Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[John]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVSRm80WzZk

On 7/22/2019 01:06:46, Alan C wrote:
My late uncle told me of a strange occurrence on the family farm back in 1936. 
The family were the proud owners of a spanking new Jaguar SS. While he was 
polishing the beast late on a balmy Saturday afternoon ready for its weekly trip 
to Church, a small green, box shaped car came trundling down the dirt farm road. 
The driver seemed very disorientated & had obviously lost his way. After giving 
him directions to get back to the main road, he asked if he could look under the 
bonnet. He had never seen anything like it before - front wheel drive with a 
small transverse Cooper engine. The visitor admired the gleaming Jaguar & said 
he was busy restoring a 1938 model. My uncle asked how that could be seeing it 
was only 1936. The visitor did not answer - he thanked my uncle, climbed into 
his car and drove off, disappearing into the dusk. My uncle said he slept very 
uneasily that night. Early on the Sunday morning he walked out of the house & 
noticed the tyre tread pattern of the visitor,s car in the sand. It was a 
pattern he had never seen before. He decided to follow it up the road but after 
about 200yds it became fainter & simply disappeared. He then walked the other 
direction & found exactly the same thing. In 1960 I became the proud owner of a 
Mini-Cooper!


Alan C

On 21-Jul-19 11:07 PM, Bob Pdml wrote:

On 21 Jul 2019, at 16:29, Mark Roberts  wrote:

Steve Cottrell wrote:

If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little 
visit a few years ago

That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
haven't visited us in the past.

What a relief!


maybe they will have visited us in some past yet to come...









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Religion - Answers we must never question.

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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Alan C]

My late uncle told me of a strange occurrence on the family farm back in 
1936. The family were the proud owners of a spanking new Jaguar SS. 
While he was polishing the beast late on a balmy Saturday afternoon 
ready for its weekly trip to Church, a small green, box shaped car came 
trundling down the dirt farm road. The driver seemed very disorientated 
& had obviously lost his way. After giving him directions to get back to 
the main road, he asked if he could look under the bonnet. He had never 
seen anything like it before - front wheel drive with a small transverse 
Cooper engine. The visitor admired the gleaming Jaguar & said he was 
busy restoring a 1938 model. My uncle asked how that could be seeing it 
was only 1936. The visitor did not answer - he thanked my uncle, climbed 
into his car and drove off, disappearing into the dusk. My uncle said he 
slept very uneasily that night. Early on the Sunday morning he walked 
out of the house & noticed the tyre tread pattern of the visitor,s car 
in the sand. It was a pattern he had never seen before. He decided to 
follow it up the road but after about 200yds it became fainter & simply 
disappeared. He then walked the other direction & found exactly the same 
thing. In 1960 I became the proud owner of a Mini-Cooper!


Alan C

On 21-Jul-19 11:07 PM, Bob Pdml wrote:

On 21 Jul 2019, at 16:29, Mark Roberts  wrote:

Steve Cottrell wrote:


If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little visit a 
few years ago

That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
haven't visited us in the past.

What a relief!


maybe they will have visited us in some past yet to come...






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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Thank you. 

The Earth's Moon is larger than Pluto, which—until it was demoted recently—was 
considered a "planet"..
;-)

Of course, it's more as a figure of speech as I used the word, rather than a 
precise statement of fact.

G
—
Such are the arguments of wizards that they generally end up where they began.

> On Jul 20, 2019, at 12:46 PM, Daniel J. Matyola  wrote:
> 
> I agree with everything you said, Godfrey, except, of course, the moon is
> not really "another planet.'  That does not in any measure diminish the
> achievement or what it has meant.
> 
> Dan Matyola
> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola


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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[William Robb]

On Sun, Jul 21, 2019 at 3:06 PM Bob Pdml  wrote:

>
> > On 21 Jul 2019, at 20:42, William Robb 
> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> On 21/7/19, Alan C, discombobulated, unleashed:
> >>
> >>> AI. There is no such thing. Machines only react to mountains of info in
> >>> their databases. They are incapable of original thought. The problems
> >>> with driverless cars occur when situations not in their databases are
> >>> encountered. At best, machines & robots are nothing more than super
> >> slaves.
> >>
> >
> > The problem with driverless cars is going to come to a head when a car
> has
> > to make a decision about who lives and who dies.
> > Either way, it’s a no win for the manufacturer and programmer of the
> > vehicle.
> >
> >
>
> https://theconversation.com/driverless-cars-once-theyre-on-the-road-human-drivers-should-be-banned-118293


Nice pap piece, but all it is doing is forwarding an agenda with a
narrative.

Put two people darting out into traffic with no way for the vehicle to
respond until someone is going to be hit. The car has to choose one or the
other to die.
Either way, especially if this happens in the USA, the company that built
the car, and the people who writhe the software that told the car which
choice to make, is going to face a pretty heavy lawsuit.

Frankly, it scares me that we are preparing to put machines into that
position. Who should live and who should die being decided by an algorithm.
The machine acting as God.


>
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Daniel J. Matyola]

Goodbye and thanks for all the fish.

Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola


On Sun, Jul 21, 2019 at 5:02 PM Bob Pdml  wrote:

> https://tinyurl.com/y6mkb3ut
>
>
> https://lightroom.adobe.com/shares/00f4c7321374431ea848517ce1613814/albums/775e41e7fe91462d820fd3ba97d4cc07/assets/b162bb4ac7564d6ea31f8a468fdb09d4
>
> > On 20 Jul 2019, at 18:20, Godfrey DiGiorgi 
> wrote:
> >
> > And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another
> planet. All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and
> wonder, and was uplifted by that fact.
> >
> > All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as for
> all the generations of history before and since. That will always be. And
> the true sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that pushing to do
> this and creating all the technology and good stuff that it spawned which
> helps human beings live longer, be more productive, and look at the world
> and the stars around them with new insights, is that it ended and we
> haven't gone back or further yet.
> >
> > But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did something
> worth writing in the history of our species that no other species we know
> has done. And all the naysayers and querulous ambivalents in the world can
> moan and whine and whinge about whether we should have or not, but it
> doesn't matter at all: We managed to do it, and it was good, and it is
> amazing, and it brought all of us worldwide together for one shining moment
> of joy and wonder.
> >
> > If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.
> >
> >
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Bob Pdml]

> On 21 Jul 2019, at 16:29, Mark Roberts  wrote:
> 
> Steve Cottrell wrote:
> 
>> If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little 
>> visit a few years ago
> 
> That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
> haven't visited us in the past.
> 
> What a relief!
> 

maybe they will have visited us in some past yet to come...



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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Bob Pdml]

> On 21 Jul 2019, at 20:42, William Robb  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> On 21/7/19, Alan C, discombobulated, unleashed:
>> 
>>> AI. There is no such thing. Machines only react to mountains of info in
>>> their databases. They are incapable of original thought. The problems
>>> with driverless cars occur when situations not in their databases are
>>> encountered. At best, machines & robots are nothing more than super
>> slaves.
>> 
> 
> The problem with driverless cars is going to come to a head when a car has
> to make a decision about who lives and who dies.
> Either way, it’s a no win for the manufacturer and programmer of the
> vehicle.
> 
> 
https://theconversation.com/driverless-cars-once-theyre-on-the-road-human-drivers-should-be-banned-118293


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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Bob Pdml]

https://tinyurl.com/y6mkb3ut

https://lightroom.adobe.com/shares/00f4c7321374431ea848517ce1613814/albums/775e41e7fe91462d820fd3ba97d4cc07/assets/b162bb4ac7564d6ea31f8a468fdb09d4

> On 20 Jul 2019, at 18:20, Godfrey DiGiorgi  wrote:
> 
> And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another planet. 
> All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and wonder, and was 
> uplifted by that fact.
> 
> All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as for all 
> the generations of history before and since. That will always be. And the 
> true sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that pushing to do this and 
> creating all the technology and good stuff that it spawned which helps human 
> beings live longer, be more productive, and look at the world and the stars 
> around them with new insights, is that it ended and we haven't gone back or 
> further yet.
> 
> But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did something 
> worth writing in the history of our species that no other species we know has 
> done. And all the naysayers and querulous ambivalents in the world can moan 
> and whine and whinge about whether we should have or not, but it doesn't 
> matter at all: We managed to do it, and it was good, and it is amazing, and 
> it brought all of us worldwide together for one shining moment of joy and 
> wonder.
> 
> If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.
> 
> 
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[William Robb]

On Sun, Jul 21, 2019 at 5:59 AM Steve Cottrell  wrote:

> On 21/7/19, Alan C, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
> >AI. There is no such thing. Machines only react to mountains of info in
> >their databases. They are incapable of original thought. The problems
> >with driverless cars occur when situations not in their databases are
> >encountered. At best, machines & robots are nothing more than super
> slaves.
>
> Be interesting to see if this stands the test of time.
>
> If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little
> visit a few years ago


The problem with driverless cars is going to come to a head when a car has
to make a decision about who lives and who dies.
Either way, it’s a no win for the manufacturer and programmer of the
vehicle.

Bill
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Paul Stenquist]

Skynet visited me in the past, Two guys in dark suits knocked on my door. 
Apparently, it’s in serious financial trouble in the future, so they’ve adopted 
the Jehova’s Witnesses business model and are seeking donations.

Paul

> On Jul 21, 2019, at 11:29 AM, Mark Roberts  wrote:
> 
> Steve Cottrell wrote:
> 
>> If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little 
>> visit a few years ago
> 
> That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
> haven't visited us in the past.
> 
> What a relief!
> 
> -- 
> Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia
> www.robertstech.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Steve Cottrell]

On 21/7/19, Mark Roberts, discombobulated, unleashed:

>That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
>haven't visited us in the past

Or we could just be in a recuring loop between those two points.

-- 


Cheers,
  Cotty


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||  (O)  |Live Broadcast News
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Mark Roberts]

Steve Cottrell wrote:

>If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little visit 
>a few years ago

That's it! We know Skynet won't ever exist in the future because they
haven't visited us in the past.

What a relief!
 
-- 
Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia
www.robertstech.com





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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Steve Cottrell]

On 21/7/19, Alan C, discombobulated, unleashed:

>AI. There is no such thing. Machines only react to mountains of info in 
>their databases. They are incapable of original thought. The problems 
>with driverless cars occur when situations not in their databases are 
>encountered. At best, machines & robots are nothing more than super slaves.

Be interesting to see if this stands the test of time.

If Skynet exists in the future, I'm sure they'll be paying you a little visit a 
few years ago



-- 


Cheers,
  Cotty


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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Alan C]

Well put, Godfrey. Man will eventually go further. He will need to do a 
lot to save mother earth too. Too many people, too few resources. We 
can't be far from the tipping point.


AI. There is no such thing. Machines only react to mountains of info in 
their databases. They are incapable of original thought. The problems 
with driverless cars occur when situations not in their databases are 
encountered. At best, machines & robots are nothing more than super slaves.


Alan C


On 20-Jul-19 08:56 PM, Jos de Fotograaf wrote:

Right Godfrey,

maybe the last really  great thing we did before our role in evolution 
will be taken over by AI / Robotics.

I would give a few years of my life for a glance in the future.

Greetz, Jos van der Hijden

On 7/20/2019 7:20 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:
And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another 
planet. All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and 
wonder, and was uplifted by that fact.


All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as 
for all the generations of history before and since. That will always 
be. And the true sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that 
pushing to do this and creating all the technology and good stuff 
that it spawned which helps human beings live longer, be more 
productive, and look at the world and the stars around them with new 
insights, is that it ended and we haven't gone back or further yet.


But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did 
something worth writing in the history of our species that no other 
species we know has done. And all the naysayers and querulous 
ambivalents in the world can moan and whine and whinge about whether 
we should have or not, but it doesn't matter at all: We managed to do 
it, and it was good, and it is amazing, and it brought all of us 
worldwide together for one shining moment of joy and wonder.


If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.

G
—
No matter where you go, there you are.






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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Stan Halpin]

A neighbor of mine in Kansas City had worked as a programmer for a NASA 
contractor. He suggested a software patch (a backdoor) to allow control of 
shuttle operations onboard. Boss said “Not in the specs. Work it on your own 
time if you like.” So he did. And Apollo 13 redirect back home became possible 
because of his code. I am sure there are thousands of other stories of 
too-seldom acknowledged bits of engineering creativity and foresight.

Some place I have the B negs of the shots I took of the landing. (From my tv 
screen.)

Stan

Sent from my iPad

> On Jul 20, 2019, at 3:46 PM, Daniel J. Matyola  wrote:
> 
> I agree with everything you said, Godfrey, except, of course, the moon is
> not really "another planet.'  That does not in any measure diminish the
> achievement or what it has meant.
> 
> Dan Matyola
> http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola
> 
> 
> On Sat, Jul 20, 2019 at 1:21 PM Godfrey DiGiorgi 
> wrote:
> 
>> And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another
>> planet. All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and
>> wonder, and was uplifted by that fact.
>> 
>> All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as for all
>> the generations of history before and since. That will always be. And the
>> true sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that pushing to do this
>> and creating all the technology and good stuff that it spawned which helps
>> human beings live longer, be more productive, and look at the world and the
>> stars around them with new insights, is that it ended and we haven't gone
>> back or further yet.
>> 
>> But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did something
>> worth writing in the history of our species that no other species we know
>> has done. And all the naysayers and querulous ambivalents in the world can
>> moan and whine and whinge about whether we should have or not, but it
>> doesn't matter at all: We managed to do it, and it was good, and it is
>> amazing, and it brought all of us worldwide together for one shining moment
>> of joy and wonder.
>> 
>> If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.
>> 
>> G
>> —
>> No matter where you go, there you are.
>> --
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>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
>> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and
>> follow the directions.
>> 
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Daniel J. Matyola]

I agree with everything you said, Godfrey, except, of course, the moon is
not really "another planet.'  That does not in any measure diminish the
achievement or what it has meant.

Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola


On Sat, Jul 20, 2019 at 1:21 PM Godfrey DiGiorgi 
wrote:

> And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another
> planet. All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and
> wonder, and was uplifted by that fact.
>
> All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as for all
> the generations of history before and since. That will always be. And the
> true sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that pushing to do this
> and creating all the technology and good stuff that it spawned which helps
> human beings live longer, be more productive, and look at the world and the
> stars around them with new insights, is that it ended and we haven't gone
> back or further yet.
>
> But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did something
> worth writing in the history of our species that no other species we know
> has done. And all the naysayers and querulous ambivalents in the world can
> moan and whine and whinge about whether we should have or not, but it
> doesn't matter at all: We managed to do it, and it was good, and it is
> amazing, and it brought all of us worldwide together for one shining moment
> of joy and wonder.
>
> If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.
>
> G
> —
> No matter where you go, there you are.
> --
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> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
> to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and
> follow the directions.
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Re: Thoughts on 50th...

[Jos de Fotograaf]

Right Godfrey,

maybe the last really  great thing we did before our role in evolution 
will be taken over by AI / Robotics.

I would give a few years of my life for a glance in the future.

Greetz, Jos van der Hijden

On 7/20/2019 7:20 PM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote:

And today is the day, 50 years on, that Mankind first touched another planet. 
All of us, together. OMG! The whole world watched in awe and wonder, and was 
uplifted by that fact.

All the problems of the world were then as well as now, as well as for all the 
generations of history before and since. That will always be. And the true 
sadness of the Apollo missions, despite all that pushing to do this and 
creating all the technology and good stuff that it spawned which helps human 
beings live longer, be more productive, and look at the world and the stars 
around them with new insights, is that it ended and we haven't gone back or 
further yet.

But, g*n it, we managed to do something incredible. We did something worth 
writing in the history of our species that no other species we know has done. 
And all the naysayers and querulous ambivalents in the world can moan and whine 
and whinge about whether we should have or not, but it doesn't matter at all: 
We managed to do it, and it was good, and it is amazing, and it brought all of 
us worldwide together for one shining moment of joy and wonder.

If that's not worth whatever it cost, then nothing is.

G
—
No matter where you go, there you are.



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Re: thoughts on the K-1 vs K-3

[Mark Roberts]

For my trek through Yorkshire on the Pennine Way next month I'm going
to be taking the K-1 (over the K-5) mainly because of the GPS tagging.
I never thought I'd use it but it's amazing how wrong I was. It's
absolutely brilliant when traveling. Hell, even close to home it's
easy to forget where I took a particular shot if there's no
identifying landmark in the shot.
 
-- 
Mark Roberts - Photography & Multimedia
www.robertstech.com





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Re: thoughts on the K-1 vs K-3

[Alan C]

Fortunately I'll never have to make such stressful decisions.

Alan C

-Original Message- 
From: Henk Terhell

Sent: 14 April, 2018 5:14 PM
To: pdml@pdml.net
Subject: Re: thoughts on the K-1 vs K-3

For me there is also always the dilemma going for a walk: do I take the
K-1 or the K-5. Weight/size versus quality.
The K-5 with the DA 21/3.2 limited is so conveniently small and fits
well under a coat in cold weather, though I see people thinking  I am
growing a belly.
Once I decide to take the K-1 the question comes up whether the ND grad
filter should go along, but that implies also the tripod, so I'll take a
backpack with more lenses...

Never do I put APS lenses on the K-1 following Northrup's advice on YT
as there is no gain in pixels.
With both cameras I am frequently struggling on focusing so that is not
an issue for me.

Henk

Op 2018-04-14 om 10:09 schreef Larry Colen:
I've noticed that lately that when I'm grabbing a camera to have with me 
when I go out, I've been a lot less picky about whether I grab my K-1 or 
K-3.  Ignoring price, if you happen to have both lying around, there are a 
lot of ways in which the K-1 is a better camera than the K-3, and a few 
that the K-3 is better than the K-1. If size, weight and fps don't 
tremendously matter, then the K-1 is a pretty damn nice APS camera in crop 
mode. It doesn't have the resolution in APS of the K-3, nor the frame 
rate, but the focus is better, and its focus points cover much more of the 
APS frame.


In challenging light, or challenging focus conditions, the K-1 does 
better, not hugely but noticeably so, than the K-3. However, in decent 
light and for that matter even some pretty lousy light, walking around 
taking pictures, I can think of very few cases (if any) where I'd look at 
the final image and be able to tell whether I shot it with the K-3 and 
16-50 or the K-1 and the 28-75.


To be sure, there are lots of times that to get a particular shot, I 
really need the larger sensor in the K-1, those are usually night time 
wide angle shots.  Also, when I'm photographing musicians and don't want 
to get great shots of microphones with blurry musicians in the background, 
the K-1 far outshines the K-3. But I've recently been surprised to realize 
how often, for basic shooting, it really doesn't matter to me which camera 
I grab.


I will note that I haven't gotten to the point of grabbing the K-1 and APS 
only lenses like the 18-250.





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Re: thoughts on the K-1 vs K-3

[Henk Terhell]

For me there is also always the dilemma going for a walk: do I take the 
K-1 or the K-5. Weight/size versus quality.
The K-5 with the DA 21/3.2 limited is so conveniently small and fits 
well under a coat in cold weather, though I see people thinking  I am 
growing a belly.
Once I decide to take the K-1 the question comes up whether the ND grad 
filter should go along, but that implies also the tripod, so I'll take a 
backpack with more lenses...


Never do I put APS lenses on the K-1 following Northrup's advice on YT 
as there is no gain in pixels.
With both cameras I am frequently struggling on focusing so that is not 
an issue for me.


Henk

Op 2018-04-14 om 10:09 schreef Larry Colen:
I've noticed that lately that when I'm grabbing a camera to have with 
me when I go out, I've been a lot less picky about whether I grab my 
K-1 or K-3.  Ignoring price, if you happen to have both lying around, 
there are a lot of ways in which the K-1 is a better camera than the 
K-3, and a few that the K-3 is better than the K-1. If size, weight 
and fps don't tremendously matter, then the K-1 is a pretty damn nice 
APS camera in crop mode. It doesn't have the resolution in APS of the 
K-3, nor the frame rate, but the focus is better, and its focus points 
cover much more of the APS frame.


In challenging light, or challenging focus conditions, the K-1 does 
better, not hugely but noticeably so, than the K-3. However, in decent 
light and for that matter even some pretty lousy light, walking around 
taking pictures, I can think of very few cases (if any) where I'd look 
at the final image and be able to tell whether I shot it with the K-3 
and 16-50 or the K-1 and the 28-75.


To be sure, there are lots of times that to get a particular shot, I 
really need the larger sensor in the K-1, those are usually night time 
wide angle shots.  Also, when I'm photographing musicians and don't 
want to get great shots of microphones with blurry musicians in the 
background, the K-1 far outshines the K-3. But I've recently been 
surprised to realize how often, for basic shooting, it really doesn't 
matter to me which camera I grab.


I will note that I haven't gotten to the point of grabbing the K-1 and 
APS only lenses like the 18-250.





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Re: Thoughts on Electronic vs Mechanical shutter?

[Bill]

On 12/28/2016 11:28 AM, John Francis wrote:


I think you have that backwards.

With an electronic shutter, the image is taken at electronic speeds; the
entire sensor is cleared, then the image is captured.  There's no reason
for the electronics to expose different pixels at different times. While
there will certainly be some delay across the sensor, I would expect all
the pixel exposures to be synchronized to within a nanosecond, which is
effectively simultaneous as far as any mechanical system is concerned.



The electronic shutter in the Fuji X-T1 takes about 1/30th of a second 
to read the entire frame. I expect the Pentax is similar.


What you are talking about is a global shutter, not a rolling shutter. 
I'm quite certain that Pentax uses a rolling shutter.




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Re: Thoughts on Electronic vs Mechanical shutter?

[John Francis]

I think you have that backwards.

With an electronic shutter, the image is taken at electronic speeds; the
entire sensor is cleared, then the image is captured.  There's no reason
for the electronics to expose different pixels at different times. While
there will certainly be some delay across the sensor, I would expect all
the pixel exposures to be synchronized to within a nanosecond, which is
effectively simultaneous as far as any mechanical system is concerned.

With a mechanical shutter, however, you're not going to get that. There
will be a difference in time between the top and bottom of an exposure
frame, because the opening and closing of the shutter is controlled by the
movement of the shutter blind across the sensor. To a first approximation
the difference in time is the maximum flash synchronisation exposure speed
(not using high-speed flash, of course). Even if you have a camera capable
of flash synchronisation at 1/1000 of a second, thats still six orders of
magnitude more temporal distortion artifacts than from an electronic shutter.

while electronic shutters can expose all the pixels simultaneously, they
only read out the pixels sequentially.  But that's because of bandwidth
limitations (both within the sensor chip and in the interface to the camera),
not because the pixels are being exposed at different times.


On Wed, Dec 28, 2016 at 12:51:28AM -0800, Larry Colen wrote:
> I was playing with some night landscape work tonight, using live view, and
> when I took a photo, I didn't hear the shutter.  I realized that was because
> I had set my camera to use electronic shutter in live view because that
> means it doesn't need to go flop flop with the shutter and you don't get all
> of the shutter lag.
> 
> I realize that with objects in motion, using an electronic, or rolling,
> shutter, you can get some interesting bits of distortion.  However, it seems
> to me that on very long exposures, that effect is minimized, and you are
> saved a whole bunch of mirror bounce.
> 
> Are there any major disadvantages of using live view/electronic shutter, on
> tripod mounted long exposures that I'm missing?
> 
> -- 
> Larry Colen  l...@red4est.com (postbox on min4est) http://red4est.com/lrc
> 
> 
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Re: Thoughts on Electronic vs Mechanical shutter?

[Zos Xavius]

You don't see the rolling effect because it is only a half electronic
shutter. When the shutter closes or stops as an electronic aperture
does is when you get the motion artifacts. That's when the sensor
starts reading out. With a mechanical shutter it just closes and
starts reading off the sensor. With electronic it reads the sensor in
chunks. First curtain is possibly going to have more noise, but
probably not really since you are already in live view and the sensor
is active. If anything the electronic shutter might help with
vibrations. I don't see any major disadvantage there really.

On Wed, Dec 28, 2016 at 3:51 AM, Larry Colen  wrote:
> I was playing with some night landscape work tonight, using live view, and
> when I took a photo, I didn't hear the shutter.  I realized that was because
> I had set my camera to use electronic shutter in live view because that
> means it doesn't need to go flop flop with the shutter and you don't get all
> of the shutter lag.
>
> I realize that with objects in motion, using an electronic, or rolling,
> shutter, you can get some interesting bits of distortion.  However, it seems
> to me that on very long exposures, that effect is minimized, and you are
> saved a whole bunch of mirror bounce.
>
> Are there any major disadvantages of using live view/electronic shutter, on
> tripod mounted long exposures that I'm missing?
>
> --
> Larry Colen  l...@red4est.com (postbox on min4est) http://red4est.com/lrc
>
>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 8/11/16, Chris Mitchell, discombobulated, unleashed:

>I had to type "I side with Cotty here" five times before it stuck
>on the screen.

Mark!

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Chris Mitchell]

On 7 Nov 2016 22:35, "Steve Cottrell"  wrote:
>
> On 6/11/16, Chris Mitchell, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
> >I side with Cotty here - X20 is a good option.
> >I must put one on my Christmas list...
>
> Why Christopher I do believe this is a first ;-)

I know. I had to type "I side with Cotty here" five times before it stuck
on the screen.

>
> You been playing with Bob's ?

I'm far too gentlemanly to confirm or deny that.

Christopher (who only gets called that when he's being told off)
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Eric Weir]

> On Nov 7, 2016, at 9:17 PM, Bill  wrote:
> 
> It's about the same size as a Pentax ME-Super. A little bigger than that, not 
> as big as an LX. They are not a big camera. Couple it with a 35mm f/2 WR and 
> you have a very compact high quality camera

That’s the combo I’m lusting for. 

Meantime I get by with a Fuji XQI. Only one dial for shooting mode. Everything 
else controlled from buttons on the back, which are programmable, and the 
menus. No viewfinder, which I’ve gotten used to—except in bright sun. But I get 
astounding images—to me anyway—with it. 

Here's one from the state cross country championship here last weekend. 
 
The X-Q1 was my “wide angle” lens for this occasion. I shot the races with my 
K-5 and a DA 4-5.6/50-200 ED WR. Here’s one of my favorites with that combo 
.

FWIW, the team I’ve been following were state champs in their division for the 
third year running. All the kids are refugees. (Yes, I know, I’ve gone 
off-topic here.)

--
Eric Weir
Decatur, GA  USA
eew...@bellsouth.net 

(I)t is important that awake people be awake... the darkness around us is deep.

- William Stafford


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 7/11/16, Bill, discombobulated, unleashed:

>More size hints:
>
>http://users.accesscomm.ca/wrphoto/addons/xt-1pron1.html

That is horny!

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 7/11/16, Bob W-PDML, discombobulated, unleashed:

>I think the message there is buy an MX...

Hr!! :-)


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 7/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:

> I've been
>finding that my needs for the elusive perfect camera aren't being met,

MARK

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Larry Colen]

Bruce Walker wrote:



As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?


Depending on your definition of pocketable, the K-r with a DA40/2.8 is 
surprisingly trim and capable. By pocketable, it will easily fit in 
cargo pockets or jacket pockets.


In that realm I recently bought an Olympus TG-4. On paper it looked very 
nice, small, waterproof, capable of doing both stills and video, and 
could produce raw files.


Unfortunately the video shut off after 21 minutes, rendering it useless 
for the things I wanted video for, and despite the zoom being f/2 at the 
wide end, it really rather sucked in even moderately low light. I 
returned it within a week.


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bill]

On 11/7/2016 5:21 PM, Steve Cottrell wrote:

On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:


Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
your requirements


Size hints





More size hints:

http://users.accesscomm.ca/wrphoto/addons/xt-1pron1.html

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bill]

On 11/7/2016 12:51 PM, Bruce Walker wrote:

On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 10:35 AM, Bill  wrote:

On 11/5/2016 8:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:


So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
film camera.


If you have big pockets, the Fuji T-T2 with the 35mm lens would be an
excellent choice.


Pocket-wise, it's about the same size as my K-3, a little thinner I
guess. My clothing won't accommodate either. :)



It's about the same size as a Pentax ME-Super. A little bigger than 
that, not as big as an LX. They are not a big camera. Couple it with a 
35mm f/2 WR and you have a very compact high quality camera



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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[P.J. Alling]

That seems to be the problem, what you gain with the tiny body you lose 
with the adapter, or vice versa.


On 11/7/2016 6:21 PM, Steve Cottrell wrote:

On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:


Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
your requirements

Size hints






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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

> On Nov 7, 2016, at 11:46 AM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
> 
> On 7 Nov 2016, at 19:04, Bruce Walker  > wrote:
>> 
>>> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
>>> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.
>> 
>> You know something crazy? I see that you are right. The Leica is just
>> about perfect for what I'm looking for, size and price aside.
>> 
> I suspect the target market for the Fujis is largely made up of Leica 
> wannabes and Olympus Trip has-beens. Problem is, they don't fully deliver on 
> their promise. At least, not to me. The key thing about the Leicas is 
> simplicity; not getting in the way, as Godfrey puts it.

There is no digital camera simpler and more akin to the film camera experience 
than a Leica M-D (typ 262). The only settings it has other than ISO, focus, 
shutter time, and aperture are for the clock. There's no LCD … and it feels 
substantively smaller than any of the other digital Ms without it. It captures 
only raw files so just like with film, everything past the capture is done in 
processing and rendering the photo. The M-D gets out of the way instantly, it 
returns you to a time before digital, before chimping, before user settings and 
multi-mode this and that. Yet brings you all the advantages of a digital sensor 
without the disadvantages. 

I absolutely adore this camera. 

My bag has in it the M-D, a 1972 Summilux 35 that's been coded so the camera 
recognizes it, a Summarit-M 75mm f/2.4. Perfect setup for 99% of my shooting. 
Sometimes I swap those two lenses out for a Color Skopar 28/3.5 and a Color 
Skopar 50/2.5. These work well asides from color shading issues; I render only 
to B with them. There's plenty more space in the bag … it's a Tenba DNA8 … 
and it could easily fit the camera and all four of those lenses, plus an iPad 
mini. One charge on the battery is good for 500-700 exposures; a 16G card is 
good for around 800 exposures. Good match. And the default rendering of the DNG 
files in Lightroom has that beautiful feel of a Leica film camera exposure.

If you want a digital camera that gives you as close to the film experience as 
you can get, this is the one. Yes, it costs a bit; no, it won't fit in your 
pocket. It's worth it. 

G
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 6:19 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
> On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>Micro Four Thirds, so a large range of lenses available - including some
>>manual Voigtlander f/0.95 lenses (1 in your range) - as well as a number
>>of adapters for legacy lenses like Pentax.
>
> Voila
>
> 

This is really appealing. :)

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 6:07 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
> On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>>film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>>buttons and dials for the important most-used functions.
>
> If you're considering Leicas then, I might have gotten the wrong end of
> the stick.

No Cotty, you had the right end of the stick. But it's a forked stick. :)


> I assumed you were looking for something genuinely pocketable. My
> definition of pocketable is the rear pocket on a pair of Levis. YMMV.

I am looking for something pocketable, it's just that since I've been
finding that my needs for the elusive perfect camera aren't being met,
I'm expanding the search radius and considering alternatives.

Pocketable for me is actually bigger than your Levis back pocket
standard. A coat pocket, or a small fanny pack in the summer.


> Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
> your requirements - although (like the Leica) will not fit in a pair of
> Levis with a lens attached) - the Olympus Pen F.

Now this is a worthy beastie for consideration. Thank you!


> My advice: buy an X20 for under 400 bucks as you mentioned. If you can't
> get on with it, eBay it back into the system and put some wedge into a
> Leica system. If you've got the funds, go for it.

Sound advice, Cotty. Still the most likely outcome.

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bob W-PDML]

On 7 Nov 2016, at 23:22, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
> 
> On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:
> 
>> Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
>> your requirements
> 
> Size hints
> 
> 

I think the message there is buy an MX...

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
>your requirements

Size hints



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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 7/11/16, Steve Cottrell, discombobulated, unleashed:

>Micro Four Thirds, so a large range of lenses available - including some
>manual Voigtlander f/0.95 lenses (1 in your range) - as well as a number
>of adapters for legacy lenses like Pentax.

Voila



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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:

>So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>buttons and dials for the important most-used functions.

If you're considering Leicas then, I might have gotten the wrong end of
the stick.

I assumed you were looking for something genuinely pocketable. My
definition of pocketable is the rear pocket on a pair of Levis. YMMV.

I can squeeze the X20 (with it's easily understood and used UI - by me
at any rate) into my Levis at a push. I wouldn't sit down though.

It will easily fit in any jacket or coat pocket, lens retracted and
powered down.

I dare say a Leica will as well - but I defy you to get a Leica M Typ
26anything into a pair of Levis - with lens attached

Finally, a quick shout out for another camera that will easily satisfy
your requirements - although (like the Leica) will not fit in a pair of
Levis with a lens attached) - the Olympus Pen F.

Micro Four Thirds, so a large range of lenses available - including some
manual Voigtlander f/0.95 lenses (1 in your range) - as well as a number
of adapters for legacy lenses like Pentax.

My entire camera bag now consists of a Fuji X20 (zoom range equiv of
28-112), Olympus Pen F, Samyang 12/2 (24 equiv), Pentax 24/2.8 (48
equiv), Pentax 50/1.4 (100 equiv) and Tokina AT-X 90/2.5 macro (180 equiv).

That's all I've got. I have plans to replace some of the lenses with
Voigtlanders eventually, but I love the simplicity of this kit, and both
cameras tick the bill regarding old school feel. The Oly is an extremely
capable camera with large pixel count and 5 axis IS etc - so quite a
machine. Again, if `I have to take one in a pocket, it's the Fuji X20
every time.

My advice: buy an X20 for under 400 bucks as you mentioned. If you can't
get on with it, eBay it back into the system and put some wedge into a
Leica system. If you've got the funds, go for it.

I find the Leicas simply too big. And the X-Pro 1 and 2. Too big for
what I wanted. LOVE the X100T but restricted by lens for what I wanted to do.

That's why I got the Olympus.

Cheers!

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 6/11/16, Bob W-PDML, discombobulated, unleashed:

>These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and
>user interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings
>inadvertently, without any warning, and I find it really confusing and
>difficult to restore them to what I like. They are also not good for
>manual focusing because although you can do it, there is no indication
>in the optical finder of what you're focused on. On the X20 you can do
>focus peaking in the optical finder, but to get it you have to do
>without other settings (or absence of) which I find useful.

Interesting.

My experience is slightly different. There are 2 user settings on the
main top dial (C1 and C2) and global camera settings can be concreted to
these to settings. Hence, my C1 setting is mono, high ISO, high
contrast, high everything for that gritty street look. C2 is mono, low
ISO, high quality for landscapes and suchlike. For colour I just turn to
either Program or Aperture priority

The menus are quite easy to understand and cycle through - but that said
I am used to the Fuji way - and now the Oly way as well, which isn't
hugely different. What I like to do is customise the external buttons
and dials as much as possible so I can quickly switch between settings
without having to scroll thru menus


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 6/11/16, Chris Mitchell, discombobulated, unleashed:

>I side with Cotty here - X20 is a good option.
>I must put one on my Christmas list...

Why Christopher I do believe this is a first ;-)

You been playing with Bob's ?

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bob W-PDML]

On 7 Nov 2016, at 19:04, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> 
>> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
>> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.
> 
> You know something crazy? I see that you are right. The Leica is just
> about perfect for what I'm looking for, size and price aside.
> 
I suspect the target market for the Fujis is largely made up of Leica wannabes 
and Olympus Trip has-beens. Problem is, they don't fully deliver on their 
promise. At least, not to me. The key thing about the Leicas is simplicity; not 
getting in the way, as Godfrey puts it.

I think you'd find that size is not much of an issue with the Leica Ms once you 
start to use them. I keep mine on a leather wrist strap, and I normally have a 
small shoulder bag for one or two extra lenses, a light meter and other 
paraphernalia. You could easily keep it all in a combat jacket if that happens 
to be your thing. You could also buy an old (or indeed new) collapsible Elmar 
lens to make it even smaller when not in use.

I find that I carry no more with the M than I would with one of the Fujis, 
since I keep them on a wrist strap too, and still need a small bag to keep my 
wallet, phone and glasses, and light meter if I take one. It's principally the 
glasses case that causes this, as my phone goes in my wallet anyway, and that 
could go in a pocket.

B

> I gently approached this concept with my wife this morning during our
> dog walk. I said, "it's a bit pricey." She said, "oh, what, like 600
> dollars?". I admitted that no, it's actually six thousand dollars.
> 
> She did not hit me with a blunt object, so I took that as a positive
> sign. I haven't mentioned lenses yet.
> 
> 


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Boris Liberman]

Bruce, a friend of mine has one. I handled it briefly few times. It is
of course on the smallish size, but it has general gestalt of
rangefinder camera, as I see it. Here I have to admit that I only shot
one roll of film with Russian Leica clone, so I don't have that much
of a expertise as to how the rangefinder camera gotta handle. Yet, it
is a nice little camera with big sensor (relative to its size and
weight) and it is worth considering.



On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 9:09 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> It was not, until just now. :) Thanks, Boris, under consideration.
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 2:05 PM, Boris Liberman  wrote:
>> Was Panasonic LX100 mentioned?

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

It was not, until just now. :) Thanks, Boris, under consideration.


On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 2:05 PM, Boris Liberman  wrote:
> Was Panasonic LX100 mentioned?
>
> On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
>> On Sun, Nov 6, 2016 at 11:21 AM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes, it's 35mm equivalent. I have a Fuji X100, which was the first 
>>> generation of that series. It's a nice camera, but my X20 sees far more 
>>> use, and I may sell the X100 to fund my French bicycle habit.
>>>
>>> These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and user 
>>> interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings inadvertently, 
>>> without any warning, and I find it really confusing and difficult to 
>>> restore them to what I like. They are also not good for manual focusing 
>>> because although you can do it, there is no indication in the optical 
>>> finder of what you're focused on. On the X20 you can do focus peaking in 
>>> the optical finder, but to get it you have to do without other settings (or 
>>> absence of) which I find useful.
>>>
>>> Overall it is compromised in my opinion by its excessive complexity and its 
>>> attempt to do everything. They need me to tell them what it should be like.
>>>
>>> You can shoot some lovely black and white though, when you set it up right.
>>
>> I am both heartened and disheartened to hear this. I really dislike a
>> cranky UI, especially one that encourages random changes that are hard
>> to restore.
>>
>>
>>> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
>>> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.
>>
>> You know something crazy? I see that you are right. The Leica is just
>> about perfect for what I'm looking for, size and price aside.
>>
>> I gently approached this concept with my wife this morning during our
>> dog walk. I said, "it's a bit pricey." She said, "oh, what, like 600
>> dollars?". I admitted that no, it's actually six thousand dollars.
>>
>> She did not hit me with a blunt object, so I took that as a positive
>> sign. I haven't mentioned lenses yet.
>>
>> --
>> -bmw
>>
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>
>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Boris Liberman]

Was Panasonic LX100 mentioned?

On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 9:03 PM, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> On Sun, Nov 6, 2016 at 11:21 AM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
>>
>> Yes, it's 35mm equivalent. I have a Fuji X100, which was the first 
>> generation of that series. It's a nice camera, but my X20 sees far more use, 
>> and I may sell the X100 to fund my French bicycle habit.
>>
>> These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and user 
>> interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings inadvertently, 
>> without any warning, and I find it really confusing and difficult to restore 
>> them to what I like. They are also not good for manual focusing because 
>> although you can do it, there is no indication in the optical finder of what 
>> you're focused on. On the X20 you can do focus peaking in the optical 
>> finder, but to get it you have to do without other settings (or absence of) 
>> which I find useful.
>>
>> Overall it is compromised in my opinion by its excessive complexity and its 
>> attempt to do everything. They need me to tell them what it should be like.
>>
>> You can shoot some lovely black and white though, when you set it up right.
>
> I am both heartened and disheartened to hear this. I really dislike a
> cranky UI, especially one that encourages random changes that are hard
> to restore.
>
>
>> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
>> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.
>
> You know something crazy? I see that you are right. The Leica is just
> about perfect for what I'm looking for, size and price aside.
>
> I gently approached this concept with my wife this morning during our
> dog walk. I said, "it's a bit pricey." She said, "oh, what, like 600
> dollars?". I admitted that no, it's actually six thousand dollars.
>
> She did not hit me with a blunt object, so I took that as a positive
> sign. I haven't mentioned lenses yet.
>
> --
> -bmw
>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

On Sun, Nov 6, 2016 at 11:21 AM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
>
> Yes, it's 35mm equivalent. I have a Fuji X100, which was the first generation 
> of that series. It's a nice camera, but my X20 sees far more use, and I may 
> sell the X100 to fund my French bicycle habit.
>
> These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and user 
> interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings inadvertently, 
> without any warning, and I find it really confusing and difficult to restore 
> them to what I like. They are also not good for manual focusing because 
> although you can do it, there is no indication in the optical finder of what 
> you're focused on. On the X20 you can do focus peaking in the optical finder, 
> but to get it you have to do without other settings (or absence of) which I 
> find useful.
>
> Overall it is compromised in my opinion by its excessive complexity and its 
> attempt to do everything. They need me to tell them what it should be like.
>
> You can shoot some lovely black and white though, when you set it up right.

I am both heartened and disheartened to hear this. I really dislike a
cranky UI, especially one that encourages random changes that are hard
to restore.


> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.

You know something crazy? I see that you are right. The Leica is just
about perfect for what I'm looking for, size and price aside.

I gently approached this concept with my wife this morning during our
dog walk. I said, "it's a bit pricey." She said, "oh, what, like 600
dollars?". I admitted that no, it's actually six thousand dollars.

She did not hit me with a blunt object, so I took that as a positive
sign. I haven't mentioned lenses yet.

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 10:35 AM, Bill  wrote:
> On 11/5/2016 8:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:
>>
>> So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>> film camera.
>
> If you have big pockets, the Fuji T-T2 with the 35mm lens would be an
> excellent choice.

Pocket-wise, it's about the same size as my K-3, a little thinner I
guess. My clothing won't accommodate either. :)

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Godfrey DiGiorgi]

Yup. My 'pocketable' is the M-D with 35, 50, or 75 mm lens. Simple and easy to 
use. 

G

> On Nov 6, 2016, at 8:21 AM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
> 
> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.

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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Stan Halpin]

Following on with Bob's Leica thought...
I recently convinced Meg to give up her old D-Lux 3 in favor of the Type 109 
Leica (which I believe would have been a D-Lux 7 if they hadn't changed their 
naming system.) EVF which turns on automagically when it nears your eye. RAW 
option. 24-90 equivalent lens. Solid build. WiFi. Packaged with a small 
removable flash. Video option. And takes good pictures.

Stan
Sent from my iPad

> On Nov 6, 2016, at 5:21 PM, Bob W-PDML  wrote:
> 
> Yes, it's 35mm equivalent. I have a Fuji X100, which was the first generation 
> of that series. It's a nice camera, but my X20 sees far more use, and I may 
> sell the X100 to fund my French bicycle habit.
> 
> These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and user 
> interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings inadvertently, 
> without any warning, and I find it really confusing and difficult to restore 
> them to what I like. They are also not good for manual focusing because 
> although you can do it, there is no indication in the optical finder of what 
> you're focused on. On the X20 you can do focus peaking in the optical finder, 
> but to get it you have to do without other settings (or absence of) which I 
> find useful.
> 
> Overall it is compromised in my opinion by its excessive complexity and its 
> attempt to do everything. They need me to tell them what it should be like.
> 
> You can shoot some lovely black and white though, when you set it up right.
> 
> What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. 
> He should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.
> 
> B
> 
>> On 6 Nov 2016, at 16:03, Chris Mitchell  wrote:
>> 
>> Doesn't the X100T have a 35mm equivalent lens? It's 23mm on APS-C. So
>> still hobbled to that. I side with Cotty here - X20 is a good option.
>> I must put one on my Christmas list...
>> 
>> Chris
>> 
>>> On 6 November 2016 at 15:07, Bruce Walker  wrote:
>>> Great suggestions. One of the older Fuji's is probably what I'll get.
>>> I see that the X20 can be had used for below $400 US.
>>> 
>>> I'd have been interested in the current X70 model if they hadn't
>>> removed the viewfinder. Once again, no consideration for the millions
>>> of reading glasses challenged folks.
>>> 
>>> And the X100T would sure be cool if it wasn't hobbled with a 28mm equiv 
>>> lens.
>>> 
>>> Thanks everybody!
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 12:28 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
 On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:
 
> So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
> film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
> buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
> reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
> by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
> see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
> 
> I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
> FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
> lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
> 
> As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you 
> recommend?
 
 Easy.
 
 Fuji X20.
 
 X10 at a push if you want something cheap, the 20 is better.
 
 The 30 has no optical viewfinder, preferring instead an EVF. I have no
 experience with it. Ask Dave.
 
 If I'm grabbing a single camera to shove in a jacket pocket and nothing
 else, it's always the X20.
 
 --
 
 
 Cheers,
 Cotty
 
 
 ___/\__Broadcast, Corporate,
 ||  (O)  |Web Video Production
 --
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bob W-PDML]

Yes, it's 35mm equivalent. I have a Fuji X100, which was the first generation 
of that series. It's a nice camera, but my X20 sees far more use, and I may 
sell the X100 to fund my French bicycle habit.

These two Fujis are not, in my opinion, simple to use. The menus and user 
interface are a mess. It's all to easy to change settings inadvertently, 
without any warning, and I find it really confusing and difficult to restore 
them to what I like. They are also not good for manual focusing because 
although you can do it, there is no indication in the optical finder of what 
you're focused on. On the X20 you can do focus peaking in the optical finder, 
but to get it you have to do without other settings (or absence of) which I 
find useful.

Overall it is compromised in my opinion by its excessive complexity and its 
attempt to do everything. They need me to tell them what it should be like.

You can shoot some lovely black and white though, when you set it up right.

What Bruce really wants, deep in his heart of hearts, is a Leica M typ 262. He 
should bite the bullet, and go out and buy one. And some lenses too.

B

> On 6 Nov 2016, at 16:03, Chris Mitchell  wrote:
> 
> Doesn't the X100T have a 35mm equivalent lens? It's 23mm on APS-C. So
> still hobbled to that. I side with Cotty here - X20 is a good option.
> I must put one on my Christmas list...
> 
> Chris
> 
>> On 6 November 2016 at 15:07, Bruce Walker  wrote:
>> Great suggestions. One of the older Fuji's is probably what I'll get.
>> I see that the X20 can be had used for below $400 US.
>> 
>> I'd have been interested in the current X70 model if they hadn't
>> removed the viewfinder. Once again, no consideration for the millions
>> of reading glasses challenged folks.
>> 
>> And the X100T would sure be cool if it wasn't hobbled with a 28mm equiv lens.
>> 
>> Thanks everybody!
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 12:28 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
>>> On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:
>>> 
 So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
 film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
 buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
 reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
 by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
 see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
 
 I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
 FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
 lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
 
 As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?
>>> 
>>> Easy.
>>> 
>>> Fuji X20.
>>> 
>>> X10 at a push if you want something cheap, the 20 is better.
>>> 
>>> The 30 has no optical viewfinder, preferring instead an EVF. I have no
>>> experience with it. Ask Dave.
>>> 
>>> If I'm grabbing a single camera to shove in a jacket pocket and nothing
>>> else, it's always the X20.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>>  Cotty
>>> 
>>> 
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>>> ||  (O)  |Web Video Production
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>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Chris Mitchell]

Doesn't the X100T have a 35mm equivalent lens? It's 23mm on APS-C. So
still hobbled to that. I side with Cotty here - X20 is a good option.
I must put one on my Christmas list...

Chris

On 6 November 2016 at 15:07, Bruce Walker  wrote:
> Great suggestions. One of the older Fuji's is probably what I'll get.
> I see that the X20 can be had used for below $400 US.
>
> I'd have been interested in the current X70 model if they hadn't
> removed the viewfinder. Once again, no consideration for the millions
> of reading glasses challenged folks.
>
> And the X100T would sure be cool if it wasn't hobbled with a 28mm equiv lens.
>
> Thanks everybody!
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 12:28 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
>> On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:
>>
>>>So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>>>film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>>>buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
>>>reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
>>>by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
>>>see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
>>>
>>>I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
>>>FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
>>>lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
>>>
>>>As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?
>>
>> Easy.
>>
>> Fuji X20.
>>
>> X10 at a push if you want something cheap, the 20 is better.
>>
>> The 30 has no optical viewfinder, preferring instead an EVF. I have no
>> experience with it. Ask Dave.
>>
>> If I'm grabbing a single camera to shove in a jacket pocket and nothing
>> else, it's always the X20.
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>>   Cotty
>>
>>
>> ___/\__Broadcast, Corporate,
>> ||  (O)  |Web Video Production
>> --
>> _
>>
>>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bruce Walker]

Great suggestions. One of the older Fuji's is probably what I'll get.
I see that the X20 can be had used for below $400 US.

I'd have been interested in the current X70 model if they hadn't
removed the viewfinder. Once again, no consideration for the millions
of reading glasses challenged folks.

And the X100T would sure be cool if it wasn't hobbled with a 28mm equiv lens.

Thanks everybody!


On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 12:28 PM, Steve Cottrell  wrote:
> On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:
>
>>So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>>film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>>buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
>>reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
>>by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
>>see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
>>
>>I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
>>FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
>>lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
>>
>>As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?
>
> Easy.
>
> Fuji X20.
>
> X10 at a push if you want something cheap, the 20 is better.
>
> The 30 has no optical viewfinder, preferring instead an EVF. I have no
> experience with it. Ask Dave.
>
> If I'm grabbing a single camera to shove in a jacket pocket and nothing
> else, it's always the X20.
>
> --
>
>
> Cheers,
>   Cotty
>
>
> ___/\__Broadcast, Corporate,
> ||  (O)  |Web Video Production
> --
> _
>
>
>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Ken Waller]

That's what I loved about the old Optio:  it was certainly "pocketable,"
and took decent images for its time and price.


I just sold my Optio S at a camera sell/swap meet. It was still going strong 
after many years but I hadn't used it in a while after getting a less basic, 
more versatile Nikon Coolpix 7100, its pocketable if you have somewhat 
bigger pockets.


Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - 
From: "Daniel J. Matyola" <danmaty...@gmail.com>

Subject: Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?



That's what I loved about the old Optio:  it was certainly "pocketable,"
and took decent images for its time and price.

It finally died about a year ago.

Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola

On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 10:35 AM, Bill <anotherdrunken...@gmail.com> wrote:


On 11/5/2016 8:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:


Apologies for the word filmic, but I wanted a snappy subject. I am
finally tired of trying to get any decent shots with a smartphone
which, despite being always available, nearly always disappoints me.

So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
see it in the flesh and it convinces me.

I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.

As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you
recommend?



If you have big pockets, the Fuji T-T2 with the 35mm lens would be an
excellent choice.



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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Daniel J. Matyola]

That's what I loved about the old Optio:  it was certainly "pocketable,"
and took decent images for its time and price.

It finally died about a year ago.

Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola

On Sat, Nov 5, 2016 at 10:35 AM, Bill  wrote:

> On 11/5/2016 8:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:
>
>> Apologies for the word filmic, but I wanted a snappy subject. I am
>> finally tired of trying to get any decent shots with a smartphone
>> which, despite being always available, nearly always disappoints me.
>>
>> So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>> film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>> buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
>> reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
>> by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
>> see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
>>
>> I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
>> FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
>> lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
>>
>> As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you
>> recommend?
>>
>>
> If you have big pockets, the Fuji T-T2 with the 35mm lens would be an
> excellent choice.
>
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 5/11/16, P.J. Alling, discombobulated, unleashed:

>  I have 
>played briefly with a Fujifilm XPro1 and the viewfinder is lovely so I'm 
>assuming the viewfinders on the X10 and X20 are as well.

The VF in the X10 and X20 is an optical design, but is basic. The
difference between the two is there is an overlay of info in the X20,
nothing in the X10. The VF zooms with the lens to give a good
approximation of the shot (80 percent coverage IIRC), and obviously
there is the rear LCD for precise work. The rear LCD has a proximity
sensor so it can be set to turn off when the face gets near.

The whole camera is built out of solid unobtainium. You can easily use
it to knock in nails.

-- 


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  Cotty


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||  (O)  |Web Video Production
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Steve Cottrell]

On 5/11/16, Bruce Walker, discombobulated, unleashed:

>So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
>film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
>buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
>reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
>by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
>see it in the flesh and it convinces me.
>
>I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
>FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
>lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.
>
>As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?

Easy.

Fuji X20.

X10 at a push if you want something cheap, the 20 is better.

The 30 has no optical viewfinder, preferring instead an EVF. I have no
experience with it. Ask Dave.

If I'm grabbing a single camera to shove in a jacket pocket and nothing
else, it's always the X20.

-- 


Cheers,
  Cotty


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||  (O)  |Web Video Production
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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[P.J. Alling]

I've handled a Canon G12 felt solid like a 1970's compact fixed lens RF 
camera.  I expect any in the series would have the same feel and 
capabilities.  They were supposed to have very good image quality.  The 
optical viewfinder made that on a Kodak Instamatic 100 look good 
unfortunately.  The latest replacement in the series had dropped the 
viewfinder entirely so don't go there if that's important to you.


Then there's also the Fujifilm X10 and X20 with the lovely hybrid 
viewfinder.  I haven't actually tried out one of those but supposedly 
Fuji has seriously improved the usability with firmware updates. The X30 
seems to have done away with the hybrid VF and only has a EVF.  I have 
played briefly with a Fujifilm XPro1 and the viewfinder is lovely so I'm 
assuming the viewfinders on the X10 and X20 are as well.


If it were me looking for something like this I'd look at a Fujifilm 
X20, but I've got a lovely Kodak Retina IIIc which is an old school RF 
camera, so I'd probably just slip that in my pocket and be the envy of 
hipsters everywhere, (are hipsters still a thing?)


On 11/5/2016 10:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:

Apologies for the word filmic, but I wanted a snappy subject. I am
finally tired of trying to get any decent shots with a smartphone
which, despite being always available, nearly always disappoints me.

So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
see it in the flesh and it convinces me.

I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.

As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?




--
I don't want to achieve immortality through my work; I want to achieve 
immortality through not dying.
-- Woody Allen


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Re: Thoughts: pocketable compact with filmic ergonomics?

[Bill]

On 11/5/2016 8:17 AM, Bruce Walker wrote:

Apologies for the word filmic, but I wanted a snappy subject. I am
finally tired of trying to get any decent shots with a smartphone
which, despite being always available, nearly always disappoints me.

So what I'd like is pocketable and with the "feel" of an old school
film camera. That is, simple ergonomics. Simple interface, with
buttons and dials for the important most-used functions. I need
reading glasses to see closeup and I prefer devices I can work largely
by feel. Best if it has a viewfinder. Willing to consider EVF if I can
see it in the flesh and it convinces me.

I'd be okay with a fixed lens, but it would have to be a normal. 50mm
FF equiv. Subjects would often be landscape features, and the wide
lenses on smartphones just drive me nuts.

As a fellow Pentax user, what compact camera like this would you recommend?



If you have big pockets, the Fuji T-T2 with the 35mm lens would be an 
excellent choice.


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RE: thoughts

[Bob W]

 
  http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152
 
 
 I agree.. now we have another thought - teaching Joe to use the acronym
 PESO :-)
 
 For me, personally, I'm much much more apt to open a a post with a PESO
 in the subject line than um 80% of all others... although, since you
 post so infrequently, i did look at yours and realized your subject
 lines all meant to be PESOs
 
 Best,
 ann
 

Better still, flag them as KFPWC - Kitten, Flower, Puppy or Winsome Child -
so I can set up an Inbox rule to delete them.

B


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Re: thoughts

[Bob Sullivan]

Joe,
Love the eye just looking at me.
Regards,  Bob S.

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:48 AM, jn289 jn...@verizon.net wrote:
 Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the left, at
 1/32 power..Joe



 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[Tom C]

 Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the
 left, at 1/32 power..Joe


 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

I like that shot Joe. I always think the floor level shots of pets
work well. This one, with just one eye showing and expression, has a
lot of personality.

Tom C.

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Re: thoughts

[Daniel J. Matyola]

Nice dog, great expression, fine image.
Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola



On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 10:57 AM, Bob Sullivan rf.sulli...@gmail.com wrote:
 Joe,
 Love the eye just looking at me.
 Regards,  Bob S.

 On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:48 AM, jn289 jn...@verizon.net wrote:
 Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the left, at
 1/32 power..Joe



 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[Rick Womer]

It doesn't look as though he quite trusts you...

Great shot!

Rick

 
http://photo.net/photos/RickW


- Original Message -
From: jn289 jn...@verizon.net
To: pdml@pdml.net
Cc: 
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 10:48 AM
Subject: thoughts

Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the left, at 
1/32 power..Joe



http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[Mark C]

On 4/12/2012 10:48 AM, jn289 wrote:
Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the 
left, at 1/32 power..Joe




http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

Getting down to eye level with the dog really worked in this shot - the 
canny eye watching you is great. Or maybe that is the canine-y watching!


MCC

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Re: thoughts

[Ann Sanfedele]

On 4/12/2012 22:32, Mark C wrote:

On 4/12/2012 10:48 AM, jn289 wrote:

Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the
left, at 1/32 power..Joe



http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152


Getting down to eye level with the dog really worked in this shot - the
canny eye watching you is great. Or maybe that is the canine-y watching!

MCC



I agree.. now we have another thought - teaching Joe to use the acronym
PESO :-)

For me, personally, I'm much much more apt to open a a post with a PESO
in the subject line than um 80% of all others... although, since you post
so infrequently, i did look at yours and realized your subject lines all 
meant to be PESOs


Best,
ann

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RE: thoughts

[knarftheria...@gmail.com]

What a  cutie!

The low angle really works here. Brings out his personality beautifully.

Cheers,
frank

What can be asserted without proof can be dismissed without proof. -- 
Christopher Hitchens

--- Original Message ---

From: jn289 jn...@verizon.net
Sent: April 12, 2012 4/12/12
To: pdml@pdml.net
Subject: thoughts

Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the 
left, at 1/32 power..Joe



http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[Brian Walters]

Quoting jn289 jn...@verizon.net:

Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the  
left, at 1/32 power..Joe




http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152



Great shot - he obviously thinks there's something odd about you



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Cheers

Brian

++
Brian Walters
Western Sydney Australia
http://lyons-ryan.org/southernlight/


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Re: thoughts

[jn289]

Thanks, Mark



On 4/12/2012 10:48 AM, jn289 wrote:
Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the 
left, at 1/32 power..Joe




http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

Getting down to eye level with the dog really worked in this shot - 
the canny eye watching you is great. Or maybe that is the canine-y 
watching!


MCC

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Re: thoughts

[jn289]

Thanks Rick, Joe



It doesn't look as though he quite trusts you...

Great shot!

Rick


http://photo.net/photos/RickW


- Original Message -
From: jn289 jn...@verizon.net
To: pdml@pdml.net
Cc:
Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2012 10:48 AM
Subject: thoughts

Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the 
left, at 1/32 power..Joe




http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[jn289]

Thanks Dan, Joe




Nice dog, great expression, fine image.
Dan Matyola
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/danieljmatyola



On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 10:57 AM, Bob Sullivan rf.sulli...@gmail.com wrote:

 Joe,
 Love the eye just looking at me.
 Regards,  Bob S.

 On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:48 AM, jn289 jn...@verizon.net wrote:
 Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to 
the left, at

 1/32 power..Joe



 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: thoughts

[jn289]

Thanks Tom, Joe







Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the

 left, at 1/32 power..Joe


 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152


I like that shot Joe. I always think the floor level shots of pets
work well. This one, with just one eye showing and expression, has a
lot of personality.

Tom C.

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Re: thoughts

[jn289]

Bob, Thanks Joe



Joe,
Love the eye just looking at me.
Regards,  Bob S.

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 9:48 AM, jn289 jn...@verizon.net wrote:

 Puppy dog. Me laying on the floor, one flash on a remote off to the left, at
 1/32 power..Joe



 http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=14409152

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Re: Thoughts between the two

[eckinator]

2011/2/21 steve harley p...@paper-ape.com:

 unless i'm missing something, the sniper straps seem to let the camera
 swivel so the grip is not always closest to your hand

depends on the size of the lens actually and a bit on your physique as
well as how high you hang the combo. If you hang it too close to your
hip it starts to swing when you walk - the smaller the lens the more
it bounces; I reckon with a light body and a pancake you might be able
to induce a spin - and if you hang it too high it becomes
uncomfortable to raise to the eye. I have mine level with the lowest
rib and anything longer than a DFA50 or DA*55 will stay put just fine
with the grip in perfect, blind reach. Also there is a little stopper
clip that keeps the camera from sliding down beyond a certain point
but this only works up to a certain kit weight because the shoulder
pad is rather slippery. All in all I am quite happy though.
hth Ecke

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Re: Thoughts between the two

[eckinator]

Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/
HTH Ecke

2011/2/19 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
 Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
 Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
 most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
 coupon from camdapter made me bite.

 Toine

 On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
 Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
 plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
 extra long option.
 Now I don't know...

 I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

 http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

 I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

 http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

 The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
 screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
 camera.

 I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the sling
 using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
 using the QR plate on the camera.

 (Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

 http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

 The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
 stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
 to mount it on the tripod.

 The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap to
 reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
 camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
 protection.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


 --
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 PDML@pdml.net
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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Toine]

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
block the little door on the left side...

On 20 February 2011 13:57, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote:
 Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
 http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/
 HTH Ecke

 2011/2/19 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
 Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
 Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
 most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
 coupon from camdapter made me bite.

 Toine

 On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
 Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
 plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
 extra long option.
 Now I don't know...

 I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

 http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

 I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

 http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

 The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
 screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
 camera.

 I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the sling
 using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
 using the QR plate on the camera.

 (Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

 http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

 The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
 stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
 to mount it on the tripod.

 The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap to
 reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
 camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
 protection.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


 --
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 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
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the directions.

Re: Thoughts between the two

[drd1135]

I use a hand grip and an open bag with a shoulder strap. Yes, it could fall out 
but its deep and I can extract the camera quickly.  
-Original Message-
From: Toine to...@repiuk.nl
Sender: pdml-boun...@pdml.net
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2011 14:57:09 
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail Listpdml@pdml.net
Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
block the little door on the left side...

On 20 February 2011 13:57, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote:
 Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
 http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/
 HTH Ecke

 2011/2/19 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
 Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
 Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
 most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
 coupon from camdapter made me bite.

 Toine

 On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
 Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
 plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
 extra long option.
 Now I don't know...

 I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

 http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

 I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

 http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

 The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
 screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
 camera.

 I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the sling
 using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
 using the QR plate on the camera.

 (Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

 http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

 The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
 stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
 to mount it on the tripod.

 The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap to
 reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
 camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
 protection.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


 --
 PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and
 follow the directions.


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 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and 
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RE: Thoughts between the two

[Jeffery Johnson]

Toine,
I ended up ordering the following OP/TECH USA Pro Strap 3/8 (Black) from
BH and well really shouldn't have spent the monies but if I plan on walking
around much with the camera hanging from my neck I did not have much choice.
I prefer having the camera hang from my neck as I feel more secure in
knowing where the camera is and knowing that I may not accidently bump it
against something if it were hanging from my side.

Jeffery

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/39638-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1501012_Pro_Stra
p_3_8_Black.html

-Original Message-
From: pdml-boun...@pdml.net [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of
Toine
Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2011 7:57 AM
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with camera
straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging from my neck.
The short standard camera neck straps are extremely annoying. The camdapter
hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder strap is what I use now. I'll try
the camdapter sling and the next option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20 block the
little door on the left side...



-- 
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PDML@pdml.net
http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow 
the directions.

Re: Thoughts between the two

[eckinator]

I bought one from Jostein for my - moribund (need to warm up the
shutter with 50 to 100 exposures to make it not underexpose - K10D and
IIRC he used one also for the K20D from which he had taken off a small
portion to make the door work again. As my K10D may not be worthwhile
to repair I'll be happy to sell you my L bracket for a small
contribution towards my K-5 (whenever that will be... =[
Cheers
Ecke

2011/2/20 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
 Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
 camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
 from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
 annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
 strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
 option is the Luma.
 Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
 block the little door on the left side...

 On 20 February 2011 13:57, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote:
 Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
 http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/
 HTH Ecke

 2011/2/19 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
 Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
 Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
 most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
 coupon from camdapter made me bite.

 Toine

 On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
 Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
 plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
 extra long option.
 Now I don't know...

 I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

 http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

 I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

 http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

 The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
 screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
 camera.

 I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the 
 sling
 using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
 using the QR plate on the camera.

 (Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

 http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

 The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
 stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
 to mount it on the tripod.

 The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap 
 to
 reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
 camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
 protection.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


 --
 PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and
 follow the directions.


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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Toine]

I'm using that strap and it's the only one I also use on my neck if I
must. It does spread the load comfortably. If you prefer hanging the
camera from your neck it's near perfect.

Toine

On 20 February 2011 15:14, Jeffery Johnson
jefferytjohn...@bellsouth.net wrote:
 Toine,
 I ended up ordering the following OP/TECH USA Pro Strap 3/8 (Black) from
 BH and well really shouldn't have spent the monies but if I plan on walking
 around much with the camera hanging from my neck I did not have much choice.
 I prefer having the camera hang from my neck as I feel more secure in
 knowing where the camera is and knowing that I may not accidently bump it
 against something if it were hanging from my side.

 Jeffery

 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/39638-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1501012_Pro_Stra
 p_3_8_Black.html

 -Original Message-
 From: pdml-boun...@pdml.net [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of
 Toine
 Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2011 7:57 AM
 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two

 Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with camera
 straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging from my neck.
 The short standard camera neck straps are extremely annoying. The camdapter
 hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder strap is what I use now. I'll try
 the camdapter sling and the next option is the Luma.
 Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20 block the
 little door on the left side...



 --
 PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow 
 the directions.


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the directions.

Re: Thoughts between the two

[Doug Franklin]

On 2011-02-20 11:53, Toine wrote:

I'm using that strap and it's the only one I also use on my neck if I
must. It does spread the load comfortably. If you prefer hanging the
camera from your neck it's near perfect.


Yep, the OPTECH neoprene straps are great!  And not terribly expensive, 
either.  When using long lenses, which is nearly always, I use a wider 
OPTECH that's about 2 wide.


--
Thanks,
DougF (KG4LMZ)

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Re: Thoughts between the two

[John Sessoms]

From: Toine

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
block the little door on the left side...



The Luma's lanyard connector looks like it might fit through the built 
in strap loops on the camera. One drawback with Luma's web-site though 
is you can't really see many product details.


Especially for those who don't do FLASH.

Not only would an L-bracket interfere with the door on the K20, it won't 
fit the Bogen/Manfrotto RC2 system I use. But, I'm thinking a simple 
split key-ring might fit through the left side built in loop on the K20 
without interfering with the door.


I'm going to give that a try  see if that might improve the way the 
Sun-Sniper works with the camera. I wouldn't have to disconnect the 
strap every time I wanted to mount the camera on my tripod.



-
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3454 - Release Date: 02/19/11


--
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PDML@pdml.net
http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow 
the directions.

Re: Thoughts between the two

[Tim Bray]

I carry my K20 using the Luma, and the doohickey that you snap onto
fits into the strap loop just fine.  After getting used to it, it
feels 100% secure even with the 50-135 on; that's a pretty heavyweight
combination in the Pentax context.  It's astoundingly convenient
having it hanging right there at your side where you can swing it up
instantly with one hand.  -T

On Sun, Feb 20, 2011 at 9:20 AM, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
 camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
 from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
 annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
 strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
 option is the Luma.
 Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
 block the little door on the left side...


 The Luma's lanyard connector looks like it might fit through the built in
 strap loops on the camera. One drawback with Luma's web-site though is you
 can't really see many product details.

 Especially for those who don't do FLASH.

 Not only would an L-bracket interfere with the door on the K20, it won't fit
 the Bogen/Manfrotto RC2 system I use. But, I'm thinking a simple split
 key-ring might fit through the left side built in loop on the K20 without
 interfering with the door.

 I'm going to give that a try  see if that might improve the way the
 Sun-Sniper works with the camera. I wouldn't have to disconnect the strap
 every time I wanted to mount the camera on my tripod.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3454 - Release Date: 02/19/11


 --
 PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List
 PDML@pdml.net
 http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
 to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and
 follow the directions.


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to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow 
the directions.

Re: Thoughts between the two

[Ann Sanfedele]

The strap on the ist D is amazingly comfortable .  but that may only be 
because Im still wearing puffed up winter jackets...
I have the strap around my neck, but carry the small camera bag on my 
shoulder and rest the camera on it...  or on a belly pack, and
I wear a stock boy's support on my waist if I'm out for a long time.. 
helps when I've got the camera to my eye.


ann

drd1...@gmail.com wrote:


I use a hand grip and an open bag with a shoulder strap. Yes, it could fall out 
but its deep and I can extract the camera quickly.

 
-Original Message-

From: Toine to...@repiuk.nl
Sender: pdml-boun...@pdml.net
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2011 14:57:09 
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail Listpdml@pdml.net

Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
block the little door on the left side...

On 20 February 2011 13:57, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote:
 


Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/
HTH Ecke

2011/2/19 Toine to...@repiuk.nl:
   


Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
coupon from camdapter made me bite.

Toine

On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 


From: Toine
   


Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
extra long option.
Now I don't know...
 


I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
camera.

I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the sling
using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
using the QR plate on the camera.

(Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
to mount it on the tripod.

The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap to
reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
protection.


-
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Ken Waller]

Kenneth Waller
http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/kennethwaller

- Original Message - 
From: John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com


Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two



From: Toine

Reading that blog I see that I'm not alone in my frustrations with
camera straps. I hate anything, including camera's and ties, hanging
from my neck. The short standard camera neck straps are extremely
annoying. The camdapter hand strap combined with a Optech shoulder
strap is what I use now. I'll try the camdapter sling and the next
option is the Luma.
Maybe mounting an L bracket is an option but L brackets on the K20
block the little door on the left side...


I have a nicely crafted, Kirk 'L' bracket (http://www.keh.com/) that was 
designed to allow access to the little door on the LH side.






The Luma's lanyard connector looks like it might fit through the built in 
strap loops on the camera. One drawback with Luma's web-site though is you 
can't really see many product details.


Especially for those who don't do FLASH.

Not only would an L-bracket interfere with the door on the K20, it won't 
fit the Bogen/Manfrotto RC2 system I use. But, I'm thinking a simple split 
key-ring might fit through the left side built in loop on the K20 without 
interfering with the door.


I'm going to give that a try  see if that might improve the way the 
Sun-Sniper works with the camera. I wouldn't have to disconnect the strap 
every time I wanted to mount the camera on my tripod.



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Re: Thoughts between the two

[steve harley]

On 2011-02-20 05:57 , eckinator wrote:

Toine, (and everyone) another option can be seen here
http://www.timothyarmes.com/blog/2009/02/a-rapid-r-strap-an-l-bracket-and-a-vertical-grip-the-holy-grail-of-camera-confort/


in contrast to that fellow's complaint, the op/tech strap i use has no 
quick-release; it's also not sticky, so unlike some other straps, it 
slides easily when i pull the camera up from my hip, a behavior somewhat 
like the sniper straps, i guess; but different because there is some 
friction, so i can keep the camera where i want it when hanging; also 
different because the strap attaches to both strap points on the camera 
and naturally keeps the grip where my right hand will reach for it on my 
_left_ hip; unless i'm missing something, the sniper straps seem to let 
the camera swivel so the grip is not always closest to your hand



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RE: Thoughts between the two

[Bob W]

 Argh, it's too late now, but in the world of strap-ware I'm a devoted
 fan of the Luma Loop, see http://www.lu.ma/loop
 

never heard of those before, but the Loopit looks like it would be good for
the M8, so I've ordered one.

B


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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Cotty]

On 18/2/11, Tim Bray, discombobulated, unleashed:

Argh, it's too late now, but in the world of strap-ware I'm a devoted
fan of the Luma Loop, see http://www.lu.ma/loop

I saw a snapper I know on a job last week and he had one of these
attached to a 1DmIV and 16-35/2.8 (which is a very heavy combo!) and
although I thought it odd the camera was hung upside-down, it did look
very comfortable. He had it on one shoulder mostly, instead of as the
pics show (over opposite shoulder and waist).

--


Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)  | People, Places, Pastiche
--  http://www.cottysnaps.com
_



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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Cotty]

On 19/2/11, Cotty, discombobulated, unleashed:

 and
although I thought it odd the camera was hung upside-down

I should add that it was secured via the tripod mounting hole.

--


Cheers,
  Cotty


___/\__
||   (O)  | People, Places, Pastiche
--  http://www.cottysnaps.com
_



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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Toine]

Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
extra long option.
Now I don't know...


On 19 February 2011 07:14, Tim Bray tb...@textuality.com wrote:
 Argh, it's too late now, but in the world of strap-ware I'm a devoted
 fan of the Luma Loop, see http://www.lu.ma/loop

  - T

 On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeffery Johnson
 jefferytjohn...@bellsouth.net wrote:
 I really hate doing this but looks as though I will end up having to
 purchase a strap. I cannot locate a pad off of any other strap around the
 house so looks like I will end up having to buy one.

 Probably going to go with OP/Tech brand straps:

 Which will either be
 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/39638-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1501012_Pro_Stra
 p_3_8_Black.html

 Or

 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/140198-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1001252_Classic
 _Strap_Black.html

 Anyone's thoughts between the two or anyone have experience with either one
 of these straps.

 Thanks,
 Jeffery



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Re: Thoughts between the two

[John Sessoms]

From: Toine

Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
extra long option.
Now I don't know...


I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on 
the screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of 
the camera.


I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the 
sling using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR 
adapter using the QR plate on the camera.


(Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release 
adapter stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling 
when you want to mount it on the tripod.


The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the 
strap to reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and 
steal your camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might 
negate that protection.



-
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Toine]

Thanks for the tip. Mounting a QR adapter on the sling is a good idea.
Since I'm using the camdapter with the strap, the Slingstrap makes
most sense. This thread got me thinking again and a free shipping
coupon from camdapter made me bite.

Toine

On 19 February 2011 20:43, John Sessoms jsessoms...@nc.rr.com wrote:
 From: Toine

 Never noticed the Luma Loop. I was thinking about the Blackrapid,
 Sun-Sniper or Camdapter Slingstrap. Since I don't want to remove my QR
 plate the only option was the camdapter sling. This Luma Loop has an
 extra long option.
 Now I don't know...

 I have the Sun-Sniper that has the screw-lock carabiner.

 http://www.sun-sniper.com/typo3temp/pics/cd16b500db.jpg

 I use the Bogen/Manrfotto RC2 Rapid Connect Plate.

 http://tinyurl.com/4u8gq3y

 The Sun-Sniper's screw-lock carabiner clips easily to the metal loop on the
 screw Bogen/Manrfotto uses to mount the RC2 plate to the bottom of the
 camera.

 I recently saw a different way of doing it. Attach a QR adapter to the sling
 using the supplied tripod thread nut  mount the camera to the QR adapter
 using the QR plate on the camera.

 (Bogen/Manfrotto RC 2 version)

 http://tinyurl.com/6638n28

 The Quick Release plate stays on the camera and the Quick Release adapter
 stays on the sling. Easily dismount the camera from the sling when you want
 to mount it on the tripod.

 The reason I prefer the Sun-Sniper is the steel wire woven into the strap to
 reduce the chance a thief will be able to cut the strap and steal your
 camera. I think mounting a QR adapter on the sling might negate that
 protection.


 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3452 - Release Date: 02/18/11


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 PDML@pdml.net
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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Tim Bray]

Argh, it's too late now, but in the world of strap-ware I'm a devoted
fan of the Luma Loop, see http://www.lu.ma/loop

 - T

On Tue, Feb 15, 2011 at 5:50 PM, Jeffery Johnson
jefferytjohn...@bellsouth.net wrote:
 I really hate doing this but looks as though I will end up having to
 purchase a strap. I cannot locate a pad off of any other strap around the
 house so looks like I will end up having to buy one.

 Probably going to go with OP/Tech brand straps:

 Which will either be
 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/39638-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1501012_Pro_Stra
 p_3_8_Black.html

 Or

 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/140198-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1001252_Classic
 _Strap_Black.html

 Anyone's thoughts between the two or anyone have experience with either one
 of these straps.

 Thanks,
 Jeffery



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Re: Thoughts between the two

[Toine]

I have the pro and it's working like mentioned in the add. The weight
reduction effect is noticable and a plus is you can remove the
shoulder pad and connect the two smaller remaining straps and use it
as a wrist strap.

On 16 February 2011 02:50, Jeffery Johnson
jefferytjohn...@bellsouth.net wrote:
 I really hate doing this but looks as though I will end up having to
 purchase a strap. I cannot locate a pad off of any other strap around the
 house so looks like I will end up having to buy one.

 Probably going to go with OP/Tech brand straps:

 Which will either be
 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/39638-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1501012_Pro_Stra
 p_3_8_Black.html

 Or

 http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/140198-REG/OP_TECH_USA_1001252_Classic
 _Strap_Black.html

 Anyone's thoughts between the two or anyone have experience with either one
 of these straps.

 Thanks,
 Jeffery



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RE: Thoughts between the two

[Jeffery Johnson]

Thanks Toine I ordered the Pro Strap as it appears to be the most
comfortable. Will let everyone know the results of how it works out.


-Original Message-
From: pdml-boun...@pdml.net [mailto:pdml-boun...@pdml.net] On Behalf Of
Toine
Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2011 3:17 PM
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List
Subject: Re: Thoughts between the two

I have the pro and it's working like mentioned in the add. The weight
reduction effect is noticable and a plus is you can remove the shoulder pad
and connect the two smaller remaining straps and use it as a wrist strap.



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Re: thoughts on 100mm macro...?

[eckinator]

2010/9/10 Larry Colen l...@red4est.com:

 Don't listen to him, it's a terrible piece of glass.  I'll take it off your 
 hands for $50.

you'll feel bad if you take that much for it - I'll have it for 20 and
promise no hard feelings

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Re: thoughts on 100mm macro...?

[Christine Nielsen]

Such generous offers!  I think I'll pass, though...  No hard feelings?

:)
-c

On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 6:35 AM, eckinator eckina...@gmail.com wrote:
 2010/9/10 Larry Colen l...@red4est.com:

 Don't listen to him, it's a terrible piece of glass.  I'll take it off your 
 hands for $50.

 you'll feel bad if you take that much for it - I'll have it for 20 and
 promise no hard feelings

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Re: thoughts on 100mm macro...?

[Walter Gilbert]

  Just wanted to let you know I think  you made the right decision in 
allowing me to take it off your hands for $10.  And, as promised, I 
won't let anyone else on the list know about the agreement.  Mum's the 
word.  Won't tell a soul.  My lips are sealed.  May lightning strike me, 
on my grandmother's grave.


Confidentially yours,

Walt

On 9/10/2010 8:33 AM, Christine Nielsen wrote:

Such generous offers!  I think I'll pass, though...  No hard feelings?

:)
-c

On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 6:35 AM, eckinatoreckina...@gmail.com  wrote:

2010/9/10 Larry Colenl...@red4est.com:

Don't listen to him, it's a terrible piece of glass.  I'll take it off your 
hands for $50.

you'll feel bad if you take that much for it - I'll have it for 20 and
promise no hard feelings

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Re: thoughts on 100mm macro...?

[Christine Nielsen]

Walter, your discretion is greatly appreciated.  I'm happy just
knowing you'll put it to good use.  With this lens, you can easily
justify charging $300 a pop for Little League portraits.

-c


On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 9:47 AM, Walter Gilbert ldott...@gmail.com wrote:
  Just wanted to let you know I think  you made the right decision in
 allowing me to take it off your hands for $10.  And, as promised, I won't
 let anyone else on the list know about the agreement.  Mum's the word.
  Won't tell a soul.  My lips are sealed.  May lightning strike me, on my
 grandmother's grave.

 Confidentially yours,

 Walt

 On 9/10/2010 8:33 AM, Christine Nielsen wrote:

 Such generous offers!  I think I'll pass, though...  No hard feelings?

 :)
 -c

 On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 6:35 AM, eckinatoreckina...@gmail.com  wrote:

 2010/9/10 Larry Colenl...@red4est.com:

 Don't listen to him, it's a terrible piece of glass.  I'll take it off
 your hands for $50.

 you'll feel bad if you take that much for it - I'll have it for 20 and
 promise no hard feelings

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Re: thoughts on 100mm macro...?

[Boris Liberman]

On 9/8/2010 10:34 PM, Christine Nielsen wrote:

Today, I enabled myself with the Pentax smc FA 100mm 2.8 macro lens.
Funny thing is,  it happened kind of by accident... I thought I was
purchasing the DFA 100mm 2.8 macro (the non-WR version), but it turns
out I overlooked the missing D when I placed my order.  Whoops.
...
What I wonder is this:  what am I missing out on because of my
shopping cart mix-up?  (Besides the price difference...)  I'm not sure
I understand the difference between the DFA  FA designations...  Are
there other features of either lens that I should consider before I
declare this one a keeper?

Thanks,
-c


Congratulations, you got yourself on of the best lenses Pentax ever 
produced. Although a bit large and heavy it is mighty excellent...


Boris




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