RE: MD: MD Label blank
Yes. They seem to be sticky enough to not come off in normal use, but they can be peeled off easily enough. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Matt Wall Sent: 19 October 2001 01:32 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD Label blank === = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === do these labels remove easily from md's? i'm curious because i hate having stacked 3+ labels on top of each other because they all stick together. - Original Message - From: Alan Dowds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: RE: MD: MD Label blank Pressit make label software and labels for MD. I got mine from discount discs (www.discountdiscs.co.uk), or try www.pressit.com They seem to work well enough with my Epson inkjet printer. Al -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Hayes Sent: 18 October 2001 03:35 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: MD: MD Label blank Hello... I'm looking for an online MD labeler. I have found one PDF stylefor DAT tape cases. Anyone know of an MD labeler. Hayes - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD Deck Recommendations
I am looking for a deck to get my booted shows into my PC for editing and transferring to CDR. Digital output is a necessity. Keyboard control, CD player track information transfer, MDLP, high speed CD transfer would all be nice but not required. I looked at the Sony MDS-PC3 since it is built for a PC, but it doesn't look to have the same build quality as other Sony units for the same or less $. I found a discontinued Sony MDS-JB930 for $270. The 930 has almost all the functions I am looking for and has some great reviews, but I don't know if that is a good price for that unit. The 940, that replaced it, is running about $400 at most outlets I have found. Any advice on other home decks or these would be greatly appreciated. Or places to purchase MD decks on-line. Once I get this unit I am going to get a new digital sound card for my PC, any advice on those would be helpful too. Thanks in advance, Brian http://run.to/bdb _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD Label blank
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === Technically speaking if they removed easily they'd be horrible labels. Imagine one falling off in your player. Myself, I write on my labels with pencil, although that doesn't help people looking to use printed labels. I'm sure someone out there has a good technique for removing labels, but I doubt it'd be healthy for your minidisc in the process. :) :ml --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD From: Matt Wall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD Label blank Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 19:32:13 -0500 === = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === do these labels remove easily from md's? i'm curious because i hate having stacked 3+ labels on top of each other because they all stick together. - Original Message - From: Alan Dowds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: RE: MD: MD Label blank Pressit make label software and labels for MD. I got mine from discount discs (www.discountdiscs.co.uk), or try www.pressit.com They seem to work well enough with my Epson inkjet printer. Al -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Hayes Sent: 18 October 2001 03:35 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: MD: MD Label blank Hello... I'm looking for an online MD labeler. I have found one PDF stylefor DAT tape cases. Anyone know of an MD labeler. Hayes - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD Label blank
I recall 3m made removable floppy labels at one point, using post-it glue. That might work. I don't think removing a detached label in a portable would be too brutal, but I worry about residue scraping off onto something sensitive. Here is one place selling avery removables that may work. I haven't tested them. They are listed as removable and repositionable. http://www.compuforms.com/remove.htm - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD Label blank
I recall 3m made removable floppy labels at one point, using post-it glue. That might work. I don't think removing a detached label in a portable would be too brutal, but I worry about residue scraping off onto something sensitive. Here is one place selling avery removables that may work. I haven't tested them. They are listed as removable and repositionable. http://www.compuforms.com/remove.htm - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD Label blank
Pressit make label software and labels for MD. I got mine from discount discs (www.discountdiscs.co.uk), or try www.pressit.com They seem to work well enough with my Epson inkjet printer. Al -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Hayes Sent: 18 October 2001 03:35 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: MD: MD Label blank Hello... I'm looking for an online MD labeler. I have found one PDF stylefor DAT tape cases. Anyone know of an MD labeler. Hayes - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD Label blank
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === do these labels remove easily from md's? i'm curious because i hate having stacked 3+ labels on top of each other because they all stick together. - Original Message - From: Alan Dowds [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: RE: MD: MD Label blank Pressit make label software and labels for MD. I got mine from discount discs (www.discountdiscs.co.uk), or try www.pressit.com They seem to work well enough with my Epson inkjet printer. Al -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Hayes Sent: 18 October 2001 03:35 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: MD: MD Label blank Hello... I'm looking for an online MD labeler. I have found one PDF stylefor DAT tape cases. Anyone know of an MD labeler. Hayes - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-CD deck player/recorder
At 21:06 -0400 16-10-2001, Eric Woudenberg, Minidisc.org Editor wrote: I've just been told that the EasyTitle2 is back in production. This allows you to use a normal PS/2 keyboard on any Sony deck. See today's minidisc.org news. Thanks Rick. Just had a look at their website. (http://www.mujweb.cz/www/HySy/EasyTitle.htm) Ordering the thing is a bit complicated. I find it rather strange that I have to send USD when ordering from Europe. I will send an email to find out if it isn't easier to pay in EUR (euro). I don't think I will be able to send dollars to the Czech Republic from the Netherlands. But the gadget seems to be the perfect solution for a large number of Sony Decks without a PS/2 Keyboard input. (If I decide to get the thing, I will have to get a PS/2 keyboard as well, because I have a very cool Apple Pro Keyboard with my iMac, but that's USB of course. I think I will get a very old keyboard from work, shouldn't be a problem.) Mark - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-CD deck player/recorder
At 9:19 -0700 11-10-2001, Fabrizio Minelli wrote: Does anyone know where I can find a good and not to costly home deck MD and CD rec/player? Thanks Fabrizio I bought a Sony CD/MD MXD-D3 last year. I'm very happy with this machine. Maybe you can get one of these, since it has been replaced by the MXD-D4. The new model also includes MDLP. If I were to buy a new machine right now, I would save for the MXD-D5C. It has the same functions as the D4, but includes a 5CD changer and a PS/2 keyboard in. Great for titling and the only thing I really miss on my D3. Mark - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD-CD deck player/recorder
Does anyone know where I can find a good and not to costly home deck MD and CD rec/player? Thanks Fabrizio _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD use in public Radio
Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 11:54:32 -0700 From: macdef [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: MD: MD Sony PC-Link w/ Mac Hey, KQED! ;) Michael, do you use MD at all at work? Just curious about MD's penetration at KQED. Virtually all the reporters at KQED are using minidisc now. The HHB MDP-500 is the standard deck used in the field now, affectionately called the Purple People Recorder. In my own kit I have a Sony MZR - 30 and the Sharp MDRS-60. Very happpy with then both. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD Sony PC-Link w/ Mac
Eric Eduardo, and other Mac folks, I have a Mac G4 and have used the Xitel PC Link unit that came with the Sony MZR70. As with many things Macintosh, you plug it in and it works. I plugged in the Xitel to my Keyboard and that was it. I had my audio stream out The Mac should sense the USB out and should just start feeding audio automatically. Have you downloaded iTunes yet from apple.com? It's a great little mp3 organizer, ripper, and converter. Michael Johnson KQED-FM San Francisco - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD Sony PC-Link w/ Mac
Michael Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Michael Johnson KQED-FM San Francisco Hey, KQED! ;) Michael, do you use MD at all at work? Just curious about MD's penetration at KQED. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD Sony PC-Link w/ Mac
on 10/8/01 2:12 PM, Michael Johnson at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have a Mac G4 and have used the Xitel PC Link unit that came with the Sony MZR70. As with many things Macintosh, you plug it in and it works. I plugged in the Xitel to my Keyboard and that was it. I had my audio stream out The Mac should sense the USB out and should just start feeding audio automatically. Thanks for this info. It is certainly reassuring. Rgds, Eduardo H. Martinez-Hasembank Holos Media [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD to Old PowerBook
From: macdef [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... Your best bet is to hook a mini-to-mini cable from your R37 to the audio-in jack on the 5300, and use the program Coaster to do the recording (you can find Coaster on http://www.versiontracker.com/). Experiment with the levels in Coaster until you get it right, then record the audio to disc. You can have Coaster save your audio as AIFF files (the Mac counterpart to wav files on Windows, for burning to CD). Then just burn them to a CD. That's basically what I'm doing. It's just that a somewhat better sound-in option for the PB would help. Still, after some tests, I was relieved to see that this setup doesn't introduce any noise. Thanks for the reply! Alex Alex Enkerli Ph.D. Candidate Department of Folklore and Ethnomusicology Indiana University - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
re: MD: MD to Old PowerBook
Alexandre Enkerli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyway, as said in an earlier message, it'll be used for field recordings. But one thing I'd like to do is to burn backup copies on CD-Rs. The only computer I'll have then will be an old PowerBook 5300 the audio i/o of which is pretty bad. I don't necessarily want extreme sound quality for these backups but I was wondering if people here had ideas for neat ways to get decent results. My budget is really tight so the MD-to-PB solution shouldn't cost too much. The MD is a Sony MZ-R37 and the Powerbook has two PC Card slots, a specific expansion bay, and the standard Mac ports (Localtalk serial, SCSI). Your best bet is to hook a mini-to-mini cable from your R37 to the audio-in jack on the 5300, and use the program Coaster to do the recording (you can find Coaster on http://www.versiontracker.com/). Experiment with the levels in Coaster until you get it right, then record the audio to disc. You can have Coaster save your audio as AIFF files (the Mac counterpart to wav files on Windows, for burning to CD). Then just burn them to a CD. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD to Old PowerBook
Hello all! Just received my very first MD device! All I can say is: YES! Oh, YES!!! Anyway, as said in an earlier message, it'll be used for field recordings. But one thing I'd like to do is to burn backup copies on CD-Rs. The only computer I'll have then will be an old PowerBook 5300 the audio i/o of which is pretty bad. I don't necessarily want extreme sound quality for these backups but I was wondering if people here had ideas for neat ways to get decent results. My budget is really tight so the MD-to-PB solution shouldn't cost too much. The MD is a Sony MZ-R37 and the Powerbook has two PC Card slots, a specific expansion bay, and the standard Mac ports (Localtalk serial, SCSI). TIA! Alex from Montreal Alex Enkerli Ph.D. Candidate Department of Folklore and Ethnomusicology Indiana University - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD v DAT
I have a portable DAT and MD. I much prefer the MD due to editing capablities. You have to sit with your finger on the DAT's pause button if you want to edit out commercials while recording, you can not edit out unwanted material latter like you can with MD. There is a way. Use Skip IDs. The material is still there, but the DAT deck fast-forwards past it during later playback. __ Do You Yahoo!? NEW from Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: md-l-digest V3 #111
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] Matt wrote: I own a CDR deck, MD deck portable but the one thing I can't do with all this is record a continous 2 or 3 hr FM radio broadcast (and later one day from DAB). OK, my MD gear both have MDLP but I'm after quality rather than convenience. LP4 is rubbish and LP2 is very listenable, but as others have said, only really for personal/in car use. I'm therefore considering a DAT personal. (I can get an Aiwa HD-S200 for UKP150). I'd be interested in comparions of DAT with MD if anyone has experience. How does taping compare ? Editing is not really an issue. I'm after the ability to make continuous long recordings of 2 or 4 hr length. Now that the Psion Wavefinder (www.wavefinder.com) is down to ukp100, why don't you cut out the analogue stage altogether and record DAB direct to your PC hard disc? In the native mp2 format of digital broadcasts, a 45Gbyte HDD will hold three weeks of recordings (assuming no Windows crashes) and a CD-R will hold over eight hours at almost regligible cost. Mp2 files can be played with all the usual PC media players and replay quality is identical to the original digital broadcast. If you add one of the low-cost sound cards with optical i/o to your PC, you can copy the recordings to MD. Alternatively, for a larger choice of radio stations, you could use a digital satellite card such as the Hauppauge WinTV DVB-s, which, likewise, will stream mp2 to your hard drive. One other option is to convert the mp2s to mp3s (the Wavefinder can also save as mp3s directly, cutting out this step) which can then be played back on the low-cost CD-R mp3 players now becoming available. DAT appears to be passing its sell-by date in professional audio circles, and it's too much to expect it to survive in home use. Anyway, it's pointless to decompress the broadcast mp2 stream to WAV just so that you can record it expensively on a DAT cassette: it makes much better sense to archive the original mp2 on a CD-R. Richard - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD v DAT
I have a portable DAT and MD. I much prefer the MD due to editing capablities. You
have to sit with your
finger on the DAT's pause button if you want to edit out commercials while recording,
you can not edit out unwanted material
latter like you can with MD.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi,
I own a CDR deck, MD deck portable but the one thing I can't do with all this is
record a continous 2 or 3 hr FM radio broadcast (and later one day from DAB). OK, my
MD gear both have MDLP but I'm after quality rather than convenience. LP4 is rubbish
and LP2 is very listenable, but as others have said, only really for personal/in car
use. I'm therefore considering a DAT personal. (I can get an Aiwa HD-S200 for UKP150).
I'd be interested in comparions of DAT with MD if anyone has experience.
How does taping compare ? Editing is not really an issue. I'm after the ability to
make continuous long recordings of 2 or 4 hr length.
cheers
Matt
-
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MD: MD v DAT
Hi, I own a CDR deck, MD deck portable but the one thing I can't do with all this is record a continous 2 or 3 hr FM radio broadcast (and later one day from DAB). OK, my MD gear both have MDLP but I'm after quality rather than convenience. LP4 is rubbish and LP2 is very listenable, but as others have said, only really for personal/in car use. I'm therefore considering a DAT personal. (I can get an Aiwa HD-S200 for UKP150). I'd be interested in comparions of DAT with MD if anyone has experience. How does taping compare ? Editing is not really an issue. I'm after the ability to make continuous long recordings of 2 or 4 hr length. cheers Matt - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: NET MD (MD to PC upload)
Shawn Lin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: t0ner, inc wrote: AM I missing something here? Is NET MD going to allow me to upload my minidisc field recordings to my PC faster? Am I going to have to use my crappy Windoze machine?-- I'd rather use my Mac... No. Net MD works the other way, PC to MD. Not MD to PC. Hi Shawn, What do you make of the comments by the folks at My-Minidisc.de, saying they were able to perform MD to PC upload with a Sony NetMD setup at IFA? I found it surprising of course, but I talked to them subsequently by phone and they were quite earnest and serious about being able to perform the transfer. Rick - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: NET MD (MD to PC upload)
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === Eric Woudenberg, Minidisc.org Editor wrote: Shawn Lin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: t0ner, inc wrote: AM I missing something here? Is NET MD going to allow me to upload my minidisc field recordings to my PC faster? Am I going to have to use my crappy Windoze machine?-- I'd rather use my Mac... No. Net MD works the other way, PC to MD. Not MD to PC. Hi Shawn, What do you make of the comments by the folks at My-Minidisc.de, saying they were able to perform MD to PC upload with a Sony NetMD setup at IFA? I found it surprising of course, but I talked to them subsequently by phone and they were quite earnest and serious about being able to perform the transfer. Rick, That may very well be the case which would be very cool! It would explain the need for all the security stuff implemented into NetMD. I admit I haven't been following MD as religously as I used to. Shawn - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD good enough for vinyl archiving?
Hi everyone! After reading the post about using MD for vinyl archiving, I would agree with the concept. A good idea is to use 80-minute MDs for the job because you could easily fit two standard-length LPs onto one disc. This was because, during the 70s, most people I knew used to record LPs to cassette for enjoyment in car stereos and portable equipment. In a lot of these situations, they would record to C-90 cassettes with the goal of fitting both sides of one album on one side of the C-90 cassette. With most popular albums, once both sides of one album were laid down on the one side of the cassette, there was usually 5-10 minutes worth of spare tape left, which could allow a user to insert a bonus track. This let them have nearly one and ha half hour's worth of music on the one tape with 45 minutes between side-changes. The listeners would have the choice of listening to both albums by playing one after another or they would listen to one particular album by rewinding the cassette to the beginning of the side that had that album. In the inner suburbs in Australian capital cities, where there are many university students and like-minded people, there were some funky lounge-room bars that catered to this community. These bars were furnished with the kind of furniture that was common in household living areas during the 60s and the 70s. The owners of these places often played 60s and 70s music off vinyl and one place that I attended as part of a graduation party had regular clients that loved the sound of the vinyl -- they would expect the hear the familiar crackling noises that accompanied the music. In these situations, I would find that recording the vinyl to MD would work wonders because the records will last longer. In this situation, the LPs would have to be cleaned as would be expected for normal playback; then recorded to MD. You could use a deck that is equipped with MDLP and Group Mode for this application and record the vinyl in LP2 mode on 80-minute discs. Each LP would be recorded as its own group on the disc. Then the bar owner rests the LPs and plays the MDs -- the crackling sound is still there on the MDs. With regards, Simon Mackay - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD good enough for vinyl archiving?
Maybe we could invent a scratch crackle inserter and sell them. People could make oldies but goodies out of any kind of music. GRIN Simon Mackay wrote: regular clients that loved the sound of the vinyl -- they would expect the hear the familiar crackling noises that accompanied the music. Jim Coon Not just another pretty mandolin picker. mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If Gibson made cars, would they sound so sweet? My first web page http://www.tir.com/~liteways - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD good enough for vinyl archiving?
Jim Coon joked, | Maybe we could invent a scratch crackle inserter and sell them. People | could make oldies but goodies out of any kind of music. There's nothing to invent; just get some crackle noises and mix them into anything you like or play them at the same time. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD good enough for vinyl archiving?
I have a Sony MDS-JA333ES MD machine, and a Tascam DA-40 DAT machine. My personal viewpoint is that if you are archiving *for personal use*, then yes, MD is OK. But if you are archiving for *historical documentation*, or for record label purposes, my personal opinion is that MD is not OK. MD is a loss-ful medium. DAT is lossless. Theoretically, DAT, or even CD-R or CD-RW, makes identical copies of the original signal. This is not true for MD. MD has become a great recording technology over the years. But there are still artifacts present depending on the attributes of the source signal. I don't know if I believe it, but some people claim they can hear a difference between CDs and lps. (Lps sounding the better of the two. Forget about pops and clicks for a second. Just fidelity.) So the difference between MDs and lps would be even more apparent. CD-R or CD-RW would also be a good choice. __ Terrorist Attacks on U.S. - How can you help? Donate cash, emergency relief information http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/US/Emergency_Information/ - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD PC Link Interface
Hello Jacquie, I beleive that's in the FAQ, but anyway... First, your PC Link doesn't add a portable device in a way you expect it (like Iomega Zip), but it adds Sound Playback device so you can play back music to USB instead of your soundcard. Second, you can NOT load audio in anyway - you can only record it real-time (1x) while your computer plays it back. Finally, PC link is ONE way PC-MD. Do not expect too much from that small plastic box ;-) I'm afraid the only way for you is to record audio stream from MD (using analogue link) to WAV-file. -- Best regards, /D-Off JGW I'm new to the list. Here's the problem. When I plug my MiniDisc PC Link JGW Interface in to my computer's USB it is not showing up as a portable device, JGW therefore I cannot load audio. What do I do? I want to create CD's from my JGW Sony MiniDisc Recorder with Adaptec Easy CD Creator 4. Is this possible? JGW Do I need a special program? My Iomega Zip drive shows up through the USB JGW so I know it's working. JGW Jacquie. -- Best regards, /D-Off - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD PC Link Interface
Hello. I'm new to the list. Here's the problem. When I plug my MiniDisc PC Link Interface in to my computer's USB it is not showing up as a portable device, therefore I cannot load audio. What do I do? I want to create CD's from my Sony MiniDisc Recorder with Adaptec Easy CD Creator 4. Is this possible? Do I need a special program? My Iomega Zip drive shows up through the USB so I know it's working. Jacquie. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD cases for MDs withut their own slip case
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === there is not a lot of storage products availible from MD, you either have to go with whats availible or be inventive. marc On Tue, Sep 04, 2001 at 01:15:26AM +0200, Danilo Godec wrote: On Tue, 4 Sep 2001, Graham Baker wrote: The old Ferro-Rocher (sp?) plastic chocolate-boxes are ideal for this. GB True, I even used one of those for a while. But I'm looking for something just a little bit more sophisticated... :) My idea is: shorten the original slip cases by 10/15mm and glue 10, 15 or 20 of them together. Original slip cases have a sort of 'lock hook' so that they grab a hold of the MD a little. D. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD cases for MDs withut their own slip case
On Tue, 4 Sep 2001, Graham Baker wrote: The old Ferro-Rocher (sp?) plastic chocolate-boxes are ideal for this. GB True, I even used one of those for a while. But I'm looking for something just a little bit more sophisticated... :) My idea is: shorten the original slip cases by 10/15mm and glue 10, 15 or 20 of them together. Original slip cases have a sort of 'lock hook' so that they grab a hold of the MD a little. D. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD cases for MDs withut their own slip case
On Mon, 3 Sep 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: case logic makes a book style case that i have a couple of I'd like to mount such a case/box in a car, just to hold my 'car' collection of MDs... A book style case is probably not very usefull for that. D. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD in East Europe and carding
As much as I know the MD is NOT dying here, in Europe. In fact I was pleased to see myself an improvement since the new MDLP series. London I heard to be the center of european MD universe, then comes Germany, then France. I live in East Europe, Romania, where one can find a lot of cheap korean mp3 stuff and I must say I thought for quite a while the MD cause was lost here. But things are changing as I see more and more MD stuff at the local Sony Centers: the 500, the 700 and the 750 with FM. No sign of R900 or R909 tough. The cheapo MD blanks are considered the red TDK's (a little more than a dollar each). Our personal hell here is with the accesories, very hard - almost impossible - to find. You have to seek in Western Europe for everything and pay for transport. As the country with the strongest hacker community (after Russia) we cant use credit cards for ordering, nobody trust romanian customers anymore :-( Is a common fact that only in 2000 romanian hackers inflicted a 5.000.000 usd fraud in merchandise... Hope this will change soon. best regards, Stefan - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word "unsubscribe" to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin
calm down, i was just kidding At 11:47 PM 8/29/01 +0100, you wrote: Really? You don't say. I thought it was obvious that the post was primarily aimed at people in the UK. Or visitors. Or people with relations here. No one complains when the US members post about Target, Circuit City, Wal-Mart, Sears and loads of other shops that 'could be a problem' for those of us *not* in the US to visit. This is the Internet and, last time I checked, it was a worldwide medium. Maybe you should set up a US-based MD list. Then you could all moan together about how minidisc is doomed because your local shopping maul (sic) doesn't sell blanks. Perhaps in future I should prefix all non-applicable-to-American-list-members posts appropriately. Sorry to have wasted your valuable time. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jinx Sent: 29 August 2001 00:39 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin could be a problem for those of us in the usa. At 10:57 PM 8/28/01 +0100, you wrote: Hi everyone, I bought two Virgin 52 minidisc racks at the weekend from the Virgin Megastore in Glasgow (Argyll Street). They are a smart design, and hold 52 discs each. Best bit was the price - on sale at £6.99, down from £19.99. Well worth a look if you can get them in the sale. Al - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin
OK. Sorry. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jinx Sent: 30 August 2001 03:01 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin calm down, i was just kidding At 11:47 PM 8/29/01 +0100, you wrote: Really? You don't say. I thought it was obvious that the post was primarily aimed at people in the UK. Or visitors. Or people with relations here. No one complains when the US members post about Target, Circuit City, Wal-Mart, Sears and loads of other shops that 'could be a problem' for those of us *not* in the US to visit. This is the Internet and, last time I checked, it was a worldwide medium. Maybe you should set up a US-based MD list. Then you could all moan together about how minidisc is doomed because your local shopping maul (sic) doesn't sell blanks. Perhaps in future I should prefix all non-applicable-to-American-list-members posts appropriately. Sorry to have wasted your valuable time. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jinx Sent: 29 August 2001 00:39 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin could be a problem for those of us in the usa. At 10:57 PM 8/28/01 +0100, you wrote: Hi everyone, I bought two Virgin 52 minidisc racks at the weekend from the Virgin Megastore in Glasgow (Argyll Street). They are a smart design, and hold 52 discs each. Best bit was the price - on sale at £6.99, down from £19.99. Well worth a look if you can get them in the sale. Al - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD DiscCam, DVD-RAM Camcorders
=== The original message was multipart MIME=== === All non-text parts (attachments) have been removed === - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD DiscCam, DVD-RAM Camcorders
Test. The original message had text, I am sending another to see if it was a one time problem or will be a recurring one I have to fix somehow. - Original Message - From: rodrocks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:37 PM Subject: MD: MD DiscCam, DVD-RAM Camcorders === The original message was multipart MIME=== === All non-text parts (attachments) have been removed === - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin
Really? You don't say. I thought it was obvious that the post was primarily aimed at people in the UK. Or visitors. Or people with relations here. No one complains when the US members post about Target, Circuit City, Wal-Mart, Sears and loads of other shops that 'could be a problem' for those of us *not* in the US to visit. This is the Internet and, last time I checked, it was a worldwide medium. Maybe you should set up a US-based MD list. Then you could all moan together about how minidisc is doomed because your local shopping maul (sic) doesn't sell blanks. Perhaps in future I should prefix all non-applicable-to-American-list-members posts appropriately. Sorry to have wasted your valuable time. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jinx Sent: 29 August 2001 00:39 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin could be a problem for those of us in the usa. At 10:57 PM 8/28/01 +0100, you wrote: Hi everyone, I bought two Virgin 52 minidisc racks at the weekend from the Virgin Megastore in Glasgow (Argyll Street). They are a smart design, and hold 52 discs each. Best bit was the price - on sale at £6.99, down from £19.99. Well worth a look if you can get them in the sale. Al - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: md-l-digest V3 #96
I've had a lot of horrible problems with CD burners, the kind that make you This probably relates to user error or possibly a bad model cd-rw. I have had my Plextor cd-rw drive for a few months now, and with over 200 successful burns, I have had no problems. Windows is a crazy platform because God only knows what combination of drivers, software, and hardware any user might have. As far as my machine goes, I know exactly what combination of drivers, software, and hardware I have... PCs have many more ways for things to go wrong True! And ripping/coding/burning/trading MP3 CDRs has a lot that can go wrong compared to MD trades. I've never had a problem ripping and burning cdr's for trading live shows. (NOT MP3 sourced however). On the other hand, those people who I trade live shows with wouldn't accept a show in MiniDisc format due to ATRAC. The same goes for a CD-R that is sourced from MP3 format, that is just unacceptable to most people... The easiest and most reliable method of trading is SHN format, followed closely by cd-r rip/burn (sourced from .WAV files, not mp3). --Rick - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc?
Point taken. So this basically means recorders like the sharp Mt770 recorder is as small as their going to get. Which is still actually pretty good... Gerard Naude Programmer - Universal Knowledge Software E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc?
Yeah. Let's face it, MD players/recorders look goood... - Original Message - From: Mike Lastucka [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2001 3:31 PM Subject: Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc? Personally I find MD players/recorders to be very small as they are, which I also think is a good thing. :) Any time I bring my R900 out of its velcro belt case it gets a lot of ooohs and aaahs, especially about the size of the thing being way smaller than most people expect. ml --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin
Hi everyone, I bought two Virgin 52 minidisc racks at the weekend from the Virgin Megastore in Glasgow (Argyll Street). They are a smart design, and hold 52 discs each. Best bit was the price - on sale at £6.99, down from £19.99. Well worth a look if you can get them in the sale. Al - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD racks cheap at Virgin
could be a problem for those of us in the usa. At 10:57 PM 8/28/01 +0100, you wrote: Hi everyone, I bought two Virgin 52 minidisc racks at the weekend from the Virgin Megastore in Glasgow (Argyll Street). They are a smart design, and hold 52 discs each. Best bit was the price - on sale at £6.99, down from £19.99. Well worth a look if you can get them in the sale. Al - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc?
Gerald wrote, | I was just wondering when md recorders are going to become smaller than | the actual disc. In theory only half of the disc needs to be covered by | the MD recorder(to reach the middle of the md to turn it, and to cover the | disc opening). Are current MD recorder sizes restricted because of the | size of the disc? It would need to be more than half the disc. The unit has to cover the entire right edge to operate the latch and shutter as well as to access the opening, the lower left corner to read the state of the write-protect [and that of the second hole, which is the primary indicator of premastered-vs.-recordable], and of course the entire spindle. About all that could stick out would be the upper right corner (and possibly the middle of the lower edge, but a concavity there would not reduce the outer dimensions). - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc?
I remember audio tape players that were like that. I could see one issue with MD though with such a design. What if by chance the portion of the disc that extended outward from the player was bumped hard enough to flex it sufficiently that it caused problems while recording or playback, or even snapped the casing? Or if the disc is yanked out while in operation? I'm sure the design's possible but it introduces too many problems to be practical. --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD From: Gerard Naude [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Md-L [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc? Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 16:15:43 +0200 I was just wondering when md recorders are going to become smaller than the actual disc. In theory only half of the disc needs to be covered by the MD recorder(to reach the middle of the md to turn it, and to cover the disc opening). Are current MD recorder sizes restricted because of the size of the disc? Gerard Naude Programmer - Universal Knowledge Software E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: Md recorders smaller than the actual disc?
Gerard Naude wrote: I was just wondering when md recorders are going to become smaller than the actual disc. In theory only half of the disc needs to be covered by the MD recorder(to reach the middle of the md to turn it, and to cover the disc opening). Are current MD recorder sizes restricted because of the size of the disc? Hi. What would be the point of making the unit smaller than the disc? If you did that the overall size would still be the size of the disc at the very least! Personally I think that the Sony R50 is as small as I'd want a unit to be. Suppose you made a unit smaller than the disc, you would still have to have the unit closed on at least one size. That side would be a little longer than the disc. Plus you would still have the disc's size. There are practical reasons for ot making a unit smaller than a disc too. LAS - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD has finally made it!!
Well it has finally happened. It was on the bottom shelf in a corner like some kind of piece of crap, but I saw a few Sony R500PCs there. They come with the analog USB to MD adapter and sell for $180. Then I went to check on blanks, since it seemed to me that if they sold a recorder, they should also carry blanks. The only ones that I could find were a three different color/three pack by Sony. It was either $5.95 or $6.95, don't remember. 74 minute only (but in LP2 that would be 148 minutes. On the package for the recorder, it showed that the one MD could hold 4 CDs (must be in LP4). The other thing that I saw there and also in Rite Aid Drug stores of all places is a portable CD player for $80 that will play MP3's. Now I'm beginning to wonder if it pays to buy an Aiwa MP3/CD car player, which will probably run about $250, or a regular CD version which they have for only $99 (both have an AUX jack on the front). For $180.00 I could have a decent plain CD unit in the car and be able to plug in an MP3/CD player. In MP3, the CD player has 120 seconds of skip protection. The advantage there is that, I could still use the portable outside of the car. Of course the Aiwa MP3/CD player is a little better unit (I believe it comes with a wireless remote that you put on the steering wheel). All of their units still have an AUX jack, which would allow you to plug in a portable MD unit, no matter which Aiwa you buy. Larry - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === i dunno, personally i don't think its fair to critisize something for working exactly as it should, outside of the packageing problems ;) On Wed, Aug 22, 2001 at 09:26:44AM +0800, Churchill, Guy wrote: The main negative comments are the real time transfer issue, and not being able to select the output source. (meaning you can get Windoze bings and such as well as the music). That and how hard it is to get out of the packaging ! :) - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports
One solution I can suggest, which is probably something of a waste of time, is to burn all of the tracks to a CD then use a CD player with optical out to record synchronously. I've never had a problem with my Sony 5 CD changer losing parts of songs or not marking tracks. Of course, this is a very roundabout method, but it might be the only solution. Alternatively, go analogue... :D -Richard Original message from: Tugrul coming from ICQ. But this winamp plugin deserves USB audio only to Winamp Thats great. Now I am recording Kapsberger's Arie a Villanelle and DG2 marked the first track mark well, but unfortunately trimmed the first second of the next track. If someone could find a solution to this. Regards, Tugrul - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports
Are you using the DG2 in discrete or continuous mode? I got the clipped tracks when recording in discrete mode but switching to continuous seemed to eliminate the problem. Jen Hi Richard, I cant tell how I'm thankful for giving us this tip. Musicmatch records all windows sounds when switched to USB audio. The other day I had recorded Telemann's Wassermusik, and while listening to it I heard all the knocks coming from ICQ. But this winamp plugin deserves USB audio only to Winamp while other windows sounds come from the soundcard. Thats great. Now I am recording Kapsberger's Arie a Villanelle and DG2 marked the first track mark well, but unfortunately trimmed the first second of the next track. If someone could find a solution to this. Regards, Tugrul - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD-Ports
A review on the Xitel MD-Port AN1 and DG2 with reference to MD. http://www.dansdata.com/xitel.htm The main negative comments are the real time transfer issue, and not being able to select the output source. (meaning you can get Windoze bings and such as well as the music). That and how hard it is to get out of the packaging ! :) Regards GuyC - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD-Ports (Part II)
An additional note ... there is also reference to minidisc.org when talking about ATRAC and MDLP. Cheers GuyC -Original Message- A review on the Xitel MD-Port AN1 and DG2 with reference to MD. http://www.dansdata.com/xitel.htm - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports: My experience and some questions
I recently bought DG2 in hope of transfering my classical mp3 collection into MD's. As it is told the installation is very easy. The use also is quite easy. But I should say I hated Musicmatch, maybe it is because I got used to use Winamp. Track marks were my real concern. You cannot get DG2 to mark the tracks with Winamp. With Musicmatch + DG2 you get the track marks, but it is another pain, because it trims the first few seconds of the tracks randomly. With a Winamp plugin you may stop a sec. between the tracks, but for classical music it may not be convenient, because there may not be a pause between the movements, and here you get a pause. With either Winamp or Musicmatch I coulnt get the result I wanted. So I went back to my notebook which has an optical out. Now the weird point: If I record from my notebook to my R900 the music is transfered as 1 whole track. But if I record from my notebook to JB940, in one collection I got most of the track marks, in another collection no track marks at all. I noticed that DG2 cuts the flow of info between the tracks, because I see Din unlock every time. In a nutshell, I couldnt get the result I wanted with either transfer method. Still I long for a perfect PC-MD transfer method identical to CD-MD transfer. Real time or not doesnt bother me. Tugrul A review on the Xitel MD-Port AN1 and DG2 with reference to MD. http://www.dansdata.com/xitel.htm The main negative comments are the real time transfer issue, and not being able to select the output source. (meaning you can get Windoze bings and such as well as the music). That and how hard it is to get out of the packaging ! :) Regards GuyC - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports
(meaning you can get Windoze bings and such as well as the music). In Winamp at least, you can choose the output device it uses: open the Preferences window (Ctrl+P is the quickest way), click on Plugins- Output, double-click on the waveOut plugin, and choose USB Audio Device for output. Then you can go about your business in Windows with the bings and such going to your soundcard while Winamp plays to the DG-x. Then when you finish your MD recording, change Winamp back to Wave Mapper output. 2 [) [EMAIL PROTECTED] |\ http://rsquared.firest0rm.org/ - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD-Ports
Hi Richard, I cant tell how I'm thankful for giving us this tip. Musicmatch records all windows sounds when switched to USB audio. The other day I had recorded Telemann's Wassermusik, and while listening to it I heard all the knocks coming from ICQ. But this winamp plugin deserves USB audio only to Winamp while other windows sounds come from the soundcard. Thats great. Now I am recording Kapsberger's Arie a Villanelle and DG2 marked the first track mark well, but unfortunately trimmed the first second of the next track. If someone could find a solution to this. Regards, Tugrul - Original Message - From: Richard Rudie [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 6:12 AM Subject: Re: MD: MD-Ports (meaning you can get Windoze bings and such as well as the music). In Winamp at least, you can choose the output device it uses: open the Preferences window (Ctrl+P is the quickest way), click on Plugins- Output, double-click on the waveOut plugin, and choose USB Audio Device for output. Then you can go about your business in Windows with the bings and such going to your soundcard while Winamp plays to the DG-x. Then when you finish your MD recording, change Winamp back to Wave Mapper output. 2 [) [EMAIL PROTECTED] |\ http://rsquared.firest0rm.org/ - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD at Wal-Mart
Rick Woudenberg quoted Bruce Yarbor, | I'm still waiting for our Wal-Marts to start carrying them, | when that happens, I'll know they have arrived! There are blank MDs (Sonys only, last I was there) at the Wal-Mart in Niles, Illinois. I didn't see any MD hardware there, though. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MD: MD sales
htmldiv style='background-color:'DIVI frequently visit wal-mart (it's just around the corner from my house) and in the electronics section they sell packs of blank MDs, they also sell one of the sony MDLP recorders- dont' remember which one- but people have actually been buying them. I talked to the clerk that works in the electronics department and he says they've been selling better than the mp3 players (pretty neat considering they only offer one model).nbsp;- oh yah, this is in Baton Rouge, LA./DIV/divbr clear=allhrGet your FREE download of MSN Explorer at a href='http://go.msn.com/bql/hmtag_itl_EN.asp'http://explorer.msn.com/abr/html - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
On Sat, 4 Aug 2001, Tony Antoniou wrote: [...] Furthermore, take your average Joe and see what they find easier to record with ... MP3 or MD. In most cases, you'll find that they still can't grasp the concept of burning a CD, particularly if they want to play it in an ordinary audio CD player. eh, reality check please. On my PowerBook I can make a playlist and press burn CD in iTunes and it'll give me a cd to put in the car a few minutes later... Doesn't get much easier than that. :-/ If I'm not burning from mp3's, then I can use Toast in a similar fashion; drag'n'drop the tracks and press Record and that's it. I imagine that it's not much more complicated on Windows. - ask -- ask bjoern hansen, http://ask.netcetera.dk/ !try; do(); - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === Depends on the tools you use, but some are just as simple. Obviously there are more complicated tools for those who need more options. --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD From: Ask Bjoern Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate Date: Fri, 17 Aug 2001 02:53:31 -0700 (PDT) On Sat, 4 Aug 2001, Tony Antoniou wrote: B snip On my PowerBook I can make a playlist and press burn CD in iTunes and it'll give me a cd to put in the car a few minutes later... Doesn't get much easier than that. :-/ If I'm not burning from mp3's, then I can use Toast in a similar fashion; drag'n'drop the tracks and press Record and that's it. I imagine that it's not much more complicated on Windows. - ask -- ask bjoern hansen, http://ask.netcetera.dk/ !try; do(); - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
You really need to use the same DAC and line amplifier to compare these two sources. Is it possible to try this experiment again with the CD signal being routed through the MD recorder while the MD unit is in REC-PAUSE (i.e. monitor) mode? Ideally you'd take a digital signal from the CD. This way you can really compare the difference in the two sources. For my fair A/B test, I used keyboard shortcuts with WinAmp, EQ off, to compare short .wav CD rips against 224 Kbps .mp3's of the .wav, with good headphones, with problematic passages. I was unable to reliably distinguish between A and B -- but could easily and reliably identify the .mp3 at 192 Kbps. This proves I know what artifacts to look for and am perfectly satisfied with 224 Kbps with that encoder, for those passages. However, to be safe, I often bump up the rate to 256 Kbps. I concluded I don't like Joint-Stereo encoding. I have been surprised how good such MP3-then-ATRAC sounds on MiniDisc -- this says alot about how good ATRAC is, that it can re-compress good 224 Kbps MP3s and still sound very nearly like the uncompressed source. I would expect recompression to sound horrible but it sounds great -- much better than typical 128 Kbps (which sounds horrible). I need to test MDLP2 to better characterize degrees of lossy compression and compare ATRAC to MP3 artifacts. It was interesting to see my girlfriend uncritically accept the marketing claims of cramming a bunch of albums onto a single MD. For her first MP3-mix MD, she wanted to use MDLP4 to store our 192 Kbps MP3s. I had already tested this to confirm that it sounds truly horrible by any standards, so I dissuaded her. -- Michael Hoffman http://www.amptone.com/audio - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
I am not impressed. Xitel today offers no advantage over an analog connection No D/A and A/D I would've thought.. This is a false pseudo-advantage. My analog-connected tests between my portable and home deck proved that lossy compression is vastly more important than A/D and D/A conversion, with my gear. After 5 generations of copies, all the problems were due to lossy compression, not the analog connection. (plus the trackmarks malfunction sometimes). You are too forgiving -- have you tried to trade 30 albums at a time on MD versus MP3 -- when including titles? Titling is one of the biggest glaring flaws of MD versus MP3. With a keyboard connected to my deck, I find this a no-brainer, and just as fast as titling MP3's (and a lot faster than titling them after they have been encoded) Your solution is irrelevant for the many people without a keyboard input for their deck. My MD home deck is typical in that it has no keyboard input. All MP3 computers inherently have keyboard input *and* full CDDB utilization, which I mentioned but you conveniently neglected to acknowledge. WHAT ABOUT CDDB? Your MD keyboarding solution can't take advantage of it. You have to type titles yet again for every copy of the MD you produce. I don't even have to type the titles 1 time, when trading 10 copies of an album, if the titles are in CDDB. MD does titling in the most stupid, boneheaded, manual, tedious, time-consuming way possible. No, portables do it in the most time consuming way, but even that is a no-brainer thanks to the mironics interface (www.mironics.com) If you are fortunate enough to have that nonstandard benefit of micronics, so have an MD system that goes beyond the standard set of MD features, this is still too much unnecessary trouble to be called no-brainer -- all this repeated typing may be easier than with classic MD systems, but it's still more trouble than MP3, which simply automatically preserves ID3 info across copies, and utilizes CDDB too so you don't have to type anything, at all. MP3 titling is a godsend and puts MD titling to shame. I found that it was easier to trade 30 titled MP3 albums (on CD-R) in one shot than to trade just 5 titled albums on MD. Did you really, well, isn't that what confirms everything, how easy YOU found it. Not just me; I'm talking about everyone who uses CDDB, copies MP3s, and produces titled MDs without the benefit of your solution which goes beyond the classic inherent MD features. Automatic titling is inherent in MP3 but not in MD. You blame md's mistakes on what one portable can do No, I'm speaking about my home MD deck as well. You act like all home MD decks have always had keyboard input. Most do not, so your solution is not usable for most MD deck owners and MD portable owners. , yet I have yet to see a valid point that applies to ALL minidisc hardware, thus turning your argument not into MD inferior to MP3, but MZ-R900 to Computer, defeating the whole purpose in the first place. Sorry if someone has already said all this, but it needed to be said. MD home decks that lack keyboard input are inferior to MP3s as far as titling. I no longer bother titling MDs at all -- it's too damned hard, tedious, and time-consuming, on my home MD deck (Sony name-brand) as well as my MD portable. -- Michael Hoffman http://www.amptone.com/audio - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling
| Why should I have to title my MD tracks when the titles have already been | entered and uploaded by someone else in CDDB? 1. The tracks on the MD may not be exactly the set and sequence of an album listed on the CDDB. 2. The tracks may not yet be listed in the CDDB. 3. The person who provided the titles to the CDDB may have made mistakes in information or in typing. (The titles shown on the CD case may even be wrong and mislead the typist. I have a couple CDs like this.) 4. The person who provided the titles to the CDDB may have entered them in a format that differs from your preference in some varying or unpredictable fashion, such that the editing changes cannot be pre-coded into your title transfering software. 5. You might have made your own mix or edit, or your own microphone recording, or your own computer-composed tune, so the track couldn't possibly be in the CDDB. That's a good, helpful list of points. Titling of MD mixes is not solved by CDDB, but I use CDDB-downloaded titles automatically when I create an MP3 CD. This titles appear in my Rio Volt player, though I did not type them in anywhere. Poor ID3 tagging (typos, wrong titles, no titles, capitalization, poor conventions for artist/filename/directory structure) is a perrennial annoyance and an issue for hi-fi/archival MP3 CD traders. MD titling is such an undeveloped technology that these issues have barely arisen; it would be a nice improvement to get *any* electronic titling, rather than the common track 18. There are major problems with MP3 hi-fi album trades: gaps inserted by the player between live tracks; glitches; artifacts/poor compression; various titling problems. When I buy a CD (with only $0.25 going to the artist, by the way), I feel stupid for not acquiring the album via MP3 CDR trade. When I do MP3 CDR trades, I feel stupid for not simply ordering the CD online (to save time and get guaranteed high quality). When I do MD trades, I can only feel stupid for wasting time -- quality is almost guaranteed to be high, if the copy is from a pressed CD. | MD does titling in the most stupid, boneheaded, manual, tedious, | time-consuming way possible. Apparently, Mr. Hoffman, you have only a portable MD recorder and don't know how titling is on decks with full remotes, let alone on a deck with keyboard input. I find titling on portables to be as bad as you say, but it's not the only way to title a MiniDisc. I am referring to my Sony home deck with dedicated letter buttons -- so tedious and time-consuming that I quickly gave up titling MDs; and portables are even more difficult and time-consuming for entering titles. The former is very tedious, the latter utterly ludicrous (though better than nothing). A keyboard port solves one complaint, CDDB downloading of titling solves another, and inherent preservation of titling across digital copies would solve another. Thus there are several improvements needed in MD titling before it can begin to compete with the superior ergonomics of MP3 titling. | MDs are a dead-end for trades and each time you do copy an MD you lose the | titling ... There are ways to transfer titles from MD to MD. For example, many Sharp portable recorders have the Name Stamp feature that copies the disc name and all track titles from any recordable MD to any other with the same number of tracks, and the Sony MDS-W1 dual MD deck can copy titles between discs. If the tracks are at the same addresses, in many machines one can clone the entire TOC, titles and all. It's good that companies are going beyond the MD standard to help MD titling catch up with MP3 titling (which is inherently preserved via ID3 tagging). I'm glad MP3 is putting the heat on MD and inspiring it to work toward better titling approaches. I hope such improvements become standard and continue; I hope that the best features of MP3 and MD are combined across the industry. Yes, another layer of ATRACking is introduced (unless you have pro-grade equipment that can transfer bit-for-bit in the ATRAC domain). In normal personal copying you won't have too many generations and the effect will be negligible, but it is a drawback for trading. -- Michael Hoffman http://www.amptone.com/audio - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: md-l-digest V3 #83
WHAT ABOUT CDDB? Your MD keyboarding solution can't take advantage of it. With the music I listen to, CDDB rarely works properly. I have yet to even use the CDDB features. And as you rave about in your other posts, I have *NEVER* traded MD or MP3's with people. Almost everything you say is attractive about MP3 is something I never use, nor does anyone else I know. Especially when it comes to trading---the people I trade live music with absolutely *DO NOT* accept shows sourced from MP3. In my circles, MP3 trading is sure way to get excluded.. don't even have to type the titles 1 time, when trading 10 copies of an album, if the titles are in CDDB. What is the big deal with titles? The people I trade shows with (live music) all prefer printed setlists, or emailed setlists. No cd-text on the cd-r, no mp3 to begin with, and no MD trading either. Titles?? more trouble than MP3, which simply automatically preserves ID3 info across copies, and utilizes CDDB too so you don't have to type anything, at all. ...And ruins the sound quality of the music, and ruins the tradibility of the music with 90 percent of live music traders out there. And I'm not even considering those pirates who trade copyrighted studio albums. MP3 titling is a godsend and puts MD titling to shame. Titling an mp3 is inherent in structure of MP3, it is a part of the file format, and encoding mp3s and titles mp3s are done the same way: on your computer. With MD, a *storage medium*, the titling is obviously going to be more difficult because it is not a part of the PC at all. Comparing the two, which are entirely different, is unfair IMO. I found that it was easier to trade 30 titled MP3 albums (on CD-R) in one shot than to trade just 5 titled albums on MD. I just don't understand how you can do that. It is piracy, pure and simple, and it withholds money from the artist and record label. And not just that, but the sound quality is inherently bad. You are the only person I know that trades mp3 and MD albums, not that you aren't the only one... but you are also the reason that the RIAA and record labels are trying to make copyrighted cds. Automatic titling is inherent in MP3 but not in MD. This is true. 'Automatic titling' is also a very low priority for most minidisc users, and trying to compare the two is wrong. MP3 is a compression scheme. MD is not. MD is a storage medium, just like your hard drive. MD home decks that lack keyboard input are inferior to MP3s as far as titling. I agree, and it never bothers me. I title all my MD's when I feel that I can't write the titles on the label. Otherwise, just like CDs, I use the label. I have consistently differentiated between compression algs and storage media, which is all obvious to anyone with any real comprehension of the technologies. Actually most of your posts do not differentiate the two. Especially regarding titles, you constantly have compared apples to oranges. You can compare the quality of MP3 with the quality of ATRAC, or the features/abilities of MD as a storage and recording medium vs. those of SS MP3 players vs. HD-based MP3 players vs. CD-based MP3 players, etc. As I have done. Actually, regarding titling, you have compared the features of the compression and file format of MP3 (id3 tag), vs. the features of MD players. This is an argument based on compression/file format vs. audio hardware. Apple.Orange again. I think your A/B test is mis-conducted. Actually his test is very fair. It uses a raw uncompressed source (CD), and ATRAC compressed source (MD), ran digitally to his mic amp from the CD and MD players digital output, through (1) DAC (the one in the amp). In this test, you can blindly switch between the two sources with a switch, and listener doesn't know. Very fair. computer-based audio system. I'm into what the audiphiles call mid-fi (which to normal people would be considered very hi-fi). Normal people? Lol.. Normal people don't pirate albums and trade 30 of them in MP3 format... My A/B setup is much more fair. Either something is fair or it isn't, nothing can be inherently more fair. In any case, there is nothing wrong with the way his test was done. There are too many variables in your setup. Wrong. You're not A/B'ing ATRAC vs. uncompressed, alone; you're comparing two different playback audio-components (the output of a CD deck and MD deck). Wrong again. He's A/Bing ATRAC vs. Uncompressed alone. The output he is hearing is coming from the mic preamp, which is getting a pure digital signal from the MD and CD units. My diagnosis is that your CD reader and DAC system is better than your MD CD reader, DAC system?? What are these terms? My tests predict that if your gear is decently good, you'd find that MD sounds the same as the CD to your friends in critical headphone tests, and that 256 or 320 Kbps MP3s would also have that same potential. Your friends could not Highly doubtful. If he is using Seinnheiser headphones or
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Michael Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your solution is irrelevant for the many people without a keyboard input for their deck. My MD home deck is typical in that it has no keyboard input. All MP3 computers inherently have keyboard input *and* full CDDB utilization, which I mentioned but you conveniently neglected to acknowledge. WHAT ABOUT CDDB? Your MD keyboarding solution can't take advantage of it. You have to type titles yet again for every copy of the MD you produce. I don't even have to type the titles 1 time, when trading 10 copies of an album, if the titles are in CDDB. Actually, there are a number of computer-interface titling solutions out there. They aren't stock but they exist. But, again, I think people need to agree to disagree on this -- you find titling to be vital because of your particular use of MD. From being on this list for a few years now, many people couldn't really care less about titling. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Michael Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll take that challenge any day ;) I think you need to specify what you mean by critical headphone listening -- what headphones? What amps? What playback sources? A laptop PC with good sound capability, $100 headphones, using a .wav vs. mp3 of the wav, Winamp with no EQ, keyboard shortcuts, difficult source material. A laptop PC, no matter now good its good sound capability is, is not a critical listening environment. And $100 says nothing about the headphones, as there are $25 headphones that are far better than most $100 headphones out there, just as there are $100 headphones that cannot be properly driven by a laptop and absolutely require a separate amplifier. That's not to say that the system you used isn't good enough to provide you with a lot of musical enjoyment, but it's not a critical listening environment by any means. This reveals our differences. I would be perfectly happy with an excellent computer-based audio system. I'm into what the audiphiles call mid-fi (which to normal people would be considered very hi-fi). Then you've answered my earlier question-- if you consider a computer-based system to be high-end then your preferences/results make sense, and I completely respect them. However, that's a completely different thing than saying there are no differences -- the truth is that you can't hear them, not that they aren't there. My A/B setup is much more fair. There are too many variables in your setup. You're not A/B'ing ATRAC vs. uncompressed, alone; you're comparing two different playback audio-components (the output of a CD deck and MD deck). You should use a single DAC. My .wav vs .mp3 A/B test is much more fair. While the DAC issue is technically correct (but see below why your interpretation of how flawed the results are is incorrect), and I agreed to this yesterday when Rick brought it up (I'll have to do this someday), your conclusion that your test is more fair is incorrect. The system you are using (a laptop's headphone jack) is simply not good enough to do this test. It's like trying to argue the merits of CD vs. SACD by listening to them through a $100 minisystem. Remember, I'm not begrudging the ability of your playback system to musically satisfy you -- I often use my laptop for music when I'm traveling or working off-site. What I'm talking about is its ability to act as a reference-level system for comparing audio formats. My diagnosis is that your CD reader and DAC system is better than your MD reader and DAC system. And how would you know that? I get different results than you, which could mean many different things, and you magically diagnose that the reason is your test is methodologically sound, while my equipment, never before seen to you, is the problem? LOL Well, you're wrong -- the difference is not that the CD player is superior. While I do have some very nice CD equipment, one of my blind tests was between a Optimus portable CD player -- one that cost $129.99 in 1994 -- and an MZ-R50, one of the best MD portables ever made. I figured I would test two portables and see if I got the same results. The results were just as I explained -- I could clearly hear the difference, and even not really into audio friends could hear the difference. In a blind test. Are you going to try to tell me that the DAC in my MZ-R50, which was $350-$400 new and the top of the line, is inferior to a portable CD player from 1993? If the CD lost to MD in this test, I could say well, it was because the CD player was older and probably had a cheaper DA etc. But the fact that the older, cheaper, portable CD player sounded better than the newer, high-end MD portable gives a lot of credence to the idea that it wasn't the DA. Someday when I have a bunch of non-audio friends over again, I'll have to do the CD through the MD DA trick. But something tells me that even if my results were the same, you'd find some way to find fault with my tests, because you refuse to believe that compressed audio sounds even slightly worse than the original source... My tests predict that if your gear is decently good, you'd find that MD sounds the same as the CD to your friends in critical headphone tests, and that 256 or 320 Kbps MP3s would also have that same potential. Your friends could not differentiate when source A is playing from when source B is playing, or tell which one is MD. The *ONLY* thing your tests, as conducted, predict is that when listening to the horrible opamp out of a laptop, using the headphones you have (we don't know what those are), you personally feel that 256 or 320k MP3 sounds the same as CD. Your tests say even less about MD, since you couldn't test MD vs. CD. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
this would have a lot more to do with the software playing the mp3 than the atrac compression its self. -- I have been surprised how good such MP3-then-ATRAC sounds on MiniDisc -- this says alot about how good ATRAC is, that it can re-compress good 224 Kbps MP3s and still sound very nearly like the uncompressed source. I would expect recompression to sound horrible but it sounds great -- much better than typical 128 Kbps (which sounds horrible). - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling
wouldn't this be dependant on the label that the arist used and the contract they got from that label? -- When I buy a CD (with only $0.25 going to the artist, by the way) - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling
Of course, but it's still probably a high average. :) --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 11:58:10 -0700 wouldn't this be dependant on the label that the arist used and the contract they got from that label? -- When I buy a CD (with only $0.25 going to the artist, by the way) - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
-Original Message- From: Michael Hoffman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, 10 August 2001 2:20 a.m. ... WHAT ABOUT CDDB? Your MD keyboarding solution can't take advantage of it. You have to type titles yet again for every copy of the MD you produce. I don't even have to type the titles 1 time, when trading 10 copies of an album, if the titles are in CDDB. I know it isn't exactly a documented or a universal feature, but remember with many MD decks there is the ability to TOC-clone. I find this makes titling MD copies of whole CDs for pals (when I already have a titled MD of that CD, of course) an absolute breeze and it takes all of about a minute. Keyboard solutions are also generally available for (Sony) decks, if not by way of a standard keyboard input then by the QWERTY keyboard remote that Sony sells separately. Personally, I just use the standard letter buttons on the JE520s remote - I sometimes like to personalise the titling anyway, rather than having every name in CAPS. If you do a whole CD it can take 5-10 minutes, but I tend to input each track name while listening to a CD being copied so it's no big deal. How much of a nuisance you find it is obviously a subjective matter. Personally, only having access to a PC at work I'd find dealing with MP3s during my own time a far bigger hassle :-) Of course it's pointless arguing that MD stands up to MP3 for titling - obviously MD doesn't - MP3s have the titles built in and they automatically carry down onto future copies, plus inherently they have all the bonuses of being born of the PC (and I guess the limitations for those of us who see enough of our PCs at work!). However, the difference doesn't seem that huge to me. Richard Lang Senior Solicitor Duncan Cotterill Christchurch, New Zealand email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] tel: (++64)-3-379-2430 fax: (++64)-3-379-7097 http://www.duncancotterill.com ___PLEASE NOTE: ___ This communication contains information that is confidential and which may be subject to legal privilege or subject to copyright. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not use, distribute or copy the contents of this communication. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by reply e-mail, facsimile or collect telephone call to +64 3 379 2430 and destroy the original. We virus scan all e-mails and electronic media but are not responsible for any virus or alternation. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
MCDEF WROTE Well, you're wrong -- the difference is not that the CD player is superior. While I do have some very nice CD equipment, one of my blind tests was between a Optimus portable CD player -- one that cost $129.99 in 1994 -- and an MZ-R50, one of the best MD portables ever made. Actually the argument about the merits of the MZ-R50 vs the Sharp model that was current at the time, was at times quite heated. There were thread after thread here from the two camps. Many people felt that the Sharp had superior sound (especially with regard to bass). The only way to really run a decent A/B test would be to take a high end CD player with a digital output and the same for the MD deck. Both would have to go through the same (but not one that is included in a unit-we need better quality to really determine this) DAC. And there would have to be a variety of different types of music evaluated. As I stated before, to be fair, the MD should not be a copy of the CD but a high quality prerecorded MD. After all the argument is whether a CD's sound will be noticeably better than a Mini Disc. Not whether a copy of a CD will sound as good. There are too many variables in using a home grown copy. What I'm getting at is that all other things being equal, we want to know how ATRAC effects the sound. Not whether the laser on a consumer MD recorder will produce as good a copy as the original CD. There are too many factors involved with burning an MD as opposed to one that is stamped (prerecorded) just like a prerecorded CD. Once you have established whether a prerecorded MD made using the most advanced ATRAC and played back on the most advanced ATRAC version sounds different, you can take it from there. The quality of a tape recorded on an Ampex (they used to be the studio standard many moons ago) as opposed to one recorded on a consumer Webcor (any one remember that name) will be no contest. So, the way I see it, it must first be determined how much of a factor ATRAC is. Has anyone ever compared a high quality CD with a copies made from different CD writers using a variety of different brands and grade CDRs and CDRWs? You might think they would sound Identical, but do they really? The fact that some CD players (especially older ones) have trouble playing some CDRs even though they used the standard CD format, raises questions. Larry - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
This topic has been banging on for long enough, and something very important needs to be said. MP3 is MP3, ATRAC is ATRAC, why are people trying to change this. ATRAC and MiniDiscs have their advantages over MP3 (more dedicated towards audio, as it is an audio based format), MP3 has advantages over MiniDisc (computer based audio format, so it has more ease of use). Titling for MiniDiscs to some is awful, to others its a breeze, but we live in a world where competition is needed, otherwise no-one would release better products, as there would be no need, nothing to beat, no need to get a better market share than 100%. If everything becomes the same, then the world is boring, stop complaining about it. If you like MP3's ease of use, don't try and impose this on MiniDiscs. If you like the constant (at least in SP) bitrate of MiniDiscs with little chance of a duff sounding MD (when from a CD or other digital source), then don't try and impose this on MP3. Titles are only helpful, they aren't the be all and end all of a format, and neither is bitrate. I dont know if it is just me that believes this, but I would rather be listening to some decent music (for example, something like Stairway To Heaven) at a low bit rate than something terrible at high bit rate (Boy bands...), and while the tests are subjective, the view that the music you like is good shouldn't be, and it should not be based on whether its on a PC, CD, MiniDisc or a friggin 8 track. Stop bickering and turning this into war of statistics when the most important thing is the music. If, as the first e-mail was intended, minidiscs were more like mp3's, then it is highly likely that one format will die, as it is commonly known that no two formats co exist well (remember dcc vs md, or vhs vs betamax anyone?). My opinion is that neither format should grow towards the other, simply because the advantages that one has over the other would dissapear, and thus mean I could not use them in the way I do. I like MiniDiscs for walking to and from places, or for travelling. I like MP3's playing in the background when I'm browsing the net or building webpages. I like MiniDiscs for trading with people all over the world and to hear new music. I like MP3's for trading with my friends (although I do buy quite a lot of CD's as well, some artists and the shops that sell the cd's deserve the cash, whereas others dontimho of course) and also to find out what some band I've been meaning to get into or at least give a listen to sounds like (for example, Janes Addiction). The way I see it, everyone should stop bickering about which format is best, and actually enjoy the music, and of course for the few that do, enjoy creating it as well. This has been another (hopefully not) irrelevant bantering from: - -- Stuart Howlette There are many questions in life, but is the right answer only correct because the majority believe in it? This is from a chat i had with someone a while ago (and this was him being serious NoNaMeR 2KuK: say we dont need computers NoNaMeR 2KuK: we could use cheese instead For more from this chat, visit http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/personal/chat.htm [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/ http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/personal/ -- - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
las [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Actually the argument about the merits of the MZ-R50 vs the Sharp model that was current at the time, was at times quite heated. There were thread after thread here from the two camps. Many people felt that the Sharp had superior sound (especially with regard to bass). But that had nothing to do with the D/A converters in each unit. It had to do with the EQ of the headphone jacks. Sony headphone jacks are EQ'd to have a flatter response, while Sharp headphone jacks are EQ'd to be warmer, which includes a bit more bass/upper-bass. But those EQ's are *only* in the headphone jack -- when you listen via line-out, the EQ is not applied. (And yes, I've tried this to verify it ;) Differences that are clear when using headphone jacks become pretty much inaudible when using line-outs). I actually usually prefer the EQ's of Sharp headphone jacks, by the way. As I stated before, to be fair, the MD should not be a copy of the CD but a high quality prerecorded MD. Not necessarily -- since the common argument is whether or not a MiniDisc copy of a CD is indistinguishable from the original, a good copy is appropriate for that comparison. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
macdef wrote: But that had nothing to do with the D/A converters in each unit. It had to do with the EQ of the headphone jacks. Sony headphone jacks are EQ'd to have a flatter response, while Sharp headphone jacks are EQ'd to be warmer, which includes a bit more bass/upper-bass. But those EQ's are *only* in the headphone jack -- when you listen via line-out, the EQ is not applied. Yes, but there is no separate line out on Sharp portable MD units! So the output will always be colored by the EQ. The R50 has a true line out. MacDef wrote: Not necessarily -- since the common argument is whether or not a MiniDisc copy of a CD is indistinguishable from the original, a good copy is appropriate for that comparison. But is there really any method of copying anything that is truly 100% lossless? It may be possible to copy a file bit for bit. But when you are dealing with audio it is more complex. Error correction exists in all of the digital formats that I am aware of. Someone decided that below a certain number of errors, it's OK. What does that mean?? It's inaudible?? To whom? Everyone? Or just most people? Professional recording studios do not use so called audio quality DATs. The only use the more costly Data DATs because they are they only one's certified to be error free. Record companies don't record CDs, they stamp them. Besides being much faster and less expensive, by stamping from a master you will get a copy that as close as possible to the original. Relying on recording always leaves room for error. Larry - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
The Mironics interface uses the parallel port, not the serial port, Sorry about that, got confuzzed over which port it used Stuart Howlette - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: md-l-digest V3 #80
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED] LAS wrote: So far MP3 seems to have reached a certain amount of popularity and is leveling off. Without a good source, MP3 took a hit. The shutting down of Napster certainly didn't help. And Morpheus is only a shadow of what Napster was. What about the popularity of MP2, then? The skies are filled with DVB/MPEG-2 broadcasting, providing a huge choice of live music, entertainment, drama and everything else, freely available as MP2. This is a huge resource which seems scarcely to have been noticed in the MP3 community. I'm using MP3 myself only for transferring my old reel-to-reel treasures. Rate for rate, MP2 may sound a little less good than MP3, but most broadcasters are transmitting at 192 or 256kbit/s and you'd need better ears than mine to notice any inferiority, other than on special test material. Now that many major broadcasters are originating digitally, much of what you get is in pristine condition. Richard L. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
I'm thinking about getting an MD system for my new car. I need MDLP, but I'm also stuck trying to work out which is better - an MD head unit with a CD changer or a CD head unit with an MD changer? I'm thinking MD head unit because the discs are smaller and more robust for bouncing around in the front of the car. Anyone have any experience? Questions, questions. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
Alan Dowds wrote: I'm thinking about getting an MD system for my new car. I need MDLP, but I'm also stuck trying to work out which is better - an MD head unit with a CD changer or a CD head unit with an MD changer? I'm thinking MD head unit because the discs are smaller and more robust for bouncing around in the front of the car. Anyone have any experience? If you need MDLP, then the question is pretty much answered for you. MD head unit and CD changer. As far as I know, there is no such thing as an MDLP MD changer at this time. Shawn - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === Original Message - From: Eric Woudenberg, Minidisc.org Editor [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:52 PM Subject: Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate Michael Hoffman's email seems to have hit the list like a Rorschach test, causing folks to take issue (at length!) with whatever part of the MD/MP3/PC-audio equation raises their hackles. So, please allow me my reading :-) Michael Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well then forget MD and stay with MP3. We must engineer our own MD-burner technology that can do it the right way -- to make MD and possibly ATRAC a lossless bit-for-bit general file transfer and storage medium, *fully* computer-centric just like MP3. Right! While I appreciate your bravery Michael, the sad fact is that we (the users) are not permitted to decide which features and conveniences modern audio gear will have. Not even the manufacturers can. In this day and age the decision has been given over to the RIAA and their friends in Congress. The only reason people can have so much fun with MP3s and CDs (8cm or otherwise) is that PC connectable CDs existed before the Home Recording Rights Act. Were it otherwise, CD would certainly be hobbled with SCMS (or worse), just as MD is, and DataPlay will be. Also, cd-r's and cd-rw's (computer based) were not crippled with this because of computer connecitivity, which makes them not an audio format (in a manner of speaking) Wouldn't you guess it is glaringly obvious to Sony what wonderful playtoys fully PC integrated Minidisc recorders would be, and the huge market potential they would have? But I take my reading of Sony's thinking from the NetMD announcement; the promiment aspect of it is not that MD can now be part of the PC audio scene, but rather that it will be able to satisfy the digital rights management requirements that simply everyone in the PC/Internet audio field is concerning themselves with. I think it is best to consider CD/MP3 as a wonderful grandfatherered anamoly that has (so far) managed to escape being corralled by the recording industry. As for whom to plead with for the features on your audio dream machine of the future, I suggest writing congress. Rick - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === No, portables do it in the most time consuming way, but even that is a no-brainer thanks to the mironics interface (www.mironics.com) Unless it FUBARs your system I ordered the Mironics setup and it didn't work, and when next I rebooted, Windows 2000 was completely forqued, with an endless and seemingly inescapeable procession of blue-screen STOP errors. A reinstall of Win2K didn't help. I ended up buying a new hard drive, installing to that, copying my files over, and reformatting the old disk. Mironics said that they'd never heard of such a thing, so maybe I was blessed with a unique experience, but I say be warned. This is because Win ME and 2k have no direct access to the serial port, thus meaning the program will not work, and in your case, screw up the system. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
Aha! That makes it easier. Thanks mate. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Shawn Lin Sent: 07 August 2001 21:17 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation Alan Dowds wrote: I'm thinking about getting an MD system for my new car. I need MDLP, but I'm also stuck trying to work out which is better - an MD head unit with a CD changer or a CD head unit with an MD changer? I'm thinking MD head unit because the discs are smaller and more robust for bouncing around in the front of the car. Anyone have any experience? If you need MDLP, then the question is pretty much answered for you. MD head unit and CD changer. As far as I know, there is no such thing as an MDLP MD changer at this time. Shawn - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
This is because Win ME and 2k have no direct access to the serial port, thus meaning the program will not work, and in your case, screw up the system. The Mironics interface uses the parallel port, not the serial port, but WinME/2K don't have direct access to that, either. The Mironics software came with a port driver to work around it, of course; surely you didn't think they would sell me this program, knowing I have Windows 2000, if it couldn't work in Windows 2000. (Well, if it works in Windows 2000 is debatable anyway. And don't call me Shirley.) I installed the software and its port driver, rebooted once to let the port driver get its hooks into the system, and then tried out the titling. It ran fine, and pushed the buttons on my MZ-R700 in its virtual way, but they were all the wrong buttons. It titled my discs with random-seeming garbage, and then only if I manually entered titling mode first. Then when I eventually rebooted again, the now-fully-installed port driver trashed my startup and with it my installation, or so it seems. 2 [) [EMAIL PROTECTED] |\ http://rsquared.firest0rm.org/ - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
macdef [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: True, but that doesn't make it so. My headphone amp has two inputs. I have CD hooked into one, and MD into the other. I've done blind tests where I played a CD and an MD of that CD at the same time with identical output levels, and had someone else switch between the inputs. In a couple seconds I could pick out which was CD and which was MD. The MD simply didn't have as good sound as the original CD, no matter what album/music I compared. The only genre where the difference was slight was standard mass-market pop/rock stuff, and that's because of the bad recording/production that's normally used. You really need to use the same DAC and line amplifier to compare these two sources. Is it possible to try this experiment again with the CD signal being routed through the MD recorder while the MD unit is in REC-PAUSE (i.e. monitor) mode? Ideally you'd take a digital signal from the CD. This way you can really compare the difference in the two sources. Rick - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Eric Woudenberg, Minidisc.org Editor wrote: macdef [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: You really need to use the same DAC and line amplifier to compare these two sources. Is it possible to try this experiment again with the CD signal being routed through the MD recorder while the MD unit is in REC-PAUSE (i.e. monitor) mode? Ideally you'd take a digital signal from the CD. This way you can really compare the difference in the two sources. Rick Rick, that's a very good point. I have a theory that the converters are the weak link in many chains. They make professional individual ADC and DACs that cost thousands of dollars, as you know. I find it hard to believe that even a $2000 mini disc deck would have converters that could compete with individual multi thousand dollar units. Ditto the headphone amp. The thing that bothers me is why should we expect the DAC in the CD player to be that much better than the mini disc recorder? The headphone amp could also make a difference, as you suggested. The difference between different units headphone amps from unit to unit could also make a major difference. I'm sure a high end CD deck will have a far superior amp than a portable MD recorder. But your suggestion is a good one. By taking the digital output of the CD player and running it through the MD player, you would be using the MDs DAC and headphone amp. Since ATRAC is encoded on to an MD during the recording phase, the PCM signal should pass unaltered through the MD recorder and headphone amp. Matching the exact volume of both units would also be critical since there is a psychoacoustic effect where, all things being equal, the higher volume the better the perceived quality of the sound. I would love to see the data on tests done that way. Larry - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Why in the hell doesn't Xitel transfer the MP3 ID3 track titling? Really want to know why? Because it uses the S/PDIF standard, which can only, i repeat ONLY transfer SCMS in the subcode data, and also, S/PDIF wasn't made for MiniDiscs, so it was not made to title MiniDiscs, which in the case of the MZ-R900, is resistor networks, not signals sent down the optics/cable. AES/EBU could possibly send the titles, but seen as though this is uncommon in almost everything consumer orientated, it would be useless to try and implement this. I am not impressed. Xitel today offers no advantage over an analog connection No D/A and A/D I would've thought.. (plus the trackmarks malfunction sometimes). You are too forgiving -- have you tried to trade 30 albums at a time on MD versus MP3 -- when including titles? Titling is one of the biggest glaring flaws of MD versus MP3. With a keyboard connected to my deck, I find this a no-brainer, and just as fast as titling MP3's (and a lot faster than titling them after they have been encoded) MD does titling in the most stupid, boneheaded, manual, tedious, time-consuming way possible. No, portables do it in the most time consuming way, but even that is a no-brainer thanks to the mironics interface (www.mironics.com) MP3 titling is a godsend and puts MD titling to shame. I found that it was easier to trade 30 titled MP3 albums (on CD-R) in one shot than to trade just 5 titled albums on MD. Did you really, well, isn't that what confirms everything, how easy YOU found it. You blame md's mistakes on what one portable can do, yet I have yet to see a valid point that applies to ALL minidisc hardware, thus turning your argument not into MD inferior to MP3, but MZ-R900 to Computer, defeating the whole purpose in the first place. Sorry if someone has already said all this, but it needed to be said. -- Stuart Howlette There are many questions in life, but is the right answer only correct because the majority believe in it? This is from a chat i had with someone a while ago (and this was him being serious NoNaMeR 2KuK: say we dont need computers NoNaMeR 2KuK: we could use cheese instead For more from this chat, visit http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/personal/chat.htm [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/ http://www.liquid2k.com/stuh84/personal/ -- - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
No, portables do it in the most time consuming way, but even that is a no-brainer thanks to the mironics interface (www.mironics.com) Unless it FUBARs your system I ordered the Mironics setup and it didn't work, and when next I rebooted, Windows 2000 was completely forqued, with an endless and seemingly inescapeable procession of blue-screen STOP errors. A reinstall of Win2K didn't help. I ended up buying a new hard drive, installing to that, copying my files over, and reformatting the old disk. Mironics said that they'd never heard of such a thing, so maybe I was blessed with a unique experience, but I say be warned. 2 [) [EMAIL PROTECTED] |\ http://rsquared.firest0rm.org/ - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
BEGIN QUOTE By this you mean the Sony units interface with CD changers? That's cool. That might be a better thing for me really instead of a hybrid deck. That, and it's probably cheaper in the long run, and more flexible. END QUOTE=== Another way to go is to buy a Sony CD/tuner unit that can work with a UniLink-capable CD changer, then get that fab Sony MDX-65 6-disc MD changer. This small changer can be installed under the front seat or in the glove compartment or centre-console armrest / storage compartment or boot (trunk); and can play 6 MDs. It even makes clever use of the buffer by reducing the amount of dead-air during disc change. In Europe, Pioneer made a rebadged version of this MD changer and it can be integrated with any Pioneer IP-bus head unit (any model with P in the model number). It still offers the same features that the Sony design was known for. If you trawled the MD-L archives, you may see a fair bit of mention of this MD changer, including use of the RM-X69RF controller to interface it with various car stereo systems that are equipped with AUX inputs. As well, SoundLinx, a company who makes aftermarket interface kits for some European OEM car stereos sells interface kits for hooking up this changer to some of these OEM car stereos like the Ford 5000 / 6000 / 7000 RDS series head units used in European Ford cars during the mid-90s. With regards, Simon Mackay - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
las [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Granted, you have to spend a LOT more money on a vinyl system, and put a LOT more care into it, to get sound comparable to a CD system, but that's another story. You would have to spend so much money that it would not be practical for all but the wealthiest people to afford it. It costs a lot for a good vinyl system, but not that much. A few thousand dollars will let you buy a CD-based system or a vinyl-based system that can offer comparable sound. While she agrees that it is possible to make make a record that sounds as good or better than a CD, the equipment needed all the way through the chain and the care that would have to be take make it so impractical. But that doesn't make any sense. What equipment and care? How is it so different from a standard master? Also, she states that analog tape has so many inherent problems that adversely affect the final product. I respect your daughter's opinion, but that sounds more like Sony/Phillips marketing than reality. Take a look at the equipment many audiophile record labels use -- the equipment they use to make CDs that sound much better than CDs made elsewhere. I think you'd be surprised how much analog equipment (and tape) is used. We're not talking about cassette. We're talking tape masters -- the same ones used on the vast majority of CDs every produced. It's only recently that some studios have gone all-digital. Your not really keeping the sound as sound. You are converting waves to magnetic signals and there in lies your first road block. But those magnetic signals are analog signals -- there is no conversion going on, which is the first roadblock to CD/digital sound being accurate. The second being the D/A conversion that occurs later. Vinyl is analog to analog. Yes but the storage used to store the analog signal is magnetic, not physical and converting vibrations to electricity causes a great deal of distortion. Says who? Again, that sounds more like digital propaganda than reality. CD is analog - A/D processor - CD. Yes but first of all, the high end converters that are used today are so good at doing what they do that they can make a very accurate copy. Better than most analog tapes. Again, says who? If that was the case, people who care about sound wouldn't buy new DACs all the time. There is no objective evidence that CD is better, There is. There is loads of objective evidence. All of those specifications. But that doesn't mean that subjectively a CD will sound better. What specifications? All you have to do is read the PR sheets for each new wave of CD format to see why the previous was inferior and the current one is one step closer to the real thing. And all those specs don't mean that *objectively* a CD will sound better. As I wrote in an earlier message, I know what I've heard, and I know what a lot of other people have heard, and it's not because of any particular love for the sound of vinyl. Also, today almost all studios use all digital storage. You said this several times, but it's not necessarily true. In fact, many of the audiophile records labels still do everything using analog equipment. It's true that lots of the big labels (who put out mostly pop/rock/country/RB) use all-digital equipment, but even they will tell you that it's more for convenience than because they did the comparisons and found that they can produce better-sounding albums with digital. In fact, one of the biggest advantages of digital-based studios is that they can alter the recordings more easily -- something that happens a lot on mass-market pop, etc., but that doesn't happen much on high-end recordings. You mentioned that older vinyl recordings sound better to you. No I didn't. Even Lenny Kravits, who used to insist that everything be vintage and analog has given up. Someone must have convinced him that it wasn't worth the hassle. LOL, maybe someone told Lenny that rock music generally isn't the kind of music that really benefits from audiophile recording methods. My daughter said, as she was laughing about your statements of having to spend a lot of money to get the results, That may be true in some analog utopia, but not in the real world. Again, as I've said over and over, I challenge you to go to a high-end audio shop that has a *good* vinyl system, and do your own blind tests. Then come back and tell us truthfully that vinyl can't compete with CD. There are other things you said that are open for debate. Belts will wear and stretch over time, thus affecting the accuracy of speed. Haven't you ever had to retension a belt on your car because of this? Again, belt wear and tear is part of the maintenance of a good vinyl system. I've said from the beginning that such things are part of having a vinyl system. That's not the issue here. The issue is whether or not vinyl can sound as good as CD (actually, the issue was originally that MP3 sounds better than vinyl, which is not true no matter how
RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
Hi Mike, I think all MD head units can control CD changers, at least the Kenwood's ones. If you have place for a changer (MD or CD), then go for it, but remember that Sony is not only manufacturer to have such products available. For sound quality, for example, Kenwood products are better. I mentioned JVC's CD/MD head unit because it is really convenient to have the possibility to insert a CD or a MD directly in the unit rather than to have to go to the boot to remove or insert discs. Francis -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mike Lastucka Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation By this you mean the Sony units interface with CD changers? That's cool. That might be a better thing for me really instead of a hybrid deck. That, and it's probably cheaper in the long run, and more flexible. --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
Just from my own experience. I have an old car with a very old sound system. It doesn't have a CD player, but it can play cassettes. I bought a portable MD-recorder a couple of months ago (a Sony MZ-G750). Very nice little player with FM-radio. Then I got the Sony CPA-9C Car connection pack. With this little investment I can now use my MD-player in the car and even in my boombox in the bedroom which can play cassettes too. There is a disadvantage to using the Cassette Adapter: it is a little bit noisy due to the fact that the adapter runs continuously in the player. BTW, in the Netherlands the Cassette Adapter can be bought seperately from the other gadget for portable MD-players: a power plug for the cigarette lighter. I didn't get one because I thought the power plug was much too expensive. Off-topic: I have had to laught with the discussion about titling. Having grown up in the vinyl and cassette era, I don't bother with titling at all. Writing down the titles on labels is more useful to me. I never look at the player when it's playing anyway. I also own a Sony MD-DX3 combo which reads CD-Text. Very interesting, but I have only one CD with Text anyway. But at least the deck will copy titles to MD. But I don't miss the titles at all. Maybe my standard is too low, but I never heard anyone complain in the pre-CD era that the couldn't see which track was playing with an LP. We just looked at the album cover. iMark - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
macdef wrote: First off please excuse me for not addressing you by your name, but I didn't notice it anywhere and I didn't want to refer to you as MACDEF. las [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Granted, you have to spend a LOT more money on a vinyl system, and put a LOT more care into it, to get sound comparable to a CD system, but that's another story. As you stated, this debate could go on forever. But after your apparently derogatory statements about Rock, I realize it would be pointless because we don't just disagree about analog vs digital. We are on two different planets altogether! You mentioned that older vinyl recordings sound better to you. No I didn't. Here I stand corrected. I thought that your e mail was coming from the same person who started the vinyl vs CD debate. That person was actually Gerry Morgan He stated: My older (late 1950s and 1960s) LPs generally sound better than those from the 70s and 80s. I think there is room for a discussion between you and Gerry, if you disagree with his statement. You said this several times, but it's not necessarily true. In fact, many of the audiophile records labels still do everything using analog equipment. Your talking about those vintage studios that I mentioned. What specifications? Frequency range. THD. S/N ratio. Dynamic range. Channel separation. To name a few. These are objective specifications. Often they may not correlate with the subjective findings of your ears and brain. So subjectively to some people vinyl will sound better than digital. You keep mentioning analog to analog. But the analog sound that you hear live, is not the same analog sound that you hear on the recording. Because of the limitations of analog storage, frequency response must be cut off and the original sound must be compressed so that you do not over saturate the analog tape. This is actually more critical in classical music than the Rock that you seem to dislike. The dynamic range of Rock is generally not that great. But in classical music it can be far more dB than analog tape and vinyl can handle. Take the 1812 Overture. You have passages where the volume is so low that you can almost not hear the music. Then you reach a point where cannons are often actually fired. You keep mentioning the on going improvements in things such as ADC and DACs. But that is just akin to all of the improvements that analog made over the years. In fact the improvements in analog sound are much greater than those from the first CDs to the present. Poor quality mikes. Hum that was louder than the music. Going from speakers with a frequency response of 1500cps / 3000cps to speakers that almost go down to 20 and almost make it to 20,000. The same applies to the early stylus and cartridge. Dynagroove The constant inability of record companies to decide whether thinner or thicker vinyl produced better fidelity. I'm sure that if digital storage hadn't come along, new advances in analog would have been developed that would make analog recordings today as different as Tom Edison's tin foil player is to today's vinyl recordings. But research in the area of improving analog was abandoned once digital became the accepted means of storage and playback. The last major improvement in analog sound that I can think of was the invention of HiFi video recorders. Their sound quality was considered a vast improvement over vinyl and other types of analog storage. Once they managed to take advantage of the fast speed of the recording and playback heads of video tape, the difference between the sound quality of a tape recorded at faster linear speed became insignificant in comparison. All the things that you mentioned about places like Ambrosia Audio are impractical in the real world. Motion picture film is analog and even video majors would have to concede that a high quality film image still can not be matched by video. In theory film could always be superior to video, because for each step that you make in improving the quality of video, whether it is digital or analog, you could always double the size of the film and thereby double the resolution. But as in audio, there are practical limits. When you get to the point where you are describing the dimensions of film in feet or yards rather then mm, you have something so impractical to work with and so costly that it could not be used in the real world. But to me one of the most significant improvements in analog sound of the 20th century was the advent of stereo (once they learned how to use it correctly and stopped making those ping pong effect recordings). I have a feeling that our debate may actually have more to do with musical preferences than analog vs digital or vinyl vs MP3 or CDs. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
Mark Ligtenstein wrote: Just from my own experience. I have an old car with a very old sound system. It doesn't have a CD player, but it can play cassettes. There is a disadvantage to using the Cassette Adapter: it is a little bit noisy due to the fact that the adapter runs continuously in the player. The other disadvantage is the limited specifications of the cassette player itself. BTW, in the Netherlands the Cassette Adapter can be bought seperately from the other gadget for portable MD-players: a power plug for the cigarette lighter. I didn't get one because I thought the power plug was much too expensive. You can do the same in the US. My experience with cassette adapters are they have to be viewed as disposable products. No matter which brand I have bought, none of them have lasted too long. Off-topic: I have had to laught with the discussion about titling. Having grown up in the vinyl and cassette era, I don't bother with titling at all. Writing down the titles on labels is more useful to me. I never look at the player when it's playing anyway. That's interesting. I also grew up in that era and also really couldn't care less about titling. LAS - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
macdef wrote: Michael Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It is grossly irrelevant to assume 128 Kbps MP3 as the standard while assuming 292 Kbps as the MD standard, then say MD sounds better than MP3. This is all too obvious yet people insist on such obviously unfair comparisons. I never do. I equate MDLP to 292k, MDLP2 to 192 or 256k, MDLP4 to 96k. At those levels, MD sounds better on each. I've read that standard ATRAC is 292 Kbps. Why do you say 192 or 256k for MDLP2 - which rate is actually used for MDLP2? The 256 Kbps MP3s I trade sound the same as standard 5:1 ATRAC, because it's the same compression ratio and generally, all the leading compression algorithms perform approximately the same as far as fidelity vs. ratio. I would disagree. ATRAC is superior to even the best MP3 encoders. Even my friends who aren't audiophiles can tell the difference between standard MD and 256k MP3. My blindfold headphone tests between WAV and MP3 CBR showed no audible difference between 224 Kbps MP3 and the input .wav, with the encoder I used. I have top-percentile hearing and know how to use the gear. Because my ability to hear artifacts has rapidly improved, I bump up to 256 Kbps, though I consider 224 Kbps to be practically perfect even for critical headphone listening in a quiet environment. Bitrates can be deceptive -- I've heard 224 Kbps that sounds as bad as 128 Kbps (actually I suspect it was re-compressed). I back away from 320 Kbps because some of today's 1st-generation MP3 CD players can't play 320 Kbps MP3s. My mind is not completely closed on this -- I fear I am cursed with good enough hearing so that I will learn to hear the artifacts you claim even at 320 Kbps. I'm an audio fanatic but nowhere near as much as some people. I also don't get the whole thing about titling. Having to spend any time at all to title a copy is technologically absurd and obstructs the ease of using MD. Why should I have to title my MD tracks when the titles have already been entered and uploaded by someone else in CDDB? You should also acknowledge that most people do not have the ability to plug in a computer keyboard to type in titles. My setup is more typical -- I have a $330 brand new top of the line Sony 900 portable, yet Sony expects me to use the jog dial to spend 15 minutes laboriously titling tracks -- the included Xitel digital interface is the perfect example of digital hype versus digital reality that falls short of potential. Why in the hell doesn't Xitel transfer the MP3 ID3 track titling? I am not impressed. Xitel today offers no advantage over an analog connection (plus the trackmarks malfunction sometimes). You are too forgiving -- have you tried to trade 30 albums at a time on MD versus MP3 -- when including titles? Titling is one of the biggest glaring flaws of MD versus MP3. MD does titling in the most stupid, boneheaded, manual, tedious, time-consuming way possible. MP3 titling is a godsend and puts MD titling to shame. I found that it was easier to trade 30 titled MP3 albums (on CD-R) in one shot than to trade just 5 titled albums on MD. MDs are a dead-end for trades and each time you do copy an MD you lose the titling and introduce another generation of lossy compression -- unlike MP3s. With MP3s, once you have a copy of the album, you can trade it bit-for-bit with much less effort than copying one MD to another, because the titles are transferred inherently as the ID3 tag part of the MP3 file -- no lossy compression, and no need to manually re-add the titles. When considering copying albums, MD is a comparatively poor quality, dead end, and manually intensive medium (as currently packaged). Once you have an MP3 computer with CD burner set up for MP3 CD-R trades, MP3 is bit-for-bit accurate, ultra-fast, and intelligent medium. I've experienced glimpses of the best potential for MP3s, and it's much greater than even most MP3 advocates claim. MP3 technology is now in its 1st generation and has huge growth potential. Sony knows this. MD is now in perhaps its 3rd-5th generation, and has little growth potential that is as significant as adding some of the features that MP3 introduced, such as sticky titling that is not left behind when you do a file copy. Sony deliberately crippled MD and restricted its potential features (such as bit-for-bit MD cloning without another ATRAC generation) to appease the RIAA (that group of industry lawyers specializing in ripping off musicians and crippling technology). But now Sony's restriction of MD capabilities is biting Sony in the ass, because MP3 technology does not deliberately cripple itself like Sony did to MD. MP3 files are copied bit-for-bit, of course including the titles. Micronics MD titler http://www.mironics.com/default.asp?get_Click=productget_Pointer=3 First of all, for me MP3 and MD are equally easy/a pain, because I can plug a PS/2 keyboard (which I bought for $2) up to my MD recorder and title songs. So it's just as
MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging
Michael Hoffman wrote: Your points will not be valid for very long at all. We're about to be hit by a tidal wave of MP3-capable CD players and related combinations of technologies and features. Mike Lastucka wrote: Which is fine for people who like to cart around what I consider to be bulky players. MD units for me are far more discrete, imho. What are you talking about? What are your unexamined assumptions? Have some vision, some imagination. Do I need to post a list of links to innovative new combinations of technology in the latest products? Evidently you need a concrete visual proof of the crossover that is happening between MD and MP3 features and behaviors, to let go of the cliche clouds of connotations of what MD is and what MP3 is. http://www.musicmatch.com/download/radiomx_intro.htm ~~128 stereo Kbps (ATRAC3?) internet radio (I'm listening now). No interruptions, just brief station IDs, start of songs do a 1-second fade-in, can skip about 10 songs before you must wait or switch stations to skip some more songs. A hint of the future. I consider 128 Kbps stereo typical FM-quality. http://www.realnetworks.com/company/pressroom/pr/00/sony.html - RealNetworks plans to integrate support for Sony music technologies into RealJukebox, including ATRAC3, its sound compression format, as well as OpenMG copyright protection technology, the Sony Memory Stick and its portable audio players such as Memory Stick Walkman and VAIO Music Clip. This enhancement to RealJukebox is expected to ship in the Summer of 2000, and is to be designed for use with OpenMG on PCs to comply with SDMI (Secure Digital Music Initiative) requirements for copyright management. Both RealNetworks and Sony are active members of SDMI. RealNetworks also expects to provide integrated support for Sony's ATRAC3 codec technology, which will enable consumers to download and play ATRAC3-encoded music on PCs, as well as downloading such music to Sony's portable audio players packaged with OpenMG, like Memory Stick Walkman and VAIO Music Clip. Initially, RealNetworks and Sony plan to develop a version of RealJukebox for Windows 98 and 2000. Mini CD-R blanks ($0.68 US) http://www.yesbuy.net/cd-r-3--mini-cdr.html Mini CD-R blanks ($0.68 US) http://www.meritline.com/50pcsminicdr.html http://cdr4less.com/cgi-bin/smart_cart.cgi?keywords=mini%20cdr http://www.supermediastore.com/10pacmincdrb.html Mini-CD-RW: Mini CDRW blanks ($2 US, compare to regular CDRW blanks) http://cdr4less.com/cgi-bin/smart_cart.cgi?keywords=cd-rw - Not compatible with Sony Mavica CD1000 Camera. Fully ReWritable up to 1,000 times -- Silver top Mini CD-RW, in spindles (cases available separately), holds 21 minutes audio [CDDA] or 180MB of data, measures 80 mm (8cm or 3.25) round. Fits in small center depression in the tray of most CDR burners and CD-ROM players. Freecom Beatman Mini-CDR player with MP3 decoding http://www.freecom.com/ecCategory_one.asp?ID=8009type=DRIVE%5FIN Philips Expanium 401 MP3 Mini-CD-R player http://www.tecchannel.de/news/20010503/thema20010503-4303.html More hits: http://www.google.com/search?q=expanium+401 http://www.getasia.com.sg/getasia%5CGetAsiaCachePublish.nsf/Content/251DEF92E1 3C7A0248256A4D001E3376?Opendocument - Philips EXP 401 MP3-CD portable delivers over three hours of compressed MP3, UDF or AAC audio from single disc. Philips is boosting its eXpandium MP3-CD player features by shrinking the CD player itself - with a CD portable specifically designed to play 8cm (3-inch) CDs which can contain over three hours of compressed digital audio in formats like MP3, UDF or AAC. Due September 2001. MP3-CD playback (32-320 Kbps including Variable Bit Rate); 8cm CD compatibility (Audio CD, CD-R, CD-RW); Onboard decoders: CDDA, MP3, UDF or AAC. Samsung MCD-MP8 MP3 Mini-CD-R player http://www.tecchannel.de/news/20010704/thema20010704-4783.html - 180 und 230 MByte Daten. Die CDs können herkömmliche CD-Brenner beschreiben, und sie sind im Vergleich zu Flash-Medien sehr billig. Beim Direktversender Pearl, der ebenfalls einen Mini-CD-Player von Q-Sonic (289 Mark) anbietet, kostet das Medium zum Beispiel 2,30 Mark. Der Samsung Yepp wiegt 165 Gramm und misst 113 x 100 x 29 Millimeter. Er ist mit den üblichen Features wie etwa Zwischenspeicherung zum Schutz vor Erschütterung ausgestattet. Vorerst kommt der Player in Korea auf den Markt und kostet dort 193 US-Dollar. PC World July 5 2001 - Samsung Adds [Mini] CDs to Yepp MP3 Players http://www.pcworld.com/resource/printable/article/0,aid,54484,00.asp - Samsung Electronics doesn't want you to have to choose between size and song storage capacity in your MP3 player. On Tuesday, the company launched the latest member of its Yepp line of MP3 digital music players, aimed at offering a compromise between some of the most desired aspects in these devices. While small size and light weight are desirable in MP3 players, they often limit memory capacity and new memory cards can cost as much,
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Michael Hoffman wrote: Your points will not be valid for very long at all. We're about to be hit by a tidal wave of MP3-capable CD players and related combinations of technologies and features. Michael, with all do respect. once again you are making statements without specific references to what you are claiming. It would be like my saying that Sony is about to release Net MD and plans to spend millions of dollars promoting it. It also plans to drastically drop the price of hardware so that it will be almost impossible to pass it up. But I have no facts to make that claim, so I'm not making it. MP3 is hypothetically capable of portable recording just as much as ATRAC is. If that were true, there would already be portable recorders out there. Even the most advanced Pocket PC, the Compaq ipaq 3650/3670 is only capable of playing MP3 files. There is nothing stopping development of an MP3-based line of products that does everything MD does. What is the near-future potential of MP3 and the near-future potential of ATRAC or MD? So far MP3 seems to have reached a certain amount of popularity and is leveling off. Without a good source, MP3 took a hit. The shutting down of Napster certainly didn't help. And Morpheus is only a shadow of what Napster was. I'm still waiting to see how long they get away with with they are doing. Remember, Sony's Bic-lighter-sized solid-state player plays ATRAC, with no MD, and Real Audio is now starting to transmit ATRAC online, with no MD. First off, that only proves that ATRAC is just as viable an encoding system as MP3. As far as solid state goes, it may offer fast transfer rates, but what do you do once you have used up all of your kbs? Buy Sticks at $100 each? Dissolve MD into its features and subcomponents, and do the same for MP3 technologies, and we can see many new combinations. -- ideally, it can be used in a self-contained system like an MD portable recorder, but also, if you choose to hook it up to a computer, you can fully take advantage of the immense potential of GUI and computer power. This statement can just as easily be turned around to say that any audio storage should be capable of independent, portable recording and playback. I don't see any stand alone portable music CD recorders, let alone one that will store music in MP3 on a CD. I'm not saying they can't be made. But if they can, why hasn't someone come out with a prototype by now? Right now you have to have a computer. In spite of their popularity, I'm sure that I'm sure that the number of households that have some kind of musical playback unit is much higher than the number that have a computer. Michael stated: One of my main points is that any new technology must be fully computer literate How do you define new technology? Is it something brand new that has never existed before, such as a Time Machine? Or is it advancements in existing technology, like a new car with all kinds of never before offered features or tiny digital cell phones? If you subscribe to the Time Machine definition, then the PC is not a new technology. When MDs came out most PCs still had tiny speakers in them. Many without sound cards. So the PC that we have today would not be a new technology, but a continuing advancement of existing technology. This would invalidate your entire main point because for one it would depend upon the age of your computer. Since the computer is constantly evolving, we could reach a point where new computers no longer were capable of handling MP3s. Don't laugh, unless you have a very old computer, try reading from a 5 1/4 inch floppy disk! I have a fairly new scanner that I can not use with my new computer because it uses an ISA SCSI card and my new computer only accepts PCI cards. As GUI operating systems continue on to the next version, each new version does not make drivers for all older hardware. So something computer literate today may not be computer literate in as little as a year (lets see what drivers are not available for Windows XP) making your new 3 years ago technology obsolete. I have thousands of dollars worth of programs written for Windows 3.11 that are no longer usable. There are Windows 95 programs that will not run under Windows 98 (and that is only 3 years). If, however if you subscribe to my second definition of new technology (advancements in existing technology) then even things that YOU would have considered new technology must be fully computer literate, may no longer be computer literate. Are brand new cars no good because they are not fully computer literate? You can't plug a cable from your car to a PC and have them talk to each other. Does that mean that we have to start making cars with such capability or cars are in your opinion, obsolete? They now have a new technology (by the Time Machine definition) called the Ionic Breeze. It cleans the air with out the use of filters. But it is not computer literate,
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Michael Hoffman's email seems to have hit the list like a Rorschach test, causing folks to take issue (at length!) with whatever part of the MD/MP3/PC-audio equation raises their hackles. So, please allow me my reading :-) Michael Hoffman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well then forget MD and stay with MP3. We must engineer our own MD-burner technology that can do it the right way -- to make MD and possibly ATRAC a lossless bit-for-bit general file transfer and storage medium, *fully* computer-centric just like MP3. Right! While I appreciate your bravery Michael, the sad fact is that we (the users) are not permitted to decide which features and conveniences modern audio gear will have. Not even the manufacturers can. In this day and age the decision has been given over to the RIAA and their friends in Congress. The only reason people can have so much fun with MP3s and CDs (8cm or otherwise) is that PC connectable CDs existed before the Home Recording Rights Act. Were it otherwise, CD would certainly be hobbled with SCMS (or worse), just as MD is, and DataPlay will be. Wouldn't you guess it is glaringly obvious to Sony what wonderful playtoys fully PC integrated Minidisc recorders would be, and the huge market potential they would have? But I take my reading of Sony's thinking from the NetMD announcement; the promiment aspect of it is not that MD can now be part of the PC audio scene, but rather that it will be able to satisfy the digital rights management requirements that simply everyone in the PC/Internet audio field is concerning themselves with. I think it is best to consider CD/MP3 as a wonderful grandfatherered anamoly that has (so far) managed to escape being corralled by the recording industry. As for whom to plead with for the features on your audio dream machine of the future, I suggest writing congress. Rick - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
First of all, there are LPs without a cutoff of 15kHz. Second, even if all LPs were limited to 15kHz, the fact of the matter is that most humans over the age of 15 can't really hear above 15kHz anyway. So that whole argument is pretty much irrelevant. So... you have pretty much made SACD and DVD-A irrelevant. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation
=== = NB: Over 50% of this message is QUOTED, please = = be more selective when quoting text = === I'd considered getting a hybrid unit (MD/CD insertable into the in-dash unit) but it's probably more practical for me to have a CD changer in the car and have the MD insertable into the face. I'm not looking at buying just yet, I need a better car first. :) No sense putting a wicked system into an 87 Mazda 626. But thanks for the input guys. You've given me some good info to go on. --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sites.netscape.net/element5/ 2048 bit DH 0x16DC15CD From: Francis Auquier [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2001 10:35:45 +0200 Hi Mike, I think all MD head units can control CD changers, at least the Kenwood's ones. If you have place for a changer (MD or CD), then go for it, but remember that Sony is not only manufacturer to have such products available. For sound quality, for example, Kenwood products are better. I mentioned JVC's CD/MD head unit because it is really convenient to have the possibility to insert a CD or a MD directly in the unit rather than to have to go to the boot to remove or insert discs. Francis -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Mike Lastucka Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2001 2:37 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: MD: MD/CD Car Stereo Recommendation By this you mean the Sony units interface with CD changers? That's cool. That might be a better thing for me really instead of a hybrid deck. That, and it's probably cheaper in the long run, and more flexible. --- Mike Lastucka, B. Tech - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling
Thanks to Michael Hoffman for the links to 8-cm CDRWs for sale at cdr4less.com and yesbuy.com. I'd never yet heard of those companies and had not seen 8-cm CDRWs for sale before. On cdr4less.com's home audio CDR page they perpetuate the myth (repeated to me last week by a Circuit City employee) that home audio CDRs do not work in burners; I hope that isn't an indication of their competence, because it certainly is tempting to get a spindle of 8-cm CDRWs from them. | But what Earth still lacks is an external Mini-CDRW (8-cm only) burner. | It will be at least 5 minutes more before there is such a thing. It | should include headphone output and bass boost, and built-in MP3 | decoding. I think there might be a confusion of terms here. To me a burner is a computer peripheral, and an external burner is one that connects by cable to a USB, parallel, or Firewire port on the computer instead of needing to be installed inside the case. What you're saying there, Michael, doesn't seem to make sense about external burners but could about a portable component recorder. One obstacle is such a device would be required to use only consumer audio discs, and 8-cm consumer audio CDRs don't seem to be available yet. The 8-cm rings in the trays of today's CD recorders (again, folks, I'm talking about audio components, not about computer peripherals) go to waste because there are no 8-cm consumer audio CDRs to record on nor to trick the machines into recording onto 8-cm data CDRs. I wonder if it's possible to swap-trick a CD recorder with a 12-cm consumer audio CDR into recording onto an 8-cm [data] CDR, as long as the music fits? Michael has also written, | Why should I have to title my MD tracks when the titles have already been | entered and uploaded by someone else in CDDB? 1. The tracks on the MD may not be exactly the set and sequence of an album listed on the CDDB. 2. The tracks may not yet be listed in the CDDB. 3. The person who provided the titles to the CDDB may have made mistakes in information or in typing. 4. The person who provided the titles to the CDDB may have entered them in a format that differs from your preference in some varying or unpredictable fashion, such that the editing changes cannot be pre-coded into your title transfering software. 5. You might have made your own mix or edit, or your own microphone recording, or your own computer-composed tune, so the track couldn't possibly be in the CDDB. | MD does titling in the most stupid, boneheaded, manual, tedious, | time-consuming way possible. Apparently, Mr. Hoffman, you have only a portable MD recorder and don't know how titling is on decks with full remotes, let alone on a deck with keyboard input. I find titling on portables to be as bad as you say, but it's not the only way to title a MiniDisc. | MDs are a dead-end for trades and each time you do copy an MD you lose the | titling ... There are ways to transfer titles from MD to MD. For example, many Sharp portable recorders have the Name Stamp feature that copies the disc name and all track titles from any recordable MD to any other with the same number of tracks, and the Sony MDS-W1 dual MD deck can copy titles between discs. If the tracks are at the same addresses, in many machines one can clone the entire TOC, titles and all. | ... and introduce another generation of lossy compression -- unlike MP3s. Yes, another layer of ATRACking is introduced (unless you have pro-grade equipment that can transfer bit-for-bit in the ATRAC domain). In normal personal copying you won't have too many generations and the effect will be negligible, but it is a drawback for trading. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD inferior to MP3: it's not computer-literate
Eric Woudenberg, Minidisc.org Editor wrote: Right! While I appreciate your bravery Michael, the sad fact is that we (the users) are not permitted to decide which features and conveniences modern audio gear will have. Not even the manufacturers can. In this day and age the decision has been given over to the RIAA and their friends in Congress. The RIAA may have been started to improve the quality of recorded music, I don't know. but one thing that I do know is that it has turned in to a lobby that is against the consumer and will stop at nothing to prevent the wealthy interests that they represent from losing a nickel. The only reason people can have so much fun with MP3s and CDs (8cm or otherwise) is that PC connectable CDs existed before the Home Recording Rights Act. Were it otherwise, CD would certainly be hobbled with SCMS (or worse), just as MD is, and DataPlay will be. Wouldn't you guess it is glaringly obvious to Sony what wonderful playtoys fully PC integrated Minidisc recorders would be, and the huge market potential they would have? But I take my reading of Sony's thinking from the NetMD announcement; the promiment aspect of it is not that MD can now be part of the PC audio scene, but rather that it will be able to satisfy the digital rights management requirements that simply everyone in the PC/Internet audio field is concerning themselves with. I have several additional takes on Sony's motives. The first one may be way off and is not something that I strongly believe is a factor, but I'll through it out anyway. Does the patent problem with ATRAC and Dolby make the use of ATRAC less profitable for Sony? But my major take is that Sony is now in direct conflict with itself. One the one side it is a major manufacturer of consumer audio products. But on the other hand, it is a major producer and distributor of music CDs. Sony now has to weigh the balance between selling CDs and the potential loss in income do to people making copies of their music for free using equipment manufactured by Sony. I can't remember how long ago Sony acquired CBS/Columbia. If it was way before they ever had any plans to do so, then SCMS was forced on them. But if it was after Sony had already bought (or was very sure that they were going to buy) their record company, They may have been very passive about SCAM at the least. In my twisted mind an analogy would be that not very may men are involuntarily raped by women. You can't rape the willing. I have posting way too may times on the list this past day. And I would stop if anyone even hinted that I was hogging the list. But as it turns out, my posts seem to have raised a great deal of response. Mostly from people who are disagreeing with me. But in a slow summer period where days can go buy with very few posts, I may have unintentionally livened up the board. Larry PS just as an aside it occurred to me when I mentioned women, that there have never been many female members on the list. I guess this kind of stuff is largely what intelligent, non jock men are interested in. It's like that Circuit City ad where the husband promises the wife it will just be a minute, I know just want I need. Then goes crazy when he sees all of the stuff and comes out with armfuls of stuff. - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MD: MD and MP3 technologies are merging / titling
David W. Tamkin wrote: I think there might be a confusion of terms here. To me a burner is a computer peripheral, and an external burner is one that connects by cable to a USB, parallel, or Firewire port on the computer instead of needing to be installed inside the case. I'm pretty sure that the term burner is just a slang term possibly coined by someone in the recording industry because they thought that it sounded cool. Technically any device that is capable of creating a CD with something on it from a blank CD could be called a burner. I'm not sure and I'd have to check with my daughter, but there may be professional equipment capable of making or burning an audio CD from a digital source such as a DAT independent of the need for a computer. But I don't think that I have ever seen a manufacture use the term burner either on the box it came in or on the unit itself. CD Writer also really can't be used generically because it is a trademark name of HP's drive. Even CNET has copped out listing them as CDR/CDRW drives. It doesn't make sense. They should have been called CD writable and CD re-writable. In one the R stands for Recordable, in the other it stands for Re followed by Writable. I would have named them CDWR and CDW thus keeping the term writable constant. Also in computer terms, one never records to a drive. You write to it. It is only in audio that the term recordable is used. Lawrence - To stop getting this list send a message containing just the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
