Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Hey, Thanks Martin, Conspiracy Tapes making sense right now, appreciating the efforts and research. There's a techno ethos, acheivable without mixes and fixes, searching for the perfect beat. The beginning of the lockdown was kind of sinister, so the first three matched the vibe. Bit of a rough road for Brian Harvey though, eh? As for beef with Denise, this place was the perfect void. Isn't it refreshing when someone doesn't mind speaking their mind. Live For Friction? No-thinking sound system? Imo the list fails more because posters worry about the thought police ramifications when they step up like Denise wasn't afraid to do. Kudos And favourite logo - Bush. None of the poster get past the calligraphy four-four. $0.02 C On 2020-02-27 11:02, mar...@dustscience.com wrote: Hey 313, Here’s a list of mixes of things we’ve been listening to in the studio, we usually do one mix a month of stuff we like. https://soundcloud.com/the-black-dog/sets/listening-series This is a list of things we did while involved in the Conspiracy World, we had to leave due to the worries about mental health and some of the very dark people involved. One hour pieces on different subjects, free to download of you can pay over at our stores if you wish. https://soundcloud.com/the-black-dog/sets/the-conspiracy-tapes-2018 Right now we are recording stuff and making sound packs for Ableton. As for what’s happening on the list, it’s kinda sad. I’ve seen one person destroy place like UK Dance and The Big Chill before, it would be a shame for it to happen here. m
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I didn’t know people could swear so much on this list. That’s so weird to me. Hey check out these videos of me on stage talking with Detroit techno and house founders. Juan Atkins plane didn’t take off from NY or he woulda been there too. https://media.dlib.indiana.edu/?_=1525717318970%5Bcollection_ssim%5D%5B%5D=Roots+of+Techno%3A+Black+DJs+and+the+Detroit+Scene With this pandemic lockdown, the only thing I can focus on is finishing my book ... about Detroit techno. Thanks so much for more attention on this issue. Denise Dalphond On Tue, Apr 7, 2020 at 4:09 AM Edward Thompson wrote: > Agree. > Everything from her is politically motivated and so so predictable. > Would be good if the discussion was about Detroit music but everything has > a motive and its just oh so fucking boring and played out. > A perfect example of the minority screaming loudest. > Back in the 90s when i started partying and listening to Detroit > Techno/House/etc the one thing outside of the great music that was evident > was that the dance floor was for everyone to be equals. The scene in Sydney > was a heavily Gay scene and it was awesome. No one cared. No one focused on > sex, politics, or race. Its a shame that this divisive mindset has infected > the dance scene today and turned it into something it was never meant to be. > > > > On Thu, 27 Feb. 2020, 4:42 am Lerato Khathi, < > booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > >> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a >> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . >> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >> i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational >> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is >> dormant bar the denise show . >> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times >> and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these >> occasional outbursts . >> >> >> >> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond >> wrote: >> >>> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s >>> just your family. >>> >>> I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a >>> boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I >>> was Black because then you have to suffer racism. >>> >>> I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other >>> NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go >>> raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot >>> about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for >>> the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my >>> Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like >>> Konkrete Jungle. >>> >>> Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. >>> >>> Denise Dalphond >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams >>> wrote: >>> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were more opinionated about music and less about each other. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: > I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never > yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. > > You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from > Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. > > Denise, the woman > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi > wrote: > >> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f >> out? >> >> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was >> black? >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams >> wrote: >> >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund >>> lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; >>> the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even >>> typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >>> >>> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not >>> close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. >>> I'd >>> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >>> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >>> >>> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great >>> things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those >>> musicians. There are vital
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Agree. Everything from her is politically motivated and so so predictable. Would be good if the discussion was about Detroit music but everything has a motive and its just oh so fucking boring and played out. A perfect example of the minority screaming loudest. Back in the 90s when i started partying and listening to Detroit Techno/House/etc the one thing outside of the great music that was evident was that the dance floor was for everyone to be equals. The scene in Sydney was a heavily Gay scene and it was awesome. No one cared. No one focused on sex, politics, or race. Its a shame that this divisive mindset has infected the dance scene today and turned it into something it was never meant to be. On Thu, 27 Feb. 2020, 4:42 am Lerato Khathi, < booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a > long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . > i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational > and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is > dormant bar the denise show . > i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times > and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these > occasional outbursts . > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond > wrote: > >> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s >> just your family. >> >> I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a >> boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I >> was Black because then you have to suffer racism. >> >> I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other >> NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go >> raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot >> about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for >> the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my >> Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like >> Konkrete Jungle. >> >> Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams >> wrote: >> >>> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that >>> great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 >>> people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. >>> >>> I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were >>> more opinionated about music and less about each other. >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < >>> denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. Denise, the woman On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: > That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f > out? > > Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams > wrote: > >> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund >> lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; >> the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even >> typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >> >> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not >> close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. >> I'd >> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >> >> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great >> things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those >> musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more >> attention: >> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >> >> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues >> that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not >> appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group >> of >> friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So >> keep >> in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you >> disagree with them. >> > -- Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. ethnomusicologist schoolcraftwax.work >>> -- >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >> ethnomusicologist >> schoolcraftwax.work >> > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Re: Keep it real (and on topic) I've had this song stuck in my head for the past two months. Honestly, this came of topic about a year ago or so, but this is pretty much the first time I've had to respond to y'all. I work first shift, which doesn't mean anything to the hyperreal world (as your emails hit before I or everyone you know wakes up) ';p "There is a man that live next door In my neighborhood In my neighborhood And he gets me down He gets in so late at night Always a fuss and fight Always a fuss and fight All through the night I've got to get away from here This is not a place for me to stay I've got to take my family We'll find a quiet place Hear the pots and pans they fall Bang against my wall Bang against my wall No rest at all He gets in so late at night Always a fuss and fight Always a fuss and fight All through the night I've got to get away from here This is not a place for me to stay I've got to take my family We'll find a quiet place"
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Photographers that have some good books... Dave Krieger Dave Shanaman doesnt have a book but his work is cherished by many of us here in Detroit. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 17:45 Mario De Block wrote: > I can't see how anyone here would be ok with one member's explicit > suggestion that simply subscribing to unwritten board rules (on hatefree > speech, really) would link to being ok with rape culture. I can't see that. > What else is there than some degree of malevolence, particularly far away > from male violence in this case (which I detest, too). > > 313 Question: does anybody know about fine photography books on nowadays > Detroit? I liked this one very much: http://www.marchandmeffre.com/detroit. > But maybe there's more that isn't on sale via usual webshops. > > I always felt some kind of link between the melancholy of a partially > decaying city and some of the better, stringed Detroit techno. Though I > hope there's enough initiatives still to revive the city center, of course. > > Mario > > > > -- > *Van:* Andrew Green > *Verzonden:* woensdag 26 februari 2020 21:14 > *Aan:* Arturo Lopez > *CC:* Three-One-Three <313@hyperreal.org> > *Onderwerp:* Re: Keep it real (and on topic) > > Been lurking here for a long time .. I read the emails when I’m travelling > and need space. > > I know Lerato and seeing her departure saddened me. > > I’m not qualified to have an opinion on the Derrick / Michael thing. > but it’s really bizarre and ironic that the Innovator could be catalysis > for the 313 list breaking up. I hope not ! > > > > > > On 26 Feb 2020, at 19:58, Arturo Lopez wrote: > > > > > > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging > through dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, > everybody. > > -Arturo > > > > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I won't unsubscribe from the list. And I wish I could stop right there, yet I'm aware it's an invitation to rub those thinking about unsubscribing in the wrong way. So... Don't know how many times during the last week or so I started writing a reply, then discarded doing so thinking "what's this adding to the discussion?", "is this gonna make things worse?", "WHY THE FUCK DO I FEEL LIKE I HAVE TO FIX THIS?". At that point, I always realized I'm not fucking jesus, it's not my duty to fix anything and who the fuck am I anyway. Moreso, I have enough shit going on in my life. Things with higher priorities. Why bother with all of this, right? Maybe some of you can relate. Yet, I kept arriving at the same point over and over again. And I wondered why. My reasoning so far: Where does it take us, folks with a mutual interest in the same thing, if we're not able to discuss and settle things without burning the soil? I mean, isn't this what maturity is be about? Being able to take a step back from one's own position, leaving room for another to co-exist. Being able to disagree in a respectful way? And yes, it's tough. Maybe one of the toughest things these days. This feeling that one's not able to communicate on the internet anymore without fearing everything one writes gets ripped apart and re-assembled in the way maximizing damage. Ever heard about Wiios Laws of communication from the 1970s? They look like this: The fundamental Wiio's law states that "Communication usually fails, except by accident". The full set of laws is as follows: 1. Communication usually fails, except by accident. 1. If communication can fail, it will. 2. If communication cannot fail, it still most usually fails. 3. If communication seems to succeed in the intended way, there's a misunderstanding. 4. If you are content with your message, communication certainly fails. 2. If a message can be interpreted in several ways, it will be interpreted in a manner that maximizes the damage. 3. There is always someone who knows better than you what you meant with your message. 4. The more we communicate, the worse communication succeeds. 1. The more we communicate, the faster misunderstandings propagate. 5. In mass communication <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_communication>, the important thing is not how things are but how they seem to be. 6. The importance of a news item is inversely proportional to the square of the distance. 7. The more important the situation is, the more probable you had forgotten an essential thing that you remembered a moment ago. Digest those for a moment. Wanna fall for those? I don't. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of noticing how each and every one holds true for me, too. And it takes me a lot of stepping back, breathing, reflecting, stepping back some more and breathing some more to see these patterns at work. Add the 160 known biases to that. Great fun. Not. The way I see it, it takes two to get upset. One person offering something to get upset about, another person to follow that invitation. It's nobody else's but MY responsibility to choose to get upset, what to get upset about and how I want to deal with that then. So, what's frustrating me about this entire discussion: People not acting responsible for themselves, instead blaming each other. Or even Kent. Imho, it's exactly this particular lack of responsibility that put the Trumps of he world in the places where they are. It removes personal room for taking action. Creating this imminent notion of being unable to actually do something, eventually letting the idiots in the world win. Because people stop voting, thinking "what can I do about this anyway?" I'm sick of it. I don't think we need to chill. Especially those who don't want to contribute to one opinion or the other need to step up and say something. I'm crossing this off my list for now. If anyone feels like tearing this apart to fuel a point, I can't do anything about it. But I don't want to shut the fuck up, acting responsible for others in not contributing out of the fear that somebody else could actually use my words for their own agenda. Neither here. Not anywhere else. Stay sane folks, at least keep trying. On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 10:14 AM Peter Bense wrote: > It's the pervasive *negativity *by a few members that is off-putting. > > On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 10:06 AM The Archiver > wrote: > >> Well done Kent. You're doing a great job of letting this list implode. >> It's not the first time that you have stood by and let one list member >> force others to feel like they have no option but to unsubscribe. >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* kent williams [mailto:chaircrus...@gmail.com] >> *Sent:* 28 February 2020 03:41 >> *To:* DJ Shiva ; list 313 <313@hyperre
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
It's the pervasive *negativity *by a few members that is off-putting. On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at 10:06 AM The Archiver wrote: > Well done Kent. You're doing a great job of letting this list implode. > It's not the first time that you have stood by and let one list member > force others to feel like they have no option but to unsubscribe. > > > > > > *From:* kent williams [mailto:chaircrus...@gmail.com] > *Sent:* 28 February 2020 03:41 > *To:* DJ Shiva ; list 313 <313@hyperreal.org> > *Subject:* Re: Keep it real (and on topic) > > > > Would be sad to see you go. But it's up to you. Instructions here: > http://music.hyperreal.org/lists/313/02.html > > > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020, 7:59 PM DJ Shiva wrote: > > "She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and > it wouldn’t matter. " > > Mmmmh, sure Jan. You tell me everything I need to know about your > attitude toward gender right there. > > For the love of my sanity will someone unsubscribe me from this list? > > > Lisa > http://www.noncompliantmusic.com > http://www.soundcloud.com/noncompliant1 > > > "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I > can hear her breathing." - Arundhati Roy > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > > Appreciate the reply Jodie, > > > > I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re > probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being > backhanded. > > > > Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because > that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the > 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. > > > > If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her > then I don’t now what to tell you. > > > > We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are > not at least warned to change their tone. > > > > Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 > chairs party here in SF. > > > > Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? > > :-) > > > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design > wrote: > > I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. > > > > "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see in > the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the > start or throughout. > > > > She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go > after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been > removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the > heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got > so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads > and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the > emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails > discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. > > > > Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write her > off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and what > pushed her to become hostile in the first place. > > > Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has > would be a shame. > > > > Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would agree > with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated women in > the scene as much as I do. > > > > *Jodie > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi wrote: > > So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we > tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility > while trying to justify her tone” > > > > What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking why > Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes no > sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario > which she’s clearly in violation of. > > > > Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at > least on a last warning regarding her tone). > > > > > > > > > >>>>>>>>> attention: > >>>>>>>>> https://undergroundandblack.com/ > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and
RE: Keep it real (and on topic)
Well done Kent. You're doing a great job of letting this list implode. It's not the first time that you have stood by and let one list member force others to feel like they have no option but to unsubscribe. From: kent williams [mailto:chaircrus...@gmail.com] Sent: 28 February 2020 03:41 To: DJ Shiva ; list 313 <313@hyperreal.org> Subject: Re: Keep it real (and on topic) Would be sad to see you go. But it's up to you. Instructions here: http://music.hyperreal.org/lists/313/02.html On Thu, Feb 27, 2020, 7:59 PM DJ Shiva mailto:djsh...@gmail.com> > wrote: "She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. " Mmmmh, sure Jan. You tell me everything I need to know about your attitude toward gender right there. For the love of my sanity will someone unsubscribe me from this list? Lisa http://www.noncompliantmusic.com http://www.soundcloud.com/noncompliant1 "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." - Arundhati Roy On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Joe Marougi mailto:jmaro...@gmail.com> > wrote: Appreciate the reply Jodie, I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being backhanded. Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her then I don’t now what to tell you. We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are not at least warned to change their tone. Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 chairs party here in SF. Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? :-) On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design mailto:uandidesigndetr...@gmail.com> > wrote: I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see in the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the start or throughout. She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write her off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and what pushed her to become hostile in the first place. Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has would be a shame. Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would agree with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated women in the scene as much as I do. *Jodie On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi mailto:jmaro...@gmail.com> > wrote: So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility while trying to justify her tone” What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario which she’s clearly in violation of. Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at least on a last warning regarding her tone). >>>>>>>>> attention: >>>>>>>>> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues >>>>>>>>> that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not >>>>>>>>> appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a >>>>>>>>> group of >>>>>>>>> friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common.. >>>>>>>>> So keep >>>>>>>>> in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if >>>>>>>>> you >>>>&g
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Would be sad to see you go. But it's up to you. Instructions here: http://music.hyperreal.org/lists/313/02.html On Thu, Feb 27, 2020, 7:59 PM DJ Shiva wrote: > "She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and > it wouldn’t matter. " > > Mmmmh, sure Jan. You tell me everything I need to know about your > attitude toward gender right there. > > For the love of my sanity will someone unsubscribe me from this list? > > Lisa > http://www.noncompliantmusic.com > http://www.soundcloud.com/noncompliant1 > > "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I > can hear her breathing." - Arundhati Roy > > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> Appreciate the reply Jodie, >> >> I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re >> probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being >> backhanded. >> >> Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because >> that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the >> 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. >> >> If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her >> then I don’t now what to tell you. >> >> We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are >> not at least warned to change their tone. >> >> Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 >> chairs party here in SF. >> >> Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? >> :-) >> >> On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design >> wrote: >> >>> I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. >>> >>> "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see >>> in the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the >>> start or throughout. >>> >>> She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go >>> after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been >>> removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the >>> heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got >>> so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads >>> and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the >>> emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails >>> discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. >>> >>> Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write >>> her off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and >>> what pushed her to become hostile in the first place. >>> >>> Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has >>> would be a shame. >>> >>> Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would >>> agree with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated >>> women in the scene as much as I do. >>> >>> *Jodie >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi wrote: >>> So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility while trying to justify her tone” What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario which she’s clearly in violation of. Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at least on a last warning regarding her tone). > > attention: > > https://undergroundandblack.com/ > > > > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal > issues > > that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's > not > > appropriate content, but it should be in the context that > we're a group of > > friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in > common.. So keep > > in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect > even if you > > disagree with them. > > > -- > >>> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > >>> ethnomusicologist > >>> schoolcraftwax.work > >>> > >> -- > > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > > ethnomusicologist > > schoolcraftwax.work > > > > > -- > > Lerato Khathi > http://uzurirecordings.com > http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com > http://soundcloud.com/uzuri > Skype : Lakuti > > >>> -- > >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > >> ethnomusicologist > >> schoolcraftwax.work > >> > > > > > >-- > > > >Lerato
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
If that’s all you took away from my reply it also tells me a lot about you. Plus that has nothing to do with what was being discussed. But congrats on nitpicking my replies till you found something “worthwhile” to reply to instead of the real topic. Not to worry tho I’ll most likely bounce outta here soon too in case I’m the one chasing you away. On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 5:59 PM DJ Shiva wrote: > "She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and > it wouldn’t matter. " > > Mmmmh, sure Jan. You tell me everything I need to know about your > attitude toward gender right there. > > For the love of my sanity will someone unsubscribe me from this list? > > Lisa > http://www.noncompliantmusic.com > http://www.soundcloud.com/noncompliant1 > > "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I > can hear her breathing." - Arundhati Roy > > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> Appreciate the reply Jodie, >> >> I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re >> probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being >> backhanded. >> >> Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because >> that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the >> 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. >> >> If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her >> then I don’t now what to tell you. >> >> We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are >> not at least warned to change their tone. >> >> Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 >> chairs party here in SF. >> >> Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? >> :-) >> >> On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design >> wrote: >> >>> I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. >>> >>> "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see >>> in the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the >>> start or throughout. >>> >>> She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go >>> after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been >>> removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the >>> heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got >>> so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads >>> and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the >>> emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails >>> discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. >>> >>> Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write >>> her off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and >>> what pushed her to become hostile in the first place. >>> >>> Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has >>> would be a shame. >>> >>> Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would >>> agree with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated >>> women in the scene as much as I do. >>> >>> *Jodie >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi wrote: >>> So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility while trying to justify her tone” What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario which she’s clearly in violation of. Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at least on a last warning regarding her tone). > > attention: > > https://undergroundandblack.com/ > > > > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal > issues > > that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's > not > > appropriate content, but it should be in the context that > we're a group of > > friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in > common.. So keep > > in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect > even if you > > disagree with them. > > > -- > >>> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > >>> ethnomusicologist > >>> schoolcraftwax.work > >>> > >> -- > > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > > ethnomusicologist > > schoolcraftwax.work > > > > > -- > > Lerato Khathi > http://uzurirecordings.com >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
"She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. " Mmmmh, sure Jan. You tell me everything I need to know about your attitude toward gender right there. For the love of my sanity will someone unsubscribe me from this list? Lisa http://www.noncompliantmusic.com http://www.soundcloud.com/noncompliant1 "Another world is not only possible, she is on her way. On a quiet day, I can hear her breathing." - Arundhati Roy On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 2:58 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > Appreciate the reply Jodie, > > I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re > probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being > backhanded. > > Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because > that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the > 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. > > If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her > then I don’t now what to tell you. > > We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are > not at least warned to change their tone. > > Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 > chairs party here in SF. > > Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? > :-) > > On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design > wrote: > >> I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. >> >> "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see in >> the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the >> start or throughout. >> >> She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go >> after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been >> removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the >> heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got >> so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads >> and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the >> emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails >> discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. >> >> Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write >> her off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and >> what pushed her to become hostile in the first place. >> >> Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has >> would be a shame. >> >> Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would agree >> with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated women in >> the scene as much as I do. >> >> *Jodie >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi wrote: >> >>> So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we >>> tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility >>> while trying to justify her tone” >>> >>> What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking >>> why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes >>> no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario >>> which she’s clearly in violation of. >>> >>> Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at >>> least on a last warning regarding her tone). >>> >>> >>> >>> > attention: > https://undergroundandblack.com/ > > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues > that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not > appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of > friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common.. So keep > in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you > disagree with them. > -- >>> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >>> ethnomusicologist >>> schoolcraftwax.work >>> >> -- > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > ethnomusicologist > schoolcraftwax.work > -- Lerato Khathi http://uzurirecordings.com http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com http://soundcloud.com/uzuri Skype : Lakuti >>> -- >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >> ethnomusicologist >> schoolcraftwax.work >> > > >-- > >Lerato Khathi >http://uzurirecordings.com >http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com >http://soundcloud.com/uzuri >Skype : Lakuti >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Appreciate the reply Jodie, I’m gonna go out on what I feel is not too far of a limb by saying you’re probably the only one here that sees her “apologies” as not being backhanded. Please don’t deflect by trying to bring in women’s voices etc because that’s not the point we are discussing. She could have been any of the 100+ genders she probably believes in and it wouldn’t matter. If you can’t see that most here are doing their best to “tolerate” her then I don’t now what to tell you. We shouldn’t have to barely tolerate anyone here. Especially if they are not at least warned to change their tone. Speaking of Rick, spoke to him today about a conversation around a 3 chairs party here in SF. Has everyone here bought my new release yet?? :-) On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 11:42 AM U Design wrote: > I havent chimed in yet, but seeing Joe's email has prompted me to. > > "We tried to respond respectfully at first..." Sorry, but I didn't see in > the emails to Denise that there was much respect being given, not at the > start or throughout. > > She did apologize for how she reacted and people have continued to go > after her. As for the comment that "if she was a guy she would've been > removed long ago" I have to disagree. I love Tom Cox and I loved the > heated debates he used to get in. Him and I had a few as well. I never got > so touchy that I thought he should be removed from the list. Those threads > and debates back then pushed the envelope much farther than any of the > emails I saw by her did. And in reality, there have been more emails > discussing this than there were that caused this discussion to begin. > > Her contribution to the music is undeniable and rather than just write her > off as being hostile, maybe everyone should take stock as to why and what > pushed her to become hostile in the first place. > > Removing someone that has contributed as much to the musuc as she has > would be a shame. > > Just my 2 cents. And Joe, I'm pretty sure Marcellus and Rick would agree > with me on this one. They love the voices of strong opinionated women in > the scene as much as I do. > > *Jodie > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020, 15:41 Joe Marougi wrote: > >> So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we >> tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility >> while trying to justify her tone” >> >> What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking >> why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes >> no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario >> which she’s clearly in violation of. >> >> Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at >> least on a last warning regarding her tone). >> >> >> >> >>> > attention: >>> > https://undergroundandblack.com/ >>> > >>> > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal >>> issues >>> > that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's >>> not >>> > appropriate content, but it should be in the context that >>> we're a group of >>> > friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in >>> common.. So keep >>> > in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect >>> even if you >>> > disagree with them. >>> > >>> -- >>> >>> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >>> >>> ethnomusicologist >>> >>> schoolcraftwax.work >>> >>> >>> >> -- >>> > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >>> > ethnomusicologist >>> > schoolcraftwax.work >>> > >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Lerato Khathi >>> http://uzurirecordings.com >>> http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com >>> http://soundcloud.com/uzuri >>> Skype : Lakuti >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >>> >> ethnomusicologist >>> >> schoolcraftwax.work >>> >> >>> > >>> > >>> >-- >>> > >>> >Lerato Khathi >>> >http://uzurirecordings.com >>> >http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com >>> >http://soundcloud.com/uzuri >>> >Skype : Lakuti >>> > >>> >>> >>>
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Hey 313, Here’s a list of mixes of things we’ve been listening to in the studio, we usually do one mix a month of stuff we like. https://soundcloud.com/the-black-dog/sets/listening-series This is a list of things we did while involved in the Conspiracy World, we had to leave due to the worries about mental health and some of the very dark people involved. One hour pieces on different subjects, free to download of you can pay over at our stores if you wish. https://soundcloud.com/the-black-dog/sets/the-conspiracy-tapes-2018 Right now we are recording stuff and making sound packs for Ableton. As for what’s happening on the list, it’s kinda sad. I’ve seen one person destroy place like UK Dance and The Big Chill before, it would be a shame for it to happen here. m
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I can't see how anyone here would be ok with one member's explicit suggestion that simply subscribing to unwritten board rules (on hatefree speech, really) would link to being ok with rape culture. I can't see that. What else is there than some degree of malevolence, particularly far away from male violence in this case (which I detest, too). 313 Question: does anybody know about fine photography books on nowadays Detroit? I liked this one very much: http://www.marchandmeffre.com/detroit. But maybe there's more that isn't on sale via usual webshops. I always felt some kind of link between the melancholy of a partially decaying city and some of the better, stringed Detroit techno. Though I hope there's enough initiatives still to revive the city center, of course. Mario Van: Andrew Green Verzonden: woensdag 26 februari 2020 21:14 Aan: Arturo Lopez CC: Three-One-Three <313@hyperreal.org> Onderwerp: Re: Keep it real (and on topic) Been lurking here for a long time .. I read the emails when I’m travelling and need space. I know Lerato and seeing her departure saddened me. I’m not qualified to have an opinion on the Derrick / Michael thing. but it’s really bizarre and ironic that the Innovator could be catalysis for the 313 list breaking up. I hope not ! > On 26 Feb 2020, at 19:58, Arturo Lopez wrote: > > > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging through > dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, everybody. > -Arturo > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
just about to unsub, some thoughts... first subbed in '93, then off and on (due to moving/travelling) the rest of the 90s, mostly on, through the 2000s Controversy has me realizing that 313 emaiI list doesn't suit my purposes of reading the couple dozen posts per year (the larger issue), which engage me. For those posting illuminating content, I am grateful, and don't want to lose your input! I'm still looking for new new music/producers of note, updates on new standout events, history/stories when they touch on the foundation, themes of Detroit techno incl. social justice issues (became aware, in early 90s through UR/Submerge scene), and concern about the welfare of the artists who have given so much. The more petty squabbling and pointless self-aggrandizement, the less I wade through these emails (missing a few things no doubt), and the more I wish to unsub, for sure. If ppl wish to stay with the list, I still think that's great, maybe we could get a comments section on the archives, and the rest of us could self-curate/tag the posts through there? Yes, fewer ppl every year care about 313 techno, the kids have long moved on to bigger sounds of trap, and newer, etc. Most of my friends from this list (incl. those with record labels, music careers) unsubbed long ago. But still some great troopers on here like Kent, legends like Andrew Duke ... how not to lose the baby with the bath water? This music still has a vital perspective that the world needs, and the increase in diversity of new producers (incl. race, gender... anyone) making it means it isn't dead, I think. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 3:45 PM Andrew Green wrote: > Been lurking here for a long time .. I read the emails when I’m travelling > and need space. > > I know Lerato and seeing her departure saddened me. > > I’m not qualified to have an opinion on the Derrick / Michael thing. > but it’s really bizarre and ironic that the Innovator could be catalysis > for the 313 list breaking up. I hope not ! > > > > > > On 26 Feb 2020, at 19:58, Arturo Lopez wrote: > > > > > > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging > through dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, > everybody. > > -Arturo > > > > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Well my man the solution is simple but I suppose our mod(s) are choosing to nurture the cancer as opposed to treat it. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 1:45 PM Andrew Green wrote: > Been lurking here for a long time .. I read the emails when I’m travelling > and need space. > > I know Lerato and seeing her departure saddened me. > > I’m not qualified to have an opinion on the Derrick / Michael thing. > but it’s really bizarre and ironic that the Innovator could be catalysis > for the 313 list breaking up. I hope not ! > > > > > > On 26 Feb 2020, at 19:58, Arturo Lopez wrote: > > > > > > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging > through dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, > everybody. > > -Arturo > > > > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Been lurking here for a long time .. I read the emails when I’m travelling and need space. I know Lerato and seeing her departure saddened me. I’m not qualified to have an opinion on the Derrick / Michael thing. but it’s really bizarre and ironic that the Innovator could be catalysis for the 313 list breaking up. I hope not ! > On 26 Feb 2020, at 19:58, Arturo Lopez wrote: > > > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging through > dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, everybody. > -Arturo > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Tom is my boy and a fan of my label. Wish he was still here. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 1:35 PM Martin wrote: > I miss Tom >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I miss Tom
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
So I guess there’s the “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument vs “we tried to reply respectfully at first but she keeps replying with hostility while trying to justify her tone” What I replied earlier that wasn’t copied here in the group was asking why Kent would risk losing many for the sake of accommodating one. Makes no sense whatsoever. There are unwritten rules of conduct in each scenario which she’s clearly in violation of. Lastly I feel that if she was a dude she’d have been 86’d by now (or at least on a last warning regarding her tone). On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:32 PM Mario De Block wrote: > I would also hope mutual respect to be preserved, instead of hostile > egoism, leaking from one quite specific mind openly. > > Hostile and belligerent tones create negative space, leading to members to > hold back or withdraw from any contribution. This list should be about all > we want to know and share on the D. Music and stuff related. But the D. The > one and, can I say, single D, please. No ego should matter here. > > Mario > -- > *Van:* ja...@iridite.com > *Verzonden:* woensdag 26 februari 2020 20:53 > *Aan:* Fred Heutte > *CC:* 313 list <313@hyperreal.org>; Lerato Khathi < > booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> > *Onderwerp:* Re: Keep it real (and on topic) > > Amen to that Fred. > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 19:28, Fred Heutte wrote: > > I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. Also > had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the > Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play > at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, that > was > a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). > > https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 > > She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened > doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on > 313, but either way I honor the decision. > > So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the > ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why > should any of us continue to subscribe? > > The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me > for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other > mid-1990s > mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. > > Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually > beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. > Without that, there is no reason to continue. > > peace > > fh > > > > > > - > >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a > lot > >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music > >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a > >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > >being tone deaf . > >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > >keep supporting music not egos . > >i am out of here . > > > >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond > >wrote: > > > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. > I’ll > >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. > I’m > >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. > It’s a > >> pretty big series. > >> > >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. > It’s > >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I > speak > >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. > Often, > >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on > this > >> list. > >> > >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > >> > >> Denise Dalphond > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi > wrote: > >> > >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty > >>> “admissions of guilt†> >>> > >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khat
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I would also hope mutual respect to be preserved, instead of hostile egoism, leaking from one quite specific mind openly. Hostile and belligerent tones create negative space, leading to members to hold back or withdraw from any contribution. This list should be about all we want to know and share on the D. Music and stuff related. But the D. The one and, can I say, single D, please. No ego should matter here. Mario Van: ja...@iridite.com Verzonden: woensdag 26 februari 2020 20:53 Aan: Fred Heutte CC: 313 list <313@hyperreal.org>; Lerato Khathi Onderwerp: Re: Keep it real (and on topic) Amen to that Fred. On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 19:28, Fred Heutte mailto:ph...@sunlightdata.com>> wrote: I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. Also had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, that was a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on 313, but either way I honor the decision. So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why should any of us continue to subscribe? The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other mid-1990s mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. Without that, there is no reason to continue. peace fh - >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a lot >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on >being tone deaf . >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . >keep supporting music not egos . >i am out of here . > >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond >mailto:denisedalph...@gmail.com>> >wrote: > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. >> I’ll >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. I’m >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a >> pretty big series. >> >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this >> list. >> >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi >> mailto:jmaro...@gmail.com>> wrote: >> >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty >>> “admissions of guilt†>>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com<mailto:booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a >>>> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment .. >>>> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >>>> i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational >>>> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is >>>> dormant bar the denise show . >>>> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former >>>> times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these >>>> occasional outbursts . >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond >>>> mailto:denisedalph...@gmail.com>> >>>
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Don't go! Think of how much we will miss your complaining! Den ons 26 feb. 2020 20:58Arturo Lopez skrev: > Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging through > dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, everybody. > -Arturo > > >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Let me be very clear -- Kent is a good friend and has been an absolute stalwart maintaining this list since . . . a long time : ) He has bent over backwards to be fair and my point about respect applies just as much if not more to our interaction with those like Kent who take on responsibility to manage community resources. fh - >I know...my bad for not realizing the list wasnât ccâd on my reply which I >thought it was. > > >On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:57 AM Fred Heutte wrote: > >> I'm not Kent. >> >> - >> >Good job Kent, risk losing many rather than risk ââ¬Åoffendingâ⬠(or >> better >> >yet, removing) one. Iââ¬â¢m sure sheââ¬â¢ll have fun taking to >> >herself since >> sheââ¬â¢s >> >probably used to it. >> > >> >Something tells me if she was a dude sheââ¬â¢d be 86ââ¬â¢d by now (or >> >at least >> >severely warned). >> > >> > >> > >> >On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:28 AM Fred Heutte >> wrote: >> > >> >> I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. >> Also >> >> had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the >> >> Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play >> >> at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, >> that >> >> was >> >> a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). >> >> >> >> https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 >> >> >> >> She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened >> >> doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on >> >> 313, but either way I honor the decision. >> >> >> >> So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the >> >> ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why >> >> should any of us continue to subscribe? >> >> >> >> The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me >> >> for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other >> >> mid-1990s >> >> mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. >> >> >> >> Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually >> >> beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. >> >> Without that, there is no reason to continue. >> >> >> >> peace >> >> >> >> fh >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> - >> >> >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . >> >> >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a >> >> lot >> >> >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . >> >> >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global >> music >> >> >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not >> get a >> >> >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on >> >> >being tone deaf . >> >> >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . >> >> >keep supporting music not egos . >> >> >i am out of here . >> >> > >> >> >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond < >> denisedalph...@gmail.com> >> >> >wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You donâââ‰â¢t have to like my >> communication. >> >> Iâââ‰â¢ll >> >> >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be >> quiet. >> >> Iâââ‰â¢m >> >> >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. >> >> >> Itâââ‰â¢s >> all on my >> >> >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit >> and >> >> >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. >> >> Itâââ‰â¢s a >> >> >> pretty big series. >> >> >> >> >> >> Iâââ‰â¢ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not >> >> >> the IDM >> list. >> >> Itâââ‰â¢s >> >> >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I >> >> speak >> >> >> up more. Itâââ‰â¢s super patriarchal of everyone to gang >> >> >> up on the >> woman. >> >> Often, >> >> >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on >> >> this >> >> >> list. >> >> >> >> >> >> Iâââ‰â¢ll email the 313 list any time I have something to >> contribute. >> >> >> >> >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi >> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>> Very well said. Whatâââ‰â¢s worse is the lack of >> >> >>> remorse. Just >> empty >> >> >>> ââ∠âadmissions of guiltââ⬠>> >> >>> >> >> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >> >> >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: >> >> >>> >> >> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group >> for >> >> a >> >> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a >> >> comment .. >> >> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >> >> i do find though
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I know...my bad for not realizing the list wasn’t cc’d on my reply which I thought it was. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:57 AM Fred Heutte wrote: > I'm not Kent. > > - > >Good job Kent, risk losing many rather than risk “offending†(or > better > >yet, removing) one. I’m sure she’ll have fun taking to herself since > she’s > >probably used to it. > > > >Something tells me if she was a dude she’d be 86’d by now (or at least > >severely warned). > > > > > > > >On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:28 AM Fred Heutte > wrote: > > > >> I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. > Also > >> had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the > >> Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play > >> at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, > that > >> was > >> a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). > >> > >> https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 > >> > >> She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened > >> doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on > >> 313, but either way I honor the decision. > >> > >> So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the > >> ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why > >> should any of us continue to subscribe? > >> > >> The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me > >> for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other > >> mid-1990s > >> mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. > >> > >> Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually > >> beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. > >> Without that, there is no reason to continue. > >> > >> peace > >> > >> fh > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> - > >> >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > >> >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a > >> lot > >> >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > >> >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global > music > >> >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not > get a > >> >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > >> >being tone deaf . > >> >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > >> >keep supporting music not egos . > >> >i am out of here . > >> > > >> >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond < > denisedalph...@gmail.com> > >> >wrote: > >> > > >> >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my > communication. > >> I’ll > >> >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be > quiet. > >> I’m > >> >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s > all on my > >> >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit > and > >> >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. > >> It’s a > >> >> pretty big series. > >> >> > >> >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM > list. > >> It’s > >> >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I > >> speak > >> >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the > woman. > >> Often, > >> >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on > >> this > >> >> list. > >> >> > >> >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to > contribute. > >> >> > >> >> Denise Dalphond > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi > >> wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just > empty > >> >>> “admissions of guilt†> >> >>> > >> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < > >> >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > >> >>> > >> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group > for > >> a > >> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a > >> comment .. > >> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > >> i do find though that your approach denise can be very > >> confrontational > >> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the > list is > >> dormant bar the denise show . > >> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former > >> times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy > from > >> these > >> occasional outbursts . > >> > >> > >> > >> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond < > >> denisedalph...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. > So maybe > >> it’s > >> > just your family. > >> > > >> >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Right. Said. Fred. thanks, Jeffrey J Davis j...@jeffreyjdavis.com www.jeffreyjdavis.com 218.833.2847 thanks, Jeffrey J Davis j...@jeffreyjdavis.com www.jeffreyjdavis.com 218.833.2847 On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 1:28 PM Fred Heutte wrote: > > I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. Also > had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the > Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play > at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, that was > a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). > > https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 > > She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened > doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on > 313, but either way I honor the decision. > > So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the > ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why > should any of us continue to subscribe? > > The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me > for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other > mid-1990s > mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. > > Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually > beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. > Without that, there is no reason to continue. > > peace > > fh > > > > > > - > >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a lot > >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music > >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a > >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > >being tone deaf . > >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > >keep supporting music not egos . > >i am out of here . > > > >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond > >wrote: > > > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. > >> I’ll > >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. > >> I’m > >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a > >> pretty big series. > >> > >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s > >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak > >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. > >> Often, > >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this > >> list. > >> > >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > >> > >> Denise Dalphond > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> > >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty > >>> “admissions of guilt†> >>> > >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < > >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > >>> > i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a > long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment .. > i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational > and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is > dormant bar the denise show . > i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former > times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from > these > occasional outbursts . > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond > wrote: > > > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe > > it’s > > just your family. > > > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a > > boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been > > wishin I > > was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other > > NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go > > raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I > > forgot > > about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for > > the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my > > Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like > > Konkrete Jungle. > > > > Too off topic? Too
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Yea I'm out, too. Signal/Noise ratio has not been worth slugging through dumpster fire threads for a while now. Have fun, cheers, everybody. -Arturo
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Amen to that Fred. On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 19:28, Fred Heutte wrote: > I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. Also > had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the > Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play > at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, that > was > a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). > > https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 > > She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened > doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on > 313, but either way I honor the decision. > > So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the > ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why > should any of us continue to subscribe? > > The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me > for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other > mid-1990s > mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. > > Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually > beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. > Without that, there is no reason to continue. > > peace > > fh > > > > > > - > >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a > lot > >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music > >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a > >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > >being tone deaf . > >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > >keep supporting music not egos . > >i am out of here . > > > >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond > >wrote: > > > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. > I’ll > >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. > I’m > >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. > It’s a > >> pretty big series. > >> > >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. > It’s > >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I > speak > >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. > Often, > >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on > this > >> list. > >> > >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > >> > >> Denise Dalphond > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi > wrote: > >> > >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty > >>> “admissions of guilt†> >>> > >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < > >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > >>> > i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for > a > long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a > comment .. > i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > i do find though that your approach denise can be very > confrontational > and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is > dormant bar the denise show . > i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former > times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from > these > occasional outbursts . > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond < > denisedalph...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe > it’s > > just your family. > > > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I > had a > > boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been > wishin I > > was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and > other > > NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go > > raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I > forgot > > about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder > for > > the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, > or my > > Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like > > Konkrete Jungle. > > > > Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. > > > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams < >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I'm also basically a lurker these days but a list member since 1994. Also had the great fortune to meet Lakuti along with Earl Gateshead and the Flying/Plastic People crew in London 20 years ago -- and saw her play at the Detroit Artist Test Lab during the festival last year. (damn, that was a Throw Down!) She has listings on RA (so many!). https://www.residentadvisor.net/dj/lakuti/dates?yr=2020 She has been a friend to so many, built so much along the way, opened doors and kept them open. I hope my good friend decides to stay on 313, but either way I honor the decision. So here is what I have to say: this raises core questions about the ongoing purpose of this list. If we can't respect each other, why should any of us continue to subscribe? The 313 list has been a valued and even inspirational resource for me for a quarter century. It has persisted long after most of the other mid-1990s mailing lists have faded away. It has enabled lifetime friendships. Interaction online exposes different viewpoints and that's actually beneficial -- as long as we truly demonstrate respect for each other. Without that, there is no reason to continue. peace fh - >crikey . classic example of how not to built community . >i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a lot >into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . >and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music >network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a >look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on >being tone deaf . >my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . >keep supporting music not egos . >i am out of here . > >On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond >wrote: > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You donât have to like my communication. >> Iâll >> take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. Iâm >> not. You can read my writing in some published books. Itâs all on my >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. Itâs a >> pretty big series. >> >> Iâve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. Itâs >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak >> up more. Itâs super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this >> list. >> >> Iâll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: >> >>> Very well said. Whatâs worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty >>> âadmissions of guiltâ >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: >>> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment .. i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is dormant bar the denise show . i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these occasional outbursts . On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond wrote: > Well, Kent, nobody knows whoâs unsubbing except for you. So maybe itâs > just your family. > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a > boyfriend to go clubbing with. But Iâm pretty sure I never been wishin I > was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other > NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go > raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I > forgot > about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for > the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my > Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like > Konkrete Jungle. > > Too off topic? Too emotional? Iâm so irrational. > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams > wrote: > >> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not >> that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on >> 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the >> family. >> >> I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they >> were
Keep it real (and on topic)
I’ve seen Lerato on this list for some time. Just seen on their Insta that they’ve been playing back in my old home town in Australia and doing great things (nice warm fuzzies there). And I welcome what Lerato posts - even if the emails are few and far between. I’ve only ever had to block one person on 313 and unfortunately others still are responding to these posts and most if not all are sick of the bloviation being spouted. It’s a crying shame that in a community that’s always been about the music that someone is causing people to unsub because of their trolling behaviour. I couldn’t care less where you sit on the gender binary. Your personal business is your own. I care about whether you’re a good person who has value to add to a conversation. I’m not seeing that. As I sit here in Amsterdam airport heading home for another week, I reflect on the times of the Lowlands list and when 313 had signal and a decent signal to noise ratio. Now it’s largely spiteful noise. I’m just about to tune out. > > On Feb 26, 2020 at 7:00 pm, (mailto:booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com)> wrote: > > > > crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a > lot into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > > and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music > network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a > look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > being tone deaf . > > my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > > keep supporting music not egos . > > i am out of here . > > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond (mailto:denisedalph...@gmail.com)> wrote: > > > > > > > Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. I’ll > > take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. I’m > > not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > > website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > > resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a > > pretty big series. > > > > > > > > > > I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s > > pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak > > up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, > > I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this > > list. > > > > > > > > I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > > > > > > > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi > (mailto:jmaro...@gmail.com)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Very well said.What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty > > > “admissions of guilt” > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi > > > > > (mailto:booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for > > > > a long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a > > > > comment . > > > > i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > > > > > > > > i do find though that your approach denisecan be very > > > > confrontational and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels > > > > like the list is dormant bar the denise show . > > > > > > > > i am personally not gaining a lot from the listcompared to former > > > > times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from > > > > these occasional outbursts . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond > > > > mailto:denisedalph...@gmail.com)> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe > > > > > it’s just your family. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had > > > > > a boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been > > > > > wishin I was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and > > > > > other NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used > > > > > to go raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like > > > > > Twilo, I forgot about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Sweet Lerato. I am familiar with your work. I have no platform because most people don’t want to know about history and true stories. Check my archival collection at the Archives of African American Music and Culture at Indiana University. You’ll see mostly Black men’s voices. Black men from Detroit. Denise On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 1:00 PM Lerato Khathi < booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > crikey . classic example of how not to built community . > i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a > lot into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . > and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music > network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a > look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on > being tone deaf . > my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . > keep supporting music not egos . > i am out of here . > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond > wrote: > >> Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. >> I’ll take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. >> I’m not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my >> website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and >> resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a >> pretty big series. >> >> I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s >> pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak >> up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, >> I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this >> list. >> >> I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: >> >>> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty >>> “admissions of guilt” >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >>> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: >>> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is dormant bar the denise show . i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these occasional outbursts . On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond wrote: > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s > just your family. > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had > a boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I > was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and > other NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to > go > raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I > forgot > about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for > the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my > Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like > Konkrete Jungle. > > Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams > wrote: > >> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not >> that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on >> 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the >> family. >> >> I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they >> were more opinionated about music and less about each other. >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < >> denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never >>> yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. >>> >>> You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages >>> from Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. >>> >>> Denise, the woman >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi >>> wrote: >>> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f out? Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black?
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
crikey . classic example of how not to built community . i am writing to you as a black african queer woman denise who has put a lot into supporting and nurturing a lot of djs and artists . and i continue to work hard to support communities within the global music network young and old often from marginalized communities who do not get a look in , in the current climate in electronic music but yeah carry on being tone deaf . my last word . thanks for everything to everyone else over the yrs . keep supporting music not egos . i am out of here . On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:52, Denise Dalphond wrote: > Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. I’ll > take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. I’m > not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a > pretty big series. > > I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s > pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak > up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, > I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this > list. > > I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty >> “admissions of guilt” >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: >> >>> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a >>> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . >>> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >>> i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational >>> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is >>> dormant bar the denise show . >>> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former >>> times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these >>> occasional outbursts . >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond >>> wrote: >>> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s just your family. I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I was Black because then you have to suffer racism. I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like Konkrete Jungle. Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. Denise Dalphond On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams wrote: > The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not > that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on > 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the > family. > > I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they > were more opinionated about music and less about each other. > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < > denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never >> yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. >> >> You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from >> Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. >> >> Denise, the woman >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi >> wrote: >> >>> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f >>> out? >>> >>> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was >>> black? >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams < >>> chaircrus...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Dude Kent why don’t you simply remove her? She clearly violates any sort of “code of conduct” that doesn’t need to be written down but rather seen as common sense. That, and she makes other members uncomfortable regardless if she crosses any lines or not with her constant race and gender baiting. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:52 AM Denise Dalphond wrote: > Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. I’ll > take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. I’m > not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my > website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and > resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a > pretty big series. > > I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s > pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak > up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, > I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this > list. > > I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty >> “admissions of guilt” >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < >> booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: >> >>> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a >>> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . >>> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >>> i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational >>> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is >>> dormant bar the denise show . >>> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former >>> times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these >>> occasional outbursts . >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond >>> wrote: >>> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s just your family. I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I was Black because then you have to suffer racism. I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like Konkrete Jungle. Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. Denise Dalphond On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams wrote: > The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not > that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on > 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the > family. > > I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they > were more opinionated about music and less about each other. > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < > denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never >> yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. >> >> You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from >> Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. >> >> Denise, the woman >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi >> wrote: >> >>> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f >>> out? >>> >>> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was >>> black? >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams < >>> chaircrus...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Hey guys, I owe you nothing. You don’t have to like my communication. I’ll take up as much space as I need. Most people expect women to be quiet. I’m not. You can read my writing in some published books. It’s all on my website, which is in my signature. Next up is an article on Detroit and resistance in the first Oxford Handbook of Electronic Dance Music. It’s a pretty big series. I’ve never unsubscribed. This is the 313 list, not the IDM list. It’s pretty important. I used to never or rarely talk on this list. Now I speak up more. It’s super patriarchal of everyone to gang up on the woman. Often, I get private messages of support from subscribers when I speak up on this list. I’ll email the 313 list any time I have something to contribute. Denise Dalphond On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:45 PM Joe Marougi wrote: > Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty > “admissions of guilt” > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < > booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > >> i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a >> long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . >> i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . >> i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational >> and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is >> dormant bar the denise show . >> i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times >> and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these >> occasional outbursts . >> >> >> >> On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond >> wrote: >> >>> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s >>> just your family. >>> >>> I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a >>> boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I >>> was Black because then you have to suffer racism. >>> >>> I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other >>> NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go >>> raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot >>> about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for >>> the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my >>> Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like >>> Konkrete Jungle. >>> >>> Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. >>> >>> Denise Dalphond >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams >>> wrote: >>> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were more opinionated about music and less about each other. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: > I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never > yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. > > You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from > Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. > > Denise, the woman > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi > wrote: > >> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f >> out? >> >> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was >> black? >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams >> wrote: >> >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund >>> lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; >>> the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even >>> typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >>> >>> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not >>> close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. >>> I'd >>> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >>> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >>> >>> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great >>> things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those >>> musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more >>> attention: >>> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >>> >>> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues >>> that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not >>> appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group >>> of >>> friends, widely dispersed geographically, with
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Very well said. What’s worse is the lack of remorse. Just empty “admissions of guilt” On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Lerato Khathi < booki...@uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com> wrote: > i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a > long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . > i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . > i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational > and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is > dormant bar the denise show . > i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times > and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these > occasional outbursts . > > > > On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond > wrote: > >> Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s >> just your family. >> >> I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a >> boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I >> was Black because then you have to suffer racism. >> >> I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other >> NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go >> raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot >> about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for >> the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my >> Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like >> Konkrete Jungle. >> >> Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. >> >> Denise Dalphond >> >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams >> wrote: >> >>> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that >>> great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 >>> people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. >>> >>> I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were >>> more opinionated about music and less about each other. >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < >>> denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. Denise, the woman On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: > That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f > out? > > Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams > wrote: > >> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund >> lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; >> the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even >> typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >> >> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not >> close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. >> I'd >> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >> >> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great >> things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those >> musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more >> attention: >> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >> >> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues >> that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not >> appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group >> of >> friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So >> keep >> in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you >> disagree with them. >> > -- Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. ethnomusicologist schoolcraftwax.work >>> -- >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >> ethnomusicologist >> schoolcraftwax.work >> > > > -- > > Lerato Khathi > http://uzurirecordings.com > http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com > http://soundcloud.com/uzuri > Skype : Lakuti >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
i do not know you denise but i have been subscribed to this group for a long time therefore i feel that i am a bit qualified to make a comment . i am a lurker and posted sometimes but only occasionally yrs back . i do find though that your approach denise can be very confrontational and can often take up a lot of space . it often feels like the list is dormant bar the denise show . i am personally not gaining a lot from the list compared to former times and will need to unsubscribe shortly because i get no joy from these occasional outbursts . On Wed, 26 Feb 2020 at 18:20, Denise Dalphond wrote: > Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s > just your family. > > I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a > boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I > was Black because then you have to suffer racism. > > I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other > NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go > raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot > about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for > the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my > Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like > Konkrete Jungle. > > Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. > > Denise Dalphond > > > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams > wrote: > >> The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that >> great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 >> people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. >> >> I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were >> more opinionated about music and less about each other. >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond < >> denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never >>> yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. >>> >>> You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from >>> Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. >>> >>> Denise, the woman >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: >>> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f out? Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams wrote: > I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund > lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; > the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even > typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. > > I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not > close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. > I'd > rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years > since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. > > There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great > things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those > musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more > attention: > https://undergroundandblack.com/ > > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues > that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not > appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of > friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So > keep > in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you > disagree with them. > -- >>> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >>> ethnomusicologist >>> schoolcraftwax.work >>> >> -- > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > ethnomusicologist > schoolcraftwax.work > -- Lerato Khathi http://uzurirecordings.com http://uzuriartistbookingsandmanagement.com http://soundcloud.com/uzuri Skype : Lakuti
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
Well, Kent, nobody knows who’s unsubbing except for you. So maybe it’s just your family. I wish I had money to go clubbing more often in Detroit. I wish I had a boyfriend to go clubbing with. But I’m pretty sure I never been wishin I was Black because then you have to suffer racism. I do love the internet though because I can follow Liquid Sky and other NYC 90s rave accounts on Instagram and see pics of clubs I used to go raving at in NYC in 1995-1999 when I was going to NYU. Like Twilo, I forgot about Twilo. And Shelter. And Vinyl. And Roxy. I brought baby powder for the floor at the Roxy sometimes in my bright blue Adidas backpack, or my Lisa Frank backpack, cause I was a preppy raver. And the nights, like Konkrete Jungle. Too off topic? Too emotional? I’m so irrational. Denise Dalphond On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 12:10 PM kent williams wrote: > The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that > great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 > people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. > > I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were > more opinionated about music and less about each other. > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond > wrote: > >> I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never yelled >> at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. >> >> You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from Dan >> Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. >> >> Denise, the woman >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: >> >>> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f >>> out? >>> >>> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams >>> wrote: >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more attention: https://undergroundandblack.com/ And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So keep in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you disagree with them. >>> -- >> Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. >> ethnomusicologist >> schoolcraftwax.work >> > -- Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. ethnomusicologist schoolcraftwax.work
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
The Tom Cox battles were epic, but at the same time, ultimately not that great for the list. Every time there's a big emotional flare-up on 313 people unsubscribe; people I regard as essential members of the family. I'm all for people being opinionated, but it would be great if they were more opinionated about music and less about each other. On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:05 AM Denise Dalphond wrote: > I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never yelled > at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. > > You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from Dan > Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. > > Denise, the woman > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: > >> That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f out? >> >> >> Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? >> >> >> >> On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams >> wrote: >> >>> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately >>> and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the >>> flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing >>> "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >>> >>> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not >>> close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd >>> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >>> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >>> >>> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great things >>> now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those musicians. >>> There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more attention: >>> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >>> >>> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues that >>> have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not appropriate >>> content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of friends, >>> widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So keep in mind >>> you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you disagree >>> with them. >>> >> -- > Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. > ethnomusicologist > schoolcraftwax.work >
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
I miss when Tom Cox was on the list. Maybe that’s because he never yelled at me. He was more like a mentor 2 me. You can read all about it in the archives. You can read messages from Dan Sicko, too. In the 313 list archives. Denise, the woman On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 11:56 AM Joe Marougi wrote: > That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f out? > > Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? > > > > On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams > wrote: > >> I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately >> and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the >> flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing >> "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. >> >> I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close >> enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd >> rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years >> since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. >> >> There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great things >> now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those musicians. >> There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more attention: >> https://undergroundandblack.com/ >> >> And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues that >> have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not appropriate >> content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of friends, >> widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So keep in mind >> you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you disagree >> with them. >> > -- Denise Dalphond, Ph. D. ethnomusicologist schoolcraftwax.work
Re: Keep it real (and on topic)
That’s fine but why can’t folks tell “certain people” to chill the f out? Is it because she’s a woman, hates being white or wishes she was black? On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 8:48 AM kent williams wrote: > I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately > and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the > flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing > "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. > > I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close > enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd > rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years > since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. > > There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great things > now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those musicians. > There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more attention: > https://undergroundandblack.com/ > > And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues that > have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not appropriate > content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of friends, > widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So keep in mind > you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you disagree > with them. >
Keep it real (and on topic)
I generally just let the 313 list be. Frankly it's been moribund lately and probably has more subscribers outside of Detroit than inside; the flavor is completely different than it was 20 years ago. And even typing "20 years ago" about a mailing list feels weird. I don't know what to think about the Derrick May beefing -- I'm not close enough to any of the principles in that fight to know what's up. I'd rather that the focus stay on music, and to my mind, it's been 30 years since Derrick May's really been musically relevant. There are loads of Detroit producers and DJs who are doing great things now, and I think we've all been remiss to not amplify those musicians. There are vital new voices like Ash Lauryn, who deserve more attention: https://undergroundandblack.com/ And it's clear there's a lot of emotional upset and personal issues that have spilled onto the list. I don't want to say that's not appropriate content, but it should be in the context that we're a group of friends, widely dispersed geographically, with something in common. So keep in mind you're talking to a friend, and they deserve respect even if you disagree with them.
