I love this thread because it reminds me of the rollicking glory days of Usenet.
Look I offer my perspective on the pricing thing, since I buy a fair amount of
Unix servers for my company and one of my office mates buys all the HP/Dell
crap for the Windows team -
sometimes those of us in big fa
> No it's more like: "They have needs that they feel
> require a higher end
> product, and are *willing* to pay for it. - So let's
> make it for them."
Well that's exactly my point: most aren't willing to pay for it, a fact that
has reflected poorly on company's financial performance. The proof
* Kyle McDonald <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [2008-02-24 17:35]:
>
> Back then, you didn't even have to be a big customer, if you were an
> educational institution, you got a decent discount off Hardware.
I recall some universities getting some very sustantial discounts on
6+ figure supercomputers in th
On Wed, Feb 13, 2008 at 7:35 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I took everyones advice from like a year ago, and added a gig of ram
> to my U10 333, so I could run Solaris 10, ultimately so I could play
> with ZFS.
>
> Performance is acceptable, but I'd like to jump to an x86 and Nextenta
> (for be
Kyle McDonald wrote:
> It maybe true that you've had a drive that failed quickly. That's not
> what MTBF means. The M is for 'Mean' or 'Average'. Just because some
> still fail early doesn't mean that the parts, processes, testing etc.
> that go into the model you pay more for don't (on avera
UNIX admin wrote:
>
> Oh, I see. "They have money, so let's skin them!" Nice.
> And the prices are completely and totally out of touch with reality.
>
No it's more like: "They have needs that they feel require a higher end
product, and are *willing* to pay for it. - So let's make it for them."
> I have two comments. First, my experience is that you
> can almost never
> compare hardware prices in the manner many on this
> list have done. They
> look at the particular specs without thinking about
> the qualifications. For
> example, I have seen the specs on some of the disk
> drives that g
On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 20:00:01 -0500
Brian Utterback <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dr. Robert Pasken wrote:
> > I just bought a Sun Ultra-24. It is a Quad-core 2.4ghz box with 4gb of
> > memory 250gb of disk and a garbage nvidia card for $1300. Unfortunately you
> > cann't buy the better performing
Dr. Robert Pasken wrote:
> I just bought a Sun Ultra-24. It is a Quad-core 2.4ghz box with 4gb of memory
> 250gb of disk and a garbage nvidia card for $1300. Unfortunately you cann't
> buy the better performing Ultrasparc's at this proce point
>
I have two comments. First, my experience is that
I just bought a Sun Ultra-24. It is a Quad-core 2.4ghz box with 4gb of memory
250gb of disk and a garbage nvidia card for $1300. Unfortunately you cann't buy
the better performing Ultrasparc's at this proce point
This message posted from opensolaris.org
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I guess you didn't understand me. The price you suggested was 100% more than
retail. I paid list price for 2 Ultra-10's and I paid less than what you
suggested for one machine.
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On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:12:06 +
Ghee Teo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> UNIX admin wrote:
> >> I got the
> >> gist of what you said: SPARC is overpriced for what
> >> it does. x86 is the saner option. What is
> >> your opinion on Sun's x86 offerings ( esp the Sun
> >> Ultra 20M2 ) ?
> >>
>
UNIX admin writes:
> > again losing business because it has overly priced. But then raising
> > this in a developers' based channel really
> > is the not most effective channel to get the pricing down.
>
> Well buddy, if you tell me a better way, I'll be sure to try it, because so
> far everyth
> Insulating on what?
It insults my intelligence, however miniscule she might be.
> You can call Sun's hardware expensive which it has
> been stated many times before.
> Sun is a business where pricing is determined such that it can pay the
> salaries and profitable and to balance
> again los
UNIX admin wrote:
>> This is not true, just check 2GB costs $230 for
>> Utra 20M2.
>>
>
> According to store.sun.com, 2x1GB costs $189 USD. I just checked the price at
> a local website, 2x1GB ECC DDR2-667, exactly the same memory, costs $47.96
> USD.
>
> So what is Sun trying to pull here?
> This is not true, just check 2GB costs $230 for
> Utra 20M2.
According to store.sun.com, 2x1GB costs $189 USD. I just checked the price at a
local website, 2x1GB ECC DDR2-667, exactly the same memory, costs $47.96 USD.
So what is Sun trying to pull here? I mean, to me as a customer, this is j
UNIX admin wrote:
>> I got the
>> gist of what you said: SPARC is overpriced for what
>> it does. x86 is the saner option. What is
>> your opinion on Sun's x86 offerings ( esp the Sun
>> Ultra 20M2 ) ?
>>
>
> Sun is currently playing this gimmick where the base price is really good,
> but th
> I also recently went through this. I wanted to
> purchase Sun hardware
> for a client of mine but in the end I couldn't
> justify it after
> configuring it the way I wanted. I refused to buy
> Dell for no other
> reason than bad customer experience a friend had
> recently. I found
> Silicon Mecha
> I'm guessing that your institution wasn't experienced
> buying sun
> equipment so didn't have people in purchasing who
> were aware of these
> things. Worse they may have just asked for a quote
> for the U10's from
> the same computer hardware reseller that they ordered
> everything else
> fr
UNIX admin wrote:
>> So you your university was paying a 100% premium for
>> hardware. I bought two full tricked out U10 directly
>> from the Sun website when they first came out for
>> less than that
>>
> <>
> Good to know that Sun treats everyone fairly and equally, isn't it?
> <>
>
>
B
On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 09:16:52 -0800
Alan Coopersmith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> UNIX admin wrote:
> > Good to know that Sun treats everyone fairly and equally, isn't it?
>
> Many businesses offer volume discounts and other incentives to bigger
> customers - does it really surprise you that Sun d
UNIX admin wrote:
> Good to know that Sun treats everyone fairly and equally, isn't it?
Many businesses offer volume discounts and other incentives to bigger
customers - does it really surprise you that Sun does as well?
--
-Alan Coopersmith- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sun Micr
> So you your university was paying a 100% premium for
> hardware. I bought two full tricked out U10 directly
> from the Sun website when they first came out for
> less than that
<>
Good to know that Sun treats everyone fairly and equally, isn't it?
<>
This message posted from opensolaris.org
_
So you your university was paying a 100% premium for hardware. I bought two
full tricked out U10 directly from the Sun website when they first came out for
less than that
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Integer performance is the only place where the opteron is better. In this case
I mean compiles. Floating point performance on a dual 1ghz U3 is better than
the 2.2ghz dual opteron. In this case MM5 run times are comparable (within 10
seconds for a 72 hour run time) WRF run times were actually f
KG>
KG> I don't own any Sun hardware, but recently did a bit of
KG> shopping and noticed this as well. Looks like they're trying to
KG> "emulate" Dell, a company which I loathe...
I also recently went through this. I wanted to purchase Sun hardware
for a client of mine but in the end I couldn't j
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:08:19 PST
UNIX admin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I got the
> > gist of what you said: SPARC is overpriced for what
> > it does. x86 is the saner option. What is
> > your opinion on Sun's x86 offerings ( esp the Sun
> > Ultra 20M2 ) ?
>
> Sun is currently playing this gi
> I got the
> gist of what you said: SPARC is overpriced for what
> it does. x86 is the saner option. What is
> your opinion on Sun's x86 offerings ( esp the Sun
> Ultra 20M2 ) ?
Sun is currently playing this gimmick where the base price is really good, but
that same base configuration is useles
[...]
>
> Now, if you got here reading this far, you might think I'm really bashing
> Sun hardware and don't like SPARC. But the truth is, IF there were Sun V240s
> out there for a *sane*, decent price, I'd load up on them in a heartbeat. As
> they are still outrageously overpriced, even the used m
>I have always wanted to
> know what is so special about SPARC hardware that
> some people still prefer it over x86.
Unless you're really "jiggy" and "down" with the UltraSPARC processor, and know
how to squeeze that extra performance out of an UltraSPARC based CPU, nothing
really.
If you look
> Really? For workstations in general, and SPARC in
> particular they seemed
> cheap to me. Promotions combined with my Universities
> discount (no
> larger than other large commercial accounts got,) I
> often got Ultra 5's
> for around/under $2000, and Ultra10's for less than
> $3000 (I doubt t
On Wed, Feb 20, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Dennis Clarke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>
> > Ultra 10... honestly somebody on eBay will buy it from you.
>
> Probably a guy like me. Those were fine little boxes for what the
> price back then. Of course I wouldn't even consider it unless it
> had the Creator 3D
UNIX admin wrote:
>> Probably a guy like me. Those were fine little boxes
>> for what the price back then.
>>
>
> In retrospective, considering the U10 hardware, they were outrageously
> expensive back then.
Really? For workstations in general, and SPARC in particular they seemed
cheap to me
> Probably a guy like me. Those were fine little boxes
> for what the price back then.
In retrospective, considering the U10 hardware, they were outrageously
expensive back then. But it was a different time, I was young and "high" on the
purple Sun logo.
I'm surprised that you'd even consider b
> Ultra 10... honestly somebody on eBay will buy it from you.
Probably a guy like me. Those were fine little boxes for what the
price back then. Of course I wouldn't even consider it unless it
had the Creator 3D Series III framebuffer in there.
> But consider noise and heat and electrical consum
Ultra 10... honestly somebody on eBay will buy it from you.
But consider noise and heat and electrical consumption. According to sunsolve,
that Ultra 10 (sans monitor) is Input power 380 W, Heat output 1287
BTU/hr.
I know my Thinkpad running snv81 is only 72W, and you learn to apprec
Well, he can run a more up-to-date version of Macromedia/Adobe Flash!!
:) (Currently ISV support is still better for Sparc/Solaris than
x86/Solaris. (Although this is slowly changing).
If you aren't going to be running commercial/proprietary software, or
needing to develop for a production Sparc
> I'm just wondering, what am I giving up if I dump the
> U10 w/
> Solaris10? Reliabilty? Does the U10 have any unique
> capabilities
> worth considering anymore?
An Ultra10 has no "unique capabilities", that is, unless you consider the
OpenBoot PROM and the SPARC(R) V9 processor to be "unique
> I'm just wondering, what am I giving up if I dump the
> U10 w/
> Solaris10?
Your under the bridge position.
---Bob
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dennis, why the hell are you comparing a opteron with scsi to a U10,
are you THAT ignorant of what a U10 has in it? apples to apples and
all that carp
On Feb 15, 2008 10:06 PM, Dennis Clarke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Based on the dual-core Opteron win 8gb of memory, dual SATA with an N
It could be useful for a lot of things still, you can set up and run Sparc
applications on it that don't need big performance. That can be pretty useful
if you need a testbed to try something out on. It'd be potentially useful as a
non-hosted compile environment too, you can load an OEM distrib
Dr. Robert Pasken wrote:
> Based on the dual-core Opteron win 8gb of memory, dual SATA with an Nvidia
> graphics card, you MAY find the CPU performance better, BUT the disk and
> video will be awful. I've been disappointed with everything but the integer
> performance on my x86 box
>
>
So y
> Based on the dual-core Opteron win 8gb of memory, dual SATA with an Nvidia
> graphics card, you MAY find the CPU performance better, BUT the disk and
> video will be awful. I've been disappointed with everything but the integer
> performance on my x86 box
Use dual Opteron with Ultra 320 SCSI an
Based on the dual-core Opteron win 8gb of memory, dual SATA with an Nvidia
graphics card, you MAY find the CPU performance better, BUT the disk and video
will be awful. I've been disappointed with everything but the integer
performance on my x86 box
This message posted from opensolaris.org
_
I say drop it and get a decent dual/quad AMD or Intel box with an NVidia
graphics card--and you'll never look back. Just make sure that there are
drivers for your hardware. It's gotten much better with OpenSolaris
builds/releases, NVidia drivers, OpenSound, etc.
This message posted from open
I upgraded the processor in mine to a 450 cheap on ebay easy to do.
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> I took everyones advice from like a year ago, and added a gig of ram
> to my U10 333, so I could run Solaris 10, ultimately so I could play
> with ZFS.
>
> Performance is acceptable, but I'd like to jump to an x86 and Nextenta
> (for better h/w performance, and because x86's are more versatile,
I took everyones advice from like a year ago, and added a gig of ram
to my U10 333, so I could run Solaris 10, ultimately so I could play
with ZFS.
Performance is acceptable, but I'd like to jump to an x86 and Nextenta
(for better h/w performance, and because x86's are more versatile, and
becaus
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