Re: Who is Robert Wilonsky?
Does anybody know anything more about this obviously talented writer? Yeah, I know that someone posted a piece by him on LeAnn Rimes here a while ago that was so obnoxious and snide it made me wonder whether he'd propositioned her and been turned down. He also wrote a piece about Mermaid Avenue that provoked a fair amount of discussion because in it he alleged that Woody Guthrie was known, if at all, only as a "barren, soulless legend" who needed Bragg Wilco to be made human. Yeah, I gotta agree with Jon on this one. Wilonsky's a pretty good wordsmith, I'll grant you that, but he's written a number of things that, for various reasons, I and other P2ers have had a hard time with (none, of course that are coming to mind right now other than Jon's examples). I've read him over a number of years, since about 1989 when I lived in Dallas and he write for the Observer. My problem with his writing has always been how "subjective" his criticism is. I know that looks like an oxymoron or something, but what I mean is that he often strikes me as someone who has a really hard time doing a well-balanced review of any artist that isn't a personal favorite. I've seen him just savage folks that are generally pretty well thought-of musicians, and aren't considered "either/or" artists (such as Ani DiFranco, Tom Waits, Richard Buckner...). In Dallas around '90 and '91 or so, I often wondered about the guy's personal safety, his reviews were so consistently extremely pro or con on generally well-liked artists around town Anyway, we all grow up and hopefully get better at we do, if you think he's turning out some good stuff send it to the list. If nothing else his stuff has started some pretty interesting threads here before...g Dan
Re: wilco (all over the place)
Hey, I was wondering if anyone knew exactly how long Wilco's All Over the Place EP is? Thanks, Lance . . .
Re: Chicago Calendar
Hey there, Band Name O' the Week: Candy Watches, 3/3 at Double Door I'm sure it'll still qualify, but I believe the band is Candy Watches Razorblades. Later... CK nitpicking ___ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
RE: Production
[Matt Benz] Unfortunately, Shane, this is true in alot of cases: artists are frequently forced to bend to the will of the producer in making records. That's not to say it always happens, or even happens most of the time, but it does happen. Newly signed artists don't always have the clout or experience to guide them. COurse, I can't think of any examples right this minute (well, I can: Buddy Holly), I can. Shania. She didn't like the production on her first album. She didn't get to use her own songs. She was squelched. It didn't sell very well either. Dina
Robert Wilonsky
Here's Robert Wilonsky's review of Lucinda's "Car Wheels" from July 1998.
As a fan of Lucinda, I am quite pleased with the review, I have no
criticism of his words or style here.
Perfectly Imperfect
Lucinda Williams
Car Wheels on a Gravel Road
(Mercury Records)
Worth her wait: Lucinda Williams.
In the end, only critics and accountants care about the eternity it took
Lucinda Williams to record her fourth record in nearly 20 years. That it
took her six years--not to mention four producers (including Steve Earle), a
handful of engineers, a dozen or so backup musicians, and two
start-from-scratch attempts--makes for good press-release and glossy
rock-tabloid fodder, but in the end, it's just a story, and musicians should
never be judged on their gossip. Besides, no one in the world will listen to
Car Wheels on a Gravel Road and complain that it sounds too produced, too
sterile; indeed, if you didn't know better, you'd swear it was recorded over
a relaxed summer weekend out in the country--surprisingly, inexplicably, it
plays out like a casual masterpiece.
Then again, the most critically celebrated singer-songwriter of the past
decade--and a woman best known among record buyers for someone else's cover
of her work (Mary Chapin Carpenter's sweet, muted rendition of "Passionate
Kisses")--took seven years to record her 1988 self-titled record, and nobody
complained then; hell, if there's a knock on that flawless gem, it's only
that it's not as good as Car Wheels. Williams, once a Folkways artist whose
acoustic blues sounded like some bastard hybrid between Robert Johnson and
Woody Guthrie, has evolved into a country artist whose heart pumps to a rock
and roll backbeat; a lesser musician might have become, well, Bonnie Raitt.
But Williams is made of resilient, shrewd stuff: She writes deceptively
plain lyrics that reveal a dozen little broken-hearted truths between the
lines, and she sings each song in a voice that might be mistaken for soft if
it weren't for the occasional rough edges that split you open when you're
not paying attention. A song like "Drunken Angel," about an Austin musician
who pissed away talent and adoration till he died at the bottom of a bottle,
could well have been an overwrought farewell; but Williams sings the lyrics
("Blood spilled from the hole in your heart/Over the strings of your
guitar") with a little spit mixed in with the tears--she's not just sad, but
angry and betrayed. Not since Bruce Springsteen on Nebraska has a singer
delivered lyrics so pointedly and perfectly; she pauses, whispers, growls as
though she's making up the words on the spot.
Car Wheels contains its surprises: When Emmylou Harris shows up to sing
harmony on "Greenville" or when Williams throws in a ZZ Top reference to
remind an old lover of better times or when she closes out the record in a
previously unheard gospel voice so thin and pretty, you can't help but stop
and smile and wonder why no one makes records like this anymore. It's about
love, the death of love, and the miles in between--familiar stuff; but
Williams makes it all seem brand new and unknown, even if the music is
carved from the most ancient of wood. (Robert Wilonsky)
Female Rock Album
Excerpts from internet.listserv.postcard2: 23-Feb-99 Re: 50/90 by Christopher M Knaus@juno And honestly, I'm sorta surprised people rate Exile in the top ten of the decade. The year it came out, possibly, but the entire decade?? Name a more impressive better written female rock album of the 90s that actually got a teensy bit of airplay. Aimee Mann's "Whatever" and "I'm With Stupid". -John www.musicfolk.com/swoop
Re: Who is Robert Wilonsky?
He sucks.
Re: Female Rock Album
At 02:15 AM 2/26/1999 John wrote: Excerpts from internet.listserv.postcard2: 23-Feb-99 Re: 50/90 by Christopher M Knaus@juno And honestly, I'm sorta surprised people rate Exile in the top ten of the decade. The year it came out, possibly, but the entire decade?? Name a more impressive better written female rock album of the 90s that actually got a teensy bit of airplay. Aimee Mann's "Whatever" and "I'm With Stupid". -John www.musicfolk.com/swoop Yeah, I thought of those after we'd let this thread cool. Thanks for the reminder, and for not getting on me about Sam. g b.s. "The truth ain't always what we need, sometimes we need to hear a beautiful lie." -Bill Lloyd
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Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Most assuredly every writer does not like every editor he/she is ever assigned to work with, but I've never been in a position where I just handed my manuscript to an editor and said "Here, change it at will." There's a give and take there, much like what El Presidente Gracey described. Looking back on this thread (that was Shane excerpted above, and below), it's becoming evident that of the many facets of music we can discuss around here, production is perhaps the most slippery. Since music appreciation is inately subjective, and, lacking personal testimony from the participants, it's impossible to really know how a producer and artist are collaborating, arguing about production is sort of like arguing about which primary color is prettiest. And I started the damn thread! Anyhow, in my own arbitrary, subjective head, I do prefer to maintain the myth that the artist is the one calling the shots on production. As for Chet Atkins, since most of the artists he worked with wound up receiving similar arrangements for their tunes, I'd say that's fairly good evidence that he was calling the shots. That doesn't mean the artists had a problem with his choices (though I don't know that you can assume perfect harmony on those choices either). Yes, young upstart writers don't always get the luxury of choosing their editor, but a good editor worthy of the job title doesn't take the writer out of the editing process-- indeed, the writer is the key ingredient in the editing process. As an editor, and a writer, I'll just say that it pisses me off when a writer leaves all the work to me, as an editor. The final product is going to look a lot more like what the writer intended, if he or she thinks it through, and does internal editing him or herself, before handing it to me. So, maybe in the same way, I prefer those producers who gently usher the artist through the process, and expect the artist to call the shots on fundamental issues, such as, do we use a 40-piece orchestra, or just call in Del McCoury et al. With the caveat, of course, that sometimes my sense of how the record came to be is fabricated in my own head, molded with my own preconceptions and dispositions. -- Terry Smith np Bobby Bare/Chet Atkins again. "The Game of Triangles" is a killer song. I'm wondering how it would go over here in the late 90s. It has one line that goes something like this, "A woman can't steal a husband who's happy at home." Yikes.
Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....
Jon wrote; You gotta have a little sympathy for Ralph Stanley; one of the unspoken (as far as I know g) goals of Clinch Mountain Country was to get him the Grammy. Yeah, I guess it woulda been nice, but hell-he doesn't need one, at least not a Grammy from the music industry as it was shown to the world on that night. dan
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Terry says: As for Chet Atkins, since most of the artists he worked with wound up receiving similar arrangements for their tunes, I'd say that's fairly good evidence that he was calling the shots. That doesn't mean the artists had a problem with his choices (though I don't know that you can assume perfect harmony on those choices either). I'm going to pick at this a little bit more, if y'all can stand it. The problem, as I see it, is that this still suggests a model in which the artist simply comes in to get his orders and has the choice of objecting or assenting, when the way things work in the studio is typically somewhat more complicated, if only because it's not a vacuum. A lot of records, not just those produced by Atkins, had similar arrangements in the sense I think you mean, Terry; everyone would arrive at the studio with the same commercial/artistic context in mind. Let me recommend again to anyone with an interest in the subject the current issue of the Journal of Country Music, which has a lengthy excerpt from a transcript of a 1989 roundtable discussion among a bunch of studio musicians who were on many of those old records; the title is "Let's Cut A Hit: talking with A-Team Nashville Studio Musicians." Personally, having had experience both as a writer and as a recording musician, I think the differences between the two situations outweigh the similarities. np Bobby Bare/Chet Atkins again. "The Game of Triangles" is a killer song. I'm wondering how it would go over here in the late 90s. It has one line that goes something like this, "A woman can't steal a husband who's happy at home." Yikes. Haven't we talked about this before? I don't mean "The Game Of Triangles" (BTW, since the liner notes to the RT set don't mention it, let me point out that the Liz Anderson singing on this cut with Bare and pretty Miss Norma Jean is the one that wrote "I'm A Lonesome Fugitive" and a bunch of other stuff that helped make Merle Haggard a star), but the way that changing social mores have affected the content, or how we perceive it, of cheating songs. OK, *I've* talked about it before. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
RE: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....
Jon wrote; You gotta have a little sympathy for Ralph Stanley; one of the unspoken (as far as I know g) goals of Clinch Mountain Country was to get him the Grammy. Yeah, I guess it woulda been nice, but hell-he doesn't need one, at least not a Grammy from the music industry as it was shown to the world on that night. I wasn't thinking of the honor, I was thinking of the sales boost that usually goes along with a Grammy. I suspect Dr. Ralph and his posse were, too g. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
RE: Merle question
-Original Message- Stuart Munro [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] I'm expecting an easier drive to the Lowell show in April. Me too (already got my tickets). Drinks beforehand at Smithwick's Stuart? rebecca
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
-Original Message- From: Shane S. Rhyne [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] I guess I said all that to say this-- it doesn't make sense to me that folks can single-handedly blame Chet Atkins (or insert name of producer here) for any perceived faults in the production of Bobby Bare's (or insert name of artist here) records. Atkins may have acheived a good level of power, but I find it hard to believe he could force "Countrypolitan" down the throat of anyone who did not willingly want to collaborate to some degree. [Matt Benz] This is true, but there are terrible producers who will not only ruin the sound of a song, but actually add lyrics, bridges, etcessentially re-write your song. So a artist can be manipulated easily. Surprising that anyone would allow this to happen, but it does. I've seen it with my own eyes, and heard it with my own ears. Young bands-offered a chance to record-are easily waylaid and manipulated. I wouldn't say this about Atkins. The Countrypolitian Sound, was like the Motown and Stax sound, created by a group of musicians and producers working together on many projects, hence the similarities in sound and style. But it was still organic and complex, not a rote system applied like whitewash. There are as many producer/musician relationships as there are musicians and producers. There's the Ken Nelson school, where he kept out of the way of creativity for the most part, letting Buck Owens run the show while he ran the technical end, listened for problems. Then there's the George Martin type, who starts out in control, but over time becomes more of a musical partner, learning as much as the artist, then there's those producers who Rule as Gods, ala Phil Spector. And every other kind you can think of, from drinking buddy to the guy in the band who owns the board. Did you know the Beatles, in 1969, claimed that Phil Spector ruined their "Let It Be" songs with heaps of strings and choirs? Well, at least McCartney complained. I don't think the others cared anymore. Matt, wearing his new Turncoat proudly
Re: Skinning the Cat (Was: Re: Lucinda)
Howdy,
Me: the "cat" in question when "skinning a cat" is a fish and not a
feline.
CK: Wha? Please for to explain your crazy moon language.
The phrase "There's more than one way to skin a cat" refers to the special
problems associated with cutting open a catfish. Catfish have sharp pointy
things (that's the scientific name for them, I apologize for not using the
laymen's terms here) on their back and sides. So, holding a catfish like a
normal fish when you're "skinning" it, is gonna get your hands injured.
Fortunately, catfish fishermen have figured out that there is more than one
way to skin a cat and I can enjoy a fine dinner of catfish.
"Catheads" (biscuits), however, do refer to felines. ("Biscuits as big as a
cat's head.")
I hope that explanation was helpful.
Oh, wait, was this fluff?
Take care,
Shane Rhyne
Knoxville, TN
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
NP: Hazeldine, Orphans
Pronunciation question
Howdy, I'm probably going to play this band on "Fringe" this weekend and would like very much not to mangle the pronunciation of their name. So, which is it? "Hazel-dean" or "Hazel-dyne" Thanks in advance for your kind assistance. Take care, Shane Rhyne Knoxville, TN [EMAIL PROTECTED] NP: Hazeldine, Orphans
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Matt Benz wrote: Did you know the Beatles, in 1969, claimed that Phil Spector ruined their "Let It Be" songs with heaps of strings and choirs? Well, at least McCartney complained. I don't think the others cared anymore. Well, both Lennon and Harrison shortly subsequently got Spector to produce their records (Plastic Ono Band, Imagine, All Things Must Pass) so they must either never have listened to Let It Be (which offers as good a reason as any to never hire Spector for anything) or they (god help us) actually liked it. I know we've been focusing, or trying to, on producers of twang, but I've been surprised that no one's mentioned Jeff Lynne, one of the most wretched of the wretched. No matter what the lineup of the band or their style, after going through his meat grinder they all sound the same, with the limp but loud drums and those horrendous drive-by backing vocals with all the life compressed out of them. Jeez. And otherwise relatively sane people hire him, just like Spector. Somewhere in there is a point that relates to Terry's objections to Chet Atkins, but it's escaping me at this point on a Friday morning. Will Miner Denver, CO
Re: Chicago Calendar
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: (the Chicago Calendar) A few notes: Blondie will be at the Tower Records on Clark Street, Saturday (tomorrow) at 3 p.m. Autographs only, no musical performance. Hightone's newsletter says Tom Russell is playing FitzGerald's on April 26. And R.E.M. at the World, August 20. And don't forget The Plastic People of the Universe, next Friday at Empty Bottle. TWM -- Tom Mohr at the office: [EMAIL PROTECTED] at the home: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
SXSW In-Stores at Cheapo Discs
Here's the schedule (so far) of in-stores at Cheapo Discs during SXSW (posted on the Hillbilly List by Jason Shields). Cheapo is located at: 914 North Lamar (a few blocks north of Waterloo Records) 512-477-4499 Jason Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thursday, March 18th: Noon: The Billygoats (Nashville, TN) Pop-a-billy 1:00pm Tony Maserati (Austin) 50's Rock Roll 2:00pm T. Jarrod Bonta (Austin) Country Swing 3:00pm The Dusty 45's (Seattle, WA) High energy rockabilly, swing 4:00pm James Intveld (Los Angeles, CA) Supurb roots-americana 5:00pm Split Lip Rayfield (Wichita, KS) Psycho-bluegrass 6:00pm The Horton Brothers (Austin) Boppin hillbilly harmonies 7:00pm The Jive Bombers (Austin) snappy traditional swing Friday, March 19th: Noon: Eric Hisaw (Austin) Southwest folk 1:00pm Dallas Wayne (Finland) Country, folk-rock 2:00 Vic Valore (Minneapolis, MN) Ratpack lounge/swing 3:00 Hillbilly Idol (Cleveland, OH) Roots country 4:00 The Piners (Portland, ME) Americana 5:00 (TBA) 6:00 Stephen Lee Canner (Austin, TX) Hillbilly bop 7:00 American Standards (Austin, TX) Texas hot-rockabilly Saturday, March 20th: Noon: (TBA) 1:00 pm Paul Burch (Nashville, TN) 2:00 (TBA) 3:00 (TBA) 4:00 Hot Head Swing Band (Minneapolis, MN) 20's Hot Jazz 5:00 Chrome Addicts (Sacramento, CA) Adrenaline-based blues 6:00 (TBA) 7:00 (TBA) There will also be some great in-stores at Under the Sun (next door to the Continental Club) and a bash at the Texicali Grille with the Hollisters and Cornell Hurd. Will post more details later. David Goodman Modern Twang
Re: Nick Hornby / Tom Perrotta
Thomas Mohr wrote: I know there are some Hornby fans around here Just finished "About a Boy", Hornby's new one. Again, his protagonist is a pop-culture-infused manchild and, again, he's produced a fine, funny book. Tucker
Re: Pronunciation question
"Hazel-dyne" "Hazel-dyne" "Hazel-dyne" "Hazel-dyne" "Hazel-dyne" -- From: "Shane S. Rhyne" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "passenger side" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Pronunciation question Date: Fri, Feb 26, 1999, 8:52 AM Howdy, I'm probably going to play this band on "Fringe" this weekend and would like very much not to mangle the pronunciation of their name. So, which is it? "Hazel-dean" or "Hazel-dyne" Thanks in advance for your kind assistance. Take care, Shane Rhyne Knoxville, TN [EMAIL PROTECTED] NP: Hazeldine, Orphans
Re: Arbitrary Stars (Was: Re: Repost: 50/90)
At 09:14 PM 2/25/99 -0500, you wrote: Howdy, Jeff Weiss says: According to Grant Alden, writers do not control the "Star System." Editors make those decisions. That makes no sense. How does that prevent a reviewer from writing a review that is accompanied by a star rating that has no relation at all to the text of the review? Sadly, it doesn't. Welcome to Corporate rock and roll. Jeff Miles of Music mail order http://www.milesofmusic.com FREE printed Catalog: (818) 883-9975 fax: (818) 992-8302, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Alt-Country, rockabilly, bluegrass, folk, power pop and tons more.
Re: Robert Johnson
At 09:12 AM 2/26/99 +, you wrote: A longshot, this, but I really need a link to a site that has a collection of Robert Johnson lyrics if at all possible. Not a long shot at all. http://miavx1.acs.muohio.edu/~flannetd/rjlyrics.htm http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/5942/rjohnsonlyrics.html http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/Delta/2541/blrjohns.htm
Swingin' Doors, 2/25/99
Last night's show held together really well. The first hour should be up on the KCMU web page in the next day or two. Listen in at: http://www.kcmu.org/listen.htm You'll be able to hear new stuff from Damnations TX, James Hand, Steve Earle the Del McCoury Band, Jeff White, and Biller Wakefield, along with cool demos from the Souvenirs and Five Bucks, and the usual assortment of older stuff you should know about. References to P2 discussions are rampant. Buck Owens his Buckaroos - Before You Go The Souvenirs - One Less Fool (3/6 at the Tractor w/ Little Sue) Rosie Flores - Bring It On James Hand - Not Worth The Trouble Anymore Johnny Bond - The Fool's Paradise Ray Price - Please Talk To My Heart k.d. lang - I'm Down To My Last Cigarette (request) The Gourds - Magnolia (3/26 at the Tractor) Five Bucks - Down There Damnations TX - Spit and Tears (3/13 at the Crocodile w/ Richard Buckner) Beaver Nelson - Drive You Home Steve Earle and the Del McCoury Band - Leroy's Dustbowl Blues Jeff White - Lonesome As It Gets Johnson Mountain Boys - Teardrops Fell Like Raindrops Osborne Brothers - Making Plans Ira Louvin - The Bottom Of The Bottle Biller Wakefield - Martian Guts Little Jimmy Dickens - Country Boy Johnny Jack - Ashes Of Love Moon Mullican - Seven Nights To Rock Jimmie Skinner - How Low Can You Feel Cisco - Mr. Wright Kelly Hogan the Mellowcremes - Hanky Panky Woman Neko Case - Somebody Led Me Away (3/11 at the Tractor) Gene Watson - If I'm A Fool For Leaving John Anderson - Wild and Blue Kelly Willis - Not Forgotten You The Waco Brothers - Hello To Everybody Hadacol - What You Wanted The Pinetops - So Lonesome I Could Fly Bob Wills his Texas Playboys - Blues For Dixie (request) Milton Brown his Musical Brownies - Cheesy Breeze Al Dexter his Troopers - I'm Losing My Mind Over You Floyd Tillman - They Took The Stars Out Of Heaven Clay Blaker (w/ Jim Lauderdale) - It's Only 'Cause You're Lonely (request) David Ball - A Walk On The Wild Side Of Life George Jones - From Here To The Door (request) Jack Greene - Statue Of A Fool Lynn Anderson - Cry Little Sue - Down To You (3/6 at the Tractor w/ the Souvenirs) Richard Buckner - When Love Is Gone (3/13 at the Croc. w/ the Damnations) David Olney - Snowin' On Raton The Flatirons - Three Crosses Lulu Belle Scotty - Remember Me Lulu Belle - I Wish I Was A Single Girl Again Lulu Belle Scotty - Get Along Home Cindy Lulu Belle Scotty - Have I Told You Lately That I Love You The Del McCoury Band - A Far Cry J.D. Crowe the New South - You Didn't Say Goodbye (Sat/Sun@Wintergrass) Doyle Lawson Quicksilver - Speak Softly, You're Talking To My Heart Ricky Skaggs - Pig In A Pen Mac Wiseman - I'd Still Write Your Name In The Sand Gary Stewart - Ten Years Of This The Whites - I Wonder Who's Holding My Baby Tonight Merle Haggard - Ramblin' Fever (request) Swingin' Doors can be heard Thursdays from 6-9pm on KCMU 90.3FM in Seattle. Email me if you have any questions about the music played.--don
The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Is there still space on Curry's 'acts we wouldnt mind seeing wiped from the earth' list? (Billy, not Ray.) We tried to eradicate Joel when Curry was in LA and this here game was spawned, but I think it was Corrie MoM who held a spot of nostalgia for Joel and thus refused to pull the trigger. For those who didn't latch on to Curry's post the first time, this is a wonderful game for music geeks everywhere. Again, the basic premise, try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them. The three main stipulations: it can't be someone obvious like Michael Bolton nor obscure like countless 80s one hit wonders, plus, if you eradicate a solo career you eradicate everything that came before it as well. For example, I would have glady eradicated Sting but not the Police. Try it some time with a couple few friends. It seems three people is the minimum and five or six may be heading toward futility. It's good fun to discover where your peers secret and not so secret fandom often lives. Plus, it gets you chatting quite a bit about music in general. The night after we stumbled across it, we posed it again to an editor-friend of mine in an LA club. She jumped right in and was so involved that she sent me e-mails the next two days listing possible candidates. Good fun... booze highly recommended for proper gaming experience. Neal Weiss, who wanted to eradicate Asia (Curry said no) and was very passionate about losing REO Speedwagon (my wifey said no).
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Two words: Bob Seger.
Re: varnaline
I know of no other geeks I can ask this question of, and it's driving me crazy. I love the Varnaline Sweet Life cd, but it sounds SO familiar. Do I know this lead singer guy from somewhere else, or does he just sound like someone else? In fact, even their production sounds hauntingly familiar. I guess you answered your own question with the next e-mail, but I might add that lot of folks compare Anders Parker of Varnaline to Farrar as well. Of course, that's a comparison I cringe at simply because I quite like Varnaline and think that anytime a vocalist is compared to Farrar is tags them a UT clone and thus and insignificant entity. Or something... NW
Re: Robert Johnson
A longshot, this, but I really need a link to a site that has a collection of Robert Johnson lyrics if at all possible. Not a long shot at all. http://miavx1.acs.muohio.edu/~flannetd/rjlyrics.htm http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/5942/rjohnsonlyrics.html http://www.geocities.com/BourbonStreet/Delta/2541/blrjohns.htm Can I just mention here that Brad "Blah Blah Blah" Bechtel freakin rocks my world? The man is a web fiend, and always comes through for me when I looking for info on anything, as was the case this week with Kaballah. In this case, his pointers got me off my duff and into finally writing this story I've been trying to avoid. Gracias, mi amigo. Neal Weiss
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Two words: Bob Seger. Not even close. Seger made some great great music way back when. To this day, I'm especially fond of "Beautiful Loser." Next? NW
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
This is gonna get fun. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: passenger side [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, February 26, 1999 12:50 PM Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) Neil writes: Not even close. Seger made some great great music way back when. GAG! Great compared to what, REO Speedwagon? g When you look in the rock dictionary under "over hyped, bombastic and silly" there's a picture of Seger and nothing else. Next! Jim, smilin'like a rock
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Tar hutt Jeff writes: Jim, try to seek out some ofhis stuff before he became BOB SEGER and I think you might agree. Bleach. Are you referring to Turn The Page? hee hee. To me Seger was an eary day Michael Bolton. Gimme ZZ Top any day. Jim, smilin'
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
ZZ Top's early stuff positively smoked Seger - I'll agree with that... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: passenger side [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, February 26, 1999 1:02 PM Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) Tar hutt Jeff writes: Jim, try to seek out some ofhis stuff before he became BOB SEGER and I think you might agree. Bleach. Are you referring to Turn The Page? hee hee. To me Seger was an eary day Michael Bolton. Gimme ZZ Top any day. Jim, smilin'
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Is there still space on Curry's 'acts we wouldnt mind seeing wiped from the earth' list? Oo Can I play? In order: 1) The Grateful Dead. 2) Michael Bolton. 3) Steve Perry. And the world wakes up shiny and new, as if reborn and seen for the first time --Jon Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wollaston, Massachusetts
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Jeff say: ZZ Top's early stuff positively smoked Seger - I'll agree with that... Oh yes, absolutely. That 3-disc set of the early ZZ albums is quite a document. Texas, baby!! g --junior npimh: Tube Snake Boogie
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Is there still space on Curry's 'acts we wouldnt mind seeing wiped from the earth' list? Can you say "Little Texas"? As open-minded as I'd like to be, I just could not figure the rationale for their existence. --junior
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
-Original Message- Ph. Barnard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Oh yes, absolutely. That 3-disc set of the early ZZ albums is quite a document. Texas, baby!! g --junior npimh: Tube Snake Boogie Yes, yes, yes. "La Grange" STILL rocks my world. ZZ Top rools! Uh, that tube snake boogies song sucks though rebecca
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Oo Can I play? In order: 1) The Grateful Dead Nope. If I understand the rules correctly, this would not only wipe out the Old In The Way stuff, which I could probably live with, but the Bluegrass Reunion album with Red Allen, and since that's about the biggest chunk of Red available on CD (save for the cuts on the Osborne Brothers boxed set), it's a definite no-go. Check back at the end of the year to see if the Red Allen boxed set is out (or enroute) and then reapply. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Again, the basic premise, try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them. The three main stipulations: it can't be someone obvious like Michael Bolton nor obscure like countless 80s one hit wonders, plus, if you eradicate a solo career you eradicate everything that came before it as well. For example, I would have gladly eradicated Sting but not the Police. So if I choose that cleanhead guy Mark Miller of Sawyer Brown, that gets rid of not only the band but that stupid "Star Search" show? Cool! -- Geff King * [EMAIL PROTECTED] * http://www2.ari.net/gking/ "Don't let me catch you laughin' when the jukebox cries" - Kinky Friedman, "Sold American"
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
-Original Message- From: Geff King [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 1:28 PM To: passenger side Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So if I choose that cleanhead guy Mark Miller of Sawyer Brown, that gets rid of not only the band but that stupid "Star Search" show? Cool! [Matt Benz] No! I won't let you get rid of Ed McMahon! I won't! np "The God Why Don't You Love Blues"
Re: George Jones' voice
"[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Mark Wyatt)" wrote: Next up for discussion--honky-tonk diction. Why the heck do singers like Buck Owens and early Paycheck add an "ell" to words that don't have them? Like, "I ain't nell-ver..." They don't talk like that in southern Ohio (Paycheck's stomping grounds), and I bet they don't in Bakersfield, either. because it is more euphonius. My grandfather (a central Texas farm boy) always said "milnk" for the same reason. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Patty Griffin
Any fans of her out there? I love Flaming Red wondering if anyone has done any tab for her songs! Thanks. Diane
Re: George Jones' phrasing (was Gag reflex)
Jon Weisberger wrote: An interesting comment. I'd say that the *technique* isn't especially a bluegrass one - Monroe and most of the other major bluegrass singers of Jones' younger days don't clench their jaws - but the emotional content of that, the physical restraint/emotional outpouring dialectic, if you will g, is a prominent feature of the style. I always feel like bluegrass tenors are singing more up in their heads, with their noses, rather than their mouths. To me, not a bluegrass expert by any means, it almost defines the style. No vibrato, either. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Bob Seger at his (early) best is gritty and real, I once heard him singing a version of St Dominic's Preview that I'll never forget. I like "Strut". YES - Goodbye Steve Perry Goodbye Billy Ocean Goodbye Outfield Goodbye George Michael Goodbye Grateful Dead -- From: "Tar Hut Records" [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: "passenger side" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) Date: Fri, Feb 26, 1999, 11:54 AM I have to agree. Bob Seger rocked his ass off climbing up the ladder in Detroit and also on some of his early stuff. Jim, try to seek out some of his stuff before he became BOB SEGER and I think you might agree - or at least not want him off the planet. At one point, he had the heart and the guts. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: passenger side [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Friday, February 26, 1999 12:44 PM Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) Two words: Bob Seger. Not even close. Seger made some great great music way back when. To this day, I'm especially fond of "Beautiful Loser." Next? NW
RE: Dixie Chicks stand up for what's right
Reply to: RE: Dixie Chicks stand up for what's right I wouldn't have expected anything less from a band whose singer is the daughter of Lloyd Maines. Jon Weisberger wrote: Courtesy of country.com... After being approached by TV's VH-1 about playing their video for "Wide Open Spaces," the Chicks declined because they were asked to get rid of the fiddles in the song. "You might as well just edit out the banjo and the steel guitar and make it a whole new song," they reportedly told the network.
Re: Mickey Baker
In a message dated 99-02-26 12:28:58 EST, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Guitarist MICKEY BAKER. The 74 year old musician is about to receive a pioneer award from the Rhythm and Blues Foundation for his work as a sideman on hundreds of recordings of RB and rock roll records from the 50's and 60's. He recorded with Ray Charles, Dinah Washington, Screamin' Jay Hawkins, Ruth Brown, and many more. The Awards banquet takes place in L.A. February 25th. (The Rhythm and Blues Foundation is located in Washington D.C.) I attended the awards show last night, and met Mickey Baker, and heard his brief live performance during the show. He's kept up his chops amazingly well for someone who has been quite ill for a long time. The award was presented by Travis Tritt, Marty Stuart and Ray Benson. Mary Katherine
FW: Randy Howard Benefit Cybercast
-Original Message- From: Bluegrass music discussion. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Terry Herd Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 1:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Randy Howard Benefit Cybercast A special Benefit Cybercast for Randy Howard is now online at http://www.bluegrassradio.com. This 2 hour live recording made on January 31 and February 1 at the World Famous Station Inn features: The Kathy Chiavola Band, Sam Bush and John Cowan, John and Jamie Hartford, Tut Taylor, The Whites, Carl Jackson, Don Rigsby, The Nashville Bluegrass Band and many others. The program will be online for one week starting today and is a Free cybercast. If you can, we encourage you to make a donation to Randy in any amount to help him with his medical and living expenses. His address is listed on our site. Enjoy.
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Jon Weisberger writes: Oo Can I play? In order: 1) The Grateful Dead Nope. If I understand the rules correctly, this would not only wipe out the Old In The Way stuff, which I could probably live with, but the Bluegrass Reunion album with Red Allen, and since that's about the biggest chunk of Red available on CD (save for the cuts on the Osborne Brothers boxed set), it's a definite no-go. I dunno, Jon. Sounds to me like a small price to pay if I could count on never having another hippie trying to convince me how great "Workingman's Dead" was. In one fell swoop my years running a record store would have been improved by 200%. For that matter, some of 'em might have picked up a thing or two about personal hygiene at some point, too. --Jon Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wollaston, Massachusetts
Re: Dixie Chicks stand up for what's right
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Jon Weisberger wrote: Courtesy of country.com... After being approached by TV's VH-1 about playing their video for "Wide Open Spaces," the Chicks declined because they were asked to get rid of the fiddles in the song. "You might as well just edit out the banjo and the steel guitar and make it a whole new song," they reportedly told the network. Of course, to an extent I'm playing devil's advocate here (a bit of a paradox for an atheist), but just imagine a response like, "You might as well just dump the lead singer and the Sam Cooke covers" a couple of years ago. Fanning old flames while I flog dead horses and mix metaphors, Bob
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, John Kinnamon wrote: try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Two words: Kenny G Why restrict it to artists? Two more encompassing words: "Lite" jazz. And a couple more: New age. Bob
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Two words: Kenny G Too obvious. Falls into the Michael Bolton category. NW
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Actually it only takes one word:Yanni rebecca -Original Message- From: John Kinnamon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 4:38 PM To: passenger side Subject: Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammysz) try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Two words: Kenny G
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Two words: Bob Seger. Nah. Even better than Dave Edmunds version, four words:Get Out Of Denver Seger was cool till LIVE BULLET made him famous, though he did get bloated and bad awfully fast. Folks around here forget just how bad the seventies were, course a lot of 'em were just a bunch of damn kids, grumble grumble How about Lake, or Missouri? Too easy? How about Little River Band or Styx? Just four from the seventies; there's plenty more. b.s.
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
"Shane S. Rhyne" wrote: I suppose I always assumed that production was a more collaborative effort than what it sounds like. Sometimes the producer is the de facto artist, like Phil Spector, whose artists were pretty much nameless and interchangeable (except perhaps the Righteous Bros) and who really was the star of the show. Some producers are very hands-off and just interject an opinion when needed to steer things in the right direction. some of them are overpaid airheads who sleep through the session (I have personally engineered sessions with a famous-name producer who slept through the whole damn thing). There is no definition of what a record producer is or does. Some of them are people who put the money up for the session and appropriate the "producer" title just because they can, not having a clue. There are musician-producers, engineer-producers, financier-producers, label owner-producers, and increasingly now there are songwriter-producers who have very definite ideas about how they want their songs done. I swear fifty percent of the job lies in knowing when to say "that's the one. Stop now", since most musicians are perfectionists and will play something to death and go 'way past it. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
If I get rid of Pat Boone does that also take out the The Boone Sisters and Debbie. Tell me, please tell me its so. And if we can't take out the Dead because Garcia played on some ok bluegrass albums how bout we take out Weir or Pigpen. That kills the dead Dead leaves Garcia noodling without a band.. Iceman
Re: Skinning the Cat (Was: Re: Lucinda)
"Shane S. Rhyne" wrote: I enjoying mixing metaphors as much as the next bartender, but, ahem, the "cat" in question when "skinning a cat" is a fish and not a feline. says who? I'm serious. Around these parts it has always been held to be a feline. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
I swear fifty percent of the job lies in knowing when to say "that's the one. Stop now"... And another twenty-five percent lies in knowing when to say "hey, have you got that tuner nearby?" Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Two words: Kenny G Too obvious. Falls into the Michael Bolton category. NW Hey Neal, Can I get a ruling on the Grateful Dead in-a-barrel shooting in this thread? Waay too damn easy 'round these parts. b.s. sworn to wear his Skull and Roses tee to TF III. g
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Terry A. Smith wrote: np Bobby Bare/Chet Atkins again. "The Game of Triangles" is a killer song. I'm wondering how it would go over here in the late 90s. It has one line that goes something like this, "A woman can't steal a husband who's happy at home." Yikes. Interesting question, since there's a nice cover of it on the excellent The Wandering Eyes collaboration from last year. b.s.
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
"Terry A. Smith" wrote: As for Chet Atkins, since most of the artists he worked with wound up receiving similar arrangements for their tunes, I'd say that's fairly good evidence that he was calling the shots. That doesn't mean the artists had a problem with his choices (though I don't know that you can assume perfect harmony on those choices either). There is no question that Chet was making the conscious attempt to popularize country music by using pop elements the the RCA records he was making. I was a kid dj in Ft. Worth during this time, and my boss was the guy who wrote "Fraulein" and was on RCA and Chet and he talked the radio station into putting in what he called a "countrypolitan" format, which was in essence a non-twangy country format aimed at urban audiences. We played all the new Ray Price and all the RCA stuff and all of the rash of "Hank with Strings" and all that mess. However, I must say that in Atkins' defense (as if he needed it- he's a giant) that in the instances where the addition of pop elements would have been jarring, he didn't do it (like for Charley Pride and Johhny Bush.) (I still maintain that those Bare records were not jarring when we heard them for the first time- they fit perfectly with the era. Objecting to the Anita Kerr singers just would have seemed silly in the 60s.) He didn't just run from studio to studio cramming strings and singers onto country records, he used good sense to try to slick up what could be slicked up and left the rest alone. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
And if we can't take out the Dead because Garcia played on some ok bluegrass albums... No, no, I don't care that much about Old In The Way. I'm talking about Red Allen. His leads on Bluegrass Reunion (Garcia appears on guitar on two cuts, lead vocals on two cuts) are worth more than a whole coliseum full of ZZ Tops, and certainly more than a Dead-rein world. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
(I think I'd leave the Dead alone just to keep the NOT live Workingmans/American Beauty..but they did add much to the noodling disease...) Never having been a metal fan, there are days, in retrospect, I'd put the hit on Led Zep to stamp out not so much them but a lotta what they done wrought..like the notion that endless volume noddling and macho posturing are all that interesting either.but I don't think I could give up the history of Jimmie Page before that, so I'll pass. I'm pretty sure just raising this suggestion will piss off some people though--which is the point of this game, ain't it? And if you're gonna zap somebody-- you gotta keep it pivotal. Hmmm...David Crosby?... Who put out the first record that kept the ending going on and repeating forever to turn a 2:33 single into a modern bore?...Nominees? Barry M. NP: Kelly Willis
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Joe Gracey wrote: I was a kid dj in Ft. Worth during this time, and my boss was the guy who wrote "Fraulein" Your boss was Lawton Williams?! Not only did he write "Fraulein," but he also wrote what may very well be my all-time favorite country song, Gene Watson's "Farewell Party." He's still writin' some good 'uns too -- he wrote a coupla fine tunes for Justin Trevino's Texas Honky Tonk album.--don
Re: The Eradication Game (Seger The Dead)
FWIW--Bob Seger sings a bit o' background on the MC5's "High Time" LP, which is my favorite record of theirs (though certainly not because of the Seeg's "oozin aahs"). And as much as Birk-patchouli-and-crystal wearing hippies annoy the body odor out of me, certainly The Dead shouldn't be eradicated. I love Keith Godchaux's barrelhouse piano-playing, Kreutzman's drumming, and Garcia's take on "You Win Again" is one of my favorite Hank-related moments. However, I don't like any of Weir's takes on country songs, Mickey Hart should have been deported, and actually, if the band--as a whole--would've lost their arms and legs in a freak boating accident around 1977, I'm sure I would like them even more. Fuckin hippies. Lance . . .
Thursday 'Ghosts' Winner
Thursday's winner of a copy of 'Ghost's of Hallelujah' by The Gourds is: Rebecca Katic (West Roxbury, MA) TODAY is the last day, so if you want to register just go to: www.allegro-music.com/gourds 'Ghosts of Hallelujah' is released on March 9 but is available for pre-release sale on the site.
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Jon Weisberger wrote: Matt says: There are as many producer/musician relationships as there are musicians and producers. There's the Ken Nelson school, where he kept out of the way of creativity for the most part, letting Buck Owens run the show while he ran the technical end, listened for problems. Except that Nelson apparently wasn't nearly so hands-off when it came to the Louvin Brothers (it was his comments about the mandolin that got Ira into such a swivet). It really is hard to generalize about this stuff. I saw him produce a record one time. He did the weirdest thing: when it came time to mix, he got a pair of good headphones, set up a little table in front of a picture window out in the studio, opened up a good bottle of red wine, and sat there looking out over the Hill Country, sipping wine, and listening to the mix progress over the phones. It finally dawned on me what he was doing- he was removing himself from the process so that all he could be aware of was the mix itself. Brilliant, really. (Other guys do the same thing by leaving and just coming in from time to time to see how it's going.) -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Joe says: It finally dawned on me what he was doing- he was removing himself from the process so that all he could be aware of was the mix itself. Brilliant, really. (Other guys do the same thing by leaving and just coming in from time to time to see how it's going.) Or, to get back to the producer that started the thread, here's a snippet from the JCM roundtable I mentioned earlier: Q. What about the producers? I'd like for you to talk about what they contributed. Buddy Harman: A lot of 'em were smart enough to let us do what we felt like would fit the song.A lot of 'em left us alone, and they'd just play a demo and we would come up with something. Ray Edenton: Chet made that statement one time. He was really interested in it - one of the better producers, I thought. Somebody said (Chet was in there reading a book), "Why don't you tell these guys what to play?" He said, "Why the hell should I tell 'em? There're six guys out there. They could all be producers. Why should I tell 'em that when I got six people telling me how this record should be made? If I hear something I don't really like, I'll tell 'em. Otherwise, I'll read my book." Harold Bradley: Or he'd sit there and practice his guitar. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Hey Neal, Can I get a ruling on the Grateful Dead in-a-barrel shooting in this thread? Waay too damn easy 'round these parts. The Dead is fair game I think, but not necessarily easy game, as Weisberger pointed out. I too would veto such eradication because of Jerry's bluegrass jones and because I will always give props to a band so interested in experimentation, even if it was mostly dreadfully boing in reality. NW, who would like to amend the rules to eradicate the second-half of the Stones' career if he could.
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Jon Weisberger wrote: I swear fifty percent of the job lies in knowing when to say "that's the one. Stop now"... And another twenty-five percent lies in knowing when to say "hey, have you got that tuner nearby?" you know, I'm speaking with forked tongue because I rely on them, but I hate tuners. Have a stated this rant before? Before tuners records sounded really cool, with the slight disonances created by individuals tuning the best they could and never perfectly. Imagine how much less cool Jimmy Reed or Dylan in the 60s would have been, perfectly in tune? I think it is something we are missing from modern records. And what with ProTools, you will never hear anything even approaching an off-key note from a vocalist again. Imagine what they would do to Sinatra now, tweaking every one of those little slightly-off notes to perfection? It is a sad thing. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Any way we can see this whole article, Jon? Or, to get back to the producer that started the thread, here's a snippet from the JCM roundtable I mentioned earlier: Q. What about the producers? I'd like for you to talk about what they contributed. Buddy Harman: A lot of 'em were smart enough to let us do what we felt like would fit the song.A lot of 'em left us alone, and they'd just play a demo and we would come up with something.
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Any way we can see this whole article, Jon? Yeah, you can buy the issue (of Journal of Country Music); it's the current one. The masthead says you can also get a photocopy of articles through The Genuine Article, (215) 386-0100, but really, the whole issue is well worth having, not only for this lengthy roundtable, but for the other big features, too: one on "Hillbilly Boogie" and a great piece on Fan Fair by occasional Guest Rocket Richard D. Smith. If it were some mass media mag, I wouldn't hesitate to scan post it, but this is a publication of the Country Music Foundation we're talking about, and they deserve the $$ - in fact, anyone with more than a passing interest in country music ought to have a subscription ($18/year) anyhow. You can reach 'em at (615) 256-1639. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Blimey! - March's MOJO
I bought MOJO today (after the P2 recommendations) and wow, so much
alt.country in it I can't believe it!
We have:
Kelly Willis review of 'What I Deserve' (a good one too)
Steve Earle The Del McCoury Band review of 'The Mountain' (and I quote
- "If you're a Steve Earle fan and you like Bluegrass, guaranteed this
record will make you come" - ?!!)
What Happening In Americana small section (including info on Hot Club Of
Cowtown, Butch Hancock and others)
Americana Album Of The Month (Dave Alvin 'Blackjack David')
Gillian Welch David Rawlings gig review at the Aberdeen Music Hall
("The hall is only about half full when they open with Tear My
Stillhouse Down, and as the song draws to a close, a couple near the
front get up from their seats and head back to the bar.")
*And* Scotty Moore is coming to Southampton. Yippee! Can anyone tell me
what to expect?
Louise
--
If you like rocking country music, check out the Okeh Wranglers web site
at:
http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/bluesmoke
RE: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
I'm not Jon, but go get yourself a subscription to the Journal of Country Music. It's in the latest issue. Jim Nelson Matt Benz [EMAIL PROTECTED] 02/26 2:08 PM Any way we can see this whole article, Jon?
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
How about Reckless Kelly? Chad
Broken up and Blue
Servin' notice to all y'all that Red Meat's "Broken Up and Blue" is currently number 1 (that's numero UNO!) on the Panel Report's independent country singles chart... I just found out, and had to pound my chest a bit. Owen Bly (smilin', like Jim C) Ranchero Records Oakland, CA Owen Bly Ranchero Records Oakland, CA
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
However, I must say that in Atkins' defense (as if he needed it- he's a giant) that in the instances where the addition of pop elements would have been jarring, he didn't do it (like for Charley Pride and Johhny Bush.) (I still maintain that those Bare records were not jarring when we heard them for the first time- they fit perfectly with the era. Objecting to the Anita Kerr singers just would have seemed silly in the 60s.) He didn't just run from studio to studio cramming strings and singers onto country records, he used good sense to try to slick up what could be slicked up and left the rest alone. That was Joe. Yeah, notwithstanding my grumping about Chet the Producer, I have tremendous respect for the man. I still have my "Superpickers" LP, too! And are those suburban singers really the anita kerr singers? Sheesh. One more thing, people today hear things differently, have different attitudes about production, so, I'm curious, was Atkins slick production really the "normal" way folks expected to hear country tunes produced in the 60s? I just have to think that it still bothered a lot of folks back then. Of course, I'm just guessing. -- Terry Smith ps I just got a press release from a publicist for Atlantic Records' "Old Dogs" session, a record with Bobby Bare, Waylon Jennings, Jerry Reed, Shel Silverstein and Mel Tillis that was originally sold via telemarketing. It really stresses their outlaw status. Check this out: "Unlike the glossy 'flatbellies' or more homogenized icons of today, these country music trailblazers were the discontented and brilliantly expressive Marlon Brandos and James Deans of country music. If they couldn't have done it their way, they wouldn't have done it at all Included in their touring legends is the template for many of the 'bad boy' bands that came after them..." PR BS
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with the How about Joni Mitchell??
Re: BB King (was: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Brad Morris wrote: Clapton was embarrassing, and are we sure he and BB even rehearsed? That was a pretty lamo blues performance all around. As stated elsewhere, Clapton/King was a mess. I liked the way each of them made a show about being deferential to each other while trying to get their licks in. Is it me, or is BB King mailing it in when he performs these numbers? I know that the man is an original, but he relies on that glissando lick (strike a note way up high on the neck and then slide quickly down in pitch) to excess these days. He does it before a solo, in the middle of a solo, at the end of the solo, prior to a verse, and as the final note of a song. Having a unique blues vocabulary is admirable, but this guy seems reduced to a single word or two. Part of me wants to say, "If I reach that age, I hope I can remember what 'mail' is." But that doesn't mean that I enjoyed that performance either. I recently finished King's autobiography, which had been on sale at Borders for $3.99. I think he could safely have left off at a "kiss and tell" book. One chapter is actually titled "Someone Asked Me About Oral Sex." To his credit, he changes the subject after four pages. Bob
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Don Yates wrote: On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Joe Gracey wrote: I was a kid dj in Ft. Worth during this time, and my boss was the guy who wrote "Fraulein" Your boss was Lawton Williams?! Not only did he write "Fraulein," but he also wrote what may very well be my all-time favorite country song, Gene Watson's "Farewell Party." He's still writin' some good 'uns too -- he wrote a coupla fine tunes for Justin Trevino's Texas Honky Tonk album.--don Yep. Lawton was the Program Director and was taking the Gospel of Chet to the people of Cowtown. This was in 1967, when FM radio was a stepchild, unused format that nobody listened to. Putting music on FM radio was hopeless, since very few people had the receivers for it. Chet's idea was that if you removed the hard-core honky tonk stuff you could attract a much wider audience, especially females. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Re: Production-- producer as midwife
In a message dated 99-02-26 08:08:58 EST, Terry writes: Anyhow, in my own arbitrary, subjective head, I do prefer to maintain the myth that the artist is the one calling the shots on production. Oh, in a perfect world I suppose... I don't think there's any specific formula for the producer/artist relationship. Every one that I've ever been in has been unique. I've worked with guys for hire, guys working on spec, guys full of enthusiasm. I've done projects with producers I was in awe of, and where I didn't speak myu mind, so I know the feeling of failure, of coming home with something even I dont' want to listen to after so much hope and expectation. Greg Garing turned out to be amazing in the studio, got some great performances out of us, he was the midwife for the great rhythm tracks, was great at helping us find the "just right" tempos and feels. But between him and Boo, my guitarist and co-founder of the band, I found myself really having to struggle to do certain things the way I wanted them done. And I learned that sometimes if someone doesn't get their way, they lose interest. If you want to call the shots you've got to stand your ground, and accept that sometimes you're just not going to be liked. That you've got to trust your instincts and stand by your impulses, and hopefully your producer willl let you work your ideas out, even if they're not sure what you're getting at. That's the hardest thing, insisting on something when eveyrone else has a different idea. But oh boy what joy when you realize your vision and then everyone goes, "o, I see what you mean." "One Dog Town" is by far not a perfect record, but there are some things on it that I'm really proud of, and they are almost inevitably the things that I had to fight tooth and nail for. As for knowing when it's the right time to move on, it's also important to not let someone push you into accepting something your'e not happy with, when what you hear in your head hasn't happened yet on tape. I don't know if this thread was started by someone wanting to know about producers because they're entering into a producer/artist relationship (I've been on the road and forgot to unsubscribe so wow! what a lot to sort through), or if it's just a dreamy kind of speculative quest, but there are a few of my thoughts on the subject. Been enjoying reading all the fun P2 stuff again. Take care, Elena Skye P.S. Met a few P2-ers on the road, and then again last night at The Rodeo Bar. Great fun.
Grammyzzzzz Shania
On a related note, here's what a TwangCast listeners sent me today. Thank God for Twangcast! Here in Indianapolis we have two "country" radio stations, both of which, like the Grammys, seem to believe that Shania still counts. Yours, Mike Hays http://www.TwangCast.com TM RealCountry 24 X 7 Please Visit Then let us know what you think! Mike Hays www.MikeHays.RealCountry.net For the best country artist web hosting, www.RealCountry.net
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
"Terry A. Smith" wrote: And are those suburban singers really the anita kerr singers? Sheesh. Yep, they and the Jordanaires were all over Nashville records. One more thing, people today hear things differently, have different attitudes about production, so, I'm curious, was Atkins slick production really the "normal" way folks expected to hear country tunes produced in the 60s? I just have to think that it still bothered a lot of folks back then. Of course, I'm just guessing. -- Terry Smith Well, there was some grumbling from the purist camps when people like Ray Price went countrypolitan and Chet started to gussie up the product, but since most of them were the same 10,000 drunk males who had bought every other record for the past ten years, nobody much cared. There has always been the push-pull of "keep it country" vs. "pop it up" in nashville music. However, nobody thought it was odd to have singers on country records, they were a staple. Strings was usually the dividing line. ps I just got a press release from a publicist for Atlantic Records' "Old Dogs" session, a record with Bobby Bare, Waylon Jennings, Jerry Reed, Shel Silverstein and Mel Tillis that was originally sold via telemarketing. It really stresses their outlaw status. Check this out: "Unlike the glossy 'flatbellies' or more homogenized icons of today, these country music trailblazers were the discontented and brilliantly expressive Marlon Brandos and James Deans of country music. If they couldn't have done it their way, they wouldn't have done it at all Included in their touring legends is the template for many of the 'bad boy' bands that came after them..." Although much of this is patent nonsense (they did it both ways, in fact), I think it is striking to think about how utterly different and original each of these men were. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
UK CMA Awards
Any of our British P2 friends have a copy of the list of British CMA Award nominees. Dale Watson won one last year, just curious this year if he's nominated. Mike Hays http://www.TwangCast.com TM RealCountry 24 X 7 Please Visit Then let us know what you think! Mike Hays www.MikeHays.RealCountry.net For the best country artist web hosting, www.RealCountry.net
Wilonsky on Wilco and the sleazy radio programmers
I started to post this article from the Dallas Observer but it is really long. If someone really wants to see it I will post it to the list. I haven't read it all but I have heard several folks are pretty steamed. http://www.dallasobserver.com/1999/current/music1.html Jerald NP: Mike Ness 4 song sampler-he covers "Don't Think Twice" and there is steel guitar on a couple of tracks.
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Well, then, if we can't agree on the Dead, how about the evil which they hath wrought? Namely, Rusted Root and Phish? And who amongst you can argue for Motley Crue's right to live? (BTW, I think Jerry Curry should be disqualified from this game). And I don't care about Cry, Cry, Cry, Dar Williams should have hot bamboo shoots shoved under her fingernails before being eradicated. Chock full o' bile today, Erin
RE: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Well, then, if we can't agree on the Dead, how about the evil which they hath wrought? Namely, Rusted Root and Phish? Phish has been doing a fine job of introducing new fans to Alison Krauss, Del McCoury more (Ronnie mentioned Phish to me at least 3 times when I interviewed him and his dad a few weeks ago). On the other hand, I've never heard of Rusted Root; bring on the ax. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
Will Miner wrote: I know we've been focusing, or trying to, on producers of twang, but I've been surprised that no one's mentioned Jeff Lynne, one of the most wretched of the wretched. No matter what the lineup of the band or their style, after going through his meat grinder they all sound the same, with the limp but loud drums and those horrendous drive-by backing vocals with all the life compressed out of them. Jeez. And otherwise relatively sane people hire him, just like Spector. I must chime in and agree here about Jeff Lynne - particularly with the godawful synth bath production jobs he did to Dave Edmunds back in the early 80's. MichaelBerick
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
In order: 1) The Grateful Dead. 2) Michael Bolton. 3) Steve Perry. I'll throw in another vote for Steve Perry/Journey and add in Styx and Supertramp (could never keep them apart anyways) MichaelBerick
Re: Wilonsky on Wilco and the sleazy radio programmers
On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Jerald Corder wrote: I started to post this article from the Dallas Observer but it is really long. If someone really wants to see it I will post it to the list. I haven't read it all but I have heard several folks are pretty steamed. http://www.dallasobserver.com/1999/current/music1.html Wilonsky can be a jerk, but the music industry -- particularly the current sorry state of radio -- deserves every bit of scorn and ridicule that's heaped upon it. Sic 'em, Bob.--don
Re: Wilonsky on Wilco and the sleazy radio programmers
Jerald Corder wrote: I started to post this article from the Dallas Observer but it is really long. If someone really wants to see it I will post it to the list. I haven't read it all but I have heard several folks are pretty steamed. http://www.dallasobserver.com/1999/current/music1.html Interesting piece Jerald, thanks. But aside from Wilonsky's occasional editorializing, where's the controversy from it? b.s.
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
At 11:33 AM 2/26/99 -0600, you wrote: Two words: Bob Seger. NO CHANCE! Call it bombast if you must, it still rocked my world... and still makes me smile. Jeff
Re: Wilonsky on Wilco and the sleazy radio programmers
http://www.dallasobserver.com/1999/current/music1.html Interesting piece Jerald, thanks. But aside from Wilonsky's occasional editorializing, where's the controversy from it? b.s. There's a little steam rising over on Postcard. I would say that anyone who claims Jay Farrar has written not only the same album three times over, but the same song, what, 35 times over since forming Son Volt, doesn't really have a clue. In terms of the interview itself, I think some people wonder why Jeff Tweedy has to drag out the sour grapes every time Uncle Tupelo comes up in conversation. I do sometimes think it's about time he got over it, rather than inventing new ways of expressing the bitterness he feels towards Farrar every time. Oh well. Stevie np - Son Volt, Left a Slide. Which, if you think about it, sounds just like Route, Straightface and Way Down Watson...
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
In a message dated 2/26/99 12:41:22 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Celine Dion. Slim
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
I'll throw in another vote for Steve Perry/Journey and add in Styx and Supertramp (could never keep them apart anyways) Can't say yes to Styx, cuz I must confesses to hours of pre-punk adolescent enjoyment derived from Grand Illusion. But adios to the other two, especially Superchump. NW
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
In a message dated 2/26/99 11:50:55 AM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: When you look in the rock dictionary under "over hyped, bombastic and silly" there's a picture of Seger and nothing else. Next! I guess "Smokin' O.P.'s" was before your time. slim np- Bocephus King (interesting...)
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
Celine Dion. Way too obvious to count in this game, even if she's on the top of my most- likely-to-make-me-hurl-upon-seeing list. NW
Re: Production-- Ralph Emery's take on this thread
I must chime in and agree here about Jeff Lynne - particularly with the godawful synth bath production jobs he did to Dave Edmunds back in the early 80's. MichaelBerick I must chime in here too, pointing out that my pal Michael Berick (MoMZine and ND contributor) has foolishly taken my advice and logged on to P2. Welcome MB. And to all you non Los Angelenos out there, this has got to at least prove that there's what, at least three, four or five cool folks that hail from this his region, right? Doing everything I can to not work today. Neal Weiss
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
In a message dated 2/26/99 12:41:22 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Twister Sister, and now they are doing a come-back tour. Nancy
Re: The Eradication Game (Re: Grammyszzzzzzzzz....)
In a message dated 2/26/99 12:41:22 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: try to come up with an artist that all can agree should be eradicated from the earth, their history taken with them: Duh, I meant Twisted Sister
