(313) Recordstores NYC
Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
seems you agree with /0 then. for what it's worth, i view the classical-techno crossover thing with some suspicion and i find the results a tad amusing, like a novelty or a gimmick. i get the idea that the techno musician is trying to buy some respectability by interfacing with classical instruments and musicians. (this is obviously just my opinion so i'm not trying to push it as fact) my 2 eurocent fab - Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Thu, 10 Jan 2008 20:24:46 -0500 the heartfelt rationale is utter dinosaur bs, pretty much exactly mirroring the elitist anti-pop music pseudo-intellectual music criticism of adorno and horkheimer during the 1940's. anybody heard of jay greenberg? he's a child prodigy who entered Juilliard at age 11, and if you haven't heard of him, you should remember his name. his instructor at Julliard said of him on 60 minutes, We are talking about a prodigy of the level of the greatest prodigies in history, when it comes to composition. I am talking about the likes of Mozart, and Mendelssohn, and Saint-Saëns. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Greenberg he went to elementary school (very briefly) in chapel hill , nc, where my best friend had the pleasure of teaching him. we hooked him up with cubase, and burned him cd's of stuff like dmay, c2, john beltran, detroit escalator, etc. he didn't fall in love with it, but he took a serious interest in techno, synthetic sounds, and he makes all his music using cubase -- it is only later performed by orchestras. that's good enough proof for me. this is beside the point that classical music is not typically rhythmically complex to begin with, so the comparison to 4/4 16 step quantizing is totally off the mark to begin with. at one point some classical students from duke were invited to one of my music theory classes at unc, and they were all blending classical music with modern production techniques, sampling, dance rhythms, polyrhythms, etc. i can't say i liked any of what i heard that day though On Jan 10, 2008 7:52 PM, The Archiver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why do you need to Troll? This list like most mailing lists has its Highs and Lows , all you are doing is contributing to the Lows...
(313) detroit party flyers
http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ###
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
I'll give it a whirl Rob :) -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 12:47 To: Odeluga, Ken; kent williams; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of How about a filter where you see something you don't like and click on the big X at the top of the page? Easy peasy! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Odeluga, Ken [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 12:38 To: kent williams; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of It's just a waste of time for the rest of us as some people in this thread are actually writing about music. Maybe I could set up some sort of filter, but I'm reluctant as more than just occasionally one or both of these guys have something to say which isn't 'you mama'. I think you should be more pro-active Kent! :) -Original Message- From: kent williams [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 00:19 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Well the archives are in kind of a parlous state. I set up archiving to mail-archive.com, but they didn't end up pulling in the archives before sometime mid-2006, so if you want to search prior to that, you have to go to the raw mbox files on hyperreal.org I'd normally be concerned about ad hominem attacks on 313, but between /0 and tomcox, they seem to enjoy goading each other so much that it would be a shame to step in. On Jan 10, 2008 5:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO_5mp4Ghmgfeature=related it's 2008 now right? prize the first one who can find in the archives when this playpen fight started MEK Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:32:35 PM: /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:30:48 PM: # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) Recordstores NYC
I'll let the real new yorkers comment on smaller, more specialized shops, but I always enjoy a visit to Other Music: http://www.othermusic.com/ -- some people think it's pretentious, some people are put off by the standoffish mooks who work there. But they do a great job of covering all of my musical interests -- electronic, interesting rock, jazz, experimentalists of all genres. I never get away from there without spending more than I can afford, and I have several world-class record stores in my little burg. On Jan 11, 2008 8:17 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Detroit techno indeed! And IDM (forgive the term!). But thanks, will look for this shop! -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: JT Stewart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag 11 januari 2008 15:03 Aan: Remco Doorewaard CC: 313@hyperreal.org Onderwerp: Re: (313) Recordstores NYC what sort of records are you after? for detroit techno, dope jams On Jan 11, 2008 3:32 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
please help me dispel my pre-conceived notions by suggesting some techno-classical cross-over stuff that you find good and not gimmicky. in other words, please school me. ffs, i have no idea, i don't even know of anything besides the jeff mills thing and the c2 thing and i haven't heard either. otherwise it's pretty obvious that lots of the strings in techno could just as easily be in classical music, and you have stuff like john beltran...so why not welcome the crossover? cross-polination of musical styles is what brings about new styles and moves music forward. to get outside the techno bubble, and look at dance music/black music vs classical, well..jazz and most of the music of the 20th century. techno is the descendant of a classical clash already. i was referring to a techno-classical crossover, and not cross-pollination in general. and that would have been quite foolish since techno is not a pure genre in anycase. i'm sorry but i dont get the last paragraph quoted above though. what do you mean by dance music/black music vs classical? f.
Re: (313) Recordstores NYC
wow still record stores in iowa city? that's a hopeful sign.. dope jams has fairly complete backstock for labels like planet e and basic channel, sound sig, kdj, even loads of old CR records, it's good. there is very very little garbage in there, and they also have a nice disco, soul, jazz, and hiphop selection. they do not have a broad selection of all the new-newest releases though, it's pretty slim in that regard, but they pick up good stuff. i have never been to other music. i am not sure why other recommends from me would be turntable lab and defffinitely a-1, which is like 2 blocks from tt lab. a-1 is the sister store of the thing (legendary digging spot), they get first pick from any new record collections they acquire...unless you're a super bargain-hunter i would skip the thing and check out the rare goodies at a-1. if you are up for digging for a whole day for super-bargain gems among 100,000 records, hit the thing. you might not find any detroit techno there after digging for 12 hours, but it's something to behold, anyways. jt
RE: (313) Recordstores NYC
Detroit techno indeed! And IDM (forgive the term!). But thanks, will look for this shop! -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: JT Stewart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag 11 januari 2008 15:03 Aan: Remco Doorewaard CC: 313@hyperreal.org Onderwerp: Re: (313) Recordstores NYC what sort of records are you after? for detroit techno, dope jams On Jan 11, 2008 3:32 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
i don't see it as cross-pollination, but rather classical dudes playing contemporary music, possibly to get in touch with the younger masses, to show that you can be hip even for a classical dude, or something along those lines... anyway, i will check this new C2 stuff out and (like george michael said) will listen without prejudice have a nice weekend, i'm flying off to frankfurt for party. ciao f. - Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 10:35:26 -0500 i was referring to a techno-classical crossover, and not cross-pollination in general. and that would have been quite foolish since techno is not a pure genre in anycase. eh? if you recognize cross-pollination is good, then why not a techno-classical crossover? i'm sorry but i dont get the last paragraph quoted above though. what do you mean by dance music/black music vs classical? jazz was the result of black dance music crossed with essentially classical instrumentation.
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
yeah of course, and at that time particular time, I feel that it was very much Old World vs New World. -Original Message- From: JT Stewart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 15:44 To: robin Cc: 313 313 Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of essentially i agree, although i don't think it had anything to do with technology in particular, but the modernization of culture and communication..which was partially the result of technology, but also just the direction of popular taste and social/cultural identity etc... i spent wayyy too much time reading that stuff in college... but a lot of it seems to be the writings of a man desparately trying to cling onto something that was fast disappearing whilst technology washed over him like a huge wave. For all the latest news and comment visit www.telegraph.co.uk. This message, its contents and any attachments to it are private, confidential and may be the subject of legal privilege. Any unauthorised disclosure, use or dissemination of the whole or part of this message (without our prior written consent) is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us immediately. Incoming and outgoing telephone calls to our offices may be monitored or recorded for training and quality control purposes and for confirming orders and information. Telegraph Media Group Limited is a limited liability company registered in England and Wales (company number 451593). Our registered office address is: 111 Buckingham Palace Road, London, SW1W 0DT.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
On 11 Jan 2008, at 15:06, JT Stewart wrote: adorno and horkheimer published most of their stuff in the 40's. Got ya... m
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
sorry, i was a media production major and had to study him extensively... his views on music are considered a bit fascist (although he himself ran from the nazi's), he had an absolute hatred for anything that was not high-culture, which of course included the whole of black culture. here's the relevant bit from his wikipedia page In 1936, the Zeitschrift featured one of Adorno's most controversial texts, On Jazz (Über Jazz). It should be noted that jazz was frequently used to refer to all popular music at the time of Adorno's writing. This article was less an engagement with this style of music than a first polemic against the blooming entertainment and culture industry. Adorno believed the culture industry was a system by which society was controlled though a top-down creation of standardized culture that intensified the commodification of artistic expression. Extensive correspondence with Horkheimer, who was then living in exile in the United States, led to an offer of employment in America. on the surface, you can even slightly agree with it, but his views are absolutely uncompromising, absolutely anti-social, and biased towards his own supposed elite experience with high-brow classical music and academia. On Jan 11, 2008 10:22 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i don't. all i know about adorno is that i studied his text books in highschool history of art class i guess wikipedia is my friend though - Original Message - Da : Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : 313 313 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:16:35 + On 11 Jan 2008, at 15:06, JT Stewart wrote: adorno and horkheimer published most of their stuff in the 40's. Got ya... m
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
essentially i agree, although i don't think it had anything to do with technology in particular, but the modernization of culture and communication..which was partially the result of technology, but also just the direction of popular taste and social/cultural identity etc... i spent wayyy too much time reading that stuff in college... but a lot of it seems to be the writings of a man desparately trying to cling onto something that was fast disappearing whilst technology washed over him like a huge wave.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
adorno and horkheimer published most of their stuff in the 40's. On Jan 11, 2008 9:19 AM, Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 3. he's mirroring the cultural elitism of widely discredited and criticized prejudiced white guys from the 40's. I don't understand this reference, 40s, prejudice isn't exclusive, is it? Care to explain? m
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
but a lot of it seems to be the writings of a man desparately trying to cling onto something that was fast disappearing whilst technology washed over him like a huge wave. That sounds familiar for some reason :) robin...
Re: (313) Recordstores NYC
what sort of records are you after? for detroit techno, dope jams On Jan 11, 2008 3:32 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
It's just a waste of time for the rest of us as some people in this thread are actually writing about music. Maybe I could set up some sort of filter, but I'm reluctant as more than just occasionally one or both of these guys have something to say which isn't 'you mama'. I think you should be more pro-active Kent! :) -Original Message- From: kent williams [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 00:19 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Well the archives are in kind of a parlous state. I set up archiving to mail-archive.com, but they didn't end up pulling in the archives before sometime mid-2006, so if you want to search prior to that, you have to go to the raw mbox files on hyperreal.org I'd normally be concerned about ad hominem attacks on 313, but between /0 and tomcox, they seem to enjoy goading each other so much that it would be a shame to step in. On Jan 10, 2008 5:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO_5mp4Ghmgfeature=related it's 2008 now right? prize the first one who can find in the archives when this playpen fight started MEK Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:32:35 PM: /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:30:48 PM:
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) Recordstores NYC
I really like Vinyl Market, on E 10th St and 1st Ave. It's got a really small sign, and it's not right on the corner, but maybe one or two buildings west on 10th St. Lots of UR, seem to remember the whole Dust Science catalog there, ran into Paul Kendrick of the list randomly. (Haven't been there since march unfortunately) On Jan 11, 2008, at 3:32 AM, Remco Doorewaard wrote: Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
i don't see it as cross-pollination, but rather classical dudes playing contemporary music, possibly to get in touch with the younger masses, to show that you can be hip even for a classical dude, or something along those lines... i can understand that cynicism, but give the music a chance..i thought the same when c2 announced he was doing jazz stuff, but it turned out to be pretty respectable and decent stuff. and anyways, the classical guys who want to be hip are playing with kanye west and jay z and rock bands and stuff..i don't think classical and techno are an obvious match, but they fit...they're both very composed musics... there is classical stuff out there i find pretty contemporary...and just watching yo yo ma will make you break into a sweat, he rocks as hard or harder than any rocker or technodork :P enjoy frankfurt!
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
i don't. all i know about adorno is that i studied his text books in highschool history of art class i guess wikipedia is my friend though - Original Message - Da : Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : 313 313 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:16:35 + On 11 Jan 2008, at 15:06, JT Stewart wrote: adorno and horkheimer published most of their stuff in the 40's. Got ya... m
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
sorry JT, i didn't mean it as an insult... i realize that, but you definitely did not understand what i said or something... please help me dispel my pre-conceived notions by suggesting some techno-classical cross-over stuff that you find good and not gimmicky. in other words, please school me. ffs, i have no idea, i don't even know of anything besides the jeff mills thing and the c2 thing and i haven't heard either. otherwise it's pretty obvious that lots of the strings in techno could just as easily be in classical music, and you have stuff like john beltran...so why not welcome the crossover? cross-polination of musical styles is what brings about new styles and moves music forward. to get outside the techno bubble, and look at dance music/black music vs classical, well..jazz and most of the music of the 20th century. techno is the descendant of a classical clash already. i don't think you were referring to me specifically but i don't find tom a troll but rather far too opinionated for me to engage in any sort of dialectic discourse regarding music. he's just a blowhard. he has more interesting stuff to say than most, and encyclopedic knowledge to make his bs seem believable. jt
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
- Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313 313 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 10:31:23 -0500 Adorno believed the culture industry was a system by which society was controlled though a top-down creation of standardized culture that intensified the commodification of artistic expression. this I can relate to, like you said afterwards on the surface, you can even slightly agree with it, but his views are absolutely uncompromising, absolutely anti-social, and biased towards his own supposed elite experience with high-brow classical music and academia. while this, sounds like someone we know.
(313) recommendation for the dubheads
i recently discovered thanks to myspace a great producer of the techno-dub sound - his name is quantec and has released on styrax and echochord as well as others; he also has several remixes including Infiniti - Game One as well as an Aaron Carl track. link: http://myspace.com/quantec fab.
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Adorno is pretty hardcore - some of what he writes, with regard to the synthesis of the spirit of music into a commercial product, does hit home I feel, but a lot of it seems to be the writings of a man desparately trying to cling onto something that was fast disappearing whilst technology washed over him like a huge wave. He was writing at a time when many of the great composers of the early 20th century had just passed away or were coming to the end of their lives, and of course the likes of Schoenberg were beginning to make their mark with Serialism, so you can sense his despair, but his perspective just seems, if not dated, just out of place given the state of modern music and its relationship with technology. -Original Message- From: JT Stewart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 15:31 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Martin Dust; 313 313 Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of sorry, i was a media production major and had to study him extensively... his views on music are considered a bit fascist (although he himself ran from the nazi's), he had an absolute hatred for anything that was not high-culture, which of course included the whole of black culture. here's the relevant bit from his wikipedia page In 1936, the Zeitschrift featured one of Adorno's most controversial texts, On Jazz (Über Jazz). It should be noted that jazz was frequently used to refer to all popular music at the time of Adorno's writing. This article was less an engagement with this style of music than a first polemic against the blooming entertainment and culture industry. Adorno believed the culture industry was a system by which society was controlled though a top-down creation of standardized culture that intensified the commodification of artistic expression. Extensive correspondence with Horkheimer, who was then living in exile in the United States, led to an offer of employment in America. on the surface, you can even slightly agree with it, but his views are absolutely uncompromising, absolutely anti-social, and biased towards his own supposed elite experience with high-brow classical music and academia. On Jan 11, 2008 10:22 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i don't. all i know about adorno is that i studied his text books in highschool history of art class i guess wikipedia is my friend though - Original Message - Da : Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : 313 313 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:16:35 + On 11 Jan 2008, at 15:06, JT Stewart wrote: adorno and horkheimer published most of their stuff in the 40's. Got ya... m For all the latest news and comment visit www.telegraph.co.uk. This message, its contents and any attachments to it are private, confidential and may be the subject of legal privilege. Any unauthorised disclosure, use or dissemination of the whole or part of this message (without our prior written consent) is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us immediately. Incoming and outgoing telephone calls to our offices may be monitored or recorded for training and quality control purposes and for confirming orders and information. Telegraph Media Group Limited is a limited liability company registered in England and Wales (company number 451593). Our registered office address is: 111 Buckingham Palace Road, London, SW1W 0DT.
(313) This Week's Mix: Alexander Robotnick December 2007 Mix
This Week's Mix: Alexander Robotnick December 2007 Mix http://www.thearchiver.net/data/audio/Other/robotnickdecember2007.mp3 Or http://tinyurl.com/33gmxn To subscribe to our mailing list send a mail to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Archiver http://www.thearchiver.net http://www.myspace.com/archiver http://www.d1.ie No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.1/1219 - Release Date: 11/01/2008 10:19
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
True. I'm pretty sure we're on the same page. k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 12:07 PM To: Stoddard, Kamal Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers yeah, I agree with that I included the bosses as part of the audience - they're the first audience as the art represents them they are generally the most conservative (and scared) MEK Stoddard, Kamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:00:37 AM: Anyone across the pond wouldn't see an iota of the real talent in the us design community. The reason for that is exceedingly simple. The best don't get paid by companies/media that get shxt over there. The best of American design has been thriving in small magazines and art scenes all over the country. And some who have dope skills, from flyer design to total corporate rebranding, never get the jobs to flex it (my boy Zheno can't be touched (zheno.com) even though he probably hates everything on his site by now). This is not due to the average audience, but rather the average creative director being afraid to upset the conservative bosses. I know it may not seem this way given the wide angle view from there, but the status quo in America is pretty down for whatever when they're comfy. It's a few cats who keep them scared to minimize resistance to their conservative bs that set the tone. If the general pop was as conservative as many make out, there'd be no need for the fear show, we'd just agree. Americans aren't generally conservative, they're generally scared. And that fear is carefully managed and disseminated (by the same media we turn to to judge the state American design?) so, in my opinion not entirely their fault. (Sorry huge tangent) k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:37 AM To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. MEK
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Anyone across the pond wouldn't see an iota of the real talent in the us design community. The reason for that is exceedingly simple. The best don't get paid by companies/media that get shxt over there. The best of American design has been thriving in small magazines and art scenes all over the country. And some who have dope skills, from flyer design to total corporate rebranding, never get the jobs to flex it (my boy Zheno can't be touched (zheno.com) even though he probably hates everything on his site by now). This is not due to the average audience, but rather the average creative director being afraid to upset the conservative bosses. I know it may not seem this way given the wide angle view from there, but the status quo in America is pretty down for whatever when they're comfy. It's a few cats who keep them scared to minimize resistance to their conservative bs that set the tone. If the general pop was as conservative as many make out, there'd be no need for the fear show, we'd just agree. Americans aren't generally conservative, they're generally scared. And that fear is carefully managed and disseminated (by the same media we turn to to judge the state American design?) so, in my opinion not entirely their fault. (Sorry huge tangent) k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:37 AM To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. MEK
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Every time I see Rolling Stone magazine I cringe a little bit - even the paper is horrible Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:37 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:32:47 AM: Sorry, I was referring to the 90s. I know I'll get flamed for this but US graphic design is way behind that of Europe's The magazines in America are shocking! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:29 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
On 11 Jan 2008, at 16:39, Thomas D. Cox, Jr. wrote: On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. The day design died. :) m
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
wow, totally had a flashback. I didn't realize I used to know all the names in the rollcall section of A.J. Mcgee's bxtch why you lookin at me until I started saying them. that song still makes me laugh because girls used to use that phrase to start shxt on the bus sooo much. chris...eric...lil mike...big mike...toya...takis...keenta...jackie...lawann...nee nee...summer...michelle heell aaa! The girls used to sing it (dudes rocked the beat on the windows with fists) and anyone with the same name would jump up and do a dance (I totally knew a big/lil mike, a toya, a keenta, and a nee nee) and the bus driver would be yelling and threatening to kick us off and shxt. Full on flashback. Nice one. Haven't heard that song since forever. Ghetto classic. k mwnb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:29 AM To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) recommendation for the dubheads
yeah def nice [EMAIL PROTECTED] schreef: i recently discovered thanks to myspace a great producer of the techno-dub sound - his name is quantec and has released on styrax and echochord as well as others; he also has several remixes including Infiniti - Game One as well as an Aaron Carl track. link: http://myspace.com/quantec fab.
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:32:47 AM: Sorry, I was referring to the 90s. I know I'll get flamed for this but US graphic design is way behind that of Europe's The magazines in America are shocking! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:29 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
3. he's mirroring the cultural elitism of widely discredited and criticized prejudiced white guys from the 40's. I don't understand this reference, 40s, prejudice isn't exclusive, is it? Care to explain? m
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
- Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 09:00:44 -0500 seems you agree with /0 then. wtf? he's saying techno music is far too simple to interest classical musicians, i just pointed out that 1. a modern day mozart provides proof otherwise and 2. techno is more rhythmically complex than classical 3. he's mirroring the cultural elitism of widely discredited and criticized prejudiced white guys from the 40's. sorry JT, i didn't mean it as an insult for what it's worth, i view the classical-techno crossover thing with some suspicion and i find the results a tad amusing, like a novelty or a gimmick. i get the idea that doesn't that apply to any time artists established in one genre step into a pretty different one? has nothing to do with the results, more your pre-conceived notions (this is obviously just my opinion so i'm not trying to push it as fact) yep please help me dispel my pre-conceived notions by suggesting some techno-classical cross-over stuff that you find good and not gimmicky. in other words, please school me. anybody who thinks tom is just another troll should read his musical writings on his blog or check his mixes. he talks a lot of bs but he's pretty good at explaining it and it comes from a seriously intense music lover... i don't think you were referring to me specifically but i don't find tom a troll but rather far too opinionated for me to engage in any sort of dialectic discourse regarding music.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Most of the discussion (and displeasure) seems to be about techno music transposed for a classical orchestra. What about going the other direction? I can't think of specific examples at the moment but I know there are classical pieces that have been interpreted by electronic/techno artists using the tools of their trade. Is this still perceived an attempt to validate electronic music? MEK [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 09:48:53 AM: i don't see it as cross-pollination, but rather classical dudes playing contemporary music, possibly to get in touch with the younger masses, to show that you can be hip even for a classical dude, or something along those lines... anyway, i will check this new C2 stuff out and (like george michael said) will listen without prejudice have a nice weekend, i'm flying off to frankfurt for party. ciao f. - Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 10:35:26 -0500 i was referring to a techno-classical crossover, and not cross-pollination in general. and that would have been quite foolish since techno is not a pure genre in anycase. eh? if you recognize cross-pollination is good, then why not a techno-classical crossover? i'm sorry but i dont get the last paragraph quoted above though. what do you mean by dance music/black music vs classical? jazz was the result of black dance music crossed with essentially classical instrumentation.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
On Jan 11, 2008, at 11:04 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't think of specific examples at the moment but I know there are classical pieces that have been interpreted by electronic/techno artists using the tools of their trade. William Orbit did that and failed miserably. -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
well, screw it then ;-) MEK Matt Kane's Brain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:10:53 AM: On Jan 11, 2008, at 11:04 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't think of specific examples at the moment but I know there are classical pieces that have been interpreted by electronic/techno artists using the tools of their trade. William Orbit did that and failed miserably. -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Well that's been around for years with Wendy Carlos et al if we're talking about electronic music in general. It's a difficult one to call because there are examples, like Carlos or Tomita, where they've reinterpreted pieces with style and subtlety. Funnily enough, some of the truly worst examples have come from Klaus Schulze, who went down a trance/classical route in the 90's and the results are nothing less than horrific, which is surprising given the quality of his material in the 70's. I feel personally that a lot of it is just down to technology more than anything else, and our fascination with it. When options become available, then I feel that it is natural that one explores old genres and reinterprets it. The earliest forms of electronic music, apart from the truly avant-garde, did almost at once, start to recreate old popular classical music, because I guess it was the first time that it could be done. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:05 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; JT Stewart Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Most of the discussion (and displeasure) seems to be about techno music transposed for a classical orchestra. What about going the other direction? I can't think of specific examples at the moment but I know there are classical pieces that have been interpreted by electronic/techno artists using the tools of their trade. Is this still perceived an attempt to validate electronic music? MEK [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 09:48:53 AM: i don't see it as cross-pollination, but rather classical dudes playing contemporary music, possibly to get in touch with the younger masses, to show that you can be hip even for a classical dude, or something along those lines... anyway, i will check this new C2 stuff out and (like george michael said) will listen without prejudice have a nice weekend, i'm flying off to frankfurt for party. ciao f. - Original Message - Da : JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 10:35:26 -0500 i was referring to a techno-classical crossover, and not cross-pollination in general. and that would have been quite foolish since techno is not a pure genre in anycase. eh? if you recognize cross-pollination is good, then why not a techno-classical crossover? i'm sorry but i dont get the last paragraph quoted above though. what do you mean by dance music/black music vs classical? jazz was the result of black dance music crossed with essentially classical instrumentation. For all the latest news and comment visit www.telegraph.co.uk. This message, its contents and any attachments to it are private, confidential and may be the subject of legal privilege. Any unauthorised disclosure, use or dissemination of the whole or part of this message (without our prior written consent) is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify us immediately. Incoming and outgoing telephone calls to our offices may be monitored or recorded for training and quality control purposes and for confirming orders and information. Telegraph Media Group Limited is a limited liability company registered in England and Wales (company number 451593). Our registered office address is: 111 Buckingham Palace Road, London, SW1W 0DT.
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Yeah, but see? I'd never go to this party unless I knew someone involved and trusted their taste (in which case I'd probably never see the flyer. 1] I don't know whos playing. In the age of everyone can do it, I don't trust the designers use of the word proper. 2]basement soul is such an overused term in the American house community that it's kind of a turnoff without additional qualifiers. I think of guys with headwraps dancing in a circle that's waaay too big to something that would be better described as bad uptempo rb mixed with too much antibalas. 3]it's yellow. Just kidding. I kinda felt like I needed a number three and had nothing soha! k -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 12:01 PM To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
How about a filter where you see something you don't like and click on the big X at the top of the page? Easy peasy! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Odeluga, Ken [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 12:38 To: kent williams; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of It's just a waste of time for the rest of us as some people in this thread are actually writing about music. Maybe I could set up some sort of filter, but I'm reluctant as more than just occasionally one or both of these guys have something to say which isn't 'you mama'. I think you should be more pro-active Kent! :) -Original Message- From: kent williams [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 00:19 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Well the archives are in kind of a parlous state. I set up archiving to mail-archive.com, but they didn't end up pulling in the archives before sometime mid-2006, so if you want to search prior to that, you have to go to the raw mbox files on hyperreal.org I'd normally be concerned about ad hominem attacks on 313, but between /0 and tomcox, they seem to enjoy goading each other so much that it would be a shame to step in. On Jan 10, 2008 5:45 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO_5mp4Ghmgfeature=related it's 2008 now right? prize the first one who can find in the archives when this playpen fight started MEK Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:32:35 PM: /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/10/2008 05:30:48 PM: # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
Well that all depends on what you are looking for in a flyer and if that's even important to you. Last I checked I never was drawn to attend an event based on the designers skills in photoshop. With that being said, I haven't found a flyer to touch what my crew came up with for our event 8 years ago. It was a little shindig with DBX, Shake, Shawn Rudiman and company. We called it I love techno, not orginal, but this was 2000. It was a homage to the 'I love New York tourist campaign of the early 80's. In keeping with the campaign's theme the flyers were bumper stickers, so even if you lost the backing or never saw the line-up, you had the date and time of when it was going down. Simple, effective and I still see the flyers on cars all over the country to this day, mine included. jw On Jan 11, 2008 11:32 AM, Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry, I was referring to the 90s. I know I'll get flamed for this but US graphic design is way behind that of Europe's The magazines in America are shocking! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:29 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
the most irrelevant magazine still in circulation today MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:43:01 AM: Every time I see Rolling Stone magazine I cringe a little bit - even the paper is horrible Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:37 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:32:47 AM: Sorry, I was referring to the 90s. I know I'll get flamed for this but US graphic design is way behind that of Europe's The magazines in America are shocking! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:29 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
i was referring to a techno-classical crossover, and not cross-pollination in general. and that would have been quite foolish since techno is not a pure genre in anycase. eh? if you recognize cross-pollination is good, then why not a techno-classical crossover? i'm sorry but i dont get the last paragraph quoted above though. what do you mean by dance music/black music vs classical? jazz was the result of black dance music crossed with essentially classical instrumentation.
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
check this 8 foot long piece of glory that only messageboards can allow to exist http://uncensoredus.com/resources/satisfiedwebflyer.jpg MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:36:25 AM: Then there's psy trance: http://www.monkeysfist.co.za/images/2007/07/sprung_flyer.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor Sent: 11 January 2008 17:34 To: Robert Taylor; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Example: http://a273.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/123/l_822d9339cf52b46ab5af e6c43f00f638.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:26 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
The first time i've been to Chicago, i've come across this flyer : http://www.kiddy.fr/images/mushgroove.jpg I was rather amazed, and i was like everything has to be huuuge here :) - K* - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 6:39 PM Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers check this 8 foot long piece of glory that only messageboards can allow to exist http://uncensoredus.com/resources/satisfiedwebflyer.jpg MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:36:25 AM: Then there's psy trance: http://www.monkeysfist.co.za/images/2007/07/sprung_flyer.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor Sent: 11 January 2008 17:34 To: Robert Taylor; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Example: http://a273.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/123/l_822d9339cf52b46ab5af e6c43f00f638.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:26 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
Ah, you beat me to it. What creatives get paid in the US doesn't balance with what's asked of them. Supposedly this is different in other countries. The result of undervaluing creative and visual work is pretty obvious. The designers get demoralized and stop caring, and just mechanically shove jobs through the pipelines. You get a lot of work that is functional and not much else. This... APPEARS to be almost universally true. Some exceptions to the rule would include Apple Inc and whoever is doing the motion graphics and animation on Flight of the Conchords. It's not a lack of capability. American artists didn't suddenly start sucking. The US has a major leadership problem. Not just in politics but in the professional world as well. My 2c. On Jan 11, 2008 11:00 AM, Stoddard, Kamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone across the pond wouldn't see an iota of the real talent in the us design community. The reason for that is exceedingly simple. The best don't get paid by companies/media that get shxt over there.
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Example: http://a273.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/123/l_822d9339cf52b46ab5af e6c43f00f638.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:26 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817
RE: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
For me the tracks I liked the most are Imagine See The Light Sonic Destroyer -Original Message- From: Michael Pujos [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 20:38 Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Toby Frith a écrit : I enjoyed the Blue Potential. It carried an air of ridiculousness that accompanies anything highbrow Mills does - the idea of an orchestra playing some of his harder records was faintly surreal, and there is something a bit daft in the idea that classical musicians interpreting techno music sort of validates it which I often feel is the hidden agenda behind these sorts of exercises, because ultimately classical music and orchestras are seen as the high end of the spectrum, whilst some guy pressing buttons on a drab grey box is seen as the opposite end. Funnily enough, The Bells was the most enjoyable interpretation alongside The March. For me it was definitely Gamma Player the highlight track of Blue Potential.The real strings add much to it. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.1/1219 - Release Date: 11/01/2008 10:19 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.1/1219 - Release Date: 11/01/2008 10:19
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
http://onlyndetroit.com/images/rave/12-19-07/aquavelvetfront1998.jpg that's horrid MEK
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Sorry, I was referring to the 90s. I know I'll get flamed for this but US graphic design is way behind that of Europe's The magazines in America are shocking! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:29 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; /0 Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Really? I think US flyers are still somewhat stuck in this era while UK flyer design is much better now. Freak Mode party looks like it would have been great: Russ Gabriel, DBX, Ectomorph (live), Rotator, Will Webb, Taj Bell another good looking line-up is Gear: Spacetime Continuum, Autechre, Mark Broom, Stacey Pullen, Eric Haupt... 1996 - good vintage MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 07:32:18 AM: Yeah, there's not much difference between the UK and the US in flyer design - strange, cos in other graphic design areas they are are poles apart Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 13:22 To: Robert Taylor; /0; 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers it's funny how some of them look like flyers from big uk raves like Fantazia. this collection almost looks like a timeline of graphic design though, wich is pretty cool - Original Message - Da : Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] A : /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED], 313@hyperreal.org Oggetto : RE: (313) detroit party flyers Data : Fri, 11 Jan 2008 12:57:05 - Why is techno design often so lame? It's all Chesley Bonestall rip-offs and dreadful typefaces Still, it's nice looking at the old line-ups Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: /0 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 11:34 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) detroit party flyers http://onlyndetroit.com/html/rave/raveyears/1995.htm some memories here. also, did anyone on the list mention the new metro area? I think its terrible, but Im sure most of you love it. i'm curious ## ### Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ### # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
I think this is a bit unfair. Adorno's thinking is far too complex to be merely discredited. I disagree with many of Adorno's positions (his take on jazz verges on racism), but I still have to say the guy was a complete genius, so that even when he was wrong, he could at the same time be incredibly insightful. Not only that, he could be as harsh critiquing J S Bach as critiquing pop, and even his view of pop was more complex than what his detractors claim, so in my opinion he's hardly the best posterboy for pro-classical, anti-pop... This is way too complex to talk about on 313 though. I will mention that Adorno viewed ALL art as failure, because he thought that there was a utopian impulse in art, that could never be fulfilled in the artwork itself, but only in some kind of socio-political upheaval outside the realm of art. This is a pretty fair way of viewing things, if you ask me ... you could certainly look at Detroit techno as also containing some utopian impulses, dreaming of a different kind of world, a different kind of Detroit, seeing beauty and potential in the decay... Now whether an orchestra covering techno is any good ... I think that is really going to depend on how well its arranged and performed, not on the idea itself. I'm skeptical, but then again, I would have never believed that Senor Coconut would be any good, but some of those covers do indeed work for me. ~David On Jan 10, 2008 7:24 PM, JT Stewart [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the heartfelt rationale is utter dinosaur bs, pretty much exactly mirroring the elitist anti-pop music pseudo-intellectual music criticism of adorno and horkheimer during the 1940's.
Re: (313) Recordstores NYC
nah, ttlab is decent for hiphop, world music, jazzy stuff, broken beat, bmore club, and especially edits and reissues/classics...also a nice dvd section. they had a couple dozen detroit-ish records when i was in there mid december, but mostly pretty obvious stuff..c2, kdj, brikha, etc. they didn't have much equipment when i was in there..some. i didn't look at it. they definitely have a focus on merch now, with a whole side of the store reserved for clothing and stuff. it's a shiny place. On Jan 11, 2008 1:10 PM, Frank Glazer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: my main complaint with OM is NO LISTENING STATION. ARGH. when i was at turntable lab i didn't see anything but tons of hipster garbage (i seriously thought they were, like, the DFA/tiger sushi official shop or something) and one KDJ record, and a ton of way overpriced equipment. ymmv. i need to check out dope jams and vinyl market before they too go out of business. (prediction, not rumor!) On Jan 11, 2008 9:54 AM, kent williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll let the real new yorkers comment on smaller, more specialized shops, but I always enjoy a visit to Other Music: http://www.othermusic.com/ -- some people think it's pretentious, some people are put off by the standoffish mooks who work there. But they do a great job of covering all of my musical interests -- electronic, interesting rock, jazz, experimentalists of all genres. I never get away from there without spending more than I can afford, and I have several world-class record stores in my little burg. On Jan 11, 2008 8:17 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Detroit techno indeed! And IDM (forgive the term!). But thanks, will look for this shop! -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: JT Stewart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Verzonden: vrijdag 11 januari 2008 15:03 Aan: Remco Doorewaard CC: 313@hyperreal.org Onderwerp: Re: (313) Recordstores NYC what sort of records are you after? for detroit techno, dope jams On Jan 11, 2008 3:32 AM, Remco Doorewaard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I will be visiting NYC for the first time in April. Can you tell me which recordstore I must definitely visit? Thanks, Remco -- peace, frank dj mix archive: http://www.deejaycountzero.com
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
I'm so there! ;-) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:34:27 AM: Example: http://a273.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/123/l_822d9339cf52b46ab5af e6c43f00f638.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:26 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited
RE: (313) detroit party flyers
Then there's psy trance: http://www.monkeysfist.co.za/images/2007/07/sprung_flyer.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor Sent: 11 January 2008 17:34 To: Robert Taylor; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Example: http://a273.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/123/l_822d9339cf52b46ab5af e6c43f00f638.jpg Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:26 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers It was always the raves with the worst designs - happy hardcore rave flyer designs remains stuck in the 90s! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:10 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers Well, in these parts the rave scene has carried over into the club scene and the young whelps have brought in their crappy designs (and the names of the club nights are just horribly cliched) MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 11:06:14 AM: That used to be the caes in the UK - perhaps it's just cos the rave scene is 'younger' in the US than the UK Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 17:01 To: Robert Taylor Cc: 313@hyperreal.org; Thomas D. Cox, Jr. Subject: RE: (313) detroit party flyers I think part of the problem with flyer design, at least in the US, results from promoters trying to cram in ten different DJs/artists in one night (which results in a whole set of other problems). They feel compelled to list every name on the bill along with a page long bio (full of the most ridiculous hyperbole) of each person. Then the crazy techno graphic get added and top it all off with the other fine print: drink specials, time, date, directions, maps, cover charge (including split costs for ladies or time you enter), sponsors, and so much other miscellaneous b.s. you could never leave it as simple as this http://www.uniqueuncut.co.uk/Images/flyer_30_11_07.jpg bang- got the info I need I've always loved CO-OPs flyers (at least the ones I've seen) great design and usually very organic looking MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 01/11/2008 10:44:14 AM: XLR8R isn't European is it? I'm not talking about the fashion magazines with the unreadable type - just the standards Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 11 January 2008 16:39 To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) detroit party flyers On Jan 11, 2008 11:36 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I agree. My guess is because of the general audience in the US tends to be more conservative in so many different ways. or maybe they like to be able to read what is written. magazines that use crazy graphic design on every page make me feel ill, its one of the reasons i let my subscription to XLR8R run out. i just want to read the words, i dont need it to look pretty. tom ## ## # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four Television Corporation, created by statute under English law, is at 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX . 4 Ventures Limited (Company No. 04106849), incorporated in England and Wales has its registered office at 124 Horseferry Road, London SW1P 2TX. VAT no: GB 626475817 ## ## # # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel Four
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
seems you agree with /0 then. wtf? he's saying techno music is far too simple to interest classical musicians, i just pointed out that 1. a modern day mozart provides proof otherwise and 2. techno is more rhythmically complex than classical 3. he's mirroring the cultural elitism of widely discredited and criticized prejudiced white guys from the 40's. for what it's worth, i view the classical-techno crossover thing with some suspicion and i find the results a tad amusing, like a novelty or a gimmick. i get the idea that doesn't that apply to any time artists established in one genre step into a pretty different one? has nothing to do with the results, more your pre-conceived notions (this is obviously just my opinion so i'm not trying to push it as fact) yep anybody who thinks tom is just another troll should read his musical writings on his blog or check his mixes. he talks a lot of bs but he's pretty good at explaining it and it comes from a seriously intense music lover...
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Switched on Bach is the obvious example here. Ceephax has done some classical lines (Beethoven or Mozart can't remember) plugged into the 303. Kind of interesting from the sheer novelty of actually programming detailed notation into the sequencer as opposed to the more or less random approach a lot of people take. -Jim Quoting Matt Kane's Brain [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Jan 11, 2008, at 11:04 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can't think of specific examples at the moment but I know there are classical pieces that have been interpreted by electronic/techno artists using the tools of their trade. William Orbit did that and failed miserably.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Toby Frith a écrit : I enjoyed the Blue Potential. It carried an air of ridiculousness that accompanies anything highbrow Mills does - the idea of an orchestra playing some of his harder records was faintly surreal, and there is something a bit daft in the idea that classical musicians interpreting techno music sort of validates it which I often feel is the hidden agenda behind these sorts of exercises, because ultimately classical music and orchestras are seen as the high end of the spectrum, whilst some guy pressing buttons on a drab grey box is seen as the opposite end. Funnily enough, The Bells was the most enjoyable interpretation alongside The March. For me it was definitely Gamma Player the highlight track of Blue Potential.The real strings add much to it.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
Wow! I didn't know my little post about a Classical pianist interpreting one of C2's Landcruising tracks at Carnegie Hall would cause a tempest in a teapot ;) As for Techno music transposed for Classical, what about the Aphex/Glass version of Icct Hedral? I thought that worked rather well actually ... - Greg
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
aphex twin doesnt count, his music is worthy of orchestra reworks. and yeah, that performance of icct hedral is wonderful - Original Message - From: Greg Earle [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313 Mailing List 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 4:53 PM Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of Wow! I didn't know my little post about a Classical pianist interpreting one of C2's Landcruising tracks at Carnegie Hall would cause a tempest in a teapot ;) As for Techno music transposed for Classical, what about the Aphex/Glass version of Icct Hedral? I thought that worked rather well actually ... - Greg
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
On Jan 11, 2008 5:30 PM, /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: aphex twin doesnt count, his music is worthy of orchestra reworks. you cant stop saying stupid things. you just cant help yourself. tom
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
good one Tom, I hope you win - Original Message - From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 5:55 PM Subject: Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of On Jan 11, 2008 5:30 PM, /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: aphex twin doesnt count, his music is worthy of orchestra reworks. you cant stop saying stupid things. you just cant help yourself. tom
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
On Jan 11, 2008 6:58 PM, /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: good one Tom, I hope you win it would be one more win than you've had in your entire life. tommm
Re: (313) detroit party flyers
Also, in a professional creative context. Even regardless of the employer/employee relationship, clients are notorious for refusing to dislodge their dicks from your well thought out idea. Alot of the American design in question might have had vastly superior concepts behind it than what was actually executed, but unchecked egos diluted the product. Seen it a million times. You stop bothering to think up cool stuff at some point. On Jan 11, 2008 11:08 AM, Thor Teague [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ah, you beat me to it. What creatives get paid in the US doesn't balance with what's asked of them. Supposedly this is different in other countries. The result of undervaluing creative and visual work is pretty obvious. The designers get demoralized and stop caring, and just mechanically shove jobs through the pipelines. You get a lot of work that is functional and not much else. This... APPEARS to be almost universally true. Some exceptions to the rule would include Apple Inc and whoever is doing the motion graphics and animation on Flight of the Conchords. It's not a lack of capability. American artists didn't suddenly start sucking. The US has a major leadership problem. Not just in politics but in the professional world as well. My 2c. On Jan 11, 2008 11:00 AM, Stoddard, Kamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone across the pond wouldn't see an iota of the real talent in the us design community. The reason for that is exceedingly simple. The best don't get paid by companies/media that get shxt over there.
Re: (313) C2 at Carnegie Hall, well sort of
there's no sense arguing nonsensical points, we got suckered On Jan 11, 2008 8:34 PM, Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 11, 2008 6:58 PM, /0 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: good one Tom, I hope you win it would be one more win than you've had in your entire life. tommm
Re: (313) Holy crap! Detroit video time capsule
Does it get better than K.O.T.? Come on lets Jit! nope...that is as good as it gets! --- Greg Earle [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Just look at all this stuff. Jesus! http://profile.imeem.com/hy9cIx Hot Black girls, awesome outfits, great dancers, and the best Techno and Bass of the early 90's for a soundtrack?!? I mean, Christ - the show intro was the Transmat Energy Flash?!? C'mon! Does it get much better than this? - Greg Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
(313) possibly 313 related (if you like techno try this..)
we do an internet radio show every friday from 8-midnight PST come check us out. this week we have rolling though radio integrated, three very excellent innately talented techno djs and producers currently hailing from the bay area that should not be missed... 8-10pm PST DJ Saya from FILTER SF.Tokyo 10-11pm PST Ruoho Ruotsi from defchild records http://defchild.com/ LIVE P.A. 11-12am PST DJ Perla from Spain (special live PA set!! first west coast appearance) http://www.myspace.com/perladanceusted Tune in at http://www.zer01.net:1200/ Every Friday from 8pm - Midnight PST Contact : [EMAIL PROTECTED] next weeks guests.. TBA further info on subscribing to this broadcast... - To subscribe. e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
