Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

[Gino A. Villarini]

Can you get both pol.? If not, you wont reach 500 mbps

From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Rory 
Conaway mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:40 AM
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

Assuming I can only get a 40MHz channel for 10 miles, and budget is an issue, 
what is the best cost-effective product other than Cambium/Ceragon for at least 
500Mbps?

Rory Conaway • Triad Wireless • CEO
4226 S. 37th Street • Phoenix • AZ 85040
602-426-0542
r...@triadwireless.net
www.triadwireless.net

“A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz.” — Humphrey Bogart




Gino A. Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

[Stephen Patrick]

Good question:

1024QAM, 40MHz:  CableFree HCR radios can do 330.6Mbps FDX
With 2+0 XPIC, that doubles to 661.2Mbps
www.cablefree.net/hcr

The FOR3 is most cost effective model.  Same capacity for 1+0
www.cablefree.net/for3

I hope that helps,

Best regards
Stephen


On 3 August 2017 at 09:03, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:

> Can you get both pol.? If not, you wont reach 500 mbps
>
> From: Af  on behalf of Rory Conaway <
> r...@triadwireless.net>
> Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:40 AM
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Subject: [AFMUG] 18GHz link
>
> Assuming I can only get a 40MHz channel for 10 miles, and budget is an
> issue, what is the best cost-effective product other than Cambium/Ceragon
> for at least 500Mbps?
>
>
>
> *Rory Conaway **• Triad Wireless •** CEO*
>
> *4226 S. 37th Street • Phoenix • AZ 85040*
>
> *602-426-0542*
>
> *r...@triadwireless.net *
>
> *www.triadwireless.net *
>
>
>
> *“A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz.”* — Humphrey Bogart
>
>
>
>
>
> *Gino A. Villarini*
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel

[Mike Hammett]

Those are the people that aren't exactly known for good procurement processes. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Jaime Solorza"  
To: "Animal Farm"  
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 8:23:05 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 


Hum...have several dozen Dragonwave 11GHz links here and in Midland for 
hospitals and law enforcement...very reliable and support has always been 
excellent. Interesting comment. 


Jaime Solorza 


On Aug 2, 2017 6:45 PM, "George Skorup" < george.sko...@cbcast.com > wrote: 



That's what happens when you're not competitive and put most of your eggs in 
the cell co basket. 



On 8/2/2017 6:20 PM, Sean Heskett wrote: 




plus dragonwave is based in Canada (nothing against Canadians!) so when you 
have warranty or repair issues everything has to go through US customs which 
can delay things for a Lnn time. 


2 cents 


-sean 





On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 4:43 PM, John Seaman < john.sea...@cambiumnetworks.com > 
wrote: 






Dragonwave is looking a little dicey 
http://www.obj.ca/index.php/article/dragonwave-directors-resign-firm-delisted-tsx
 



From: Af [mailto: af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 5:03 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 



Maybe SIAE or Dragonwave. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 







From: "Chuck McCown" < ch...@wbmfg.com > 

To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 5:57:56 PM 

Subject: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 





Cambium will do almost 500 Mbps. 

Anyone else do better? 

Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel

[Mike Hammett]

Clearwire, then Clear. Sprint invested in them early on, as did several others 
(Intel, cable companies, etc.). The lack of follow through funding by the 
not-Sprint investors doomed them. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Chuck McCown"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 8:38:13 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 




They had the catbird seat when they sold those bazillion units to that company 
that put them up nationwide. Don’t remember the name, clearlink or something. 
They cratered and got bought by Sprint I think. DW had more money than God 
after that transaction but the squandered in a huge facility etc etc. Obviously 
believing more to come instead of that onetime huge windfall that it was. 




From: John Seaman 
Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 4:43 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 



Dragonwave is looking a little dicey 
http://www.obj.ca/index.php/article/dragonwave-directors-resign-firm-delisted-tsx
 



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 5:03 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 


Maybe SIAE or Dragonwave. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -


From: "Chuck McCown" < ch...@wbmfg.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 5:57:56 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Max BW on a 6 GHz 60 Mhz wide channel 



Cambium will do almost 500 Mbps. 

Anyone else do better? 

[AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Christopher Gray]

I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of towers.
It currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be looking to replace
that..

I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement:

1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs.
2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier
leasing.
3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I could use.

Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking a cell
carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can get the space I
need on the tower as part of the agreement?

Thank you - Chris

Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

[Adam Moffett]

I've been wondering if there's a tool to edit the land cover data files. 
 I couldn't figure out what could open or import them.  I'd like to 
change a few pixels to forest.


-Adam



-- Original Message --
From: "Brian Webster" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/2/2017 1:32:26 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

For the record that data is derived from the National Land Cover 
Dataset (NLCD). That data is built using satellite and aerial data and 
classifies the ground clutter for each 30 meter square. Roger converted 
that data to a format similar to the SRTM file format so that Radio 
Mobile can read and use it. I have attached a Google Earth file that 
links to the National  set if you want to just view the data and 
compare it to aerial images. As I recall the latest version had some 
issues due to the fact that there were a couple of extra land cover 
classes added and the conversion process from the old format does not 
always work out exactly as desired. Also keep in mind that due to the 
30 meter square getting only one type of classification, it’s one or 
the other in a 30 meter square area where you could have both buildings 
and trees. In the urban clutter class this is pretty common. Radio 
Mobile does loss calculations for buildings only in that square and 
cannot account for a line of trees that do not make up the majority of 
the 30 meter square.






Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

www.Broadband-Mapping.com



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 11:56 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Perfect, thanks.



From: Eric Muehleisen

Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 9:54 AM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



In Mobile Radio under Internet Options. Land cover can be downloaded 
from the internet and saved locally. I have mine pointing to "Landcover 
- Site 2" which is http://www.ve2dbe.com/geodata/landcover/




On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Lewis Bergman 
 wrote:


The last I remember getting data for something similar it came from 
NASA. This might be a place to start:


https://data.giss.nasa.gov/landuse/

If you do a google for NASA land search you get a few thiings that 
might help.




On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:17 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:

But where does the data come from?  Seems like Roger was giving it 
away one year at AnimalFarm.  I probably got a disk but I doubt I 
could ever find it.




From: Steve Jones

Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2017 6:07 PM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Thats an option you select and edit into that file. I think its all 
like 20 years old though on the clutter


On Aug 1, 2017 5:11 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

Where do you get land cover data for Radio Mobile?

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Adam Moffett]

Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in 
a pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because 
they'll turn down the tx power.


With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't 
turn down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.



-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical 
product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, 
but it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional 
communication between the optics to negotiate power levels.


I may be wrong but this is just my experience.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:
How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have 
a TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to 
manufacturing differences or different equipment.


On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson"  
wrote:

Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem 
to bother anything I'm currently using.




-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at 
UBNT and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% 
failure rate. In fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too 
hot. I'm new to the SM Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't 
realize the signal could be too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi 
mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really well.


You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield 
 wrote:

>
> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about 
their Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be 
more related to the way it's throttled then the GPON.

>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. 
I really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. 
The fiber port breaks very easily.

>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,   
wrote:

>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  
Lotsa overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are 
selling more Gig circuits than ever before.

>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per 
port) 1U unit?

>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing 
yet for the OLT 1U unit.

>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in 
the rack already.

>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort 
of transition panel/setup right?

>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home 
connections.

>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, 
with 20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details 
yet).

>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I 
could easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get 
another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm 
done.

>>
>> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since 
I've never actually done GPON.

>>
>> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and 
instead maybe get four of the UBNT Fiber OLT units.
>> That would take up 4U of rack space, the fanout would probably 
still take up 4U of rack space, for a total of 8 U.
>> And I would have instead an 18 customer to 1 port on the GPON 
instead of 72 which I like better for future use.

>>
>> Do these UFiber OLT 1U rackmount units share just 1Gbps per each 
of the 8 ports? That would only be 8Gbps needed total.
>> So I assume the GPON spec they are using can transmit more than 
that per each of the 8 GPON ports, right?

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Josh Reynolds]

We had to pad much of our gear in the Datacenter as well as the NOC in the
office on short single mode runs, including our Juniper MX960s.

On Aug 3, 2017 8:33 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:

> Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a
> pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because
> they'll turn down the tx power.
>
> With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn
> down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Reynolds" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
> To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical
> product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but
> it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional
> communication between the optics to negotiate power levels.
>
> I may be wrong but this is just my experience.
>
> On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:
>
>> How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a
>> TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing
>> differences or different equipment.
>>
>> On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.
>>>
>>> Sounds like they need to fix that.
>>>
>>> Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to
>>> bother anything I'm currently using.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>>
>>> I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT
>>> and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In
>>> fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM
>>> Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be
>>> too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works
>>> really well.
>>>
>>> You learn something new every day.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>> Brett A Mansfield
>>>
>>> > On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield <
>>> li...@silverlakeinternet.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their
>>> Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related
>>> to the way it's throttled then the GPON.
>>> >
>>> > I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I
>>> really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The
>>> fiber port breaks very easily.
>>> >
>>> > Thank you,
>>> > Brett A Mansfield
>>> >
>>> >> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,  
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa
>>> overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more
>>> Gig circuits than ever before.
>>> >>
>>> >> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>>> >> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>>> >> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>>> >> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>> >>
>>> >> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port)
>>> 1U unit?
>>> >>
>>> >> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet
>>> for the OLT 1U unit.
>>> >>
>>> >> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the
>>> rack already.
>>> >>
>>> >> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of
>>> transition panel/setup right?
>>> >>
>>> >> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home
>>> connections.
>>> >>
>>> >> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with
>>> 20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>> >>
>>> >> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could
>>> easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>>> >> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get
>>> another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done.
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since I've
>>> never actually done GPON.
>>> >>
>>> >> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and
>>> instead maybe get four of the UBNT Fiber OLT units.
>>> >> That would take up 4U of rack space, the fanout would probably still
>>> take up 4U of rack space, for a total of 8 U.
>>> >> And I would have instead an 18 customer to 1 port on the GPON instead
>>> of 72 which I like better for future use.
>>> >>
>>> >> Do these UFiber OLT 1U rackmount units share just 1Gbps per each of
>>> the 8 ports? That would only be 8Gbps needed total.
>>> >> So I assume the GPON spec they are using can transmit more than that
>>> per ea

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Josh Reynolds]

I've always looked at it that way. It's also like taking the entire
spectrum and containing it in strands of glass.

On Aug 3, 2017 8:40 AM,  wrote:

> It is technically RF from a physics point of view.  You can swamp out any
> receiver with too much signal and it will lose its ability to properly
> demodulate.  All optical receivers have a range of powers where they will
> work.  Too much or too little and you have problems.  Exactly like RF.
>
> *From:* Josh Reynolds
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 7:36 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
> We had to pad much of our gear in the Datacenter as well as the NOC in the
> office on short single mode runs, including our Juniper MX960s.
>
> On Aug 3, 2017 8:33 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:
>
>> Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a
>> pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because
>> they'll turn down the tx power.
>>
>> With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn
>> down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Josh Reynolds" 
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>>
>> To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical
>> product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but
>> it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional
>> communication between the optics to negotiate power levels.
>>
>> I may be wrong but this is just my experience.
>>
>> On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:
>>
>>> How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a
>>> TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing
>>> differences or different equipment.
>>>
>>> On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

 Sounds like they need to fix that.

 Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem
 to bother anything I'm currently using.



 -Original Message-
 From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
 Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

 I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at
 UBNT and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure
 rate. In fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new
 to the SM Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal
 could be too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB
 and works really well.

 You learn something new every day.

 Thank you,
 Brett A Mansfield

 > On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield <
 li...@silverlakeinternet.com> wrote:
 >
 > I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their
 Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related
 to the way it's throttled then the GPON.
 >
 > I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I
 really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The
 fiber port breaks very easily.
 >
 > Thank you,
 > Brett A Mansfield
 >
 >> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,  
 wrote:
 >>
 >> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.
 Lotsa overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling
 more Gig circuits than ever before.
 >>
 >> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
 >> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
 >> To: 'af@afmug.com'
 >> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
 >>
 >> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port)
 1U unit?
 >>
 >> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing
 yet for the OLT 1U unit.
 >>
 >> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in
 the rack already.
 >>
 >> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort
 of transition panel/setup right?
 >>
 >> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home
 connections.
 >>
 >> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with
 20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
 >>
 >> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could
 easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
 >> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get
 another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[chuck]

It is technically RF from a physics point of view.  You can swamp out any 
receiver with too much signal and it will lose its ability to properly 
demodulate.  All optical receivers have a range of powers where they will work. 
 Too much or too little and you have problems.  Exactly like RF.  

From: Josh Reynolds 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 7:36 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

We had to pad much of our gear in the Datacenter as well as the NOC in the 
office on short single mode runs, including our Juniper MX960s.

On Aug 3, 2017 8:33 AM, "Adam Moffett"  wrote:

  Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a 
pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because they'll 
turn down the tx power.

  With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn 
down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.


  -- Original Message --
  From: "Josh Reynolds" 
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical product 
I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but it's never 
really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional communication between the 
optics to negotiate power levels. 

I may be wrong but this is just my experience.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:

  How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a 
TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing 
differences or different equipment.

  On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson"  wrote:

Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem 
to bother anything I'm currently using.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at 
UBNT and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In 
fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM 
Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be too 
hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really 
well.

You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield 
 wrote:
>
> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their 
Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related to 
the way it's throttled then the GPON.
>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I 
really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The fiber 
port breaks very easily.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,   
wrote:
>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  
Lotsa overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more 
Gig circuits than ever before.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 
1U unit?
>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing 
yet for the OLT 1U unit.
>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in 
the rack already.
>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort 
of transition panel/setup right?
>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home 
connections.
>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with 
20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could 
easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get 
another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done.
>>
>> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since I've 
never actually done GPON.
>>
>> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and 
instead maybe get four of th

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Chuck Hogg]

It doesn't work that way, "turn down".  There are specification limits,
those are specified in the optics.  Maximum differential fiber distance is
usually about 20km for the distance from your nearest to farthest client.
There are different optic levels, B+/C+, but it really depends on your
splits and light levels.

Regards,
Chuck

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a
> pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because
> they'll turn down the tx power.
>
> With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn
> down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Reynolds" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
> To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical
> product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but
> it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional
> communication between the optics to negotiate power levels.
>
> I may be wrong but this is just my experience.
>
> On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:
>
>> How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a
>> TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing
>> differences or different equipment.
>>
>> On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.
>>>
>>> Sounds like they need to fix that.
>>>
>>> Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to
>>> bother anything I'm currently using.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>>
>>> I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT
>>> and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In
>>> fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM
>>> Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be
>>> too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works
>>> really well.
>>>
>>> You learn something new every day.
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>> Brett A Mansfield
>>>
>>> > On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield <
>>> li...@silverlakeinternet.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their
>>> Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related
>>> to the way it's throttled then the GPON.
>>> >
>>> > I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I
>>> really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The
>>> fiber port breaks very easily.
>>> >
>>> > Thank you,
>>> > Brett A Mansfield
>>> >
>>> >> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,  
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa
>>> overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more
>>> Gig circuits than ever before.
>>> >>
>>> >> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>>> >> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>>> >> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>>> >> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>> >>
>>> >> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port)
>>> 1U unit?
>>> >>
>>> >> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet
>>> for the OLT 1U unit.
>>> >>
>>> >> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the
>>> rack already.
>>> >>
>>> >> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of
>>> transition panel/setup right?
>>> >>
>>> >> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home
>>> connections.
>>> >>
>>> >> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with
>>> 20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>> >>
>>> >> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could
>>> easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>>> >> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get
>>> another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done.
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since I've
>>> never actually done GPON.
>>> >>
>>> >> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and
>>> instead maybe get four of the UBNT Fiber OLT units.
>>> >> That would take up 4U of rack space, the fanout would probably still
>>> take up 4U of rack space, for a total of 8 U.
>>> >> And I would have instead an 18 customer to 1 port on the GPON instead
>>> of 72 which I like better for future use.
>>> >>
>>> >> Do these U

[AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Carl Peterson]

1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the
SFP port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any
limitation as to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so
we can just run clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have
to waste fiber.  Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not
worked?

2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland
in whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with
room for the SFP and connector?

Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

[Cameron Crum]

You'd have to change a whole 30 meter bin. It is a binary file 3601x3601
bytes (to make it a grid representation). You would have to find the
"square" or bin in the grid and modify the value at that byte position in
the file.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 8:29 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> I've been wondering if there's a tool to edit the land cover data files.
> I couldn't figure out what could open or import them.  I'd like to change a
> few pixels to forest.
>
> -Adam
>
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Brian Webster" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:32:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>
> For the record that data is derived from the National Land Cover Dataset
> (NLCD). That data is built using satellite and aerial data and classifies
> the ground clutter for each 30 meter square. Roger converted that data to a
> format similar to the SRTM file format so that Radio Mobile can read and
> use it. I have attached a Google Earth file that links to the National  set
> if you want to just view the data and compare it to aerial images. As I
> recall the latest version had some issues due to the fact that there were a
> couple of extra land cover classes added and the conversion process from
> the old format does not always work out exactly as desired. Also keep in
> mind that due to the 30 meter square getting only one type of
> classification, it’s one or the other in a 30 meter square area where you
> could have both buildings and trees. In the urban clutter class this is
> pretty common. Radio Mobile does loss calculations for buildings only in
> that square and cannot account for a line of trees that do not make up the
> majority of the 30 meter square.
>
>
>
>
>
> Thank You,
>
> Brian Webster
>
> www.wirelessmapping.com
>
> www.Broadband-Mapping.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 02, 2017 11:56 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>
>
>
> Perfect, thanks.
>
>
>
> *From:* Eric Muehleisen
>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 02, 2017 9:54 AM
>
> *To:* af@afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>
>
>
> In Mobile Radio under Internet Options. Land cover can be downloaded from
> the internet and saved locally. I have mine pointing to "Landcover - Site
> 2" which is http://www.ve2dbe.com/geodata/landcover/
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Lewis Bergman 
> wrote:
>
> The last I remember getting data for something similar it came from NASA.
> This might be a place to start:
>
> https://data.giss.nasa.gov/landuse/
>
> If you do a google for NASA land search you get a few thiings that might
> help.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:17 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>
> But where does the data come from?  Seems like Roger was giving it away
> one year at AnimalFarm.  I probably got a disk but I doubt I could ever
> find it.
>
>
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 01, 2017 6:07 PM
>
> *To:* af@afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>
>
>
> Thats an option you select and edit into that file. I think its all like
> 20 years old though on the clutter
>
> On Aug 1, 2017 5:11 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
>
> Where do you get land cover data for Radio Mobile?
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

[Rory Conaway]

I can get both polarities.

Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Stephen Patrick
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 3:11 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

Good question:

1024QAM, 40MHz:  CableFree HCR radios can do 330.6Mbps FDX
With 2+0 XPIC, that doubles to 661.2Mbps
www.cablefree.net/hcr

The FOR3 is most cost effective model.  Same capacity for 1+0
www.cablefree.net/for3

I hope that helps,

Best regards
Stephen

On 3 August 2017 at 09:03, Gino A. Villarini 
mailto:g...@aeronetpr.com>> wrote:
Can you get both pol.? If not, you wont reach 500 mbps

From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Rory 
Conaway mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:40 AM
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

Assuming I can only get a 40MHz channel for 10 miles, and budget is an issue, 
what is the best cost-effective product other than Cambium/Ceragon for at least 
500Mbps?

Rory Conaway • Triad Wireless • CEO
4226 S. 37th Street • Phoenix • AZ 85040
602-426-0542
r...@triadwireless.net
www.triadwireless.net

“A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz.” — Humphrey Bogart




Gino A. Villarini

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968


[cid:image001.png@01D30C29.48BA55C0]

Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

[Adam Moffett]

No graphical tool to open it with then?
I'm positive I could do what you're saying, but I'd like to be able to 
delegate a trained idiot to run through an area and edit pixels.



-- Original Message --
From: "Cameron Crum" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/3/2017 10:19:12 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

You'd have to change a whole 30 meter bin. It is a binary file 
3601x3601 bytes (to make it a grid representation). You would have to 
find the "square" or bin in the grid and modify the value at that byte 
position in the file.


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 8:29 AM, Adam Moffett  
wrote:
I've been wondering if there's a tool to edit the land cover data 
files.  I couldn't figure out what could open or import them.  I'd 
like to change a few pixels to forest.


-Adam



-- Original Message --
From: "Brian Webster" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/2/2017 1:32:26 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

For the record that data is derived from the National Land Cover 
Dataset (NLCD). That data is built using satellite and aerial data 
and classifies the ground clutter for each 30 meter square. Roger 
converted that data to a format similar to the SRTM file format so 
that Radio Mobile can read and use it. I have attached a Google Earth 
file that links to the National  set if you want to just view the 
data and compare it to aerial images. As I recall the latest version 
had some issues due to the fact that there were a couple of extra 
land cover classes added and the conversion process from the old 
format does not always work out exactly as desired. Also keep in mind 
that due to the 30 meter square getting only one type of 
classification, it’s one or the other in a 30 meter square area where 
you could have both buildings and trees. In the urban clutter class 
this is pretty common. Radio Mobile does loss calculations for 
buildings only in that square and cannot account for a line of trees 
that do not make up the majority of the 30 meter square.






Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

www.Broadband-Mapping.com



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 11:56 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Perfect, thanks.



From: Eric Muehleisen

Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 9:54 AM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



In Mobile Radio under Internet Options. Land cover can be downloaded 
from the internet and saved locally. I have mine pointing to 
"Landcover - Site 2" which is 
http://www.ve2dbe.com/geodata/landcover/ 





On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Lewis Bergman 
 wrote:


The last I remember getting data for something similar it came from 
NASA. This might be a place to start:


https://data.giss.nasa.gov/landuse/ 



If you do a google for NASA land search you get a few thiings that 
might help.




On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:17 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:

But where does the data come from?  Seems like Roger was giving it 
away one year at AnimalFarm.  I probably got a disk but I doubt I 
could ever find it.




From: Steve Jones

Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2017 6:07 PM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Thats an option you select and edit into that file. I think its all 
like 20 years old though on the clutter


On Aug 1, 2017 5:11 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

Where do you get land cover data for Radio Mobile?

Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

[Cameron Crum]

I think Brian just posted he has a viewable file for GE, but yeah, nothing
to point and click and edit.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> No graphical tool to open it with then?
> I'm positive I could do what you're saying, but I'd like to be able to
> delegate a trained idiot to run through an area and edit pixels.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Cameron Crum" 
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Sent: 8/3/2017 10:19:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>
> You'd have to change a whole 30 meter bin. It is a binary file 3601x3601
> bytes (to make it a grid representation). You would have to find the
> "square" or bin in the grid and modify the value at that byte position in
> the file.
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 8:29 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
>
>> I've been wondering if there's a tool to edit the land cover data files.
>> I couldn't figure out what could open or import them.  I'd like to change a
>> few pixels to forest.
>>
>> -Adam
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Original Message --
>> From: "Brian Webster" 
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:32:26 PM
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>>
>> For the record that data is derived from the National Land Cover Dataset
>> (NLCD). That data is built using satellite and aerial data and classifies
>> the ground clutter for each 30 meter square. Roger converted that data to a
>> format similar to the SRTM file format so that Radio Mobile can read and
>> use it. I have attached a Google Earth file that links to the National  set
>> if you want to just view the data and compare it to aerial images. As I
>> recall the latest version had some issues due to the fact that there were a
>> couple of extra land cover classes added and the conversion process from
>> the old format does not always work out exactly as desired. Also keep in
>> mind that due to the 30 meter square getting only one type of
>> classification, it’s one or the other in a 30 meter square area where you
>> could have both buildings and trees. In the urban clutter class this is
>> pretty common. Radio Mobile does loss calculations for buildings only in
>> that square and cannot account for a line of trees that do not make up the
>> majority of the 30 meter square.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank You,
>>
>> Brian Webster
>>
>> www.wirelessmapping.com
>>
>> www.Broadband-Mapping.com
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Chuck McCown
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 02, 2017 11:56 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>>
>>
>>
>> Perfect, thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Eric Muehleisen
>>
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, August 02, 2017 9:54 AM
>>
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>>
>>
>>
>> In Mobile Radio under Internet Options. Land cover can be downloaded from
>> the internet and saved locally. I have mine pointing to "Landcover - Site
>> 2" which is http://www.ve2dbe.com/geodata/landcover/
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Lewis Bergman 
>> wrote:
>>
>> The last I remember getting data for something similar it came from NASA.
>> This might be a place to start:
>>
>> https://data.giss.nasa.gov/landuse/
>>
>> If you do a google for NASA land search you get a few thiings that might
>> help.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:17 AM Chuck McCown  wrote:
>>
>> But where does the data come from?  Seems like Roger was giving it away
>> one year at AnimalFarm.  I probably got a disk but I doubt I could ever
>> find it.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Steve Jones
>>
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 01, 2017 6:07 PM
>>
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question
>>
>>
>>
>> Thats an option you select and edit into that file. I think its all like
>> 20 years old though on the clutter
>>
>> On Aug 1, 2017 5:11 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
>>
>> Where do you get land cover data for Radio Mobile?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

[Adam Moffett]

Yeah, you can export from Radiomobile to a PNG with KML.
I could even open that image in a GIS program and project it and edit 
the color of pixels, but then I can't easily re-save it in Radiomobile's 
format (as far as I know).



-- Original Message --
From: "Cameron Crum" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/3/2017 10:32:41 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

I think Brian just posted he has a viewable file for GE, but yeah, 
nothing to point and click and edit.


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:25 AM, Adam Moffett  
wrote:

No graphical tool to open it with then?
I'm positive I could do what you're saying, but I'd like to be able to 
delegate a trained idiot to run through an area and edit pixels.



-- Original Message --
From: "Cameron Crum" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/3/2017 10:19:12 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

You'd have to change a whole 30 meter bin. It is a binary file 
3601x3601 bytes (to make it a grid representation). You would have to 
find the "square" or bin in the grid and modify the value at that 
byte position in the file.


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 8:29 AM, Adam Moffett  
wrote:
I've been wondering if there's a tool to edit the land cover data 
files.  I couldn't figure out what could open or import them.  I'd 
like to change a few pixels to forest.


-Adam



-- Original Message --
From: "Brian Webster" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/2/2017 1:32:26 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question

For the record that data is derived from the National Land Cover 
Dataset (NLCD). That data is built using satellite and aerial data 
and classifies the ground clutter for each 30 meter square. Roger 
converted that data to a format similar to the SRTM file format so 
that Radio Mobile can read and use it. I have attached a Google 
Earth file that links to the National  set if you want to just view 
the data and compare it to aerial images. As I recall the latest 
version had some issues due to the fact that there were a couple of 
extra land cover classes added and the conversion process from the 
old format does not always work out exactly as desired. Also keep 
in mind that due to the 30 meter square getting only one type of 
classification, it’s one or the other in a 30 meter square area 
where you could have both buildings and trees. In the urban clutter 
class this is pretty common. Radio Mobile does loss calculations 
for buildings only in that square and cannot account for a line of 
trees that do not make up the majority of the 30 meter square.






Thank You,

Brian Webster

www.wirelessmapping.com

www.Broadband-Mapping.com



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown
Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 11:56 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Perfect, thanks.



From: Eric Muehleisen

Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2017 9:54 AM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



In Mobile Radio under Internet Options. Land cover can be 
downloaded from the internet and saved locally. I have mine 
pointing to "Landcover - Site 2" which is 
http://www.ve2dbe.com/geodata/landcover/ 





On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Lewis Bergman 
 wrote:


The last I remember getting data for something similar it came from 
NASA. This might be a place to start:


https://data.giss.nasa.gov/landuse/ 



If you do a google for NASA land search you get a few thiings that 
might help.




On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 10:17 AM Chuck McCown  
wrote:


But where does the data come from?  Seems like Roger was giving it 
away one year at AnimalFarm.  I probably got a disk but I doubt I 
could ever find it.




From: Steve Jones

Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2017 6:07 PM

To:af@afmug.com

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT RM Question



Thats an option you select and edit into that file. I think its 
all like 20 years old though on the clutter


On Aug 1, 2017 5:11 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

Where do you get land cover data for Radio Mobile?

[AFMUG] Article on Mimosa's proposal for the C-Band

[Rory Conaway]

http://www.multichannel.com/blog/i-was-saying/fcc-launching-inquiry-examine-sharing-c-band-spectrum/414342

Rory Conaway * Triad Wireless * CEO
4226 S. 37th Street * Phoenix * AZ 85040
602-426-0542
r...@triadwireless.net
www.triadwireless.net

"A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz." - Humphrey Bogart

[AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

[Sean Heskett]

Is anyone accepting bitcoin as a form of payment for your products or
services?

If so are you converting to cash at the time of transaction or just hanging
on to the bitcoin?

What's been your experience so far? Good, bad, ugly?

Taxes???

Thanks!

-Sean

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[chuck]

Last time I did some calculations, you run into timing limitations before you 
run out of light.  

From: Chuck Hogg 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 8:11 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

It doesn't work that way, "turn down".  There are specification limits, those 
are specified in the optics.  Maximum differential fiber distance is usually 
about 20km for the distance from your nearest to farthest client.  There are 
different optic levels, B+/C+, but it really depends on your splits and light 
levels.

Regards,
Chuck

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

  Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a 
pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because they'll 
turn down the tx power.

  With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn 
down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.


  -- Original Message --
  From: "Josh Reynolds" 
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical product 
I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but it's never 
really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional communication between the 
optics to negotiate power levels. 

I may be wrong but this is just my experience.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:

  How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a 
TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing 
differences or different equipment.

  On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson"  wrote:

Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem 
to bother anything I'm currently using.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at 
UBNT and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In 
fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM 
Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be too 
hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really 
well.

You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield 
 wrote:
>

> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their 
Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related to 
the way it's throttled then the GPON.
>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I 
really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The fiber 
port breaks very easily.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,   
wrote:
>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  
Lotsa overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more 
Gig circuits than ever before.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 
1U unit?
>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing 
yet for the OLT 1U unit.
>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in 
the rack already.
>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort 
of transition panel/setup right?
>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home 
connections.
>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with 
20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could 
easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get 
another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done.
>>
>> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since I've 
never actually done GPON.
>>
>> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and 
instead maybe get four

Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

[Sterling Jacobson]

That’s a good question.

Platypus isn’t capable of transacting Bitcoin (or IPPay for that matter I’m 
pretty sure).

I don’t think I would bother with it until the major transaction companies and 
our own bill pay systems handle it natively.

I don’t even have a bitcoin account myself or for my business, so a direct 
transaction would be impossible anyways.

Maybe in the future I would sign on as I like the technology, just not the 
fluctuations in market and volatility.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sean Heskett
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:00 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

Is anyone accepting bitcoin as a form of payment for your products or services?

If so are you converting to cash at the time of transaction or just hanging on 
to the bitcoin?

What's been your experience so far? Good, bad, ugly?

Taxes???

Thanks!

-Sean

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Sterling Jacobson]

I think the UBNT display on the ONT is really cool, but my application is 
wasted because use the ONT in a NID on the side of the house.

Even new construction out here there is no conduit to the inside and no fiber 
from outside to inside.
It’s all Cat5e/6 today, so I go the path of least resistance.

If we’re talking 10+Gbps next gen PON, then I might make available the running 
of fiber from the NID inside.
But even then, it’s likely to sit in a wiring closet and translate to Ethernet 
router or cross connect to a router in another room.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Hogg
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 9:13 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I will say, I really like the UBNT ONT, and I've been thinking of offering it 
as a premium option because of the display.  Having the ability to show usage 
easily is very nice.  I just feel UBNT missed the price mark here, and missed 
the opportunity to do something big like ngpon2 with 40gb/s capacity 
capabilities.  That would have rocked the manufacturers.

On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 1:37 PM Brett A Mansfield 
mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>> wrote:
It's funny to me that I was just on FS.com the other day and I 
saw they sell attenuators and I thought to myself, why on earth would you want 
to attenuate the signal? Now I know.


Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Aug 2, 2017, at 11:29 AM, Josh Reynolds 
mailto:j...@kyneticwifi.com>> wrote:
To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical product I 
have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but it's never 
really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional communication between the 
optics to negotiate power levels.

I may be wrong but this is just my experience.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds" 
mailto:j...@kyneticwifi.com>> wrote:
How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a TX 
power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing 
differences or different equipment.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to bother 
anything I'm currently using.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf 
Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT and he 
shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In fact, it's 
a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM Fiber game, so 
I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be too hot at only -3 
dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really well.

You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield 
> mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>> wrote:
>
> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their Fiber 
> never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related to the 
> way it's throttled then the GPON.
>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I really 
> like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The fiber port 
> breaks very easily.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
>> mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa 
>> overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more Gig 
>> circuits than ever before.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 1U unit?
>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet for 
>> the OLT 1U unit.
>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the rack 
>> already.
>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of 
>> transition panel/setup right?
>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home 
>> connections.
>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with 20Gbps 
>> uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could easily 
>> use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get another 576 
>> panel count that spliced 72 count to each po

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Matt Mangriotis]

Carl –


1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…

2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.

Matt

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  Has 
anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?

2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
for the SFP and connector?

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Mark - Myakka Technologies]

Title: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON


Chuck,

We are pushing 30km with our GPON using C Lasers.  Our zhone equipment allows use to slide that 20km window to fix the timing issues.  That port is on a 20km-40km timing window instead of the standard 0km-20km.

-- 
Best regards,
 Mark                            mailto:m...@mailmt.com

Myakka Technologies, Inc.
www.MyakkaTech.com

Proud Sponsor of the Myakka City Relay For Life
http://www.RelayForLife.org/MyakkaCityFL

Please Donate at Please Donate at http://www.myakkatech.com/RFL.html
--

Thursday, August 3, 2017, 11:10:02 AM, you wrote:






Last time I did some calculations, you run into timing limitations before you run out of light.  
 
From: Chuck Hogg
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 8:11 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
 
It doesn't work that way, "turn down".  There are specification limits, those are specified in the optics.  Maximum differential fiber distance is usually about 20km for the distance from your nearest to farthest client.  There are different optic levels, B+/C+, but it really depends on your splits and light levels.
 
Regards,
Chuck
 
On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:




Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because they'll turn down the tx power.
 
With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.
 
 
-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
 




To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional communication between the optics to negotiate power levels. 
 
I may be wrong but this is just my experience.
 
On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:




How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a TX power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing differences or different equipment.
 
On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson"  wrote:




Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to bother anything I'm currently using.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really well.

You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield  wrote:
>
> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related to the way it's throttled then the GPON.
>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The fiber port breaks very easily.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,   wrote:
>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more Gig circuits than ever before.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 1U unit?
>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet for the OLT 1U unit.
>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the rack already.
>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of transition panel/setup right?
>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home connections.
>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with 20Gbps uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could easily use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get another 576 panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Gino A. Villarini]

ZTE has xg-pon available,

From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Chuck 
Hogg mailto:ch...@shelbybb.com>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 at 11:12 PM
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I will say, I really like the UBNT ONT, and I've been thinking of offering it 
as a premium option because of the display.  Having the ability to show usage 
easily is very nice.  I just feel UBNT missed the price mark here, and missed 
the opportunity to do something big like ngpon2 with 40gb/s capacity 
capabilities.  That would have rocked the manufacturers.




Gino A. Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

On Wed, Aug 2, 2017 at 1:37 PM Brett A Mansfield 
mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>> wrote:
It's funny to me that I was just on FS.com the other day and I 
saw they sell attenuators and I thought to myself, why on earth would you want 
to attenuate the signal? Now I know.


Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

On Aug 2, 2017, at 11:29 AM, Josh Reynolds 
mailto:j...@kyneticwifi.com>> wrote:

To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical product I 
have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but it's never 
really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional communication between the 
optics to negotiate power levels.

I may be wrong but this is just my experience.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds" 
mailto:j...@kyneticwifi.com>> wrote:
How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a TX 
power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing 
differences or different equipment.

On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson" 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.

Sounds like they need to fix that.

Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to bother 
anything I'm currently using.



-Original Message-
From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf 
Of Brett A Mansfield
Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT and he 
shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In fact, it's 
a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM Fiber game, so 
I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be too hot at only -3 
dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works really well.

You learn something new every day.

Thank you,
Brett A Mansfield

> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield 
> mailto:li...@silverlakeinternet.com>> wrote:
>
> I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their Fiber 
> never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related to the 
> way it's throttled then the GPON.
>
> I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I really 
> like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The fiber port 
> breaks very easily.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
>> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
>> mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
>>
>> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa 
>> overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more Gig 
>> circuits than ever before.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
>> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
>> To: 'af@afmug.com'
>> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>>
>> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 1U unit?
>>
>> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet for 
>> the OLT 1U unit.
>>
>> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the rack 
>> already.
>>
>> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of 
>> transition panel/setup right?
>>
>> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family home 
>> connections.
>>
>> The UBNT Fiber OLT has 8 ports handling up to 128 clients each, with 20Gbps 
>> uplink capability (not quite sure on those split details yet).
>>
>> I currently only take a max of 576 per cabinet on active, so I could easily 
>> use just one of these UBNT fiber OLT units.
>> If I don't care about the share ratio I guess, I would just get another 576 
>> panel count that spliced 72 count to each port and I'm done.
>>
>> I'm unclear what that panel/splice would look like though since I've never 
>> actually done GPON.
>>
>> And I would probably want to not load up that many per port, and instead 
>> maybe get fou

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Matt Mangriotis]

Further to 1) … I couldn’t find any information on BIDA.  However, if you mean 
BIDI Simplex, then we don’t currently support this, but have plans to add this 
support (via software) in the near future.  I don’t yet have a release this 
support is targeted for, but it will be on the roadmap once we do.

Hope this helps.

Matt


Carl –


1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…

2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.

Matt

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  Has 
anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?

2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
for the SFP and connector?

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[chuck]

Are we totally stuck with Cambium only optics?

From: Matt Mangriotis 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:35 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

Further to 1) … I couldn’t find any information on BIDA.  However, if you mean 
BIDI Simplex, then we don’t currently support this, but have plans to add this 
support (via software) in the near future.  I don’t yet have a release this 
support is targeted for, but it will be on the roadmap once we do.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Matt

 

 

Carl – 

 

1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…

2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.

 

Matt

 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

 

1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  Has 
anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?  

 

2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
for the SFP and connector? 




 

 

[AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Gino A. Villarini]

http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



Gino A. Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Josh Reynolds]

Wonder if anybody is willing to purchase the IP?

On Aug 3, 2017 10:41 AM, "Gino A. Villarini"  wrote:

> http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-
> firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
>
>
>
> *Gino A. Villarini*
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Carl Peterson]

Thanks Matt, yes, I meant BiDi.  Assuming they aren't locked to Cambium
SFPs, I'm not sure what would be different about it.  Guess I could just
try coding a Bidi SFP the same as the cambium SFP that comes with the kit
and test it.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:39 AM,  wrote:

> Are we totally stuck with Cambium only optics?
>
> *From:* Matt Mangriotis
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:35 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
>
> *Further to 1) … I couldn’t find any information on BIDA.  However, if you
> mean BIDI Simplex, then we don’t currently support this, but have plans to
> add this support (via software) in the near future.  I don’t yet have a
> release this support is targeted for, but it will be on the roadmap once we
> do.*
>
>
>
> *Hope this helps.*
>
>
>
> *Matt*
>
>
>
>
>
> Carl –
>
>
>
> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA
> module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
>
> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The
> kit consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and
> the entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
>
>
> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the
> SFP port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any
> limitation as to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so
> we can just run clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have
> to waste fiber.  Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not
> worked?
>
>
>
> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little
> space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland
> in whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with
> room for the SFP and connector?
>
>
>
>
>
>



-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Sterling Jacobson]

Wow. I wonder how that happened?

Used to be one of the forefront in that market.

Just couldn't keep pace with the industry?

I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



Gino A. Villarini

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968


[cid:image001.png@01D30C3D.A2462240]

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Josh Reynolds]

It's been awhile since I've looked at this. Isn't there a requirement now
to make the tower large enough to accommodate several other tenants?

On Aug 3, 2017 8:03 AM, "Christopher Gray" 
wrote:

> I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of
> towers. It currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be looking to
> replace that..
>
> I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement:
>
> 1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs.
> 2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier
> leasing.
> 3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I could use.
>
> Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking a
> cell carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can get the
> space I need on the tower as part of the agreement?
>
> Thank you - Chris
>

[AFMUG] OT Paradyne/Zhone DSL

[chuck]

I am trying to determine if an old Paradyne 4200 DSLAM can be upgraded.  Anyone 
know this product?

[AFMUG] UBNT/UniFi is killing it

[Josh Reynolds]

https://seekingalpha.com/news/3285339-ubiquiti-networks-plus-24-percent-new-high-record-revenues

Well, you investors who are holding stock should be happy :)

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Christopher Gray]

I think that depends on the local bylaws (I have not seen it on a larger
scale, but I may be wrong). In my town they have a maximum height limit of
80ft but they want you to accommodate 5 carriers :-).

This is in a nearby town that does not have the same requirements.


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:55 AM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> It's been awhile since I've looked at this. Isn't there a requirement now
> to make the tower large enough to accommodate several other tenants?
>
> On Aug 3, 2017 8:03 AM, "Christopher Gray" 
> wrote:
>
>> I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of
>> towers. It currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be looking to
>> replace that..
>>
>> I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement:
>>
>> 1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs.
>> 2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier
>> leasing.
>> 3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I could
>> use.
>>
>> Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking a
>> cell carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can get the
>> space I need on the tower as part of the agreement?
>>
>> Thank you - Chris
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Mike Hammett]

Their new radio matches or exceeds Cambium\Ceragon. Probably cost control. That 
or they got stiffed. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Sterling Jacobson"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:48:22 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



Wow. I wonder how that happened? 

Used to be one of the forefront in that market. 

Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry? 

I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two. 



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 


http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
 


Gino A. Villarini 

President 

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968 

Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

[Chuck Hogg]

I can tell you that we are mining and investing in bitcoin, and we are
doing it legally by claiming it on taxes...

Now, as for accepting it as payment?  There are a few companies that will
provide a "merchant type" account for BTC that does instant transfer to
USD.  Like Sterling, our Platypus doesn't support it and we don't plan to
currently support it at this time...but would be open to it in the future.

Regards,
Chuck

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Sean Heskett  wrote:

> Is anyone accepting bitcoin as a form of payment for your products or
> services?
>
> If so are you converting to cash at the time of transaction or just
> hanging on to the bitcoin?
>
> What's been your experience so far? Good, bad, ugly?
>
> Taxes???
>
> Thanks!
>
> -Sean
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Jon Langeler]

Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the advantages.

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> Wow. I wonder how that happened?
>  
> Used to be one of the forefront in that market.
>  
> Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?
>  
> I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>  
> http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
>  
> 
> Gino A. Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 

Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON

[Chuck Hogg]

Mark:

That's correct, we can do the same.  You just have to worry about the
differential timing window, manufacturers call it different things.

Regards,
Chuck

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:27 AM, Mark - Myakka Technologies  wrote:

> Chuck,
>
> We are pushing 30km with our GPON using C Lasers.  Our zhone equipment
> allows use to slide that 20km window to fix the timing issues.  That port
> is on a 20km-40km timing window instead of the standard 0km-20km.
>
>
>
> *-- Best regards, Mark*mailto:m...@mailmt.com
> 
>
>
> *Myakka Technologies, Inc. *www.MyakkaTech.com
>
>
> *Proud Sponsor of the Myakka City Relay For Life *
> http://www.RelayForLife.org/MyakkaCityFL
>
> *Please Donate at Please Donate at *http://www.myakkatech.com/RFL.html
>
>
>
>
> *-- Thursday, August 3, 2017, 11:10:02 AM, you wrote: *
>
> Last time I did some calculations, you run into timing limitations before
> you run out of light.
>
> *From:* Chuck Hogg
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 8:11 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
> It doesn't work that way, "turn down".  There are specification limits,
> those are specified in the optics.  Maximum differential fiber distance is
> usually about 20km for the distance from your nearest to farthest client.
> There are different optic levels, B+/C+, but it really depends on your
> splits and light levels.
>
> Regards,
> Chuck
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 9:33 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:
>
> Don't forget that Sterling is doing ethernet, not PON.  I've plugged in a
> pair of 40km ethernet SM SFP's at 3' away and they work fine because
> they'll turn down the tx power.
>
> With PON there's a single Tx source for the entire network, it can't turn
> down because you may have subs at 1km and other subs at 20km.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Reynolds" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/2/2017 1:29:28 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
>
> To clarify, there is no real intelligent attenuation on any optical
> product I have ever seen. Some can do a 2-3db depending on the product, but
> it's never really a truly intelligent system with bidirectional
> communication between the optics to negotiate power levels.
>
> I may be wrong but this is just my experience.
>
> On Aug 2, 2017 12:26 PM, "Josh Reynolds"  wrote:
>
> How could they? TX and RX are different optic sources. You might have a TX
> power level much higher on one end than the other due to manufacturing
> differences or different equipment.
>
> On Aug 2, 2017 12:10 PM, "Sterling Jacobson"  wrote:
>
> Hmmm, that's not good if it can't auto-attenuate down.
>
> Sounds like they need to fix that.
>
> Most of my SMF lasers and links are short and 'hot', but doesn't seem to
> bother anything I'm currently using.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Brett A Mansfield
> Sent: Wednesday, August 2, 2017 10:16 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
>
> I need to print a retraction here. I have been talking to Martin at UBNT
> and he shows me the error of my ways. I do not have a 50% failure rate. In
> fact, it's a 0% failure rate. My signal was just too hot. I'm new to the SM
> Fiber game, so I'm learning as I go. I didn't realize the signal could be
> too hot at only -3 dB. All of my multi mode Fiber sits at -2 dB and works
> really well.
>
> You learn something new every day.
>
> Thank you,
> Brett A Mansfield
>
> > On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:46 PM, Brett A Mansfield <
> li...@silverlakeinternet.com> wrote:
> >
> > I have heard a lot of complaints from DirectCom customers about their
> Fiber never being close to what they pay for, but that may be more related
> to the way it's throttled then the GPON.
> >
> > I've been playing with several of these ONT/OLT over the past week. I
> really like them. Though I have a 50% failure rate on the nanoG's. The
> fiber port breaks very easily.
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Brett A Mansfield
> >
> >> On Jul 31, 2017, at 2:31 PM,   wrote:
> >>
> >> We have good luck with 32 customers per 2.4 Gbps down on GPON.  Lotsa
> overhead.  No problems, not even close, so far.  And we are selling more
> Gig circuits than ever before.
> >>
> >> -Original Message- From: Sterling Jacobson
> >> Sent: Monday, July 31, 2017 2:19 PM
> >> To: 'af@afmug.com'
> >> Subject: [AFMUG] UBNT OLT Transition from Active Ethernet to GPON
> >>
> >> Anyone tried their PON OLT CPE and OLT 8 port (128 clients per port) 1U
> unit?
> >>
> >> I see pricing around $70 retail for OLT, but haven't seen pricing yet
> for the OLT 1U unit.
> >>
> >> Also, I'm active fiber right now, so I have full 1 to 1 panels in the
> rack already.
> >>
> >> If I wanted to 'migrate' to OLT from active I would need some sort of
> transition panel/setup right?
> >>
> >> Right now my density is 48 ports per 1U 1 to 1 single family h

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Rory Conaway]

We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support and they 
make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use command line 
entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of our relationship with 
that company going forward.  GUI’s are important to reducing training and being 
able to have more techs handle basic support which in turn reduces costs and 
improves support times.  How that message hasn’t gotten through to some 
companies is beyond me.


Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the advantages.
Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
Wow. I wonder how that happened?

Used to be one of the forefront in that market.

Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?

I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



Gino A. Villarini

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[AFMUG] Ceragon IP10 change polarity

[Adam Moffett]

I need to change an existing Ceragon IP-10 (I think IP-10G) from 
Vertical to horizontal polarity.
Do we just rotate the ODU, or do we have to adjust something on the dish 
also?  Anybody happen to know?

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Steve Jones]

I assume theyll just be bought like alvarion and all the rest wont they?
This doesnt mean theyre gone.
What happens to the warranty, when we went through vendors for our first
licensed link, i believe they had the best warranty, like 8 years or
something iirc

On Aug 3, 2017 11:38 AM, "Jon Langeler"  wrote:

Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the
advantages.

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:

Wow. I wonder how that happened?



Used to be one of the forefront in that market.



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.



*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On Behalf
Of *Gino A. Villarini
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-
firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



*Gino A. Villarini*

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Steve Jones]

Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear

On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway"  wrote:

> We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support and
> they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use command
> line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of our
> relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are important to
> reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic support
> which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How that message
> hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.
>
>
>
> Rory
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Jon Langeler
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>
>
>
> Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the
> advantages.
>
> Jon Langeler
>
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson 
> wrote:
>
> Wow. I wonder how that happened?
>
>
>
> Used to be one of the forefront in that market.
>
>
>
> Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?
>
>
>
> I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On
> Behalf Of *Gino A. Villarini
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>
>
>
> http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-
> firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
>
>
>
> *Gino A. Villarini*
>
> President
>
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>
> 
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Rory Conaway]

Ha, yea.  I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was all over so 
this doesn’t scare me ☺.  With the amount of equipment we have to work with, 
it’s impossible to be a command line expert in everything.  GUI’s are far more 
universal.  Had to put up a Sub-10 80GHz radio yesterday.  5 minutes through 
the GUI, caught up.  Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get 
our first link up.  Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in 
the future.

Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear

On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway" 
mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>> wrote:
We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support and they 
make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use command line 
entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of our relationship with 
that company going forward.  GUI’s are important to reducing training and being 
able to have more techs handle basic support which in turn reduces costs and 
improves support times.  How that message hasn’t gotten through to some 
companies is beyond me.


Rory

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] On Behalf 
Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the advantages.
Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson 
mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
Wow. I wonder how that happened?

Used to be one of the forefront in that market.

Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?

I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
To: af@afmug.com<mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



Gino A. Villarini

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Adam Moffett]

I feel about the same.  I'm not scared of a CLI.  I just don't have the 
time to learn and remember everybody's syntax.



-- Original Message --
From: "Rory Conaway" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/3/2017 12:51:52 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

Ha, yea.  I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was all 
over so this doesn’t scare me J.  With the amount of equipment we have 
to work with, it’s impossible to be a command line expert in 
everything.  GUI’s are far more universal.  Had to put up a Sub-10 
80GHz radio yesterday.  5 minutes through the GUI, caught up.  
Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get our first 
link up.  Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in the 
future.




Rory



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear



On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway"  wrote:

We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support 
and they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use 
command line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of 
our relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are important 
to reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic 
support which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How 
that message hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.




Rory



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the 
advantages.


Jon Langeler

Michwave Technologies, Inc.




On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson  
wrote:



Wow. I wonder how that happened?



Used to be one of the forefront in that market.



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.



From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



Gino A. Villarini

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Jon Langeler]

+1 Its 2017 and a GUI is required these days. Time is $$$

Jon Langeler
Michwave Technologies, Inc.


> On Aug 3, 2017, at 12:44 PM, Rory Conaway  wrote:
> 
> We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support and 
> they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use command 
> line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of our 
> relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are important to 
> reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic support 
> which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How that message 
> hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.
> 
> 
> Rory
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>  
> Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the 
> advantages.
> 
> Jon Langeler
> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>  
> 
> On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson  wrote:
> 
> Wow. I wonder how that happened?
>  
> Used to be one of the forefront in that market.
>  
> Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?
>  
> I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>  
> http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
>  
> 
> Gino A. Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Robert Andrews]

I love a CLI, _as a backup_  for those times that I only have text 
access.   But give me a GUI.   My favorite is still the Mikrotik custom 
gui but there has to be a web one as well.


On 08/03/2017 09:55 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:

I feel about the same.  I'm not scared of a CLI.  I just don't have the
time to learn and remember everybody's syntax.


-- Original Message --
From: "Rory Conaway" mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: 8/3/2017 12:51:52 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown


Ha, yea.  I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was
all over so this doesn’t scare me J.  With the amount of equipment we
have to work with, it’s impossible to be a command line expert in
everything.  GUI’s are far more universal.  Had to put up a Sub-10
80GHz radio yesterday.  5 minutes through the GUI, caught up.
Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get our first
link up.  Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in
the future.



Rory



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
*On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear



On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway" mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>> wrote:

We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support
and they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use
command line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of
our relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are important
to reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic
support which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How
that message hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.



Rory



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
*On Behalf Of *Jon Langeler
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the
advantages.

Jon Langeler

Michwave Technologies, Inc.




On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:

Wow. I wonder how that happened?



Used to be one of the forefront in that market.



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.



*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Gino A.
Villarini
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown




http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17



/*Gino A. Villarini*/

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Adam Moffett]

What Mikrotik did right is that if you know the GUI then you probably 
know the CLI.
I.E.: Clicking IP -> Firewall -> NAT is the same as typing "/ip firewall 
nat"


-- Original Message --
From: "Robert Andrews" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/3/2017 1:09:52 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

I love a CLI, _as a backup_  for those times that I only have text 
access.   But give me a GUI.   My favorite is still the Mikrotik custom 
gui but there has to be a web one as well.


On 08/03/2017 09:55 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
I feel about the same.  I'm not scared of a CLI.  I just don't have 
the

time to learn and remember everybody's syntax.


-- Original Message --
From: "Rory Conaway" mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Sent: 8/3/2017 12:51:52 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown


Ha, yea.  I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was
all over so this doesn’t scare me J.  With the amount of equipment we
have to work with, it’s impossible to be a command line expert in
everything.  GUI’s are far more universal.  Had to put up a Sub-10
80GHz radio yesterday.  5 minutes through the GUI, caught up.
Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get our first
link up.  Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in
the future.



Rory



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
*On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear



On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway" mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>> wrote:

We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech 
support

and they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use
command line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end 
of
our relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are 
important

to reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic
support which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How
that message hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.



Rory



*From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
*On Behalf Of *Jon Langeler
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown



Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the
advantages.

Jon Langeler

Michwave Technologies, Inc.




On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:

Wow. I wonder how that happened?



Used to be one of the forefront in that market.



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.



*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Gino A.
Villarini
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown




http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17




/*Gino A. Villarini*/

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

[Layne Sisk]

Might consider it in the same way I would consider a side of beef, or other 
trade.  You can certainly spend it as enough vendors accept it now.

Ps. Platypus does accept IPPay, but definitely does not support Bitcoin :)

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102
[New logo xl]
[http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
[Utah 100]   [fast50-01] [Inc 5000]

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sterling Jacobson
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 9:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

That’s a good question.

Platypus isn’t capable of transacting Bitcoin (or IPPay for that matter I’m 
pretty sure).

I don’t think I would bother with it until the major transaction companies and 
our own bill pay systems handle it natively.

I don’t even have a bitcoin account myself or for my business, so a direct 
transaction would be impossible anyways.

Maybe in the future I would sign on as I like the technology, just not the 
fluctuations in market and volatility.

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Sean Heskett
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:00 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

Is anyone accepting bitcoin as a form of payment for your products or services?

If so are you converting to cash at the time of transaction or just hanging on 
to the bitcoin?

What's been your experience so far? Good, bad, ugly?

Taxes???

Thanks!

-Sean

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Bill Prince]

When they got into bed with Clearwire (AKA Clear), and were doing ~~ 50
licensed links per day, there was speculation what might happen to them
if/when Clear went toes up. It happened, but the hysteresis of that
reaction is pretty interesting.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 10:11 AM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> What Mikrotik did right is that if you know the GUI then you probably know
> the CLI.
> I.E.: Clicking IP -> Firewall -> NAT is the same as typing "/ip firewall
> nat"
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Robert Andrews" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/3/2017 1:09:52 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>
> I love a CLI, _as a backup_  for those times that I only have text
>> access.   But give me a GUI.   My favorite is still the Mikrotik custom gui
>> but there has to be a web one as well.
>>
>> On 08/03/2017 09:55 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>>
>>> I feel about the same.  I'm not scared of a CLI.  I just don't have the
>>> time to learn and remember everybody's syntax.
>>>
>>>
>>> -- Original Message --
>>> From: "Rory Conaway" >> <mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
>>> To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
>>> Sent: 8/3/2017 12:51:52 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>>>
>>> Ha, yea.  I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was
>>>> all over so this doesn’t scare me J.  With the amount of equipment we
>>>> have to work with, it’s impossible to be a command line expert in
>>>> everything.  GUI’s are far more universal.  Had to put up a Sub-10
>>>> 80GHz radio yesterday.  5 minutes through the GUI, caught up.
>>>> Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get our first
>>>> link up.  Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in
>>>> the future.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Rory
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
>>>> *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM
>>>> *To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway" >>> <mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> We just put some up and weren’t impressed.  When you call tech support
>>>> and they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use
>>>> command line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of
>>>> our relationship with that company going forward.  GUI’s are important
>>>> to reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic
>>>> support which in turn reduces costs and improves support times.  How
>>>> that message hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Rory
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:*Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com <mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>]
>>>> *On Behalf Of *Jon Langeler
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM
>>>> *To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the
>>>> advantages.
>>>>
>>>> Jon Langeler
>>>>
>>>> Michwave Technologies, Inc.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson >>> <mailto:sterl...@avative.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Wow. I wonder how that happened?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Used to be one of the forefront in that market.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Gino A.
>>>> Villarini
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
>>>> *To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-
>>>> dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> /*Gino A. Villarini*/
>>>>
>>>> President
>>>>
>>>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>>
>>>>
>


-- 
--
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Adam Moffett]

There was a law firm selling some language like that to municipalities.  
The intent was to have one tower on the skyline instead of 3 or 4.  The 
real effect is you get 3 or 4 bigger towers on the skyline.



-- Original Message --
From: "Christopher Gray" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/3/2017 12:24:48 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

I think that depends on the local bylaws (I have not seen it on a 
larger scale, but I may be wrong). In my town they have a maximum 
height limit of 80ft but they want you to accommodate 5 carriers :-).


This is in a nearby town that does not have the same requirements.


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:55 AM, Josh Reynolds  
wrote:
It's been awhile since I've looked at this. Isn't there a requirement 
now to make the tower large enough to accommodate several other 
tenants?


On Aug 3, 2017 8:03 AM, "Christopher Gray" 
 wrote:
I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of 
towers. It currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be 
looking to replace that..


I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement:

1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs.
2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier 
leasing.
3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I 
could use.


Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking 
a cell carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can 
get the space I need on the tower as part of the agreement?


Thank you - Chris

Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service

[Louis Arsenault]

My recommendation would be for a person who wants to pay you in bitcoin is
to get a Shift card.

They transfer money into a coinbase account and then pay using Shift.

https://www.coinbase.com
https://www.shiftpayments.com/card

I have been using this for several months now to spend bitcoins.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 1:15 PM, Layne Sisk  wrote:

> Might consider it in the same way I would consider a side of beef, or
> other trade.  You can certainly spend it as enough vendors accept it now.
>
>
>
> Ps. Platypus does accept IPPay, but definitely does not support Bitcoin :)
>
>
>
> Layne Sisk
>
> ServerPlus
>
> 801.426.8283, ext 102
>
> [image: New logo xl] 
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
> 
>
> [image: http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
> 
>
> [image: Utah 100]   [image: fast50-01][image: Inc 5000]
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Sterling Jacobson
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 9:17 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service
>
>
>
> That’s a good question.
>
>
>
> Platypus isn’t capable of transacting Bitcoin (or IPPay for that matter
> I’m pretty sure).
>
>
>
> I don’t think I would bother with it until the major transaction companies
> and our own bill pay systems handle it natively.
>
>
>
> I don’t even have a bitcoin account myself or for my business, so a direct
> transaction would be impossible anyways.
>
>
>
> Maybe in the future I would sign on as I like the technology, just not the
> fluctuations in market and volatility.
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On
> Behalf Of *Sean Heskett
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:00 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] Accepting bitcoin as payment for Internet service
>
>
>
> Is anyone accepting bitcoin as a form of payment for your products or
> services?
>
>
>
> If so are you converting to cash at the time of transaction or just
> hanging on to the bitcoin?
>
>
>
> What's been your experience so far? Good, bad, ugly?
>
>
>
> Taxes???
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> -Sean
>
>
>



-- 
-Louis

NTInet
O: 803-533-1660 X 207
C: 803-997-0004

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Mark Radabaugh]

We routinely run Bidi optics in the 820c’s with no issues.   Our usual vendor 
is FlexOptics, which can be programmed to mimic pretty much any locked optic, 
but we just run a generic profile on them.  They work fine though Cambium 
doesn’t provide any SFP diagnostics (as far as I know they don’t provide 
diagnostics with the branded optics either).

N82L014 PTP 820 Glands_x5_Kit gets you 5 of these:





The ID of the threaded end is big enough to clear the face of the SFP even 
though the SFP protrudes slightly from the radio.

Mark

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:35 AM, Matt Mangriotis 
>  wrote:
> 
> Further to 1) … I couldn’t find any information on BIDA.  However, if you 
> mean BIDI Simplex, then we don’t currently support this, but have plans to 
> add this support (via software) in the near future.  I don’t yet have a 
> release this support is targeted for, but it will be on the roadmap once we 
> do.
>  
> Hope this helps.
>  
> Matt
>  
>  
> Carl –
>  
> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
> module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
> consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
> entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
>  
> Matt
>  
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
> Behalf Of Carl Peterson
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>  
> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
> port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
> to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
> clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  
> Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?  
>  
> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
> space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
> whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
> for the SFP and connector? 

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Robert Andrews]

Wow, so how is it on oil usage for that long a run?

On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
hours on a small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Robert Andrews]

Did you buy it with propane, or is it the kit, like on amazon?

On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
hours on a small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[George Skorup]

ve.net>
<mailto:sterl...@avative.net
<mailto:sterl...@avative.net>>> wrote:

Wow. I wonder how that happened?



Used to be one of the forefront in that market.



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry?



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two.



*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com
<mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>] *On Behalf Of *Gino A.
Villarini
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
<mailto:af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>>
*Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown




http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17

<http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17>



/*Gino A. Villarini*/

President

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto
Rico 00968







--
--
bp
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Mike Hammett]

Those limits are crap. You have to go through a long drawn out process whether 
your tower is lower than that or not. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Christopher Gray"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 11:24:49 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space? 


I think that depends on the local bylaws (I have not seen it on a larger scale, 
but I may be wrong). In my town they have a maximum height limit of 80ft but 
they want you to accommodate 5 carriers :-). 


This is in a nearby town that does not have the same requirements. 




On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:55 AM, Josh Reynolds < j...@kyneticwifi.com > wrote: 



It's been awhile since I've looked at this. Isn't there a requirement now to 
make the tower large enough to accommodate several other tenants? 




On Aug 3, 2017 8:03 AM, "Christopher Gray" < cg...@graytechsoftware.com > 
wrote: 



I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of towers. It 
currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be looking to replace that.. 


I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement: 


1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs. 
2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier leasing. 
3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I could use. 


Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking a cell 
carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can get the space I 
need on the tower as part of the agreement? 


Thank you - Chris 

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Mike Hammett]

You mean it's 2017 and everything should be integrated and automated with one 
universal pane of glass... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Jon Langeler"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 11:55:29 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 


+1 Its 2017 and a GUI is required these days. Time is $$$ 


Jon Langeler 
Michwave Technologies, Inc. 



On Aug 3, 2017, at 12:44 PM, Rory Conaway < r...@triadwireless.net > wrote: 






We just put some up and weren’t impressed. When you call tech support and they 
make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use command line 
entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of our relationship with 
that company going forward. GUI’s are important to reducing training and being 
able to have more techs handle basic support which in turn reduces costs and 
improves support times. How that message hasn’t gotten through to some 
companies is beyond me. 


Rory 



From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Jon Langeler 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 


Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the 
advantages. 

Jon Langeler 

Michwave Technologies, Inc. 




On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson < sterl...@avative.net > wrote: 



Wow. I wonder how that happened? 

Used to be one of the forefront in that market. 

Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry? 

I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two. 



From: Af [ mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On Behalf Of Gino A. Villarini 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 


http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
 


Gino A. Villarini 

President 

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968 
 

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[can...@believewireless.net]

​I'm pretty sure you need to change the oil every 20 hours. ​

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:08 PM, Robert Andrews 
wrote:

> Did you buy it with propane, or is it the kit, like on amazon?
>
>
> On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
>> We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
>> prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
>> hours on a small tank in eco mode.
>> Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown

[Mike Hammett]

I guess the latest version of Dragonwave was reasonably priced. Maybe their 
bean counters told them to move more units, but no one believed them. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "George Skorup"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 1:09:03 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 

The Nokia/Alcatel-Lucent thing hurt them the most. 

We were looking to do our first licensed path years ago and considered DW, but 
we bought more radio at 1/2 the price with Trango. 


On 8/3/2017 12:21 PM, Bill Prince wrote: 



When they got into bed with Clearwire (AKA Clear), and were doing ~~ 50 
licensed links per day, there was speculation what might happen to them if/when 
Clear went toes up. It happened, but the hysteresis of that reaction is pretty 
interesting. 


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 10:11 AM, Adam Moffett < dmmoff...@gmail.com > wrote: 


What Mikrotik did right is that if you know the GUI then you probably know the 
CLI. 
I.E.: Clicking IP -> Firewall -> NAT is the same as typing "/ip firewall nat" 

-- Original Message -- 
From: "Robert Andrews" < i...@avantwireless.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 8/3/2017 1:09:52 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



I love a CLI, _as a backup_ for those times that I only have text access. But 
give me a GUI. My favorite is still the Mikrotik custom gui but there has to be 
a web one as well. 

On 08/03/2017 09:55 AM, Adam Moffett wrote: 


I feel about the same. I'm not scared of a CLI. I just don't have the 
time to learn and remember everybody's syntax. 


-- Original Message -- 
From: "Rory Conaway" < r...@triadwireless.net 
> 
To: " af@afmug.com " < af@afmug.com > 
Sent: 8/3/2017 12:51:52 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



Ha, yea. I wrestled a Grizzly Bear once, 15-20 seconds late it was 
all over so this doesn’t scare me J. With the amount of equipment we 
have to work with, it’s impossible to be a command line expert in 
everything. GUI’s are far more universal. Had to put up a Sub-10 
80GHz radio yesterday. 5 minutes through the GUI, caught up. 
Dragonwave, 2 support calls, and 2 guys for 4 hours to get our first 
link up. Guess which one will never get a P.O. from our company in 
the future. 



Rory 



*From:*Af [mailto: af-boun...@afmug.com ] 
*On Behalf Of *Steve Jones 
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:47 AM 
*To:* af@afmug.com  
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



Uh oh, you just poked the cli commando bear 



On Aug 3, 2017 11:44 AM, "Rory Conaway" < r...@triadwireless.net 
> wrote: 

We just put some up and weren’t impressed. When you call tech support 
and they make you feel like a second class tech because you don’t use 
command line entries instead of the GUI, that’s pretty much the end of 
our relationship with that company going forward. GUI’s are important 
to reducing training and being able to have more techs handle basic 
support which in turn reduces costs and improves support times. How 
that message hasn’t gotten through to some companies is beyond me. 



Rory 



*From:*Af [mailto: af-boun...@afmug.com ] 
*On Behalf Of *Jon Langeler 
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:38 AM 
*To:* af@afmug.com  
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



Dragonwave was always higher priced but I could never figure out the 
advantages. 

Jon Langeler 

Michwave Technologies, Inc. 




On Aug 3, 2017, at 11:48 AM, Sterling Jacobson < sterl...@avative.net 
> wrote: 

Wow. I wonder how that happened? 



Used to be one of the forefront in that market. 



Just couldn’t keep pace with the industry? 



I bet that happens to Ceragon in the next year or two. 



*From:* Af [mailto: af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On Behalf Of *Gino A. 
Villarini 
*Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:42 AM 
*To:* af@afmug.com  
*Subject:* [AFMUG] DW shutsdown 



http://www.rcrwireless.com/20170803/business/backhaul-firm-dragonwave-enters-receivership-tag17
 



/*Gino A. Villarini*/ 

President 

Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968 

 














-- 




-- 
bp 
part15sbs{at}gmail{dot}com 

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Mike Hammett]

A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Matt Mangriotis"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs 



Carl – 

1) Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA module 
(not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one… 
2) Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit. The kit consists 
of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the entitlement 
key to apply the license to the radio. 

Matt 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs 


1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
to what SFPs you can run? Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber. Has 
anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked? 



2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
whith an SFP installed. Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
for the SFP and connector? 

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Robert Andrews]

That's the first oil change, after that it's supposed to be every 50 
hours.   We haven't been getting that far without getting to the low oil 
light.  But that's on the eu1000...


On 08/03/2017 11:19 AM, can...@believewireless.net wrote:

​I'm pretty sure you need to change the oil every 20 hours. ​

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:08 PM, Robert Andrews mailto:i...@avantwireless.com>> wrote:

Did you buy it with propane, or is it the kit, like on amazon?


On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has
all the
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run
close to 48
hours on a small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Robert Andrews]

oops, old manual, they now say 100 hours...

On 08/03/2017 11:37 AM, Robert Andrews wrote:

That's the first oil change, after that it's supposed to be every 50
hours.   We haven't been getting that far without getting to the low oil
light.  But that's on the eu1000...

On 08/03/2017 11:19 AM, can...@believewireless.net wrote:

​I'm pretty sure you need to change the oil every 20 hours. ​

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:08 PM, Robert Andrews mailto:i...@avantwireless.com>> wrote:

Did you buy it with propane, or is it the kit, like on amazon?


On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has
all the
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run
close to 48
hours on a small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Steve Jones]

lol, thats a thing with these, they ship with a little oil, they wont run
unless the oils is full, this got us when we get the first one, fought it
for like an hour before fully filling it to the top
we never changed the oil on the little one one time, it had to have had
over a thousand hours

modified
http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 1:19 PM, can...@believewireless.net <
p...@believewireless.net> wrote:

> ​I'm pretty sure you need to change the oil every 20 hours. ​
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:08 PM, Robert Andrews 
> wrote:
>
>> Did you buy it with propane, or is it the kit, like on amazon?
>>
>>
>> On 08/03/2017 11:05 AM, Steve Jones wrote:
>>
>>> We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
>>> prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
>>> hours on a small tank in eco mode.
>>> Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions
>>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Micah Miller]

At least it's got SFP ports :P

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 1:34 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:

> A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Matt Mangriotis" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
> Carl –
>
>
>
> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA
> module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
>
> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The
> kit consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and
> the entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
>
>
> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the
> SFP port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any
> limitation as to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so
> we can just run clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have
> to waste fiber.  Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not
> worked?
>
>
>
> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little
> space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland
> in whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with
> room for the SFP and connector?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


-- 
Micah Miller
Network/Server Administrator
Network Business Systems, Inc.
Phone: 309-944-8823

Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?

[Lewis Bergman]

Requiring multiple carriers definitely isn't a national thing. Whether or
not you should build one big enough is a whole separate question.

I like the tower business. I am finishing a 300 foot next week. Building a
tower a carrier will get on is a big PITA though. You really need an ASR

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017, 12:29 PM Adam Moffett  wrote:

> There was a law firm selling some language like that to municipalities.
> The intent was to have one tower on the skyline instead of 3 or 4.  The
> real effect is you get 3 or 4 bigger towers on the skyline.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Christopher Gray" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/3/2017 12:24:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Tower Options: Big Enough to Lease Space?
>
> I think that depends on the local bylaws (I have not seen it on a larger
> scale, but I may be wrong). In my town they have a maximum height limit of
> 80ft but they want you to accommodate 5 carriers :-).
>
> This is in a nearby town that does not have the same requirements.
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:55 AM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> It's been awhile since I've looked at this. Isn't there a requirement now
>> to make the tower large enough to accommodate several other tenants?
>>
>> On Aug 3, 2017 8:03 AM, "Christopher Gray" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'm preparing to purchase a piece of property that is in a group of
>>> towers. It currently has an old ~100' guyed Rohn 45G. I would be looking to
>>> replace that..
>>>
>>> I'm considering a couple possible options for replacement:
>>>
>>> 1. Replace with improved tower big enough for my needs.
>>> 2. Replace with an oversized tower that could allow for cell carrier
>>> leasing.
>>> 3. Approach a cell carrier to have them build a new tower that I could
>>> use.
>>>
>>> Is it worth building large enough to lease space? Is it worth asking a
>>> cell carrier to lease the space and build a tower there if I can get the
>>> space I need on the tower as part of the agreement?
>>>
>>> Thank you - Chris
>>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] 18GHz link

[Mike Hammett]

Dragonwave?  


SIAE 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Rory Conaway"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 1:40:29 AM 
Subject: [AFMUG] 18GHz link 



Assuming I can only get a 40MHz channel for 10 miles, and budget is an issue, 
what is the best cost-effective product other than Cambium/Ceragon for at least 
500Mbps? 

Rory Conaway • Triad Wireless • CEO 
4226 S. 37 th Street • Phoenix • AZ 85040 
602-426-0542 
r...@triadwireless.net 
www.triadwireless.net 

“A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz.” — Humphrey Bogart 

[AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Donnie McCorkle]

This question was posed by one of my managers this week.



I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look….



Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or has 
worked for you?

Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?



We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Gino A. Villarini]

In this day and age…

From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Mike 
Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:34 PM
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]






Gino A. Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]


From: "Matt Mangriotis" 
mailto:matt.mangrio...@cambiumnetworks.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

Carl –


1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…

2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.

Matt

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Carl Peterson
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  Has 
anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?

2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
for the SFP and connector?

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[chuck]

I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.  

From: Donnie McCorkle 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

This question was posed by one of my managers this week.

 

I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 

 

Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or has 
worked for you?

Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?

 

We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

 

 

 

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Adam Moffett]

I think the person with 2000 subs must have put a lot of effort into 
automation and hired a call center to answer the phone.


That would be a great target to aim for, but I wouldn't guarantee 
hitting it.



-- Original Message --
From: "Donnie McCorkle" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/3/2017 4:18:12 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?


This question was posed by one of my managers this week.



I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look….



Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be 
standard or has worked for you?


Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is 
sufficient?




We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers 
before he hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Carl Peterson]

Matt,

While I have your attention, I have two more 450M questions.

1) What are the supported POE pinouts?

2) Off chance, but it it ground agnostic, i.e isolated ground?

It is nice to see an SFP port but I really would have LOVED to see and SFP
and -48VDC or +/-48VDC like most Siklu gear.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Gino A. Villarini  wrote:

> In this day and age…
>
> From: Af  on behalf of Mike Hammett <
> af...@ics-il.net>
> Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:34 PM
> To: "af@afmug.com" 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
> A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
>
>
>
> *Gino A. Villarini*
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>
> --
> *From: *"Matt Mangriotis" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
> Carl –
>
>
>
> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA
> module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
>
> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The
> kit consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and
> the entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
>
>
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On
> Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>
>
>
> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the
> SFP port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any
> limitation as to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so
> we can just run clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have
> to waste fiber.  Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not
> worked?
>
>
>
> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little
> space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland
> in whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with
> room for the SFP and connector?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Gino A. Villarini]

Field techs or support techs ?

From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of Chuck 
McCown mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>>
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 4:19 PM
To: "af@afmug.com" mailto:af@afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?




Gino A. Villarini


President
Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968

[cid:aeronet-logo_310cfc3e-6691-4f69-bd49-b37b834b9238.png]

I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.

From: Donnie McCorkle
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

This question was posed by one of my managers this week.

I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look….

Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or has 
worked for you?
Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?

We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] Article on Mimosa's proposal for the C-Band

[Paul McCall]

Good article

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Rory Conaway
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:38 AM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Article on Mimosa's proposal for the C-Band

http://www.multichannel.com/blog/i-was-saying/fcc-launching-inquiry-examine-sharing-c-band-spectrum/414342

Rory Conaway * Triad Wireless * CEO
4226 S. 37th Street * Phoenix * AZ 85040
602-426-0542
r...@triadwireless.net
www.triadwireless.net

"A hot dog at the game beats roast beef at the Ritz." - Humphrey Bogart

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Mark Radabaugh]

Carl,

I apologize, I was working on a 820C project earlier and for some reason I 
misread this as a discussion of 820’s and not 450M.

The glands I called out earlier are probably not going to fit in the 450m.   I 
don’t have a 450M I can try it in at the moment.  We are supposed to be getting 
4 in tomorrow and I can try it and let you know if it fits.

We have powered the 450m with both +48V and -48V DC supplies through a CMM5

And since we are talking about a 450m and not a 820c, I have not tried a BiDi 
SFP yet.

Sorry for the misinformation.   To many voices in the head :-)

Mark


> On Aug 3, 2017, at 4:25 PM, Carl Peterson  wrote:
> 
> Matt,
> 
> While I have your attention, I have two more 450M questions.
> 
> 1) What are the supported POE pinouts?
> 
> 2) Off chance, but it it ground agnostic, i.e isolated ground? 
> 
> It is nice to see an SFP port but I really would have LOVED to see and SFP 
> and -48VDC or +/-48VDC like most Siklu gear.  
> 
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Gino A. Villarini  > wrote:
> In this day and age… 
> 
> From: Af mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com>> on behalf of 
> Mike Hammett mailto:af...@ics-il.net>>
> Reply-To: "af@afmug.com "  >
> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:34 PM
> To: "af@afmug.com " mailto:af@afmug.com>>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
> 
> A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously?
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>   
>  
>  
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>   
>  
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Gino A. Villarini
> 
> President
> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Matt Mangriotis"  >
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
> 
> Carl –
> 
>  
> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for BIDA 
> module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
> 
> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The kit 
> consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and the 
> entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
> 
>  
> Matt
> 
>   <>
> From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] On 
> Behalf Of Carl Peterson
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
> To: af@afmug.com 
> Subject: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
> 
>  
> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the SFP 
> port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any limitation as 
> to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so we can just run 
> clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have to waste fiber.  
> Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not worked?  
> 
>  
> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very little 
> space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium gland in 
> whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special gland with room 
> for the SFP and connector? 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Carl Peterson
> 
> PORT NETWORKS
> 
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
> 
> Baltimore, MD 21202
> 
> (410) 637-3707 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]]

Where did you buy that nice machine?

Jim



Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone


 Original message 
From: Steve Jones 
Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the prpane 
guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48 hours on a 
small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[chuck]

Field techs.  

From: Gino A. Villarini 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

Field techs or support techs ?

From: Af  on behalf of Chuck McCown 
Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 4:19 PM
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?





  Gino A. Villarini
 
  President 
  Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968 




I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.  

From: Donnie McCorkle
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

This question was posed by one of my managers this week.

 

I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 

 

Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or has 
worked for you?

Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?

 

We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

 

 

 

[AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Andreas Wiatowski]

Hi all,

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this.

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Mike Hammett]

You absolutely are not. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:07:30 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 

Hi all, 

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this. 

Cheers, 

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Andreas Wiatowski]

Really!? Ok...looks like I'll have to employ my McGyver skills to get my 
customers back online...

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:

You absolutely are not.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Andreas Wiatowski" 
mailto:andr...@silowireless.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:07:30 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

Hi all,

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this.

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[CBB - Jay Fuller]

When did you take your last vacation? lol

  - Original Message - 
  From: Donnie McCorkle 
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 3:18 PM
  Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?


  This question was posed by one of my managers this week.

   

  I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 

   

  Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or 
has worked for you?

  Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?

   

  We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

   

   

   

Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Mike Hammett]

I was able to put a hose clamp behind the mounting plate and then hold the 
radio on with that. I definitely do not like it, but it's better than hanging 
by the pigtails. 

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/Your-Ideas/ePMP-2000-Suggestions/idi-p/67910
 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:14:43 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 


Really!? Ok...looks like I'll have to employ my McGyver skills to get my 
customers back online... 

Cheers, 


Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





You absolutely are not. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski" < andr...@silowireless.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:07:30 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 

Hi all, 

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this. 

Cheers, 

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Andreas Wiatowski]

Ok...you were able to get the pigtails on and the rain cap?

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:20 PM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:

I was able to put a hose clamp behind the mounting plate and then hold the 
radio on with that. I definitely do not like it, but it's better than hanging 
by the pigtails.

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/Your-Ideas/ePMP-2000-Suggestions/idi-p/67910



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Andreas Wiatowski" 
mailto:andr...@silowireless.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:14:43 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

Really!? Ok...looks like I'll have to employ my McGyver skills to get my 
customers back online...

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:

You absolutely are not.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
Midwest Internet Exchange
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]
The Brothers WISP
[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png][http://www.ics-il.com/images/youtubeicon.png]




From: "Andreas Wiatowski" 
mailto:andr...@silowireless.com>>
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:07:30 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

Hi all,

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this.

Cheers,

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO
Silo Wireless Inc.
1-866-727-4238 x-600
http://www.silowireless.com
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV

Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna

[Mike Hammett]

E. 

I honestly don't remember. I just know I wanted a better solution. I have some 
pictures in that thread I linked to. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:23:06 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 


Ok...you were able to get the pigtails on and the rain cap? 

Cheers, 


Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:20 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





I was able to put a hose clamp behind the mounting plate and then hold the 
radio on with that. I definitely do not like it, but it's better than hanging 
by the pigtails. 

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/Your-Ideas/ePMP-2000-Suggestions/idi-p/67910
 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski" < andr...@silowireless.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:14:43 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 


Really!? Ok...looks like I'll have to employ my McGyver skills to get my 
customers back online... 

Cheers, 


Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

On Aug 3, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





You absolutely are not. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Andreas Wiatowski" < andr...@silowireless.com > 
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 4:07:30 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Epmp 2000 ap with 1000 antenna 

Hi all, 

We just lost 4 ePMP 1000 on a tower and have the ePMP 2000 to put up in place. 
Are you able to mount the 2000 AP onto a 1000 antenna using the supplied 
materials in the box? I'd appreciate anyone's experience with this. 

Cheers, 

Andreas Wiatowski, CEO 
Silo Wireless Inc. 
1-866-727-4238 x-600 
http://www.silowireless.com 
Wireless | Fibre | VoIP | PBX | IPTV 

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Layne Sisk]

Part of this is a matter of scale.  If you are starting out you need to have 
coverage and you will be at a pretty high ratio (starts out at 1-1 until you 
get your second customer :)  ).  After you have some momentum I think Chuck’s 
600-1 on Field Techs is about right.  For phone techs we look at about 2000-1, 
but those numbers are deceiving.  You could not serve 2000 customers with only 
one person answering the phones, you need a base to start with.  Because we are 
supporting a significant number of end users we add one tech (or what really 
amounts to 40 hours a week of staffing) for each additional 2000 support 
customers we add, but we did not get to that ratio until we had over 30k end 
users to support.  Example, we just added a 3000 user ISP and we added 60 
additional hours of staffing to accommodate them.

Layne Sisk
ServerPlus
801.426.8283, ext 102
[New logo xl]
[http://i.imgur.com/VOz763A.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/xvQYYWa.png]
[http://i.imgur.com/ELG0AB1.png]
[Utah 100]   [fast50-01] [Inc 5000]

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of CBB - Jay Fuller
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 3:15 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?


When did you take your last vacation? lol

- Original Message -
From: Donnie McCorkle
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 3:18 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

This question was posed by one of my managers this week.

I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look….

Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or has 
worked for you?
Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?

We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Joe Falaschi]

We are currently staffed at 500:1.  I think a lot of it has to do with the age 
of your network (how many CPE conversions you have to do, removals from 
cancellations, etc) vs a newer company with all new gear and not as much chance 
for a customer base and equipment to age, move away etc.  Probably the biggest 
factor is how far out are you booked and is that timeline acceptable to you.

Joe


> On Aug 3, 2017, at 3:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> 
> I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.  
>  
> From: Donnie McCorkle <>
> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
> To:  <>af@afmug.com 
> Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?
>  
> This question was posed by one of my managers this week.
>  
> I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 
>  
> Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or 
> has worked for you?
> Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is sufficient?
>  
> We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before he 
> hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs

[Carl Peterson]

Thanks Mark,

Was wondering about that gland, it looks a lot like the glands that come
with Siklu radios which are too big.  I've ordered the 450M kit and I'll
see how it fits and test out BiDa.  I'm planning on adding an Isolated
DC-DC +48V bus at the site at least for now unless someone else wants to
test them out for awhile on -48.  Kind of a PITA though.  Wish everyone
would just support + and - 48DC on a DC terminal, at least on gear costing
multiple Ks.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 4:42 PM, Mark Radabaugh  wrote:

> Carl,
>
> I apologize, I was working on a 820C project earlier and for some reason I
> misread this as a discussion of 820’s and not 450M.
>
> The glands I called out earlier are probably not going to fit in the 450m.
>   I don’t have a 450M I can try it in at the moment.  We are supposed to be
> getting 4 in tomorrow and I can try it and let you know if it fits.
>
> We have powered the 450m with both +48V and -48V DC supplies through a CMM5
>
> And since we are talking about a 450m and not a 820c, I have not tried a
> BiDi SFP yet.
>
> Sorry for the misinformation.   To many voices in the head :-)
>
> Mark
>
>
> On Aug 3, 2017, at 4:25 PM, Carl Peterson 
> wrote:
>
> Matt,
>
> While I have your attention, I have two more 450M questions.
>
> 1) What are the supported POE pinouts?
>
> 2) Off chance, but it it ground agnostic, i.e isolated ground?
>
> It is nice to see an SFP port but I really would have LOVED to see and SFP
> and -48VDC or +/-48VDC like most Siklu gear.
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Gino A. Villarini 
> wrote:
>
>> In this day and age…
>>
>> From: Af  on behalf of Mike Hammett <
>> af...@ics-il.net>
>> Reply-To: "af@afmug.com" 
>> Date: Thursday, August 3, 2017 at 2:34 PM
>> To: "af@afmug.com" 
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>>
>> A license key to use the SFP port? Seriously?
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> *Gino A. Villarini*
>> President
>> Metro Office Park #18 Suite 304 Guaynabo, Puerto Rico 00968
>>
>> 
>> --
>> *From: *"Matt Mangriotis" 
>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>> *Sent: *Thursday, August 3, 2017 10:20:32 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>>
>> Carl –
>>
>>
>> 1)  Not sure on this… I have asked engineering about support for
>> BIDA module (not BIDI?), and will post an answer when I get one…
>>
>> 2)  Yes, there is an “extended” gland that comes with the kit.  The
>> kit consists of three parts: the SFP module itself, the extended gland, and
>> the entitlement key to apply the license to the radio.
>>
>>
>> Matt
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com ] *On
>> Behalf Of *Carl Peterson
>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 9:17 AM
>> *To:* af@afmug.com
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] 450M SFPs
>>
>>
>> 1) I know you need to buy cambiums SFPs to get the license to unlock the
>> SFP port on the 450M, but once the license is applied, is there any
>> limitation as to what SFPs you can run?  Would much prefer to use BIDA so
>> we can just run clearshield simlex with SC SOCs on it and so we don't have
>> to waste fiber.  Has anyone tested other SFPs in it and have any not
>> worked?
>>
>>
>> 2) The SFP cage is flush with the exterior of the case and has very
>> little space in the antenna side of the cage so you can't screw the cambium
>> gland in whith an SFP installed.  Does the SFP kit come with a special
>> gland with room for the SFP and connector?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Carl Peterson
>
> *PORT NETWORKS*
>
> 401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553
>
> Baltimore, MD 21202
>
> (410) 637-3707
>
>
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Steve Jones]

http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm


On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] 
wrote:

> Where did you buy that nice machine?
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>
>
>  Original message 
> From: Steve Jones 
> Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00)
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator
>
> We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
> prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
> hours on a small tank in eco mode.
> Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions
>

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Lewis Bergman]

800:1 with thousands. I think that number would vary allot depending on
network growth etc. The better specs (fade margin) you require to be met on
install the less you will need.

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017, 4:52 PM Joe Falaschi  wrote:

> We are currently staffed at 500:1.  I think a lot of it has to do with the
> age of your network (how many CPE conversions you have to do, removals from
> cancellations, etc) vs a newer company with all new gear and not as much
> chance for a customer base and equipment to age, move away etc.  Probably
> the biggest factor is how far out are you booked and is that timeline
> acceptable to you.
>
> Joe
>
>
> On Aug 3, 2017, at 3:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.
>
>
> *From:* Donnie McCorkle
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
>
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?
>
> This question was posed by one of my managers this week.
>
> I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look….
>
> Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard
> or has worked for you?
> Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is
> sufficient?
>
> We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before
> he hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?

[Matt Hoppes]

We are 2:600

One doing installs constantly and the other doing service calls and site 
maintenance. 

> On Aug 3, 2017, at 6:21 PM, Lewis Bergman  wrote:
> 
> 800:1 with thousands. I think that number would vary allot depending on 
> network growth etc. The better specs (fade margin) you require to be met on 
> install the less you will need.
> 
> 
>> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017, 4:52 PM Joe Falaschi  wrote:
>> We are currently staffed at 500:1.  I think a lot of it has to do with the 
>> age of your network (how many CPE conversions you have to do, removals from 
>> cancellations, etc) vs a newer company with all new gear and not as much 
>> chance for a customer base and equipment to age, move away etc.  Probably 
>> the biggest factor is how far out are you booked and is that timeline 
>> acceptable to you.
>> 
>> Joe
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Aug 3, 2017, at 3:19 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>> 
>> 
>>> I used to use a 600:1 rule of thumb.  
>> 
>>>  
>>> From: Donnie McCorkle
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2017 2:18 PM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>> 
>>> Subject: [AFMUG] How do I decide if we need more technicians?
>> 
>>> This question was posed by one of my managers this week.
>>>  
>>> I told him I’d ask the animal farm and he gave me a strange look…. 
>>>  
>>> Is there any ratio of technicians to subscriber that seem to be standard or 
>>> has worked for you?
>>> Any other rational your company uses to decide if your manpower is 
>>> sufficient?
>>>  
>>> We read an article recently were a startup WISP had 2000 customers before 
>>> he hired his first employee.. and that sounded pretty wild.

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Nate Burke]

How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?

On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm 




On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] 
mailto:j...@brazoswifi.com>> wrote:


Where did you buy that nice machine?

Jim



Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone


 Original message 
From: Steve Jones mailto:thatoneguyst...@gmail.com>>
Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has
all the prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will
run close to 48 hours on a small tank in eco mode.
Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Brandon Yuchasz]

We are in need of a new generator so I am following along with interest. My 
question is why not just use gas instead of propane? What is the up side. 
Second question is how does the propane fair in cold weather. Say 20F or less?

 

Thanks,

Brandon

 

 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:22 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

 

How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?  

On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

  
http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm

 

 

On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]  
wrote:

Where did you buy that nice machine?

 

Jim

 

 

 

Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

 

 

 Original message 

From: Steve Jones  

Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00) 

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator 

 

We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the prpane 
guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48 hours on a 
small tank in eco mode. 

Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

 

 

[AFMUG] OT Don't piss off a gamer

[Chuck McCown]

Found on the interwebs...

"The organizers of a Pokémon Go fest in Chicago went from being booed at 
last week’s event to being sued by one angry attendee. The offended party, 
Jordan Norton, has filed a class-action suit against event organizer Niantic 
after being unable to partake in the online game, claiming they are liable 
for false advertising Pokemon Go Fest, according to Complex Pop Culture.


Niantic and the carriers supplying coverage for the event have pointed 
fingers at each other for its failure. Niantic CEO John Hanke said: “On the 
pure network access issue, we provided detailed estimates on attendance and 
required data throughput per user to our event partner (Sprint), who worked 
with the major carriers to allow them to plan for adequate coverage,” he 
said. “Some carriers deployed Cellular on Wheels (COWs) to extend their 
capacity. In other cases, the providers deemed them unnecessary based on 
other infrastructure already in place at the site. Users reported different 
levels of success with these providers.”


The lawsuit said the company described a festival “bursting with activity” 
but was instead fraught with app errors and long lines. Although Niantic 
offered apologies and refunds, that was not enough to quash the gamer 
uprising.


“In reality, those in attendance at the Fest were unable to play the Game 
due to Defendant’s failure to account for the number of people that attended 
the Fest,” reads the suit. “Due to Defendant’s failure to account and 
prepare for the number of attendees at the Fest, angry attendees found 
themselves waiting in line to enter the Fest hours after commencement of the 
event.”


“Had Plaintiff and the Class members known that they would spend most of the 
event waiting in lines, be unable to obtain cellular or internet service, 
and encounter technical problems with Defendant’s game,” reads the suit, 
“they would not have purchased tickets to the Fest, and would not have spent 
money on travel and other accommodations.”

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Chuck McCown]

Because gas goes stale, spoils, coats the insides of everything with varnish 
etc.  
Propane is OK in cold weather but there is a minimum tank size for specific 
deliveries at different low temps.  The more gas you need or the lower the temp 
the larger the tank.

But for a small generator like this, I really think a 5 gallon tank will take 
you to below zero.  
Perfectly efficient 1000 watts is 3412 Btu/hr  But in the real world figure 10 
btu/hr per watt.  

If it scales linearly, a 5 gallon tank can deliver about 5000 btu/hr at 0 
degrees F.  
So perhaps a 500 watt load on the generator.  

Actually I found a chart:


So, assuming you need 10,000 BTU for 1000 watts, your 5 gallon barbecue grill 
tank will work down to 0 degrees until it drops below 20% full.  


From: Brandon Yuchasz 

Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 5:49 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

We are in need of a new generator so I am following along with interest. My 
question is why not just use gas instead of propane? What is the up side. 
Second question is how does the propane fair in cold weather. Say 20F or less?

 

Thanks,

Brandon

 

 

From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Nate Burke
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:22 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

 

How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?  

On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

  http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm

   

   

  On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]  
wrote:

  Where did you buy that nice machine?

   

  Jim

   

   

   

  Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

   

   

   Original message 

  From: Steve Jones  

  Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00) 

  To: af@afmug.com 

  Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator 

   

  We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the 
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48 hours 
on a small tank in eco mode. 

  Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

   

 

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Steve Jones]

They recomend running the exaust at the tank in the winter, its caveated
with keeping it at a safe distance. They start fine in the cold. There is a
model with waterproof plugs, but weve never had issue with rain or snow.
These are nice, i can toss it in my front seat with a tall tank in my
alero, the gas ones were too big. We have 5 or six portable gas generators
collecting dust now
Transport of fuel and runtime are huge factors, 48 hours of gasoline is
alot of gas, and youd need an external tank. Propane wont varnish your
engine guts either. The only thing i dont like about propane is around here
nobody will top off tanks by weight, they charge a full fill rate, so short
runs are irritating. Talked to the local propane dealer about topping off
from our office generator tank, but the pump would be expensive and
insuring that is expensive.
We have a split hose too so we can run dual tanks if we know a site will be
down for an extended time.

We do have some lightweight carbon fiber tanks that you can see the liquid
level, those are nice. We also use a big heavy chain and padlock to keep
the generator from walking away, these WILL get stolen.

They have a standby with remote start and all that jazz for about 5k, its
way more generator than any of our sites need, but its an option.

On Aug 3, 2017 7:03 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

Because gas goes stale, spoils, coats the insides of everything with
varnish etc.
Propane is OK in cold weather but there is a minimum tank size for specific
deliveries at different low temps.  The more gas you need or the lower the
temp the larger the tank.

But for a small generator like this, I really think a 5 gallon tank will
take you to below zero.
Perfectly efficient 1000 watts is 3412 Btu/hr  But in the real world figure
10 btu/hr per watt.

If it scales linearly, a 5 gallon tank can deliver about 5000 btu/hr at 0
degrees F.
So perhaps a 500 watt load on the generator.

Actually I found a chart:
[image: image]

So, assuming you need 10,000 BTU for 1000 watts, your 5 gallon barbecue
grill tank will work down to 0 degrees until it drops below 20% full.


*From:* Brandon Yuchasz

*Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 5:49 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator


We are in need of a new generator so I am following along with interest. My
question is why not just use gas instead of propane? What is the up side.
Second question is how does the propane fair in cold weather. Say 20F or
less?



Thanks,

Brandon





*From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Nate Burke
*Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:22 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator



How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?

On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm





On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] 
wrote:

Where did you buy that nice machine?



Jim







Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone





 Original message 

From: Steve Jones 

Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00)

To: af@afmug.com

Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator



We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
hours on a small tank in eco mode.

Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Chuck McCown]

If you have a liquid pickup on your large tank you can top them with gravity 
only.  It’s wastes a bit if fuel but you can fill them all the way up.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:31 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

They recomend running the exaust at the tank in the winter, its caveated with 
keeping it at a safe distance. They start fine in the cold. There is a model 
with waterproof plugs, but weve never had issue with rain or snow. 
These are nice, i can toss it in my front seat with a tall tank in my alero, 
the gas ones were too big. We have 5 or six portable gas generators collecting 
dust now
Transport of fuel and runtime are huge factors, 48 hours of gasoline is alot of 
gas, and youd need an external tank. Propane wont varnish your engine guts 
either. The only thing i dont like about propane is around here nobody will top 
off tanks by weight, they charge a full fill rate, so short runs are 
irritating. Talked to the local propane dealer about topping off from our 
office generator tank, but the pump would be expensive and insuring that is 
expensive.
We have a split hose too so we can run dual tanks if we know a site will be 
down for an extended time.

We do have some lightweight carbon fiber tanks that you can see the liquid 
level, those are nice. We also use a big heavy chain and padlock to keep the 
generator from walking away, these WILL get stolen.

They have a standby with remote start and all that jazz for about 5k, its way 
more generator than any of our sites need, but its an option.

On Aug 3, 2017 7:03 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

  Because gas goes stale, spoils, coats the insides of everything with varnish 
etc.  
  Propane is OK in cold weather but there is a minimum tank size for specific 
deliveries at different low temps.  The more gas you need or the lower the temp 
the larger the tank.

  But for a small generator like this, I really think a 5 gallon tank will take 
you to below zero.  
  Perfectly efficient 1000 watts is 3412 Btu/hr  But in the real world figure 
10 btu/hr per watt.  

  If it scales linearly, a 5 gallon tank can deliver about 5000 btu/hr at 0 
degrees F.  
  So perhaps a 500 watt load on the generator.  

  Actually I found a chart:


  So, assuming you need 10,000 BTU for 1000 watts, your 5 gallon barbecue grill 
tank will work down to 0 degrees until it drops below 20% full.  


  From: Brandon Yuchasz 
  Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 5:49 PM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

  We are in need of a new generator so I am following along with interest. My 
question is why not just use gas instead of propane? What is the up side. 
Second question is how does the propane fair in cold weather. Say 20F or less?



  Thanks,

  Brandon





  From: Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] On Behalf Of Nate Burke
  Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:22 PM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator



  How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?  

  On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:

http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm





On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] 
 wrote:

Where did you buy that nice machine?



Jim







Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone





 Original message 

From: Steve Jones  

Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00) 

To: af@afmug.com 

Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator 



We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the 
prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48 hours 
on a small tank in eco mode. 

Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions

Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator

[Jason Wilson]

I have not used this but I have heard good things.
http://www.motorsnorkel.com/motor-snorkel-tri-fuel-natural-gas-propane-and-gasoline-conversion-kit-3554.html



On Aug 3, 2017 6:22 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:

> If you have a liquid pickup on your large tank you can top them with
> gravity only.  It’s wastes a bit if fuel but you can fill them all the way
> up.
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:31 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator
>
> They recomend running the exaust at the tank in the winter, its caveated
> with keeping it at a safe distance. They start fine in the cold. There is a
> model with waterproof plugs, but weve never had issue with rain or snow.
> These are nice, i can toss it in my front seat with a tall tank in my
> alero, the gas ones were too big. We have 5 or six portable gas generators
> collecting dust now
> Transport of fuel and runtime are huge factors, 48 hours of gasoline is
> alot of gas, and youd need an external tank. Propane wont varnish your
> engine guts either. The only thing i dont like about propane is around here
> nobody will top off tanks by weight, they charge a full fill rate, so short
> runs are irritating. Talked to the local propane dealer about topping off
> from our office generator tank, but the pump would be expensive and
> insuring that is expensive.
> We have a split hose too so we can run dual tanks if we know a site will
> be down for an extended time.
>
> We do have some lightweight carbon fiber tanks that you can see the liquid
> level, those are nice. We also use a big heavy chain and padlock to keep
> the generator from walking away, these WILL get stolen.
>
> They have a standby with remote start and all that jazz for about 5k, its
> way more generator than any of our sites need, but its an option.
>
> On Aug 3, 2017 7:03 PM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
>
> Because gas goes stale, spoils, coats the insides of everything with
> varnish etc.
> Propane is OK in cold weather but there is a minimum tank size for
> specific deliveries at different low temps.  The more gas you need or the
> lower the temp the larger the tank.
>
> But for a small generator like this, I really think a 5 gallon tank will
> take you to below zero.
> Perfectly efficient 1000 watts is 3412 Btu/hr  But in the real world
> figure 10 btu/hr per watt.
>
> If it scales linearly, a 5 gallon tank can deliver about 5000 btu/hr at 0
> degrees F.
> So perhaps a 500 watt load on the generator.
>
> Actually I found a chart:
> [image: image]
>
> So, assuming you need 10,000 BTU for 1000 watts, your 5 gallon barbecue
> grill tank will work down to 0 degrees until it drops below 20% full.
>
>
> *From:* Brandon Yuchasz
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 5:49 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator
>
>
> We are in need of a new generator so I am following along with interest.
> My question is why not just use gas instead of propane? What is the up
> side. Second question is how does the propane fair in cold weather. Say 20F
> or less?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Brandon
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Af [mailto:af-boun...@afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Nate Burke
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 03, 2017 6:22 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator
>
>
>
> How do you weatherproof it, aren't the plugs just exposed on the side?
>
> On 8/3/2017 5:09 PM, Steve Jones wrote:
>
> http://www.genconnexdirect.net/honda_propane_modified_generators.htm
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 3:45 PM, Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi] <
> j...@brazoswifi.com> wrote:
>
> Where did you buy that nice machine?
>
>
>
> Jim
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S7 active, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
>
>
>
>
>
>  Original message 
>
> From: Steve Jones 
>
> Date: 8/3/17 1:05 PM (GMT-06:00)
>
> To: af@afmug.com
>
> Subject: [AFMUG] Great portable propane generator
>
>
>
> We have a smaller one that started having problems, but this has all the
> prpane guts on the inside and a quick connect hose. Will run close to 48
> hours on a small tank in eco mode.
>
> Easy to start, runs like a champ in all weather conditions
>
>
>
>
>
>
>