RE: [Vo]:Why is there such as difference between Pvac(calculated) and Pvac(observed)

[Remi Cornwall]

Let’s not get ahead of ourselves. I don’t know how one can extract (and hence 
make disappear) something that is a constant. Hawking radiation is no free 
lunch.

 

From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 11 January 2019 23:44
To: Remi Cornwall
Cc: vortex-l
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Why is there such as difference between Pvac(calculated) and 
Pvac(observed)

 

 

 

On Fri, Jan 11, 2019 at 5:32 PM Remi Cornwall  wrote:

Hi

 

As part of the EMPropulsion project, I had to set about justifying why Quantum 
Field Theorists calculate a massive zero-point energy (10111J/m3) and yet 
Astronomers/Cosmologists using General Relativity measure a vacuum energy of 
only 10-9J/m3.

 

This cosmological constant problem of some 10120 is one of the biggest problems 
in physics. I think there is a way around this where rather than put the 
calculated quantum vacuum energy density directly into the stress-energy 
tensor, we introduce it as a third order perturbation.

 

I discuss it here: http://vixra.org/abs/1901.0143 

 

And this is part of a post I wrote to a fellow academic:-

 

The imbalance relates to the maximum amount of energy available in the vacuum 
compared to the efficiency of vacuum energy extraction produced by long lived 
gravity based black holes. These huge gravity based black holes are poor at 
extracting energy from the vacuum through hawking radiation. 

 

Few people understand how hawking radiation actually works with regard to 
vacuum energy extraction. The most efficient black holes are the micro black 
holes with extremely short life times. Polariton condensates produce these 
analog EMF based black holes. 

 

This is very complicated and difficult stuff due to the complications that 
general relativity imposes on the event horizon. But according to Dr. Paul M. 
Sutter, all particle and photon based hawking radiation is predetermined at the 
instant of black hole creation. This is the result of time dilation at or near 
the event horizon.

Like a scoop of ice cream with sprinkles on its surface, as the ice cream melts 
over time, the sprinkles are freed from the surface and move away from that 
surface. The time that this release happens is a function of the position of 
the sprinkles at or near the surface when the ice cream scoop first forms.

This is why small black holes radiate with much more intensity than big ones do 
since time dilation is less intense at the time of small hole formation as 
compared to large hole formation.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1JLCxoi4GI

 

Believe it or not, the  hutchison effect is a form of LENR that produces anti 
gravity on the surface of objects through the use of polarized RF. The 
polariton condensate has been shown to produce negative mass/energy. 

 



https://www.sciencealert.com/negative-mass-quasi-particle-polaritons-low-energy-lasers

 


Physicists Say They've Created a Device That Generates 'Negative Mass'


 

This effect is actually anti gravity produced by polaritons as they extract 
energy from the vacuum. . Polaritons are actually extremely short lived EMF 
analog black holes that extract energy from the vacuum through hawking 
radiation. 

 

 

 

 

The second paper was just trying to reconcile it with the cosmological vacuum 
energy that astronomers see – it’s begging the question if it’s real or not. I 
intend to engineer with some phenomena, so I have to make sure the phenomenon 
exists. I say that it is but it doesn’t go directly into the EFE where it would 
have a big effect (understatement) but as an higher order correction effect and 
the numbers come out about right. In fact, I think the 10120 gulf between what 
quantum mechanics predicts and what astronomers see should be bigger – more 
like 10129 

 

then pvac(observed) = (G/c4)3pvac(calculated) 

 

and that may indicate more degrees of freedom/extra dimensions (more harmonic 
oscillators with 1/2hf zpe) that the String Theorists have been going on about 
for years. I am bouncing this off a few people. If the ideas are correct, it 
might be a nifty result giving some credence to ST, which has been a bit of 
mathematical exercise (apart from AdS/CFT which is a bit like Gauss’ 
Law/Stoke’s Law, so largely applied maths).

 

Remi.

 

[Vo]:Why is there such as difference between Pvac(calculated) and Pvac(observed)

[Remi Cornwall]

Hi

 

As part of the EMPropulsion project, I had to set about justifying why
Quantum Field Theorists calculate a massive zero-point energy (10111J/m3)
and yet Astronomers/Cosmologists using General Relativity measure a vacuum
energy of only 10-9J/m3.

 

This cosmological constant problem of some 10120 is one of the biggest
problems in physics. I think there is a way around this where rather than
put the calculated quantum vacuum energy density directly into the
stress-energy tensor, we introduce it as a third order perturbation.

 

I discuss it here: http://vixra.org/abs/1901.0143 

 

And this is part of a post I wrote to a fellow academic:-

 

 

The second paper was just trying to reconcile it with the cosmological
vacuum energy that astronomers see - it's begging the question if it's real
or not. I intend to engineer with some phenomena, so I have to make sure the
phenomenon exists. I say that it is but it doesn't go directly into the EFE
where it would have a big effect (understatement) but as an higher order
correction effect and the numbers come out about right. In fact, I think the
10120 gulf between what quantum mechanics predicts and what astronomers see
should be bigger - more like 10129 

 

then pvac(observed) = (G/c4)3pvac(calculated) 

 

and that may indicate more degrees of freedom/extra dimensions (more
harmonic oscillators with 1/2hf zpe) that the String Theorists have been
going on about for years. I am bouncing this off a few people. If the ideas
are correct, it might be a nifty result giving some credence to ST, which
has been a bit of mathematical exercise (apart from AdS/CFT which is a bit
like Gauss' Law/Stoke's Law, so largely applied maths).

 

Remi.

 

RE: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

Thanks. Busy at the moment but I will try to take a look later.

 

From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net] 
Sent: 03 January 2019 14:20
To: Vortex-l
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

 

 

Here is a version of Wallace and son's paper on relativistic spin waves.

 

http://vixra.org/abs/1405.0015

 

One reason that it is interesting in the context of EM propulsion (with an 
applicability to LENR) and as a foundation for  anomalous thermodynamics, is 
identifying a real particle (as opposed to an imaginary particle like the 
polariton) which can interact directly with other real particles. This applies 
directly to EM propulsion, if such exists.

 

That would assume that the mystery particle can truely be physically identified 
and/or characterized as Wallace suggests. He has not done this to the 
satisfaction of most but it is tantalizing. 

 

To skeptics, the mystery particle looks like a neutrino.

 

Jones

 

 

Remi Cornwall wrote: 

 

If you say so.

 

From: Brian Ahern 

I think John Wallace's 2009 article on "longitudinal spin waves" has value here.

John identified an 'entity' with a mass a billion times lighter than an 
electron.

 

  _  

From: mix...@bigpond.com 


Take into consideration that, at the atomic level, a gyro is a collection of
charged particles, all moving in an electromagnetic sea.

I suspect that if you examine Laithwaite more closely, you may find that, as
Jones suggests, it has commonalities with your work.

RE: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

If you say so.

 

From: Brian Ahern [mailto:ahern_br...@msn.com] 
Sent: 03 January 2019 13:00
To: mix...@bigpond.com; vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

 

 I think John Wallace's 2009 article on longitudinal spin  waves mas value
here.

 

John identified an 'entity' with a mass a billion times lighter than an
electron.

 

It could act like a reactionless agent. 

 

In April 2012 and July 2013 we observed self charging of large battery
packs.

Several Megajoules of energy caused destruction of many batteries.

 

The July 2013 event was timed within hours  of a Japanese report of a Nova
explosion in our galaxie.

 

We do not know what accompanied the photons.

 

  _  

From: mix...@bigpond.com 
Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2019 4:54 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper 

 

In reply to  Remi Cornwall's message of Wed, 2 Jan 2019 16:19:58 -:
Hi Remi,
[snip]
>You need something to react against to dump the momentum to and for that
>reason gyroscopes don't work as a propulsion device. 
>
>All this L = r x p stuff and the "strange way" they behave confuses people,
>even Laithwaite. 
>
>All the best.

Take into consideration that, at the atomic level, a gyro is a collection of
charged particles, all moving in an electromagnetic sea.
I suspect that if you examine Laithwaite more closely, you may find that, as
Jones suggests, it has commonalities with your work.

>
>>>Jones Beene Wed, 02 Jan 2019 06:49:08 -0800
> Brian,
>
>Here is a download which does not demand access to you contacts list
>https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fvixra.org%
2Fabs%2F1812.0484

data=02%7C01%7C%7C8aaf5feaf61348612bdf08d670fce1bf%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb4
35%7C1%7C0%7C636820628749255145sdata=pPRuymy1LHBuID75IiDvf6
RjTrVsGGSc%2FwkJlvtcpWA%3Dreserved=0
>This basic concept - "static electromagnetic momentum", as expounded in the

>"Feynman Disk"   is interesting especially to vortex and should be fertile 
>ground for comment.
>Here is a discussion of one part of the paradox - and it reminds me of the 
>several Laithwaite videos which are on YouTube
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

RE: [Vo]:Reorganized ICCF indexes

[Remi Cornwall]

I hope all your conferences are going well and that you are managing to attract 
new blood into your field on its 30th anniversary year.

When a few fringe things come through, hopefully the taxpayer will start to 
drain the swamp on unproductive "big" science and use the funds more 
productively.

From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 02 January 2019 21:54
To: Vortex
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Reorganized ICCF indexes

Okay, I now have all ICCF proceedings indexed except ICCF-13, June 2007. I do 
not have a copy of that book. I did not attend the conference. I guess the 
proceedings are not available in electronic form.

If someone has a printed copy, and you are willing to sacrifice it, please send 
it to be destructively scanned, here:

http://1dollarscan.com/

RE: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

Nebulous. Also, atomic matter is electrical neutral, it will have a dipole
moment, quadrapole moment, so any scheme to couple with the EM field is
miniscule, compared to bulk charged matter. Furthermore, it would have to
couple in the right way and follow a cyclical "protocol" to dump angular
momentum to the field (ExB at certain radius, ExB smaller radius and then
with cancelling fields)

Classical mechanics works very well describing bulk matter and the CM of a
gyroscope won't move unless there is an external force. The stuff spinning
round will precess and do a fancy dance but that's it.

-Original Message-
From: mix...@bigpond.com [mailto:mix...@bigpond.com] 
Sent: 02 January 2019 21:54
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

In reply to  Remi Cornwall's message of Wed, 2 Jan 2019 16:19:58 -:
Hi Remi,
[snip]
>You need something to react against to dump the momentum to and for that
>reason gyroscopes don’t work as a propulsion device. 
>
>All this L = r x p stuff and the “strange way” they behave confuses people,
>even Laithwaite. 
>
>All the best.

Take into consideration that, at the atomic level, a gyro is a collection of
charged particles, all moving in an electromagnetic sea.
I suspect that if you examine Laithwaite more closely, you may find that, as
Jones suggests, it has commonalities with your work.

>
>>>Jones Beene Wed, 02 Jan 2019 06:49:08 -0800
> Brian,
>
>Here is a download which does not demand access to you contacts list
>http://vixra.org/abs/1812.0484
>This basic concept - "static electromagnetic momentum", as expounded in the

>“Feynman Disk”   is interesting especially to vortex and should be fertile 
>ground for comment.
>Here is a discussion of one part of the paradox - and it reminds me of the 
>several Laithwaite videos which are on YouTube
Regards,


Robin van Spaandonk

local asymmetry = temporary success

RE: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

You need something to react against to dump the momentum to and for that
reason gyroscopes don’t work as a propulsion device. 

All this L = r x p stuff and the “strange way” they behave confuses people,
even Laithwaite. 

All the best.

>>Jones Beene Wed, 02 Jan 2019 06:49:08 -0800
 Brian,

Here is a download which does not demand access to you contacts list
http://vixra.org/abs/1812.0484
This basic concept - "static electromagnetic momentum", as expounded in the 
“Feynman Disk”   is interesting especially to vortex and should be fertile 
ground for comment.
Here is a discussion of one part of the paradox - and it reminds me of the 
several Laithwaite videos which are on YouTube

Feynman's disk paradox used as a gyroscope?


I have recently learned about Feynman's disk paradox, where angular momentum
is 
stored in the properties of the ...


From: Brian Ahern [mailto:ahern_br...@msn.com] 
Sent: 02 January 2019 14:18
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com; remic...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

I cannot open the file unless I adopt Facebook. No thank you.
____
From: Remi Cornwall 
Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2019 9:02 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper 
 
Hi Folks,
 
Wishing you all a Happy New Year, especially Bill Beattie for providing this
resource since I was virtually a teenager. I’m still sticking it to them
(the establishment, the Philistines) and I am assembling a good team,
business and engineering behind me. I wish you all success in your
endeavours for 2019.
 
I’ve completed the triptych of my fundamental physics engineering papers:
 
http://www.academia.edu/38062548/A_Mechanism_for_Propulsion_without_The_Reac
tive_Ejection_of_Matter_or_Energy
 
https://www.academia.edu/29296558/The_misuse_of_the_No-communication_Theorem

 
https://www.academia.edu/31637706/Heat_engines_of_extraordinary_efficiency_A
nd_the_general_principle_of_their_operation 
 
 
(available here too: http://vixra.org/author/remi_cornwall )
 
http://webspace.qmul.ac.uk/rocornwall/ 
 
Y’all take care now,
Remi Cornwall.

RE: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

Make a logon with a fake email address and password (I'm not sure it needs
to verify that email address) or simply, look here:

 

http://vixra.org/author/remi_cornwall 

 

BTW, I have never used Facebook and get by without it.

 

From: Brian Ahern [mailto:ahern_br...@msn.com] 
Sent: 02 January 2019 14:18
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com; remic...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

 

I cannot open the file unless I adopt Facebook. No thank you.

  _  

From: Remi Cornwall 
Sent: Wednesday, January 2, 2019 9:02 AM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:New EM propulsion paper 

 

Hi Folks,

 

Wishing you all a Happy New Year, especially Bill Beattie for providing this
resource since I was virtually a teenager. I'm still sticking it to them
(the establishment, the Philistines) and I am assembling a good team,
business and engineering behind me. I wish you all success in your
endeavours for 2019.

 

I've completed the triptych of my fundamental physics engineering papers:

 

http://www.academia.edu/38062548/A_Mechanism_for_Propulsion_without_The_Reac
tive_Ejection_of_Matter_or_Energy
<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.academ
ia.edu%2F38062548%2FA_Mechanism_for_Propulsion_without_The_Reactive_Ejection
_of_Matter_or_Energy=02%7C01%7C%7C8186f0bd9f724506b80608d670bb00d8%7C84
df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636820345803787820=cJ94CrvHCD
rZFvMA%2FeSaheWpnD9XTvVdUKF%2BW4kiJfg%3D=0> 

 

https://www.academia.edu/29296558/The_misuse_of_the_No-communication_Theorem
<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.acade
mia.edu%2F29296558%2FThe_misuse_of_the_No-communication_Theorem=02%7C01
%7C%7C8186f0bd9f724506b80608d670bb00d8%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C
1%7C0%7C636820345803787820=DUjRDTt9boZNPw1BxE6PxP%2BoMhi4nZqs7usZaKKJs
R0%3D=0>  

 

https://www.academia.edu/31637706/Heat_engines_of_extraordinary_efficiency_A
nd_the_general_principle_of_their_operation
<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.acade
mia.edu%2F31637706%2FHeat_engines_of_extraordinary_efficiency_And_the_genera
l_principle_of_their_operation=02%7C01%7C%7C8186f0bd9f724506b80608d670b
b00d8%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636820345803787820=
2ZXQQOWNAUiaAaOjFfT9lrrrvvw9aWruWX8NmNvLNs4%3D=0>  

 

 

(available here too: http://vixra.org/author/remi_cornwall
<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fvixra.org%
2Fauthor%2Fremi_cornwall=02%7C01%7C%7C8186f0bd9f724506b80608d670bb00d8%
7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636820345803787820=jKmNt2
qSuY7z27ZXTUlXVb4%2F88A09H7GCr4JU%2FNoEiQ%3D=0>  )

 

http://webspace.qmul.ac.uk/rocornwall/
<https://eur04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebspace.q
mul.ac.uk%2Frocornwall%2F=02%7C01%7C%7C8186f0bd9f724506b80608d670bb00d8
%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636820345803787820=2dLrj
lAj0ifPPuq1qcNDLNlXCRBnv0CKDPen4WK15bU%3D=0>  

 

Y'all take care now,

Remi Cornwall.

[Vo]:New EM propulsion paper

[Remi Cornwall]

Hi Folks,

 

Wishing you all a Happy New Year, especially Bill Beattie for providing this
resource since I was virtually a teenager. I'm still sticking it to them
(the establishment, the Philistines) and I am assembling a good team,
business and engineering behind me. I wish you all success in your
endeavours for 2019.

 

I've completed the triptych of my fundamental physics engineering papers:

 

http://www.academia.edu/38062548/A_Mechanism_for_Propulsion_without_The_Reac
tive_Ejection_of_Matter_or_Energy

 

https://www.academia.edu/29296558/The_misuse_of_the_No-communication_Theorem


 

https://www.academia.edu/31637706/Heat_engines_of_extraordinary_efficiency_A
nd_the_general_principle_of_their_operation 

 

 

(available here too: http://vixra.org/author/remi_cornwall )

 

http://webspace.qmul.ac.uk/rocornwall/ 

 

Y'all take care now,

Remi Cornwall.

[Vo]:Question about Muon catalysed fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

I thought I’d forward a discussion with someone about Muon catalysed fusion.

 

Idea is that moderated cosmic ray muons (some 10,000/m^2/minute) might last 
longer in a lattice (the free electron gas would prevent decay, much like a 
neutron in a nucleus doesn’t decay because of the protons Pauli excluding the 
decay – it can’t decay because the states it wants to decay to are already 
filled). Also prevent muon capture by alpha particles (product of fusion). Stem 
these two processes – muon decay and capture and it might work.

 

Might it be possible to capture the cosmic muons, subject them to a magnetic 
field, whereupon they go around in circles bremstrahalunging a bit until they 
are slow enough to initiate CF in a LiD lattice (or maybe LI metal infused with 
deuterium rather than an ionic LiD lattice). The person I am corresponding with 
notes that heavy metal lattices preferentially capture muons, so I suggested a 
light metal lattice. I also suggested a magnetic field (+ve go one way, -ve 
another) or UV to break up muon capture by alpha particles. Compression may 
help fusion too – put the material in a diamond anvil.

 

If anyone is up for this, let me know.

 

From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:remic...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 12 July 2017 12:29
To: 
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Question about Muon catalysed fusion

 

Moderate them? If you capture them, subject them to a magnetic field, they will 
go in circles until their energy is such that it might allow reactions.

 

From: 
Sent: 12 July 2017 00:12
To: remic...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Question about Muon catalysed fusion

 

Cosmic muons are so energetic that they will never see the LiD lattice. These 
cosmic ultra fast muons will lose all that cosmic energy when they are two 
miles underground.

 

On Tue, Jul 11, 2017 at 7:04 PM, Remi Cornwall wrote:

I see, then what about a lattice of LiD ? Incidentally, not talking about 
generating muons but using what is present from cosmic radiation at sea level.

From: 
Sent: 11 July 2017 23:55
To: remic...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Question about Muon catalysed fusion

Muon Physics  

http://www.physics.rutgers.edu/ugrad/389/muon/muonphysics.pdf

Total nucler caputure rates for negitive muons.

http://lartpc-docdb.fnal.gov/0002/000248/002/Suzuki_etal.pdf

The muon capture rate goes up as the atom's nuclear size goes up. uranium has a 
capture rate 1,000,000 times greater than hydrogen.

B) If the lattice is then either warm enough or bombarded with UV, magnetic
field (Hall effect) might this stop the muon capture?

light elements stop the capture of muons.

Most muon capture happens away from where the muon was created, possibly 
kilometers away. The amount of secondary muon catalyzed fusion that occurs in 
LENR is miniscule  local to the lattice that produced the muon.

The amount of muons that escape the lattice is very large unless the lattice is 
surrounded by a foot or two of lead.

 

On Tue, Jul 11, 2017 at 6:27 PM, Remi Cornwall <remic...@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Vo,

Sorry if this is off topic but I have a question about Muon catalysed
fusion.

If I understand correctly, basically two factors come into play a) Muon
decay and b) Muon capture by alpha particles from the fusion process. So I
thought this:-

A) A neutron on its own decays after about 15 minutes 1/2 life to a proton
and an electron (and electron neutrino and perhaps gamma). In the nucleus it
doesn't decay by the Pauli exclusion principle, which stops it dropping into
a non-empty proton state (it's surrounded by protons). So, might it be
possible to stop a muon decaying in a lattice somewhat because there is a
free electron gas?

B) If the lattice is then either warm enough or bombarded with UV, magnetic
field (Hall effect) might this stop the muon capture?

My two cents. Who can expand on this?

Regards,
Remi.

 

 

[Vo]:Question about Muon catalysed fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

Dear Vo,

Sorry if this is off topic but I have a question about Muon catalysed
fusion.

If I understand correctly, basically two factors come into play a) Muon
decay and b) Muon capture by alpha particles from the fusion process. So I
thought this:-

A) A neutron on its own decays after about 15 minutes 1/2 life to a proton
and an electron (and electron neutrino and perhaps gamma). In the nucleus it
doesn't decay by the Pauli exclusion principle, which stops it dropping into
a non-empty proton state (it's surrounded by protons). So, might it be
possible to stop a muon decaying in a lattice somewhat because there is a
free electron gas?

B) If the lattice is then either warm enough or bombarded with UV, magnetic
field (Hall effect) might this stop the muon capture?

My two cents. Who can expand on this?

Regards,
Remi.

[Vo]:A chap from CERN

[Remi Cornwall]

 
Vo,
 
A chap from CERN was asking a question about biological transmutation of
ResearchGate and he posted this paper:
 
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15447332
 
No doubt the LENR crowd are familiar with it. It seems pretty unequivocal,
so what happened to it?
 
Remi.

[Vo]:Important: NASA hacker Gary McKinnon

[Remi Cornwall]

Dear Vortex,

I unsubscribed in the past because I simply disagreed with many of the
opinions and science that goes on here, to me there is no point in arguing
anymore.

I would like to use some of the 'cache' I have in Vortex to ask British
citizens to lobby their MPs/home secretary/Euro MPs in their own words (and
with their own postcodes/emails to avoid being SPAM-handled) on the matter
of Gary McKinnon.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7831481.stm

http://freegary.org.uk/

This is the story of a British man being crushed by the USA for 'hacking'
into their unprotected computers and allegedly finding stuff about 'UFOs'.
He did no criminal damage, made no real risk to national security.

All he has done is commit the misdemeanour of trespass and this is not a
felony warranting 70 years in a US maximum security jail.

It is cruel and unusual punishment forbidden by the American constitution
anyway.

One should fear that US law can usurp British and European independence.

Remi.

This is my letter, please use your own words.

To:

Home Secretary
Rt Hon. Jacqui Smith MP
c/o Direct Communications Unit
Home Office
2 Marsham Street
London SW1P 4DF

On reading the BBC news item about Gary McKinnon and taking the suggestion
of his support campaign I write to you as follows:

Gary McKinnon has committed no felony. He has caused no criminal damage. He
has not threatened national security.

He has merely trespassed and it is a misdemeanour.

His sentence bears no relation to this misdemeanour. We see child abusers,
murderers, rapists get off with trivial sentences of a few years or other
legal technicalities.

Under the USA constitution his punishment is cruel and unusual and thus is
unconstitutional.

70 years in a maximum security prison bears no relation to the offence.

This disproportionate crushing of Gary must show that they have a conspiracy
to hide.

I also object to the usurping of British justice by the USA. The
misdemeanour was committed on British soil so he is subject to British Laws.

Gary was and still is a man of exemplary character.

Please support:

Early Day Motion 2388 sponsored by David Burrowes MP

I support Gary.

Remi Cornwall.

[VO]: Important: NASA hacker Gary McKinnon

[Remi Cornwall]

(Resent with [VO] to avoid SPAM-age)
Dear Vortex,

I unsubscribed in the past because I simply disagreed with many of the
opinions and science that goes on here, to me there is no point in arguing
anymore.

I would like to use some of the 'cache' I have in Vortex to ask British
citizens to lobby their MPs/home secretary/Euro MPs in their own words (and
with their own postcodes/emails to avoid being SPAM-handled) on the matter
of Gary McKinnon.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7831481.stm

http://freegary.org.uk/

This is the story of a British man being crushed by the USA for 'hacking'
into their unprotected computers and allegedly finding stuff about 'UFOs'.
He did no criminal damage, made no real risk to national security.

All he has done is commit the misdemeanour of trespass and this is not a
felony warranting 70 years in a US maximum security jail.

It is cruel and unusual punishment forbidden by the American constitution
anyway.

One should fear that US law can usurp British and European independence.

Remi.

This is my letter, please use your own words.

To:

Home Secretary
Rt Hon. Jacqui Smith MP
c/o Direct Communications Unit
Home Office
2 Marsham Street
London SW1P 4DF

On reading the BBC news item about Gary McKinnon and taking the suggestion
of his support campaign I write to you as follows:

Gary McKinnon has committed no felony. He has caused no criminal damage. He
has not threatened national security.

He has merely trespassed and it is a misdemeanour.

His sentence bears no relation to this misdemeanour. We see child abusers,
murderers, rapists get off with trivial sentences of a few years or other
legal technicalities.

Under the USA constitution his punishment is cruel and unusual and thus is
unconstitutional.

70 years in a maximum security prison bears no relation to the offence.

This disproportionate crushing of Gary must show that they have a conspiracy
to hide.

I also object to the usurping of British justice by the USA. The
misdemeanour was committed on British soil so he is subject to British Laws.

Gary was and still is a man of exemplary character.

Please support:

Early Day Motion 2388 sponsored by David Burrowes MP

I support Gary.

Remi Cornwall.

[Vo]:A review paper by Storms

[Remi Cornwall]

Review papers are always the way to get to know a subject.

Is this available online fee of charge? If not I can’t be bothered to go out
of my way to get it:

• Storms, Edmund (2007), Science of Low Energy Nuclear Reaction: A
Comprehensive Compilation of Evidence and Explanations, Singapore: World
Scientific, ISBN 9-8127062-0-8  

[Vo]:'Living organisms'

[Remi Cornwall]

Had a look on Amazon. Going for £43, it’s not in the university library. 

Seems to me you’ve got to bend over backwards to take the material to ‘them’
when you’re that unpopular. I’d make the main review book/papers easily
accessible as a teaser taster.

Is it not online rather than just scanning the contents?


‘5.8 Role of the Hydrino and Hydrex’
‘5.10 Role of Super-Heavy Electrons…’
‘5.12 Role of Electron Cluster’
‘5.15 Living Organisms’, 
‘6.2.1 Living Organisms’.

You’re going to have a difficult time...

I was going to leave a copy around with a few research fellows see if we
could get the group enthused. 

I’m not so sure now...

Good luck. Adieu. Back to the conventional world, lots of funding available
if you pass muster...

Wish you well.

RE: [Vo]:Connections @ Oilgae

[Remi Cornwall]

Jed, give it up. You alienate him he'll give you a good kicking in later. He
might have contacts high up in the food chain.

You're a big boy now I'm sure I don't need to tell you the game.

Too many emails again. Vortex is addictive when you're on the computer all
day. TTFN.

-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 14:54
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Connections @ Oilgae

R C Macaulay wrote:

Speaking of politics grin.. err.. I mean.. pond scum. Algae 
investor Bill Gates $ 100 million and Google $ 50 million has put up 
some  serious investment money  for  pond scum.
One would hope that these people would also be investing in LENR. 
They are NOT. Why?

My guess is that they have not heard of it. That is to say, the only 
thing they know about cold fusion is what you read in the Scientific 
American or the New York Times; i.e., it is compounded of fraud, 
incompetence and lunacy.

Gene Mallove and I once managed to get through to the Gates 
Foundation, which at that time was run by Bill Gates' father. We got 
back a pleasant but unhelpful letter from someone there referring to 
cold fusion as the Mallove and Rothwell idea. They had not bothered 
to read the information enough to connect it the 1989 news, and they 
had no idea who was actually doing the research or what they claimed. 
They glanced at it and rejected it out of hand.

Despite the fact that people have visited LENR-CANR.org 1.6 million 
times, most people in the world have no idea that cold fusion exists, 
or if they have heard of it, they are completely unaware of the fact 
that anyone ever claimed to replicate it. Furthermore, many of them 
do not want to hear about it, and they get upset -- or in high 
dudgeon I guess you would call it -- when someone tries to tell them 
about it. The attached recent correspondence between Prof. Wilson  I 
illustrates this attitude.

- Jed

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

fromJed Rothwell [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
dateSat, Nov 1, 2008 at 3:05 PM
subjectCONDUCT, MISCONDUCT, AND CARGO CULT SCIENCE
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Nov 1 (2 days ago)
Reply
Greetings. I read you paper on cargo cult science.

Your assertions about cold fusion are incorrect. Thousands of
professional scientists have replicated the cold fusion effect, at
hundreds of laboratories such as Los Alamos and BARC. They have
published roughly a thousand papers in mainstream, peer-reviewed
journals describing these replications. This extensive literature was
available when you wrote this paper, but you did not include any
references to it. I get a sense you are unfamiliar with this
literature, because your assertions (along with Huizenga's) are at
odds with it.

Before you comment on experimental research, it is customary and
strongly recommended that you first read the peer-reviewed literature
on that subject.

You will find a bibliography of 3,500 papers on cold fusion and 500
full text papers here:

http://lenr-canr.org/

- Jed Rothwell
Librarian, LENR-CANR.org


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

- Hide quoted text -
Jed Rothwell wrote:
Greetings. I read you paper on cargo cult science.

Your assertions about cold fusion are incorrect. Thousands of
professional scientists have replicated the cold fusion effect, at
hundreds of laboratories such as Los Alamos and BARC. They have
published roughly a thousand papers in mainstream, peer-reviewed
journals describing these replications. This extensive literature was
available when you wrote this paper, but you did not include any
references to it. I get a sense you are unfamiliar with this
literature, because your assertions (along with Huizenga's) are at
odds with it.

Before you comment on experimental research, it is customary and
strongly recommended that you first read the peer-reviewed literature
on that subject.

You will find a bibliography of 3,500 papers on cold fusion and 500
full text papers here:

http://lenr-canr.org/

- Jed Rothwell
Librarian, LENR-CANR.org


Dear Mr. Rothwell,

I must admit that this is a first for me---having a librarian write 
to me to tell me that statements in one of my papers are incorrect.  In the
past I have had engineers, computer scientists, statisticians, 
operations researchers, and specialists in a variety of fields 
(including naval architecture, botany, and food science) write to ask 
me questions about the technical correctness of specific statements 
that I have made in my published archival journal article.  In some 
cases their questions simply required clearing up a misunderstanding 
about a specific technical point at issue that was in fact correctly 
stated in one of my papers; and in some cases I must confess that I 
had made a misstatement of fact that required correction.  In the 
instances in which the latter situation haoccurred, I published a 
correction in the same archival journal in the original article appeared.

I must say, however, that I have never 

RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

For real!? Does he get one group of people to stand in one long line to vote
and another to fast track in a much shorter line?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFfXV3VHyz4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jn8K8EA7-Q


-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 16:31
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan


There will be an entity stirring people up, urging them to march to the 
Valley of Jezreel, his name is Lucifer.


--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---

RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

Mark I agree with you. It is galling to hear Barrack Obama talk about
corruption, lobbyists and regulation when *he has* taken money from the
federal housing corporations.

No doubt they have the disgrace of an impeachment hanging over him to reign
in his powers.

However what I take objection to is maybe the lucky complacent type of black
man who by, maybe luck or environment looks down on other blacks as lazy
welfare bums. I've come to the conclusion that they are deeply self-loathing
about slavery (why didn't we fight back? The Jews suffer this too) and their
perceived lack of contribution to society. Or that they excel in sports and
music marks them as physical and somehow more primitive than the other
homo-sapiens on the planet.

I often used to row with my father about his ambivalent, ambiguous,
contradictory almost admiring way of dealing with racists. He seemed to be
forever holding out the olive branch as if to say 'we can change them, we
can improve to their standards'. I've come to the confidence of maturity now
where I don't have to prove myself to anybody or can deal with the
embarrassed looks when I meet the person I've been speaking to down the
phone for years (and hears a quite plumy English accent) and sees someone
who is 'black' (coffee actually).

Colin Powell is a hell of an example. You couldn't get more physical and in
your face than army life. He's rose through the ranks and has implemented
change: all (*all*) can serve their country.

Republican real-politik dissuaded him from the nomination back in 1999 and
he said his wife couldn't take the strain as 1st lady. Well she did OK as
the wife of the Chief of Staff. With respect it seems an excuse and someone
told him to stand down. What's more they made him the fall guy for weapons
of mass destruction

The republicans made a few token gestures with Condi who is a real brain box
and I'd bet we'd like to be a fly on the wall to hear the rows she's had.
However it is, really, only the democrats who are seizing the day and
entering into the 21st century with a massive statement of supporting the
most able guy, regardless of race.

I think Thomas Sewell and Walter Williams are just poster boys for the
right. It's ok to speak about race we've got our frontmen. The more I see
it they complain too much, are self-loathing and are being used by
unreconstructed right-wingers who hide behind a philosophy that purports to
be fair and meritocratic. 

Their vision is one of unfettered dog eat dog. Their talk of meritocracy is
false and all the power will go to the well connected Ivy League boys and
people who bought their children a decent education, gave Daddy little boy a
hand up in the work place. It's all self perpetuating.

Digressing slightly, their passion for being 'objective' seems to have blue
(or ultra-violet) tinted glasses. When faced with irrefutable scientific
evidence about any issue opposed to *their* notions of personal liberty the
siren call goes up big government, liberal fascism and they find
themselves back peddling. (I like the one with Ayn Rand's novels being laced
with cigarette smoking characters whilst she rails on about Jazz clubs,
people taking drugs and the 60s counter-culture. So the legend goes, when
told by her doctor to stop smoking for scientific reasons she just stopped
by sheer force of will and hard work. Yeah right, I believe you.)

So despite the lies, the threat of impeachment and the dodgy economics, I
find Obama the best man. I get the same feeling about the Tories in the UK,
despite David Cameron who seems a very nice man (Eton-Oxford grandee); it's
still full of bigots. Several generations have to die out probably before it
can redeem itself. Then when the playing field is level we can discuss the
free market.

-Original Message-
From: Mark Iverson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 07:24
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan


For the most part I agree that most modern religions have decent goals and
try to teach people how
to behave in a society, and that it's the actions of a few zealous members
that give it a bad name,
but I was not thinking of that when I wrote what I did... But you seem to
think that its never the
religion.  If you want to qualify that with the term, mainstream
religions, then I would agree.
However, there have been belief systems that I would consider dangerous.  In
addition, there are
instances where the leaders of a religion are culpable in the actions that
are contrary to what the
institution preaches.  A perfect example is how the Vatican had at first
refused to acknowledge the
problem of pedophiles in the ranks, and it was only due to considerable
pressure from hi-profile
cases that it finally admitted, barely, to a problem.  This does nothing but
destroy the people's
faith in that institution...  I've also heard that more people have died in
wars fought over
religious disputes as opposed to territorial 

RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_(The_Original_Miniseries)


-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 17:06
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

For real!? Does he get one group of people to stand in one long line to vote
and another to fast track in a much shorter line?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFfXV3VHyz4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jn8K8EA7-Q


-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 16:31
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan


There will be an entity stirring people up, urging them to march to the 
Valley of Jezreel, his name is Lucifer.


--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---

RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

Just taking a shot of their front page today:
http://www.capmag.com/index.asp?page=2

This is the Objectivists (extreme rightwing) rag mag.

The Black reporter kicks in the Black guys they don't like

The Jewish reporter kick in the Jewish guys they don't like

You see it's alright then. 

-Original Message-
From: Jeff Fink [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 11:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan


That means you are suppose to bless those muslims who hate you. 
Harry


Yes.  

Before, during, and after 9-11 America had troops in Kosovo protecting
Muslims from Serbian attack.  My son was one of those troops.

Jeff

RE: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface

[Remi Cornwall]

I 'knew' John too in offline conversations and I think I talked to him once
on the phone or that might have been Gene Mallove (Chris Tinsley too). Reall
nice people, I mean *really* nice. They must go somewhere. I'm prepared to
believe in lifeforce.

Someone hinted Fred might be terminal. He was another one you could sense
had a huge, warm character.

Really nice people. It makes me think of the film Stargate 1 and the
reptilian alien who had assumed human form: Your lives so short yet your
bodies so easy to repair.

I'd be described as 'late youth' fit as a fiddle with muscles (and women on
the go, heh, heh) but it all seems to go so quickly. I love medical
technology and can see (no hubris) us living to 150-200 towards the end of
this century. Apparently it can be done.

-Original Message-
From: Mark Iverson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 05:17
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface

So sorry to hear that... Damn.

I knew John well, visited him several times, had many long phone
conversations, and helped each
other in tough times.  Perhaps he'll send me a little hint from the other
side...

Nothing but fond memories,
Take care John,
-Mark


-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 8:55 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface

Mark Iverson wrote:

Thomas:
Do you mean John Schnurer, of Xenia/Yellow Springs Ohio, whose father
taught at Antioch college?


Yes

RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

The whole cynicism of the right, the talk about Barney Franks, Senator Chris
Dodds, Clinton, the Communities Reinvestment Act, even far back as Kennedy
and FDR is just a smoke screen...

The idea that it is false love and just cynical left-wingers buying votes is
laughable.

When you have a country taken by force by one race of people, who then
systematically ethnically cleanse it of its original inhabitants, ship in a
whole group of people to use like cattle, when they find that the original
inhabitants died out from the strains of disease they brought to this new
'discovered' land, systematically segregate and disadvantage those who are
not its race and then have the gall to say that these people are lazy and a
burden when the system just isn't inclusive or nurturing of their talents,
it is a small measure when some wealth gets redistributed to let them have a
piece of the pie and own their own properties.

The collapse seems to have been deliberately engineered by the people (the
speculators, those in the market) who didn't want it to work, didn't want a
more fair society and wanted to keep the old order. They are doing well from
all the welfare we the tax payer now pay them.

Deep down it is driven by the old Anglo Saxon desire for dominion but the
world is a different place, the 'wogs' have knowledge now, China, India,
Brazil the power of the Muslim nations. The European dominion is but a blip
in recent history and you find the world is going back to equilibrium. All
races are equal, all have something to offer.

Putting in a man from the ethnic minorities sends out a powerful message
from the US: please forgive us before we all go mad.
 
-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 11:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

Just taking a shot of their front page today:
http://www.capmag.com/index.asp?page=2

This is the Objectivists (extreme rightwing) rag mag.

The Black reporter kicks in the Black guys they don't like

The Jewish reporter kick in the Jewish guys they don't like

You see it's alright then. 

-Original Message-
From: Jeff Fink [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 04 November 2008 11:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan


That means you are suppose to bless those muslims who hate you. 
Harry


Yes.  

Before, during, and after 9-11 America had troops in Kosovo protecting
Muslims from Serbian attack.  My son was one of those troops.

Jeff

[Vo]:Ding dong!

[Remi Cornwall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Jn8K8EA7-Q

 

 

 

 

 

[Vo]:What's new, what's not, what's bad, what's good

[Remi Cornwall]

Vo,

Vo,
I got directly contacted by someone called Michael Julian who seems similar
to a Michel Julian but they can't be the same person. Obviously the names
are similar. He told me to look at the logs and wondered what happened? So I
did. Look, mate, it's the same old vortex: some old, some new, some changed.
I have to say what you did was a bit kooky but you don't win friends that
way. Life is politics...

What you have to understand is, to use the Buddhist framework, that people
are on a life's journey attempting (or not) purification and reaching
Nirvana. As I see it there is a caste system on vortex (please learn
newbies):

Bill,
then 
Jed:
These guys seem above the fray and noble. They don't have hang-ups (may be
they were lucky and were born that way and didn't need purging). They seem
genuinely LIBERAL, well adjusted and not just out to get votes or to be
loved. Some say this about Bill Clinton or Barack Obama. I won't comment
(I'm sure I will some time later ;)

You have just a step down your academics and researchers who are of the
warrior caste. Getting involved in the cut and thrust can be a dirty
business but they too, one day, reach Nirvana. Personally I'd put Schwartz
above Storms in terms of maturity and nobility but it's not much and they
aren't far down on Bill and Jed. We are talking hyperfine splitting of caste
levels here. 

Then you've got your young or youngish researchers who drop in and out and
really want to talk to 'Dad'. Sometimes they are mouthy but it's probably
testosterone and lack of bonking. These are the lower end of the warrior
caste on their first commission where as the other end are Lt. Generals and
Generals to five stars.

Then you have your 'untouchables' or rank and file. They seem to be sort of
undistinguished (may be) mainly working class or middle management/retired.


Often the people lower in caste are very direct and speak their minds. This
is not to say it is of less value or wisdom, certainly it has less polish,
often it is pretentious (pretending to be liberal, non envious, educated but
just wannabe) but one must temper it with how life nurtured them.

I imagine being surrounded by crude blue collar, macho, white culture all
one's life would give one the certainty that the world is a better place run
by this *man*-tribe and that they invented everything, brought order and the
slaves were so much happier on the plantation when they got fed and watered
and did a real days work.

I find that the position of a lieutenant (1st, 2nd) is very much of one of
being in contact with the body of men whilst seeing the top brass.

Personally I never think you will win them over by telling them what they
palpably are. Listen, learn with good humour up and down the chain of
command but keep it together and don't be derisive.

Men like FDR, Clinton, Obama have this quality that they actually **love
people**. They are leaders, not selfish, are educated, take responsibility
and steer the ship, know what to do OR MORE IMPORTANTLY look like they know
what they are doing.

I see this fear of liberalism that we are going to have our bank accounts
sequestered, made vegans, held down and buggered into being 'metro-sexuals'
and I find it laughable.

We have great expectations and they know people's fear of the excesses of
liberalism - the Ivy League arrogance, the government spend-thrift, may be
questionable patriotism, the denial of logic to push a stance (let's give 5
year old sex education - doing the rounds in the UK at the moment, for
example).

*You can* vote them out but now more than ever I hope one man (a *real*
leader) can integrate all these philosophies and be pragmatic but most of
all - be a leader.

It seems to me the only thing you have to fear is his colour itself.

It's a no brainer.

Remi.

[Vo]:Sammy Davies and racists

[Remi Cornwall]

I heard about this on the radio and may listen to it later. There were a few
sound bites on the ad.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/documentaries/bruceandsammy.shtml

 

I'm not prepared to believe Frank or Dean were racists because they said
old smoky or get to the back of the bus in jest. It was of it's time (or
that age group) and they were a force for good. The programme seems centred
around the civil rights era and there's Frank doing a version of 'He's got
high hopes' as an election song for Kennedy.

 

However these things are not objective and you just a get a feel when
someone is a racist. They just complain a little too much, one-sided without
making a real point to educate. Can't quite put my finger on it but I know
it when I see it Left or Right wing.

 

The sanction might be a removal, a denial of promotion or getting sent to
Coventry in the workplace or even worse - hitting someone and calling them
names is seen as a worse crime than just getting hit in itself. I think a
lot of the PC movement has paralysed legitimate debate but if your opening
gambit is 'more de king's english' or talking about welfare and blacks
whilst never mentioning about the Bailout (proper noun, capital 'B'),
government subsides for big business or how a minority has to be twice as
good to get the same job, taking someone's ideas and never giving them
credit, talking around them but not to them, showing clear signs of envy,
then you've failed that shibboleth test, Left or Right.

 

RE: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface

[Remi Cornwall]

John dead I'm so sad. When did this happen? It's been so much time since the
early days of vo. What happened to Fred Sparber?

-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 03 November 2008 11:12
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface

60 minutes just did a segment on a brain to electrode interface, BEI. 
The late John Scheurner, whom I met on Vortex, worked on the first 
prototypes of the BEI. A scientist, paralyzed by ALS, was shown 
communicating by typing out messages.

The first model was a cap with electrodes, the reporter put it on and a 
technician put conducting jell between the electrodes and the scalp.

Then they showed a later model which is implanted in the brain. I had 
the same idea, but I decided that I didn't need another hole in my head.

OTOH, if we could come up with a design where the skin were closed over 
the hole and the electrode just touched it.


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RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

Scan reading the posts and some random thoughts,

I find talk about black tribal leaders selling other blacks into slavery a
non-sequitur. That was wrong but the Europeans took part and made it a
massive industry of pure misery.

OR

The US espouses the free market and yet gives a welfare cheque to the whole
military-industrial complex in spite of world trade agreements.

Or what of the Bailout? You had the reigns for 8 years and look at the
mess.

Some try to blame the credit crunch on blacks and Hispanics yet it was those
slick boys in Wall Street who came up with the *property pyramid* and
laundered the cash here in Old Blighty, London. (once again the sidekick)

Some seem to thing that they are always bailing out blacks, but the wealth
of US and the UK came from black labour before mechanical power. You
wouldn't have done it unless (the whole mid Atlantic trade) it gave you an
advantage. 

Some go on about Black culture; well it isn't actually black culture but
REDNECK OVERSEER culture that the slaves inherited - all the broken homes,
wife beating, alcohol and drug abuse, the crime. You had to break their
culture and totally bastardise them. Black men 'ape' the overseer who used
to beat the dissent (and decent) out of anyone. You will find ample smart
Africans without this burden doing well academically. 40 acres and mule,
what happened? How about a proper health system and education. How about
getting the people who prey on black estates with drugs and alcohol.

Some fail to read history and don't see the snapshot of this moment and
forget the contribution to knowledge of Egyptians, Persians, Babylonians,
Muslims, Orientals.

Some go on about radicalised Muslims and think all Muslims are like this but
fail to see how obnoxious the Bible belt is with their blonde, blue eyed
Jesus.

Some go on about how Blacks never seem to develop but bear in mind that the
continent is 'cursed' with natural resources and the European powers have
done much to destabilise anywhere with resources in the name of mercantilism
not free-trade.

So I am sick of rightwing fears about a black president. Blacks fought and
died for your country, save lives, give jobs, invented, gave you jazz, rock
and roll.


But most of all, the biggest stealth, Manchurian candidate enemy of your
culture is not someone who pallied around with terrorists or whose middle
name is Hussein, it's the assh.les who ruined your economy, over stretched
your military and made you look small in the world, made the world a more
dangerous place.

A leader will realise you need some old fashioned but post Keynesianism
thought with New Deal style projects to avoid stagflation. Real old
fashioned infrastructure wealth, not shallow consumer goods caused by excess
cash dumped on the market but realignment of your economy to be sustainable,
fair, civilised (European style health care and education) and with a
military used in conjunction with other nations as the world's police force.

Only a clever leader can affect this synthesis of ideas and camps and dig
America out of that hole. It's a real FDR moment. It would be a great
combination of US and EU and their great heritage of English and Latin
traditions.

(I had really switched off to vortex seeing no people of real influence. I'm
better off moving in other circles. That's not to insult you all it just
doesn't seem to connect with anything or anyone important at the moment.
Once a few of you learn what science is and put up a decent unified front
that might change. TTFN)

RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

I LIKE COLIN POWELL. HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT.

BUSH MESSED HIM OVER BEING THE FALL GUY FOR WEAPONS OF MASS DISTRACTION.

You can tell a leader when they speak, they are articulate, mature and
magnanimous. 

For all the bad things done in its name, the US army IS a band of brothers
and sisters of all classes, creeds and races. It's telling that a black man
can rise to high office in the army but not so easily in other spheres of
life (industry and academia).

It gave people a leg up and when you've fought alongside people you'd never
normally associate with (and they save your neck) you never forget it.

Colin Powell has the calibre to be CEO of any multinational let alone
president.

That idiot Bush the command in chief, Cheney (puppet master), and the closet
old-world order screwed Powell and your nation in the pursuit of
reconstruction contracts, the oil homogeny and just base, venal, top level
greed.

Least we not forget in November at this time or remembrance.

-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 03 November 2008 11:19
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

Harry Veeder wrote:

The same argument applies to Christains with respect to certain passages in
their bible.
  

From: Jeff Fink [EMAIL PROTECTED]

If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
Jews been living in their cities for over a millennium?

Because most Muslims are not living their religion by the book!  
Only what we refer to as the extremists behave that way.  Most Muslims show

much more kindness than that.
-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

If good Muslims kill all non-muslims why have
Jews been living in their cities for over a millennium?
  

Not if you look at the Bible as a hologram.



--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---

[Vo]:Fred Sparber

[Remi Cornwall]

I'm sure all of Vortex wishes Fred well.

I imagine Jones will keep up the fanciful stuff in the same vein as Fred
did. There's no harm in that ;)

[Vo]:All the talents

[Remi Cornwall]

Whoever gets elected, if they made a pragmatic centralist regime with a
cabinet of all the talents they would pour oil on troubled waters (err, not
good, too Exxon like). The mark of a leader then would stamp his approval or
his own decision by being the equal or greater than the intellects of
everyone in that room. 'W' never could do that. That's what I mean about a
clever Ivy Leaguer, not from the upper classes but one with the common
touch.

Being smart and a good orator is not an upper class elitist thing. I imagine
working class whites are often scared when they see 'uppity' Ivy League
blacks. 

Colin Powell though, worked his way up through the ranks. He got through it
and he's a lovely man. Can you imagine the trouble he must have had on the
battlefield with his first commissions and some hard as nails NCOs wanting
to usurp him?

I imagine Barack has been through all that too, in a way, and suffered all
the hostility but I think he could be great, another FDR or Kennedy.

Just get the best advisors, left or right but you, sir, you have the balls
to step up to the plate and take the responsibility. I hope all the world
and its extremists, home and abroad, get behind the next president.

Machiavelli said it is better for a leader to be feared, no, it's better to
be loved but that doesn't make one a pushover. 

The next leader needs a solid mandate otherwise the bickering will never
stop. That happened here in UK with John Major in the early 1990s. Nice guy,
maybe too nice, maybe lacking talent, he struggled with a poor majority.
Then we got Tony (an extremely able man) who was all things to all people
but that approach can mean that you have no principles and end up becoming
popularist (left) and corrupt (big business money). 

Yes, have the ideologues along in this cabinet but say we are dealing with
real politik not political fiction. A real leader would then defeat advisor
opinion deadlock and stamp his mark. The top guy is more important than
ever, it's not just titular.

RE: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

[Remi Cornwall]

Oh I see is that's what their up to now...

Oh they're going to say Obama is the anti-Christ. I remember this with Bill
Clinton and Gorbachev and anyone smart enough to stand up to them.

I've heard all kinds of bullshit, that the Annunarki are due in 2012 (some
planet they live on is meant to come back to the solar system), that the
London 2012 Olympic symbol secretly says Zion and that's why they were so
loathed to change it - the power of that lobby.

Ignorance and bigotry is a really powerful force. We must quell the urge to
crush bugs and regard outsiders as suspicious. Superstition and this basic
reflex seem to be some deed evolutionary mechanism and when you see it for
what it is... well nothing to fear but the fear itself.

-Original Message-
From: OrionWorks [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 03 November 2008 22:46
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

Jeff Fink Said:

...

 You may wonder how good of a Christian I am?  Well,
 I am not as good as I need to be, but I am trying.

I often wonder how good a human being I am to myself and to others as
well. I know I could use improvement, and I am trying.

 Bible prophesy, which has a habit of coming true, indicates
 that at the end of the age there will be a one world religion
 that will punish Christian believers, who refuse to deny Jesus,
 with execution by beheading. Read: Revelation 20: 4

 I ask, Is there any major religion on the fast track to
 world domination that hates the concept of Jesus as God, and
 that punishes infidels with beheading?  It would seem to
 benefit most of us to postpone the arrival of that religious
 system as long as possible.

 Jeff

Collectively speaking when too many people at any period of history
tend to take the Bible, the Torah, the Koran, or any religious book
literally we will indeed experience the end of the world. If such a
horrible prophesy were to manifest I suspect it wouldn't be because
g*d finally came back and kicked everybody's ass out of the pool for
peeing in it. The prophesy would come about because everyone will be
shooting at their neighbors across geopolitical and religious
boundaries, all in the name of their g*d, the one and only true g*d.

At times like this I sometimes wish I could be an atheist. But alas, I
don't suspect a godless world would be any more of a solution to the
world's woes. From what I can tell stupidity, ignorance, hatred, and
bigotry know no geopolitical and/or philosophical boundaries. If there
were no religion in the world I suspect all the idiots, bigots, and
the ignorant would find some other all-mighty philosophy to hang their
hang-ups on.

I continue to hope that the Golden Rule for which Mike Carrell
refreshingly brought back to our attention will eventually prevail. It
is one of the most universally prevalent and respected laws known on
our planet.

Regards
Steven Vincent Johnson
www.OrionWorks.com
www.zazzle.com/orionworks

[Vo]:Line Broadening 2

[Remi Cornwall]

Table 1: Langmuir's Symptoms of Pathological Science 

  _  

1. 

The maximum effect that is observed is produced by a causative agent of
barely detectable intensity, and the magnitude of the effect is
substantially independent of the intensity of the cause. 

2. 

The effect is of a magnitude that remains close to the limit of
detectability or, many measurements are necessary because of the very low
statistical significance of the results. 

3. 

There are claims of great accuracy. 

4. 

Fantastic theories contrary to experience are suggested. 

5. 

Criticisms are met by ad hoc excuses thought up on the spur of the moment. 

6. 

The ratio of supporters to critics rises up to somewhere near 50% and then
falls gradually to oblivion. 

  _  


3. THE LOGICAL STRUCTURE OF SCIENCE


3.1 Baconian Inductivism vs. Data Selection


As a basis for their discussion of how science actually works, Woodward and
Goodstein examine critically the theories of the scientific method that are
due to Francis Bacon ([1620] 1994) and Karl Popper (1972). Baconian
inductivism prescribes that scientific investigation should begin with the
careful recording of observations; and as far as possible, these
observations should be uninfluenced by any theoretical preconceptions. When
a sufficiently large body of such observations has been accumulated, the
scientist uses the process of induction to generalize from these
observations a hypothesis or theory that describes the systematic effects
seen in the data. 

On the contrary, Woodward and Goodstein assert that Historians,
philosophers, and those scientists who care are virtually unanimous in
rejecting Baconian inductivism as a general characterization of good
scientific method. Woodward and Goodstein argue that it is impractical to
record all one observes and that some selectivity is required. They make the
following statement: 

But decisions about what is relevant inevitably will be influenced heavily
by background assumptions, and these ... are often highly theoretical in
character. The vocabulary we use to describe the results of measurements,
and even the instruments we use to make the measurements, are highly
dependent on theory. This point is sometimes expressed by saying that all
observation in science is theory-laden and that a theoretically neutral
language for recording observations is impossible. 

I claim that in the context of computer simulation experiments, this
statement is simply untrue. By using portable simulation software, we can
achieve exact reproducibility of simulation experiments across computer
platforms--that is, the same results can be obtained whether the simulation
model is executed on a notebook computer with a 16-bit operating system or
on a supercomputer with a 64-bit operating system. Moreover, the
accumulation of relevant performance measures within the simulation model
can be precisely specified in a way that is completely independent of any
theory under investigation. Thus we can attain Feynman's ideal of a kind of
utter honesty in which every simulation analyst has available the same
information with which to evaluate the performance of proposed theoretical
or methodological contributions to the field. In my view, it is impossible
to overstate the fundamental importance of this advantage of simulated
experimentation; and we are deeply indebted to the developers and vendors of
simulation software who have taken the trouble and expense to provide us
with the tools necessary to achieve the reproducibility that is an essential
feature of all legitimate scientific studies. 

According to Woodward and Goodstein, Baconian inductivism leads to the
potentially erroneous and harmful conclusion that data selection and
overinterpretation of data are forms of scientific misconduct, while a less
restrictive view of how science actually works would lead to a different set
of conclusions. In many prominent cases of pathological science, the root of
the problem was data selection (cooking) that may have been subconscious
but was nonetheless grossly misleading. In addition to the case of
Blondlot's nonexistent N rays, Langmuir and Hall (1989) and Broad and Wade
(1982) detail several other noteworthy cases of such cooking and
overinterpretation of experimental data in the fields of archaeology,
astronomy, geology, parapsychology, physics, and psychology. I claim that
whatever the theoretical deficiencies of Baconian inductivism may be, they
have no bearing on the field of computer simulation; moreover, there are
sound practical reasons for insisting that researchers in all fields should
avoid selection or overinterpretation of data that has even the appearance
of pathological science. 


3.2 Validating vs. Cooking Simulation Models


Because simulationists work far more closely with the end users of their
technology than specialists in many other scientific disciplines, we are
sometimes exposed to greater pressure from clients or sponsors to fudge or

[Vo]:Line Broadening 3

[Remi Cornwall]

 

 

 


3.3 Popperian Falsificationism


Next we turn to the falsificationist ideas of Karl Popper. According to this
theory of the scientific method, we test a hypothesis by deducing from it a
prediction that can be tested in an experiment. If the prediction fails to
hold in the experiment, then the associated hypothesis is said to be
falsified and must be rejected. Thus Popperian falsificationism requires a
scientist to hold a hypothesis tentatively, to explore and highlight the
ways in which the hypothesis might break down, to uncover and scrutinize
evidence contrary to the hypothesis rather than discarding or suppressing
such evidence, and in general to avoid exaggeration or overstatement of the
evidence supporting the hypothesis. Perhaps the most forceful statement of
this view of science was given by Richard Feynman in the quotation at the
beginning of this article. 

According to Woodward and Goodstein, there are also serious deficiencies in
Popperian falsificationism as a general theory of good scientific method: 

One of the most important of these is sometimes called the Duhem-Quine
problem. We claimed above that testing a hypothesis H involved deriving from
it some observational consequence O. But in most realistic cases such
observational consequences will not be derivable from H alone, but only from
H in conjunction with a great many other assumptions A (auxiliary
assumptions, as philosophers sometimes call them). ... It is possible that H
is true and that the reason that O is false is that A is false. 

...It may be true, as Popper claims, that we cannot conclusively verify a
hypothesis, but we cannot conclusively falsify it either. 

The most distinctive feature of computer simulation experiments is that the
simulationist has complete control over the experimental conditions via (a)
the random number streams driving the simulation model's stochastic input
processes, and (b) the deterministic inputs governing model operation. Thus
in simulated experimentation it is possible to isolate the effects of
auxiliary assumptions, so that the Duhem-Quine problem can be effectively
resolved. However as several colleagues have pointed out, often
practitioners fail to evaluate the effects of auxiliary assumptions in
large-scale simulation projects. This failure may be due to the lack of a
well-documented, widely recognized methodology for addressing the
Duhem-Quine problem in the context of simulation studies. Future simulation
research should focus on the development of such methodology together with a
comprehensive investigation of the connections between methods for solving
the Duhem-Quine problem and methods for validating a simulation model. 

Beyond their theoretical objections to Popperian falsificationism, Woodward
and Goodstein claim that this approach has serious practical disadvantages: 

Suppose a novel theory predicts some previously unobserved effect, and an
experiment is undertaken to detect it. The experiment requires the
construction of new instruments, perhaps operating at the very edge of what
is technically possible, and the use of a novel experimental design, which
will be infected with various unsuspected and difficult-to-detect sources of
error. As historical studies have shown, in this kind of situation there
will be a strong tendency on the part of many experimentalists to conclude
that these problems have been overcome if and when the experiment produces
results that the theory predicted. Such behavior certainly exhibits
anti-Popperian dogmatism and theoretical bias, but it may be the best way
to discover a difficult-to-detect signal. Here again, it would be unwise to
have codes of scientific conduct or systems of incentives that discourage
such behavior. 

The scenario of Woodward and Goodstein is a remarkably accurate description
of the experimental setting in which occurred all of the cases of
pathological science detailed by Langmuir and Hall (1989) and Broad and Wade
(1982). Moreover, this scenario describes the notorious cold fusion
experiments of Martin Fleischmann and B. Stanley Pons as documented in the
book Cold Fusion: The Scientific Fiasco of the Century by John R. Huizenga
(1993). It seems clear that in such a scenario, the scientist's foremost
concern should be to avoid lapsing into self-deception and pathological
science. 


4. THE SOCIAL STRUCTURE OF SCIENCE


Woodward and Goodstein claim that ultimately inductivism and
falsificationism are inadequate as theories of science because they fail to
account for the psychology of individual scientists and the social structure
of science. First Woodward and Goodstein consider the role of social
interactions in scientific investigation: 

Suppose a scientist who has invested a great deal of time and effort in
developing a theory is faced with a decision about whether to continue to
hold onto it given some body of evidence. ... Suppose that our scientist has
a rival who has invested time and resources in developing an 

[Vo]:Line Broadening 4

[Remi Cornwall]

5. SCIENCE AS CRAFT


Woodward and Goodstein question the general validity of the following
principle: 

Scientists must report what they have done so fully that any other scientist
can reproduce the experiment or calculation. 

They claim that science has a large skill or craft component, and that 

Conducting an experiment in a way that produces reliable results is not a
matter of following algorithmic rules that specify exactly what is to be
done at each step. 

This may be true of some areas in the biological sciences and other
experimental sciences in which the behavior of living organisms or the
functioning of complicated instrumentation may not be well understood, but
this does not apply to computer simulation experiments. We can and must
insist on exact reproducibility of simulation experiments; and this should,
in fact, be a matter of following precisely stated, fully documented
algorithms. 

There is of course a large craft component in building and using
simulation models. Different individuals presented with the same system to
be modeled neither build identical simulations nor apply those models in
precisely the same way, just as different researchers in any other
scientific discipline will neither build the same experimental apparatus nor
carry out exactly the same experimental protocol to study a given effect.
Nevertheless in these situations different simulationists should be able to
reproduce each other's results in order to judge the significance and
limitations of the conclusions based on the experiments in question. More
generally, there is a large craft component in doing simulation research
just as there is a large craft component in doing other types of
scientific research--but this state of affairs does not mitigate the need
for reproducibility of the main experiments associated with such research. 


6. PEERS AND PUBLICATION


6.1 Is the Scientific Paper a Fraud?


Woodward and Goodstein cite Peter Medawar's (1991) paper entitled Is the
Scientific Paper a Fraud? to argue that because most archival papers in the
scientific literature do not accurately portray the way scientific research
is actually done, these papers fail to measure up to Feynman's ideal of
leaning over backwards. It is certainly true that primary journal articles
in the scientific literature do not document all of the mistakes, dead ends,
and backtracking that are an inevitable part of virtually every successful
scientific investigation. Medawar (1982, p. 92) himself admitted that 

I reckon that for all the use it has been to science about four-fifths of my
time has been wasted, and I believe this to be the common lot of people who
are not merely playing follow-my-leader in research. 

In my view, the fundamental issue here is that there simply is not enough
space in all the scientific journals to document the way that science is
actually done; moreover no one has the time to absorb all the final results
even in a relatively narrow area of specialization, much less to read the
associated background material. Nowadays many high school students are
sufficiently sophisticated to realize that primary journal articles are
vehicles for efficiently communicating significant discoveries rather than
for documenting the processes by which those discoveries were made.
Moreover, this issue is rapidly becoming moot because of current trends
toward complementing the printed version of a primary journal article with
comprehensive supporting documentation (such as appendices containing
lengthy proofs or detailed descriptions of experimental protocols) archived
on a World Wide Web server that is maintained by the journal's sponsoring
organization. 


6.2 Problems with the Peer Review System


Finally Woodward and Goodstein examine the peer review system for evaluation
of research proposals and primary journal articles, concluding that the
conflict of interest inherent in asking competitors to evaluate each other's
work has inflicted genuine distress on the system. In my own experience, by
far the most common form of misconduct by peer reviewers has nothing to do
with conflicts of interest; instead the problem is simple dereliction of
duty by reviewers who cannot be bothered to read and evaluate carefully the
work of other researchers. Although this remark applies to evaluation of
research proposals as well as refereeing of primary journal articles, I am
most concerned with problems in refereeing. In my judgment, the problem of
nonperformance by referees has reached epidemic proportions, and I believe
it is urgently necessary for the scientific community to address this
scandalous state of affairs. 

In preparing these remarks I solicited comments from numerous colleagues not
only in the simulation community but also in the hard scientific
disciplines, and I have been startled by the vehemence of their agreement
with my evaluation of the current state of the refereeing system. Based on
numerous conversations with colleagues in 

[Vo]:Line Broadening 5

[Remi Cornwall]

7. CONCLUSION


To close these remarks, I come back to the opening quotation by Richard
Feynman. In essence my central thesis is simply this: as scientists we
should all strive to live up to the standards of professional conduct so
memorably articulated by Feynman. Sophisticated (or merely sophistic)
rationalizations of anything short of this standard serve no constructive
purpose and should be avoided. In a time when public esteem for science has
been damaged by high-profile cases of scientific misconduct, we in the
simulation community have a unique opportunity to lead the way in achieving
Feynman's ideals not only in the design and execution of our experimental
procedures but also in our collective response to the challenges of
responsible, professional peer review. 


ACKNOWLEDGMENTS


Although they may not have found these remarks to be completely congenial, I
thank David Goodstein and James Woodward for their comments on this article.
I also thank the following individuals for insightful suggestions concerning
this article: R. H. Bernhard, L. F. Dickey, S. E. Elmaghraby, and S. D.
Roberts (North Carolina State Univ.); F. B. Armstrong and B. J. Hurley (ABB
Power TD Co.); C. Badgett (U.S. Navy Joint Warfare Analysis Center); K. W.
Bauer (Air Force Institute of Technology); R. C. H. Cheng (Univ. of Kent at
Canterbury); M. M. Dessouky (Univ. of Southern California); P. L'Ecuyer
(Univ. de Montréal); D. Goldsman (Georgia Institute of Technology); P.
Heidelberger (IBM T. J. Watson Research Center); M. Irizarry (Univ. of
Puerto Rico); R. W. Klein (Regenstrief Institute for Health Care); R. E.
Nance (Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State Univ.); B. L. Nelson
(Northwestern Univ.); A. A. B. Pritsker (Pritsker Corp. and Purdue Univ.);
R. G. Sargent (Syracuse Univ.); B. W. Schmeiser (Purdue Univ.); T. J.
Schriber (Univ. of Michigan); R. W. Seifert (Stanford Univ.); A. F. Seila
(Univ. of Georgia); P. M. Stanfield (ABCO Automation, Inc. and North
Carolina Agricultural and Technical State Univ.); J. J. Swain (Univ. of
Alabama-Huntsville); and M. A. F. Wagner (Boeing Information Services). The
quotation by Richard Feynman appearing at the beginning of this article is
reproduced with permission from W. W. Norton  Company. 


REFERENCES


*   Bacon, Francis. [1620] 1994. The novum organum; with other parts of
The great instauration. Chicago: Open Court. 
*   Broad, William, and Nicholas Wade. 1982. Betrayers of the truth. New
York: Simon and Schuster. 
*   Elliott, Deni, and Judy E. Stern, eds. 1997. Research ethics: A
reader. Hanover, New Hampshire: University Press of New England, for the
Institute for the Study of Applied and Professional Ethics at Dartmouth
College. 
*   Feynman, Richard P. 1985. Surely you're joking, Mr. Feynman!:
Adventures of a curious character. New York: W. W. Norton  Co. 
*   Fleischmann, Martin, and Stanley Pons. 1989a. Electrochemically
induced nuclear fusion of deuterium. Journal of Electroanalytical Chemistry
261 (2A): 301-308. 
*   Fleischmann, Martin, and Stanley Pons. 1989b. Errata. Journal of
Electroanalytical Chemistry 263: 187-188. 
*   Forscher, Bernard K. 1965. Rules for referees. Science 150:319-321. 
*   Gardner, Martin. 1957. Fads and fallacies in the name of science.
New York: Dover Publications. 
*   Gleser, Leon J. 1986. Some notes on refereeing. The American
Statistician 40 (4): 310-312. 
*   Honor in science. 1986. 2d ed. New Haven, Connecticut: Sigma Xi, The
Scientific Research Society. 
*   Huizenga, John R. 1993. Cold fusion: The scientific fiasco of the
century. New York: Oxford University Press. 
*   Knepell, Peter L., and Deborah C. Arangno. 1993. Simulation
validation: A confidence assessment methodology. Los Alamitos, California:
IEEE Computer Society Press. 
*   Langmuir, Irving, and Robert N. Hall. 1989. Pathological science.
Physics Today 42 (10): 36-48. 
*   Macrina, Francis L. 1995. Scientific integrity: An introductory text
with cases. Washington, D.C.: ASM Press. 
*   Medawar, Peter B. 1979. Advice to a young scientist. New York:
BasicBooks. 
*   Medawar, Peter B. 1982. Pluto's republic. Oxford: Oxford University
Press. 
*   Medawar, Peter B. 1991. Is the scientific paper a fraud? In The
threat and the glory: Reflections on science and scientists, ed. David Pyke,
228-233. Oxford: Oxford University Press. 
*   Nye, Mary Jo. 1980. N-rays: An episode in the history and psychology
of science. Historical Studies in the Physical Sciences 11 (1): 127-156. 
*   On being a scientist: Responsible conduct in research. 1995. 2d ed.
Washington, D.C.: National Academy Press. 
*   Popper, Karl R. 1972. The logic of scientific discovery. 3d ed.
London: Hutchinson. 
*   Sargent, Robert G. 1996. Verifying and validating simulation models.
In Proceedings of the 1996 Winter Simulation Conference, ed. J. M. Charnes,
D. J. Morrice, D. T. Brunner, and J. J. Swain, 55-64. Piscataway, New

RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs

[Remi Cornwall]

Opps! Typos and grammatical errors in past posts. Quick typing and very very
mild dyslexia I guess.

I find keeping problems really simple with analogies, get the bare facts of
the matter, brainstorm and then solve the problem works. I've never really
come across anything that doesn't succumb to reductionism. This is an
article of my faith. 

(yes I'm still thinking about that gas car PV, TS diagrams. I had some
misconceptions its one big potentially reversible adiabatic in the ideal
case without the long piston but a reciprocating engine releasing the
pressure in little steps. It doesn't have to be too limited if it can keep
to the grand sweep of that main adiabatic and could be a good form of energy
storage with some tricks). 

There is no mystery to economics it just that the experts want to keep
messing around with the definitions for ideological and control reasons.

The basic problem is the golden goose and people pissing in the beer to pass
it off as real:-

We'll give you fake beer so we can motivate you and some of you will
actually make real beer which we'll water down again. That's how this
refinancing trick goes - we keep picking the tab up, eventually.

Local currency schemes look good (and there is internet digital money). It's
a level up from barter but you trade with those whose word is good. Trouble
is you can't op-out because Nurse Mildred Ratched has got you bound into the
big gov. system and she knows what's best for you (she wants your tax too
and woe betide you if you don't pay that - you'll get your door kicked
down).

The future needs self-sufficient, sustainable communities (own means of #1
energy, #2 food, #3 waste disposal, #4 medicine, #5 building) than being
tied into greater society. Even in a city there can be SSSCs its just an
agglomeration.

If we do #1 then #2 and #3 look good. I note that #4 is being prevented in
Europe by the state trying to outlaw health foods. If you need a
prescription you get tied in, they have to scare you with horror stories
first though. Nurse Mildred Ratched will give you nightmares.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 12:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs

Have a read of this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_Currency

One was set up in Lewis East Sussex. Very pretty town. Trouble is the
outsiders tend to by the notes as souvenirs.

 

[Vo]:Lateral think Tata Motors

[Remi Cornwall]

Vo,

This is simply an energy storage problem. Forget all the adiabatics,
isothermals, reciprocating engines, Carnot, regenerators, multi-stage
systems etc. etc.

In the ideal case you go up and down an adiabatic pretty damn reversibly -
if you had a cylinder with a long piston.

All that happens is at the compression station it goes up, then (on PV) goes
down at constant volume, then goes down another adiabatic and comes out
cold. The rejected heat goes to environment, some work is available in the
car, and some of that work rejected to the environment comes back - herein
lies all the icing up problems and inefficiencies in design. It's a kind of
hysteresis.

I suggested lagging the tank and coming up with means of keeping the
pressure down and increasing the energy storage of the thing.

All it's doing is acting like a SPRING, so why not use the real thing???


The gas is used as a storage medium where the energy is stored in random
(non coherent) KINETIC ENERGY of the molecular motion hence all the
thermodynamics getting in the way of a simple problem. Traditionally we've
struggled with random motion and it leaking away. That's all the problem is,
no mystery to thermodynamics or unassailable problems if you **get out the
mind set**.

Now, a SPRING stores the energy in a COHERENT manner as POTENTIAL ENERGY
between the chemical bonds. If you keep it in the linear region (no
deformation) then there is little hysteresis.

It simply a question of what material you use.

So we store work against a few MPa in a gas or work against a few GPa in a
solid.

Why not CLOCKWORK POWERED Tata cars???


I've never loved Thermodynamics and feel the subject gets locked up in lots
of mysteries and can't do rules of thumb when it can be thought around or
even have its premises totally re-thought. No bogey man subject here telling
people what they can and I can't do.

I've never like the subject because it gives me silly limits. Speaking
artistically (and an engineer is 'artistic' (solves things from the human
perspective, art is a human construct), he creates what has never been,
where as a scientist discovers what is), it doesn't let you soar, constrains
the imagination too much. So I don't like it as a subject. Relativity is
like that too. Attack its premises and take it in new directions whilst
constrained by experiment and logic as the honest research must be. 

Designs and thoughts without limits when you break out of Society's imposed
rules. Break the mould it's no bogeyman can't do this can't do that
subject.

It strikes me a bit like music, ballet or architecture. They impose the
rules then someone breaks the mould, then they say what was the fuss?

RE: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

[Remi Cornwall]

Sorry Jones,

You know nothing. You aren't doing research at top universities, you don't
have supervisors/mentors at the highest level, have to be subject to
due-diligence, show real data, approach a problem from many directions and
get it to tie up, get peer reviewed. 

That is the mark of real science. It's honesty, openness, plasticity of
thought (the desire to move arguments on with more SOUND arguments and
DATA), has a receptive ear.

Mills doesn't appeal to REAL data nor appeal to the body of knowledge that
has come before. Get over it.

Remi.


-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 18:14
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

- Original Message 

From: Remi Cornwall 

 Yes it a Maxwell Demon but it can be done if you know your way around the
Maxwell Demon arguments.

This is not to detract from you argument, which I like -- 

... but would want to see more detail (like are you using the penduli in the
same way as the 'tuning fork' analogy?)

... yet I find it most amusing that you can readily accept a Maxwell Demon -
for which there is zero proof, and at the same time be so vocal in rejecting
the Mills theory of 'redundant ground states' of hydrogen; for which there
is ample proof from him, from cosmology; and even quasi-independent
University replication, where a megajoule of excess is documented, and with
little other way to explain it (non chemical at least).

Jones

[Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

[Remi Cornwall]

Vo,

All these things are just the energy vector.

At the moment we are constrained to the wheel running on road. (It's been
like for millennia until someone comes up with non-aerofoil levitation).

The most graceful solution to mobility of apelike-bipeds is the electric
motor 80% efficient.

The whole business of heat and reciprocating engines will seems quaint in
ten years.

I am of the opinion that I can make a heat battery say CaO + water (or how
about CaC + H2O - ethylene for you ICE fans). 

Useless low grade heat at the moment but with the ferrofluid temporary
remenance cycle I do at uni. heat will just routinely become another form of
energy you can transform too at 100% efficiency.

I mean a pendulum (in vacuo) cycles KE to PE and we see no mystery.

Take a coupled ensemble of those pendulums and the nice motion you've set up
at the start becomes randomised - you have trouble getting it back and we
call that entropy increase. However the individual pendulums are still,
perfectly inter-converting KE and PE.

Put something on the scale of these little atomic pendulums (moving on in
the argument) and you can tap and cohere this motion. Yes it a Maxwell Demon
but it can be done if you know your way around the Maxwell Demon arguments.
 
Basically you must have a discriminant function to decide what's fast and
slow (a gate etc.). The arguments come down to that your function gets
randomised because it is getting knocked about too (its small, on the scale,
right?) or that it is blinded by the isotropy of the radiation, or that it
must have a little computer running it and this inevitably rejects more heat
into the environment than the d.f. is trying to reduce.

All the old arguments are bogus if you use phase changes and think out of
the square. This can be argued macroscopically (thermodynamics T-S diagrams,
meso-scopically considering the chemical potential and nano-scopically by
molecular dynamics simulations. That's what I'm up to and I feel a renewed
vigour after all the years of boredom. It is an interesting subject.

RE: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

[Remi Cornwall]

if you know your way around the Maxwell Demon arguments
 
Demon Problem in a nutshell:
Basically you must have a **discriminant function** to decide what's fast
and slow (a gate etc.). The arguments come down to that your #1 function
gets randomised because it is getting knocked about too (its small, on the
scale, right?) or #2 that it is blinded by the isotropy of the radiation, or
#3 that it must have a little computer running it and this inevitably
rejects more heat into the environment than the d.f. is trying to reduce.

Here's the way out:
All the old arguments are bogus if you use phase changes and think out of
the square. This can be argued macroscopically (thermodynamics T-S diagrams,
meso-scopically considering the chemical potential and nano-scopically by
molecular dynamics simulations. That's what I'm up to and I feel a renewed
vigour after all the years of boredom. It is an interesting subject.

I need to type this up clearly in the thesis from all the early papers. It's
based on logic and fact. 

I'm not jerking myself off denying reality. I don't see the point in jerking
science because like God, it just stares back at one, unchanging, because it
just IS regardless of ONE.

If you want to play God with the laws of nature become a science fiction
writer. One day that kind of person will have their own Holo-deck or Fantasy
Island and they can make the rules, be rich, be loved but it will be an
imaginary world.



I am finding it fascinating and interesting again and that solely motivates
me, not the pursuit of money and shiny offices. 

Love the problem and solving the problem for its sake and forget the
trappings of office.

After I've done my projects I'll run off with some of my girlfriends into
nice exotic countries and happily live the life of a farmer, then disappear
into the background, job done.

I've got no ego trip merely a personal journey and to have fun for the mind.

Go cross-correlate that with sociopath crank messiah inventor types and
compare them to real scientists.

-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 18:14
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

- Original Message 

From: Remi Cornwall 

 Yes it a Maxwell Demon but it can be done if you know your way around the
Maxwell Demon arguments.

This is not to detract from you argument, which I like -- 

... but would want to see more detail (like are you using the penduli in the
same way as the 'tuning fork' analogy?)

... yet I find it most amusing that you can readily accept a Maxwell Demon -
for which there is zero proof, and at the same time be so vocal in rejecting
the Mills theory of 'redundant ground states' of hydrogen; for which there
is ample proof from him, from cosmology; and even quasi-independent
University replication, where a megajoule of excess is documented, and with
little other way to explain it (non chemical at least).

Jones

RE: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

[Remi Cornwall]

I have a lot of work to do and haven't touched this area for over two years
simply because I didn't want to push it in front of very conventional
supervisors.

The struggle has been to get into the mindsets of establishment scientists
and present the thesis. It's been difficult, breaking down a few times,
disappearing for months, popping up again, conceding (both ways), toning
stuff down, taking advice.

The MD stuff I'd never talk to my supervisors about at this stage. One was
trained as a theoretical physicist at Cambridge so no point arguing at this
stage. Wait for the data. No-one sticks their neck out until the bandwagon
is rolling.

More than anything I've learnt about research is that it is more like
politics. People are not necessarily wanting to solve problems but change
their positions when it becomes unsustainable. You go there all young and
giddy and have to tone it down.

http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/PartOutline.pdf

I think eqn. 33 page 16 is really neat and economical and I don't really
need to do the MD simulations but I will.

I want to tidy up this: http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/NonCarnot.pdf

Came to me in a flash a few years ago and was written down quickly. 

This one is very old (2002) and I am embarrassed by it. More prose than
maths (around page 5) http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/PTSP2ndLaw.pdf


REMEMBER THIS STUFF NEEDS TIDYING UP. When I have an idea I sketch it down
quickly not necessarily complete then I come back to it.


-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 18:14
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

- Original Message 

From: Remi Cornwall 

 Yes it a Maxwell Demon but it can be done if you know your way around the
Maxwell Demon arguments.

This is not to detract from you argument, which I like -- 

... but would want to see more detail (like are you using the penduli in the
same way as the 'tuning fork' analogy?)

... yet I find it most amusing that you can readily accept a Maxwell Demon -
for which there is zero proof, and at the same time be so vocal in rejecting
the Mills theory of 'redundant ground states' of hydrogen; for which there
is ample proof from him, from cosmology; and even quasi-independent
University replication, where a megajoule of excess is documented, and with
little other way to explain it (non chemical at least).

Jones

RE: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels

[Remi Cornwall]

Very easy to email and be snappy.

Sorry Jones, I just don't believe you can drop below ground state and not
see it in nature. Where is the spectrographic data?

Turn a 'scope at a hot nebula and Mills should get lines he predicts.

Preferentially hydrogen (and all the other stuff) should have dropped to the
ground state long ago.

So why are we all excited? (if you excuse the pun)

Why isn't everything collapsing so that atoms are about 10pm in size?

What's kicking us up from his sub-levels and why doesn't it then kick us
higher? Why aren't things routinely ionized?

It's nothing personal but this is getting my goat.

Come on, simple answers. Get to the point.

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

Jones be fair on people (as we all must be) conversions on the Road to
Damascus (St Paul, sh.t not a good analogy) don't happen in infinitesimal
time due to finite processes in brains.

Like I said, research, like a pop song needs a catchy hook because people
won't drop everything quickly when they have vested interests and a job.

You want people to stop watching pop idol and go and listen to an hour and
half of avant-garde, atonal, serial music by Oliver Messian say. Most people
who can hum a tune would say the notes are all wrong. The educated would
say, Ah we know Dr Messian's work we've been awaiting this symphony. See
what I'm getting at?

Now:
Preferentially hydrogen (and all the other stuff) should have dropped to the
ground state long ago.

So why are we all excited? (if you excuse the pun)

Why isn't everything collapsing so that atoms are about 10pm in size?

What's kicking us up from his sub-levels and why doesn't it then kick us
higher? Why then aren't things routinely ionized?

-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 19:36
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata, Butanol, Biofuels



- Original Message 

From: Remi Cornwall 

 Where is the spectrographic data?

He has found these lines, Remi! 

apparently you are reluctant to read his theory, but it is all in there.

 Turn a 'scope at a hot nebula and Mills should get lines he predicts.

Exactamundo ! where have you been? 

This is part and parcel of the theory and without it, few of us would be as
convinced.

Matter of fact, without the cosmological stuff, and before the Rowan report,
I could probably agree with most of the criticism, as he has made some
fairly serious math errors.

These are documented on the HSG forum. They are errors, but they are not
fatal to the theory, and will probably be reconciled sooner or later.

Jones

Re: [Vo]:Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels, RE: [Vo]:hydrino lines

[Remi Cornwall]

Thanks I can see some logic coming out here and in Jone's previous post.

 PVN: Regarding the groundstate of the H atom: in Mills theory the ordinary

groundstate is the first level of a series of 137 which can only be reached
by energy transfer through collision. No fotons are emited when energy is
released.

Below n = 1 won't you require selection rules to prevent emission of
photons. You see I find this bogus. You say the energy is given over in
collisions so just what do you think are the expression of those forces?

PVN: Unfortunately these lines can also be caused by transitions within the
Fe atom.

Principle of parsimony - Occam's Razor.

PVN: The fact that the corona is so abnormal hot is probably caused by a
until now unknown heating mechanism.

Probably has a lot to do with magneto-hydro-dynamics. I think that is the
way the mainstream is pointing on that one.

Also Jones, Steven, there's a nice quick proof in Feynman III about the size
of atoms where he uses the Uncertainty Principle in a 1/r well.

Since the charges are the same, to get any lower must mean that 'h' has
changed. How, why?


I accept that a lot of stuff goes by under the radar. We are pattern
recognition machines and isn't bloody odd that when you buy a car suddenly
you keep seeing the same car on the road, in the same colour! 

-Original Message-
From: Peter van Noorden [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 20:25
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:hydrino lines

Hello Remi,

In the spectrum of the solar corona, all the hydrino lines are visible. 
Unfortunately
these lines can also be caused by transitions within the Fe atom.
The fact that the corona is so abnormal hot is probably caused by
 a until now unknown heating mechanism. The blacklight reaction could 
produce the heat
( about 200eV/reaction ). The reactionproduct of the He+ and H interaction 
is a dihydrinogas
which is very stable and not easily ionised. This dihydrinogas is a 
candidate for dark matter.
Regarding the groundstate of the H atom: in Mills theory the ordinary 
groundstate is the first level of a series of
137 which can only be reached by energy transfer through collision. No 
fotons are
emited when energy is released. After a hydrino ( small electron) is formed 
without any radiation, an electron is captured
which can be detected as an EUV foton.

Peter van Noorden
the Netherlands



- Original Message - 
From: Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 8:26 PM
Subject: [Vo]:Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels


 Rename this thread.


 Very easy to email and be snappy.

 Sorry Jones, I just don't believe you can drop below ground state and not
 see it in nature. Where is the spectrographic data?

 Turn a 'scope at a hot nebula and Mills should get lines he predicts.

 Preferentially hydrogen (and all the other stuff) should have dropped to 
 the
 ground state long ago.

 So why are we all excited? (if you excuse the pun)

 Why isn't everything collapsing so that atoms are about 10pm in size?

 What's kicking us up from his sub-levels and why doesn't it then kick us
 higher? Why aren't things routinely ionized?

 It's nothing personal but this is getting my goat.

 Come on, simple answers. Get to the point.




 

RE: [Vo]:Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels, RE: [Vo]:hydrino lines

[Remi Cornwall]

I accept that a lot of stuff goes by under the radar. We are pattern
recognition machines and isn't bloody odd that when you buy a car suddenly
you keep seeing the same car on the road, in the same colour! 


But when our Neural nets get programmed to the wrong reason it stays stuck
to the wrong model to explain everything.

I understand researchers in the mind believe that is the mechanism behind
faith and superstition.

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

Stephen:
Is there a simple, concise explanation of why a hydrogen atom can't
spontaneously collapse to a hydrino, by radiating away the transition
energy as a photon? I.e., why is a collision with a catalyst necessary?

 PVN: Regarding the groundstate of the H atom: in Mills theory the 
 ordinary groundstate is the first level of a series of 137 which can only
be reached by energy transfer through collision. No fotons are emited when
energy is released.

 RC: Below n = 1 won't you require selection rules to prevent emission of
photons. You see I find this bogus. You say the energy is given over in
collisions so just what do you think are the expression of those forces?

 RC: Also Jones, Steven, there's a nice quick proof in Feynman III about
the size of atoms where he uses the Uncertainty Principle in a 1/r well.
Since the charges are the same, to get any lower must mean that 'h' has
changed. How, why?


-Original Message-
From: Stephen A. Lawrence [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 21:12
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels



Mike Carrell wrote:
 ... The ground state is
 simply the relaxed state in a vacuum, neither ionized nor catalyzed.
 Mills' discovery is that the fractional state can be reached by
 selective catalysis under special conditions.

I have a Very Dumb Question here.

Is there a simple, concise explanation of why a hydrogen atom can't
spontaneously collapse to a hydrino, by radiating away the transition
energy as a photon?

I.e., why is a collision with a catalyst necessary?

If the only simple answer is Don't be so lazy, Read The Book, well,
whatever ... but I'm hoping it's possible for someone here to give an
approximate summary of the reason in a few sentences.

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

On quick inspection of this and scan reading (how one always reads stuff
first) some points:

#1 Feynman is one of the greatest ever educators and he has simple little
footnotes and tricks to get you rough and ready answers. Much like the
famous Chopin (or Schuman?) saying, you will be a solid pianist if Bach is
your daily bread. I keep him to hand always when starting from the ground
up on some problem. That one on calculating the sizes of atoms gets the
crucial ideas across quickly and is correct.

#2 The Uncertainty relation doesn't really 'come from' the Schrodinger
Equation, however it does pop out from the Fourier Transform and waves. It
really came about as the old quantum mechanics with ad-hoc Summerfield
quantisation rules were systematically thought over by Heisenberg's Matrix
Mechanics. At the core he explored the ideas of conjugate variables not
commuting. Jordon showed that Schrodinger's approach is the same as
Heisenberg and once again Feynman gives a brilliant 'derivation' of the S.E.
using matrix mechanics and the state approach taken in the limit.

So these are just points of presentation on the history of science which may
appear pedantic. 

# Argument 1 on page 7 is wrong.

Delta a x delta p = h

Feynman does precisely this. 'a' the size is precisely delta 'a' if the
centre is 'zero'. Likewise in this 'little solar system' model 'p' is delta
'p' if your zero is zero. The motions are define wrt to the centre of the
system.

He is not doing delta (a x p) = h as is claimed.

# Argument 2 on page 7 see point #2 above. As regards the equation 'kinetic
energy of rotation' he lists and reference [20] I don't have it to hand but
looking at that equation it is a mishmash of a classical equation and a
quantum result. You can't expect it to be totally right. When Feynman does
that it is to get a rough and ready result. Since the formula is wrong Mills
conclusion is then wrong. ***Don't extrapolate results with wrong
formulas.***

You can't talk about 'kinetic energy of rotation' it is a classical concept,
the electron doesn't rotate but takes on a waveform centred over the atom.
It is precisely why QM was created when Maxwell came up with EM theory -
atoms would radiate down to nothing. Classical concepts are easy heuristics
and you must apply the correct quantum equations. 

Nobody else works like this. They would begin with 'let's get a rough and
ready calculation', 'let's get a feel of the magnitude of things'. He is say
its correct!!!

I can't be bothered to read the rest because everything else is based on
these howlers.
 
Building a thesis is like building a house - the foundations must be secure.


-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 21:37
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels



Remi, Stephen:


 RC: Also Jones, Steven, there's a nice quick proof in Feynman III about
the size of atoms where he uses the Uncertainty Principle in a 1/r well.
Since the charges are the same, to get any lower must mean that 'h' has
changed. How, why?

The World According to Mills:


The  Fallacy of Feynman's Argument on the Stability of the Hydrogen  Atom
According to Quantum Mechanics 


-  R.L. Mills, Annales de la Fondation Louis de Broglie,  Vol. 30, No. 2,
(2005), pp. 129-151.

http://www.ensmp.fr/aflb/AFLB-302/aflb302m185.pdf

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

I give another example of howlers I've seen where people then go and run off
on a wild goose chase with faulty underlying assumptions:

#1 A man builds some kind of trolled with two rotating arms which swing
around in synchrony. He tries it on ice and sees that is moves around. He
puts it on a pendulum and kicks one way.

He's cracked reaction-less propulsion and broken CoM! Dedicates his life to
it. 'Educates' me about long jump athletes, 'you see that's why they swing
their arms and legs'.

We go up to BAe special projects system and around the table their brains
say things like 'differential friction'. I chip in you can punt across an
ice rink if you resolve the normal reaction force to a horizontal component
down the pole. 

It dawns on us that the weights are shifting the centre of mass about and
it's rocking on its base.

#2 A man builds some rings and rollers and sees (so he thinks) the magnets
accelerating as he touches them slightly. No it's just a low friction system
with complicated, cusp-like forces and you disturbed the equilibrium.

#3 A man observes an electron tube burn out. He takes it to and expert and
the expert comes up with some circular vacuum drum (he hid batteries in it
BTW) then it mutates to a linear tube with magnets on the outside.

'How's does it all work then'. 'Err, err it's a rate of change of flux'. 'No
you are saying V = dBA/dx 'cos the field is tapering when it's V = dB/dt.'
'So what you saying is that if I shake a charge on the other side of the
galaxy I get instantaneous communication (in classical physics) and
transference of mass energy'.

#4 A man builds a ramp with a tapering track with magnets either side and
sees a ball dragged up it and fall off the end perhaps to do it all again.
 
No it's a system of field building a potential well (like a harmonic
oscillator but more complicated) and the reason why your ball got dragged up
the ramp is that it is not in the equilibrium position and hence you started
the oscillation like a pendulum to one side. Just watch it damp down.

And so on. Faulty premises. We all do it but if you're honest you censor
yourself. The cosmic censor is going to do it for you anyway.

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

No, no, no. Argue what we know and extend the argument if there is anything
new.

I am not prepared to read one more line of Mills until he sorts out his
premises and those howlers.

Your honour, as the court knows we are assuming a system of justice based
on English common law and 1500 years of tradition. Let us ignore that and go
on the basis that what I say is right because I say it is and you should
read up on the law according to me in an easy to digest 1000+ page volume
for only £1000 download, because your education is obviously deficient
(tsck!) if you display any ignorance.

Or 
As you know in the past it has been suggested that a sphere is infinitely
symmetrical thing which is the locus of constant distant from a centre
(tsck!) but this is not the case for I have actually proven that a sphere is
spiky and irregular...

Come off it Jones.

Don’t worry, the cosmic censor will get him.

-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 23:23
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

Remi,

Most of the problem you are having with this is that for Mills,electrons are
not infinitesimal points nor probability  waves surrounding infinitesimal
point particles.  

To quote the introductory material on HSG: electrons are  spinning 2D
electric and magnetic flux surfaces  (orbitspheres) that deform into
various geometries  under different conditions.  This insight into the
resolution of wave-particle duality leads to practically  obvious
explanations of mysterious, counter-intuitive  quantum particle behaviors -
explanations for which were  previously the sole domain of quantum theory
and its offspring.

Most of your objections have been argued over the years, and the threads can
be followed on:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/hydrino/

I can understand why you may not want to wade through this old material or
to join the discussion group at this late stage. Mills himself was
responding to objections up til about 2003 and has at one time or another,
responded to almost everything, but not to the satisfaction of the skeptics.


There can be no clear resolution of this situation, since Mills diverts from
normal physics so early and so drastically; and from then on, there is no
turning back. He pretty much intends at this point in time to present to the
world a device which derives energy from the orbitsphere's reduced angular
momentum and let the results do most of the talking wrt to his idiosyncratic
methods and assumptions - which seem strange to you, or to everyone who has
been taught the consensus viewpoint.

Is everyone out of step but Randy? 

Hard to say,but in such a situation, juxtapposed to the 'big picture' need
of world energy resources; and the mounting experimental evidence which has
been accumulated - it would be foolish from a societal POV for this to be
overlooked becasue so-and-so even a Feynman, or a Zimmerman, or a
Cornwall, etc. etc. does not like the way that it differs from what they
have been taught.

Jones

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

I remember reading John's Searl's (giggle) thesis and his Laws of the
Squares law of, well, everything.

Well call me tardy but I knew several things obeying laws greater than
second order.

It was written like a comic book on sort of crape paper (you know the ones
where you cut out pictures and paste them in) and went from everything like
stars and galaxies, pollution to the sizes of women's breasts - and just to
prove it there was a picture, given as example, of some lovely with a right
lovely pair. I frowned and quickly washed my hands because the pages seemed
a bit glued together at that point. 

-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 23:23
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

Remi,

Most of the problem you are having with this is that for Mills,electrons are
not infinitesimal points nor probability  waves surrounding infinitesimal
point particles.  

To quote the introductory material on HSG: electrons are  spinning 2D
electric and magnetic flux surfaces  (orbitspheres) that deform into
various geometries  under different conditions.  This insight into the
resolution of wave-particle duality leads to practically  obvious
explanations of mysterious, counter-intuitive  quantum particle behaviors -
explanations for which were  previously the sole domain of quantum theory
and its offspring.

Most of your objections have been argued over the years, and the threads can
be followed on:

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/hydrino/

I can understand why you may not want to wade through this old material or
to join the discussion group at this late stage. Mills himself was
responding to objections up til about 2003 and has at one time or another,
responded to almost everything, but not to the satisfaction of the skeptics.


There can be no clear resolution of this situation, since Mills diverts from
normal physics so early and so drastically; and from then on, there is no
turning back. He pretty much intends at this point in time to present to the
world a device which derives energy from the orbitsphere's reduced angular
momentum and let the results do most of the talking wrt to his idiosyncratic
methods and assumptions - which seem strange to you, or to everyone who has
been taught the consensus viewpoint.

Is everyone out of step but Randy? 

Hard to say,but in such a situation, juxtapposed to the 'big picture' need
of world energy resources; and the mounting experimental evidence which has
been accumulated - it would be foolish from a societal POV for this to be
overlooked becasue so-and-so even a Feynman, or a Zimmerman, or a
Cornwall, etc. etc. does not like the way that it differs from what they
have been taught.

Jones

RE: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels

[Remi Cornwall]

I UNSUBSCRIBE TO THIS.

SCIENCE NOT SCIENCE FICTION.

-Original Message-
From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 October 2008 23:56
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]: Mills' recapitalisation of energy levels


- Original Message - 
From: Stephen A. Lawrence [EMAIL PROTECTED]




 Mike Carrell wrote:
 ... The ground state is
 simply the relaxed state in a vacuum, neither ionized nor catalyzed.
 Mills' discovery is that the fractional state can be reached by
 selective catalysis under special conditions.

 I have a Very Dumb Question here.

 Is there a simple, concise explanation of why a hydrogen atom can't
 spontaneously collapse to a hydrino, by radiating away the transition
 energy as a photon?

That is *not* a VDQ at all. It is profound and fundamental and historic. As 
the 'planetary' model of the atom began to emerge in the late 1800s, it was 
realized that the model predicted that the electron, being accelerated [in a

circular path] should radiate energy and fall into the proton. A hot black 
body would radiate its heat in a flash. Yet these things do not happen. The 
salvation was the idea that radiation could occur only at discrete 
frequencies, and Quantum Theory was born.

The next question was what mechanism determined those discrete frequencies? 
Mills' answer was to conceive that the electron was a a two-dimentional, 
superconducting, shell of moving charge. It was like a resonator cavitywhich

would support only modes with an interger relationship to size. This 
followed Maxwell's equations and gave a 'natural' quantization and a 
conceptual continuity between the atomic and macroscopic worlds. Thus Mills'

claim that GUTCP is valid over 85 orders of magnitude. If accepted and 
tested, this is a landmark achievment in physics.

I don't know why Mills selected 137 as the highest degree of shrinkage. The 
number 137 appears in strange places in physical theory. Hydrinos can 
catalyze each other, but one goes to a higher state as the other goes to a 
lower state. Mills has observed spectral lines associated with 11 degress of

shrinkage. More may occur, but they are so rare that the radiation signature

has not been detected.

 I.e., why is a collision with a catalyst necessary?

 If the only simple answer is Don't be so lazy, Read The Book, well,
 whatever ... but I'm hoping it's possible for someone here to give an
 approximate summary of the reason in a few sentences.

Again not a VDQ, but a VGoodQ, and the heart of the BLP reactions. Consider 
an isolated hydrogen atom. If, say, a singly ionized argon atom comes within

a certain distance of the hydrogen atom, energy is transfered without a 
photon being created. This transfer destabilized the hydrogen electron's 
orbit and it moves to an orbit closer to the proton, releasing a burst of 
energy as a ultraviolet photon. The hydrogen is now smaller, a hydrino. In

this state it can acquire another electron, becoming a hydride, or combine 
with another hydrino as a compound, or become a catalyst to another H or 
hydrino. The energy initially transfered is very specific, 27.2 eV. Hence it

is called a resonant transfer, abbreviated rt or RT. It is resonant 
because the energy required is specific, 27.2 eV or an integer multiple of 
27.2. Ionized argon is one example. He+, Rb+, O++, K+, 2H and NaH also 
fufill the requirement. There are probably others. In general, Mills states 
that anything presenting the right energy hole will do.

Actual contact is not reqluired, but the exact conditons have not been 
disclosed by Mills  [if they are actually known to him]. This resonant 
transfer is not an invention of Mills, for it is known in other places, 
such as fluroescent phosphors. It is a phenomenon of nature. These reactions

are demonstrated in animations to be found on the website.

Hope this helps.

Mike Carrell




 
 This Email has been scanned for all viruses by Medford Leas I.T. 
 Department. 

RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

This is what a colleague at QMUL said:

Remi, 
in compressed in air engines regenerative braking is usually considered to
be best achieved by compressing air into a seperate (small) tank. Obviously
this also causes some heating - but the main advantage is that it allows
the extra energy to be used when required - ie when accelerating (much
harder with heat energy). Also - I think it would be difficult to utilise
heat from braking to keep the engine at a stable temperature, as this would
mean that when the driver is not braking sufficiently to meet the design
point, the engine would freeze up.
Thanks though - always on the lookout for new ideas.
H.

I think it is so simple that he is slightly missing the point too. He is
talking about a continuous run where the engine and tank have reached a
stable temperature (covered in ice and below ambient). N2(l) engines (what
he does) use a 'fuel' injector approach into the cylinder and mix it with
air. I'm not sure they dehumidify or just spew out fine ice in the exhaust.
I'm not sure what toll fine ice grit takes on the engine. I'll ask him.
Anyway we are talking compressed air engines.

I don't think he is really seeing the suggestion about application in
stop-start situations and that really most of the k.e. (99% ?!! really?!!!)
could go back to the tank.

I think the suggestion is so simple it is defeating me too. It was conceived
late in the day when I was muzzy. I've been a little sleepless thinking
through the night. It's now morning and I'm even more muzzy and it just
doesn't seem right but then again it does.

Once again:

Forget the losses from the expansion and the venting and running the motor.
Say 80% of the PE in the tank gets to the wheel. Say because we are going so
slowly that wind/rolling resistance is not a problem. In stop-start we could
get back most of that 80% even it is seen as a useless dissipative process
and just waste heat.

The temptation would have to been put a heat engine on the waste heat and
drive a compressor. No need, a 'useless' dissipative process actually in the
limit lets you recover 'all' the KE.

The tank looses internal energy U - mc(T2-T1) part of this coupled back so 
U - mc(T2-T1)+ k* mc(T2-T1). It discharges slower.

It can't be this simple. Something has got to be wrong. It seems paradoxical
and one has to argue both sides to find the 'why'.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 October 2008 02:09
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of
compressed air!

In a nutshell the problem is this:

1) We want to preserve the charge on the tank in stop-start situations

2) (Obviously the available work eventually venting to the atmosphere will
be less than the potential energy stored in the tank. This is not the
question for those not sharp enough to understand what is going on. You
can't turn 100% of the pressurized energy into work)

3) When driving a certain amount will be lost to wind, rolling resistance
etc. Since this is low speed it ain't much.

4) It is fair to say that in short stop-start conditions most of the kinetic
energy at the wheels ends up in the brakes as heat.

5) There is no law preventing us from conducting most of that heat back to
the tank but the difference in temperatures and ratios of the heat
capacities of the brakes to the tank. On engineering terms 'all' the heat
could go back to the tank if the brakes had low heat capacity and were very
hot.

We could elect to send the heat back with a heat engine and compressor but
heat flow does this more gracefully. Not all dissipative heat flow is a dead
end for engineers.

6) Imagine a continuous stop-start cycle where we can compute the average
energy out from the tank and the average energy back into it. It would seem
that if the outflow from the tank is O and the inflow is I, then the new
outflow is O - I.

7) Naively 6) should preserve the life of the tank charge:

The tank temperature is linear in I, E = mcT

And the work from the tank is f(T) and nRTln P1/P2 for an isothermal process
at least. So linear in T too.

If the whole plant function was very sensitive to the tank temperature
(higher order terms in T) then the process would be worthwhile.

8) In the steady state the assumption at 6) is probably correct because of
(7)

9) Realistically stop-start cycles won't be 'regular'. The temperature will
not reach equilibrium and there will be very little change in the tank
temperature at next power demand despite our feedback. In short the thing
would be sluggish.

It probably would be better to have a SMALL high pressure reserve tank to
capture the braking energy that then rapidly give it out on the next power
demand. 

2pm and that probably is the answer without detailed work. May look at it
again in a few days.

RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

Another post from me. May be I haven't seen it yet and the penny hasn't
dropped but for what its worth, a few design sketches. Shame we can't upload
pictures to vortex.

Imagine the tank 'lagged' with water and the water tank is itself lagged
too. At the filling plant the heat from compression goes into the lagging
water tank so it is not wasted. Instead of the tank dropping to 30C ambient
in our Indian city it is at 70C, say after the tank is pumped. Just doing
isothermal work between two pressures nRTln(P1/P2) it is proportional to
temperature so there is a gain straight away in having a hot tank.

The water is acting like a heat battery.

Now a simple control system pumps heat from the red hot brakes back into the
tank making sure it is not running in reverse and actually cooling the tank
when the brakes are cold (a clever scheme could be conjured here, a sort
holding tank which only puts in if it has greater temperature than the
lagging tank. You might lose the thread in the digression).

Overall result, range increased.

It can't be this simple??

Now H. at QMUL is very conventional minded and I don't think would drop
something quickly to try something else out. He's got the tools and
equipment (great lab) but I just don't see him as that kind of guy to run
off on wild ideas. He comes across as very methodical. I don't think he'd be
seen dead on vortex either if he saw CF/LENR and other stuff.

Anyone wants to try this out? If I was tooled up I'd do it today.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 October 2008 08:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of
compressed air!

This is what a colleague at QMUL said:

Remi, 
in compressed in air engines regenerative braking is usually considered to
be best achieved by compressing air into a seperate (small) tank. Obviously
this also causes some heating - but the main advantage is that it allows
the extra energy to be used when required - ie when accelerating (much
harder with heat energy). Also - I think it would be difficult to utilise
heat from braking to keep the engine at a stable temperature, as this would
mean that when the driver is not braking sufficiently to meet the design
point, the engine would freeze up.
Thanks though - always on the lookout for new ideas.
H.

I think it is so simple that he is slightly missing the point too. He is
talking about a continuous run where the engine and tank have reached a
stable temperature (covered in ice and below ambient). N2(l) engines (what
he does) use a 'fuel' injector approach into the cylinder and mix it with
air. I'm not sure they dehumidify or just spew out fine ice in the exhaust.
I'm not sure what toll fine ice grit takes on the engine. I'll ask him.
Anyway we are talking compressed air engines.

I don't think he is really seeing the suggestion about application in
stop-start situations and that really most of the k.e. (99% ?!! really?!!!)
could go back to the tank.

I think the suggestion is so simple it is defeating me too. It was conceived
late in the day when I was muzzy. I've been a little sleepless thinking
through the night. It's now morning and I'm even more muzzy and it just
doesn't seem right but then again it does.

Once again:

Forget the losses from the expansion and the venting and running the motor.
Say 80% of the PE in the tank gets to the wheel. Say because we are going so
slowly that wind/rolling resistance is not a problem. In stop-start we could
get back most of that 80% even it is seen as a useless dissipative process
and just waste heat.

The temptation would have to been put a heat engine on the waste heat and
drive a compressor. No need, a 'useless' dissipative process actually in the
limit lets you recover 'all' the KE.

The tank looses internal energy U - mc(T2-T1) part of this coupled back so 
U - mc(T2-T1)+ k* mc(T2-T1). It discharges slower.

It can't be this simple. Something has got to be wrong. It seems paradoxical
and one has to argue both sides to find the 'why'.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 October 2008 02:09
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of
compressed air!

In a nutshell the problem is this:

1) We want to preserve the charge on the tank in stop-start situations

2) (Obviously the available work eventually venting to the atmosphere will
be less than the potential energy stored in the tank. This is not the
question for those not sharp enough to understand what is going on. You
can't turn 100% of the pressurized energy into work)

3) When driving a certain amount will be lost to wind, rolling resistance
etc. Since this is low speed it ain't much.

4) It is fair to say that in short stop-start conditions most of the kinetic
energy at the wheels ends up in the brakes as heat.

5) There is no law preventing us from conducting most of that heat back

RE: [Vo]:TOTALLY SEEN IT NOW. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

The penny has dropped completely now. Totally see it.

H. at QMUL is right but so am I.

Imagine we somehow get the brake heat back to the tank. The shell could be
glowing red hot but if it doesn't have time to equilibrate the charge in
the tank would be used up in the normal fashion like nothing happened. 

Heat conduction is a 2D process. Potentially slow.

Somehow getting that fraction of the brake back to the tank by COMPRESSION
(a 3D process acting on all the gas) would be more efficient. Hence H.s
suggestion at QMUL that people use a SMALL regenerator tank to kick the next
power demand.

However...

If the tank was ***space filled*** with an electric element (so large
surface area) and glowed very hotly, most of the 'dead' k.e. *would* be
returned to the tank very quickly before the next power demand...

But electrical regenerative braking is not good at slow speeds and won't
static brake.


The best suggestion and they probably do it already is to lag the tank at
the compressing plant. The area between the adiabatic line and the
isothermal line (which the tank would drop to without lagging) is just
wasted energy.

Good fun. Back to TEC and other stuff I do.

RE: [Vo]:TOTALLY SEEN IT NOW. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

Oh no, emailing again

On filling the tank have a lag of material (or even put it in the tank with
high surface area) that changes phase so would tend to suppress the
adiabatic heating but release this energy back to the gas. That would make
it easier to cram a lot of charge into the tank without the tendency of
fighting the rise in temperature and needing to have excessively high
pressure tanks.

Use gearing on the electrical regenerative braking. Make the dump load
variable so the force felt back at the wheels is not suddenly large (due to
all the gearing) but can go right down to slow speeds. This would be better
than a compressor which is just a Carnot engine.

Would be a fun project. Haven't got the time or resources. You know how long
getting funds takes. 

I especially like the 'active tank'/compensated tank concept using a phase
changing buffer to keep the heat and pressure down in the tank.

Must get on now.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 October 2008 10:39
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:TOTALLY SEEN IT NOW. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

The penny has dropped completely now. Totally see it.

H. at QMUL is right but so am I.

Imagine we somehow get the brake heat back to the tank. The shell could be
glowing red hot but if it doesn't have time to equilibrate the charge in
the tank would be used up in the normal fashion like nothing happened. 

Heat conduction is a 2D process. Potentially slow.

Somehow getting that fraction of the brake back to the tank by COMPRESSION
(a 3D process acting on all the gas) would be more efficient. Hence H.s
suggestion at QMUL that people use a SMALL regenerator tank to kick the next
power demand.

However...

If the tank was ***space filled*** with an electric element (so large
surface area) and glowed very hotly, most of the 'dead' k.e. *would* be
returned to the tank very quickly before the next power demand...

But electrical regenerative braking is not good at slow speeds and won't
static brake.


The best suggestion and they probably do it already is to lag the tank at
the compressing plant. The area between the adiabatic line and the
isothermal line (which the tank would drop to without lagging) is just
wasted energy.

Good fun. Back to TEC and other stuff I do.

[Vo]:Thermodynamics

[Remi Cornwall]

So you see,

 

I’m just not interested in conventional thermodynamics. I find the subject
boring.

 

No matter how we do this compressed air engine thing: adiabatic expansion
charging into the cylinder, followed by further adiabatic expansion in the
cylinder, followed by isothermal expansion scavenger stages it all comes
down to one thing: Carnot. Between liquid air temp and say 300K there’s not
much you can do in turning that to useful work. On the other hand the non
Carnot regenerator (returning KE to tank) seems interesting.

 

I just find the subject boring unless people are working with phase changes
and saying explicitly that you can convert 100% heat to work.

http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/PartOutline.pdf I got bogged down in
molecular dynamic simulations and other models just at the point when my
supervisors were seeing the argument with what I was doing with ferrofluid.
I think eqn. 33 is really neat an economical and I don’t really need to do
the simulations but I will.

 

I want to tidy up this: http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/NonCarnot.pdf
which came to me in a flash a few years ago and was written down quickly. I
have to do the stuff at the front of the thesis (above) to break the
argument across in the methodical way that university wants.

 

Also the ferrofluid problem is being cracked. We know it can be done because
a chap produced papers in the late 80s on audio frequency ferrofluid. I have
to get the induction and susceptibility up, to get net-power. 

 

Nether-the-less I have proof of the independent flux idea but await better
ferrofluid for the cooling with one reservoir then excess power tests.

 

I always test my hypothesis with data, mine or someone else’s/know fact. 

 

Funds got diverted from my project because two arsehole cranks I warned the
investor about for years wasted probably over £1M of his money. It was all
Star Trek and not Science (one to do with rotating magnets, rings and
rollers, the other to do with static magnets and an electron gun. Both total
bolloxs both guys were nuts, literally). They never sort peer review or even
internal review but because one called himself “professor” and the other was
a “professor” from a polytechnic (for what that’s worth!) that took
precedence over me. I was right and now I am able to move things along with
matched funding.

 

Also there were a lot of shenanigans, thick people (including the lecturers)
and politics at the polytechnic (Brighton) so I left it and that wasted 3
years.

 

So that is what has happened to our TEC expert – sheer bloody boredom. 

 

Dullards everywhere! 

 

I only did science for the stimulation and to meet like minded people.
Seriously. 

 

It has been very boring so far. I’ve only come across one or two people (not
here) whose scientific talent shines out, the rest are journeymen.

 

 

[Vo]:Laws of economics

[Remi Cornwall]

Thomas,

I find this amazing: these very trained, usually journeyman, uncreative type
physicists would be the first to tell people in the new energy that you
can't create energy out of nothing, do this do that. Yet they suspend sane
ideas of conservation laws, mass action and logic and then go and join the
banking sector and spend their time coming up with complex financial
instruments which are trying to do the impossible.

May be a few laws of economics along the lines of physics are required to
remind them:

1) delta W - 0 as t - 0. Wealth (W) cannot be created out of thin air in
an infinitesimal amount of time.

2) W  0 as t  0. Humans displaying more intelligence than pond life (just)
can improve their lot over time and hence wealth can increase.

3) VW.t =  H You can borrow or create Virtual Wealth on the never never for
a short period of time given by H'idiots constant but the cosmic censor is
watching and wants it back some day. This is known as the HirePurchasenberg
Certain Trouble Principle.

4) Wealth locked up in assets is Concretised Wealth and is ordered,
coherent, meaningful Wealth.

5) When Concretised Wealth is liquidated it becomes Kinetic Wealth or Cash.

6) Releasing a lot of Wealth on the market creates the Potential to make
more Wealth.

7) The Law of General Increase of Surplus Cash and Disorder (Inflation) is
not a nice one. It is better to tie up wealth in more ordered things like
Concretised Wealth.

7a) If wealth is released in a rapid/fool hardy manner it actually
dissipates Wealth. This is known as the CantDo Law. Wealth creation
processes are thus CantDo Law limited.

When Kinetic Wealth is released gradually, realistically by mature educated
people in slow processes (as opposed to get rich quick processes) it has the
potential to do a lot of good. However this requires patience which is a
higher human function (see pond life).

8) Path Independence: When you are creating more Wealth it doesn't really
matter what path you take in expressing this as long as it is constructive,
improves the lot of mankind and the planet and is done in an ethical way. 

However complex financial instruments (applying 'complex' pseudo
mathematical operators and procedures on the measures of Wealth) to give you
the Expectation of More Wealth actually does nothing useful. 

Thus 'Hedging it', 'betting it', 'collateralising it' actually in themselves
don't increase Wealth,

That sirs requires Talent.


-Original Message-
From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 02:46
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Anti cold fusion and anti-HOT-fusion book

Remi Cornwall wrote:

Last one from me for a bit... (probably)
  

From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


My nephew thinks that laser fusion projects such as the ITER, will work. 
OTOH, he's savvy enough not to spend his own money on this research. 
He'd happily spend your (tax) money on it however. 


I guess with a numerate higher degree you can retrain as a financial
engineer!! Black-Scholes and all that!! No, no, I know several people who
did that, tasted the highlife for a bit and now, oh dear.

Masters of Disasters (MaD) or Paper Hanging Device (PhD) in Financial
Engineering
  

That's exactly what my Nephew is studying to be, they call them Quats.



--- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html ---

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

 OK, perhaps I was too power hungry. 
ROFL

You get lots of ICE when you release compressed air!


On Oct 28, 2008, at 2:13 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:

 Edmund Storms wrote:

 A normal car needs at least 100 hp to meet  the needs of speed and  
 hills in the US.

 The Prius ICE delivers 70 hp max.

 As Stephen A. Lawrence pointed out, small cars such as the older VWs  
 had 35 hp motors, and kept up with traffic. However they were kind  
 of dangerous at highway speeds. Lightweight yet safe vehicles could  
 be developed using advanced materials and techniques.

 My 1994 Geo Metro, which one reviewer affectionately called a  
 hamster powered tin can on wheels has a 55 hp motor which was  
 barely enough for U.S. highways when the car was new.

 - Jed

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

Seriously about the ice...

Could not a form of regenerative braking be achieved?

-Original Message-
From: Terry Blanton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 20:42
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I would like to suggest that we no longer refer to the infernal
combustion engine as an ICE.  Water ice is such a marvelous and
beautiful material and is degraded by the acronym.  I believe it would
be more appropriate to refer to the combustion engine as an IC engine.
 Icky better describes the device and its byproducts.

Regards,

Terry

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 OK, perhaps I was too power hungry.
 ROFL

 You get lots of ICE when you release compressed air!


 On Oct 28, 2008, at 2:13 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:

 Edmund Storms wrote:

 A normal car needs at least 100 hp to meet  the needs of speed and
 hills in the US.

 The Prius ICE delivers 70 hp max.

 As Stephen A. Lawrence pointed out, small cars such as the older VWs
 had 35 hp motors, and kept up with traffic. However they were kind
 of dangerous at highway speeds. Lightweight yet safe vehicles could
 be developed using advanced materials and techniques.

 My 1994 Geo Metro, which one reviewer affectionately called a
 hamster powered tin can on wheels has a 55 hp motor which was
 barely enough for U.S. highways when the car was new.

 - Jed

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

It's obvious. The air is a storage medium which has been compressed
adiabatically then allowed to cool. As it cools the pressure goes down and
the available work decreases.

In operation it will cool below ambient (and get caked in ice) reducing the
pressure still further and the useful work.

Couple the hot disc brakes to the cylinders (some kind of circulation system
or do it electronically) and recoup that energy which just gets wasted
anyway. Very good on stop start urban cycles.

You know they give out patents for that type of thing. Improvements
relating to compressed air engines.

Piece of piss to do.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 20:51
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

Seriously about the ice...

Could not a form of regenerative braking be achieved?

-Original Message-
From: Terry Blanton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 20:42
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I would like to suggest that we no longer refer to the infernal
combustion engine as an ICE.  Water ice is such a marvelous and
beautiful material and is degraded by the acronym.  I believe it would
be more appropriate to refer to the combustion engine as an IC engine.
 Icky better describes the device and its byproducts.

Regards,

Terry

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 OK, perhaps I was too power hungry.
 ROFL

 You get lots of ICE when you release compressed air!


 On Oct 28, 2008, at 2:13 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:

 Edmund Storms wrote:

 A normal car needs at least 100 hp to meet  the needs of speed and
 hills in the US.

 The Prius ICE delivers 70 hp max.

 As Stephen A. Lawrence pointed out, small cars such as the older VWs
 had 35 hp motors, and kept up with traffic. However they were kind
 of dangerous at highway speeds. Lightweight yet safe vehicles could
 be developed using advanced materials and techniques.

 My 1994 Geo Metro, which one reviewer affectionately called a
 hamster powered tin can on wheels has a 55 hp motor which was
 barely enough for U.S. highways when the car was new.

 - Jed

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

In fact in the limit, 'all' the wasted braking energy could be coupled back
because there is no limit on how hot you can make the interface plate.

Imagine the car is braking pretty hard for a few seconds then power output
would be say 100kW and the disks would glow red hot (say 600C). If you chose
to get this power electronically and coupled through a very small volume, it
would get say white hot, plasma hot. Fundamentally 'all' the wasted braking
power can be coupled back.

On the other hand if you used a heat engine between red heat and air temp to
run a compressor then by Carnot you'd waste some of this energy. (This is
towards the latter half of my thesis. There is nothing 'fundamental' about a
Carnot cycle apart from the fact that it has two reservoirs and so always
rejects heat to the lower. You can form one reservoir heat engines One
thinks outside the box)

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 21:12
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

It's obvious. The air is a storage medium which has been compressed
adiabatically then allowed to cool. As it cools the pressure goes down and
the available work decreases.

In operation it will cool below ambient (and get caked in ice) reducing the
pressure still further and the useful work.

Couple the hot disc brakes to the cylinders (some kind of circulation system
or do it electronically) and recoup that energy which just gets wasted
anyway. Very good on stop start urban cycles.

You know they give out patents for that type of thing. Improvements
relating to compressed air engines.

Piece of piss to do.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 20:51
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

Seriously about the ice...

Could not a form of regenerative braking be achieved?

-Original Message-
From: Terry Blanton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 20:42
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I would like to suggest that we no longer refer to the infernal
combustion engine as an ICE.  Water ice is such a marvelous and
beautiful material and is degraded by the acronym.  I believe it would
be more appropriate to refer to the combustion engine as an IC engine.
 Icky better describes the device and its byproducts.

Regards,

Terry

On Tue, Oct 28, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
 OK, perhaps I was too power hungry.
 ROFL

 You get lots of ICE when you release compressed air!


 On Oct 28, 2008, at 2:13 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:

 Edmund Storms wrote:

 A normal car needs at least 100 hp to meet  the needs of speed and
 hills in the US.

 The Prius ICE delivers 70 hp max.

 As Stephen A. Lawrence pointed out, small cars such as the older VWs
 had 35 hp motors, and kept up with traffic. However they were kind
 of dangerous at highway speeds. Lightweight yet safe vehicles could
 be developed using advanced materials and techniques.

 My 1994 Geo Metro, which one reviewer affectionately called a
 hamster powered tin can on wheels has a 55 hp motor which was
 barely enough for U.S. highways when the car was new.

 - Jed

RE: [Vo]:What happend to our TEC expert?

[Remi Cornwall]

It's good but I can do better. I didn't feel the need to comment.


-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 21:57
To: vortex
Subject: [Vo]:What happend to our TEC expert?

There was a time, not to long ago, when Remi was somewhat of a resident
expert on thermoelectric conversion - TEC - and he has a page to prove it:

http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/Thermoelectric_Conversion.htm

 ... so Remi - given that you are not shy with opinions on all kinds of
things and issues for which your are less conversant - may I ask why you
have neglected to comment on the JTEC:

http://www.johnsonems.com/jhtec.html

Your expertise here would not doubt be invaluable to the huddled masses

Jones

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

I'll work it out for you tomorrow after I've done some main work. I map out
how I will calculate in the morning.

It's not that trivial and runs something like this, with these assumptions:

A) Big tank, connected by isolating valve to small cylinder of the engine.
B) Consider run between tank and cylinder is small (no volume) but we can
ascribe temperature to both tank and cylinder.

1) Cylinder TDC no volume for argument's sake. Start at P1 V1 T1
Expand adiabatically (quick) to P2 V2 T2
Calculate the work

2) Middle, P2 V2 T2
Isolate tank. So tank at P2 V1 T2
Cylinder at P2 V2a T2   V2a = V2 - Vtank = V2 - V1

Let cylinder expand adiabatically to P3 V3 T3

Calculate the work. This is part of the engine output

3) Bottom. Let cylinder vent to atmosphere so Pa V4 T4 in another adiabatic
(quick process)

Calculate the work. This is the remainder of the engine output

So the above is like the little kernel of a subroutine to calculate output
in ONE cycle if you know the end points.

The assumptions about adiabatics and polytropic processes I need to watch
carefully.

Both tank and cylinder run cold below Ta (ambient).
Let's say the tank is lagged. The cylinder isn't and has a heat flux coming
in from Ta. Let's say it reaches some STEADY temperature below Ta but above
Ttank.

Run the calculation and see how the tank cools and see how the power output
of the engine falls in time.

Now model some heat flux into the tank at STEADY state and run the steady
state calculations between start conditions and end to work out the engine
power.

Now see how with regenerative braking that in stop-start situations we can
raise the temperature of the tank and recover waste energy. It arrests it
tendency to get colder and colder as it does work there by prolonging the
lifetime of the charge. You've seen it say when you empty a calor gas
cylinder it gets a crust of ice around it (also liquid to gas phase change).
If the cylinder is warm the gas will spew out faster and that is what is
driving the compressed air engine.

It's a little bit involved but if you have the engineering intuition you
have probably seen what I'm getting at already but if you are Jones
has-Beene-never-was you just insult people to gain cheap points.


-Original Message-
From: Michael Foster [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 22:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I take it none of you guys has been in Indian traffic or seen the typical
vehicle mix. A compressed air car would be perfect for India.  Even on the
highways the speed limit is 60 kph, roughly 40 mph.  It's never that high in
the cities.

Imagine the type of traffic you get when no one pays any attention to the
marked traffic lanes except the sacred cattle who line up facing the flow of
vehicles, looking rather placid and pleased with themselves.

It's not unusual to see a family of five riding a motor scooter. Combine
that with the autorickshaws with a capacity of four but stuffed with up to
20 people and various animal powered carts in addition to conventional
autos, and you can imagine that the traffic doesn't move too fast. 

Any vehicle that could start and stop in such traffic without the
inefficiencies of an ICE would be a boon to the average Indian citizen and
without the expense of a hybrid.  The reduction in air pollution would be an
improvement in the major cities, where most of the small cars are diesel
powered.


M.


  

RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

Now a colleague of mine who actually works on N2(l) engines says that the
practice is to have a small high pressure reserve tank for regenerative
braking. So this has been thought about. Yes he says, the tank as you cram
it gets hot but he's never thought about the problem of feeding back to the
tank. So worth looking at still, I guess.

Feeling through the problem, if the tank is very large its temperature will
drop ever so slightly from the work, W. The regen-heat input would raise the
tank temperature linearily (mcT) and say for isothermal expansion W =
nRTln(P1/P2) so that is linear too (in T) and it would be worthwhile to
feedback the regen heat. 

Now P1P2 so write ln(P1/P2) as ln( (P2+P) / P2) so ln(1+x) = 1 -x^2/2 +
x^3/3...

The point is P2 will be a function of T and the expression nRTln(P1/P2)
might not end up linear enough in T and the decline in work output from
the decline in temperature of the tank may not be compensated for, much, by
feeding back the waste heat.

Then one must put in latency as the heat has to flow and equilibrate in the
tank and we are considering a stop-start scenario. A sudden pulse of heat to
the outside of the tank may have very little effect (or time to) on the
pressure output from the tank.

It may be that the combined regeneration system and engine would just be too
lethargic in response to add any significant benefit. This is what my
colleague was hinting at. So the high pressure, SMALL capture reserve tank,
even though it gets hot still works out better in the end.

It's late, I'm tired. What seemed an obvious idea is in fact rather
involved.

Usually most problems need a lot of working through and mathematical
modelling to see if there is any point.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 October 2008 01:06
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I'll work it out for you tomorrow after I've done some main work. I map out
how I will calculate in the morning.

It's not that trivial and runs something like this, with these assumptions:

A) Big tank, connected by isolating valve to small cylinder of the engine.
B) Consider run between tank and cylinder is small (no volume) but we can
ascribe temperature to both tank and cylinder.

1) Cylinder TDC no volume for argument's sake. Start at P1 V1 T1
Expand adiabatically (quick) to P2 V2 T2
Calculate the work

2) Middle, P2 V2 T2
Isolate tank. So tank at P2 V1 T2
Cylinder at P2 V2a T2   V2a = V2 - Vtank = V2 - V1

Let cylinder expand adiabatically to P3 V3 T3

Calculate the work. This is part of the engine output

3) Bottom. Let cylinder vent to atmosphere so Pa V4 T4 in another adiabatic
(quick process)

Calculate the work. This is the remainder of the engine output

So the above is like the little kernel of a subroutine to calculate output
in ONE cycle if you know the end points.

The assumptions about adiabatics and polytropic processes I need to watch
carefully.

Both tank and cylinder run cold below Ta (ambient).
Let's say the tank is lagged. The cylinder isn't and has a heat flux coming
in from Ta. Let's say it reaches some STEADY temperature below Ta but above
Ttank.

Run the calculation and see how the tank cools and see how the power output
of the engine falls in time.

Now model some heat flux into the tank at STEADY state and run the steady
state calculations between start conditions and end to work out the engine
power.

Now see how with regenerative braking that in stop-start situations we can
raise the temperature of the tank and recover waste energy. It arrests it
tendency to get colder and colder as it does work there by prolonging the
lifetime of the charge. You've seen it say when you empty a calor gas
cylinder it gets a crust of ice around it (also liquid to gas phase change).
If the cylinder is warm the gas will spew out faster and that is what is
driving the compressed air engine.

It's a little bit involved but if you have the engineering intuition you
have probably seen what I'm getting at already but if you are Jones
has-Beene-never-was you just insult people to gain cheap points.


-Original Message-
From: Michael Foster [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 October 2008 22:30
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

I take it none of you guys has been in Indian traffic or seen the typical
vehicle mix. A compressed air car would be perfect for India.  Even on the
highways the speed limit is 60 kph, roughly 40 mph.  It's never that high in
the cities.

Imagine the type of traffic you get when no one pays any attention to the
marked traffic lanes except the sacred cattle who line up facing the flow of
vehicles, looking rather placid and pleased with themselves.

It's not unusual to see a family of five riding a motor scooter. Combine
that with the autorickshaws with a capacity of four but stuffed with up to
20 people and various animal powered carts in addition

RE: [Vo]:In a nutshell the problem is this. Tata Motors - full of compressed air!

[Remi Cornwall]

In a nutshell the problem is this:

1) We want to preserve the charge on the tank in stop-start situations

2) (Obviously the available work eventually venting to the atmosphere will
be less than the potential energy stored in the tank. This is not the
question for those not sharp enough to understand what is going on. You
can't turn 100% of the pressurized energy into work)

3) When driving a certain amount will be lost to wind, rolling resistance
etc. Since this is low speed it ain't much.

4) It is fair to say that in short stop-start conditions most of the kinetic
energy at the wheels ends up in the brakes as heat.

5) There is no law preventing us from conducting most of that heat back to
the tank but the difference in temperatures and ratios of the heat
capacities of the brakes to the tank. On engineering terms 'all' the heat
could go back to the tank if the brakes had low heat capacity and were very
hot.

We could elect to send the heat back with a heat engine and compressor but
heat flow does this more gracefully. Not all dissipative heat flow is a dead
end for engineers.

6) Imagine a continuous stop-start cycle where we can compute the average
energy out from the tank and the average energy back into it. It would seem
that if the outflow from the tank is O and the inflow is I, then the new
outflow is O - I.

7) Naively 6) should preserve the life of the tank charge:

The tank temperature is linear in I, E = mcT

And the work from the tank is f(T) and nRTln P1/P2 for an isothermal process
at least. So linear in T too.

If the whole plant function was very sensitive to the tank temperature
(higher order terms in T) then the process would be worthwhile.

8) In the steady state the assumption at 6) is probably correct because of
(7)

9) Realistically stop-start cycles won't be 'regular'. The temperature will
not reach equilibrium and there will be very little change in the tank
temperature at next power demand despite our feedback. In short the thing
would be sluggish.

It probably would be better to have a SMALL high pressure reserve tank to
capture the braking energy that then rapidly give it out on the next power
demand. 

2pm and that probably is the answer without detailed work. May look at it
again in a few days.

RE: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange

[Remi Cornwall]

Morning.

I never f..king swear you fill the words in. It's the way your mind works,
you see...

And I didn't do Team America.

-Original Message-
From: R C Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 00:07
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange


And Mom, wash Remi's mouth out with soap before you tuck him in.  The 
problem with letting a kid hang around college students is they pick up on 
the slang without ever learning there is a difference between wisdom and 
knowledge.
Richard

Remi wrote,
Sorry bedtime the clocks have gone back. 

[Vo]:The sub-prime crisis

[Remi Cornwall]

Could this be how the sub-prime crisis occurred?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP5EC1S_F20

 

Oh this one's good too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz9_YfIQaz4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uz9_YfIQaz4feature=related
feature=related

 

 

 

 

 

 

RE: [Vo]:Anti cold fusion and anti-HOT-fusion book

[Remi Cornwall]

Last one from me for a bit... (probably)

 From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

 My nephew thinks that laser fusion projects such as the ITER, will work. 
 OTOH, he's savvy enough not to spend his own money on this research. 
 He'd happily spend your (tax) money on it however. 

Yeah but what is the cost when someone creates a bubble over a certain metal
on the stock market or across the energy market in general anyway. It causes
lack of business confidence, people loose jobs, government spending goes up
anyway in a multitude of ways (not just welfare) say, crime increase.

Swings and roundabouts. It's all interconnected.

When it comes to the economy I'm not sure left or right knows what they are
doing. It seems a little fiat and mild coercion shifts butts and gets the
job done.

 As for the wrecked careers, the hot fusion physicists have used this dream
 as a cash cow for over a half century. AFAIK, there's no end in site.

I guess with a numerate higher degree you can retrain as a financial
engineer!! Black-Scholes and all that!! No, no, I know several people who
did that, tasted the highlife for a bit and now, oh dear.

Masters of Disasters (MaD) or Paper Hanging Device (PhD) in Financial
Engineering

They nailed their faeces to the wall.

TaahoMas! TaahoMas! You get in dere and you kill dat mouse!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mammy_Two_Shoes 

RE: [Vo]:More notes on the Obama campaign techniques and technology

[Remi Cornwall]

Shuuks Jed, you're giving it all away...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spy_vs._Spy


http://www.dccomics.com/mad/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_magazine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_mad_mad_mad_world

Neuman for president! (Or Mills or Searl)

-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 14:47
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:More notes on the Obama campaign techniques and technology

This is somewhat off topic but we are living through historic events 
and I thought people would be interested in hearing some first-hand 
reports of them.

Here are some more notes on my impressions of the Obama campaign, 
relevant to their ability to deal with technical problems.

The Obama people seem to be good at solving difficult, intractable 
problems. They are skillful and decisive. They make decisions in 
minutes that would take other campaigns hours or days. I saw a pile 
of donated junked computer parts at the campaign headquarters, and I 
said to the 20-something kid in charge: let me assemble some of 
those for you. He said: go for it, we really need more computers, 
so I did. (I brought some of my own cyber-junk.) He didn't even know 
my name. No authorization, BS phone calls or waiting: just go for 
it. They are frugal, clever with technology and psychology, 
resourceful and young, like a startup tech company circa 1980. They 
keep track of people. As one commentator put it, they never lose 
your phone number.

They are using clunky and unreliable web-based software to keep track 
of their Get Out The Vote (GOTV) campaign, but the advantage is that 
the software is dirt cheap and it works with any computer anywhere, 
including the cyber-junk (spare-parts) computer I assembled.

Here is an example of their psychology. My daughter described a 
meeting she attended. They asked for volunteers and maybe 60 new 
people showed up. All young people, who always carry cell phones 
these days. The first thing the Obama people did was to hand out 
sheets of paper with four telephone numbers on each sheet. They said 
to the potential volunteers: Here are the numbers of four people who 
registered to vote with our campaign. Please call these four numbers 
and urge them to vote. The paragraph on the bottom tells you what to 
say, 'Hello, I am with the Obama campaign . . .' The thing is, when 
people first volunteer they may feel inhibited or embarrassed about 
calling strangers. But after you call three or four people, you 
realize it is not difficult and you are more inclined to continue. 
Plus when you are with a large group of people who are all doing it 
for the first time you feel some pressure to go along with the 
others, and you see that other people may feel awkward but they are 
capable of doing it.

The campaign does many things that never would have occurred to me, 
such as advertising Obama in on-line adventure games and other 
cyberspace gathering places, which my daughter calls the new public 
space. Here is a cute illustration of that:

http://www.npr.org/templates/common/image_enlargement.php?imageResId=9603096
3

Caption:

In this image provided by Kathryn Grim, two furry avatars wearing 
Barack Obama shirts attend a meeting at the SecondLife Obama campaign 
headquarters.

That sentence would have been meaningless 10 years ago, and 
incomprehensible 30 years ago. I cannot imagine trying to explain to 
my grandmother what a furry avatar is, or what it has to do with 
winning a presidential campaign.



By the way, I have left-over cyber-junk free for anyone who needs it: 
a 16 X read-write internal DVD drive with cables, and an external USB 
read-wright DVD drive. If anyone has a use for either one, contact me 
directly. You pay shipping only.

- Jed

RE: [Vo]:More notes on the Obama campaign techniques and technology

[Remi Cornwall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck9jg25sbII

Love the bit with Abe Lincoln.

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 15:09
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:More notes on the Obama campaign techniques and technology

Shuuks Jed, you're giving it all away...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spy_vs._Spy


http://www.dccomics.com/mad/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_magazine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Its_a_mad_mad_mad_world

Neuman for president! (Or Mills or Searl)

-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 14:47
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:More notes on the Obama campaign techniques and technology

This is somewhat off topic but we are living through historic events 
and I thought people would be interested in hearing some first-hand 
reports of them.

Here are some more notes on my impressions of the Obama campaign, 
relevant to their ability to deal with technical problems.

The Obama people seem to be good at solving difficult, intractable 
problems. They are skillful and decisive. They make decisions in 
minutes that would take other campaigns hours or days. I saw a pile 
of donated junked computer parts at the campaign headquarters, and I 
said to the 20-something kid in charge: let me assemble some of 
those for you. He said: go for it, we really need more computers, 
so I did. (I brought some of my own cyber-junk.) He didn't even know 
my name. No authorization, BS phone calls or waiting: just go for 
it. They are frugal, clever with technology and psychology, 
resourceful and young, like a startup tech company circa 1980. They 
keep track of people. As one commentator put it, they never lose 
your phone number.

They are using clunky and unreliable web-based software to keep track 
of their Get Out The Vote (GOTV) campaign, but the advantage is that 
the software is dirt cheap and it works with any computer anywhere, 
including the cyber-junk (spare-parts) computer I assembled.

Here is an example of their psychology. My daughter described a 
meeting she attended. They asked for volunteers and maybe 60 new 
people showed up. All young people, who always carry cell phones 
these days. The first thing the Obama people did was to hand out 
sheets of paper with four telephone numbers on each sheet. They said 
to the potential volunteers: Here are the numbers of four people who 
registered to vote with our campaign. Please call these four numbers 
and urge them to vote. The paragraph on the bottom tells you what to 
say, 'Hello, I am with the Obama campaign . . .' The thing is, when 
people first volunteer they may feel inhibited or embarrassed about 
calling strangers. But after you call three or four people, you 
realize it is not difficult and you are more inclined to continue. 
Plus when you are with a large group of people who are all doing it 
for the first time you feel some pressure to go along with the 
others, and you see that other people may feel awkward but they are 
capable of doing it.

The campaign does many things that never would have occurred to me, 
such as advertising Obama in on-line adventure games and other 
cyberspace gathering places, which my daughter calls the new public 
space. Here is a cute illustration of that:

http://www.npr.org/templates/common/image_enlargement.php?imageResId=9603096
3

Caption:

In this image provided by Kathryn Grim, two furry avatars wearing 
Barack Obama shirts attend a meeting at the SecondLife Obama campaign 
headquarters.

That sentence would have been meaningless 10 years ago, and 
incomprehensible 30 years ago. I cannot imagine trying to explain to 
my grandmother what a furry avatar is, or what it has to do with 
winning a presidential campaign.



By the way, I have left-over cyber-junk free for anyone who needs it: 
a 16 X read-write internal DVD drive with cables, and an external USB 
read-wright DVD drive. If anyone has a use for either one, contact me 
directly. You pay shipping only.

- Jed

RE: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

I am posting too much.

*Fund a chair* at a very good university. Get someone with balls (or
ovaries) who is well respected (and above it all) and can street fight if it
comes down to it.

I can't remember the name of the chap doing CF at MIT... Let them be your
president and chief administrator (you can vote them off). Get a visionary
who is strong and still young but mature 45-55.

Rather than make the chair exclusive let the chair be cross subject, say
micro-electronics and LENR research with a requirement that they must devote
at least half their time, seriously to each chair.

They will liaise with universities, industrial labs, talented individuals
and small teams and add some coherency.

If you still had Julian Schwinger I guess he would have been good for this
role.

You need a champion for the downtrodden. Well connected, a real mover and
shaker who gets a foot in the door at government level.

Try the scientific society who's who and get a group of your leaders to meet
them. Ask for a few hours of their time politely in a non-formal, get to
know-ya session. Make sure the people you send have too done good stuff
outside the CF field, not necessarily science. Say an ex-general etc.

This DOE report of a few years ago, didn't half think it was worth pursuing.
Why not contact that half?

Long live the Queen, long live the president. Gawd bless you marm!

-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 17:57
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

OK Thomas, suppose your letter is believed and answered. Exactly how  
would you propose this money be spent and by whom? You can say, this  
is not your concern.  However, somebody has to provide the answer.  
This is impossible unless the field can agree on what the consensus  
thinks is the best approach.  Would you want the loudest or the most  
well connected to make this decision, which is what usually happens to  
government programs?  While I agree letter writing can have an effect  
if it addresses an obvious solution on which many people agree. The CF  
field is not in this position.  The information you propose to include  
in your letter is important but I suspect all aware people at the  
national level these days already know this.  The question is what do  
they do about this knowledge?  Without this information, the letter  
will be wasted.

Ed


On Oct 27, 2008, at 11:35 AM, thomas malloy wrote:

 Edmund Storms wrote:

 As for a letter, someone will be asked to describe exactly how the   
 requested money will be spent, exactly who will do the work, and  
 when  the promised results can be expected. Without a rational and   
 scientifically correct answer, all of the

 I would suggest making the case that there are numerous experiments  
 showing surplus energy production, isotopes which are rare in nature  
 occurring in high quantities, and radioactive materials becoming  
 nonradioactive in weeks, not millennia. I would also mention BLP's  
 exotic material production. I would mention the LENR site, and the  
 documentation that it provides.

 I would continue by saying that the mainstream scientists have  
 fought this technology by all means at their disposal. I would  
 speculate that the results conflict with their preconceived notions.  
 However, I would hasten to mention that they have received over $150  
 billion in research grants, and that just covers hot fusion, not  
 radioactive element remediation. In spite of this resistance, the  
 research into LENR has continued funded in large by individuals.

 I would conclude by suggesting that the government commit 1/10 as  
 much to LENR as it has to hot fusion and Yucca Mountain.


 --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! --
http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html 
  ---

RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs

[Remi Cornwall]

Concepts such as money supply, paper money, gold standard, inflation and
government borrowing apply here.

Monetarists say that inflation didn't exist before paper money and big 20
century government spending.

How should a central bank manage money supply and the interest rate? How
independent should it be from government control? Are they merely the minter
of coins, the bank of banks or the government's banker? 

Is modern wild credit fashion just a natural inevitable consequence of
valueless money from the fashion for big government spending? Government did
it so why shouldn't joe public? We live by example.

I don't know enough history and economics nor have the benefit of experience
of living through several economic cycles in my adult life. When last did
'you never had it so good' then so bad.


-Original Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 21:43
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs


Some terms defined:
IUO is an I-Owe-You
An IOU is given for what *will be* produced. I will define this as pure
debt.

ITU is an I-Thank-You.
An ITU is given for what *has been* produced. I will call this pure
credit. This is in contrast with credit derived from the creation debt,
which is consistent with a banker's conception of credit. A good portion
of wages is derived from debt, so a wage is not really a pure source of
credit.

Because the current monetary system is debt-driven, it fails to
recognize the value and significance of ITUs. This has resulted in
overproduction and pointless consumption.

Harry

RE: RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs

[Remi Cornwall]

and show him the tomato sauce trick. The ex-patient sees how the orderlies
have built up a real blood bank for their retirement and given the very
voluminous toxic blood back to the nurses to somehow purify and put back
into circulation.

Both nurses and orderlies feel fine because the M3 figure was fine for a few
years despite an honest nurse complaining about irrational exuberance with
the blood dilution and the blood making machine.

Suddenly many patients die and they begin to realise that M1 is the real
blood although they forgot that long ago. You've really done it this time
shriek the nurses to the orderlies! Nurses come to the rescue and take all
the toxic blood in one fell swoop, say a few incantations and crank up the
blood-making-out-of-thin-air-machine. The orderlies are given some quality
liquidity blood which they promptly hide.

The patients are going to be very anaemic for a few years.

It's late. I'm tired and vague and need to think about this. 

-Original Message-
From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 27 October 2008 23:18
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs


Prior to the 20th century (from records dating back to about 1800) there
were periods of inflation followed by periods of deflation.

Harry

- Original Message -
From: Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Monday, October 27, 2008 6:47 pm
Subject: RE: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs

 Concepts such as money supply, paper money, gold standard, 
 inflation and
 government borrowing apply here.
 
 Monetarists say that inflation didn't exist before paper money and 
 big 20
 century government spending.
 
 How should a central bank manage money supply and the interest 
 rate? How
 independent should it be from government control? Are they merely 
 the minter
 of coins, the bank of banks or the government's banker? 
 
 Is modern wild credit fashion just a natural inevitable consequence of
 valueless money from the fashion for big government spending? 
 Government did
 it so why shouldn't joe public? We live by example.
 
 I don't know enough history and economics nor have the benefit of 
 experienceof living through several economic cycles in my adult 
 life. When last did
 'you never had it so good' then so bad.
 
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Harry Veeder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 Sent: 27 October 2008 21:43
 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Cc: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Subject: [Vo]:IOUs and ITUs
 
 
 Some terms defined:
 IUO is an I-Owe-You
 An IOU is given for what *will be* produced. I will define this as 
 puredebt.
 
 ITU is an I-Thank-You.
 An ITU is given for what *has been* produced. I will call this pure
 credit. This is in contrast with credit derived from the creation 
 debt,which is consistent with a banker's conception of credit. A 
 good portion
 of wages is derived from debt, so a wage is not really a pure 
 source of
 credit.
 
 Because the current monetary system is debt-driven, it fails to
 recognize the value and significance of ITUs. This has resulted in
 overproduction and pointless consumption.
 
 Harry
 
 
 
 

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

Mike and all,

Yes it is a really fascinating discussion for all the usual reasons, some of
them science.

We've got a future energy group at university which is damn rigorous, full
of good people, attached to other great departments and universities YET
amazingly open minded and tolerant if you obey the house rules: if you are
junior you get everything checked over by your betters before using the name
of the institution and listen to advice.

As I've said on this list I saw a lecturer/research fellow stand up in a
seminar in front of the head of ITER (hot fusion in Europe) and mention CF.
I thought this would be career suicide. 

It's a rocky road to acceptance but the old conspiracy theories can wear
thin, just like a person were always to say it 'cos I'm a member of this
substitute minority they're got it in for me. It might work a few times
then it will piss people off.

That Mills Treatise/grand thesis, like a novel I'd expect to get hooked if
it knew how to tease me from page to page:

1) The data: unequivocal data for excess heat production. The hard ball nuts
and bolts engineering and design calculations that reliably makes your
apparatus. GENERALLY ACCEPTED FACT.

2) HYDRINOS, we got some! Some *measured* properties of Hydrinos, an
equation of state, density measurements, emission data,
diffraction/crystallography data, reaction kinetics data, calorimetry,
specs, mass measurement more more more WHAT CAN YOU DO WITH 60 MILLION
DOLLARS!

3) Taking the stuff further: anomalous astronomical data NOBODY KNEW WHAT
THAT EMISSION LINE WAS AT 54eV for years.

4) Then you start laying on the treatise and telling everyone they are
wrong.


However if it's like this:

Chapter 1) You're all wrong. I ain't got much data yet but trust me. Unlearn
everything (logic, simple arithmetic too). I've got nothing that's generally
accepted but here's my GUT.

Chapter 2) Here's more GUT.

I guess that that smart productive band of people 20s to 50 who are good
senior fellows, post docs, PhDs, MScs, final year students, won't even
bother with it. Your jobbing research fellow going along to seminars will
leave a seminar PDQ. There are similarities to getting research out and
election hustings - there's a lot of emotion over reason.  

So what are left to think?
Crank science, charismatic/loopy leader, flawed science, acolyte troops of
hangers on to the funding money (hey, nice offices, nice logos)

Or they had something but the leader got a bit cranky? Keep a distance.

-Original Message-
From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 01:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

Remi,

Thanks for the calibration and apologies for any apparent condescension. I'm

retired afer 38 years as a senior systems engineer for RCA, bridging between

the research world and the production world.

Regards,
Mike Carrell




- Original Message - 
From: Remi Cornwall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 6:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


 It's alright Mike I am a seasoned researcher, engineer, been in industry,
 know the ropes, have some aptitude, done some work, know a few things, 
 seen
 a few things. People are busy and they don't tend to want to re-learn 
 stuff
 if it doesn't come to the point soon, claims too much, looks too slick
 (websites and overheads) and requires outlay to download papers.

 Remi, I've suggested some homework. When you look at the website, include
 the mamagement credentials and stay tuned. BLP's next step will require 
 some

 very serious money and very serious people are interested, despite the
 turmoil in the financial world. BLP's posture is shifting fromn research 
 to
 development.

 Mike Carrell

I mean is anything generally accepted/corroborated,
 peer reviewed?

 i.e. can you make the clever people at the Ivy League or Fortune500 labs
 want to spent their time on it?

 
NaH apparently qulaifies as a catalyst because heating can intiate a
reaction resulting in H[1/3] which is a hydrino catalyst.
 

 And such stuff.

 Like anyone in Physics, Engineering or Chemistry in graduate school or
 postdoc level could just pick and say I know this to be a fact.

 I mean I will show you bogus as bogus gets: look up John Searl on Wiki or
 YouTube. It's done in the style of science to look scientific when it 
 is
 science fiction and snake oil.

 I'm not saying Mills is but taking the stance of an impartial observer 
 who
 knows how difficult it is passing muster with peers at top universities
 and
 how important it is to take people's advice over presentation matters.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: 25 October 2008 18:30
 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


 - Original Message - 
 From: Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 10:21 PM
 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

You know organisations, big plans, fail when the leadership is weak. It's
tragic when people get promoted beyond their ability or the ability of their
ego to contain it all. Then the hangers on smell the carrion.

I'd rather take a quiet role as advisor than the captain of the ship.
Technical knowhow and business don't often mix.

Yeah, the Ivy Leaguers don't know everything but I'd sooner have an Ivy
Leaguer directing it all, peer reviewing, running the whole show, patrician
and patronising as they may be, than submit to the Searls, Steorns, The
Meyers, Mills(?), The Millers(he's a UK phenomenon nipped in the bud),
Newmans, Enrons, Bear Sterns of this world than the totally-gone
laissez-faire alternative.


Jed gave this a few weeks ago.
http://newdeal.feri.org/speeches/1932d.htm
http://www.hpol.org/fdr/inaug/

We need that kind of vision and integrity at the top allied with the private
sector for new energy.

(Drop below the ground state, tsck! bollox! Tricks with wheels and magnets
bollox! 'Tickling phase space', 'The Searl Effect', 'Collateralised debt',
'financial engineering' all bollox and scams! )

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

Vortex,

Not blowing my own trumpet (I don't need to I've got good support behind me)
this is what an apprentice learns in graduate school:

The subject frontiers
The art of scientific writing
How to do presentations
How to lead
Research Ethics
Writing grant proposals
How to manage time
How to manage people
Life in general

There is more, much more. In fact there is a requirement to actually attend
taught courses as such in UK universities in grad school. If you've done a
lot outside it feels like you are having your style cramped being told how
to write papers, for instance. We all hate these courses. I've done a bunk
on some of them but I'll catch up when they are re-run half yearly.

Now not blowing my own trumpet:
http://uk.geocities.com/remicornwall/PartOutline.pdf. I've got a contentious
idea, right? I learn to keep schtump until I begin (just beginning to) to
pass master with people who are professionals in the field. Yes over the
years I'll get shown the door, insulted, have to put up with fools in high
positions I know I ring circles around (Polytechnic Professors).

*The art of progress is dealing with people, keeping your cool, conceding
when you are wrong, being gentle in victory and DOING THE GODDAM WORK!*

Section by section I write that document in the link above. It will
eventually be cut and pasted into a thesis which I will have to defend.

Sometimes I get pissed off with the whole establishment, down tools for
months, go and do something else. Sometimes I get depressed. Sometimes I
avoid my supervisors. Then I pluck up the courage go and see them and they
are happy to see me. Yes I was annoyed how slow things were going in their
acceptance of my ideas BUT THE CHANGE COMES FROM ME TOO.

I am chuffed that these guys are even bothering. I think for the fees to
attend (I don't pay them now) I get a lot of their wisdom and facilities for
buttons. Like a lawyer might represent you, these guys know how to present
an argument in the court of expert opinion and if you don't take their
advice, then the client is a fool.

Bit by bit I hone the arguments, design experiments, get the grants in, get
the data and do the seminars/write the papers. Leave the knock-out whammy
far-out sh.t to the end. Who knows, ideas at the start may be very different
when at the end: Plasticity in thought.

I am prepared, though with much frustration, to accept the wisdom of others
more experienced than me IF I KNOW THEIR INTENTIONS ARE GOOD. If I smell the
rat of indifference and incompetence I leave the place (yeah Brighton).

I like liberal patricians. I like the good 'ole Ivy league types when
watching BBC4 in programmes like Alan Clarke's Civilisation or Simon
Schama on the USA (http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00f4zgd). I get to
realise how little I know. I know my limitations. Then again I might think
what Schama says about the US realising that the US dream is dead (war,
environment, finance) is sh.t because he doesn't have the mind of someone
who knows about technology or the sheer optimism and ignorance of someone
not as smart as him to do something everyone thinks is wrong. 

I also like the world outside university and the ability it gives you to run
off and get your own funding when no-one listens. Then again I see the waste
and endless charismatic half-wits with silly permanent magnet motors.

I hate the scam artists, the vain and incompetent. They ruin it for
everyone.

RE: [Vo]:Generating X-RAYS From Scotch Tape

[Remi Cornwall]

Interesting. I imagine high voltages are generated too.

 

I like the one when you open mail in a darkened room and get a blue flash as
the adhesive is torn. I think it's called electro-trilubescence spelling.

 

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 18:36
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:Generating X-RAYS From Scotch Tape

 

Hello all. I have been lurking here for eons, however, this report is too
intriguing not to post.  According to Nature It has been discovered that
scotch tape when peeled in a vacuum gives off x-rays!  Enough x-rays to
photograph the bones in a finger!

 

http://www.nature.com/news/2008/081022/full/news.2008.1185.html

 

It is speculated that the well known luminescense that crystals radiate when
struck or compressed  or when certain tapes are unwound is the cause.The
comments at the bottom of the page are as interesting as the article.  You
will see a couple from Bill B.

There is also mine.  Would astronauts have to be warned not to use duct tape
in a vacuum?   Trevor  Lawrence





  _  

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RE: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

 I assume Obama will win. This is probably good news for us. His people are
highly in tune with technology and change.

 

A liberal broad church. No Creationists, lobby, war or mad greedy lobby in
the democrat camp.

 

 Robin When you specify an amount, you run the risk of creating an
artificial ceiling that you may come to regret. OTOH if you don't specify an
amount you run the risk of getting too little.

 

Nice to have educated people not greedy salesmen types controlling your
existence, know the price of everything and the value of nothing.

 

  _  

From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 20:21
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

 

After the election, I think it would be a good idea for cold fusion
researchers to make a concerted effort to approach the incoming
administration. We should find out who has been tapped for the secretary of
energy and/or who the elected president's energy advisors are, and try to
approach those people. We should approach anyone who might have access to
the nascent administration, along with influential people who have expressed
sympathy for cold fusion, such as Llewellyn King. There will be millions of
e-mails and letters sent to the new administration so it will be difficult
to get through this blizzard, but perhaps if we act in concert and we sound
like highly  responsible mainstream people and we can generate a signal
above the noise level.

I assume Obama will win. This is probably good news for us. His people are
highly in tune with technology and change. I have first-hand personal
experience with this, working as a volunteer for the campaign. They have
used computers and other technology in ways that never would have occurred
to me, and I pride myself on being a forward-looking, with-it kind of guy.
(Whether Obama himself is highly computer literate does not matter; he hires
people who are and he gives them free reign to do what they want to do.)
Obama and his people are also extremely well-organized and responsive.
Quoting an expert on this: [Obama] has the best political organization for
a presidential campaign that I have ever seen here, Tom Slade, a former
[Florida] state Republican chairman, said of Mr. Obama. Bar none. He has
run a phenomenally good campaign.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/25/us/politics/25florida.html

I have not had time to think about this lately, but I am going to circulate
this memo to cold fusion researchers and interested people such as the
readers of this list. Anyone who has ideas to contribute should post them
here.

I recommend a restrained, sensible tone, concentrating strictly on technical
issues. There is no need to mention the anti-cold fusion hysteria of the
last 20 years. We need to describe the results, but we should avoid
experimental jargon. I recommend a short message signed by many people. I
have not thought much about what the content should be, but it should be
short and to the point. The person reading it will be extremely busy so we
must get right to the point and say everything we need to say in two or
three short paragraphs.

I would make the tone similar to the standard response I send to people who
attacked cold fusion: 

Cold fusion was replicated by hundreds of world-class laboratories, and
these replications were published in mainstream, peer-reviewed  journals.
You will find a bibliography of over 3,000 papers and the full text from
over 500 papers here:

http://lenr-canr.org http://lenr-canr.org/  

(I just sent a copy to Charles Seife, the author of the new book.)

The letter has to be a little longer than this but it should have the same
tone. It should be an open letter meaning we circulate copies everywhere
and upload them to various websites. I suppose the main points we want to
make are:


Cold fusion, the Fleischmann and Pons effect, has been replicated by
hundreds of scientists, and these replications have been published in
roughly 1000 peer-reviewed papers in mainstream journals.

The effect has produced as much as 10,000 times more energy per gram of fuel
than any chemical reaction can, and no chemical ash has been detected, so it
is a nuclear reaction. It has produced temperatures and power density equal
to the core of a conventional fission reactor. At present, the cold fusion
effect cannot be easily reproduced or controlled, but if it can be
controlled it may become a useful source of energy. It produces virtually no
pollution; the fuel source is inexhaustible; and the energy will be far
cheaper than any alternative.

We believe that the federal government should allocate between five and $10
million a year to this research. Many qualified fellow researchers would
like to perform cold fusion research, but they have not been funded.



I would make the letter not much longer or more detailed than this.

- Jed

RE: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange

[Remi Cornwall]

Have you ever come across Hydrinos?

 

Can people tell the difference between Star Trek and the Discovery channel?

 

Despite the Arthur C Clarke quote, the initiated know the difference between
science, the pursuit of science and pure and applied bullshitology.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEfKEzX9QLE

 

(Not a personal attack)

 

  _  

From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 21:21
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange

 

Robin,

Have you ever come across this in Mills' CQM (or in any commentary by
others):

The possible direct conversion of the negative hydrogen ion (H-) into
hydrino hydride in one step? 

I think you can see where that suggestion is going wrt NaH 

Jones

 

RE: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange

[Remi Cornwall]

[snip]
Nobody knows anything. There is no such thing as knowledge, because
knowledge
implies certainty, and there is always some element of doubt.

Come off it. Someone said that getting a PhD was a license to do research.
I'm not saying the state should ban non-initiates but there is the
Scientific Method.

1) Conjecture stage. Wacky idea. Wacky data. Wacky discovery. 

2) Hypothesis. You do some sums, read some books, talk to some people begin
to understand it or understand that you misunderstood it. You design future
experiments.

3) Theory/theorem stage. The data comes in and there is no other way to
explain it. You attach a theorem to the data and it matches to so many s.f.
(that's significant figures not science fiction, right?) and it achieves
general acceptance

4) Outreach stage. The clever people come along and look at it in all
different ways from different directions and see it ties up with other
stuff. They reformulate it and beauties of economy and other predictions
come out.

No, go find a Hydrino. Go look at spectrums from stars. Try and isolate the
stuff. Get a few uL of it. Do diffraction testing, find out how big they
are. Compress it and do a thermodynamic analysis of it so you can get its
equation of state. That'll give you an idea of how big the particles are too
and the forces they exert amongst each other. Try getting its emission
spectrum and tie it up with your astronomical data. Tackle the problem in
several directions and get the data to tie up.


He doesn't do any of this on his 60M$ dollar budget because he doesn't know
what he is doing or he is vain and wants to push a theory or it just doesn't
bloody exist.

If all you say all day is f..king hydrino, hydrino, hydrino on the john, on
the wife, on the au pair, squeezing your zits, having a w.nk, then I would
say you based your whole project on it and it was pretty damn central. So
your objective would be to nail that one right away. Right? 

Having met that milestone it would get generally accepted.

But you don't like certainty? Not even CERTAINTY OF APPROACH???



On the other hand they kick co-researchers in the nuts who are doing similar
things with metals and hydrides, drag them DOWN INTO THE MIRE BY ASSOCIATION
when all that needed to be said was:

We get excess heat, we don't know what the mechanism is but there is
definitely excess heat


Charismatic mono-idea-its who never touch reality are soggy floating turds
in the punch bowl of serious endeavour. (Does a soggy turd float? On the
stock market I guess)

Yes, having an intuition may guide you to the result (or even completely
different directions) even if the intuition is wrong. But it must touch
reality to be called Science.

The CF, LENR people I'd call the Anomalous Metal Hydride Excess Heat
Phenomena (AMHEHP?) and start again. Get the best (**experimenters**) in the
field and keep the cranks out unless they come to you with something that
works. They'll drag you down and kill it all.

You go in with the CERTAINTY of what something IS by giving it a NAME. If
research is open-ended you might not know what that thing even is. 

Changing CF to LENR was a good move. Besides some programming language has
appropriated the name.

Changing Global Warming to Climate Change is a similar move because some
prediction from xs CO2 cause a cooling, ironically, by altering airflow or
ocean current flow.

Sorry bedtime the clocks have gone back. 

-Original Message-
From: Robin van Spaandonk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 21:55
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:NaH - strong and strange

In reply to  Remi Cornwall's message of Sun, 26 Oct 2008 21:42:34 -:
Hi Remi,
[snip]
Have you ever come across Hydrinos?

 

Can people tell the difference between Star Trek and the Discovery channel?

 

Despite the Arthur C Clarke quote, the initiated know the difference
between
science, the pursuit of science and pure and applied bullshitology.
[snip]
Nobody knows anything. There is no such thing as knowledge, because
knowledge
implies certainty, and there is always some element of doubt.

Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

Print gov. bonds, print money. Joe Soap picks the tax bill up in the future.
It's tough sh.t, you want free market funny money instead? Just what is the
difference anyway? Hyper inflated house prices is just the same legerdemain.

 

Oh it's bedtime.

 

  _  

From: R C Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 22:03
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

 

Remi,

Add to the list... NO MONEY .. and you have a better picture to the new
regime.

Richard

 

 

 

 I assume Obama will win. This is probably good news for us. His people are
highly in tune with technology and change.

 

A liberal broad church. No Creationists, lobby, war or mad greedy lobby in
the democrat camp.

 

RE: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

[Remi Cornwall]

Clever guy:

 

http://newdeal.feri.org/speeches/1932d.htm

http://www.hpol.org/fdr/inaug/

 

Someone with balls, a clever Ivy Leaguer to command the economy over the
craziness of the market being far from equilibrium. 

 

It's like settling a large wobbling bowl of water: you need to be bigger and
stronger than it to have an overview of its behaviour to catch the chaotic
oscillations and smooth them out. Once conditions have returned back to
normal a light hand on the tiller is sufficient.

 

Tough times need men with balls: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6rDeOojFXk 

 

  _  

From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 22:39
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

 

Print gov. bonds, print money. Joe Soap picks the tax bill up in the future.
It's tough sh.t, you want free market funny money instead? Just what is the
difference anyway? Hyper inflated house prices is just the same legerdemain.

 

Oh it's bedtime.

 

  _  

From: R C Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 26 October 2008 22:03
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The new administration and cold fusion

 

Remi,

Add to the list... NO MONEY .. and you have a better picture to the new
regime.

Richard

 

 

 

 I assume Obama will win. This is probably good news for us. His people are
highly in tune with technology and change.

 

A liberal broad church. No Creationists, lobby, war or mad greedy lobby in
the democrat camp.

 

Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

OK, you caught me lurking.

 

I am fascinated by this BLP stuff but haven't been following it in detail
over the years.

 

Ron Wormus gave this:
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Documentary%20Video/blacklight_experiment_vid
eo_v2.wmv

 

These guys seem competent, respected and well kitted out in their lab. Where
is a video or write up for the more technical crowd?

 

'Heat spike': relative magnitudes

'Small amount of hydrogen': How much?

Nickel: How much?

Electrical input: etc

Temperature of reaction vessel?

Did Ni undergo phase change?

 

Big questions: 

1) More power is generated than is needed to split water from hydrogen. What
about that needed to regenerate the Ni or is it a consumable? 

2) Is the Ni H complex somehow more inert at the end of the process?

 

I can't vouch anything for Mills' GUTs because I haven't been exposed to
them. It is understood that Chemistry is the physics of the outer electron
shell. Processes are expected to be only a few eV.

 

A Chemistry of inner electron shells would be radical and he would be a
visionary in the league of a Linus Pauling when he used QM to describe the
chemical bond.

 

On this point would the activation energies of these reactions be
prohibitively large or slow to start but then rapidly feeding back? Can they
do chemical kinetic type experiments to postulate reaction intermediates,
you know, what data? Mechanisms.

 

On a simple hydrogen model, the energy levels are proportional to the mass
of the electron. To drop below would require the mass of the electron to
change. I can't imagine (yet) what the effect of a change in the effective
mass would have in a lattice. I guess it wouldn't. I don't know how easy it
is to transmute electrons into muons.

 

Any suggestions and write ups?

Remi.

 

 

 

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

Rest mass muon  100Mev. So that answers a question about them being
created. I guess not a possible mechanism.

 

  _  

From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 16:14
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

 

OK, you caught me lurking.

 

I am fascinated by this BLP stuff but haven't been following it in detail
over the years.

 

Ron Wormus gave this:
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Documentary%20Video/blacklight_experiment_vid
eo_v2.wmv

 

These guys seem competent, respected and well kitted out in their lab. Where
is a video or write up for the more technical crowd?

 

'Heat spike': relative magnitudes

'Small amount of hydrogen': How much?

Nickel: How much?

Electrical input: etc

Temperature of reaction vessel?

Did Ni undergo phase change?

 

Big questions: 

1) More power is generated than is needed to split water from hydrogen. What
about that needed to regenerate the Ni or is it a consumable? 

2) Is the Ni H complex somehow more inert at the end of the process?

 

I can't vouch anything for Mills' GUTs because I haven't been exposed to
them. It is understood that Chemistry is the physics of the outer electron
shell. Processes are expected to be only a few eV.

 

A Chemistry of inner electron shells would be radical and he would be a
visionary in the league of a Linus Pauling when he used QM to describe the
chemical bond.

 

On this point would the activation energies of these reactions be
prohibitively large or slow to start but then rapidly feeding back? Can they
do chemical kinetic type experiments to postulate reaction intermediates,
you know, what data? Mechanisms.

 

On a simple hydrogen model, the energy levels are proportional to the mass
of the electron. To drop below would require the mass of the electron to
change. I can't imagine (yet) what the effect of a change in the effective
mass would have in a lattice. I guess it wouldn't. I don't know how easy it
is to transmute electrons into muons.

 

Any suggestions and write ups?

Remi.

 

 

 

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

All looks a bit bogus? 50M$ where's the peer review? 

 

I don't mean way-out theories posted to alternative physics type
publications (see that's the start of it - conjecture, hypothesis, theory
the scientific process) but hardball nuts and bolts applied
physics/engineering theory or good chemistry lab procedure.

 

I mean is anything generally accepted/corroborated?

 

I'd accept a new type of repeatable experiment, well above noise with or
without understanding (theory) but with extensive good procedure in the lab.
You know - excess heat, any neutrons or hydrinos (anyone isolated one?),
mass specs, spectrographs, looking for reaction intermediates (NMR),
electron micrographs ... the whole gamut.

 

You know, what other good (unbiased) people (experimenters) would do in
other good labs undertaking the same work.

 

You know, pure natural science procedure, like botanists or rare stamp
collectors:

What is it? 

Where can I get more? 

If I do this, does it do this? 

Under what conditions? 

What isn't it - definitely? 

Can I write this up in such a way that it will pass muster with experts in
the field?

Can I break it to them gradually in small steps with well known or easily
repeatable experiments?

Have I got a misconception somewhere?

 

Can I get a discussion with both True Believers and Pathological Sceptics?

Is the argument moving anywhere, or does it just remain polarised camps for
decades never hitting mainstream?

 

Is it getting hyped for no real data or progress? 

Who's on board, are their intentions pure or is it a snake oil bubble?

Did I create a monster with lots of hangers on and should I say as much to
protect what little might have been good work initially?

Do I distance myself from others in the field?

 

Peer review and research ethics.

 

  _  

From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 16:17
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

 

Rest mass muon  100Mev. So that answers a question about them being
created. I guess not a possible mechanism.

 

  _  

From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 16:14
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

 

OK, you caught me lurking.

 

I am fascinated by this BLP stuff but haven't been following it in detail
over the years.

 

Ron Wormus gave this:
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Documentary%20Video/blacklight_experiment_vid
eo_v2.wmv

 

These guys seem competent, respected and well kitted out in their lab. Where
is a video or write up for the more technical crowd?

 

'Heat spike': relative magnitudes

'Small amount of hydrogen': How much?

Nickel: How much?

Electrical input: etc

Temperature of reaction vessel?

Did Ni undergo phase change?

 

Big questions: 

1) More power is generated than is needed to split water from hydrogen. What
about that needed to regenerate the Ni or is it a consumable? 

2) Is the Ni H complex somehow more inert at the end of the process?

 

I can't vouch anything for Mills' GUTs because I haven't been exposed to
them. It is understood that Chemistry is the physics of the outer electron
shell. Processes are expected to be only a few eV.

 

A Chemistry of inner electron shells would be radical and he would be a
visionary in the league of a Linus Pauling when he used QM to describe the
chemical bond.

 

On this point would the activation energies of these reactions be
prohibitively large or slow to start but then rapidly feeding back? Can they
do chemical kinetic type experiments to postulate reaction intermediates,
you know, what data? Mechanisms.

 

On a simple hydrogen model, the energy levels are proportional to the mass
of the electron. To drop below would require the mass of the electron to
change. I can't imagine (yet) what the effect of a change in the effective
mass would have in a lattice. I guess it wouldn't. I don't know how easy it
is to transmute electrons into muons.

 

Any suggestions and write ups?

Remi.

 

 

 

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

In a rarefied *ionised plasma gas* the spectrum is continuous. The mean free
path is large, the electrons are 'at infinity'. In a free electron gas, in a
metal say, there is a band structure.

I don't know the context of this particular argument but that is fact.

My 2 cents worth.

-Original Message-
From: Robin van Spaandonk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 21:48
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

In reply to  Edmund Storms's message of Sat, 25 Oct 2008 09:06:07 -0600:
Hi Ed,
Robin, my main point is that an electron leaving an atom cannot go to  
infinity under the conditions Mills has in his reactor.  At most, it  
will go into some other energy level, such as the conduction band if  
one exists in the material. This fact is not based on speculation,  
assumptions, or theory. This is a simple fact of nature that is well  
understood.
[snip]
When an atom/molecule is ionized, the electron *never* goes to infinity, so
in
that sense, *no* measured (by *anyone*) ionization energy is 100% accurate.

However due to the inverse square drop in electric field, the electron
doesn't
have to be removed very far from an atom before the difference between that
and
infinity is so small as to be trivial (a few microns is enough). Such
distances
are easily attained in a plasma. What happens to the electron after that is
irrelevant to the process from which the electron originated.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Thank you MC. RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

Thank you MC

-Original Message-
From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 22:49
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


- Original Message - 
From: Remi Cornwall
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 11:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


OK, you caught me lurking.

I am fascinated by this BLP stuff but haven't been following it in detail 
over the years.

MC: You have a lot of cathing up to do. Go to www.blacklghtopower.com and 
soak up the tutorial material available; it is quite condensed. The paper I 
cited will be rough going.

Ron Wormus gave this: 
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Documentary%20Video/blacklight_experiment_vid
eo_v2.wmv 
The videos are not very instructive. there are a lot of animations worthy of

study.

These guys seem competent, respected and well kitted out in their lab. Where

is a video or write up for the more technical crowd?

MC: Mills magnum opus, all 1000+ pages, can be downloaded from the website, 
along with selected papers. A list of over 70 journal papers is given, 
available for a fee from the respctive journals. There is an extensive Power

Point briefing, but no narration. The best book I know of about Mills is 
America's Newton by Tom Stolper, available as a print-on-demand book from 
Amazon.

'Heat spike': relative magnitudes MC: 50 kW reported, megajoule total heat.
'Small amount of hydrogen': How much? MC: About 5 mg NaOH charge.
Nickel: How much? about 1 kg Raynal-Ni, a commercial catalyst
Electrical input: etc Energy input for heater1396 kJ, output 2194 kJ, excess

753 kJ [vaporize 8 oz water]
Temperature of reaction vessel? Peaked at 600 C
Did Ni undergo phase change? Not stated. All reactants resused except added 
H.

Big questions:
1) More power is generated than is needed to split water from hydrogen. What

about that needed to regenerate the Ni or is it a consumable? MC: Ni is not 
a comsumeable. Power needed to operate the recycling process not known, 
pending engineering studies. The final energy yield is so high that there is

reasonable belief that a closed cycle system can be built. Doing such is 
BLP's current target.

2) Is the Ni H complex somehow more inert at the end of the process? MC: I 
don't know. Mills states that it is only necessary to add H in the 
regeneration steps, and that such has been deomostrated by bench chemistry. 
Whether this holds true in a large scale operating reaction remains to be 
seen. Surprises can be expected.

I can't vouch anything for Mills' GUTs because I haven't been exposed to 
them. It is understood that Chemistry is the physics of the outer electron 
shell. Processes are expected to be only a few eV. MC: The shell shrinks 
during the catalysis process, releasing a large burst of energy. Multiple 
stages of shrinkage have been observed.

A Chemistry of inner electron shells would be radical and he would be a 
visionary in the league of a Linus Pauling when he used QM to describe the 
chemical bond. MC: True, and Mills is only dealing with hydrogen [or 
deuterium]. Mills has developed software for molecular modeling by a 
subisidary Millsian, Inc.

On this point would the activation energies of these reactions be 
prohibitively large or slow to start but then rapidly feeding back? Can they

do chemical kinetic type experiments to postulate reaction intermediates, 
you know, what data? Mechanisms. MC: The activation enegies are a small 
fraction of the yield. Once hydrinos are created, they can interact in 
complex ways.

On a simple hydrogen model, the energy levels are proportional to the mass 
of the electron. To drop below would require the mass of the electron to 
change. I can't imagine (yet) what the effect of a change in the effective 
mass would have in a lattice. I guess it wouldn't. I don't know how easy it 
is to transmute electrons into muons. MC: The mass of the electron does not 
change; its orbit is closer to the proton.

Any suggestions and write ups?

MC: See above. Good Hunting.
Mike Carrell


Remi.





This Email has been scanned for all viruses by Medford Leas I.T. Department.

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

It's alright Mike I am a seasoned researcher, engineer, been in industry,
know the ropes, have some aptitude, done some work, know a few things, seen
a few things. People are busy and they don't tend to want to re-learn stuff
if it doesn't come to the point soon, claims too much, looks too slick
(websites and overheads) and requires outlay to download papers.

 Remi, I've suggested some homework. When you look at the website, include 
the mamagement credentials and stay tuned. BLP's next step will require some

very serious money and very serious people are interested, despite the 
turmoil in the financial world. BLP's posture is shifting fromn research to 
development.

Mike Carrell

I mean is anything generally accepted/corroborated,
 peer reviewed?

 i.e. can you make the clever people at the Ivy League or Fortune500 labs
 want to spent their time on it?

 
NaH apparently qulaifies as a catalyst because heating can intiate a
reaction resulting in H[1/3] which is a hydrino catalyst.
 

 And such stuff.

 Like anyone in Physics, Engineering or Chemistry in graduate school or
 postdoc level could just pick and say I know this to be a fact.

 I mean I will show you bogus as bogus gets: look up John Searl on Wiki or
 YouTube. It's done in the style of science to look scientific when it is
 science fiction and snake oil.

 I'm not saying Mills is but taking the stance of an impartial observer who
 knows how difficult it is passing muster with peers at top universities 
 and
 how important it is to take people's advice over presentation matters.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mike Carrell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: 25 October 2008 18:30
 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


 - Original Message - 
 From: Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 10:21 PM
 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?


 In reply to  Mike Carrell's message of Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:54:12 -0400:
 Hi,
 [snip]
To:
Robin van Spaandonk
Jones Beene
Ed Storms
Scott Little
[and lurkers]

This has been a very useful discussion. If you have not done so, I
recommend
downloading http://www.blacklightpower.com/papers/WFC102308WebS.pdf and
printing pages 10-14 and 48. Figure 7 on p48 is a scan of NaH using
Differential Scanning Clorimetry. It is most instructive. At 350 C there 
is
endothermic decompoisition of NaH. Beginning at 640 C is a very strong
exothermic reaction, which I think is conventionally unexpected. The NaH
was
in 760 Torr He.

 This is unfortunate given that He+ is also a catalyst.

 MC: But He is not a catalyst, it used as a chemically inert heat transfer
 medium. When the reaction fires, undoubtedly some He will be ionized and 
 the

 H atoms around, may contribute to the energy yield. That is not 
 unfortunate,

 it is just a sideshow.

The reactions involved in the test cell are complex, and discussed on pp
10-12, equations 23-35. The next-to-bottom paragraph of p11 is specially
interesting.

NaH apparently qulaifies as a catalyst because heating can intiate a
reaction resulting in H[1/3] which is a hydrino catalyst.

 That is secondary. The primary reason it qualifies as a catalyst is that 
 the

 sum
 of the three components of the dissociation energy into the specified
 components
 adds to 54.35 eV, which is a close match for 54.4 eV.

 Ah, but as a compound those electrons are in place. The riddle here is 
 that
 Na in a compound does not appear to manifest the required energy hole. The
 molecule may thermally dissociate, with the H taking back it electron. 
 Where

 is the energy to ionize the Na as it separates from the H? If Na can act 
 as
 a catalyst during the separation with only thermal energy, then the
 resonant raansfer phenomenon as used/described by Mills apparently has 
 new

 aspects. Ignoring this detail, and regarding the H[1/3] rpoduct of the
 reaction, then a 'conventional' hydrino catalyst has appeared and can act
 with any H around.

It still is not
clear to me where the 54.35 eV for ionizing Na to catalyze H comes from.

 Mills has this weird way of writing his equations. Note that the Hydrino
 reaction itself on the right hand side of equation 23 actually produces
 108.8
 eV, half of which goes into the electron hole, and the other half of which
 is
 just direct free energy.
 Any one else would just have written eq. 23 with an excess of 54.45 eV on
 the
 right hand side, and nothing on the left.

 MC: agreed, I have traouble understanding these chemical equations.

 He writes it the way he does, in order to indicate that the energy release
 occurs in 2 phases, the first resonant energy dump into the hole (which 
 in
 this case is 54.35 eV), and the second phase release, which is likely in 
 the
 form of kinetic energy.

 However don't mistake the 54.35 eV on the left as external input to the
 reaction. It isn't. (it's just a quantity of -54.35 eV that Mills has
 transferred from the right hand side of the equation 

RE: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

[Remi Cornwall]

I'm going to go to bed soon but photons are electrically neutral. Robin,
virtual photons shield charge. QED is a *big* subject that's tackled in the
graduate school and it's not easily mastered unless one's done the complete
groundwork and then specialised.

No when revolutions come they start off with simple premises, simple
paradoxes and experiments that people can get their heads around. Then the
best theoreticians move in once a consensus starts to emerge to make it all
cogent. Look at the history of QM from the early experiments and paradoxes
(1860-1905) to about 1970. The sheer economy that people like Heisenberg,
Schrodinger, Jordan, Pauli, Dirac, Feynman brought to all the disparate
phenomena and sheer zoo of stuff is one of the most intellectual Everests
ever climbed. People don't throw out the whole lot without good reason.

It's a bit like a catchy song that has a 'hook' to rise up above all the
other stuff. In my situation a very prominent academic told me some time ago
keep it simple. Everything gets scan read to pass muster initially unless
one has an air to the good and great and they rate you highly initially.
Cock up a few times and you get set back, it takes time to win the
confidence back.

Barring repeatable experiments and unequivocal data the good people are too
busy and just can't be bothered.

-Original Message-
From: Robin van Spaandonk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 25 October 2008 23:25
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?

In reply to  Remi Cornwall's message of Sat, 25 Oct 2008 16:13:44 +0100:
Hi,
[snip]
On a simple hydrogen model, the energy levels are proportional to the mass
of the electron. To drop below would require the mass of the electron to
change.
[snip]
Changing the mass of the electron would be one way of achieving this, but it
isn't the only way. 

Mills achieves it by proposing that trapped photons have the same effect as
the
creation of extra charge on the nucleus virtual charge if you will.

I do it by assuming that the De Broglie wave of the electron can take on a
more
complex form than a simple circle (e.g. a Lissajous structure) - see my web
page
( http://users.bigpond.net.au/rvanspaa/New-hydrogen.html ).

Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: [Vo]:The evolution of good governance

[Remi Cornwall]

Nice, nice? Ad-homs, personalised debate?

 

What's this? Let's beat up Remi day or secret big dick envy?

 

I've got too much work on, grants coming in (both state and private) and
several projects on the go to be wrangling with a bunch of looney left
slackers.

 

When you work out the bogus 'GW' or 'CF' shama-lama-dingdong ting I'll be
back. 

 

Guess that won't be soon. 

 

-Original Message-
From: Nick Palmer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 02 October 2008 07:23
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:The evolution of good governance

 

Jones Beene wrote:

Although its economy is generally so far to the left as to be called 

socialist by detractors in the NeoCon movement, due to its entitlements and 

innate humanism, it is ironically also one of the most free market and 

capitalist farm economies in the world - less regulated than the US or Brit 

farmer - which only indicates that *true liberalism can be the ideal form of


capitalism.*Eat you heart out, Remi.

Generally speaking, the Dutch are also amongst the nicest people in the 

world too - co-incidence? I think not.

 

 

Nick Palmer

 

On the side of the Planet - and the people - because they're worth it 

 

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

Sure looks like hate speech to me. You sure you want these guys being
leaders of the free world?

 

I think the battle lines are clear; a battle between the good of freedom and
the evil, lying, socialist control.

 

When will they ever learn?

Cash for Trash 
By Bill Bonner

Bankruptcy of Neo-Capitalism, shouted a headline in Wednesday's Paris
press. Scarcely since Hitler blew his brains out has the type been bigger or
the contentment broader.

Almost everyone everywhere is enjoying the show. Each headline brings more
laughs. The financial markets give people neither what they expect nor what
they want, but what they deserve. What a treat to see people getting it -
good and hard.

Near to home, that galling millionaire next door - many will take pleasure
in seeing his portfolio of stocks marked down. Stocks for the long run, he
used to say, smugly; the silly old coot will be dead before his stocks come
back! He'll have to work until he drops dead, just like the rest of us.

On Wall Street, the masters of the universe - who had the pay slips to prove
it! - are now getting blown up by their own debt bombs. The top five firms
on Wall Street were thought to be too big to fail. But Bear Stearns has
been blown to smithereens. Lehman is exploding into small pieces. Merrill
ducked and missed the blast. Then, the last big capitalist desperadoes -
J.P. Morgan and Goldman - waved the white flag. They petitioned the
government to allow them to become regulated, deposit taking banks!

And George Bush will leave behind the biggest nationalization program in
history. Surely, that's worth a snide chuckle. The takeover of Fannie and
Freddie alone leaves half the country living in what are effectively,
government-subsidized housing projects. Meanwhile, the coordinated takeover
of Wall Street, put together by his apparatchiks, left even the hardened
lefties at France's Liberation in shock and awe: This enormous statist
intervention...is the work of the most ideological and extremist
administration that the US has ever had.

How heartwarming to see that the meddlers and world-improvers get a second
wind. It's like driving around in a '33 Lincoln...or throwing rocks at the
gendarmes in '68. The old, gray Bolshies feel young again! Impetuous!
Brainless!

And every capitalist is behind the bail out program too. All over the world,
markets are out - state-sponsored meddling is in. Free market principles are
fine - until prices start going down!

And there's the breathtaking chutzpah of it! After proposing a $700 billion
program, in which the government buys up Wall Street's mistakes - otherwise
known as cash for trash - Henry Paulson says he had no choice: We did
this to protect the taxpayer, said the former Goldman chief.

Even Russia got into the act. New to counterfeit capitalism, it's getting
the hang of it fast, pledging $20 billion in the fight to keep stock prices
from falling to what they are really worth.

Then, not be left behind in general hysterical absurdity, SEC honcho
Christopher Cox announced a list of 799 financial stocks on which shorting
is banned until Oct. 2nd. In Britain, the FSA's ban on shorting financial
shares lasts until Jan 16. But Pakistan gets the King Canute Memorial Prize;
by law in that benighted land, stocks can't go below their August 27th
close.

And what a bunch of numbskulls - Greenspan, Paulson and Bernanke! Every word
they've said so far has been financial poison. Greenspan relaxed about
house prices... reported the Financial Times in 2005. Most negatives in
housing are probably behind us... said the same sage in October 2006. We
believe the effect of the troubles in the subprime sector...will be likely
limited... said Bernanke in March 2007. It's not a serious problem...I
think it's going to be largely contained, added Paulson in April 2007.

But these are the same numbskulls who now say they are saving capitalism
from itself. Ah, there's the rub...amid all this giddy merriment is a
serious threat. The feds have bailed out the bankers, the insurers, the
mortgage lenders, and half of Wall Street. But who will bail out the feds?

Since 1971, the world's money system rests on the dollar. And the dollar
rests on nothing but faith, hope and the kindness of strangers. And while
the full faith and credit of the United States of America is elastic, it can
snap.

Last week, the price of gold popped up $120 in two days. Then, on Monday, it
added another $43. Oil gushed up 44% in the space of barely a week.
Investors felt the geyser of liquidity coming from Washington and beat a
retreat from the dollar.

For the last 15 years, the U.S. money supply has grown about twice as fast
as GDP. Federal government liabilities, meanwhile, have grown three times as
fast. As a result, the USA now has more financial obligations than assets.
It is, effectively, broke. Nevertheless, the debit side of its ledgers grow
heavier and heavier. This year's US government deficit will add about half a
trillion. The US 

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

Mmmh, perhaps you should get him to research and write about CF.

 

  _  

From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 30 September 2008 14:58
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

 

Actually, Bill Bonner shares your basic attitude toward government, except
he is a better writer and has researched the issue in depth..

 

Ed

 

 

On Sep 30, 2008, at 3:09 AM, Remi Cornwall wrote:





Sure looks like hate speech to me. You sure you want these guys being
leaders of the free world?

 

I think the battle lines are clear; a battle between the good of freedom and
the evil, lying, socialist control.

 

When will they ever learn?

Cash for Trash 
By Bill Bonner

Bankruptcy of Neo-Capitalism, shouted a headline in Wednesday's Paris
press. Scarcely since Hitler blew his brains out has the type been bigger or
the contentment broader.

Almost everyone everywhere is enjoying the show. Each headline brings more
laughs. The financial markets give people neither what they expect nor what
they want, but what they deserve. What a treat to see people getting it -
good and hard.

Near to home, that galling millionaire next door - many will take pleasure
in seeing his portfolio of stocks marked down. Stocks for the long run, he
used to say, smugly; the silly old coot will be dead before his stocks come
back! He'll have to work until he drops dead, just like the rest of us.

On Wall Street, the masters of the universe - who had the pay slips to prove
it! - are now getting blown up by their own debt bombs. The top five firms
on Wall Street were thought to be too big to fail. But Bear Stearns has
been blown to smithereens. Lehman is exploding into small pieces. Merrill
ducked and missed the blast. Then, the last big capitalist desperadoes -
J.P. Morgan and Goldman - waved the white flag. They petitioned the
government to allow them to become regulated, deposit taking banks!

And George Bush will leave behind the biggest nationalization program in
history. Surely, that's worth a snide chuckle. The takeover of Fannie and
Freddie alone leaves half the country living in what are effectively,
government-subsidized housing projects. Meanwhile, the coordinated takeover
of Wall Street, put together by his apparatchiks, left even the hardened
lefties at France's Liberation in shock and awe: This enormous statist
intervention...is the work of the most ideological and extremist
administration that the US has ever had.

How heartwarming to see that the meddlers and world-improvers get a second
wind. It's like driving around in a '33 Lincoln...or throwing rocks at the
gendarmes in '68. The old, gray Bolshies feel young again! Impetuous!
Brainless!

And every capitalist is behind the bail out program too. All over the world,
markets are out - state-sponsored meddling is in. Free market principles are
fine - until prices start going down!

And there's the breathtaking chutzpah of it! After proposing a $700 billion
program, in which the government buys up Wall Street's mistakes - otherwise
known as cash for trash - Henry Paulson says he had no choice: We did
this to protect the taxpayer, said the former Goldman chief.

Even Russia got into the act. New to counterfeit capitalism, it's getting
the hang of it fast, pledging $20 billion in the fight to keep stock prices
from falling to what they are really worth.

Then, not be left behind in general hysterical absurdity, SEC honcho
Christopher Cox announced a list of 799 financial stocks on which shorting
is banned until Oct. 2nd. In Britain, the FSA's ban on shorting financial
shares lasts until Jan 16. But Pakistan gets the King Canute Memorial Prize;
by law in that benighted land, stocks can't go below their August 27th
close.

And what a bunch of numbskulls - Greenspan, Paulson and Bernanke! Every word
they've said so far has been financial poison. Greenspan relaxed about
house prices... reported the Financial Times in 2005. Most negatives in
housing are probably behind us... said the same sage in October 2006. We
believe the effect of the troubles in the subprime sector...will be likely
limited... said Bernanke in March 2007. It's not a serious problem...I
think it's going to be largely contained, added Paulson in April 2007.

But these are the same numbskulls who now say they are saving capitalism
from itself. Ah, there's the rub...amid all this giddy merriment is a
serious threat. The feds have bailed out the bankers, the insurers, the
mortgage lenders, and half of Wall Street. But who will bail out the feds?

Since 1971, the world's money system rests on the dollar. And the dollar
rests on nothing but faith, hope and the kindness of strangers. And while
the full faith and credit of the United States of America is elastic, it can
snap.

Last week, the price of gold popped up $120 in two days. Then, on Monday, it
added another $43. Oil gushed up 44% in the space of barely a week.
Investors felt the geyser of liquidity

RE: [Vo]:Nanoparticle accelerator ?

[Remi Cornwall]

I've been out all weekend enjoying the Indian summer in the beautiful city
of Bath.

Skimmed this thread. This is already being done with ferrofluid thrusters.
Along the lines of an inkjet printer little nozzles expel ferrofluid. We
have some people at QMUL doing this.


-Original Message-
From: Robin van Spaandonk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 September 2008 04:40
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Nanoparticle accelerator ?

In reply to  Jones Beene's message of Sat, 27 Sep 2008 18:03:28 -0700 (PDT):
Hi,
[snip]
The 'magic' if there is any, would be in the special properties of the BEC
state. If that state were to be strongly involved, then it is not simply 5
keV used to push nuclei together, which want to repel - but it is more
comparable to 5 keV added to already superimposed nuclei, which is used to
keep them in that condition for long enough, in a phase transition, so that
the lower entropy alpha particle results in the ending nucleus, instead of
the two deuterons repelling.

This could have been essentially unknown or unappreciated when the early
atom smashers were being designed... Or else - maybe that is for good
reason. Perhaps it is impossible to maintain such a required very hard
vacuum in an accelerator, such that the BEC state is maintained in an
accelerated particle.

There is an early CF experiment where Pd/D(Or was that Al?) is bombarded
with
fast electrons. That is almost a turned around version of what you want.
IOW
iso accelerating the BEC and crashing it into something, accelerate the
something and crash it into the BEC. That is probably easier to do, as it
avoids your vacuum problem. For that matter, if BECs are forming in CF
cathodes,
and fast particles are being generated by fusion events, then this is
probably
already happening.
Regards,

Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

What's causing the drop Stephen? Is it banking shares or all shares?

-Original Message-
From: Stephen A. Lawrence [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 19:18
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

Now down 700 points and dropping


Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:
 Stockholders have just voted.  The bailout was extremely important to
 the financial health of the country, or so they apparently believe.
 
 ---
 NEWS ALERT
 from The Wall Street Journal
 
 Sept. 29, 2008
 
 The Dow Jones Industrial Average plunged more than 500 points as the the
 final votes were tallied in the bailout vote in the House and the bill
 appeared short of the votes needed to pass. The package, which would
 have marked the most dramatic federal intervention in the financial
 markets since the Great Depression, was finalized Sunday after days of
 exhaustive negotiations between lawmakers and the White House.
 

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

Yes but what's causing the drop? I'm curious to know if after $700billion
whether anything has changed.

-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 19:42
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout



What's causing the drop Stephen? Is it banking shares or all shares?


Well - in a larger sense of this being an historic  day of judgment
(starting at sunset), it is easier to understand what is going on. The
wicked will be getting hit the hardest.

It is written that on Rosh Hashanah the
fate of the wicked, the righteous, and those of an intermediate class
are recorded. 

The later class, vorticians included, are
allowed a respite of ten days, so act accordingly.

Shofar, so good? g

Shana Tov

RE: [Vo]:Good News for the *ANTARCTIC*

[Remi Cornwall]

http://environment.newscientist.com/channel/earth/dn14724-antarctic-sea-ice-
increases-despite-warming.html


-Original Message-
From: Jones Beene [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 20:00
To: vortex
Subject: [Vo]:Good News for the Arctic

This may have been mentioned in the earlier thread on the scientific
contradictions and general high levels of bad-info on GW.

http://www.dailytech.com/Arctic+Sees+Massive+Gain+in+Ice+Coverage/article128
51.htm

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

Tell me something, is a president of the USA largely titular like a British
monarch or do they have real power. Is it government by cabinet or
leader-centric? 

-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 20:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

The people who nuked the deal are the people who do not trust the  
administration and who, in addition to listening to the voters, were  
able to hear what various economists are saying. Of course, it helps  
to be very conservative or very liberal. Thank heaven, there was  
enough independent thinking this time to not create another Iraq in  
the financial world.

Ed


On Sep 29, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:

 News stories I'm seeing make it sound like it was the conservative
 Republicans who nuked the deal.

 With Barney Frank as lead representative on the bill, in the end it  
 was
 apparently, in some sense, a Democratic initiative(?) or at any rate  
 it
 was certainly bi-partisan.

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

The reason I ask is to find out just how much power Bush has.

In Britain we have a constitutional monarchy. The Queen is titular and
advises the PM behind the scenes (her aides do to).

Government is by cabinet (or is meant to be unless the PM is very
charismatic and controlling like Blair).

The civil service are the executive and it doesn't really matter if there is
a 'regime change' the service has an 'inertia' and a political colour. For
instance Thatcher was always coming up against them. It often takes several
terms and reappointment before the service starts reflecting the desires of
the elected government.

So Ed, you are building up Bush as this bogey man and I want to know how he
does it, how he causes such a cock up in your opinion. How does he wield
such power day to day to have caused this mess in your opinion?

-Original Message-
From: Remi Cornwall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 21:48
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

Tell me something, is a president of the USA largely titular like a British
monarch or do they have real power. Is it government by cabinet or
leader-centric? 

-Original Message-
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 20:43
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

The people who nuked the deal are the people who do not trust the  
administration and who, in addition to listening to the voters, were  
able to hear what various economists are saying. Of course, it helps  
to be very conservative or very liberal. Thank heaven, there was  
enough independent thinking this time to not create another Iraq in  
the financial world.

Ed


On Sep 29, 2008, at 1:30 PM, Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:

 News stories I'm seeing make it sound like it was the conservative
 Republicans who nuked the deal.

 With Barney Frank as lead representative on the bill, in the end it  
 was
 apparently, in some sense, a Democratic initiative(?) or at any rate  
 it
 was certainly bi-partisan.

RE: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

[Remi Cornwall]

I think the democrats are shifting the blame.

The law makers have a duty to make sure that people behave in a civilised
manner. If you create an environment where people can panic in a crowded
theatre (by analogy the people are the market) don't blame the people -
that's what people do. You need to have stopped the panic occurring in the
first place.

The democrats favour these hybrid corporations (Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac)
that get a blank cheque from government when it all goes wrong. The only
reason why they did it was to appeal to their demographic of subprime voters
(referring to the 2003 proposed regulation of said corps).

Now they are cynically trying to shift the blame on the free-market system
where they created the conditions that allowed the panic in the theatre to
start.

They are forever talking about the character of the republicans but one
needs to look at the character of the left: a motley crew of the
self-loathing, anarchists, vandals, control freaks, low standards, low
achievement, anti-patriotic scumbags.

Why else can they be rubbing their hands with glee as the system collapses?

It's the demented laughter of the arsonist admiring their work from a hill
as they watch a hanger of expensive cars go up in flames.

You know, they destroy what they are incapable of doing themselves
(generating wealth, having talent).

The birds of a feather are really flocking together...

This patient is really sick and has deep issues...

-Original Message-
From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 29 September 2008 23:17
To: vortex-L@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:OFF TOPIC News of the bailout

Robin van Spaandonk wrote:

I heard on TV last night that the level of private debt in the US is
$41 trillion. Imagine what is going to happen if the banks start calling in
*all* their loans.

Precisely. That's what people like Warren Buffett are worried about. 
They are not concerned about the fate of highroller Wall Street 
investors. Buffett has expressed contempt for such people many times.

I have no idea if that $41 trillion figure is accurate or not. I have 
heard various estimates. I think a large part of the problem is that 
no one has any idea what the true number is, or who owes what to whom 
for what property. As OrionWorks says, more transparency is essential.

I read the other day a proposal that publicly traded corporations 
should be compelled to keep all of their financial books on the 
Internet. I wonder if something like that could be done with banks as 
well. That is, with any bank that is federally insured. The ones that 
are not should be allowed to collapse as far as I am concerned . . . 
although I suppose they are the ones who hold $41 trillion in debt -- 
I wouldn't know.

Although I know next to nothing about this, along with everyone else 
I am getting a quick education from the newspapers. I get the 
distinct impression that the so-called experts at banks and insurance 
companies and the Federal Reserve are a bunch of blundering amateurs. 
They know much less than they thought they did, or that I assumed 
they did. The mistakes they have made -- such as not checking 
collateral -- seem elementary to me. A pair of British comedians 
summarized the situation better than most financial experts I have 
read, Bird and Fortune - Subprime Crisis. See:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzJmTCYmo9g

Sometimes experts turn out to be real experts -- people you can rely 
on. This is usually the case with engineering and other well-defined 
disciplines. Sometimes we find they are expert at all. We have seen 
this in cold fusion and other narrow scientific disciplines, 
multidisciplinary studies, and situations in which few people are 
aware of the facts, and few people have done their homework.

It would be very surprising if experts in plasma fusion were wrong, 
because that subject has been widely studied and many textbooks and 
papers have been written about it. It is less surprising that people 
like Huizenga who appointed themselves experts in cold fusion a week 
after March 23, 1989 turned out to be wrong.

- Jed