from:"Charles\-H . Schulz"

Hi,

Given that the marketing blog is not known at all, it might be a good approach.
Marc, do you mind posting its URL? I am mot sure many here know it :-)

Thanks,

Charles.

Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Immanuel,

What a great idea! This would make sure that people would visit our
blog.

So, just to be clear,

First:
* blog about an interesting LibreOffice article/event/etc on the
Marketing Blog (this will act as our main teaser) linking to the
original website

Second: post a message on the following linking to our official
Marketing Blog. But these posts would have to be considerably shorter
in
content to the blog teaser.

** Our official Facebook group
** Our official Google + community
** The official TDF Google + page
** The Libreoffice subreddit
** The Open Source subreddit

What do people think of this? I'll look into bufferapp.com

Cheers,

Marc

Le 2013-01-13 10:39, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :
From a social marketing strategy point of view, may I make an humble
suggestion:

Publish the news on the blog
and THEN share it on Facebook, Twitter, Linked, G+, etc.

Why?
1- Because by doing so, followers/fans/members of the TDF/LO
community can
retweet/share and it created a buzz around the news.
2- Because when people click on the link, it brings them to the blog,
and
the blog might lead them to the main site, and the download section
:)

Immanuel

p.s. The person who does the blogging and sharing can/should use
bufferapp.com to keep track of analytics.

On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 10:20 AM, Marc Parém...@marcpare.com
wrote:

Le 2013-01-13 05:56, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :

Hello Marc,

Sure. But I'd much rather make sure these news and updates get a
good and
large audience and I suggest we post them first to the following
sites ( in
no particular order):

Our official Facebook group
Our official Google + community
The official TDF Google + page
The Libreoffice subreddit
The Open Source subreddit.

These would really spread the word, the marketing blog does.not
seem to
have a large audience...

Best,

Charles.

Thanks for the suggestions. If I could add to this then, I would
also
suggest we publish these on the blog as well and try to get
readership up
on it as well.

How do I get on subreddit?

Cheers,

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Blogging of items on the Marketing List

Hello Marc,

Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 10:09 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 http://libomarketing.wordpress.com/


Thanks... BTW this blog is a mess. No post is chronologically ordered.
Immanuel may have a point with his suggestion. Mind if I ask what's
possible to do on our website directly ?

Best,
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Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Blogging of items on the Marketing List

Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 11:15 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2013-01-14 10:15, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :
  Hi Marc,
 
  On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Marc Parém...@marcpare.com  wrote:
 
  Second: post a message on the following linking to our official Marketing
  Blog. But these posts would have to be considerably shorter in content to
  the blog teaser.
 
  ** Our official Facebook group
  ** Our official Google + community
  ** The official TDF Google + page
  ** The Libreoffice subreddit
  ** The Open Source subreddit
 
 
  We should also include at least 1 of the twitter feeds.
 
  Immanuel
 
 
 Which one should we include?

the only official one @tdforg and/or @libreoffice

Best,
Charles.




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Blogging of items on the Marketing List

Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 11:14 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2013-01-14 10:26, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Hello Marc,
 
  Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 10:09 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
  http://libomarketing.wordpress.com/
 
 
  Thanks... BTW this blog is a mess. No post is chronologically ordered.
  Immanuel may have a point with his suggestion. Mind if I ask what's
  possible to do on our website directly ?
 
  Best,
 
 Some of our blogs are on Wordpress. I believe that the infrastructure 
 move will also bring a consolidation of blogsites into one server and 
 under the TDF control. But for now, even some of the nl blogs are set up 
 on Wordpress.
 
 We follow all the same format:
 
 http://blog.documentfoundation.org/
 http://libomarketing.wordpress.com/
 http://libodocs.wordpress.com/
 
 We wanted to make the blog sites accessible to the people blogging on 
 them. Yes, Silverstripe, our CMS, is also able to do blogging, but for 
 now this is what we have. I also think that Italo is comfortable using 
 the Wordpress system.
 
 If you have any suggestions, feel free to comment. BTW ... the top 
 comment box on our blog is a general statement of our group; all other 
 articles under this are in date format order.
 
 Does this explain the mess?

Yes, probably :-)
My observation so far (sorry if sounds like critics, it's not meant to
be):
- the editorial line is unclear
- inasmuch as I DON'T like the blog.documentfoundation.org design, we
should try to come up with something more visually pleasing here.
- last but not least, libomarketing.wordpress.com has two issues, of
which you obviously no control over: it shouts but  they couldn't even
afford a domain name, like marketing-blog.libreoffice.org and two, it
insets the infamous LibO again, but leaves LibreOffice behind. 

So... where do we go from there?
First of all I'd like to thank you Marc and the authors of this blog for
keeping it going. 
Given the amount of content there is on the blog I'd like to suggest a
redesign and a proper URL, or a cloning and reopening under a hosted
install.

What do you think?

best,

Charles.



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Blogging of items on the Marketing List

Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 11:39 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2013-01-14 11:22, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Le lundi 14 janvier 2013 à 11:15 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
  Le 2013-01-14 10:15, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :
  Hi Marc,
 
  On Sun, Jan 13, 2013 at 9:28 PM, Marc Parém...@marcpare.com   wrote:
 
  Second: post a message on the following linking to our official Marketing
  Blog. But these posts would have to be considerably shorter in content to
  the blog teaser.
 
  ** Our official Facebook group
  ** Our official Google + community
  ** The official TDF Google + page
  ** The Libreoffice subreddit
  ** The Open Source subreddit
 
 
  We should also include at least 1 of the twitter feeds.
 
  Immanuel
 
 
  Which one should we include?
 
  the only official one @tdforg and/or @libreoffice
 
  Best,
  Charles.
 
 
 
 
 
 Thanks!
 
 So just to keep the list complete and for clarity, it now looks like this:
 
 First:
 * blog about an interesting LibreOffice article/event/etc on the 
 Marketing Blog (this will act as our main teaser) linking to the 
 original website
 
 Second: post a message on the following linking to our official 
 Marketing Blog. But these posts would have to be considerably shorter in 
 content to the blog teaser.
 
 ** Our official Facebook group
 ** Our official Google + community
 ** The official TDF Google + page
 ** The Libreoffice subreddit
 ** The Open Source subreddit
 ** Our official TDF Twitter: @tdforg
 ** Our official LibreOffice Twitter: @libreoffice
 
 Unless there are others we can work out the process or just test-try it 
 to see if it suits our needs.


The more I think about it, the less I think the marketing blog is the
right place. Let me explain my perception. blog.documentfoundation.org
is very well followed and it's there where people get their news. The
second place they get the news is through our twitter and identi.ca
accounts, Facebook and Google +. Then comes the Reddit galaxy. 

I'm afraid that our marketing blog is not known by many. 

May I thus suggest two approaches:
- we post more on the blog.documentfoundation.org
- we handle the marketing blog as a more specific and focused blog,
and handle our social networks in an autonomous way, that is, without
the marketing blog being some sort of central point.

What do you think?

Charles.

 
 Marc
 
 
 -- 
 Marc Paré
 m...@marcpare.com
 http://www.parEntreprise.com
 parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
 parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org
 
 


-- 
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Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Blogging of items on the Marketing List

2013-01-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

Sure. But I'd much rather make sure these news and updates get a good and large 
audience and I suggest we post them first to the following sites ( in no 
particular order):

Our official Facebook group
Our official Google + community
The official TDF Google + page
The Libreoffice subreddit
The Open Source subreddit.

These would really spread the word, the marketing blog does.not seem to have a 
large audience...

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

This is mostly a message to Italo and Charles,

When we receive posts on this list that merit blogging, would you like 
us to help out with putting these items out on our Marketing Blog?
Cases 
in point: the LibreOffice news in an Indian Newspaper[1] and Klaibson

Ribeiro's neat calendar/tables[2][3].

We could agree on some of the Marketing members being qualified to 
blog about such items on our blog. I could help out if you want and I
am 
sure some of the others on this list, who have good writing/composing
in 
EN, could offer up their help.

We could then encourage more people to report to our marketing list of 
occasions where LibreOffice makes a splash on some media or in other 
forms such as usage etc. Something like what we used to do a while back

with our indexing magazines etc. on our LibreOffice in the Press wiki

page.[4] For that matter, would it make more sense for us to blog about

articles in the press rather than indexing them? At least then, our
blog 
readers would get more exposure to the LibreOffice brand in the media 
and get to read up on these articles.

BTW ... Tom is/was the maintainer for the longest time on the 
LibreOffice in the Press page and did a wonderful job it. I don't 
believe that page is being updated too much anymore, if at all.

Cheers,

Marc

[1] 
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.documentation.libreoffice.marketing/6976

[2] 
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.documentation.libreoffice.marketing/6974

[3] 
http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.documentation.libreoffice.marketing/6914

[4] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LibreOffice_In_The_Press


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Funding Wishlist

2013-01-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Kannan,

These are great news indeed.  It would be great if you could upload some of  
materials (banners for instance) on the wiki. We have a marketing section as 
well as a design section. For CDs we have several initiatives, Libreoffice-Box 
as well as the North American DVD and I think these guys are doing a great job 
and would be happy to help. Is there anything else we could help you with?

Best,

Charles.


Kannan Moudgalya kan...@iitb.ac.in a écrit :

Sorry, I forgot to add three more ways we can contribute to the ongoing

marketing effort:

3.  We have a good number of ORCA spoken tutorials to help on the topic

of accessibility.  The tutorial relevant to LibreOffice is 
http://www.che.iitb.ac.in/faculty/km/08-orca_word-processor.mp3.  It is

one of 10+ tutorials on ORCA.  As this were made a few years ago, OO is

explained.  We are in the process of remaking these tutorials, as 
apparently, some things have changed in the way ORCA is distributed.  
When we make them again, we can explain LibreOffice instead.  We have 
amongst our team Krishnakant Mane, a visually impaired FOSS expert, who

worked closely with the ORCA team and developed these tutorials.

4.  We can provide free dubbing rights to those who want to dub spoken 
tutorials on LibreOffice.  We can train the interested people how to do

the dubbing.  We require, however, that the video is not changed and 
that the end users are not charged.  We also give honorarium to anyone 
from anywhere who can help with the dubbing in India's 20+ official 
languages 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_with_official_status_in_India).
 
Interestingly, a few languages spoken in India are used in neighbouring

countries also - Urdu: Pakistan, Nepali: Nepal, Bengali: Bangladesh, 
Tamil: Sri Lanka.

5.  We can help train those who want to organise workshops using spoken

tutorials, available at http://spoken-tutorial.org.  This service is 
also offered free of cost.

Regards,

Kannan


Kannan Moudgalya wrote:
 As I don't know in what form additions or modifications are expected 
 on this wiki page, I am writing to the list.  As at present we have
an 
 Indian Government supported project to promote FOSS, we can
contribute 
 to the ongoing marketing effort in the following two ways:

 1.  Our artists can help create the artwork, required for banners, 
 brochures, etc.  We use GIMP.  Because of the distances, however, it 
 is not clear how effective this will be.

 2.  If ever there is a marketing effort by mailing CDs, we can 
 participate in it by sending free CDs within India.  Please note that

 many people in India do not have access to good bandwidth and hence 
 depend on such offline promotional material.  It will not, however,
be 
 possible for us to send the CDs overseas, although, it may be
possible 
 to send one or two bulk mailings.

 Regards,

 Kannan


 Marc Paré wrote:
 I have updated the wiki page for this. You may find it here: 
 [https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Funding_Priorities]

 I will be adding the result of the other mailing lists in the next 
 day or less.

 Cheers,

 Marc




-- 
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http://spoken-tutorial.org/What-is-a-Spoken-Tutorial-2-Minute-Video-English
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Funding Wishlist

2013-01-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Kannan,

These are great news indeed.  It would be great if you could upload some of  
materials (banners for instance) on the wiki. We have a marketing section as 
well as a design section. For CDs we have several initiatives, Libreoffice-Box 
as well as the North American DVD and I think these guys are doing a great job 
and would be happy to help. Is there anything else we could help you with?

Best,

Charles.


Kannan Moudgalya kan...@iitb.ac.in a écrit :

Sorry, I forgot to add three more ways we can contribute to the ongoing

marketing effort:

3.  We have a good number of ORCA spoken tutorials to help on the topic

of accessibility.  The tutorial relevant to LibreOffice is 
http://www.che.iitb.ac.in/faculty/km/08-orca_word-processor.mp3.  It is

one of 10+ tutorials on ORCA.  As this were made a few years ago, OO is

explained.  We are in the process of remaking these tutorials, as 
apparently, some things have changed in the way ORCA is distributed.  
When we make them again, we can explain LibreOffice instead.  We have 
amongst our team Krishnakant Mane, a visually impaired FOSS expert, who

worked closely with the ORCA team and developed these tutorials.

4.  We can provide free dubbing rights to those who want to dub spoken 
tutorials on LibreOffice.  We can train the interested people how to do

the dubbing.  We require, however, that the video is not changed and 
that the end users are not charged.  We also give honorarium to anyone 
from anywhere who can help with the dubbing in India's 20+ official 
languages 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_with_official_status_in_India).
 
Interestingly, a few languages spoken in India are used in neighbouring

countries also - Urdu: Pakistan, Nepali: Nepal, Bengali: Bangladesh, 
Tamil: Sri Lanka.

5.  We can help train those who want to organise workshops using spoken

tutorials, available at http://spoken-tutorial.org.  This service is 
also offered free of cost.

Regards,

Kannan


Kannan Moudgalya wrote:
 As I don't know in what form additions or modifications are expected 
 on this wiki page, I am writing to the list.  As at present we have
an 
 Indian Government supported project to promote FOSS, we can
contribute 
 to the ongoing marketing effort in the following two ways:

 1.  Our artists can help create the artwork, required for banners, 
 brochures, etc.  We use GIMP.  Because of the distances, however, it 
 is not clear how effective this will be.

 2.  If ever there is a marketing effort by mailing CDs, we can 
 participate in it by sending free CDs within India.  Please note that

 many people in India do not have access to good bandwidth and hence 
 depend on such offline promotional material.  It will not, however,
be 
 possible for us to send the CDs overseas, although, it may be
possible 
 to send one or two bulk mailings.

 Regards,

 Kannan


 Marc Paré wrote:
 I have updated the wiki page for this. You may find it here: 
 [https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Funding_Priorities]

 I will be adding the result of the other mailing lists in the next 
 day or less.

 Cheers,

 Marc




-- 
Bridging digital divide through FOSS and helping migration to Scilab
from Matlab
http://spoken-tutorial.org/CSI.pdf
http://spoken-tutorial.org/What-is-a-Spoken-Tutorial-2-Minute-Video-English
http://spoken-tutorial.org/What_is_a_Spoken_Tutorial_English
http://scilab.in/Textbook_Companion_Project
http://scilab.in/Lab_Migration_Project


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: IMPORTANT !!! NEW Marketing Call Doodle January

Hello everyone,


On Thu, 10 Jan 2013 16:46:22 -0500
Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com wrote:

 http://doodle.com/v62vd3u23y3ag79z


Based on the input we received I'd like to set the call to Thursday the
17th, 7 pm CET (Berlin-Rome-Paris) wich means 6 pm London or noon NY
time.

The call details are these. Dial in using this list of available numbers
http://www.talkyoo.net/main/telefonkonferenz_internationale_rufnummern

then the room number is 53 71 38.

We will be on IRC at the same time, but only for follow-up or links
sharing if necessary which means that unless you're on the call you
won't be able to follow it on IRC. The IRC channel is #libreoffice on
the freenode network.

See you there,

-- 
Charles-H. Schulz 
Co-founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint
Mobile Number: +33 (0)6 98 65 54 24.

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[libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Strategy confcall

Hi,

Based on the input we received I'd like to set the call to Thursday the
17th, 7 pm CET (Berlin-Rome-Paris) wich means 6 pm London or noon NY
time. (http://doodle.com/v62vd3u23y3ag79z  )

The call details are these. Dial in using this list of available numbers
http://www.talkyoo.net/main/telefonkonferenz_internationale_rufnummern

then the room number is 53 71 38.

We will be on IRC at the same time, but only for follow-up or links
sharing if necessary which means that unless you're on the call you
won't be able to follow it on IRC. The IRC channel is #libreoffice on
the freenode network.

See you there,

-- 
Charles-H. Schulz 
Co-founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint
Mobile Number: +33 (0)6 98 65 54 24.

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibreOffice vs. MS Office


Hello everyone,

Before this thread turns into yet another fruitless (and endless) 
discussion, may I remind you that we have the 4.0 to prepare and that we 
will have a marketing conference call on the 17th. We already have open 
action items. For instance we're still looking for volunteers who can 
design a nice webpage with the most important features of the 4.0 
(described here:https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/4.0)


Also we are looking for volunteers who can help with mapping out the 
overall LibreOffice community.


Thank you,

Charles-H. Schulz.

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibreOffice vs. MS Office


Hello Immanuel,

Le 12.01.2013 21:42, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :

On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 3:39 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:


Also we are looking for volunteers who can help with mapping out the
overall LibreOffice community.



What do you mean by mapping out the overall LibreOffice community??



As the marketing team is in charge of conveying and sharing information 
from one point of the project to another (being an information bus, if 
you will) as a first item, it's important to map the project: how is it 
structured, what native-language teams work, the workflows, the 
superstructure and informal structures, etc. All that with as many 
contacts and names possible. Sophie had started something, but that as 
well could need some update and nice presentation.


Cheers,

Charles.

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: LibreOffice vs. MS Office

Immanuel, Marc,

Sophie has the first material and she's in cc.

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Charles,

Le 2013-01-12 15:46, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello Immanuel,

 Le 12.01.2013 21:42, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :
 On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 3:39 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

 Also we are looking for volunteers who can help with mapping out
the
 overall LibreOffice community.


 What do you mean by mapping out the overall LibreOffice community??


 As the marketing team is in charge of conveying and sharing
information
 from one point of the project to another (being an information bus,
if
 you will) as a first item, it's important to map the project: how is
it
 structured, what native-language teams work, the workflows, the
 superstructure and informal structures, etc. All that with as many
 contacts and names possible. Sophie had started something, but that
as
 well could need some update and nice presentation.

 Cheers,

 Charles.


Sorry, I am unaware of this project as well. Is there a link that you 
can point us to? I don't remember it being discussed on this list.

Cheers,

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: LibreOffice vs. MS Office

Immanuel, Marc,

Sophie has the first material and she's in cc.

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Charles,

Le 2013-01-12 15:46, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello Immanuel,

 Le 12.01.2013 21:42, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :
 On Sat, Jan 12, 2013 at 3:39 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

 Also we are looking for volunteers who can help with mapping out
the
 overall LibreOffice community.


 What do you mean by mapping out the overall LibreOffice community??


 As the marketing team is in charge of conveying and sharing
information
 from one point of the project to another (being an information bus,
if
 you will) as a first item, it's important to map the project: how is
it
 structured, what native-language teams work, the workflows, the
 superstructure and informal structures, etc. All that with as many
 contacts and names possible. Sophie had started something, but that
as
 well could need some update and nice presentation.

 Cheers,

 Charles.


Sorry, I am unaware of this project as well. Is there a link that you 
can point us to? I don't remember it being discussed on this list.

Cheers,

Marc

-- 
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m...@marcpare.com
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parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Japanese page on FB

2013-01-10 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Marc, I like the video idea. Italo, we should do something :-)

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Naruhiko,

Le 2013-01-09 11:11, Naruhiko Ogasawara a écrit :
 Hi Marc,


 Very sorry to later reply...


 That is wonderful, thanks! We'll put any future events like those on
our
 events calendar. It is great to hear your community being so active.

 I'm really happy to read your warm words.  Thanks!


 BTW, if you do have an event, feel free to ask on this list if any
developer
 presenters or any marketing presenters (such as Italo or Charles or
...)
 would be available to visit/speak at your events. They may have time
to fly
 out to speak at a event/conference.

 Alright.
 Right now our community is growing but not strong enough to host our
own
 international event, but in the (near, I hope) future, we may ask
someone
 visit to Japan and talk for Japanese LibreOffice fan :)


 BTW, I checked the JA events wiki page, the first two events, in the
 comments column, the links do not lead to a wiki page -- there is an
extra
 character at the end or your link on the wiki page that you should
remove to
 make the weblink work.

 Very sorry, I've mistaken. Already fixed. Check the page please.
 And also I made a English wiki page about our first whole-day
conference:

 [1] https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Events/LibOCon_mini_JP

 Yes it is Japanese local event and every sessions will have in
Japanese,
 but it is a symbolic event for us, and a good opportunity to let
people
 know our activities.

 I added the link in JA event wiki page to the page[1].


 I will put these on the event calendar once the weblinks are fixed.
Let me
 know if you need help fixing these.

 It's a time now, could you please put them on the calendar?


 Thanks,

My apologies for the late response. I have put the event on the
calendar.

Naruhiko: Have you blogged about this yet? If not, we can put it up for

you on our marketing blog.

Italo: Is there anything else we could do to help the mini-conference? 
Perhaps, you or Charles or Florian could just do a little welcoming 
video to the group that could be played at the conference (make sure in

the video that you clearly state your official position with the
project 
for those who don't know)? Would it help if we said that the conference

was a sanctioned TDF/LibreOffice event?

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Japanese page on FB

2013-01-10 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

That would be a great idea indeed.

Cheers,
Charles.


Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@gmail.com a écrit :

On 1/10/13 10:10 PM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
 Marc, I like the video idea. Italo, we should do something :-)

We can produce the video at FOSDEM. I can bring the camcorder and the
tripod, and we can record the video on Sunday.

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skype italovignoli - gtalk italo.vign...@gmail.com

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] IMPORTANT !!! NEW Marketing Call Doodle January

2013-01-05 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Thank you Marc!

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

There is a new Marketing Call Doodle calendar[1] to replace the old
one.

This new version has a TIME-ZONE LINK on the right-hand side of the 
calendar (right above the yellow box). Use this button to set your 
time-zone correctly so that there are no questions as to when the 
meeting has been suggested. Make sure to pick the country and city 
closest to you.

To the other people who have already signed on the first Doodle 
calendar, please re-sign on this new calendar as this is the one that 
will be used to plan the call. The first calendar will not be 
considered! The people who signed on the first Doodle are: Immanuel 
Giulea, Italo Vignoli, Fridolin Kathan, Florian Effenberger, Drew
Jensen 
(I will try to email these people about the change -- Marc).

My apologies to all for the confusion.

BTW ... if you have never been to a confcall (conference call) and are 
interested in marketing LibreOffice, you can join in on the call and 
just listen in BUT it is customary to announce your name to the group. 
You may find that you are able to help out with some item on our 
confcall to-do list.

Let me know if there are any problems with filling out the Doodle or
any 
other question regarding the confcall. There will be an agenda posted
on 
the list sometime before the meeting.

Cheers,

Marc

[1] http://doodle.com/v62vd3u23y3ag79z


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Marketing Call Doodle January

2013-01-03 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

I have no time to recreate a doodle and I specifically mentioneed the timezones 
already. I will also make sure to mention them again. 

As for IRC I am quite hesitant. Tge whole point of a call is to talk, and 
that's not the case with IRC. We have several phone numbers one can dial from 
pretty much every corner of the earth and we also have Skype access.

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Charles

Le 2012-12-30 11:09, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello,

 This call will be primarily about the 4.0 release and our team
 activities development. Times are expressed in CET (that is, Berlin,
 Paris, Rome time):
 http://doodle.com/rxen66dq79m35tw4

 Please put your name and choose what day and time would fit the best.

 Best
 Charles.


The time-zone button is missing on the Doodle. Could you re-create the 
Doodle but include the button (I think this is offered on step 2 of the

Doodle creation page)? We can then contact the 4 people who have
already 
registered their dates so that they can refill the new Doodle again.

Otherwise, there is a higher risk of missing the meeting as there is no

indication as to what time-zone the Doodle is displaying. This is 
particularly important for time-zone sensitive members living outside
of 
the Eu time-zone which is obviously the zone it is displaying.

We need to try to include as many interested contributors as possible, 
as (I hope) most of the people at the meeting will be actively 
contributing their time at filling action items decided at the meeting.

ALSO, will we also be recommending that the people attending make the 
use or the IRC channel at the same time?

Cheers,

Marc


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Marketing Call Doodle January

2013-01-03 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

I have no time to recreate a doodle and I specifically mentioneed the timezones 
already. I will also make sure to mention them again. 

As for IRC I am quite hesitant. Tge whole point of a call is to talk, and 
that's not the case with IRC. We have several phone numbers one can dial from 
pretty much every corner of the earth and we also have Skype access.

Best,

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Charles

Le 2012-12-30 11:09, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello,

 This call will be primarily about the 4.0 release and our team
 activities development. Times are expressed in CET (that is, Berlin,
 Paris, Rome time):
 http://doodle.com/rxen66dq79m35tw4

 Please put your name and choose what day and time would fit the best.

 Best
 Charles.


The time-zone button is missing on the Doodle. Could you re-create the 
Doodle but include the button (I think this is offered on step 2 of the

Doodle creation page)? We can then contact the 4 people who have
already 
registered their dates so that they can refill the new Doodle again.

Otherwise, there is a higher risk of missing the meeting as there is no

indication as to what time-zone the Doodle is displaying. This is 
particularly important for time-zone sensitive members living outside
of 
the Eu time-zone which is obviously the zone it is displaying.

We need to try to include as many interested contributors as possible, 
as (I hope) most of the people at the meeting will be actively 
contributing their time at filling action items decided at the meeting.

ALSO, will we also be recommending that the people attending make the 
use or the IRC channel at the same time?

Cheers,

Marc


-- 
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m...@marcpare.com
http://www.parEntreprise.com
parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Japanese page on FB

2013-01-01 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Nahuriko-San, everyone,

Happy New Year in Japan and all over the world!

Charles.


Naruhiko Ogasawara naru...@gmail.com a écrit :

Everyone, Happy New Year!


Sophie,


Sorry little bit later reply,
In Japan, new year holiday is very special so I had
to drink sake too much and hard to write English ;).


 You're welcome :) I know your group is doing a lot of marketing and
 meetings, it's really great to see how you are active.

Thanks!
We have spent a lot of time to attend Japanese local Open Source
event.  Yes, we are active :)

 well 185 now ;)

Welcome to our group!


 And you're right, any media that can help us to gather people is
 welcome. But the Japanese group is far from the French one for
example,
 I didn't meet enough people to open a FB page, or a G+ or even a
twitter
 account.

In my understanding, Open the door and wait strategy is not enough
for marketing


 Naruhiko, don't hesitate to report here what you're are doing, your
 initiatives or anything you're putting in place. It's very
interesting
 for all of us and help us to learn how to put the same things in
place
 in our own language.

Of course I'll do but please wait quite a long.  Because I'm very new
of LibreOffice community, and Japanese community has a long history
from OOo era, so I don't know why we're doing so or we're not doing so.
I want whole of our activities, then I'll summarize then, then I'll
tell
what we and I want.

Anyway, if we, Japanese commmunity have some problem and need a
solution,
need a discussion where we should go, looking for any good
success-stories,
I promise I'll share these issue in here, not closed Japanese
community.


Thanks,
-- 
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [us-marketing] Marketing material suggestion: Why LibreOffice?

Apologies for top posting. Marc is right. Immanuel has the lead on this but we 
will all contribute. In the end it should ideally become a nice looking page on 
our website, nof just a wiki page. 

Thanks Immanuel!

Charles.


Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Italo and Immanuel,

Le 2012-12-29 16:49, Italo Vignoli a écrit :
 Sorry for top posting, but I think that the idea of creating a wiki
page
 where we can brainstorm about the selling points for Windows (as
 Microsoft document is focused on Windows, which is their cash cow) is
 very good. All the points that have been raised so far are extremely
 good, and I think that we should pick them and paste in a starting
document.

 I am currently working at the final version of the migration and
 training protocol for certification, and I do not have the time for
 creating this wiki page for a few days. Anyone could create the page
 though, in the Marketing area of TDF wiki:

 https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing

 I would call the page Selling Point vs MS Office, because this is
the
 summary of the contents.

 Marc can definitely help in creating the page, if someone has
problems
 with the wiki.

 I am definitely interested in helping with the contents, once I will
 have finished working on the certification protocols.


I think Immanuel has offered to lead on this. I can help with setting
up 
the page. I like the good arguments on this thread. We have to make
sure 
that we are as factual as possible. MS will capitalize on any claims 
that we make that are not factual, so we have to watch carefully over 
our claims.

Immanuel, let me know if you need any help with the wiki page.

Cheers,

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [us-marketing] Marketing material suggestion: Why LibreOffice?

Go ahead. If my memory serves me right there was an OpenErp booth at the last 
FOSDEM. I'll go talk to them then.

Best,

Charles.


Immanuel Giulea giulea.imman...@gmail.com a écrit :

There was an OpenERP meetup in Montreal recently. I can get in touch
with
the local people here.

Immanuel
On Dec 29, 2012 5:12 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

 Anybody knows someone at openerp? Otherwise I'l lcontact them.

 Best,
 Charles.


 Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@gmail.com a écrit :

 Sorry for top posting, but I think that the idea of creating a wiki
 page
 where we can brainstorm about the selling points for Windows (as
 Microsoft document is focused on Windows, which is their cash cow)
is
 very good. All the points that have been raised so far are extremely
 good, and I think that we should pick them and paste in a starting
 document.
 
 I am currently working at the final version of the migration and
 training protocol for certification, and I do not have the time for
 creating this wiki page for a few days. Anyone could create the page
 though, in the Marketing area of TDF wiki:
 
 https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing
 
 I would call the page Selling Point vs MS Office, because this is
the
 summary of the contents.
 
 Marc can definitely help in creating the page, if someone has
problems
 with the wiki.
 
 I am definitely interested in helping with the contents, once I will
 have finished working on the certification protocols.
 
 On 12/29/12 10:07 PM, Jay Lozier wrote:
  On 12/29/2012 01:12 PM, Immanuel Giulea wrote:
  Well to be fair, I raised three points that seemed to me were the
  arguments of MS feature-wise.
 
  Other arguments are listed, and my suggestion was to create a new
 wiki
  page where we could compare (side-by-side) LO and MSO.
 
  Summary of arguments from MS against LO
 
  *Arguments about $$*
 
* Total costs: Business impact; like software issues,
integration,
  incompatibility, run-time errors, downtime, unreliable
support
 and
  security vulnerability.
 
  Unreliable support? MS normally offers very limited direct user
 support
  - 1 or 2 incidents max if I remember correctly. Most user support
 will
  be from a help desk (internal or external). If it is from MS it is
 via
  separate contract or additional costs to the licensing agreement.
  Security is a joke because MS is notorious for shipping insecure
  products. Run-time errors? What about BSOD for Windows?
Integration
 and
  incompatibility are very nebulous - do they mean file formats or
 being
  able to access the program from another? The first is really MSO
not
  following standards and the later is a programming issue.
 
* Total benefit: Such as reliable supports, updates,
 accessibility,
  and security.
 
* Integration cost: The cost associated when you decide to use
a
  different software platform.
 
  Different software platform - do they mean OS? If so, LO does this
  better even if the OS/distro is not officially support because the
  source code is available and can be compiled by someone for a very
  specific platform. With MSO, if a version is not provide you have
no
  options (Linux version available).
 
* Management: Can it be easily managed? Large companies tend to
 have
  this issue because they don't have a unified system.
 
  This is truly a management problem, is the management competent?
 
* Deployment costs: Can it handle corporate size business
  productivity? In addition to the compromise or extra benefits
of
  software alternatives.
 
  Software suitability should be determined for each case. There is
no
  blanket answer for this. MS is implying that MSO is the only
answer
 for
  businesses when in fact it is often not. Often the issue is that a
  company has an installed base of VB macros, etc for MSO that would
 need
  porting to LO
 
* OpenOffice/LibreOffice does not provide the same depth of
  functionality as Microsoft Office as a result do not meet the
  needs of some end users. This will force your organization to
  manage multiple software suites potentially increasing IT
costs.
 
  No software meets the needs of all users because all are
 design/feature
  compromises.
 
* When running a mixed software environment you are also
running
 the
  risk of interoperability issues which could further increase
IT
  and helpdesk costs, inhibit productivity, and generate end
users
  frustration.
 
  Most companies standardize on the software tools as much as
possible
 to
  reduce these costs. However no single program/suite will cover all
 user
  needs so to some degree there will be a mixed software
environment.
 
* Additional factors that could create higher costs include
  integration with your existing systems and applications like
ERP
  and content management systems and software updates.
 
  This is more of issue with the ERP and CMS software not LO per se

[libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Call Doodle January


Hello,

This  call will be primarily about the 4.0 release and our team 
activities development. Times are expressed in CET (that is, Berlin, 
Paris, Rome time):

http://doodle.com/rxen66dq79m35tw4

Please put your name and choose what day and time would fit  the best.

Best
Charles.

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[libreoffice-marketing] Mapping the community


Hello,

As you will recall the Marketing project's mission is to act as an 
information broker inside the LibreOffice project, as well as from 
inside it to the outside. Let's start with a fundamental block of this 
role then:
we should map our community. What does this mean? It means to draw both 
the structure and the workflows of our community, from one end of the 
project to the other.


The end result can be anything from a chart to a logical diagram, I 
think only text might be too dry and complex but suggestions are 
welcome. Any takers ?


Thanks,

Charles.

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [tdf-discuss] Marketing material suggestion: Why LibreOffice?


Immanuel,

Just leave the feature comparison page where it is; perhaps you could 
focus on a more synthetic document, and one that takes into account 
broader points (not just feature by feature)?


Thanks,

Charles.

Le 30.12.2012 17:51, Immanuel Giulea a écrit :

I figured out how to create pages, so I started by creating:
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Selling_points
and
https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Selling_points_MSO

an hour later, I also found:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Feature_Comparison:_LibreOffice_-_Microsoft_Office


Should the Feature Comparison be moved to marketing or if left alone,
referred to from the marketing materials?


On Sun, Dec 30, 2012 at 10:27 AM, Immanuel Giulea 
giulea.imman...@gmail.com

wrote:



The documentation linked below is from version 6.1 and included
integration with OpenOffice only.
We are assuming that LibreOffice would handle it the same.
OpenERP released version 7 not long ago, and it would be better to 
confirm

integration, and for them to update their docs.
So far, I couldn't find the v7 docs. And the release notes only 
mention
Google Docs in general without saying if text documents in .ODT are 
handled

the same as .DOC format.

Is there a section in the LO docs that integration with OpenERP can 
be

addressed?

Immanuel


On Sat, Dec 29, 2012 at 3:24 PM, Boudi van Vlijmen 
bo...@vanvlijmen.nlwrote:



OpenERP integrates best with LibreOffice and OpenOffice (

http://doc.openerp.com/v6.1/book/8/8_20_Config/8_20_Config_reports.html)
and not with MS-Word. (more cost effective than other business 
solutions)






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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Silent Updates

2012-12-29 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello everyone,

I'd like to call this discussion to an end. As it was mentionned several times 
here and elsewhere, implementing a self-upgrade mechanism, be it silent or 
otherwise is for the moment not possible. It's high up there in terms of 
developpers visibility, meaning that developers know it's important but given 
the nature of our legacy code it requires a lot of efforts - or a lot of money. 
Unless someone here is willing to raise money and to write the full spec , this 
discussion is daydreaming :-) .

Going back to important matters we are releasing the 4.0 in less than two 
months. I'll send out a doodle for a marketing call, Italo will update us on 
the communication strategy, and we are still looking for volunteers willing to 
design a nice page presenting the 4.0 , among other tasks. Any takers?

Cheers,

Charles.
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Marketing material suggestion: Why LibreOffice?

2012-12-29 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Immanuel,

Nice pick! it's The First time we got mentionned by our biggest competitor, so
it's time for a bottle of champagne :-D

More seriously, if these are three arguments they can come up with it seems we
got a looong way.simce 2005 or so.

-Pivot table: Bullshit, we do it just as well only differently.
-Collaboration: depends... We have collaborative features (cmis anyone?) too
-No Outlook?... Seriously? Well, no Outlook, true. But I can think of many
arguments why this is a good choice.

We need something ( a webpage) that takes what we have in the 4.0 and compares
it witg MSOffice. Anyone would like to drive this?

Best,
Charles.

Immanuel Giulea giulea.imman...@gmail.com a écrit :

Hello all,

Microsoft put out a three-page document that hits on some of the
weaknesses
of LO (and bundles LO with OOo):
http://download.microsoft.com/download/D/0/D/D0DA0C4B-22DE-40C7-A84D-0C7E03347A9C/Considering-LibreOffice-and-OO-v2.pdf

Is there some materials that can explain the strong points of LO and
offer
counter-arguments to what MS says ?

Some of the key points would be:
- lack of calendaring/email
- collaboration tools
- pivot tables

Immanuel

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [us-marketing] Marketing material suggestion: Why LibreOffice?

2012-12-29 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Anybody knows someone at openerp? Otherwise I'l lcontact them.

Best,
Charles.


Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@gmail.com a écrit :

Sorry for top posting, but I think that the idea of creating a wiki
page
where we can brainstorm about the selling points for Windows (as
Microsoft document is focused on Windows, which is their cash cow) is
very good. All the points that have been raised so far are extremely
good, and I think that we should pick them and paste in a starting
document.

I am currently working at the final version of the migration and
training protocol for certification, and I do not have the time for
creating this wiki page for a few days. Anyone could create the page
though, in the Marketing area of TDF wiki:

https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing

I would call the page Selling Point vs MS Office, because this is the
summary of the contents.

Marc can definitely help in creating the page, if someone has problems
with the wiki.

I am definitely interested in helping with the contents, once I will
have finished working on the certification protocols.

On 12/29/12 10:07 PM, Jay Lozier wrote:
 On 12/29/2012 01:12 PM, Immanuel Giulea wrote:
 Well to be fair, I raised three points that seemed to me were the
 arguments of MS feature-wise.

 Other arguments are listed, and my suggestion was to create a new
wiki
 page where we could compare (side-by-side) LO and MSO.

 Summary of arguments from MS against LO

 *Arguments about $$*

   * Total costs: Business impact; like software issues, integration,
 incompatibility, run-time errors, downtime, unreliable support
and
 security vulnerability.

 Unreliable support? MS normally offers very limited direct user
support
 - 1 or 2 incidents max if I remember correctly. Most user support
will
 be from a help desk (internal or external). If it is from MS it is
via
 separate contract or additional costs to the licensing agreement.
 Security is a joke because MS is notorious for shipping insecure
 products. Run-time errors? What about BSOD for Windows? Integration
and
 incompatibility are very nebulous - do they mean file formats or
being
 able to access the program from another? The first is really MSO not
 following standards and the later is a programming issue.

   * Total benefit: Such as reliable supports, updates,
accessibility,
 and security.

   * Integration cost: The cost associated when you decide to use a
 different software platform.

 Different software platform - do they mean OS? If so, LO does this
 better even if the OS/distro is not officially support because the
 source code is available and can be compiled by someone for a very
 specific platform. With MSO, if a version is not provide you have no
 options (Linux version available).

   * Management: Can it be easily managed? Large companies tend to
have
 this issue because they don't have a unified system.

 This is truly a management problem, is the management competent?

   * Deployment costs: Can it handle corporate size business
 productivity? In addition to the compromise or extra benefits of
 software alternatives.

 Software suitability should be determined for each case. There is no
 blanket answer for this. MS is implying that MSO is the only answer
for
 businesses when in fact it is often not. Often the issue is that a
 company has an installed base of VB macros, etc for MSO that would
need
 porting to LO

   * OpenOffice/LibreOffice does not provide the same depth of
 functionality as Microsoft Office as a result do not meet the
 needs of some end users. This will force your organization to
 manage multiple software suites potentially increasing IT costs.

 No software meets the needs of all users because all are
design/feature
 compromises.

   * When running a mixed software environment you are also running
the
 risk of interoperability issues which could further increase IT
 and helpdesk costs, inhibit productivity, and generate end users
 frustration.

 Most companies standardize on the software tools as much as possible
to
 reduce these costs. However no single program/suite will cover all
user
 needs so to some degree there will be a mixed software environment.

   * Additional factors that could create higher costs include
 integration with your existing systems and applications like ERP
 and content management systems and software updates.

 This is more of issue with the ERP and CMS software not LO per se.
They
 can support LO if required by contract or if the vendor desires.

   * *LibreOffice*/OpenOffice *does not allow for incremental
software
 updates. *Instead it requires a complete uninstall and reinstall
 every time you need to update the software.

 How difficult are Windows/Mac updates? I use Linux. I am not sure
this
 is a major issue if the updates are handle uninstall/reinstall
without
 user intervention.
 
 The cost argument is mostly bogus because it ignores the
 purchase/licensing

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

Hi,


Le vendredi 21 décembre 2012 à 02:58 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Hi Florian et al,
 
 Le 2012-12-08 06:19, Florian Monfort a écrit :
  Can I have the sources from this precise file please?
 
  It's too small to integrate well with the Community logo resolution
  standard, I need it bigger and with a larger alpha channel
 
  http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Libocommunity.png
 
  Thanks!
 
 
  On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 10:00 PM, Hillar Liivliivhil...@gmail.com  wrote:
 
 
 The marketing/design team need to have a serious discussion about this 
 icon. If we decide to adopt it, then I would like to add it to our 
 resources page[1].
 
 Charles had a good point about possible brand confusion and what our 
 logo means. If we adopt this logo as our community icon, then IMO, it 
 should be used as our community icon for our social media sites so that 
 we can also work on its recognition along with our official 
 TDF/LibreOffice logo.
 



Can someone point to a rationale about having a logo for the community
that would be different from the logo we use everyday? We have two
logos. One which can only be used with explicit written permission (the
one with the TDF subline) and one that has more convenient terms. The
notion that there should be a different logo used by the community is
troubling for at least two reasons:
1. the community is LibreOffice which is the community which is
LibreOffice... :-)
2. marketing-wise we are pushing the branding forward, raising its
awareness and do not want the brand to be diluted (esp. with unclear
needs such as this one).

Thanks,
Charles.





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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

Hello Marc,

Le vendredi 21 décembre 2012 à 09:42 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2012-12-21 06:38, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 
 
  Can someone point to a rationale about having a logo for the community
  that would be different from the logo we use everyday? We have two
  logos. One which can only be used with explicit written permission (the
  one with the TDF subline) and one that has more convenient terms. The
  notion that there should be a different logo used by the community is
  troubling for at least two reasons:
  1. the community is LibreOffice which is the community which is
  LibreOffice... :-)
  2. marketing-wise we are pushing the branding forward, raising its
  awareness and do not want the brand to be diluted (esp. with unclear
  needs such as this one).
 
  Thanks,
  Charles.
 
 
 We should also get Italo's opinion on this as well, and, make a note of 
 the decision so that we do not go over it again.
 
 A lot of the confusion is that the community and community-product - 
 LibreOffice Suite share the same logo. We may need to differentiate 
 the two if we are to promote both. As you suggested, the page icon with 
 surrounding people-figures may need some work if we were to develop a 
 logo for the community.
 
 Perhaps a combination of the formal logo (with subline) and the 
 suggested community-page-icon[1]? This would allow us a recognized brand 
 with two flavours -- community as well as product. If we were to adopt 
 this as our community logo, we would then have the following breakdown 
 in logos:
 
 1. Community logo
 * with TDF subline for official use
 * without TDF subline for unofficial use
 
 2. Product logo
 * with TDF subline for official use
 * without TDF subline for unofficial use
 
 3. We would also have the LibreOffice page icon brand that, IMO, we 
 should also defend/protect against abuse. The page icon is the base for 
 many of our icon design development. We should develop brand recognition 
 for this as well.
 
 So far the LibreOffice logo has been pushed more for the product than 
 the community. The proposed community logo[1] would be close enough to 
 the up-to-now product logo to gain quick brand recognition. Maybe we 
 should not mess around with the up-to-now product logo brand 
 recognition and develop a community logo in tandem with the product logo.


But again, why do you want to differentiate, esp. now that we're
essentially saying that we're not pushing the product but equate the
product and the community? Why a different logo? That's what I don't
get. It is not like there's a product, a company producing it, and then
a community of fans of the product with a specific identity. It is
rather that there's a community happening to develop a product and being
in charge of it at every stage. Am I missing something here? :-)
It appears to add one more layer of complexity and confusion on a
marketing team that's already struggling to take off...

best,
Charles. 




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

Le vendredi 21 décembre 2012 à 10:50 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2012-12-21 10:11, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Hello Marc,
 
 
  We should also get Italo's opinion on this as well, and, make a note of
  the decision so that we do not go over it again.
 
  A lot of the confusion is that the community and community-product -
  LibreOffice Suite share the same logo. We may need to differentiate
  the two if we are to promote both. As you suggested, the page icon with
  surrounding people-figures may need some work if we were to develop a
  logo for the community.
 
  Perhaps a combination of the formal logo (with subline) and the
  suggested community-page-icon[1]? This would allow us a recognized brand
  with two flavours -- community as well as product. If we were to adopt
  this as our community logo, we would then have the following breakdown
  in logos:
 
  1. Community logo
  * with TDF subline for official use
  * without TDF subline for unofficial use
 
  2. Product logo
  * with TDF subline for official use
  * without TDF subline for unofficial use
 
  3. We would also have the LibreOffice page icon brand that, IMO, we
  should also defend/protect against abuse. The page icon is the base for
  many of our icon design development. We should develop brand recognition
  for this as well.
 
  So far the LibreOffice logo has been pushed more for the product than
  the community. The proposed community logo[1] would be close enough to
  the up-to-now product logo to gain quick brand recognition. Maybe we
  should not mess around with the up-to-now product logo brand
  recognition and develop a community logo in tandem with the product logo.
 
 
  But again, why do you want to differentiate, esp. now that we're
  essentially saying that we're not pushing the product but equate the
  product and the community? Why a different logo? That's what I don't
  get. It is not like there's a product, a company producing it, and then
  a community of fans of the product with a specific identity. It is
  rather that there's a community happening to develop a product and being
  in charge of it at every stage. Am I missing something here? :-)
  It appears to add one more layer of complexity and confusion on a
  marketing team that's already struggling to take off...
 
  best,
  Charles.
 
 
 I think the dilemma here is that we are in fact trying to do 2 things at 
 once. Up until the LibreOffice Conference 2012, we had been trying to 
 establish the LibreOffice product brand and have managed this quite 
 well. The iconic LibreOffice name, color (green) and iconic page-logo 
 have a foothold on the office suite circuit.
 
 Since the LibreOffice Conference 2012, we are now shifting our approach 
 to branding our community (which, BTW, I much more prefer). However, we 
 have spent the last 2 years, working the medias, conferences etc. and 
 have achieved significant recognition by the public of the LibreOffice 
 suite, by and large, also by the recognition of the LibreOffice logo 
 brand. I don't believe that when the public/enterprises see the 
 LibreOffice logo that they have our community in mind, they rather see 
 the LibreOffice product and docs, and rightly so -- our marketing has 
 worked. We were being a little selfish in trying to get more people to 
 adopt the product rather than adopt the community.
 
 In my opinion, I would suggest we not waste the product brand 
 recognition that has been gained in the last 2 years and throw it away 
 in order to re-boot our priorities. I think this would not be a good 
 tactical move for our product brand. I would now suggest we develop a 
 community logo that our social media websites could use to advance our 
 community brand. The logo does not have to be that much different from 
 the established product brand, but just have enough subtle differences 
 to show community involvement. However, the common design lines of the 
 community and product logos will work in our favour and help boost the 
 community brand recognition.


So we agree on the diagnostic only in part, and disagree on the
remedy ;-) . You are much more optimistic than I am on the brand
recognition. For sure we had tremendous results but the brand
recognition is not where it should be. That's where we disagree on the
diagnostic. On the remedy, we disagree precisely on the fact that you
feel we would confuse the community and the product (did I get that
right?) with one logo, as we're changing our marketing strategy. I beg
to differ in that I'm saying the opposite: product and community are one
and the same. Another detail: we hadn't a marketing strategy before. We
had an emphasis on the product by default, because no one ever advocated
anything contrary to that, and even then we never did what it took to
push the product.

Best,



-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LinuxCon Japan: Call for Participation

Naruhiko-San,

I'm putting Kohei Yoshida in cc of this message. We need the support
with the japanese community for that.

Best,

Charles.

Le samedi 22 décembre 2012 à 02:01 +0900, Naruhiko Ogasawara a écrit :
 Hi -marketing listmates,
 
 
 LinuxCon Japan 2013[1], one of the most biggest Asia international
 Linux / FLOSS event by The Linux Foundation, looking for speakers[2].
 
 
 This event titled LinuxCon, however, you might know, lots of kind of
 FLOSS related session such as desktop environment, community building,
 etc. are welcome.
 All of session will be in English; no Japanese needed.
 
 
 Anyone have a plan to send CFP for this event?
 It's big chance for Japanese/Asian people to know how LibreOffice
 and our really active and open community are nice!
 
 I'll also send CFP not for LibreOffice, but if it will be accepted
 or not I might be there.  If someone will come and will meet in
 Tokyo I'm really happy!
 
 
 The venue, Chinzan-so[3] combines hotel and conference center; it is
 very good place; beautiful garden, very luxury hotel and close to
 Akihabara :)
 
 
 Please consider to come Jappan!
 
 
 [1] https://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/linuxcon-japan
 [2] https://events.linuxfoundation.org/events/linuxcon-japan/cfp
 [3] http://www.chinzanso.com/english/
 
 
 Regards,
 -- 
 Naruhiko Ogasawara (naru...@gmail.com)
 


-- 
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Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

Hello Marc,

Le vendredi 21 décembre 2012 à 12:14 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2012-12-21 11:09, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 
  So we agree on the diagnostic only in part, and disagree on the
  remedy ;-) . You are much more optimistic than I am on the brand
  recognition. For sure we had tremendous results but the brand
  recognition is not where it should be. That's where we disagree on the
  diagnostic. On the remedy, we disagree precisely on the fact that you
  feel we would confuse the community and the product (did I get that
  right?) with one logo, as we're changing our marketing strategy. I beg
  to differ in that I'm saying the opposite: product and community are one
  and the same. Another detail: we hadn't a marketing strategy before. We
  had an emphasis on the product by default, because no one ever advocated
  anything contrary to that, and even then we never did what it took to
  push the product.
 
  Best,
 
 
 Hmm, not sure about the ... but the brand recognition is not where it 
 should be ... statement as we had not really talked about market 
 penetration numbers that we had to reach. We did hold regular meetings 
 from Oct 25th 2010 (from when I organized the wiki pages, there were 
 some other confcalls before this but they were not well documented) up 
 until July 4th 2011 (I was usually the secretary) and you'll find the 
 notes on the wiki[1]. I was not available for approximately 6-7 months 
 due to surgeries. These meetings were chaired by mostly Florian, Italo 
 (and at the time, Drew). So, there was some strategy implemented, which 
 came from the top-down. Members with experience had the lead.

Yes indeed. But you know just as well as I do, that building such a team
and organizing marketing is a tremendously time consuming task... I
might give the impression to be overly critical; if that's the case it's
not what I would like to confer. But my point is that we're only at  the
very beginning of the journey, and we need to continue :-)
 
 As well, during this period and up-till-now, Italo has been the defacto 
 marketing lead, where any serious decisions were/are taken by him. 
 Unless anything has changed, Italo is still the marketing team lead.


I indeed think that you didn't get the memo (anyone follows the
board-discuss list here?). Marketing has been broken into two
meta-tasks or team  since this summer . Italo is very much in charge
of Marketing/Communications (MarCom) and I am in charge of the strategic
marketing, which does not involve communications, but does include all
the rear operations  that marketing needs, as well as community
building. Of course, no one is nitpicking and having preseances, so you
will see Italo here just as often as before, and we are not locked in
our clusters but are working jointly all together in a smooth way (which
we've been doing in the past). 
 
 So, the marketing team was at least quite busy, putting into action 
 initiatives that were later taken on by other groups. You only need to 
 tour the marketing team wiki pages to see the end-product (even if 
 disorganized -- my plans were/are still to organize these pages). My 
 most recent concerns, as you know, was the lack of design-member help 
 for marketing initiatives which go by the wayside if there is no such 
 help. At one point, the marketing team was quite organized  and had an 
 agreed production process with the design team which worked quite 
 well[2][3] (which led to the creation of the Visual Elements Resources 
 wiki page for the Marketing and Design Teams[3]). But, for some reason, 
 UX has taken over and there is now little time left for anything else. 
 The same concerns I voiced previously (apologies, I can't find the page 
 right now) were also echoed by KJ just recently on the design list.

My impression is that it's fundamentally a resources problem, and that's
leading to the issue you're describing. 

 
 The LibreOffice product, in my opinion, would not be where it is today, 
 without the initial cooperation between teams and advocacy. Yup, your 
 view is more pessimistic than mine. A lot has been achieved in just 2 
 years of market presence.

Of course, no one is saying the contrary! Obviously, our project and
brand is two years old. It's not a long time, but we are in an unique
position where we need to establish our brand (we can consider it
established) against people's lack of awareness AND against a brand
many of us had been contributing to  before (OpenOffice). Because of
that the dilemna is interesting, but it's a bit like having twice the
size of the challenge. In light of these factors, we indeed did a hack
of a great job, and you (and others here) can definitely be proud of the
work that's been done here. Yet we're only starting the journey here...

 
 As for the logo dilemma, would the use of a community logo and a product 
 logo confuse? No. Would we confuse the community and users/enterprises 
 if we used one logo? Yes. Unfortunately, we started

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Out of town till late next Tuesday

2012-12-18 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

Le dimanche 16 décembre 2012 à 06:43 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Le 2012-12-06 00:16, Marc Paré a écrit :
  Just letting the list know that I will be away out of town till next
  Tuesday with limited internet access. My mother has moved to a
  retirement village, and I am helping with her electronics setup.
 
  I may be able to read my mail once her gear is set up and if she will
  let me use her computer! [*smile*]
 
  Have a great weekend.
 
  Marc
 
 
 I am back from an unplanned extended trip where there was no access to 
 the internet. It will take me a day or two to wade through all of the 
 hundreds of emails I missed (as well as Christmas spam -- nasty).
 
 My apologies for missing the marketing meeting.


No worries. It's good to see you're back and yes, you already did a lot
of work on the website :) 

You asked for some minutes of the Marketing Strategy Workshop in Berlin,
I repost them here, as I had asked for feedback on these a few months
ago:
http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/

Best,
Charles.



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Out of town till late next Tuesday

2012-12-18 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Le mardi 18 décembre 2012 à 07:26 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Hi Charles,
 
 Le 2012-12-18 06:27, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Hello Marc,
 
  Le dimanche 16 décembre 2012 à 06:43 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
  Le 2012-12-06 00:16, Marc Paré a écrit :
  Just letting the list know that I will be away out of town till next
  Tuesday with limited internet access. My mother has moved to a
  retirement village, and I am helping with her electronics setup.
 
  I may be able to read my mail once her gear is set up and if she will
  let me use her computer! [*smile*]
 
  Have a great weekend.
 
  Marc
 
 
  I am back from an unplanned extended trip where there was no access to
  the internet. It will take me a day or two to wade through all of the
  hundreds of emails I missed (as well as Christmas spam -- nasty).
 
  My apologies for missing the marketing meeting.
 
 
  No worries. It's good to see you're back and yes, you already did a lot
  of work on the website :)
 
  You asked for some minutes of the Marketing Strategy Workshop in Berlin,
  I repost them here, as I had asked for feedback on these a few months
  ago:
  http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/
 
  Best,
  Charles.
 
 
 Thanks for the link. Yes, now I do remember reading it.
 
 Am I correct when I say that the resulting decision is that we are now 
 to market NOT the LibreOffice Office Suite, but rather our community 
 project first which has a product to offer our members and anyone else 
 interested?
 
 Is this the new line of thinking we are to adopt?

Yes, that's the general idea; that's the strategy. Tactics do include
product pages of course but no classical SWOTs and segmentation
analysis. So yes, the new line of thinking is not about the product but
about the community, and how, process wise, the marketing team should
act as an information broker inside the project and outside it.

Best,
Charles.




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] other references

2012-12-14 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Paolo,

Please read the minutes of our last marketing strategy confcall if you wish to 
know where we are going and how you could help.

Thanks!

Charles.


Paolo Debortoli paolo_debort...@yahoo.com a écrit :

http://www.techsoup.org/learningcenter/software/page4765.cfm

targeting universities (we vhave already many example to quote) ?




 From: Paolo Debortoli paolo_debort...@yahoo.com
To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org
marketing@global.libreoffice.org 
Sent: Saturday, December 15, 2012 12:16 AM
Subject: [libreoffice-marketing] other references
 
I don't understand when they were written, but they might be
interesting:

http://www.datamation.com/applications/how-microsoft-office-tops-libreoffice-11-features-1.html

http://www.datamation.com/applications/how-libreoffice-writer-tops-ms-word-12-features-1.html




by the way...  still asking about weak points...  what we miss about
marketing.  maybe we can address schools with posters, cds,
broshures...  ?

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] US Journalist blames LibO for lost work

2012-12-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Tom,

Hold on right there. Dan Gillmore is a famous newspaper journalist from
Silicon Valley and he's no bullshiter. I have asked him to send us a
copy of this problematic document, we will see...

best,
Charles.

Le jeudi 13 décembre 2012 à 12:38 +, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)
 It's just a couple of people (perhaps  paid by MS) just trying to stir-up 
 trouble.  
 
 
 Notice that it's a problem that has never been reported to the User List here 
 nor to the forums.  I've never had the problem.  Have you?  They could have 
 reported the problem to the Users List or anywhere else that might have been 
 able to either help or would have been interested in posting a bug-report and 
 getting it fixed.  So, they clearly didn't want it fixed but more than that, 
 they didn't want it to become obvious that their grumble is more likely to be 
 due to hardware issues (note they gave no specs nor version numbers of 
 anything).  
 
 
 IF the 2 people (or 1 person using 2 names) really did have the problem then 
 there are a lot of questions.  Was there enough empty space on the drive they 
 were saving too?  Were they saving to a temp folder and then cleared their 
 temp folders?  Was there drive corruption?  Did other programs appear to lose 
 data?  Have they even tried other programs since the problem occured?  Did 
 they immediately follow standard data-loss protocols?  DId they check it 
 wasn't just that they accidentaly changed font colour to white against a 
 white background?  Did they do Anne's favourite and deleted their lock-file 
 and then save an older version over the top of the newer version of the 
 document.  In their thread no-one asked any of those questions.  No-one tried 
 opening the file as though it was a zip file.  
 
 If people don't want a problem solved and want to ensure they don't recover 
 the allegedly missing data then the approach they took is just about perfect. 
  
 
 
 There will be an increasing amount of FUD out there as LO and AOO become more 
 widely used.  If you see something negative about LO out there then just ask 
 yourself who stands to profit from it, follow the money.  Also ask yourself 
 how likely the problem is and whether the people have really made an effort 
 to fix it.  Perhaps point them to somewhere they really might get some useful 
 help.  
 
 Regards from
 Tom :)  
 
 
 
 
 
 
  From: C. Olofson c.olof...@gmail.com
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org 
 Sent: Thursday, 13 December 2012, 8:38
 Subject: [libreoffice-marketing] US Journalist blames LibO for lost work
  
 fyi;
  I really really want to like Libre Office, but I just lost an hour of 
  editing in a document due to some bizarre bug that I can't can now 
  reproduce. And I was saving regularly. Crap, crap, crap.
 https://plus.google.com/113210431006401244170/posts/E7Ktup1Aq4M
 
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[libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Strategy Call in one hour

2012-12-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello,

This is a reminder that our marketing conference call will start in
about one hour. 
In order to access the call, you will need two things: the phone number
you have to dial in (local numbers are available) :
http://www.talkyoo.net/main/telefonkonferenz_internationale_rufnummern

and the room number (dial # after the number):
53 71 38 .

Agenda:
- Marketing strategy set up and action items
- 4.0 launch preparations

Best,
Charles-H. Schulz.



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Strategy Call in one hour

2012-12-13 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hi,

And now the minutes below...

Le jeudi 13 décembre 2012 à 17:00 +0100, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello,
 
 This is a reminder that our marketing conference call will start in
 about one hour. 
 In order to access the call, you will need two things: the phone number
 you have to dial in (local numbers are available) :
 http://www.talkyoo.net/main/telefonkonferenz_internationale_rufnummern
 
 and the room number (dial # after the number):
 53 71 38 .
 
 Agenda:
 - Marketing strategy set up and action items
 - 4.0 launch preparations


Participants: Charles-H. Schulz, Drew Jensen, Italo Vignoli, Fridolin.

* Marketing Strategy set up and action items
- quick recap of the Berlin marketing strategy workshop
- basic idea is to turn the marketing team into an information broker
inside the community and outside it.
- action item: draft a monthly newsletter of the activity in every
corner of the LibreOffce project, connect with people: Fridolin
volunteers to lead this, needs some help.
- action item: social networks (Facebook page + G+ community) are
turning into massive influx of fans, users that need to be turned into
contributors (at least some of them) Charles needs to report on Facebook
ad and activity.

- we need a team who helps put a nice online page (on the website) about
the ten most proeminent features for each major release . Some are doing
this but the marketing team does not help -needs to take the active lead
here.

* 4.0 launch preparations:
- Italo explains the general philosophy of the 4.0 launch: the rebasing,
the major release with major changes, code cleanups, etc. 
- need to run a set of developers' interviews on this technological
changes. We need volunteers to help drive these interviews.

Anything I've forget? Please let me know.

Best,

-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

2012-12-08 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hmm, I'm really not so sure I like the new logo. Florian, would you mind
replacing it by our standard logo? Perhaps we can launch a design contest
afterwards.

Thanks,

Charles.

2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com

 Nope, but I think that brings up a very interesting point : two pages is
 maybe too much. I think we should choose between a LibreOffice and a
 Document Foundation page. Having both brings confusion.


 On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 12:43 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com wrote:

  Hello,
 
  Is https://plus.google.com/+libreoffice/posts cover photo changable by
  You too? Or who is managing this libreoffice page?
 
  Hillar
 
 
 
 
  2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
 
  Thank you, that is exactly what I need :)
 
 
 
  On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 12:24 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Hello,
 
  I send a source file, i hope you can make mods you need:
  http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibO_community.svg
 
  Hillar aka Medieval
 
 
 
  2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
 
  Can I have the sources from this precise file please?
 
  It's too small to integrate well with the Community logo resolution
  standard, I need it bigger and with a larger alpha channel
 
  http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Libocommunity.png
 
  Thanks!
 
 
  On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 10:00 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Hello,
 
  I do not know about the cover picture, but should the community have
  its own image/icon?
  Something like this?
  http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Libocommunity.png
 
 
  Hillar aka Medieval
 
 
 
 
  2012/12/7 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
 
   Hi everyone!
 
  Could we have a LibreOffice cover photo for our official page on
  Google+ ?
 
  Right now we're using the default theme which is not so classy...
 
  Thanks!
 
  --
  *Monfort Florian*
 
  BM2 Student at France Business School
  Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
  Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
  florian.monf...@gmail.com
  Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 
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  --
  *Monfort Florian*
  BM2 Student at France Business School
  Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
  Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
   florian.monf...@gmail.com
  Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 
 
 
 
 
  --
  *Monfort Florian*
  BM2 Student at France Business School
  Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
  Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
  florian.monf...@gmail.com
  Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 
 
 


 --
 *Monfort Florian*
 BM2 Student at France Business School
 Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
 Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
 florian.monf...@gmail.com
 Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: [libreoffice-design] LibreOffice cover photo - Google+

2012-12-08 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Florian,

I am sorry... but why is it relevant? LibreOffice is the community. There's
no  LibreOffice and the community.

Best,

Charles.

2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com

 Hi Charles,

 Even if it's not as good, it is still more relevant for a Community than
 the standard logo ;)

 Let's launch a contest, but it is important to differenciate the Community
 from the official page.


 On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 1:06 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

 Hmm, I'm really not so sure I like the new logo. Florian, would you mind
 replacing it by our standard logo? Perhaps we can launch a design contest
 afterwards.

 Thanks,

 Charles.

 2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com

  Nope, but I think that brings up a very interesting point : two pages is
  maybe too much. I think we should choose between a LibreOffice and a
  Document Foundation page. Having both brings confusion.
 
 
  On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 12:43 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
   Hello,
  
   Is https://plus.google.com/+libreoffice/posts cover photo changable
 by
   You too? Or who is managing this libreoffice page?
  
   Hillar
  
  
  
  
   2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
  
   Thank you, that is exactly what I need :)
  
  
  
   On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 12:24 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
   Hello,
  
   I send a source file, i hope you can make mods you need:
   http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibO_community.svg
  
   Hillar aka Medieval
  
  
  
   2012/12/8 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
  
   Can I have the sources from this precise file please?
  
   It's too small to integrate well with the Community logo resolution
   standard, I need it bigger and with a larger alpha channel
  
   http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Libocommunity.png
  
   Thanks!
  
  
   On Fri, Dec 7, 2012 at 10:00 PM, Hillar Liiv liivhil...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
   Hello,
  
   I do not know about the cover picture, but should the community
 have
   its own image/icon?
   Something like this?
   http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Libocommunity.png
  
  
   Hillar aka Medieval
  
  
  
  
   2012/12/7 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com
  
Hi everyone!
  
   Could we have a LibreOffice cover photo for our official page on
   Google+ ?
  
   Right now we're using the default theme which is not so classy...
  
   Thanks!
  
   --
   *Monfort Florian*
  
   BM2 Student at France Business School
   Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
   Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
   florian.monf...@gmail.com
   Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
  
   --
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 cannot
   be deleted
  
  
  
  
  
   --
   *Monfort Florian*
   BM2 Student at France Business School
   Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
   Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
florian.monf...@gmail.com
   Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
  
  
  
  
  
   --
   *Monfort Florian*
   BM2 Student at France Business School
   Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
   Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
   florian.monf...@gmail.com
   Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
  
  
  
 
 
  --
  *Monfort Florian*
  BM2 Student at France Business School
  Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
  Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
  florian.monf...@gmail.com
  Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 
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 BM2 Student at France Business School
 Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
 Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
 florian.monf...@gmail.com
 Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Google+ Community

2012-12-07 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Florian,

Le vendredi 07 décembre 2012 à 12:16 +0100, Florian Monfort a écrit :
 Hi,
 
 Following the announcement of the Google+ Communities functionality, I
 think it would be important to post our updates, press releases and
 informations in this community, or in any other community that looks
 relevant :
 
 https://plus.google.com/u/0/communities/100252562265178248672
 
 This would ensure better coverage and help spread the word about
 LIbreOffice being a viable alternative for the Enterprise
 
 Cheers
 

Funny, I was talking about that just now somewhere else :-)
Florian, would you mind creating that community and add myself, Simon
Phipps and Florian Effenberger as co-admins?

Thanks,

-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Ad on Facebook?

2012-12-03 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

Le lundi 03 décembre 2012 à 11:29 -0500, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Hi everyone,
 
 Le 2012-11-26 06:06, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Hi,
 
  Provided that TDF has the budget, would you guys agree to have a
  sponsored link on Facebook?
 
  Thanks,
 
 Judging from the positive response to this, I have added this item to 
 the wishlist thread.
 
 Charles, as you are the person who suggested this item, could I put you 
 down as the contact person for when/if the TDF approve the funds for this?

Sure. 

 
 Could you (or someone on this list) also provide a cost estimation for 
 placing an ad ... I imagine there are many varieties of target 
 audience that prospective ads could be chosen from -- e.g. different 
 regions of the globe; target particular clients interested in 
 technology, education, etc ...

yes indeed.

 
 If you could provide different ad possibilities depending on the costs. 
 Maybe we could target people in different regions of the globe for x 
 number of months and then move to another region OR target particular 
 types of individuals for x number of months and then mover to another 
 type of target.

Exactly. I'm trying to determine that in order to come up with a
budget...

 
 I guess it all depends on what type of target types FP allows for its ad 
 placement.
 
 But ad placement, IMO, would work if there was a plan to place ads over 
 a certain amount of months, as well as, later, getting some kind of 
 feedback of its success.

Exactly. The notion goes like this: facebook ads can cost anywhere
between 2$ and 5000$ a day. So there's really room for thinking and
playing. But I would not want this to go nowhere just because there are
too many options. I'd envision a first campaign that's short and
targeted in a not too specific way (as in, we target specific categories
but don't go too deep) and evaluate the returns on this.

From what I know and have observed on several blogs and websites,
Facebook may not drive purchases, but it drives real traffic. I have
heard about GM pulling out from Facebook, but then tracking the
customer's interest from a facebook page to the car loan signed  at the
specific GM's reseller seems far-fetched in any case. However, one click
leading to a download of a free software is quite different imho.

Best,
Charles.

 
 Cheers,
 
 Marc
 
 -- 
 Marc Paré
 m...@marcpare.com
 http://www.parEntreprise.com
 parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
 parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org
 
 


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?

2012-12-02 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Paolo,

Before this turns into another circular discussion please take a look here:
http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/

Thanks,
Charles.
Le 2 déc. 2012 15:09, Paolo Debortoli paolo_debort...@yahoo.com a
écrit :

 I have found a new article which coul be useful:

 http://refugeeks.com/RefuGeeks/2012/07/why-pay-for-microsoft-office/


 other ideas may be eventually targeting students (who could be attracted
 by the saving money) and schools (eg primary schools, copying the idea of
 microsoft, eg by sending a cd with a presentation letter or simply a
 printed brochure or poster).



 
  From: Paolo Debortoli paolo_debort...@yahoo.com
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 Sent: Monday, November 26, 2012 11:03 PM
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?


 internet if full of articles and comments about libreoffice which can be
 used in advertising,  i don't know wether it should be more about
 functionality, costs, microfoft comparison or what...



 http://news.cnet.com/8301-13845_3-57364785-58/a-free-microsoft-office-alternative-thats-actually-good/

 http://www.squidoo.com/Openoffice-org

 http://www.technohunk.com/2012/09/libreoffice-and-microsoft-office/

 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3628542


 http://blog.worldlabel.com/2012/seven-reasons-for-choosing-libreoffice-over-microsoft-office.html


 http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/apache-openoffice-3-4-makes-official-debut-libreoffice-makes-its-case/10915

 http://www.novell.com/products/libreoffice/

 may be advertising via banners in software's and magazines' websites
 could also be an idea.



 
  From: Paolo Debortoli paolo_debort...@yahoo.com
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 Sent: Monday, November 26, 2012 9:00 PM
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?

 LO 4.0 marketing plan ok, but maybe advertising on facebook may be too
 general (not everyone on fb is looking for an office productivity suite).
 advertising on specialized magazines or websites by reporting our success
 e.g. in the french government or with some technical detail (such as the
 portable version or the european low about open data format in the public
 administrations) could be more productive.



 
 From: Danishka Navin danis...@gmail.com
 To: Charles-H. Schulz charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org
 Cc: marketing@global.libreoffice.org marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 Sent: Monday, November 26, 2012 12:13 PM
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?

 On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 4:36 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

  Hi,
 
  Provided that TDF has the budget, would you guys agree to have a
  sponsored link on Facebook?
 

 I think we should discus this under LibreOffice 4.0 marketing plan.

 
  Thanks,
  --
  Charles-H. Schulz
  Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
  Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
  Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
  Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint
 
 
 
 
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 --
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 http://danishkanavin.blogspot.com
 http://twitter.com/danishkanavin
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/danishkanavin/

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?

2012-12-02 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Robert,

People don't buy Libreoffice. The ads would not be used to raise money but
to drive adoption and.increase brand recognition.

Best.

Charles.
Le 2 déc. 2012 18:54, Robert Ryley rryley1...@gmail.com a écrit :

 A bit late to this thread, but I have a question:

 What would be accomplished by a Facebook ad campaign?  How would that
 help the financing or development goals of the project?

 The empirical analysis of Facebook advertising is not good.  When
 large entities with large budgets and quants to crunch the numbers
 start pulling back, you had better re-think your course of action if
 something is a good idea.

 For example:
 Facebook: The Best Show In Town
 http://adcontrarian.blogspot.com/2012/05/facebook-best-show-in-town.html

 Quote:
 On Tuesday, the big bomb hit when GM announced it was cancelling $10
 million in Facebook ads. According the The Wall Street Journal...

 General Motors Co. plans to stop advertising on Facebook after the
 auto maker's executives determined their paid ads had little impact on
 consumers' car purchases... (GM) will continue to expand its use of
 marketing through Facebook's pages, in which marketers can display
 content at no cost...

 Might Facebook be a good medium for LO advertising?  Perhaps, but I'd
 doubt it.  The only time I click on a FB ad is by accident.

 I had a small success earlier this year writing a small blurb for a
 trade publication (the American Medical Writers' Association) about
 LO.  It might be a good idea to get articles about the benefits of LO,
 or case studies about organizations that moved over to LO, published
 in relevant communities.  I would much rather see developers or the
 full time members of the organization use the funds, rather than some
 advertiser.


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[libreoffice-marketing] Ad on Facebook?

2012-11-26 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hi,

Provided that TDF has the budget, would you guys agree to have a
sponsored link on Facebook?

Thanks,
-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Marketing Strategy Call

2012-11-20 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hear hear, 

the Marketing Strategy Call will take place on Thursday, December the
13th at 6 pm Berlin time, that is at 5 pm London time and noon EST
(Montreal, NYC, Boston, Scranton Pennsylvania, Miami, Savannah, Mystic,
Connecticut and Nantuckett). 

Agenda:
- introductions
- feedback and organizing based on the marketing strategy workshop
- concrete action items for the 4.0 release preparation.

I'll circulate the access call details before the call.

Best,
-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibreOffice logo on invoices

2012-11-20 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

No objection from my side.

Best,

Charles.
Le 21 nov. 2012 08:33, Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org
a écrit :

 Hello,

 we have a request from a supporter, who wants to use the LibreOffice logo
 on his invoices, to show his appreciation.

 While I really like people strengthening our brand, I'm a bit sceptical,
 because I'd like to avoid confusion - he's no official partner and does not
 invoice on our behalf.

 Any objections we grant him the use, given our logo for external use (
 http://wiki.**documentfoundation.org/**Marketing/Branding#Logo_**
 resources_for_community_**members_and_external_usehttp://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Branding#Logo_resources_for_community_members_and_external_use)
 is prefixed with something like created using or powered by or proud
 user of?

 Florian

 --
 Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board (Vorstandsvorsitzender)
 Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
 The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
 Gemeinnützige rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
 Legal details: 
 http://www.documentfoundation.**org/imprinthttp://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Introduction

2012-11-16 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Welcome Fridolin!

Charles.

2012/11/16 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com

 Welcome to you Fridolin, I'm pretty sure you will fit in here, and I hope
 you're going to enjoy your time with us :)


 On Fri, Nov 16, 2012 at 7:44 AM, Cor Nouws oo...@nouenoff.nl wrote:

  Good day Fridolin,
 
  Thanks for your interesting introducing!
  Good that you follow the group for some time already and that you have
  some experience in your country with open source and such!
 
  For sure time will show us many opportunities to share and work together
  :-)
 
  Cheers,
 
  Cor
 
  Fridolin wrote (16-11-12 06:06)
 
  Hello to all LO Marketeers,
 
  [...]
 
  Once again thanks to all involved for their efforts
  and lets work together to promote LO
 
 
  --
   - Cor
   - http://nl.libreoffice.org
   - www.librelex.org
 
 
 
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: NA-DVD 3.6.3 is now online on the LO DVD download pages

2012-11-16 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Ditto here. Thank you for your work!

Best,

Charles.
Le 16 nov. 2012 11:37, Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

 Hi Tim,

 Le 2012-11-15 10:43, webmaster-Kracked_P_P a écrit :


 Thanks to our friendly admins and the mirrors, the North American
 Community DVD is now online at the DVD download pages.

 http://www.libreoffice.org/**download/?type=boxversion=3.**6.3http://www.libreoffice.org/download/?type=boxversion=3.6.3

 It has the installs for 3.6.3 for
 Windows,
 Mac [Intel and PPC],
 Linux [DEBS, RPM]

 3.6.2 install for the Portable version

 It has language and help packs [where available] for the following
 languages:
 English [default]
 French
 Spanish
 Great Britain English
 German
 Italian
 Brazil Portuguese
 Hebrew

 There are Extensions, Templates, Dictionaries, Documentation, Artwork,
 and other Extras in the DVD.

 Here is the link to the 3.6.3 DVD via the online web page version.
 http://libreoffice-na.us/**English-3.6-installs/install.**htmlhttp://libreoffice-na.us/English-3.6-installs/install.html

 I would love to hear from users letting me know of what might be useful
 to include in the DVD. The 3.6.4 version DVD will have a link to the LO
 Donation page from every main page. The web site version has it, but the
 ISO file version does not, since it was updated after the ISO file was
 placed in the queue for inclusion in the LO DVD download pages.

 The off list email address to talk about the NA-DVD is
 webmas...@libreoffice-na.us



 Thanks for doing all of this. It is very much appreciated!


 --
 Marc Paré
 m...@marcpare.com
 http://www.parEntreprise.com
 parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
 parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] 3.7-4.0

2012-11-14 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hi,

This is a reminder for our marketing call. Here's the Doodle, please put
your name and your preferred time and dates on it:
http://doodle.com/3r9qeeikkayvbcdg

Best,

-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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[libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Strategy Call

2012-11-14 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hi,

This is a Doodle to schedule a Marketing Strategy call in the coming
weeks. Please register and select your preferred date and time.

http://doodle.com/3r9qeeikkayvbcdg


Best,
-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] 3.7-4.0

2012-11-12 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

There you go, feel free to set your preferences. The times are expressed
in CET time (GMT +1): http://doodle.com/3r9qeeikkayvbcdg

Best,

Charles.

Le samedi 10 novembre 2012 à 17:38 +0530, Danishka Navin a écrit :
 I think we should have a product marketing meeting for LibreOffice 4.0
 
 Lets fix a date!
 
 
 On Mon, Nov 5, 2012 at 4:33 PM, Charles-H. Schulz
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:
 Hello,
 
 Our next branch, the 3.7, will actually be our 4.0 (I know,
 it's
 Monday).
 More technical details are available here:
 http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/LibreOffice4
 and they're intensely technical as you can see.
 
 The new features are not fully defined, but we need to work on
 all the
 specific details on the announcement. Anything such as:
 - new features
 - specific messaging -remember:
 
 http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/ 
 within our broader messaging is welcome. We need to convey who we are and 
 what we do, in broad and specific terms, and in various ways to the public.
 
 In short, we need a shock team for product marketing; Italo
 will start
 to work on the PR side of things later on.
 
 I'd like to break a few work items so that people can own
 them:
 - new features : nice new webpage
 - web presence: banners, buttons, etc.
 - community presentation, facts, etc.
 - coordination  communication with other teams: Design team,
 localization / former Native-Lang teams, etc.
 
 I'm sure I'm forgetting several items here. Please apply here
 if you'd
 like to start on any one of these items.
 
 Best,
 --
 Charles-H. Schulz
 Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
 Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
 Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
 Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint
 
 
 
 
 --
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 +h...@global.libreoffice.org
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 -- 
 Danishka Navin
 http://danishkanavin.blogspot.com
 http://twitter.com/danishkanavin
 http://www.flickr.com/photos/danishkanavin/
 
 
 
 
 


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] FAQ on website needs reworking

2012-11-10 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

I'd go for the second.

Best,

Charles.
Le 10 nov. 2012 11:08, Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Could we take a look and rework the FAQ section on the website. It had
been suggested that the FAQ would probably work better on the About Us
section.

After re-reading that section I think we should either:

* leave the FAQ there; remove the items that would best fit on the About
Us section, but put it up on a static page.

* move the FAQ section to the About Us section; remove any items that do
not fit there and add them to the Ask LibreOffice. (I prefer this option)

Thanks for any suggestions.

Cheers,

Marc

--
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] 3.7-4.0

2012-11-10 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

I'll open a doodle tomorrow or monday.

Best,

Charles.
Le 10 nov. 2012 13:09, Danishka Navin danis...@gmail.com a écrit :

 I think we should have a product marketing meeting for LibreOffice 4.0

 Lets fix a date!


 On Mon, Nov 5, 2012 at 4:33 PM, Charles-H. Schulz 
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org wrote:

 Hello,

 Our next branch, the 3.7, will actually be our 4.0 (I know, it's
 Monday).
 More technical details are available here:
 http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/LibreOffice4
 and they're intensely technical as you can see.

 The new features are not fully defined, but we need to work on all the
 specific details on the announcement. Anything such as:
 - new features
 - specific messaging -remember:

 http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/within
  our broader messaging is welcome. We need to convey who we are and
 what we do, in broad and specific terms, and in various ways to the public.

 In short, we need a shock team for product marketing; Italo will start
 to work on the PR side of things later on.

 I'd like to break a few work items so that people can own them:
 - new features : nice new webpage
 - web presence: banners, buttons, etc.
 - community presentation, facts, etc.
 - coordination  communication with other teams: Design team,
 localization / former Native-Lang teams, etc.

 I'm sure I'm forgetting several items here. Please apply here if you'd
 like to start on any one of these items.

 Best,
 --
 Charles-H. Schulz
 Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
 Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
 Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
 Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Dubious claims

2012-11-09 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello everyone,

So... thank you all for your comments, and your support. It is welcome
and heartwarming. But at the risk of repeating myself, let's not waste
our time on this. Somebody quacked against us for a number of reasons,
and we don't plan nor do we have the ability to change his  mind. We (we
as a group and as individuals) have much better things to do, one of
them working our our community and marketing for LibreOffice. 

That's why I'd like to ask everyone to spend any more efforts or
comments on this chapter. Just let the duck in its pond. :-)

Best
Charles.

Le vendredi 09 novembre 2012 à 13:09 +, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)
 +1
 except that i suspect he does understand but it destroys his argument rather 
 than reinforcing it so he ignores it.  
 Regards from
 Tom :)  
 
 
 
 
 
 
  From: Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@gmail.com
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org 
 Sent: Thursday, 8 November 2012, 22:11
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Dubious claims
  
 Il 08/11/2012 17:16, Jay Lozier ha scritto:
 
  Positive trends are more important than precise numbers of users.
 
 The problem here is that everyone, including journalists, is aware that our 
 figures are intended to provide a trend, while [the chap] does not 
 understand this basic concept. He would like to see journalists bashing TDF, 
 as he has been doing on a regular basis since June 2011. This, of course, 
 will never happen, for two reasons: journalists might criticize but do not 
 bash, and the positive trends around TDF and LibreOffice are so clear that 
 writing something different would be impossible (unless you have a specific 
 agenda against TDF, LibreOffice, free software and open standards).
 
 -- Italo Vignoli - italo.vign...@gmail.com
 mob +39.348.5653829 - VoIP 5316...@messagenet.it
 skype italovignoli - gtalk italo.vign...@gmail.com
 
 


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Dubious claims

Hello Florian,

We hold the data sources open. They're out there, if anybody needs
counting.

best,
Charles.

Le lundi 05 novembre 2012 à 10:42 +0100, Florian Monfort a écrit :
 But isn't he right in any of his writings ?
 
 Sounds pretty convincing :/
 
 
 On Mon, Nov 5, 2012 at 10:34 AM, Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@gmail.comwrote:
 
   No, he will go on and on. He is paid by IBM, so he is just doing his job.
  He is testing our patience.
 
  --
  Italo Vignoli
  Mobile +39.348.5653829
  Email italo.vign...@gmail.com
 
  On Monday 5 November 2012 at 10:06, Florian Monfort wrote:
 
  Here we go again...
 
 
  http://www.robweir.com/blog/2012/11/libreoffices-dubious-claims-part-3-developers.html?utm_source=feedburnerutm_medium=feedutm_campaign=Feed%3A+robweir%2Fantic-atom+%28Rob+Weir%3A+An+Antic+Disposition%29
 
  Is this ever gonna stop ?
 
  --
  *Monfort Florian*
  BM2 Student at France Business School
  Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
  Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
  florian.monf...@gmail.com
  Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 
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 -- 
 *Monfort Florian*
 BM2 Student at France Business School
 Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
 Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
 florian.monf...@gmail.com
 Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 


-- 
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Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: ideas for campaigns

Hello Sophie,


Le dimanche 04 novembre 2012 à 20:41 +0100, Sophie Gautier a écrit :
 Hi all,
 Resent with the good address ;)
 On 04/11/2012 20:34, Sophie Gautier wrote:
  I would like to throw some ideas for the next donation campaign or the
  next com campaign, you can forget about it if you want, I'm not a
  specialist just an idea picker from the other projects ;)
  
  - have ready to use donation buttons/banners (translatable) for our
  supporters who want to put them on their site or articles.
  - same with a thank you button
  - have a common thread (I imagine something with our logo) that any of
  us can follow, imagine and relay on our social media
  - have some large objectives mentioned so people may bet for what they
  are giving
  - have a more aggressive campaign with 2 or 3 people in charge of
  repeating the message, thanking people, creating buzz around it for a
  fixed period (not to bother people ;)
  - mark a deadline because that push people to invest themselves more
  than if it's diluted in time.
  
  Kind regards
  Sophie


Thanks for passing this around. So essentially this is a call to design
web buttons and banners for our future and present(?) donation
campaigns. Interested people please upload your designs on our wiki in
the design section.

Thank you,


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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[libreoffice-marketing] 3.7-4.0

Hello,

Our next branch, the 3.7, will actually be our 4.0 (I know, it's
Monday).
More technical details are available here:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/LibreOffice4
and they're intensely technical as you can see. 

The new features are not fully defined, but we need to work on all the
specific details on the announcement. Anything such as:
- new features
- specific messaging -remember:
http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/ 
within our broader messaging is welcome. We need to convey who we are and what 
we do, in broad and specific terms, and in various ways to the public. 

In short, we need a shock team for product marketing; Italo will start
to work on the PR side of things later on. 

I'd like to break a few work items so that people can own them:
- new features : nice new webpage
- web presence: banners, buttons, etc.
- community presentation, facts, etc.
- coordination  communication with other teams: Design team,
localization / former Native-Lang teams, etc. 

I'm sure I'm forgetting several items here. Please apply here if you'd
like to start on any one of these items.

Best,
-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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[libreoffice-marketing] Re: 3.7-4.0

Sorry, I forgot this link as well:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/3.7

best,
Charles.

Le lundi 05 novembre 2012 à 12:03 +0100, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
 Hello,
 
 Our next branch, the 3.7, will actually be our 4.0 (I know, it's
 Monday).
 More technical details are available here:
 http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Development/LibreOffice4
 and they're intensely technical as you can see. 
 
 The new features are not fully defined, but we need to work on all the
 specific details on the announcement. Anything such as:
 - new features
 - specific messaging -remember:
 http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/ 
 within our broader messaging is welcome. We need to convey who we are and 
 what we do, in broad and specific terms, and in various ways to the public. 
 
 In short, we need a shock team for product marketing; Italo will start
 to work on the PR side of things later on. 
 
 I'd like to break a few work items so that people can own them:
 - new features : nice new webpage
 - web presence: banners, buttons, etc.
 - community presentation, facts, etc.
 - coordination  communication with other teams: Design team,
 localization / former Native-Lang teams, etc. 
 
 I'm sure I'm forgetting several items here. Please apply here if you'd
 like to start on any one of these items.
 
 Best,


-- 
Charles-H. Schulz
Co-Founder  Director, The Document Foundation,
Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint




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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Fwd: Re: LibreOffice Icon

2012-10-31 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Alistair,

Thank you for your email. I think your discussion would be better suited to
the design mailing list. If you have icons or specific artwork to
contribute, please feel free to submit them.

Thank you,

Charles.

2012/10/31 Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com

 I actually think the logo is pretty good.

 - The absence of vivid colors makes it easy to adapt to any platform design
 standard.
 - Simple shape makes it easy to recognize.

 What problem is it that you identify with the current logo ?

 Cheers


 On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 3:56 PM, Kingswells Computercraft 
 supp...@kingswellscomputercraft.co.uk wrote:

  Dear LibreOffice teams,
 
  My apologies if you have already got my message (below) - I tried sending
  it a few days ago, but only seem to have succeeded in subscribing to
  mailing lists!
 
  From my message below, you can see I believe it is essential that the
  LibreOffice main icon be replaced by one that aids in the recognition and
  identity of LibreOffice, which I believe the current one icon fails to
 do.
  From some of the messages I've seen since subscribing (especially
  marketing), it now seems to me that it is crucial that the icon is
 replaced.
  I would suggest that the following are essential requirements of the main
  icon for LibreOffice:
 
a) colourful and eye-catching, i.e. an attractive wrapper.
b) equals (or at least hints at) the sophistication of the program.
c) something that aids with  brand recognition.
 
  I'm sure it is (and will continue to be) an uphill struggle to achieve
 the
  recognition that Apache OpenOffice has automatically inherited from its
  predecessor.  Without an icon that helps to achieve this, I could see a
 day
  when LibreOffice disappears into obscurity, and that would be a great
 pity.
   It wouldn't be the first time a great product has failed, not because it
  was unworthy, but it didn't have the recognition (and therefore the
  following) necessary to carry it forward.
 
  Best regards,
   Alistair Bain
  Kingswells Computercraft
  Aberdeen, Scotland
 
 
   Original Message 
  Subject:Re: LibreOffice Icon
  Date:   Tue, 23 Oct 2012 13:50:31 +0200
  From:   Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org**
  Organisation:   The Document Foundation
  To: Kingswells Computercraft support@**
 kingswellscomputercraft.co.uksupp...@kingswellscomputercraft.co.uk
  
  CC: i...@documentfoundation.org
 
  Hello,
 
  thank you very much for your feedback and interest in LibreOffice! The
  topic you raise fits very well for our design team, and I strongly
  propose you get in touch with them directly.
 
  All information as well as the official mailing list is available at
  http://www.libreoffice.org/**get-involved/ux-visual-**designers/
 http://www.libreoffice.org/get-involved/ux-visual-designers/
 
  Thanks again,
  Florian
 
  Kingswells Computercraft wrote on 2012-10-11 10:41:
 
  Dear Document Foundation,
 
  First, thank you so much for LibreOffice!  I have been a user since
  OpenOffice.org version 1.1.2, and I have recommended it to many friends
  and customers over the years.  I recognise LibreOffice to be the
  legitimate successor to the earlier OpenOffice.org, and believe it to be
  a better suite than the Oracle/Apache's version (I used both until
  recently).
 
  I am writing to you today to plead with you to change the main program
  icon currently in use for LibreOffice as I believe it is seriously
  underwhelming!  As an icon for the Document Foundation it says it all to
  me - clear, simple, document.  However, considering it as the flag or
  packaging for LibreOffice, it is far too bland:
 
• It is not easy to pick out among hordes of other icons
• It lacks colour and warmth, is not striking or eye-catching
• It says nothing about the elegance and sophistication of LibreOffice
• It doesn't inspire confidence.
 
  In my experience I often introduce LibreOffice as an alternative to
  Microsoft Office to people who have never heard of it before.  To these
  new users, the desktop icon is the shop window for the application,
  and it is frankly uninspiring!  I have considered replacing the desktop
  icon with another (third party) icon, but I am aware that this breaches
  your guidelines about branding  icon usage, so I don't want to do that.
 
  Please, please change the icon for something that does the application
  justice.
 
 
  Best Regards,
   Alistair Bain
  Kingswells Computercraft
  Aberdeen, Scotland
 
 
  --
  Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board (Vorstandsvorsitzender)
  Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
  The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
  Gemeinnützige rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
  Legal details: http://www.documentfoundation.**org/imprint
 http://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Awkward article.

2012-10-31 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Thanks Jay. And please everyone, don't be impressed or annoyed by this
blog. We have more serious and productive stuff to do.

best,
Charles.

2012/10/31 Jay Lozier jsloz...@gmail.com

On 10/31/2012 11:13 AM, Marc Paré wrote:

Le 2012-10-31 09:44, Italo Vignoli a écrit :

Il 31/10/2012 14:19, Florian Monfort ha scritto:

http://www.robweir.com/blog/**2012/10/libreoffices-dubious-**
claims-part-i-downloads.html?**utm_source=feedburnerutm_**
medium=feedutm_campaign=Feed%**3A+robweir%2Fantic-atom+%**
28Rob+Weir%3A+An+Antic+**Disposition%29http://www.robweir.com/blog/2012/10/libreoffices-dubious-claims-part-i-downloads.html?utm_source=feedburnerutm_medium=feedutm_campaign=Feed%3A+robweir%2Fantic-atom+%28Rob+Weir%3A+An+Antic+Disposition%29

Of course not. Rob Weir is our main enemy, and has always been such (you
can dig a little bit inside his blog). He represents IBM mood, and this
is just a proof that TDF and LibreOffice are more successful than Apache
OO.

Well, disregarding the author's name, the article contends that the
metrics behind TDF/LibreOffice is not verifiable. So, the question is, can
anyone collect LibreOffice data on their own and at any moment? I don't
think we are at the point where we can say yes to this. But, we should
definitely be working hard on this so that we can all have clarity on the
number of downloads and user numbers. Being able to verify numbers by all,
and, at any time (whether for our own use or for our competition to see)
serves us well in determining the health of our community.

The problem is that numbers have a variety of statistical problems built
in no matter the openness of the source. Multiple downloads, multi-boot
systems, having both installed and using one primarily, source bias (distro
shipping with LO not AOO for example). The problem is well beyond my very
limited statistical literacy and judging from Rob Weir's comments my
statistical competence is far greater than his.

Rob's problem is that he confuses downloads with usage and implies that
anyone who download statistics he can not supposedly verify is lying. He
never answers the implicit question of why the TDF would lie about LO
downloads or even want to lie about the statistics. My statistical
background is from a manufacturing background but I see several lurking
problems in anyone's statistics.

Anyone who runs a small website will get various statistics from their
host and they statistics can not be verified by someone like Rob. Is the
host or website owner a liar when they report the statistics? Almost,
always no because they have no reason to lie about their traffic. The TDF
is in the same situation, the traffic is what the traffic is and the
downloads are what they are. I would more interested in the trends of the
both than the absolute numbers because that would be an indication of
growth and future project health.

The author also uses the race horse analogy, people would bet on the
fastest horse rather than the slow one (paraphrased). While this may be
true, a new up-and-coming horse may get more support than a fast horse that
is obviously in decline.

IMO, we should not respond to his article and just let it die a slow
death, we should not give him the soap box that he is looking for. Anyone
with common sense can read the writing on the wall. Let's keep on our track
and not worry about such articles. It still doesn't stop us from reading
them and taking out what may be of value to us.

Agreed, read them, discuss what we can learn from them and move on. In
this case I would say the real problem is accurately determining actual
usage from various raw download statistics for any FOSS project not just
LO. A download does not mean regular user.

Cheers,

Marc

--
Jay Lozier
jsloz...@gmail.com

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Workshop proceedings

2012-10-29 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

We did mention it, yes. And I plan on restarting those asap.

Best,

Charles.
Le 29 oct. 2012 10:03, Florian Effenberger flo...@documentfoundation.org
a écrit :

Hi Charles,

Charles-H. Schulz wrote on 2012-10-21 15:59:

We had a very productive and fruitful marketing strategy workshop in
Berlin. We didn't take minutes per se, and there was a live stream of
the session. I expect the stream itself will be available again soon,
alongside the streams from the other sessions. I have written however
the various ideas that were discussed here:
http://standardsandfreedom.**net/index.php/2012/10/21/**
marketing-workshop-2012/http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/

thanks a lot for sharing! Did you also discuss the option of having a
marketing confcall as kick-off? That's something I had been asked for quite
often, and something I'd like to start soon. :)

Florian

--
Florian Effenberger, Chairman of the Board (Vorstandsvorsitzender)
Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108
The Document Foundation, Zimmerstr. 69, 10117 Berlin, Germany
Gemeinnützige rechtsfähige Stiftung des bürgerlichen Rechts
Legal details:
http://www.documentfoundation.**org/imprinthttp://www.documentfoundation.org/imprint

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Otto Kekäläinens talk -- proposing to kill the features section on the webpage, have adopters section instead

2012-10-26 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Bjoern,

I agree in part with you,  but the need to have these features listed
somewhere not too buried has been identified. That, however does not mean
we should not rethink our website and presentation on community, the
project, etc. I am just trying to break down work items in a way that
volunteers can do something about it.

Best,

Charles.
Le 26 oct. 2012 00:31, Bjoern Michaelsen bjoern.michael...@canonical.com
a écrit :

 On Thu, Oct 25, 2012 at 08:36:52AM +0200, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
  Let have both. Features list is usually requested strongly by local
 groups.

 Yes, but is that the question that we should ask ourselves when putting
 something on the webpage? Or rather: What helps us grow users and esp.
 contributors? I dont think ancient and boring features in a flowing text
 help
 at all. If anything something like:

  http://www.videolan.org/vlc/features.html

 is what is the maximum we should subject the reader too. Everything that
 keeps
 people from:

 - the download button
 - the donation button
 - the contribution howto

 for just one second is losing us users and contributors given todays short
 attention spans.

 Best,

 Bjoern


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Otto Kekäläinens talk -- proposing to kill the features section on the webpage, have adopters section instead

2012-10-25 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Let have both. Features list is usually requested strongly by local groups.

Best,

Charles.
Le 25 oct. 2012 02:04, Bjoern Michaelsen bjoern.michael...@canonical.com
a écrit :

 Hi,

 walking through the slides at (I didnt see the talk):

  http://fsfe.org/news/2012/news-20121022-01.en.html

 I have to agree: The adoptors need to be right on the frontpage. Lets
 instead
 kill the section:

  https://www.libreoffice.org/features/

 (excepting the new in 3.X sections). Those pages tout al lot of features
 that
 every major productivity suite (including us) had for more than 10 years.
 Thats
 not a selling point.

 Any violet objection, or shall I file WWW-Bugs for that?

 Best,

 Bjoern

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] AOO - Cloud ?

We already did, we have a working pre alpha version running, etc.
Notice however that their vision is tied to IBM technologies and entirely
brought forth by IBM.

Best,
Charles.
Le 24 oct. 2012 10:10, Florian Monfort florian.monf...@gmail.com a
écrit :

 Hi all,

 Should we answer to that ?


 http://www.zdnet.com/cloud-apache-openoffice-plans-to-be-discussed-next-month-706221/

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] AOO - Cloud ?

Florian,

We have communicated several times on this already; the press knows
about and has seen the demo, then the POC... right now anything more is
pure vaporware. Remember that TDF only announces and talks about code
that exists and runs (not necessarily on a stable stage though) It's
been our simple, yet unwavering policy on software .

I'm not suggesting others do the opposite (it's not what matters) but
the article on ZDNet talks about someone talking abot what could be done
by IBM (who already has an online office suite, just check IBM docs on
Lotus Greenhouse) as an integration between AOO and whatever web 2.0
technology coming from IBM. Last but not least, it does not mean that
what they are going to / might /may release at an unspecified date in
the future is a bad idea . Not at all. It is just too early for us to
comment or even analyse at this stage.

Best,
Charles.

Le mercredi 24 octobre 2012 à 10:24 +0200, Florian Monfort a écrit :
 Don't need to make some direct comparison.
 
 Just make them talk about us, to try to indirectly make AOO look much
 smaller.
 
 On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 10:22 AM, Italo Vignoli 
 italo.vign...@gmail.comwrote:
 
  I would prefer to avoid any direct comparison, especially now that they
  have graduated and can speculate on their future plans.
 
 
  On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 10:10 AM, Florian Monfort 
  florian.monf...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
  Should we answer to that ?
 
 
  http://www.zdnet.com/cloud-apache-openoffice-plans-to-be-discussed-next-month-706221/
 
 
  --
  Italo Vignoli
  phone +39.348.5653829 - voip: +39.02.320621813
  skype: italovignoli - italo.vign...@gmail.com
 
 
 
 
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 Marketing Apprentice at Red Hat
 Marketing Team Member at The Document Foundation
 florian.monf...@gmail.com
 Mobile : +33 6 58 97 15 61
 




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[libreoffice-marketing] Helping create a picture gallery of the conference

Hi,

We need a few volunteers to create a nice picture gallery of the
conference, based on the pictures uploaded by the Berlin conference
participants... (we're also waiting for the pictures). Any volunteer?
Please just report on any of the marketing or website  list.

Thanks,

Charles.


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[libreoffice-marketing] creating a team for the LibreOffice features page

Hello,

One of the points that was discussed during the marketing workshop is
that we need a dedicated (understand: stable, identifiable) team to
maintain and update our feature page for each major release (each time
the second digit changes 3.x, 3.y, and of course, 3.x to 4.0)

The feature page is first elaborated on the wiki on the release notes
page: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/3.6

and then gets a nice touch of paint for the website itself (again,
taking the example of the 3.6):
http://www.libreoffice.org/download/3-6-new-features-and-fixes/

Last but not least, the team should from time to time update this very
interesting and instructive chart:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Feature_Comparison:_LibreOffice_-_Microsoft_Office

Volunteers please add your name here:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Work_Items#Product_Marketing

Thanks,

Charles.


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] creating a team for the LibreOffice features page

Le mercredi 24 octobre 2012 à 14:13 +0200, Italo Vignoli a écrit :
 Il 24/10/2012 13:42, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto:
 
  Volunteers please add your name here:
  http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Work_Items#Product_Marketing
 
 Hi Charles, independently from the product marketing area, we should
 update the entire Marketing work Items page and make it more attractive
 for newcomers.
 
 There are many work items whch have been sitting there for ages without
 anyone picking them, so I think it is just useless to have them listed
 if there is not interest from volunteers.
 
 I will try to edit the page during next week. I will try to change the
 name to Marketing Easy Hacks, and if this is not possible I will create
 a Marketing Easy Hacks page which we can then announce to try to find
 additional volunteers.
 

Yes certainly, I already started to tweak content and presentation here
and there.

Best,
Charles.



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] creating a team for the LibreOffice features page

Le mercredi 24 octobre 2012 à 14:56 +0200, Italo Vignoli a écrit :
 Il 24/10/2012 14:47, Charles-H. Schulz ha scritto:
 
  Yes certainly, I already started to tweak content and presentation here
  and there.
 
 It looks like changing the title to Easy Hacks is quite easy, leaving a
 redirection for all the pages which link to the old title. I will then
 rename the page ASAP, and start reworking the Easy Hacks.
 
 We can then announce the re-launch of the marketing effort, asking for
 people willing to help. We must start from very easy tasks, adding a few
 lines of how to to each task.


Yup; but what I think this entails is to pretty much slash half of the
page (the marketing work items page), add some easy tasks that are not
there and rework some of the existing tasks. I can do that with you.

Best,
Charles.




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[libreoffice-marketing] Marketing Workshop proceedings

2012-10-21 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello,

We had a very productive and fruitful marketing strategy workshop in
Berlin. We didn't take minutes per se, and there was a live stream of
the session. I expect the stream itself will be available again soon,
alongside the streams from the other sessions. I have written however
the various ideas that were discussed here:
http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2012/10/21/marketing-workshop-2012/

This means that we have a lot of work to do. Comments (here and on the
blog) are welcome. In a few days we should start implementing them and
build a real marketing activity here.

Best regards,

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

2012-10-21 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Tim,

We are actually not going to do that (see my previous mail in a new
thread).
In fact we already did discuss this ten times in the past, and I really
would like to close this subject once and for all. 

Thank you,

Charles.

Le dimanche 21 octobre 2012 à 10:02 -0400, webmaster-Kracked_P_P a
écrit :
 I think this thread has gone way beyond what the original posting was about.
 
 Yes, there is a point about calling a version conservative since a few 
 people might see the name and think about their country's political 
 party with that name.  But the point is we are beyond using words like 
 more stable in describing one line over the other.  So it is time to 
 move on and stop using this thread name.
 
 Maybe someone can start a new thread about how to describe the two lines 
 for new users.  When 3.7.0 comes out in Feb 2013, we will have the same 
 questions being asked about which line a user should try first.  At 
 that point 3.6.5 will be out as well.
 
 SO
 end this thread and someone start a new one about what words, terms, 
 etc., are needed to help NEW users choose between the two lines.  Then 
 by  the time 3.7.0 comes out, we might have an agreement on how we can 
 better promote our two line development cycle and its packages.
 
 end-of-thread
 please.
 
 On 10/21/2012 08:43 AM, Tom Davies wrote:
  Hi :)
  Please give it a rest.
 
  I was just pointing out that 1 suggested name was the same name as a major 
  political party.  Accidentally calling things by names that have serious 
  implications in certain places is something that we might be able to avoid 
  unless we are not allowed to communicate with each other.
  Regards from
  Tom :)
 snip
 
 




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Marketing list on forums? Marketing team discussion.

2012-10-12 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Quick comment from my side: I will not be very active on forums as tou
can't work with them on phones and I use my phone a lot for email.

But I am open to experimentation. However we must form a real marketing
team with tasks and production. Then we'll think about forums or mailing
list.

Best,

Charles.
Le 12 oct. 2012 21:51, Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

At th risk of starting another heated discussion, we need to decide, and,
I think it important the marketing team think about this. By team, I
mean the regular members on this list who actually contribute to the work,
discussions and decision making, which is why you are on this list. For the
others who are on this list just to monitor, well, I only wish you could
join in and help out, we need you.

Do we want the LibreOffice Marketing section to move to the forums?

My proposal is that we test-try for a few months with leaving both mailing
list and forums (I would suggest 9 months to a year). If we find that we
gain more interest/contributors from the forums, then a move, IMO, would be
good. If not, we can all commit to transfer any information from the forums
back to the mailing list if we need to do this.

Who knows, we may decide to keep both, the forums as an entry point for
potential marketing contributors and the mailing lists to do the bulk of
the work, planning, discussion etc.

We are a LibreOffice section where, I would consider, in dire need of
more marketing contributors.

* Not only should we be leading the charge with marketing materials (in
joint partnership with the design team), but we also have other important
roles to fill such as:

* we should be helping with vetting all materials being put out by the
TDF/LibreOffice. We should be checking materials for EN grammar, syntax,
cohesion, both, before the materials are published (important!), and, after
publication (review and improvement of text). At present we are doing
very-little to not-at-all of this. We need people who are very adept with
the EN language for this.

* keeping up the wiki pages for the marketing materials that are developed
(this is already a big job unto itself -- we would need a couple of people
to take care of this)

* monitor the NL groups and help catalogue their marketing materials into
EN for potential global use. A good example are the DE and PT-BR
communities who publish materials that could be adapted for EN-global use.

* help all other sections of the wiki to make sure that the wiki is
representative of the TDF/LibreOffice brand and make sure that the brand is
protected on these pages.

* we need help to re-new our Marketing wiki pages (something that I have
promised to do, but there is always something else that bumps this)

* we should also make sure the TDF/LibreOffice websites are representative
of the brand/values of the project and help out with text on the site(s)

Although the project started quite strong with organizing the marketing
team, we have recently fallen quite short in filling in our
responsibilities. In large part, this is the result of LibreOffice's
stratospheric rise bringing with it demands unto the very few of us who are
at work on the project (bearing different responsibilities) and having too
few to help out. Although our numbers in dev contributors have kept pace,
so far, our team contributors have seem very little increase in months and
are in need of attention.

So, should we try a forums for the marketing section?

Cheers,

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Marketing list on forums? Marketing team discussion.

2012-10-12 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

One more thing : I expect that after Berlin we will change the focus of
this marketing list  to a more task based mailing list. Right now the list
is not productive and has no focus, and we need to change that. In this
context I would very wellsee the forum working as a catchall suggestions
and ideas for Libreoffice and marketing. What do you think?

Best,

Charles.
Le 13 oct. 2012 00:24, Cor Nouws oo...@nouenoff.nl a écrit :

 Marc Paré wrote (12-10-12 21:50)

  My proposal is that we test-try for a few months with leaving both
 mailing list and forums (I would suggest 9 months to a year).


 +1
 - thanks for working on this!



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Fwd: Some notes about donate page

2012-10-07 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Marc,

The BoD (mostly Thorsten) kind of does that but still this year the
forecast is limited as there's the notion that we still are working on a
limited, minimalistic budget.

This being said this needs to change and I agree with you that we ought to
have prepared this fundraising in a better way. Part of the problem is,
members of the BoD and much of the rest of people here are swamped...

Best,
Charles.
Le 7 oct. 2012 16:27, Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com a écrit :

Hi Florian,

Le 2012-10-07 07:39, Florian Effenberger a écrit :

Hello,

sharing this with the website and marketing list, he has a point here,
and we're already working to gradually improve the page - the donation
meter is a first start :)

Florian

Original Message
Subject: Some notes about donate page
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2012 06:08:59 +0330
To: webmaster@documentfoundation.**org webmas...@documentfoundation.org

Hi,

I should mention that right now, the total amount of money you target
for fundrasing is not obvious. I think there should be a target to make
people get serious about helping to achieve it. Also, clicking on the
status indicator, does nothing and takes you back to the page you are
in. A reasonable target budget, and a donation log or status page will
be great.

Btw, when a user goes to donate page, there is no way to get back to the
original LibreOffice home using the links available on the page.

Thanks for sharing.

I think that Charles' proposal for now seems to make the most sense. I
don't believe that the members of the marketing team have enough
information as to the needs of the project as a whole to give an objective
comment on the bottom line and itemize list of wants for the upcoming
year -- it would be better to come from the BoD who have a better finger
on the pulse of the project.

We should put a target amount soon as IMO, we should always start off with
a projected amount before setting up a donation campaign, People want to
know what they are donating towards, and it make them feel like they
belong. The are in fact part of the list of our contributors, its just that
their contribution, rather than being of physical help, is $$$-related.

I was wondering, does the BoD do any budgetary forecasting? That is, does
the BoD, at some time of the year, take a step back and forecast their
needs for the upcoming year? Is this planned for the conference. If so,
next time, the donation campaign could then be started after the LibOCon.

Cheers,

Marc

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

2012-10-05 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Tom,

Hoping this will be the last time we discuss this on the marketing list,
and so that we can move on to actual marketing topics and work

Le vendredi 05 octobre 2012 à 09:26 +0100, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)
 I'm sorry but that only seems to confirm what i have been saying :(  
 Obviously i am wrong but where is my mistake?  
 
 When you say 
 1.  In each LibreOffice series, over the various minor releases, hundreds of 
 bugs are fixed. it suggests, to me, that 'hundreds' of bugs are found at the 
 beginning of a series.  Would that be around the 3.x.0, 3.x.1, 3.x.2 and 
 3.x.3?  The various minor releases are that 3rd figure? 

Yes.

  So as that 3rd figure increases the number of fixed bugs increases?  So as 
 we get to the .4s, .5s and onwards there are usually less bugs that cause 
 problems?  
 

Yes.

 2.  Bugs that have been introduced by making new features.  When do new 
 features get added?  In my stupidity i have assumed that new features are 
 mostly added at the beginning of the series, in the 3.x.0 release, maybe some 
 in the 3.x.1 

that's correct (most of the time).

 if they were not quite ready in time or some last minute hiccup meant they 
 couldn't be active in the .0.  However i could be completely wrong.  Are a 
 roughly equal amount of new features added at each minor release?

no (see above).

   or is the .0 chosen as the best time to incorporate a load of new features?

Keep in mind that the releases happen on a fixed schedule, and by fixed
I mean scheduled ahead of time. Take a look here:
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan
and http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Release_Criteria


 
 3.  The rest of the paragraph seems to be things that both branches have in 
 common.  Bugs that have been introduced by improvements in code, performance.
 Bugs that have become visible because other bugs were fixed. Bugs from
 external reasons, bugs from ..
 - What is a simple annoyance for the
 one user, someone knowing ways to work around it in ample seconds, can
 be a serious bug for someone with less computer skills..  Possibly a bit 
 more at the start of a series and at the start (the .0s, .1s) perhaps also 
 affecting reasonably skilled users that perhaps aren't LO devs.  But 
 basically that paragraph-fragment seems to cover all minor-point releases 
 including the first.  
 
 4.  allows people  ... that can handle bugs (...)
 more easily, to use the newer versions and benefit from the
 improvements and new features that it offers.  Are these newer versions the 
 start of the series?  (the .0s, .1s, .2s?)  Or is that referring to every 
 minor-point release?
 
 5.  so that at a certain time it will be ready for more conservative, more 
 careful, users and organisations..  Does this mean that more conservative 
 users should not use LO at all until the series has settled down or do they 
 just have to suffer through the problems of the early minor-point releases in 
 the series or might they be better staying with the older branch's more 
 recent minor-point releases such as the .4s, .5s, .6s?  
 
 See?  I think this point 5 is where i am going wrong.  I have been thinking 
 that it's better for conservative, more careful, users to stick with the 
 older branches latest releases.  Obviously (to you and Charles) i am wrong 
 and there is no need for the older branch.  Or is there?


No. The older branch is there for a reason (that you actually already
outlined yourself) , but the concern, and the *wrong* message to spread
here is that somehow the new branch is dangerous and should not be used.
The new branch is usable, professional and by no means experimental.
Also, the way it improves is by testing and by having a large userbase.
So what's important to understand here is that the older branch is in a
sense for enterprise users who wants less innovation and needs higher
stability, but we need a broad user base of the new branch for better
adoption, more bug detection, etc. The new branch is, again, by no means
experimental. Before we release anything, there are alphas, betas,
developer builds, release candidates, etc. 

What is thus important for us *here in marketing* is to make sure we
advertise the new branch and stop explaining there are problems with it.
There are distinct benefits for each branch, that's true, but we must
push the new branch and its features (we in marketing), and have a
coherent message on the older branch (more conservative users is a
good start for a concept).


   
 
 
 Just to make it clear to anyone new that i DO NOT often find any problems 
 with LO.  It knocks the socks off MS Office.  There does tend to be quite a 
 spike around the release of the new series until it reaches around 3.x.4.  
 However, i overhear more grumbles about MS Office from MS-fanboys in my 
 little town than i hear from LO's international, global, world-spanning users 
 support list in the course of an average day.  
 
 Also bear in mind that you can't make

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

2012-10-05 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Hello Marc,

Le vendredi 05 octobre 2012 à 06:41 -0400, Marc Paré a écrit :
 Hi Charles,
 
 Le 2012-10-05 06:32, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Tom,
 
  Hoping this will be the last time we discuss this on the marketing list,
  and so that we can move on to actual marketing topics and work
 
 
 To be fair to Tom, this is also a recurring topic from others. So, when 
 I have time, if we can all agree to this, I will put together a wiki 
 page for reference. We can then point to the appropriate wiki page for 
 reference.
 
 How does this sound?

It does sound good, just make sure you digest the two links on the
release plan and release criteria I pointed out..

Thank you,

Charles.
 
 This does not mean that I am suggesting that we not discuss it anymore, 
 just that we all get the facts down on paper so that we can have a more 
 productive discussion on this topic should it come up again.
 
 Cheers,
 
 Marc
 
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 m...@marcpare.com
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 parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
 parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org
 
 




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

2012-10-05 Thread Charles-H. Schulz

Tom,

Somehow you are now asking *very important and fundamental questions*
but still manage to ruin stuff with implying that PRs don't tell the
truth. See my comments inline..

Le vendredi 05 octobre 2012 à 13:14 +0100, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)
 I think it is important to clarify what the product is.  Then sell it for 
 what it is.  As opposed to what we currently do, which is to 
 1.  Find the Unique Selling Points of the product
 and then 
 2.  Try to sell it by making claims that more true of the other branch and 
 not really true of the product being sold.  Oh, and ignore anything found out 
 during 1.  

To me what you describe comes at the very end of a process so to speak.
I think that we first need to understand that who we (the project) are
and how we make it is the cornerstone upon which we can communicate.
LibreOffice is not just another piece of software, and it's not just a
clever alternative that (for the sake of the argument) enables anyone
not to buy MS Office. If we push for a product vs. product marketing we
will always be the cheapo-lamo stuff, not highlighting product benefits
and ultimately being painted just  like that. We have a soul,
LibreOffice has a soul, and LibreOffice has a community (community =
soul here) When we set ourselves in this fashion we can work on specific
communications strategy, but we can also roll out specific marketing
tools and items that we miss even today. I guess that what I'm trying to
say is that it's not enough to have a few people dedicated at
presenting the new features of each release and then claim, well, that's
good value because it does not cost anything. We need that team, but we
need a team that's able to market the project to the community (and vice
 versa). 

Hope this helps,

Charles.


 
 I would really love to never bring this subject up ever again but it depends 
 largely on the accuracy of public announcements.  If they were true and fair 
 then i wouldn't have to say anything.  
 Regards from
 Tom :)  
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  From: Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org 
 Sent: Friday, 5 October 2012, 11:41
 Subject: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] 
 The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2
  
 Hi Charles,
 
 Le 2012-10-05 06:32, Charles-H. Schulz a écrit :
  Tom,
  
  Hoping this will be the last time we discuss this on the marketing list,
  and so that we can move on to actual marketing topics and work
  
 
 To be fair to Tom, this is also a recurring topic from others. So, when I 
 have time, if we can all agree to this, I will put together a wiki page for 
 reference. We can then point to the appropriate wiki page for reference.
 
 How does this sound?
 
 This does not mean that I am suggesting that we not discuss it anymore, just 
 that we all get the facts down on paper so that we can have a more 
 productive discussion on this topic should it come up again.
 
 Cheers,
 
 Marc
 
 -- Marc Paré
 m...@marcpare.com
 http://www.parEntreprise.com
 parEntreprise.com Supports OpenDocument Formats (ODF)
 parEntreprise.com Supports http://www.LibreOffice.org
 
 
 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to marketing+h...@global.libreoffice.org
 Problems? 
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 Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette
 List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/
 All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be 
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All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

Tom,

The points you are making are repeated at each release. I cannot really
help if you refuse to understand how we work or how software development
works. But as we are on the marketing list we need to work on marketing and
not lose our time with recurring rants that are not related to marketing.

We must discipline ourselves if we are on this list and post on it: we work
on marketing and stay focused on it.

Thank you for your understanding.

Charles.

Charles.
Le 4 oct. 2012 14:01, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk a écrit :

Hi :)
Again. The only advantage listed for the new release in the newest branch
of LO is that it's more stable. What is it more stable than? Is it more
stable than the 3.5.6?

Putting anything mentioning bug-fixes and possible regressions just makes
people wonder what new bugs and new regressions are likely to appear in
this new release. Most profitable software companies avoid mentioning the
possibility that their new software might be buggy and have new regressions
despite the fact we know that both are likely. I think we should avoid
mentioning it too until they become more open and honest about the
possibility.

Possibly marginally better to say latest rather than last unless you
include a date. Last sounds fairly finally and hints that it happened a
long time ago. I don't know why. Both really mean roughly the same thing
if you look them up in a dictionary.

Again there are tons of advantages to the newest branch but stability is
not one of them. If people want stability then they are better off chosing
the latest release in the older branch. If they want, for example, better
compatibility with other formats and programs (ie such as MS's) then
3.6.x is probably best.

Please. Can we have those circular or just plain wrong arguments again
about
1. I haven't noticed any bugs so far and few people have reported
bugs. Therefore no bugs really exist because things don't exist until
after they have been discovered. For example, the water on Mars didn't
exist until there were photos of it.

2. Any bugs found need to be reported against the earliest version of
LO/OOo they can be found in.

3. Rinse and repeat.

1. It must be more stable. It's newer. Therefore it must be more
stable.

2. We must expect new branches to have more bugs as a result of having
much greater functionality
3. Older branches focus on bug-fixes and therefore tend to have less new
added functionality

4. Therefore the only thing we can say about new branches is that they
are more stable.

1. All software has bugs. [Perhaps implying that LO is no more stable
than java]

Regards from
Tom :)

- Forwarded Message -
From: Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@documentfoundation.org
To: annou...@documentfoundation.org
Sent: Thursday, 4 October 2012, 12:05
Subject: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice
3.6.2

Berlin, October 4, 2012 - The Document Foundation (TDF) announces
LibreOffice 3.6.2, for Windows, MacOS and Linux, solving bugs and
regressions and further improving the stability of the program for
corporate deployments. The best free office suite ever is quickly
becoming the de facto standard for migrations to free office suites,
thanks to the quickly growing feature set and the improved
interoperability with proprietary software.

The growing number of LibreOffice adoptions by private and public
enterprises is a demonstration of the improvements brought to the legacy
code by TDF, thanks to over 500 developers who are focusing on stability
and quality (in addition to new exciting features).

The last public administration to migrate has been the city of Limerick,
Ireland's third largest city, where LibreOffice is now used on all 450
desktops in use at the city's six main locations including the three
public libraries, the fire department, the municipal museum and the City
Gallery of Art.

The community behind LibreOffice will gather in Berlin for the second
LiboCon from October 17 to October 19. During three days, company
representatives and volunteers will discuss their experiences, learning
from each other in the true spirit of the community.

Registration for the conference end on October 8, Registration for the
conference ends on October the 8th. If you want to join in, please
register at this address: http://conference.libreoffice.org/registration.

LibreOffice 3.6.2 is available for immediate download from the following
link: http://www.libreoffice.org/download/. Extensions for LibreOffice
are available from the following link:
http://extensions.libreoffice.org/extension-center.

Change logs are available at

http://download.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/src/bugfixes-libreoffice-3-6-1-release-3.6.2.1.log
(fixed in 3.6.2.1) and

http://download.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/src/bugfixes-libreoffice-3-6-1-release-3.6.2.2.log
(fixed in 3.6.2.2).

Short

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

Public announcements are obviously marketing. Someone repeatedly
complaining that software comes with bugs on the marketing list is not
related to marketing.

Charles.
Le 4 oct. 2012 14:48, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk a écrit :

 Hi :)
 Ahh, sorry.  I didn't realise that public announcements and press releases
 have nothing to do with marketing.
 Apols and regards from
 Tom :)





 
  From: Charles-H. Schulz charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org
 To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 Sent: Thursday, 4 October 2012, 13:30
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw:
 [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2
 
 Tom,
 
 The points you are making are repeated at each release. I cannot really
 help if you refuse to understand how we work or how software development
 works. But as we are on the marketing list we need to work on marketing
 and
 not lose our time with recurring rants that are not related to marketing.
 
 We must discipline ourselves if we are on this list and post on it: we
 work
 on marketing and stay focused on it.
 
 Thank you for your understanding.
 
 Charles.
 
 Charles.
 Le 4 oct. 2012 14:01, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk a écrit :
 
  Hi :)
  Again.  The only advantage listed for the new release in the newest
 branch
  of LO is that it's more stable.  What is it more stable than?  Is it
 more
  stable than the 3.5.6?
 
  Putting anything mentioning bug-fixes and possible regressions just
 makes
  people wonder what new bugs and new regressions are likely to appear in
  this new release.  Most profitable software companies avoid mentioning
 the
  possibility that their new software might be buggy and have new
 regressions
  despite the fact we know that both are likely.  I think we should avoid
  mentioning it too until they become more open and honest about the
  possibility.
 
 
  Possibly marginally better to say latest rather than last unless you
  include a date.  Last sounds fairly finally and hints that it
 happened a
  long time ago.  I don't know why.  Both really mean roughly the same
 thing
  if you look them up in a dictionary.
 
 
  Again there are tons of advantages to the newest branch but stability is
  not one of them.  If people want stability then they are better off
 chosing
  the latest release in the older branch.  If they want, for example,
 better
  compatibility with other formats and programs (ie such as MS's) then
  3.6.x is probably best.
 
 
  Please.  Can we have those circular or just plain wrong arguments again
  about
  1.  I haven't noticed any bugs so far and few people have reported
  bugs.  Therefore no bugs really exist because things don't exist until
  after they have been discovered.  For example, the water on Mars didn't
  exist until there were photos of it.
 
  2.  Any bugs found need to be reported against the earliest version of
  LO/OOo they can be found in.
 
  3.  Rinse and repeat.
 
 
 
  1.  It must be more stable.  It's newer.  Therefore it must be more
  stable.
 
  2.  We must expect new branches  to have more bugs as a result of
 having
  much greater functionality
  3.  Older branches focus on bug-fixes and therefore tend to have less
 new
  added functionality
 
  4.  Therefore the only thing we can say about new branches is that they
  are more stable.
 
 
  1.  All software has bugs.  [Perhaps implying that LO is no more
 stable
  than java]
 
  Regards from
  Tom :)
 
 
 
 
 
  - Forwarded Message -
  From: Italo Vignoli italo.vign...@documentfoundation.org
  To: annou...@documentfoundation.org
  Sent: Thursday, 4 October 2012, 12:05
  Subject: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice
  3.6.2
  
  Berlin, October 4, 2012 - The Document Foundation (TDF) announces
  LibreOffice 3.6.2, for Windows, MacOS and Linux, solving bugs and
  regressions and further improving the stability of the program for
  corporate deployments. The best free office suite ever is quickly
  becoming the de facto standard for migrations to free office suites,
  thanks to the quickly growing feature set and the improved
  interoperability with proprietary software.
  
  The growing number of LibreOffice adoptions by private and public
  enterprises is a demonstration of the improvements brought to the
 legacy
  code by TDF, thanks to over 500 developers who are focusing on
 stability
  and quality (in addition to new exciting features).
  
  The last public administration to migrate has been the city of
 Limerick,
  Ireland's third largest city, where LibreOffice is now used on all 450
  desktops in use at the city's six main locations including the three
  public libraries, the fire department, the municipal museum and the
 City
  Gallery of Art.
  
  The community behind LibreOffice will gather in Berlin for the second
  LiboCon from October 17 to October 19. During three days, company
  representatives

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2

I read your message three times actually. And I do maintain what I
wrote.

Thanks,

Charles.

Le jeudi 04 octobre 2012 à 14:20 +0100, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)
 Hmm, try reading my post rather than ignoring it and pretending it
 says soemthing other than what it really says.
 Regards from
 Tom :)  
 
 
 
 
 __
 From: Charles-H. Schulz
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org
 To: Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk 
 Cc: marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 marketing@global.libreoffice.org 
 Sent: Thursday, 4 October 2012, 13:54
 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw:
 [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice
 3.6.2
 
 
 Public announcements are obviously marketing. Someone
 repeatedly
 complaining that software comes with bugs on the marketing
 list is not
 related to marketing.
 
 Charles.
 Le 4 oct. 2012 14:48, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk a
 écrit :
 
  Hi :)
  Ahh, sorry.  I didn't realise that public announcements and
 press releases
  have nothing to do with marketing.
  Apols and regards from
  Tom :)
 
 
 
 
 
  
   From: Charles-H. Schulz
 charles.sch...@documentfoundation.org
  To: marketing@global.libreoffice.org
 marketing@global.libreoffice.org
  Sent: Thursday, 4 October 2012, 13:30
  Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously??
 Fw:
  [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice
 3.6.2
  
  Tom,
  
  The points you are making are repeated at each release. I
 cannot really
  help if you refuse to understand how we work or how
 software development
  works. But as we are on the marketing list we need to work
 on marketing
  and
  not lose our time with recurring rants that are not related
 to marketing.
  
  We must discipline ourselves if we are on this list and
 post on it: we
  work
  on marketing and stay focused on it.
  
  Thank you for your understanding.
  
  Charles.
  
  Charles.
  Le 4 oct. 2012 14:01, Tom Davies
 tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk a écrit :
  
   Hi :)
   Again.  The only advantage listed for the new release in
 the newest
  branch
   of LO is that it's more stable.  What is it more stable
 than?  Is it
  more
   stable than the 3.5.6?
  
   Putting anything mentioning bug-fixes and possible
 regressions just
  makes
   people wonder what new bugs and new regressions are
 likely to appear in
   this new release.  Most profitable software companies
 avoid mentioning
  the
   possibility that their new software might be buggy and
 have new
  regressions
   despite the fact we know that both are likely.  I think
 we should avoid
   mentioning it too until they become more open and honest
 about the
   possibility.
  
  
   Possibly marginally better to say latest rather than
 last unless you
   include a date.  Last sounds fairly finally and hints
 that it
  happened a
   long time ago.  I don't know why.  Both really mean
 roughly the same
  thing
   if you look them up in a dictionary.
  
  
   Again there are tons of advantages to the newest branch
 but stability is
   not one of them.  If people want stability then they are
 better off
  chosing
   the latest release in the older branch.  If they want,
 for example,
  better
   compatibility with other formats and programs (ie such
 as MS's) then
   3.6.x is probably best.
  
  
   Please.  Can we have those circular or just plain wrong
 arguments again
   about
   1.  I haven't noticed any bugs so far and few people
 have reported
   bugs.  Therefore no bugs really exist because things
 don't exist until
   after they have been discovered.  For example, the water
 on Mars didn't
   exist until there were photos of it.
  
   2.  Any bugs found need to be reported against the
 earliest version of
   LO/OOo they can be found in.
  
   3.  Rinse and repeat

Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Stable? Seriously?? Fw: [tdf-announce] The Document Foundation announces LibreOffice 3.6.2