That makes sense. Are you trying to say that there are no
corporations, profits or rich people in NO? LOL.
-Gary
Al said the following on 9/1/2005 11:41 AM:
This Administration and Congress don't care about the common people.
Only the rich, the corporations and profits.
Al
Am I missing something? You expected the ships to be sitting just
outside of NO, prior to a Hurricane hitting the area? What do you think
would happen to the ships? I would expect they would be large piles of
steel and rubble along with everything else that was in the wake of Katrina.
-Gary
On Sep 1, 2005, at 21:07, Christopher Fisk wrote:
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Eli Allen wrote:
from the WaPo's Robin Givhan). A fellow shopper, unable to fathom
the absurdity of Rice's timing, went up to the Secretary and
reportedly shouted, How dare you shop for shoes while thousands
are
At 05:01 PM 01/09/2005, Eli Allen wrote:
According to Drudge, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice has recently
enjoyed a little Broadway entertainment. And Page Six reports that she's
also working on her backhand with Monica Seles. So the Gulf Coast has gone
all Mad Max, women are being raped
Sorry, didn't see the cease and desist message.
T
On Fri, 2 Sep 2005, James Boswell wrote:
I played online poker last night. How dare I gamble while thousands are
dying and homeless!
WTF Was the shopper there shopping for if she's gonna get upset if she sees
someone else shopping. Damn hypcrites.
And that shopper is also secretary of
- Original Message -
From: Wayne Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 8:22 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
The casinos in MS were supposedly designed for level 5 hurricane look
what happened
- Original Message -
From: Wayne Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:30 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
housing building codes back then like they do now so to say they're doing
nothing
31, 2005 9:30 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina housing building codes back then like they do now so to say they're doing nothing is false. Most of the buildings in the French Quarter etc have
been there for over a century. I went to an elementary school in NO was terrified when
Chris,
You also, however, forget that several people were indicted for
embezzlement out of the project and that a congressional budget audit
made clear that the books could not be reconciled.
Project Impact was always designed at small grants given to
communities to develop planning..
Analyst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Au contraire.
'Project Impact' also involved federal planning to mitigate the damage done
by large natural disasters by taking measures that would be crucial to a
strategy to save lives and cut
recovery costs.
FEMA had pre-planned a New Orleans
Just because folks protested doesn't mean they've got their way.
There was ton's of protesting when the petro companies started setting
up the canals to host their infrastructure, part of the reason the
southern wetlands have gone from a 200 mile to 30 mile buffer area is
directly related to all
Except those 'protests' were about the REDESIGN and expansion of the levee
system and it's spillways and locks.
It's a different kettle of fish that because of the Bushies budget cuts, the
Corps essentially stopped major work on the now-breached levee system that
had protected New
Part of the criticism levied at bushco right now though hinges around
the simple fact that the federal money to simply maintain the levee's
vanished with the onset of the war in iraq and afghanistan and all the
spending on DHS, oh and the TSA, oh and the ill advised tax cuts...On 9/1/05, CW [EMAIL
and it does not matter whom is in office IMO
fp
At 09:41 AM 9/1/2005, Al Poked the stick with:
This Administration and Congress
don't care about the common people.
Only the rich, the corporations and profits.
Al
--
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
It's who you look like..Not who you
and if the dog hadn't stopped to take a shit he would have
caught the rabbit
At 10:40 AM 9/1/2005, j m g Poked the stick with:
Part of the criticism levied at
bushco right now though hinges around the simple fact that the federal
money to simply maintain the levee's vanished with the onset of
:
-Original message-
From: Analyst [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:56:08 -0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
Chris,
I think if you read through the ACE report to the senate in 1997, they
argued
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Analyst wrote:
The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the
levees, the very levees that broke through, was STOPPED in 2004, for the
first time in 37 years, because of the Bushies massive budget cuts.
Why didn't the city of NO pick up where the federal
still been a multi-month project, regardless of any fresh water intake or not.
-Original message-
From: Analyst [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 11:56:08 -0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
Chris,
I think
; by congressional
rules, no money for anything other then federal projects could be handed to
them.
-Original message-
From: Christopher Fisk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:12:37 -0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
In addition, when Bush tries to use the nobody could have anticipated
defense:
I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4204754.stm
I.e lies to the public, he deserves to be critized. Sure maybe Chris is
right in that there wasn't much
Chris,
The problem with the repair was that many even within the department
disagreed with the project entirely. Rebulking the current sitting
levees (not a redesign, a reset repair) was something that even
those within the USMS had some oppossition to.. the current weight and
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, CW wrote:
The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the
levees, the very levees that broke through, was STOPPED in 2004, for the
first time in 37 years, because of the Bushies massive budget cuts.
Why didn't the city of NO pick up where the federal
Chris,
So, did both the feds the state make a mistake? Yes. Did that
mistake make any substantial difference in the outcome? I don't think
so
So it's your position that finishing the repairs on the the levees, the
pre-positioning of many pumping ships and hospital ships, let
-0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
In addition, when Bush tries to use the nobody could have anticipated
defense:
I don't think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4204754.stm
It was much easier to put $200M to the Superdome.
CW
-Original message-
From: Christopher Fisk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 12:36:08 -0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, CW wrote
On 1 Sep 2005 at 14:03, Christopher Fisk wrote:
The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the
levees, the very levees that broke through, was STOPPED in 2004, for
the first time in 37 years, because of the Bushies massive budget
cuts.
Why didn't the city of NO pick
You're still off some tangent. Several areas of the levees had been down to
FOUR FEET in height, and the repairs were in progress.
I'd like to see the opposition to THAT, and I don't mean by anti-tax groups
that don't want to spend money on anything besides a national defense.
I'm not
NYC gets ton's of federal aid. Museums, bridges, hospitals, tons
of cash go to various projects/causes, both infrastructure and fluff.On 9/1/05, Christopher Fisk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, CW wrote: The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the
levees, the
And I'm sure everyone's overjoyed to know that the Pentagon's Patriot Day festivities are still fully funded...On 9/1/05, j m g
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:NYC gets ton's of federal aid. Museums, bridges, hospitals, tons
of cash go to various projects/causes, both infrastructure and fluff.On 9/1/05,
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Analyst wrote:
On 1 Sep 2005 at 14:03, Christopher Fisk wrote:
The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the
levees, the very levees that broke through, was STOPPED in 2004, for
the first time in 37 years, because of the Bushies massive budget
cuts.
Chris,
WTF do they need 40-50 BILLION to upkeep the current levee's? The
Federal Budget was just 70 million for the levees.
Sorry, that was a typo. That should be $40-$50 MILLION.
That's what the cuts were, annually.
Vince
You know what, we can go back and forth about why and who should have
paid for what, state, local or federal funding. But this is a
big, big, disaster, where is the federal response?
check out cnn.comOn 9/1/05, Analyst [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Chris, WTF do they need 40-50 BILLION to upkeep the
On 1 Sep 2005 at 15:15, j m g wrote:
You know what, we can go back and forth about why and who should have
paid for what, state, local or federal funding. But this is a big,
big, disaster, where is the federal response?
On vacation.
Vince
Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Analyst
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 3:12 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
Chris,
WTF do they need 40-50 BILLION to upkeep the current levee's? The
Federal Budget was just 70
Chris,
I'm not proclaiming oppossition to that.
Yet that is exactly what was stopped by the budget cuts.
Federal flood control spending for Southeastern Louisiana has been
chopped from $69 million in 2001 to $36.5 million in 2005, according
to budget documents. Federal hurricane
] On Behalf Of Analyst
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 3:28 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
On 1 Sep 2005 at 15:15, j m g wrote:
You know what, we can go back and forth about why and who should have
paid for what, state, local or federal funding
from the dailykos -
Category 4 Hurricane Determined to Strike U.S. -- Cont.
by Hunter
Thu Sep 1st, 2005 at 10:28:22 PDT
George W.
Bush was once known as the C.E.O. President, a term his handlers
eagerly coined in order to convey that the country would from now on be
run like a business.
the duties of the top position of the state
dept.
From: Eli Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 16:01:10 -0400
According to Drudge
Um, she shouldn't be on vacation playing around in NYC, she should be doing
something to help with the disaster. She is a cabinet level official, not
just anyone.
Eli
- Original Message -
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Eli Allen wrote:
from the WaPo's Robin Givhan). A fellow shopper, unable
On Thu, 1 Sep 2005, Eli Allen wrote:
from the WaPo's Robin Givhan). A fellow shopper, unable to fathom the
absurdity of Rice's timing, went up to the Secretary and reportedly shouted,
How dare you shop for shoes while thousands are dying and homeless! Never
one to have her fashion choices
Yep, it's a bottomless pit.
Bush was smart not throwing good money after bad.
Gary VanderMolen
- Original Message -
Here's what was happening: as we kept restructuring the levees, they kept gaining more heft.. and they sunk faster and faster.
From 1995-2001, we spent more then
The issue is that the repair, maintenance, and beefing-up of the levees, the very levees that broke through, was STOPPED in
2004, for the first time in 37 years, because of the
Bushies massive budget cuts.
How can you beef-up something when the very act of beefing-up
will cause it to sink
The removal has been hindered a great deal; since the beginning, the focus
has been on immediate removal of the sick infirmed to help lower disease
spread and give them a chance at survival, followed by everyone else.
People rushed busses and military convoy equipment to demand their entrance
So just because people in NO have it bad, everyone else is
supposed to be in sack cloth and ashes?
Ms Rice's job is to deal with foreign dignitaries, not to provide
aid relief.
Gary VanderMolen
- Original Message -
According to Drudge, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice has recently
Chris,
Vince, I really don't think we are arguing bitterly with each other
Gee, I would hope not.
and I think we have a lot of grounds of agreement. I want to state
that right off.
OK.
The concept of coming up with $50M/yearly, as you point out, fails to
put into perspective that
, 2005 5:14 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
I have no problem with that. Move people to more solid ground, make
where New Orleans a nice, gigantic national wildlife preserve, and you
save all the money.. and you do something nice for mother nature
Ok this is starting to piss me off. Can I get an admin ruling on when
to take this thread off the list and to private? Another few days and
I will be tempted to just unsubscribe.
--
Brian
On 9/1/05, Al [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Al
If this is the worst that ever happens to you, you will have it made.
Well I didn't mean it that way. It's just I see this crap of blaming
Bush or Clinton or Osama from every other media source 24/7 and all
kinds of speculation about what could
Ok this is starting to piss me off. Can I get an admin ruling on when
to take this thread off the list and to private? Another few days and
I will be tempted to just unsubscribe.
Back away from the coffee. :)
And set your email client to ignore/delete this thread automatically.
Gary
What would Glass do?On 9/1/05, Gary VanderMolen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Ok this is starting to piss me off.Can I get an admin ruling on when to take this thread off the list and to private?Another few days and I will be tempted to just unsubscribe.
Back away from the coffee. :)And set your
tonight, the thread ends.
CW
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Brian Weeden
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 6:17 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
On 9/1/05, Al [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Al
From: Analyst [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
So it's your position that finishing the repairs on the the levees, the
pre-positioning of many pumping ships and hospital ships, let alone the
organization of a coordinated air lift,
would not have made any
I was done with this thread, but since this was sent directly at me...
On 1 Sep 2005 at 17:40, jeff.lane wrote:
Vince,
In keeping with your thought of pre-positioning ship
It wasn't my thought. It was part of a plan that FEMA had laid out under the
previous administration, part of
At 04:07 PM 9/1/2005, Christopher Fisk typed:
I played online poker last night. How dare I gamble while thousands are
dying and homeless!
I suppose BC was playing with interns. The reason we don't have an energy
policy is because Monica was playing with his cigar.
I've got an idea, why
bad, really bad - Katrina
In 1980, there were big complaints about how USGS funding went down in 78
79 before Mt. St. Helens erupted. Well, I know it's cruel, but if you
built your house on a Volcano and thought the government could save you,
you were a fool. People in Pompei learned
Ah, republican penis envy. BC had a Rep congress the whole time
and new we've got a Rep pres and congress. If stuff is broken
now, guess what - it is their fault.On 9/1/05, Wayne Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
At 04:07 PM 9/1/2005, Christopher Fisk typed:I played online poker last night.How dare
: Thursday, September 01, 2005 8:08
PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad -
Katrina
Ah, republican penis envy. BC had a Rep congress the
whole time and new we've got a Rep pres and congress. If stuff is broken
now, guess what - it is their fault.
On 9/1/05, Wayne
Johnson [EMAIL
At 11:08 PM 9/1/2005, j m g typed:
Ah, republican penis envy. BC had a Rep congress the whole time and new
we've got a Rep pres and congress. If stuff is broken now, guess what -
it is their fault.
I'm sure that the Dems didn't filibuster anything that was worth doing
either? If it were up
We have a situation where we are going to have American refuges. The people
of the Gulf needs help, lots and lots of help. If you haven't yet, consider
donating to the Red Cross. I don't usually (because of $$ excuses) but
damn, my countrymen are in a world of hurt in gumbo land. But I can't
Subject: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
We have a situation where we are going to have American refuges. The people
of the Gulf needs help, lots and lots of help. If you haven't yet, consider
donating to the Red Cross. I don't usually (because of $$ excuses) but
damn, my countrymen
: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
We have a situation where we are going to have American refuges. The
people of the Gulf needs help, lots and lots of help. If you haven't yet,
consider donating to the Red Cross. I don't usually (because of $$
excuses) but damn, my countrymen are in a world
Not to sound heartless, but people are not going to be totally reliant
on donations to get by. There will be a ton of federal aid, insurance
money, etc. going to these people.
There will be no refugee camps. People will be relocated to other
cities. We don't live in a 3rd world country, and
of
the city is still a mess.. it's going to be a very messy and difficult work
through.
CW
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ben Ruset
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 3:08 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad
Chris Reeves [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And the problem
is, there is so much poverty in New Orleans, and the structural design of
the city is still a mess.. it's going to be a very messy and difficult work
through.
President Bush says that now that the catastrophe has hit, government
should
It's so American. Don't teach birth control, fight abortion. Don't
prepare for mathematical certainty, worship the melodrama of numerically
insufficient rescues.
The only certainty is that Mother Nature is unpredictable. How much
money should we throw at this bottomless pit? If you design
Gary VanderMolen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The only certainty is that Mother Nature is unpredictable. How much
money should we throw at this bottomless pit? If you design levees
for a Cat 3, next time it will be a Cat 4 hurricane. People should not
live below sea level when they are so
://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001051313
Eli
- Original Message -
From: Gary VanderMolen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
It's so
On 8/31/05, Eli Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
While I do agree that living below sea level like that is a bad idea this
was preventable. There was a major levee construction project whose funding
was cut by Bush (~$250 million) If Bush didn't cut the funding the levees
wouldn't have broke
severe. I'll have a longer post later; I'll talk to him later tonight and
see how things go ;)
CW
-Original message-
From: Eli Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 15:52:58 -0500
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
While
] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
Not to sound heartless, but people are not going to be totally reliant
on donations to get by. There will be a ton of federal aid, insurance
money, etc. going to these people.
There will be no refugee camps. People will be relocated to other
cities. We don't live
, MCP
Systems Administrator
Humes Barrington, P.C.
St. Louis, MO USA
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of CW
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 5:30 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
It should be noted
Myrna Rademacher [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Trying to place blame for such a disaster certainly doesn't help
the victims of this horrible natural event.
But then it's not supposed to. It's supposed to create an awareness of
our government spending 400 billion creating a war as a cover for
that would be a good trick
At 02:15 PM 8/31/2005, Al Poked the stick with:
I say, governments job was
to prevent catastrophes like Katrina,
--
Tallyho ! ]:8)
Taglines below !
--
Free men do not ask permission to bear arms
FORC5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
that would be a good trick
At 02:15 PM 8/31/2005, Al Poked the stick with:
I say, governments job was
to prevent catastrophes like Katrina,
Not to prevent hurricanes, but to prevent the depth of the disaster
caused by it.
Al
At 07:53 PM 8/31/2005, Al typed:
Not to prevent hurricanes, but to prevent the depth of the disaster
caused by it.
The casinos in MS were supposedly designed for level 5 hurricane look
what happened to them.
--+--
Wayne D. Johnson
Ashland, OH, USA 44805
- Original Message -
From: Brian Weeden [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 3:16 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
On 8/31/05, Eli Allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
While I do agree that living below sea level
Another good trick
- Original Message -
From: Al [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: The Hardware List hardware@hardwaregroup.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 4:53 PM
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
FORC5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
FORC5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
that would be a good trick
At 02:15 PM 8/31/2005, Al Poked the stick with:
I say, government's job was
to prevent catastrophes like Katrina,
Not to prevent hurricanes, but to prevent the depth
At 05:15 PM 8/31/2005, Al typed:
We've been aware of New Orleans' inevitable horror for decades, and
absolutely nothing sufficient was done about it. The levees, now broken
and filling the city, were supposedly designed to protect against a
Category Three hurricane, yet Katrina was only a Two
At 08:48 PM 8/31/2005, jeff.lane typed:
Another good trick
Didn't you know the federal gov't is suppose to build a sea wall all along
the Gulf Atlantic coast without raising our taxes that can withstand the
worst case scenario hurricane. I don't know what
Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wayne Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 9:40 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad - Katrina
At 08:48 PM 8/31/2005, jeff.lane typed:
Another good trick
were better off
spending it elsewhere, ala opportunity costs.
- Carroll Kong
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Wayne Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 8:22 PM
To: The Hardware List
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad
...
Probably be considerably cheaper and more effective than trying to save the
old city. The money saved could rebuild the victim's homes and business'
that were not covered by insurance.
Jeff
From: Wayne Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [H] It's bad, really bad
I do remember that project
couldn't remember exactly when it was
fp
At 06:45 PM 8/31/2005, Carroll Kong Poked the stick with:
Actually it is very funny
someone should mention this. The government DID
have a department designed to stop hurricanes, called Project
Stormfury.
They were using
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