Re: [AFMUG] suction cup mounts

[David Coudron]

We tried those a couple of times for relays on farmyards.   We found that the 
suctions cups did not hold the radio up for very long.  Usually within a couple 
of months, the suction cup would release and the radio would fall.   Seemed 
like a good idea, but in practice, it just didn't work well.  In particular, in 
Minnesota with the glass getting cold and warm over season change, the suction 
cup just wasn't high enough quality to hold it.  If they had used the same 
material that some of the better car window mount phone holders used, it might 
have been OK.   For short distance relays, the Low E glass didn't drop the 
signal enough to matter since we pretty over powered for what was needed.   
However, I would think using that for a normal SM installation would cause too 
large a signal drop to work.   We have were also using Mikrotik Wireless Wire 
for relays where high speed was needed.   Even at short distance the Low E 
would kill the signal to a point where it was unusable.   Mounting on the 
outside and running the cable inside was the only way we could get a good 
connection on them.

Regards,

David Coudron

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 7:23 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: [AFMUG] suction cup mounts

Apparently Ubiquiti made a mounting bracket for attacking a Nanostation to a 
window with suction cups.

Was the Nanostation supposed to go on the outside of the window, or the inside 
shooting through the glass?  I ask because we have now encountered 2 competitor 
installs shooting through the glass.  Isn't that a bad idea, unless it's 100 
year old glass or else Plexiglas?
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Re: [AFMUG] suction cup mounts

[Colin Stanners]

I think it's only been in the last dozen years that the low-E glass that
blocks RF has gotten popular. At least around here, few places have it
other than brand-new houses.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 7:23 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> Apparently Ubiquiti made a mounting bracket for attacking a Nanostation to
> a window with suction cups.
>
>
>
> Was the Nanostation supposed to go on the outside of the window, or the
> inside shooting through the glass?  I ask because we have now encountered 2
> competitor installs shooting through the glass.  Isn’t that a bad idea,
> unless it’s 100 year old glass or else Plexiglas?
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] suction cup mounts

[chuck]

Low E glass blocks most of the RF.

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 6:22 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: [AFMUG] suction cup mounts

Apparently Ubiquiti made a mounting bracket for attacking a Nanostation to a 
window with suction cups.

 

Was the Nanostation supposed to go on the outside of the window, or the inside 
shooting through the glass?  I ask because we have now encountered 2 competitor 
installs shooting through the glass.  Isn’t that a bad idea, unless it’s 100 
year old glass or else Plexiglas?




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[AFMUG] suction cup mounts

[Ken Hohhof]

Apparently Ubiquiti made a mounting bracket for attacking a Nanostation to a
window with suction cups.

 

Was the Nanostation supposed to go on the outside of the window, or the
inside shooting through the glass?  I ask because we have now encountered 2
competitor installs shooting through the glass.  Isn't that a bad idea,
unless it's 100 year old glass or else Plexiglas?

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Ken Hohhof]

https://dilbert.com/search_results?terms=Neal


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick - Lists
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 6:00 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Unless you are going all in without a guard, it’s helpful to have someone who 
get get the back of your neck for you.

My wife is 5’3” and I’m over 6’2”...I have to kneel, which she believes is my 
proper position before her!  :-)

Jeff Broadwick
CTIconnect
312-205-2519 Office
574-220-7826 Cell
jbroadw...@cticonnect.com

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 6:54 PM, Jay Weekley  wrote:
> 
> Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?
> 
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much longer and I 
>> will give myself a buzz.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24, 
>> 2020 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT 
>> Fun Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
>> Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.
>> 
>>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:
>>> 
>>> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Jay Weekley
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
>>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>>> 
>>> Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro 
>>> pick earlier today.  Seriously.
>>> 
>>> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>> > We all knew you were a troll.
>>> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 
>>> > 23,
>>> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
>>> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
>>> > I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not 
>>> > downs, so I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a 
>>> > hippy.
>>> >
>>> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> 
>>> --
>>> *Jay Weekley*
>>> *Cyber Broadband
>>> *
>>> 
>>> --
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>>> https://www.avg.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
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>>> 
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 
> 
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
> 
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Jay Weekley]

That's one of the best prices I've seen.

Ken Hohhof wrote:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Flowbee-vintage-home-haircutting-system-hair-cut-in
-box/373030481273?hash=item56da596d79:g:nvsAAOSwcLleodKp


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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Jay Weekley]

The day is coming.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Super easy.  Just put on a #2 guard and start mowing.
-Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Friday, April 24, 
2020 4:53 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
OT Fun

Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much 
longer and I will give myself a buzz.


-Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24, 
2020 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: 
[AFMUG] OT Fun

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:


When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
earlier today.  Seriously.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> We all knew you were a troll.
> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 
23,

> 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> [AFMUG] OT Fun
> I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not 
downs, so

> I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>>
>

--
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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Bill Prince]

At some point, the WDC (Whole D*** Country) is going to have to figure 
out how to get our government's IT infrastructure out of the stone age. 
I would not be surprised to hear ULS is running a COBOL program in a PDP-11.



bp


On 4/24/2020 2:37 PM, Caleb Knauer wrote:

ULS is gonna have to get way more gerbils, it barely runs on a good day.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 8:25 AM Tim Hardy  wrote:

Everyone on the unlicensed side is now claiming that this was their baby, but if 
you really want to do know where the influence came from - follow the lobbying and 
follow the money.  Facebook, Amazon, Microsoft, Apple & Google spent over $16 
million in 1st Qtr of 2020 - this thing didn't spring up over night and the $$$ 
spent on this over the last five years is astronomical.  It took a ton of lobbying 
at both the FCC and Congress just to get to the Rule Making process that started on 
Oct 1, 2018, and the RM garnered over 700 comments, reply comments and ex-parte 
filings.

The success / failure of this relies heavily on the AFC to adequately protect 
both existing and new incumbents.  Standard power devices must check-in with 
the AFC at least once a day.  The AFC will rely solely on ULS (per FCC 
requirement) and it is widely recognized that ULS has major problems and 
deficiencies - in fact, the WTB will be issuing a Public Notice reminding 
licensees of their duty to ensure that their licenses are complete and 
accurate.  The AFC systems must go through a testing and certification process 
and this will further delay things.  Its going to take some time for all of 
this before devices that require the AFC to be used.

FYI - in a letter dated January 2018, the RLAN group that includes Apple, 
Broadcom, Cisco and HP projects over 958,062,017 unlicensed devices at 6 GHz.

On Apr 23, 2020, at 10:34 PM, Tim Withrow via AF  wrote:

After posting this I seen an article that said they (WFA) was the crusader. 
Wispa seems to be a member of that group as well.
https://www.wi-fi.org/discover-wi-fi/wi-fi-certified-6




On Thursday, April 23, 2020 Tim Reichhart  wrote:

I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it WISPA 
isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.




-Original Message-
From: "Matt Hoppes" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
Date: 04/23/20 10:14
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies dropped 
that made it happen?

On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen  wrote:

The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of them. 
They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power (WiFi6) usage.

I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.


On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout  wrote:

There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out of the 
goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the common 
man/small business.

So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy  wrote:

FCC has total authority over these bands.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser  
wrote:

How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
Congress?


On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

yes you are right.


Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 815-570-3101





On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

More like 4.9 to 7.



From: AF  On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum



Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean heavily, so 
really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum proposed will 
likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability standpoint it will 
be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general.   What about the 
Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able to cover the entire 
band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...








Erich Kaiser

North Central Tower

er...@northcentraltower.com

Office: 815-570-3101






On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:

from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:



"There are really two different types of devices approved today. A Standard Power device, 
allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an AFC that determines what frequencies are 
available at its location. It must have geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to 
see how the "client AP" is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably 
conservative, so the licensed PtP users are generally pretty happy with it. And a whole bunch 
of companies have already been working on AFCs.


The Low Power Indoor device, on the other 

Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Caleb Knauer]

Last few we did were all 20+ miles.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 6:33 PM Jaime Solorza  wrote:
>
> Yep...I help maintain two long 6GHz STLs for a Christian Radio station...El 
> Paso to Las Cruces, Las Cruces to tower on mountain above Hatch , NM..
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 3:47 PM Caleb Knauer  wrote:
>>
>> The majority of broadcast TV and radio STL replacements I've been
>> involved with have been 6Ghz due to distances to transmitter towers
>> and fade margins.  Those aren't going away, and they have a pretty big
>> voice with the feds.  AFC feels like it could be quite the boondoggle.
>> But we shall see.
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:39 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> >
>> > But unlike 11/18/23 GHz it can be used for PTP links >10 miles based on 
>> > rain fade characteristics.  And there are many existing links.  Just 
>> > saying your spectrum would be nice for indoor WiFi doesn’t make them go 
>> > away, and the service carried on those existing links is often critical 
>> > traffic.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
>> > Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 10:29 PM
>> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Honestly I think that 6ghz licensed is becoming less practical. As more 
>> > and more fiber is run to the tower the 6ghz band would be much more better 
>> > utilized for last mile PTMP and indoor wifi.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 10:30 PM Tim Reichhart 
>> >  wrote:
>> >
>> > I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it 
>> > WISPA isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 
>> >
>> > -Original Message-
>> > From: "Matt Hoppes" 
>> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
>> > Date: 04/23/20 10:14
>> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>> >
>> > So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies 
>> > dropped that made it happen?
>> >
>> >
>> > On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen  wrote:
>> >
>> > The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
>> > companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of 
>> > them. They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power 
>> > (WiFi6) usage.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>> >
>> > There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out 
>> > of the goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the 
>> > common man/small business.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy  wrote:
>> >
>> > FCC has total authority over these bands.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser  
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
>> > Congress?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser  
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > yes you are right.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Erich Kaiser
>> >
>> > North Central Tower
>> >
>> > er...@northcentraltower.com
>> >
>> > Office: 815-570-3101
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>> >
>> > More like 4.9 to 7.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
>> > Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
>> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean 
>> > heavily, so really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum 
>> > proposed will likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability 
>> > standpoint it will be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general. 
>> >   What about the Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able 
>> > to cover the entire band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Erich Kaiser
>> >
>> > North Central Tower
>> >
>> > er...@northcentraltower.com
>> >
>> > Office: 815-570-3101
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>> >
>> > from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "There are really two different types of devices approved today. A 
>> > Standard Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with 
>> > an AFC that determines what frequencies are available at its location. It 
>> > must have geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see how 
>> > the "client AP" is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably 
>> > conservative, so the licensed PtP users are generally pretty happy with 
>> > it. And a whole bunch of companies have already 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Jeff Broadwick - Lists]

Unless you are going all in without a guard, it’s helpful to have someone who 
get get the back of your neck for you.

My wife is 5’3” and I’m over 6’2”...I have to kneel, which she believes is my 
proper position before her!  :-)

Jeff Broadwick
CTIconnect
312-205-2519 Office
574-220-7826 Cell
jbroadw...@cticonnect.com

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 6:54 PM, Jay Weekley  wrote:
> 
> Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?
> 
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much longer and I 
>> will give myself a buzz.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 
>> 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>> Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
>> Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.
>> 
>>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:
>>> 
>>> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Jay Weekley
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
>>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>>> 
>>> Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
>>> earlier today.  Seriously.
>>> 
>>> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>> > We all knew you were a troll.
>>> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
>>> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
>>> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
>>> > I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, so
>>> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>>> >
>>> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> *Jay Weekley*
>>> *Cyber Broadband
>>> *
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>>> https://www.avg.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>> 
> 
> -- 
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
> 
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com


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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Ken Hohhof]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Flowbee-vintage-home-haircutting-system-hair-cut-in
-box/373030481273?hash=item56da596d79:g:nvsAAOSwcLleodKp


-Original Message-
From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:56 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Super easy.  Just put on a #2 guard and start mowing.  

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 4:53 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun 

Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much longer 
> and I will give myself a buzz.
>
> -Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24,
> 2020 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
> OT Fun Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
> Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:
>>
>> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Jay Weekley
>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>>
>> Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro 
>> pick earlier today.  Seriously.
>>
>> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> > We all knew you were a troll.
>> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 
>> > 23,
>> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
>> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
>> > I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, 
>> > so I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>> >
>> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> --
>> *Jay Weekley*
>> *Cyber Broadband
>> *
>>
>> --
>> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>> https://www.avg.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>

-- 
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Ken Hohhof]

Rent G.I. Jane.  Or Aliens 3.  Didn't they buzz Sigourney Weaver's head for
lice or something in the movie?  I'm sure this will all make your daughters
much happier about the idea.

 

https://www.realstylenetwork.com/celebrities/2012/07/5-actresses-who-cut-off
-their-hair-for-films/


https://www.today.com/news/6-actresses-who-bared-their-heads-roles-826373

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of James Howard
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:42 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

 

I told my kids we were going to shave all their heads since they can't go
anywhere anyway.  The 10 year old didn't seem to care but the girls
definitely got upset about it...

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:24 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

 

My wife is a hairdresser, I'll trade you all some haircuts for some force
300-25s

 

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 5:09 PM James Howard mailto:ja...@litewire.net> > wrote:

If the hair parlors open first will you go get a perm?

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com  ]
On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:06 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

 

Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here. 
Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.

-Original Message- 
From: Caleb Knauer 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun 

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com%3e>
> wrote:
>
> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Weekley
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Actually, I can rock an afro. I was actually looking for my afro pick
> earlier today. Seriously.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:
> > We all knew you were a troll.
> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > I'm contemplating some dire options. My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com  




You received this message because the domain afmug.com 
is on your allow list.

 

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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com  




You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on your allow
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[chuck]

Super easy.  Just put on a #2 guard and start mowing.  

-Original Message- 
From: Jay Weekley 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 4:53 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun 


Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much longer 
and I will give myself a buzz.


-Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24, 
2020 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
OT Fun

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:


When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
earlier today.  Seriously.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> We all knew you were a troll.
> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> [AFMUG] OT Fun
> I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, so
> I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>>
>

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[chuck]

Wouldn’t be the first time... hello 1977...

From: James Howard 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 4:08 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

If the hair parlors open first will you go get a perm?

 

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:06 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

 

Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here. 
Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.

-Original Message- 
From: Caleb Knauer 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun 

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM 
> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Weekley
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Actually, I can rock an afro. I was actually looking for my afro pick
> earlier today. Seriously.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > We all knew you were a troll.
> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > I'm contemplating some dire options. My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Jay Weekley]

Is it hard to give yourself a buzz?  Have you done it before?

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  Too much longer 
and I will give myself a buzz.


-Original Message- From: Caleb Knauer Sent: Friday, April 24, 
2020 3:48 PM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
OT Fun

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:


When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
earlier today.  Seriously.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> We all knew you were a troll.
> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> [AFMUG] OT Fun
> I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, so
> I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>>
>

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*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[James Howard]

I told my kids we were going to shave all their heads since they can't go 
anywhere anyway.  The 10 year old didn't seem to care but the girls definitely 
got upset about it.

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:24 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

My wife is a hairdresser, I'll trade you all some haircuts for some force 
300-25s

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 5:09 PM James Howard 
mailto:ja...@litewire.net>> wrote:
If the hair parlors open first will you go get a perm?

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On 
Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:06 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.
Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.

-Original Message-
From: Caleb Knauer
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  
wrote:
>
> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Weekley
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Actually, I can rock an afro. I was actually looking for my afro pick
> earlier today. Seriously.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > We all knew you were a troll.
> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > I'm contemplating some dire options. My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com





You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Ken Hohhof]

Anybody else remember a comic in the newspaper called “Rick O’Shay”?  Rick 
would launch into a stream of pseudo swear words like “son of a badger pup”.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Bill Prince
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:56 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

 

I don't claim to be pure as the driven snow, but I also don't generally use 
that kind of language. It sure does affect my judgement of a person who talks 
that way. You have to admit, that the F-word is a pretty universal word. It can 
be a noun, verb, adjective, adverb, you name it. None-the-less I think it 
devalues someone like a sales person or anyone for that matter when it's 
overused.

I know that when I, or an associate encounters someone with the affliction, it 
tends to be notable in a not-positive way.

I also recall when I was little (as in a pre-teen boy), my family went to a 
fishing resort for several years. The guy who owned the resort was Gilbert 
Norman (he has got to be long gone by now). Gilbert was (apparently, as I 
learned this after I was "adult") quite a "flowery" talker. Sprinkled little 
F-bombs and other NSFW words when he talked. All except when children were 
present. He was apparently very aware of children and the disapproval he would 
get when speaking that way in front of children. So when kids were around all 
his swear words were changed to "by jeepers creepers" or an abbreviation of 
same. All of us kids just called him "Jeepers". We all loved him.

 
bp

 

On 4/24/2020 7:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:

Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.  

 

I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings. 
 

 

Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

 

TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
 Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?

 

 





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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Trey Scarborough]

you are only comparing SFP transceiver cost. The reason why it is dead 
is transport equipment and switch equipment you pretty much are burning 
a 100G port to do 40g there are some 100G 2x40 transponders out there 
but they are the same cost as a 200G 2x100G transponder so if you go to 
order a 40G wave service it will cost you the same as a 100G maybe more 
if they have to use an OTU4 to 40GLANPHY card. As well most switches 
being deployed by providers are 100G/25G/10G and don't have 40G ports. 
so you hae to burn a 100G port to provide 40G therefor the cost is 
priced accordingly.


Is it dead in the data center space for the most part to because the 
power requirements vs speed is horrible uses almost as much power as a 
100G and only get 40% of the bandwidth. The power for a 25G is 
comparable to 10G. Starting to see 25G IX connection options as well.


Don't worry you are going to start seeing a bunch more 25G options 
coming out because the demand is growing. There are already companies 
starting to sell 25G channelized DWDM optics. The price at the moment is 
high because they are new and the demand is low, but will greatly reduce 
the cost the more that the utilization grows.



On 4/24/2020 10:07 AM, Steven Kenney wrote:
That is up for debate but we'll see in a few years.  I'd rather jump 
to 40 than 25.  You almost defeated your own point stating you have a 
lot of 40G laying around.  Price has come down on them and 
transceivers are not as expensive either. Personally I'd rather jump 
to 100 :)


40G transceivers I can get for most models for $55.  (short range)  
Same price for 25G!  Why bother with 25?

Short range 100G are under $200 each.


--
Steven Kenney
Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)


*From: *"Kurt Fankhauser" 
*To: *"af" 
*Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 10:03:36 AM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

Dennis,how many of these do you have on order?

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett > wrote:


25G will be far more common than 40G.
40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so
because I have a lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to
things, but that's not going to happen.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions 


Midwest Internet Exchange 


The Brothers WISP 





*From: *"Steven Kenney" mailto:st...@wavedirect.org>>
*To: *"af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM
*Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out.  25
is kinda a black sheep in the industry.  Good luck matching
equipment with upstreams.  I know they can get the cards but most
are moving to 40 or 100.

-- 
Steven Kenney

Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)


*From: *"af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*To: *"af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Cc: *"Dennis Burgess" mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>>
*Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM
*Subject: *[AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces

2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces

Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

List price: $600

*LTI-Full_175px*

*Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium
ePMP Certified *

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”

*Link Technologies, Inc*-- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services

*Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net


Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com


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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Jaime Solorza]

Yep...I help maintain two long 6GHz STLs for a Christian Radio station...El
Paso to Las Cruces, Las Cruces to tower on mountain above Hatch , NM..

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 3:47 PM Caleb Knauer  wrote:

> The majority of broadcast TV and radio STL replacements I've been
> involved with have been 6Ghz due to distances to transmitter towers
> and fade margins.  Those aren't going away, and they have a pretty big
> voice with the feds.  AFC feels like it could be quite the boondoggle.
> But we shall see.
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:39 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> >
> > But unlike 11/18/23 GHz it can be used for PTP links >10 miles based on
> rain fade characteristics.  And there are many existing links.  Just saying
> your spectrum would be nice for indoor WiFi doesn’t make them go away, and
> the service carried on those existing links is often critical traffic.
> >
> >
> >
> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
> > Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 10:29 PM
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
> >
> >
> >
> > Honestly I think that 6ghz licensed is becoming less practical. As more
> and more fiber is run to the tower the 6ghz band would be much more better
> utilized for last mile PTMP and indoor wifi.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 10:30 PM Tim Reichhart <
> timreichh...@hometowncable.net> wrote:
> >
> > I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in
> it WISPA isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: "Matt Hoppes" 
> > To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> > Date: 04/23/20 10:14
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
> >
> > So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies
> dropped that made it happen?
> >
> >
> > On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen 
> wrote:
> >
> > The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name
> companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of
> them. They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power
> (WiFi6) usage.
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
> >
> > There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out
> of the goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the
> common man/small business.
> >
> >
> >
> > So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy  wrote:
> >
> > FCC has total authority over these bands.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser <
> lists.wavel...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act
> of Congress?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
> >
> > yes you are right.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Erich Kaiser
> >
> > North Central Tower
> >
> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> >
> > Office: 815-570-3101
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> >
> > More like 4.9 to 7.
> >
> >
> >
> > From: AF  On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
> > Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
> >
> >
> >
> > Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean
> heavily, so really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum
> proposed will likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability
> standpoint it will be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general.
>  What about the Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able
> to cover the entire band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Erich Kaiser
> >
> > North Central Tower
> >
> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> >
> > Office: 815-570-3101
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
> >
> > from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:
> >
> >
> >
> > "There are really two different types of devices approved today. A
> Standard Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an
> AFC that determines what frequencies are available at its location. It must
> have geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see how the
> "client AP" is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably conservative,
> so the licensed PtP users are generally pretty happy with it. And a whole
> bunch of companies have already been working on AFCs.
> >
> >
> > The Low Power Indoor device, on the other hand, does not require AFC. It
> is limited to indoor use only (must have mains power, may not be
> weatherproof, must be labeled) and is allowed +30 dBm EIRP (clients +24
> dBm). Since those can use any 

Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Steve Jones]

My wife is a hairdresser, I'll trade you all some haircuts for some force
300-25s

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 5:09 PM James Howard  wrote:

> If the hair parlors open first will you go get a perm?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 5:06 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
>
>
> Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.
> Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Caleb Knauer
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
> Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:
> >
> > When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Jay Weekley
> > Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> > To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> > Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
> >
> > Actually, I can rock an afro. I was actually looking for my afro pick
> > earlier today. Seriously.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > > We all knew you were a troll.
> > > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > > I'm contemplating some dire options. My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> > >
> > > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> > --
> > *Jay Weekley*
> > *Cyber Broadband
> > *
> >
> > --
> > This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> > https://www.avg.com
> >
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >
> > --
> > AF mailing list
> > AF@af.afmug.com
> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
> --
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
>
> *Total Control Panel*
>
> Login 
>
> To: ja...@litewire.net
> 
>
> From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com
>
> *You received this message because the domain afmug.com 
> is on your allow list.*
>
>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[James Howard]

If the hair parlors open first will you go get a perm?

From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 5:06 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.
Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.

-Original Message-
From: Caleb Knauer
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  
wrote:
>
> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Weekley
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Actually, I can rock an afro. I was actually looking for my afro pick
> earlier today. Seriously.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > We all knew you were a troll.
> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > I'm contemplating some dire options. My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

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To: 
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From: af-boun...@af.afmug.com





You received this message because the domain afmug.com is on your allow list.



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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[chuck]

Barbershops and hair parlors are all closed out here.  
Too much longer and I will give myself a buzz.


-Original Message- 
From: Caleb Knauer 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 3:48 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun 


Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:


When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?

-Original Message-
From: Jay Weekley
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
earlier today.  Seriously.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> We all knew you were a troll.
> -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> [AFMUG] OT Fun
> I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, so
> I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>>
>>
>

--
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] Tacos de Rez y papa asada. With all the trimmings

[Jaime Solorza]

Can't ship it...has to be fresh

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 3:37 PM Steve Jones  wrote:

> imma need to have this
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 4:33 PM Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Chile California y jalapeno, cebolla, cilantro y ravanos
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun

[Caleb Knauer]

Noticing more and more buzz cuts in our video meetings lately.
Luckily summer time makes it more feasible.

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:08 PM  wrote:
>
> When I get a crew cut am I appropriating skin head culture?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Jay Weekley
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:55 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT Fun
>
> Actually, I can rock an afro.  I was actually looking for my afro pick
> earlier today.  Seriously.
>
> ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> > We all knew you were a troll.
> > -Original Message- From: Jay Weekley Sent: Thursday, April 23,
> > 2020 11:05 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re:
> > [AFMUG] OT Fun
> > I'm contemplating some dire options.  My hair grows out, not downs, so
> > I'll look more like the guy that lives under a bridge than a hippy.
> >
> > ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >
>
> --
> *Jay Weekley*
> *Cyber Broadband
> *
>
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> https://www.avg.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Caleb Knauer]

The majority of broadcast TV and radio STL replacements I've been
involved with have been 6Ghz due to distances to transmitter towers
and fade margins.  Those aren't going away, and they have a pretty big
voice with the feds.  AFC feels like it could be quite the boondoggle.
But we shall see.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:39 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> But unlike 11/18/23 GHz it can be used for PTP links >10 miles based on rain 
> fade characteristics.  And there are many existing links.  Just saying your 
> spectrum would be nice for indoor WiFi doesn’t make them go away, and the 
> service carried on those existing links is often critical traffic.
>
>
>
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 10:29 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>
>
>
> Honestly I think that 6ghz licensed is becoming less practical. As more and 
> more fiber is run to the tower the 6ghz band would be much more better 
> utilized for last mile PTMP and indoor wifi.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 10:30 PM Tim Reichhart 
>  wrote:
>
> I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it 
> WISPA isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 
>
> -Original Message-
> From: "Matt Hoppes" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Date: 04/23/20 10:14
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>
> So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies 
> dropped that made it happen?
>
>
> On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen  wrote:
>
> The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
> companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of 
> them. They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power (WiFi6) 
> usage.
>
>
>
> I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out of 
> the goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the common 
> man/small business.
>
>
>
> So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy  wrote:
>
> FCC has total authority over these bands.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser  
> wrote:
>
> How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
> Congress?
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser  
> wrote:
>
> yes you are right.
>
>
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
>
> North Central Tower
>
> er...@northcentraltower.com
>
> Office: 815-570-3101
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> More like 4.9 to 7.
>
>
>
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>
>
>
> Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean heavily, 
> so really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum proposed 
> will likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability standpoint 
> it will be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general.   What about 
> the Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able to cover the 
> entire band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
>
> North Central Tower
>
> er...@northcentraltower.com
>
> Office: 815-570-3101
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
> from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:
>
>
>
> "There are really two different types of devices approved today. A Standard 
> Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an AFC that 
> determines what frequencies are available at its location. It must have 
> geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see how the "client 
> AP" is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably conservative, so the 
> licensed PtP users are generally pretty happy with it. And a whole bunch of 
> companies have already been working on AFCs.
>
>
> The Low Power Indoor device, on the other hand, does not require AFC. It is 
> limited to indoor use only (must have mains power, may not be weatherproof, 
> must be labeled) and is allowed +30 dBm EIRP (clients +24 dBm). Since those 
> can use any frequency, the incumbents are a wee bit concerned. But between 
> building entry losses (pretty high at 6 GHz) and the directionality of the FS 
> dishes, harmful interference is unlikely. That is likely to be a volume 
> market for Wi-Fi 6e. The higher-end business stuff, and ours, will be 
> standard power.
>
> The FNPRM asks about Very Low Power outdoor operation without AFC. Like cell 
> phones and small hotspots. It also asks about higher power for AFC-controlled 
> devices."
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 4:07 PM Jaime Solorza  
> wrote:
>
> Yep...lots of 

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Sean Heskett]

Hi Gilbert,

Yeah our issues were on the 1036.  The 1072s have been pretty stable.

We also had an NTP issue but I can’t remember all the details of that one.

Since nothing is showing in your logs id look at environmental issues, but
it seems heat Probably isn’t your issue.

-Sean


On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 3:28 PM Gilbert Gutierrez <
mailing-li...@phxinternet.com> wrote:

> Sean,
> In my investigation on possibly following your suggestions, I found that
> the 1072 appears to be fixed at 1000. It was an idea .
>
>
> Gilbert
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:00 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
>> Hi Steve,
>>
>> We were having random reboots on some CCR1036s and we finally solved the
>> issue by downclocking the CPU to 1000 (they run at 1200 out of the box).
>>  down clocking them didn't really impact performance other than they
>> stopped randomly rebooting lol.
>>
>> -sean
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:44 PM Steven Kenney 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Were you ever able to pin down certain times/situations when you'd get
>>> the random reboot?  I've experienced this too,  nothing in the console,
>>> logs,  nothing.  Supout had nothing as well.  Its completely random however
>>> it does tend to happen when there is higher amount of traffic.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Steven Kenney
>>> Network Operations Manager
>>> WaveDirect Telecommunications
>>> http://www.wavedirect.net
>>> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>>>
>>> --
>>> *From: *"Gilbert Gutierrez" 
>>> *To: *"af" 
>>> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 12:03:37 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>> Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
>>> units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
>>> else to replace them.
>>> Gilbert
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:
>>>
 My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a
 1072


 On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:

 Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under
 the hood..

 This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some
 limitations here.

 On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?
>
>
>
> Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
> directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
> architected as a router, or a switch?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess
> via AF
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
>
>
> Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
> MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess
> via AF
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>
> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>
> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>
>
>
> List price: $600
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
> MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


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>>>
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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Caleb Knauer]

ULS is gonna have to get way more gerbils, it barely runs on a good day.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 8:25 AM Tim Hardy  wrote:
>
> Everyone on the unlicensed side is now claiming that this was their baby, but 
> if you really want to do know where the influence came from - follow the 
> lobbying and follow the money.  Facebook, Amazon, Microsoft, Apple & Google 
> spent over $16 million in 1st Qtr of 2020 - this thing didn't spring up over 
> night and the $$$ spent on this over the last five years is astronomical.  It 
> took a ton of lobbying at both the FCC and Congress just to get to the Rule 
> Making process that started on Oct 1, 2018, and the RM garnered over 700 
> comments, reply comments and ex-parte filings.
>
> The success / failure of this relies heavily on the AFC to adequately protect 
> both existing and new incumbents.  Standard power devices must check-in with 
> the AFC at least once a day.  The AFC will rely solely on ULS (per FCC 
> requirement) and it is widely recognized that ULS has major problems and 
> deficiencies - in fact, the WTB will be issuing a Public Notice reminding 
> licensees of their duty to ensure that their licenses are complete and 
> accurate.  The AFC systems must go through a testing and certification 
> process and this will further delay things.  Its going to take some time for 
> all of this before devices that require the AFC to be used.
>
> FYI - in a letter dated January 2018, the RLAN group that includes Apple, 
> Broadcom, Cisco and HP projects over 958,062,017 unlicensed devices at 6 GHz.
>
> On Apr 23, 2020, at 10:34 PM, Tim Withrow via AF  wrote:
>
> After posting this I seen an article that said they (WFA) was the crusader. 
> Wispa seems to be a member of that group as well.
> https://www.wi-fi.org/discover-wi-fi/wi-fi-certified-6
>
>
>
> 
> On Thursday, April 23, 2020 Tim Reichhart  wrote:
>
> I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it 
> WISPA isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.
>
>
>
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: "Matt Hoppes" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Date: 04/23/20 10:14
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>
> So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies 
> dropped that made it happen?
>
> On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen  wrote:
>
> The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
> companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of 
> them. They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power (WiFi6) 
> usage.
>
> I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout  wrote:
>
> There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out of 
> the goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the common 
> man/small business.
>
> So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy  wrote:
>
> FCC has total authority over these bands.
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser  
> wrote:
>
> How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
> Congress?
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser  
> wrote:
>
> yes you are right.
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 815-570-3101
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> More like 4.9 to 7.
>
>
>
> From: AF  On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>
>
>
> Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean heavily, 
> so really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum proposed 
> will likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability standpoint 
> it will be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general.   What about 
> the Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able to cover the 
> entire band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
>
> North Central Tower
>
> er...@northcentraltower.com
>
> Office: 815-570-3101
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:
>
> from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:
>
>
>
> "There are really two different types of devices approved today. A Standard 
> Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an AFC that 
> determines what frequencies are available at its location. It must have 
> geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see how the "client 
> AP" is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably conservative, so the 
> licensed PtP users are generally pretty happy with it. And a whole bunch of 
> companies have already been working on AFCs.
>
>
> The Low Power Indoor device, on the other hand, does not require AFC. It is 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Tacos de Rez y papa asada. With all the trimmings

[Steve Jones]

imma need to have this

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 4:33 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Chile California y jalapeno, cebolla, cilantro y ravanos
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Caleb Knauer]

My day to day language is admittedly pretty salty, especially when
tired or after a few beverages.  Must be my inner grumpy redneck.  But
you have to be able to flip that switch when you're in a professional
setting unless you've bonded with someone of a like mind.  The new
sales reps are surprised when they get on a client call for the first
time or two with me and I kick into what I call "customer voice".  The
circle back afterwards is always a good time.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:54 AM  wrote:
>
> Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
> was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
> toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
> manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing 
> I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
> just asking for a sanity check.
>
> I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
> years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F 
> word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il 
> complaining about their director of sales being too salty for high end 
> businesses meetings.
>
> Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
> good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
> told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am 
> too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
> millennials...
>
> TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business 
> world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Gilbert Gutierrez]

Sean,
In my investigation on possibly following your suggestions, I found that
the 1072 appears to be fixed at 1000. It was an idea .

Gilbert

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:00 PM Sean Heskett  wrote:

> Hi Steve,
>
> We were having random reboots on some CCR1036s and we finally solved the
> issue by downclocking the CPU to 1000 (they run at 1200 out of the box).
>  down clocking them didn't really impact performance other than they
> stopped randomly rebooting lol.
>
> -sean
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:44 PM Steven Kenney 
> wrote:
>
>> Were you ever able to pin down certain times/situations when you'd get
>> the random reboot?  I've experienced this too,  nothing in the console,
>> logs,  nothing.  Supout had nothing as well.  Its completely random however
>> it does tend to happen when there is higher amount of traffic.
>>
>> --
>> Steven Kenney
>> Network Operations Manager
>> WaveDirect Telecommunications
>> http://www.wavedirect.net
>> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>>
>> --
>> *From: *"Gilbert Gutierrez" 
>> *To: *"af" 
>> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 12:03:37 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>
>> Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
>> units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
>> else to replace them.
>> Gilbert
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:
>>
>>> My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a
>>> 1072
>>>
>>>
>>> On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>>
>>> Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under
>>> the hood..
>>>
>>> This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some
>>> limitations here.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>>
 So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?



 Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
 directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
 architected as a router, or a switch?



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
 AF
 *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
 *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
 *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out



 Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.





 *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*


 *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
 MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *

 Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”

 *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services

 *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net

 Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com



 *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
 AF
 *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
 *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
 *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
 *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out







 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces

 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces

 Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU



 List price: $600





 *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*


 *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE,
 MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *

 Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”

 *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services

 *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net

 Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com


 --
 AF mailing list
 AF@af.afmug.com
 http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

>>>
>>>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Bill Prince]

  
  
I don't claim to be pure as the driven snow, but I also don't
  generally use that kind of language. It sure does affect my
  judgement of a person who talks that way. You have to admit, that
  the F-word is a pretty universal word. It can be a noun, verb,
  adjective, adverb, you name it. None-the-less I think it devalues
  someone like a sales person or anyone for that matter when it's
  overused.
I know that when I, or an associate encounters someone with the
  affliction, it tends to be notable in a not-positive way.

I also recall when I was little (as in a pre-teen boy), my family
  went to a fishing resort for several years. The guy who owned the
  resort was Gilbert Norman (he has got to be long gone by now).
  Gilbert was (apparently, as I learned this after I was "adult")
  quite a "flowery" talker. Sprinkled little F-bombs and other NSFW
  words when he talked. All except when children were present. He
  was apparently very aware of children and the disapproval he would
  get when speaking that way in front of children. So when kids were
  around all his swear words were changed to "by jeepers creepers"
  or an abbreviation of same. All of us kids just called him
  "Jeepers". We all loved him.


bp



On 4/24/2020 7:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com
  wrote:


  
  

  Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and
during the visit he was dropping the F bomb left and right. 
I would have thought he would have toned it down as my wife
was in the meeting.  After he left I told a manufacturer’s
rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next
thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to
cause him problems as work, just asking for a sanity check. 
  
   
  I have been in probably thousands of board and business
meetings over the years, and don’t recall anyone ever being
gratuitous in the use of the F word.  I do recall one of the
big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining
about their director of sales being too salty for high end
businesses meetings.  
   
  Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger
which had done a pretty good job in his Tesla review except
for the F bomb every other sentence.  I told him it was
about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am
too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those
thin skinned millennials...
   
  TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common
in the business world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
   
   

  
  
  

  


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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Steve Jones]

youre in alabama? if I start drinking now, by the time you get here to pick
me up and we get back to alabama i should have the right proper BAC for
stilt hanging fiber. we will build out that network right quick

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 2:37 PM Jay Weekley 
wrote:

> I think you're it.  Are you for hire?
>
> Steve Jones wrote:
> > does no one know how to walk on stilts these days?
> >
> > On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 2:25 PM Jay Weekley 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> I wouldn't look forward to having to hook a towable lift each time I had
> >> to go to a different pole either.
> >>
> >> Mark Radabaugh wrote:
> >>> Keep in mind the majority of bucket trucks will not let you use the
> >> bucket unless the truck is stopped with the outriggers extended.   Using
> >> this for stringing is painful -  park, outriggers, in the bucket, do
> your
> >> work, down, out, outriggers, move, and repeat.Efficiency is not
> good.
> >>   You are probably better with a manlift you can drive yourself if you
> don’t
> >> have the correct bucket truck.
> >>> Mark
> >>>
>  On Apr 24, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Jason McKemie <
> >> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>  I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm
> >> hanging adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of
> >> the cable from a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more
> stable. A
> >> bucket truck would be best, but I can't find those for rent.
>  On Friday, April 24, 2020, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>>
> >> wrote:
>  I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.
>  Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.
> 
>  From: Steve Jones <>
>  Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
>  To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
>  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
> 
>  " which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
>  never stop being concerned
> 
>  The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id
> like
> >> to try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of
> the
> >> cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it
> >> instead of a trailer pull.
>  Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house
> to
> >> pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if
> i
> >> could pull it off from a pole ladder
>  On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie <
> >> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com <>> wrote:
>  I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum
> >> height without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone
> >> used a standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They
> aren't
> >> insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though
> I'll
> >> be well below the neutral.
>  --
>  AF mailing list
>  AF@af.afmug.com <>
>  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com <
> >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com>
>  --
>  AF mailing list
>  AF@af.afmug.com 
>  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com <
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>  --
>  AF mailing list
>  AF@af.afmug.com
>  http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >> --
> >> *Jay Weekley*
> >> *Cyber Broadband
> >> *
> >>
> >> --
> >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> >> https://www.avg.com
> >>
> >>
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> >>
> >
> >
>
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> *
>
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Gilbert Gutierrez]

I have not found out the source. I may try Sean's clocking idea.

Gilbert

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 11:44 AM Steven Kenney  wrote:

> Were you ever able to pin down certain times/situations when you'd get the
> random reboot?  I've experienced this too,  nothing in the console,  logs,
> nothing.  Supout had nothing as well.  Its completely random however it
> does tend to happen when there is higher amount of traffic.
>
> --
> Steven Kenney
> Network Operations Manager
> WaveDirect Telecommunications
> http://www.wavedirect.net
> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>
> --
> *From: *"Gilbert Gutierrez" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 12:03:37 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
> Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
> units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
> else to replace them.
> Gilbert
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:
>
>> My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a 1072
>>
>>
>> On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under the
>> hood..
>>
>> This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some
>> limitations here.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>>> So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
>>> directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
>>> architected as a router, or a switch?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>>>
>>> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>>>
>>> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> List price: $600
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Jay Weekley]

I think you're it.  Are you for hire?

Steve Jones wrote:

does no one know how to walk on stilts these days?

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 2:25 PM Jay Weekley 
wrote:


I wouldn't look forward to having to hook a towable lift each time I had
to go to a different pole either.

Mark Radabaugh wrote:

Keep in mind the majority of bucket trucks will not let you use the

bucket unless the truck is stopped with the outriggers extended.   Using
this for stringing is painful -  park, outriggers, in the bucket, do your
work, down, out, outriggers, move, and repeat.Efficiency is not good.
  You are probably better with a manlift you can drive yourself if you don’t
have the correct bucket truck.

Mark


On Apr 24, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Jason McKemie <

j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:

I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm

hanging adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of
the cable from a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more stable. A
bucket truck would be best, but I can't find those for rent.

On Friday, April 24, 2020, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>>

wrote:

I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.
Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.

From: Steve Jones <>
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

" which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
never stop being concerned

The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like

to try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the
cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it
instead of a trailer pull.

Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to

pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i
could pull it off from a pole ladder

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie <

j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com <>> wrote:

I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum

height without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone
used a standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
be well below the neutral.

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Steve Jones]

does no one know how to walk on stilts these days?

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 2:25 PM Jay Weekley 
wrote:

> I wouldn't look forward to having to hook a towable lift each time I had
> to go to a different pole either.
>
> Mark Radabaugh wrote:
> > Keep in mind the majority of bucket trucks will not let you use the
> bucket unless the truck is stopped with the outriggers extended.   Using
> this for stringing is painful -  park, outriggers, in the bucket, do your
> work, down, out, outriggers, move, and repeat.Efficiency is not good.
>  You are probably better with a manlift you can drive yourself if you don’t
> have the correct bucket truck.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >> On Apr 24, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm
> hanging adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of
> the cable from a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more stable. A
> bucket truck would be best, but I can't find those for rent.
> >>
> >> On Friday, April 24, 2020, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>>
> wrote:
> >> I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.
> >> Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.
> >>
> >> From: Steve Jones <>
> >> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
> >> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
> >> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
> >>
> >> " which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
> >> never stop being concerned
> >>
> >> The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like
> to try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the
> cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it
> instead of a trailer pull.
> >>
> >> Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to
> pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i
> could pull it off from a pole ladder
> >>
> >> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com <>> wrote:
> >> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum
> height without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone
> used a standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
> insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
> be well below the neutral.
> >> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Jay Weekley]

I wouldn't look forward to having to hook a towable lift each time I had 
to go to a different pole either.


Mark Radabaugh wrote:

Keep in mind the majority of bucket trucks will not let you use the bucket 
unless the truck is stopped with the outriggers extended.   Using this for 
stringing is painful -  park, outriggers, in the bucket, do your work, down, 
out, outriggers, move, and repeat.Efficiency is not good.   You are 
probably better with a manlift you can drive yourself if you don’t have the 
correct bucket truck.

Mark


On Apr 24, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Jason McKemie  
wrote:

I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm hanging 
adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of the cable from 
a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more stable. A bucket truck would 
be best, but I can't find those for rent.

On Friday, April 24, 2020, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.
Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.
  
From: Steve Jones <>

Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
  
" which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"

never stop being concerned
  
The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it instead of a trailer pull.
  
Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i could pull it off from a pole ladder
  
On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie > wrote:

I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height without 
being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a standard 
articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't insulated (other than the 
tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral.
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Mark Radabaugh]

Keep in mind the majority of bucket trucks will not let you use the bucket 
unless the truck is stopped with the outriggers extended.   Using this for 
stringing is painful -  park, outriggers, in the bucket, do your work, down, 
out, outriggers, move, and repeat.Efficiency is not good.   You are 
probably better with a manlift you can drive yourself if you don’t have the 
correct bucket truck.

Mark

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 2:20 PM, Jason McKemie  
> wrote:
> 
> I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm hanging 
> adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of the cable 
> from a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more stable. A bucket truck 
> would be best, but I can't find those for rent.
> 
> On Friday, April 24, 2020, mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> wrote:
> I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches. 
> Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done. 
>  
> From: Steve Jones <>
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group <>
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
>  
> " which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
> never stop being concerned
>  
> The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to 
> try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the cargo 
> area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it instead of a 
> trailer pull.
>  
> Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to pick 
> up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i could 
> pull it off from a pole ladder
>  
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie 
> > wrote:
> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height 
> without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a 
> standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't insulated 
> (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well 
> below the neutral.
> -- 
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Sean Heskett]

Hi Steve,

We were having random reboots on some CCR1036s and we finally solved the
issue by downclocking the CPU to 1000 (they run at 1200 out of the box).
 down clocking them didn't really impact performance other than they
stopped randomly rebooting lol.

-sean



On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:44 PM Steven Kenney  wrote:

> Were you ever able to pin down certain times/situations when you'd get the
> random reboot?  I've experienced this too,  nothing in the console,  logs,
> nothing.  Supout had nothing as well.  Its completely random however it
> does tend to happen when there is higher amount of traffic.
>
> --
> Steven Kenney
> Network Operations Manager
> WaveDirect Telecommunications
> http://www.wavedirect.net
> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>
> --
> *From: *"Gilbert Gutierrez" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 12:03:37 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
> Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
> units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
> else to replace them.
> Gilbert
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:
>
>> My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a 1072
>>
>>
>> On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under the
>> hood..
>>
>> This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some
>> limitations here.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>>> So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
>>> directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
>>> architected as a router, or a switch?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>>>
>>> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>>>
>>> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> List price: $600
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Steven Kenney]

Were you ever able to pin down certain times/situations when you'd get the 
random reboot? I've experienced this too, nothing in the console, logs, 
nothing. Supout had nothing as well. Its completely random however it does tend 
to happen when there is higher amount of traffic. 

-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "Gilbert Gutierrez"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:03:37 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 

Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both units 
and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something else to 
replace them. 
Gilbert 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave < [ mailto:dmilho...@wletc.com | 
dmilho...@wletc.com ] > wrote: 



My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a 1072 


On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote: 

BQ_BEGIN

Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under the 
hood.. 

This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some limitations 
here. 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof < [ mailto:af...@kwisp.com | 
af...@kwisp.com ] > wrote: 

BQ_BEGIN



So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM? 



Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports directly 
connected to the CPU, or via switch chips? And is this architected as a router, 
or a switch? 




From: AF < [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] > On 
Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via AF 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | 
af@af.afmug.com ] > 
Cc: Dennis Burgess < [ mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net | dmburg...@linktechs.net 
] > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 




Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces. 








Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office : 314-735-0270 Website: [ http://www.linktechs.net/ | 
http://www.linktechs.net ] 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with [ http://www.towercoverage.com/ | 
www.towercoverage.com ] 





From: AF < [ mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com | af-boun...@af.afmug.com ] > On 
Behalf Of Dennis Burgess via AF 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | 
af@af.afmug.com ] > 
Cc: Dennis Burgess < [ mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net | dmburg...@linktechs.net 
] > 
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 










10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces 

2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces 

Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU 



List price: $600 







Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office : 314-735-0270 Website: [ http://www.linktechs.net/ | 
http://www.linktechs.net ] 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with [ http://www.towercoverage.com/ | 
www.towercoverage.com ] 


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BQ_END

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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Jason McKemie]

I'm framing from a ladder, and could use a ladder to string, but I'm
hanging adss and am not sure I'm going to be able to get the grip off of
the cable from a ladder. Plus the man lift just seems a lot more stable. A
bucket truck would be best, but I can't find those for rent.

On Friday, April 24, 2020,  wrote:

> I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.
> Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.
>
> *From:* Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
>
> " which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
> never stop being concerned
>
> The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to
> try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the
> cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it
> instead of a trailer pull.
>
> Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to
> pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i
> could pull it off from a pole ladder
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie <
> j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:
>
>> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height
>> without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a
>> standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
>> insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
>> be well below the neutral.
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Mark Radabaugh]

I don’t see any reason it wouldn’t work.   For what it’s worth the ‘correct’ 
vehicle for this is a ’Telstra’ or ‘Placer’ style of boom truck.   These are 
the trucks that have a boom that can accept the side loading of pulling cable 
while being driven down the road with a person in the bucket.   Obviously they 
do not use outriggers for stability in this type of truck.   There is an 
intercom in the bucket that is always on to talk to the driver.   These truck 
are NOT insulated booms.

As others have mentioned you always need to be aware of power, but I would not 
be concerned about doing it with a uninsulated lift as ‘uninsulated’ is the 
standard method anyway.

Only other issue I could think of would be your state requirements for 
machinery on roads and if they would accept a manlift.   Don’t really see why 
they wouldn’t as long as you are following rules on traffic control and 
lighting.

Mark

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 1:42 PM, Jason McKemie  
> wrote:
> 
> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height 
> without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a 
> standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't insulated 
> (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well 
> below the neutral.
> -- 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Craig House]

I second the bucket truck. I found one for five years and it’s amazing that 
uses that you can find for in the places that you can get one of them into that 
you couldn’t get into with a tow behind

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 13:12, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
> 
> 
> I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches. 
> Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done. 
>  
> From: Steve Jones
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work
>  
> " which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
> never stop being concerned
>  
> The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to 
> try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the cargo 
> area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it instead of a 
> trailer pull.
>  
> Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to pick 
> up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i could 
> pull it off from a pole ladder
>  
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie 
>  wrote:
>> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height 
>> without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a 
>> standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't 
>> insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll 
>> be well below the neutral.
>> -- 
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[chuck]

I used to build aerial with hooks, brace and bit and wrenches.  
Pulled the lasher by hand etc.  Can be done.  

From: Steve Jones 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 12:09 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

" which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral" 
never stop being concerned

The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to try 
one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the cargo area. 
I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it instead of a trailer 
pull.

Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to pick up 
anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i could pull it 
off from a pole ladder

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie 
 wrote:

  I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height 
without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a 
standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't insulated 
(other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below 
the neutral.
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[chuck]

I use a bucket truck.  

From: Jason McKemie 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:42 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height 
without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a 
standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't insulated 
(other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below 
the neutral.



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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Steve Jones]

" which concerns me a bit, even though I'll be well below the neutral"
never stop being concerned

The cable company has a mix of boom trucks and van mount booms. Id like to
try one of the van ones, but i think the base takes up the bulk of the
cargo area. I just like the idea of driving it right where you need it
instead of a trailer pull.

Id looked at doing an aerial fiber patch from a location to my house to
pick up anything i could along the way. I honestly planned on seeing if i
could pull it off from a pole ladder

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 12:43 PM Jason McKemie <
j.mcke...@veloxinetbroadband.com> wrote:

> I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height
> without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a
> standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
> insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
> be well below the neutral.
> --
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Jay Weekley]

We've used the towable versions.

Jason McKemie wrote:

I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height
without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a
standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
be well below the neutral.





--
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

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This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
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[AFMUG] OT: Manlift for aerial work

[Jason McKemie]

I need a manlift for stringing some fiber.  I'm going the maximum height
without being in the power zone (40" below neutral).  Has anyone used a
standard articulating manlift for something like this?  They aren't
insulated (other than the tires) which concerns me a bit, even though I'll
be well below the neutral.
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AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Dennis Burgess via AF]

Quite a few..


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

Dennis,how many of these do you have on order?

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett 
mailto:af...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
25G will be far more common than 40G.

40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I have a 
lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's not going to 
happen.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing 
Solutions
[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2ffbicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-6504653533f92e8045c8b2b0822057e390e4259f[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2fgoogleicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-ca428430ec359da8e5ae25441d2d7c11250030e4[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2flinkedinicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-a4f96b9d54587818aa10b75d4d5762aa99addc69[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2ftwittericon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-f3ed0f4792cbaa6906280d6c147abeeef5f06e52
Midwest Internet Exchange
[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2ffbicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-6504653533f92e8045c8b2b0822057e390e4259f[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2flinkedinicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-a4f96b9d54587818aa10b75d4d5762aa99addc69[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2ftwittericon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-f3ed0f4792cbaa6906280d6c147abeeef5f06e52
The Brothers WISP
[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2ffbicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-6504653533f92e8045c8b2b0822057e390e4259f[https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.ics%2dil.com%2fimages%2fyoutubeicon.png%5d=F2D80EC7-A40C-CF05-AF6E-EFB06EB1D299=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-819a4fdc1ff9e2844a5c4946d835cc6a556e16d3




From: "Steven Kenney" mailto:st...@wavedirect.org>>
To: "af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out.  25 is kinda a 
black sheep in the industry.  Good luck matching equipment with upstreams.  I 
know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100.

--
Steven Kenney
Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)


From: "af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
To: "af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Cc: "Dennis Burgess" mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>>
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out


[cid:image002.png@01D61A35.08B13B70]

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

List price: $600


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, 

Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[Colin Stanners]

In the past we used non-armoured fiber for house installs, and there are
cases where we can't put the fiber CPE in a utilitity room/closet, so it
would be on a desk somewhere with the fiber line near the floor and more
easily damaged.

We had a customer who had many uncontrolled cats... Visited that house 3
times I believe to replace chewed fiber before we started using armoured
fiber (due to the customer's other difficulties it was empathically
difficult to charge for those fixes).

Luckily  don't like chewing on metal...

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020, 10:19 AM Nate Burke  wrote:

> Just got a call from a customer
>
> "Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and
> then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into the
> router"
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
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AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Seth Mattinen]

On 4/24/20 9:40 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
That sounds like the greylisting fans who claim email senders are 
required to retry again within 15 minutes from the same IP address.


Sure.  And in the real world …




Greylsiting is highly effective against a specific set of spew sources: 
compromised machines connecting directly to SMTP. But now most ISPs 
block port 25 by default (since port 587 is now widely supported) so you 
don't see a high volume of fire and forget compromised users anymore.


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AF@af.afmug.com
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Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Mike Hammett]

If they tell me specifically that they require it, who am I to argue? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Ken Hohhof"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:40:06 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 



That sounds like the greylisting fans who claim email senders are required to 
retry again within 15 minutes from the same IP address. 
Sure. And in the real world … 

Remember the story about the ship captain ordering the lighthouse to change 
course? 




From: AF  On Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:27 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


"I'm not sure why that is still being preached." 



Multiple CDNs specifically require it and state as much in their peering or 
cache server documentation. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -


From: "Darin Steffl" < darin.ste...@mnwifi.com > 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:22:17 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 

To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of 
additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much 
larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I also 
trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS infrastructure than 
just myself. 



I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it 
on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and 
Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues years 
ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major providers 
and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive all local 
content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, 
etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that content to come from elsewhere 
and I'm not sure why that is still being preached. 



On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 




I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs and 
IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8. I’ve also had 
PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 in order 
to pass the audit. And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their own DNS 
server, bypassing the router or the OS. 

All of which they’re free to do. 

There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 or 
something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster to 
use cloud DNS. You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim. It’s 
like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
servers, which baffles me. And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too. 



As Mike said - it's another one of his things. I'm surprised you haven't seen 
that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG. 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 




That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor? 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
wrote: 




Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying to 
resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate  . However, we 
are pretty small. We have a few Techs, a scheduling/technician support person 
and me. That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making 
sure backups are working, etc is an hour not spent building the next tower. For 
me, it is a poor trade off, I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone 
else do that. I also know myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job 
of patching VMs, backing them up, and overall operational run of the servers as 
someone who does that for a living. I expect that will change some day, but for 
now, unfortunately that 

Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Mike Hammett]

I have seen this on Google, Netflix, and I believe Akamai. 




Our Akamai node is getting upgraded to a 40G node. :-) 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Cassidy B. Larson"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:35:08 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 

Which CDNs require it? 


I know Google, Apple and Netflix don’t matter they use the source IP of the 
requestor not the DNS. 
Akamai is still old-school hasn’t figured out this new-generation of DNS like 
the new kids on the block have. 
However, with Akamai pulling all their caches that are serving <10G from ISPs, 
I dont know if it makes that much difference any more since they’re not going 
to be hitting my non-existent local Akamai cache. 









On Apr 24, 2020, at 10:27 AM, Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 


"I'm not sure why that is still being preached." 


Multiple CDNs specifically require it and state as much in their peering or 
cache server documentation. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Darin Steffl" < darin.ste...@mnwifi.com > 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:22:17 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of 
additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much 
larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I also 
trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS infrastructure than 
just myself. 


I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it 
on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and 
Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues years 
ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major providers 
and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive all local 
content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, 
etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that content to come from elsewhere 
and I'm not sure why that is still being preached. 


On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 





I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs and 
IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8. I’ve also had 
PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 in order 
to pass the audit. And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their own DNS 
server, bypassing the router or the OS. 

All of which they’re free to do. 

There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 or 
something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster to 
use cloud DNS. You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim. It’s 
like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
servers, which baffles me. And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too. 



As Mike said - it's another one of his things. I'm surprised you haven't seen 
that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG. 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 




That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor? 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
wrote: 




Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying to 
resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate  . However, we 
are pretty small. We have a few Techs, a scheduling/technician support person 
and me. That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making 
sure backups are working, etc is an hour not spent building the next tower. For 
me, it is a poor trade off, I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone 
else do that. I also know myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job 
of 

Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Ken Hohhof]

That sounds like the greylisting fans who claim email senders are required to 
retry again within 15 minutes from the same IP address.

Sure.  And in the real world …

 

Remember the story about the ship captain ordering the lighthouse to change 
course?

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:27 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

"I'm not sure why that is still being preached."

 

Multiple CDNs specifically require it and state as much in their peering or 
cache server documentation.



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 




  _  

From: "Darin Steffl" mailto:darin.ste...@mnwifi.com> >
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:22:17 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of 
additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much 
larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I also 
trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS infrastructure than 
just myself.

 

I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it 
on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and 
Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues years 
ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major providers 
and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive all local 
content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, 
etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that content to come from elsewhere 
and I'm not sure why that is still being preached.

 

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs and 
IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8.  I’ve also had 
PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 in order 
to pass the audit.  And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their own DNS 
server, bypassing the router or the OS.

 

All of which they’re free to do.

 

There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 or 
something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster to 
use cloud DNS.  You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim.  It’s 
like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
servers, which baffles me.  And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive.

 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too.

 

As Mike said - it's another one of his things.  I'm surprised you haven't seen 
that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron mailto:david.coud...@advantenon.com> > wrote:

Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying to 
resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate .   However, we 
are pretty small.   We have a few Techs,  a scheduling/technician support 
person and me.That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new 
VM, making sure backups are working, etc is an hour not spent building the next 
tower.  For me, it is a poor trade off, I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let 
someone else do that.   I also know myself well enough to know I won’t do as 
good a job of 

Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[dave]

LOL!
I loved my cat he was skittish around other people unfamiliar to the 
family unit.
We had him before his eyes opened and bottle fed him. He only knew the 
home as his world nothing more.
He never scratched furniture or chewed on things he shouldn't. He only 
came around to get acknowledgement
he was in the house and it was time for food.  Had him for over 16yrs 
before he passed of kidney failure.

My daughter would dress him up like pikachu LOL!


On 4/24/20 11:13 AM, Ken Hohhof wrote:


The kittens will grow up thinking they are pit bulls.  Remember the 
news coverage of the kitten raised by Huskies?  Thought it was a 
diminutive Husky.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
*Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 10:43 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

we found 2 fresh kittens in my dads shop, brought them home for the 
daughter to keep her occupied through the siege of governor/president 
pissing contest we are experiencing here in illinois. my pitbull 
apparently thinks she is their mother, and pit bulls are clean 
animals, she is licking and flipping them left and right, she 
doesnt understand how much bigger than them she is, one lick with her 
massive tongue and the rolls them three times


On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:36 AM Steven Kenney > wrote:


Yeah cats tend to get up and into everything in the house.  Why I
don't have them as pets.  A dog would just chew it and the wires ..

-- 
Steven Kenney

Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)



*From: *"Nate Burke" mailto:n...@blastcomm.com>>
*To: *"af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
*Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 11:19:04 AM
*Subject: *[AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

Just got a call from a customer

"Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the
room, and
then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into
the
router"

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

-- 
AF mailing list

AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com




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Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Cassidy B. Larson]

Which CDNs require it?

I know Google, Apple and Netflix don’t matter they use the source IP of the 
requestor not the DNS.
Akamai is still old-school hasn’t figured out this new-generation of DNS like 
the new kids on the block have.
However, with Akamai pulling all their caches that are serving <10G from ISPs, 
I dont know if it makes that much difference any more since they’re not going 
to be hitting my non-existent local Akamai cache.



> On Apr 24, 2020, at 10:27 AM, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> "I'm not sure why that is still being preached."
> 
> Multiple CDNs specifically require it and state as much in their peering or 
> cache server documentation.
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>   
>  
>  
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>   
>  
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
>  
> 
> 
>  
> From: "Darin Steffl" 
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:22:17 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing
> 
> To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of 
> additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much 
> larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I 
> also trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS infrastructure 
> than just myself.
> 
> I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it 
> on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and 
> Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues years 
> ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major providers 
> and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive all local 
> content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, 
> etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that content to come from 
> elsewhere and I'm not sure why that is still being preached.
> 
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof  > wrote:
> I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs 
> and IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8.  I’ve 
> also had PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 
> in order to pass the audit.  And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their 
> own DNS server, bypassing the router or the OS.
> 
> All of which they’re free to do.
> 
> There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
> insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 
> or something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster 
> to use cloud DNS.  You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
> therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim.  It’s 
> like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
> servers, which baffles me.  And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
> set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive.
> 
> 
> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf 
> Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  >
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing
> 
> Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too.
> 
> As Mike said - it's another one of his things.  I'm surprised you haven't 
> seen that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> 
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof  > wrote:
> That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor?
> 
> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf 
> Of Josh Luthman
> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM
> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  >
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing
> 
> This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P
> 
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> 
> 
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron  > wrote:
> Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying 
> to resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate .   However, 
> we are pretty small.   We have a few Techs,  a scheduling/technician support 
> person and me.That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new 
> VM, making sure backups are working, etc is an hour not 

Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Robert]

It's and indicator of respect of those around you...  & usually comes 
down from how you were raised.   Someone that is going to use that word 
around people you are not closely familiar with isn't going to try and 
understand anyone else in the meeting, excepting their superiors ( which 
the customer is supposed to be )...


On 4/24/20 8:20 AM, Craig House wrote:
I don’t use that kind of language especially in a business 
environment. It’s one thing to be hanging on a tower with guys that 
speak that way on a daily basis it’s quite another to be in a 
conference room or meeting a client and have someone using that kind 
of language. If I was making a decision between two vendors and 
everything else being equal, that sort of thing would help me make my 
choice because I wouldn’t wanna be around it During future 
transactions. Sort of seems like they’re setting the tone for all 
future conversations. I agree it’s much more common but it used to be 
and maybe I’m an old fart now , But it just doesn’t seem professional


Sent from my iPhone


On Apr 24, 2020, at 10:15, Ken Hohhof  wrote:



I don’t think it is now or has ever been appropriate for a sales rep 
to use that kind of language.  Other language like racial and ethnic 
jokes may have changed over time, but it’s just plain stupid for a 
sales person to use offensive language.


Trying to set language standards for a video blogger however is 
probably expecting too much.


I have not noticed that millennials have thinner skins than the 
general population.  I can think of a 73 year old politician who 
seems very thin skinned.  And there are billionaire entrepreneurs who 
are surprised that calling someone a “pedo guy” is considered 
defamatory.  Yes, there are millennials with thin skin, and her name 
is Karen.


*From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *ch...@wbmfg.com
*Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 9:54 AM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* [AFMUG] OT business decorum

Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the 
visit he was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have 
thought he would have toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  
After he left I told a manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted 
the guys boss and the next thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was 
not trying to cause him problems as work, just asking for a sanity 
check.


I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over 
the years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use 
of the F word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast 
in Quincy Il complaining about their director of sales being too 
salty for high end businesses meetings.


Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done 
a pretty good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every 
other sentence.  I told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an 
elevator.  He thinks I am too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess 
he is one of those thin skinned millennials...


TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the 
business world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?






-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Mike Hammett]

"I'm not sure why that is still being preached." 


Multiple CDNs specifically require it and state as much in their peering or 
cache server documentation. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Darin Steffl"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:22:17 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of 
additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much 
larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I also 
trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS infrastructure than 
just myself. 


I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it 
on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and 
Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues years 
ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major providers 
and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive all local 
content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft, 
etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that content to come from elsewhere 
and I'm not sure why that is still being preached. 


On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 





I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs and 
IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8. I’ve also had 
PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 in order 
to pass the audit. And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their own DNS 
server, bypassing the router or the OS. 

All of which they’re free to do. 

There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 or 
something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster to 
use cloud DNS. You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim. It’s 
like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
servers, which baffles me. And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive. 



From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too. 



As Mike said - it's another one of his things. I'm surprised you haven't seen 
that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG. 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 




That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor? 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Josh Luthman 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P 






Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
wrote: 




Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying to 
resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate  . However, we 
are pretty small. We have a few Techs, a scheduling/technician support person 
and me. That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making 
sure backups are working, etc is an hour not spent building the next tower. For 
me, it is a poor trade off, I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone 
else do that. I also know myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job 
of patching VMs, backing them up, and overall operational run of the servers as 
someone who does that for a living. I expect that will change some day, but for 
now, unfortunately that is where we are at. 

Regards, 

David Coudron 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:49 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 


The cost of running an ISP is that you have to run an ISP. ;-) 





I see a lot of people trying to run server-less, and you just can't... at least 
not while being responsible. If you've got one VM, the work in more VMs isn't 
dramatically different. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 







From: "David Coudron" < david.coud...@advantenon.com > 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:35:53 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing 
I 

Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Mike Hammett]

Some people with speech impediments have adapted to use filler words instead of 
their stutter or whatever afflicts them. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "David Coudron"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:17:50 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum 



Things appear to be changing over time, however, I don’t think it is 
appropriate in a business setting. I recently completed a 5 year consulting 
project for Wells Fargo and 3 years of work before that for Best Buy’s 
corporate IT group. It is definitely not common place and not looked at as 
acceptable, even in lower level meetings. Once you leave the office and are 
having drinks, knock yourself out with the salty language. From everything I 
have heard the things you don’t do at work are: 

1. Swear 
2. Lose your temper 
3. Talk politics 

Those are above the obvious ones related to sexual harassment, stealing, etc. 

In my role at Wells Fargo, myself and two others interviewed and hired for 3 
dozen consulting roles. Swearing in the interview, over use of the word “Like” 
were among the items that severely negatively impacted a person’s ability to 
get the role. If you can’t express an idea without swearing or misusing the 
word Like, you weren’t a serious candidate. 

Just my two cents…..  

Regards, 

David Coudron 


From: AF  On Behalf Of Nate Burke 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:04 AM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum 

I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that do. I'll 
admit that I will judge a person based on how they're speaking. Having not used 
that language, I will say that it seems that is becoming the 'normal' Even when 
visiting customers now, those words just are in their natural speech now. 

However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and it 
doesn't seem to bother me. Youtube videos do bother me though. Maybe something 
about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying to to fill time? 

On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: 





Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right. I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting. After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing. Was not trying to cause him problems as work, just 
asking for a sanity check. 



I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word. 
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings. 



Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence. I told 
him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator. He thinks I am too old to 
have a valid opinion. I guess he is one of those thin skinned millennials... 



TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
Perhaps Utah is in a bubble? 










-- 
AF mailing list 
AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com 

-- 
AF mailing list
AF@af.afmug.com
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com

Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Darin Steffl]

To be fair, Cloudflare is only 3.0ms away from us and that's not a lot of
additional latency, particular considering that their cache is likely much
larger than ours. So their cache hit % should be much higher than ours. I
also trust Cloudflare to have more people working on their DNS
infrastructure than just myself.

I totally understand and agree the lowest latency way for DNS is to host it
on-site on your own gear but we've had customers on OpenDNS (10ms away) and
Cloudflare (3ms away) with no issues at all. Google has had some issues
years ago so we switched away awhile ago. We peer with many of the major
providers and even though we use DNS that is outsourced, we still receive
all local content from our IX like Netflix, Google, Akamai, Apple,
Facebook, Microsoft, etc. Not having on-site DNS has not caused that
content to come from elsewhere and I'm not sure why that is still being
preached.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:01 AM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer
> techs and IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8.
> I’ve also had PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to
> 8.8.8.8 in order to pass the audit.  And it’s getting so apps and browsers
> set their own DNS server, bypassing the router or the OS.
>
>
>
> All of which they’re free to do.
>
>
>
> There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and
> insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1
> or something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s
> faster to use cloud DNS.  You could maybe say they have a bigger customer
> base and therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their
> claim.  It’s like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer
> than the ISP’s servers, which baffles me.  And as far as cache size, it
> seems most sites now set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
>
>
> Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too.
>
>
>
> As Mike said - it's another one of his things.  I'm surprised you haven't
> seen that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
> That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
>
>
> This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron <
> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>
> Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not
> trying to resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate .
> However, we are pretty small.   We have a few Techs,  a
> scheduling/technician support person and me.That means every hour spent
> upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making sure backups are working, etc is
> an hour not spent building the next tower.  For me, it is a poor trade off,
> I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone else do that.   I also know
> myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job of patching VMs,
> backing them up, and overall operational run of the servers as someone who
> does that for a living.  I expect that will change some day, but for now,
> unfortunately that is where we are at.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:49 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
>
>
> The cost of running an ISP is that you have to run an ISP.  ;-)
>
>
>
>
>
> I see a lot of people trying to run server-less, and you just can't...  at
> least not while being responsible. If you've got one VM, the work in more
> VMs isn't dramatically different.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
>
> *From: *"David Coudron" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: 

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Harold Bledsoe]

And just to comment from a product standpoint on why 25G will become more
common...

To Mike's point, 40G is made with 4x 10G meaning it eats up 4 SERDES on a
chip.  25G uses 1 SERDES that runs faster and 100G is made again with 4x of
the 25G SERDES.

Now that 25G capable SERDES is more prolific on the chip side, it makes
more sense to put 25G ports on things and use a single SERDES vs. putting
40G and chewing up 4 of the same SERDES running at slower speeds.  If you
are going to use 4 on these newer chips, it will be to make 100G.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 11:11 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> I have switches around, but I can't get transport or upstream connections
> with them without subsidizing the purchase of the card. As someone that has
> a lot of 40G and wishes that 40G wasn't dead, it is unless you have total
> control of the infrastructure.
>
>
> 40G is 4x10G and (modern) 100G is 4x25G. Yes, before it was 10x10, but
> that changed as it was too inefficient.
>
> In a single channel, you can run either 10G or 25G. In four channels, you
> can run 40G or 100G.
>
>
> If we can't get 100G at 1310 nm to work at the distances we need, we're
> likely going to go Nx25G in DWDM.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Steven Kenney" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 10:07:16 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
> That is up for debate but we'll see in a few years.  I'd rather jump to 40
> than 25.  You almost defeated your own point stating you have a lot of 40G
> laying around.  Price has come down on them and transceivers are not as
> expensive either.  Personally I'd rather jump to 100 :)
>
> 40G transceivers I can get for most models for $55.  (short range)  Same
> price for 25G!  Why bother with 25?
> Short range 100G are under $200 each.
>
>
> --
> Steven Kenney
> Network Operations Manager
> WaveDirect Telecommunications
> http://www.wavedirect.net
> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>
> --
> *From: *"Kurt Fankhauser" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 10:03:36 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
> Dennis,how many of these do you have on order?
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:
>
>> 25G will be far more common than 40G.
>> 40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I
>> have a lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's
>> not going to happen.
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Midwest Internet Exchange 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The Brothers WISP 
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>> --
>> *From: *"Steven Kenney" 
>> *To: *"af" 
>> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>
>> Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out.  25 is
>> kinda a black sheep in the industry.  Good luck matching equipment with
>> upstreams.  I know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100.
>>
>> --
>> Steven Kenney
>> Network Operations Manager
>> WaveDirect Telecommunications
>> http://www.wavedirect.net
>> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>>
>> --
>> *From: *"af" 
>> *To: *"af" 
>> *Cc: *"Dennis Burgess" 
>> *Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM
>> *Subject: *[AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>>
>> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>>
>> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>>
>>
>>
>> List price: $600
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>
>>
>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>
>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>
>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>
>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>
>> Create Wireless Coverage’s 

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Darin Steffl]

Gilbert,

We have three 1072s and none of them randomly reboot. I suggest you make
sure they're on stable power and use ONLY the latest Long-Term release. Do
not use Stable, testing, or development branches.

If you give Mikrotiks good firmware, they are great but I see too many
people using the Stable or Testing versions that cause issues. The best
thing they did was release the Long-Term (used to be called Bugfix) branch
and our gear has been rock solid ever since.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 11:04 AM Gilbert Gutierrez <
mailing-li...@phxinternet.com> wrote:

> Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
> units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
> else to replace them.
>
> Gilbert
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:
>
>> My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a 1072
>>
>>
>> On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>>
>> Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under the
>> hood..
>>
>> This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some
>> limitations here.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>
>>> So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
>>> directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
>>> architected as a router, or a switch?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via
>>> AF
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
>>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>>>
>>> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>>>
>>> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> List price: $600
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>>
>>>
>>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>>
>>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>>
>>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>>
>>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>>
>>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> AF mailing list
>>> AF@af.afmug.com
>>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>


-- 
Darin Steffl
Minnesota WiFi
www.mnwifi.com
507-634-WiFi
 Like us on Facebook

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Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[Ken Hohhof]

The kittens will grow up thinking they are pit bulls.  Remember the news 
coverage of the kitten raised by Huskies?  Thought it was a diminutive Husky.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:43 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

 

we found 2 fresh kittens in my dads shop, brought them home for the daughter to 
keep her occupied through the siege of governor/president pissing contest we 
are experiencing here in illinois. my pitbull apparently thinks she is their 
mother, and pit bulls are clean animals, she is licking and flipping them left 
and right, she doesnt understand how much bigger than them she is, one lick 
with her massive tongue and the rolls them three times

 

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:36 AM Steven Kenney mailto:st...@wavedirect.org> > wrote:

Yeah cats tend to get up and into everything in the house.  Why I don't have 
them as pets.  A dog would just chew it and the wires .. 

 

-- 
Steven Kenney
Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)

 


  _  


From: "Nate Burke" mailto:n...@blastcomm.com> >
To: "af" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:19:04 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

 

Just got a call from a customer

"Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and 
then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into the 
router"

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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Gilbert Gutierrez]

As you see the words used more and more in movies, music, etc.
(Entertainment) you see them used in regular settings. Movies like to push
the envelope. Music that younger people listen to tends to come from more
economically depressed areas where you hear the words more often. We are
all getting old. I never heard my parents use those words growing up, but I
even hear myself using the words on occasion with that occasion getting
more frequent.

Gilbert

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 8:51 AM James Howard  wrote:

> In the immortal words of Curly in response to the question “do you
> solemnly swear”…….  “No, but I know all the woids”.
>
>
>
> About 25 years ago I was working for a large company as a network engineer
> and was training a new guy that we had hired for one of the plants out
> east.  He was at our main facility and I sent him up on a man-lift to make
> some changes to a switch out in the factory.  As he got up there, he let
> loose with an extended string of F bombs.  When he came back down I said
> something to the effect of “whoa….  That was different” and his response
> was “sorry about that man, it was the sailor in me coming back out”.  He
> had spent about 10 years in the Navy before starting work for us.  Aside
> from that, I don’t recall him ever letting loose like that again in the few
> years I worked with him (if not daily contact, at least a few times every
> single week) before I left the company.
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 10:21 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum
>
>
>
> Ive noticed this trend, not just from the young. I dont sit in a whole lot
> of board meetings given my nobody status, but i have found myself
> dragged into them periodically. Im always somewhat floored when a
> profession drops an fbomb in particular. Im a lowlife, so in my regular
> life i swear alot, but in my professional life i always gauge the company
> im in  and make decisions on the communication type, usually edging toward
> playing it safe and not using curse words. but anymore it just seems no
> matter who you meet, theyre cussing. Ive seen it a whole lot from salesmen.
> Im not sure if its a sales tool to break ice or if society is just
> generally foul mouthed. maybe its actually always been this way and it is
> the age that makes you notice it more
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:10 AM  wrote:
>
> On a tech type you tube video, I normally feel safe enough having them on
> when my grandkids are around.  Normally...
>
>
>
> *From:* Nate Burke
>
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 9:04 AM
>
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
>
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum
>
>
>
> I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that do.
> I'll admit that I will judge a person based on how they're speaking.
> Having not used that language, I will say that it seems that is becoming
> the 'normal'  Even when visiting customers now, those words just are in
> their natural speech now.
>
> However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and it
> doesn't seem to bother me.  Youtube videos do bother me though.  Maybe
> something about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying to to
> fill time?
>
> On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit
> he was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would
> have toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a
> manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next
> thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems
> as work, just asking for a sanity check.
>
>
>
> I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the
> years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F
> word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il
> complaining about their director of sales being too salty for high end
> businesses meetings.
>
>
>
> Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a
> pretty good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other
> sentence.  I told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He
> thinks I am too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those
> thin skinned millennials...
>
>
>
> TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business
> world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
>
> *Total Control Panel*
>
> Login 
>
> To: ja...@litewire.net
> 

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Mike Hammett]

I have switches around, but I can't get transport or upstream connections with 
them without subsidizing the purchase of the card. As someone that has a lot of 
40G and wishes that 40G wasn't dead, it is unless you have total control of the 
infrastructure. 




40G is 4x10G and (modern) 100G is 4x25G. Yes, before it was 10x10, but that 
changed as it was too inefficient. 


In a single channel, you can run either 10G or 25G. In four channels, you can 
run 40G or 100G. 




If we can't get 100G at 1310 nm to work at the distances we need, we're likely 
going to go Nx25G in DWDM. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Steven Kenney"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:07:16 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 



That is up for debate but we'll see in a few years. I'd rather jump to 40 than 
25. You almost defeated your own point stating you have a lot of 40G laying 
around. Price has come down on them and transceivers are not as expensive 
either. Personally I'd rather jump to 100 :) 


40G transceivers I can get for most models for $55. (short range) Same price 
for 25G! Why bother with 25? 
Short range 100G are under $200 each. 




-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 

- Original Message -

From: "Kurt Fankhauser"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:03:36 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 




Dennis,how many of these do you have on order? 


On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett < af...@ics-il.net > wrote: 




25G will be far more common than 40G. 

40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I have a 
lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's not going to 
happen. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 






From: "Steven Kenney" < st...@wavedirect.org > 
To: "af" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 



Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out. 25 is kinda a 
black sheep in the industry. Good luck matching equipment with upstreams. I 
know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100. 

-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "af" < af@af.afmug.com > 
To: "af" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Cc: "Dennis Burgess" < dmburg...@linktechs.net > 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 







10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces 
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces 
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU 

List price: $600 


LTI-Full_175px
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 
Office : 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net 
Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com 

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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Ken Hohhof]

I’m going by memory which in my case is dangerous, but I think the 1100AHx4 and 
4011 already use Annapurna Labs devices.  I assume this one is on steroids.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Harold Bledsoe
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:00 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

 

It shows AL32400 so Annapurna labs:  
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annapurna_Labs

 

They were bought by Amazon a while back and make good CPUs.  I'd guess 
performance will be pretty good.  Most of these are architected with ARM cores 
+ lots of hardware offload for doing routing and other such tasks.  So it is 
kind of like having a L3 HW engine inside the CPU.

 

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 7:31 AM Dennis Burgess via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

Don’t know yet as they have not published a block diagram or routing 
performance numbers.  However, I would assume it would do just as good if not 
better than a 1072.. Course, that could be v7 as well, but don’t know yet.  

 

 



Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office: 314-735-0270  Website:   
http://www.linktechs.net 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with   
www.towercoverage.com 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:39 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

 

whats the comparison to 1072?

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:26 PM Dennis Burgess via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

Yep, seeing the 8 port SFP+ model retail is 3k ..  under 1k and more ports and 
25gig ports!  

 

What 64bit ARM CPU is supposed to do I guess!  We have our stock ordered, its 
not even on the MT product site yet.  Will be a week or two before they come 
in.  We will have significant stock on them.  

 

 



Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office: 314-735-0270  Website:   
http://www.linktechs.net 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with   
www.towercoverage.com 

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

 

this thing is pretty cheap too isnt it

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:18 PM Dennis Burgess via AF mailto:af@af.afmug.com> > wrote:

 



 

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces

2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces

Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

 

List price: $600

 

 



Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office: 314-735-0270  Website:   
http://www.linktechs.net 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with   
www.towercoverage.com 

 

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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Gilbert Gutierrez]

Dave... I have two 1072s in my network and I have had issues with both
units and perceived random reboots. I am not a fan and buying something
else to replace them.

Gilbert

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:04 PM dave  wrote:

> My thoughts exactly because Im looking at replacing my powerv4 with a 1072
>
>
> On 4/23/20 2:47 PM, Josh Baird wrote:
>
> Yeah - we need to see diagrams to see what is actually going on under the
> hood..
>
> This is supposedly the "new 1009," so I suspect there are some limitations
> here.
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>
>> So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?
>>
>>
>>
>> Seems like you’d need to see the block diagram, are all those ports
>> directly connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this
>> architected as a router, or a switch?
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via AF
>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>
>>
>>
>> Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>
>>
>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>
>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>
>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>
>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>
>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Dennis Burgess via AF
>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
>> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
>> *Cc:* Dennis Burgess 
>> *Subject:* [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>>
>> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>>
>> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>>
>>
>>
>> List price: $600
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>>
>>
>> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
>> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>>
>> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>>
>> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>>
>> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>>
>> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>>
>>
>> --
>> AF mailing list
>> AF@af.afmug.com
>> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[James Howard]

In the immortal words of Curly in response to the question “do you solemnly 
swear”…….  “No, but I know all the woids”.

About 25 years ago I was working for a large company as a network engineer and 
was training a new guy that we had hired for one of the plants out east.  He 
was at our main facility and I sent him up on a man-lift to make some changes 
to a switch out in the factory.  As he got up there, he let loose with an 
extended string of F bombs.  When he came back down I said something to the 
effect of “whoa….  That was different” and his response was “sorry about that 
man, it was the sailor in me coming back out”.  He had spent about 10 years in 
the Navy before starting work for us.  Aside from that, I don’t recall him ever 
letting loose like that again in the few years I worked with him (if not daily 
contact, at least a few times every single week) before I left the company.


From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:21 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

Ive noticed this trend, not just from the young. I dont sit in a whole lot of 
board meetings given my nobody status, but i have found myself dragged into 
them periodically. Im always somewhat floored when a profession drops an fbomb 
in particular. Im a lowlife, so in my regular life i swear alot, but in my 
professional life i always gauge the company im in  and make decisions on the 
communication type, usually edging toward playing it safe and not using curse 
words. but anymore it just seems no matter who you meet, theyre cussing. Ive 
seen it a whole lot from salesmen. Im not sure if its a sales tool to break ice 
or if society is just generally foul mouthed. maybe its actually always been 
this way and it is the age that makes you notice it more

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:10 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>> 
wrote:
On a tech type you tube video, I normally feel safe enough having them on when 
my grandkids are around.  Normally...

From: Nate Burke
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that do.  I'll 
admit that I will judge a person based on how they're speaking.  Having not 
used that language, I will say that it seems that is becoming the 'normal'  
Even when visiting customers now, those words just are in their natural speech 
now.

However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and it 
doesn't seem to bother me.  Youtube videos do bother me though.  Maybe 
something about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying to to fill 
time?
On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.

I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings.

Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
 Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?






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Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[Steve Jones]

we found 2 fresh kittens in my dads shop, brought them home for the
daughter to keep her occupied through the siege of governor/president
pissing contest we are experiencing here in illinois. my pitbull apparently
thinks she is their mother, and pit bulls are clean animals, she is licking
and flipping them left and right, she doesnt understand how much bigger
than them she is, one lick with her massive tongue and the rolls them three
times

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:36 AM Steven Kenney  wrote:

> Yeah cats tend to get up and into everything in the house.  Why I don't
> have them as pets.  A dog would just chew it and the wires ..
>
> --
> Steven Kenney
> Network Operations Manager
> WaveDirect Telecommunications
> http://www.wavedirect.net
> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>
> --
> *From: *"Nate Burke" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 11:19:04 AM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] That Darn Cat!
>
> Just got a call from a customer
>
> "Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and
> then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into the
> router"
>
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Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[chuck]

Back when I was a young telephone repairman, I had a repeated service call to a 
place the used to be a barbershop but was turned into an apartment.  Weird 
young guy there had it full of cats.  The cats kept chewing the line cord off 
the phone.  The smell was so bad that I would hold my breath, go in and attach 
a new line cord to the connector block, then drag the phone outside and connect 
the cord to the phone and test it while sitting on the sidewalk.  This was 
before phones that had modular cords...

So the last time I had to go there, the guy bitches that I am letting all his 
cold air out.  He called my boss, my boss told me to just suck it up and fix 
the phone in the house.  I asked my boss to come over and show me how that is 
to be done.

Of course that pissed him off but he was like one block away from this place so 
he came stomping over with a tool belt on.  Went in and came right back out and 
told me to finish on the sidewalk...

There is another more famous story that is similar.  I will see if I can find 
it.

From: Steven Kenney 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:35 AM
To: af 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

Yeah cats tend to get up and into everything in the house.  Why I don't have 
them as pets.  A dog would just chew it and the wires .. 

-- 
Steven Kenney
Network Operations Manager
WaveDirect Telecommunications
http://www.wavedirect.net
(519)737-WAVE (9283)




From: "Nate Burke" 
To: "af" 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:19:04 AM
Subject: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!


Just got a call from a customer

"Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and 
then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into the 
router"

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Re: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[Steven Kenney]

Yeah cats tend to get up and into everything in the house. Why I don't have 
them as pets. A dog would just chew it and the wires .. 

-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "Nate Burke"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 11:19:04 AM 
Subject: [AFMUG] That Darn Cat! 

Just got a call from a customer 

"Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and 
then barfed in the router. Nowhere else, except for squarely into the 
router" 

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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Steve Jones]

Ive noticed this trend, not just from the young. I dont sit in a whole lot
of board meetings given my nobody status, but i have found myself
dragged into them periodically. Im always somewhat floored when a
profession drops an fbomb in particular. Im a lowlife, so in my regular
life i swear alot, but in my professional life i always gauge the company
im in  and make decisions on the communication type, usually edging toward
playing it safe and not using curse words. but anymore it just seems no
matter who you meet, theyre cussing. Ive seen it a whole lot from salesmen.
Im not sure if its a sales tool to break ice or if society is just
generally foul mouthed. maybe its actually always been this way and it is
the age that makes you notice it more

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:10 AM  wrote:

> On a tech type you tube video, I normally feel safe enough having them on
> when my grandkids are around.  Normally...
>
> *From:* Nate Burke
> *Sent:* Friday, April 24, 2020 9:04 AM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum
>
> I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that do.
> I'll admit that I will judge a person based on how they're speaking.
> Having not used that language, I will say that it seems that is becoming
> the 'normal'  Even when visiting customers now, those words just are in
> their natural speech now.
>
> However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and it
> doesn't seem to bother me.  Youtube videos do bother me though.  Maybe
> something about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying to to
> fill time?
>
> On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit
> he was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would
> have toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a
> manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next
> thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems
> as work, just asking for a sanity check.
>
> I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the
> years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F
> word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il
> complaining about their director of sales being too salty for high end
> businesses meetings.
>
> Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a
> pretty good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other
> sentence.  I told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He
> thinks I am too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those
> thin skinned millennials...
>
> TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business
> world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Craig House]

I don’t use that kind of language especially in a business environment. It’s 
one thing to be hanging on a tower with guys that speak that way on a daily 
basis it’s quite another to be in a conference room or meeting a client and 
have someone using that kind of language. If I was making a decision between 
two vendors and everything else being equal, that sort of thing would help me 
make my choice because I wouldn’t wanna be around it During future 
transactions. Sort of seems like they’re setting the tone for all future 
conversations. I agree it’s much more common but it used to be and maybe I’m an 
old fart now , But it just doesn’t seem professional

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 10:15, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> 
> 
> I don’t think it is now or has ever been appropriate for a sales rep to use 
> that kind of language.  Other language like racial and ethnic jokes may have 
> changed over time, but it’s just plain stupid for a sales person to use 
> offensive language.
>  
> Trying to set language standards for a video blogger however is probably 
> expecting too much.
>  
> I have not noticed that millennials have thinner skins than the general 
> population.  I can think of a 73 year old politician who seems very thin 
> skinned.  And there are billionaire entrepreneurs who are surprised that 
> calling someone a “pedo guy” is considered defamatory.  Yes, there are 
> millennials with thin skin, and her name is Karen.
>  
>  
> From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:54 AM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] OT business decorum
>  
> Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
> was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
> toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
> manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing 
> I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
> just asking for a sanity check. 
>  
> I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
> years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F 
> word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il 
> complaining about their director of sales being too salty for high end 
> businesses meetings. 
>  
> Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
> good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
> told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am 
> too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
> millennials...
>  
> TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business 
> world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
>  
>  
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[AFMUG] That Darn Cat!

[Nate Burke]

Just got a call from a customer

"Our cat just sat on the desk waiting for me to walk into the room, and 
then barfed in the router.  Nowhere else, except for squarely into the 
router"


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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Jay Weekley]

If it's not going to help you make the sale then don't say it.

Ken Hohhof wrote:

I don’t think it is now or has ever been appropriate for a sales rep to use 
that kind of language.  Other language like racial and ethnic jokes may have 
changed over time, but it’s just plain stupid for a sales person to use 
offensive language.

  


Trying to set language standards for a video blogger however is probably 
expecting too much.

  


I have not noticed that millennials have thinner skins than the general 
population.  I can think of a 73 year old politician who seems very thin 
skinned.  And there are billionaire entrepreneurs who are surprised that 
calling someone a “pedo guy” is considered defamatory.  Yes, there are 
millennials with thin skin, and her name is Karen.

  

  


From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:54 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

  


Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.

  


I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings.

  


Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

  


TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
 Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?

  

  







--
*Jay Weekley*
*Cyber Broadband
*

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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Ken Hohhof]

I don’t think it is now or has ever been appropriate for a sales rep to use 
that kind of language.  Other language like racial and ethnic jokes may have 
changed over time, but it’s just plain stupid for a sales person to use 
offensive language.

 

Trying to set language standards for a video blogger however is probably 
expecting too much.

 

I have not noticed that millennials have thinner skins than the general 
population.  I can think of a 73 year old politician who seems very thin 
skinned.  And there are billionaire entrepreneurs who are surprised that 
calling someone a “pedo guy” is considered defamatory.  Yes, there are 
millennials with thin skin, and her name is Karen.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:54 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

 

Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.  

 

I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings. 
 

 

Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

 

TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
 Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?

 

 

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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[chuck]

On a tech type you tube video, I normally feel safe enough having them on when 
my grandkids are around.  Normally...

From: Nate Burke 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:04 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that do.  I'll 
admit that I will judge a person based on how they're speaking.  Having not 
used that language, I will say that it seems that is becoming the 'normal'  
Even when visiting customers now, those words just are in their natural speech 
now.  

However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and it 
doesn't seem to bother me.  Youtube videos do bother me though.  Maybe 
something about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying to to fill 
time?  


On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.  

  I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings. 
 

  Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

  TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business 
world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?



   






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Re: [AFMUG] anybody got any airfiber 5x for sell?

[Kurt Fankhauser]

sending you an email offlist

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 11:01 AM Tim Reichhart <
timreichh...@hometowncable.net> wrote:

> Does anybody have any airfiber 5x for sell?
>
>
>
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Re: [AFMUG] Track loaders

[Kurt Fankhauser]

They are probably all just as good as the other, the big thing is going to
be service and parts availability. Our closest implement store and service
center is John Deere and they tend to have a really good supply chain for
parts.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 10:36 AM Roland Houin  wrote:

> jcb teleskid.
> much safer, as you can get in and out of cab without going under/over
> bucket
>
> Roland
>
>
> > Considering making a purchase of a track loader. I’m sure it’s a Chevy
> versus
> Ford versus Dodge sort of scenario but what is the opinions of anyone in
> this
> group as to which brand is best? If you have one how long have you had it
> and
> how much or often do you have to do repair work?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Steven Kenney]

That is up for debate but we'll see in a few years. I'd rather jump to 40 than 
25. You almost defeated your own point stating you have a lot of 40G laying 
around. Price has come down on them and transceivers are not as expensive 
either. Personally I'd rather jump to 100 :) 

40G transceivers I can get for most models for $55. (short range) Same price 
for 25G! Why bother with 25? 
Short range 100G are under $200 each. 


-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "Kurt Fankhauser"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 10:03:36 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 

Dennis,how many of these do you have on order? 

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett < [ mailto:af...@ics-il.net | 
af...@ics-il.net ] > wrote: 



25G will be far more common than 40G. 
40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I have a 
lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's not going to 
happen. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
[ http://www.ics-il.com/ | Intelligent Computing Solutions ] 
[ https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL ] [ 
https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb ] [ 
https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions ] [ 
https://twitter.com/ICSIL ] 
[ http://www.midwest-ix.com/ | Midwest Internet Exchange ] 
[ https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix ] [ 
https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange ] [ 
https://twitter.com/mdwestix ] 
[ http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/ | The Brothers WISP ] 
[ https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp ] [ 
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg ] 

From: "Steven Kenney" < [ mailto:st...@wavedirect.org | st...@wavedirect.org ] 
> 
To: "af" < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 

Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out. 25 is kinda a 
black sheep in the industry. Good luck matching equipment with upstreams. I 
know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100. 

-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
[ http://www.wavedirect.net/ | http://www.wavedirect.net ] 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "af" < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > 
To: "af" < [ mailto:af@af.afmug.com | af@af.afmug.com ] > 
Cc: "Dennis Burgess" < [ mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net | 
dmburg...@linktechs.net ] > 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 









10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces 

2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces 

Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU 



List price: $600 







Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office : 314-735-0270 Website: [ http://www.linktechs.net/ | 
http://www.linktechs.net ] 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com 



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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Nate Burke]

I don't talk that way, so It puts me off when I'm around people that 
do.  I'll admit that I will judge a person based on how they're 
speaking.  Having not used that language, I will say that it seems that 
is becoming the 'normal'  Even when visiting customers now, those words 
just are in their natural speech now.


However, I watch TV shows/movies where the language is just a blue, and 
it doesn't seem to bother me.  Youtube videos do bother me though.  
Maybe something about having a scripted reason to say it, vs just saying 
to to fill time?


On 4/24/2020 9:53 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the 
visit he was dropping the F bomb left and right. I would have thought 
he would have toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he 
left I told a manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys 
boss and the next thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying 
to cause him problems as work, just asking for a sanity check.
I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over 
the years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of 
the F word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in 
Quincy Il complaining about their director of sales being too salty 
for high end businesses meetings.
Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a 
pretty good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other 
sentence.  I told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an 
elevator.  He thinks I am too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he 
is one of those thin skinned millennials...
TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the 
business world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?





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Re: [AFMUG] OT business decorum

[Colin Stanners]

It's not just the business world or a physical area, I noticed that a small
but vocal percentage of the population, often young, has started to use the
F-word excessively in a few contexts, trying to be "edgy" or showing that
they don't care about others' opinions. When I've commented on it the
responses have been "I say what I want" or "I'm not trying to offend you so
[buzz] off".

It's a small group of people but in that group the evaporation of respect /
mature conversation is worrying.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:54 AM  wrote:

> Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit
> he was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would
> have toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a
> manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next
> thing I know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems
> as work, just asking for a sanity check.
>
> I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the
> years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F
> word.  I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il
> complaining about their director of sales being too salty for high end
> businesses meetings.
>
> Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a
> pretty good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other
> sentence.  I told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He
> thinks I am too old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those
> thin skinned millennials...
>
> TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business
> world.  Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?
>
>
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[AFMUG] anybody got any airfiber 5x for sell?

[Tim Reichhart]

Does anybody have any airfiber 5x for sell?



 

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Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Ken Hohhof]

I do find it interesting that one of the “improvements” that computer techs and 
IT guys typically apply is to change the DNS server to 8.8.8.8.  I’ve also had 
PCI auditors tell the customer to change their DNS server to 8.8.8.8 in order 
to pass the audit.  And it’s getting so apps and browsers set their own DNS 
server, bypassing the router or the OS.

 

All of which they’re free to do.

 

There is a whole movement telling people that ISP resolvers are slow and 
insecure, that it will be faster and safer to use DNS over HTTPS to 1.1.1.1 or 
something similar. I’ve never quite understood the claim that it’s faster to 
use cloud DNS.  You could maybe say they have a bigger customer base and 
therefore more cached entries, but that doesn’t seem to be their claim.  It’s 
like they think 8.8.8.8 or 1.1.1.1 is closer to the customer than the ISP’s 
servers, which baffles me.  And as far as cache size, it seems most sites now 
set the TTL so low that all queries are recursive.

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 9:36 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too.

 

As Mike said - it's another one of his things.  I'm surprised you haven't seen 
that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof mailto:af...@kwisp.com> > wrote:

That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor?

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P


 

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

 

 

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron mailto:david.coud...@advantenon.com> > wrote:

Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not trying to 
resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate .   However, we 
are pretty small.   We have a few Techs,  a scheduling/technician support 
person and me.That means every hour spent upgrading Linux, building a new 
VM, making sure backups are working, etc is an hour not spent building the next 
tower.  For me, it is a poor trade off, I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let 
someone else do that.   I also know myself well enough to know I won’t do as 
good a job of patching VMs, backing them up, and overall operational run of the 
servers as someone who does that for a living.  I expect that will change some 
day, but for now, unfortunately that is where we are at.

 

Regards,

 

David Coudron

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com> > On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:49 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

 

The cost of running an ISP is that you have to run an ISP.  ;-)

 

 

I see a lot of people trying to run server-less, and you just can't...  at 
least not while being responsible. If you've got one VM, the work in more VMs 
isn't dramatically different.



-
Mike Hammett
  Intelligent Computing Solutions
   
  
  
 
  Midwest Internet Exchange
   
  
 
  The Brothers WISP
   
 





  _  


From: "David Coudron" mailto:david.coud...@advantenon.com> >
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" mailto:af@af.afmug.com> >
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:35:53 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] billing

I hear ya, but it is another system to support/upgrade/backup etc.We’d 
really like to be in the business of building the ISP network and get out of 
the server/application support business.   We have looked at quite a few 
monitoring systems, but haven’t found a good mix of hosted, robust, and 
reasonably priced.Additionally, you need to either put them in the central 
office and live with more traffic flowing over your DIA, or find some sort of 
distributed SNMP polling solution.   One of the biggest reasons to move to 
Sonar for us was to get access to Pulse, and next generation network 
monitoring.   To some extent we feel like moved to a feature for feature 
comparison of where we were at with Powercode and a slightly less reliable 
monitoring systems since we don’t have the local BMUs grabbing the data.   We 
have moved Sonar pollers out further into the network to help with 

Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Harold Bledsoe]

It shows AL32400 so Annapurna labs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annapurna_Labs

They were bought by Amazon a while back and make good CPUs.  I'd guess
performance will be pretty good.  Most of these are architected with ARM
cores + lots of hardware offload for doing routing and other such tasks.
So it is kind of like having a L3 HW engine inside the CPU.

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 7:31 AM Dennis Burgess via AF 
wrote:

> Don’t know yet as they have not published a block diagram or routing
> performance numbers.  However, I would assume it would do just as good if
> not better than a 1072.. Course, that could be v7 as well, but don’t know
> yet.
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of * Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:39 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
>
>
> whats the comparison to 1072?
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:26 PM Dennis Burgess via AF 
> wrote:
>
> Yep, seeing the 8 port SFP+ model retail is 3k ..  under 1k and more ports
> and 25gig ports!
>
>
>
> What 64bit ARM CPU is supposed to do I guess!  We have our stock ordered,
> its not even on the MT product site yet.  Will be a week or two before they
> come in.  We will have significant stock on them.
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Steve Jones
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:23 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
>
>
> this thing is pretty cheap too isnt it
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:18 PM Dennis Burgess via AF 
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>
> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>
> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>
>
>
> List price: $600
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
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>


-- 

Harold Bledsoe
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[AFMUG] OT business decorum

[chuck]

Had a vendor make a visit to my company a while back and during the visit he 
was dropping the F bomb left and right.  I would have thought he would have 
toned it down as my wife was in the meeting.  After he left I told a 
manufacturer’s rep about it and he contacted the guys boss and the next thing I 
know the guy is apologizing.  Was not trying to cause him problems as work, 
just asking for a sanity check.  

I have been in probably thousands of board and business meetings over the 
years, and don’t recall anyone ever being gratuitous in the use of the F word.  
I do recall one of the big bosses at Harris Broadcast in Quincy Il complaining 
about their director of sales being too salty for high end businesses meetings. 
 

Then yesterday I was taken to task by a video blogger which had done a pretty 
good job in his Tesla review except for the F bomb every other sentence.  I 
told him it was about as welcome as a fart in an elevator.  He thinks I am too 
old to have a valid opinion.  I guess he is one of those thin skinned 
millennials...

TV shows it all the time, but I don’t think it is common in the business world. 
 Perhaps Utah is in a bubble?

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Re: [AFMUG] billing

[Josh Luthman]

Mostly humor, but it's kinda true too.

As Mike said - it's another one of his things.  I'm surprised you haven't
seen that, though it may not be too often in AFMUG.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373


On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:00 PM Ken Hohhof  wrote:

> That’s kind of harsh, or was that humor?
>
>
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Josh Luthman
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 4:50 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
>
>
> This guy probably doesn't run his own DNS ;P
>
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:48 PM David Coudron <
> david.coud...@advantenon.com> wrote:
>
> Yes, that is something we need to continually consider, and I am not
> trying to resurrect the SaaS apps vs own it and run it yourself debate .
> However, we are pretty small.   We have a few Techs,  a
> scheduling/technician support person and me.That means every hour spent
> upgrading Linux, building a new VM, making sure backups are working, etc is
> an hour not spent building the next tower.  For me, it is a poor trade off,
> I will gladly pay a monthly fee and let someone else do that.   I also know
> myself well enough to know I won’t do as good a job of patching VMs,
> backing them up, and overall operational run of the servers as someone who
> does that for a living.  I expect that will change some day, but for now,
> unfortunately that is where we are at.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> David Coudron
>
> *From:* AF  *On Behalf Of *Mike Hammett
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:49 PM
> *To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
>
>
> The cost of running an ISP is that you have to run an ISP.  ;-)
>
>
>
>
>
> I see a lot of people trying to run server-less, and you just can't...  at
> least not while being responsible. If you've got one VM, the work in more
> VMs isn't dramatically different.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
>
> *From: *"David Coudron" 
> *To: *"AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:35:53 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] billing
>
> I hear ya, but it is another system to support/upgrade/backup etc.We’d
> really like to be in the business of building the ISP network and get out
> of the server/application support business.   We have looked at quite a few
> monitoring systems, but haven’t found a good mix of hosted, robust, and
> reasonably priced.Additionally, you need to either put them in the
> central office and live with more traffic flowing over your DIA, or find
> some sort of distributed SNMP polling solution.   One of the biggest
> reasons to move to Sonar for us was to get access to Pulse, and next
> generation network monitoring.   To some extent we feel like moved to a
> feature for feature comparison of where we were at with Powercode and a
> slightly less reliable monitoring systems since we don’t have the local
> BMUs grabbing the data.   We have moved Sonar pollers out further into the
> network to help with reliability, but now we have Linux devices we have to
> remotely maintain again.   I know I am whining about this, but we thought
> we would be a lot closer to our ideal use case than where we ended up, and
> I am a little sore that so many things appear to be part of v2 and it just
> keeps being pushed a little beyond our reach.
>
>
>
> Ideally we would like this to be the case, if it is possible and we
> haven’t stumbled on it yet, we’d love to hear about it.
>
>
>
>1. SNMP monitoring data collected on the Mikrotiks and passed to a
>central database.   Reasoning – We have them everywhere, we already
>committed to maintaining them and they are close to the devices we want to
>get data from.
>2. SNMP monitoring system lives inside of our billing system so that
>we have the tie from customer router to SM to tower AP to tower router, to
>core routers to edge routers all sitting in the same system and tied to the
>customer.   We thought Sonar was going to be that.
>3. Ability to supplement the Sonar data with some simple math where
>the SNMP data doesn’t provide exactly what were are looking for.  In
>particular, or Mimosa backhauls don’t provide 

Re: [AFMUG] Track loaders

[Roland Houin]

jcb teleskid.
much safer, as you can get in and out of cab without going under/over bucket

Roland


> Considering making a purchase of a track loader. I’m sure it’s a Chevy versus
Ford versus Dodge sort of scenario but what is the opinions of anyone in this
group as to which brand is best? If you have one how long have you had it and
how much or often do you have to do repair work?

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Kurt Fankhauser]

Dennis,how many of these do you have on order?

On Fri, Apr 24, 2020 at 9:42 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> 25G will be far more common than 40G.
>
> 40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I
> have a lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's
> not going to happen.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Steven Kenney" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Sent: *Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
> Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out.  25 is kinda
> a black sheep in the industry.  Good luck matching equipment with
> upstreams.  I know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100.
>
> --
> Steven Kenney
> Network Operations Manager
> WaveDirect Telecommunications
> http://www.wavedirect.net
> (519)737-WAVE (9283)
>
> --
> *From: *"af" 
> *To: *"af" 
> *Cc: *"Dennis Burgess" 
> *Sent: *Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM
> *Subject: *[AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out
>
>
>
>
>
> 10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
>
> 2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
>
> Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU
>
>
>
> List price: $600
>
>
>
>
>
> *[image: LTI-Full_175px]*
>
>
> *Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE,
> MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified *
>
> Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
>
> *Link Technologies, Inc* -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
>
> *Office*: 314-735-0270  Website: http://www.linktechs.net
>
> Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com
>
>
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
>
> --
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> AF@af.afmug.com
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>
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Re: [AFMUG] Track loaders

[Craig House]

I’d like to stay with something around the 9000 pound range

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 24, 2020, at 08:43, Mike Hammett  wrote:
> 
> 
> Full size or compact?
> 
> 
> 
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> 
> The Brothers WISP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Craig House" 
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:33:23 AM
> Subject: [AFMUG] Track loaders
> 
> Considering making a purchase of a track loader. I’m sure it’s a Chevy versus 
> Ford versus Dodge sort of scenario but what is the opinions of anyone in this 
> group as to which brand is best? If you have one how long have you had it and 
> how much or often do you have to do repair work?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> -- 
> AF mailing list
> AF@af.afmug.com
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
> 
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Re: [AFMUG] Track loaders

[Mike Hammett]

Full size or compact? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Craig House"  
To: af@af.afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:33:23 AM 
Subject: [AFMUG] Track loaders 

Considering making a purchase of a track loader. I’m sure it’s a Chevy versus 
Ford versus Dodge sort of scenario but what is the opinions of anyone in this 
group as to which brand is best? If you have one how long have you had it and 
how much or often do you have to do repair work? 

Sent from my iPhone 
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Mike Hammett]

25G will be far more common than 40G. 


40G is dead and has been dead for years. I wish that wasn't so because I have a 
lot of 40G switches that I'd love to connect to things, but that's not going to 
happen. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Steven Kenney"  
To: "af"  
Sent: Friday, April 24, 2020 8:38:00 AM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 




Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out. 25 is kinda a 
black sheep in the industry. Good luck matching equipment with upstreams. I 
know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100. 


-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 

- Original Message -

From: "af"  
To: "af"  
Cc: "Dennis Burgess"  
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 








10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces 
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces 
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU 

List price: $600 


LTI-Full_175px
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 
Office : 314-735-0270 Website: http://www.linktechs.net 
Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com 

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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Steven Kenney]

Ugh.. I was wondering when the 40Gbps version was coming out. 25 is kinda a 
black sheep in the industry. Good luck matching equipment with upstreams. I 
know they can get the cards but most are moving to 40 or 100. 

-- 
Steven Kenney 
Network Operations Manager 
WaveDirect Telecommunications 
http://www.wavedirect.net 
(519)737-WAVE (9283) 


From: "af"  
To: "af"  
Cc: "Dennis Burgess"  
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:17:51 PM 
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out 









10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces 

2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces 

Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU 



List price: $600 







Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer 
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP 
Certified 

Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition” 

Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services 

Office : 314-735-0270 Website: [ http://www.linktechs.net/ | 
http://www.linktechs.net ] 

Create Wireless Coverage’s with [ 
https://mail.wavedirect.org/www.towercoverage.com | www.towercoverage.com ] 



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[AFMUG] Track loaders

[Craig House]

Considering making a purchase of a track loader. I’m sure it’s a Chevy versus 
Ford versus Dodge sort of scenario but what is the opinions of anyone in this 
group as to which brand is best? If you have one how long have you had it and 
how much or often do you have to do repair work?

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Dennis Burgess via AF]

Don’t know yet as they have not published a block diagram or routing 
performance numbers.  However, I would assume it would do just as good if not 
better than a 1072.. Course, that could be v7 as well, but don’t know yet.


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:39 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

whats the comparison to 1072?

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:26 PM Dennis Burgess via AF 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com>> wrote:
Yep, seeing the 8 port SFP+ model retail is 3k ..  under 1k and more ports and 
25gig ports!

What 64bit ARM CPU is supposed to do I guess!  We have our stock ordered, its 
not even on the MT product site yet.  Will be a week or two before they come 
in.  We will have significant stock on them.


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage’s with 
www.towercoverage.com

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Steve Jones
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:23 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

this thing is pretty cheap too isnt it

On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 1:18 PM Dennis Burgess via AF 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com>> wrote:

[cid:image002.png@01D61A0A.367A05D0]

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

List price: $600


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage’s with 
www.towercoverage.com

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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Tim Hardy]

Everyone on the unlicensed side is now claiming that this was their baby, but 
if you really want to do know where the influence came from - follow the 
lobbying and follow the money.  Facebook, Amazon, Microsoft, Apple & Google 
spent over $16 million in 1st Qtr of 2020 - this thing didn't spring up over 
night and the $$$ spent on this over the last five years is astronomical.  It 
took a ton of lobbying at both the FCC and Congress just to get to the Rule 
Making process that started on Oct 1, 2018, and the RM garnered over 700 
comments, reply comments and ex-parte filings.  

The success / failure of this relies heavily on the AFC to adequately protect 
both existing and new incumbents.  Standard power devices must check-in with 
the AFC at least once a day.  The AFC will rely solely on ULS (per FCC 
requirement) and it is widely recognized that ULS has major problems and 
deficiencies - in fact, the WTB will be issuing a Public Notice reminding 
licensees of their duty to ensure that their licenses are complete and 
accurate.  The AFC systems must go through a testing and certification process 
and this will further delay things.  Its going to take some time for all of 
this before devices that require the AFC to be used.

FYI - in a letter dated January 2018, the RLAN group that includes Apple, 
Broadcom, Cisco and HP projects over 958,062,017 unlicensed devices at 6 GHz.

> On Apr 23, 2020, at 10:34 PM, Tim Withrow via AF  wrote:
> 
> After posting this I seen an article that said they (WFA) was the crusader. 
> Wispa seems to be a member of that group as well.
> https://www.wi-fi.org/discover-wi-fi/wi-fi-certified-6
> 
> 
> 
> On Thursday, April 23, 2020 Tim Reichhart  wrote:
> 
> I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it 
> WISPA isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies.
> 
>  
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: "Matt Hoppes"  >
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  >
> Date: 04/23/20 10:14
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
> 
> So did WISPA make this happen?  Or was it the millions these companies 
> dropped that made it happen?
> 
> On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen  > wrote:
> 
>> The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
>> companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of 
>> them. They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power (WiFi6) 
>> usage.
>> 
>> I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this.
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout > > wrote:
>> There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out of 
>> the goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the common 
>> man/small business. 
>> 
>> So the question is who can utilize this spectrum?
>> 
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy > > wrote:
>> FCC has total authority over these bands.
>> 
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser > > wrote:
>> How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
>> Congress?
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser > > wrote:
>> yes you are right.
>> 
>> 
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com 
>> Office: 815-570-3101
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof > > wrote:
>> More like 4.9 to 7.
>> 
>>  
>> From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On 
>> Behalf Of Erich Kaiser
>> Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM
>> To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group > >
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum
>> 
>>  
>> Two of the UNII  bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean heavily, 
>> so really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum proposed 
>> will likely be unuseable outdoor.  I feel like from a reliability standpoint 
>> it will be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general.   What about 
>> the Antenna being used on these APs are they going to be able to cover the 
>> entire band from 5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently?  Just thinking...
>> 
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> Erich Kaiser
>> 
>> North Central Tower
>> 
>> er...@northcentraltower.com 
>> Office: 815-570-3101
>> 
>>  
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett > > wrote:
>> 
>> from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list:
>> 
>>  
>> "There are really two different types of devices approved today. A Standard 
>> Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an AFC that 
>> determines what frequencies are available at its location. It must have 
>> geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see 

Re: [AFMUG] OT movie suggestions

[Dennis Burgess via AF]

TV Series:
Mrs. Browns Boys
Young Sheldon
Dark Crystal
The Expanse
The Witcher
The Magicians
Chernobyl (HBO Documentary)

Movies:
Midway (2019)
The Banker (2020)
Made in Dagenham (2010)
A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood (2019)




[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition”
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage’s with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jaime Solorza
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 7:10 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT movie suggestions

My wife watches Hulu and Netflix shows...I don't... catching up on Law and 
Order...I got to see almost the complete NYPD Blue series from start to finish 
last year ..still holds up

I might start working Homicide: Life on The Streets.
Now it's a few BBC series, some news..
At 9 pm... TV off...watch a few tower climbing or MMA videos...then shoe 
shining ASMR videos, which I just listen to with headphones...and adios 
muchacho...meemees time.

On Wed, Apr 22, 2020, 10:43 PM CBB - Jay Fuller 
mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net>> wrote:

Go watch "the last ship" on Hulu.  Was on TNT...

Sent from my smartphone

- Reply message -
From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Subject: [AFMUG] OT movie suggestions
Date: Wed, Apr 22, 2020 7:41 PM

Anyone have anything to recommend?
I saw the Ronda Rousey documentary last night.  It was well worth watching.
Death of Stalin was good.
Starting to watch Killing Eve.
Devs just got weird.  Meh
Westworld is getting weird too.
Billions starts up again soon... that is one of my favs.
Little fires was interesting in the beginning but became too much of a chick 
flick for me at the end.
I like High Maintenance.
Better call Saul is coming to and end... sob...
Homeland is ending this week ... sob ...
BlackAF is interesting.  Especially if you read up on the creator.  He did 
Blackish.  I think I will tire of it soon.

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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Dennis Burgess via AF]

Those are not available yet.  They scuttlebutt is that there is no switch chip.


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition"
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage's with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Ken Hohhof
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:42 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

So is Tilera now like PPC, they have moved on to ARM?

Seems like you'd need to see the block diagram, are all those ports directly 
connected to the CPU, or via switch chips?  And is this architected as a 
router, or a switch?

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Dennis Burgess via AF
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:34 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Cc: Dennis Burgess mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

Correction 12x 10Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces.


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition"
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage's with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Dennis Burgess via AF
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Cc: Dennis Burgess mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>>
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out


[cid:image002.png@01D61A05.24719330]

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

List price: $600


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition"
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage's with www.towercoverage.com

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Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

[Dennis Burgess via AF]

We have already placed our order, so 2 weeksish ?


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition"
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage's with www.towercoverage.com

From: AF  On Behalf Of Jim Bouse [Brazos WiFi]
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 3:50 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out

ETA?

Jim Bouse
Owner - Brazos WiFi
979-999-7000
https://imsva91-ctp.trendmicro.com:443/wis/clicktime/v1/query?url=http%3a%2f%2fwww.brazoswifi.com=AC49EE84-A408-0105-94CE-46EBBA3B98A5=079c058f437b7c6303d36c6513e5e8848d0c5ac4-27936d49296f1d98ef47932254919f8331977105

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com>> On Behalf Of 
Dennis Burgess via AF
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 1:18 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com>>
Cc: Dennis Burgess mailto:dmburg...@linktechs.net>>
Subject: [AFMUG] CCR2004 coming out


[cid:image003.png@01D61A04.F74A2070]

10x 10 Gigabit SFP+ Interfaces
2x 25 Gigabit SFP28 Interfaces
Quad Core ARM 64 bit CPU

List price: $600


[LTI-Full_175px]
Dennis Burgess, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
MTCNA, MTCRE, MTCWE, MTCTCE, MTCINE, MTCSE, HE IPv6 Sage, Cambium ePMP Certified
Author of "Learn RouterOS- Second Edition"
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services
Office: 314-735-0270  Website: 
http://www.linktechs.net
Create Wireless Coverage's with www.towercoverage.com

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Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum

[Mike Hammett]

Of course not. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Tim Reichhart"  
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"  
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 9:29:29 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum 


I dont think it was WISPA I think other companies had there fingers in it WISPA 
isnt that big in DC like some of these other companies. 







-Original Message- 
From: "Matt Hoppes" < mattli...@rivervalleyinternet.net > 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" < af@af.afmug.com > 
Date: 04/23/20 10:14 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum 



So did WISPA make this happen? Or was it the millions these companies dropped 
that made it happen? 

On Apr 23, 2020, at 9:51 PM, Eric Nielsen < ericlniel...@gmail.com > wrote: 






The primary influencers behind the rule change are some small, no-name 
companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, Broadcom. I doubt you've heard of them. 
They're interested in unlicensed 6GHz for the indoor low power (WiFi6) usage. 


I'm certain they've dropped millions lobbying for this. 





On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:45 PM TJ Trout < t...@voltbb.com > wrote: 



There must be some ulterior motive here there is no way that the FCC out of the 
goodness of their heart provided more unlicensed spectrum to the common 
man/small business. 


So the question is who can utilize this spectrum? 


On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 6:35 PM Tim Hardy < thardy...@gmail.com > wrote: 




FCC has total authority over these bands. 



On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 9:29 PM Kurt Fankhauser < lists.wavel...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



How can the FCC make spectrum available for un-licensed without an act of 
Congress? 




On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 7:30 PM Erich Kaiser < er...@northcentraltower.com > 
wrote: 



yes you are right. 












Erich Kaiser 


North Central Tower 
er...@northcentraltower.com 
Office: 815-570-3101 








On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 6:12 PM Ken Hohhof < af...@kwisp.com > wrote: 





More like 4.9 to 7. 


From: AF < af-boun...@af.afmug.com > On Behalf Of Erich Kaiser 
Sent: Thursday, April 23, 2020 5:35 PM 
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group < af@af.afmug.com > 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] New unlicensed spectrum 


Two of the UNII bands are heavily used for licensed PTP and I mean heavily, so 
really if the AFC system works correctly most of the spectrum proposed will 
likely be unuseable outdoor. I feel like from a reliability standpoint it will 
be tough to count on a system that uses AFC in general. What about the Antenna 
being used on these APs are they going to be able to cover the entire band from 
5Ghz to 6Ghz efficiently? Just thinking... 






















Erich Kaiser 


North Central Tower 

er...@northcentraltower.com 

Office: 815-570-3101 








On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 5:24 PM Sean Heskett < af...@zirkel.us > wrote: 





from Fred Goldstein via the wispa list: 



"There are really two different types of devices approved today. A Standard 
Power device, allowed +36 dBm EIRP, must communicate daily with an AFC that 
determines what frequencies are available at its location. It must have 
geolocation. (We are waiting to see the final Order to see how the "client AP" 
is handled.) The rules for the AFC are reasonably conservative, so the licensed 
PtP users are generally pretty happy with it. And a whole bunch of companies 
have already been working on AFCs. 

The Low Power Indoor device, on the other hand, does not require AFC. It is 
limited to indoor use only (must have mains power, may not be weatherproof, 
must be labeled) and is allowed +30 dBm EIRP (clients +24 dBm). Since those can 
use any frequency, the incumbents are a wee bit concerned. But between building 
entry losses (pretty high at 6 GHz) and the directionality of the FS dishes, 
harmful interference is unlikely. That is likely to be a volume market for 
Wi-Fi 6e. The higher-end business stuff, and ours, will be standard power. 

The FNPRM asks about Very Low Power outdoor operation without AFC. Like cell 
phones and small hotspots. It also asks about higher power for AFC-controlled 
devices." 



On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 4:07 PM Jaime Solorza < losguyswirel...@gmail.com > 
wrote: 



Yep...lots of buzz from this 



On Thu, Apr 23, 2020, 3:47 PM Sean Heskett < af...@zirkel.us > wrote: 



WISPA said they are waiting for them to release the order. they are hoping it's 
36db...there's a chance it's only 30db. 



On Thu, Apr 23, 2020 at 3:42 PM Tim Withrow via AF < af@af.afmug.com > wrote: 


I learned that the FCC approved 1200Mhz of unlicensed spectrum in 6 Gigahertz 
today. 
any idea what Eirp they approved for fixed wireless? 
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