RE: CSCC CS for swimming pools
Hi Marshall, I think you are forgetting about the solubility of silver chloride. At 1 ppm Cl about 0.7 ppm of the silver will remain dissolved, halve the amount of chlorine and double the amount of silver will remain dissolved. Ivan -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Tuesday, 21 May 2002 4:07 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCC CS for swimming pools Normally the amount of chlorine is on the order of 1 ppm. One ppm of chlorine will react with about 3 ppm of silver (by weight). A pool containing 20,000 gallons of water with 1 ppm of chlorine would have sufficient chlorine to react with half a pound of silver making about 2/3 pound of silver chloride. I would hardly call that insignificant. Marshall MARIANO DELISE wrote: It needs a very SMALL amount of chlorine to burn off all the dead critters killed by the silver. Not enough to make much silver chloride - Original Message - From: natural_essenti...@juno.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Sunday, May 19, 2002 8:18 AM Subject: CSCC CS for swimming pools Hi all, I've been looking at some ionizers for swimming pools. The majority of sites say that some chlorine is still needed weekly. It would seem to me that the chlorine and silver would make some silver chloride. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that silver chloide was poisonous/toxic? Does anyone currently use an ionizer in your pool/spa, and how satisfied with it are you? I seem to recall the original thread was posed by Marshall. Leacy Life is Good! GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSSTD's was CSzapper
-Original Message- From: Joyce Inouye [mailto:jinou...@ccsf.cc.ca.us] Sent: Monday, 20 May 2002 4:04 p.m. To: John Reeder Cc: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: RE: CSzapper ... Sex is an easy way to get cancer germs and parasites into your body. About ten (10) HIV viruses can fit the diameter of the average hole in a condom. Those who teach kids to use condoms are indirectly spreading deadly germs such as HIV and cancer-causing germs among the young people. Teaching kids to have sex with condoms increases venereal diseases among them, and venereal diseases are linked to cancer. What sort of logic is that. Those kids who use condoms are preventing a great percentage of the sexually transmitted diseases that would otherwise be spread if they didn't wear them! This actually decreases the incidence of venereal diseases among them. Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPhototherapy Light Wand Assembly Instructions
The LED modules you guys are looking at are not really intense enough for low level light therapy (LLLT) The Jameco part has a maximum intensity of 12,000 mcd The BGgmicro parts have a maximum intensity 7,700 mcd Whereas the Digikey part (67-1589-ND) has a max intensity of 48,000 mcd and is much more likely to produce results. I have single red LEDs that produce 6,000 mcd. Search for LLLT (many hits for laser, but the coherency of the light is lost as it enters the tissue and LEDs do just as well). Also try LED phototherapy. This is a well researched and serious treatment modality. Visible red light (660nm) penetrates the tissue 25 - 50mm and interacts with the mitochondria directly, causing an increase in cellular energy production, and increased rates of DNA and RNA transcription, (i.e. increased healing) among other things. Near infrared (700 - 800nm) interacts with the cellular membranes, causes the production of singlet oxygen radicals (at levels high enough to oxidise pathogens but not high enough to cause cellular damage) and increases the potential difference across the membrane allowing for optimum entry of nutrients and expulsion of waste. Apart from Brook's highly innovative and important use of this simple technology, red light can be used to halt bruising (use instead of ice) limit or halt inflammation, lessen pain, and speed healing of sprains, contusions, ulcers and so on. My units are in constant use by the family and friends, and now my daughters school is wishing for a unit (which I will donate) ever since I brought a portable one to the sick bay for my daughter to use, a boy had dropped a chair on her toe. Within minutes of use (the school reports) the pain and swelling had gone, the shoe was on and she was outside with her team having netball practice. One would do well to build a LED phototherapy unit. Ivan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSWater Diffusion
I have been studying the diffusion of water into the body and cells, mindful of the comments of Dr Batmanghelidj (Your Bodies Many Cries For Water) which in essence says that, as water is accepted into the body via the cells one molecule at a time, there is no point in drinking structured water or any other 'special water' (at least not for the water content) because these structures are broken up and any mineral or other content stripped from them before the water is absorbed. I have a couple of highly technical papers that describe the structure of a fairly recently discovered class of cellular pores called Aquapores (funnily enough), which do indeed restrict the entry of water to single file. However I did come across this site which explains the implications of this discovery in an amusing and non-technical manner. Enjoy! http://student.biology.arizona.edu/honors98/group6/ Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CShype or not...
-Original Message- From: Rich Adams [mailto:r...@kc.rr.com] More hype? http://www.purestcolloids.com/ionic.htm Yes. 1. I know of no research that compares the effectiveness of silver chloride vs true silver colloids. Silver chloride is known to be mildly anti-bacterial in vitro, silver ions are a far more anti-bacterial than true silver colloids in vitro. 2. A high percentage of ingested silver ions are absorbed into the blood stream, whether as silver chloride or some amino acid chelate. This is shown to be true by an investigation into a largely ionic CS written by Roger Altman (ex list member), and ironically, a copy can be found on the silver-colloids web site. 3. All so called colloidal silver, other than Mesosilver true colloid, the silver proteins and other silver complexes, have a high ionic content. Most of the testimonials regarding the effectiveness of CS refers to the high ionic variety, even those that could be found on sites selling mesosilver. 4. The fact that a child can do it makes this valuable supplement available to all, and not just those with a deep wallet. My opinion only, Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCA on eyelid
Might I suggest the use of beta glucan mixed with aloe vera for application to the eyelid. Many studies on this substance, but still widely unknown. Proven anti-cancer properties (one detailing resolving melanoma by direct injection into mass), best immune stimulator available. Beta glucan (mixed with d. water) can be used in the eye also. Will aid healing even if other remedies are used. Ivan. -Original Message- From: d.linen [mailto:li...@flash.net] Sent: Sunday, 5 May 2002 9:08 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCA on eyelid Which eyelid? Mine is on my lower eyelid right now. I've been using Cansema, a black salve. You can put it up to 1/4 inch from the eye. BUT you can use the liquid Cansema on the eyelid and around the eye with no problem because it's not caustic like the salve is. I had a huge cancer that was about the size of a credit card under my left eye and now it's about 75 percent improved over a year ago. I just can't quite get the salve that close to my eye or it would be healed by now. I take the Cansema capsules too. Connie wrote: From a friend ...The doctor decided one of the lumps on my eyelid is cancer :-( I was told a Dermotologist would do the eye,,,then the Opthalmologist said I needed a Plastic Surgeon,,, and the Plastic surgeon thinks they and the Opthalmologist have to work together for different things! Any suggestions for a friend? Would Black salve be OK that close to the eye? She is a believer in CS, but not sure if she has any trust in other alternative treatments. Connie -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCA on eyelid
Oops! find beta glucan here: http://www.chisolmbio.com/ Ivan -Original Message- From: I Anderson [mailto:i...@win.co.nz] Sent: Sunday, 5 May 2002 10:35 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: RE: CSCA on eyelid Might I suggest the use of beta glucan mixed with aloe vera for application to the eyelid. Many studies on this substance, but still widely unknown. Proven anti-cancer properties (one detailing resolving melanoma by direct injection into mass), best immune stimulator available. Beta glucan (mixed with d. water) can be used in the eye also. Will aid healing even if other remedies are used. Ivan. -Original Message- From: d.linen [mailto:li...@flash.net] Sent: Sunday, 5 May 2002 9:08 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCA on eyelid Which eyelid? Mine is on my lower eyelid right now. I've been using Cansema, a black salve. You can put it up to 1/4 inch from the eye. BUT you can use the liquid Cansema on the eyelid and around the eye with no problem because it's not caustic like the salve is. I had a huge cancer that was about the size of a credit card under my left eye and now it's about 75 percent improved over a year ago. I just can't quite get the salve that close to my eye or it would be healed by now. I take the Cansema capsules too. Connie wrote: From a friend ...The doctor decided one of the lumps on my eyelid is cancer :-( I was told a Dermotologist would do the eye,,,then the Opthalmologist said I needed a Plastic Surgeon,,, and the Plastic surgeon thinks they and the Opthalmologist have to work together for different things! Any suggestions for a friend? Would Black salve be OK that close to the eye? She is a believer in CS, but not sure if she has any trust in other alternative treatments. Connie -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPrill Thin Water
From the twilight zone http://www.thetwilightnetwork.com Bath Crystals, Dollop of Love, DOL, Golden Seal Drops, Magic Oil, Magic Water, Sea Snow, Snow Crystals, St. John's Wort Drops, Precious Prill Beads, Laundry Bag, produced in The Star Chamber and now available to bring The Star Chamber experience to you at home! Can I get too much Magnesium Chloride from the products? Prill Water - Magic Water - Magic Oil - Dollop of Love - DOL - Golden Seal Drops - St. John's Wort Drops all have Magnesium Chloride in them to remedy your Magnesium Deficiency for over all health and to let your body NATURALLY raise to your normal levels. Maybe you could add 125mg of magnesium chloride to a litre of water for the same effect (you might need to add a little pure love energy as well). Ivan. -Original Message- From: Ian Roe [mailto:ian_onta...@hotmail.com] Sent: Friday, 3 May 2002 12:29 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSPrill Thin Water I know they say that the prills add nothing to the water but that is not true. I started with R.O. water at 6 ppm TDS and wound up with water at 83ppm TDS or about 1/2 the TDS of our municipal water which is at 170 to 190 ppm. The nice thing was that the pH had been about 7.1 and after prilling, is at least 8 or higher (wouldn't test higher than 8) But it sure is cheap alkaline water. I was about to spend $1000 or more on one of those Japanese micro machines and now I don't have to. The prills work great. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSRe: Alternative treatment - LED construction
The following is a series of messages generously sent to the list by Brooks Bradley. I retrieved them from my hard drive as I know how hard it is to search the archive. Ivan To all interested list members: Recently, a rather serendipitous occurence revealed a possible synergistic effect through the combination of CS and LED protocols.utilized simultaneously. During a recent evaluation of protocols directed toward alleviating the problems of long-term, persistent, sinus/upper throat insults, one of our researchers experienced some unexpected successfrom combining CS mist inhalation and LED exposure. The most interesting factor being the nature of the LED array application. During earlier experiments, it had been determined that LED exposure (especially in the 660 to 680 nm range) resulted in very pronounced control of upper throat pathogens. Exposure times as short as 5 minutes, directed through the open mouth (using 5 element, 3500 mcd Leds), achived immediate and marked relief---in an impressive number (75%) of cases..across the entire age spectrum from 25 to 83 years of age. However, the success rate/degree was much less (25%) involving cases of deep-seated sinus insults from pathogenic/allergenic complications. Principally, because of the difficulty experienced in directly illuminating the insulted tissue. The protocol adjustment resulting in a most pronounced improvement in frontal sinus infections/complications, sprang from the simple application of a 15 element LED array (1.5 X 3 in area) being held against the skin surface---first on one side directly adjacent to the nose for 5 to 10 minutes; followed immediately by a repetition on the other side of the nose. The geometry is somewhat difficult to explain without a drawing, but imagine placing the array in such a manner to rest one corner on the middle of the bridge of the nose (addressed from the side) then repeating for the other side. The array should placed with the long side in the horizontal (3.5 X 1.5 ) extending away from the nosekeeping the array below the eye. The soft-tissue is penetrated quite well and we believe the bony structures may be providing some unanticipated diffusion benefits. The throat area was treated in two ways: First, after a thorough misting, with the mouth fully open, a 5 element (circular) LED array was used to directly expose the back of the mouth/tonsil area.for 5 minutes. The front edge of the array was allowed to rest on top of the lower front feeth. As the subject experienced saliva generation they were instructed to swallow---without closing their mouth. This had the added advantage of , momentarily, changing the geometry of the tonsile area to give an increased exposure. The most dramatic results accrued from the application of the 15 element LED array on the outside of the throat area ( from just below the jaw bone, downward). Prior to using this modification, we had only conjectured as to a possible benefit from such an arrangement. Afterward, we conducted some soft-tissue penetration tests using 3500 to 6000 mcd LEDs. Even the 3500 mcd bulbs yielded .5 penetration. We are, at present, conducting tests to determine the minimum power LED that will yield positive results under similar conditions. A single Laser Pointer unit was tested with some, but much reduced effectiveness . This, combined protocol, yielded positive control over some very pernicious---long-standing---frontal sinus insults. Some of you may care to conduct your own experiments along these lines.Sincerely, Brooks Bradley. p.s. I have not forgotten my promise to post the assembly instructions for the 5 element LED array, contained in the pvc tubing. I WILL try to get it done sometime before the week is out. CSOT: POSSIBLE USEFUL ADJUNCTIVE PROTOCOL To all interested llist members. Recently, we completed a series of evaluations which yielded VERY substantial results. These evaluations were a continuation of earlier protocols employing LED units in experimenting for effective protocols. One protocol, IN PARTICULAR.gave particularly efficacious results. This, experimental protocol, involved the application of 660 nm red-spectrum light, (via both 5 bulb portable and larger, more powerful non-portable units). The weakest bulbs to yield high-quality results were on the order of 3500 mcd ( 5 bulbs arranged in a compact, circular assembly). The most rapid results were achieved with a much higher -powered (non-portable) unit of our own design and construction. This latter unit possesses a tissue-penetration capability of greater than 8 -for lean-muscle tissue. However, VERY ACCEPTABLE results were gained from the
RE: CSAltman article
Terry and Duncan, Some links to info about silver selenite. http://wlapwww.gov.bc.ca/wat/wq/BCguidelines/silver/bcsilver-14.htm#P6 23_48187 Experiments with radiosilver indicate that it is mainly associated with the reticulo-endothelial system. The silver is concentrated in the basement membrane of the skin, in the elastic fibres around sweat glands and the eyes; generally in areas of the skin exposed to the sun. The discoloured skin in argyric patients exposed to ultraviolet radiation is likely caused by photoreduction of silver chloride to metallic silver, which is then oxidized to black silver sulphide and bound by tissues. If the diet is high in selenium, the silver sulphide is converted to silver selenide which may result in higher silver deposition rates than with silver sulphide (Danscher 1981, Berry and Galle 1982, Buckley et al. 1965). http://www.synthon.co.za/silver.html a list of silver chemicals for sale, including silver selenite and selenide. http://www.onecachet.com/cfilmsz.htm I. Selenium Toner 1. MACO LP Selenia is a modern selenium toner used in processing black and white prints to improve archivality by turning the silver into silver selenite, a compound that is more impervious to environmental pollutants. Selenium toning, done according to the instructions, also increases maximum density and cleans up the whites. The chart below shows the time/toning results ratio. Ivan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSa newbie here
Nice to meet you Tys, welcome! Ivan. -Original Message- From: Tyson Brennan [mailto:tysbr...@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, 19 April 2002 11:30 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSa newbie here Hello everybody, I have just joined the list and I am obviously interested in getting a real time perspective on colloidal silver. I have been interested in alternative medicine for several years now and consider the prospect of becoming more knowledgable about as many areas as possible, well, a hobby. I am most curious about validating my opinions on the benefits of CS which I will pretty much get from simply recieving posts. Glad to be here! Tys -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSMSP IV HIV
Reduction of Viral Load in AIDS Patients With Intravenous Mild Silver Protein: 3 Case Reports Ward Dean, MD, Mark Mitchell, MD, Victor Whizar Lugo, MD, and James South, MA ABSTRACT: Mild silver protein has been used since the 19th century as an antimicrobial agent, with a wide range of bactericidal, fungicidal, and virucidal properties. This paper reviews the historical use of mild silver protein in medicine, and documents the recent effectiveness of intravenous mild silver protein to cause a dramatic reduction in viral load of 3 patients with human immunodeficiency virus. (Clinical Practice of Alternative Medicine 2(1):48-53, 2001) -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSArgyria treatment
I agree with James, that the first port of call if one suspects Argyria is confirmation via tissue biopsy. Only then can one be sure that the correct questions are being asked. Ivan. http://www.silverprotects.com/argyria.html A Possible Cure for Argyria Is it possible that restoring healthful levels of vitamin E and selenium along with the ingestion of ample water might bring about a gradual reversal of argyria in at least some cases? I decided to discuss my idea with a nutritional specialist, Hans Gr uenn, MD. After talking at length about the EPA studies and the properties of vitamin E and selenium, Dr. Gruenn concluded, It is a worthy hypothesis that should be tried. Dr. Gruenn gave the following recommendations: 200mcg to 400mcg of selenium per day is a safe supplement to take on an ongoing basis. He also advises a high-quality,* mixed vitamin E, at 1000 IU per day for people over 50 years of age who may be at risk of stroke, and 2,000 IU per day for people under 50 who are not at risk of stroke. I told Dr. Gruenn that I was taking 4,000 IU a day. He replied that this was still safe for a strong healthy person. The danger of high doses of vitamin E is that it thins the blood. This could be dangerous in many situations where bleeding is hard to stop. Personally, I would also drink lots of water, simply because that's how the body clears out debris. No one knows if this therapy will prove efficacious, or if it does in how many cases. If my liver spots are any kind of indicator, some lightening of t he skin ought to be visible within six weeks if this therapy really is working. Three to six months should be a sufficient amount of time to completely eliminate argyria provided that no additional silver is being ingested. (Since my conversation with Dr. Gruenn, I've had some additional ideas for getting the most out of this nutritional therapy for argyria.) 2 tsp. of MSM per day. Sulfur (MSM) binds with silver and can help to pull it from the body. More information on silver and sulfur can be found on page 88. 4,000 mg. of vitamin C per day. 1 tablet a day of a good quality multiple mineral since this therapy may deplete needed minerals from the body. * Most vitamin E supplements are of poor quality and some even contain rancid oils that will be an additional burden rather than an aid to the body. Dr. Gruenn recommends a vitamin E that has a mix of d-alpha, beta, delta and gamma tocopheryls -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSColloidal vs silver ions
Well, I was bound to comment on the ionic vs elemental colloid thread eventually... Firstly the idea that silver ions precipitate out in the elementary tract, and never make it to the blood stream, is pure speculation. This theory is most eloquently proposed by Purest Colloids who market a product of high elemental colloid percentage. However the theory, I believe, is pretty much debunked by an article which is (ironically) found on the Purest Colloids sister web site: http://www.silver-colloids.com/Papers/AltmanStudy.PDF This study was written by Roger Altman (who used to grace this list with his not inconsiderable presence) and details the elimination vs ingestion of what would be a high ionic percentage CS. He found that pretty much what is ingested is what comes out, and that a high percentage comes out in the urine. Now these ions did not get into the urine by precipitating out and not getting into the blood stream, obviously the blood stream is exactly where they ended up. The fact that a high percentage of ingested ions emerged in the urine also suggests that little is bound in the tissues (at least in this case) which further suggests that in order to develop argyria, a large amount of silver must be consumed, and/or specific (and unusual?) circumstances are present, such as deficiencies in vitamin E and/or selenium (or perhaps overdose of selenium, as suggested by some research). What the fate of silver ions in the blood before elimination is moot, however my own observations would suggest that they are at least as effective as elemental colloids in controlling infection... so don't throw away your 9v battery generator just yet! Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Tuesday, 16 April 2002 9:06 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSColloidal vs silver ions While it is the ionic form that can cause argyria, there is a minimum amount of silver necessary. According to I believe it is, the EPA website, one would have to drink so much 5 ppm CS 90% ion they would die from water poisoning first. It helps to understand what is going on here. 1. Silver ions will combine with the hcl in the stomach and mostly precipitate out as silver chloride. Thus they never make it to the blood stream. 2. In the body, silver ions can precipitate out onto silver particles when a developer such as caffine is present. When taking silver salts, there are no particles, but particles are formed when the salts are exposed to light. Thus when taking silver salts, the initial particles will always occur in skin exposed to light. At that point, the ions in the salts can precipitate out onto the particles and thus make them grow until they become bound in the tissue making what is basically a tatoo. 3. Silver salts must be present in a large enough quantity so that particles grow rapidly enough to become lodged before being flushed out. This requires a fairly high concentration of silver ions in the blood. So we have 3 reasons why normal CS should not be a problem. Most of the ions combine with chlorine and precipitate out, those that do make it to the blood stream will bind with silver particles throughout the body, instead of just in the skin, the concentration of ions will be too low to cause significant particle size increase and lodging. Marshall Bobbye Stegen wrote: Hi all, I am a novice in the world of colloidal silver. I have attempted to read up on using the product, asking questions, etc. I've read the Purest Colloids web site which holds the patent on the process of a higher % of colloidal particulate matter. The web site is impressive but alas, the product is very expensive. I have read many of your messages discussing making your own CS and on other boards/lists. Now as I understand it, the CS you make at home has a high percentage of silver ions Now if I understand it correctly, it is the ionic silver that can cause the blue discoloration. At this point, I don't want to even attempt to make my own CS as I want to experiment to see if CS works for me and my family as many of you have attested to. My question is, if ionic silver can cause a problem no matter how small a chance, why would you take a chance making your own? This is not a challenging question but request for information only. CS costing $61 a bottle is still much much cheaper and better for the bodyespecially if one does not use allopathic medicines unless it is a matter of life and death. I've looked at the health food stores and find 10ppm and 30ppm on the shelves. Now is this ionic silver? If you were going to buy CS, would you risk buying anyother on the market other than the Purest Colloids? Have any of you tried Purest Colloids? Again, this is not to start a debate but just asking for honest opinions. Thanks, Bobbye --
RE: CSH2O2 in CS
Bob, I think you will find that USP stands for US Pharmacopeia, which is a set of standards and processes that must be followed in order to use the label. USP relates to purity only so far as is laid out in the standard. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Bob Bartell [mailto:bobbart...@earthlink.net] Sent: Monday, 15 April 2002 9:09 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: RE: CSH2O2 in CS Thanks Kevin. Still think its wrong to use USP to ascribe a level of purity when the product contains identifiable other components - trace amounts or otherwise. Namaste: Bob Bartell -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSVirgin Coconut oil vs. Copra
Dear Catherine, Thanks, but this page says nothing about coconut milk or cream. The fact is that coconut milk and cream supply appreciable amounts of short chain fatty acids, which are the active ingredients of CNO. One does well to eat them. Even macaroons are said to be of benefit by coconut oil guru Mary Enig. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Catherine Creel [mailto:ccr...@maine.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, 10 April 2002 5:55 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSVirgin Coconut oil vs. Copra What is Virgin Coconut Oil? Virgin Coconut Oil can only be achieved by using fresh coconut meat or what is called non-copra (see below for a definition of copra). Chemicals and high heating are not used in further refining. There are currently two main processes of manufacturing Virgin Coconut Oil: 1. Quick drying of fresh coconut meat which is then used to press out the oil. Using this method, minimal heat is used to quick dry the coconut meat, and the oil is then pressed out via mechanical means. 2. Wet-milling. With this method the oil is extracted from fresh coconut meat without drying first. Coconut milk is expressed first by pressing. The oil is then further separated from the water. Methods which can be used to separate the oil from the water include boiling, fermentation, refrigeration, enzymes and mechanical centrifuge. The method which is used by Mt. Banahaw Health Products Corporation in the Philippines is fermentation. The coconut milk expressed from the freshly harvested coconuts is fermented for approximately 48 hours. During this time, the water separates from the oil. The oil is then slightly heated for a short time to remove moisture, and filtered. The result is a clear coconut oil that retains the distinct scent and taste of coconuts. This is a traditional method of coconut oil extraction that has been used in the Philippines for hundreds of years. Laboratory tests show that this is a very high quality coconut oil, with the lauric acid content often being over 53%. This oil is not mass produced, but made by hand just as it has been done for hundreds of years. Since we live in the community where the coconuts grow, we personally guarantee that the best organic coconuts available are used in producing this Virgin Coconut Oil, and that no chemicals whatsoever are used in the growing or processing of the coconuts. How is Virgin Coconut Oil different from other coconut oils? Most commercial grade coconut oils are made from copra. Copra is basically the dried kernel (meat) of the coconut. It can be made by: smoke drying, sun drying, or kiln drying , or derivatives or a combination of these three. If standard copra is used as a starting material, the unrefined coconut oil extracted from copra is not suitable for consumption and must be purified, that is refined. The standard end product made from copra is RBD coconut oil. RBD stands for refined, bleached, and deodorized. Both high heat and chemicals (e.g. solvent extractions) are used in this method. RBD oil is also often hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated. Hydrogenated oils have been shown to increase serum cholesterol levels which contribute to heart disease. http://www.tropicaltraditions.com/what_is_virgin_coconut_oil.htm -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: CS TASTE POLL -- The 3 Questions
Just to add another ingredient into the stew... I had a reference about two hard drives ago, which advanced the idea that people who experience strong metallic taste do so because of the presence of sulphur bearing (producing?) bacteria at the base of the tongue and throat. Ions should taste stronger than metals because they can interact with the taste buds more readily. Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPriorities (coconut oil)
Nothing wrong with copra Tracy, Its dried coconut meat. Passing water through desiccated coconut and pressing it out is the only way I know of to obtain coconut milk. Coconut milk is the next best thing to coconut oil, as it contains up to 20% (by memory) oil, assuming its a good brand. If it goes hard in the fridge it probably contains appreciable amounts of oil. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Nick Grant [mailto:nwgr...@inet.net.nz] Sent: Tuesday, 9 April 2002 10:04 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSPriorities (coconut oil) That sounds ominous. Copra. Has a nasty ring...:) What is it? Tracy - Original Message - From: Catherine Creel ccr...@maine.rr.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Tuesday, 9 April 2002 19:46 Subject: Re: CSPriorities (coconut oil) Hi Tracy, The brand is Trident, and it is not sweetened, or homogenised. Just coconut and water and a preservative of course. Good! But the preservative...oy vey. Also, you may want to ask the company how it's processed. My understanding is most companies use copra. Catherine -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCancer: cause and cure
Jason, I am not quite sure what you are trying to say in your message. Individual cancers cases are to be treated on their particular circumstances of course, and I did say that the internal 'landscape' needs to be altered for lasting results, and that this MAY be sufficient in and of itself. Does that make me an honest (I already know I'm not a cancer expert)? Being a vegetarian generally means that one does not have the optimum balance of minerals and vitamins, or protein to carbohydrate intake, and the intake of saturated fats is likely to be less than ideal. How much vitamin D is in the diet, how much calcium is being absorbed... there are endless questions to be answered before one can gain an idea of how a person had become susceptible to cancer, and how best to treat it. I'm sorry to hear that this person has joined the legion for whom treatment failed, and I guess she was poorly advised and made the wrong choices. But all is not lost (I hope) and with proper guidance, she may yet triumph. As to DNA repair and life extension, I'm for it! Of course, optimal cell function, I'm sure you would agree, begins with optimal nutrient balance. Be well! Ivan. -Original Message- From: AVRA / Jason [mailto:silverd...@hotmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, 9 April 2002 2:16 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSCancer: cause and cure Ivan: Point and case is a very virulent basil cell cancer I've just been made aware of. The individual has been on a strict alkaline diet now for a long time, and has been given a death sentance by the Mao Clinic. The individual is a vegetarian as well. The change in the alkaline conditions of the body have done absolutely nothing to slow the cancer growth. While this may surprise others, it doesn't surprise me. I haven't met an honest cancer expert that doesn't agree with the idea that a body alkaline environment isn't always enough. DNA repair is absolutely critical in another arena of research, life extension... I agree that as far as cancer is concerned, the direct repair of DNA is really not ideal. But when one is talking about accelerating cell functions, it is critical that one begins with optimally functioning cells. Needless to say, it really pisses me off that places like the Mayo clinic are trashing people's lives. It further upsets me that any treatment is touted as the cure, which leads the individual to stop seeking a solution, thinking that what they are doing is enough. This individual has lost an eye, and may lose another, because the cancer has not responded to treatment, and is now fully inoperable. None of all of that was necessary. Jason - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Monday, April 08, 2002 4:55 AM Subject: RE: CSCancer: cause and cure Jason, There is no point in attempting to repair mutated DNA, in my opinion. When a healthy cell develops a problem the cell self destructs, this does not happen in cancer cells and so they continue to grow. Best to kill them off. Some treatments such as polyMVA do work directly with the DNA, often allowing the cell to go into apoptosis (self destruction). The prime causes of cancers are many and varied, but the process is the same in them all. A pH of 7.4 in all fluids and tissue, except urine and stomach, with the proper calcium reserves, create conditions which make it difficult for even the worst carcinogens to gain entry to the cell. The central problem is an internal landscape which is chemically, and therefore electrically, unable to defend against mutagens. Such an internal chemistry begets an impaired immune system which is unable to repair the defects caused by ionising radiation for instance. I am sure that various electrical or EMF devices can cause an immune or physiological response, just as IR light, or sound can. Even colours or essential oils have this property, as does acupuncture or meditation or the laying on of hands. But the bottom line is that the internal landscape needs adjustment for lasting results and may be sufficient in and of itself. Regards Ivan -Original Message- From: AVRA / Jason [mailto:silverd...@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 5:43 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCancer: cause and cure Kevin: I agree with your thinking. When one central cause for something is usually found, then one central cure usually suffices; vitamic C always cures Scurvy. That is why my primary and fundamental method of treatment is based in natural medicine. Oxygen treatments don't always work, that is for certain. You move the body toward a state of improved health, while addressing identifiable and treatable conditions directly. I believe the oxygen issue is a symptom of a cause, not a cause. I believe the PH
RE: CSCitric Acid and CS
Kathie, Vitamin C has the habit of gobbling up metals, which would tend to render both useless. So probably best to separate the intake. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kathie Jones [mailto:kathiejo...@comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, 9 April 2002 2:58 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSCitric Acid and CS Has anyone read/heard/etc anything about the presence of CS and a citric based drink or food a non-no at the time of oral ingestion of CS? I read such about a year ago and since then we have been careful about ingesting CS with orange juice, vitamin C, etc since then. Thought? Insights? Kathie -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSUnidentified subject!
Thanks Ronan, Yes it seems that the negative pole of a magnet will cause the body fluids to become more alkaline. Calcium bicarbonate, normally a straight molecule, will bend and break into calcium hydroxide and CO2. The cytoplasm oscillates between pH 7.4 and 6.6 as the pores open and close and cations and nutrients enter and leave the cell. Thanks for the input... and I must say that I am seriously considering purchasing a magnetic bed underlay... what do you think? Ivan. -Original Message- From: Ronen Yehiav [mailto:y...@bezeqint.net] Sent: Tuesday, 9 April 2002 4:33 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSUnidentified subject! - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz Subject: RE: CSUnidentified subject! Hi Terry, confirm in the most, what I have learned. What does seem to be missing is the recognition of the manner in which calcium becomes bio-available. Most diseased states benefit from an increase in serum calcium levels, it is the most needed of all minerals and is involved to some extent in every bodily process, so I guess it is surprising that it is one of the hardest to absorb by modern man. The requirements for the absorption of calcium are that it is ionised (dissolved) and that the vitamin D receptors in the small intestinal wall are populated with vitamin D. In these times of little sun exposure, and sun blocks, one needs to supplement with vitamin D if one wishes to absorb 20 times more calcium than one would otherwise. To my mind it doesn't much matter which type of calcium one takes, if one remembers that calcium will form insoluble compounds with phosphorous, and it is advantageous to take malic acid in the form of apple juice which will keep the calcium ionised long enough for good absorption. The idea that two different types of calcium will react together to supply useable energy I find suspect, especially considering that this will take place in the stomach. Up to this point, I agree completely: The ONLY variable I found which consistently affects calcium absorption is cellular metabolism. This primary life - force process has a direct relation to the cellular magnetic charge, which must be negative. This is, BTW, an alkaline state of the cytoplasm. Any other state of charge disrupts cellular metabolism. When this happens, calcium absorption is not the only thing that goes wrong. The easiest, most consistent way I found to help the body recharge itself is through day - time charging of the sternum point with a powerful negative pole of a permanent magnet. If the body has a significant load of parasites, Zapping may help. I get magnets from www.magnetizer.com (they also have a very educational book), and I get zappers from www.worldwithoutparasites.org which I found to be the best there are, for several reasons. Ronen. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPriorities (coconut oil)
Read here: www.coconut-info.com Copra has lost the benefits of the coconut. Catherine No it hasn't. Here are a couple of links found at www.coconut-info.com as suggested. http://www.apcc.org.sg/special.htm Earlier this year, at a special conference entitled, Functional Foods For Health Promotion: Physiologic Considerations; EXPERIMENTAL BIOLOGY '99, Renaissance Washington Hotel, Washington, DC Saturday, April 17, 1999, which was sponsored by the International Life Sciences Institute, ILSI NORTH AMERICA, Technical Committee on Food Components for Health Promotion, the term functional foods was defined as a functional food provides a health benefit over and beyond the basic nutrients. This is exactly what coconut and its edible products such as desiccated coconut and coconut oil do. As a functional food, coconut has fatty acids that provide both energy (nutrients) and raw material for antimicrobial fatty acids and monoglycerides (functional components) when it is eaten. Desiccated coconut is about 69% coconut fat, as is creamed coconut. Full coconut milk is approximately 24% fat. http://www.coconut-info.com/weight-loss.htm The second thing you should do is use other coconut products as much as possible. Find ways to use fresh and dried coconut. You can find recipes in cookbooks. Coconut milk is a wonderful item that can be used in a wide variety of dishes. It can replace cowÂ’s milk and cream in most any recipe and tastes great. Some of the dishes I make using coconut milk include butterscotch pudding, coconut milk pancakes, clam chowder, chicken almondine, and creamy coconut gravy, to mention just a few. Coconut milk that you buy in the can is not sweetened so it can be used for a wide variety of main dishes or desserts. With delicious meals like these, dieting can be a pleasure, and because there are no calorie restrictions to worry about, it can easily be maintained for life without feeling hungry or deprived. When combined with a high-fiber diet, using coconut oil and coconut products can have a remarkable effect on your weight and your health. For more detailed information about using coconut products to lose unwanted weight I recommend the book Eat Fat, Look Thin: A Safe and Natural Way to Lose Weight Permanently. This book outlines a dietary program based on coconut and includes numerous delicious recipe The second thing you should do is use other coconut products as much as possible. Find ways to use fresh and dried coconut. You can find recipes in cookbooks. Coconut milk is a wonderful item that can be used in a wide variety of dishes. It can replace cowÂ’s milk and cream in most any recipe and tastes great. Some of the dishes I make using coconut milk include butterscotch pudding, coconut milk pancakes, clam chowder, chicken almondine, and creamy coconut gravy, to mention just a few. Coconut milk that you buy in the can is not sweetened so it can be used for a wide variety of main dishes or desserts. With delicious meals like these, dieting can be a pleasure, and because there are no calorie restrictions to worry about, it can easily be maintained for life without feeling hungry or deprived. When combined with a high-fiber diet, using coconut oil and coconut products can have a remarkable effect on your weight and your health. For more detailed information about using coconut products to lose unwanted weight I recommend the book Eat Fat, Look Thin: A Safe and Natural Way to Lose Weight Permanently. This book outlines a dietary program based on coconut and includes numerous delicious recipe Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPriorities (coconut oil)
No, you were drinking coconut water. Pretty good for you too. The best sports drink never manufactured. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Wednesday, 10 April 2002 2:45 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSPriorities (coconut oil) I thought coconut milk was the liquid inside of a coconut. Broke a coconut last week and drunk some myself. Marshall -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSUnidentified subject!
Hi Terry, I read your message with interest.. I have found Reams' theories to be a very difficult to critique mainly because he invented his own scientific jargon. However, his treatments appear to be valid and confirm in the most, what I have learned. What does seem to be missing is the recognition of the manner in which calcium becomes bio-available. Most diseased states benefit from an increase in serum calcium levels, it is the most needed of all minerals and is involved to some extent in every bodily process, so I guess it is surprising that it is one of the hardest to absorb by modern man. The requirements for the absorption of calcium are that it is ionised (dissolved) and that the vitamin D receptors in the small intestinal wall are populated with vitamin D. In these times of little sun exposure, and sun blocks, one needs to supplement with vitamin D if one wishes to absorb 20 times more calcium than one would otherwise. To my mind it doesn't much matter which type of calcium one takes, if one remembers that calcium will form insoluble compounds with phosphorous, and it is advantageous to take malic acid in the form of apple juice which will keep the calcium ionised long enough for good absorption. The idea that two different types of calcium will react together to supply useable energy I find suspect, especially considering that this will take place in the stomach. Once in the body calcium is transported into the blood by calcium-binding proteins which are stimulated by vitamin D, and from the blood the deposition in the bones is controlled by the calcitonin hormone released from the parathyroid gland. Calcitonin, along with inositol triphosphate control both the deposition and removal of calcium from the cells. The parathyroid glands are controlled by the pituitary gland, which lies behind the eyes, and is stimulated by FULL spectrum light, whilst inositol triphosphate is stimulated by cellular photoreceptors. So it can be seen that sunlight is a basic need for proper bodily function and instrumental in the absorption and distribution of the most important body constituent, calcium. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Terry Chamberlin [mailto:tcj...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 7:48 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSUnidentified subject! I was wondering why there is such a difference between ones Urine PH, and Ones Saliva PH. Also, which one would give a correct indication of the body's Alkaline/Acid content.. Thanks, Grant.. The following is to address the pH issue, from the literature I give to all my clients. It is intended here for informational purposes, not as a marketing ploy. The Calcium Connection Determining which calcium your body needs Nowadays there is a lot of talk about our need for calcium. You will see products from milk to orange juice with the words Calcium Added! prominently displayed on the label. Nearly everyone knows how a lack of calcium can contribute to such health issues as arthritis and osteoporosis. Nearly everyone also knows that calcium levels have decreased significantly in our modern food, which is commercially grown in mineral-poor soil. To get enough calcium, most people recognize the need to take calcium supplements. But when you go to the pharmacy or a health food store, it can become confusing. You see all kinds of calciums. There is calcium carbonate, lactate, citrate and gluconate, which are on almost every shelf. Then there are the less well-known calciums such as calcium phosphate, sulphate, aspartate, orotate, hydroxide, plus others with names too difficult to pronounce! It makes you wonder: Are some kinds of calcium better than others? Does it matter which kind of calcium you take? Is it possible to take too much calcium? Can calcium hurt you? Do the various kinds of calcium affect the body in different ways? According to the late Dr. Carey Reams, bio-chemist and bio-physicist, our bodies need a balanced variety of calciums. He spent over 50 years studying and researching the affects of various calciums and other minerals on the human body. He found that there are essentially three categories of calciums to be considered: Alkaline-pH calciums (calcium hydroxide, phosphate and carbonate), Acid-pH calciums (calcium lactate and sulphate) and neutral-pH calciums (calcium citrate, aspartate, gluconate, etc.). pH, as used here, refers to the acidifying or alkalinizing effect upon the body. The body needs calcium from each of these groups in order to achieve balance for good health. Frequently people have an adequate amount of one kind, but a deficiency of the other. The presence of both acidifying and alkalinizing calciums is important because the interaction between the two is how both kinds are assimilated. Without enough of one kind, there is a poor assimilation of the other. Imagine taking a cup of vinegar and a cup of baking soda. If you dump
RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response
Hi Kevin, Yes both high and low pH will kill cancer cells, indeed cancer cells kill themselves by producing large quantities of lactic acid. The acid drops the pH to a point where the cell can no longer function. A cancer mass is a core of dead cells surrounded by a skin of actively growing cancerous tissue... it is not the mass itself which kills the host, but the toxins leaking from the dead centre. Cesium or rhodium salts by their physical nature are able to enter cancer cells but are unable to get out, and being the most alkaline of all metals will raise the pH to a level which also kills the cancer, neutralising the acidic toxins as they go. This is called High pH Therapy and is something that I offer to people who ask me for help. Manfred von Ardennene, of Otto Warburg's students advances a therapy which relies on the massive uptake and use glucose to feed cancer cells, thus lowering their pH: In Europe, the sugar feeds cancer concept is so well accepted that oncologists, or cancer doctors, use the Systemic Cancer Multistep Therapy (SCMT) protocol. Conceived by Manfred von Ardenne in Germany in 1965, SCMT entails injecting patients with glucose to increase blood-glucose concentrations. This lowers pH values in cancer tissues via lactic acid formation. In turn, this intensifies the thermal sensitivity of the malignant tumors and also induces rapid growth of the cancer. Patients are then given whole-body hyperthermia (42 C core temperature) to further stress the cancer cells, followed by chemotherapy or radiation.19 SCMT was tested on 103 patients with metastasized cancer or recurrent primary tumors in a clinical phase-I study at the Von Ardenne Institute of Applied Medical Research in Dresden, Germany. Five-year survival rates in SCMT-treated patients increased by 25 to 50 percent, and the complete rate of tumor regression increased by 30 to 50 percent.20 The protocol induces rapid growth of the cancer, then treats the tumor with toxic therapies for a dramatic improvement in outcome. The irrefutable role of glucose in the growth and metastasis of cancer cells can enhance many therapies. Some of these include diets designed with the glycemic index in mind to regulate increases in blood glucose, hence selectively starving the cancer cells; low-glucose TPN solutions; avocado extract to inhibit glucose uptake in cancer cells; hydrazine sulfate to inhibit gluconeogenesis in cancer cells; and SCMT http://www.mercola.com/article/sugar/sugar_cancer.htm As Terry Chamberlain has pointed out, too high a pH is associated with poor digestion, constipation etc. This creates a dilemna for anyone already experiencing those symptoms (I have on and off) who wants to guard against cancer. A naturopath friends advice to acidify my system by taking lots of lemon juice, and for a while calcium lactate, certainly fixed up a bout of constipation Well that may be correct, but it has to be pretty difficult to be too alkaline, unless one is a strict vegetarian, or is taking large doses of alkaline salts. Lemon juice is ultimately alkaline forming as is calcium, the lactates are well tolerated by all except those with low pH. You may have been calcium deficient. Glad your on the move now though. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 1:54 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response Thanks Ivan. As you say, a big question. Low cellur pH then seems to be a chief cause of cancer initiation. Does that mean that raising cellular pH will reverse the process once cancer has set in? As Terry Chamberlain has pointed out, too high a pH is associated with poor digestion, constipation etc. This creates a dilemna for anyone already experiencing those symptoms (I have on and off) who wants to guard against cancer. A naturopath friends advice to acidify my system by taking lots of lemon juice, and for a while calcium lactate, certainly fixed up a bout of constipation. regards, Kevin Nolan - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 10:09 PM Subject: RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response Hi Kevin, You ask a BIG question, which requires time to marshal a response. Does anaerobic metabolism cause cancer? Warburg had quite a bit to say about oxygen and cancer, but I am not sure that he gave an answer to that question. What he did find in cancerous tissue was impaired or defective mitochondrial processes. It is in the mitochondria that cellular energy processes occur, normally by the oxidation of glucose with the products being ATP, CO2 and water. The process proceeds through a glycolysis phase which produces a small amount of ATP and lactic acid. The lactic acid would then be oxidised further with a much larger production
RE: CSPriorities
The anti-microbial action of pure virgin coconut oil is but a bonus to its real benefits. The fact that CNO is a saturated short chain fat means that it normalises cholesterol levels, does not deplete the bodies reserves of antioxidants as do polyunsaturated fats, does not form toxic trans-fatty acids, is protective of the heart, liver and vascular systems, increases metabolism, causes weight loss and so on. It is the healthiest of all the fats. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Russ Rosser [mailto:russros...@rovin.net] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 2:02 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSPriorities Raw coconut oil? There was a HUGE thread about coconut's anti-microbial properties some time ago. The lists harps on saturated fat. Cancer was unknown among Eskimos whie their diet was up to 90% fat, in the form of RAW whale blubber, etc. Even the word eskimo means 'eats it raw.' --Russ -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCancer: cause and cure
Jason, There is no point in attempting to repair mutated DNA, in my opinion. When a healthy cell develops a problem the cell self destructs, this does not happen in cancer cells and so they continue to grow. Best to kill them off. Some treatments such as polyMVA do work directly with the DNA, often allowing the cell to go into apoptosis (self destruction). The prime causes of cancers are many and varied, but the process is the same in them all. A pH of 7.4 in all fluids and tissue, except urine and stomach, with the proper calcium reserves, create conditions which make it difficult for even the worst carcinogens to gain entry to the cell. The central problem is an internal landscape which is chemically, and therefore electrically, unable to defend against mutagens. Such an internal chemistry begets an impaired immune system which is unable to repair the defects caused by ionising radiation for instance. I am sure that various electrical or EMF devices can cause an immune or physiological response, just as IR light, or sound can. Even colours or essential oils have this property, as does acupuncture or meditation or the laying on of hands. But the bottom line is that the internal landscape needs adjustment for lasting results and may be sufficient in and of itself. Regards Ivan -Original Message- From: AVRA / Jason [mailto:silverd...@hotmail.com] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 5:43 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCancer: cause and cure Kevin: I agree with your thinking. When one central cause for something is usually found, then one central cure usually suffices; vitamic C always cures Scurvy. That is why my primary and fundamental method of treatment is based in natural medicine. Oxygen treatments don't always work, that is for certain. You move the body toward a state of improved health, while addressing identifiable and treatable conditions directly. I believe the oxygen issue is a symptom of a cause, not a cause. I believe the PH issue can be both a symtpom and a cause. I believe the DNA issue can be a symptom and a cause. Solvents and other chemicals in the body can be a cause. Radiation can be a cause. Deficiencies can be a cause. Electromagnetic pollution can be a cause. In all of my experience with cancers, the one central theme I have noticed is that all cancer has been demonstrated ( to me ) to be an immune system deficiency. I've heard it said that cancer can be an immune system over-response, but this is not my experience. Dr. Robert O. Beck's research makes the most sense to me, as his observations fit soundly with all the symptoms and causes of cancer that I am aware of. The central problem is cell differentiation, the causes are multitudinous. If it is a DNA problem, then the cancer will have to be destroyed, or the DNA repair mechanisms corrected. If the DNA is shortened, how are any of these so-called cancer cures going to affect an absolute change, without eliminating the cells? The answer is that they aren't. The individual is going to die, despite internet websites touting six hundred thousand cancer cures. There are very few researchers capable of direct DNA repair. What about modified DNA? Oxygen therapy isn't going to correct this, neither is a proper PH balance. The cancer is going to create the conditions that promotes its own survival, and it is VERY capable of doing so, as it is a primitive cell structure. The body is not going to recognize the cancer as an invasive agent. The dead person won't be able to tell the world of all the failed alt cancer cures tried, and the families are usually to embarrased to speak out. The ongoing DNA repair work, on many levels, shows extreme promise. The methods are through scalar wave technology and other multi-dimensional energy approaches. I'm involved in some aspects of this type of research, which is still years away from true practical application. Sonic waveforms show great promise. The problem is that the technology that can accurately measure subtle forms of energy is just now becoming readily available. The technology allowing complete measurement of DNA sequencing has also been slow to surface. The problem here is that weapons applications has kept much of this technology non-commercial. Since it costs hundreds of thousands of dollars just to obtain the basic equipment needed, independent research has been very slow due to a complete lack of funding outside of defense applications. Those involved in such research applications ( myself included ) cannot share too much along these lines, because the hundreds of thousands of dollars in measurement equipment rapidly translates to millions of dollars in applications equipment... If the primary interests are not protected, then there would be no research at all. True, repeatable medical applications are still quite a ways off, at any rate. But
RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response
Indeed, But I was describing the Krebs cycle which takes place in the lumen of the mitochondria and is about the production of adenosine triphosphate (ATP) via firstly glycolysis and finally oxidation of lactic acid, the product of the first stage. The second stage produces about 5 times more ATP than the first. The ATP is then available as an energy source for cellular function by reduction to the species you mention. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Malcolm Stebbins [mailto:s...@asis.com] Sent: Monday, 8 April 2002 5:52 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response I Anderson wrote: Hi Kevin, You ask a BIG question, which requires time to marshal a response. Does anaerobic metabolism cause cancer? It is in the mitochondria that cellular energy processes occur, normally by the oxidation of glucose with the products being ATP, CO2 and water. The process proceeds through a glycolysis phase which produces a small amount of ATP and lactic acid. The lactic acid would then be oxidised further with a much larger production of ATP, CO2 and water. Warburg found that the second phase did not occur in cancer cells, Hi, don't mean to be picky but I thought the energy cycle went from the high energy compound adenosine triphosphate to the lower energy one, adenosine diphosphate, and sometimes further to adenosine monophosphate, or AMP; yes? Take care, Malcolm -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response
Hi Kevin, You ask a BIG question, which requires time to marshal a response. Does anaerobic metabolism cause cancer? Warburg had quite a bit to say about oxygen and cancer, but I am not sure that he gave an answer to that question. What he did find in cancerous tissue was impaired or defective mitochondrial processes. It is in the mitochondria that cellular energy processes occur, normally by the oxidation of glucose with the products being ATP, CO2 and water. The process proceeds through a glycolysis phase which produces a small amount of ATP and lactic acid. The lactic acid would then be oxidised further with a much larger production of ATP, CO2 and water. Warburg found that the second phase did not occur in cancer cells, leading to the rise in concentration of lactic acid (and therefore lowering of pH), and found that mitochondria was impaired in some way. I think he believed that a lack of oxygen caused mitochondrial damage, but others disagree, the fact remains, however, that where there is lactic acid build there is anaerobic energy production, whether this is in the presence of oxygen or not. What causes a cell to become cancerous in the first place is the mutation of dna (be it cellular or mitochondrial) or some impairment of cellular process, notably the expression or manufacture of proteins and enzymes, from nucleotide building blocks. A normal pH ensures the breakdown glucose into the A, C, G and T nucleotide radicals that promote healthy DNA synthesis, and severely limits the ability of mutagens to cross the cellular membrane where they might cause some mutation. If the extracellular plasma is more acidic than optimum the intracellular fluid must also drop below normal (pH6.6) to maintain the appropriate potential across the cellular membrane, not only does this allow the passage of mutagens, but also impairs proper nucleotide production. These events may cause cells to mis-function and develop cancer. When the pH of a cancerous cell lowers sufficiently, the pores on the cellular membrane do not work correctly (they are driven by potential difference between the inside and the outside of the cell, which is related to pH). This restricts the passage of oxygen but not of glucose. So one can see a number of events which can lead to the ceasing of oxidative respiration, leaving only glycolysis (fermentation) as the source of energy for cancer cells. The formation of cancerous tissue is not a function of available oxygen per se, that is just a corollary of the process. So does anaerobic respiration cause cancer..., no, anaerobic respiration is a result of the physiological conditions that cancers cause, ie, mitochondrial damage and disfucntional membrane pores by way of low pH. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Thursday, 4 April 2002 1:33 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response The oft repeated claim from the alternative healing sector that cancer cells operate via a fermentation metabolism and thus are susceptible to oxygenation (Warburg hypothesis) is appealing and I hope true. Stephen Barret of Quackwatch has justifiably received bad press here re CS safety. But that doesn't mean he gets it all wrong. On the matter of cancer cell metabolism, the following from http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/Cancer/oxyge n.html is worth some serious pondering: Does anaerobic metabolism cause cancer? In a 1961 monograph [7], Aisenberg reviewed and analyzed the subject of energy metabolism in normal and tumor tissues. He concluded that most carcinogens are not respiratory poisons; most respiratory poisons are not carcinogens; oxygen neither prevents nor inhibits cancer growth; tumor cells grow optimally in tissue culture dishes in atmosphere containing 20% oxygen; tumors grow rapidly in tissues that are well supplied with oxygenated blood; absence of oxygen does not stimulate tumor growth in vitro or in vivo; agents effective against cancer interfere with DNA synthesis, not with aerobic metabolism; tumors do not get a significant amount of their energy from anaerobic metabolism; tumors can and do produce energy by an oxygen-driven metabolism of fats and carbohydrates. Since the mid 1960s, information amassed has identified cancer initiation, promotion, and progression. Alteration of genetic regulation through DNA damage, oncogene activation, and inhibitor dysregulation give rise to abnormally proliferating cancer cells. There is no evidence of poisoning in the respiratory enzyme systems of tumor tissues. Although Warburg discovered some differences in metabolism between normal and cancer cells, research did not bear out what he considered to be the primary cause of cancer, i.e., the replacement of respiration by fermentation.[7]. Worth reading the rest of that article also. Comments anyone? Kevin
RE: CSBody PH..
Grant, The kidneys are part of the pH regulation system and will extract hydrogen ions from the blood plasma in order to lower the plasma pH, thus raising the pH of the urine accordingly. The saliva mirrors blood pH, and while affected by food and may give false readings, it is pretty accurate if one tests the saliva 3 hrs after putting anything in the mouth, and draws two or three fresh lots into the mouth and swallows it before testing. 11AM is a good time for doing this according to Robert Barefoot, who also suggests repeating the measurement on successive days and averaging the result. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Grant [mailto:g...@island.net] Sent: Sunday, 7 April 2002 10:02 a.m. To: Silver - List Subject: CSBody PH.. Hi there: I was wondering why there is such adifference between ones Urine PH, and Ones Saliva PH.. also which one would give a correct indication of the bodys Alkaline/Acid content.. Thanks Grant.. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response
Marlene' 1,3 1,6 beta glucans are natural sugars extracted from primarily yeast cell walls, but are also found in oats, barley, mushrooms etc. They work by stimulating and making your immune system more efficient. Vitamin C taken in conjunction further potentiates the immune system. There has been a lot of research into this substance, but not much interest shown by the medical profession. Quite big in the cosmetics industry though. Works well in resolving skin cancer. Some reading for you follows... Regards - Ivan. http://www.tldp.com/issue/184/Yeast%20Derived%20Beta.htm Glucan anti-tumor effect can be local or systemic. A local injection of beta-1,3-D-glucan suspension into melanoma lesions has been shown to successfully resolve the tumor locally (Mansell, 1978). In these human experiments, the site of injection revealed no previously established tumor, but plenty of macrophages filled with pigments. Obviously, macrophages were drawn to the site where they phagocytized and destroyed pigment-bearing tumor cells. These intralesional injections in some cases were able to control further growth of remote metastasis of the same tumor which resumed growth after glucan treatment withdrawal. Unfortunately, no clinical applications were developed out of these results until recently (Carrow, 1996). The latest data contains very promising information, not only in regard to human melanoma, but also to basal cell carcinoma. http://www.arrowheadhealthworks.com/B13GRsh.htm http://neuro-www.mgh.harvard.edu/forum_2/CongenFiberTypeDisproF/9.28.9 97.58PMMEDICALPROOF.html -Original Message- From: Marlene Hanson [mailto:mlehan...@msn.com] Sent: Thursday, 4 April 2002 7:07 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response Hi Ivan, What is 1, 3, Beta Glucans and would this work for skin tumors? Thank you Marlene - Original Message - From: I Anderson Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 4:27 AM To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response Jason, just some comments on some of your message. When a tumor forms, it is very difficult to eliminate through dietary means alone, when the dietary changes do not directly address the tumor growth. The problem is a bioelectric one. Dr. Becker demonstrated that a tumor, and cancerous cells in general, are the most positively charged of all tissues. Bioelectrics, chemical potential, pH are all measures of the same thing from different perspectives. Cancer cells are the most positively charged of all cells because they are the most acidic. Being acidic means a high concentration H+ ions (high positive charge and low pH). Cancer cells become highly acidic as a result of nutrients crossing from a more acidic than normal extracellular fluid (plasma) which causes a break down in the cellular channels which in turn does not allow oxygen to pass into the cell. Without oxygen energy production changes from oxidation to fermentation, the product of which is lactic acid which accumulates and thus causes a large drop in pH. Diet plays a great part in the pH of the extracellular fluid. Cancer cells cannot grow in alkaline environments, because in these environments oxygen is abundantly available and mutated cells either lie dormant or die. Calcium is the most important mineral in maintaining a healthy and buffered serum pH, and ultimately the bioelectric condition of tissue. Vitamin D is essential in the absorption of calcium. A diet which pays attention to these facts, and is otherwise sensible, will be well protective against cancer. Large cancerous growths can be pretty readily eliminated through the high pH method, skin cancers respond well to this also, or can be well treated by the injection of 1,3 beta glucan into the base of the cancer mass. I personally don't see the point of attempting electrical treatment, but wish you luck, and look forward to discussing a successful treatment. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScan anyone offer help
See my previous post Joanne. Also take a look here: http://www.polymvasurvivors.com/ Ivan. -Original Message- From: Joanne [mailto:sam...@snowcrest.net] Sent: Thursday, 4 April 2002 5:30 p.m. To: silver list Subject: CScan anyone offer help A friend sent me this letter he received from a friend and asked if anyone over here might have any suggestions.. Thank you Joanne Hey... well, I found out today and its not great but its not ... well, its not great... its called synoval sarcoma. It originates in bone so my fears of it spreading TO bone was silly because it started there. I'm going to MD ANDERSON next thurs on the 10th and will go thru some tests... I know they will test the rest of my body (mri) to see if its spread and if not (WHICH I'M REALLY REALLY REALLY HOPING NOT) then we will begin with an operation. I will have to have my radius removed as well as much of my muscle. I spoke with the surgeon about rebuilding and he didn't look hopeful that it would be a possibility because of all the nerve damage that will occur. A numb limb is a useless one and dangerous to have in many ways... so I will wake up to one of two scenarios: the most likely is that my arm will be removed just below or with the elbow, or (unlikely) will have a skinny sickly scary looking tiny long thin arm below the elbow that we'll reconstruct. It all depends on what they find inside so this all stinks!. I'm angry but I'm becoming QUITE enlightened... I'm becoming crystal clear about a lot that would have taken me many many years to understand. I wish I could explain the changes in my perception and reality but words fail. Just know I'm getting a lot of positive things out of this. Sarcomas aren't killed off easily at all by chemo which is why the removal thing is necessary with them... high percentages of ppl who ever have a sarcoma will get reoccurring ones. But for now if it hasn't spread and the cancer is removed from my arm I will be cancer-free. I'm lucky because its not my leg... or my pancreas or something like that, if its just my arm... I'm also lucky that it isn't my RIGHT arm. I'm lucky to have people who care so much about me and My town is lucky Im not a postal worker. hahahaha just kidding. Actually I'll just take everything one step at a time... I figure if I'm going to the hosp on the 10th I'll have tests, then the surgery very very soon after, and chemo and, possibly, radiation. woo hoo. fun. eek! Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts. I'm going to be ok. This is just hard. heck. I did labor, right? :) love, Laura. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSurinary track infection
Malcolm, The pH of the blood plasma lies within the range of 7.3 to 7.5, this is a critical range outside of which it is difficult to sustain life. There is a system of buffers and defences which inhibit the extremes in plasma pH. One of the most important is the mobilisation of calcium from the bones to bond with (and thus neutralise) those acidic compounds which would otherwise cause a drop in plasma pH. Unfortunately, most calcium complexes are insoluble at these pH levels, which are, after all slightly alkaline, and so precipitates and stones form. One way to overcome this problem in the short term is to supplement with alkaline forming foods or supplements, which supply those more caustic elements sodium and potassium. Sodium and potassium will replace calcium in precipitates and render them soluble, so that they might then be excreted by the kidneys. In the long term, preventative measures which will ensure all round good health, might include limiting phosphate consumption (red meat, carbonated drinks etc.), vitamin D supplementation which ensures the bioavailability of calcium supplementation, sunshine or at least full spectrum light each day to ensure the hormone production for proper calcium regulation. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Malcolm Stebbins [mailto:s...@asis.com] Sent: Wednesday, 3 April 2002 9:03 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSurinary track infection Hi, I don't go along with your comment that an acidic environment in the urinary tract is linked to bladder or kidney stones, in fact I think it's just the opposite. Generally the stones are a compound of calcium, and can even be dissolved by adding acidic solutions to a chunk of one. There may be something, or some form of stone, I don't know about, or maybe there is some bodily reaction to the constant presence of an acidic environment, so if you have knowledge about some specifics I'd like to learn of them. Quite often, bacteria hide inside the stones, thus avoiding total destruction by the usual antibiotic regimen, and after even months of pills they return when the ABX are gone and in a few days to a week or so, there you are, yucky pee again. Malcolm Kathie Jones wrote: I suppose, any variance from a standard range of normal is what the bacterium that are often the culprits for urinary tract infections are fond of. Other bacteria may well favor a more acidic environment that what is * normal * and decreasing acid levels would discourage their staying. Too much acid in *some* people, over a period of many weeks or months, is linked to kidney stones. BUT...often there is something else going on that is encouraging this * i.e. consumption of too much soda *high carbonic acid levels*, genetic predisposition, imbalances in other parts of the bodies digestive or endocrine system. All in all, it goes back to Vit C helps the body's immune system *kick in* and kick out bacterial invaders, and is known to be especially efficient at combating UTIs when combined with cranberry. I stopped using cranberry juice, and switched to tablets a long time ago as the sugar in the drinks actually did the urinary system a disservice when trying to fight and infection. I have had HUGE success when doing this for myself, my daughter, hubby and my dog. :-) Gotta keep all the family members happy! *G* Kathie Hm... I was always under the impression that bacteria, and viruses liked to live in an Acidic environment Grant.. Kathie Jones wrote: LOTS of vitamin C and CS will do amazing things! :-) And don't forget cranberry tablets. The cranberry keeps the bacteria that is causing the infection from being able to * adhere * to the urinary system walls, the C makes the urine acidic * the bacteria like an alkaline environment*, and the CS will kill the bacteria off. Kathie -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSSilver Compounds and electrobiological/electromagnetic response
Jason, just some comments on some of your message. When a tumor forms, it is very difficult to eliminate through dietary means alone, when the dietary changes do not directly address the tumor growth. The problem is a bioelectric one. Dr. Becker demonstrated that a tumor, and cancerous cells in general, are the most positively charged of all tissues. Bioelectrics, chemical potential, pH are all measures of the same thing from different perspectives. Cancer cells are the most positively charged of all cells because they are the most acidic. Being acidic means a high concentration H+ ions (high positive charge and low pH). Cancer cells become highly acidic as a result of nutrients crossing from a more acidic than normal extracellular fluid (plasma) which causes a break down in the cellular channels which in turn does not allow oxygen to pass into the cell. Without oxygen energy production changes from oxidation to fermentation, the product of which is lactic acid which accumulates and thus causes a large drop in pH. Diet plays a great part in the pH of the extracellular fluid. Cancer cells cannot grow in alkaline environments, because in these environments oxygen is abundantly available and mutated cells either lie dormant or die. Calcium is the most important mineral in maintaining a healthy and buffered serum pH, and ultimately the bioelectric condition of tissue. Vitamin D is essential in the absorption of calcium. A diet which pays attention to these facts, and is otherwise sensible, will be well protective against cancer. Large cancerous growths can be pretty readily eliminated through the high pH method, skin cancers respond well to this also, or can be well treated by the injection of 1,3 beta glucan into the base of the cancer mass. I personally don't see the point of attempting electrical treatment, but wish you luck, and look forward to discussing a successful treatment. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made.
Hi Marshall, A few comments. Firstly, whilst the concentration of chloride ions is high in the stomach and may indeed combine with silver ions to form silver chloride(solid), it drops to serum levels and below in the duodenum where most metal absorption occurs. Some of any AgCl(s) will be redissolved here in reflection of the lower Cl- concentration, probably by a couple of orders of magnitude. If the chloride concentration is higher than the Ag+ ion concentration then silver chloride complexes such as AgCl2-(aq) will be formed as well as AgCl(aq). Also other ions will compete for the chloride ion further lowering its availability. And further more, other molecules will compete for the silver ions' attention, these might include transport proteins and enzymes, and vitamin D which acts as a facilitating transport mechanism for metallic cations (M+). Of the remaining silver chloride (solid), there is no reason to believe that the size of the these molecules is too large to be absorbed, indeed at least one study shows that silver chloride readily passes through biological membranes. Therefore it is entirely reasonable to believe that a large proportion of ingested silver ions is available and absorbed. Thus absorbed, the silver ions will bond to proteins and so on, but much will still be available to replace the hydrogen in sulfhydryl groups and disable pathogen function. Silver chloride will give up silver to sulphide. If the silver load is so large that it cannot be cleared by the bodies chelating and disposal systems, and despite that to some extent no doubt, some silver will bond to tissue, where it may be reduced to silver metal by light and/or be reoxidised by light, depending upon the composition of surrounding molecules. And while to some degree the process of photography is similar, the comparison is not really appropriate, due to the dilution of the CS involved and the presence of a myriad of other molecules and chemicals. And lets be clear, particles of silver (as found in the CS you would prefer to ingest) would be a ready building block for the development of silver grains, such as you describe. In saying all this, I am presuming that one is sensible about the concentration and the amount of silver one ingests, it is entirely possible to develop argyria by taking large amounts of silver (only achievable by ingesting silver compounds) and being nutritionally deficient in some areas and/or surficient in others. I don't think any one is suggesting the ingestion 1000ppm silver citrate complex. Regards Ivan -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Tuesday, 26 March 2002 3:31 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made. Kevin Nolan wrote: Marshall; I seem to recall you making these same remarks a while back. I believe Ivan answered at that time that the response to light of concentrated silver acetate in a photographic emulsion can hardly be equated to what happens when a dilute solution is ingested in the human body. Yes, but I don't consider 500-1000 ppm as dilute. Following some negative comments by Bob Berger on the light sensitivity of CS brewed with citrate (actually, I think it was added potassium citrate, which is a very different situation), I tried an experiment. Left an old PETE jar containing ~ 20 PPM silver, brewed with excess citric acid, out in the sun over the entire summer period. The solution is still perfectly clear, with no signs of any dropout. But did you add the developer, and make the ph over 7? Without those two items, then development will not occur. If it is still acid, then it cannot occur, in fact stop bath is normally acetic acid for that reason. I am not sure of the % ionic but there is a moderate to strong TE present. By the same token, many list members have reported light sensitivity of CS brewed with DW only - a sign their technique was wrong, rather than any inherent photosensitivity with 'traditionally brewed' CS. All photsensitivity does is cause a few of the silver atoms in a compound to reduce to silver atoms. This is of virtually no consequence, the real problem is that more can reduce upon contact with the atom (or CS particle), and make it grow until it becomes stuck. This does not require light, just the right chemistry, which blood is if you drink a cup of coffee. THE REDUCTION OF A FEW IONS TO SILVER ATOMS IS OF NO CONSEQUENCE. IT IS 'DEVELOPMENT' THAT IS A PROBLEM. As far as silver citrate being 'another compound of silver' - so is predominantly ALL the CS made, whether HVAC or LVDC. The figures quoted are anywhere from 75-99 % ionic silver. Well it can't just be silver ions present - what you have is the COMPOUND silver hydroxide (dissociated in solution as ions of course, just as silver acetate is). So the arguement is whether acetate ions are somehow more dangerous than
RE: CSRE: Thrush
Craig, You might try beta glucan to control both the thrush and the candida. Dissolve some in water and rinse the mouth... this can be used in conjunction with other remedies. ionic silver is more likely to be helpful than particulate... however adding a few drops of H2O2 to particulate silver (colloidal) will make it clear and ionic. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Craig Chamberlin [mailto:c...@itsmyplace.com] Sent: Wednesday, 27 March 2002 9:04 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSRE: Thrush Greetings list members, My sister has metastasized breast cancer. The cancer isn't killing her but the inability to eat and drink because of the Thrush. We can get the candida which underlies the Thrush, if we can just get the Thrush under control in her mouth so she can eat and drink. We have used high concentration CS (from Frank Rey, thank you for making this available), white oak bark and some allopathic swish swallow which didn't do anything...but neither did the others. We have been advised that 3% H2O2 is effective, won't know until tomorrow when she comes home. We are treating her for thrush with a 6C EM+ machine as well, but to no avail. Mostly because she keeps getting dehydrated and it seems to deter the Rife Effect. I am wondering about a 5% Hydrochloric acid solution. I desparately need a thrush buster that works and works fast. She is small and has always been thin, so not much in reserve. Thanks for your help, Craig -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSsuspension
A single 9v battery makes pretty good CS, current runaway does not seem to be a problem until you hit about 15ppm, just takes a lng time. I would suspect the water if fallout continues after a couple of days. Ivan -Original Message- From: Ode Coyote [mailto:coy...@alltel.net] Sent: Friday, 29 March 2002 12:26 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSsuspension While I haven't experimented with a single nine volt battery, i would suggest starting with the electrodes fairly close and spreading them apart every 10 or 15 minutes up to 2 or 3 inches at finish in order to keep the current draw low. If it turns significantly yellow..or any color at all, shorten the run time and reduce current. I presume you are using distilled water and no salt? My idea is, if it falls out, it's not colloidal silver. So, let every batch settle and pour what's left off the top and use that. A laser pointer will tell you there's plenty of silver still suspended. Colloidal silver is not light sensitive, contrary to popular belief. A clear plastic pop bottle or clear glass works just fine for storage. I suggest buying or making a current controlled generator. http://www.silverpuppy.com [basic and inexpensive, turns itself off, nice package] Ken http://www.silvergen.com [works well and has bells and whistles, turns itself off and has variable controls] Trem http://www.wishgranted.com [don't know much about it but seems like it's OK] Vince Attached is a current control circuit that can be made for less than $5 Ken So now of course I now make my own and because of friends have to make a lot. I use a small 9 volt battery powered generator. Mostly this is fine, however sometimes I have noticed that after 7,8 days the silver particles fall out of suspension and the fluid has to be shaken. Can anyone please help me on this matter? All my tools are glass except for some plastic spoons. I store the output in brown glass bottles out of direct sunlight. Is 9volts enough, should I use a mains transformer? How far apart should the silver rods be spaced. What is the ideal water temperature. Any help will not go unnoticed. To conclude, I will be in New York around the middle of April and would like to contact any subscribers in the NY area for a chat. DH -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSTahitain Noni
Hi Catherine, You will find that a major active ingredient of Noni, barley, oats, mushroom, Aloe, wheat grass, yeast and more, is the polysaccharide 1,3Beta Glucan. There has been many studies done on this substance, but because of its very high price (until recently) it is not widely known. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Catherine Creel [mailto:ccr...@maine.rr.com] Sent: Thursday, 28 March 2002 2:42 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSTahitain Noni Gladys it all depends on what you were taking the Noni Juice for. One bottle will not tell you a thing we are a society that is promised magic pills by conventional medicine, and although nthey don't deliver, we have been indoctrinated into thinking this way so still look fro the magic pill in everything we try. The benefits of Noni are well-documented. Below are two of nineteen studies found at PubMed on Noni--Catherine Ann N Y Acad Sci 2001 Dec;952:161-8 Cancer preventive effect of Morinda citrifolia (Noni). Wang MY, Su C. Department of Pathology, UIC College of Medicine, Rockford, Illinois 61107, USA. mianw...@uic.edu Morinda citrifolia (Noni) has been extensively used in folk medicine by Polynesians for over 2,000 years. It has been reported to have broad therapeutic effects, including anticancer activity, in both clinical practice and laboratory animal models. The mechanism for these effects remains unknown. The hypothesis that Morinda citrifolia possesses a cancer preventive effect at the initiation stage of carcinogenesis was studied. Our preliminary data indicated that 10% Tahitian Noni Liquid Dietary Supplement or Tahitian Noni Juice (TNJ), made from Morinda citrifolia fruit by Morinda Inc, in drinking water for one week was able to prevent DMBA-DNA adduct formation. The levels of DMBA-DNA adducts were reduced by 30% in the heart, 41% in the lung, 42% in the liver, and 80% in the kidney of female SD rats. Even more dramatic results were obtained in male C57 BL-6 mice: 10% TNJ was able to reduce DMBA-DNA adduct formation by 60% in the heart, 50% in the lung, 70% in the liver, and 90% in the kidney. In order to explore the mechanism of this preventive effect, the antioxidant activity of TNJ was examined in vitro by lipid hydroperoxide (LPO) and tetrazolium nitroblue (TNB) assays. In the LPO assay, LPO oxidizes leucomethylene blue to methylene blue in the presence of hemoglobin. The resultant blue color was quantified at 660 nm spectrophotometrically. In the TNB assay, superoxide anion radicals (SAR) reduce TNB into formazan blue that was also measured by absorption at 602 nm. TNJ showed a dose-dependent inhibition of both LPO and SAR in our system. The antioxidant activity of TNJ was compared to the effects of vitamin C, grape seed powder (GSP), and pycnogenol (PYC) at the daily dose per serving level recommended by U.S.RDAs or manufacturers. The results suggest that prevention of carcinogen-DNA adduct formation and the antioxidant activity of TNJ may contribute to the cancer preventive effect of Morinda citrifolia. PMID: 11795436 Phytother Res 1999 Aug;13(5):380-7 An immunomodulatory polysaccharide-rich substance from the fruit juice of Morinda citrifolia (noni) with antitumour activity. Hirazumi A, Furusawa E. Department of Pharmacology, John A., Burns School of Medicine, 1960 East West Road, University of Hawaii, Honolulu, HI 96822, USA. The fruit juice of Morinda citrifolia (noni) contains a polysaccharide-rich substance (noni-ppt) with antitumour activity in the Lewis lung (LLC) peritoneal carcinomatosis model. Therapeutic administration of noni-ppt significantly enhanced the duration of survival of inbred syngeneic LLC tumour bearing mice. It did not exert significant cytotoxic effects in an adapted culture of LLC cells, LLC1, but could activate peritoneal exudate cells (PEC) to impart profound toxicity when co-cultured with the tumour cells. This suggested the possibility that noni-ppt may suppress tumour growth through activation of the host immune system. Concomitant treatment with the immunosuppressive agent, 2-chloroadenosine (C1-Ade) or cyclosporin (cys-A) diminished its activity, thereby substantiating an immunomodulatory mechanism. Noni-ppt was also capable of stimulating the release of several mediators from murine effector cells, including tumour necrosis factor-alpha (TNF-alpha), interleukin-1beta (IL-1beta), IL-10, IL-12 p70, interferon-gamma (IFN-gamma) and nitric oxide (NO), but had no effect on IL-2 and suppressed IL-4 release. Improved survival time and curative effects occurred when noni-ppt was combined with sub-optimal doses of the standard chemotherapeutic agents, adriamycin (Adria), cisplatin (CDDP), 5-fluorouracil (5-FU), and vincristine (VCR), suggesting important clinical applications of noni-ppt as a
RE: CSTahitain Noni
Lucy, If you re-read my message you will find that I noted that beta glucan is a major active ingredient (perhaps I should have said constituent) of all these foods. The positive health benefits that these foods elicit will be due, at least in part, to the beta glucans. In writing that message, I was inviting people to investigate the properties of this rather amazing substance. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kimdane [mailto:kimd...@shaw.ca] Sent: Friday, 29 March 2002 3:18 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSTahitain Noni Ivan the ingredients of Morinda Tahitain Noni are: Reconstituted Morinda citrifolia fruit juice from pure juice puree from French Polynesia, natural grape juice concentrate, natural blueberry juice concentrate, and flavours from all natural sources. Protein 0 gr Fat 0 gr Carbohydrates 3 gr Energy 10 cal None of the ingredients you listed are in Morinda Tahitian Noni. Morinda started producing noni juice. Since then other companies have come on board but none have been able to be equal. Lucy Giesbrecht, Kimdane Reg Barf Fed Great Danes Tahitian Noni Juice An Exotic Health Discovery Winnipeg, Mb. Canada kimd...@shaw.ca ICQ 57495753 - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz Hi Catherine, You will find that a major active ingredient of Noni, barley, oats, mushroom, Aloe, wheat grass, yeast and more, is the polysaccharide 1,3Beta Glucan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made.
Still here Kevin, lurking in the background. Don't have much time these days ...working on various projects. One is building a lab beneath my new residence. There is nothing on-line about this, I took my information from the patent and my own investigations. I have not tried diluting a concentrated solution, but see no reason for it not to be perfectly stable. The only question that I have yet to answer, is just how readily the silver becomes biologically available, but I should imagine at concentrations below 285ppm the question is not relevant as the ions are solvated and not complexed with the citrate (I presume). Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Monday, 25 March 2002 1:41 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made. Hi Ivan, Was wondering whether you were still on the list. Are you aware of any on-line references on this matter? What happens when such a concentrate is diluted with water to various concentrations? Is the complex unstable at lower concentrations? regards, Kevin Nolan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CS250ppm fulvic acid ionic silver, good or not?
Dear Tang, I see no problem with the ionic silver, but I am personally wary of fulvic acid. Fulvic acid is a type of humic acid as found in various soils, and as such its composition and action varies from place to place. FA is a clathrate or chelate and a strong solvent, which may penetrate all parts of the body. Some FA has been found to be beneficial and some found to be implicated in various bone and liver disease. Please search the archives for 'fulvic acid' for some of the information I have posted on this subject in the past, so that you might be better informed. Kind regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Huajun Tang [mailto:huajun_t...@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, 25 March 2002 7:01 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CS250ppm fulvic acid ionic silver, good or not? Hello everyone, After reading the discusion on 100-500 PPM CS and how it's made, I begin to worry the 250ppm ionic silver made with fulvic acid that I am using to treat my candida problem. Is there any safty problem with this ionic silver? Any information will be highly appreciated. Thanks Huajun Tang -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSHi Ivan
Hi Arnold, Nice to talk to you again! Happy to repost, but not quite sure of the particular ones you had in mind. I have two (see below) which explain the rational behind current limiting, and I shall try to find my calculations of the current density. Kind regards Ivan. Hi Arnold, I think we need to start on common ground, so I will go through the process as I understand it...you probably know all this anyway. The power supply and the electrolysis cell form a circuit. The cell consists of an electrolyte and 2 electrodes. Current is able to flow in the circuit when cations are able to leave one electrode and anions contact the other. Electrons cannot flow in a liquid and so travel via the power supply connections. In the case of a silver anode (positive electrode), at a certain potential a single electrons will be removed from silver atoms creating Ag+ silver ions. These cations, as they are known, enter the liquid electrolyte and drift towards (and some will eventually contact) the cathode where they are supplied with the electron they need to become metallic silver once more. The current able to flow in the circuit is wholly dependent upon the conductivity of the electrolyte, that is the number of ions that are able to complete the circuit. Distilled water is a very poor electrolyte but above 0.71V hydrogen will reduce (gain electrons) at the cathode while silver requires 0.80V to oxidise (lose electrons) at the anode. This is what drives the reaction at start up. Silver is oxidised at the anode, supplying electrons, and hydrogen gas is generated at the cathode receiving electrons. The limiting factor at this time is the number of hydrogen ions able to be ripped from the water molecules, and this is a function of the current flow and so of the applied potential. As silver ions enter the solution and ultimately reach the cathode they are also reduced as the reduction potentials of hydrogen and silver are similar, and reducing hydrogen leaves a charged hydroxyl anions in solution which adds to the accumulation of charged species, hence the current increases. The reason that silver accumulates in the solution at all, even though the same number of electrons oxidised at the anode must be reduced at the cathode, is that the later is shared between hydrogen and silver, that is more silver ions enter the system than leave it. What I am leading to Arnold, is that to achieve an acceptable concentration of silver ions (10 -20 ppm in my opinion) one must accept a certain amount of plating out on the cathode, and that the process is not futile past this point as silver keeps accumulating as long as hydrogen gas is evolved at the cathode. Now, in order to generate a product that is of the smallest particle size one must allow the silver ions to hydrate, to become surrounded by water molecules so that they resist the attractive forces that are generated between like ions and limit the aggregation that otherwise occurs. Limiting the current limits the amount of ions generated at any moment, increasing the chance of quick hydration and dispersion. There is a certain current density at the electrode that when exceeded leads to an inferior product. The trouble with limiting the current of course is, as the resistance of the cell decreases so does the voltage. It is the voltage which determines the type of electrolysis that will proceed (it is possible to remove more than one electron from a silver atom if the voltage is high enough). I feel that being able to control the voltage across the electrodes will eventually lead to a better product. The only way I can think of to do this is by PWM which although, as you rightly note, is a method of controlling power input, it does so at a particular voltage (yes?) and is also a method of limiting current. PWM would also have the advantage of the pulse - drift movement of the silver ions, further increasing the chance of better hydration and dispersal. and In anticipation of your question, let me give a little more information. The velocity of an ion in an electric field is the product of the field strength E(Vcm^-1) and its electrophoretic mobility U(cm^2 V^-1 s^-1). The ion is instantly accelerated to the velocity where the resistive forces (viscosity of medium etc.) equal the attractive forces, where upon the ion travels at a constant rate. v = EU(cm s^-1) For silver ions (effective radius of 0.15nm) U = 6.4 x 10^-6. Larger ions = slower speeds. Higher charge = higher speeds. So at a field strength of 1Vcm^-1 the velocity = 6.4 x 10^-6 cm s^-1 which is very slow unless you are an ion. Obviously it is not the voltage that is the main diffusion factor in CS production but thermal or mechanically induced currents. The link below (part of a marvellous body of work) gives a gentle insight into the world of electrode dynamics, and the treatment of the electrolyte solution as a resistive and capacitive load.
RE: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made.
Yes Marshall you are correct, the solubility of silver citrate is 280ppm. However it is thought that the silver-citrate complex formed by the electrolysis of silver in a citric acid solution is either a zwitterion where the negative charge is on the complex itself (Ag+CA-) where the total charge of the complex is neutral, or the empty 5s orbital of Ag+ overlaps with the delocalised .pi. bond on one of the carboxyl groups of citric acid. This concentration of silver is found when generated into a 10% citric acid solution, higher citric acid concentrations allow higher silver concentrations. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Sunday, 24 March 2002 6:48 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made. That is interesting. The solubility of silver citrate is 280 ppm. And of course the silver content of that would be less than the whole molecule. I wonder what the other part is doing. Marshall Kevin Nolan wrote: I recall Ivan Anderson stating he had managed to electrolytically produce ~ 1000 PPM CS (probably an ionic complex) via citric acid addition. Here is an excerpt: however it is known that brewing in a citric acid solution enables one to increase the silver content to more than a thousand ppm Kevin Nolan - Original Message - From: Russ Rosser russros...@rovin.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2002 8:30 AM Subject: Re: CS100-500 PPM CS and how it's made. herbalhealer.com also has 500 ppm. If it can't be made electrically without agglomeration, perhaps it's distilled down from a reasonablly concentrated batch?? --Russ -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSOne last reversal experiment
Ivan - why the big difference(17.7 compared to 10-11) Steve, Could be that my multiplication factor is a bit high and the margin of error of the conductivity meter (2% of full scale?), also you are subtracting the starting conductivity reading from the end reading, which is not something that I do (half of that reading will be due to cations which will most likely plate out on the cathode). If we look at the rise in conductivity: straight run 0.8uS - 10.9uS a rise of 13.6 times. switched run 0.8uS - 6.4uS a rise of 8.0 times. vs. drop in resistance calculation: straight run 220KOhms - 15K4Ohms a drop of 14.3 times switched run 209KOhms - 27K7Ohms a drop of 7.6 times we can see a good correlation between the two measurements (if it were not so then something would be seriously wrong). Perhaps my 'silver factor' should equal the conductivity meter adjustment factor. Any way, good experiment, thanks a lot... this result is in line with what I have predicted. If you sill have the batches, could you do something for me? Could you add a few drops of H2O2 (equal amount to an equal amount of each) and see if one fizzes or becomes more cloudy than the other, This is a simple test for the presence of metallic silver particles. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: S J Young [mailto:you...@konnections.net] Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2002 6:00 p.m. To: Silver List Subject: CSOne last reversal experiment Hello again, Recently I reported results of comparing CS production of a control batch with constant current same polarity verses a batch produced with constant current but relay switched voltage reversals. Brew time was 4 hours with constant 30 RPM paddle stirring. The result was the reversed batch was about 55% weaker than the control batch. Ole Bob did his best to convince me I did something wrong, and that the strength of the two batches should have been about the same. I thought perhaps I was trying to make too strong a brew, and I should cut down the brew time. So I did another experiment as follows: Both cases were run for 3 hours with constant stirring at 55 degrees F starting with 0.8 uS DW. I use an electronically regulated constant current of about 1.11 ma. I didn't have quite enough voltage to draw the full 1.11 ma at the run starts, but the current was 1.11 ma for the majority of the 3 hours. Both brews look the same as the original DW-perfectly clear. Here are the results. 1) Control (no reversal): Some gunk sluffed off the wires. Starting V=174.1 i=0.79 ma. Starting Resistance=220KOhm Ending uS=10.9, V=17.4 i=1.13. Ending resistance=15.4KOhm uS gain due to silver ions =10.9-0.8=10.1. Using Ivan's Frank Key's Trem's conversion factor of 1 to 1.1, the PPM is 10.1 to 11.1. Using Ivan's recently posted formula, PPM for ions =1.3 * Rstart/Rend = 17.7. Ivan - why the big difference (17.7 compared to 10-11)? 2) Reversal: Polarity switched each 60 seconds which Ole Bob says gives the best results. Wires got black but no gunk sluffed off. Starting V=171.4 i=0.82 ma. Starting R=209KOhm Ending uS=6.4, V=31 i=1.12. Ending R=27.7KOhm PPM ala recent Ivan formula is 1.3 *209/27.7=9.8. uS gain due to silver ions=6.4-0.8=5.6. So PPM ala Trem et al is 5.6-6.2. So this batch is 5.6 uS/10.1 uS * 100 = 55% weaker. So, sadly, I again conclude polarity switching produces significantly weaker ionic silver concentrations. The first experiment showed that if the reversed brew time is doubled, the strength was still not as much as the non-reversed case, and black pepper-like particles began to fall off the wires. Again, I conclude that I don't see any advantage to polarity switching which justifies the extra complexity. I don't mind a bit of gunk sluff-off as I am able to decant off almost all the brew and leave the gunk behind in the jar. Someone else can continue with polarity reversal experiments - I think I have performed my last one. --Steve Young -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSLiving Water CS
Ah yes, this is what I thought also, until I realised that the ionised hydrogen referred to is the H- hydride. http://www.h-minus-ion.org/ any one take a guess at the method by which the magic jug works? http://www.h-minus-ion.org/Methods-to-modify-ORP-water-1.html Hmmmagreed! Ivan. -Original Message- From: M. G. Devour [mailto:mdev...@eskimo.com] Sent: Thursday, 7 February 2002 11:59 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSLiving Water CS Re: CSLiving Water CS Hi: There are things that can be done to water that affects it's surface tension and hydrogen ion concentration. For instance, bubbling ionized hydrogen gas through water, increases the pH and makes hydrogen available as the ultimate antioxident. I can understand H+ being an antioxidant, but wouldn't that *lower* the pH, ie. make it more acidic? Or is the Cl in HCl that makes an aqueous solution acidic? Damn. Chemistry class was a looong time ago. Hmmm... Interesting. Mike D. [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@eskimo.com] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSLiving Water CS
One way to re-program water is to freeze it. This forces the molecules to adopt a structured lattice. Thawing in sunshine is good. Magnets, vortexes, ozone or what ever can then be applied. BTW, if one skims the first formed ice, one can remove the deuterium (D2O) component (for better or worse), as it freezes at a lower temp. Ivan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSBubbler System for CS and Commentary
Yes, you are right except in regards to stability. Whilst the silver can't disappear, it can plate out on to the sides of the container, or flocculate and settle out. Being a manufacturer of CS, I probably have different expectations of a quality CS than most users, to me stability is paramount as the label must reflect the contents of the bottle even after sitting on the shelf for a year or more. I also need to be prepared for some authority testing the contents for purity. However, I am the first to say that it is practically impossible to make a CS that is not effective, no matter how simple the generator... I am not one who believes that particle size is of great importance, 1nm or 50nm, it all seems to work... its just that the smaller the particle size the more stable the colloid. I should also note, that when I measure CS I measure the ionic content primarily because that is what I endeavour to produce. Glass bottles are intuitively the best container, but this is not necessarily so. Positive ions (cations) will plate out onto glass, and inert plastics are probably a better choice. Pure CS should not be light sensitive. Apart from electron microscopy, or 20nm syringe filters, there is no cheap particle sizing. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Jeffus [mailto:marshalljef...@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, 30 January 2002 7:12 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: RE: CSBubbler System for CS and Commentary Please consider the following discussion as coming from a limited background, based on what little I know about CS: the quality of CS is not determined by ppm, but by particle size and purity. Solution ppm shouldn't typically change, even over long term, as the silver can't just disappear. However, it can clump into larger particles (due to cohesive forces), rendering it ineffective. It can also combine molecularly with contaminants in the solvent (water) or the container, which makes a good case for using inert (glass) bottles. Also, keep in mind due to light degradation. Particle size can be tested, but not without cost. Btw does anyone know of an inexpensive particle size tester? I think it's lab equipment, not a handheld like a TDS meter. Would appreciate anyone who can either affirm or correct the above information. I Anderson i...@win.co.nz wrote: I guess it's a case of what ever works for you! I have 10L of 3 year old CS, slight golden colour, that tests as having the same concentration (22ppm) as the day it was made. And it was made without any stirring at all, apart from the occasional hand stirring during the 2.5 days it took to make it! Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCS Fulvic Acid
Ric, I can only direct you to the message I sent on the 25th which contained some summaries and links to further info. Some fulvic acid is implicated in liver cancer and bone problems, some fulvic acids seem beneficial. Knowing which is which is not something I am willing to trust to the market. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Ric Stoll [mailto:r...@townsqr.com] Sent: Thursday, 31 January 2002 4:36 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: RE: CSCS Fulvic Acid Ivan, do you have a source for the following opinion? I have been considering ingesting fulvic acid but sure wouldn't want to if it's detrimental. Thanks much. Ric -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSCS - HIV
CS does kill the HIV in the test tube. There are individuals who have reported a drop in viral load as a consequence of ingesting colloidal silver. Here is a link to some good results: http://www.health-truth.com/articles/hiv03.asp There was some work done with electrodes inserted directly into the arteries, with dramatic results, I suspect IV would produce similar results. There are many other approaches... interestingly virgin coconut oil has or is being tested in the Philippines, about 4 tablespoons a day seems to produce good results. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Douglas De La Roca [mailto:ddelar...@nationalpeo.org] Sent: Thursday, 31 January 2002 4:41 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSChecking..JUst Ignore.. Hello ! I have a question and not sure who can help...but anybody giving any information will be of great help. I been researching CS for a quiet a while now... My question is How effective is CS with HIV+ if there a simple treatment or prove that it even works? Please any comments on this email at stalin2...@aol.com Thanks so much for any help... i am 24 year old male...trying to understand this medecine. thanks DD -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCS Fulvic Acid
Marlene, No I don't think so are you thinking of malic acid? Fulvic acid is one of the humic acids produced in the ground by the decay of vegetable matter. It is a chelator, and is responsible for the movement of toxic metal pollution from place to place. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marlene Hanson [mailto:mlehan...@msn.com] Sent: Thursday, 31 January 2002 6:35 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCS Fulvic Acid Hi Ivan, Isn't Fulvic Acid part of apple cider vinegar? I am currently taking apple Vinegar for digestive and circulation problems. Thank you Marlene
RE: CSCS Fulvic Acid
Yes Nancy, that is my opinion, and further, I would not personally take any product that contained fulvic acid. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Black [mailto:dbl...@cfl.rr.com] Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2002 9:35 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSCS Fulvic Acid Thanks, Ivan. so what you said is that Fulvic acid is both unnecessary and ill advised for use with CS? Nancy... -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold.
I think monoatomic gold has all of its electrons, they are just arranged a little differently ...hard to tell ;-) Ivan. -Original Message- From: Russ Rosser [mailto:russros...@rovin.net] Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2002 8:12 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. Russ, In this case it is the ionic form that is toxic. The ionic gold needs to be reduced to metallic gold before ingestion. ...Unless it's in monatomic form, of course! :^) -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSbubbler solution?
A very good idea Willy Thanks! Ivan -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Tuesday, 29 January 2002 6:06 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSbubbler solution? Hi, Would it not be good to when using a bubbler to pump it trough DW to purify the air, then into the CS maker? Here is how I would make it: Take a glass container +-1/2 liter with a quick-lock lid. Then take 2 pieces of copper tubing 1/4 diameter. drill two holes in the lid and solder one tube in the hole so that it almost reaches the bottom of the container; The second tube is soldered in the second hole so that it sits to about 1/4 from the top of the container. Fill the container with DW until 3/4 of the top. close the container and connect the lower pipe to your air supply. Then the upper tube is connected to the bubbler in the CS maker. If you now start pumping, then the air bubbles and is washed in the first tank and then travels to the SC. Satchid, -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCS and hospital use.
Annie, The difference between CS and silver nitrate is the nitrate. Silver ions as supplied by both CS and silver nitrate are benign, but the nitrate is caustic to tissue. Highly diluted silver nitrate has been used to good effect for many years in preventing nasty infections passed from mother to baby during birth, but prolonged use of silver compounds, especially silver nitrate, can be hazardous to health, if not for the tissue damage, then by the large amounts of silver that can be ingested or absorbed in the form of compounds (as opposed to the very small amounts of silver delivered by colloidal silver). Ingestion of large amounts of silver can lead to the cosmetically disfiguring condition known as argyria, in which silver ions bound to tissue, especially skin or eye, may be photo-reduced to silver metal and cause a greying or bluing of the skin. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Tuesday, 29 January 2002 4:44 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCS and hospital use. Annie Hall wrote: Anyway, as an absolute newby can someone say what is the difference, in simple English, between silver nitrate and CS please? Big difference. Silver Nitrate is a compound, and colloidal silver is the pure metal in very small custers. An undeveloped film contains silver compounds (such as silver nitrate or silver chloride), and the developed photograph contains very small silver particles, similar to a colloid. Thus if silver nitrate is exposed to light, and a developer such as caffine, it will develop into silver particles which will appear black. Not a good thing. Silver nitrate is also toxic, whereas silver metal and colloid is not. Some theories as to how silver kills bacteria relay on it's catalytic propterites. colloidal silver is a very good catalyst, but silver nitrate is a very poor catalyst. Marshall -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSNewbie
Dan, Even the most modest generator will make acceptable colloidal silver, be it clear yellow or golden. The primary difference will be in the shelf life of the output. None of it will be harmful to ingest. For a given concentration, clear CS will have the smallest particle size, then yellow, gold through to grey. Aim for a light colour with a strong beam (Tyndall Effect) as shown by a laser pointer shone through the solution, until you are familiar with the process and its nuances. Many people have been helped by CS made in a glass with two silver electrodes draped over the side, connected to 1, 2 or 3 9V batteries. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Dan Williamson [mailto:danw6...@mail.cannet.com] Sent: Tuesday, 29 January 2002 7:29 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSNewbie I have only started looking at CS as a possible alternative to conventional treatment for skin cancer. There seems to be so much conflicting information on the net as to low voltage CS preparation that I have hesitated making any. Are there any web sites out there that give accurate information? Some sites say that the finished product will be slightly yellow to golden in color the next day while others say it will be clear. Could someone clarify this for me as I intend to use the CS internally as well and I certainly don't need to use something that is usless or harmful, this old body of mine is the only one I have. Thanks -dan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSBubbler System for CS and Commentary
I guess it's a case of what ever works for you! I have 10L of 3 year old CS, slight golden colour, that tests as having the same concentration (22ppm) as the day it was made. And it was made without any stirring at all, apart from the occasional hand stirring during the 2.5 days it took to make it! Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Tel Tofflemire [mailto:telt...@home.com] Sent: Tuesday, 29 January 2002 4:47 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSBubbler System for CS and Commentary Brooks I have been using the fish tank bubblier, and sometimes a Alpine Ozone Gen. for Cs, and I knew in my deepest of my being it was ok...I tested it by making with bubblier and with out, I could plainly see by my necked eyes that bubbled CS was better, it doesn't loose PPM setting on the shelf, and it stayed clear or maybe just a faint bit light purple color, but on first look appears perfectly clear..white background reveals a tint of purple. ..Thank you Brooke for taking the time...\ Tel Tofflemire Phoenix, AZ -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCS Fulvic Acid
Some info on fulvic acid, which is a type of humic acid. http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m22663.html http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/m26609.html Ivan -Original Message- From: Black [mailto:dbl...@cfl.rr.com] Sent: Friday, 25 January 2002 4:43 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSCS Fulvic Acid While searching for some CS info for someone who wants to know exactly what CS is I came across a web site called Healix which claims that by adding Fulvic Acid to silver ions you get a better delivery of the CS to the bloodstream. Anyone heard of this? nancy... -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSfish aquarium air bubbler
Marshall, You seem so sure that silver oxide exists in CS solutions ...why? There is little, if any, molecular oxygen atoms in d. water, and none produced at the anode, if silver is being ionised there as silver ionises at 0.79V as opposed to the 1.6V (or there abouts) required to rip oxygen from water molecules. It is my understanding that the colour of CS solutions is a result of the particle size. The greyish build up on the cathode is simply reduced silver ions, ie silver metal fluff. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Jeffus [mailto:marshalljef...@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2002 1:08 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSfish aquarium air bubbler Thanks for the excellent suggestion. Perhaps the bubbler whisks away silver before it has a chance to burn. If that's the case, it's the movement of water that's important. Burnt silver - that's silver oxide, of course, which adds color to CS. The darker the color, the more of it, so I understand. Also, what do you notice in the way of oxide buildup on the electrode: the grayish solid stuff. Less or none? What is your generator type? LVDC or otherwise, what voltage/amperage. I'm new to all this and trying to find out what is the best setup. One other thing: what is your concentration (ppm). My understanding is that the clearer the liquid, the finer the particles. Thanks for replying. Like I said, I'm new to all this and am really grateful for any input any of you may have out there on getting a quality generator up and running. Thanks, Marshall PS Melvin Wolf says that adding a very small drop of honey in distilled water helps a lot. Something about how it fixes the electrical/magnetic properties of the water and allows for good conduction without adding electrolyte. Saw this on a web site. What do you know about this? Tel Tofflemire telt...@home.com wrote: Marshall Jeffus , I use a small fish tank bubbler, in a 2 qt glass jar. I get crystal clear CS using the bubblier, and it stays clear. I put the bubblier in the bottom of the jar, I use oxygen rated hose designed for breathing bottled ox. with a stone defuser on bottom to slow the flow and make tiny bubbles. Some on the list said it was not the best way to do it, so I tested for 2 days 48 hrs. using bubblier and not , my best CS was using the bubbler...with out I got particles so large you could see them , with bubblier, crystal clear.good luck... Tel Tofflemire Phoenix Marshall Jeffus wrote: Please, more info on this aquarium air bubbler. How is it used in the process? Do the air bubbles run over the silver electrodes? DJG ql...@tds.net wrote: I have heard this affects the CS while making it. Any comments? -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold
Willy, Is the conductivity of your solution increasing? Ivan -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2002 12:04 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: CScolloidal gold Dear listers, Is it necessary to have a colored CG to have a working solution? Is it not as with CS that if more color (yellow for silver) that there is more particles clustered together. I find that when making CG that there is already a good strong TE before the color is visible. Thank willy -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSfish aquarium air bubbler
Marshall D, Thanks for your reply, and thanks for the informative link g Try this, for an insight to the process of electrolysis, just substitute Ag (0.79V) for chlorine at the anode. http://scifun.chem.wisc.edu/chemweek/cl2naoh/Cl2NaOH.html Silver hydroxide can only degrade if it is a compound and not dissolved ions Ag+ and OH- . If water is being reduced to H2 gas at the cathode (0.83V) then most likely silver is not (0.79V). H2 gas is formed at the start of the process when no silver ion are available for reduction, and intermittently throughout the generating process when Ag+ concentration is low in the cathode vicinity, or so I theorise. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Marshall Dudley [mailto:mdud...@execonn.com] Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2002 4:58 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSfish aquarium air bubbler I Anderson wrote: Marshall, You seem so sure that silver oxide exists in CS solutions ...why? There is little, if any, molecular oxygen atoms in d. water, and none produced at the anode, Hun? Electrolysis produces oxygen at the anode. http://webhome.idirect.com/~famistew/hydrogen/electro.htm if silver is being ionised there as silver ionises at 0.79V as opposed to the 1.6V (or there abouts) required to rip oxygen from water molecules. In the later stages of production, if the current is allowed to go way up, I have seen bubbles produced at both electrodes. If hydrogen is being produced at the cathode, then 1/2 as much oxygen HAS to be produced at the anode. You can't produce one without the other beyond the absorption level of water. It is my understanding that the colour of CS solutions is a result of the particle size. Absolutely. The greyish build up on the cathode is simply reduced silver ions, ie silver metal fluff. I think there is silver oxide when the process is run too long. First when that happens the CS will get a bitter taste which I associate with being alkaline. With silver, hydrogen and oxygen as the only elements present, silver oxide and silver hydroxide are the only compounds I know of that can do this. Theoretically silver hydroxide could be made at the cathode, and silver oxide at the anode, where there is lots of free monoatomic hydrogen or oxygen. Silver hydroxide spontaneously degrades to silver oxide rather quickly, so I believe that there can be trace amounts of it present in CS that is overdone, and that is what contributes the bitter taste. Marshall -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold.
Russ, In this case it is the ionic form that is toxic. The ionic gold needs to be reduced to metallic gold before ingestion. Has any one thought of LVDC or LVAC arcing under water ...why does it need to be HV? Ivan -Original Message- From: Russ Rosser [mailto:russros...@rovin.net] Sent: Wednesday, 23 January 2002 4:30 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. Yes, salts can be toxic; however, a theory I've had about other ionic compounds may apply here: If gold chloride naturally dissolves into an ionic solution in water, then the chloride might be separated out by means of a water ionizer. In 2000, the CS list had a thread about dietary minerals wherein Duncan initiated a sereis of posts titled, It's the ionic form that really works. Simultaneously, a discussion was underway regarding a good calcium supplement. While various (expensive) brands were mentioned, I got the idea of buying CHEAP (50 lb. bags of) calcium magnesium chloride, dissolving them in water and running that through a polarizer to achieve an aqueous solution of pure Ca+ and Mg+ (and OH-). Now those machines can be outrageously expensive, so I began musing over how I might build one. The platinum coated electrodes, which catalytically protect the (usually titanium) substrate against acidic corrosion, are the prime expense, so I was investigating alternatives (carbon rods, iridium compounds, conductive polymers) when more mundane concerns took precedence...but it still might be worth pursuing and pertinent to CG. Thoughts? --Russ - Original Message - From: Marshall Dudley mdud...@execonn.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 9:21 AM Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. I want to warn everyone that gold salts are reported to be quite toxic I believe. So be careful that you have NO salts left. (I have not verified this information, it came from a doctor discussing gold shots for people who have arthritis) Marshall Kevin Nolan wrote: Thanks again Ivan. Any thoughts on the best reagents to precipitate gold as colloid, concentrations to use etc? Looks like we're homing in on something here - possibly that thing at the end of the rainbow! regards, Kevin Nolan - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Monday, January 21, 2002 8:06 PM Subject: RE: CScolloidal gold. Kevin, Yes quite cost effective. 1g of gold chloride will make 49L of 10ppm colloidal gold. In Australia you can obtain supplies here: http://www.proscitech.com.au/ ProSciTech PO Box 111 Thuringowa Qld 4817 Australia Street Address: 37 Framara Dr, Kelso, 4815 C106 Gold Chloride AU$58.00 1g 10% discount for 10 x 1g GOLD CHLORIDE hydrate H(AuCl4) :H2O. F.W. 229.79 Chloroauric acid; hydrogen tetrachloroaurate; gold trichloride, acid. Assay 99.9985%. Gold content 49%+. Used in histology for staining of nerves. This highly purified gold compound may be used for the preparation of colloidal gold sols. Golden-yellow to reddish, highly hygroscopic, crystals. Deteriorates readily in UV light, is caustic on skin, dissolves well in water and alcohol. M.S.D.S C106 Gold Chloride, 1g (ampoule) Price -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 2:50 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. Thanks, Ivan. So where does one purchase gold chloride, and is it economic compared with electrolytically making from gold wire or similar? regards, Kevin Nolan - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2002 11:28 AM Subject: RE: CScolloidal gold. Yes Kevin, But then why go to the trouble of electrically generating ionic gold when one can purchase soluble gold chloride. Chemical reduction of gold chloride by various compounds (tannic acid, sodium citrate, etc.) as you mention is the traditional way of making commercial and batch quantities of CG, as used in large amounts by the bio-chemistry industry. With the ability to regulate a uniform particle size from about 6nm +, it would seem to be the way to go. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http
RE: CScolloidal gold.
-Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Tuesday, 22 January 2002 5:03 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. A valid point. This article: http://www.belmarpharmacy.com/library/reference2a.html from a site suggested by Ivan contains references to some toxic effects of various gold salts. Pure CG is given a clean bill of health re toxicity. Might pay to steer clear of chemical methods unless accurate determination of residual salts can be made. Kevin Nolan If one uses sodium citrate, then as long as more than enough is added to reduce the gold, the only ions that could remain in solution are citrate, sodium, or chloride, all of which are perfectly harmless. Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSColloidal gold - chemical method
paper on best practice. http://www.devicelink.com/ivdt/archive/01/03/001.html Let alfalfa reduce gold(III) salts to colloid particles for you. http://www.engg.ksu.edu/HSRC/98Proceed/11Gardea2/11gardea2.pdf Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold.
Kevin, Yes quite cost effective. 1g of gold chloride will make 49L of 10ppm colloidal gold. In Australia you can obtain supplies here: http://www.proscitech.com.au/ ProSciTech PO Box 111 Thuringowa Qld 4817 Australia Street Address: 37 Framara Dr, Kelso, 4815 C106 Gold Chloride AU$58.00 1g 10% discount for 10 x 1g GOLD CHLORIDE hydrate H(AuCl4) :H2O. F.W. 229.79 Chloroauric acid; hydrogen tetrachloroaurate; gold trichloride, acid. Assay 99.9985%. Gold content 49%+. Used in histology for staining of nerves. This highly purified gold compound may be used for the preparation of colloidal gold sols. Golden-yellow to reddish, highly hygroscopic, crystals. Deteriorates readily in UV light, is caustic on skin, dissolves well in water and alcohol. M.S.D.S C106 Gold Chloride, 1g (ampoule) Price -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 2:50 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. Thanks, Ivan. So where does one purchase gold chloride, and is it economic compared with electrolytically making from gold wire or similar? regards, Kevin Nolan - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2002 11:28 AM Subject: RE: CScolloidal gold. Yes Kevin, But then why go to the trouble of electrically generating ionic gold when one can purchase soluble gold chloride. Chemical reduction of gold chloride by various compounds (tannic acid, sodium citrate, etc.) as you mention is the traditional way of making commercial and batch quantities of CG, as used in large amounts by the bio-chemistry industry. With the ability to regulate a uniform particle size from about 6nm +, it would seem to be the way to go. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
Hi Kevin, You may be right, most of the current sag may well be in the build up of charge in the electrode/water double layer. And without in depth study I am not in a position to argue the toss. But it undoubtedly true that the current passes through zero at each polarity change ...how much this slows the reaction I cannot say. Here is a nice site with some info ...also on various rotating electrodes. http://www.bath.ac.uk/~chsacf/java/electrochemistry/elec/l6html/cvac.h tm Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 2:42 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSPolarity Switch Experiment Ivan - inertial effects are completely negligible in any electrolysis setup. The relaxation time (roughly a dividing line between resistive and inertial response) for ions in water is I think of the order of 10^-13 seconds or so. Even taking the electrolysis setup - container plus DW plus electrodes, as a capacitor, the electrical system relaxation time would be much less than a microsecond. The rise and fall in current is undoubtedly a consequence of the electrodeposition and subsequent dispersal of a semi-insulating deposit on the electrodes - the 'plate-out' of silver. Current fluctuation is mirroring electrode surface resistance fluctuation. regards, Kevin Nolan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
Sound like a nice unit. Thanks Trem. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Trem [mailto:t...@silvergen.com] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 7:27 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment Hi Ivan, I don't have any reference point because we never did run the units un-switched. The electrodes are only 3/8 or so apart and are corrugated for rigidity. I needed a way to either clean them manually or have them be self cleaning. I didn't think users would be very handy at cleaning them without damaging them, so, reversing current was my only option. I used close spacing to have a high gradient in the water which would force the process to start quickly using startup voltages around 70 volts. Everything was a tradeoff. We are running about twice the current density on the switching unit as compared to the un-switched one but they both seem to make the same ratio of ionic to particulate silver. Am using about 15 times the surface area of silver on the switched unit compared to the un-switched one. Beats me why they have the same ratio..maybe when one is using very low current density it just works out that way. With 4 electrodes 1.5 X 5 wetted depth connected in parallel sets so that cathodes and anodes are always sandwiched between 2 electrodes (except for 1 end electrode) we run 30 ma. I'm having a tough time explaining electrode configuration here...hope you understand my meaning. Your explanation of the sag we experience after each reversal sounds good to me. With good water flow between electrodes it is minimized however. We use a submergible pump to keep it all in motion so there isn't an area of stagnant ions between electrodes that has to be turned around. They are all in continuous motion. Trem -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSdog bites
Sounds like you've got it covered Jim. Perhaps infra-red heat lamp or LED's or laser pointer will help to heal faster. Best wishes Ivan. -Original Message- From: Acmeair [mailto:res00...@gte.net] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 10:45 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSdog bites my ex- is a volunteer at the local animal shelter, in a group that tries to adopt out the inmates. she was working with a mal-treated 12 year old, that was scared to death. it spooked on her, and bit her real bad in the face. stitches in the lip, and a lot of teeth marks just under the eye. the doc sewed her up and prescribed the standard anti-biotics. by the time i heard about it, fever had set in , along with all the swelling. she insisted on taking the anti-biotics, but did agree to drink CS, and keep a CS dampened cloth with the ice pack she is to use. i've got her to keep cleansing the wounds with a cotton ball soaked with CS, and to dring a cup of CS 4 times a day.. i think i'll tell her to cleanse the wounds with h2O2, also. any other things i could prompt her on???TIA jim, O+, S
RE: CScolloidal gold.
Well Satchid, If you look at this study, you will find that it used at much higher doses that can be supplied by HVAC method (for serious cases). http://www.belmarpharmacy.com/library/reference2a.html Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Monday, 21 January 2002 10:38 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: RE: CScolloidal gold. Ivan, Is this CG the usable in the same way as the CG made with the HVAC device? Satchid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble
Gaston, I tried bubbling with first with air and then argon. I found in using air that I was seeing a definite Tyndall Beam (TE for Alison) with many sparkles, which is not acceptable in my product. Argon was better, but too expensive, so I only use that as a pressure source for my filter (0.2um so that I can claim filter sterilisation). I find a slow mechanical or thermal stirring to result in a perfectly clear product with no TE. The selection of a very small current density is the secret of fine CS, and my small commercial generators use this to good effect, generating 15ppm in 500mls in about 2.5 hrs with no stirring required (however I do recommend stirring by hand two or three times during the run). But to be honest, I have not compared the actual silver concentration vs. conductivity of bubbled and stirred CS, which is why I only suggested an increase in conductivity due to CO2 inclusion, which never the less I believe to highly likely. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Gaston [mailto:obouc...@colba.net] Sent: Saturday, 19 January 2002 2:33 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble Hi Ole Bob I see the reply from Ivan about CS that will probably read higher when using a bubbler instead a stirrer. Have you had a chance of comparing the two to prove that pls ? I presume that Ivan has done so. Gaston = - Original Message - From: I Anderson i...@win.co.nz To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Friday, January 18, 2002 3:46 AM Subject: RE: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble Connie, A couple of thoughts come to mind: The stirrer does not mix too well. You are trying for too high a concentration. The bubbler introduces CO2 gas to the water, which will ionise and give a false (high) reading. If you are finding a change in the CS when exposed to light then it is possibly due to the quality of your water. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold.
Satchid, The standard reduction potential of gold is 1.52V Au --- Au+++ or 1.83V --- Au+. The only thing that stops this reaction occurring at near this voltage is electrode polarisation, which may be overcome in an acidic solution. Note that this method results in ionic gold and perhaps should not be taken. Regards Ivan -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Saturday, 19 January 2002 7:26 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CScolloidal gold. I tried today (probably still with the right transformers to make colloidal gold. I could not get good result. the one transformer is to low voltage (4500 V 100 ma) the other is 8000V 50 Ma. I decided to try the low voltage way again but not that low. So, I took a Diode bridge and connected the AC side directly to the main 240v then I connected the positive to the gold electrode the negative to a silver electrode. At first I had current but it stayed almost stable. Then It started slowly to go up from 1.35 ma and it is now already at 9 ma and this after about 45 minutes. For this I used no current limiting. Do you think that I have colloidal Gold? Thank You Satchid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSQuestion about saline other stuff
Hi Laura, -Original Message- From: gotoh...@aol.com [mailto:gotoh...@aol.com] Sent: Saturday, 19 January 2002 3:54 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSQuestion about saline other stuff Sorry to be so ignorant, I am definitely not good at chemistry, but my question re: saline and the concern about sodium chloride, it is only if used when making the cs, or does it also apply when mixing together such as in a nasal spray? Some people put saline in their nasal spray, I don't myself. Also, my first quart batch of cs I stored in amber bottles, the color was almost clear. The second batch I put in one of the distilled water bottles which was opaque, and the color was clearish until the next day when I had it in my truck for a couple of hours and it got kind of warm, but not hot. It changed to a grey color. Was that because of the container being too light, or the warmer temp. or a combination of both, and would it still be okay to use or should it be discarded? Could be out gassing from the container affecting the stability of the CS. There is no reason to expect clear CS with light TE to be affected by light or heat. I would not use it myself. Third batch, I put some in a clear glass, and added a little bit of salt for the chloride test, and the cs stayed almost the same, just a tiny bit cloudy. What does that indicate? That you have a percentage of silver ions in your CS, it is behaving as expected. Next question, I am planning to purchase a ppm tester, do the less expensive ones work okay? (the 25.00 price range). Please forgive my ignorance, I want to use cs for life, and want to do it right! You need a conductivity meter which measures in the 00.0 - 99.9 uS (microseimen) range. A Hanna PWT (pure water tester) or equivalent. Laura H. Regards Ivan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
Nice test Steve, thanks. What is interesting is that at polarity reversal time, the voltage rises up and settles back to the pre-switch voltage in just a few seconds. Thus one would think the production strength would not be affected more than 10% or so instead of over 50%. Well it is not the voltage that indicates the rate of silver dissolution. The current dip and restoration will be more indicative, and as Kevin mentioned, some of the energy will used in undoing what was done in the last cycle, and as he mentioned later, it is likely that a higher proportion of metallic colloid particles are produced. A test of total silver content for both runs would be very interesting. Ivan -Original Message- From: S J Young [mailto:you...@konnections.net] Sent: Saturday, 19 January 2002 4:38 p.m. To: Silver List Subject: CSPolarity Switch Experiment List, I performed the following experiment: Case 1 was to make one quart of CS using a constant 1 ma DC current for 4 hours with electrodes spaced about 2 inches and with constant stirring. Starting V= 173.7 volts, I=0.86 ma, so R = 202K. Ending V = 13.8, I=1.18 ma, so R= 11.7K. Using Ivan's formala, the PPM was 1.3*(202/11.7) = 22.4 PPM. uS measured 14.5 with Hanna PWT. At the end there was some gunk which sluffed off the wires and sunk to the bottom. Case 2 is exactly the same as Case 1, except the polarity was reversed about every 45 seconds. Start V=168, I=0.96 so R=175K. End V=30, I=1.16 so R=25.9K. PPM calculates to 8.8 and measured 6.7 uS. Both wires were black, but no gunk was produced. Both batches have very faint Tyndall effect, visiable only in a dark room. Case 1 was slightly more visible. Both were made with Wallmart DW which measures around 1 uS with the PWT. So it is obvious to me that polarity reversing definitely produces a weaker batch. Case 1 is (14.5-1)/(6.7-1) = about 2.4 times stronger, comparing uS measurements. Or, case 1 is 22.4/8.8= about 2.5 times higher PPM using Ivan's formula. Granted this was not a highly controlled experiment. One quart jar may have had a bit more residual silver which had plated out on the glass than another. I may not have filled the jars to exactly the same level, the 120 volt line voltage may have been a bit different, etc. But the difference (more than a factor of 2) between polarity reversal and not is much too large to be explained away be sloppy experiment procedures. So it appears that one must run their constant current generator a bit more than twice as long if polarity reversal is used to end up with the same PPM for no reversal. What is interesting is that at polarity reversal time, the voltage rises up and settles back to the pre-switch voltage in just a few seconds. Thus one would think the production strength would not be affected more than 10% or so instead of over 50%. So, fellow scientists, why the big drop in uS or PPM when polarity switching is used? How about if some of you repeat the experiment to ensure my findings are valid? I suspect similar results will occur even if your generator is not constant current (e.g. 3 9 volt batteries). --Steve -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSfirst batch
Hi Alison, congratulations on your first batch! It is not always possible to see any reaction at all from the electrodes, depending upon the generator set-up. But the taste test should prove whether you have succeeded or not (most unlikely not to succeed). Also you should notice that one electrode darkens and the other goes grey, and may have a film build up. A laser pointer shone through the solution will show a light beam (TE or Tyndall effect), which is another good indicator, although in some cases this will be very faint, even in a dark room. CS will be stable indefinitely or for only a couple of weeks, depending upon how it was made. When you find black fall-out on the bottom of your storage container it is probably on the way out. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: aliso...@ihug.co.nz [mailto:aliso...@ihug.co.nz] Sent: Saturday, 19 January 2002 7:17 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSfirst batch My mother and I made our first batches of CS today. ( I had made a trial batch using boiled water last week but only got my distilled water yesterday - and Mum had to wait till yesterday for me to get the generator that I made for her to her) I was very happy with mine - after about 15 mins one rod had bubbles rising from it and the other had the finest wisps coming off it so I timed it 5 mins from then. I plan on drinking 40mls a day, more if I feel myself coming down with something. My mothers batch, even after an hour she could not see wisps tho she had the rising bubbles and the tarnished rods. Can we assume that she has made CS? Yes, she did use distilled water at room temperature. She is 65 and her eyes are not as good as they once were. Maybe there is a possibility that she just didnt see the wisps as they were so fine. I would be grateful for any opinion here. What indication does one get when the batteries are going flat? Also, what is the shelf life of CS? I was wondering about putting some in a small bottle and keeping it in my handbag for any eventuality. Does anyone else do this? Is it adviseable? Alison in New Zealand -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CScolloidal gold.
Yes Kevin, But then why go to the trouble of electrically generating ionic gold when one can purchase soluble gold chloride. Chemical reduction of gold chloride by various compounds (tannic acid, sodium citrate, etc.) as you mention is the traditional way of making commercial and batch quantities of CG, as used in large amounts by the bio-chemistry industry. With the ability to regulate a uniform particle size from about 6nm +, it would seem to be the way to go. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Sunday, 20 January 2002 3:19 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CScolloidal gold. Ivan - suppose one used LVDC and an acid solution to produce ionic gold solution. Are there not chemical reduction methods that might not produce an acceptably fine gold colloid? I imagine rapid stirring may be needed when adding, eg, sodium carbonate (just guessing here). Traditional CG has been made that way I think. It would certainly avoid some of the Frankenstein HVAC requirements, including it seems boiling the water at times before completing a run. regards, Kevin Nolan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
Sorry Kevin, You did indeed say: ...a much higher ratio of true CS to ionic silver for the polarity switched case. Given your faint tyndal effect observations in both cases, that possibility seems to be ruled out. which is the opposite to what I said you said. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Sunday, 20 January 2002 2:45 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSPolarity Switch Experiment With all respect, Ivan, I think you should read again what I actually said. regards, Kevin Nolan Ivan wrote: Well it is not the voltage that indicates the rate of silver dissolution. The current dip and restoration will be more indicative, and as Kevin mentioned, some of the energy will used in undoing what was done in the last cycle, and as he mentioned later, it is likely that a higher proportion of metallic colloid particles are produced. A test of total silver content for both runs would be very interesting. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
Steve, As I understand the passage of current in aqueous systems. The passage of current is wholly dependent upon the movement of ions. As ions have size and weight, they also have inertia and drag and therefore will lag the application of potential and change in polarity. Indeed, with the change in polarity the ions must slow down and reverse their direction, therefore there will be a moment when no current flows at all, then a build up in current as the ions reach their terminal velocity. As this occurs for each change in polarity, the amount of current that flows per unit time is necessarily less for switching circuits than for non-switching circuits. I dare say it is not the resistance that changes in your solution (after all, the number of ions is the same) but rather the current, and this is the reason you notice a changing voltage. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: S J Young [mailto:you...@konnections.net] Sent: Sunday, 20 January 2002 2:16 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSPolarity Switch Experiment Ivan, Remember my generator produces a constant current, so the current can't dip at reversal. Instead, the voltage goes up to maintain the constant current. In other words, the solution's apparent conductivity goes down (resistance goes up) for a few seconds at reversal. Or, the coatings on the electrodes behave like semiconductors (partial diodes) for a while until they are restructured. I don't have a clue what is happening at the atomic level. Perhaps the ions just get confused at reversal, wander around haplessly for a while wondering why they are suddenly going the wrong way on a one-way street , they get reoriented again?? --Steve -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSPolarity Switch Experiment
-Original Message- From: Trem [mailto:t...@silvergen.com] Hi Ivan, We had AA testing done on samples from our SG6 which does not have polarity reversal and also on our SG7 which does reverse polarity and found both units produce about 85% ionic. Apparently it makes no difference...at least in our units. What now? Trem Well, that sort of destroys that theory, Trem. What now? Beats me... BTW, do you need a longer brewing time switched vs. steady, per unit concentration? Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble
Connie and Gaston, Thanks for taking the time to do those tests and post the results. It is obvious that at least some increase in conductivity is found as a result of bubbling. It could be, as you add silver ions then further CO2 may be dissolved, but whether it is worth finding out, I don't know. In any event, we now know a little more than we did before! Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble
Connie, A couple of thoughts come to mind: The stirrer does not mix too well. You are trying for too high a concentration. The bubbler introduces CO2 gas to the water, which will ionise and give a false (high) reading. If you are finding a change in the CS when exposed to light then it is possibly due to the quality of your water. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Connie [mailto:wufn...@stargate.net] Sent: Friday, 18 January 2002 11:48 a.m. To: silver- list Subject: CSquestions: stir vs. bubble I have the SG6-very happy with my generator. I have done some experiementing with the way I make my CS. I would like to compare my brew with stirring vs. bubbling and please comments as too the differences. I use a 64 fl. oz. coffee creamer container to make my CS. Some days...using the stirit seems to take longer. Not observant enough to say why one day is different vs. another. Here are the comparisons of the last two batches made: --First brew: Stirred batch. Seeded, ppm per Hanna PWT 4ppm. I cleaned electrodes (with heavy build up) 3 x's during the brew. After 36 hours of generation...the ppm per Hanna was about 18ppm. Indicator light, indicating that the brew had not reached 20pppm (as dialed) was still on. My stirred CS ALWAYS reads a lower number the next day, when retested. Often I will turn the generator back on, let it run again until the indicator light goes off. Allowed the brew to sit overnight. A lot of precipitate in the container. Did not bother to retest the ppm. ( I expected it to be lower than what measured the night before) I gave up on that brew...used it in the bathwater --Second brew: Bubbled batch-stirrer removed. Seeded DW ppm at start 4ppm. 10 hrs. later: indicator light off. I did not clean the electrodes at all. I shut down the generator. Did not test the ppm. left til this AM, testing ppm with Hanna, the ppm is 26ppm. (set at 20ppm) Some, but little precipitateelectrodes with little build up. My observed main points -bubbled CS consistently more stable after brew sits (ppm's do not fall from one day to the next) -bubbled CS consistently has less build up on the electrodes, less precipitate in the container. -bubbled CS consistently able to achieve higher ppm (per Hanna) -occassionally will get pale yellow CS with stir, never with bubbled -consistently stirred CS will turn ashen with even minimal exposure to light, bubbled does not seem to (I have not specifically ''tested'' this.) -brew time for higher ppm's consistenly quicker with bubbler. (this case 36 hours for less than 20ppm stirred vs. 10 hrs. for 26ppm bubbled) I have no clue why such a difference. I know Ole Bob you do not like the bubbler, I believe also Trem that you prefer stir Could someone explain some of these differences for me...in terms I could understand and if bubbling is not good, whywhen it appears to make a better product? TIA Connie -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSSatchid's current schematic
--- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.313 / Virus Database: 174 - Release Date: 2/01/2002 attachment: SatchidGen03.gif
CSRE: cs generator as it is now.
Yes Satchid, that came through... very nice, thank you. Couple of questions. Can you name a substitute for the 4N45 opto-isolators, can't get them here in NZ. What type of OPAmp. Does R3 = 18ohm. What power supply do you use. What does R9 control? R11 and R23? Can you name the TP's for me? Thanks Ivan. -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Wednesday, 16 January 2002 8:02 a.m. To: i...@win.co.nz Subject: cs generator as it is now. I give you what I have. if you know electronics then it will be easy for you to understand the setup. the first step controls the current, the second step the voltage. I hope that you can get it in the list. The schematic is here --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.313 / Virus Database: 174 - Release Date: 2/01/2002 -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSHow to use Beta Glucan
http://www.alphazee.com/beta-glucan/beta.html http://www.alphazee.com/beta-glucan/bg.html Beta 1, 3 D-Glucan Complex -- -- Biologically active Beta 1, 3 Glucan is actually a complex of beta 1, 3 glucan (about 70%) and other glucan linkages which allows for polybranching. Yeast derived Beta Glucan with 90% or more carbohydrate will be good product. Don't get thrown by beta 1, 3 glucan vs beta 1, 3 D-glucan they refer to the same molecule in this regard, one is a little more discriptive. 99.9% beta 1, 3 glucan is available, it is produced by bacteria, has no polybranching and is biologically inert, it is used as a food additive. The controversy surrounding test claims is discussed below. Lower purity beta glucan(70-75%) can actually be more bioavailable(more potent) and less expensive but might not be indicated for those with yeast sensitivity. -- -- Extensive notes and references on Beta Glucan Complex How to use Beta Glucan, How much Should I take? -- -- To: BetaMax Consumers From: Chip Dopson, ImmunDynamics/Chisolm Biolabs Enclosed in this packet are the results of our efforts to evaluate and document BetaMax (beta 1,3 glucan). This was done to further our knowledge and provide you, the consumer. with the confidence that you are indeed receiving the most purified and efficacious beta 1,3 glucan currently available. It is most unfortunate but true, however, that all current domestic producers of beta glucan with the exception of us, Chisolm Biological Laboratory, engage in negative discussion regarding purity and quality of one another's beta glucan instead of concentrating on improving their beta glucan. We maintain, as has been our commitment from the inception of our company twenty-two years ago, to consistently improve our products. Initially, we inquired from numerous testing laboratories their capability to test beta glucan. We found they did not have any knowledge of beta glucan but were quite willing to make an attempt at testing (this most likely is some of the same labs presently providing inaccurate or erroneous results). We eventually chose UGA Carbohydrate Research Center since I was familiar with their capabilities having graduated from their Organic Chemistry program some years back. This department ranks in the top ten in the nation and presently the golden standard worldwide for carbohydrate testing. I understand our competitors stated the purity of beta glucan presently available is between 30% and 50% and theirs is 95% to 100% pure. As you note on UGA's study (February 1997), our beta glucan is documented to show a total of 94.3%. UGA, however. has created much confusion recently since they changed the methodology of testing. This in effect has decreased tile percent results of 1,3 glucan. You will note that the results from 1997 to 1993 show an increase in terminal-link glucose and a corresponding decrease in 1,3-link glucan. Could this increase in terminal glucose be from the direct degradation of beta 1,3-link glucose? Could higher terminal link glucose mean higher branching which is indicative of higher immunological activity? These questions are presently difficult to answer, and only time and research will provide the answers. UGA stated to us that with the employment of the new methodology, the results of the 1,3-linkage of the beta glucan samples was 80% or below. In light of these results, I can only assume although all current beta glucan producers have had UGA evaluate their material that they are quite embarrassed to provide consumers with their lower-than-hyped results. We lay the results out on the table, and they are what they are. It is unfortunate that the competition seemingly cannot deal with honesty- UGA also states the linkage study can vary 5% in either direction on repetitive testing of the same sample or in essence a 10% error. I think the important issue for you, as a consumer, is to look at the composition studies, which relate to the percent carbohydrate and percent protein of the total sample- You will note that sample #1 (a production sample from a 250-kg lot) shows 99.9% carbohydrate (glucose) and a trace protein (0.1%) This denotes that in essence there is practically 100% link-glucose and only a trace of protein (yeast extracts and/or contaminants). Yon can also see on the gas chromatograph only very specific peaks, which represent the various glucose (1,3 linkage; 1,6 linkage; 2,3 linkage; 3,6 linkage, and terminal glucose), with very little extraneous material between the peaks. This data clearly and undeniably proves the purity and excellent quality of our product. Thank you. Summarized Test Results:2/19/97 2/18/98 2/18/98 #1 #2 Composition analysis: Glucose
CSVaginal Yeast Infections.
My ex was a nurse consultant in the sexual health field. She would tell her clients (off the record) to use colloidal silver for vaginal yeast infections, as it worked so well. A spray bottle seemed to be the preferred method of administration. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Craig Chamberlin [mailto:c...@itsmyplace.com] Sent: Tuesday, 15 January 2002 5:43 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com; Terry Chamberlin Subject: Re: CStainted well Terry, Have you used cs to treat vaginal yeast infections? Regards, Craig Chamberlin -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSBill Briggs letter
I think Kevin read this book, and was somewhat disappointed. Seems to be an awful lot of mumbo jumbo in this message. Not quite sure why one would align the water magnetically when one passes a relatively huge current through it later, or maybe that is what he means. Specific ion measurement = conductivity or TDS Hydrogen potential = pH Atomic absorption analysis = Atomic Absorption Spectroscopy Particle charge intensity + or - = ions or sludge? I didn't realise silver was a co-enzyme, ground breaking research? I think I remember Kevin mentioning a lack of references in this book. When prepared in the proper manner, silver colloids are capable of achieving these reactive tasks in a safe natural manner without side effects. Yes that is true. And fortunately applies to a very wide range of generating parameters, from the simple battery model to the HVAC machine. It tend to agree with your comments Terry. Is there a reason for making it appear to be really difficult... Ivan. -Original Message- From: Terry Chamberlin [mailto:tcj...@yahoo.ca] Sent: Tuesday, 15 January 2002 2:45 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSBill Briggs letter Listers, I ran across this email in my files from a Mr. Bill Briggs to a friend of mine. It seems to me that there was some discussion on the list about Mr. Briggs' ideas. From: Magic Chef Pty Ltd magicc...@bigpond.com Subject: SILVER COLLOID AUSTRALIA Dear , In response to your email of 8th November I confirm that I have written a book titled Silver Colloid The True Picture In this book I give a more informative view of silver colloid including x-rays and photographs of silver colloid produced in the market place today. The book also confirms the long term effects of using an improperly prepared colloidal silver. I am aware that many manufacturers when they test for purity only test for the purity of the silver - e.g. particle size, concentration and other metals. This only touches the surface of the purity aspect. Testing for purity should also include many other tests such as specific ion testing [anyone know what he is referring to?] and then compared to atomic absorption analysis, hydrogen potential monitoring [what? pH?], particle charge intensity [are these real scientific terms? Ivan?] and whether it is positive (loss of electrons) or negative (gaining of electrons) through the electrolysis process. [So far, it sounds to me like scientific-sounding gobble-de-gook] It is always essential to remember that the greatest potential of silver resides in its ability to act as a co-enzyme as well as a catalyst. [I'd love to see the research data on this] When prepared in the proper manner, silver colloids are capable of achieving these reactive tasks in a safe natural manner without side effects. [Argyria?] For your information production time from preparing the water [heating it up?] and aligning the water molecular matrix [setting it on a magnet for awhile?] to a completed batch of 5 litres takes approximately 90 minutes and a further 10 minutes for product analysis and Q.C. testing. Then and only then can the batch be dispensed. Regards, BILL BRIGGS Terry comments: I'll have to admit, when someone describes a process that I consider myself familiar with in terms completely out of my frame of reference, I conclude that he is either conning me, or is a genius I can't keep up with. When he implies that CS must be made just right (the way he is making it) or suffer side effects, my conclusion isn't in the genius category. Terry Chamberlin __ Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSpolluted water
Satchid, Do you have a holding tank for your water? This would be the ideal place to either generate CS in situ, or to add premade CS. Your generator design (still awaiting schematic ;-) ) would be perfect for generating in situ, assuming it resets itself when the concentration drops as fresh water is added. It is lucky that the ionic content of the water is so low to allow this, (although such a low dissolved mineral content is unusual). You could then do a series of challenge tests to determine the lowest concentration required to make the water sterile. Having said that, it may be just as easy to pump the well water through a 0.2um (micrometre) filter, which will remove bacteria, or use a reverse osmosis filter (but this is wasteful of water). UV sterilisation or ozone sterilisation might be other options worth considering. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Tuesday, 15 January 2002 1:14 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: RE: CSpolluted water sorry for the mistakes in the spelling, I repeat: Dear researchers, 2 months ago we had a well drilled 40 m deep. The geological institute in Brussels told us that there would be good drinkable water without treatment (Before starting to drill). Now the tests from the laboratory revealed that there is very bad bacteria (even bacteria that could kill someone) in the water. This is because the well is about 50 m away from a canal built for boat traffic about 100 years ago. There are very little or no salts in the water, the ion contend is 1.5 ppt. This well was very expensive to drill. Therefore we want to use it. Would an injection of ionic silver be able to make the water drinkable? If so, How would I proceed to do this? Would it be better to make the cs in the water stream in real time or inject premade cs in the water? I will appreciate every suggestion. Willy. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSpolluted water
Oh, low iron content ;-) That makes more sense...and means you would need a timed switch for the generator, or a reed switch to sense water flow. Looking forward to seeing the schematic... it is getting more sophisticated by the minute. I believe the gold electrodes should be held by a floating assembly, old Bob' may be able to help you here. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Satchid [mailto:satc...@sevaproductions.com] Sent: Wednesday, 16 January 2002 1:45 a.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: RE: CSpolluted water I am sorry for mi miss spelling of iron. It is an Iron content not an Ion content. Will send you the schematic soon. I am still purifying it. I am now working to ad the electronic polarity reversal system on it. I made a pint of sc with polarity reversing (by means of a time relay that switches over every 40 seconds). The quality is good clear as normal water. No need for cleaning the electrodes hens no extra dirt from the cleaning material that could stick to the electrodes. An other point that I have noticed is that the taste is better, Les bitter after taste. I am still locking for a way to make a HVAC unit. I know already that I have to use a neon High voltage transformer, but I know noting about the setup. Is it just to put 2 Gold electrodes in the water and apply the high voltage to it? Thank You all. Willy -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSSilver concentration estimate
I thought message I sent elsewhere would be useful here! Joe, if you calculate the resistance of the water at the start (Voltage in volts divided by current in Amps -for those that don't know), and divide this by the resistance of the water at the end... then multiply the result by 1.3, you will have a fairly good estimate of the concentration of silver ions. In the run below: start = 75V/0.00377A = 19.9KOhms end = 19V/0.00599A = 3.2KOhms 19.9/3.2 = 6.22 6.22 x 1.3 = 8.1ppm as silver ions Maybe another 1 or 2ppm as metallic silver. This formula might be of use to quite a few people... don't know why it didn't occur to me before! Ole Bob might like to refine the constant further, as he has documented more silver runs than anybody in the modern world. Regards Ivan. Hi from Joe: Did the following: 1/9/02 distilled H2O @ 74 F, short ckt current = 6.38 mA, supply source = 172 + or - 2 Vdc, R = 26 K ohms [limiter] T = elapsed time, min.Ve = electrode voltage Ie = electrode current electrodes - 5 sq inches submerged on +, 6 sq on -; spacing = 2.25 continuous mechanical stirring T Ve Ie - 1730 0 753.77 [calculated - analog meter stuck] .5 733.85 1 733.85 2 71.9 3.88 4 703.96 6 693.99 [measured - all following] 8 674.03 12 654.13 15 644.24 20 604.40 25 584.47 30 554.56 35 524.67 40 504.74 45 484.81 50 464.95 55 445.03 60 425.10 75 365.33 90 315.51 105275.57 120255.71 135235.72 150225.73 165215.77 180205.95[3 hrs] 195206.02 210195.98 240195.98 [4 hrs - variation due to 120 Vac changes] 270196.00 30018.7 6.05 [5 hrs] 360196.02 420195.96 48019.7 6.02 54019.7 5.97 600195.99 [10 hrs - end] What is your best guess at ppm concentration? Thanks. ---~- -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CShelp in getting 20mA when converting 220 AC to 110 DC
Hi Reid, I think that you are correct, that the resistance of the water and distance between electrodes will limit the current, at least at the beginning of the run. If your colleagues are saying that this will cause your unit to shut down, then you may need a shunt resistor across your electrodes or a resistor in series with one electrode. Remember that current = voltage divided by resistance. As your supply will be constant voltage (correct me if I am wrong, somebody), then the only way to limit the current is to vary the resistance. Ivan -Original Message- From: Reid Harvey [mailto:ceram...@bol-online.com] Sent: Tuesday, 25 December 2001 7:50 p.m. To: silver list Subject: CShelp in getting 20mA when converting 220 AC to 110 DC CS Friends, In the process of fabricating the electrical component for a new CS generator we are running into problems, and seek the help of those here who are knowledgeable. The generator design is after what Terry Chamberlain has so graciously supplied the list, bearing in mind we're working to stay down to 20 miliamps, as specified by Ole Bob. We are having no problem converting 220 volts AC (the standard here in Bangladesh) down to 110 DC, but cannot figure out how to support the 20mA, without converting by means of a lot of additional apparatus. I had thought that the amount of water, about a gallon, and the five inches between the electrodes would bring the amperage down to what we want, but my Bangladeshi friends are telling me this cannot happen without the system shutting down. Can someone help us to understand what to do. I feel sure we are simply missing some small piece of the puzzle. Thanks. Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CShelp!
Hi Jim, I saw your original post, and made a note to have a look at it later and filed it in the too hard basket. The trouble is with 36 volts and no current limit probably 15ppm will be the limit before things start getting murky and grey. What I suggest is that you run with 36V until you hit 3mA. That will probably take about 2 or 3 hours and give about 10ppm. Drop your voltage if you can to 18V for another hour which should be around 15ppm. Drop the voltage again to 9V for another hour for 20ppm. Another way to look at this is by resistance. Your starting resistance is E/I = 36/.00022 = 164,000 Ohms You want a twenty-fold increase in conductivity (or there a bouts) so you need a twentieth of the resistance...which equals about 8200 Ohms. This may be a little on the low side but equates to a current of about 4.5mA. If you can get to this without large amounts of sludge (may well be possible) then do so. If, on the other hand you do start getting constant fluffy coating of the anode, then wipe it off and drop the voltage. Good luck to you, Ivan -Original Message- From: Acmeair [mailto:res00...@gte.net] Sent: Thursday, 20 December 2001 8:23 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CShelp! i've just made a 3 unit adapter, 28vdc unit, using 2 silver rounds, on 12 ga .999 wire for a friend. we just tried his unit out on monday. it worked as advertized. this morning, he called, and was asking wether or not CS worked on Ebola. wow! i told him that according to beck's writings, and stuff on this site and others, i was of the impression that it did work on ebola. why are you asking, i said.?? this guy has been heppin out an older guy, and his wife. she was having trouble with her feet, and had gone to the hospital with what looked like gang green. the AMA doc's couldn't figure out what was going down. they finally informed the family that the lady had something that was similar to ebola, but was not in fact ebola. woweee!! i have asked for some help on this site, regarding how much current , and time, etc. it takes to make 15-20 ppm cs with my unit. i'll cut and paste my first request. i'd sure like to know if i'm making cs at a proper strength to hep. just finished bumping my cs unit to 3 6 vdc adapters in series, giving me 29.5 vdc. with 31 oz of DW @ 62 degrees F, the initial flow is .22 ma. with the elements 1 7/8 apart. the wetted area is about 2.85 square inches. (using one 14 ga wire, and one silver round hung on 14 ga wire. at what milliamps would i be gettin 15-20 ppm? thanks a lot. jim O+, S would deeply appreciate any hep, or data. thanks,jim O+, S -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSWater Distiller
Hi there Ted, Trouble is, there is quite a difference between tap water which carries high concentrations of dissolved solids already, and steam, which is pure water looking for solids to dissolve. Steam is quite reactive and corrosive, and will eat away at the copper tubing. Perhaps some plastics might be alright especially those that can withstand autoclaving. Ivan -Original Message- From: Theodore Corbett [mailto:miesenbac...@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, 20 December 2001 10:17 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSWater Distiller I don't see a reason why you couldn't use copper tubing as long as your distilling drinking water. In my house the plumbing for the hot and cold water is copper pipe. I just recently tested my water and one of the tests was for copper and the test came out negative and the copper pipe is at least 15 years old! If you go to one of the home brewing supply houses on the web they sell 3/8 and 1/2 coiled copper tubing that would be perfect for a distiller. They use them to cool the wurt when brewing beer. They run between $20.00 to $50.00. They also have high temp plastic tubing. If you need a couple URL's for the home brew sites let me know. Ted Corbett -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRequest
Time for another 'Chateaux Pomeroy's' Brooks. I think you might be meaning Alvin Rose you should be able to reach him at: i...@rtvc-2000.com Merry Christmas to you also, and many more! Ivan. -Original Message- From: Brooks Bradley [mailto:liat...@flash.net] Sent: Friday, 21 December 2001 4:26 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSRequest I have just...todaygotten my PC system cleaned and back up. It was necessary to purge everything in my mail systems and during the process I lost all of my mail archives---for both mailers. The net result was I have lost all of my mail records for the past six months..both inand out. Recently, I mailed some benign...but importantchemical to Alan Rose in Canada. If anyone on the list happens to have his email address I would be more than appreciative for same. Alan, if you are listening...please send it to me. I am most anxious to see if you have received my promised mailing. Since my ISP mail back-up contained over 1500 messages, I have been rather busy editing this evening. She-Who-Must-Be-Obeyed (wife), daily reminds me I need a 24 hour keeper and should not be allowed to mix with the more Web-Literate young folk...such as frequent this list. Obstinance being my principal claim to intellectual substance..I refuse to surrender this last vestige of personality announcing my worth to the planet. Additionally, since destiny may not grant me another Christmaspast this oneI hope list protocol will indulge my wishing each of you only the most joyous experiences during this holiday season. Sincerely, Brooks Bradley. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration'
Kevin, I was trying to show that it is not the salt but the silver load that may cause argyria or other problems. Most salts are absorbed as dissolved ions, the cations taking different pathways to the anions. If a salt was to be absorbed as a compound, then the fact that this is so would suggest that the salt does not disassociate readily, and therefore would be less reactive than the component ions. The difference between compounds and CS is the concentration at with they are supplied. It matters only that free silver ions are available to react with body tissue, and the number of ions that do so. If several different salt solutions, containing the same concentrations of free silver ions are tested against microbes, I would expect the results to be similar, disregarding the effect the anion may have. In aquatic environments, waters which have high sulphide or chloride conditions, high silver concentrations have little effect on susceptible marine creatures as there is little in the way of free silver ions, however in places that have a high concentration of dissolved silver pollution, aquatic creatures can be severely effected. I am always wary when someone says that this physical event cannot occur ;-) Surely the electrostatic effect of ions in solution is rendered neutral by the solvation by the polar water molecules, creating large crystal like structures which are essentially neutral at their boundary with the bulk solution. I do not think this has been well investigated, mainly due to the difficultly of forming and capturing ions of a single species. Your thoughts good sir? Ivan. -Original Message- From: Kevin Nolan [mailto:ken...@optusnet.com.au] Sent: Tuesday, 18 December 2001 2:15 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration' In digest #1195, Ivan anderson wrote, in two separate postings: If a silver salt or protein were to enter the body as a compound, then it is much less likely that it will be deposited in the tissue, simply because the compound must have a high affinity for the silver and would be far less reactive. This is why silver salts and proteins have less germicidal effect in the test tube than silver ions. However, because these compounds are often supplied at very high concentrations, the available silver ions (while small as a percentage of total dose) may in fact be large enough to cause some deposition in tissue. The term 'salt' should really only be applied to the solid compound. When a salt is dissolved it ceases to be a compound and is then a aqueous mixture of the two separate and distinct ions from which it was formed. Silver hydroxide, when dissolved, is simply silver ions in slightly more alkaline water. The same applies to silver nitrate, which completely dissolves at very high concentrations. The silver is available as silver ions, as is the nitrate. Unfortunately, the nitrate is corrosive to tissue It is most likely not the species that the silver ions are derived from that can cause problems, but rather the concentration in which they are present. Leaving aside organic silver compounds and mild silver proteins, there seems to be a contradiction between the first and second quotes above, in relation to salts vs ions. We agree that whether as a silver salt such as silver nitrate, or (as Marshall Dudley would point out) a base such as silver hydroxide, when dissolved in water such ionic compounds dissociate fairly well completely to give just a mixture of ions. How then can it be said that dissolved silver salts are much less effective than silver ions? Are they not in effect one and the same? A while back I pointed out it is impossible to have just one ionic species in solution - charge neutrality requires that ionic silver (or any other cation) must always be accompanied by anions of some kind, whether hydroxyl, nitrate, acetate or whatever. This brings the matter back full circle. Despite all the words so far, the following basic issue has not been answered: Suppose we have different ionic silver compounds each made up to the same PPM dissolved silver ion in solution. Examples might be 10PPM silver each as silver hydroxide, silver acetate, silver citrate, silver bicarbonate. For none of these is the anion either poisonous or germicidal. Should we expect the germicidal power to be essentially equivalent, whether in the test tube, or in the body? If not, on what basis? regards, Kevin Nolan ken...@optusnet.com.au -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'agglomeration'
That is correct. Indeed, CS of high ionic content (85%) and small size particle remainder is colourless and has very little TE. One may even have to go into a dark room to see it. Ivan -Original Message- From: Jonathan B. Britten [mailto:jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp] Sent: Thursday, 20 December 2001 8:09 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'agglomeration' I take this response to mean, then, that all of the Tyndale effect I observe using a ruby laser pointer is based on actual particles of silver, and not of silver ions. I would assume then that any product consisting of 100% siler ions -- if such is possible to make -- would have no Tyndale effect, even with a laser beam. Is that correct? Thanks in advance. JBB I Anderson wrote: You are correct JBB, in a manner of speaking, but the wavelengths of 'light' that are small enough to be reflected are not visible. They are in the ultraviolet and the x-ray range. Regards Ivan. -Original Message- From: Jonathan B. Britten [mailto:jbrit...@cc.nakamura-u.ac.jp] Sent: Tuesday, 18 December 2001 1:21 p.m. To: *Silver-List* (E-mail) Subject: Re: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'agglomeration' Well, what if you get lots of ions all together in one jar? Would not certain wavelengths of light bump into some of them? Honestly I do not know, but it seems possible. JBB -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration'
Reid, The term 'salt' should really only be applied to the solid compound. When a salt is dissolved it ceases to be a compound and is then a aqueous mixture of the two separate and distinct ions from which it was formed. Silver hydroxide, when dissolved, is simply silver ions in slightly more alkaline water. The same applies to silver nitrate, which completely dissolves at very high concentrations. The silver is available as silver ions, as is the nitrate. Unfortunately, the nitrate is corrosive to tissue. Gold chloride dissolves as gold 3+ ions and chloride ions. The chloride is non toxic but the gold ions will oxidise body tissue and enzymes and can cause problems. Metallic gold on the other hand, has all its electrons and is quite non-reactive. It is most likely not the species that the silver ions are derived from that can cause problems, but rather the concentration in which they are present. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Reid Harvey [mailto:ceram...@bol-online.com] Sent: Thursday, 13 December 2001 3:00 p.m. To: silver list Subject: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration' Ken, I never stopped to think that the silver may be the hydroxide, evedince that my understanding of chemistry is limited. (Sometimes I stop and think and sometimes I just stop.) Can you fill me in on how it is that the hydroxide is a salt? Does anybody else have an answer? I feel sure that you're correct that the reason this is not harmful to us CS lovers in the long run is that 10ppm is extremely dilute. Of course this begs a question about assertions here that it's not a problem to ingest ionic silver at the really high concentrations. If this sort of CS is practically unattainable without the salts then responsible people should talk about some kind of an upper ppm limit for ingesting. On the other hand finding that number may be difficult. Also, back to my limited chemistry, I would like to know why it is that one would have to isolate one element in a simple compound as the culprit in a health problem. For example with silver nitrate why does the problem have to be either the silver or the nitrate. I think the problem is probably the compound. Another example: it's been stated here that gold chloride is highly toxic, yet gold metal is beneficial and chlorine is a lot less toxic. Salaam, Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration'
Jason, The body reacts to metals electro-chemically. The fate of these metals depends upon the physical properties they exhibit. Silver will bind to albumin in the blood plasma, selenides, sulphides, ascorbates, metaloproteins and so on. Some will inevitably bind to these groups which may be found in tissue and organs. If the concentration of silver is high, and the concentration of selenium (for example) is low, then more silver is likely to bind with tissue. When the bodies supply of metaloproteins become low, because of their use in binding with silver (or some other metal) then more are manufactured, if large amounts are required this may trigger an immune response, a rise in the white blood cell count, and an increase in body temp. If a silver salt or protein were to enter the body as a compound, then it is much less likely that it will be deposited in the tissue, simply because the compound must have a high affinity for the silver and would be far less reactive. This is why silver salts and proteins have less germicidal effect in the test tube than silver ions. However, because these compounds are often supplied at very high concentrations, the available silver ions (while small as a percentage of total dose) may in fact be large enough to cause some deposition in tissue. Don't be fooled into thinking that solid food is treated any differently to liquid food. Food enters the body as ions and molecules, and water enters as water. Even when silver was normally supplied as highly concentrated salts or proteins, only a very small percentage of its users developed argyria. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Jason / AVRA [mailto:silverd...@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, 13 December 2001 3:44 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSRe: concentrated CS and 'aglomeration' From: Kevin Nolan ken...@optusnet.com.au But is argyria solely due to the high silver dosage possible with silver nitrate (very high solubility), or is there some kind of synergy effect as well? regards, Kevin Nolan Kevin: The slate blue colour of argyria is not entirely due as one might suspect, to the deposition of metallic silver (Petering, 1976), but largely to an increased deposition of melanin. Apparently, the issue of Argyria ( the two types ), is not as simple as it may first appear. Silver, in any form, when it reaches a certain theoretical concentration in the body is a toxic substance. Like most toxic substances, the effects will only last while the substance is active in the body. The question is: When and why does silver accumulate in the body, and when and why does it not? The body knows, and responds, to a toxic substance when detected in the body. This is a toxic response... It happens every time one eats garlic, for instance. The body moves to remove the substance as quickly as possible. This is a system-wide, metabolic response of the body. This response is markedly different than the normal elimination responses in the body. First, I believe that with the colloidal silver that most use, the body does NOT detect the silver as toxic. I don't believe the concentration is great enough, even at say a liter per day. I believe that isolated silver, whether in ion form or in colloidal particle form, is not deposited nor accumulated in organs or skin tissue, whether a toxic response is experienced or not. I believe that some, if not many, silver salts and proteins DO deposit silver in the tissue, because the body does not handle these substances in the same manner as it does water. This is the key concept. What is the body trying to do with these salts and proteins? I can induce a toxic reaction to isolated silver through heavy lung use. If the silver accumulated in the organs, then the symptoms would continue as documented in many materia medicas. However, the symptoms are temporary, corresponding very closely with the conclusions drawn in Roger Altman's informal study on silver elimination. However, I believe that even a teaspoon of silver protein/salts can easily cause a toxic reaction in the body. I believe this based upon the documented cases of Argyria from the old school medical documents and the EPA listed studies. When a toxic reaction occurs to these substances, silver begins to accumulate in tissues. Obviously, this doesn't ( or should say 'didn't ) occur in every case, or there would be thousands of more documented cases of Argyria back then. Evidently, Argyria ( to the point where it was noticed and recorded ) only occured in a small percentage of the people using silver-based products. These people may have accumulated silver more quickly through vitamin E and Selenium deficiencies. There may be other factors involved as well. The whole idea here: One wants the silver product to be treated exactly like water, not like a food substance or a solid. That is exactly what you get with
RE: CSdr. jon - an update
Well, I don't know... 1. Dr. Jon Brooks appears to be the pen name of Fred Fason, M.D., who graduated from Baylor Medical School in 1960. Dr. Fason did his residency at U.C.L.A. Is it or not? If it is why does the rest of the letter talk about Stewart Fason or John Fason? One is a lawyer and one is a doctor, one gives money away... are they all Dr Jon? Is there such a person as Dr Jon Brooks retired oncologist, dispenser of medical advice and vitamins? If Dr Jon is a Fason, is that not deception. Wouldn't describing an alias as a pen name require a spin doctor? This letter does not answer any of the points raised by Hanson and Miller, and reads more like a PR brochure than an incisive piece of detective work. And note the twisted logic, that if Hanson and Miller cannot prove harm then they are guilty of viscous character assassination (after all there is a whisper that they are involved in MLM practices and therefore have no honour or virtue), even while conceding in the same sentence, that at least some of their claims are true. When someone builds an empire (be it for profit or not) on the back of respect gained, as an oncologist who has turned his back on his peers and embraced alternative treatment. Someone who uses the powerful legitimacy that this lends to his recommendations, but who is in truth, someone that is not only not a doctor but is a man who uses alias to suit his aims, and may in fact know absolutely nothing about health at all. I'm sorry, but I view this as a pretty serious travesty of right and wrong. Certainly, people should be given the evidence, so they might make an informed judgement as to the weight they assign to the legitimacy of his past and future claims. Ivan. -Original Message- From: cking...@nycap.rr.com [mailto:cking...@nycap.rr.com] Sent: Monday, 10 December 2001 10:16 a.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: CSdr. jon - an update Another look from another list, about the co-op's good doctor. I'm glad I didn't jump in and join the slanderfest... Chuck Transvestite: A guy who likes to eat, drink and be Mary! This is a post from another list by Darrell Sandlien, concerning the Dr. Jon scandal. I have followed the well documented allegations made by Mr. Hanson and Ms. Miller with great interest. The evidence is compelling that deceptive practices are involved. I am a retired P.I. and am fascinated by puzzles. The facts I have learned, from public records mostly, are: 1. Dr. Jon Brooks appears to be the pen name of Fred Fason, M.D., who graduated from Baylor Medical School in 1960. Dr. Fason did his residency at U.C.L.A. 2. Stewart Fason is a well known philanthropist in the Palm Beach, FL area. He donated his home, at 115 Via la Selva, Palm Beach to The Jewish Community Day school. It had a mortgage of over 300k so the school only netted about 650k when sold for $1,000,000.00 to a bank president. He gave away almost $200,000.00 in computer equipment to various schools and universities. I spoke with Carol Roberts, a former Mayor of W. Palm Beach. She confirmed that the Fasons presented many concerts in So. Florida, showcasing young artists. They would invite the entire audience to their home for a post concert reception. They were the first to open their mansion to ordinary people. There was never any charge. They refused to accept any donations. If one could not afford the modest cost of the concerts, they became guests of The Chopin Society, a charitable trust founded by the Fasons. In the 70's Fason got in a jam with the C.F.T.C. After years of litigation he settled for a $75,000.00 fine, which was peanuts to him. 3. There is little data on John Fason. All I could find was he graduated from Rice University Law School. My friend was overcharged by $22.00 by the Generic Co-op. Within a week he received a refund check, which it appeared Fason signed. The check was drawn on The First National bank of Sharp County, Ash Flat AR. I called the bank and was referred to Morris Street, an officer. Mr. Street knew John well and had only glowing comments. They handle all the VISA/MC business for the Co-op. I asked if they had many complaints about The Generic Co-op. He replied, Not one from thousands of transactions. MAKING SENSE OF ALL THIS There is no doubt that the Fasons walk to a beat of a different drummer. In reviewing the past newsletters on Yahoo I came across this, allegedly written by his cat ON 8-26-01???: * IF YOU BOUGHT BETA SITOSTEROL RECENTLY, YOU GOT E-SCREWED! The lab report came in today. It revealed that the current production of Beta Sitosterol contains only 90% of what is claimed. To meet the CO-op's specifications it must have a minimum of 97%. I advised him to just clam up, as you would never know the difference for it is still almost twice
RE: CSRe: Eniva's angstrom sized ionic minerals
Hi Again Kevin, You wrote: Judging from your remark they do not use salt., perhaps you didn't understand what I was saying by seems to me a simpler definition would suffice: Angstrom size ionic mineral = salt (general term, not just NaCl). Example: silver hydroxide - which is about 80-90 % of the output of a typical home-made low tech CS generator! I am not quite sure where the silver hydroxide remark comes form, but very little in the way of silver hydroxide is formed at pH less than 9. If you are referring to precipitation, AgOH solid is brown. I was trying to make it clear that it was the general term salt, meaning any combination of (generally) metallic cation, such as Ag+, Ca++, etc, and any anion, such as OH-, Cl-, SO4--. When dissolved in water, such salts dissociate, either completely or partially, to produce angstrom-sized ions! Eniva are at pains to distinguish their product as being definitely NOT a colloid, but is both angstrom sized and ionic. Well if that's not a good definition of a dissolved salt, what is it? Are they claiming a new state of matter? I requested more info as per their web site offer, only to receive a strong come-on to join as a MLM affiliate. The definition of a dissolved salt requires both cations and anions. If Eniva can introduce Ag+ cations into the water, without adding anions, then this is not a dissolved salt. Eniva claim to do this by a vacuum plasma process. DG, if you are convinced their product is truly superior, I'd love to here more from you as to your experience using it. At the moment, things are not quite adding up. That would be interesting. Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSCancer Cure
Thank you Robb, Very interesting. For those that might wish to learn more, the patent no. for this procedure is US 5,578,637. Ivan. -Original Message- From: Robb Allen [mailto:rube2...@hotmail.com] Sent: Thursday, 6 December 2001 1:46 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCancer Cure Here it is http://www.msnbc.com/news/667259.asp From: Tel Tofflemire telt...@home.com Reply-To: silver-list@eskimo.com To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSCancer Cure Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2001 17:28:21 -0700 -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSOzonated water, FIR fibre
Kevin Nolan wrote: From what I have read, as soon as ozone hits water it converts to H2O2 - which I can purchase as 50% technical grade for $1 AU per litre. How many litres does that work out to as the equivalent cost of an ozone generator (which needs bottled oxygen, I understand)? Not so Kevin. O3 will dissolve in water to eventually degrade to H2O2. O3 will remain dissolved in room temp water for a few minutes and in ice cold water for about 20 minutes. Ozone can be generated using dry air quite acceptably, without the generation of the nitric acid contaminant that would accompany 'wet' air. As for so-called Far infrared fibres - the concept defies basic thermodynamics. All materials emit and absorb precisely the same spectrum of heat radiation when at the same temperature. If your FIR underclothing seems better, either it is simply better at insulating, or you are experiencing the power of suggestion. Ditto for the FIR bags - it will be the ozonated CS doing all the work. Again this is not so, as far as I know. Some elements or compounds (silicon dioxide, aluminium oxide) will accept energy of some wavelength and then radiate it at another, in the far infrared in this case. All that is required is the conservation of energy. While the same energy is output (more or less) FIR radiation is much more efficient at heating our bodies as it is able to penetrate deeply (unlike radiation of shorter wavelength) and is similar to the resonant frequency of water and tissue and thus the energy is absorbed more efficiently. Regards Ivan. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSburning
I'm over here, Tracy. LOL. I re-sent the message that I sent you a week ago, which you must have missed. It has all the info you requested. Burning... Why is the baby being given CS. Is there some health problem? It could be that the entire family is suffering from some sort of gastro infection or other malady which the CS reacts with. I suggest you retrieve the CS from these people and try it yourself...replace it with some that you know is ok, ie you have drunk a sample yourself. If you do not have a burning reaction then perhaps the family should have some tests run. Regards Ivan -Original Message- From: Nick Grant [mailto:nwgr...@inet.net.nz] Sent: Thursday, 6 December 2001 2:19 p.m. To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSburning Hi Dean Ivan has tested my CS in the past and it has been fine. I used cheap water for awhile till I found out that it was a problem, then went back to the original DW that was a lot more expensive, and that Ivan had tested. I don't put the leads in the water and the wires are fine. I am in the middle of getting some more from Ivan as they are pretty worn (thin). It doesn't have this affect on anyone else that I give it to. My whole family drink it and we have never noticed any burning. It is a mystery to me. I will send some up to Ivan for testing as soon as I hear from him. IVAN are you thereYoohooo -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver-list archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
