[RCSE] Comparing the Eraser to the Fazer
Hi folks, Anyone have any experience with both the Fazer and Eraser? I've heard extremely good things about the Fazer as an F3B ship, but a friend was wondering about whether it would be a better or worse choice than the Eraser for TD. Any help appreciated! Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Looking for a comparison between the Eraser Xtreme and Sharon
Hi folks, Posting for a friend off-list. He's looking for a relative comparison of the flying abilities of the Sharon 3.7 and Eraser Xtreme, and since I've never flown a Sharon, I'm not much help. I'd assume that the Eraser would be better at working light or tight lift, but what about relative flight speeds or climbing ability in lift? How strong is the Eraser Xtreme wing? (I know the F3B wing is basically bulletproof...love my Eraser) Will the RG-15 Sharon wing slow down nicely in lift like the Eraser's MH-32 will? He's finding that his d-box NYX doesn't match his flying style, and is looking for something else. I'm pushing him towards an Eraser of some description since I've been flying them for 5 years faithfully, but don't have any direct experience with anything other than the F3B version. Anyone have a NIB or like-new Sharon or Eraser Xtreme (or F3J) that they want to sell? Would have to be in perfect shape, no repaired models please. Cheers, Adam PS - got to fly a pair of bald eagles today as we both themalled out from about 50 feet...what a treat! Photos: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=343196
[RCSE] Re: Electric Tug Drive for Sale
Darn...third time lucky?: http://www.rcgroups.com/links/index.php?id=4641 Worst case, please go to www.liftzone.com, and click on the article on the Ultrastick 120. Cheers, Adam Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:13:00 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: Electric Tug Drive for Sale Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sorry, link should be: http://www.rcgroups.com/links/index.php?id=3D4641 Sorry, it did not work for me. Dennis RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Anyone have an F3B model for sale? Need practice ship...
Hi folks, Thanks for all the responses. Just sorting through them now, and I'll get back to everyone ASAP. Cheers, Adam Adam Till (Cal) wrote: Before I get lured away by a friend wanting to split shipping on some scale models, does anyone have any F3B models for sale that would make good practice ships? There's a group of us who have decided to learn to fly the tasks properly this season, and from what I've been learning my Erasers might not cut it. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Electric Tug Drive for Sale
Hi folks, If anyone is looking for a quiet alternative for towing moderate-sized scale sailplanes, I have just the ticket. I'm selling an Aveox 1817/4Y, Hacker Master 48 Opto, and a Tom Hunt belt drive. Same drive that was featured in the following article: http://www.rcgroups.com/links/index.php?id=4641 Works okay in a slow model like a Telemaster, but works really well in an UltraStick 120 Lite or similar. All bugs have been cleared up, and we've had a lots of great tows on it. Could include a 20x13E prop, but that might increase shipping Selling because we've got big sailplanes in the club now, and so have gone gas. This setup happily towed a Roedel 4m ASK21. Would also be a good match for a larger motorglider, especially since it's so quiet. Will sell all the drive components for $500 cdn + shipping ($400US), or $600 cdn with a 30 cell kapton nicad pack (about 30 cycles, carefully maintained) or 30 new, loose GP3300 cells. Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: Electric Tug Drive for Sale
-- Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:18:50 -0700 From: Adam Till \(Cal\) [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: Electric Tug Drive for Sale Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sorry, link should be: http://www.rcgroups.com/links/index.php?id=4641 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Anyone have an F3B model for sale? Need practice ship...
Hi folks, Before I get lured away by a friend wanting to split shipping on some scale models, does anyone have any F3B models for sale that would make good practice ships? There's a group of us who have decided to learn to fly the tasks properly this season, and from what I've been learning my Erasers might not cut it. Then again, I could solve the problem by just doing both :) Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] The perfect platform or Not....
I can use LiftRoll to adjust twist to make it look like an elipse or not, but how do I generate the comparison number from my origional post, IE wing 1 will have min sink of 1 fps and wing 2 will have minimum sink of X fps? You don't necessarily want an elliptical lift distribution in a real-world model, since that might result in turning behaviour that is a little scary at times if your airfoil selections aren't correct. You're really looking to optimize cruise here, right? (ie min power setting for level flight). Look into the power factor calculation available from xfoil/profili. Flight power is proportional to CD/CL^1.5, but remember that CD is the total airframe drag coefficient, so working with the airfoil Cd along isn't going to give you the full picture. How do I use LiftRoll to get a wing Cd, Cl given a polar Cl, Cd? Very simple...you can't. It's not designed to be able to give you this information, since at no point does it incorporate actual airfoil data. In LiftRoll is av/mx Cl the Cl I want to optimize for? That's a planform efficiency number, giving you a measure of how aggressive the planform design is. Real-world meaning: a high efficiency number will require a more competent pilot, since upon reaching stall more of the wing will let go at the same time. Compromising this measure will result in a model that's easier to fly over a wide range of conditions. How do I go about guessing an AOA? (Again from the airfoil polar? ) Don't bother...I've already made a sheet that will calculate it for you (overall Cd, wing drag, tail drag etc). You need to know the weight of the model (assuming you're calculating a level flight condition, ie weight=lift required) and you need access to the airfoil polar data from Profili/Xfoil at the appropriate Re# Go to the following link to download the sheet...based off of LiftRoll about 3 yrs ago: http://www.soarcalgary.com/Extras/Articles/Sailplane%20Design%20Spreadsh eet/ Did you have a webpage for your solar project? I've been curious how it was coming along, but the few searches I ran never came up with the webpage that I seem to remember seeing once upon a time. Hope that helps, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Choosing Stab Sections
Hi folks, Hoping someone can give me a hand with the particularities of proper stab/fin airfoil design. I remember understanding the concepts behind it at one point, but I've since forgotten, and would appreciate a refresher (the archives for these lists didn't help I'm afraid). I'm designing a new aerobatic model, and after some investigation have decided to try some of the Eppler sections that were presented in the March 2001 issue of SE Modeller. When Dr. Eppler was writing about the E175, he said: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/xfoil/files/E175/ Also, when I calculated the flapped case for the rudder chord of the 1/3 scale Swift at 50%, I clearly noticed a turbulator is necessary on both sides of the section at 35% chord. You must be aware of this fact, as I am afraid that the landing control may become very difficult without the turbulator Well, frankly...I don't see it. I tried running a few test cases, and I see a marked decrease in the lift/drag ratio with the addition of the turbulator. Maybe my Reynolds number is too high? (300K) I've included the output I get for the section in flapped condition (6 degrees) with and without the turbulators in the following folder: Could some kind soul explain to me how best to optimize a stab or fin airfoil for a particular Re#? I'm not really interested in the full-flying variety at this point, but am willing to learn anything new if you'd like to share those concepts as well. In a related manner, I've been doing some reading on F3A pattern models, and have noticed that even though their manoeuvre speed is about 80 mph, they tend to truncate the wing airfoils they use so that the wing has a thick TE (2-3mm sometimes on a 19 chord). This apparently results in a dampening effect much like exponential. When I simulate this, I get a slight increase in max lift at a corresponding increase in drag at low Cl, but I can't rationalize an exponential effect. I've even heard of flared TE's on F3A rudders, which apparently help the models keep a heading on an upline (my guess is that this works much the same way as a double gurney flap). Is this a case of an airfoil actually needing a turbulator, as Dr. Eppler describes? Finally, regarding the location of hingelines, my typical approach in the past has been to run a variety of flapped conditions using a single value for degrees of deflection, and then to choose the case with the best lift/drag ratio. If this is different at for the tip and root of the stab, I've drawn a line perpendicular to the fuse centerline and aligned the hingelines to give me an overall stab planform. Is this method sound? Thanks for any help you can offer, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Selig 6060 Coordinates
Yep, guilty as charged. Thanks to everyone who responded...most appreciated. I have most sections, but I couldn't find this one for whatever reason. Thanks, Adam -Original Message- From: John Derstine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2005 4:10 AM To: Adam Till (Cal); Soaring@airage.com Subject: RE: [RCSE] Selig 6060 Coordinates Ah Ha, the man has done his research on glider aerobatic sections :-) Consider transitioning to a 6061 profile at the tip. I can't send you the file as my old compufoil and profili airfoil library left my computer, but there are plenty of on line sources for this. JD Endless Mountain Models http://www.scalesoaring.com email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Adam Till Cal [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 9:05 PM To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] Selig 6060 Coordinates Hi folks, Would someone please be kind enough to send me the coordinates for the S6060 section? Thanks, Adam Adam Till RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Selig 6060 Coordinates
Hi folks, Would someone please be kind enough to send me the coordinates for the S6060 section? Thanks, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Scale Glider Aerobatics - part two
Hi John, Thanks very much for the extensive review - VERY appreciated (especially on a list with such a high level of noise). I think I have a better idea of what would be involved now. I'll chat with some of my pattern friends to see what their interest level would be. My gut feeling is that a guy coming off of an F3A machine would have more interest that someone obsessed with big control surfaces and hanging on the prop. The reason I asked was that out club now has a couple of working tugs, and hopefully by the end of this season there will be someone else to fly them (ie. not me). That means I can actually get a scale sailplane again :) I've always loved the look and performance of the Roedel Fox (there's one in our club), and was curious if I could eventually do something competitive with one (or something similar). I enjoyed flying an electric-powered UltraStick 120 Lite that served as our tug for two years, but since that's gone gas, I wouldn't feel as comfortable fun-flying it at the sailplane club anymore (gas is really just for towing there). As a result, if I wanted to fly an aerobatic machine again at that club I either need to get another big electric, or an aerobatic sailplane. I'm leaning towards the latter :) Unfortunately this is all academic for the next few months, since I have some UAV work to complete (darn Transport Canada is making life difficult). Cheers, Adam -Original Message- From: John Derstine [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 24, 2005 6:54 PM To: Adam Till (Cal); Soaring@airage.com Subject: RE: [RCSE] Scale Glider Aerobatics - part two In the meantime Pete George and I made an attempt to modify the Scale Event at the NATs (2002 rules cycle I think) to emphasize the flying aspect and deemphasize the Petty arcane scale judging part. We, in three years managed to pass the revised scale event which in our minds was written in such a way as to not only encourage more general participation at the NATS event, but that this format could easily be made a scale aerobatic competition at the local level by selecting aerobatic planes as the only type competing. Flying maneuvers were to be consistent with the full scale prototype, and pilots and or CD's were free as is always the case, to modify the format within the rules to hold a local scale competition with emphasis on aerobatics. Well this effort has been hashed and rehashed and the event fizzled in spite of our efforts. It seemed that most scale pilots in the US simply had no interest in formal competition or lots of rules. The ISSA discussion was influenced by Pete Goldsmith's effort to perhaps include an informal aerobatic competition at the first JR Aerotow. The Result of that discussion was endless arguing on the part of some, insisting on their form of Aresti patterns rather than adopt the German figures that were already established, were readily available, not too difficult for the intermediate sailplane pilot, and published on the internet for anyone to copy and practice. It became obvious as the discussion went on that many scale guys just did not want to go through the hassle associated with organizing a competition. The final analysis remains that there is little interest in such serious competition among scale sailplane flyers. The TOC guys showed a little initial interest, but for whatever reason, time most likely, did not constitute a new contingent of scale sailplane acro flyers. John Diniz and Pete George even performed at the break at one of the last TOC competitions. I think there is potential for this someday in the U.S. The format needs to be relaxed enough to be fun for ordinary weekend pilots, yet challenging enough, and organized in such a way as to establish a standard and attract skilled pilots as well. Classes for non scale, scale acro planes, and perhaps vintage scale might draw a larger cross section. XCscale seems to be the next trend, and hopefully, it might be a more accessible format for flying scale sailplanes and competing. I left out tons of info, and hopefully did not raise too many hackles out there. JD Endless Mountain Models http://www.scalesoaring.com email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Adam Till Cal [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, January 24, 2005 7:45 PM To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] Scale Glider Aerobatics - Current State of Affairs? Hi all, Are there are any glider aerobatic competitions scheduled for North America in 2005? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Scale Glider Aerobatics - Current State of Affairs?
Hi all, Are there are any glider aerobatic competitions scheduled for North America in 2005? I found an interesting, if dated, discussion on the subject on the ISSA website, and was curious what the current state of affairs is? Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Use of twist in extreme aspect ratio scale wings...
Hi folks, Does anybody know offhand to what degree large scale high aspect ratio scale ships (ie ASW-22, ASH 25 etc) typically use washout to control stall behaviour? I don't have any direct experience with such models, but I can't think that washout would be all that (visually) noticeable on the huge wings, and would definitely seem to be almost mandatory given the huge differential in flying speeds between the two tips in a turn. Just another interesting lunchtime question from yesterday Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Frequency Scanners
Thanks for all the suggestions folks, lots to think about. Cheers, Adam RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Frequency Scanners
Hi folks, In the market for a scanner for 72mhz (and possibly 50mhz). Doesn't have to do anything more than tell me if there's something on my channel, and some measure of signal strength. Basically, the simpler, the better. Old subject I know, but I seem to remember that the old standard recommendation model scanner has been discontinued. Anyone have one that they want to get rid of? Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Flight reports on CO-9 F3B?
Hi folks, Happy new year to all! Anyhoo, has anyone heard any flight reports on the CO-9 F3B flying wing? I was doing some browsing at lunch, and couldn't find much on it other than plans. I talked to the Kuhlman's, and confirmed that they only know about the following link: http://www.zanonia-flyers.de/nfco9e.htm ...and the similar one on www.aerodesign.de Anybody know anything more on how it flies? Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] The proper way to add washout/twist...
Hi folks, Just curious if anyone knows how washout should be properly added to a wing. I don't mean how much should be added (that I understand fine), but rather how the wing should be twisted. Do you rotate the tip section about the 1/4 chord point? Do you rotate the tip section about the LE? Does it really matter? Thanks, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
RE: [RCSE] The proper way to add washout/twist...
Thought so, and that's what I'd usually do. This time I'm doodling a little flying wing that has twist from 1/2 span out, however, and having a straight LE would be helpful as a reference. Any guesses as to what doing this rather than twisting at 1/4 chord would do? Cheers, Adam -Original Message- From: Bill Swingle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 10:07 AM To: Adam Till (Cal); [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] The proper way to add washout/twist... The 1/4 chord point would be the best choice. But it's not that big of a concern usually. If you're cutting a foam core, then yes. Rotate the tip template around the 1/4 chord point. Bill Swingle RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
RE: [RCSE] The proper way to add washout/twist...
Not an EPP foamie (bagged composite), so I have to make the decision before I cut the cores, but I'm sure it'll work out fine. I'll throw in an extra 1/4 degree of twist (it requires 4 already). Thanks again, Adam -Original Message- From: Bill Swingle [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 10:17 AM To: Adam Till (Cal) Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] The proper way to add washout/twist... Twisting around the LE will add a bit of a pitching moment. Usually. However, a flying wing USUALLY will have a near-zero pitching moment airfoil so it's a non-issue. Besides, if it's a foamie, just twisting it with you hand and applying a heat gun, will usually twist around approximately the 1/4 chord point. So it's no problem. Really I've done it dozens of times. Don't sweat it. Bill Swingle RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
[RCSE] FW: [nurflugel] The proper way to add washout/twist...
Good thought from Al, in case anyone was following this. Cheers, Adam From: Al Bowers [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:21 AMTo: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: [nurflugel] The "proper" way to add washout/twist... Adam, Just curious if anyone knows how washout should be "properly" added to a wing. I don't mean how much should be added (that I understand fine), but rather how the wing should be twisted. Do you rotate the tip section about the 1/4 chord point (typically how I've done it in the past)? Can you rotate the tip section about the LE instead without changing the effect very much? Does it really matter?Just a thought: you should twist it about the hingeline of the controlsurfaces. The hingeline becomes a straight line, which simplifies thehinge and the seal of the surfaces. This way, you maximize the seal(or at least minimize the complexity of the hinges and seals) for thecontrol surface. Leaking pressure from the bottom of the wing to thetop of the wing (reducing aero efficiency and control powerefficiency) is usually a bad idea...Reimar Horten always did it that way. So it MUST be a good idea...Al Bowers-- Al Bowers Deputy Director of Research (acting)[EMAIL PROTECTED] NASA Dryden Flight Research Center"Tranquility Base here, the Eagle has landed. " -Neil Armstrong, 20 Jul 1969Need to unsubscribe or change your subscription profile? Please go to http://www.onelist.com to make the appropriate change. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Yahoo! Groups Links To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nurflugel/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
RE: [RCSE] Flying wings for F3J or F3B
Hi all, From: Douglas, Brent [EMAIL PROTECTED] Without going into this too much, the best link I have for flying wings is www.aerodesign.de - hint, it's in German. Good list of ships used for F3J/B applications - also some great looking electric flying wing designs. I tried one of the constant chord designs as a sloper, and it worked very well. Thanks for that, I've been there. I was really looking for someone who's actually flown something like a CO7, since flight reports are few and far between. From: Daryl Perkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] Doubtful you'll never see one for either of these tasks. You can't set them up to launch effectively. D The few flight reports that are available for the CO7 talk of it being able to outlaunch Ellipses and V-Ultras, so with proper setup they should be okay. http://www.glide.net.au/flyingwing/co7.htm Those aren't current competition models, but they were in the CO7's day. Don't know if things have changed to the point where a wing wouldn't be competitive anymore, but I don't think anyone really knows on this (NA) side of the pond. There are (or used to be) whole F3B competitions in Germany specifically for wings, but I never heard anything about them, or if they're still going on. The catch 22 seems to be that since few people are interested in such wings, there aren't many being flown. Since that small group of pilots doesn't contain a member who flies at the very top level of the sport, wings don't get exposure and there isn't any demand for them by the general population. No demand, no availability. Or they just aren't competitive enough and this whole line of questioning is moot. Of course, it could also be that Zagi's and their ilk are so annoying that a whole generation of pilots has such a low opinion of wings that they try to mentally block them out at every chance :) From: John Derstine [EMAIL PROTECTED] Here is one contender, several are in the works here in the U.S. and it has been rumored that they will be used for TD work as an experiment. At 7 pounds, hey are not specifically designed for this, but as a high performance aerobat and thermal ship. http://www.scalesoaring.net/EMM/Taborca.htm Sorry John, several Taborca's or several different designs? The Taborca looks like a nice model, but like you mention, it's really too heavy to be too competitive in either TD or F3J events. Take 2.5 lbs out and it might very well be, I don't know. That's actually one of the bigger issues I have with the available information. All the F3J designs I've seen so far aren't nearly strong enough to actually survive an F3J tow, and they all tend to be fairly crude structurally (6 oz plain weave carbon and 3 oz glass with a shear web, or layups of that nature). As a result, they're also very heavy for their size. Since I'm told that wings tend to behave like a conventional model that weighs 20% less, it's even more critical to engineer them properly. I think it would be very doable to engineer a wing that weighs 20% less than one with a conventional tail, but it leads me to believe that the effort in doing so might not really be worth it. That said, I don't know that for sure, and don't plan to give up flying normal F3X models for the time being. From: Bill Swingle [EMAIL PROTECTED] The comments that I've been told regarding tailless wings for thermal flying is that the performance is reasonably good. The Tailless performance is quite doable and is being perfected. However, I've been told that thermal flyers find it difficult to fly a plane well without the visual indicator of a tail. I can definitely see visibility as a concern, but if it's just a matter of getting used to something that looks different (but the performance gain is there), I could work around it. Again, purely a theoretical exercise at this point, but it never hurts to learn something new. Thanks, Adam From: James V. Bacus [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can speak for yourself here, but please don't speak for me. I don't feel the same way. Wasn't trying to Jim, just a thought tacked onto the end of another post. I thought I'd actually gone out of my way to say that everyone was entitled to their own opinion, and I believe that. Members can use the list however they like. From: Adam Till Cal [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Members can do what they like when it comes down to it... RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
[RCSE] Repair of broken Becker Antenna
Hi folks, Unfortunately, I was dumb enough to bend the second-last segment on my Becker antenna when I bent down to pick up my sailplane on the weekend. I didn't even notice that I'd done it until I got back to the car...oh well. After noticing that the telescoping sections appeared to be brass, I stripped the paint off the bent (now snapped) sections, and straightened the tube with an awl and a piece of music wire that fit the inside diameter. After finding a piece of brass that nested inside the previously-bent sections, I snipped off a section less than 1/4 long, and soldered the antenna back together using the tube as an internal splint/stiffener. A little paint should have it back looking as good as new, with the only lasting damage being that the tip section only collapses about halfway now. Any chance my repair has (significantly) changed the behaviour of the antenna? I can range check using a friend's undamaged antenna just to be safe, but I'm sort of curious what the effect would be from an academic standpoint. Any thoughts? FWIW - I really missed having the antenna when I went out again the next day. I'd forgotten how much of a pain it is to fly with those stock antennas! Cheers, Adam Adam Till Mechanical Engineer 403-270-9200 (ext 154) 403-270-0399 (Fax) UMA Engineering Ltd. 2540 Kensington Road NW Calgary AB, Canada T2N 3S3 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
[RCSE] Flaps servos are stalling when in flap stick is in full up0 flap
Hi Stan, Are you using JR digital servos by any chance? A friend of mine had this same problem in his Icon last weekend, except for him it happened at full flap. The servo basically turned itself off at full flap, and you could move it by hand freely. One click less (or 98% ATV) and it turned back on and followed the other flap perfectly. Very strange I thought... Cheers, Adam Date: Sat, 03 Apr 2004 14:07:45 -0600 From: Stan Myers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Soaring Digest [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Flaps servos are stalling when in flap stick is in full up0 flap position. Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] When in move the flap stick just one notch the servos stop stalling. I have a 8103. How do I adj to get the stall out? Many thanks Stan RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
RE: [RCSE] Stab design from a technical perspective (many questi ons)
Thanks to all who have pointed this out, I should be more careful when I type! I'm aware that it should be 1/4MAC, but I was visualizing a 2D airfoil section polar when I was writing, where 1/4 MAC = 1/4 chord. I'll be more careful next time :) Cheers,Adam -Original Message-From: Dave [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 4:01 PMTo: Bill Swingle; Adam Till (Cal); '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'Subject: Re: [RCSE] Stab design from a technical perspective (many questions) Guys Note:- one thing from what I remember the 25% chord is good but 25% MAC for both wing and Tailplane not 25% root. Dave (UK) Yahoo! Messenger - Communicate instantly..."Ping" your friends today! Download Messenger Now
[RCSE] Re: Hinge lines
Do you have Profili? If so, you can use the pressure distribution to figure out where best to place the hingeline. Read the article below where it mentions the kink or knuckle in the pressure distribution: http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomframe.jsp?query=fletcher+f3b+designpage=1offset=0result_url=redir%3Fsrc%3Dwebsearch%26amp%3BrequestId%3Dc1a4cb4c5e9e8442%26amp%3BclickedItemRank%3D1%26amp%3BuserQuery%3Dfletcher%2Bf3b%2Bdesign%26amp%3BclickedItemURN%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hsa.lr.tudelft.nl%252F%257Efrits%252Ffletchtxt.html%26amp%3BinvocationType%3D-%26amp%3BfromPage%3DnsBrowserRollremove_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hsa.lr.tudelft.nl%2F%7Efrits%2Ffletchtxt.html Any other answer will be a rule of thumb, which may or may not be what you're looking for. Cheers, Adam Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 22:53:52 -0500 (EST) From: Joshua [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Hinge lines Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] At the Re we use, I understand that we need our control surfaces relatively large. But how large? I know Drs. MacCready and Drela must have an answer, and maybe everyone else but me does, too. I have an RG15 on which I would like flaperons. The chord will be between ~5 and ~6 inches at the position the flaperons will be in the wing. According DJ, well, I don't quite understand, but I think they're saying to make it as big as you can. Thanks, folks. -J -- End of Soaring V1 #3368 *** RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
[RCSE] Minimoa for sale
Hi folks, Just curious if anyone needs a new scale bird for the upcoming towing season (I'm off to get a new tug either tonight or tommorrow). Since I end up flying the tug most of the time anyway, I think I'll be able to make do with just my DG300. Asking $700 cdn RTF (- reciever), which includes two packs of 5 cell 3000mah nicads, two JR 507 servos, two HS81 servos, two HS225MG servos, and a Dymond 1/4 scale servo. Model is 4m in wingspan, 12-13lbs, and a VERY gentle flier (ideal aerotow trainer). Includes Graupner retractable airbrakes and is covered in 21st Century fabric. Pics: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attachment.php?s=postid=815000 http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attachment.php?s=postid=992236 Local sale or pickup only (Calgary, AB), I don't even want to consider shipping this. Cheers, Adam Dave - could you forward this to Eraldo (sp?) at the Red Deer club. Thanks for the tip earlier today!
[RCSE] Re: Electric Tug
Hi all, We're actually doing a project on that very subject right now for LiftZone.com, execpt the goal is to tow 4 and 5m sailplanes (look for the article in the coming months). Phase one has been to use a Senior Telemaster with a big Aveox drive system on 30 cells, and that has more than enough power to tow my friend's 4.2m ASK-21 off of long grass. The problem that we've been having so far is putting 2.5 horsepower through a belt without it delaminating, though even that problem should be solved quickly. Check out the following links for videos, or see the Scale Sailplanes forum on RCGroups.com Here's an email I sent to our club list. We tried again this weekend, only to have the belt blow up...damaging the tug in the ensuing off-field forced landing. Joy! Now it's my turn to spend the week repairing... Had our first successful tow with the tug/sailplane combo, and one that went horribly wrong. Just as a reminder, the tug is a Hobby Lobby Senior Telemaster (about 10.5-11 lbs), and the sailplane is a Rodellmodel ASK-21 (4.2m, 12lbs?). The first one was fine, with the combo coming off after a 100ft rollout or so. This actually works very well! The climbout was strong, but it was hard to keep the tug from climbing too strongly and slowing the sailplane down too much. We got to about 300 ft when the sailplane released, because I ran out of down elevator on the tug (needs some trim work). Video here: http://www.soarcalgary.com/Multimedia/Tow1 The second tow didn't go so well. After retrimming the tug a bit, it started off well. Video here: http://www.soarcalgary.com/Multimedia/Tow2 After the first leg however, the tug and sailplane got a little uncoordinated and ended up putting a bunch of slack in the line. As the slack came out, the tug got yanked almost to a standstill, but the sailplane got thrown in a violent flat spin. Since we were only about 150 feet up, the sailplane wasn't able to recover completely in time to avoid damage. The wingrod was rather severly bent (1 steel tube!), and the tail needs some 'glasswork patching. The tug landed without incident. The ugly: http://www.soarcalgary.com/Multimedia/BadTow That was it for the day, obviously, but we'll be out again next weekend if weather and repairs permit. Cheers, Adam Date: Mon, 22 Sep 2003 13:57:34 EDT From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] Electric tow plane Is it possible to tow 3 meter scale gliders into the air by electric powered planes ? What kind of motors will be required ? I have been pondering on the same subject, except I want to tow larger gliders also. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Looking for a Soaring Achievement Program? Re: [RCSE] LSF V Tasks
Hi folks, Since the topic seems to have migrated back over to the LSF tasks again (spring must be in the air), I just thought I'd plug another program that concentrates more on soaring, and less on scoring. Look up the Canadian Soaring Society achievement program (www.crcss.org). The tasks are mainly individually based, and test general flying skill much more than the LSF does, IMHO. The LSF 8 hour slope task doesn't hold a candle to the CSS 3 hour thermal flight! Plus, the CSS gives you fancy pins when you achieve your levels :) Mind you, if you're looking to test your contest flying ability, the LSF is hard to beat. Cheers, Adam Till -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.geocities.com/sunbirdz If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. -George Carlin Crinkle, crinkle, little spar, strained beyond the yield-point far. Up above the world so high, bits and pieces in the sky... -Darrol Stinton RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] Mixing Digiital Servos
Doesn't seem to be a big problem with MPX servos. I have (had...just sold) a Hera with two mini digitals on the flaps and analog servos elsewhere (all MPX), and never had any sort of problems in two years of flying. I've had Superslim and IPD recievers in it, with no change in performance. Specked out many, many times. Cheers, Adam Pat McCleave wrote: Hi Gang, The following information was sent to me by a fellow modeler and this is the first I had heard anything about it. Has anyone experienced any problems of this kind? I personally have only owned one model that mixed digital servos with analog and had absolutely no problems at all, but maybe I was lucky. Any additional information would be greatly appreciated. Also, does anyone have George Steiner's email address. I would like to contact him directly about this as well. I am not sure if you have heard the latest on digital servos, You can not mix brands of digital servos or mix analogue and digital in the same plane. George Steiner has discover a cross talking feedback problem that could end up in a disaster for your plane.. See Ya, Pat McCleave Wichita, KS RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. -George Carlin Crinkle, crinkle, little spar, strained beyond the yield-point far. Up above the world so high, bits and pieces in the sky... -Darrol Stinton RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Photos of building hollow composite structures
Hi all, Does anyone know of any good photographs/articles of hollow composites being built? I know of the Trinitus shots on www.f3j.dk and the Europhia shots on the MRSSA site, but that's about it. The Soaring Stuff video is great for generalities and basic techniques, but not really for layup details and such. Cheers, Adam -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. -George Carlin Crinkle, crinkle, little spar, strained beyond the yield-point far. Up above the world so high, bits and pieces in the sky... -Darrol Stinton RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Receiver Recommendations
I've heard that Berg recently redesigned their Berg6, but the earlier ones were pretty useless in a contest situation. I even had problems with my 555's last year at Poway, and have since switched my Encore and Feather DLG over to Multiplex IPD7's. The Encore tried to kill itself in the 1,2,3,4 min round when I (standing upwind) flew over a group of pilots downwind. It dove vertically without any elevator input, and I just pulled out before killing someone. I'd got my 1,3,2 and was just skying out for the 4 too...expletives abounded after that I assure you. The only recievers that I haven't heard having any problems at Poway were the Multiplex ones, and they're not cheap anymore. I used to be able to pick one up for 124.99 Cdn w/crystal, but I think they're closer to $150 now. Cheers, Adam Jody Z. Vogel wrote: Anyone fly a Berg6 in a contest environment with success? This is a dual-conversion rcvr, correct? I like the Berg6 http://www.rc-direct.com/ sells them and they are priced pretty nice. -Original Message- From: Jody Z. Vogel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 8:41 AM To: RCSE Subject: [RCSE] Receiver Recommendations Looking for comments (pos neg) on various rcvr brands. I need to acquire at least three new receivers for my DLG's that I'll be taking to Poway in June. Here is what I have... Snip Jody Z San Antonio, TX RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. George Carlin Cohn's Law: The more time you spend reporting on what you are doing, the less time you have to actually do anything. Stability is achieved when you are doing nothing but reporting on the nothing you are doing. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Manners for newbies
Sorry, can't say I agree. I get rather annoyed when I take the time to respond (especially if the response is significant in length or effort) and don't even get a thanks. It's like people who hang up on the phone without a goodbye. Manners still count for something. Honestly, what does it take? Adam John J. Brown wrote: Harley, I disagree. We don't need our inboxes cluttered with responses that are just Thanks. Appreciation is understood. -Original Message- From: Harley Michaelis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 7:47 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] Manners for newbies When answers are given to a newbie on some question, he should realize that he is owed nothing by those offering them. Rather, answers are voluntarily and generously offered in a spirit of wanting to be helpful. It follows that as a manner of common courtesy a response should be acknowleged, even if only a simple thanks. If he is later seen making other inquiries, he must be checking the mail, so seems without excuse. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. George Carlin Cohn's Law: The more time you spend reporting on what you are doing, the less time you have to actually do anything. Stability is achieved when you are doing nothing but reporting on the nothing you are doing. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] repairing a molded wing
If the construction of the Millenium uses a Rhoacell core like my Emerald does (which I suspect), then repairs are a little tough. When I crunched a bit of the LE trying to land through my shin (skegs don't work on ice BTW), I carefully pieced the core foam together with foam safe CA, re-adhered the skin with laminating epoxy, then put a light veil of 0.75 oz cloth over the repair. It didn't add much weight and actually worked really well, but it wasn't a quick repair! Good luck, Adam Till [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I got a couple of crushed spots on my Millennium leading edge with no spar damage. I am looking for ideas for a slick repair without the use of a vacuum bag. I am not overly concerned with cosmetics. Bruce Davidson Louisville, KY RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. George Carlin Cohn's Law: The more time you spend reporting on what you are doing, the less time you have to actually do anything. Stability is achieved when you are doing nothing but reporting on the nothing you are doing. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Full-flying tail configurations
Hi all, First off - thanks for the suggestions for the tailplane airfoil, keep em' coming. Right now I'm leaning towards the HD801, but I'll hold off for a bit. Next question: how to set up the full-flying elevator. The two ways that I've done it are: (a) single piece: http://www.multimania.com/f3i/images/thumaid/01520514.jpg and (b) the traditional joiner rod method, with a pivot rod near the neutral point and foward articulation rod. Are there any aerodynamic advantages and disadvantages to be considered. I like a for the structural strength of a single-piece elevator, but machining the pivot would be a pain. Thanks, Adam Till -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten. George Carlin Cohn's Law: The more time you spend reporting on what you are doing, the less time you have to actually do anything. Stability is achieved when you are doing nothing but reporting on the nothing you are doing. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] why are ailerons top-hinged?
It's usually because ailerons have more upward deflection than downward, especially in a crow or spoileron setup. Having the hinge on top allows for this larger movement with a smaller cutout (gap) in the wing. That's why flaps are usually bottom hinged...greater deflection downward. It all becomes academic with wipers however, since the hinge is pretty free to move sans-gap up to about 60 degrees (in most cases). Cheers, Adam From: Arne Ansper [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] why are ailerons top-hinged? Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 17:06:07 +0200 (Israel Standard Time) hi! simple question: why are ailerons top-hinged? i have two explanations: 1) they look better this way 2) since the pushrod is usually on the lower side of wing one can use shorter control horn (by the thickness of the aileron), to achieve same throw that helps to reduce drag somewhat. since i'm putting the pushrod on the top of the wing i would like to put the hinge to the lower surface. are there any aerodynamical consideration which make the top hinged ailerons with continous upper surface more desireable? arne RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send subscribe and unsubscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: 3-Position Switch was RE: [RCSE] Which computer radio?
Oh, I fully realize what you were talking about - I was disagreeing with the statement that you need to dive excessively. What's the point in bleeding off altitude for airspeed? That isn't what a zoom is about. Sure you need a mild dive to perform this, but you don't need a steep one. The added effect from the zoom is gained mainly from tensioning the line...not from dive speed. That's why the wings need to be that strong on zoomable airplanes, the winch is almost pulling directly downwards with up to 200lb of line tension. Adam From: Jeff Reid [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: 3-Position Switch was RE: [RCSE] Which computer radio? Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 11:34:24 -0800 why would it be better to lose rudder control vs. elevator control? A properly trimmed sailplane should only need rudder inputs before zooming on tow...even then it's only a very mild dive-entry I was referring to contest style zooom launches, like F3J. Dive entry is not mild at all. Tension and speed are built up during the first few seconds of launch, then glider is nosed down fairly steeply to convert tension into more speed, 80mph or more, then the glider is nosed up to almost vertical, gaining almost another 200 feet in altitude. The purpose of this is to get maximum altitude out of a fixed length line. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] carbon d light hlg
Hi Louis, My experience with the Unlimited version of the sailplane has been alright. As far as I know, the only difference between the 1.8m 1.5m versions is an added bit to the wing, so it should be academic for what I'm about to say. I ordered mine from www.ecmc.com, but I got the cruisform version because it was on sale. Don't do that - go v-tail. The airplane was looking to have to have 2.5-3 oz of lead in the nose! I ended up making it an electric boosted glider simply because that amount of lead puts this airplane out of the competitive weight range (that was a bit of a disappointment to me). My sailplane now flies well w/ S-400 7 600mah cells @ 19.4 oz, but I don't consider the Carbon D-Lite it to be a very competitive hand launch. It doesn't penetrate very well unballasted, but it does thermal happily in calmer conditions. Now if only my Encore would come sometime this year. Four months and counting, not that it matters at all since we're under a layer of snow and it's a balmy -14C. Sigh Cheers, Adam www.geocities.com/sunbirdz/Sailplane_Homepage.html From: "Louis Gonzalez" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: "Louis Gonzalez" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "soaring" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] carbon d light hlg Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 10:15:59 -0800 any carbon d light owners that can comment and compare this hlg with a dartar hlg or similar.? im want to get one since my dartar is preety worn now., but im curious if it will have similar performance to a vaccum bag wing hlg. it looks preety good for 139 from icare sailplanes., also ..does anyone know if there are distributors other than icare and nesail. thanks luis RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Hitec 8 Super Slim Rcvr 3 cells?
Anyone tried this combination? Does it work well? Cheers, Adam www.geocities.com/sunbirdz/Sailplane_Homepage.html It's a big mistake to allow any mechanical object to realize that you are in a hurry. The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was. - _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Fun1=Blazer=NSP Victor?
Or something brooding and ominous, like "Vendetta" or "Valkyrie" (sp? it's Friday and I'm lazy...". Cheers, Adam From: "John B" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] Fun1=Blazer=NSP Victor? Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 09:24:05 PDT How 'bout: Tsunami The name implies power and destruction (of competitors) - and it's got that funny T at the beginning. ]You are correct and I forgot! Need a new name. Best name conTest gets ]$50.00 ]credit with NSP! ] ][EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ] ] Sal wrote: In the meantime we have come out with ] the Filip slope at a great price and will shortly reveal two new ]molded ] 60" slope sailplanes. One is called the Fury and the ] other the Storm. ] ] Oh great, another sailplane called the STORM! ] I own the Slegers 2M Storm... about 3-5 years old design, still on ]Ed's web ] site! It is a great first full house TD ship with sloping potential. ] ] Bruce in Vancouver, WA ] ]-- ]Sal DeFrancesco ]Northeast Sailplane Products ]948 Hercules Dr. Suite 12 ]Colchester, Vt. 05446 ]802-655-7700 ] ]Website: http://www.nesail.com ] ] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] 8UAFS and Spectra module?
Someone was talking about having to remove and replace the module when the TX was on. Is that EVERY time you turn the TX on, or just when channels get flipped? Cheers, Adam Tons of people on rec.models.rc.air have verified that it works without problems (the question comes up A LOT!). Supposedly its not FCC legal because the module was not tested by Futababut that's a whole 'nother argument. John B wrote: Apparently the Hitec "Spectra" module (http://www.hitecrcd.com/Catalog/Air/Other/spectra_72mhz.html) plugs right into the Futaba 8UAFS and allows you to safely set the tx frequency to any channel. Has anyone verified that this works, and are there any pitfalls to doing this? _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] 8UAFS and Spectra module?
Well there goes that idea. That would drive me nuts in short order. Does Futaba make such a creature? AT From: Darwin N Barrie [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Till [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] 8UAFS and Spectra module? Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 01:18:51 -0700 Adam Till wrote: Someone was talking about having to remove and replace the module when the TX was on. Is that EVERY time you turn the TX on, or just when channels get flipped? Everytime you turn the tranny on. Darwin N. Barrie Scottsdale AZ _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Satisfied NSP Customer
I guess the rest of us must smell bad, or something like that ;) Adam From: "James T Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: "James T Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "soaring" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] Satisfied NSP Customer Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2000 08:13:40 -0700 Bought several times. Always satisfied with price, delivery and service. jtm RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] aileron differential, which way?
Actually, most people aim to get a pure roll reponse by using aileron differential. Inducing proverse yaw, yaw into the direction of the turn, isn't really much better than having adverse yaw. A coordinated turn comes from using rudder and aileron together, not having ailerons providing a yawing movement. You need more upward deflection than downward, from what I remember, because the drag induced by undercambering the airfoil (downward aileron) increases at a faster rate than reducing (or reversing) the camber (upward deflection). Any difference in the drag on either wing will yield a yawing effect. Interestingly enough, the reverse is true of a v-tail. Any ideas why anyone? Cheers, Adam From: daniel gaudenti [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] aileron differential, which way? Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 13:22:38 -0700 (PDT) Should there be more up or down throw, and why? From what I remember, more up is required. And the reason is to prevent adverse yaw. More throw on the up aileron causes more drag and helps the plane yaw in the same direction of the turn. Am I remembering correctly? TIA, Danny RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Paging Mike Shelhart...
I'm looking to get a hold of Mike Shelhart of Torrance, CA. Anybody know why he's presently indisposed? Thanks, Adam _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Northeast Sailplane Web site (A General Tip)
I'm always amazed that Sal can even deal with email. I don't know why he bothers to show the [EMAIL PROTECTED] address - he never answers it. I've asked a couple of questions, querried about orders, asked to be notified upon shipment, things like that, and I've NEVER recieved a response. Ever. I tried to cancel an order (after not even recieving a confirmation of receipt) and had to ask his wife in the end in order to get an answer. Poor show to say the least. I have to add that I got my last order in only a couple of weeks, but I never recieved the confirmation that I asked for. I know quite a few people in my club that refuse to even bother anymore, which is a shame considering the product diversity that is available through NES. But, like the whole Saturn car concept, people will tend to migrate to the place they get the best service. There are quite a few suppliers out there, and some great looking new ones. Cheers, Adam I've tried to get a response from NSP for over 5 months now after they promised to apply a credit to my card for an order that was never shipped (from last January). Of course, no response at all since the initial promise to apply the credit. So again, I'm here to ask RCSE for advice. _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Spirit Elite
Decent kit, just watch your wood selection for excessive weight. Junk the plastic pushrods, they're susceptable to thermal expansion. Strong wing, especially if built as one-piece, but tricky to get perfectly straight without using a wing-jig. Sensitive to CG changes, and will tip-stall if speed get too low in a bank. Thermals decently, slows to a crawl with full flaps. Rudder linkage is junk, too much unsupported length to have perfectly tight. Fuselage really isn't up to the rigors of contest flying (trust me), but can be strengthened with judicious use of composites. Looks great with a Sharon-style v-tail ;) Hope that helps, Adam From: Louis Cimon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: RCSE [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] Spirit Elite Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 13:18:38 -0400 I am thinking about upgrading from my old Sophisticated Lady to a Spirit Elite. I have a Futaba 8 so programmable transmitter is no problem. I would like to know comments about actual use of the Spirit Elite. Thank you very much -- Louis Cimon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 141 rue Mistral www.mediom.qc.ca/~lcimon/planeur.htm Beauport, QC tel : (418) 664-1023 Canada G1E 5V4 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] HGL Contest in California
Not to be picky, but lately a few people have been spelling (H)and (L)aunch (G)lider as HGL, not HLG. Just looks strange is all. Adam Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Futaba 8UAFS question
Well, I'm not in for making a profit off of resale myself (I have an SAE Heavy Lift aircraft and a Rosenthal Ventus to worry about), but I think I got the price about right. Here's the scoop (think Canadian): $358.45 original bill, TX, RX, stupid non-JR compatable charger $335.00 sans government contribution $320.00 after losing the charger $195.05 dropping the $124.95 Hitec RX/crystal --- $130.03 converting to Yankeebucks (feels better going THAT way) Talk to PMS Hobbycraft here in Calgary if you don't believe me. And no, that's not a mistype on the name. Needless to say, they have trouble selling their hats. The best thing that anyone could do if they want A Futaba 8 is to lose that dumb little square reciever. When they came out they were nice and compact, but the little Hitec I have (can't think of the model) retails for a good $100cdn less, and I can't tell a difference in performance. Cheers, Adam From: Brett Jaffee [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Adam Till [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] Futaba 8UAFS question Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 15:46:35 -0700 $130? Are you sure? At that rate, you could surely sell them for a profit. I don't think the 4 servos, battery and reciever add up to even close to the $230+ it would take to equal the usual full price of ~$360. Buy some more, or better yet, tell me where you got them! Adam Till wrote: If you talk nicely to your local hobby shop, they'll usually take the bits out for you. I got my 8 for $130 with the slick plastic case. Not bad for a radio that, IMHO, is the best unit this side of a Stylus. Cheers, Adam From: "Garland Hanson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: "Garland Hanson" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Jeb" [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] Futaba 8UAFS question Date: Tue, 22 Aug 2000 16:08:18 -0700 Try National Hobbies in Marietta, GA. They are at: http://www.nationalhobbysupplyinc.com/national.asp?ViewType=Radios Check the bottom of the page for the 8U. Garland - Original Message - From: Jeb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2000 11:41 AM Subject: [RCSE] Futaba 8UAFS question Can anyone recommend a place to purchase Futaba Radios without the Rx and Servos? One of the stores (Bruckner Hobbies) which was mentioned earlier in the week is out of stock. I am interested specifically in the 8UAFS. Thanks.. Tom RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- _ Brett Jaffee [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.earthlink.net/~jaffee The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page http://www.bayarea.net/~nathan/extra300 OnTheWay Quake 2 and 3 Server Utility http://www.planetquake.com/ontheway _ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Kasper Wing
Could the person who posted a link concerning the Kasper Wing please send me the information again. I pulled a "Monday" when looking through my messages today. Thanks, Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] 2 meter sailplane wanted and over
I don't have access to my bookmarks right now (I know there is a page out there somewhere), but I'll try not to butcher a description too badly! ;) 1)First of all, draw a line from the outboard, inside corner of the aileron cutout in the wing to a point on the trailing edge about 1/4" from the tip (umm...right). Here's a "graphic", join the x's: _ tip/ | / | /x__| /x_|___aileron___| 2)Take the piece that you cut off of the wing, and belvel it as you did for the aileron (either double beveled for centerline hinging or single beveled for top hinging, respectively). 3)Find an old piece of clear nyrod inner about 1" long, and a piece of music wire that fits comfortably but "slideably" inside of it. 4)Make a slot in your aileron and the new trileron about halfway down the chord so that the nyrod fits with one half in either control surface. 5) Making sure that the TE is straight when you do this, glue the nyrod into your slot. Don't glue the trileron to the aileron when you do this! 6) Cut the tube in half. Insert the wire into the tube, and check that the trileron moves with the aileron. Hope that hasn't confused anyone; it's easier to do than to describe! You get smoother airflow around the wingtips for your trouble. Cheers, Adam From: Kevin Sheen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "Adam Till" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] 2 meter sailplane wanted and over Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 10:41:46 -0400 Adam, I'm in the process of building an Elite. I'm done with the tail, fuse and left wing so it may be a bit late for me to do anything with 2 but I can certainly look at 1 and 3. I'm kind of a newbie, would you have a web page or a short description of Robertson Trilerons? About the only thing I have done so far that isn't 'stock' is to laminate the inner panel spars with .007 CF. thanks, Kevin At 02:03 PM 08/03/2000 +, Adam Till wrote: Kind of a tall order if you don't give us more specifics (budget, flying style, what have you...). If you're looking for a step up, but to stick with a built-up kit, I'd recommend a Great Planes Spirit Elite. It's a decently capable, full-house sailplane. I built one a while back with a customized Sharon-style composite tail, and I never had any major problems (I sold it about a month ago for lack of use). If you do choose that kit, I do have a couple of suggestions; it's not quite up to the quality level of other GP kits that I've built. 1)Lose the comical plastic pushrods that come with the kit. They're sloppy, and suffer from dramatic thermal expansion. 2) Watch the weight of the wood that comes with your kit. Maybe I'm just getting fussy, but a lot of it seemed too heavy for its intended use. 3)Reinforce the area just in front of the tail, as it is notorious for failing under "unexpected loading" (ie hard landings) Just so you know, it's a great candiate for the addition of Robertson Trilerons. I noticed a bit of a performance boost, and that was enough to justify the minimal effort. All the best, Adam From: "Louis Gonzalez" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: "Louis Gonzalez" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "soaring" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] 2 meter sailplane wanted and over Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 20:48:31 -0700 guys. im looking to get a 2 meter sailplane , im currently flying a hangar 9 aspire but i just dont like it, i plan to use it with a high start. so...does anybody have any suggestions or even have some for sale? thanks luis RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Canadian NATS
They're in Vancouver this year, but they're already underway (July 29 - August 6). Would've been there myself, but I've already used my vacation time for the next while! Cheers, Adam From: "Stanley B Koch" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "RCSE" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] Canadian NATS Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 23:37:17 -0500 Would someone post the date and location of the Canadian NATS? Also, is registration still open? Thanks STAN KOCH RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Icare Scratchbuilder Fuselages
G'Morning ladies gents, Directed primarily towards the scratchbuilders on the list (are there any out there anymore?), I was curious if anyone has had any experience with sailplanes built from the following "Icare Sailplanes" fuses: Martinet F3I, X-Country Pick 20 Scale fuselage 1:5 (Is this an Eiri Avion PIK-20?) ASW-19 Scale Fuselage 1:3.5 I know that each example would be unique, but I'm just curious about the choices that are available. Thanks in advance, Adam Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Help! I keep loosing my trainer chords!
Not that this is purely soaring-related, but it's better than snarling at each other over RX/TX techno-bits! But sure, that's an easy one to answer. It's basically been the advent of the computer, especially lately with the increasing popularity of the Internet and email-based communication. Just think about what computers provide for us: Spell check: allows people to just "get in the ballpark" before a quick right-click settles things right again. Why bother to learn to spell if you'll always have a checker to do it for you? Some high-schools are even allowing provicial-level exams in English and Social Studies to be written on a processor. Email: You only have to look at a list like this, informal as it might be, to see that it is easy to get into the habit of being lazy when writing. A lot of posts here have no semblance of grammar or structure (eg. ALL IN CAPS), and a few don't even bother with punctuation (I find such posts especially frustrating to read). Forgive my sounding like a technophobe, but that's just the way I see it. I think a lot of the problem comes with people not taking much time to read anymore, as well. Just my thoughts... Cheers, Adam From: "robert k scott" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [RCSE] Help! I keep loosing my trainer chords! Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 00:10:36 -0700 Does anyone know why many people are suddenly having a problem with homonyms? Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Heavy-Duty High Starts British hobby stores
Good evening gents, I was just wandering if anyone had any leads on a good, heavy-duty high-start. My club has a couple of really heafty winches, but when they're not out, my RnR Genesis and my friend's ICARE DG-600 stay firmly grounded, and my Multiplex Lucky is a little iffy on launch. I've been looking around at the usual suspects (Multiplex 4M start, which is huge, and the NES Zoom start), because my 11 year old Dynaflight open start just doesn't cut it anymore. On a semi-related note, I'm going to be in the UK in a few weeks, and I was wondering if anyone knew of any good hobby shops in the vacinity of Oxford? My wallet might not appreciate it, but I will ;) Cheers, Adam Till Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
