ng etc. but
my paranoia is aroused
Did anyone click on them before this message was posted and have a
similar experience?
Does anyone have the resourses and expertise to check them out for
malicious content?
CCS
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Does anyone know anything about 3PGold or 3PSecure? Neither their account
creation page nor their logon seem to actually work. And neither seems to
be secure!
CCS
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ntermediary in real-time
this was not exactly true. The cryptocraphic protocols of digital
bearer instruments certainly make them more secure but there still
is vulnerability due to the need for communication with a central
clearing mechanism.
CCS
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the case then SR is no better than OSGold!
What are people thinking of when they say "backed"; it doesn't
mean anything if there is no redemption.
Best,
CCS
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nt the likelyhood that OSGold has substantial
capital: the scams obviously get away with a lot of money.
CCS
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Can anyone explain what happens when you click on this?
http://www.e-gold-fever.com/
CCS
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Page 15 0f 34 is the following entry.
>Gold & Silver Reserve, Inc.
>Attn: Douglas Jackson
>1013 Centre Road, Suite 350
>Wilmington, DE 19805-
>Ph: (800) 909-6590 Ext.
>Fax: (302) 994-4750
>E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Size of Business:
What do you make of that?
CCS
--
use made up to rationalize
after the fact something the powerful decide to do for other
reasons (it gives them more power). [Just because a politician
says he is going to take your savings to feed the widows and orphans
does not mean that is the real reason he does it.]
CCS
---
You are cu
institutes law after law to regulate Capitalism into
> some sort of Socialism. Socialism would be a great system to live
> under, ...
NO. Even taken on its own terms socialism is a terrible, destructive
system to live under. The results are bad because the ideas are bad,
morally evil.
Just what legal defense fund do you suppose this refers
to? Perhaps it is for some scam and this guy doesn't realize
that e-gold has nothing to do with it.
CCS
> I had an initial amount of $750.00 stolen from my e-gold
> account by the legal defense fund!! I did not
>
pic. Namely, the assertion that the use by
a 3rd party, such as SR, of e-gold to back another currency, such
as AUG, would introduce risk to e-gold itself.
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probably is right about what it really
means. However, GoldMoney's user agreement certainly invites
this misunderstanding and I think they should revise it for
clarity.
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o longer backed 100% by an hard asset (gold) as
> soon as you use credit instruments to increase your broad money base.
Huh??? A risk for which currency? There are two units of account
involved. Nothing has changed for the backing unit.
CCS
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der's use which
is impractical to enforce. It would mean, for instance, that I would be
in violation of the user agreement if I were to say to a friend who just
bought me lunch: "I'll pay you back next week with GoldMoney". This is
absurd!
CCS
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are not selling the customer a real gram of gold, they are selling
> ether-gold.
They are not selling "gold" and they are not selling "nothing". They
are selling contractual obligations. The "problem" lies in your own
misunderstanding. If they do not misrepresent the terms of the
contract and they fulfill those terms then it is not fraud.
CCS
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SSL?) and exists on their server at sometime.
Just curious...
CCS
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arsing is necessary when dealing with G&SR.
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ake a case that interests him. And he did write
a book on gold (clause contracts).
Best,
CCS
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ing from the exchange providers. This may be reduced for
harder forms of payment (eg Bank Wires) for larger amounts; but not
for the small retail exchanges that were your concern.
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ars would go down,
as you envisage, below those for e-gold. The reason, in both cases,
is the same: the risk taken by the market makers in selling hard
money (Hansa-dollars or e-gold) for soft money. The crooks would
prey on the Hansa-dollar market makers too.
CCS
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ld now need a market trading
dollars (the ones you have) for Hansa dollars. Does anyone have them? Is
anyone selling them? Is buying them any easier or cheaper than
buying e-gold?
CCS
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Hey! Can anyone tell me how to make an e-gold account balance
public? I thought you used to be able to do it when you accessed
an account. But when I went looking the facilities were not
there. Were they before? Or am I misremembering?
CCS
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in production.
Exactly. I explained at some length how property in land (and other
"natural resources") derives from property in production.
CCS
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of Henry
George) usually advocate that government be conveniently financed
by the expropriation of all land rent since they believe that the
government created the property in the first place.
CCS
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]
> The larger the area of the currency the more worthwhile it is for
> alternative currencies and payments systems to compete with it,
I disagree. The larger the scope of fiat money the more easily the
alternatives can be supressed.
CCS
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communities faired in economic and social competition with purely
capitalist ones. [But I would not tolerate forcing everyone into
Georgist communities (not that I would actually have anything to say
about it!).] How I wish I lived in a world where such a comparison
could be tried. I would g
JP,
> I can think of no better way of reaching them than an advert ON THE
> SPEND CONFIRM MECHANISM.
Yes, you have identified the absolutely perfect, premier advertising
medium for reaching e-gold users. It ought to command premium prices
if they would only sell it like capitalists
y or the free market in
> collecting it.
If it collects the tax involuntarily that certainly violates
individual liberty and is not a free market! The marketplace is
the standard of justice.
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t as high as they
are for a scam. Furthermore, e-gold may not be as uniquely useful
for real businesses as it is for scams. But on the other hand, it
is very useful and MLM does work for some more-or-less real
businesses (like AMWAY).
CCS
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ely
that e-gold will cooperate. They are not known for helping much to
make their own business succeed let alone behaving like capitalists.
So it seems likely that some other way will have to be found. I wish
I had a good idea how!
CCS
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n (ie unfreedom) of trade
more comprehensively over a larger area. Both of these are steps
backward.
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pable welfare state
not a free society. The Euro is just another link in the chain of
oppression the eurocrats are tirelessly working to forge.
3. The remarkable progress of Ireland owes nothing to the EU or
the Euro and is, in fact, ominously threatened by any further
association with su
n non-US banks do field online systems they usually
do usually make such transfers possible.
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that they can get away with treating
> minutes a lot more like a currency; with beneficial results both for them and
> for their customers (and for us, obviously).
Already done. http://www.pocketpass.com But no e-gold connection.
CCS
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n (ref: the correspondence I
mentioned) they determine the policy.
But perhaps. Where did you get that idea?
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ly did admit that they (e-gold) would only accept
bailment from themselves (G&SR). Their answer (such as it was) via Jim
Ray has been posted on this list and the FM list several times. If you
wish I can send you a copy of the entire correspondence.
Best,
CCS
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> > OmniPay is NOT like any other exchange provider. Not only is there
> > a past history of unity with e-gold and an incestuous relation amoung
> > the principals of the "two" companies but OmniPay has the exclusive
> > privilege of bailment.
> >
> &
> I'd note that OmniPay is like any exchange provider, ...
OmniPay is NOT like any other exchange provider. Not only is there
a past history of unity with e-gold and an incestuous relation amoung
the principals of the "two" companies but OmniPay has the exclusive
privilege
than 1 (or at least for a quantity
of 4; which is what I wanted). It "adds" the right quantity
but extends only a quantity of 1 to the invoice and calculates
the charge incorrectly.
CCS
PS And I thought I was going to get to use e-gold for something!
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it is prudent to place in the guarantees of governments.
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e presumed too much. So let me
repeated that it was sarcastic in the exreme.
CCS
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> Looks like another well designed, pretty web site.
>
> And everything is being given away free...
>
> HMMM.
It sure is generous of them to offer to store everyone's egold
for free, isn't it? What a deal. I just can't wait to send them
everything I hav
d gold bars.
This is a red herring. The gold market is old and very
sophisticated. Such problems were dealt with long ago. As
long as the gold never leaves the vaults of the large money
center banks and depositories it does not have to be reassayed
or even moved.
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ed
> currency.
Not only is this untrue in theory it is false to historical
fact. During the California gold rush when there was a gold
standard in this country so much new gold was produced that
it caused inflation.
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ption of currency but of ignorance and error.
> Money is a medium of exchange, it does not matter what its backed by
> or what it can be redeemed for just as long as it can be traded
> for something.
Do you suppose there might be a connection between what it is backed
by and/or what i
metal.
And the only reason GoldFinger will continue to do that is the
expectation that the redemption pledge will be honored. If it
ever appears that that pledge will not be honored no one will
trade anything for an ounce of e-gold any longer.
CCS
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e system". Any laws currently
consistent with these values are temporary historical aberations
which, since they are incompatible with the logic of power, will,
in the long run, be progressively eliminated.
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ed
> > as a condition of using the system.
> >
> > CCS
>
> Gad! I don't see it that way at all. The purpose of e-gold is to
> create an international internet currency, NOT to defy the
> state. There are so many good things that can be done with a
> digital, g
e the END of e-gold.
>
> Why?
>
> Craig
Because the value of e-gold derives from its utility as a means
that enables individuals to trade freely in defiance of the
state. It would cease to be useful for this purpose if submission
to the state, which is what identification amounts to
st, say, four levels from your own.
It seems to me unlikely that the crooks would find that so easy to
do but all legitimate customers should have little trouble after a
period for the web of trust to spread which should not be very long.
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osophy!
As do I.
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overnment :( or
> replace historical limits with something that is flexible enough to
> allow sometimes severe cultural differences to get along well enough.
Well said and good thinking. This is a productive direction.
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ow balance
> limit' on accounts whose owners cannot be identified with certainty.
That would be the END of e-gold.
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) who mutually
guarantee each others debts.
Some non-contemporary (ie either new or old) thinking is needed
here!! You people are stuck in the contemporary statist mind
set that leads only to crime and tyranny.
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ot;check
cashing" stores in the US these days; an arrangement with one of
the chains would go a long way towards enabling people to directly
deposit cash into one of your accounts.
CCS
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ation service and devising a real way to accomplish their
actual objective that is compatible with the interests of their
potential customers.
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cceed in accomplishing the goals you championed so
passionately it will be necessary not only for us to maintain
our own privacy but to devise ways of doing it that deal with the
problems created by the crooks.
Best,
CCS
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To un
up in any court of law (that
> isn't corrupt).
This is not a court. We are not required to cease thinking or
speaking about things which we cannot prove in a court of law.
CCS
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large, periodic income in e-gold
in anxious need to be anonymously converted back to fiat money.
CCS
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iness in a "foreign currency". How is that handled
without getting into the same problem of accounting for every single
transation of a foreign branch as a foreign exchange speculation?
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the other, mean
government control that would remove all reasons to use it.
> Now offshore companies that are tax free, and individuals and
> companies that have no compunction about defying tax laws can
> use e-gold without too much trouble, but I can't see it being
> us
nvolving e-gold.
It gives one pause. A substantial part of the growth in e-gold
activity may be driven by scamsters.
CCS
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eful" ideas, and maybe even do business together.
How right you are!
CCS
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Yes, something is very peculiar about e-gold. They have deliberately
created a false impression that bailment is possible when in fact
it is not actually accepted. After a great deal of obfuscation and
heming and hawing from Jim Ray he finally admitted this fact. The
following is Ray's post to
Yes, there may be a problem with Gold-Age. The following is from
the Free-Market e-gold forum.
---
How Gold Age stole my money
Posted by: Bojan ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on 3 Dec 2000 at 7:39:02 AM
First I wish to apologize you for m
> > It is hard to see how anyone (older than about 9) can be so stupid
> > as to fall for a Ponzi game.
>
> Do you participate in the social security system?
>
> Don Henson
No, as a matter of fact, I do not.
You are right that the SS system is structurally a Ponzi
game. However, it does
more, the ambiguities of establishing and maintaining trust
in confidential relationships and the opportunity for abuse in
the e-gold system attracts crooks for obvious reasons.
The question I would like to pose is: how can we devise means to
solve these problems? A code of ethics? A BBB? Adoption of
ce
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