Re: metric
Peter Tandy wrote: > Americans should be warned. If you 'go > metric' as Britain has been forced to do it will seem a very strange world > for those not brought up to it from an early age. What the hell is a litre > of petrol?? Mercifully though, I can still get a pint of beer, and with > that I know my limitation. Long may it continue. This metric versus imperial or american measurements will never end. It certainly has more to do with how you were "brought up" than with any easiness of use or practicality. I was brought up with the metric system. At least at school that's what I learned. Customary measures were not even tought. Now, my grandparents would always use the customary system. My father would use a mix. My mother was "metric-minded". One of my grandfathers was a blue collar work in a railroad built by the British. That means that when he was talking about his tools, nuts and bolts he would use the British system. Maybe I was in a very unique position to learn several systems at once. Now, either I was too lazy or the British and Brazilian customary systems were too much confusing. The fact is that as kid (without knowing anything about politics or imperialism) I rejected both the British and the Brazilian system. It did not seem I would ever learn how to express something in yards, feet, inchs and fractions of inches. To me putting a comma somewhere (we use the decimal comma, not the decimal point) seemed much easier than finding the proper unit that would come next. There was one more problem: many measures we quite unique in the sense that what they represented could change from state to state, town to town or even person to person. One "league", for instance, could mean either 6 km or 6.6 km. Now I know (I did not know then) that a league may also represent 3 statute mile (4.8 km). Now, 1 alqueire (land measure) had its fractions expressed in liters! Oh boy, only I know how my little head was confused: learning at school that liters were used to measure volume, now they were using it to measure surface! Eventually I was to learn that 1 alqueire = 48 liters. And reason was quite simple and straightforward: 1 alqueire was the land that would consume 48 liters of bean seed. Of course, beans have different sizes; some people like sowing close together, other like sowing far apart. So it is easy to see why the "alqueire" was quite elastic. There were other ways to measure the "alqueire". Eventually it was boiled down to *only* for: "alqueire de sesmaria", "alqueire paulista", "alqueiro goiano" and "alqueiro mineiro". Any doubt why I attached myself firmly to the metric system? Even if you love the American Customary System, do your kids a favour: teach them the metric system. So, in the future I'll be able to drink 0.5 l or 500 ml of bear instead of a pint. I can't believe drinking a pint can be as refreshing and awarding as half a liter :-) - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Building five sundials on a single parallelepiped
Roger Bailey wrote: > Hi Fernando, > > I would take a box and a ruler and do some experiments to see which looked > best. Fix the ruler pointing south at an angle equal to your horizon. Put > the box beside it and visualize a gnomon parallel to the ruler on each > surface. Turn and incline the box to see different orientations. Choose the > one that looks best. I was already doing this. Using the program "Shadows", by François Blateyron it was really easy to see how the real thing would look like. > > By the way, I use the new clipboard feature on the Windows version to bring > the design drawings into Word or Excel to finish with text. This works > better for me that dxf files imported into the cheapo CAD program I've try > to use. I'll try this too (alas, I don't have any CAD program)! Thank you. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: FAQ Answer Committee Volunteers
Tom The Y2K bug really messed with your computer clock. See that its date is 12/31/1969! Wow! As you know, the Unix Epoch starts on 0 h 0 m 0 s of January 1, 1970. So your private bug, instead of taking you back to 1900 took you back to 1969. Call the press and let them know the bug is still alive and kicking! :-) - fernando Original Message Subject: Re: FAQ Answer Committee Volunteers Date: (No, or invalid, date.) From: "Tom McHugh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "John Carmichael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, sundial@rrz.uni-koeln.de References: Conversation <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> with last message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Tom McHugh wrote: John, I would be happy to help field FAQ questions--within limits. Since I don't have the foggiest idea how Hour Plane dials work, I would defer to others on that subject. Tom McHugh [EMAIL PROTECTED] Rt. 1, Box 896 Fort Fairfield, ME 04742 USA N 46° 45' 13" W 67° 48' 42" -- > Hello Dialists: > > Here is a list of those people who supplied questions to NASS's FAQs About > Sundials project and therefore might be interested in serving on the FAQ > Answer Committee. Please review and let me know if you would like your name > added or removed from this list of committee volunteers. Your help is > greatly appreciated. > > Dominique Collin, Merril Compton, Ralph Galvin, Willian Gottesman, Henry > Hatem, Doug Kenny, Edward Keyes, James Lattis, Charlie Mead, Susan Miller, > Harris Morrison, Mike Muhn, Donald Petrie, Woodruff Sullivan, Tom McHugh, > Jim Cobb, Ryan Weh, Dave Bell, Roger Bailey, John Carmichael, Jack Aubert, > Harold Brandmaier, Donald Snyder, Ben Hoffman, Peter Hirtle, Jeff Adkins, > Chris Lusby Taylor, Andrew Pettit, Luke Coletti, fer j. de vries, Tony Moss, > Alexei Pace, Dan Simmons, Richard Mallett, Patrick Powers, Thibaud > Taudin-Chabot, Lawrence Roberts, Krzyztof Kotynia, Arthur Carlson, Peter > Tandy, Les Cowley, Chuck Nafziger, Mike Shaw, Jean-Paul Cornec, John Davis > > Thanks for your help, > > John Carmichael > 925 E. Foothills Dr. > Tucson Az 85718 > USA > tel: 520-696-1709 > e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Carmichael) > -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Azimuthal dial
What do they say about images and words? I was not paying to much attention to this thread. I thought it was too technical for me. Then I saw this image produced by Fer, and voilá! I understood the whole thing at once. Thanks Fer. - fernando "fer j. de vries" wrote: Hello Dave, Attached ia an example of such a dial. Spin means spider. The dial is for latitude 52 degrees north, longitude 5 degrees east, time meridian 15 degrees east ( our wintertime ) ( In summer we use 30 degrees east as time meridian ) You don't need a nodus, but just a vertical rod in the center. Read where the shadow of the rod intersects the circle of the proper date. At low latitude this type of dial isn't very useful. Best, Fer. Fer J. de Vries [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.iae.nl/users/ferdv/ Eindhoven, Netherlands lat. 51:30 N long. 5:30 E - Original Message - From: Dave Bell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: fer j. de vries <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2000 9:46 PM Subject: Re: Dali dials > Hello, Fer! > > > In my programs suite zwvlak95 there is a program spin.exe to calculate such > > a dial for a horizontal plane with circular scales of date and a vertical > > style. > > You also may name this type of dial an azimuthal dial. > > Can you give me a mental (or real!) image of this dial? I had never tried > 'spin' before, and the result is, to say the least, interesting! Is this > basically a flat dial, with a vertical style and nodus? How would one > derive the height from the drawing? > > Thanks! > > Dave > >Fer J. de Vries [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.iae.nl/users/ferdv/ Eindhoven, Netherlands lat. 51:30 N long. 5:30 E -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Azimuthal dial
"fer j. de vries" wrote: At low latitude this type of dial isn't very useful. Maybe with a very tall rod? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Azimuthal dial
"fer j. de vries" wrote: Fernando, Another picture of such a dial at Southern latitude 35 degrees and suntime can be seen as followGo to my home page ( URL below ) and use the link "Types zonnewijzers". You find it just above the start of the English part. Beautiful. Now that I've seen one for latitude 52 and another for latitude 35 I started having ideas. What would be the appearence of one for the latitude 0? I can imagine (I don't know if Math and reality supports me) a dial designed as human lips. Imagine a woman puts some lipstick and kisses a piece of white paper. Putting a rod on the center we (I mean, YOU) could perhaps have an Azimuthal dial for the latitude 0? Months Jan, Feb, 1/2 Mar, 1/2 Sept, Oct Nov and December would be represented in the upper lip; the other months in the lower lip. Does this make sense or am I completely stray? - fernando PS - Since I was visiting your site I downloaded your "computation of flat sundials again". I had done once, in the hope that I could write it in C. I don't know what I did to the pages, but I know that in the last few years I have not been able to use a C compiler not even to say "hello world". Perhaps I can program it into my calculator, during a flight. -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Azimuthal dial
I've got your point. Thank you.
As always, I tried to locate this "Mayall and Mayall". The only thing
I found was "The Sky Observer's Guide : A Handbook for Amateur
Astronomers"
by Robert Newton Mayall, Margaret W. Mayall (Illustrator),
Jerome Wyckoff
which certainly is not the one you've mentioned. :-(
- fernando
"Wm. S. Maddux" wrote:
Beginning on p.180 of "SUNDIALS" by Mayall and Mayall,
there
is a description, and construction advice, for dials of this type.
It includes: ..."However, the shadow will not fall on the outer
arc between 9 in the morning and 3 in the afternoon, unless
the height of the gnomon is proportioned to the altitude of the
sun at noon on June 21. But this makes the gnomon look too
high for the dial. Therefore, the shadow of a shorter gnomon
usually is extended by eye to the date arc during the period
when the shadow the shadow does not fall on the arcs."
I would like to suggest that a string can be loosely tied as a
loop ('bowline") around the base of a "too short" cylindrical
gnomon, and stretched along the center of the gnomon's too
short shadow as in the attached sketch, (SPUN.GIF) in order
to make clear the time as extended to an arc of greater radius
than the shadow. (In sketch, to just before 3 p.m. on 1 April.)
--
Fernando Cabral
Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.pix.com.br
Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
PABX: +55 61 329-0202
Fax: +55 61 326-3082
15º 45' 04.9" S
47º 49' 58.6" W
19º 37' 57.0" S
45º 17' 13.6" W
Any moon data site?
Does anybody there knows of any site where I can get information about moonrise and similar? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: warning notice about a new virus
Unfortunately this is a "hoax". This message is pretty standard. Sometimes they will the change the name of the virus (Wobbler, in this case), other times the names of the "authorities" will be changed (AOL and IBM, in this case.) The virus is the message itself that gets sent to million of people. A good rule of thumb (one more! about this kind of message is: a) if it is said to come from IBM, Microsoft, AOL or any other big company, it is a hoax. These big companies do not send this kind of message; b) if says something like "send this to as many people as you can", then is a hoax; c) If the source is "respectable", then it is probabily a hoax. d) If it says "don't even open the message", then it is a hoax. Sorry to add to the huge traffic already introduced by the hoax but I hope this message will help to can reduce them in the future. - fernando peter ransom wrote: > I have been told of the following by a reliable source, and hope that it > comes in time! > > Peter Ransom > > >>NEW VIRUS > >> > >>I have received the following message today: > >> > >>"We have been informed of a new virus - WOBBLER. It will > arrive on email > >>titled 'How to give your cat a colonic'. > >> > >>IBM and AOL have announced that it is very powerful, more so > than Melissa > >>and there is no remedy. It will eat all your information on > the hard > drive > >>and also destroys Netscape Navigator and Microsoft Internet > Explorer. > >> > >>Do not open anything with this itle and please pass this > message on. Not > >>many people seem to know about this yet so propagate it as > fast as > >>possible. > >> > >>This information was announced on last Thursday by IBM. > >> > >>Please share it with everyone in your address book so that the > spreading > of > >>the virus may be stopped. This is a very dangerous virus and > and there is > >>no remedy for it at this time. > >> > >>Please practice cautionary measures and forward this to all > your online > >>friends ASAP." > __ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: warning notice about a new virus
Tom McHugh wrote: > I don't know that Microsoft Internet Explorer (3.02a) needs the help > of a virus to self destruct. Good! Very good! Excellent! - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: The Noah Effect
Tony Moss wrote: > The severity of this effect is proportional to the distance in miles the > diallist has to travel to reach the dial's location to perform the > alignment. So you should invite me to align dials in Europe and Asia. We'll have rain enough to make the ocean sweet. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Off topic, but not too much
Dave Bell wrote:Dave > (Who missed Easter *twice* in 1999, flying to Russia on April 4th, and > flying back home on the 11th - wiping out both Western and Orthodox > Easters!) You sinful, iniquitous worm. Repent. And be penitent. Next year have it twice. Fly back and forth as needed but have it twice. :-) And don't forget the rabits and eggs here and there. -fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
OFF TOPIC -- OFF, OFF TOPIC
Dear French sundiallers I've heard the French Assembly has approved a "Resolution 495" which determines (so I heard) that every public organization in France has to replace Microsoft Windows by Linux. Maybe there is some web site with this kind of information. Or maybe there is some government Agency I can call to get it. Any help will be much appreciated. I hope everybody will excuse me for abusing this list's patience. Thank you. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: GPS, spherical sundial
Alain MORY wrote: > I did'nt clearly expose my problem : A wall must be built above a > foundation that has to be exactly oriented face to south. This wall will > contain an iron armature, so that a magnetic compass will not work > exactly near the wall. I don't see this as a problem. First, because since the wall is not built yet, its armature is not a problem. You can locate the wall using the magnetic compass. You put a line in place and you are done. The only problem I see here is how precise this measure can be. You would have to use a very good compass. And you would have to use it in a very professional way. You should take care both of magnetic declination and problems with the compass itself. You could easily end up with an error of 3 or 4 degrees, or even more. Now, even if you already have some magnetic influence on the place, this still should not be a problem. You can go as further away as you want (and can). Than you take a sight (for instance, using a engineering or militar compass) as you ask someone to put in place two stakes in the East/West direction. > So I thought to give an azimuth to the workers, for example by saying : > the wall must be perfectly aligned with this house angle an with this > treee. If the workers can follow this kind of instruction, ok. But it certainly would be easier to put the stakes in the right place and tie a line between them so the wall can just be built along the line. > I thought that it was possible to point with the GPS particular points > around the wanted site. > I will take relatively far points to give a better accurate guideline > (e.g. some mountains twenty km far from my wall) > Is it playable ? For this the compass maybe more precise than the GPS. The GPS only shows the direction when you are moving. In this case you should be moving in a straight line. Maybe repeating the movement back and forth, until you find the azimuth you want. Does not seem an easy task. Or even desirable. Now, you could use the GPS to take several fixes in far away points (5, 10 or even 20 km). The further away, the less important the error the GPS will be presenting (you should expect up to 100 m). Then, after taking the proper fixes you could connect them visually and from that line derive the azimuth you want. Finally, I don't think neither the compass nor the GPS is a good solution for the problem you have. I think for this particular case a time-proven solution of using the sun shadow is still easier, more precise and less cumbersome. Just put a vertical stake on the. You can also use a plumb line with a node somewhere at a suitable hight. Now, at chosen intervals, like 9 o'clock, 10 o'clock... until noon, mark in the ground where the stake shadow ends. For each mark, draw a circle having the stake as the center. In the afternoon, mark where the shadow is at each corresponding hour. That is, 1 pm, 2 pm and 3 pm corresponding, respectively to 11 am, 10 am and 9 am. Now draw a line connecting each pair of hour. Now pick one of the lines and bisect it and draw a perpendicular line. This line should coincide with the noon line. Also, if everything is ok, this perpendicular should bisect all the other lines. Two marks should suffice. Say, 11 am and 1 pm. Nevertheless, it is always good to have several marks. On one hand, because you may have clouds at the right time, making it impossible to draw the second mark when the time comes. If you have several marks then you will have as many opportunities to find the second mark. On the other hand, if you have several marks you can always check one against the others. This means more certainty. If the stake if correctly placed in the vertical you will end up with a very precise North/South line from which you can find any azimuth you may need. (By the way, the closer the solstice on the "other" hemisphere the more price the measuring will be). I do think this method is easier and more precise than the compass and the GPS (at least in "normal" usage). Regards - fernando > > > > Regards > > Alain MORY > > 47°N 7°E > 500 m > > Alsace, the country where the Sun shines in the gold wine glasses ! :-) -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: GPS and magnetic compasses for dial orientation.
Bob Haselby wrote: > To reduce the error to a minimum one would use two gps units > simultaneously one at each location and with the judicious use of a cell > phone to effect simultaneity, one could minimize the total differential > error. For good topographic conditions like yours the technique you suggest should work ok. Nevertheless... > A topographical map could also be used for alignment without > actually involving a hike to the peak. If you have a topo map that is refined enough (and has a proper scale), they you would need only the map itself and an alidade. I think. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: GPS, spherical sundial
Arthur Carlson wrote: > Fernando Cabral <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > I do think this method is easier and more precise than the compass and > > the GPS (at least in "normal" usage). > > I agree that a shadow method is likely to be easier and more precise > than using either a compass or GPS, but I have some comments on your > exposition. First, the clock time of the readings is not > important. In the afternoon, you want the locations where the shadow > of the nodus crosses each circle, regardless of what your watch says > the time is. You are absolutely RIGHT. My idea was not to suggest that the time was important. It is not, as you correctly say. The idea -- which I did not express correctly -- was that if you know that you made the first mark at 11 am, than the second one will be around 1 pm. So you can go for lunch and come back (say) 15 to 1 and wait until the shadow meets the circle. If you mark at 9 am then you should be back at 3 pm, so on and so forth. The only function of reading the watch is spare your time. So, thank you for clarifying this important point. > Second, the accuracy of the result can be compromised if > the ground is not level from East to West. For high precision, you > will first need to prepare a level surface for the shadows to fall on. Right again. - fernando > > > Regards, > > Art Carlson -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: special on NOVA
Ryan Weh wrote: > FYI, I just saw a special on NOVA tonight about the man (I can't quite > remember his name) Harrison? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Marathon, GPS and sundials
Dear fellows in sundialling Here I am, back from Morroco after surviving the Sahara Desert and the most gruelling foot race available for mad people like myself (http://www.sandmarathon.com, http://www.aoicimbaly.com) The first thing I read after sitting in my desk was that the American government has relinquished the controlled availabity for the GPS system. Nevertheless, the source was not reliable and does not hint to the original source. Is this a confirmed news? Best regards - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Azimuth calculation
Hello Friends It's been a long, long time since I last disturbed you with my novice questions. I was just acculating credits do be entitled to ask the following question that has more to do with navigation than any other thing: a) If I am using UTM coordenates, what is the easiest way to calculate the bearing from point A to point B in the chart; b) Same questions if am using latitude and longitude When using UTM I have come accross a solution that works but I must confess I hate it because I don't think it is elegant and it takes a lot of time so I am sure there must be a better solution. For the UTM it is much simpler because I can always create a Pythagorean triangule whose sides are the difference of Northing and Easting of the points, so I have three sides and an angle. Now, if I make the origin point the origen of a Cartesian system I can find the Azimuth adding together the angle I found plus 0, 90, 180 or 270 if the destination point is on the first, second, third or fourth quadrant. I does work, but there must be a simpler way to do it. If what I have are the geographic coordinates it takes me much more time with the spherical triangles and I am never sure I've done the right thing. I've read some books on celestial navigation and position astronomy. I can see the solution is there, but it does not seem I have the expertise to convert all those useful information in a simple formula for this specific calculation. And I feel very unhappy when I have to fill out a couple of pages with ugly calculations just to find out an azimuth I can easily find with a GPS or with a protactor and a map! Best regards - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Measurements on the Equinox
Sorry, but I have not been able to visualize this. No matter how I look into it, I can't seen how it will generate a perpendicular line. I see the pegs and cable as follows: + W o=o E + Where do I pull the rope taut? I'd imagine where the crosses are (+) but I can't see how it will work. Can someone help this guy who can't use the right side of his brain? - fernando John Carmichael wrote: > Rudolph: > > What a great idea! No math or plotting! This method also seems like it > would be very precise (If there is no stretch in the rope. A chain or cable > metal cable might be better than a rope for super precision). > > John > > >Yes, yes yes! Laying out lines is really fun and healthy. > > > >To derive the meridian from the east-west line, you don't even have to use a > >Pythagorean triangle. > >If you peg two points on the E-W line (not too close together) and connect > >them with a long rope, you can pull the rope taut first on one side of the > >E-W line, then on the other, each time grasping the rope in the same point. > >That point can be anywhere on the rope, although not too far from the middle > >(of the rope) is best. > >If you mark the two places you can reach that way, you have two points of > >the meridian. > > > >Have fun! > > > >Rudolf > > > >- Original Message - > >From: Wm. S. Maddux <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >(...) > >Although it might seem a bit like watching the grass grow, a dialist > >can find peculiar, but real, pleasure while doing this, just to see the > >the straight W to E line reveal itself again, as it always has. > > > >Later you can draw the local meridian at a right angle, anywhere > >along this established line, which is a most essential thing to know > >for any dialing project. (The good old Pythagorean ratio of 3:4:5 > >for the sides of a measured right-triangle is a good way to lay off > >the right angle.) > >(,,,) > > > > -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Measurements on the Equinox
Fritz Stumpges wrote: Hi Don't pull the rope too tight, leave a little slack. Now grab the rope anywhere near the middle and pull it snuggly to one side and mark the spot. Then holding the rope at the same spot move to the other side and repeat. I love the simple ideas people on this list come up with!!! Explanations are pouring in so quickly I am almost flooded. Thank you all guys. I am reproducing Fritz' explanations because it sounded crystal clear to me. My mistake was to think in two cables instead of one. + (A) /--\ W (o o) E \--/ + (B) That's how I had tried it. The cable has two legs. I tried to pinch A and B and the same time and pull them apart. Not good. Now I got it. And I also understand why John Carmichael suggests using a metal cable or chain. Thank you all guys. So simple and still there are some dumb people who can not understand it. These guys should not be in this list of bright people :-) - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: New California DST
Cary Chleborad wrote: > > Politicians are idiots! How absurd for them to think that because the > numbers on the clock read differently, at the same (well approx.) solar > angle, that the laws of physics will change for them and somehow the > people will magically use less power I can't understand why this summer time is handled in so emotional a manner. In Brazil it is always the same. Every year, when time is changed, people complain a LOT. This year several states went to the courts. What used to be confusing enough became more so as different judges made their decisions and appeals changed their decisions, etc. As to myself I L O V E daylight saving. Not only because it works (about 5% saving in Brazil, on the average) but mainly because it gives me a better quality of life. I am supposed to live my office at 6 PM but I usually do it much latter. On the summer I try to leave at 6 or so because I know I can go home and have about two hours more of day light. Instead of turning the TV on, turning several lights on I go walking or gardening or whatever. That explains why savings occurs. Of course, it does not work the same for everybody. The Brazilian Northern and Northeastern regions do not benefit at all (but would not lose either). In the Southern region (say, from latitude 20S to 34S) saving is much higher, up to 15% in the extreme South. But for me, what is more important is the fact that daylight saving is NATURAL. Since our ancestors as well as our primitive cousins around the world are governed by sunlight, it is quite clear to me that if left alone we would naturally follow a daylight saving scheme, because we would tend to awake up with the sunrise and sleep with sunset. I see no reason to treat this so emotionally. I can't understand why people have to complain so much because they have to shift their agenda one hour back or forth as DST enters and exits. Of course, this should not prevent politician to do what they SHOULD DO (but rarely do). - fernando -- From a country where it seems 70% of the inhabitants seem to react quite unreasonable against DST! > While they're on a roll they > should work at rounding PI down to make is simpler for the school > children to understand. > > -Cary > > P.S. I'm a crazy Californian. > > Ron Anthony wrote: > > > > All, > > > > The other day I heard on the radio that some politcians has proposed a 2 > > hour Daylight Savings Time offset to save energy. > > > > ++ron > > > > -- -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Re: DST emotions
> Sarah Edmondson-Jones wrote: > > How about following nature and just changing the hours we > conduct our business in, instead of the clocks? Would people be > more upset by the idea of having lunch at 10:00, than having a > two hour time shift and lunching at midday? As a boy I used to live in a farm. My father was a peasant. He'd raise at around 4 am, do some domestic chores until 5 or 6 and then go to the crop fields. Lunch time was somewhere between 9 and 10. About 1 pm he'd have a snack. At 2 he would head home and have dinner at 3. He'd go to bed maybe at 7 or so. Between dinner and bed time was "kid time" when we kids could talk with him an learn the things we had to do at home (prepare the cheese, hull the rice, toast the coffee bins, prepare the corn...) Maybe those few sweet years of my childhood were so strong that even the most modern gadgets have not been able to dissolve them into the time that oozed away. So -- curiously enough -- clock is something I love. The more precise the better. But I never feel enslaved to what those hands have to say. I like controlling them, make them go faster or slower as it pleases me, always avoiding let them make me faster or slower. I don't care if I have lunch at 10 or 12, as long as I have it because I am hungry and I want it, not because it is "time". - fernando ------ Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Re: Time Zones
> "A.Brown" wrote: > > Hi All > I just wondered what members in the group think of the latest > zoneless time concept, Internet Time where the day is broken up > into beats eliminating the need for geographical based time > zones. Is it seen as helping to make ours one world or as > cynical "commercial" exploitation? More often than not I feel dumber than I'd like to admit. I have always seen this Swatch issue as one of the purest form of hype. When I hear anything about "beat" I see it as snake oil talk. We already have too many good ideas about time and Swatch time, in my humble opinion is NOT among them. First of all, I can't see how it will avoid the "time zone" issue. If it could do it, we would do better with a 24-hour clock adjusted for (say) GMT or UTC. And it would have the advantage of allowing quick and easy fall back to the old "time": it would be only a matter of each country/county/person "shifting" back or forth one hour per 15 degrees longitude. Or -- still more precise -- shifting hours, minutes and seconds so every single person in this world could use both a universal time and a very precise local time. Perhaps synchronized with the sun (as apposed to political time). In fact, that's how UNIX is supposed to work since 1970. It's clock counts the seconds since midnight of first of January, 1970. The trick is to make that midnight a UTC (or GMT) midnight). Than it will offer you a "universal time". Different applications apply certain rules to convert to local time. A user can set a "personal" variable named TZ or TIMEZONE (standards are so good some people have decided to offer us several of them for the same purpose!). This way, a single machine, running anywhere in the world, can provide a time corrected for any other place in the world. It is very hard to think Swatch "beats" has anything to add to this simple and effective idea. And has been working for tens of years. The Intel machine I use most has maybe the worst clock ever made. It drifts off by as much as 40 minutes per day! I don't care. I am connect to the Internet on a permanent basis so I what I do it to read the time from a very precise clock at ntp2.usno.navy.mil I have programmed my machine to do it each 5 minutes (I could have programmed it to do it at any interval I wished). So, in fact, the clock I see on my screen appear to be very, very precise. Now, the time I read is UTC (or is it GMT -- too lazy to check now). It does not matter. And so is the time my machine's clock keep. Nevertheless, the software I use for displaying the time takes my longitude into account and gives me what I want more often. So, off with Swatch! It adds nothing but confusion. It creates nothing, but downgrades previous creations. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Re: Time Zones
Thierry van Steenberghe wrote: > > Steve Lelievre wrote: > > > > > Ireland is on the same timezone at the UK, and so is Portugal. It s > > Anyway, timezones don't solve the whole problem. When I lived in England I > > did a lot of business with Finland (+2 hours), and France and Germany (+1). > > It was difficult to contact colleagues when we needed to. Yes, this was due > > Still, it's more easy to find somebody in UK or Finland than in the US, from > Europe, that is, don't you think? I remember when I was in a company here in > Brussels, how difficult it was to call equipment providers in the US. Hey, guys, how about inventing a flat world with a sun burning from far, far, far away and turning itself on and off 12 hours? If it is very, very far away every corner of the new, flat world will be equally lit. And if it turns itself on and off regularly there will be no time zones, no shift differences, no daylight saving in the Summer and none of the problems some of us have been discussing. Let's accept for a fact that all those problems are NOT created by time zones or daylight saving time. They are not even problems. They are the reality we are provided with. And if we are interested in causes, it is because the Earth is a ball, it revolves and moves, so on and so forth. :-) - fernando -- ------ Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Re: Time Zones
Dave Bell wrote: > > Even easier, Fernando: "Invent" a spherical, but hollow Earth, with the > "Sun" quite close, at the center! Perfectly common design for a > sufficiently large, and sufficiently advanced space habitat, or entire > civilisation, living within a Dyson Sphere... huuummm... How about the shadows extending from feet to head? Won't them look phantasmagoric? If not, this is a wonderful idea. - fernando > > Dave > > On Thu, 29 Mar 2001, Fernando Cabral wrote: > > > Thierry van Steenberghe wrote: > > > > > > Steve Lelievre wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Ireland is on the same timezone at the UK, and so is Portugal. It s > > > > Anyway, timezones don't solve the whole problem. When I lived in > > > > England I > > > > did a lot of business with Finland (+2 hours), and France and Germany > > > > (+1). > > > > It was difficult to contact colleagues when we needed to. Yes, this was > > > > due > > > > > > Still, it's more easy to find somebody in UK or Finland than in the US, > > > from > > > Europe, that is, don't you think? I remember when I was in a company here > > > in > > > Brussels, how difficult it was to call equipment providers in the US. > > > > > > Hey, guys, how about inventing a flat world with a sun > > burning from far, far, far away and turning itself on and > > off 12 hours? If it is very, very far away every corner of > > the new, flat world will be equally lit. And if it turns itself > > on and off regularly there will be no time zones, no shift > > differences, no daylight saving in the Summer and none of > > the problems some of us have been discussing. > > > > Let's accept for a fact that all those problems are NOT created > > by time zones or daylight saving time. They are not even > > problems. > > They are the reality we are provided with. And if we are > > interested in causes, it is because the Earth is a ball, > > it revolves and moves, so on and so forth. :-) > > > > - fernando > > > > -- > > -- > > Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas > > Abertos > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br > > Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 > > 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W > > 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W > > -- > > -- -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Re: Time Zones
Dave Bell wrote: > > Wouldn't all shadows look like noon in the tropics, and just be > "puddles" at one's feet? > > Seriously, a sperical shell doesn't work, as there is no gravity inside, > and it would be difficult to keep your feet on the ground! Hey, what's the matter with you? We are creating this so we can redefine Newton's laws. We can say that a source of light in the core of a sphere will generate a certain attraction, so on and so forth. Or else we can make the sphere to be magnetic and attract our feet, magnetic too, with opposed pole ;-) - fernando > A cylindrical > shell, with a glowing central core (presumably fusion-powered), may be > slowly spun on its axis, giving full-time zenithal sunshine. > > Moving shadow planes have been suggested as a means of providing at least > twilight conditions, without the need to extinguish the fusion core. These > could orbit near the core, in near-weightless conditions. > > There are exciting recreational possibilities, as well, for low-G mountain > climbing at the endwalls, and free flight in the space "above" the living > surface... > > Dave > > On Thu, 29 Mar 2001, Fernando Cabral wrote: > > > Dave Bell wrote: > > > > > > Even easier, Fernando: "Invent" a spherical, but hollow Earth, with the > > > "Sun" quite close, at the center! Perfectly common design for a > > > sufficiently large, and sufficiently advanced space habitat, or entire > > > civilisation, living within a Dyson Sphere... > > > > huuummm... How about the shadows extending from feet to head? > > Won't them look phantasmagoric? If not, this is a wonderful > > idea. > > > > - fernando > > > > > > > > Dave > > > > > > On Thu, 29 Mar 2001, Fernando Cabral wrote: > > > > > > > Thierry van Steenberghe wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Steve Lelievre wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ireland is on the same timezone at the UK, and so is Portugal. It s > > > > > > Anyway, timezones don't solve the whole problem. When I lived in > > > > > > England I > > > > > > did a lot of business with Finland (+2 hours), and France and > > > > > > Germany (+1). > > > > > > It was difficult to contact colleagues when we needed to. Yes, this > > > > > > was due > > > > > > > > > > Still, it's more easy to find somebody in UK or Finland than in the > > > > > US, from > > > > > Europe, that is, don't you think? I remember when I was in a company > > > > > here in > > > > > Brussels, how difficult it was to call equipment providers in the US. > > > > > > > > > > > > Hey, guys, how about inventing a flat world with a sun > > > > burning from far, far, far away and turning itself on and > > > > off 12 hours? If it is very, very far away every corner of > > > > the new, flat world will be equally lit. And if it turns itself > > > > on and off regularly there will be no time zones, no shift > > > > differences, no daylight saving in the Summer and none of > > > > the problems some of us have been discussing. > > > > > > > > Let's accept for a fact that all those problems are NOT created > > > > by time zones or daylight saving time. They are not even > > > > problems. > > > > They are the reality we are provided with. And if we are > > > > interested in causes, it is because the Earth is a ball, > > > > it revolves and moves, so on and so forth. :-) > > > > > > > > - fernando > > > > > > > > -- > > > > -- > > > > Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas > > > > Abertos > > > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br > > > > Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 > > > > 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W > > > > 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W > > > > -- > > > > > > > > -- > > -- > > Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas > > Abertos > > mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br > > Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 > > 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W > > 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W > > -- > > -- -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W --
Apparent solar altitude calculation
Hello I'd like to be able to calculate the apparent solar altitude, day by day from January first to December 31 on a hourly base from 7 AM to 6 PM. Do you know if any of the calculators available on the Internet can provide this? Thank you - fernando -- Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: R: Apparent solar altitude calculation
It seems Gianni Ferrari's GEFFEM is what I need. I've spent about 3 minutes playing with it and it seems I can find everything I need. I can imagine what I'll be able to do after reading the manual and playing around for half an hour! I've also found reading a screen in Italian is funny. No matter how much attention I pay to it, a "G" for day always surprises me (I can never understand why Italians have dropped the "H" and the "J"...) Thank you Gianni for you program. I think I have sent personnal messages to the great number of people that tried to help me in several different ways. Anyway, I'd like to say "thank you all" in public. This is a great list with great people! Thank you. - fernando Em Sexta 08 Junho 2001 07:12, Gianni Ferrari escreveu (wrote): > Hello Fernando, > > I've written a program - GEFFEM - to calculate Sun's multiple ephemeris > with a great precision. > The program is in Italian but I think you can understand and use it very > easily. > > You can download it from the Mario Arnaldi's Internet place > http://digilander.iol.it/McArdal/Gnomo-index.htm > select > Software > Astronomia > Geffem > > > Regards - > > Gianni Ferrari -- Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Oughtred
Rudolf Hooijenga wrote: > > As for "Oughtred", I never gave it a thought, always having assumed it was > "Ought" as in "you ought to do this" plus "red" as in the colour. > > A famous family of packet drivers for (among others) Ethernet cards comes > from a firm called Crnwyr. > > Just to be on the safe side, there was a .wav file on their web page that > pronounced this name for you. I have a British friend who is always pulling the legs of his American friends (and foes) because (se says) Americans do not know how to spell and pronounce proper names. As a foreigner who has learned a little English by reading and writing (as opposed to listening and speaking), I have always had enormous difficulties guessing how to pronounce certain proper nouns. Sometimes the best of my efforts take me miles aways from the right sounds. This is kind of funny because it can not happen in Portuguese unless it is a foreign name. I think it does not happen in other langagues either, like Italian, Spanish and German. I am glad to learn that native speakers can have some difficulties too. Maybe from now on I will not feel so embarrassed as I used to when I have to face the daunting task of pronouncing someone's name over the phone and get the other side to understand who I am referring to. :-) - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Lunar ephemerids
Since I am among scients I am a little affraid to mention this topic, but... if people have to chuckle, so be it. I am interested in doing some experiments concerning the possible effect of the moon and planets on animal e vegetal life on Earth. In order to do that I need to have reasonably precise information on planets and moon positions so as I can sow and harvest accordingly. Maybe some one in this list is also interested in this "less accepted" aspect os astronomy and can hint me on softaware/pages when I can gather this kind of information... Best regards - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Lunar ephemerids
Fritz Stumpges wrote: > Thanks for your hints about TheSky. I'll check it up. > For now, please keep me informed as to what you are studying and how it > goes. There is a German (I think) lady (Maria Thun) who is a follower of Rudolf Stein. It is said that she carefully tested sowing, transplanting and harvesting hour by hour. I heard she consistently observed differences in weight, size, shelf life and nutrient contents. Without intending to be so meticulous as we think Germans are, I'd like to do something similar (but much, much simpler), like observing if seeds sowed in the new moon do any better than seeds sowed in the waning moon, etc. My impression is that we are always labiling this and that of superstition. And, by doing it, we may be excluding from due evaluation things that might work. Anyways, I noticed your domain is "fluidcomponents". I wonder if you've heard about Viktor Schauberger, a German engineer who studied hydrodynamics and wrote some articles (or books) about turbines and vortices. It seems he has some crazy ideas about the way water behaves... This is another issue I'd like to investigate some time soon. Best regards - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: AW: Lunar ephemerids
so forth. No, back to moon influence. If the moon (and perhaps the planets and the sun) has any influence, it will be made clear in a "sinusoid inside a sinusoid". Let's assume -- just for the sake of argument -- that beans have a higher yield when sowed in the new moon while it has the least yield in the waining moon. Now, if this is the case, as the year wears out from the first of January to the end of December we will find a sinusoid peaking (for each moon cycle) in the new moon and bottoming in the waining moon. Peaks might be less tall in the winter and taller in the summer; the valleys might be deeper in the winter and less deep in the summer. But if the moon has an influence (as above), we'll still see its presence in the sinusoid. Well, if we can't see no changes in the curve as the days advance and the moon ages (in a cyclical manner) then we can conclude no influence exists. Otherwise, we can conclude that there is an influence and then decide when it is positive and when it is negative. The experiment is so simple that we can expect to be able to do it not only year after year but also with many different plants. And, with a little help from interested souls, perhaps around the world. And, whatever the results are, they will be valid for true-to-life agriculture not for white apron, air-conditioned pseudo agriculture. I know things like these seem naïve to sophisticated minds, but it is the only thing someone simpleminded like me needs to be kept busy and happy. Best regards - fernando > For example, you need to > compare two sets of seeds, both planted at the equinox, but one set in a > year where the moon was full at the equinox and the other in a year where > the moon was new at the equinox. But that is not enough because you have to > be sure that the temperature, cloudiness, and percipitation at the time of > planting and several weeks before and after were similar. Your only hope to > prove an effect would be to plant the seeds indoors and keep the > temperature, humidity, and light at constant levels over several months. > Several plantings would be necessary to be sure the seeds weren't drying out > or something from one planting to the next. If you could manage to prove a > small but consistent effect it would have no immediate application because > the weather and other effects would certainly be more important in deciding > when to plant in any given year. On the other hand, an incontrovertible > positive result would be extremely interesting from a scientific point of > view -- precisely because it would contradict so much of what we believe to > understand about the world. > > Best regards, > > Art Carlson -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Lunar ephemerids
In the begining I expected to send a thank you message for the guys who so promptly helped me with pointers and solutions to the lunar ephemerids question. In this list there are so many ladies and gentlemen ready to help that I ended up with a long list of names. So I opted for this "thank you all guys". You know who you are. Take care - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: AW: Lunar ephemerids
amateur among professionals. I'd have to chance and it... > More importantly, such statistical results should also convince your > neighbour, or Arthur Carlson for that sake. That's why we need a set > of rules about what we should consider "convincing evidence". This is > a major aspect of the scientific method. I agree with you. But it seems most people the call themselves "scientists" are not paying attention to this requirement, are they? > But, why not try? "The proof of the pudding is in the eating", as the > British say. Progress is made by experiment! Now we are talking the same language again! Take care. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Angular units
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > 51G 30M > > often with the G and M above their respective figures. > > Can someone tell me, please, what the G stands for? The only angular G I > know is the grad, or 1/100th of a right angle. This is clearly not what is > meant in these cases, as 51D(egrees) 30M(minutes) is meant to represent > London. Or did grad mean something different in Tudor and Stuart times? In Portuguese the same word "gradus" begot both "grau" (degree) and "gradus" (360 and 400 units). So maybe *that* G was "gradus" which by the time probabily meant "degree", not what we nowadays know as "grad". This specalution could very easily be tested with a book on History of math, or an encyclopaedia neither of which I have right now. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Sundial Trick Photography
Thierry van Steenberghe wrote: > > One such objective is the PC Nikkor (28mm f/3.5) by Nikon, where PC > stands for Perspective Correction. > The focal length is short, and probably better adapted to buildings than > to details, unless the position of the sundial allows for getting > relatively close, but it can be useful for horizontal dials. For an old-timer, a camera with bellows and flat film allow for the same correction. And if you use a large-format camera you can see the correction on the viewing glass before inserting the film in place. Alas! Those cameras are now quite rare. But who cares? - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: posting to list in HTML=fewer readers
john hoy wrote: > I know that there are other people who prefer not to have email in HTML > but I can't speak for them. As to me, I prefer plain text, no attachments, no HTML. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Daylight saving has just begun...
Hello Daylight saving time has just begun in Brazil. And, as every year, I hear the most unimaginable argumentation against it. Like someone who contended it was invented and introduced in Brazil by the military dictatorship as an act againt the people. In fact, daylight saving time was suspended during the dictatorship! Another one said he can't work or study during the summer because the daylight saving time plays havoc with his health... Even though I know DST was alive and kicking in the fifities, it does not seem I have a quick way to determine when it was introduced in Brazil for the first time. So, the question is: does anybody there knows when it was first introduced in the world? And in specific countries, like the US, UK, etc.? Best regards. And "carpe 'the longer' diem". :-) - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: calender
A year is a leap year if it can be devided by four without remaining, except if it ends in "00" (like 1900, 2000...) in which case it must be devisible by 400 instead. If my memory is of any avail, week days repeat at regular intervals of 18 years. Maybe I am wrong. Anyway, it is easy to check if you have a perpetual calendar at hand. - fernando "walter.jonckheere" wrote: > > Hello everybody, if I am right the year 2000 had a februari 29. What is the > formula for calculating the year allready gone, also > with a februari 29 and where the names of the day were exactly the same, I > mean if januari 1 was a monday in 2000, it should also be a monday in the > year we are looking for. The interest of this search lies with old VCR,s > unable to set the date on the year 2000 or beyond, thus preventing timer > recordings. By setting the old year this will again be possible. > Furthermore, I remember buying in Hong Kong some 30 years ago, a small date > calculator with very interesting options, f.i. you could subtract or add a > number of days to a given date & obtain the other date; subtract dates & > obtain the number of days, check what day was your birthday, & so on. But I > lost it, probably while moving; does someone know if this gadget > still exists, I never found another, or if it exist as a software program. > Thank you for your answers. > Walter, 50N 42 1 4E 33 46 -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Finding the meridian with a GPS
After buying an old theodolite I merrily travelled to my little farm with the firm purpose of finding the local meridian with high precision. And, as an extra, I would survey the region and have a very precise map. For no purpose at all, but what is a theodolite good for if you don't find ways to use it? They say that if you give a child a hammer she will try to fix the whole world using it. So, if an adult gives himself a theodolite, he MUST find what to do with it, right? Well, theodolite, almanac, calculator, everything in place except... the moon, the sun, the stars. It rained cats and dogs for several days. Starting on December 20 until January 5, we had plenty of water from the skies. As chance uses to have it, if I had to go to main street to buy some stuff or perhaps visit a friend, that's when we had a brief period of clear sky. But experience had taught me: if I decided to rush back home clouds would immediately fly in and start pouring the water god wanted to send us... After several days I picked up my old GPS and decided to use it to replace the stars. I chose a far away point. A tree about 1000 m from the place I set up the theodolite. I walked to it and took a reading (in fact, several readings). Then I walked back to where the theodolite was and took some readings. According to the GPS distance was a little bellow 1000m. I used the GPS to find the bearing from one point to the other. I set the limbo to 0 at that tree. From there I could find any other bearing. My reasoning was that even if the GPS would give me an error of, say, 20 meters to one side (worst case) I'd still be very close to the real azimuth. In fact, let's suppose (this was what I reasoned) I have a right triangle with two legs of 707,1 m each. The third side would be 999,99 (that is, 1000 m). Now, the angle each of the two other angles would be 45 degrees. Now, if, instead of having a leg of 707,1m I had it with 727,1, the difference in the angles would be arc tan (727,1 / 707,1) = 45,7 so, an error of less than 1 degree. Close enough for most purposes, I guess, And probabily better than the other simple methods. Of course, if I wanted to secure higher precision I could still try to go further away (terrain permiting). With a tower (or tree) 5 km away my error would be of less than 10 minutes for a GPS error of 20 m in the worst direction. I still expect to refine my findings when I have a good star in the proper position and a cloudless sky. But for the time being I am happy that I could put my o'theodolite to use. Now I am a happy (ancient) kid! - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Virus warning
MMB wrote: > > Mike Shaw wrote: > > > > I have just received this e-mail, and I also found I had this Virus. Sounds > > as though its worth checking your systems. Just follow the instructions. > > I own a Mac so my computer is fortunately immune. However, for those of > you with pcs I have pasted below an extract from a newsletter I receive. > DON'T delete that .exe file from your system. Even thou my personal computer is a Linux (and has been a Unix-live for the last 20 years or so), I still have to work with Microsoft junk because of my profession. Although it is possible to develop virus for Unix-like OS, they are very rare, mainly because they are very hard to write and exceedingly difficult to install in any seriously-administered machine. As I said, I have to work with Microsoft stuff too. In spite of that, I have never been victimized by a virus even thou I have been exposed to the Internet for about 20 years now. Now, in all those years I have NEVER, NEVER, NEVER received a good-intentioned message that is not a hoax. Let's see what a hoast is comprised of: a) Good intention -- Some one wants to PROTECT you or something. Perhaps a child, a pet, a cause; b) They have support from a well-known company (Microsoft, IBM, other big names); c) They trust you are ready to help other people educating them about how to avoid the problem you've just been helped about; d) They think you will send the warning to a lot of friends, relatives and acquaitances. But just to be on the safe side they will also prod you along instruction you to "send to ..." A hoax has two bad consequences: the first one is clogging your mail box and the whole Internet (remember, we are talking about millions of people sending millions of copies of thousands of different hoaxes 24 hours per day...) This is its main target. the second one is a collateral effect that some hoaxes may have. Like telling you to remove a file or calling a certain telephone number. By doing so you destroy your operating system yourself. Or you can cause very serious problem, as it recently happened in Brazil when a hoax asked people to call a certain telephone number because a sick child was about to die and had no friends or relatives to talk to. Millions of calls were placed to an emergency number in a hospital and it went kaput for several days until the calls subsided. People may have died because of this. So, here is a good advice: NEVER TRY TO HELP OTHER PEOPLE BASED ON MESSAGES with ONE OR MORE of the above-mentioned characteristics (based on your solidarity, big names, good causes). They are hoaxes. Always hoaxes. Bear in mind that if you know about something that might affect your friends, and this something comes from a trustful source, you will naturally let your friends know about it. Not because you received a message with a boilerplate prodding you to disseminate it. If (when) you get such messages just delete them. The less people know about it, the better. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
virus -- this is a joke
My Portuguese friends should NOT read this message. If they do, they should NOT complain to me but to the bishop :-) Brazilian love to tell jokes involving silly Portugueses. We receive it back in kind. Or worse when our victims are the Argentineans. So, let me be politically incorrect and crack this one. A internaut receive a message that read as follows: This is a virus. It was developed in Lisbon by a very competent Portuguese programmer. He is so clever that he was able to develop this virus even thou he had no access to the well-kept secret of the art of virus-growing. So, please, follow carefully these instructions: a) Turn your computer on if it is not running as yet (if so, how have you read this message?) b) Open a MS-DOS windows. In order to do so, click in the "Start" stab, click in "Run", type "Command" and "Enter". c) In that black windows that will open up, do "CD \" d) type "DELTREE *.*" + Enter You're done and so am I. Please, help your friends to do the same. It seems the last hoax in the sundial list was based on this (simplified above) Brazilian joke about the Portuguese virus. Manoel Joaquim Pereira (Nobody would trust this virus unless the author's name was Manoel or Joaquim, certo, pá?) -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Virus hoaxes
"innocents" spreading them around. Humanity will survive this time too. Perhaps, with a message like this one I am sending now those who have done because of their innocency only will not do it anymore. Or perhaps I am completely wrong in every respect and aspect. And perhaps some people will even want to have my tongue cut because I am a messanger that says: hey, look out, someone is manipulating your sentiments. So be it. > Donald Petrie wrote: > > This is my first submission to the Sundial List and, > ironically, it is not about sundials. > Having recently been a victim of the "Sulfnbk.exe" hoax, I > thought that you should be aware of a valuable web site - > http://securityresponse.symantic.com > At this Gito home page, click on [Technical Support], then on > the Symantic page, click on [Security Response]. Here you will > find all kinds of information about virus threats and > a Reference Area where you can find Hoaxes listed. Click on > this and you will find a surprising number of virus hoaxes out > there in cyberspace. If you have deleted "Sulfnbk.exe" and wish > to re-install it, there are instructions on how to do so. > (Sulfnbk.exe is a Windows utility used to store long file > names; it is not required to run Windows). > I agree that information about computer viruses should be > shared as widely as possible. The above web site provides a > good way to check them out. > > Don Petrie. -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Virus hoaxes
Ron Anthony wrote: > > However, I must disagree that you should supress the news of a real virus > that has infected > your computer. Just as with human viruses, the infection speads to those you > know the best. > And just with human viruses, you have a duty to notify those you have had > contact with so that > they can be on guard for unknowingly being infected. Granted. I should have said so. But in my interpretation this case would not be a case of "news supression" but instead, the rendering of a duty. And the message would be quite different from those hoaxes. Something like "virus such and such has infected my machine. If you have received a message from me, please double check to be sure it was not sent by the virus itself or is not contaminated. Sorry." This has none of the characteristics of hoax, does it? And certainly it does not invite people to keep spreading the news (as is the case with hoaxes). Thank you for reminding me of this exception (if you will). - fernando > > ++ron > > - Original Message - > From: "Fernando Cabral" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Donald Petrie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Cc: "Sundial List" > Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 5:03 AM > Subject: Re: Virus hoaxes > > > Since I wrote a message about hoaxes I have been bugged > > by the impression that it was not welcome. In fact most > > public and private messages I've received are very kind > > but somehow manage to say "let the hoax come". > > > > Now, it seems my message did not get thru. Let's hear what > > Donald Petrie says: > > > > >I agree that information about computer > > > viruses should be > > > shared as widely as possible. > > > > With different wording I heard this same thing from half a dozen > > people. > > That's precisely the principle hoaxes are based on. This belief > > is their lifeblood itself. > > > > Yes, information and education about how virus and hoaxes work > > should help. Maybe it is the only thing that will help. > > Nevertheless, since MOST messages about virus are, in > > fact, hoax, spreading the "news" is, in fact, spreading > > the "virus" itself! > > > > That's why notices about virus should NEVER be spread. No > > matter how good the intention is. It will only accomplish > > what the bad guys want them to accomplish: clog the network > > and everybody's mailbox. And they will do it using candid, > > and well-intentioned hands: yours. > > > > There ARE real virus and there are hoaxes. The treatment > > for both is the same: delete them and DON'T SPREAD THE > > NEWS! If you want to be useful, beneficial, show solidarity, > > then teach your friends how to detect a virus or a hoax > > (or better yet, how to avoid them!). But do it in private > > message exchange. Person to person. > > > > Again, in the Internet, anything that resembles a > > "pyramid" or a "chain" is nasty and has nasty > > results. Hoaxes and news about virus have this > > characteristc. > > > > So, I must insist, spreading news about virus and hoaxes > > IS sinful, deleterious, even if SOME people might find > > it informative and helpful. Perhas it will do a little > > good to those few, but it will certainly do great damage > > to the Internet as a whole and to the vast majority > > of users that will not benefit from those "alerts", > > be them real (very rare) be them fraud (most common). > > > > I know, it has been proved time and again that most > > people will do something -- anything -- if they can > > SEE that a FEW are benefitted, as long as they DON'T > > SEE that MANY are hurt. When a person spreads hoaxes > > she tends to listen to those who may eventually benefit > > from their action. She will not take into account those > > that are impaired. > > > > The only acceptable attitudes about virus and hoaxes are: > > > > 1) Delete them > > 2) If you want to know for sure if it is a real virus or a hoax, > >check some of the sites where this kind of information is > >logged. - as Donald Petrie mentioned, > > http://securityresponse.symantic.com > >is one of those sites. > > 3) If you think some of your friends might need help about virus > > and > >hoaxes educate them on a person-to-person basis. Eliminate > >any possibility that your teachings be taken as a "chain" > >or "pyramid" because if you don't yo
Re: Patents
"J.Tallman" wrote: > > Hello Brooke, > > but some of the ones I saw listed did not > really seem unique enough to warrant/earn patent protection. Well, when you know that Microsoft has the word "Windows" under trade mark protection... I think anything can be expected. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: reply or not to reply
Steve Irick wrote: > > All: > > I view the Listowner as neutral and send this email as a balance for > consideration to those who requested the change. My mail is pretty evenly > divided between individual and group, most of it is technical. This mix > benefits from the capability of my email programs ( I use several) that all > have "reply, reply to all and address list". I make a similarity to this > dilemma by the standardization of the valve on the left being the hot water > and the valve on the right being the cold water. I would prefer that > wherever I traveled that when I turned on the valve on the left that I > would get hot water and not cold. Take care, you could very easily get burned if travelling around the world! :-) I would say both work, as it works with cars in England where they are in the right side when they are on left side while elsewhere they are in the right side when they are in the right side! Now, my preferred mode is replying to the sender only, not to the list. This has several obvious advantage and only a very minor disadvantage: 1) Most of the time we DO want do respond to the sender only. It is true that sometimes people do not know it, but a good observation will clearly show it. For instance, request for information (any information) should almost always be responded to the sender only, not to list. Agressive answers should be sent to the sender only; reprimands should be sent to the sender only... 2) It avoids so many "sorry, I wanted to send to the sender only" 3) It forces us to DECIDE if our answers benefit the whole list or not. And, if we decide, we have to take responsability for what we do (as opposed to what happens when we do things "by accident") 4) We can very easily correct ourselves with no damages if we intended to send to the whole list but sent to the sender only. The reverse is disastrous. Now, the only price we pay for having so many benefits (and others I have not listed) is to have to type "sundial" or any other nickname we find fit so our mailer can complete it for us with the full address. Very small price, indeed. - fernando > > Thanks > > Steve > Yorktown VA USA > > - -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: reply or not to reply
Patrick Powers wrote: > > An off topic comment if I may :-) > > Message text written by fernando > > It's wise to remember that the populations of the countries who drive on > the left much exceeds those who drive on the right. It's just that China, > India and Africa etc don't yet have the same car ownership as the US > The day for us 'drivers on the left' will come...!!! > > Ah well some day! Or perhaps this European Community thing will change England and then... the rest of the lefties (and leftists) will follow :-) - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: reply or not to reply
Richard Mallett wrote: > I am think we have been stretching this issue too far and feel sorry for having my own share of responsability in it. But here I go again... > Reply to : Fernando > > I think it is very sad if people only use the facilities of this list > for personal 'one to one' communication. I didn't mean the list is to be used 'one to one'. This would be contradictory since we are talking about a list. What I meant is that VERY OFTEN the questions are directed to everybody but the answers will not interested the majority. I in the last couple of years I have asked this kind of questions myself. Several times. I asked them because I am ignorant. Most people in the list are not as ignorant as I am. Most of the time answer to my questions would not interest them. Of course, s/he who answer should know better and use his/her discrimination to decide if the answer has collective interest (I do understand that for dumb questions like mine most of the times the answers are so good that they deserve public broadcasting...) > I would expect that, in a > moderated list such as this, that there would be very few aggressive > messages or reprimands, and requests for information (and responses to such > requests) would surely benefit everybody - isn't that what these discussion > lists are supposed to be all about ? I belong to about 30 lists on yahoo > groups, and about 15 lists on Compuserve, and all default to posting > replies to the list, so I don't really see the problem here. Most lists I subscribe to are different than yours. And I am happy with the way they work. As somebody else already said in this list (I can't remember who), it should work both ways. There is only a small price to pay for changing the costume. - fernando PS - I think I have said more than enough about this issue. It does not deserve so much bandwith. I am happy with any decision you guys or the list owner adopt. -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Visiting the North Pole
Hi Some of the members of this list will remember that two years ago I mentioned I was going to the Sahara Desert. I was to run the Marathon des Sables, a 236-km race in the Morocco. Well, I think I never came back to it. I wrote an article about the race. But it has never been translated into English. Those who can read in Portuguese or perhaps just want to browse a few pictures can see it at http://sites3.winbr.com/gaia/fcabral/esportes/corrida/maratona_areias/maratona_areias.html One thing I must say is that after spending those two weeks in the desert I came to understand why we had some so brilliant astronomers in the Arab world. I spent one night sleeping in the sand without even a Berber tent to protect me. In spite of the cold -- boy, it was cold! -- I couldn't resist staring the sky for a long, long time. It was so beautiful! So many stars shining against that clear sky... even thou I had trekked for about 65 km through the tough "dunettes" (and that was already the third day) carrying a heavy knapsack, I couldn't sleep at once (as I used to do) because I wanted to take in and breath and dive into that glorious and rare moment. The Beduins of old had an open university available for free: the starry and clear skies. Now I am returning. I want to run that race again. Mostly, I want to see the desert again. And I want to drink from its mysteries as I want to drink from the pristine waters of life. This time I'll do it a little different. After the race, instead of coming back to Brazil I'll visit the North Pole. From Morocco to Moscow, Siberia and... North Pole. I expect to be there from the 21st to the 28th of April. Maybe I'll take with me a especially made sundial (aha, you though this had nothing to do with sundials?). Any suggestions? - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: Sundial water drainage
John Carmichael wrote: > > Hi All > > Does anybody know the MIMIMUM amount of slope that would be needed for > drainage? I'm thinking that architects must have some set standard for > this. I am not an architect but I have built several things in my farm most of them with the same drainage requirements. Most of the time I have been advised by engineers and architects to use a 2% inclination with is an angle of 1.145 degrees. I has worked for my purposes. May work for you too. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: Slopes and inclinations
MMB wrote: > > Anselmo, you have taught us all something. In English, too, we would > never say "the inclining tower of Pisa" :-) On the other hand, you have NO OTHER way to say but "inclined tower of Pisa" (Torre inclinada de Pisa). But who cares to say it is "inclinada?". Just say Torre de Pisa and... it is clear what you meant. - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: Polar Alignmen
Brooke Clarke wrote: > > Hi Richard: > > It may not be that simple. > > I have considered using a surveying transit to sight Polaris at culmination > and > transferring the N-S line to stakes on the ground. This N-S line could then > be > transferred to the center of the dial. Then you are back to the issue of borrowing my theodolite as suggested by Roger. But I tell, not even over my dead body! - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: Sundial water drainage
The Shaws wrote: > > Tony Moss wrote:- > > <<"I am a sundial! Ordinary words > Cannot convey my thoughts on birds!" > > Hillaire Belloc 1938 (ish)>> > = I am a sundial too! I only need a four-letter word to convey my thoughts on vandals! - fernando -- REDUZIR, REUSAR, RECICLAR -- Dever de todos, amor aos que virão REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE -- Everybody's duty, love to those who are to come Fernando CabralPadrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fone Direto: +55 61 329-0206 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] PABX: +55 61 329-0202 Fax: +55 61 326-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S (23 L 0196446/8256520) 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S (23 K 0469898/7829161) 45º 17' 13.6" W -
Re: SUNDIAL FRO SOUTHERN HEMISPHERE
fer j. de vries wrote: > It is calculated with Zonwvlak.exe. > With the windows interface Zwvlak95 it is easier to use these programs. > You can download the needed files at http://www.iaehv.nl/users/ferdv/ Are the messages in English? - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf 1 (TEXT/ttxt) (7D1E)
Re: Verse Competition
Ross McCluney wrote: Wm. S. Maddux wrote: The list is truly international, and although its members use English as its "lingua franca" , it would be quite unfair to conduct a competition solely in that language. My first response is to apologize to everyone on the list for my knowing only one language. I studied German and French in college and graduate school, dated my conversational German instructor from Vienna, and had to pass tests on Scientific German and French to receive my doctorate. Not having had any occasion at all to practice my limited competencies in these marvelous languages, over the many years since this early exposure, my vocabularies have diminished to nearly nothing. I marvel at the people I have met in Europe who converse freely in several languages, and envy the many benefits this provides them. I found Ross McCluney's comments on language dominance excellent. It is a fact of life that from time to time some language will dominate the "civilized" (whatever this is supposed to mean) world. Greek, Latin, Portuguese, French, English... It seems to have something to do with economical and military power. I believe there will be a time when the number of languages spoken by minorities will either become stable or even increase. At the same time, for any given era, there will be a dominant language. Today it is English but I wouldn't bet it will still be English within, say, 100 years. (After thinking again about what I've just said... yes, I could bet but it would be useless: I'll not be here to collect my money :-) There are a number of languages that have survived heavy artillery from dominant powers. Let me mention the Basque language as a prototype of this ability to survive even when surrounded by much stronger powers and languages spoken by a much greater number of people. I hope I am right. This will enable Portuguese to survive and be spoken by my daughter, grand son, even though Portuguese has no way to expand its presence. - fernando - fernando I'm very much against the homogenization of varied cultures, and languages, around the world, as commerce becomes ever more global in nature. Too little effort is being expended to save and protect the rich cultures and varied ways of living around the world, which seem to be in the path of the steam-roller of globalization. The situation is not unlike the terrible atrocities to the aboriginal natives of my own country, the first true Americans, who have suffered terrible genocide and ecocide at the hands of my government and the commerce which continues to drive much government action against these people. However, I have had to accept the cold hard reality that English-speaking whites, myself and my ancestors included, have overtaken and dominated the continent, as a fait accompli, and all my crying and apologies will not change what has already happened. (There may be a sort of poetic justice addendum to this story. Hispanic immigration proceeds apace in the U.S., due to very liberal immigration laws, and spanish is becoming the language of choice in many regions of the country, even some small towns in the south. There's a real possibility that English will become a minority language in the U.S. and it probably already is one for all of North America.) I fear that this is not unlike the paradox faced by the other English-speaking contributors to this list. We are sorry that our language has become the standard language of international discourse---not by design but by default. Short of choosing the language of the competition by lot, or cancelling the competition altogether, I suggest that we simply accept that English is the accepted language of the list and let that be the language of the competition, of necessity but with regret. If there is but one list contributor who objects to this, I'll change my recommendation to this. Let's continue the limericks, in any language of choice, but to drop the judging of a winner and awarding of a prize, declaring that all contributors are winners and putting them all together in a special document on a selected web site following a cut-off date, such as 1 November of this year. That way the complete list of contributions can be downloaded and read by anyone. (What about the prize? Well, it could be awarded to me for the excellence of my recommendations!!! More appropriately, perhaps it could go to the originator and maintainer of the list, whoever that is, as a thank you for a job well done.) Ross McCluney -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=
Sundials and books in Londons
Hello I only joined this list recently. For more than 30 year I've been nursing a dream of building a sundial for my garden. A couple of months ago I decided it was time to take it more seriously. On a business trip I'll spend next SUNday in London. I wonder if some of you living on the region could point me some interesting SUNdials in Lodon (downtown and neighborhoods). Also, I'd like to visit some bookstore, browse and buy some more books. Any help appreciated. Thank you. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf (TEXT/ttxt) (7FBB)
Re: Question
George L. McDowell, Jr. wrote: In Druid Hill Park in Baltimore, Maryland there is a compendium dial which bears the inscription "SINE UMBRA NIHIL." My Latin is not good enough to confirm what I suspect is a double entendre. Could this inscription mean, without torturing the language, both "without shadow there is nothing," and "nothing is without shadow?" Or is there a third possible meaning? Thanks. My Latin is certainly much worse than yours so my support to your opinion is basically worthless... but yes, I can read both meaning but I can't see a third one. But if we translate it into Portuguese we can certainly have a third meaning that, of course, has nothing to do with the original, it is just a curiosity: These are the two (possible) translation into Portuguese: nada [é] sem sombra sem sombra [é] nada But "nada sem sombra" also means "swims without a shadow". I don't think this is fun or interesting, just a "third" meaning I found when translating into Portuguese. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf 1 (TEXT/ttxt) (813F)
Re: Question
George L. McDowell, Jr. wrote: > We use the term "mean" to describe the time shown > by man-made chronometers. I suggest that this is > an incorrect use of the English word (and an > incorrect use of words in other languages which > have the same meaning as 'mean' has in English). > I think the proper word is "average." I say this > because I think that the average time it takes the > earth to rotate each day beneath the sun from one > point in its orbit to the same point approximately > a year later is 24 hours, and that the mean of the > times it takes the earth to so rotate is not > relevant to a determination of the length of a > day. Is my thinking correct or incorrect? Thanks. My opinion as to difference between "mean" and "average" is irrelevant because I am nota native speaker and certain subtilities may very well escape my blunt understanding of the language. As far as Portuguese is concerned, I think we would use "média" (from Latin "medium"/"media" English "mean") for both terms. The caliber of the students . . . has gone from mediocre to above average == "o calibre dos estudantes... passou de medíocre para acima da *média*" "Greenwich mean time" -- "hora *média* de Greenwich" I don't think in English both terms can be used interchangeably in general, but it seems to me that when they refer to operations similar or analog to adding numbers together and than divinding the result both terms mean (no pun intended) the same thing. Like in "the average value of a set of number", or "the mean value of a set of number", On the other hand, in Portuguese it doesn't seem we have this kind of problem. We have a single word both for "average" and "mean". Gostaria de ouvir a opinião de meus colegas portugueses e brasileiros (ou outros que falem português). Temos outra palavra para traduzir "average" e "mean" no contexto dado? Claro, temos coisas como "proporção", "regular", "rateio" que podem eventualmente ser usados (um aluno "regular" por um aluno "médio", etc.), mas penso que não vem ao caso. Abraços - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf 2 (TEXT/ttxt) (8140)
Re: Verse Thoughts
Paul Murphy wrote: > IMHO, the verse should be original. > > Like other members of the list I have a goodish collection of mottoes in > various languages, and it would be easy to submit them, even if tedious to > type them up. True enough. Nevertheless, I think before pointing our fingers to anyone, we should considerthe likelyhood of someone creating a motto that had been created before. If you ask hundreds of people with a common interest, to write a single sentence about a narrow theme like "shadow", it seems unavoidable some coincidences. > As to the method of picking a winner, I think this should be in the hands > of a wordsmith, perhaps a poet, not necessarily a dialler but one who can > appreciate a motto for its 'artistic' merit and purpose. Although I see virtue in the intention of proposing a wordsmith to judge the mottoes,I think a dialler is better because diallers will be more prepared to evaluate how well the motto relates to dialling while a wordsmith may just appreciate the "artistic" merit regardless of its affinity with dialling - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf 3 (TEXT/ttxt) (8141)
Re: on strike
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Mac, I'll give it a try based on my high school Spanish. Anyone > else, Jorge included, is welcome to correct me :-) > > "An expression that gives the average obliquity of the ecliptic is: > 23d 26' 21.45'' - 46.815'' *T - 0.0006'' *T^2 + 0.00181*T^3 > where T is the number os Julian seconds after the epoch 2000 Jan 1.5 Julian centuries > (Julian day 2,451,545.0)" > Regards, > Mike Blackwell > > - CONTEXT BELOW - > [ Jorge Ramalho < ">[EMAIL PROTECTED]> originally wrote: > > Achim, > > A expressao que dah o valor medio da obliquidade da ecliptica eh > 23d 26' 21.45'' - 46.815'' *T - 0.0006'' *T^2 + 0.00181*T^3 > > T eh o numero de seculos Julianos para ou desde a epoca 2000 Jan 1.5 > (Dia Juliano 2 451 545.0) > > [ To which Mac Oglesby < ">[EMAIL PROTECTED]> replied: > > Dear Jorge, > It would be a kindness to me, and perhaps to some others on this List, > if > you would either return to posting in English, or offer a translation > into > English. > Thank you very much. > > > [ Jorge responded: > > This is a parenthesis on my strike until that anglo-saxonian > dialect poetry contest of yours chooses a winner. > > Mac: If you feel I am a black sheep on the flock just tell me. > I can anytime send those magic words to Majordomo. -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf (TEXT/ttxt) (86D9)
Re: pergunta quatro
Mac Oglesby wrote: > Dear Jorge, > > It would be a kindness to me, and perhaps to some others on this List, if > you would either return to posting in English, or offer a translation into > English. Mac The last thing I want is to be in the middle of a language war. I'll let share with you how I see it. Perhaps that would help you feel better. We all know that there are several thousands languages in use today. From those only a few have a significant number os native speakers.I think Mandarin is the most important (numberwise), followed by English, Spanish, Russian, Portuguese, French (no precision intended, and this list is not in any particular order) Theoretically, if you want to be understood by the largest number of people, Mandarin and English are good choices. Nevertheless, most of us think that the natural way to communicate more universally is resorting to English. Since the Internet is a "universal" asset, it seems more than natural that English be used as its lingua franca. So be it. On the other hand, there are moments when people do not want -- and do not expect -- to be understood by everybody. In these moments, instead of using English they may prefer to use a less know language. Myself, I take this at its facial value. When I encounter a message whose meaning I can not decipher because I don't know its code, I just take it as if the author: a) Did not want to share it with a larger number of people b) Could not translate it (either because it was difficult or he lacked the skill to do it) c) It only interests a small number of people that share a common language Whatever the reason, I have three choices: a) skip it b) try to understand it using dictionaries and grammars c) ask someone to translate it Most of the time I opt for a), accepting that the author -- whatever his reasons -- did not consider it appropriate, or necessary or convenient to use a more "universal" language. I accept that, it does not disturb me and I don't have the feeling that I am missing something. Again I don't think this is a war, and if it is, I don't think it is worth to be fighting it. - fernando > > > Thank you very much. > > Mac > > You wrote: > > > >Achim, > > > >A expressao que dah o valor medio da obliquidade da ecliptica eh > > 23d 26' 21.45'' - 46.815'' *T - 0.0006'' *T^2 + 0.00181*T^3 > > > >T eh o numero de seculos Julianos para ou desde a epoca 2000 Jan 1.5 > >(Dia Juliano 2 451 545.0) > > > >jorge -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Fernando Cabral Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Attachment converted: MAC Hard Disk:vcard.vcf (TEXT/ttxt) (86EE)
Re: pergunta quatro
Dave Bell wrote: > On Fri, 28 Aug 1998, Tony Moss wrote: > > > Dear Friends in Sundialing! > > > > As a young teacher, many years ago, I always gave my class an alternative > > activity when they became restless or unruly. Here is a distraction you > > may wish to pursue. > > > > "When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl." > > > > There was a time when I would have innocently suggested a prize for the > > first correct solution! > > > > tony moss > > Good thought, Tony... And here I am, with a mail reader that doesn't > do ROT13, and I can no longer sight-read it! It seems that the United States believe what Tony says about the outlaws and privacy. So muchso it has banned the cryptography export. Among other ridiculous things, for the American Government cryptography is war ammunition! Ohl, - sreanapb > > > Dave -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
Re: patent on a sundial
John wrote: > If I had a dollar for everybody who told me I'd never make any money on my > sundial design I'd probably have more money than I'll ever make on my > sundial... yet I persevere. I don't know about the rest of the world (do > the shepherd's really still use cylinder dials?) but here in the USA > gnomonics is not exactly a mainstream activity. > Based on what I know about previous success and failures stories, it can be terribly good or terribly bad to have people saying you'll not make any money on your ideas. It indicates one of two things: a) the idea is so good nobody understand it; so new people don't see a place for it; so brilliant it obfuscates whoever looks into it. If this is case you are prone to make a lot of money b) the idea is really worth nothing except for your own heart. Problem is: who can tell you for sure? Too many inventions have been considered worthless in spite of what, they have made people rich. If I had a single good idea I would persevere, no matter what others could tell me. You will only know if it worthwhile after you have tried. Sadly enough, even a good idea may not flower. For some the award comes too late. Mr. Harrison had a very good idea when he built his clocks, watchs and chronographs. Nevertheless, it took him 40 years of hard working to get some pay back. If I were you, if I had any idea I could deem good I would try to sell it. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
My trip to UK
sed did not have anything about sundials. I visited the seven dials -- that same night. I found the sevenths dial (there are only six on the center of the square). The sevenths is on a wall oposed the Earlham Street. It is an electrical time piece. I worked hard the next two days. Wednesday I woke up very early, took the tube and went to Foyles. I waited until they opened at 9 o'clock. I found a single book. No one to help me. Not even their computer, although I had a list of titles I printed from their Internet site! Then I understoo what Andrew meant when he said "I think [Foyles is] the largest 'new book' shop in London though not always very helpful". Right on the target, Andrew! Dover opened at 10 and a little past 10 I was there. I found two books only. Precisely two of the fours I have. I gave a last look to the seven dials, still under rain and took the subway to the airport. Having visited the Old Observatory was great. Visiting London was fun. Now I have a map with more than a dozen spots where sundials can be found in Soho, Holborn, Covent Garden, Wetminster, etc. Next time I'll see them all, even if under the rain. As we say here in Brazil: "I am not made of sugar [so I will not dissolve away under the rain]". Again, I want to thank all of you that pointed me several places to go. I'll not blame you for the rain :-) - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
drawing Solstice/Equinox lines
Hello sundiallers I am calculating my first real sundial. I am more nervous than a father expecting to see his first newborn. Latitude is 15 45' 44.4" S, Longitude is 47 49' 40.1" W It is a horizontal sundial. Its dial plate (is it better to say dial plate or dial table, or whatever?) has a diameter of 3000mm. The angles I've calculated, starting from the noon line are (using Angle = atan (sen LATITUDE * tan HourAngle)): 2,0484,163 6,4198,913 11,774 15,197 19,494 25,196 33,256 45,39264,142 90 (Americans, please replace the comma with a dot). I've checked this at least 5 times so I don't expect any troubles here (unless I've been using wrong formulae). Than I designed a gnomon with an angle of LATITUDE (15,762), pointing South, with a lenght of 1388 mm. I chose this lenght because I expect its shadow to be 1500 mm long in our winter Solstice for our hemisphere (June 21). According to my calculations, in the Summer Solstice the shadow lenght will be 1284,576 mm and when the Sun is crossing the Zenith here in Brasilia shadown lenght will be 1335,808 mm. First question is: do these figures look OK? Second question is: if I want to include a line marking some special date such as a birthday how do I calculate the parabola the tip of the shadown will describe in that particular day? Sorry for this long message with so many novice questions. And thank you for your attention. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
Re: alto e p�ra o baile!
Jorge Ramalho wrote: Fernando, Não resisto Se voce quer ter 1500 do PR à sombra do Solstício de Junhoo comprimento do Gnomon Polar tem de ser mesmo 1500/(1/tg15.762+tg(15.762+23.44))/sen15.762 = 1 266.9 Caro Jorge Devido ao erro que você encontrou nos meus cálculos, decidi refazer tudo de zero (isto é, a parte do gnomon). Como eu não tinha guardado a memória de cálculo, não sei onde errei originalmente. Desta vez não apenas fui mantendo a memória como, no final, fiz uma verificação geral, isto é, supus conhecida uma linha e dois ângulos e calculei todos os demais. Assim, tanto quanto me lembro, o valor é mesmo 1 266,9 Já vi que você é igual a mim: quando um problema perturba, perturba mesmo! Felizmente na sexta-feira eu fui a Belo Horizonte. O vôo tem uma hora de duração, portanto tive tempo de refazer tudo. Uma hora (quase) sem interrupções é tudo que podemos pedir quando temos cálculos a fazer. Isto me tirou da agonia em que encontrava! Obrigado - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
Pointers to magnetic declination
Hello A few days ago someone gave me the URL of a place where I could calculate magnetic declination for any spot in the world. I used it. Now I need it again but can't find the original message. Can someone help me? - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082
Declination by calculation?
Hello fellows in sundialling I've already ordered some books, including "Astronomy With Your Personal Computer" (Peter J. Duffett-Smith), "Practical Astronomy With Your Calculator", ( Peter J. Duffett-Smith) "Astronomical Formulae for Calculators" (Jean H. Meeus) so I expect to be able to ask question of higher significance in the future. Meanwhile, please bear with my novice questions. Is there a formula to calculate the sun declination based on the date and perhaps the local time? The idea here, of course, is getting rid of any tables. Thank you - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433Fax: +55 61 225-3082 Birthplace: 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W Home: 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W
Beginner's session: sunrise and sunset time with a calculator?
Hello Concerning my previous question about "declination by calculation" I received several useful answers. They all lead to the same formula. Since different people took different approach a had a very good opportunity to learn a lot. Some just gave me a formula (which was what I expected at first); some offered more background information (which was great). I think I have thanked everyone that helped me in a private message. Here I say "thank you" again for each one of you that helped me. And now one more question from a inquiring neophyte: What is the formula to calculate sunrise and sunset times given latitude, longitude and declination (or perhaps the date)? Thank you. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W
Chronicle on sundialling
un would be seen between the congress towers). That's when I found that on October 6, at 7:19 o'clock the sun's Azimuth would be due East. I had an opportunity to check the line I had drawn last Sunday. Than you can imagine my exultation when at the expected time the sun was in the right spot, the shadow was where I expect it to be and the angle between the N-S line I had drawn and the E-W line I was about to draw had 90 degrees. The purest amazement! That's what I wanted to share with you: no scientific breakthrough, no groundbreaking technology, no findings at all, just the innocent elatedness of a 47 years old child! Oh, yes, the sun can be seen between the towers for several minutes a few days before and after the summer (Southern) solstice, never in April 21. But what is reality, what is the meaning of hard facts? Facts can be forgotten or changed to fit any theory, isn't that right? - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W
Re: Chronicle on sundialling
Chris Lusby Taylor wrote: > Dear Fernando, > Thank you for your wonderful, heart-warming story. I know exactly how you > feel. Thank you. > I am puzzled by only one thing: Why was the sun rising above a house SOUTH > of yours? Shouldn't that be EAST? > Sorry for not being clear enough. My lot is not in a perfect East-West Direction. In this seasonthe sun rises further to the South which means in the first hours of the day its light is blocked by a house that is next to mine, in the South direction (in fact, more Southeast). See the most crude diagram bellow. N ++ W || | sdMH| ++ |NH | || ++s S sd is the place where I am drawing the compass rose with cardinal lines; MH is my house and NH is my neighbor's house. s is the sun. Things are so disposed that after a certain date (some time in September), if I am in my backyard (particularly at sd) I'll see the sun rising from behind his house. > Your English is excellent. May I point out just one slight mistake which I > believe you made. You refer to a "vertical inclining dial" where I think > you mean a declining dial. It is most unfortunate that we use the word > 'declination' to mean two unrelated things - the orientation of a vertical > dial and the distance between the equator and a heavenly body such as the > sun. The quite unrelated meanings of 'analemma' and 'analemmatic' could > cause similar problems. You are absolutely right. I meant to say "declining". I noticed I had madethat mistake when I arrived home and started doing some calculation for the other sides of the square column. When I opened Albert E. Waugh's "Sundials - Their Theory and Construction" on chapter 10 (Vertical Declining Dials) I detected my mistake... Too late. Thank you. - fernando > > > Best wishes > Chris Lusby Taylor > > -Original Message- > From: Fernando Cabral [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: 06 October 1998 18:23 > To: sundial@rrz.uni-koeln.de > Subject:Chronicle on sundialling > > Dear Fellows in sundialling > > Based on certain accidental discoveries I had made yesterday, I waked up > a > little earlier this morning and walked to my back yeard to prepare for > the > sun to rise above the ceiling of a house south to mine. > > > Now I was there, steping on a North-South line, facing the rising sun > whose Azimuth was... 90 degrees. > > -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W
Re: Chronicle on sundialling
Tony Moss wrote: > Fernando, > > Thank you for many quotable words on the very special pleasures > of sundialling. > > Your statement - > > > "...It has also given me the opportunity to do something quite useless but > very pleasurable." > > - brings to mind Prof. David Pye's distinction between 'useless' and > 'valueless' in creative design. What you experienced had no 'use' but > great 'value'. > That's a very important distinction I had never seen worded before. Thank you. - fernando -- mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W
Help! a novice is knocked down
Hello fellows in sundialling I assure you I strived a lot to avoid bringing this problem to you. I can not hide from you the fact that it humilates me. But I still think my ignorance chagrins me more than my failure. So, here I am, humbly asking you to help me one more time with something that should be a child's play... but is knocking me down. Perhaps because I am not a child? Following the instructions found on pages 78-85 of Albert E. Waugh's "Sundials - Their Theory and Construction" I built a N 20 W decliner. It is in place and working fine. Than I went to build the dials for the other faces. Alas! After two weeks of nightly work I am still mystified, completely bewildered with the results I gotten so far. Applying the recipé I found the following: (The algorithm is described pages 78-86.) Data: Phi = 15.7513 Wall: E 20 N The angles I found are: SD (sub-style distance) = -50.4886 (tan SD = sin D * cot Phi) SH (style height) = 64,7434 (sin SH = cos D + cos Phi) DL (difference in longitude) = -53,2830 (cot DL = cot D * sin Phi) AV (6o'clock angle ) = 84.4898 (cot AV = sin D * tan Phi) Converting DL into time units I have 3,5522 = 3 h 33 m 8 s Hour angles from sub-style position are as follows: 1113.76 297.42 380.85 464.55 548.88 634.00 719.80 86.07 Sub-style 97.50 1021.26 1135.52 1250.48 1366.23 1482.58 1599.14 16 115.44 17 131.11 18 145.99 19 160.19 20 173.92 21 187.50 22 201,26 23 215.52 24 230.00 I've calculated the hour for a full 24-hour dial just as a way to double check my calculation. Also, I've done all the number checking that the author recomends. They all indicate the results are good. Nevertheless, when I built the model and put it in place... it does not work. Can somehelp me before I lose my hair? Something must be wrong. But what? What? - fernando PS -- Both Abert Waugh and René R. J. Rohr say that in a vertical dial the 12 o'clock line is always vertical. Nevertheless, I've noticed this is not the case for a vertical direct west (or east) dial. Have I found a hint here? -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Help! a novice is knocked down
Chris Lusby Taylor wrote: > PS -- Both Abert Waugh and Rene R. J. Rohr say that in a vertical dial > the 12 o'clock line is always vertical. Nevertheless, I've noticed this > is not the case for a vertical direct west (or east) dial. Have I found > a hint here? > > [Chris Lusby Taylor] I think you are wrong. A vertical direct east or west > dial does not have a 12 o'clock line! At 12 o'clock the sun is in the plane > of the dial, so the shadow of the gnomon does not fall on the dial. > A very very nearly direct east or west dial does, in principle, have a 12 > o'clock line, and it is vertical, passing through the point where the > gnomon touches the dial. Unfortunately the gnomon is almost in the plane of > the dial, so it protrudes only a very small amount and it is not very > practical. This is why direct east and west declining dials are always made > with the gnomon held away from the dial. I feel so bad when I am caught saying things so negligently... You are completely right. Let me try to fix what said and meant. I wonder if I can still mend my reputation ;-) I am completely uncapable of mentally creating solids in the space. Of course, this spells big trouble when you thy to see with the eyes of your mind how the angles and shadows move as you, say, rotate a vertical plane to "see" the results. Alas, I cannot do that without resorting to some drawing and models. My thinking was: in a vertical direct east dial you have a gnomon that makes with the horizontal an angle equals to the latitude. The hour-lines are all paralell with the gnomon as well as to each other. The hour lines are put further apart as you go from 6 o'clock to a hyphothetical 12 o'clock line. Of course, I clearly understand both physically as well as mathmathically that this 12 o'clock line does not exist. Now I am approching the point I made my error. I can accept this, but I can not "see" it. Let me go a little further: At least theorethically, we can get as close to the 12 o'clock line as we like. Say, to 89 59' 59" or even closer. That hour-line, no matter how far from the gnomon, is still parallel to it. Let's also consider that our dial is set for a latitude of 60 degrees South. This means that the hour line for 12 o'clock minus "a very small delta" still makes an angle of 60 degrees with the horizontal. Let's say, just for the sake of argument, that now we twist our vertical plane just a very very small amount. Something very very close to 0. In this moment, that line jumps abruptly from its 60 degrees to 90 degrees with the vertical. That's the part I can not follow with my mind's eyes. Although I can still see that it probabily has to do with the tangent of the angle when when the angles varies from very close to 90 degrees to 90 degrees. By now I think I have fixed my original description, replacing 12 o'clock line by almost 12 o'clock line. Also, I certainly can understand the discontinuity of a function. I still can not make the dial work! - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Beginner's session: sunrise and sunset time with a calculator?
John Pickard wrote: > Fernando, > > A slightly facetious answer: > > Change the date and location to the desired day and place in your GPS, and > use the built-in sunrise / sunset calculator! I've used this more than once to solve practical problems. Nevertheless, it spoilsmy purpose of learning how to do things. It is probabily the same thing as using a good watch... instead of building a sundial. Thank you. - fernando > > > Yes, I know, it doesn't really help, but it certainly can check your answer. > Plus it is great when doing field work and trying to figure out how many > more sites I can sample before stopping to camp. > > Cheers, John > > Dr John Pickard > Senior Lecturer (Environmental Planning) > Graduate School of the Environment > Macquarie University NSW 2109 Australia > > Sabbatical leave July - December 1998. > You can't contact me by phone or fax as > I am on sabbatical leave in arid and semi-arid > Australia. Please contact me via email or > post material to the above address. It will > be forwarded regularly. -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
OK, a novice has recovered
Hello all To my surprise this time I heard more from the silence of others than from the advices. Chris Lusby gave me a very good and practical example on how to see what happens when I build a certain dial with a 20km-long gnomon. Nevertheless, I've had a small engineering problem in building it. Something easy to overcome, like several truckloads of dollars and a few years of hard work. Of course, these difficulties will not prevent me from builing it! No, mot me! ;-) Back to seriousness. I now think my mistake was quite simple (as it was to be expected). Basically it was a matter of how to measure and express the declination of a wall. I had understood -- I mean, misunderstood -- that a declination was to be measured for each wall against its meridian if facing North or South; or against its East-West line, if facing East or West. In summary, I was calculating a sundial for a declination of, say, 20 when it was in fact 70 or 110. Once I fixed that and measured the angles of declination against the meridian for every face things started making sense and I got three more handsomely consistent dials. At least on the paper (since I am travelling I have not had the opportunity to check them with a working model). And I even know where my misunderstanding came from. Albert Waugh's notation for a declining sundial is "we would say this wall declines S 24 E, which means that it faces somewhat toward the south, but has been twisted around toward the east through an angle of 24" And he goes on to refer to "N 24 W", S 24 E" and other declination. >From that I inferred (wrongly) that, say a "E 20 N" was plausible. So I was using a declination of 20 when in fact I should be using 70. It would never work, would it? When I say this is Waugh's notation I also presume it is a common notation but since I don't have many books about sundialling I don't know if other authors follow the same convention. I must presume I "invented" the "E 20 N" and "W 20 S" dial and fell in my all trap! I was so mislead by my understanding of how declination was to be measure and used, that when Fer J. de Vries corrected me saying > Do yoy mean a vertcal dial facing north east? Dial N 20 E ? > You wrote E 20 N . > For a vertical dial N 20 E : > the inclination of the plane is 90 degrees and the declination -160 > degrees. I could not understand what he was saying! If he had used less tact with me, perhaps saying "there isn't such a thing as "E 20 N", I could have learned more quickly. Anyway, I think he is too educated to say it. Before finishing this message that is already too long, let me add one more fact that helped to keep me mystified for much longer that it should: the first task I faced was to calculate the N 20 E dial. It worked wonderfully in the first try. When I was in trouble with the other faces I recalcuted it several times and it always worked. I also drew it using the graphical method and it worked the same way. That gave me confidence to apply the formulae the way I was using them. Unfortunately it also made me believe I was calculating the declination in a proper manner. Alas, after all I am a human being. Not only that. As evidence shows, a dumb one! Thank you guys from trying to help me with your silence. I am sure most of you that did not try to help me were just avoiding to embarass me. Some how it worked as a maieutical teaching. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Help! a novice is knocked down
Dear Fer I was quite dumb when I did not try to grasp the real meaning behind your question > Fernando, > > Do yoy mean a vertcal dial facing north east? Dial N 20 E ? > You wrote E 20 N . I contained the answer I was looking for but I still couldn't see it. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
: Help! a novice is knocked down
Jorge Ramalho wrote: > Fernando, > > Try a Decl of 20+180=200 > or 20-180= - 160 Cheguei de viagem ontem à noite e comecei meus testes hoje pela manhã. Está meio chuvoso e o sol arredio, nas primeiras horas o modelo funcionou bem. Amanhã, sábado, terei oportunidade de verificar direitinho, desde o nascer do sol até pouco mais de meio dia. Estou esperançoso. Relendo as instruções vi que de duas interpretações possíveis, eu havia dado a menos apropriada. Agora parece queestou de novo no caminho certo. Obrigado. > To know the coordinates of the place where the needed Horizontal is > you can 'walk' 10 000km (1/4 of Earth perimeter) towards the direction > your Vertical is facing to and then ask someone where you are (use gestual > language). > I was thinking in using navy flags instead. What do you think? I could also usesmoke language, but since the Brazilian indians never used smoke signals, I'll have to do some training in the US first. Too expensive, I guess. > As an alternate method you can solve the sph triangle North Pole, Your > Vertical > and the Horizontal. I prefer that "step back" method. It seems walking 10 000 km is easier than solving the sph triangle. Um abraço - fernando
4 decliners and one horizontal built
hello sundiallers This is to let you know that after a trip that kept me away from home for more than one week, followed by an almost continous rain, I was finally able to test 3 of my decliners plus an horizontal one on the top of the column. Yes, they are working fine. Now I have to decide how to build the final dials that will replace the models. I thought you would like to know I've succeded. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Electric Astrolab
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > If you have not visited this page, or downloaded this software DO SO NOW!!! > This is a FANTASTIC program!!! I can not say enough about it!!! I beg to disagree. This is a very dangerous program. First of all, it is quite addictive. Secondly, it puts your job at risk. Third, it may force you to spend several years trying to understand the mechanics of ourGalaxy. Finally, it is too good. I downloaded it yesterday morning. Since that time I couldn't stop using it even thou I had very important and even urgent things to do. I had to read the documentation during lunch time and some of it I had to devour at night, which means I lost one or two hours of good sleep. Until yesterday I could summarize my whole knowledge about the firmament in half an A-4 page. At the same time, I could describe my ignorance about the same subject in one or two pages. After seeing and tasting the Electric Astrolabe and reading the documentation I need only one sentence to describe what I know. Not even one sentence. One word is enough. Nothing. On the other hand, I now need several pages to describe my ignorance. Now my real problem is: if I am to take advantage of all the wonderful functionalities and nicities the Electric Astrolabe offers, I'll have to learn a lot more. Also, I'll have to find some more time to put it to good use. That's why I say this to anyone that has not downloaded the program yet: CAVEAT EMPTOR - the Electric Astrolab is addictive. Once you start using it you can not stop. It can also offer you fun enough for the any number of hours or days you chose. It installs very easily and runs very well. - fernando > As a programer myself I know the tedium of writting and Jim has done this in > Assembly language (A very fast running and demanding language). > His user documents are in .DOC format and he states on his page that you can > get a viewer to view/print these docs if you don't have MS-Word. > > His page is at: > > http://myhouse.com/mc/planet/astrodir/electric.htm > > A good location for the .DOC viewer is at: > > http://officeupdate.microsoft.com/index.htm > > If your like me (Win 3.x, old word proc.) the file to download is: > > wdvw9716.exe > > Super Job!! > > P.R. Field I/O Asso. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://www2.netcom.com/~abraxas2/suntile.htm -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: learn something new every day
Log in ID is QED. This software is not > "North-American-centric." > > Here's the information on how to run the on-line program: > > GEOMAG provides values of the elements and parameters of the Earth's magnetic > field. The values are estimates based on mathematical models. Values of the > following elements and their rates of change are available: > > D - Declination (also called compass variation; east declination is > considered positive, west declination negative) > I - Inclination (also called dip; downward inclination is considered > positive, upward inclination negative) > H - Horizontal intensity > X - North component > Y - East component > Z - Vertical intensity (considered positive downward, negative upward) > F - Total intensity > > Positions of the Magnetic Poles and parameters of the centered and eccentric > geomagnetic dipoles are also available. > > You will be prompted to select a field model and to enter the date and > geographic coordinates (latitude, longitude, and elevation) of locations of > interest. If you are unsure of how to respond to any prompt, enter a question > mark (?) to get help. If you would like the program to back up to the > previous prompt, enter a caret (^) (that is, the SHIFTed-6 key, not the > UP-ARROW key). If a default response (shown in brackets) is available and is > suitable, you may select it simply by pressing RETURN. To quit the program, > press CTRL-Z (hold down the Control key and press Z). > > (Reminder: Enter for help, <^> to back up, to quit.) > > Options: > 1 = Field Values (D, I, H, X, Y, Z, F) > 2 = Magnetic Pole Positions > 3 = Dipole Axis and Magnitude > 4 = Magnetic Center > > -- Richard Langley >Professor of Geodesy and Precision Navigation > > > == > = > Richard B. Langley Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Geodetic Research Laboratory BITnet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Dept. of Geodesy and Geomatics Engineering Phone:(506) 453-5142 > > University of New BrunswickFAX: (506) 453-4943 > > Fredericton, N.B., Canada E3B 5A3 Telex:014-46202 > > Fredericton? Where's that? See: http://www.city.fredericton.nb.ca/ > == > = > > >On Fri, 7 Nov 1997, k.schwarzinger wrote: >> Dear all, >> >> is there in the INTERNET a website, which gives informations >> about the curent value from the declination of the magentic >> North Pole ? >> >> Are there still informations about the situation of the magnetic >> North Pole ( INTERNET or literature ) ? >> >> Thanks for any help. >> >> Regards >> Karl. >http://www.geolab.nrcan.gc.ca/geomag/e_cgrf.html >=== > Richard B. Langley Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Geodetic Research Laboratory BITnet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Dept. of Geodesy and Geomatics Engineering Phone:(506) 453-5142 > University of New BrunswickFAX: (506) 453-4943 -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Halos
Les Cowley wrote: > > When cirrus clouds weaken sundial shadows it is well worth looking > sunward. Atmospheric halos, formed by refraction > and reflection of light through cloud ice crystals, are surprisingly > frequent. They are beautiful and tell us a great deal about > cloud crystals. The familiar circular halo around the sun or > moon is an example - the rarer forms that often span the sky > are well worth looking for. In Brazil old farmers will always tell you that when there is a halo close to the moon, that means it will not rain any time soon; when the halo is far from the moon, that means it is about to rain. I've never had the time or opportunity to check this popular belief. I wonder if there is some similar believes in other countries. - fernando > We have a new Windows program that simulates halos. It can be > freely downloaded from > http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/lc/halo/halosim.htm > The site describes halos, has photographs and example > simulations. There's a puzzle for the halonically challenged. > > Les Cowley > Michael Schroeder
Style angle on declining sundials
René R. J. Rohr, in his "Sundials - History, Theory, and Practice", page 55 says about how to place the style in a declining dial: "The principle is simple. The style lies in the plane of the meridian and its axis makes with the vertical of noon an angle equal to the complement of the latitude". In the four decliners I built ballpark measures (I didn't have the instruments to take a proper measure) indicate he is right about the plane of the meridian. As to the the angle its axis makes with the vertical, it does not match what I've found. Am I wrong again? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Foster-Lambert
Looking for Foster-Lambert in the Internet I found a single article written by Yvon Masse. It is easier for me to read in English than in French. Does anybody there know if the article has been translated? Perhaps there are other articles in English. Thank you - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: list?
Dave Bell wrote: > > Good thought on the Solstice! Maybe now is the time to consider a Solstice > Sunrise marker, to celebrate the new year. I'll build one in my backyard. If I have the time, that is... - fernando
Re: E,W,S,N ?
Fox Moon wrote: > > > one responded with the conclusion that since the coordinates are E,W,S,N > it must have been made in an English-speaking country. I am embarrassed > to say this never occurred to me and now seems so obvious -- but, does In Brazil it is still customary do use "W" for "Oeste". This is so because the Oeste (West) came from anglo-saxon West via French Ouest but the abbreviation came directly from the compasses. The same is true about East. In Portuguese you can use both L and E. E comes from "Este" which comes from East. L comes from Leste that comes from French "L'est". The same is true about South (Sul) and North (Norte). So, even today, compasses and sundials designed in Brazil could still have the indications "E/W/S/N". The further we go back in time the more likely to find these letters. As most of you probabily know, Brasilia looks like an airplane (the designer saw it first as a cross and than as a bow and arrow -- but who can fight against modernity?). Blocks are named according to a very simple code: 1 to 16 South and 1 to 16 North or 100/900 West, 200/800 East. So if the firt digit is odd, it is West; it it is even, it is East. So, 115 North is Northeast while 205 South is Southeast. The streets are named accordingly. And here is the point: West is still "W" although East is "L". Don't ask me why. So, streets the run in the North/South direction and lie to East of the main "axis" are named L1, L2...L5... and those that lie to the West of the same axis are named W1, W2... W3... This long dissertation to show how "W" is still used in Brazil in place of "O". I also have facsimiles of some Portuguese and Spanish maps drawn in the 1600's. As far as I can remember (I don't have them here with me) the wind roses are marked with W/E/N/S. I would guess the Spaniards and Portuguese used W/E/N/S for many centuries. The French and Italians too? - fernando PS - I wrote this long message with a bunch of useless information in the hope that some people that are missing messages in this list will have something to chew until something more useful shows up.
Re: list?
Dave Bell wrote: > On Sun, 13 Dec 1998, Fernando Cabral wrote: > > > Dave Bell wrote: > > > > > > Good thought on the Solstice! Maybe now is the time to consider a Solstice > > > Sunrise marker, to celebrate the new year. > > > > I'll build one in my backyard. If I have the time, that is... > > > > - fernando > > Except it's a Summer Solstice marker for you, isn't it? Sure. We automatically "translate" back and forth when we talk about winter and summer, don't we? That is, if the conversation is between people who live South or North of the Equator. Not only that. When your prepare yourselves for hybernation, down here the ladies get the smallest garments from their wardrobes and go tanning under the unmerciful sun that shines just above the Tropic of Capricorn. That is, just above Rio de Janeiro. If you see them by millions walking to and fro the beaches, than you know it is summer Solstice. Alas, in Brasilia we don't have any beaches so it is much harder to know when the Summer Solstice is coming! :-) - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Wood for dials
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hi everyone, > >I use a wood product for my vertical declining dial called MEDEX board > which is used by sign makers. It is an engineered wood panel made from a > blend of wood fibers. It can be carved, sandblasted or painted. It must be > protected with some type of coating or paint to hold up in the weather. I > have some painted dials more than five years outside, and are still very sound > so far. There are other companies that make this type of product. > My two cents: I think someone would like to use wood for two reasons: a) because it is easy to find and easy to work with; b) some wood may be quite attractive because of its collor, grain, etc. Since I am not an artist in any sense and since I am a very poorly-qualified dialist, very slow in undertanding and completely uncapable building any shape in the space using the imaginantion only, I very often use wood to build sundials, so I can visualize it. Since my only purpose is to have something to see and touch, a model to work with, I usually choose the cheapest and softest wood I can find. Although they may last a lot if kept indoors, it does not really matter so I can give to some kid to play with. If this is the purpose, wood fits the need. On the other hand, if wood is being used due to its attractiveness than there is no point in painting it. But if it is not under a heavy coat of something, it will not last much long if kept in the whether. A very good, very hard Brazilian wood could last perhaps 15 years under the inclemency of a tropical whether (depending on the thickness, how and when it was cut, the part of the trunk it was cut from...) A more common wood, or any timber improperly cut or handled will last much less, perhaps even less than a single summer. In my opinion, it does not make sense to build sundials with this kind of stuff. Goods sundials should last forever. Or at least a few hundred years. No wood can deliver this under normal usage (outdoors comes sun, comes rain). Finally, if the wood is to be disguised as any other thing, then why to use wood, to begin with? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Ruby's flames
Hello friends in sundialling In the last few hours I've revived what solidarity looks like: a bunch of people telling you that you don't speak the best English around; you are not the king of the hill; you make a lot of mistakes; you don't even understand what sundialling is... but, no matter what you do, say or write "we can still find something useful sprouting of you." I feel good after receiving more than 20 private messages and several public messages supporting me in this "Professor Ruby" issue. Most of all, after reading the message the same "persona" sent to Roger Bailey I understood it had nothing to do with me. The guy (or girl) is in deep trouble from an emotional point of view. I did not try to identify his/her gender but since he signed "Professor" (a masculine word both in Portuguese and Spanish) and identified himself as a "Columbian", I thought he might be a man. After reading the messages again I drew the conclusion it is really a "she", be it a real she or a fictional she. After reading the message she sent to Roger, I could spot the same mannerisms I found in the message she sent to me. She said to Roger: > Have you noticed lately that people around you >seem to be snickering behind your back? For God's sakes man, wake up! >They are laughing AT YOU! and she said to me: > they claim that they at least enjoy laughing at your feeble > attempts at the English language. I do not think that it is funny, as > they are in reality laughing AT YOU PERSONALLY The words "laughing AT YOU" are precisely the same in both messages. Then she says to Roger: > It is only as a friend that I pen these harsh > criticisms. I hate to see an otherwise good man drown in the mire of his > own stupidity. To me she says about the same thing: > In an altruistic moment when I was feeling sorry for you, I decided > to pen a few lines reflecting the collective thoughts of many who read > your biased opinions (in atrociously spelled English, I might add!) on > the sundial list. Many of us also belong to an invitation-only, private > list which allows us to function in a more vociferous mode. Her decision to "pen" something has a good story to tell. Any way, here it is the message sent to me by "Professor Ruby Bojorquez": > Hello Fernando. > > > In an altruistic moment when I was feeling sorry for you, I decided > to pen a few lines reflecting the collective thoughts of many who read > your biased opinions (in atrociously spelled English, I might add!) on > the sundial list. Many of us also belong to an invitation-only, private > list which allows us to function in a more vociferous mode. > On this private list, several prominent, well-established members > have iterated strong positions against your vituperative agenda. > However, they claim that they at least enjoy laughing at your feeble > attempts at the English language. I do not think that it is funny, as > they are in reality laughing AT YOU PERSONALLY. Being a fellow Hispanic, > (a native Columbian),I find it shameful that it is necessary to > experience this type of futullian shame at the expense of one ignorant > of the "silent laughter". Your infirm attempts at ingratiation with > members of the list only widens the chasm that separates you from the > majority of the group. In all fairness to you, you may perhaps be more > articulate in your native language. If so, I suggest that you confine > your communications to the same. I am myself a pentalinguist, but do not > make rash claims about my abilities in other tongues. Forgive an > oversimplified analogy, but as we say in Columbia, "Just because you > sqeak loudly doesn't mean that you can communicate with mice". >If I have shamed or embarrassed you, then consider it a humanitarian > attempt at halting you from further self-embarrassment in the future. > Believe it or not, I truly believe that you mean well; as I hope > that > you also believe about myself. Sadly however, your communicative skills > lack the required luster to impress your intellectual superiors. Almost > anyone can appear wise, if they keep their mouths shut. > > Professor Ruby Bojorquez, > D.L.S. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Looking for software source code
Dear Fellows Jean Meeus' "Astronomical Algorithms", in its appendix III refers to a "Companion diskette" and there is a order form to be used with snail mail. I wonder if someone knows an Internet address (web or e-mail) where I can order that floppy. Thank you - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Invention to tame moon monsters
Roger Bailey wrote: > Some really smart person could automate this. Mount the moon dial on a well > connected to the sea. The height of water in the well would vary with the > tides. This could be used to drive a mechanism to shift the dial to correct > for the lunar equation of time. Do I have an invention here? Rube Goldberg > probably beat me to the patent office. > > and 1000 km from tide water. plus about 1100 m above sea level! :-) - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Best angle to catch sun light - off topic
Hello I am affraid this is off-topic but still related to the sun and to the shadows. Solar power is not much used in Brazil but Brasília, where I live, is an exception. Here I have never seen or heard of a single house that does not have solar panels for water heating. We can have hot water (around 60 C all the year around) without spending a single cent with electric power. One thing I have noticed is that no one plans the roof in order to take advantage of the sun in an optimized way. They build their house and than the best place for the panel is found. Usually this just means deciding which side of the house is facing North. That where the panel is placed. Also, the angle the panel makes with the horizon is just an accident: whatever the inclination of the roof is. Now I am planning to build a house for a small farm I have. I've been thinking on how to take the best advantage of the solar power. This includes where to have a garder with a nice sundial and where to place the solar panels for water heating as well as (perhaps) electricity (at least in Brazil solar panels for electricity are very expensive). At 19 37' 57" S, it is clear that the panel should be facing North. But what is the best angle with the horizon. And, if I can have several panels, is there a practical to calculate the best angle of each so as I can guarantee the highest possible insolation level? Say, if I have three panels, is it best to place them side by side, with the same inclinatation and declination? Perhas if one is a inclined towards the East with a certain angle and the other to the West with a proper angle I can capture more light? I know this information can probabily be found in some book about photometry or perhaps archtecture/engineering. I couldn't find them... thank you - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Latin Inscription
Krzysztof Kotynia wrote: > > > > "Hora Fugit Rapide Letumq.invadit inermus" > > > > 'letumq.' may be an abbreviated word and the 'us' of 'inermus' is not too > > clear. > Tony, > > I am not sure, perhapse somebody has decrypted this inscription > but if not I would do. > Hora - hour > fugit - escapes, flights, runs,compare with ``fugitive'' > rapide - rapidly, quickly > letumq. = letumque = et letum (very popular abbreviation in Latin) > means ``and death'' > invadit - comes > inermus - literally means ``not armed'' but also ``unprepared.'' An so [More or less] literally from Latin into Portugues: Hora= hora fugit = fugir rapide = rápida letum = letal invadit = invadir inermus = inerme In spite of that, translation is not easy, is it? Again, and so... - fernando > > > Best regards > Krzysztof Kotynia -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: [Fwd: Best angle to catch sun light - off topic]
Ross McCluney wrote: > For those interested, my reply to Fernando Cabral about solar water > heating is attached, or can be seen below. One thing I forgot to say is > that when you have one collector facing East toward the morning sun, if > the panels are placed in series, the heat collected by the East panel > will be radiated out by the West panel facing away from the sun. If > they are in parallel, the same problem is experienced, but it is the > heat the "hot" panel has put in the tank which is radiated by the "cold" > panel. Ooops! This is a possibility I had not thought about. You are100% right (albeit for people living near the Equator the problem is much less acute than for people living in temperate zones, I guess). - fernando > The only way to avoid this problem would be to make a special > plumbing system which made the circulating water go through only the > East panel in the morning, shutting off flow through the West one, and > reversing this arrangement in the afternoon, a complex solution and the > reason all installations have all panels facing the same direction. > > An extreme version of this problem was tested (against our protest that > the test was not worth doing) by FSEC in the late 70s. It consisted of > a cylindrical hot water tank, painted black all around, and covered by a > cylindrical transparent glazing all the way around. We pointed out that > the sides of this tank in shade would be radiating while the sides in > sun would be collecting. The collector was tested for the inventor > anyway, and he was very disappointed with the poor results. > > Another solar collector tank, similar to the one described, was slightly > taperd at the top, and we called it the "suppository solar collector." > > Another one we tested was a fairly conventional flat plate collector in > an insulated box and the inventor had a good idea of putting folded > transparent plastic in the space between the glass and the blackened > metal fin and tube absorbing plate. Solar water heating collectors have > to be tested both in simulated actual opertion, with water in them, and > empty, dry. The latter test is to make sure they won't have any > problems when sitting in the sun, on the roof or ground below, while the > plumbing and wiring are being done. This collector failed the dry, > "stagnation," test when the plastic inside melted, ran through some > cracks in the case, and pooled on the ground below. > > Ross McCluney, Cocoa, FL > > > > > Subject: Re: Best angle to catch sun light - off topic > Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 10:00:38 -0500 > From: Ross McCluney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Organization: Florida Solar Energy Center > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > References: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Fernando Cabral wrote: > > > One thing I have noticed is that no one plans the roof in order to take > > advantage of the sun in an optimized way. They build their house and > > than the best place for the panel is found. Usually this just means > > deciding > > which side of the house is facing North. That where the panel is placed. > > > > Also, the angle the panel makes with the horizon is just an accident: > > whatever > > the inclination of the roof is. > > > > Now I am planning to build a house for a small farm I have. I've been > > thinking > > on how to take the best advantage of the solar power. This includes > > where > > to have a garder with a nice sundial and where to place the solar panels > > for water heating as well as (perhaps) electricity (at least in Brazil > > solar panels for electricity are very expensive). > > > > At 19 37' 57" S, it is clear that the panel should be facing North. > > But what is the best angle with the horizon. And, if I can have several > > panels, is there a practical to calculate the best angle of each > > so as I can guarantee the highest possible insolation level? > > > > Say, if I have three panels, is it best to place them side by side, with > > > > the same inclinatation and declination? Perhas if one is a inclined > > towards > > the East with a certain angle and the other to the West with a proper > > angle I can capture more light? > > I suggest that you visit our web site and explore the available options for > getting information from our documents section. Most of our publications > are free. Though oriented mainly for northern latitudes in the U.S., I > think you should be able to translate the recommendations to your loc
Re: Solar Panels
Jim Tallman wrote: > The three panels could also be angled from right to left to provide an > "array" effect so that one would be best in the morning, one for midday, > and one for afternoon. This has been ruled out because the panels that are not receiving lightwill work to dissipate energy... > manufacturer to find out for sure if this even matters. If the "straight" > system builds up enough energy during the midday hours to carry through to > the next day then the angling of the panels from right to left is not > necessary. That's right. Nevertheless, what I am searching for is how to get the highest possibble efficiency. Otherwise I'll follow tradition and get heat enough for everything I need. Tradition goes more or less like this: for 1-2 people, one panel; for 3-5 people, 2 panels; for 5-10 people, 3 panels. Find the roof whose azimuth is is closest to 0 degree and put it there. Inclination does not matter. If you just want hot water, this works very well (in my neighborhoods) Again, what I am trying to do is to escape from pure empiricism and calculate area and angle in a more rational way. - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Any Sun Dials in San Antonio - TX?
I'll be spending four days in San Antonio, Texas. Even though I have a quite tight agenda, I'd like to try and see any available sundials in the neighborhood. Any hints? - fernando -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: Solar panels, also off topic. Sorry.
hese problems will get worse, > not better. > > The result of this is a severely compromised future for our children and > grandchildren, their futures compromised by a fouled air supply and > increased global warming, with it's very long time-constant, meaning > that instant cessation of the introduction of greenhouse gases will > still be followed by many years of global warming. > > Much of this, and other disrespect to Spaceship Earth, our home and our > Earthly life-support system, results from a severely inappropriate > world-view, of the citizens and leaders of the industrial nations acting > as if they think the Earth is here for us to use, abuse, and take from > without concern for the future. The "resoning" seems to be little more > than a claim that we simply must, at any cost, protect our current high > level of material consumption, mistakenly equating this with quality of > life. Less well developed countries, incredibly, are intent on > immulating the disasterous path being followed by the polluting > industrial nations, virtually guaranteeing a demise of the planet for > viable human habitation sometime in the next century. > > This is why the solar industry that once was thriving in the U.S. is now > a hollow shell of its former glory. For less-developed countries, those > without extensive electric utility grids in place to deliver relatively > inexpensive energy to their homes, solar energy remains the one great > hope for reaonable access to that precious commodity of modern > industrialized nations -- energy. In a nutshell: Solar energy provides > just enough. Just enough to meet reasonable needs for auxiliary energy > in our lives, but not enough that you can be wasteful with it, trying to > meet the high energy consumption levels of modern, wasteful > industrialized buildings with their isolation from the outside world, > and with their high levels of electrically powered illumination (when > solar lighting is there, just outside, for the taking) inside, and with > their high dependence on fossil fuel powered interior comfort zones. > > In conclusion, thanks to the Shaws for the question. In answer to it, > life as we know it is doomed because we don't have enough thermosiphon > water heating systems in the world today. Perhaps we should take this > discussion off-line so that subscribers to the sundial list can read > about sundials, rather than the coming collapse of civilization. > > Ross McCluney, Cocoa, FL, USA -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
Re: sundial setting
Philip P. Pappas, II wrote: > Hello dialists: > > Hoping that I might get your help with one last question that needs > answering before the new edition of my Sundial Owner's Manual goes to print. > In the chapter on setting a (horizontal) sundial, I recomend that a dial > should be oriented north not by a compass and not by polaris but by the > "time method". I say that this method is the most accurate but will only > work on those dials that are properly designed, constructed and leveled. > Correcting for the Equation of Time and longitude, using a reliable time > source, the sundial should automatically point north if it reads the right > time. Let me hitchhike on your question after turning it upside down: if we orienta sundial using the method described above, how precise can we expect the orientation to be? In my case we would be trying to find the South, of course. I must presume it also depends on the size of the dial, the thickness of the hour lines, the hour of the day, the precision of the gnomon, if it has or does not have longitude correction, etc. If we could take all those factors into account, can we expect to have a better reading than one provided by a compass? - fernando PS - By the way, I would ask you guys that write about sundialling to always take into account the fact that we live in a global village. People like myself buy sundials in the northern hemisphere in the hope to be able to use in the sourthern hemisphere. If the books and leaflets are always referring to the Polaris, to the North, so on and so forth, common people will never be able to correctly orient a sundial. > > > Then I say that you can set a horizontal dial with greater precision in the > early morning or late afternoon because the space between the minute lines > is larger at those times > (This is when the shadow points due east or due west). It is easier to > read a dial at those times because the lines aren't as bunched up as they > are at apparent noon. > > Here's my question: Is a sundial more accurate when the sun is setting or > rising? Is the benefit of larger spacings between the minute hands wiped > out by atmospheric effects (refraction and the mirage effect.)? By the way, > does anybody know by how many minutes an actual sunset precedes the apparent > sunset?Does this amount vary with latitude and seasons? > > Sorry, one question turned into four! > > Thanks for your help > > John Carmichael -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
GPS clock accuracy
Hello >From time to time I set my watch based on the time given by my Garmin G38. My watch seems quite good in the sense that after several weeks of even months it is showing about the same time the GPS is showing. Nevertheless, I don't know how accurate my GPS is. Is there a "standard" error or deviation or something like this? How precise can I expect my GPS to be? - fernando PS - It does not seem I can tune to any reliable source of time information here in Brasília. Also, I've tried several different programs in my windows environment to set my computer clock according to some of the well-known atomic clocks in the Internet. Nevertheless, it does not seem the software are good enough. I've found difference of up to 25 seconds amongst them. -- Fernando Cabral Padrao iX Sistemas Abertos mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pix.com.br mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Fone: +55 61 321-2433 Fax: +55 61 225-3082 15º 45' 04.9" S 47º 49' 58.6" W 19º 37' 57.0" S 45º 17' 13.6" W
