the building with just the start and end number, right? Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] The return of the coastline checker
On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 2:34 AM, Rob Reid <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Has it stopped again, status shows last update was the 18th. Hmm, yes. It has been disabled due to excessive memory usage. The process of converting OSM ways into shapes took up too much memory on hypercube... I thought I could fix it to use a lot less memory but I was wrong and I havn't had any real bright ideas yet... Nor a lot of time either. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] suggestion for SOTM09
On Wed, Jul 16, 2008 at 10:15 PM, D Tucny <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > How about Hong Kong? Somewhat further east and I'm sure you could get there > almost entirely by train if you really really wanted... Does it really have > to be Europe? Well, can you go by ICE to Hong Kong? The nice thing about the ICE is they have power sockets for laptops :) Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] The return of the coastline checker
After a hiatus of two weeks (during which time no-one apparently noticed it wasn't working) the coastline checker is updated again. North america is actually looking pretty good these days. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] suggestion for SOTM09
On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 3:08 PM, Richard Fairhurst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Being a bit of a tree-hugger at heart, I'd prefer somewhere in > mainland Europe easily accessible by train. I'd vote for somewhere in south germany, say, in the area of Weissenburg. But that's just me looking for an excuse to go there, the scenery is beautiful And because I think the SOTM needs to be a lot further east than it has been so far. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Misclassified roads
On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 10:43 AM, Steve Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Thu, 10 Jul 2008, Martijn van Oosterhout wrote: > >> I don't want to be annoying, but what about the ordinary roads, which >> don't fit in the above classification. With houses on both side but >> limited to 50km/h for example. > > Well, this is why I don't like the highway=residential tag. Agreed, highway=residential was never very well thought out and it rendered even worse. >> Inside housing estates sounds like >> living_street me. Maybe the word 'estate' means something else in the >> UK than I think. > > The definition of living_street is a bit vague in the wiki. A relevant bit > seems to be: > "Simply tagging them with something like highway=residential, max_speed=7, > motorcar=yes, motorcycle=yes, bicycle=yes" Oh, I never looked at the wiki, I use it to mark roads with the appropriate sign in NL (and no, the speed limit isn't 7, I've never seen that anywhere). > I don't know enough about the road systems in other countries to comment - > from your description, it sounds like maybe you have living streets (very > low speed limit) rather than residential roads (20-30mph speed limits). As I > said, I really don't like the residential tag (although I do use it in order > to be consistent with the rest of the map). For roads with speed limits > over 30mph I don't tag them with highway=residential, even if they have > houses along them. We don't have anything with very low speed limits, not even living_streets. But from the your description here, what do you tag roads that are 30mph and don't have a centre line? i.e. the single most common type here. > As I've said before, I have no intention of changing any areas I'm not > involved with - I'm just bringing a problem to the attention of everyone > else since I suspect that Swansea isn't the only place affected. Ok, as long as you change nothing in NL I don't really mind one way or the other :) >- they are wrong according to the > definitions in the wiki - things like 50mph 2 lane dual carriageways are > _not_ unclassified roads by any stretch of the imagination. Agreed. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Misclassified roads
On Thu, Jul 10, 2008 at 11:20 AM, Steve Hill <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Unclassified: > Narrower than a tertiary, usually without a dotted line along the middle > and usually with a relatively high speed limit (although you might not want > to drive anywhere near that speed :) > > Residential: > Roads in housing estates - they probably look like tertiary roads, but have > houses along them (I actually don't like this classification and think they > would be better tagged as highway=tertiary and abutters=residential) I don't want to be annoying, but what about the ordinary roads, which don't fit in the above classification. With houses on both side but limited to 50km/h for example. Inside housing estates sounds like living_street me. Maybe the word 'estate' means something else in the UK than I think. The problem is that "unclassified" actually means something specfic in the UK and is totally meaningless elsewhere. So we denoted something in the hierarchy of roads here to map to unclassified and FTLOG don't go changing them all because you think they're wrong according to some classification you came up with on your own. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] SOTM weekend accommodation?
On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 8:54 AM, Renaud Martinet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Probably any European ID proving your nationality would do but better > to check. Usually they give advice when you book the flight. AIUI within the EU you only need to carry *some* kind of (probably official looking) photo identification, it doesn't have to be a passport (though that has the advantage of being recognised everywhere in the world). Between schengen countries you're not required to show it at the border. If you arrive at a londen airport it even says that ID cards are acceptable for EU citizens. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] pronunciation tag
On Tue, Jun 24, 2008 at 3:28 AM, SteveC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > One of the badly pronounced streets in San Francisco is Divisadero. > So, I propose that we do something like > > pronounce=deevisadeero > > or something similar readable by humans and flying computers that talk. No doubt you'll need a pronouce tag for every name tag there is on the node, to cater for things like Wenen/Wien/Vienna. And Den Haag/'s Gravenhage/The Hague. SAMPA is useless by being english specific and X-SAMPA is just an ASCII translateration for IPA, so we may as well go for IPA. This is a good candidate for a JOSM plugin, I think :) Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Create extra Planet files for syncing (was: Bad coastline)
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 10:44 AM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Would it be possible to issue "extra" planet dumps after events that disrupt > the diff chain, like we had last week? So that those who rely on diffs for a > current version of the data have a clean start to work on, without having to > wait for the next regular planet? It would be sufficient just to regenerate the diff. The diffs are generated by specifying a time interval someone could generate a diff for one day last week without any problems. > What does OSMXAPI do in cases like these? It uses the minutely diffs, not sure if they were similarly affected. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Bad coastline
On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 12:46 AM, Matthias Urlichs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello, > > I've just noticed that the island of Gran Canaria (N28.0, W15.5) > doesn't seem to have a coast line in the Mapnik maps, the island is > under water, just like Atlantis. :-P (Osmarender shows it correctly.) > > What gives? The coastline error checker doesn't see it either. If it isn't in the database, perhaps you can upload it? The coastline checker won't see anything after the 19th because the daily diff for that day is missing. Either the diff will appear or it will resync on the next planet dump. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] AND China data
On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 5:16 AM, D Tucny <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi Kleptog, > > There was some useful data in the AND dataset for China, so, I'm hoping we > can push forward and get some of it used... As you did most of the work on > processing the India and China data, I'm coming back to you for help :) Did I not send you the link for the data? Or send it to you? Hmm, I can't find it myself now either so I'll have to dig it up. I'll try to do it tomorrow after my exam. Bug me again thursday if you havn't got a response by then... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Tilecache Memory Error (Myanmar Cyclone Relief)
On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 8:20 AM, Brett Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I suspect I didn't with tilecache (not sure if it's possible), but I do > now with mod_tile. It's definitly possible, otherwise it would swiftly go awol like you saw. The config file has quite a few comments, i'm surprised you missed it. Have a nce day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik & large rievrs
On Wed, Jun 11, 2008 at 3:58 PM, Andy Allan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The more complex case, which I'm surprised hasn't been discussed at > any point in this feature's development, is how I render a river with > a polygon fill and a polyline riverbank (e.g. a dark blue line down > each riverbank). As far as I see it osm2pgsql will have to do some > complex pre-processing to make sure that the sections of riverbank > which span the river (i.e. aren't actually river banks) don't get > rendered when rendering an outline of the river. If it ever gets decided to do riverbanks as just polylines instead of complete polygons, the main effect will be that the processing will be pushed out-of-line just like the coastlines are now. We'll have to generate seperate riverbank shapefiles for all the riverbanks which with then have to be processed seperately in the stylesheet. We support the usage of polylines for coastlines because we pretty much have to. But PFTLOG don't do go suggesting polylines-for-areas for everything just because it would be nice, because it really just isn't nice at all... polylines-joined-by-a-relation is cool, no problems there. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Tilecache Memory Error (Myanmar Cyclone Relief)
A bit late and maybe a stupid question but: do you have metatiling turned on. Rendering is going to really suck without it. On Mon, Jun 9, 2008 at 8:08 AM, Brett Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > My tilecache.cfg file contains the following entry (I assume I should > re-enable tms_type but have been playing with different settings): > [osm] > type=Mapnik > mapfile=/home/tilecache/mapnik/osm.xml > spherical_mercator=true > #tms_type=google That significantly reduces the number if tiles it tries to render smultaneously Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Nested areas
On Thu, Jun 5, 2008 at 2:07 PM, Dave Stubbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Layer tags on areas are pure evil. The layer tag is there to indicate > vertical separation, not to give a handy z-order hint to the renderer. > So unless you do genuinely have two areas which are physically > suspended one on top of the other then please don't add layer tags! > Thankfully the mapnik maps will just ignore them. Not entirely. On the NL list we had a building overlapping a water area and mapnik was drawing them in the wrong order. Due to the shapes, the building covered more area. Perhaps longterm we should change the styles to always draw buildings over waterways, but for now a layer tags fixes it nicely. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 11:52 PM, Cartinus <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > For another less obvious example closer to Martijn van Oosterhout: > A Dutch "waterschap" is an administrative level that resorts directly below > the national government. Several of them straddle provincial boundaries. In > the Netherlands this problem is solved on most maps by just ignoring > the "waterschap" boundaries, because most people ignore the "waterschappen" > anyway. There is however no reason not to put them in the openstreetmap > database (if we can get the data). Most people ignore them because they are irrevelent to most people. They make no laws, have no jurisdiction. In that sense they're more like postcode boundaries: a fairly arbitrary division of area for the purposes of optimising some process. Another example would be the area covered by a power substation or gas distribution node. These are well-defined areas, but not interesting to people directly. That isn't to say these boundaries shouldn't be in OSM. It would be interesting to have the local zones associated with schools in AU, for example. I'm just not sure admin_level is the right tag for this. But then, I don't have any other suggestion for tags either. I was kinda assuming that admin_level would only be for legal administrative boundaries, not so much any arbitrary boundary. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mulltipolygons and Mapnik
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 9:32 PM, Jon Burgess <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I believe the sites are both using very similar code (unless Kleptog has > some private changes for the NL site). I think the difference may be due > to the NL site using the "--slim" mode. In this case this is probably > allowing it to keep the untagged inner way that would have been > discarded in non-slim mode. Correct, the --slim mode makes all the difference. The basic problem is that to manage such relations it needs to remember the relevent ways for when it processes the relations. When processing a whole planet dump it obviously can't rememeber all the ways in memory, which is why non-slim mode doesn't get it. Slim mode remembers everything and so it always works. It would be possible to get non-slim mode to work also by processing relations first. As usual, needs a coder. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 11:20 PM, Lester Caine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Same applies to any of the country boundaries, do you draw high water line, or > the international demarcation out on the continental shelf. > And England and Ireland are part of Europe and the EU so do you include the > water around them or not. For country boundaries we draw them where they are. No country's border is at the high water mark. Consider this image: http://www.rijkswaterstaat.nl/geotool/ I don't know where the continental shelf is, but I bet it isn't along any of those borders. Something like the EU is merely the union of the countries within it. There are bits of the EU scattered across the globe., I would rather model that as a relation. Some 60% of the earths surface is "international waters" and belongs to no-one. Most of the time the EEZ is relevent because the continetal shelf varies dramatically in width. > The 'nesting' rule does not exist. We have already had enough examples of > where boundaries form different 'sets' of areas so there is no way to insist > that the 'admin' boundaries are mutually exclusive :( Do you have an example if such a jurisdictional anomoly? It would seem to me that such a "servant with two masters" would have some rather interesting problems. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 10:17 PM, Lester Caine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm not bothered that these levels are numbers, it is just that the CURRENT > numbers do not allow for ALL of the levels as THIS list suggests. > > I still think there is a place for continents here rather than having to > create yet another set of numbers? Africa, Asia and the rest are USED to > provide administrative type grouping just as African Union and Asian Union do. Problem is that they violate the nesting rule: countries can span multiple continents. Similarly continents are defined strictly by geographical features (where the land meets the sea) whereas country borders reach a distance into the sea, so they violate the covering idea also. I don't have any good ideas about how to do continents (and by extension the large oceans like Atlantic/Pacific/Indian/Southern/etc), but I don't think admin_level is the right place. I don't think a single country border runs along a continent border so you're not even saving space. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 3:57 PM, Andy Allan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yes, for rendering decisions like X >=5. That doesn't imply it's the > best approach for storing the data. Don't tag for renderers etc. It's not tagging for renderers. It's tagging for anything that wishes to programmatically extract administration-type data from the OSM database. > So how can one admin level be globally defined, but another one isn't? > "Within a country" is a farcial statement, since this entire > conversation has shown there is no global equivalence to the meaning > of the word "country". You don't need a passport to travel from Wales > to England, nor from Belgium to Luxembourg, and the United Arab > Emirates adds a whole new level of complexity... Easy, because "country" is one of the few things in the world there is a broad concensus over: if you can issue a passport or not is a pretty good test. Not perfect, but as long you can settle on a definition that matches the criteria I set down below then I don't particularly care. No idea about Wales vs England but travelling from Belgium to Luxembourg you most certainly need a passport or ID card. You don't need to *show* it to anybody, but that's a different issue entirely. Let me tell you how I see the boundary/admin_level data being defined: - Every point on the globe should be, for each value of admin_level, either in exactly one boundary at that level, or be outside all boundaries at all levels greater than or equal to this one. - At any single boundary level, the sets of boundaries at that level, together with the set of points outside any area cover the entire globe (there are no gaps). - admin_levels nest, so that the area covered by an admin_level=X is also covered by areas with admin_level > X With these constraints we can implement an is_in system. You can pick any point on the earths surface and find all the boundaries it is inside. Other GIS systems can do this, so why shouldn't OSM? I think the problem is that you're trying to derive other non-geographic information from this, like whether you need a passport or not. If you want that, please go invent a new set of tags because that's a completely different problem. > You miss the point entirely, I think. Each renderer would choose the > number of boundary types it wants to distinguish between, and would > have a rule for each. My point is that you're proposing creating hundreds of boundary types and then requiring every renderer to know about all the types. We don't have hundreds of highway types so we should use the same idea here: encode an approximation of the most important useful feature and use additional tags to describe the details. > not some kind of small minded kludge where someone stood up one day > and said "there can only be 10 types of border in OSM". Or do we > accept floating point values? We havn't said there can be only 10 types, we've said that we only expect there to be upto 10 levels of nesting. What the boundary means politically is completely orthoginal. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders in the British Islands
On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 11:25 AM, Andy Allan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Other words *could* be mapped into the same numbers. But since we can > see quite clearly that there are more than 10 types of administrative > boundaries in the world, and different people have different opinions > as to which are equivalent, what advantage is there in trying to > shoe-horn them into such a narrow set? And can anybody, in advance, > name every boundary type in the entire world and get the inter-nation > equivalence correct and uncontroversial? I think not. Because 99% of applications don't care the slightest how the internal subdivisions of some random country in the world compare to those in england. All renderers care about is "is boundary A more or less important than boundary B". Numbers work perfect for this and that's why they're used. There is absolutely no implication that admin_level=4 is the same everywhere. We know it isn't but we do know it's within a country, because countries are admin_level=2. Just like highway=tertiary is not the same everywhere in the world, but customised to the local situation. > I think we should store the actual boundary types, and if a user of > the data (e.g. a renderer) considers that English counties are > equivalent to US states then he can process them into both being the > same numerical value. If he considers English counties and US counties > to be equivalent, he can do so too. So the numerical equivalence table > should be on the rendering end of things, and the database should > store the actual factual data. If you are willing to maintain a mapping table for the 160+ counties in the world and maintain the megabytes of rendering rules that would be required to make it render sensebly then we can talk. Until then let us use admin_level and be done with it. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Update OSM PostGIS DB with .osc files?
On Thu, May 29, 2008 at 11:16 AM, Dave Stubbs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Not actively as far as I'm aware. > > Martijn did some work to make the osm2pgsql slim mode work which you'd > need for this; this results in tables for ways, nodes, and relations, > as well as the standard feature tables. Correct, in slim mode it now stores the actual ways and nodes. For making it parse diffs files you basically need the following steps: - Parse the actual diff itself, this shouldn't be too hard - Process the directives in the diff. This shouldn't be too hard either, you need to extend the out/mid api to have commands for modify and delete. This is also fairly straightforward, if a lot of typing. - Correctly update the output tables, this is harder. The basic idea is as follows: If a node is inserted, treat like a normal insert when bulk loading If a node is updated/deleted: - delete from points table with osm_id=this_node - Run new version through output processing (may not appear in new output if tags were removed) - Find all the ways/relations using this node and mark then processed=false For ways the system is the same. There is the additional step of handling processed=false ways, these need to have their output deleted (with matching osm_id). Relations using these need processed=false. Finally, to handle relations the same stuff needs to be repeated again, handling unprocessed relations. The whole deal about processed is because in general all the nodes of a way will be changed when a way is changed and the updates will not appear in order that they can be directly applied. Database changes are: - Indexes on the osm_id fields - Index on the nodes of a way/relations. Needs the intarray contrib module. It's not exceptionally difficult, it just needs a chunk of dedicated coding time... Hope this helps, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Import Error
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 9:11 PM, Ian Dees <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Ahh, thanks. This version of osm2pgsql was installed via apt-get. Can we get > an updated version on the multiverse servers? No idea about Ubuntu, but Debian has a much more recent version: http://packages.debian.org/sid/osm2pgsql Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik Import Error
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 9:00 PM, yellowbkpk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I'm running postgres-8.3-postgis on a Ubuntu 8.04 system. > > I finished downloading the planet.osm file yesterday and started running > osm2pgsql. When I woke up this morning, I had the following on my screen: > > osm2pgsql SVN version 0.08-20071112 $Rev: 4842 $ SVN is currently up to version 0.54 so I suggest you find a newer version. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Svalbard coastlines
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 2:37 PM, Erik Johansson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Does anyone know how to get coastlines for Svalbard > (http://openstreetmap.org/?lat=78.99&lon=14.9 ), I know three people > who are going there this summer so I was thinking of giving them a GPS > for the trip. There is one guy who is going there by sea[1] so he will > need a coastline to moor his ship. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Running_the_coastline_upload Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] simplifying mapnik layout definition
On Tue, May 27, 2008 at 7:29 PM, Robert (Jamie) Munro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here's some working code that simplifies the file: > sed "s/(\[bridge] = 'yes' or \[bridge]='true')/isBridge/g" osm.xml > > And the reverse: > sed "s/isBridge/([bridge] = 'yes' or [bridge]='true')/g" I'm thinking of teaching osm2pgsql and Mapnik about booleans at some point so that all the comparisons against yes/no/1/0/on/off/etc all get done during import. For this to work Mapnik needs to be able to handle comparing different types, I sent a patch to Jon to do this so hopefully at some point we can simplify at least that portion... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mulltipolygons and Mapnik
On Sat, May 24, 2008 at 1:01 AM, Dermot McNally <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > It's worth a try, and we'll know in a week, but I'm not so sure this > will cure the problem. Otherwise, how do you explain the island that > already was tagged the same but still didn't render on the mapnik > layer? I'm also about 90% sure that I've seen untagged islands with an > inner role in the relations showing up OK in the past. Also, when reporting these kinds of issues it's very helpful to provide the ID of the relation, because then it only takes seconds to see if its tagged properly. Don't discount the possibility of bugs in renderers Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] osm2pgsql.exe on Win32
On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 9:36 PM, S Knox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > As a follow up I managed to get Boost Build to work with simple files, but > am stuck with something so complicated as osm2pgsql. I know this is way out > of my depth, as I don't have the expertise to start playing around with > compiling files meant for Linux systems, so I would appreciate any of the > files you used to create the Windows build. By all means go and tell me to > get Linux, but I'll probably wait until I can get one of those decent Asus > Eees. If you do get the source or a patch could you pass it on? If there's some simple changes that can be made to support windows then we could just incorporate them... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Road crossings proposal - status?
On Mon, May 12, 2008 at 7:25 PM, Brian Quinion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'll have a go at implementing a local macro system in JOSM and see > how well it works then it can be extended to pull from the server if > it seems worth having. Well, JOSM already supports preset files which can be loaded over the internet automatically. I made a preset file for NL which used NL descriptions. http://kleptog.org/temp/nl-wegen.xml Not exactly sure how much simpler it could be made. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] street traits
On Fri, May 9, 2008 at 8:30 PM, Jeffrey Martin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > A name for each kind of road in a person's country could be set up as an > editor feature. I select > "mountain road 2" from my list and it fills in the number of lanes, lane > size, shoulder size, etc. > for me. Strangly enough, JOSM supports this already. > Another option might be to have some kind of bot that fills in specific data > based on country > specific highway tags. I thin you're missing something though. Just because it says highway=motorway doesn't mean it looks identical everywhere. It means what a motorway is in the country its located in. Just determine which types of roads there are (there are about 7 usually, no matter what the country) and then map those to the existing highway tags. All done. If you want to add stuff like lanes/etc go ahead, but for the basics you don't need it. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [tagging] Road crossings proposal - status?
On Tue, May 6, 2008 at 6:54 PM, Alex Mauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm not interested in tagging animal crossings. Naturally I'm not going > to try to document the intricacies of british naming conventions for > their road crossings when: I will never have occasion to use them as I > don't live or map in Britain; I am unfamiliar with names for these > specialised crossings for the same reason; I am more interested in > having something usable by the world. Heh. While in london someone tried to explain to me what was so special about all these crossing types. They have names for crossings that here in NL would "normal". A crossing with a separate light for bikes, that's like every crossing in NL. All sorts of variations. I don't think I've ever seen a crossing for horses, they just cross. Then again, they also had a sticker next to the hot water tap: "Warning: Hot water". Maybe it's related. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [Fwd: Re: Bangladesh under the water]
On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:19 AM, Neil Penman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Is there a history to the flooding of large land > masses at high zoom? > Timor and Indonesian archipelago also disappear under > water when you try > and get too close. Was this always the case? I've > added the coastline > for Timor in now so hopefully that will fix this > particular problem . > Is anyone looking at the rest of Indonesia? For a long time we used PGS directly for coastlines at highzoom. This meant we didn't have blue sea at highzoom, everything looked like land. So I wrote the coastline checker so we had a good view of what coastline was uploaded already and whether it was in good state. In short order the US, Africa, Australia and most of Asia were uploaded and fixed. Since we like to have our oceans blue we decided to switch. There was plenty of warning and plenty of encouragement, but in the end it was decided not to wait until every last island was uploaded. So no, it's only been like this for a few months. On the plus side you can fix it yourself. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] namespaces and copyright
On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 6:10 PM, elvin ibbotson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Correct! I have never actually seen one, but I'm sure they exist. However, I > can make my own spelling mistakes without their help. I hope people didn't > assume I'm doing all my mapping from the A-Z. I do actually go out there > collecting tracks with my GPS, photographing things, naming waypoints and > even remembering the odd street name. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Copyright_Easter_Eggs It's pretty straight-forward, if you are 100% sure that the road exists and the name is what it says it is then it's not such a big deal. But one thing I learned from mapping my own area: the maps you buy are *wrong* in so many places. Maybe easter eggs, maybe bugs. In either case, don't make the assumption that just because you paid money for it or that it looks like an official looking printed map that it's actually accurate. I seem to recall someone telling me that one bug per square kilometer is not an unrealistic estimate. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Vandalism in Trumpington
On Sun, Apr 27, 2008 at 6:41 PM, David Earl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Oh. I thought this had been done. So what happens if someone deletes the > whole of Cambridge? What I used to do was after uploading an area I also saved it to disk. So I had saved copies of my neighbourhood. If you noticed somebody deleted something I could just load the file into JOSM, make some dummy change and upload, viola! Not exactly nice, but it worked. Something that would be nice would be a server you could point to that had data from a week ago, that would make it much easier to revert stuff like this if it get noticed in time... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik viewer for OSM data - UI suggestions?
On Fri, Apr 25, 2008 at 1:03 PM, Nick Whitelegg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hello everyone, > > One of the OSM projects I'm hoping to work on is a Mapnik GUI renderer for > .osm files (and live API data, cached locally, and PostGIS databases), > based on the Mapnik viewer. However what would be good is to get some user > interface suggestions from people. The aim is to try and make it as easy > as possible for people to render, and print, custom Mapnik maps. One thing I notice people running into is providing an interface for users to view the contents of the data being rendered. The results of the queries for the layers, for example. QGIS has this to some extent. For extra points: the user can click on an item and see its attributes and which style/layers are associated with it. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Lakes and relations, what did I break?
On Mon, Apr 21, 2008 at 3:14 AM, Frederik Ramm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Close-areas uses a tile index to find out what to do when it > encounters a tile with *no* coastline at all (and your tiles do not > have coastline on them). The tile index may indicate either land, sea, > or "mixed". It returns "mixed" for your tiles. I am leaning towards > changing this into "land" because your tiles are, from a "the coast of > Ireland" perspective, clearly inland... any thoughts on that, Martijn > (who invented the tile index)? Yeah, it should be marked land. I find it interesting that bugs in the tile index have become quite rare recently, which would indicate we've almost converged to almost the right file. > My initial implementation of close-areas did create a blue background > only if the tile index indicated "sea". It seems that meanwhile > someone has added code to "guess" the background colour in cases where > the tile index indicates "mixed". The guessing goes like this: Yeah, the guessing rule was a bit if a hack, and IIRC you're looking at the new version :) Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] tagging and rendering highways in the USA and elsewhere
On Sat, Apr 19, 2008 at 2:43 PM, Robert (Jamie) Munro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hopefully we won't need a separate tileserver for each rendering style - > 1 server should be able to render more than one style at a time at > different URLs. I am led to believe that mod_tile cannot currently > render more than one style of tiles on a single apache installation - I > don't know what tilecache is capable of. It would be more efficient to > spread the load across multiple servers by odd/even tile numbers, or > possibly by odd/even zoom levels. Tilecache can render as many layers as you want. I'm sure mod_til could do the same with the appropriate hacking. The program is diskspace. We're already calculating hundreds of GB for the current map, doing that per country is going to be crazy, unless we are donated a petabyte storage array. Odd/even tiles is a waste, given metatiling renders an area larger than the one you're viewing anyway. Doing it per zoom level might work... > It is likely that a USA tileserver will be busy at different times from > a UK or Japan tile server, and it would be useful if they could share > the rendering loads between each at their own peak times. AIUI we're limited by I/O not CPU, so we need to look at advanced storage solutions. (And the appropriate performance improvements in mapnik). Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Too many nodes?
On Sat, Apr 19, 2008 at 2:23 PM, Brian Quinion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > IIRC, Mapnik supports bezier hinting for quite a while now, just > > no-one has gone and updated the stylesheet to use it. > > I was looking for these options the other day for a map I was doing > but came to the conclusion that they had not yet been exposed at the > stylesheet level. > > Do you have a short example of how to enable this? Interesting, Artem sent a mail in January that he was working on it and I foolishly assumed that meant he was working on it in SVN. However looking through the source it seems you are right, there's nothing there. I'll bug him to release a patch at least so we can play with it. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Too many nodes?
On Sat, Apr 19, 2008 at 1:08 PM, Ben Laenen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Well, before using it, I'd like to ask to have a way to disable the > curves as well (and I'd even prefer to see nice curves for roads > disabled by default). When roads or other features (like the water > borders in a port) have straight corners instead of curves, it gives > awkward results like extra bulges in [EMAIL PROTECTED] On mapnik you have access to the properties: it's not a global setting. So we can only bezier highway=foo things and nothing else. But if you're proposing having it off by default then I think the status quo is fine. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Too many nodes?
On Sat, Apr 19, 2008 at 1:30 AM, Ari Torhamo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I remember reading this bezier system being planned, but understood that > it wouldn't be nearly ready yet. Is it indeed ready for use, and will it > be the default method for rendering maps? Is it coming to Mapnik too? > What about other renderers? If it will be used for all rendering in the > future, that will make drawing nice curves much easier :-) IIRC, Mapnik supports bezier hinting for quite a while now, just no-one has gone and updated the stylesheet to use it. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] tagging and rendering highways in the USA and elsewhere
On Fri, Apr 18, 2008 at 9:02 PM, Tom Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I was thinking about that while I was walking home earlier. The > main question I guess is how efficient PostGIS is at answering > the question "which of these N hundred polygons is this data > in", or how efficiently we can code the equivalent in osm2pgsql. Getting osm2pgsql to do it on insert wouldn't be too hard once you have a table of polygon. Biggest problem is going to be that it's going to slow everything down a lot. However, when we get so far that osm2pgsql can process just diffs, then you only have to do it once and after that the load will be quite managable... > Indeed. I was thinking about that too, and I think it needs an > extrat level of indirection, so the existing stylesheet stays > largely as it is but instead of saying that a secondary road > is rendered as #213455 or whatever some sort of code name is > given and then that is mapped to the real colour based on the > country. Yeah, either mapnik needs to handle this (perhaps some kind of lookup table indirection), or we have a script that takes the current sheet and a list of (country code,tag,colour) and produces a much bigger file with all the changes... Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] house numbers revisited
On Thu, Apr 17, 2008 at 2:36 PM, Martijn van Exel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Pitfalls include: > > > > * what if way direction is reversed? > > * what if way is extended, merged, split? > > That will be a problem indeed. Could theoretically be solved with > strong editor support, but that does not fix the intrinsic flaw. You > never know when a script comes around that reverses direction for some > valid reason, outside the editors. Someone on talk-nl suggested using > a NSEW-based tagging scheme, but this is not unambiguous either. I say these problems are irrelevent right now. We have other tags (like oneway) which break when roads are reversed and that doesn't seem to excite anyone enough to fix it. I'd say ignore that problem, when it gets solved for other tags, it'll get solved for these also. Have a nice day, -- Martijn van Oosterhout <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://svana.org/kleptog/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
