Re: Derailers release date...
Junior writes:A single from the album, "Full Western Dress," will be out in June. Apparently this single memorializes Mark Wyatt's pointy boots. Hey I didn't even know Brian knew Mark. Besides those platform shoes don't count as Western, unless yer talkin', um L.A. g Thanks for the info. Jim, smilin'
Re: Clip: New Faces Show
In a message dated 3/16/99 6:21:55 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Bottom line for me is that Jon Randall Stewart's a talented guy, and she's a talented singer (she flat out tore up that "I've Enjoyed As Much Of This As I Can Stand," which was, BTW, written by Bill "I Get The Fever" Anderson), and either their marriage will work out or it won't; it doesn't make much difference to me either way. Then shut the hell up about it. Just funnin' with ya. Slim
Re: Clip: The state of country radio
I see your point Jon, but I think you give Shania too much credit for her early career as some people slam her too much for singing cabaret-style "pop" tunes. Before Lange got involved, you have a woman who wanted a music career; was influenced equally by country and pop and who tinkered around writing songs. She sang whatever gave her a paycheck and the Nashville invite was just "luck". She says now that she fought to get things her own way - well, interesting point is that she really didn't have a style at that point. She pretty much sang as a pop songstress, wore ordinary and sometimes frumpy looking clothes and had that wedge cut of a hairdo. She got a job as a house singer for Crook Chase. I think it was Wilson who did say that he looked over the songs she had written and didn't think much of them, adding that "they" didn't think they were good. Exit Norro Wilson, enter Lange. Her vocal style changes, her music changes, her "look" changes and she adopts male rock star stage mannerisms. She didn't do this all by herself. The songs which she did write were altered by Lange and we'll probably never know exactly who wrote what or was responsible for what as it's all part of the myth those two want us to "buy" into. Her future was thought-out beforehand and planned step-by-step. Absolutely brilliant "take" on the Eliza Doolittle story. While I'm on the subject - often I think that people look at her rock influence and cite her videos and some of her television appearances as a threat to country music and sometimes to women in general. Her videos express a more perfunctory sensuality than her actual stage presence. In concert, she is not the sassy little belly-button waving sex kitten or the freewheelin' liberated woman, but rather a happy cheerleader of country/pop who literally bounces about the stage, invites members of the audience to sing with her, including children and who often shows a video of herself strumming guitar and singing a country song at age 9 or 10. She tries very hard to entertain and she is quite likeable in a little sister sort of way. After seeing one of her concerts, my impression was that she was a "nice girl" who just wants to be liked. Her music and her "style" belies the fact that she is a 33 year old woman. I have concluded that she is an interesting phenomenon whose time will pass also as the bouncy cheerleader pose won't work much longer as she gets older. Actually, I'm a bit suprised it has worked thus far. Those videos obviously work to her advantage. Anyway, Jennings, Nelson, Glaser and Colter had a cause to support, were already in the business and knew exactly how they wanted to approach and stand up for their beliefs whereas Twain just wanted to be in the music business and sing with the likes of Elton John and Stevie Wonder. Tera -Original Message- From: Jon Weisberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: passenger side [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tuesday, March 16, 1999 1:36 PM Subject: RE: Clip: The state of country radio Looking at the matter in terms of the country music industry and the way that it works, Twain's career, at least through The Woman In Me, bears a considerable resemblance to that of some of the 70s Outlaws - that is to say, a struggle with "conservative" producers and label execs over her desire to pursue a new sound that could appeal beyond the "normal" country audience by bringing in pop/rock elements. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/ Jon, you keep making this point, but I'd argue that you're overstating the resemblance between Twain's career (and, by necessity, her music, since that's her career) and that of the 70s outlaws. Let's see. Artist A has essentially mediocre success using producer-determined/arranged material, fights with his label in order to record the stuff that *he* wants to, rather than what the label has stuck him with in the past, wins fight, hits it big with crossover appeal. Artist B has essentially mediocre success using producer-determined/arranged material, fights with her label in order to record the stuff that *she* wants to, rather than what the label has stuck her with in the past, wins fight, hits it big with crossover appeal. Looks like a pretty close resemblance to me on a pretty important level. As I said before, there's rock influences and then there's rock influences, and they're not all floating around on the same, precise relativist plain. So you say, but I think it depends a lot on your degree of interest in rock. If you're not interested in classical music, and you think that incorporating classical music influences into rock makes the result less enjoyable, are you really going to care whether it's Beethoven's influence or Holst's? Are you going to find a Beethoven-influenced rock song better than a Holst-influenced one? Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: New Los Lobos list
Larry writes: From previous comments I know there are several Los Lobos fans on the list, so thought I'd pass along word that a new Los Lobos mailing list is getting started. It's probably not going to be a very high-volume list, but with the new CDs from Cesar Rosas, the Latin Playboys, and David Hildalgo/Houndog out, upcoming tours, a new Los Lobos disc in June, etc. there should be some things to talk about. ...and for all you Boston area fans, Cesar Rosas will be playing on 4/28 at The Original House of Noise (oops...I meant Blues), in Cambridge. It's a Sunday, rest up! Kate.
Re: Car-Mounted Vodka Bottle
This reminds me of something a state trooper told me one time, about an old guy he stopped for driving erratically, who actually had his windshield wiper cleaner hose routed through his dashboard. He filled the reservoir up with Heaven Hill bourbon, and whenever he wanted a drink, he'd push the button, hold his dixie cup under the mouth of the hose, and get a shot. You've got to give the geezer extra credit for ingenuity. -- Terry Smith ps So what's the dope on Patty Page? Good pop or bad pop? My work colleague has a greatest hits CD that I've been thinking about borrowing.
RE: Derailers release date...
And remember, Columbus resident Ed Atkins is the new bass player. He'll be the good lookin one. Be sure to say hi to him on tour and make him feel at home. Can you imagine: signing on to a band and having a video shoot being your first "job?" -Original Message- From: BARNARD [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 1999 8:38 PM To: passenger side Subject: Derailers release date... Oh by the way Apparently we're looking at a projected July 13 release on the Derailers. A single from the album, "Full Western Dress," will be out in June. Apparently this single memorializes Mark Wyatt's pointy boots. --junior
Tweedy @ Salon
From a Salon interview with Jeff Tweedy. Joshua Green is the writer. Who is he and why is he such a dick? Q: I was thinking specifically of the No Depression purists who are kind of militantly pro-twang, you know what I mean? A: I really have no concern for them. It's great that they have plenty of music to like. I think it's interesting that they still talk about us. It's like something for them to talk about that this band continues to let them down. I think there are a certain group of people that are really purist about it, but somehow they can't find it in their hearts to just let us alone and get on with their lives. Militantly pro-Scorcher, Dave *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Given the recent traffic here and especially on P1, I'd say the man has a valid point. rebecca, who is still unsure if she likes "Summerteeth" -Original Message- From: Dave Purcell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] From a Salon interview with Jeff Tweedy. Joshua Green is the writer. Who is he and why is he such a dick? Q: I was thinking specifically of the No Depression purists who are kind of militantly pro-twang, you know what I mean? A: I really have no concern for them. It's great that they have plenty of music to like. I think it's interesting that they still talk about us. It's like something for them to talk about that this band continues to let them down. I think there are a certain group of people that are really purist about it, but somehow they can't find it in their hearts to just let us alone and get on with their lives. Militantly pro-Scorcher, Dave *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 09:34:32 -0500 Dave "Man the Barricades" Purcell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From a Salon interview with Jeff Tweedy. Joshua Green is the writer. Who is he and why is he such a dick? Q: I was thinking specifically of the No Depression purists who are kind of militantly pro-twang, you know what I mean? You know, I just read this interview and I'm with Dave. What's the deal here? Since when did this "No Depression purists" tag start appearing? Just who exactly is this guy referring to? He doesn't say. Out of the 700 people on this list, I doubt that anyone really fits the bill here. Is he referring to Postcard? I haven't been over to that side in years, so I really don't know what the discussion is like over there these days. I've started to see this "purists" theme more and more lately and wonder if it's backlash-driven. PS -- Be sure to check out Keith Knight's hilarious cartoon on SXSW on the same Salon site. William, who once walked out of a Scorchers show, much to Dave's dismay when I fessed up to it. William Cocke Senior Writer HSC Development University of Virginia (804) 924-8432
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Militantly pro-Jeff Rebecca writes: Given the recent traffic here and especially on P1, I'd say the man has a valid point. Dunno about Postcard, but given that everything from Coltrane to Blue Oyster Cult comes up here on a regular basis, I think one would be hard-pressed to describe P2 as a list of No Depression purists. It's ironic that Tweedy gets annoyed with the "Wilco is an alt.country band" cliche, but seems perfectly willing to play along with the "No Depression purists" stereotype. Perhaps he should consider that some people, such as myself, just don't like his music, and its twang quotient is beside the point. Militantly pro-Wildcat, Dave *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Dave: Dunno about Postcard, but given that everything from Coltrane to Blue Oyster Cult comes up here on a regular basis, I think one would be hard-pressed to describe P2 as a list of No Depression purists. Indeed. Perhaps the demographic description should be changed to "free-range country lovin' eclectics". Sure has a snappy ring to it... --junior
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
From a Salon interview with Jeff Tweedy. Joshua Green is the writer. Who is he and why is he such a dick? Q: I was thinking specifically of the No Depression purists who are kind of militantly pro-twang, you know what I mean? A: I really have no concern for them. It's great that they have plenty of music to like. I think it's interesting that they still talk about us. It's like something for them to talk about that this band continues to let them down. I think there are a certain group of people that are really purist about it, but somehow they can't find it in their hearts to just let us alone and get on with their lives. Militantly pro-Scorcher, Dave Do these writers all hang out together? The whole "escape from alt.country" thing is getting as used-up as the "phoenix rising from the ashes of Uncle Tupelo" lines... To wit, Joel Reese's take on Joe Henry: "It's not that Henry shouldn't be applauded for pushing his own musical envelope on "Fuse." There's nothing wrong with moving on from the confining alt.country scene. This movement is known for its zealous fans, quick to accuse a band of selling out if it doesn't meet their exacting purist standards. (Just ask The Jayhawks and * Wilco, which have both evolved from their country-rock roots.)" Zealous, accusatory and exacting, TL (BTW, I loved this quote from Henry: "People have a tendency to treat an acoustic guitar like it's the basket that floated the infant Moses down the river," he says. "There's nothing pure or natural about any of this, I don't care who you are. This idea that doing things with acoustic instruments is somehow more pure and more real - I don't have any interest in that as a notion.")
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
At 09:12 AM 3/17/99 +, you wrote: Dave: Dunno about Postcard, but given that everything from Coltrane to Blue Oyster Cult comes up here on a regular basis, I think one would be hard-pressed to describe P2 as a list of No Depression purists. Indeed. Perhaps the demographic description should be changed to "free-range country lovin' eclectics". Sure has a snappy ring to it... --junior Damn straight Dave! Purist shmurist! Junior- I believe you have found THE description for said demograhic... I myself am going out and getting business cards done. g morgan "what's so funny about peas, loam, and underplanning?" (referring to my very ungreen thumb)
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
I get the feeling this entire journalistic discourse is part of larger marketing and publicity calculations. When these people could secure a niche identity for themselves as "altcountry," they did. Now that they've consolidated at that level and seek poprock market visibility wider than that allowed by the niche label, they busy themsevles with "evolving" beyond a caricatural version of altcountry. When they wanted to be covered in ND, they were "altcountry." Now that they want to get covered in Rolling Stone and Spin and gain access to the much larger market demographics they represent, they're "evolving." That's fine, I just wish they didn't feel compelled to misrepresent their original audience in such reductive ways But yeah, as Todd and Dave remarked, it sure seems to be a trend and the journalistic cliche of the season. --junior
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
What's his beef? He did the Mermaid Ave music in a roosty vein (never have I heard a band try so hard to sound like the Basement Tapes, BTW), so it's not like a huge stretch for folks to expect him and WIlco to still produce ND related music, when his last project *was* so NDish. Now he has a big ELO pop music spectacular, which is fine, but for him to express bewilderment that folks are surprised and maybe not thrilled with such sudden musical changes is funny. It is a radical jump from one album to the next. People who like the Neil Young sound don't rush out and embrace his rockabilly big band techno albums either. People like consistancy. Not everyone is so embracing of the wide range of pop and rock stylings that a artist may feel like playing. Not everyone is so well rounded as some of the folks on p2. No big deal, just the way it is. Interesting to note Joe Henry is also going thru this stage. I don't care what he puts out, I don't think he's betraying anything by changing sounds, I just get tired of him and the "purists" whoever and where ever they are-talking about it.
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
Joel Reese's take on Joe Henry: This movement is known for its zealous fans, quick to accuse a band of selling out if it doesn't meet their exacting purist standards. (Just ask The Jayhawks and Wilco, which have both evolved from their country-rock roots.)" Don't you actually have to sell records to sell out? Lance . . .
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
On Wed, 17 Mar 1999, Matt Benz wrote: with such sudden musical changes is funny. It is a radical jump from one album to the next. People who like the Neil Young sound don't rush out and embrace his rockabilly big band techno albums either. People like consistancy. Not everyone is so embracing of the wide range of pop and rock stylings that a artist may feel like playing. Not everyone is so well rounded as some of the folks on p2. No big deal, just the way it Ah ah buster.not so fast. I followed Neil Young through all of his iterations and really, enjoyed all of them, including _Trans_. I despise consistancy. Probably another reason I liked Dave Edmunds' Jeff Lynne phaseit just sounded different. "Different is good", remember the ad? Sigh..you are probably right Matt. People want a constant sound/feel. I don't think _Nebraska_ or _Tom Joad_ did any wonders for Springsteen's popularity. I doubt _Sweethearts of the Rodeo_ added a multitude of fans to the Byrd's popularity. The last Sam Phillips and Maria McKee albums ripped away popularity and in McKee's case, cost her a contract. Tweedy's comments are also reminding me of the statements that Emmylou made trying to *defend* her Lanois produced _Wrecking Ball_ album. Dammit, sometime the artists just want to stretch and critics fans alike have to find something, anything worth bitching about. I'm finding Tweedy's transformation equally fascinating as Neil Young's although I totally agree with your point regarding alienating fans. He's just feeling so frigging defensive about being asked about his changing musical direction particularly in the face of his "deified" musical past. That's a bit annoying to say the least. I wish he'd relax and just say, that's he's exploring directions that he's always wanted to go down. You know what else I really do believe, although I'll be nice and not attribute this to be his main motivehe's moving his material closer and closer to stuff that could attain commercial acceptabiltiy and viability. I'l just say that he's follwing his heart and following that ELO jones that I've also harbored all of these years g. Jerry NP: Wilco - Summerteeth My opinion: It's so interesting with the synthesizers and layered sounds, wonderful record sonically. Again, I think the writing is really flat and uninteresting. This seems to be a problem w/ Wilco for many P2'ers. I also find the violence a bit disturbing. Again however, I love the sound of this release.
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Michael J. Cempa wrote: I don't think Tweedy "sold out," he just made a record he wanted to make. If you don't like it, that's fine, but anyone who thinks Tweedy has some moral, musical or any other kind of responsibilty to alt.country is being close-minded. Exactly. That's what alt.country fans are being accused of though, and...well, the writers are just wrong. I never once accused Tweedy of selling out, I just think he's a mediocre songwriter. Dave *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
I don't know about other bands, but I think it's somewhat understandable that Tweedy (and that other guy, what's his name again? g) might be a little bit defensive about the "alt-country" tag. Because lookit, a bunch of fans of his old band started up an AOL folder, named after a song covered by his old band, which became the inspiration for a magazine, also named for the song covered by his old band (and the folder), which furthermore focuses (especially in the early issues) in a Capital-F Faanish way on his old band, and which contributes in no small way towards the genre or movement (which is also sometimes called by the same name as the song and the AOL Folder) being particularly defined as inspired by his old band. None of which he had anything to do with, or even, apparently, much interest in. I've always thought the way No Depression (the zine) looked up to UT, and their obvious expectations for its two offshoot bands, was just begging for -- okay not disaster, but mild embarrassment at least. And it seems to me that ever since the zine went out on that limb, Tweedy has been industriously sawing away at the base of it. As for the rock critics now turning up their pointy damp noses at "alt-country" as purism/confining/etc., this is a perfect example of the way the popular music press is short-sighted, trend-obsessed, arrogant -- and powerful. Because these guys actually *believe* they lead trends rather than follow, they in effect *do*. They kill the thing because they say it's dead. Not that alternative country will die -- but when these critics clamp the lid down on the possibility of serious consideration of it, it sure makes it hard to grow out there in the wider world of popular music. But -- more on this later; I'm working it into an essay (essays?) about alt-country between time and Timbuktu, generations, the so-called Boomer canon, and stuff I'm shit sick of. Hey. Work is slow, and life is good. --Cheryl Cline
Re: FW: well shit gawddam there's no justice in this mean and bitter world
Aghhhggh! Kelly Willis cancelled her Columbus show! Doesn't she know? Doesn't she understand? All those letters I sent her, all those "items" of my affection, all those.oh.I see Now Matt...she just needs her "space"...you understand don't you? Matt? Matt?
Twangfest motel
Hey what's the name of that motel that everybody stays at in St. Louis for Twangfest? How much does it cost, etc.? Red Meat's playing in St. Louis on 4/10 and I gotta find 'em a place to live for the night. I figure either there or a clean, comfortable room at the 6, whichever's cheaper. That 4/10 show is with Big Smith and the Rockhouse Ramblers (Kip's band), so if you're in the area and looking for a good time, come on by Blueberry Hill! Thanks for yer lodging info... Owen Owen Bly Ranchero Records Oakland, CA
Re: all things Iggy (and V-Roys)
On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: how many of their songs are about the dilemma posed when some woman is a faithless liar, though. Are there really that many faithless lying ladies in Tennessee? Yes, I married one became divorced from one! g She took a *liking* to one of her graduate students. Yes, I am kiddingsort of. JC
RE: Tweedy @ Salon, Kelly Willis
[Matt Benz] Well, in many ways, I identify with Tweedy, since I grew up with much the same musical influences, I suspect, and hell, I jump around myself musically. But then, no one asks me about that, nor do I have an adoring audience following my every move. Well, I do, but a court order should take care of that problem. Anyhoo, what I mean to say is I understand what he wants to do musically, and again, I'm not one of them ND purists. But like Purcell, I haven't really got into Wilco that much. Not sure why, but it isn't cause of betrayal or anything. Just don'tlike it...much. I'm also kinda disappointed with Kelly Willis' release. I guess I was hoping for something more along the lines of "Kelly Willis," a harder country sound. This is too ...erm.americana for my tastes, at least some of it. Still, it is her voice, so I'll live and still play it. Saw an old video of heres from the "Bang Bang" days in which she fully participates in one of them modern country videos. Yowza.
Faithless ladies in TN (was Re: all things Iggy (and V-Roys)
Are there really that many faithless lying ladies in Tennessee? Carl W. Yes. Of course, there are plenty of faithless men, too. Not that we Tennesseans are a faithless lot, we're just really CONCERNED with the idea of faith (and also guilt, salvation, etc.). I've always thought Scott Miller was at his best when writing songs about faithless women, God, and/or life in south Knoxville. V-roys songs about faithless women (an incomplete list): Lie I Believe Goodnight, Loser Kick Me Around Testify (First Time That You've Done That Again) ... and probably a few others Looking down our song list, we've got: How Much You Lied Just a Fool This Charmed Life She's Left Me For Good (Again) and, of course,there is the Mystery Dates' re-write of Doug Sahm's "Key to My Heart" -- "(Give Back the) Keys to My Car (that you stole from my driveway, you bitch)" Rob Russell the Bystanders http://listen.to/thebystanders
all things Iggy (and V-Roys)
Tom wrote:
this Iggy thing has me all worked up. I've been listening to "The
Idiot" and "Lust for Life" since Sunday night...
One highlight from last night's V-Roys entertainment (pardon me but
I'm not going to know titles) - one song launched with a rousing
version of the rhythm line from Lust for Life, continued until tabels
of people in the audience were singing it, and then hit the first
verse of what turned out to be a very upbeat twangy pop tune and not
Lust for Life at all, which then segued into a (unfortunately not very
good) post-grunge Modern Southern Rock tune sung by the goateed
guitarist... It was a confusing family-tree exercise linking Iggy,
Buddy Holly, Black Oak Arkansas and Soundgarden, very clever.
Otherwise - several nice ballads, lots of good rave-ups, some clever
lyrics and between-song bits. ("I was going to call this next song
Jesse's Girl, but it was taken, so I called it, Goodnight You Goddamn
Fuckin' Loser.") A good ability to find wide variation within a strict
genre, without sounding too samey through the whole set. A little odd
how many of their songs are about the dilemma posed when some woman is
a faithless liar, though. Are there really that many faithless lying
ladies in Tennessee?
Carl W.
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
I thought the Joel Reese quote in re Joe Henry that Todd Larson posted: There's nothing wrong with moving on from the confining alt.country scene. This movement is known for its zealous fans, quick to accuse a band of selling out if it doesn't meet their exacting purist standards. (Just ask The Jayhawks and Wilco, which have both evolved from their country-rock roots.)" was more disturbing than Tweedy's comments (after all, Tweedy does say "If it's something they don't like then I don't expect them to buy it"; it's his complaint that the "purists" are talking about how they don't like it because it's not "pure" that's off-the-wall). "Selling out" is, in my opinion, a fairly serious charge to make, and I don't believe I have *ever* seen Wilco or The Jayhawks characterized that way here or in ND; Carl's point about the limited value of P2/ND as representative of the "No Depression movement" is valid, but even so, one would think that just about any view that's at all widely held in said "movement" would find some reflection in one or both of those places. I'm inclined to think of these things as analogous to the way that McCarthy era ex-lefties were required to get themselves out of trouble by denouncing their former associations; ex-twangers seeking to move into the mainstream (not that there's anything wrong with that per se) are supposed to demonstrate their sincere interest in it by dismissing their earlier fans and critical supporters as unable to discern the virtues of Real - i.e., pop/rock - Art. That idea at least accounts for the persistence pop/rock writers seem to exhibit in pursuing the matter. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
I have a mixed reaction to this - clearly the current backlash (which I think has been accelerated by PazznJop and a couple of other instances of high-profile folk like Christgau calling alt-country "confining") is largely crap, and another case of Moronic Media Meme syndrome. And Tweedy has shown, for a long time, a puzzling inability to resist whining about how misunderstood he is. *But* - I don't think P2 - at least the most active participants on P2 - are representative of the alt-country fan base in general, and I don't think Tweedy is talking about P2. (He may see stuff from Postcard and from AOL, but who the hell would be trawling through this mountain of verbiage and pointing out to him things to be annoyed by?) Don't take it too personally, but I think there is some truth to the complaint that there is a reactionary twang audience out there. Case in point: Last night I went to see a free gig in town by the V-Roys, who I thought were a great bar band, though they were batting about .500 on decent songs. But the crowd was a really roadhouse-country-rock-lovin' bunch, who wanted their roots as loud and straight-up and danceable as possible. Nothing wrong with that, of course. Since we don't get much of the V-Roys brand of twang this far north, I haven't seen a gathering like that at most shows here, and it was fun. But I was very doubtful about how eclectic that audience's tastes probably were. And if Tweedy feels like there are people in such audiences who aren't open to different directions, he may be more right than the braintrust at P2 (The Official Home of The Alt-Whatchamacallit Intelligentsia, tm) would like to assume. Until there are better demographic surveys of the so-called No Depression market, all generalizations are suspect, and all suspicions are general. Carl W.
Re: April issue of Gig Magazine - Pittsburgh Content
They had a photo of some Elvis impersonator, but not one mention of Paul Ameritwang (unless he IS the Elvis impersonator). That was most likely the one and only Frankie Capri. Ms. Stephanie and I took Paul to see his "show" after Lydia Lunch's opening (art opening, what else?). Paul has never been the same. Also, this Iggy thing has me all worked up. I've been listening to "The Idiot" and "Lust for Life" since Sunday night. Could a cover of "Give Me Danger" be far off? One of my great brushes with fame was Iggy bumming a smoke off of me, the other was going to high school with the brother of the guy who made the ham sandwich that choked Mama Cass. Tom Moran The Deliberate Strangers' Old Home Place http://members.tripod.com/~Deliberate_Strangers/index.html
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
Carl Wilson wrote: Case in point: Last night I went to see a free gig in town by the V-Roys, who I thought were a great bar band, though they were batting about .500 on decent songs. But the crowd was a really roadhouse-country-rock-lovin' bunch, who wanted their roots as loud and straight-up and danceable as possible. Is that any different from people at a Metallica show not wanting to hear Lars co sound like Celine Dion? Or Ziggy Marley fans not wanting Ziggy to pull a glam-rock move? I think that's one of the dangers of bands who want to have one foot in the alt.country door and the other somewhere else. If they can sell to a roadhouse audience, great -- but they shouldn't be surprised if Mike Ireland goes over better than Wilco. Ditto with bands who play roots music with camp or irony. Mike told me once he wished they could play more VFW-type places. Wilco, on the other hand, would get killed at a biker bar. Not making this point as clearly as I'd like, Dave *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
I said of the V-Roys audience the crowd was a really roadhouse-country-rock-lovin' bunch, who wanted their roots as loud and straight-up and danceable as possible. And Dave P retorted: Is that any different from people at a Metallica show not wanting to hear Lars co sound like Celine Dion? Or Ziggy Marley fans not wanting Ziggy to pull a glam-rock move? Nope, it ain't, and those are good comparisons (since like Tweedy, Metallica and Ziggy have both been held up as standard-bearers by fans for their respective genres). However, that doesn't mean I wouldn't like to hear Ziggy Marley do a Velvet Goldmine soundtrack number, or that he shouldn't do so if he wants. And yeah, it would be kinda silly for him to whine and complain if reggae fans didn't appreciate his sudden penchant for Roxy Music and crushed-fabric blue evening dress. (Still if I heard someone verbally bitchslapping him for it, I'd be inclined to say, well, hold on, that's some fine glamrock Mr. Ziggy's turned out there, open your ears. So I'm swinging both ways on this one.) But my point was that P2 in general has established itself as a place where eclecticism is not only tolerated, but in some ways demanded. Which distinguishes it from your standard roadhouse crowd or even the usual cliques of genre devotees. (I don't think the same applies to No Dep to the same degree, by the way - it is more devoted to promoting the genre qua genre, though it's not close-minded.) If they can sell to a roadhouse audience, great -- but they shouldn't be surprised if Mike Ireland goes over better than Wilco. Ditto with bands who play roots music with camp or irony. Good point. It's worth noting here that Wilco's own roots have nothing to do with roadhouses - UT was a post-punk indie band, not a rockin' bar band, and that's a vast cultural divide. The alt-country scene includes both, as Dave's examples indicate. The backlash in the Henry and Wilco articles represent alt-twang way too monolithically. On the other hand, I disagree with Jon W.'s claim that nobody in the ND/P2 world has ever cried sellout at groups like Wilco. When a band known as alt-country moves away from twangier sounds - the Old 97s, Wilco, whoever - there's usually a comment made to the effect that it seems like a combination of "artistic development" and label pressure and/or commercial ambition, because as we all know twang doesn't sell. Now, on P2, that's usually accompanied by a "not that there's anything wrong with that" (which I find just a touch more convincing than the same excuse for anti-gay jokes on Seinfeld). But even if those comments are made in a spirit of complete objectivity, I think in the 90s it's hard for a songwriter to hear claims that changes in their sound are commercially driven without interpreting it partly as a dig. I've looked at twang from both sides now... Carl W.
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
I don't understand it either? I think it's really a case of being "catagorized" that gets artists squirrelly. It seems like Tweedy and Henry to a lesser extent take a defensive stance because a) they feel they have to defend their "evolving" art b) not so sure they are confident with their changes. Maybe? Just an observation from the son of a psycholgist. g But I think their defensiveness is more often than not justified. Matt is correct in that generally people are not extremely accepting en masse of an artist veering away from their roots so to speak. So, I think that is what Tweedy is referring to in that a portion of his earlier audience will and has abandoned him because of his "alleged" betrayal. So it's natural for him to just dismiss them as he feels they've dismissed him. It's always been tough for artists to forge ahead. They're always being compared to their earlier works and if they've had the good fortune or misfortune as the case may be to narrowly miss brilliance in their earlier work, it makes for a constant uphill battle. Neil Young is a great example. People constantly pitted "Trans" against "Harvest"... Different animals, period. Elvis Costello's worst records will far exceed the fodder we call top 40 today, yet he's crucified for a not so terrific release (in the eyes of the media). Essentially I see that one of the primary roles of a writer is to challange his or herself and evolve... If the Beatles stopped at "She Loves You" we never would have had "Happiness is a Warm Gun", if Bob Dylan said to himself "Heck, maybe this electric thang ain't goin' to work here", he would have never been booed off the stage in Newport with his blatent betrayal of folk with his "Band" backing him. What a treat that must have been for him. g I'm sure he hated being crucified, but he did it nevertheless, and now it's being lauded as one of the greatest moments in his career with the recently released Live at the Royal Albert Hall record. I applaud Tweedy/Henry/Jayhawks in the fact that they are uncompromising in their pursuit of making great records. Will there be missteps in the public eye? Yep? Will they lose and gain audiences? Yep? But isn't that what it's all about? The only unfortunate thing is that they feel that it's necessary to lash out at the ND/alt.country label...as we are a valid, and I agree, pretty open minded group of music enthusiasts that don't deserve to be slapped for their interests. The bottom line should be if you like what you here great, if you don't great... But the artists should be judged by the songs... Good songs are good songs period... morgan "slightly defensive and somewhat biased fan of Tweedy/Henry/Louris/Olson/L V (not the ex Miss America)Williams/ Farrar/Earle/Townsend/Hiatt and countless others" At 11:41 AM 3/17/99 -0500, you wrote: What's his beef? He did the Mermaid Ave music in a roosty vein (never have I heard a band try so hard to sound like the Basement Tapes, BTW), so it's not like a huge stretch for folks to expect him and WIlco to still produce ND related music, when his last project *was* so NDish. Now he has a big ELO pop music spectacular, which is fine, but for him to express bewilderment that folks are surprised and maybe not thrilled with such sudden musical changes is funny. It is a radical jump from one album to the next. People who like the Neil Young sound don't rush out and embrace his rockabilly big band techno albums either. People like consistancy. Not everyone is so embracing of the wide range of pop and rock stylings that a artist may feel like playing. Not everyone is so well rounded as some of the folks on p2. No big deal, just the way it is. Interesting to note Joe Henry is also going thru this stage. I don't care what he puts out, I don't think he's betraying anything by changing sounds, I just get tired of him and the "purists" whoever and where ever they are-talking about it.
RE: Tracy Byrd leaves MCA
Does he have a song about Watermelon in Georgia?
Yeah, that was probably his biggest hit to date, "Watermelon Crawl." An
HNC-ish band I worked in for a while did it, and like Lester says, I kindly
learned to love it. It's a spiffy little country-rocker of the sort I think
I like a lot more than a lot of other P2ers g. Anyhow, he's also hit
twice with Johnny Paycheck remakes ("Don't Take Her She's All I Got" and
another one I disremember at the moment), and some other fine stuff,
including a solid version of "You Lied To Me," written by Bill "I Get The
Fever" Anderson (there's another 2 days for Wm. Western). Even Roy Kasten
allowed as how there were some good cuts on his Big Love album.
Note that Byrd is from the same background (musical and geographical) as
Mark Chesnutt, and, with the closure of the latter's Decca, a label-mate as
well. Maybe this will encourage Chesnutt to make the same kind of stylistic
move, and then we'll never have to hear him sing those friggin' Diane Warren
ballads again.
Another intersting aspect to this is that Byrd's producer was Tony Brown.
I've been as big a defender of Brown as anyone - make that far and away the
biggest defender - here, but it looks to me as though the time is rapidly
coming when he's going to have to decide which way he wants to go - more
stuff like The Key (or like Byrd presumably wanted to cut) or more stuff
like that friggin' Diane Warren ballad.
Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Carl W. says: On the other hand, I disagree with Jon W.'s claim that nobody in the ND/P2 world has ever cried sellout at groups like Wilco. When a band known as alt-country moves away from twangier sounds - the Old 97s, Wilco, whoever - there's usually a comment made to the effect that it seems like a combination of "artistic development" and label pressure and/or commercial ambition, because as we all know twang doesn't sell. The way that I look at it, "selling out" means that "artistic development" isn't in the picture, so even leaving aside the question of whether it's really a criticism to say that a stylistic change includes a commercial motivation (in my book, it ain't), from my perspective there's a healthy-sized difference between the two characterizations. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
RE: Tweedy @ Salon, Kelly Willis
was: gimmackry sp should have been: gimmickry...previous post...was:here sp should have been: hear. my brain...it is not letting my finger's work properly today...plus I'm very related to several english teachers. g BTW, Happy St. Patrick's Day to you all!
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
Cheryl Cline wrote: But -- more on this later; I'm working it into an essay (essays?) about alt-country between time and Timbuktu, generations, the so-called Boomer canon, and stuff I'm shit sick of. For the record, I'm shit sick of Cheryl writing more eloquently and intelligently about music than I ever could in a hundred years. Dave, who is looking forward to drunken Twangfesters attempting to pronounce "shit sick" at 4am *** Dave Purcell, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Northern Ky Roots Music: http://w3.one.net/~newport Twangfest: http://www.twangfest.com
the pop switch(was Tweedy @ Salon)
I don't understand this almost predictable switch of formerly dubbed alt-twang bands to this pet-sounds pop thing. we've seen it with joe h, jayhwaks, wilco, golden smog, and the old 97's. maybe it's simply because most of them have been musically incestuous to varying degrees recently and in the past, and ole tweedy and louris have rubbed off on each other. not that I'm oppossed to new styles, I'm not sure if I get their new music. I felt this way after "sound of lies", then with "weird tales", now even more so with "fuse" and "summer teeth". some of the new songs on fuse and summerteeth are interesing, but it's not like I'm rushing home to listen to these records every night. why aren't these bands getting more twangy? more rock? punk? it's hard to give up on bands that have given me so much in the past. and these new fangled twang bands, well, seem to be riding the currents instead of causing the ripples themselves. so maybe that's what tweedy is trying to do. I'm not sure how big of a splash he'll make, but I'm glad that he's exploring new directions in his music. -george
RE: Tweedy @ Salon, Kelly Willis
At 01:40 PM 3/17/99 -0500, you wrote: [Matt Benz] Well, in many ways, I identify with Tweedy, since I grew up with much the same musical influences, I suspect, and hell, I jump around myself musically. But then, no one asks me about that, nor do I have an adoring audience following my every move. Well, I do, but a court order should take care of that problem. Anyhoo, what I mean to say is I understand what he wants to do musically, and again, I'm not one of them ND purists. But like Purcell, I haven't really got into Wilco that much. Not sure why, but it isn't cause of betrayal or anything. Just don'tlike it...much. You've got the right perspective... You understand where he's coming from, yet you don't like it 'cause it just doesn't resonate with you... That's cool... Personally I think this a really good/interesting record (time will tell if it stays on my repeat listens list). I don't know if its the unabashed Brian Wilson influence or what? Maybe it's just that I'm a hopeless popster myself...g Ultimately, I think it's that he's written some strong tunes once again and they're to be found beneath the studio gimmackry... I'm also kinda disappointed with Kelly Willis' release. I guess I was hoping for something more along the lines of "Kelly Willis," a harder country sound. This is too ...erm.americana for my tastes, at least some of it. Still, it is her voice, so I'll live and still play it. Saw an old video of heres from the "Bang Bang" days in which she fully participates in one of them modern country videos. Yowza. I'm actually new to Kelly Willis. I just picked up the record and really like it. Yes indeed, her voice is very beautiful and that carries me through alot of it. I also like the fact that she chose a few choice covers (Drake and Westerberg respectively)... Louris' contribututions are great to boot, particularly "Happy with that". "Not Long for this World" is a fine closer... Not sure if it's been discussed? The new Paul Westerberg Record...Best post Replacements release... Agree? Disagree? Discuss. g morgan
RE: That Bottle was Just a Coincidence - there's a song here somewhere
I like it! Especially the hook of the last line... BTW, Marie tells me you've got a new record coming out soon? Psyched to hear it! At 02:18 PM 3/17/99 -0500, you wrote: The proposed chorus: Yes, I slammed into that wall But not on account of the alcohol That much I can claim in self defense Broken hearted over losing you Drives me to do the things I do I don't mean no offence But that open bottle well that was just a coincidence
Re: Ooooops
** Attention - Bad Info Corrected *** Thank goodness someone is minding the company store! The ever alert Boudin Dan writes: I'm thinkin' you mean 3/28 my dear seeing he's playing the Met on Saturday 3/27. After I incorrectly stated that: ...and for all you Boston area fans, Cesar Rosas will be playing on 4/28 at The Original House of Noise (oops...I meant Blues), in Cambridge. It's a Sunday, rest up! Kate. The man speaketh the truth, 3/28 is the correct date. K.
V-Roys
Lust for lifenever thought of that one. The one that gets me is "Hey Mary" which is basically the same as Cash's "Hey Porter" musically. In case anyone was wondering, the V-Roys are *still* the best live band in America. Cheers. Steve == Steve Gardner * Sugar Hill Records Radio Promotion [EMAIL PROTECTED] * www.sugarhillrecords.com WXDU "Topsoil" * A Century of Country Music [EMAIL PROTECTED] * www.topsoil.net ==
RE: the pop switch(was Tweedy @ Salon)
George Figgs wrote: I don't understand this almost predictable switch of formerly dubbed alt-twang bands to this pet-sounds pop thing. we've seen it with joe h, jayhwaks, wilco, golden smog, and the old 97's. Slonedog responds: While a handful (and it is just a handful folks) of the songs on "Summerteeth" (which I think is brilliant) do owe a debt to "Pet Sounds", I don't think either "Sound of Lies" or Joe Henry's new one have much to do with Brian Wilson. The Jayhawks record reminds me more of 70s pop, rock (Big Star, et al) and even psychedelia. Some of the stuff on the Golden Smog record seems to serve as almost a bridge between "Sound of Lies" and "Summerteeth" (I do think Louris and Tweedy influence each other). And Joe Henry's new stuff (some of which is really good, if not as immediately accessible as his earlier alt-country stuff) seems to come from a different planet altogether. And while I haven't heard the new Old 97s record (looking forward to it), I think it's silly to lump all of these efforts together as their "pop thing" or their "Pet Sounds" thing. It's just like some people who see all alt-country bands as sounding the same. Across the above mentioned records and even from track to track, there is a diversity that cannot be that easily categorized.
RE: That Bottle was Just a Coincidence - there's a song here somewhere
Cool. I'm looking forward to it... At 04:23 PM 3/17/99 -0500, you wrote: Oh, um, yeh, the belated Sovines cd comes out this April on Kingpin Records. God willing and the creek don't rise -Original Message- From:Morgan Keating [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent:Wednesday, March 17, 1999 3:49 PM To: passenger side Subject: RE: That Bottle was Just a Coincidence - there's a song here somewhere I like it! Especially the hook of the last line... BTW, Marie tells me you've got a new record coming out soon? Psyched to hear it! At 02:18 PM 3/17/99 -0500, you wrote: The proposed chorus: Yes, I slammed into that wall But not on account of the alcohol That much I can claim in self defense Broken hearted over losing you Drives me to do the things I do I don't mean no offence But that open bottle well that was just a coincidence
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
Jon sez: "even leaving aside the question of whether it's really a criticism to say that a stylistic change includes a commercial motivation (in my book, it ain't), from my perspective there's a healthy-sized difference between the two characterizations." I agree, Jon, but in the minds of someone like Tweedy and the rock critics who interview him too much - generally reared in varying countercultures with self-styled anticommercial posturings - the "accusation" of commercial motivation is going to be read as a sell-out slam, and nuances are likely to be ignored. In a way I brought this up to show the double-bind involved: It's plainly fact that it's hard to make a living doing twangy music that doesn't pander to commercial country radio (not that all radio country's bad, I hasten to say, but I think we can agree its demands are fairly rigid). Rock audiences, for their part, are wary of twangy sounds, the more fool them, and rock labels even more so. So the artist's under all this pressure from "above" to make other sorts of music, and if you're Jeff Tweedy, you might say, "Well, actually, that's what I'm interested in doing at this point anyway." Yet you feel the reverse pressure from "below" -- the weird segment of the rock audience/press that thrives on twangy sounds sneers at pop (as if country were in itself a non-pop form - note second internal paradox). Yet in cases where label-and-money concerns are a bigger factor than natural development, the artist might feel their own regrets about leaving country inflections behind (not in Tweedy's case, I think, but I wonder about the Old 97s) and be extra defensive - perhaps projecting their own ambivalence onto a somewhat mythically constituted "alt-country" audience (esp. when critics are suddenly happy to help you do so). It's all, as Chris Isaks (sp?) might say, a twisted game. Makes me envy the pro musicians out there a bit less. carl w
Re: the pop switch(was Tweedy @ Salon)
Slonedog: While a handful (and it is just a handful folks) of the songs on "Summerteeth" (which I think is brilliant) do owe a debt to "Pet Sounds", I don't think either "Sound of Lies" or Joe Henry's new one have much to do with Brian Wilson. Right on. The Jayhawks' pop turn was pretty Beatlesque, to these ears, while Henry's turn is ... well, follow the bouncing Daniel Lanois. I'm not real impressed with "Fuse," myself, mostly for the songwriting itself rather than the sound. But I do find it sort of an unfortunate marriage of, say, Springsteen and U2. (Altho at times it sounds weirdly like Joe Ely.) The critical/musicians' rediscovery of Brian Wilson in the mid-90s, while a wonderful thing, is leading to way too many lazy uses of the Beach Boys as a metonymy for all things that are pop yet not bubblegum. Weird, weird, weird. Another instance of the syndrome by the way is the Scud Mtn Boys --- Pernice Bros. transformation. Of the group, Joe Pernice is also the one, so far, who seems to me to have the most sophisticated-pop-music chops, with genuine Brian/vdParks attentions *plus* Beatles, 70s pop, Big Star and, for that matter, the likes of Burt Bacharach. Me, I think the pop turn is as much the result of a sudden but sincere, methinks, rediscovery that shiny happy music is not inherently evil, and is a way out of rock's dead ends in a similar way that the adoption of twang influence had been. On the down side, it seems like the late 90s in rock-related music are the equivalent of the early 60s, a transitional time where individual songs are mattering more than albums and tho pop is reborn there are few long-term prospects so far. Which makes me real curious what will happen once this millennial funnybusiness is over, say in 2002-03. Carl W.
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Carl says: I agree, Jon, but in the minds of someone like Tweedy and the rock critics who interview him too much - generally reared in varying countercultures with self-styled anticommercial posturings - the "accusation" of commercial motivation is going to be read as a sell-out slam, and nuances are likely to be ignored. Which I guess is true enough, and in Tweedy the musician's case, ignoring the nuances might be understandable, but in the case of the interviewer, well, all I'll say is this is one of the reasons one should be wary of rock critics (someone please be sure to forward this to off-list Neal g). Not that critics in other fields are necessarily better, I hasten to add. Anyhow, in another post, Carl says: Me, I think the pop turn is as much the result of a sudden but sincere, methinks, rediscovery that shiny happy music is not inherently evil... Better late than never. Jon Weisberger Kenton County, KY [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.fuse.net/jonweisberger/
RE: the pop switch(was Tweedy @ Salon)
Carl Wilson wrote: Me, I think the pop turn is as much the result of a sudden but sincere, methinks, rediscovery that shiny happy music is not inherently evil, and is a way out of rock's dead ends in a similar way that the adoption of twang influence had been. Slonedog responds: It may be a "way out" creatively but not necessarily commercially. I don't exactly hear radio stations begging for the next "Pet Sounds"-soundalike song. Most of them are looking for the next Matchbox3rdEyeBlindSugarRay one hit wonder. So, while the turn towards pop might expand the audiences of these formerly (once possibly future?) alt-country bands, I don't think it's a path that will lead them to world domination. One more reason that any accusation that these bands are "selling out" just doesn't hold water.
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
William T. Cocke wrote: You know, I just read this interview and I'm with Dave. What's the deal here? Since when did this "No Depression purists" tag start appearing? Just who exactly is this guy referring to? He doesn't say. Out of the 700 people on this list, I doubt that anyone really fits the bill here. Is he referring to Postcard? Only thing happening on postcard in this domain is so-called ND non-purists getting pissed off because so-called ND purists AREN'T complaining about how ND impure Summerteeth sounds. If you see what I mean. I'd say that interviewer would be in good company with the other strawperson manufacturers on that mailing list. Stevie
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
Dave Purcell wrote: It's ironic that Tweedy gets annoyed with the "Wilco is an alt.country band" cliche, but seems perfectly willing to play along with the "No Depression purists" stereotype. Perhaps he should consider that some people, such as myself, just don't like his music, and its twang quotient is beside the point. Go, Dave! (Damn. Why couldn't I figure out how to say it that wittily?) Stevie
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
Matt Benz wrote: What's his beef? He did the Mermaid Ave music in a roosty vein (never have I heard a band try so hard to sound like the Basement Tapes, BTW), The first time I heard "Guess I Planted," I thought Bragg had hired The Band to back him up. The keyboards are reminiscent of the swirling Garth Hudson variety and the lead guitar is in the Robbie Robertson doing Hubert Sumlin style. Couldn't just be a coincidence, could it? ;-) I haven't had a chance to check out Bragg's ACL appearance yet for comparison. Gregg === Gregg Makepeace [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
A few folks have mentioned Neil Young and his topsy-turvy stylistic swings as analogous to Tweedy. I'd say an important difference is that Young -- at least not that I can remember -- never burned his bridges. When it suited him, he swung back to country or rock or whatever. I don't have an opinion on Tweedy's current record -- though the ELO comparisons make me want to stay very far away from it -- but he ought to be careful about generalizing, particularly with such an impossible group to pin down, who stand around punching the shit out of each other under the "big umbrella." But, on the other hand, he should say whatever comes into his head, because he's just yapping, and who gives a shit. If I really cared, I'd write 16 more paragraphs! -- Terry Smith
Re: Tweedy @ Salon, Kelly Willis
Check out the Time magazine this week. Richard Corless -- one hell of a reviewer, but mainly movies -- drools over Kelly Willis new one. I'll confess, though, I couldn't figure out what the hell he was trying to say, and moreover missed anything about the way the record "sounds," other than a bunch of vagaries about the feel, versus the sound, of Willis' voice. -- Terry Smith
Re: Tweedy @ Salon
The first time I heard "Guess I Planted," I thought Bragg had hired The
Band to back him up. The keyboards are reminiscent of the swirling Garth
Hudson
variety and the lead guitar is in the Robbie Robertson doing Hubert Sumlin
style. Couldn't just be a coincidence, could it? ;-)
Gregg
Yeah, and on "Hoodoo Voodoo," damn if Coomer's giddy-up ride cymbal don't
call Levon Helm to mind ("Time to Kill" from Stage Fright, in particular).
The harmonies from "At My Window Sad and Lonely" are also remarkably similar
to the double-helix vocals of Danko and Manuel. But, on "Hesitating Beauty,"
does anyone else hear the mighty Everly Brothers--or is it my Percodan
talking again?
Lance . . .
Re: Walter Hyatt?
Hi ya'll, I've been a reader of this list for a while, though due to its volume, I save it to a file and use it as a search database . I stumbled across the Walter Hyatt discussion from January and had to add a few notes: Bell/Wrightson wrote: Walter was originally from North Carolina. He and his band, Uncle Walt's Band, arrived in Texas in the mid-70s. They included Champ Hood (who still lives and performs in Austin) and the now hat-act, David Ball. Actually Walter, DesChamp David were from Spartanburg, South Carolina, and moved to Nashville in the early 70's and were part of the folk/RR scene there, which wasn't happening yet (boy that's certainly changed now hasn't it - Nashpop...); but they did meet Raleigh, NC expatriots Tommy Goldsmith and Steve Runkle (who wrote zillion seller "Love Song" as done by the Oak Ridge Boys), and folk-god Dave Olney. Soon Goldsmith headed for Austin to play lead for Marcia Ball, and Uncle Walt's Band followed. After a while the Austin thing got old with no fame and fell apart for them. David Ball went solo and Walt, Champ, Tommy and Steve formed The Contenders back in Nashville, which should have been successful (they sure worked hard at it), but all that survived was a postmortum release on Chapel Hill-based Moonlight Records in 1978. I know Goldsmith wrote some liners for the Uncle Walt comps on Sugar Hill, and I always wondered why Suger Hill hasn't re-released the Contenders record. Its truely a gem, though rare as hell. This is a great list, - Michael Coxe, Raleigh-expatriot San Jose, CA since 78
More Iggy stuff (was: Re: April issue of Gig Magazine - Pittsburgh Content)
In a message dated 3/17/99 5:40:02 PM !!!First Boot!!!, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Also, this Iggy thing has me all worked up. I've been listening to "The Idiot" and "Lust for Life" since Sunday night. Could a cover of "Give Me Danger" be far off? One of our local record labels put out a compilation recently called "Pop O.D.", which is basically a bunch of local bands, most of whom are members of the local Detroit Musicians Alliance (gag!), covering Iggy songs. Jeez, you'd think the local press had just gotten their hands on the next "Sgt. Pepper." Nothing but praise for it, but you talk to the locals, and none of them have even considered purchasing it. I've listened to it, and believe me, I'll stick with the original. Mitch Matthews Gravel Train/Sunken Road
Re: V-Roys
In a message dated 3/17/99 9:09:16 PM !!!First Boot!!!, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In case anyone was wondering, the V-Roys are *still* the best live band in America. Uh, you better put something like "IMHO" before that statement, because IMHO, The Bottle Rockets hold that title, and I'll stand on Steve Earle's lazy susan in my jungle stompers and say it out loud. Hmm, although few will deny (again, IMHO) that The Beat Farmers were the best live band when they were around (Dick, you're still in my soul). Mitch Matthews Gravel Train/Sunken Road
waddy wachtel
Am I right in assuming that the well-known session guitarist Waddy Wachtel is the same Wachtel who wrote the beautiful "Maybe I'm Right" on Ronstadt's "Simple Dreams" album? And was this a one-off, or is he familiar for his songwriting? If it IS a one-off, did he just get struck by lighting one day, or what? curious Stevie
ciao for now
Outta here for SXSW. So goodbye to the the P2 parallel universe for about a week or so. Best for now, --junior
Lyle Lovett in Des Moines
Tickets went on sale today for Lyle Lovett at this great old 1200-seat auditorium in Des Moines. The show's Friday, May 7, and would be well-worth driving in from several hours away. The hall has great sight lines and acoustics, and I've already mentioned how quiet we repressed Methodist Iowans are. g It would be a great place to make a tape. . . Drop me a line if you want more info. [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Alt-country is too confining [was: Tweedy ad nauseum]
These comments from reviewers that alt-country is "confining" are really just a secret greeting to identify themselves as part of the Brotherhood of People Who Hate Twang (BOPWHT), which was originally founded in New York but which now has chapters anywhere. Not only is the alt-country crowd here on P2 an eclectic bunch, but most of the people who have been herded together under the "alt-country" banner have been pretty eclectic themselves. The idea that there are strong limits here is absurd. But what *is* meant is that the reviewer doesnt really like country instruments or country songs or country stylings and so they might wish that one of these bands that they sorta like would break out of the confines and get less country. Y'know, like they should do something daring and original, like trying to sound like an "alternative" or Modern Rock band. And of course those styles arent confining at all. Rock critics are idiots when it comes to this stuff. And Tweedy has been whining ever since he got to front his own band but still felt like he was in Jay Farrar's shadow. Who cares. Will Miner Denver, CO
RE: Tweedy @ Salon
On Wed, 17 Mar 1999, Matt Benz wrote: Now he has a big ELO pop music spectacular, which is fine, but for him to express bewilderment that folks are surprised and maybe not thrilled with such sudden musical changes is funny. It is a radical jump from one album to the next. People who like the Neil Young sound don't rush out and embrace his rockabilly big band techno albums either. I'd say Jerry Curry is the odd fan out on this one. Most people, if they latch onto an artist because they really like a record, will probably hope that the next record has a lot of the same good qualities. That doesnt have to mean the same sound, but whatever got your wheels spinning you hope spins 'em on the next disc. Any band that leaps around from record to record has to assume they will disappoint a lot of people. Neil Young made a lot of crappy records in the 80s, and at least he didnt care. It's pretty obvious that Tweedy isnt so self-confident on that. Given the pointlessness of so many of the songs on "Being There," with lyrics that sound at times like he'll throw in any word that rhymes, and his inability to settle on a sound gives me the impression that he's just making records to make records. He's not half bad at it either, but the stuff aint substantial enough to justify all this philosophizing and defensiveness on his part or any of his critic fans. Needless to say I'm not curious about this new record. Hey, I liked ELO too, but by the end of the 70s enough was enough. He's 20 years too late. Will Miner Denver, CO
Re: waddy wachtel
In a message dated 3/18/99 12:30:51 AM !!!First Boot!!!, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Am I right in assuming that the well-known session guitarist Waddy Wachtel is the same Wachtel who wrote the beautiful "Maybe I'm Right" on Ronstadt's "Simple Dreams" album? And was this a one-off, or is he familiar for his songwriting? If it IS a one-off, did he just get struck by lighting one day, or what? He had a few songwriting tricks up his sleeve as well. He did a lot of work with Warren Zevon, his most popular being co-writer with Zevon on "Werewolves of London." Mitch Matthews Gravel Train/Sunken Road
Re: Fix-it-in-the-mix price drop
Will Miner wrote: On Mon, 15 Mar 1999, Jon Weisberger wrote: Now you, too, can "correct the pitch of the most tone-deaf singers and build lush multi-voice harmonies with a click of the mouse" for less than $400. I hadnt heard of this technology, although it isnt surprising. So, is this something that's regularly used commercially? Are we approaching the days when everyone is going to be Milli Vanilli? Will we swoon over gorgeous voices like those of Lucinda Williams or Kelly Willis only to find out, when we see them live, that they cant sing anything like they sound on their records? Will Miner Denver, CO This is a part of the industry standard, "ProTools", and has already been used on almost any artist you can think of who records for a major label. Get used to it, it is here to stay. There is only one argument in favor of it and here it is: When you record a typical vocal these days, the general idea is to record three or four tracks of the vocal and then go through them and pick out the best phrases and notes and put together a "comp" vocal out of the best of all of them. This makes a nice vocal but can sound sort of odd, since it was literally done at four different times, no matter how close together they may have been. Also, as you do it over again, you tend to lose the fresh, innocent quality of the first take. This is analogous to the old days of mono, when they used to record a song many times and splice together the best segments of the song into a good complete take. This was common practice and done on almost all hit records. Or, you can do the vocal over and over and over again until you get it perfect but you have sung the life out of it. Now, with ProTools a competent singer like Kimmie can step up to the mic, sing the hell out of the song, and stop when the vocal is at its most fresh and believable and heartfelt. Then, if there is one note she missed and it will be a horrible moment for everybody until the end of time, you simply go in and tune that one note and you have a vocal that is virtually a first, single, take. This is in fact an improvement over every other option. The only thing better than this would be to just go in and sing the song and take what you get, but frankly, very very few records have ever been done that way and most of them were folk efforts where flaws are not only tolerated but admired. No modern artist will allow lousy performances out of the studio unless being perverse. I hope this is illuminating and not merely dense. -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Tweedy and the ghettoizing of alt-country
All this talk about Tweedy and bands moving away from alt-country is linked, methinks, to the larger trend of the ghettoizing of alt-country. My own case in point: At the college radio station I work at, the alt-country stuff in rotation gets precious little attention - rockabilly like Rev. Horton Heat, with an occasional exception like the Old 97s, is the only thing that gets more than a couple of spins. However, when I go get a Green on Red, Rank and File, Blasters, or even Dwight album out of the record library, it's clear that they used to get a lot of airplay back in the day (and no - they're not just a little tattered - they have lots of initials documenting that people actually played them). A large part of this trend is a big swing towards techno music and the like amongst the other djs. Maybe it's just the djs at my radio station, but I think the roots-rock of the 80s was more acceptable to the alt-rock (wasn't it called college-rock back then) hipsters of the mid 80s than it is today. And since, as we talked about some time ago, mainstream success, when it comes for alt-country/country bands, is much more likely to come from a country audience than a rock audience - it's not that surprising that the alt-country tag might start to get a little frightening for some bands that have probably seen themselves as always closer to the rock side of things. There was another point I wanted to make, but I'm getting kind of sleepy. Evan Cooper
Re: waddy wachtel
Stevie Simkin writes: Am I right in assuming that the well-known session guitarist Waddy Wachtel is the same Wachtel who wrote the beautiful "Maybe I'm Right" on Ronstadt's "Simple Dreams" album? And was this a one-off, or is he familiar for his songwriting? If it IS a one-off, did he just get struck by lighting one day, or what? I'm not sure if he's ever done a solo album, though I remember that Wachtel teamed up with some other studio pros around '79 or '80 for an album under the group name of Ronin; Wachtel being the lead singer, if memory serves. It's been probably twenty years since I've heard anything from it, though I remember it actually being halfway decent; kinda Stonesy, I think. I see the album turn up in used bins once in a great while. --Jon Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wollaston, Massachusetts
Re: Boot recommendations?
I get mine custom-made from M.L. Leddy Sons on N. Main in Fort Worth, Texas. They do not hurt. I always have worn them, and always will, and will be buried in my best pair. Bad boots are not real boots. "Terry A. Smith" wrote: Cowboy boots hurt, there's no getting around it. A slave to fashion in the jurassa-alt.country days, I wore the damn things for years, and the only use I ever found for them was... -- Joe Gracey President-For-Life, Jackalope Records http://www.kimmierhodes.com
Re: V-Roys
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In case anyone was wondering, the V-Roys are *still* the best live band in America. Mitch Matthews wrote: Uh, you better put something like "IMHO" before that statement, because IMHO, The Bottle Rockets hold that title, uh...obviously you didn't see them here in Pittsburgh last time around... Hmm, although few will deny (again, IMHO) that The Beat Farmers were the best live band when they were around (Dick, you're still in my soul). ok Mitch, you've redeemed yourself...we'll let you back anytime you want! Paul np: Damned - Best of
