Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
It should be expanded to have all the options available to you by using your arrow keys. If you have it minimized, you need to press enter on one of the main ribbons (home, insert, page layout, mailings, review, add-ins) in order to view the options under each ribbon. Steve - Original Message - From: Liuda balciu...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 5:08 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I have a question. When I press control plus F1, I hear Ribbons Expanded, Inactive. What does this mean and is this set as it should be for best results and operation? -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:05 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Al. I've noticed the Minimize Ribbons choice on Word 2010's top level ribbon. Can I assume my ribbon is maximized if I hear the minimize ribbon choice? On 3/18/2014 10:49 AM, Alan Robbins wrote: Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
It should say minimize the ribbon checked if it is minimized, otherwise it just say minimize the ribbon Regards Tom Bisset -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Jim Pursley Sent: March 18, 2014 9:54 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Al. I've noticed the Minimize Ribbons choice on Word 2010's top level ribbon. Can I assume my ribbon is maximized if I hear the minimize ribbon choice? On 3/18/2014 10:49 AM, Alan Robbins wrote: Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Yes, if it wasn't you'd here checkbox checked. Try it then undo and you'll see what I mean. Alternatively use ctrl F1 as a toggle. Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Jim Pursley Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:54 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Al. I've noticed the Minimize Ribbons choice on Word 2010's top level ribbon. Can I assume my ribbon is maximized if I hear the minimize ribbon choice? On 3/18/2014 10:49 AM, Alan Robbins wrote: Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Is it better for minimize or maximize in your opinion? -Original Message- From: david Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
the question was asked; Is it better for minimize or maximize in your opinion? well, for navigational purposes? maximized. although, I think the final say would depend on the users thought process, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Janie Degenshein Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 11:37 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Is it better for minimize or maximize in your opinion? -Original Message- From: david Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Well, I'll be damned. Thanks again for teaching this old dog a new trick. Of course, I always knew how to minimize and maximize windows, but until you mentioned the Control-F1 keystroke and the Context menu option, I had no idea that ribbon menus could also be minimized or maximized, as well. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch, to minimize the bribbon in my office program/word2007. I was able to duplacate your findings, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:44 AM
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Well, now that I have my Word 2007 ribbons maximized, I find that they are not that difficult to navigate after all. But here's a curious question. I checked every option of every ribbon menu, and can't find an option for the Letter Wizard, a handy feature that makes it easy to set up and format a letter. There used to be an audio tutorial demonstrating how to use it on the JAWS Users audio page, and it was apparently a menu option in Word 2003 and earlier. The only way I know of to launch it in Word 2007 is with the keystroke Alt-T, then E,Z. Does anyone know why this feature is hidden in Word 2007, and whether it is available in Word 2010 and 2013? Or is it on one of the Word 2007 ribbon menus that I am somehow overlooking? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation the question was asked; Is it better for minimize or maximize in your opinion? well, for navigational purposes? maximized. although, I think the final say would depend on the users thought process, -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Janie Degenshein Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 11:37 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Is it better for minimize or maximize in your opinion? -Original Message- From: david Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
That's strange. I have Ms Office 2007 here and it works that way. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:05 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello Gerald; well, glad it worked for you, you're problem/access to the ribbon menu, didn't sound right to me! so I had a hunch
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
I have a question. When I press control plus F1, I hear Ribbons Expanded, Inactive. What does this mean and is this set as it should be for best results and operation? -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:05 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Liuda, If it's expanded the ribbons should be maximized. To make sure press the, alt key, to open the menues, Open the context menu, arrow up to, minimize, if it's checked they're minimized, if it's unchecked, they're maximized. HTH Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Liuda To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 2:08 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I have a question. When I press control plus F1, I hear Ribbons Expanded, Inactive. What does this mean and is this set as it should be for best results and operation? -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 1:05 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi David, Personally speaking , for probably other list members as well, I / we can't thank you enough for teaching us about the minimizing / maximizing keystroke! What a difference! Also, about finding the option in the context menu. Thanks again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 5:43 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Amen to that! this is, as they say, a game changer. Thanks for this wonderful information; this is very helpful. Pete - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi David, Personally speaking , for probably other list members as well, I / we can't thank you enough for teaching us about the minimizing / maximizing keystroke! What a difference! Also, about finding the option in the context menu. Thanks again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 5:43 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Wow, this worked! Now the ribbon menus seem to work the way they are supposed to. Now when I scroll to the Mailings tab and press tab once, I land on Envelopes. Thanks. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well, it sounds to me like your ribbon is minimized. try opening word, then use the keystroke, ctrl+f1 key, now, you should be able to use the menus. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 6:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I arrow down from the Mailings tab in Word 2007, the first item I land on is Microsoft Office Word Help,not Envelopes, just the same as if I had pressed tab once. I'm telling you that the only way to reach the Envelopes option from the Mailings tab is to first pressEnter, then press tab once to land on Labels and then Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow to land on Envelopes. It doesn't matterwhether I'm using JAWS 9 or JAWS 13, ribbon navigation works the same way in both bersions. That's why the menu ribbons are so widely despised: there is apparently no rhyme or reason to the way they work, which can vary from computer to computer. Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 9:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
When the ribbon is minimized what is the difference if it is not minimized. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:05 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way of verifying whether the ribbon menus are minimized/hidden or maximized/restored. Very confusing. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi LeDon, If the ribbons are maximized they can be navigated much, much, more easily. HTH Take care. Mike This email was sent from my iLazyBoy. - Original Message - From: LeDon To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 7:01 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation When the ribbon is minimized what is the difference if it is not minimized. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:05 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Not in Word 2007. When I toggle Control-F1, there is no announcement of any kind. The only way I can tell for sure whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized is to launch the context menu and see whether the minimize the ribbons option is unchecked or checked, respectively. . Gerald - Original Message - From: Steve pipeguy...@gmail.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 12:04 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Another way in Ms Office is just to press control-F1. You will either hear collapsed or expanded. It is minimized if it is collapsed. - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:56 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation gerald; if you want to know if the ribbon is minimized or maximized, in MSWord2007, 1, open word, 2, press the alt key, this gets you into the ribbon menu, now press the applications key, now up arrow, you will hear, minimize the ribbon, if it's checked, you will hear checked. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 10:48 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Apparently, this feature is absent in Word 2007 because when I scroll across the ribbon menus with the left and right arrow key, I do not encounter any check box or button that indicates whether the ribbon menus are minimized or maximized. If I scroll across the upper ribbons with the right arrow key, the last tab I encounter is Search Commands. If I continue to right arrow, I land on the Microsoft Office Word Help button, then Office Button Submenu Grid and finally wrap around back to theHome tab. If I minimize the ribbons by pressingControl-F1, I get the same results, although, interestingly, the upper tabs seem to respond a little less sluggishly in this minimized mode than they do when the ribbons are maximized. Other than this subtle clue, I have no other way to know whether the ribbons are minimized or maximized, and I suspect that other blind users of Office 2007 may be unaware that their ribbon menus are not properly maximized, and hence become frustrated trying to navigate them. Perhaps JAWS should be enhanced so that it announces something like ribbons minimized and ribbons restored when Control-F1 is pressed repeatedly. Gerald - Original Message - From: Alan Robbins arobb...@nycap.rr.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:49 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Gerald, I don't have Office 2007 but do have Office 2010. If you hit your alt key in Word and right arrow across the top ribbon structure, toward the end you'll hear a button that says minimize the ribbons. If you select this with space bar and then repeat the steps this time it will announce a check box that is checked. Of course the ctrl F1 toggles it as well as David mentioned. Best, Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2014 9:29 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation What's amazing to me is that my ribbon menus were apparently minimized from the get go when Office 2007 was originally installed on my system five years ago, and I simply didn't realize until now that they were not functioning correctly. Maybe a lot of other blind computer users also have their ribbon menus minimized/hidden, and so become frustrated trying to navigate the MS Word menus in their minimized format. I had no idea that Control-F1 is a toggle that hides or restores the ribbon menus because the tech guy from the rehab center who originally installed Office 2007 on my computer never mentioned it. If Mike D had not brought up the subject of ribbon navigation, I would have continued to grope around my Word 2007 menus the way they were, remaining ignorant that they were never in proper maximized ribbon format in the first place. Also, JAWS does not announce any change when you press Control-F1, so you really have no way
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
That's because I don't think you are doing it correctly. In ribbons, there is vertical navigation. When you scroll to Mailings, don't press Enter. Arrow down. You should see two options then envelopes and labels. If you want to address an envelope, select that. If you want to print a bunch of labels, select that and then go through the options. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 8:57 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation I just tried ribbon navigation using JAWS 13, and I get the same results on the Word 2007 Mailings tab as with JAWS 9. If I scroll to the Mailings tab, then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help. If I scroll to Mailings, press Enter and then press Tab once, I hear Labels, just like wit JAWS 9. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. So no matter what I do, Envelopes does not come up as the first option under Mailings. Perhaps ribbon menus behave differently in XP than they do in Windows 7 and 8. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Monday, March 17, 2014 7:33 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello there; well I do understand what your saying; however, my only question is? why are you pressing enter on the mailings tab? once you've right arrow to mailings tab, just use the tab key? my only other thought would be, because your using an earlier version of jaws, I'm using jaws 15, I think I recall you saying your using jaws 9. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:06 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Mike, I have office 20007. I would appreciate any help you can send. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 8:49 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Jim, What version of Office are you running? It seems that using Ubit in Office 2007 or Office 2010 may have slightly different steps. Also, the steps may vary just a touch when using the Ubit program in Power Point, Excel, or Word, I need to work with the various programs to give Señor Ferrin the proper steps. I don't have Office 2013, as of yet, to work with but, possibly soon! I'm defintely a glutton for punishment! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: jim rawls To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if you gag help, send it along, because I don't get it either, as I said earlier. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:10 PM To: Jaws-Users List Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Exactly. You would logically think that in order to get to something west of you, and you move east around the globe, you would eventually get there. But you cannot. Yet, move west from your origin, and you'll find it. It makes absolutely no sense at all. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy bwaylimi...@verizon.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:54 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi David, Thank you very much for your explanation of the upper lower ribbon structure. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: david To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 5:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Gerald, When you right arrow to the Mailing tab try not pressing enter but, just tab from the Mailing tab without pressing enter. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 10:18 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay focused on the particular tab title. if you go to the top of the ribbon, now do a ctrl+tab, you will hear such things as, page numbers button, use the right arrow,or the tab key, word count, spelling and grammar button, etc, also, keep in mind, you can find many settings, access, when you use the applications key in word. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of jim rawls Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:24 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons, obviously, you have an upper and lower part of the ribbon. the upper part is primarily the various tabs, example: home, insert, page layout, etc, the lower part of the ribbon provides the various setting for each of the tabs. to access the settings, use the tab key, now you may hear things such as, 1 of 4, one of 8, so, by using the tab key, you'll stay in the lower part of the ribbon, and stay
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Gerald, Do, not, press enter on the, Mailing tab!! Just right arrow to it tab 1 time, see if that works. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option to find it? And navigating the ribbon menus in MS Office is one thing, but what about the ribbon menus for Windows Explorer and Internet Explorer which are used in Windows 8? This is a whole other ball game altogether. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 8:42 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well here's my take on the ribbons
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
If I scroll to the Mailings tab in Word 2007 without hitting Enter, and then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help Button. If I tab again, I hear Office submenu grid, and if I tab a third time, I hear Quick Access Tool Bar. To get to Envelopes and Labels, I have to pressEnter when I land on the Mailings tab. Gerald - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Gerald, Do, not, press enter on the, Mailing tab!! Just right arrow to it tab 1 time, see if that works. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options , but never encounter the Envelopes option. However, if I navigate back to the Labels option and then press Shift-Tab or Shift-left arrow, the Envelopes option magically appears. This behavior certainly doesn't make any sense to me. Why doesn't the Envelopes option appear when you keep pressing Tab? Why do you have to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Gerald, Okay, thank you very much for the clarification. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:13 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation If I scroll to the Mailings tab in Word 2007 without hitting Enter, and then press tab once, I hear Microsoft Office Word Help Button. If I tab again, I hear Office submenu grid, and if I tab a third time, I hear Quick Access Tool Bar. To get to Envelopes and Labels, I have to pressEnter when I land on the Mailings tab. Gerald - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 4:45 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Gerald, Do, not, press enter on the, Mailing tab!! Just right arrow to it tab 1 time, see if that works. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Gerald Levy To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Please don't misunderstand. I only used the Mailings tab as an example of how navigating the ribbon menu can yield unpredictable results. I have been using the Alt-M, E shortcut keystroke ever since I began using Word 2007, so I am familiar with it. But if I use the alternate technique to get to the Envelopes option and I press Tab after hitting Enter on the Mailings tab, the first thing I hear is Labels, not Envelopes. If I then press Shift-Tab, I hear Envelopes. Maybe this is just an unusual quirk, but there are probably others just like it that I am not aware of. Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 2:21 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; what happens if; 1, you go to the ribbon menu, 2, right arrow to mailings tab, 3, now just use the tab key one time, what do you hear; also, have you tried the shortcut, alt+m+e so, alt+m=mailings, e=envelope. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 1:18 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Your instructions don't work for me. When I Hit Enter on the Mailings tab in Word 2007 using JAWS 9, and then press tab, the first item I land on is Labels, not Envelopes. Intuitively, you would think that by continuing to press the tab key, I would eventually land on the Envelopes option. But this is not the case. The only way I can reach Envelopes is to press Shift-Tab from the Labels option. Of course, a sighted person could see the juxtaposition of the Labels and Envelopes options. But there is no easy way for a blind person to find it unless he is clever enough to experiment with various key combinations and finds it by accident, or is told how to find it. That's why the JAWS virtual menu feature was developed. By the way, did you know that the popular Envelope Wizard feature from earlier versions of Word is not located on any Word 2007 menus, but can be launched only with the secret key combination Alt-T, then E, Z? Does hiding a popular feature like this make any sense? Gerald - Original Message - From: david davidwhitehead1...@cogeco.ca To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 11:55 AM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation hello; well; if I were wanting to print out an envelope, using word 2007, 1, menu right arrow until you hear mailing tab, now, use the tab key, the first press of the tab key you will see/hear, envelope. now, press enter. or, within the document, press, alt+m+e, you don't press enter on the mailings tab, however, if your using the jaws virtual ribbon feature, then after going to the menu, right arrow to mailings tab, now press enter, now right arrow one time, you will see envelope. I don't use the jaws ribbon feature, so, I can use the shortcut keys. -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Gerald Levy Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2014 9:55 AM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation It's not that simple. Here's a specific example of why the ribbon menus are so maddening. Suppose I want to print an envelope using Word 2007, but I can't recall the quick tip keys to access the Envelopes option on the Mailings tab. First, I press Alt to bring up the menu tabs, then use right arrow to scroll to the Mailings tab and select it by pressing Enter. The first item I encounter after pressing Tab is Labels. If I continue to tab from this point, I will get dozens of options
[JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Another reason I do not like anything beyond Windows XP. Visually? They may be appealing. Screen reader usage? CrapOla! They should not have fixed what was not broken. I must use the feature of jaws that is a work around to these ribbon menus which are of no use other than being an unnecessary nuisance to a blind computer user. If such a tutorial exists, I would also like to know where to find it. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
I would like to know what this ribbon stuff is for and how to eliminate any mention of it on my computer. Marilyn - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation : Hi All, : : I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the : hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the : ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the : Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the : hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess : it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really : like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in : simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because : I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, : hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL : : So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. : Thanks much. : Take care. : Mike : This email was sent from my, iBarstool. : For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: : http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Mike, Other than learning all the first letter navigation ways to go through the menus, the next best think I found was the JAWS virtual cursor. Have you tried that or just don't want to use it? Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 5:10 PM To: Jaws-Users List Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
The problem is that you can tab or arrow into a subRibbon, if you could call it that, and the opposite keystroke such as a shift leftarrow or shift tab does not bring you back to where you were when you used the keystroke that got you into that subRibbon. If I go too far north along a sidewalk, I expect to be able to accurately retrace my steps to get back to where I made the error in judgment. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch florl...@iol.ie To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
How could adding layers be of any benefit to sighted users? I! hate! ribbons! too! Sunny Day Maria Campbell lucky1i...@sbcglobal.net When the power of love is stronger than the love of power, Then the world will know peace. On 3/15/2014 5:16 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: Another reason I do not like anything beyond Windows XP. Visually? They may be appealing. Screen reader usage? CrapOla! They should not have fixed what was not broken. I must use the feature of jaws that is a work around to these ribbon menus which are of no use other than being an unnecessary nuisance to a blind computer user. If such a tutorial exists, I would also like to know where to find it. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hello, If you go to: http://vip.chowo.co.uk/jaws-guides/ There is a tutorial on using JAWS and Windows live mail 2011. Within this guide there is a section on how to use the ribbons. It is a fairly good guide to using them. Greg Wocher Follow me on Twitter @GWocher On 3/15/2014 5:09 PM, Mike B. wrote: Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
And that is the nice thing about the virtual ribbons, they do exactly that Al -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 6:58 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation The problem is that you can tab or arrow into a subRibbon, if you could call it that, and the opposite keystroke such as a shift leftarrow or shift tab does not bring you back to where you were when you used the keystroke that got you into that subRibbon. If I go too far north along a sidewalk, I expect to be able to accurately retrace my steps to get back to where I made the error in judgment. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch florl...@iol.ie To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Amen, Bharles. MS broke it in order to make money, of course. They could have rested on their laurels, bragged up xp and issued a new version while not shoving win 7 down our throats. Marilyn - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 5:16 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation : Another reason I do not like anything beyond Windows XP. Visually? They : may be appealing. Screen reader usage? CrapOla! They should not have : fixed what was not broken. I must use the feature of jaws that is a work : around to these ribbon menus which are of no use other than being an : unnecessary nuisance to a blind computer user. If such a tutorial exists, I : would also like to know where to find it. : : --- : Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, : you! really! are! finished! : - Original Message - : From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net : To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com : Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:09 PM : Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation : : : Hi All, : : I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the : hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the : ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the : Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get : the : hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess : it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really : like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in : simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because : I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, : hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL : : So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. : Thanks much. : Take care. : Mike : This email was sent from my, iBarstool. : For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: : http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ : : : For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: : http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Greg, Very cool. Thank you mooy moocho! Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Greg Wocher To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:34 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello, If you go to: http://vip.chowo.co.uk/jaws-guides/ There is a tutorial on using JAWS and Windows live mail 2011. Within this guide there is a section on how to use the ribbons. It is a fairly good guide to using them. Greg Wocher Follow me on Twitter @GWocher On 3/15/2014 5:09 PM, Mike B. wrote: Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
~Can someone tell me how the jaws virtual ribbons work? -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 7:11 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Greg, Very cool. Thank you mooy moocho! Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Greg Wocher To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:34 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello, If you go to: http://vip.chowo.co.uk/jaws-guides/ There is a tutorial on using JAWS and Windows live mail 2011. Within this guide there is a section on how to use the ribbons. It is a fairly good guide to using them. Greg Wocher Follow me on Twitter @GWocher On 3/15/2014 5:09 PM, Mike B. wrote: Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
I agree with your assessment. Indeed, I bore it in mind when writing up my own thing about Ribbons a few hours ago now. - Original Message - From: Greg Wocher icewolf2...@gtwebdesign.us To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 11:34 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hello, If you go to: http://vip.chowo.co.uk/jaws-guides/ There is a tutorial on using JAWS and Windows live mail 2011. Within this guide there is a section on how to use the ribbons. It is a fairly good guide to using them. Greg Wocher Follow me on Twitter @GWocher On 3/15/2014 5:09 PM, Mike B. wrote: Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Mike, if the powers that be won't post it to the list, please send it to me. I just plain flunk out of the using ribbons class. I just don't know how to use it. Send it to: jazzpi...@ca.rr.com. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:35 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi Flor All, I thank you very much for your input ideas but, I found a little program called UBit that makes navigating the ribbons a much more simple endeavor! I'll send the information steps I've typed up to the head honcho let him make the decision on if it can be posted or not. Thank you all again. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: Flor Lynch To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:35 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, I'll try this in general brief but rough summary, dealing with the idea of it. You're familiar with tab controls? The different pages (ctrl+tab) you get in multi-page dialog boxes? Well, ribbons are much the same as them. You can also right- or left-arrow between each of them. Now you have lower ribbons, or sub-ribbons, which will be accessed through their parent ribbons - often down-arrow from such if there's a sub-or lower-ribbon present on an option. The JAWS Virtual Ribbons are not the real Ribbons, and indeed, in some cases they rearrange many things in the structure and leave other things out. Another way to regard them is as if they were toobars activated with buttons. (You may recall Excel had plenty of those.) Now the good news is that there are many, many hot keys associated with the items in the Ribbons, that can be activated. However, it does take longer to accomplish a task i.e., more keystrokes, that formerly used to be a quite simple structural through the menu approach. Things are now more layered than they were, i.e. more vertical rather than linear. - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 9:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Join the club. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Maria Campbell Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:11 PM To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation How could adding layers be of any benefit to sighted users? I! hate! ribbons! too! Sunny Day Maria Campbell lucky1i...@sbcglobal.net When the power of love is stronger than the love of power, Then the world will know peace. On 3/15/2014 5:16 PM, Charles Rivard wrote: Another reason I do not like anything beyond Windows XP. Visually? They may be appealing. Screen reader usage? CrapOla! They should not have fixed what was not broken. I must use the feature of jaws that is a work around to these ribbon menus which are of no use other than being an unnecessary nuisance to a blind computer user. If such a tutorial exists, I would also like to know where to find it. --- Be positive! When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, you! really! are! finished! - Original Message - From: Mike B. mb69ma...@charter.net To: Jaws-Users List jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 4:09 PM Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Mike, if you gag help, send it along, because I don't get it either, as I said earlier. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:10 PM To: Jaws-Users List Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation
Hi Jim, What version of Office are you running? It seems that using Ubit in Office 2007 or Office 2010 may have slightly different steps. Also, the steps may vary just a touch when using the Ubit program in Power Point, Excel, or Word, I need to work with the various programs to give Señor Ferrin the proper steps. I don't have Office 2013, as of yet, to work with but, possibly soon! I'm defintely a glutton for punishment! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. - Original Message - From: jim rawls To: jaws-users-list@jaws-users.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Mike, if you gag help, send it along, because I don't get it either, as I said earlier. Jim -Original Message- From: JAWS-Users-List [mailto:jaws-users-list-boun...@jaws-users.com] On Behalf Of Mike B. Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2014 2:10 PM To: Jaws-Users List Subject: [JAWS-Users] Ribbons Navigation Hi All, I'll get right to the point. The ribbons in Office 07 up frustrate the hell out of me! I've been searching for a good tutorial that explains the ribbons, i.e, both upper lower, navigating the with without using the Jaws Virtual Ribbons option I'm not having any luck. I just can't get the hang or get my head wrapped around on how to navigate ribbons I guess it's high time I start living in the new world of Office! I would really like a tutorial that really breaks the ribbons navigating them down in simple, easy to understand steps. I need something really simple because I'm certainly a knucklehead when it comes to this ribbons crap! LOL, hahaha hahaha hahaha, LOL So folks, any help will be graciously accepted greatly appreciated. Thanks much. Take care. Mike This email was sent from my, iBarstool. For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/ For answers to frequently asked questions about this list visit: http://www.jaws-users.com/help/
