RE: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Original Message- From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On Behalf Of Bryan O'Neal Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 1:30 PM To: Main PLUG discussion list Subject: OT: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group As stated in a recent thread there seems to be a substantial lack of decent windows admin groups. Particularly ones with the culture we enjoy here. The solution - start one. I know a dozen or so people here who are forced to admin windows boxes and would like a collective support group like what we have for plug. The next questions is do we have 1) Support - I am not founding another insta-dead group. The world has too many already 2) Name - How does MAUG sound - Microsoft Admin Users Group. The Maug are a group of islands in southeast asia near Japan. If I get more then 10 responses I will have the mailing list and a elchepo web page up tonight. After which I will start garnering support from the windows community so we can get a few hundred active members into the fold as quickly as possible Let me know --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
How about WAG for win admin group? I cringe every time I see the name microslop --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
RE: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
I don't know if I have anything to offer, however I open do have Win questions. I have both Win and Linux in my home office. The combo serves me well. Please no flames. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Jared Shapiro ja...@infinitysol.com wrote: From: Jared Shapiro ja...@infinitysol.com Subject: RE: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 8:20 AM Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Original Message- From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On Behalf Of Bryan O'Neal Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 1:30 PM To: Main PLUG discussion list Subject: OT: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group As stated in a recent thread there seems to be a substantial lack of decent windows admin groups. Particularly ones with the culture we enjoy here. The solution - start one. I know a dozen or so people here who are forced to admin windows boxes and would like a collective support group like what we have for plug. The next questions is do we have 1) Support - I am not founding another insta-dead group. The world has too many already 2) Name - How does MAUG sound - Microsoft Admin Users Group. The Maug are a group of islands in southeast asia near Japan. If I get more then 10 responses I will have the mailing list and a elchepo web page up tonight. After which I will start garnering support from the windows community so we can get a few hundred active members into the fold as quickly as possible Let me know --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
The combo servers many of us well. For a lot of us we are in a windows dominate work place and are doing our best to intergrate linux. This is why I wanted to start a windows group for people like us. If I get about 5 more people I will start the group and we can start a windows admin recruitment with us plugers as a cultural base. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I don't know if I have anything to offer, however I open do have Win questions. I have both Win and Linux in my home office. The combo serves me well. Please no flames. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Jared Shapiro ja...@infinitysol.com* wrote: From: Jared Shapiro ja...@infinitysol.com Subject: RE: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 8:20 AM Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Original Message- From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us[mailto: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On Behalf Of Bryan O'Neal Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 1:30 PM To: Main PLUG discussion list Subject: OT: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group As stated in a recent thread there seems to be a substantial lack of decent windows admin groups. Particularly ones with the culture we enjoy here. The solution - start one. I know a dozen or so people here who are forced to admin windows boxes and would like a collective support group like what we have for plug. The next questions is do we have 1) Support - I am not founding another insta-dead group. The world has too many already 2) Name - How does MAUG sound - Microsoft Admin Users Group. The Maug are a group of islands in southeast asia near Japan. If I get more then 10 responses I will have the mailing list and a elchepo web page up tonight. After which I will start garnering support from the windows community so we can get a few hundred active members into the fold as quickly as possible Let me know --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.com wrote: And this is why boycotts are stupid... if you take it to the logical conclusion no one can buy anything. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Nadim Hoque nadimho...@gmail.com wrote: The thing is that Apple is based in california and that's where the design their products. Then again if we were to boycott all of california products wouldn't we have to ban our networking infrastructure because we the hardware is mostly based in california? Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Kurt Granroth kurt+plug-disc...@granroth.comkurt%2bplug-disc...@granroth.com Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 13:23:48 To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? On 5/16/10 12:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. What does any of this have to do with Apple? --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Exactly. That's why I'm boycotting all GM products. GM is in the same state as Ford and Ford assembles quite a few of their cars in Mexico. Mexico, as we all know, objects to the new AZ immigration law. On 05/17/2010 12:55 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.com mailto:sphar...@gmail.com wrote: And this is why boycotts are stupid... if you take it to the logical conclusion no one can buy anything. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Nadim Hoque nadimho...@gmail.com mailto:nadimho...@gmail.com wrote: The thing is that Apple is based in california and that's where the design their products. Then again if we were to boycott all of california products wouldn't we have to ban our networking infrastructure because we the hardware is mostly based in california? Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Kurt Granroth kurt+plug-disc...@granroth.com mailto:kurt%2bplug-disc...@granroth.com Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 13:23:48 To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? On 5/16/10 12:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. What does any of this have to do with Apple? --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 12:55 PM Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.com wrote: And this is why boycotts are stupid... if you take it to the logical conclusion no one can buy anything. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Nadim Hoque nadimho...@gmail.com wrote: The thing is that Apple is based in california and that's where the design their products. Then again if we were to boycott all of california products wouldn't we have to ban our networking infrastructure because we the hardware is mostly based in california? Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Kurt Granroth kurt+plug-disc...@granroth.com Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 13:23:48 To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? On 5/16/10 12:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. What does any of this have to do with Apple? -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
well outsourcing is viable if the dollar has overwhelming purchasing power in the target country. This could change sooner rather than later. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 1:35 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com* wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 12:55 PM Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:46 PM, Steve Phariss sphar...@gmail.comhttp://mc/compose?to=sphar...@gmail.com wrote: And this is why boycotts are stupid... if you take it to the logical conclusion no one can buy anything. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Nadim Hoque nadimho...@gmail.comhttp://mc/compose?to=nadimho...@gmail.com wrote: The thing is that Apple is based in california and that's where the design their products. Then again if we were to boycott all of california products wouldn't we have to ban our networking infrastructure because we the hardware is mostly based in california? Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Kurt Granroth kurt+plug-disc...@granroth.comhttp://mc/compose?to=kurt%2bplug-disc...@granroth.com Date: Sun, 16 May 2010 13:23:48 To: plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? On 5/16/10 12:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. What does any of this have to do with Apple? -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Joshua Zeidner wrote: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Does anyone else find this ludicrous? -- -Eric 'shubes' --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I do. So far i find it petty and silly, because so much of their core is Dependant on AZ resources and companies. and responding in knid would be the same.. My apple boycott has nothing to do with LA/Cali being silly and petty and everything to do with the fact that apple keeps doing things that make my skin crawl On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: Joshua Zeidner wrote: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Does anyone else find this ludicrous? -- -Eric 'shubes' --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button. Stephen --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:01 PM, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back This is how they want it to be viewed, as if outsourcing is inevitable and natural progression. It's anything but that. These trade agreements and the price differentials that make it possible are very much structured by our policy (including military). We give a lot of direct foreign aid to India- why, if they are simultaneously outbidding us in the new international job market? Tell me, as foreign countries assume just about every white collar job imaginable, what are we going to be doing exactly? I think there is the tendency to buy the story from the main stream media. It might seem comfortable to accept the dominant story for the short term, but it suggests many more long term problems. Big problems. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
Sign me up I have to work with Linux at one job and Windows at the other both would serve me great so let's do this. Brian On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Stephen cryptwo...@gmail.com wrote: Honestly OS's are tools you use the one that best suits your needs. I love linux for allot fo things and it gets better every day, but there are some things i deal with that require windows. Ill join the windows group On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 12:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.comwrote: I don't know if I have anything to offer, however I open do have Win questions. I have both Win and Linux in my home office. The combo serves me well. Please no flames. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Jared Shapiro ja...@infinitysol.com* wrote: -- A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button. Stephen --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- Brian Fields arizona.r...@gmail.com --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:18 PM, Stephen cryptwo...@gmail.com wrote: I do. So far i find it petty and silly, because so much of their core is Dependant on AZ resources and companies. and responding in knid would be the same.. My apple boycott has nothing to do with LA/Cali being silly and petty and everything to do with the fact that apple keeps doing things that make my skin crawl Well I think its part of the greater program. California is desperate to prove the viability of their technology sector, and the recent shenanigans with Apple were perhaps their last ditch effort to prove to the world that California has some kind of advantage in technology production. It seems scary things are in store for California. Regarding LA/Cali, they are very much damaging AZ with their recent attempts to smear the entire state. I expect more of this kind of garbage for their leadership there, who refuse to represent the middle class and offer excuse after excuse. In general both Apple and Microsoft will continue to get pricier and more legally cumbersome, making Linux more and more attractive. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/05/17/san-diego-faces-medicine-arizona-residents-cancel-travel-following-boycott/ -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: Joshua Zeidner wrote: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Does anyone else find this ludicrous? -- -Eric 'shubes' -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: registry cleaner
I used the c-cleaner on my wife's computer. Her computer was almost not usable. I was going to put more RAM in it. Now it is fine. What a great tool! Keith Smith --- On Sun, 5/16/10, Bryan O'Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: From: Bryan O'Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com Subject: Re: registry cleaner To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Sunday, May 16, 2010, 10:43 AM Unlike some people on this list I too understand how you could associate so little with windows as to not have a support structure for it. Thus, this being your only geek forum, would ask a windows question here ;) Especially since there are a number of windows admins on the list. I recommend C Cleaner (As one of the few free, decent. ones out there) - You can see the Red Seven guys do a youtube vid on it here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLRjpsrOIyQ Good luck :) And if you have any more windows question feal free to ask me off list. Or I will just toss out there - Can any one recommend a good windows admin list? - preferably an enterprise level one. On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 1:17 AM, Michael Havens bmi...@gmail.com wrote: I got a big bad virus infestation and had to reinstall my xp system. BUMMER! Well, I need a registry cleaner and can't remember which one I had before. Could you all suggest one? -- :-)~MIKE~(-: --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 15:27, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:01 PM, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back This is how they want it to be viewed, as if outsourcing is inevitable and natural progression. It's anything but that. These trade agreements and the price differentials that make it possible are very much structured by our policy (including military). We give a lot of direct foreign aid to India- why, if they are simultaneously outbidding us in the new international job market? Tell me, as foreign countries assume just about every white collar job imaginable, what are we going to be doing exactly? I think there is the tendency to buy the story from the main stream media. It might seem comfortable to accept the dominant story for the short term, but it suggests many more long term problems. Big problems. -jmz Theres an old saying.. you get what you pay for when you go with the lowest bidder. I've never seen a case where outsourcing saved company money in the long term. What they save in labor costs they pay for in communication issues and missed deadlines. I've witnessed a huge job slide during my life time. We've lost meat packing, textile, hospitality, construction, plumbing, electrical, agriculture jobs, and a lot more lower level jobs when our government allowed illegal immigrants to stay here unchecked which pushed unskilled Americans out of those jobs. We've lost manufacturing jobs when companies move out of the country. We've lost high tech jobs when they've been outsourced to companies in other countries. We've host high tech jobs by in inflow of H1B's that live here (that companies say they can't survive without) while our white collar unemployment rate climbs. Add on top the most expensive education in the world and you're right.. Big Problems. Eventually many generations from now big business will run out of people to exploit and we can be on a level playing field... or robots will be doing those jobs. To answer your question... haven't you seen Wallee?? We're all going to end up having robots do every conceivable job and lay around like gelatin blobs all day until we're unable to even walk :) Regarding Boycotting.. Any state, company, or other entity that boycotts Arizona businesses for whatever reason will not receive my business. That includes weekend trips to San Diego, Mexico, etc. JD --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I agree with most of what you say below, but I think here lies the wishful thinking. This thing is not sustainable even for a few years more. California is *about to default on its debt*... if you think this is the time to sit back and admire your 401k statement, think again. But you're absolutely right, our economy has been gutted. Time to stop making excuses and claiming its 'inevitable'. Eventually the new 'marketing class' will even be out of work. No more bubbles to move to, no more inflated asset classes. What do you think we will all be doing in the future? America has to produce something other than green pieces of paper. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:48 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: Theres an old saying.. you get what you pay for when you go with the lowest bidder. I've never seen a case where outsourcing saved company money in the long term. What they save in labor costs they pay for in communication issues and missed deadlines. I've witnessed a huge job slide during my life time. We've lost meat packing, textile, hospitality, construction, plumbing, electrical, agriculture jobs, and a lot more lower level jobs when our government allowed illegal immigrants to stay here unchecked which pushed unskilled Americans out of those jobs. We've lost manufacturing jobs when companies move out of the country. We've lost high tech jobs when they've been outsourced to companies in other countries. We've host high tech jobs by in inflow of H1B's that live here (that companies say they can't survive without) while our white collar unemployment rate climbs. Add on top the most expensive education in the world and you're right.. Big Problems. Eventually many generations from now big business will run out of people to exploit and we can be on a level playing field... or robots will be doing those jobs. To answer your question... haven't you seen Wallee?? We're all going to end up having robots do every conceivable job and lay around like gelatin blobs all day until we're unable to even walk :) Regarding Boycotting.. Any state, company, or other entity that boycotts Arizona businesses for whatever reason will not receive my business. That includes weekend trips to San Diego, Mexico, etc. JD --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com* wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:58 PM In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
you might see some kind of short term deflation, but any substantial deflation would break us. Any time you have debt, then deflation makes that debt harder to pay. Not only would it be tragic for Americans on a personal level, but on a state and federal level it would be equally disastrous. eg. What would happen if everyone's salary were halved next week? Massive default on mortgages, housing inventory increases, values go down, etc. I would think that deflation might be beneficial, I just don't think its an option (either financially or politically). Most likely they will just print their way out of this, and destroy the dollar in the process. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com* wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:58 PM In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.comhttp://mc/compose?to=klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.comhttp://mc/compose?to=herr...@owlriver.com * wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.comhttp://mc/compose?to=herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? herrold, earlier: This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back Deflation relative to what? Gold? The CHF? The JPY? The EUR? Why should a loss in purchasing power of a unit amount of one currency affect non-lockstep linked currencies at all? Bretton Woods ended those days Prediction of the path financial markets will take appear to be a multi factor, non-linear problem, with path dependencies. Anyone saying they _know_ otherwise should be encouraged to play against you in a markets simulation where you run a true random strategy. If they can consistently articulate a durable strategy that produces above market gains, follow it What if AZ were the first mover in a economic game where it restricted non-documented guest workers and TX and FL followed suit, but NM and CA did not. Where will budget and employment crises continue longer? Opinons are cheap; horse races are held regularly to settle differences of opinion as to which of a collection of horses can run the fastest. One problem with the study of economics, and behavioural economics, is that there is no 'experimental lab'; and 'repeatable starting conditions' repetition of history, to settle arguments like this. -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
We are definitely in a pickle. Maybe it is not as pure as just this simple one item however if my tax burden was reduced by 25% then I would be able to live on 25% less. Isn't that a deflation? The national debt is a real problem. We need to get control of our country and where it is going! Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:13 PM you might see some kind of short term deflation, but any substantial deflation would break us. Any time you have debt, then deflation makes that debt harder to pay. Not only would it be tragic for Americans on a personal level, but on a state and federal level it would be equally disastrous. eg. What would happen if everyone's salary were halved next week? Massive default on mortgages, housing inventory increases, values go down, etc. I would think that deflation might be beneficial, I just don't think its an option (either financially or politically). Most likely they will just print their way out of this, and destroy the dollar in the process. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:58 PM In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
So what would you do if you were in charge? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:16 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? herrold, earlier: This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back Deflation relative to what? Gold? The CHF? The JPY? The EUR? Why should a loss in purchasing power of a unit amount of one currency affect non-lockstep linked currencies at all? Bretton Woods ended those days Prediction of the path financial markets will take appear to be a multi factor, non-linear problem, with path dependencies. Anyone saying they _know_ otherwise should be encouraged to play against you in a markets simulation where you run a true random strategy. If they can consistently articulate a durable strategy that produces above market gains, follow it What if AZ were the first mover in a economic game where it restricted non-documented guest workers and TX and FL followed suit, but NM and CA did not. Where will budget and employment crises continue longer? Opinons are cheap; horse races are held regularly to settle differences of opinion as to which of a collection of horses can run the fastest. One problem with the study of economics, and behavioural economics, is that there is no 'experimental lab'; and 'repeatable starting conditions' repetition of history, to settle arguments like this. -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. If one reduces taxes (I assume here, you mean the net effective Federla ones), the federal deficit goes up faster, and the feds need to borrow more to fund its payment obligations. This sucks funds away from the private sector, who then need to 'outbid' the feds for business borrowing. Bidding up rates to but (here, rent the use of money) the use right of same asset sounds like price increases with no change in the underlying. That is asset price inflation I dont ses the causal link you are suggesting exists to cause a deflation. -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:16 PM, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? herrold, earlier: This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back Deflation relative to what? Gold? The CHF? The JPY? The EUR? Why should a loss in purchasing power of a unit amount of one currency affect non-lockstep linked currencies at all? Bretton Woods ended those days Prediction of the path financial markets will take appear to be a multi factor, non-linear problem, with path dependencies. Anyone saying they _know_ otherwise should be encouraged to play against you in a markets simulation where you run a true random strategy. If they can consistently articulate a durable strategy that produces above market gains, follow it What if AZ were the first mover in a economic game where it restricted non-documented guest workers and TX and FL followed suit, but NM and CA did not. Where will budget and employment crises continue longer? I think thats why they made the media $h!tstorm. It poses a huge threat to them, because the fact is, removing illegals is going to be highly beneficial to our local economy. It's much better to be employing tax paying American citizens. Add to that the related problems of crime, drugs, etc. its a clear win for Arizona. They don't want a domino effect happening. It's utterly ridiculous to be paying out so much in unemployment while also paying social service subsidies to non-Americans who work the jobs the unemployed would have. Gov. Arnold's solution to the problem: cut all welfare. If I were a non-billionaire legal Californian, I would be utterly furious. California is quickly degrading, hopefully if we keep doing what we've been doing for the past month or so, we'll be ok. Actually, we'll be a very desirable place to live (this means your house is worth more). -jmz Opinons are cheap; horse races are held regularly to settle differences of opinion as to which of a collection of horses can run the fastest. One problem with the study of economics, and behavioural economics, is that there is no 'experimental lab'; and 'repeatable starting conditions' repetition of history, to settle arguments like this. -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Thats not really deflation... you have to consider purchasing power overseas, etc. which is a function of money supply, interest rates, and other factors. That's just reducing size of government, which I'm in favor of. Real deflation is simply not possible. I think we bought a one way ticket to financial disaster I'm sad to say. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:18 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: We are definitely in a pickle. Maybe it is not as pure as just this simple one item however if my tax burden was reduced by 25% then I would be able to live on 25% less. Isn't that a deflation? The national debt is a real problem. We need to get control of our country and where it is going! Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com* wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:13 PM you might see some kind of short term deflation, but any substantial deflation would break us. Any time you have debt, then deflation makes that debt harder to pay. Not only would it be tragic for Americans on a personal level, but on a state and federal level it would be equally disastrous. eg. What would happen if everyone's salary were halved next week? Massive default on mortgages, housing inventory increases, values go down, etc. I would think that deflation might be beneficial, I just don't think its an option (either financially or politically). Most likely they will just print their way out of this, and destroy the dollar in the process. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.comhttp://mc/compose?to=klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.comhttp://mc/compose?to=jjzeid...@gmail.com * wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.comhttp://mc/compose?to=jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:58 PM In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.comhttp://mc/compose?to=klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.comhttp://mc/compose?to=herr...@owlriver.com * wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.comhttp://mc/compose?to=herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.ushttp://mc/compose?to=plug-disc...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: So what would you do if you were in charge? Negative agenda don't resonate with voters, so these need to be 'dressed up' as positives, but I wont sugar coat it here Not suggest that protectionism (here, a boycott) is anything but a distorion of a market based economy Remove 'too big to fail' guarantees, explicit and implicit, from the economic system, and move to a market based economy Not lend money on no security into Western Europe and allow the Greece socialist experiment reform itself without my intervention Not 'juice the stock market' to make people reading their 401k statements feel 'happy' at the expense of eating the heart out of the country's future Not have liability caps on offshore drilling operations Call 'bullsh*t' when people who have not read, or are not intellectionally honest about SB 1270 call it racist or anti-immigrant Vote out and work effectively to remove from influnce people in and out of public office who hide behind lies I am not a libertarian by any stretch of the imagination, but much they have long proposed simply makes sense standing alone -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
BTW, everyone there is going to be a big rally on June 5th ( also another on the 12th) at the AZ Capitol. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ http://www.phoenixrally.com/ It is reported that there will be over 10,000 people there. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:34 PM, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: So what would you do if you were in charge? Negative agenda don't resonate with voters, so these need to be 'dressed up' as positives, but I wont sugar coat it here Not suggest that protectionism (here, a boycott) is anything but a distorion of a market based economy Remove 'too big to fail' guarantees, explicit and implicit, from the economic system, and move to a market based economy Not lend money on no security into Western Europe and allow the Greece socialist experiment reform itself without my intervention Not 'juice the stock market' to make people reading their 401k statements feel 'happy' at the expense of eating the heart out of the country's future Not have liability caps on offshore drilling operations Call 'bullsh*t' when people who have not read, or are not intellectionally honest about SB 1270 call it racist or anti-immigrant Vote out and work effectively to remove from influnce people in and out of public office who hide behind lies I am not a libertarian by any stretch of the imagination, but much they have long proposed simply makes sense standing alone -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I was not taking into consideration our national debt. If we did not have that and we could shrink government by 50% then we could live on 25% less. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:23 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. If one reduces taxes (I assume here, you mean the net effective Federla ones), the federal deficit goes up faster, and the feds need to borrow more to fund its payment obligations. This sucks funds away from the private sector, who then need to 'outbid' the feds for business borrowing. Bidding up rates to but (here, rent the use of money) the use right of same asset sounds like price increases with no change in the underlying. That is asset price inflation I dont ses the causal link you are suggesting exists to cause a deflation. -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I'm thinking it is. If I need $30 an hour to live and I am now, through reduced taxes, able to make it on $22.50 an hour isn't that deflation? I know that is a far cry from the $5/hr Indian programmer, however all things considered maybe that is all it takes. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:27 PM Thats not really deflation... you have to consider purchasing power overseas, etc. which is a function of money supply, interest rates, and other factors. That's just reducing size of government, which I'm in favor of. Real deflation is simply not possible. I think we bought a one way ticket to financial disaster I'm sad to say. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:18 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: We are definitely in a pickle. Maybe it is not as pure as just this simple one item however if my tax burden was reduced by 25% then I would be able to live on 25% less. Isn't that a deflation? The national debt is a real problem. We need to get control of our country and where it is going! Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:13 PM you might see some kind of short term deflation, but any substantial deflation would break us. Any time you have debt, then deflation makes that debt harder to pay. Not only would it be tragic for Americans on a personal level, but on a state and federal level it would be equally disastrous. eg. What would happen if everyone's salary were halved next week? Massive default on mortgages, housing inventory increases, values go down, etc. I would think that deflation might be beneficial, I just don't think its an option (either financially or politically). Most likely they will just print their way out of this, and destroy the dollar in the process. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 4:06 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I think if taxes were reduced by 25% or even 50% we would see deflation. We need to deflate. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:58 PM In a deflation scenario, the dollar would buy a lot of code, but it would also bankrupt just about anyone with a mortgage or any other kind of debt. Remember deflated dollars are harder to come by. -jmz - On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 3:44 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: Maybe. What if we were to go into deflation? Wouldn't that help? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 3:01 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: I sure hope outsourcing becomes null and void. What do you base this on? earlier, Joshua Zeidner: Clearly they are doing it for symbolic purposes... which is why we should do it right back to them. Apple products are overpriced and overpromoted anyway. They are a California based company but they certainly do most of their work overseas. The way things are currently going the outsourcing equation will change, and possibly become invalid. This looks like wishful thinking. The outsourcing/offshoring genie is out of the bottle, and nothing is going to put it back -- Russ herrold --- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 16:24 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: I think thats why they made the media $h!tstorm. It poses a huge threat to them, because the fact is, removing illegals is going to be highly beneficial to our local economy. It's much better to be employing tax paying American citizens. Add to that the related problems of crime, drugs, etc. its a clear win for Arizona. They don't want a domino effect happening. It's utterly ridiculous to be paying out so much in unemployment while also paying social service subsidies to non-Americans who work the jobs the unemployed would have. Gov. Arnold's solution to the problem: cut all welfare. If I were a non-billionaire legal Californian, I would be utterly furious. California is quickly degrading, hopefully if we keep doing what we've been doing for the past month or so, we'll be ok. Actually, we'll be a very desirable place to live (this means your house is worth more). I guess I don't understand what any of this has to do with Linux and why it's being discussed except to provide a barometer of people's ability to analyze what has been happening and of course their political views. I would prefer that this entire thread just die. FTR - there's been a war on drugs for 40+ years and it hasn't stopped it. In fact, it's much worse today than ever. A huge number of these so called 'illegals' have left the country, there is no work. Check out all of the 'For Rent' apartments in traditionally Mexican areas - they can't give them away. The problem Arizona has is mostly a perceptual problem because of clowns like Sheriff Joe, Andy Thomas and others who use their power poorly and thus the rest of the country is over-reacting to Arizona's over reaction but the perceptual problem is that the police in Arizona will use this new law to justify profiling and anyone who understands things like DWB understands the problems with profiling. It's not just California and Arizona that are disintegrating - it's the entire country because big business has seized control and the money they can toss around to manipulate politicians, media, laws, etc. have made a complete mess of everything. The truth is that prosperity in America has always been built on the backs of cheap labor and chasing people back to Mexico will do little to bring prosperity to America. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Okay, I agree. I would add volumes of more granular rules. For starters I would remove the special retirement and health care for our congress. Move them to an HMO and 401k. Add a recall system and a requirement that they meet with the people multiple times a year and with the state legislature multiple times a year. Make congress accountable. Put into effect a balanced budget requirement for the federal government within 24 months. Beef up our military and give then hefty pay increases and pay extra pay associated with their specialty. A person in finance, who eats hot chow and spends most of his/her time in a nicer place, does not rate as much as the infantry, field artillery, tanks, and other in the field in the enemies face type of military occupation. I'd like to see some military occupations receive up to 50% of there base pay because of the job they have. On top of this I would reduce the pay rate of most government employees to the equal amount paid to non-government employees. I's also remove many laws on the books. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com wrote: From: R P Herrold herr...@owlriver.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 4:34 PM On Mon, 17 May 2010, keith smith wrote: So what would you do if you were in charge? Negative agenda don't resonate with voters, so these need to be 'dressed up' as positives, but I wont sugar coat it here Not suggest that protectionism (here, a boycott) is anything but a distorion of a market based economy Remove 'too big to fail' guarantees, explicit and implicit, from the economic system, and move to a market based economy Not lend money on no security into Western Europe and allow the Greece socialist experiment reform itself without my intervention Not 'juice the stock market' to make people reading their 401k statements feel 'happy' at the expense of eating the heart out of the country's future Not have liability caps on offshore drilling operations Call 'bullsh*t' when people who have not read, or are not intellectionally honest about SB 1270 call it racist or anti-immigrant Vote out and work effectively to remove from influnce people in and out of public office who hide behind lies I am not a libertarian by any stretch of the imagination, but much they have long proposed simply makes sense standing alone -- Russ herrold --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I would not say Sheriff Joe is a clown. He is dealing with an area that has been reported to the the kidnap capital of the world. Most of those being kidnapped are illegals. Some are tortured and murdered. Our Sheriff has a touch job. If more commanders of law departments were like him we might have a better handle on things. If you don't want anything to do with Joe then don't break the law. I don't see how he is taking advantage, he is doing what the people want. Now Phil Gordan is another story. I would agree with your assessment with big business buying the media and the politicians. Solution: make our politicians accountable. The Tucson City Council wanted to play hard ball with the citizens by cutting a large number of officers and fire fighters. They changed their mind after a recall petition was filed. We just have to be diligent and stay diligent. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: From: Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:04 PM On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 16:24 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: I think thats why they made the media $h!tstorm. It poses a huge threat to them, because the fact is, removing illegals is going to be highly beneficial to our local economy. It's much better to be employing tax paying American citizens. Add to that the related problems of crime, drugs, etc. its a clear win for Arizona. They don't want a domino effect happening. It's utterly ridiculous to be paying out so much in unemployment while also paying social service subsidies to non-Americans who work the jobs the unemployed would have. Gov. Arnold's solution to the problem: cut all welfare. If I were a non-billionaire legal Californian, I would be utterly furious. California is quickly degrading, hopefully if we keep doing what we've been doing for the past month or so, we'll be ok. Actually, we'll be a very desirable place to live (this means your house is worth more). I guess I don't understand what any of this has to do with Linux and why it's being discussed except to provide a barometer of people's ability to analyze what has been happening and of course their political views. I would prefer that this entire thread just die. FTR - there's been a war on drugs for 40+ years and it hasn't stopped it. In fact, it's much worse today than ever. A huge number of these so called 'illegals' have left the country, there is no work. Check out all of the 'For Rent' apartments in traditionally Mexican areas - they can't give them away. The problem Arizona has is mostly a perceptual problem because of clowns like Sheriff Joe, Andy Thomas and others who use their power poorly and thus the rest of the country is over-reacting to Arizona's over reaction but the perceptual problem is that the police in Arizona will use this new law to justify profiling and anyone who understands things like DWB understands the problems with profiling. It's not just California and Arizona that are disintegrating - it's the entire country because big business has seized control and the money they can toss around to manipulate politicians, media, laws, etc. have made a complete mess of everything. The truth is that prosperity in America has always been built on the backs of cheap labor and chasing people back to Mexico will do little to bring prosperity to America. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:26 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: I would not say Sheriff Joe is a clown. He is dealing with an area that has been reported to the the kidnap capital of the world. Most of those being kidnapped are illegals. Some are tortured and murdered. Our Sheriff has a touch job. If more commanders of law departments were like him we might have a better handle on things. If you don't want anything to do with Joe then don't break the law. I don't see how he is taking advantage, he is doing what the people want. Now Phil Gordan is another story. Gordan is done. He knows that. The issue is we have to make sure they don't put another idiot in his place. Don't know how many of you live in the city of Phoenix, but things are about to get interesting to say the least. There is a very good chance that we will get something other than a corporate shill this time. -jmz I would agree with your assessment with big business buying the media and the politicians.Solution: make our politicians accountable. The Tucson City Council wanted to play hard ball with the citizens by cutting a large number of officers and fire fighters. They changed their mind after a recall petition was filed. We just have to be diligent and stay diligent. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com* wrote: From: Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:04 PM On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 16:24 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: I think thats why they made the media $h!tstorm. It poses a huge threat to them, because the fact is, removing illegals is going to be highly beneficial to our local economy. It's much better to be employing tax paying American citizens. Add to that the related problems of crime, drugs, etc. its a clear win for Arizona. They don't want a domino effect happening. It's utterly ridiculous to be paying out so much in unemployment while also paying social service subsidies to non-Americans who work the jobs the unemployed would have. Gov. Arnold's solution to the problem: cut all welfare. If I were a non-billionaire legal Californian, I would be utterly furious. California is quickly degrading, hopefully if we keep doing what we've been doing for the past month or so, we'll be ok. Actually, we'll be a very desirable place to live (this means your house is worth more). I guess I don't understand what any of this has to do with Linux and why it's being discussed except to provide a barometer of people's ability to analyze what has been happening and of course their political views. I would prefer that this entire thread just die. FTR - there's been a war on drugs for 40+ years and it hasn't stopped it. In fact, it's much worse today than ever. A huge number of these so called 'illegals' have left the country, there is no work. Check out all of the 'For Rent' apartments in traditionally Mexican areas - they can't give them away. The problem Arizona has is mostly a perceptual problem because of clowns like Sheriff Joe, Andy Thomas and others who use their power poorly and thus the rest of the country is over-reacting to Arizona's over reaction but the perceptual problem is that the police in Arizona will use this new law to justify profiling and anyone who understands things like DWB understands the problems with profiling. It's not just California and Arizona that are disintegrating - it's the entire country because big business has seized control and the money they can toss around to manipulate politicians, media, laws, etc. have made a complete mess of everything. The truth is that prosperity in America has always been built on the backs of cheap labor and chasing people back to Mexico will do little to bring prosperity to America. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I would urge EVERYONE, even if you're in the outer realms of Arizona (probably means even more to you then) to come to this. I spoke to some organizers and they are busing in people from other states. The whole country is coming to this thing. When is the last time you've even seen your state capitol I was down there the other day when Al Sharpton payed us a visit, there were people waving a USSR flag. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:32 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. Sent from my BlackBerry Slowphone provided by Allfail -Original Message- From: j...@actionline.com Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 18:32:56 To: Main PLUG discussion listplug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: [OT] ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 00:40 +, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. it never did. It does however illustrate the perceptual problem that people living elsewhere have with Arizona. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
this is coming from someone who stated that he does not find the actions of this mob to be objectionable. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEmez3J4nIwfeature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEmez3J4nIwfeature=related -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:40 PM, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. Sent from my BlackBerry Slowphone provided by Allfail -Original Message- From: j...@actionline.com Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 18:32:56 To: Main PLUG discussion listplug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Yes sign the petition. However Washington is not listening. I have to drive 45 minutes to get to the capital and I will be at the rally. If you care be there! Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, j...@actionline.com j...@actionline.com wrote: From: j...@actionline.com j...@actionline.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:32 PM This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
And they reported there were 4000 people there. I was there and I think it was 500 - 1000 people in protest of HB1070 the night Al Sharpton came to Phoenix. If we truly get 10,000 people on the 5th that will be history. History is being made in your backyard. We are one of the most conservative states in the US and we have taken a stand. There will be 10 or more states by this time next year. Bring your camcorder and record history. Put your video onto YouTube.com. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:39 PM I would urge EVERYONE, even if you're in the outer realms of Arizona (probably means even more to you then) to come to this. I spoke to some organizers and they are busing in people from other states. The whole country is coming to this thing. When is the last time you've even seen your state capitol I was down there the other day when Al Sharpton payed us a visit, there were people waving a USSR flag. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:32 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- -Inline Attachment Follows- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: [OT] ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Give us more detail. In your opinion, what is the perceptual problem that others have and how does this thread illustrate that perceptual problem? Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: From: Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com Subject: Re: [OT] ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: huerta...@gmail.com, Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:49 PM On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 00:40 +, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. it never did. It does however illustrate the perceptual problem that people living elsewhere have with Arizona. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: [OT] ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
people living elsewhere don't have a perceptual problem with Arizona. Last time I checked over 65% of the country is in total support of us. You need to stop watching the idiot box. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:49 PM, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: On Tue, 2010-05-18 at 00:40 +, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. it never did. It does however illustrate the perceptual problem that people living elsewhere have with Arizona. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Spouting broken logic is something I can tolerate, but putting words in my mouth is something that I won't. As a libertarian, I don't like mob mentalities in general is something I am very much against, especially when it leads to violence. I said specifically that I was against laws that are detrimental to federalism and fundamental rights to privacy. Source: http://huertanix.tumblr.com/post/552777872/this-seriously-went-on-for-like-two-days Some of us have more important things to do than play internet superman, so if you want the PLUG mailing list to be your playground, then by all means, take it. Print this email out and stick it on your fridge with a gold star and glow proudly at what you've accomplished on a linux mailing list. The rest of the world has shit to do. Ubsubscried, .dh On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: this is coming from someone who stated that he does not find the actions of this mob to be objectionable. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEmez3J4nIwfeature=related -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:40 PM, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. Sent from my BlackBerry Slowphone provided by Allfail -Original Message- From: j...@actionline.com Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 18:32:56 To: Main PLUG discussion listplug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- [.dh] --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
and at least half of the people at the Sharpton rally were professional protesters and organizers who certainly were not from here. They told me that Arizona is really part of Mexico and I am standing on their land. I kid you not, they not only believe this, but they actually preach this philosophy. Regarding 10 more states, yes they will try to stop similar legislation and try to turn the entire country into California. Do you want your state to be broke and telling the federal government you will have riots if you don't get a loan? this stuff is serious business. If we have a bad situation here you can be sure that your property value will plummet. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:03 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: And they reported there were 4000 people there. I was there and I think it was 500 - 1000 people in protest of HB1070 the night Al Sharpton came to Phoenix. If we truly get 10,000 people on the 5th that will be history. History is being made in your backyard. We are one of the most conservative states in the US and we have taken a stand. There will be 10 or more states by this time next year. Bring your camcorder and record history. Put your video onto YouTube.com. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com* wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 5:39 PM I would urge EVERYONE, even if you're in the outer realms of Arizona (probably means even more to you then) to come to this. I spoke to some organizers and they are busing in people from other states. The whole country is coming to this thing. When is the last time you've even seen your state capitol I was down there the other day when Al Sharpton payed us a visit, there were people waving a USSR flag. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:32 PM, j...@actionline.comhttp://mc/compose?to=...@actionline.com wrote: This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
David, I met Andrea Garcia at the rally, she seemed very concerned about my privacy rights. She assured me that shes a conservative, but shes 'new to the political scene'. What a great time to start your conservative activism and working hard to protect the privacy of the people who are attacking police officers. Thanks for your patriotism, David. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:11 PM, David Huerta huerta...@gmail.com wrote: Spouting broken logic is something I can tolerate, but putting words in my mouth is something that I won't. As a libertarian, I don't like mob mentalities in general is something I am very much against, especially when it leads to violence. I said specifically that I was against laws that are detrimental to federalism and fundamental rights to privacy. Source: http://huertanix.tumblr.com/post/552777872/this-seriously-went-on-for-like-two-days Some of us have more important things to do than play internet superman, so if you want the PLUG mailing list to be your playground, then by all means, take it. Print this email out and stick it on your fridge with a gold star and glow proudly at what you've accomplished on a linux mailing list. The rest of the world has shit to do. Ubsubscried, .dh On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:54 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: this is coming from someone who stated that he does not find the actions of this mob to be objectionable. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEmez3J4nIwfeature=related -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 5:40 PM, huerta...@gmail.com wrote: It should be marked as OT. The thread doesn't really have anything to do with Linux anymore. Sent from my BlackBerry Slowphone provided by Allfail -Original Message- From: j...@actionline.com Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 18:32:56 To: Main PLUG discussion listplug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- [.dh] --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
The Tucson Unified School District is teaching La Raza classes and they teach this is AZLAN and this part of the US was stolen from Mexico. If you do not believe me Google both. I saw this type of festering mess in Cochise County in 1981 and 1982 when a group of radicals moved into Miracle Valley. The Sheriff did little and the problem escalated. The group detonated a bomb by accident while on the way to blow up a substation. By that time it was too late. The Sheriff could not get things under control and about 6 months later it ended with a shootout. The group then moved back to Chicago. This is exactly what is going on here. The government has led the illegal to believe they will be getting amnesty and that they have rights. We have gone as far as to tell them it is our fault they must work under the table or steal someone's ID to work. We tell them it our fault that we lure them with jobs and a non existent border. Now we have a problem. We have defiant people who are blaming us for their illegal activity. They are saying they would not have to break the law if we would just give them a social security number. They say We are here so why make them go home. The Mexican TV has been telling them the economy would crash if it were not for them. If we do not take care of this problem soon we will have a race war. Just wait until September 3. By the way Mexico prints pamphlets on how to get to the US and gives them to their people. Why? Because Mexico makes nothing of value. Mexico's economy is dependent on the money the illegal sent back to Mexico. The largest part of their economy comes from tourism and then the remittance sent by the illegal. In a nutshell we subsidize (we are their economy) Mexico by giving section 8 housing and food stamps to the illegals and then they send some of the money they make illegally back to Mexico. The Mexican president has the audacity to say Where there is a Mexican the is Mexico. The prior Mexican President threatened to sue a rancher in Douglas, AZ who had a ranch on the border and was rounding up Illegals that were trespassing on his land. That same rancher was sued by those illegals for violating their civil rights and the illegals won. So much for being American. The liberal courts sided with those destroying his land. Do I sound a little irritated? I am. I grew up on the border and have watched this problem for years. I watched the first amnesty and know first hand want a failure it is. I've been in the trenches and I have seen the truth. It is time to solve this problem by exporting all the illegals and their children back to Mexico. Now this might seem a little radical and maybe it is. I think we should withdraw our troops from Afghanistan and Iraq and put them on our Southern boarder and give Mexico 30 days to clean up their mess and begin creating an economy for those being repatriated. If they miss the 30 day deadline then we use force to flush out the drug cartels, try them, and take the appropriate action. Also we need to investigate the wealthy ruling class as well. Then take over the banking system and start building a government and industry that will be self deficient. And maybe we should put some pavement on some of those dirt roads. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 6:12 PM and at least half of the people at the Sharpton rally were professional protesters and organizers who certainly were not from here. They told me that Arizona is really part of Mexico and I am standing on their land. I kid you not, they not only believe this, but they actually preach this philosophy. Regarding 10 more states, yes they will try to stop similar legislation and try to turn the entire country into California. Do you want your state to be broke and telling the federal government you will have riots if you don't get a loan? this stuff is serious business. If we have a bad situation here you can be sure that your property value will plummet. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:03 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: And they reported there were 4000 people there. I was there and I think it was 500 - 1000 people in protest of HB1070 the night Al Sharpton came to Phoenix. If we truly get 10,000 people on the 5th that will be history. History is being made in your backyard. We are one of the most conservative states in the US and we have taken a stand. There will be 10 or more states by this time next year. Bring your camcorder and record history. Put your video onto YouTube.com. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: From: Joshua
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On May 17, 2010, at 5:32 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: This is the best topic (the content, not the subject line) that I have ever seen on PLUG ... even if it is Off Topic. http://www.phoenixrally.com/ is the best thing I've seen happen in the nine years I've lived in Arizona. I hope everyone on this list will forward this web address to everybody they know and urge everyone to sign this petition. http://www.numbersusa.com/petition?ID=15 Awesome! Ill be going... In protest :) David I find your lack of faith disturbing --Darth Vader --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:08 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? It means: I'm going to throw a hissy fit if anyone calls illegal aliens what they are. -jmz --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 19:12 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:08 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? It means: I'm going to throw a hissy fit if anyone calls illegal aliens what they are. it means that there are some who cannot exert self control and abuse this list to push their political views. I'm somewhat close to unsubscribing at this point. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
For what it is worth we value you on the list Craig, David, anyone else who is ready to leave. I have plans for a website and I'll send a link. I cannot say that I will not from time to time join in on the political bantering though. I think this thread might be dead. Keith Smith --- On Mon, 5/17/10, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: From: Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com Subject: Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts? To: Main PLUG discussion list plug-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us Date: Monday, May 17, 2010, 7:46 PM On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 19:12 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:08 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? It means: I'm going to throw a hissy fit if anyone calls illegal aliens what they are. it means that there are some who cannot exert self control and abuse this list to push their political views. I'm somewhat close to unsubscribing at this point. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I joined this list recently to see about participating more with PLUG. Is this really what a Linux-oriented mailing list is about? My mailbox as never been so full of crap. What's the usual ratio of rabid howling to actual technical discussion? On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:46 PM, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 19:12 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:08 PM, j...@actionline.com wrote: http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? It means: I'm going to throw a hissy fit if anyone calls illegal aliens what they are. it means that there are some who cannot exert self control and abuse this list to push their political views. I'm somewhat close to unsubscribing at this point. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 19:57, Russell Deneault russell.denea...@gmail.comwrote: I joined this list recently to see about participating more with PLUG. Is this really what a Linux-oriented mailing list is about? My mailbox as never been so full of crap. What's the usual ratio of rabid howling to actual technical discussion? You are correct ... the discussion has nothing really to do with Linux. I thought the discussion was interesting and this is an issue that effects everyone. I'm not offended by your opinion (you're entitled to it); even if I don't agree with everything people say It's trivial to press DELETE. Though if this did become a list that didn't allow people to speak freely I'd just unsubscribe (no threats first). JD --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Well... we did steal it from Mexico. In a style that is reminiscent of the Romans but is still distinctly American. In truth it is an awesome tail of we want it, we can make claim for it, we can take it, and we are so cool the rest of the world will demand you apologize to us for making us take it from you. We are some bad as* mot** f :) But that is just my humble opinion ;) As for the rest of your rant - I agree with nearly everything you say, but feel I need to state stuff any way 1) Strong boarder is good, but much like the war on drugs you can never have a tight enough boarder when their is massive economic incentive. Or just strong desire. Look at East Germany 2) This means we need a multi prong approach that opens up the boarder to documented and permitted immigrant workers. The joy of this is if you are not working you stay home. But since we allow so many of the workers in the flow of people trying to break in (or just smuggle goods) become much more manageable. It also means those people who are net drains on our services are (by broad demographic) not flooding in. We also get to cut way down on tax fraud from there employment 3) Do not give then rites! They are here on a work visa (rite now not even that) not US citizens!!! But then again I am not entirely in favor of automatically granting anyone citizen ship. Not even third generation American White Europeans. But again. that is just me. If I have offended everyone I know it is a good plan ;) On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 6:56 PM, keith smith klsmith2...@yahoo.com wrote: The Tucson Unified School District is teaching La Raza classes and they teach this is AZLAN and this part of the US was stolen from Mexico. If you do not believe me Google both. I saw this type of festering mess in Cochise County in 1981 and 1982 when a group of radicals moved into Miracle Valley. The Sheriff did little and the problem escalated. The group detonated a bomb by accident while on the way to blow up a substation. By that time it was too late. The Sheriff could not get things under control and about 6 months later it ended with a shootout. The group then moved back to Chicago. This is exactly what is going on here. The government has led the illegal to believe they will be getting amnesty and that they have rights. We have gone as far as to tell them it is our fault they must work under the table or steal someone's ID to work. We tell them it our fault that we lure them with jobs and a non existent border. Now we have a problem. We have defiant people who are blaming us for their illegal activity. They are saying they would not have to break the law if we would just give them a social security number. They say We are here so why make them go home. The Mexican TV has been telling them the economy would crash if it were not for them. If we do not take care of this problem soon we will have a race war. Just wait until September 3. By the way Mexico prints pamphlets on how to get to the US and gives them to their people. Why? Because Mexico makes nothing of value. Mexico's economy is dependent on the money the illegal sent back to Mexico. The largest part of their economy comes from tourism and then the remittance sent by the illegal. In a nutshell we subsidize (we are their economy) Mexico by giving section 8 housing and food stamps to the illegals and then they send some of the money they make illegally back to Mexico. The Mexican president has the audacity to say Where there is a Mexican the is Mexico. The prior Mexican President threatened to sue a rancher in Douglas, AZ who had a ranch on the border and was rounding up Illegals that were trespassing on his land. That same rancher was sued by those illegals for violating their civil rights and the illegals won. So much for being American. The liberal courts sided with those destroying his land. Do I sound a little irritated? I am. I grew up on the border and have watched this problem for years. I watched the first amnesty and know first hand want a failure it is. I've been in the trenches and I have seen the truth. It is time to solve this problem by exporting all the illegals and their children back to Mexico. Now this might seem a little radical and maybe it is. I think we should withdraw our troops from Afghanistan and Iraq and put them on our Southern boarder and give Mexico 30 days to clean up their mess and begin creating an economy for those being repatriated. If they miss the 30 day deadline then we use force to flush out the drug cartels, try them, and take the appropriate action. Also we need to investigate the wealthy ruling class as well. Then take over the banking system and start building a government and industry that will be self deficient. And maybe we should put some pavement on some of those dirt roads. Keith Smith --- On *Mon, 5/17/10, Joshua Zeidner
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
/| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ SUCCESSFUL TROLL IS SUCCESSFUL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 20:12, Bryan O'Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: Well... we did steal it from Mexico. In a style that is reminiscent of the Romans but is still distinctly American. In truth it is an awesome tail of we want it, we can make claim for it, we can take it, and we are so cool the rest of the world will demand you apologize to us for making us take it from you. We are some bad as* mot** f :) But that is just my humble opinion ;) That's like saying that I stole your car when I drove away with it after paying you $5k ;) Mexico was conquered by Spain which annexed what we call California and other areas. Later Mexico ceded California and New Mexico in the Mexican American war for the agreed upon price of $15M. Other parts of southern America were purchased in the Gadsden Purchase and Louisiana Purchase. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gadsden_Purchase http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_Purchase http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viceroyalty_of_New_Spain http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican-American_War Great map here: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/United_States_1803-04-1804-03.png JD --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
Sign me I'll join your new group. Mike On 05/17/2010 08:20 AM, Jared Shapiro wrote: Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Original Message- From: plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us [mailto:plug-discuss-boun...@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us] On Behalf Of Bryan O'Neal Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2010 1:30 PM To: Main PLUG discussion list Subject: OT: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group As stated in a recent thread there seems to be a substantial lack of decent windows admin groups. Particularly ones with the culture we enjoy here. The solution - start one. I know a dozen or so people here who are forced to admin windows boxes and would like a collective support group like what we have for plug. The next questions is do we have 1) Support - I am not founding another insta-dead group. The world has too many already 2) Name - How does MAUG sound - Microsoft Admin Users Group. The Maug are a group of islands in southeast asia near Japan. If I get more then 10 responses I will have the mailing list and a elchepo web page up tonight. After which I will start garnering support from the windows community so we can get a few hundred active members into the fold as quickly as possible Let me know --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On 05/17/2010 07:57 PM, Russell Deneault wrote: I joined this list recently to see about participating more with PLUG. Is this really what a Linux-oriented mailing list is about? My mailbox as never been so full of crap. What's the usual ratio of rabid howling to actual technical discussion? The list will be solidly technical for two or three weeks at a time. Then a hot political topic comes along that generates a huge amount of off topic traffic. On rare occasions threads refuse to die so list admins have had to kill them. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:46 PM, Craig White craigwh...@azapple.com mailto:craigwh...@azapple.com wrote: On Mon, 2010-05-17 at 19:12 -0700, Joshua Zeidner wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:08 PM, j...@actionline.com mailto:j...@actionline.com wrote: http://huertanix.tumblr.com wrote: Ubsubscried, What does Ubsubscried mean? It means: I'm going to throw a hissy fit if anyone calls illegal aliens what they are. it means that there are some who cannot exert self control and abuse this list to push their political views. I'm somewhat close to unsubscribing at this point. Craig -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us mailto:PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Did you not even read you cited references? It is more like if I called your mama fat beat you up and then drove off down the street in your car after tossing you a few bucks and a pick of your naked sister out the window onto your limp body and then when the cops showed up made you say thank you and apologize for wasting my time ;) Not that I am complaining. I think it was a bold move that paid off very, very, well. But denying the nature of the conflict is like saying the Civil War was fought over slavery. It is fine for your Jr. High text book but when grow, otherwise intelligent, people try spouting that stuff they are either American idiots or just don't care. To quote from the wikipidia page you cited. The Mexican–American War was an armed conflict between the United States and Mexico from 1846 to 1848 in the wake of the 1845 U.S. annexation of Texas, which Mexico considered part of its territory despite the 1836 Texas Revolution. In addition to a naval blockade of the Mexican coast, American forces invaded and conquered New Mexico, California and parts of northern Mexico. Another American army captured Mexico City, forcing Mexico to agree to the sale of its northern territories to the U.S. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:47 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 20:12, Bryan O'Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: Well... we did steal it from Mexico. In a style that is reminiscent of the Romans but is still distinctly American. In truth it is an awesome tail of we want it, we can make claim for it, we can take it, and we are so cool the rest of the world will demand you apologize to us for making us take it from you. We are some bad as* mot** f :) But that is just my humble opinion ;) That's like saying that I stole your car when I drove away with it after paying you $5k ;) Mexico was conquered by Spain which annexed what we call California and other areas. Later Mexico ceded California and New Mexico in the Mexican American war for the agreed upon price of $15M. Other parts of southern America were purchased in the Gadsden Purchase and Louisiana Purchase. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gadsden_Purchase http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisiana_Purchase http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viceroyalty_of_New_Spain http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican-American_War Great map here: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4f/United_States_1803-04-1804-03.png JD --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
To the rest, you're trying to tell me a few emails in your inbox is so absolutely painful you're going to throw a fit or something? no, you just don't like what is being said... but guess what- this issue is now front and center and as far as I'm concerned there is no controversy here if you are an concerned Arizonan. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
David, Will you condemn and denounce the political groups La Raza and MEChA right now? -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:42 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Why? Serious inquiry. From my brief reading, they don't do anything many other political groups do. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:47 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: David, Will you condemn and denounce the political groups La Raza and MEChA right now? -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:42 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Linux dual boot?
I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
I'm linux only at home, but at work that's not the case. I am also always willing to learn, so if you kick this off please throw me an invite. from my DROID On May 17, 2010 9:23 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: Sign me I'll join your new group. Mike On 05/17/2010 08:20 AM, Jared Shapiro wrote: Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Ori... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Flame wars? Really? Did you all read that linux magazine article about how the editor thinks they are enjoyable reads? from my DROID On May 17, 2010 9:41 PM, Bryan Oapos;Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: Did you not even read you cited references? It is more like if I called your mama fat beat you up and then drove off down the street in your car after tossing you a few bucks and a pick of your naked sister out the window onto your limp body and then when the cops showed up made you say thank you and apologize for wasting my time ;) Not that I am complaining. I think it was a bold move that paid off very, very, well. But denying the nature of the conflict is like saying the Civil War was fought over slavery. It is fine for your Jr. High text book but when grow, otherwise intelligent, people try spouting that stuff they are either American idiots or just don't care. To quote from the wikipidia page you cited. The Mexican–American War was an armed conflict between the United States and Mexico from 1846 to 1848 in the wake of the 1845 U.S. annexation of Texas, which Mexico considered part of its territory despite the 1836 Texas Revolution. In addition to a naval blockade of the Mexican coast, American forces invaded and conquered New Mexico, California and parts of northern Mexico. Another American army captured Mexico City, forcing Mexico to agree to the sale of its northern territories to the U.S. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:47 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - plug-disc...@lis... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Mon May 17 21:37:56 -0700 2010: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The subject remains, however, off-topic. It has nothing to do with your political opinions, or your expression thereof. All I'm saying is, choose your medium. Many of us are friends with you on Facebook or some other social networking site, and a few of us read your blog. Also respect that most people on this list are pedantic about what is off-topic, or simply do not care. The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. I hate those threads too. Internet memo: either we already know that there's a Cox outage, or we don't care because we don't subscribe to Cox, thankyou. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
@tuna thank you for the art! I'm deffinately going to use it. Probably the best part of this thread. from my DROID On May 17, 2010 8:33 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ SUCCESSFUL TROLL IS SUCCESSFUL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recen... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - plug-disc...@lists.p... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Will you condemn and denounce them? simple question. We're not comparing to other groups. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:56 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Why? Serious inquiry. From my brief reading, they don't do anything many other political groups do. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:47 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: David, Will you condemn and denounce the political groups La Raza and MEChA right now? -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:42 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Mon May 17 21:44:38 -0700 2010: To the rest, you're trying to tell me a few emails in your inbox is so absolutely painful you're going to throw a fit or something? At the time of writing, this thread is 67 messages long. That's more than a few. Easy to ignore in my GMail-style threaded email client, although it does take about a minute to open this thread. no, you just don't like what is being said... but guess what- this issue is now front and center and as far as I'm concerned there is no controversy here if you are an concerned Arizonan. It's not that we don't like it, or even that we don't care. It's simply the wrong place, and therefore trolling. We respect your political opinions, and many of us may even agree. But please, not on plug-discuss. This is not your personal enraged-chain-mail-list, or your television audience. This is a (shrinking) group of hobbyists and professionals that like to talk about Linux. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
I recommend giving opensuse, ubuntu, and fedora a try. Any of those will be a great start. If you want to try a server, I'd go with centos since its exactly like rhel. If you have any questions feel free to contact me off list. from my DROID On May 17, 2010 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
I can respect that Tuna, but keep in mind that people say politically charged things all the time here without problem. It's when we arrive at loaded topics like illegal aliens that suddenly registers as 'trolling'. The fact is this issue effects us all, even as developers or Linux users, and most certainly as Arizonan residents. Trying to blot out the discussion is just as caustic. The fact that David seems tacitly supportive of groups like La Raza make it even more alarming. I don't see why people who hold perfectly valid opinions with regards to illegal aliens should feel alienated *in their own country*. Enough of this PC crap. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Mon May 17 21:44:38 -0700 2010: To the rest, you're trying to tell me a few emails in your inbox is so absolutely painful you're going to throw a fit or something? At the time of writing, this thread is 67 messages long. That's more than a few. Easy to ignore in my GMail-style threaded email client, although it does take about a minute to open this thread. no, you just don't like what is being said... but guess what- this issue is now front and center and as far as I'm concerned there is no controversy here if you are an concerned Arizonan. It's not that we don't like it, or even that we don't care. It's simply the wrong place, and therefore trolling. We respect your political opinions, and many of us may even agree. But please, not on plug-discuss. This is not your personal enraged-chain-mail-list, or your television audience. This is a (shrinking) group of hobbyists and professionals that like to talk about Linux. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
And I asked why. An even simpler question to answer, it would seem. David I find your lack of faith disturbing --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 10:06 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Will you condemn and denounce them? simple question. We're not comparing to other groups. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:56 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Why? Serious inquiry. From my brief reading, they don't do anything many other political groups do. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:47 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: David, Will you condemn and denounce the political groups La Raza and MEChA right now? -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:42 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Win: Starting a windows enterprise admin group
Will do ;) On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:59 PM, Tim Noeding tim.noed...@gmail.com wrote: I'm linux only at home, but at work that's not the case. I am also always willing to learn, so if you kick this off please throw me an invite. from my DROID On May 17, 2010 9:23 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: Sign me I'll join your new group. Mike On 05/17/2010 08:20 AM, Jared Shapiro wrote: Sign me up for the MAUG ! js -Ori... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
you either support their politics or you don't. I'm sure I'm not the only one who will assume that you do support them if you fail to provide a decisive answer to the question. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:21 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net wrote: And I asked why. An even simpler question to answer, it would seem. David I find your lack of faith disturbing --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 10:06 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Will you condemn and denounce them? simple question. We're not comparing to other groups. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:56 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Why? Serious inquiry. From my brief reading, they don't do anything many other political groups do. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:47 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: David, Will you condemn and denounce the political groups La Raza and MEChA right now? -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:42 PM, David da...@damnetwork.net da...@damnetwork.net wrote: Josh, I don't know you from Adam, but FU for calling me unAmerican. Yes, a personal attack. Just as the comment I'm referring to is. David I find your lack of faith disturbing. --Darth Vader On May 17, 2010, at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-v ote-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html Hopefully they will choose Linux. -jmz -- --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: OT ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Indeed I did ;) On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:01 PM, Tim Noeding tim.noed...@gmail.com wrote: Flame wars? Really? Did you all read that linux magazine article about how the editor thinks they are enjoyable reads? from my DROID On May 17, 2010 9:41 PM, Bryan Oapos;Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: Did you not even read you cited references? It is more like if I called your mama fat beat you up and then drove off down the street in your car after tossing you a few bucks and a pick of your naked sister out the window onto your limp body and then when the cops showed up made you say thank you and apologize for wasting my time ;) Not that I am complaining. I think it was a bold move that paid off very, very, well. But denying the nature of the conflict is like saying the Civil War was fought over slavery. It is fine for your Jr. High text book but when grow, otherwise intelligent, people try spouting that stuff they are either American idiots or just don't care. To quote from the wikipidia page you cited. The Mexican–American War was an armed conflict between the United States and Mexico from 1846 to 1848 in the wake of the 1845 U.S. annexation of Texas, which Mexico considered part of its territory despite the 1836 Texas Revolution. In addition to a naval blockade of the Mexican coast, American forces invaded and conquered New Mexico, California and parts of northern Mexico. Another American army captured Mexico City, forcing Mexico to agree to the sale of its northern territories to the U.S. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:47 PM, JD Austin j...@twingeckos.com wrote: On Mon, May 17, 2010 at... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - plug-disc...@lis... --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
I am partial to Debian. I have it running on a a 64bit Dell laptop for about 6 months with no problems. I also run Windows 7 Pro as a virtual machine. Mark On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
I agree - The SuSE, RedHat (Fedora), and Debian (Ubuntu) branches are quite different but all very good. See which one you like best. Personally I loved SuSE at first but could not spend the time to learn it as well as Fedora or Ubuntu. And, well, Ubuntu just amazes me at how simple it can be for simple things, like printing, so it get heavy props. For servers I am almost pure RedHat (Cent OS to be specific) for desktops I have one Ubuntu and one Fedora on my desk. I use them both equally. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Mark Phillips m...@phillipsmarketing.biz wrote: I am partial to Debian. I have it running on a a 64bit Dell laptop for about 6 months with no problems. I also run Windows 7 Pro as a virtual machine. Mark On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Mon May 17 22:14:09 -0700 2010: I can respect that Tuna, but keep in mind that people say politically charged things all the time here without problem. It's when we arrive at loaded topics like illegal aliens that suddenly registers as 'trolling'. The fact is this issue effects us all, even as developers or Linux users, and most certainly as Arizonan residents. Trying to blot out the discussion is just as caustic. The fact that David seems tacitly supportive of groups like La Raza make it even more alarming. I don't see why people who hold perfectly valid opinions with regards to illegal aliens should feel alienated *in their own country*. Enough of this PC crap. -jmz No question the topic swelled to 70+ posts because many find this more inflammatory than others. I am only attempting to treat the effect, a 70+ post thread of worthless hissy fits. I would have posted my lovely ASCII art if this was a discussion of traffic light bias, horseradish recipes, gay marriage, animal rights, a new proposed sales tax, thebanning of your mom jokes on the lightrail, or the availability of finger sandwiches in downtown Tempe. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:02 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Mon May 17 21:44:38 -0700 2010: To the rest, you're trying to tell me a few emails in your inbox is so absolutely painful you're going to throw a fit or something? At the time of writing, this thread is 67 messages long. That's more than a few. Easy to ignore in my GMail-style threaded email client, although it does take about a minute to open this thread. no, you just don't like what is being said... but guess what- this issue is now front and center and as far as I'm concerned there is no controversy here if you are an concerned Arizonan. It's not that we don't like it, or even that we don't care. It's simply the wrong place, and therefore trolling. We respect your political opinions, and many of us may even agree. But please, not on plug-discuss. This is not your personal enraged-chain-mail-list, or your television audience. This is a (shrinking) group of hobbyists and professionals that like to talk about Linux. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:37 PM, Joshua Zeidner jjzeid...@gmail.com wrote: Tuna, We were discussing macro economic trends that effect all linux developers as well as issues pertaining to Arizona and Linux. Just because some deem the issue of illegal aliens to be out of bounds does not mean we terminate the discussion whenever we arrive at the subject. Of course some people don't like it being discussed. Those are the people who want to prevent action from being taken. There are some of these people on this thread. How can we discuss anything these days without addressing *what is right in front of our faces every day*!? The fact is everyone, this country is in deep doo doo. It's not a laughing matter. Anyone who was at the Sharpton rally will tell you that these people are violent and they most certainly are un-american. Our state is broke, as are many other states. Our ability to maintain our technology sector will rely heavily on our ability to stabilize ourselves politically. This means *your job*. It might even be an opportunity to position ourselves profitably relative to California. Discussion is absolutely critical to moving in the right direction. Don't let people blow the issue out of proportion or try to turn it into some racial battleground. That being said, you may now return to complaining about COX service or whatever other stuff is 'on topic'. -jmz On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: /| ___ / | __-- --__ |\ | \_----_ / | |)\/ | \__/ / ) ,-` / 0 .. 0 | / /| | , \ ,__ / | \/ | \ ```) \__/ ILLEGAL ALIEN IS ILLEGAL I created this ascii art myself, and hereby release it into the public domain. Congrats, Zeidner. Excerpts from Joshua Zeidner's message of Sun May 16 12:54:33 -0700 2010: Hello PLUG, I am wondering if anyone is switching off Apple products due to the recent Los Angeles boycott of Arizona: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/05/12/20100512los-angeles-boycott-vo te-over-arizona-immigration-law12-ON.html
Re: Linux dual boot?
I concur. I also strongly recommend running additional hosts as virtual machines (either with VirtualBox or VMware Player/Workstation) instead of dual booting. VMs are much nicer to use. -- -Eric 'shubes' Bryan O'Neal wrote: I agree - The SuSE, RedHat (Fedora), and Debian (Ubuntu) branches are quite different but all very good. See which one you like best. Personally I loved SuSE at first but could not spend the time to learn it as well as Fedora or Ubuntu. And, well, Ubuntu just amazes me at how simple it can be for simple things, like printing, so it get heavy props. For servers I am almost pure RedHat (Cent OS to be specific) for desktops I have one Ubuntu and one Fedora on my desk. I use them both equally. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Mark Phillips m...@phillipsmarketing.biz wrote: I am partial to Debian. I have it running on a a 64bit Dell laptop for about 6 months with no problems. I also run Windows 7 Pro as a virtual machine. Mark On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
I will agree with that as well. Unless you have a vid capture card or some other special hardware VM's are a much better option for learning Linux. And VMWare is supper easy On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:38 PM, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: I concur. I also strongly recommend running additional hosts as virtual machines (either with VirtualBox or VMware Player/Workstation) instead of dual booting. VMs are much nicer to use. -- -Eric 'shubes' Bryan O'Neal wrote: I agree - The SuSE, RedHat (Fedora), and Debian (Ubuntu) branches are quite different but all very good. See which one you like best. Personally I loved SuSE at first but could not spend the time to learn it as well as Fedora or Ubuntu. And, well, Ubuntu just amazes me at how simple it can be for simple things, like printing, so it get heavy props. For servers I am almost pure RedHat (Cent OS to be specific) for desktops I have one Ubuntu and one Fedora on my desk. I use them both equally. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Mark Phillips m...@phillipsmarketing.biz wrote: I am partial to Debian. I have it running on a a 64bit Dell laptop for about 6 months with no problems. I also run Windows 7 Pro as a virtual machine. Mark On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: ditching Apple products due to boycotts?
On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:29 PM, Tuna t...@supertunaman.com wrote: I don't see why people who hold perfectly valid opinions with regards to illegal aliens should feel alienated *in their own country*. Enough of this PC crap. -jmz No question the topic swelled to 70+ posts because many find this more inflammatory than others. it's inflammatory because it's an open wound. -jmz --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
So far all great suggestions. If you can afford it i would suggest a new/extra HDD for your Linux install and setting it to be your first drive (after you install windows with the spare drive unplugged That way you have a drive you can torture and alter to your hearts content, and you don't have to worry about breaking the boot sector on your win7 install. It is not repairable, you can back it up with any number of tools (i like clonezilla) and for a bistro to learn with, Depending on your personal technical masochism you can install Gentoo. It made me want to chuck my computer out the window during install, but when i was done I knew a great deal more about the underbelly of Linux, and Gentoo is pretty well documented. but the extra HDD i think is a very good suggestion. especially when learning. --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
Re: Linux dual boot?
If you go with a virtual machine route you can also go with virtualbox. it has matured well, and has some hardware graphics acceleration. Also you can get a FOSS version that is cross platform. so if you decide to switch you can save your vm's and move them. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:49 PM, Bryan O'Neal bryan.on...@theonealandassociates.com wrote: I will agree with that as well. Unless you have a vid capture card or some other special hardware VM's are a much better option for learning Linux. And VMWare is supper easy On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:38 PM, Eric Shubert e...@shubes.net wrote: I concur. I also strongly recommend running additional hosts as virtual machines (either with VirtualBox or VMware Player/Workstation) instead of dual booting. VMs are much nicer to use. -- -Eric 'shubes' Bryan O'Neal wrote: I agree - The SuSE, RedHat (Fedora), and Debian (Ubuntu) branches are quite different but all very good. See which one you like best. Personally I loved SuSE at first but could not spend the time to learn it as well as Fedora or Ubuntu. And, well, Ubuntu just amazes me at how simple it can be for simple things, like printing, so it get heavy props. For servers I am almost pure RedHat (Cent OS to be specific) for desktops I have one Ubuntu and one Fedora on my desk. I use them both equally. On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 10:24 PM, Mark Phillips m...@phillipsmarketing.biz wrote: I am partial to Debian. I have it running on a a 64bit Dell laptop for about 6 months with no problems. I also run Windows 7 Pro as a virtual machine. Mark On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 9:58 PM, mike Enriquez myli...@cox.net wrote: I am planning to build a dual boot workstation. It will a 64bit computer with Windows 7 pro but I have yet to select a linux distro. I am open to any suggestions. Which linux distro would you use. My only requirement is that it further my linux education. I am willing to try any Linux Distro in workstation or server version. Also what would you put into your 64 bit computer? I am planning to use an i7 extreme processor on an MSI X58 pro-E motherboard. Ram is going to be DDR3 1600 MHz. I am open to any ideas. Please send me your ideas. Thanks Mike Enriquez --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss -- A mouse trap, placed on top of your alarm clock, will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep after you hit the snooze button. Stephen --- PLUG-discuss mailing list - PLUG-discuss@lists.plug.phoenix.az.us To subscribe, unsubscribe, or to change your mail settings: http://lists.PLUG.phoenix.az.us/mailman/listinfo/plug-discuss
