Stas Bekman wrote:
>
> I believe XML is a way too heavy for docs writing. Why one will want to
> get a messy source code, when you can get away with a minimalistic POD.
> Just look at the Guide's source code and look at the generated PDF --
> isn't it great? I love POD. And if you want more than
> > But you forget about the benefits of the source code editing, which is
> > diff and tools working with it. Surely enough big editors support their
> > own diff formats and tools, but they aren't possessed by many people. And
> > with POD everybody has a text editor :)
>
> As with XML :)
But
Gunther Birznieks wrote:
>
> One book I would highly recommend on CVS is Open Source Development with
> CVS by Karl Franz Fogel. I found it to be not only highly informative but
> an incredibly fun read as well. Each of the semi-dry CVS chapters is
> followed up by a fun anecdotal chapter about o
Perrin Harkins wrote:
>
> Drew, if this all sounds like too much trouble for the first draft and you
> already started in HTML, I'd say just finish that up and we'll distill it
> into POD later. (html2pod?)
I have no problems learning something new. I know basic POD, and it
sounds like the tool
On Fri, 4 Aug 2000, Stas Bekman wrote:
> > People are migrating to XML because there are good editors coming onto the
> > market (though sadly none for Linux yet, but I'm getting close to
> > persuading Arbotext to port Adept to Linux...). The editors hide the
> > complexity and you never need to
On Fri, 4 Aug 2000, Matt Sergeant wrote:
> On Fri, 4 Aug 2000, Stas Bekman wrote:
>
> > > > > I hope that you write the doc is POD :)
> > > >
> > > > I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
> > > > features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
>
On Fri, 4 Aug 2000, Stas Bekman wrote:
> > > > I hope that you write the doc is POD :)
> > >
> > > I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
> > > features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
> > > HTML table would make my life MUCH easier there.
Gunther Birznieks ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) said something to this effect:
> One book I would highly recommend on CVS is Open Source Development with
> CVS by Karl Franz Fogel. I found it to be not only highly informative but
> an incredibly fun read as well. Each of the semi-dry CVS chapters is
> fo
> > > I hope that you write the doc is POD :)
> >
> > I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
> > features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
> > HTML table would make my life MUCH easier there. Is there something in
> > POD that makes tables ea
At 08:03 AM 8/4/00 +0100, Matt Sergeant wrote:
>On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Gunther Birznieks wrote:
>
> > At 05:10 PM 8/3/00 -0700, Perrin Harkins wrote:
> > >On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > > > Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forward to it.
> Awfully
> > > > nice to able to
On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Gunther Birznieks wrote:
> At 05:10 PM 8/3/00 -0700, Perrin Harkins wrote:
> >On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > > Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forward to it. Awfully
> > > nice to able to roll back to a previous version - although (knock on
> > >
On 3 Aug 2000, (Randal L. Schwartz) wrote:
> > "Drew" == Drew Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> Drew> I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
> Drew> features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
> Drew> HTML table would make my life MUC
At 05:33 PM 8/3/00 -0700, Randal L. Schwartz wrote:
> > "Drew" == Drew Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>Drew> I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
>Drew> features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
>Drew> HTML table would make my life
At 05:10 PM 8/3/00 -0700, Perrin Harkins wrote:
>On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forward to it. Awfully
> > nice to able to roll back to a previous version - although (knock on
> > wood!) I haven't had to use it yet.
>
>I can help if you
> "Drew" == Drew Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
Drew> I suppose I could... I was planning on having a nice checklist of
Drew> features/systems that would be a pain to do in a fixed width font. An
Drew> HTML table would make my life MUCH easier there. Is there something in
Drew> POD that m
Perrin Harkins wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forward to it. Awfully
> > nice to able to roll back to a previous version - although (knock on
> > wood!) I haven't had to use it yet.
>
> I can help if you get stuck.
>
> > > I h
On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forward to it. Awfully
> nice to able to roll back to a previous version - although (knock on
> wood!) I haven't had to use it yet.
I can help if you get stuck.
> > I hope that you write the doc is POD :)
Stas Bekman wrote:
>
> Sure, no problem. One of the current cvs access holders can commit the
> first release for you, and then you will be able to continue by
> yourself. Obviously getting all the support that you might need on the
> way.
Having recently discovered the joy of CVS, I look forwar
I apologize, I forgot to strip the list's address when sending this.
On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Stas Bekman wrote:
> [this goes off the list]
...snipped...
_
Stas Bekman JAm_pH -- Just Another mod_perl Hacker
http
[this goes off the list]
>
> BTW, you probably don't remember me, but we briefly met at ApacheCon and
Do you have a picture online. I'm sure I'll recall once I see you again!
> I attended your mod_perl classes there (and enjoyed them). :-)
Thanks a lot!
> 501 N. College Street
> Charlotte, NC
> Stas Bekman wrote:
> >
> > On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Perrin Harkins wrote:
> >
> > > On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > > > > Gunther, has anyone found a good home for such a comparison to be
> > > > > hosted? It would be cool if it were at perl.apache.org, or even better
> > > > > at www.p
Stas Bekman wrote:
>
> On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Perrin Harkins wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > > > Gunther, has anyone found a good home for such a comparison to be
> > > > hosted? It would be cool if it were at perl.apache.org, or even better
> > > > at www.perl.com or somet
On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Perrin Harkins wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > > Gunther, has anyone found a good home for such a comparison to be
> > > hosted? It would be cool if it were at perl.apache.org, or even better
> > > at www.perl.com or something (since it's not mod_perl spec
On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> > Gunther, has anyone found a good home for such a comparison to be
> > hosted? It would be cool if it were at perl.apache.org, or even better
> > at www.perl.com or something (since it's not mod_perl specific). As
> > long as it's easily updatable by its
Ron Pero wrote:
>
[cut]
>
> * Place the templating systems into a spectrum of categories, from simplest
> to most complex/developed.
> It would look approximately like this (not attempting to be complete):
> -Level one, simplest
> * Simple tag/anchor replacement
> * Embedded code
> I think splitting the systems into tiers (simple, average, framework)
> will also help to solve this problem. And of course, the feature
> checklist will be a continually evolving creature.
Absolutely agree. There is no reason to reinvent the wheel. I don't
see why a complete app server syste
Ken Williams wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gunther Birznieks) wrote:
> >I am afraid that while I agree, a check system is really quite useful to
> >me. Some things do need more quantification, but that can be done later.
> >
> >eg lightweight vs heavyweight is subjective. But it can be broken up
"Randal L. Schwartz" wrote:
>
> > "Ron" == Ron Pero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> Ron> A few days ago I sent this suggestion to Drew Taylor, who is
> Ron> preparing a web page comparing the templating systems. He said he
> Ron> likes the idea. The Categorical "Congratulations: you wrote a
On 2 Aug 2000, (Randal L. Schwartz) wrote:
> > "Ron" == Ron Pero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> Ron> A few days ago I sent this suggestion to Drew Taylor, who is
> Ron> preparing a web page comparing the templating systems. He said he
> Ron> likes the idea. The Categorical "Congratulations:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gunther Birznieks) wrote:
>I am afraid that while I agree, a check system is really quite useful to
>me. Some things do need more quantification, but that can be done later.
>
>eg lightweight vs heavyweight is subjective. But it can be broken up into
>saying something like how
I am afraid that while I agree, a check system is really quite useful to
me. Some things do need more quantification, but that can be done later.
eg lightweight vs heavyweight is subjective. But it can be broken up into
saying something like how much code needs to be loaded at start time (an
i
Matt Sergeant wrote:
>
> On Tue, 1 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
>
> > Bill Moseley wrote:
> > >
> > > It seems as if there needs to be a general templating mailing list...
> > >
> > > Here I have a comment about comparing template systems, and then I solicit
> > > advice on which system to use..
> "Ron" == Ron Pero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
Ron> A few days ago I sent this suggestion to Drew Taylor, who is
Ron> preparing a web page comparing the templating systems. He said he
Ron> likes the idea. The Categorical "Congratulations: you wrote a
Ron> templating system!" web memorial.
W
>Maybe we should have a "Congratulations: you wrote a templating
>system!" web memorial. :)
>
>One brief serious note: I think the fact that there are SO MANY is a
>tribute to just how easy it is to process text in Perl. I don't think
>there are 47 templating system for Java. :)
>
A few days ag
znieks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 2:32 AM
Subject: RE: Feature sets [was Re: Templating System]
> Hi there,
>
> I have a pure perl implementation of a simple templating system which is
> (what I consider to be) relatively light
Drew Taylor wrote:
>Ken Williams wrote:
>>
>> I suggest having not just a simple checkmark, but a 3-way check. A
>> system either supports a feature, or it doesn't, or it *optionally*
>> supports it (can be switched on and off). This is often very helpful to
>> know, and might let one get a go
Randal Schwartz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>One brief serious note: I think the fact that there are SO MANY is a
>tribute to just how easy it is to process text in Perl. I don't think
>there are 47 templating system for Java. :)
>
Couldn't agree more. Sometimes Perl is too easy/powerful for its
> "Eric" == Eric Cholet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I have a pure perl implementation of a simple templating system which is
>> (what I consider to be) relatively lightweight - it copes well in both
>> cgi-bin and mod_perl environments, at least for me. I've looked at vari
> Hi there,
>
> I have a pure perl implementation of a simple templating system which is
> (what I consider to be) relatively lightweight - it copes well in both
> cgi-bin and mod_perl environments, at least for me. I've looked at various
> other modules, and do believe mine brings an alternative
le includes
* file and database caching of preprocessed templates
* "loose" expansion of tags
* "template subroutines" (hard to explain in one line)
Please mail me if you're interested in finding out more
Chris
-Original Message-----
From: Gunther Birznie
Gunther Birznieks wrote:
> Of course, mod_perl support is crucial for those that want to "scale", but
> normal CGI/Perl support is really a biggie that I haven't seen highlighted
> within the context of this thread.
Most of the popular template modules support CGI use. Almost everything
except A
I have to say that I am also interested in template kits myself.
My requirements are almost identical to yours (minus a few advanced things).
Basically, I write open source web applications in Perl -- that means that
they must be able to run reasonably fast on non-modperl systems and must
run
>
> > In my mind, almost all my applications seem to fit a system where a my
> > application uses the templates, instead of the templates using my
> > application. In other words, URLs map to the application and not to
> > pages. I assume the likes of TT and HTML::Template fit this, but
> > Embpe
On Tue, 1 Aug 2000, Bill Moseley wrote:
> In additions to a comparison of features, people (including me) might find
> it useful to have a general overview and comparison of the different
> templating _technologies_ and what type of applications work well with each
> and why.
I was planning to
Matt Sergeant wrote:
>
> On Tue, 1 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
>
> > Bill Moseley wrote:
> > >
> > > It seems as if there needs to be a general templating mailing list...
> > >
> > > Here I have a comment about comparing template systems, and then I solicit
> > > advice on which system to use..
>
> Look at the history of this list: it often gets very bursty and the quiet
> again. I think setting up a perl-template mailing list would be initially
> heavily trafficed, but be pretty much dead in a few weeks (or days even).
>
I agree to that
Gerald
-
On Tue, 1 Aug 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> Bill Moseley wrote:
> >
> > It seems as if there needs to be a general templating mailing list...
> >
> > Here I have a comment about comparing template systems, and then I solicit
> > advice on which system to use...
> >
>
> Bill,
>
> After all the r
"Erich L. Markert" wrote:
>
> Drew Taylor wrote:
> >
> > Bill Moseley wrote:
> > >
> > After all the response the thread generated, I wonder if perhaps we
> > (meaning the people who have control over those things :-) really
> > _should_ setup another list.
> >
>
> I could see the efficacy of a
Drew Taylor wrote:
>
> Bill Moseley wrote:
> >
> After all the response the thread generated, I wonder if perhaps we
> (meaning the people who have control over those things :-) really
> _should_ setup another list.
>
I could see the efficacy of a template developers site for those people
invol
Bill Moseley wrote:
>
> It seems as if there needs to be a general templating mailing list...
>
> Here I have a comment about comparing template systems, and then I solicit
> advice on which system to use...
>
Bill,
After all the response the thread generated, I wonder if perhaps we
(meaning
It seems as if there needs to be a general templating mailing list...
Here I have a comment about comparing template systems, and then I solicit
advice on which system to use...
The only reason I'm using my own templating system (besides the requirement
that everyone writes one) is because I rea
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> After all this discussion, what would benefit me most in choosing my
> next template system would be a concise central repository of the
> features & benefits for the major template systems (TT, Apache::ASP,
> Embperl, Mason, & HTML::Template come to mind
Ken Williams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Frank D. Cringle) wrote:
> >
> >This sounds dreadfully microsoftian. Trashcan: check; Bouncing
> >paperclip: check.
>
> Well yeah, if you choose features that nobody cares about, then nobody will
> care whether the package supports th
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Frank D. Cringle) wrote:
>Drew Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> Ken Williams wrote:
>> >
>> > I suggest having not just a simple checkmark, but a 3-way check. A
>> > system either supports a feature, or it doesn't, or it *optionally*
>> > supports it (can be switched on a
Drew Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Ken Williams wrote:
> >
> > I suggest having not just a simple checkmark, but a 3-way check. A
> > system either supports a feature, or it doesn't, or it *optionally*
> > supports it (can be switched on and off). This is often very helpful to
> > know,
Matt Sergeant wrote:
>
> This is getting too complex. Just do a couple of paragraphs on each, and
> let everyone bang it out to a bit more than that. I guarantee that once
> one template system designer says "Mine does X", the others will chime in
> and say "Well mine can do X too, and optionally
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Drew Taylor wrote:
> Ken Williams wrote:
> >
> > I suggest having not just a simple checkmark, but a 3-way check. A
> > system either supports a feature, or it doesn't, or it *optionally*
> > supports it (can be switched on and off). This is often very helpful to
> > know,
Ken Williams wrote:
>
> I suggest having not just a simple checkmark, but a 3-way check. A
> system either supports a feature, or it doesn't, or it *optionally*
> supports it (can be switched on and off). This is often very helpful to
> know, and might let one get a good sense of the difference
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Drew Taylor) wrote:
>Gerald Richter wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > Vivek had an excellent suggestion in private email: put together a list
>> > of features and let the developers check off the options their system
>> > supports. My biggest question is who comes up with the feature list in
Gerald Richter wrote:
>
> >
> > Vivek had an excellent suggestion in private email: put together a list
> > of features and let the developers check off the options their system
> > supports. My biggest question is who comes up with the feature list in
> > the first place?
> >
> I would suggest i
>
> Vivek had an excellent suggestion in private email: put together a list
> of features and let the developers check off the options their system
> supports. My biggest question is who comes up with the feature list in
> the first place?
>
I would suggest it the other way round. Put together wha
Gerald Richter wrote:
>
> > As for summarizing, I have some pretty good info already: a private
> > email from a user of embperl, Andy's post of TT, and Joshua pointed me
> > to Apache::ASP's website. I'll probably do some serious reading this
> > weekend and (hopefully) begin to sketch out the c
> As for summarizing, I have some pretty good info already: a private
> email from a user of embperl, Andy's post of TT, and Joshua pointed me
> to Apache::ASP's website. I'll probably do some serious reading this
> weekend and (hopefully) begin to sketch out the comparison. And yes,
> help is alw
Simon,
You aren't the only one who was pleasantly surprised to come back to a
mailbox overflowing with messages on a topic near & dear to my heart.
:-)
As for summarizing, I have some pretty good info already: a private
email from a user of embperl, Andy's post of TT, and Joshua pointed me
to Ap
Yes please !
I've been following these threads with avid interest as I am just starting
to look at this technology.
I'm currently using SSI to call mod_perl scripts to handle the dynamic
parts of the pages but this is getting very unwieldy when I start doing
form h
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