Re: [WISPA] The long day...final insult
Get em a litter box, he'll keep mice away. At 04:23 PM 12/7/2009, you wrote: So, I get to the workshop this afternoon, and walk in.There's a cat on my chair.I have NO idea how he got in, other than he must have dashed through the door as I walked in or out. I specifically made sure he wasn't in the next to last time I walked in or out. And, of course, as soon as I kicked the heat on and it warmed up, the pungent aroma he'd messed under my rollaround desk chair... And I had rolled the chair through it to sit at my workstation. ( pounds head slowly against monitor. slowly, of course, I have a splitting headache from lack of sleep) -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 12:02 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day! I've had a great experince over the past few years with StarOS/WRAP combos. They just work. With that said, I am slowly migrating to Mikrotik/Routerboards because I like the control they offer. So far, they just work as well. -RickG On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 12:39 PM, jree...@18-30chat.net jree...@18-30chat.net wrote: SShhh, don't tell him that, hes a StarOS guy =) Along the same, my primary site went down last night, cycling every 30~45seconds. -15F reported at the site this morning. RB433 is spec'd for -4FW T F Time to replace it with a few NS's and a RB450/750 in better temp controlled case. To bad they do not make a RB790 with POE =) jp wrote: I don't think an rb14 can handle the power need of multiple XR cards. I'd suggest unless you have a good reason besides saving $100, either use routerboards or stick to manufactured radio systems from a reputable and reliable manufacturer. You pay more money or give up a little flexibility, but it gives YOU more time to gain customers, sleep, etc... I love tinkering as much as the next guy, and I have a a variety of MT links, but I stick to familiar and trusted components despite the alluring variety of parts out there. Far Far outnumbering MT radios on my network are brand name radios from folks like Alvarion, Trango, and others. If I built all my radios and APs, I'd be out of business in a hurry as I'd be working full time tinkering instead of running an ISP, or hiring staff to build radio equipment instead of installing and taking care of customers. On Mon, Dec 07, 2009 at 03:49:59AM -0800, MDK wrote: It's 2:30 AM... I just drove up to the house, and walked VERY fast inside. After all, weather.com says that it's 12 degrees and an 8 MPH wind. In their head, maybe.Outside of the little valley I live in, the wind's more like 25 mph. There's no snow on the ground. I don't make a habit of staying up late, but last night, I was doing one of those let's just have some fun looking around sessions on EBAY. Next thing I knew, it was nearly 3AM. Without shutting anything down, I just crawled into bed. At 8:45 my cell phone rang... I didn't answer it, but I did get up. Looked at my computer and Peer Monitor says... nothing is connected.Now, I have had some issues with one of the dist points a few miles outside of town.It had randomly locked up 3 times last week. Each time, I thought I had found the problem and not worried about it. The first time for instance, it was extremely dense fog, and I found the ventilation fan running in the box. Thinking I had sucked in too much damp, I just shut it off and rebooted. The locked up system is a mini-itx board and RB 14 adapter card W/4 radios... Obviously, I was wrong. Something was wrong. It had run since Friday, but now it's Sun AM and PM says I've been off for 3 hours. It's died 2 other times since the fog incident, so... Houston, we have a problem... I quick yanked on some clothes and drove up the mountain to the site, used the step ladder to get to the box lid and looked in. Restarted and everything went off just fine. But, it's now done this several times. And that's not good or right. I look in the van. Spare mini-ITX board, licensed. Spare RB14, 2 spare radios, including an XR5, just like what's up there.Anyway, morning zips by, and I have an appointment in the afternoon to switch a family friend's computer out for her. So, I go to do that and she's not home. That's odd. I could have sworn she said she'd be there at 2... I wanted to be home, nice and warm and setting up the new board so I could change in in daylight tomorrow. So, I go to the workshop and do some stuff I've been putting off and ... fall asleep, waiting for an OS install to finish. When I wake up, it's after 5. Must have slept at least 15 min... Sheesh. So, I get
Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012
I like! Many of my customers have wireless routers in their homes/offices. Once the devices become cheap and readily available it will be a godsend. At 09:18 PM 12/8/2009, you wrote: Ah! Well why in the heck would they leave out something that important? Here I was thinking 5.8wasgoing bye bye in one quick hurry! They can have it then. Still a waste unless they are an office sharing a server or have home server with their pirate bay movies, music and viruses to stream to everyone in the house. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of 3-dB Networks Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 10:11 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012 60GHz... plenty of spectrum... and it won't propagate that far. But no mention of that in the article... I know the IEEE is working on that as a standard... Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 8:03 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012 160MHz channels? What in the heck frequency are they looking muddy up THIS time??? Just think of an apartment building with 1/3 of the residents running 160MHz channels on their routers and yet they only have 10mbps internet and the channels are all set on Auto along with everything else. HAHAHA! My nightmare is coming true! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Philip Dorr Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 9:03 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012 The IEEE has recently begun the first steps of voting on a major improvement to Wi-Fi standards due in two years. The 802.11ac standard should upgrade 802.11a to use 80MHz or even 160MHz channels that provide much more bandwidth than today. Just reading the first couple of sentences it looks like it will make a ton of illegal links and be a waste of RF spectrum. On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 7:48 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net wrote: http://www.electronista.com/articles/09/12/07/80211ac.process.underway/ - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Insurance....
This little historical item says a lot about this subject. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRdLpem-AAs WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012
I agree! However, most of the newer laptops don't have 802.11a capabilities any more. I like it when my technologically challenged customers want wireless in the house. When one of their friends says they have a 4M connection on Mediacomm, they respond, I connect at 54Mbps! Really helps sell my service. I've tried explaining, but the task bar tells all, right? Mike G At 08:30 AM 12/9/2009, Mike Hammett wrote: In 5 GHz (the home of 802.11a) there are a few hundred MHz available. All the home routers really should be in 5 GHz. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012
Made me look! Two fairly new HPs and a Dell, as well as my netbook (take to installs) have B/G cards, no A. At 10:22 AM 12/9/2009, you wrote: Every laptop I've seen recently usually comes with 802.11 a/b/g/n cards... except maybe netbooks Daniel White 3-dB Networks http://www.3dbnetworks.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 9:21 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wi-Fi to top 1 GB/s by 2012 I agree! However, most of the newer laptops don't have 802.11a capabilities any more. I like it when my technologically challenged customers want wireless in the house. When one of their friends says they have a 4M connection on Mediacomm, they respond, I connect at 54Mbps! Really helps sell my service. I've tried explaining, but the task bar tells all, right? Mike G At 08:30 AM 12/9/2009, Mike Hammett wrote: In 5 GHz (the home of 802.11a) there are a few hundred MHz available. All the home routers really should be in 5 GHz. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wind!
Hi Chuck! That is all of my cat5 running to the shack. I ran a steel cable and they are wire wrapped several spots on the wire. Look up the tower about 25 feet. Thats a 10 point rack and skull. :-) mg At 11:32 AM 12/9/2009, you wrote: What's that fancy wrap on the leads to the tower? Are you hanging and freezing deer sausage on that cloths line? -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 9:16 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wind! I just tried digging out a path for the animals to go back outside. It's fruitless. I have 4 and 5 foot drifts and the wind is gusting to 45 mph. With a 1/2 mile long lane and an old Ford with front loader, I'll be an entire day digging out. I won't even start until this wind subsides. That's my 180' freestanding tower on the property. It gets moving pretty good in strong winds. mg At 10:43 AM 12/9/2009, you wrote: That may be what's going on but they looked steady when I was watching them, but I can't see both ends at the same time obviously. But that's a lot of deflection. I should have a better signal to begin with than the -72 or 73 is sits at, seeing as how it's a short straight shot. When I first put it in I was convinced I was connecting to a side lobe due to the signal but I never could get any better than that. I may be on one and that may explain it but I'll be darned if I could ever find out. Bob- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wind!
Call me when you do. We can meet up if you like. Mike At 12:03 PM 12/9/2009, you wrote: And the wonder pole is now ice Say it isn't so! I gotta go out to cedar rapids in a week or so. That sucks! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:16 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wind! I just tried digging out a path for the animals to go back outside. It's fruitless. I have 4 and 5 foot drifts and the wind is gusting to 45 mph. With a 1/2 mile long lane and an old Ford with front loader, I'll be an entire day digging out. I won't even start until this wind subsides. That's my 180' freestanding tower on the property. It gets moving pretty good in strong winds. mg At 10:43 AM 12/9/2009, you wrote: That may be what's going on but they looked steady when I was watching them, but I can't see both ends at the same time obviously. But that's a lot of deflection. I should have a better signal to begin with than the -72 or 73 is sits at, seeing as how it's a short straight shot. When I first put it in I was convinced I was connecting to a side lobe due to the signal but I never could get any better than that. I may be on one and that may explain it but I'll be darned if I could ever find out. Bob- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Wind!
ur nuts! I was laughing so hard I had to read it to Elaine. ur nuts! At 12:35 PM 12/9/2009, you wrote: That's my fault. I'm basically lazy so when I heard that certain aerosols cause global warming I starting using anything with a gas that would cause greenhouse gasses. Me and the kids sometimes spend our days releasing Freon from old refrigerators and old A/C systems in the cars, use hair spray for no particular reason and feed the livestock things that cause more gas. It's a hobby. But we have no desire to move, only for it to be warm. We're winning! I seen Al Gore out at the gate but we never let him in. Had to call the dog out on him once, he never came back. Al, that is. The dog stayed. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 1:23 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wind! So much for global warming! Oops, another hot topic these days! On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 12:15 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: I just tried digging out a path for the animals to go back outside. It's fruitless. I have 4 and 5 foot drifts and the wind is gusting to 45 mph. With a 1/2 mile long lane and an old Ford with front loader, I'll be an entire day digging out. I won't even start until this wind subsides. That's my 180' freestanding tower on the property. It gets moving pretty good in strong winds. mg At 10:43 AM 12/9/2009, you wrote: That may be what's going on but they looked steady when I was watching them, but I can't see both ends at the same time obviously. But that's a lot of deflection. I should have a better signal to begin with than the -72 or 73 is sits at, seeing as how it's a short straight shot. When I first put it in I was convinced I was connecting to a side lobe due to the signal but I never could get any better than that. I may be on one and that may explain it but I'll be darned if I could ever find out. Bob- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] an epic storm
I'm not sure how this storm is affecting my fellow midwest WISP friends, but it is turning into an epic event here. Snow has drifted above the windows on a couple sides of the house. Winds are 35 mph sustained gusting to 50. It is still snowing, and we've had 14 - 16 inches of snow. It's 10 degrees outside. The thermometer above my shoulder reads 75 inside. You have to love wood heat. It will take me all day tomorrow to dig out I'm sure. I dug out a path for the three legged dog to go out and pee, and it's drifted in. Epic. I hope you're all safe, warm and secure. mg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Lanyards and Rebar Hooks
One of the short farm jacks might be easier to work on the tower. I have one of the long HiLift jacks I use for all sorts of things. That would be easy to gin pole to a lower section and use it without the base. At 04:36 PM 12/9/2009, you wrote: Ya know, I thought about an old scissor jack. Might be the cheap and easy answer. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 5:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Lanyards and Rebar Hooks Go get you one of these: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200305253 _200305253 or go to the local junk yard and get one out of any junk import car. Weld you a piece of metal to the top and bottom strong enough and long enough to push your tower pieces apart. That is what I use. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Data Technology w...@dtisp.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 09 Dec 2009 10:40:18 -0600 Scott, Take a look at the picture on the home page. http://www.superiormusic.com/towerjack.htm The notches cut on the jack fit around the horizontal rungs and to take the section apart you pull down on the handle. To help pull the section together you place the hook around the top rung and pull down on the handle. I have the hevi duty version which also has a leg aligner on it. I don't think I have ever needed to use the leg aligner. This is a lot easier than using a bottle jack and 2 2x4's. I came up with one better than that once. It was using a car jack and bolting the 2x4's to it so did not have to worry about loosing a 2x4. LaRoy McCann Data Technology Scott Reed wrote: Since I am not the one that does our tower work, I will let my curiosity ask, how do you use the tower jack? Data Technology wrote: Robert, I just bought one of these a couple of months ago. Don't know if it will keep me from killing my self because I have not had the misfortune to try it out yet ;) http://www.midwestunlimited.com/detail.lasso?cat_master=1002cat_level=1023; product_id=10709 I don't know if these numbers are working but there are 2 numbers and an email link on their website. http://www.superiormusic.com/towerjack01.htm Robert West wrote: Looking for a source for lanyards with rebar hooks but for a decent price, as in cheap but not so cheap I'll kill myself using it.Yeah, I can Google all day looking, and lots of times I do, but thought if someone is happy with a supplier who has good quality and decent price, may as well ask. ALSO. Man, I've been trying to buy a tower jack for Rohn 25g sections for months! The guy who makes it, his site is up but phone disconnected, no answer to email. I call Tesco, EXPENSIVE but they tell me out of stock anyhow.I call wb0w, they tell me to call the number of the guy who makes it, the disconnected number of course, and a place north of me also lists it so I stopped in, and sure enough, we no have, call the guy who makes it. Right. I'm going to go back to hauling a bottle jack and wood 100+ feet up on a Rohn 25g. I'm so flippin' pleased. I'm about to just haul a saws all up and be done with it. Robert West Just Micro Digital Services Inc. 740-335-7020 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Data Technology MailScanner, and is believed to be clean. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out
Re: [WISPA] an epic storm
I hope that's all you end up getting. Looks like it's headed out of here and east. It's 5 degrees. The winds are slowing to 15. I'm going to be VERY busy first light. Looks like Toledo received 14 inches. I got a little more out here in the country, but it's really hard to tell with all that wind. It was near white out conditions earlier. Awesome. mg At 02:39 PM 12/9/2009, you wrote: So far just a bunch of wind and one AP down. I'll take only wind over what you have out there! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 3:34 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] an epic storm I'm not sure how this storm is affecting my fellow midwest WISP friends, but it is turning into an epic event here. Snow has drifted above the windows on a couple sides of the house. Winds are 35 mph sustained gusting to 50. It is still snowing, and we've had 14 - 16 inches of snow. It's 10 degrees outside. The thermometer above my shoulder reads 75 inside. You have to love wood heat. It will take me all day tomorrow to dig out I'm sure. I dug out a path for the three legged dog to go out and pee, and it's drifted in. Epic. I hope you're all safe, warm and secure. mg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day!
24 volts won't kill you. 25 volts will; with enough current. :-) At 10:00 PM 12/9/2009, you wrote: By low, I was talking about 24 volts. I know the electric company calls 120 volts. My point was I'm not taking a bucket near any electrical power lines, period. Thanks! On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 9:31 PM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote: More people die every year from low voltage than from high. Or so I've been told. But that may not be quite right: http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/docs/98-131/epidemi.html#fig1 Still, far too many deaths from ALL voltages. marlon - Original Message - From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 10:07 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day! Not near high power lines. With that said, your comments are very good advice and well taken. It wasnt long ago that a co-worker at the electric company I was at was killed up in a bucket. We should all take high power seriously. Thanks! On Wed, Dec 9, 2009 at 11:04 AM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote: You mean to say that you've never ended up with the bucket or boom in a place that you didn't expect it to get? I sure have! marlon - Original Message - From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, December 08, 2009 10:13 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day! On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 10:59 AM, Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.comwrote: - Original Message - From: Scottie Arnett sarn...@info-ed.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 9:23 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] One long @#$% day! One time, I had to borrow a friends bucket I'll assume you meant bucket truck. The day we bought our bucket truck and brought it home, I took a 3/8 drill bit to about 3 places in the bottom of the bucket to let water out. That's not a good idea. You now give a place for electricity to run through your body if you happen to move between a ground source and an electrical line. I've thought of doing that to my truck, but it's really not hard to just dump the buckets. I've worked for several electric companies and understand the reasoning behind this. But, if you dont use a bucket near high power lines then its not an issue. -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Trademark on a color?
Oh yes they did. Try to buy John Deere green paint; you pay a premium. They absolutely maintain control on marketing of the green, Deere. At 09:05 AM 12/10/2009, you wrote: I really don't think you can do that. I seem to remember that John Deere tried it and failed. Regards, Jeff Jeff Broadwick ImageStream 800-813-5123 x106 (US/Can) +1 574-935-8484 x106 (Int'l) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Dylan Bouterse Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 8:33 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trademark on a color? I know a trademark attorney out of silicon valley if anybody is interested. Sorry if you want to trademark Blue. We have that. :oP Dylan -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jack Unger Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 10:29 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Trademark on a color? I suggest you consult a patent and trademark attorney. I doubt that there are any on this list. :-( Robert West wrote: I was looking through some invoices and just caught that UPS has a trademark on the color Brown. HUH? I guess in the context of a package delivery company it would stick but man, what about shades of brown? So I was thinking, as I randomly do, if I use every primary color in different versions of my logo and trademark them all, wouldn't that leave any other wireless company with no colors to do a darned thing with? Just seems silly to trademark a color. Can I trademark cats? Or smells? Or maybe the smell of a cat? Who would want to. Bob- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Technical Writing, Editing, and Training Serving the Wireless, Networking, and Telecom Communities Since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I have to believe we are on the cusp of some real innovation. The answer will not be wireless as we now know it. Instead, it will be some sort of ultra wide band signal spread over a certain frequency band and controlled by software defined radios. With the right algorithms, many users could be using the same band and only raise the noise floor slightly to an observer or an analog spectrum analyzer. Most of the recent innovation in UWB is for personal devices, low power, and short range. It can be done on a much larger, wider scale. Distance will dictate the amount of spectrum a device can use and still have adapting radiators efficient at that slice of spectrum. The biggest hurdle will be the back door the government will insist on having into the system. http://www.deviceforge.com/articles/AT8171287040.html Every house or business could have a central device communicating with the mesh or whatever it becomes, and relaying to devices in use by individuals, using a lower power UWB. I'm not sure the end device will be a phone/IPhone type device, but instead will be some sort of thin film display you either unfold, or something that is integrated into eye wear. http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,667638,00.asp I think we have reached the limits of the technology now commonly available. The smart phone is not the answer. Little tiny screens are usable by young eyes, but not by mature users. A screen that communicates with the device in your pocket will be the norm. I have a friend/customer who just got a new set of hearing aids. It interfaces with his phone via bluetooth. He is able to use a cell phone now, where previous attempts were less than satisfying. My prediction is many of the people on this list will be amongst the innovators that bring these technologies to the masses. mg At 08:30 AM 12/12/2009, you wrote: There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past 15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something the cheaper way. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in my eyes. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Scottie Arnett sarn...@info-ed.com Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice I found these stats interesting: the number of households either lacking Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 million - half of the households in the United States. Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? and... Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access to $60 billion. I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing broadband, it would be more than enough. How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? I bet it would go directly towards the customer. Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there just trying for a little help and deservedly so
Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti PTMP Antenna Selection
Is that saying any antenna with less than 30dBi gain is within the rules? Have they relaxed the rules on certification? Just curious. At 12:04 PM 12/15/2009, Matt wrote: According to Ubiquiti themselves and the FCC: This equipment is required to be professionally installed The device has been designed to operate with the antennas listed below and having a maximum gain of 30dBi. Antennas not included in this list or having a gain greater than 30dBi are strictly prohibited for use with this device. The required antenna impedance is 50 ohms ... list deleted WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Oh, and I was giving you credit for quoting from Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy, where 42 was the answer to the Universal Question. mg At 04:11 PM 12/16/2009, you wrote: I read an interesting thing the other day concerning that. As proof that you can use numbers to come to any conclusion that you desire, some smart guy worked out some equation with the total mass of the universe (how in the heck can anyone even calculate that?) and he comes up with an answer of 42. Same type of guy who said a person making 15 grand a year could afford a loan on a $200k house. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:01 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice The universal answer to all questions. I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! now, if I could just remember -- From: Marlon K. Schafer o...@odessaoffice.com Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice roflol Now THAT's funny! So long and thanks for all the fish! marlon - Original Message - From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice 42 is the answer. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. Oh, one correction though, thinking on this list. should be by some thinking on this list. :) Not all here think the government is the answer. -RickG On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK rea...@muddyfrogwater.us wrote: That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. Just like REAL health care. Just like REAL education. Just like REAL science. Just ask the advocates of government can make our lives a paradise thinking on this list.I have learned. All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend 7 times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in one package. -- From: Scottie Arnett sarn...@info-ed.com Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, according to a new study from Insight Research. Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot
I like the hand warmer idea. I see em for less than a buck per regularly. Thanks for the tip. mg At 02:01 PM 12/17/2009, you wrote: Yeah, you are an id10t! Yikes. It's only internet guys! NO ONE IS GONNA DIE if it doesn't work. Oh, they act like they will, but they wont. Safety first, and last. If you aren't safe out there, it'll be the last thing you do in this business or any other. We get in enough jams just doing what we have to do. Lets not compound the problem. OK, having said that. I keep a box full (yes a box full) of those chemical hand and foot warmers in the car this time of year. EVERY car. When I have to work outside for any amount of time (I tend to not wear gloves at all, can't work with them) I tape one to the inside of my wrist. Right where you'd check your pulse. That does an amazing job of warming the blood going into your hands. Try it some time, you'll be amazed at how warm your hands stay. You can also put one or two of them in your front pants pocket and that'll help keep your feet warm. I found out that riding a dirt bike stirs up too much air and they get really hot! I ended up with blistered skin on my legs from a couple of them. If they start to feel too hot, they are. I'd have never guessed that that could have happened! laters, marlon - Original Message - From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 3:39 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot Mine seem to freeze at approximately... oh 28 degrees while holding onto a steel ladder in a 17mph wind, at least that's my best estimation. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Luthman Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 6:33 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] I'm an idiot Really glad you're OK! I have never been able to keep my fingers decent - they freeze at 50! On 12/16/09, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: I'm an idiot. Had to climb to the top of a tower this afternoon. 300 foot tower. Drive to the tower, put on the harness and all the other crap, grab the hat, all good. No gloves. Figures. Where are the gloves? The NEW gloves? Home. All I had was a thin pair of leather work gloves. Did I go up? Certainly, because I'm an idiot. I can now almost feel my fingers. Was a balmy 28 degrees out with winds to 17 mph. Just had to share my utter stupidity. Never again. Robert West Just Micro Digital Services Inc. 740-335-7020 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. --- Albert Einstein WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time?
I was almost ready to pull the trigger on some Ubiquiti equipment for a new project. The scent of low price is alluring. Then I start reading about connectors pulling out, connectors not soldered on properly, and the wrong boot code on boards. Is it too early? Should I wait a bit before I dive in? Has the haste to get product into the distribution stream compromised quality control? Is the low price just too good to be true? I'd be interested in some constructive thoughts and analysis. Thanks mg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time?
Thanks Bob, Rick and Tom for your thoughts. My hands itch when I'm uncertain about something. It might just be the dry air. Are the Ubiquity radios more apt to require reboots than some of the other mainstream CPE? Seems to be a common thread here. I am most interested in the rocket stuff, aren't I? Tom what sort of radio and board are in the MeshCam2? mg At 02:24 PM 12/19/2009, you wrote: My biggest concern with these units is (a) lack of mechanical robustness - little plastic bits leak or break off quite easily and (b) lack of a hardware watchdog timer which personally I think is essential esp. when you're using development stage firmware. We did most of the work to port our Qcode to run on the ubnt platform, but have decided to shelf that project for another year, waiting for things to really settle down. In the CCTV business, there's no-one around to power-cycle the equipment and unrecoverable device hangs are really a disaster. I realize that the ISP business is a little different because the customer can always reboot the CPE! Tom S. - Original Message - From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com To: jai...@budget.net; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 7:55 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? I'm with ya on all that, Jamie. We've had minor issues but I expected things to not be perfect, they never are with version 1.0! The trade off is worth it, for me anyhow. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of jai...@budget.net Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 10:26 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? We use all UBNT and I have been very happy with the equipment. Tower has 2 Rocket M5s With 120 sectors, backhaul is Rocket M5s with the Rocket Dish. CPEs are Nano M5. Durring testing at 4 Miles with CPE to AP I was able to sustain symmetrical speeds of 75M to our test server on the other end of the backhaul. I was really amazed at how well they preformed for the price. I have read all the horror stories in the UBNT forums but have yet to have one problem. Probably just cursed myself and should of kept my mouth shut. But so far so good. On Sat 12/19/09 6:35 AM , Mike m...@aweiowa.com sent: I was almost ready to pull the trigger on some Ubiquiti equipment for a new project. The scent of low price is alluring. Then I start reading about connectors pulling out, connectors not soldered on properly, and the wrong boot code on boards. Is it too early? Should I wait a bit before I dive in? Has the haste to get product into the distribution stream compromised quality control? Is the low price just too good to be true? I'd be interested in some constructive thoughts and analysis. Thanks mg WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org [2] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ Links: -- [1] http://signup.wispa.org/ [2] mailto:wireless@wispa.org [3] http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless [4] http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.427 / Virus Database: 270.14.114/2574 - Release Date: 12/18/09 19:38:00 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless
Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes
I think he meant prawn, which is shrimp. I just recently joined DAM; Mother's Against Dyslexia. At 08:51 AM 12/24/2009, you wrote: I'm no able to get my pron at all. I think they have a pron block in my area. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 4:50 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8 dishes We have used some 7 1/2 ft dishes from the C-band days along with Ubiquity M series and got close to 1 Gigabit per second. Our only problem has been which direction to face the satellite dish. We chose between the old faithful Galaxy 5 satellite and the Telstar 5 satellite. Both seemed to pick up well, but the T5 satellite brought pron in much faster? Happy Holidays All! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Wed, 23 Dec 2009 18:09:37 -0700 Us too. We have used a lot of the 2' and 3' PacWireless dishes. Work fine. Used a couple 4' RadioWaves dishes and those worked fine too. Although the feedhorn mount is kinda flimsy and was bent on arrival. On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:06 PM, Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.comwrote: I've been happy with both pairs of 2 foot Pac dishes. On 12/23/09, Philip Dorr wirel...@judgementgaming.com wrote: We use Pac Wireless 3 foot dishes with ray dome on most of our PTP links On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Michael Baird m...@tc3net.com wrote: I'm looking for opinions on 5.8 dishes, if you've got any extra you are looking to dump message me, I've got a 28db dish and some 26db/30 db grids, neither of the grids work as well as 2 foot dish. Would like 32 db on up, I just need one to compare to my existing dishes. Regards Michael Baird WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources. --- Albert Einstein WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List:
Re: [WISPA] power management tools for cell sites
Check out DigitalLoggers: http://www.digital-loggers.com/din.html They have some cool devices. I use them at tower sites and can reboot individual devices. The DIN relays might work for you. I use the web switches a couple places. Mike At 08:24 PM 12/24/2009, you wrote: I'm hoping someone on this list might recommend me some power management options for cell sites. Ideally, I would like something that does the following: --auto-reboots a device when an IP address does not ping --is ruggedized for outdoor environments (or is easy to stuff in a NEMA 4X box) --let's me http or ssh in and reboot certain ports --is affordable enough where I could just budget it in with all of the cameras and wireless devices Tools like iBoot are a step in the right direction, but it doesn't seem to have very many features, and I will likely want some SNMP features so I could, say, graph the power levels in Cacti . (The idea here is to be able to proactively troubleshoot stuff to avoid a truck roll, and if I do have to do a truck roll, I know that the most obvious power-related stuff has been done first) WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Another epic storm?
I hope everyone is weathering this latest event OK. We have one customer down, but they may have turned off the lights when they went out of town; not sure. The low seems to have been spinning over Fort Dodge, IA and bringing bad weather along the Mississippi and into IL, and on the other side, from OK to SD. Western Iowa got hammered. We had 48 hours of above freezing temperatures that started melting the snow pack. Christmas day the temp dropped 10 degrees in a few minutes and all the slush froze hard. It has been snowing lightly off and on since. Yell if you need some help! Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Water sealing in cold weather
The Andrew way has always been wide mastic/coax seal/good electrical tape. The mastic keeps the coax seal out of the threads The coax seal seals The electrical tape protects the coax seal Always wrap like you're roofing; bottom up. Mike -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jason Hensley Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 12:15 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: [WISPA] Water sealing in cold weather Hey guys. What do you use to water seal a connection in cold weather (30* or colder)? N connector specifically. This is something that needs to be done on top of a tower - need to replace a radio and would prefer to not have to bring the antenna down to do it and don't have another antenna that we could use to replace this one with. Thanks! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Condolences and prayers for the people Haiti
Prayers to all the good people of Haiti. This is an awful event. If plate tectonics are in motion here in the western hemisphere, we can only hope the New Madrid fault isn't next. God help those in St. Louis and Memphis if so. The largest earthquake in this hemisphere was on that fault, and is estimated to have been an 8 on the scale, or 10 times more powerful than the Haitian one yesterday. The New Madrid quake was 199 years ago this month, or the same time frame as the last big quake in Haiti. Mike -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Leary Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 9:32 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Condolences and prayers for the people Haiti And there are a few good WISPs there. Patrick WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Send MONEY Now!
Absolutely not true with the RED Cross. You get a big bang for your buck, and they are always the first to respond with relief, know what they're doing, and do it well. At redcross.org you can even use Amazon payments to get your donation on the way. Do it, it'll make you feel good. Mike -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jon Auer Sent: Thursday, January 14, 2010 11:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Send MONEY Now! I always figured that the larger groups (Red Cross, DWB) eat up a larger percentage of donations in their bureaucracy simply because of their larger size. On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 10:16 AM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote: 2010/1/14 RickG rgunder...@gmail.com: You guys are the best for doing this but be careful who and where you send money. Unfortunately, there are a lot of scam artist that will take advantage of situations like this. Yes, I would avoid the missionary groups. Doctors Without Borders is legit, and the Red Cross is always a fairly safe bet. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Send MONEY Now!
I guess you could pick a more efficient charity; the Carnegie Science Foundation, but would that put the resources where they are immediately needed? The site you sent splits hairs. Administrators of the Red Cross are higher caliber people, and require higher compensation that Administrators of the St. Petersburg soup kitchen. According to your site, over 90% of Red Cross funds go right to the cause, quickly, efficiently. Why debate, just give. Give blood while you're at it too. The Red Cross does that well too. Mike -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jeremy Parr Just a link; no verbiage WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Equipment cleanup
Just going through some extra gear, we picked up from a recent aquisition, have an assortment of Tranzeo 2.4's/5.8's and Trango 900 AP/SU's and TenX radios. We are going to put this stuff up on ebay soon (or bin it), we have tested it and verified it's functioning, if someone is interested please let me know what you are looking for offlist, and I'll see what we have. Regards Michael Baird WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] PDU/UPS
We've got to purchase some PDU/UPS for new locations, I'm looking to standardize on something into the future. I'd prefer a combo PDU/UPS device with 8 ports providing surge/conditioning, remotely accessable via IP and something that can stand the rough Michigan weather conditions. I've looked at Tripplite's and APC's, and they don't seem to do what I want 100%. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Radio Seperation
We've just installed a 3 sector 2.4 setup, at 145' with maxrad 120's. I'm noticing the receive sensitivity on the AP's are about 15-20 db's different then what I see on the CPE's, tried a Tranzeo/Ubiquity radio. I'm using Ubiquity AP's, and they work fine on another 3 sector setup I have, however this tower is an A-Frame. The tower owner won't allow outside climbers so his guy did it, and he put one on each leg at 145' back to back. If the radios were too close together even on different channels, would the RX performance on the AP exhibit this behavior? Only other change on this tower was RFLinx Quarter-wave arrestors in line. If I'm 3-5 miles away I can see on the CPE a RSSI of -65 to -75 for example, on the AP the reading would be in the -90 to not even below the noise floor. Any thoughts would be appreciated as always. Regards Michael Baird WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Radio Seperation
Yea, can't try that until Monday though. Was just sort of wondering if improper isolation would cause the issue I'm seeing, or if I need to keep looking for something else. Regards Michael Baird - Original Message - From: Bob Moldashel lakel...@gbcx.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 5:13:10 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [WISPA] Radio Seperation Michael, A quick test would be to shut off the other two sectors and see if your AP RSL goes up. If it does, you may have answered your question regarding channel separation. -B- m...@tc3net.com wrote: We've just installed a 3 sector 2.4 setup, at 145' with maxrad 120's. I'm noticing the receive sensitivity on the AP's are about 15-20 db's different then what I see on the CPE's, tried a Tranzeo/Ubiquity radio. I'm using Ubiquity AP's, and they work fine on another 3 sector setup I have, however this tower is an A-Frame. The tower owner won't allow outside climbers so his guy did it, and he put one on each leg at 145' back to back. If the radios were too close together even on different channels, would the RX performance on the AP exhibit this behavior? Only other change on this tower was RFLinx Quarter-wave arrestors in line. If I'm 3-5 miles away I can see on the CPE a RSSI of -65 to -75 for example, on the AP the reading would be in the -90 to not even below the noise floor. Any thoughts would be appreciated as always. Regards Michael Baird WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 802.11 CPE's
Looking for a good MT vendor. The fellow I've been trying to work with has gone AWOL. I need to get a link going for a community project pretty quickly. Regards, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] MT Vendor lead
Oops! Forgot to change the subject. Looking for a good MT vendor. The fellow I've been trying to work with has gone AWOL. I need to get a link going for a community project pretty quickly. Regards, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] MT Vendor lead
Victoria: Thanks for the response! I see on your web site you can provide T1 service for a great price. I beat my head against the wall every time I try to deal with Iowa Telecomm, or for that matter, any of the rapacious monopolists. I'd pay that in a heartbeat if I could get a T1 or 2 delivered to 2903 H Ave, Toledo, IA 52342. I should tell you I am way out in the sticks, at the end of a 1/2 mile long lane. Why? I love the remoteness, and my property is one of the highest points in Tama County, Iowa. Here I built a 180' Rohn 9N and went into the WISP business. Best Regards, Mike Gilchrist Disruptive Technologist Advanced Wireless Express P.O. Box 255 Toledo, IA 52342 239-770-6203 At 05:40 PM 7/20/2009, you wrote: Try Dennis Burgess from www.linktechs.net One of the best! Victoria Proffer - President/CEO StLouisBroadband.com http://stlbroadband.com/ 314.974.5600 * Fax 573.747.4756 SBA Certified WOSB - SBA 8 (a) Certification - submitted. Follow us on Twitter.com @stlbroadband -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 5:13 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] MT Vendor lead Oops! Forgot to change the subject. Looking for a good MT vendor. The fellow I've been trying to work with has gone AWOL. I need to get a link going for a community project pretty quickly. Regards, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Canopy Distance
You have to set max range on the Canopy for the most distant radio. Trying to go that far will just degrade your whole system. The Canopy backhauls CAN go that distance, connectorized, dish antennas et al, in any event, you should be looking for a point-to-point system for that distance, or just tell the customer it won't work if you are trying to reach that distance with an AP to SM. Mike At 07:01 PM 7/30/2009, you wrote: Any chance it could do 30 to 40 miles from ap to cpe with that setup? Jason Gino Villarini wrote: Charles Actually now it's FCC certified with the low power setting Sent from my Motorola Startac... On Jul 30, 2009, at 7:12 PM, Charles Wu mailto:c...@cticonnect.comc...@cticonnect.com wrote: It's generally illegal to use a dish on a 5.2 SM From a *theoretical* perspective, 5.2 will propagate just as good as 5.8 -Charles -Original Message- From: mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.orgwireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jason Wallace Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 5:48 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Canopy Distance Sorry, I thought I'd read in their literature that the 5200sm could operate at 5.8... The 5200sm is what I am interested in. Does anyone know what the maximum useful distance is with the dish mounted 5200sm like: http://www.ojbox.com/ebay/new/5200sm-dish/5200sm-dish.htmhttp://www.ojbox.com/ebay/new/5200sm-dish/5200sm-dish.htm Jason Charles Wu wrote: Hi, A 5200 SM operates in 5.2, not 5.8 The difference between 5.2 and 5.8 is FCC rules -Charles -Original Message- From: mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.orgwireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wirelessmailto:wireless- mailto:boun...@wispa.orgboun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jason Wallace Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2009 11:01 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Canopy Distance Speaking of 5.8 distance... Does anyone know what the real world maximum distance the canopy 5200sm can do? Assuming a quiet noise floor, best ap setup, etc. Jason --- --- --- --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ --- --- --- --- WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe
Re: [WISPA] 5.8 Distance
But NOT with Canopy, right? At 10:25 AM 7/31/2009, you wrote: We have 29 mile ptmp links that will deliver 6Mbps x 3Mbps without a problem. Travis Microserv WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Mounting a dish on a Rohn 9N
I need to mount a 2' dish close to the top of a Rohn 9N tower. The tower steel is not very large in diameter that high, and I already have another dish mounted on the pipe coming out the top of the taper. So, I need to mount it to the side. The mounts for the dish and radome will accommodate 1 1/2 at the smallest. What are you guys using as a pipe mount in such a situation? Is there something I could use I could buy locally? Thanks, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Mounting a dish on a Rohn 9N
When I search there for pipe to pipe, I only get hits for ice bridge hardware. At 01:30 PM 8/3/2009, you wrote: Pipe to pipe mount This will allow you to mount to the leg and add a larger pipe to mount the dish. www.sitepro1.com ... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Installs on Towers, what's your method?
I too disagree on the electrical tape. An old installer taught me that 9 - 12 lengths of insulated solid #8 wire makes great bundle ties. Before the climb, he cuts a bunch of them to length, stuffs them in his pouch. On the way back down, every five feet or so he will take the wire around the bundle and around the tower leg. Two twists with pliers, cut the tags and fold them over. Quick, cheap and last forever. At 09:18 AM 8/5/2009, you wrote: I disagree on the electrical tape. Every climb where I see electrical tape the stuff is remarkably frail. A stiff breeze would peel it right off. Maybe 3M is way better then whatever I saw. The tower climber I have to use for a couple towers lead me to these and I love them: http://www.tessco.com/products/displayProductInfo.do?sku=455824eventPage=2 They can get tighter due to finer distances between ridges and last forever. As was said, these things are razor sharp once cut. Just last week I cut my finger on one of these and didn't notice it for a good while. I can't think of anything to add to that list since you posted it but I'm sure someone will get an idea =) Good list to have! Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Aug 5, 2009 at 12:20 AM, Scott Carullo sc...@brevardwireless.comwrote: Similar but instead of Zip ties use good electrical tape (3m) Put enough wraps (6-10) and it will last probably longer than tie wrap and it puts more even pressure on all cable types than tie wraps Bonus is no rough edges, have one size fits all roll, able to remove without tools etc Scott Carullo Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x102 On Aug 4, 2009, at 11:56 PM, Chuck Hogg ch...@shelbybb.com wrote: I just thought I'd share what we do for our tower installs, and find out what/if anything other people are doing. RF Prep 1. Use Radio Mobile to determine what we will need for antennas, radios, etc. Basic Tower Side/Mounting/Cables 1. Use a 18-24 standoff mount, or sometimes direct to the leg (sectors and backhauls). 2. Use LMR400 for jumper connections, mastic, tape, butyl, tape. 3. Use CMXR for Cat-5e cable, solder the ground ends, seal around with heatshrink. 4. Use Dielectric Grease on all connections. Protects the Ethernet port and cable from allowing condensation or moisture to build up on the connector and get water inside the cable. I also use it on RF. Once I was on a building and installing a link. I didn't have any tape, so I just used dielectric grease on the connector. I went back to that building a year later and the connections are still solid. I know for a fact I have had water in a connector when only using mastic, so this was bare and it was dry. Link is still solid. 5. Use UV Rated zip ties, so that they don't break later on down the road. Lightning Protection Side 1. Use QLW-8080s Ethernet Surge Suppressor on interior of any MikroTik board. 2. Use PolyPhaser Lightning protection on all connections. 3. Use 600SS or other Canopy Grounding 4. Check the resistance in the current grounding from tower to ground source. 5. Use CMXR for the grounding and double shield. Safety Fall Protection 1. Hard Hats/Helmets Everyone there. 2. Steel-toed boots with the arch plate for standing on those towers. 3. We use Elk River and DBI/Sala Exofit Tower XP Harnesses, 1-2 positioning lanyards and an adjustable lanyard from Petzel. 4. Loads of shackles, beaners, block/pulleys, 5k lb load rope and 1k lb tag line. 5. Cable/Rope Grabs 6. Food/Drink/Hydration (they say water is best at tower class, works for me) 7. Safety plan and project meeting Base 1. We setup a UPS. (sometimes battery banks, depending on the importance of the tower) 2. We install a monitor/remote power switch. 3. Solar panels, aimed per the internet for optimal sun. 4. Trojan Deep Cycle batteries, easy to find at the golf cart shops. 5. Setup a Site Monitor and Sync Injector if Canopy 6. Ground out everything at the base. Setup 600SS and other surge supressors 7. Mount POE's, Switches, etc. to 3/4 x4'x4' plywood 8. Typically every tower we put up has a RB/450G or a RB/493AH Do a ground run through to make sure you aren't missing anything. Happy vertical travels, and up you go. Take your time, double check everything 3 times, as you don't want to forget and safely come down. I'm probably
Re: [WISPA] Tranzeo 900 Latency
I'd try putting a netequalizer on the network, setting the connections to 15 or so and let it do it's thing. Here in corn country the big farmers are all using these 900 MHz GPS location units on top of their tractors. Poles and other deployments have gone up everywhere to create the network; grain bins, rural water towers etc ... It's the fastest growing wireless network I've ever seen, and all but trashes 900 MHz. Mike At 10:17 AM 8/6/2009, you wrote: Most of my tranzeo AP's have had to be replaced due to similar things. They started out good, but as people have done more things with the internet they are dying. We're changing them ALL. The tr6000 and 6600 anyway. These days they can't seem to handle more than 4 or 5 subs on them. Sometimes even less. The new firmware fixed the lockups (mostly) but created what you're seeing here. Intermittent REALLY slow performance. Junk. BTW, this happens in places where there is a lot of interference or nearly none. No rhyme or reason that I can figure. Other than the amount of traffic or maybe threads going through them. Good luck, marlon - Original Message - From: John Scrivner j...@scrivner.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Thursday, August 06, 2009 7:09 AM Subject: [WISPA] Tranzeo 900 Latency We have a couple of sectors of 900 MHz Tranzeo which were running fine previously but seem to experience enormous latency at times now. I am talking about upwards of 5000 milliseconds (5 full seconds) for a return on a ping. It is intermittent. I am guessing interference but was wondering if anyone had seen anything else cause this. We have had limited success in dealing with interference in 900 MHz previously so we are hoping there is something else we can try before completely bailing on the band in those locations. Any ideas are appreciated. John Scrivner WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
Recently we had a tropospheric ducting episode which affected ever 2.4 p2mp customers. There was a layer of warmer air actually trapped by a layer of cooler air. This junction looks like a mirror to radio waves and can be steered or bounced quite a bit off target. When I built microwave links in S FL that had to be very reliable, we engineered for space diversity. One 22 mile link at 6GHz used pairs of dishes with 30' separation. It would switch many times in a year, and during tropo events, several times in one night. Gulf areas are more apt to see tropo events. Here in the midwest they are uncommon. This may not be the case with your link, but is worth learning about. Here is a nice site for tropo predictions. http://www.dxinfocentre.com/tropo_car.html Mike At 10:33 PM 8/7/2009, you wrote: So, what causes this crazy loss on all of my 'longer' 5.8 links after dark/overnight? Temp drop? Contraction? Condensation? Moonbeams? More importantly, is there anything I can do about it? Anyone else dealing with it? Links are N-S, E-W and NE-SW, different brands radios, but all in the ISM 5.8 spectrum. Can start as early as 8pm but usually after midnight. Goes until the suns been up 1 to 3 hours. Doesn't happen every day, but seems to be predominant in the summer when we get over 90 degrees with 90% humidity and then the afternoon/evening rain from the buildup. I see it happening to short links also, just doesn't get bad enough to drop. Ideas?[image: 2009-08-07_221007.jpg] Ed Spoon triparish.net / cajun.net Computer Sales Services, Inc. Ph: 985-879-3219 / Fax: 985-876-6789 PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL COMMUNICATION This electronic transmission and any documents attached hereto may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. The information is intended only for use by the recipient named above. If you have received this electronic message in error please notify the sender and delete the electronic message. Any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of information received in error or otherwise is strictly prohibited. Content-Type: image/jpeg; name=2009-08-07_221007.jpg Content-ID: ii_122f807387d6193a X-Attachment-Id: ii_122f807387d6193a WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
At 08:18 AM 8/8/2009, you wrote: Likely to be scintillation. Could be, but in my experience, scintillation is more of a factor mid day. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
Scintillation, for our purposes, is similar to when you see a mirage on a highway in front of you, usually on a hot day, and not uncommon across deserts. The wavering of the light waves is the same thing that happens to radio signals, more-or-less. I once had a canopy, with dish mounted on a high roof shooting across a white flat roof. After the install, the customer would drop lots of packets. We moved it 4 feet higher to change the angle of incidence and it stayed stable. That's one reason all of this seems black magic at times. Regarding the tropo propagation, as a ham radio operator, at times the uhf and vhf bands would open from SW FL all the way across the Gulf of Mexico and we could talk to hams in Texas, Alabama, Louisiana and others at times. Many times this went on for hours and sometimes days. At 10:19 AM 8/8/2009, you wrote: Which definition of scintillation applies? * Scintillation or twinkling are generic terms for rapid variations in apparent brightness or color of a distant luminous object viewed through the atmosphere. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scintillation_(astronomy) * scintillate - twinkle: emit or reflect light in a flickering manner; Does a constellation twinkle more brightly than a single star? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
Scintillation effects cause the radio signals to be refracted. Scintillation is a real world concern for those building microwave links *ESPECIALLY* if the scintillation off of a warm surface is in the fresnel zone of the link, like in my install over a flat roof. The dish was at least 10 feet off the surface of that roof, but shooting over probably 300 feet of flat rubber membrane. Scintillation every afternoon trashed the link until we raised the dish a few feet. At 12:27 PM 8/8/2009, you wrote: LOL... I believe RickG is trying to point out that the correct word is Refraction and not Scintillation.. Jack U. can add his comments into this Heat Humidity cause Refraction to radio waves, ...that is why in long links they use Diversity Antenna Arrays. Regards Faisal Imtiaz -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Saturday, August 08, 2009 1:05 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss Scintillation, for our purposes, is similar to when you see a mirage on a highway in front of you, usually on a hot day, and not uncommon across deserts. The wavering of the light waves is the same thing that happens to radio signals, more-or-less. I once had a canopy, with dish mounted on a high roof shooting across a white flat roof. After the install, the customer would drop lots of packets. We moved it 4 feet higher to change the angle of incidence and it stayed stable. That's one reason all of this seems black magic at times. Regarding the tropo propagation, as a ham radio operator, at times the uhf and vhf bands would open from SW FL all the way across the Gulf of Mexico and we could talk to hams in Texas, Alabama, Louisiana and others at times. Many times this went on for hours and sometimes days. At 10:19 AM 8/8/2009, you wrote: Which definition of scintillation applies? * Scintillation or twinkling are generic terms for rapid variations in apparent brightness or color of a distant luminous object viewed through the atmosphere. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scintillation_(astronomy) * scintillate - twinkle: emit or reflect light in a flickering manner; Does a constellation twinkle more brightly than a single star? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
On long links the information could help you explain some anomalies. From an engineering point of view space diversity is the best way to cope with tropospheric ducting. To a lesser extent, frequency diversity can help maintain a long link since different frequencies are affected slightly differently by the duct. An apt metaphor is two different sized flat rocks will exhibit different skip patterns as they are launched across a pond. At 11:51 AM 8/9/2009, you wrote: So, it would be good to pay attention to the thermal ducting reports as another tool towards a better understanding of issues with your network? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 5.8GHz Link Loss
Has the link changed completely? Or does it come and go with time of day? Are both ends of the link at the same height? If so, the reflection point will be roughly half the path. If not, the reflection point will be closer to the lower antenna. Has anything changed in the terrain at the reflection point? Are these paths urban or rural? Could there be some new growth at the reflection point? If the phenomenon has not passed, it may not be tropospheric ducting. Although ducting can persist for a day or so, if it's still degraded, probably not. If the path is over an urban are it may be Rayleigh fading, or Rician fading if the path is over trees and such. Did someone else show up and start shooting across your path, especially at mid path? There is a wealth of knowledge on this list, but we still need some more info. Did all of the 3? paths degrade similarly? Mike Both links are using Radiowave 3' high performance antennas. One link is a pair of Orthogon units, the other are Trango Tlink10's and a third 20mi link are Trango Atlases. This scenario is setup as an OSPF 'ring'. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] On-line back-up
In my heart, I know you are right. The nature of our business is we buy bandwidth wholesale, and then resell it to others who can't afford to buy dedicated bandwidth. We factor an oversubscription rate, and count on bursty, short lived traffic from users that share the bandwidth. If I could afford to add bandwidth so everybody could maintain a 500 kbps connection for days on end, then I would. But the economics are I pay $350.00 for my first MB and $250.00 for each additional. So a person using the system for backup is utilizing a $175.00 resource for $42.40 a month; IF the back-up software only uses 500 kbps, and I've seen them surge way over that. So, two people running Mosy hog a Meg or more of a precious resource. Four of them, and they've used a couple MB or more. I'm sure you get the point. I do have a Netequalizer in place with fairness rules that will penalize those packets, because they are long duration IF and when the network gets near capacity. So, they get penalized, and grandma downloading pictures from her grand kids also gets penalized, even though her use is bursty and infrequent, just because there is not enough overhead on the pipe BECAUSE of the long duration back-up users. Without the Netequalizer, just a few of these users would bring my network to its knees. I am beginning to think Mosy and their ilk belong in the same camp as Netflix and the P2Pers. Mike At 05:51 AM 8/13/2009, you wrote: Mike wrote: Seems wrong too that a company can make money off using MY bandwidth for hours on end with no compensation. You are getting compensated, by your customer, so now it isn't really your bandwidth, but theirs. The customer is paying you to transport data, be it pictures of kittens, a HDD backup, or something else. If the terms of your contract are such that you can't support this usage, then you should probably look at changing the terms of the contract. However, I would think that it would be pretty easy to look at the flows and put throttling rules in place that limit Carbonite/Mozy/xyz traffic when there is congestion. Josh -- Josh Cheney josh.che...@gmail.com http://www.joshcheney.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Wiliboard grounding
I took the board out of a Deliberant AP2i wireless indoor router, just to experiment. It is one of the Wiliboards. There is no apparent grounding point on this board. Have any of you messed with these? How did you ground it? I soldered a ground wire to the metal shield on the RJ45 jack on the board, but wondered if there was a better way. Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Apartment Buildings
Where is the telephone demark. Access? You're a CLEC, put a small DSLAM in there; Zhone? Or consider Ethernet over power line. Apartment complexes of any size can get really ugly with RF in a hurry. Wireless absolutely? I don't know about the Meraki hardware mentioned, but seem to remember they phone home to a central server, but a mesh system could work. At 01:16 PM 8/20/2009, you wrote: Hi All - I've looked through several of the archives and wasn't finding an answer quickly, but I will apologize if this has been discussed before. Quick history, we are a facilities-based CLEC and provide phone and broadband internet over a dedicated fiber-optic network. Through out our service area (three small business communities) are many apartment buildings. It is easy for us to provide phone service to those units, but Internet is another story as the buildings are not wired for Internet. The cost of pulling wire is too expensive and too time consuming. We are looking for a way to place centrally located access points/wireless routers in these apartments to connect the tenants. Easy enough if we wanted a wide-open connection - but the tough part comes in trying to manager user accounts. We need away that would present a log-in page, and then upon entering valid credentials authenticated back against something like a radius service, they would gain access to the internet. To clarify, we are not looking for a hosted application, but more of a home-grown solution. We have all of the components for billing, which will automatically create a radius account and e-mail, we have online billing and web-mail - the only part is the is missing is the web authentication piece. Thanks for listening Jeff Yette Sales Engineer Slic Network Solutions (www.slic.com) WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Handheld GPS recommendations, anyone?
Early Saturday morning and playing catch-up with the list since we took our daughter to college yesterday. I had to look at my cell phone, which by-the-way woke me up a few minutes ago because a router down message was coming in from my upstream provider, to see what day it was. Reading all these cell phone posts I thought it was Sunday, and I was in church or a Canopy convention. At 10:19 AM 8/21/2009, you wrote: No level, no walkie, no computer, no gps, no camera -- just my iPhone 3GS (with 2 year $86 replacement insurance from squaretrade) Scott WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] VPN's
Ran into the Citrix problem a long time ago. Most data programs are sensitive to dropped packets. The problem with Citrix is that the packets were small. The program was written to work as a database across a local area network. Once WANs became common and the databases were centralized I think the programmers modified the code. Is someone running an old LAN version of Citrix? At 08:02 AM 8/23/2009, you wrote: No one has complained about this from us in years, but when we had some customers on Trango gear, Citrix would always drop. Since we started using gear that has ARQ, we haven't heard a peep from anyone about this. Citrix is VERY sensitive to dropped packets and I believe their was some posts on DSL Reports several years ago on what Citrix administrators could do to lessen this but don't remember any of the specifics. On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 5:43 PM, Josh Luthmanj...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote: That's not a VPN. I know MS terminal services works on dial-up. If he is having issues with that my first place I would look is the server not responding in time. Can you setup a Windows box for a few days next to your core so that the customer can remote into it? On 8/22/09, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: This one is Citrix. Another used the built-in Windows version. On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 10:04 PM, Josh Luthmanj...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote: What type of VPN? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 9:59 PM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: Need some tips on VPN's. I know I've got many people who VPN to their offices with little or no trouble. But, I've had a few that had nothing but problems (dropped connections). I've got one now that is complaining but his connection is very strong (pings without loss avg 2ms direct from AP and 7ms from my MT firewall). MT Ping speed test shows a fairly consistant 3Mbps. He is 3 hops out. Equipment is WRAP2E/StarOS AP, Tranzeo CPQ-19 CPE. Any ideas? -RickG WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Gettin sick of Microtik
If this was one of your remote sites and you suspected virus activity, would you put a sniffer on the AP? How and with what would you analyze the problem? What's the best way to be alert to such happenings? At 08:26 AM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Sounds like you have one or more infected customers that are flooding the AP. Also, 120 customers is not acceptable for a Mikrotik AP. We keep our MT AP's under 50 people (and try to stay around 30). WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Antenna Loads
You can strip the shield back on coax like suggested, but you stand the chance of having too high of a standing wave ratio and harming the RF amp. You can just keep a couple rubber duckies with the right gender changer on the bench, or terminate to a proper dummy load like these: http://www.rfparts.com/dummy.html Mike At 04:10 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: For bench purposes, how hard is it to build antenna loads for the bench. I hate having to hook up a antenna, LMR and Pigtail every time I test a radio. I am pretty new to this Building my own stuff and not buying preconfigured. Can you just solder a 50 Ohm resister to some pig tails? Or is there a better answer? Steve Barnes Manager PCS-WIN RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, vision cleared, ambition inspired, and success achieved. - Helen Keller WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
I bought two of the Northern Tool $79.00 15 watt panels, their $49.00 charge controller, a deep cycle marine battery from Walmart and built my own. So far, the fully charged light comes on every day. The battery should run my two radio repeater for more than a week. Might not be the club way to do it, but it works. Mike At 11:09 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Hi All, Sorry for the cross post. Time is short on this project and I need a lot of help. I've never done a solar project. Never really even looked at them due to the costs I've seen tossed about. Now I have a customer that's willing to purchase the initial equipment needed to cover his community. The ONLY way into the area is a hill that's within sight of my tower and NOT anywhere near power. I'll be able to just run a single MT board with two radios in it for this site. One backhaul and 1 distribution. I'll guess that I'll have less than a 2 amp draw (probably much less than 1 amp in reality). We don't often get long periods of no sun. Could be days of fog or low clouds in the winter, but mostly we'll have a lot of sun. On the foggy or cloudy days we often don't have enough wind to worry about wind generation. I think. So, please clue me in on what to buy, who to buy it from (vendors welcome!) and anything else I'm missing. Thanks all! marlon WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
I was shocked to find the 15W panels at Northern for $79.00. I ordered some and they work great. You need a charge controller, $45.00 to keep the batteries from over charging. You have to get creative with uni-strut and angle iron to make your own mount, or buy them. Batteries are the biggest expense. So to answer your question, yes. At 11:29 AM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Are you really saying that less than 500 bucks will build a solar system good enough for our radios these days? Dude, if that's true I can open up a LOT more doors! marlon WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Location agreement
I am going to plant a 60 foot pole on a fellow's farm. The plan is to light up a river valley which can't get fast Internet. Does anyone have a friendly agreement they've used and would share? Thanks, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Tower sighting
I probably shouldn't admit this but I think I discovered a novel way to find a tower from a distance without using balloons or kites. We put one of those small two bulb rotating 12V emergency lights atop our 180' Rohn 9N this weekend. I had some spare CAT5 already up the tower so split it into two sets of 4 wires and wired it up. Voltage drop calculations showed about 12V drop over 200 feet so I connected it to a 24V 18A supply and to an IP switch. The results exceeded my expectations. You can see the tower when the light is toggled on from over 10 miles. The twirling amber light is unmistakable compared to other tower lights. I should add my calculations were a bit off and it appears to be only running at about 70% or so compared to how fast they spin connected to 12V with a short wire. However, the intensity is good enough for my distances. The light was around 100 bucks, the power supply a hundred, and the CAT5 was already up there. I mounted the light to a sheet of aluminum and mounted that with an articulating mount from an ARC panel to the top of the tower. Fairly small and will no doubt be useful many times before the halogen bulbs need replaced. I am doing a critical install and needed to know where exactly on a property I needed to plant a pole. I had a fellow put me up in a bucket truck at the terminal end, had the light toggled on and found the sweet spot. Just thought I'd pass this on since it was a subject of conversation a while back. Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
This particular setup is mounted to a 4 x 6 x 4 Wells Cargo enclosed trailer. I painted it bright white and added my logo and on one side Solar Powered Wireless. I park it at events and provide free WiFi. I park it downtown every Friday for Farmers Market and the name recognition has been outstanding. I have a 40 foot Wonder Pole mounted to the side I swing into position and hoist a Deliberant panel up. Inside the trailer I have a Deliberant AP2i doing DHCP and giving out access. I don't push the pole up farther than 15 or 20 feet for events, but will run it all the way up for site surveys on occasion. Both radios pull less than an Amp total and the system supplies 2.5 Amp in good sun. The 800 Amp hour battery will run it for 800 hours? Mike At 08:04 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Interesting. What radios are you powering this with? Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 10:50:14 -0500 I bought two of the Northern Tool $79.00 15 watt panels, their $49.00 charge controller, a deep cycle marine battery from Walmart and built my own. So far, the fully charged light comes on every day. The battery should run my two radio repeater for more than a week. Might not be the club way to do it, but it works. Mike At 11:09 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Hi All, Sorry for the cross post. Time is short on this project and I need a lot of help. I've never done a solar project. Never really even looked at them due to the costs I've seen tossed about. Now I have a customer that's willing to purchase the initial equipment needed to cover his community. The ONLY way into the area is a hill that's within sight of my tower and NOT anywhere near power. I'll be able to just run a single MT board with two radios in it for this site. One backhaul and 1 distribution. I'll guess that I'll have less than a 2 amp draw (probably much less than 1 amp in reality). We don't often get long periods of no sun. Could be days of fog or low clouds in the winter, but mostly we'll have a lot of sun. On the foggy or cloudy days we often don't have enough wind to worry about wind generation. I think. So, please clue me in on what to buy, who to buy it from (vendors welcome!) and anything else I'm missing. Thanks all! marlon -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
http://www.wonderpole.com/wp640_630.html I have had very good service from this device. Don't over-tighten the section rings in the field unless you have a pair of channel locks with you. Don't ask me how I know that. At 01:59 AM 8/26/2009, you wrote: Wonder Pole? Please tell me more! Mike wrote: This particular setup is mounted to a 4 x 6 x 4 Wells Cargo enclosed trailer. I painted it bright white and added my logo and on one side Solar Powered Wireless. I park it at events and provide free WiFi. I park it downtown every Friday for Farmers Market and the name recognition has been outstanding. I have a 40 foot Wonder Pole mounted to the side I swing into position and hoist a Deliberant panel up. Inside the trailer I have a Deliberant AP2i doing DHCP and giving out access. I don't push the pole up farther than 15 or 20 feet for events, but will run it all the way up for site surveys on occasion. Both radios pull less than an Amp total and the system supplies 2.5 Amp in good sun. The 800 Amp hour battery will run it for 800 hours? Mike At 08:04 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Interesting. What radios are you powering this with? Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Mike mailto:m...@aweiowa.comm...@aweiowa.com Reply-To: WISPA General List mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 10:50:14 -0500 I bought two of the Northern Tool $79.00 15 watt panels, their $49.00 charge controller, a deep cycle marine battery from Walmart and built my own. So far, the fully charged light comes on every day. The battery should run my two radio repeater for more than a week. Might not be the club way to do it, but it works. Mike At 11:09 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Hi All, Sorry for the cross post. Time is short on this project and I need a lot of help. I've never done a solar project. Never really even looked at them due to the costs I've seen tossed about. Now I have a customer that's willing to purchase the initial equipment needed to cover his community. The ONLY way into the area is a hill that's within sight of my tower and NOT anywhere near power. I'll be able to just run a single MT board with two radios in it for this site. One backhaul and 1 distribution. I'll guess that I'll have less than a 2 amp draw (probably much less than 1 amp in reality). We don't often get long periods of no sun. Could be days of fog or low clouds in the winter, but mostly we'll have a lot of sun. On the foggy or cloudy days we often don't have enough wind to worry about wind generation. I think. So, please clue me in on what to buy, who to buy it from (vendors welcome!) and anything else I'm missing. Thanks all! marlon -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out http://www.info-ed.com/wireless.htmlwww.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: mailto:wireless@wispa.orgwireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelesshttp://lists.wispa.org/mailman
Re: [WISPA] solar site
I'd love to add that to my trailer. What is the make? At 11:36 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: That sounds like great public service and a way to get recognized too! If you want to see something that really gets attention, have a look at my site survey/portable AP rig. http://ralphfowler.com I have been reluctant to put signs on it though, for obvious reasons. (people already think I am toting a rocket launcher) LOL Ralph -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:57 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site This particular setup is mounted to a 4 x 6 x 4 Wells Cargo enclosed trailer. I painted it bright white and added my logo and on one side Solar Powered Wireless. I park it at events and provide free WiFi. I park it downtown every Friday for Farmers Market and the name recognition has been outstanding. I have a 40 foot Wonder Pole mounted to the side I swing into position and hoist a Deliberant panel up. Inside the trailer I have a Deliberant AP2i doing DHCP and giving out access. I don't push the pole up farther than 15 or 20 feet for events, but will run it all the way up for site surveys on occasion. Both radios pull less than an Amp total and the system supplies 2.5 Amp in good sun. The 800 Amp hour battery will run it for 800 hours? Mike At 08:04 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Interesting. What radios are you powering this with? Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 10:50:14 -0500 I bought two of the Northern Tool $79.00 15 watt panels, their $49.00 charge controller, a deep cycle marine battery from Walmart and built my own. So far, the fully charged light comes on every day. The battery should run my two radio repeater for more than a week. Might not be the club way to do it, but it works. Mike At 11:09 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Hi All, Sorry for the cross post. Time is short on this project and I need a lot of help. I've never done a solar project. Never really even looked at them due to the costs I've seen tossed about. Now I have a customer that's willing to purchase the initial equipment needed to cover his community. The ONLY way into the area is a hill that's within sight of my tower and NOT anywhere near power. I'll be able to just run a single MT board with two radios in it for this site. One backhaul and 1 distribution. I'll guess that I'll have less than a 2 amp draw (probably much less than 1 amp in reality). We don't often get long periods of no sun. Could be days of fog or low clouds in the winter, but mostly we'll have a lot of sun. On the foggy or cloudy days we often don't have enough wind to worry about wind generation. I think. So, please clue me in on what to buy, who to buy it from (vendors welcome!) and anything else I'm missing. Thanks all! marlon -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless
Re: [WISPA] solar site
It depends on how high you push it up. I *HAVE* had it all the way up with a 12 panel, low wind condition, one person on the ground and the other sitting on the gable end of a roof for testing. The top two sections get a little wispy (pun intended) for big panels, or to leave up. I regularly put it 20' - 26' and leave it with a panel attached. They sell a drive-on mount with a socket for holding it. I just mounted mine through the trailer side with one of those nice alloy dish mounts so I can rotate it to about 45 degrees for transport. When I set it up, I rotate upright, put the end into a socket I made from one of those floor PVC toilet bowl flanges. Eyeball along a building or vertical surface in two planes and you get the whole thing somewhat vertical. Above the mount, on the side of the trailer, I put two stainless eye bolts. Once I get the mast vertical, I put a custom fitted piece of wood with an arc cut in the end to fit the pole, between the pole and trailer and lash it with a bungy cord. Gives it a third attachment point along the trailer side; ground, middle, near the top. It's raining pretty hard right now or I'd take a picture. I can set it up on Friday in about 20 minutes at the market. At 08:03 AM 8/26/2009, you wrote: Would the wonder pole handle a wind load of an NS2/Canopy? What about a massive Arc MT combo? How do you mount the base? Can this be made mobile/temporary? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 8:55 AM, ralph ralphli...@bsrg.org wrote: Were you speaking of the pneumatic mast in my pics, or of the wonder pole? Mine is a Wil-burt or Wilburt and they cost a bunch- like $5,000.00 new. But since the DTV rollout is complete, there should be surplus ENG trucks around with these masts. The TV stations started keeping their old trucks to use for testing. I actually had one given to me complete with pole and generator. I could not go get it and the station decided to keep it for DTV testing. Call around to your local stations and ask about surplus ENG trucks. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I'd love to add that to my trailer. What is the make? At 11:36 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: That sounds like great public service and a way to get recognized too! If you want to see something that really gets attention, have a look at my site survey/portable AP rig. http://ralphfowler.com I have been reluctant to put signs on it though, for obvious reasons. (people already think I am toting a rocket launcher) LOL Ralph -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:57 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site This particular setup is mounted to a 4 x 6 x 4 Wells Cargo enclosed trailer. I painted it bright white and added my logo and on one side Solar Powered Wireless. I park it at events and provide free WiFi. I park it downtown every Friday for Farmers Market and the name recognition has been outstanding. I have a 40 foot Wonder Pole mounted to the side I swing into position and hoist a Deliberant panel up. Inside the trailer I have a Deliberant AP2i doing DHCP and giving out access. I don't push the pole up farther than 15 or 20 feet for events, but will run it all the way up for site surveys on occasion. Both radios pull less than an Amp total and the system supplies 2.5 Amp in good sun. The 800 Amp hour battery will run it for 800 hours? Mike At 08:04 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: Interesting. What radios are you powering this with? Scottie -- Original Message -- From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Tue, 25 Aug 2009 10:50:14 -0500 I bought two of the Northern Tool $79.00 15 watt panels, their $49.00 charge controller, a deep cycle marine battery from Walmart and built my own. So far, the fully charged light comes on every day. The battery should run my two radio repeater for more than a week. Might not be the club way to do it, but it works. Mike At 11:09 PM 8/24/2009, you wrote: Hi All, Sorry for the cross post. Time is short on this project and I need a lot of help. I've never done a solar project. Never really even looked at them due to the costs I've seen tossed about. Now I have a customer that's willing to purchase
Re: [WISPA] solar site
The solar panels look just like the $79.00 Northern ones. I am curious how they built the PVC frame. Not a bad deal considering it also has the controller *AND* an inverter you could keep in the truck to power your laptop charger. 60 watts is probably overkill for most of our applications except Marlon's. :-) You could even wire the four of them series/parallel to get 24V for a long CAT5 run. This stuff has really come down in price the past few months thanks to the Northern/Home Depot/Harbor Freight Chinese importers. This IS a deal maker for those remote repeater sites some of us have been contemplating. Yes Marlon, you CAN solar power a site for less than $500.00 if you're willing to do some creative work. Gotta love it. At 08:43 AM 8/26/2009, you wrote: Home depot's site. go figure. $329 a Solar Back Up Kit (as they call it.) 60 Watts. $329 http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051langId=-1catalogId=10053productId=100658288 Mike wrote: It depends on how high you push it up. I *HAVE* had it all the way up with a 12 panel, low wind condition, one person on the ground and the other sitting on the gable end of a roof for testing. The top two sections get a little wispy (pun intended) for big panels, or to leave up. I regularly put it 20' - 26' and leave it with a panel attached. They sell a drive-on mount with a socket for holding it. I just mounted mine through the trailer side with one of those nice alloy dish mounts so I can rotate it to about 45 degrees for transport. When I set it up, I rotate upright, put the end into a socket I made from one of those floor PVC toilet bowl flanges. Eyeball along a building or vertical surface in two planes and you get the whole thing somewhat vertical. Above the mount, on the side of the trailer, I put two stainless eye bolts. Once I get the mast vertical, I put a custom fitted piece of wood with an arc cut in the end to fit the pole, between the pole and trailer and lash it with a bungy cord. Gives it a third attachment point along the trailer side; ground, middle, near the top. It's raining pretty hard right now or I'd take a picture. I can set it up on Friday in about 20 minutes at the market. At 08:03 AM 8/26/2009, you wrote: Would the wonder pole handle a wind load of an NS2/Canopy? What about a massive Arc MT combo? How do you mount the base? Can this be made mobile/temporary? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Wed, Aug 26, 2009 at 8:55 AM, ralph ralphli...@bsrg.org wrote: Were you speaking of the pneumatic mast in my pics, or of the wonder pole? Mine is a Wil-burt or Wilburt and they cost a bunch- like $5,000.00 new. But since the DTV rollout is complete, there should be surplus ENG trucks around with these masts. The TV stations started keeping their old trucks to use for testing. I actually had one given to me complete with pole and generator. I could not go get it and the station decided to keep it for DTV testing. Call around to your local stations and ask about surplus ENG trucks. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 5:40 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site I'd love to add that to my trailer. What is the make? At 11:36 PM 8/25/2009, you wrote: That sounds like great public service and a way to get recognized too! If you want to see something that really gets attention, have a look at my site survey/portable AP rig. http://ralphfowler.com I have been reluctant to put signs on it though, for obvious reasons. (people already think I am toting a rocket launcher) LOL Ralph -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 10:57 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] solar site This particular setup is mounted to a 4 x 6 x 4 Wells Cargo enclosed trailer. I painted it bright white and added my logo and on one side Solar Powered Wireless. I park it at events and provide free WiFi. I park it downtown every Friday for Farmers Market and the name recognition has been outstanding. I have a 40 foot Wonder Pole mounted to the side I swing into position and hoist a Deliberant panel up. Inside the trailer I have a Deliberant AP2i doing DHCP and giving out access. I don't push the pole up farther than 15 or 20 feet for events, but will run it all the way up for site surveys on occasion. Both radios pull less than an Amp total and the system supplies
Re: [WISPA] Antenna Mount extensions
'splain please! How is that configured? Thanks. At 10:50 AM 8/27/2009, you wrote: ... We now mount 2 pieces of 1-5/8 Unistrut with 1/4 lags and clamp the pipe to it. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
Instead of talking 33.3 days and 24 hours of sun, let's just take an average day. At optimal output, and for the sake of argument, let's say our 60W rated panels only produce 45W; optimally. Let's lob off 12% of that to satisfy the naysayers and devil's advocates, and to account for inefficiencies. We have a power output of close enough to 40W. Not all can do it, but for the short run repeater, and with two radios, let's say we run it at 12V, while loosing less heat at the voltage regulator on the radio. Since we're rounding numbers, we'll call that 3.3A. The radios require .8A. During optimal conditions, there are 2.5A free to charge the battery. On our average day, we have 6 hours of optimal sun, maybe more, maybe less. We have gained 15AH of charge to send to our battery. For 3 more hours of the day we will receive less than optimal output -- 2.5A, for another gain of 5.1AH. We now have 20.1AH more than we need to run the radios. We will get another hour of diminished 1A or less output but will not consider that here. So, during our 24 hours, we are either generating enough, or excess for 9 hours. We have to store power for the 15 hours where our system is not generating power. We have to provide 12AH for dark time. We have already generated an excess of 20.1AH. We can provide 8.11AH on our average day to keep our battery charged. If the 12V storage battery is capable of 800AH, and it is topped off with our system it CAN keep the repeater going for 41 days. If you monitor battery condition, you should be able to see a net loss coming way before it shuts down the repeater. Assumptions: We are using efficient radios capable of running at 12V or less. Let's say both are Atheros based Deliberant radios. The CAT5 run to our radios is insignificant, and not some 200' run. Hams, geeks and wisp owners are cut from similar cloth. Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] solar site
That's one point I was making with my fuzzy math repeater example. :-) I think the Wili card radios in that repeater system will operate down to 7V. I may need more than toys if I tried to use legacy 48V stuff and the resultant voltage conversions. At 10:08 AM 8/29/2009, you wrote: The best way to design an off-grid radio system is to take advantage of every chance you find to avoid having to generate a watt in the first place. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] Non-disclosure
If you have customers on a remote repeater site, and have agreed to pay a percentage to the landowner as compensation, how do you prove to them how many customers are on that system? Anyone have a short non-disclosure paragraph they've added to a location agreement? Would you share? Friendly Regards, Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik Processor Load
Couldn't you run a bridge computer with something like Untangle running to see what the traffic contains at the tower site? I've never run Untangle, but have considered setting up such a device to put at a troublesome node for analysis. Thoughts? Mike At 07:41 AM 9/2/2009, you wrote: Their isn't any way to see the processes running on a MikroTik unit. If you have run away cpu load. Create a supout.rif file and send it to MikroTik support and they can figure it out. The supout.rif contains info I understand about running processes but they are the only ones that have the tool to view the content of the .rif file. /Eje Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -Original Message- From: Scott Reed scottr...@onlyinternet.net Date: Wed, 02 Sep 2009 07:10:19 To: WISPA General Listwireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Mikrotik Processor Load I checked all of this before posting. That is the reason for the original question about how to see processor load. I was hoping someone would know that Mikrotik had provided something like top (for Linux) or Task Manager (for Windows) that shows the processes using the processor. Would make it a lot easier to find that the problem is a filter rule or something like that. Tom DeReggi wrote: Are you talking about a 233 mhz or 400 mhz 532? Well the first step is how much traffic is teh RF sending? 2 mbps in an Eth port, could be 15 mbps going out a RF port if lots of retransmissions due to noise. We typically saw 233Mhz 532 peak out at full CPU utulization at 18mbps or so. If two PTP links, its possible the two links are interfering with each other. As well, if you are using WDS Slave (true bridging) accross the RF paths, there is not coordiantion to prevent self interference, and it uses much more CPU processing than non-WDS routed modes. Not saying it the problem, but additional factors to investigate. As well, look for high rate of small packets, for possible DOS attacks. Its real common to see ssh attacks. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Scott Reed scottr...@onlyinternet.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Tuesday, September 01, 2009 7:24 PM Subject: [WISPA] Mikrotik Processor Load Anyone know an easy way to figure out what a 532 with 2 PtP links on it would be running at 80+%? No queues, no filters. Moving about 2Mbps from the 2 backhauls down the wire. -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x4000 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.74/2339 - Release Date: 09/01/09 06:52:00 -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x4000 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Senate Bill
Was it Prodigy, AOL or Gore who invented the Internet? Or was it Compuserve? Man we've come a long ways since ALL of those. At 10:53 AM 9/3/2009, you wrote: I guess it depends on your definition of Internet. The ARPANET model doesn't really show what we have today. For me it's about TCP/IP, communication globally from the home, the capacity for anyone to present what they want nearly instantly. 20 years could you put a video online and share it with the planet in less then a minute? That would have been a joke back then. Anyways..back to the government not doing its job... Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 11:50 AM, RickG rgunder...@gmail.com wrote: It was more about national defense way back in the 60s -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARPANET Commercial didnt enter the picture until much later. -RickG On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 12:49 AM, Josh Luthmanj...@imaginenetworksllc.com wrote: Actually Internet wasn't really made for anything. If you want to tie it to any one thing, commercial purposes was the primary focus. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Internet Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Thu, Sep 3, 2009 at 12:01 AM, Kurt Fankhauser k...@wavelinc.com wrote: Wasn't the internet made for the exact opposite of what this bill is trying to give him power to due? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 10:44 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Senate Bill He'll have to pry my radios from my cold, dead fingers! What I cant figure out is why we are giving this guy so much power? At any rate, the comments are interesting: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/28/senate-president-emergency-contro l-internet/comments/ -RickG http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/28/senate-president-emergency-contro%0Al-internet/comments/%0A-RickG On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 10:27 PM, John J. Thomasjtho...@quarnet.com wrote: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/28/senate-president-emergency-contro l-internet/ http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/28/senate-president-emergency-contro%0Al-internet/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives:
Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question
I'm curious if anybody has explored using circular polarization at 900 MHz for some of the reasons posted in this thread? At 10:42 AM 9/3/2009, you wrote: Lol, and the answer is because horizontal usually has less noise. Whcih has nothing to do with the size of the wave cycle. Unless someone knows something I dont - which is always possible. On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 11:15 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: heh, the question was why folks doing 900 preferred horizontal -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 9:41 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: Folks like horizontal for 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long I knew that but couldnt figure out why you specified horizontal. I guess you might have said Folks like 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long. Thanks! -RickG On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 9:51 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: same size. The electromagnetic wave is the same, polarity refers to the orientation of the wave. up and down or side to side. 13 inches is the wavelength (length of a single cycle). -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 7:33 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question The wave size of vertical would be different? -RickG On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: Folks like horizontal for 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 11:02 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question But look at all the experience you are gaining :) On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 10:36 AM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: Why horizontal polarity? Cause I'm a total idiot when it comes to 900mhz and as my luck usually runs, if I go by the book nothing works until I do what I'm not supposed to do. But, also as my luck runs, the opposite of what I try first will work So it actually won't matter what I do including sitting the antennas 5 feet in front of each other, it will never work the first time out. :) Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tim Edwards Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 12:33 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question I'm with Chuck, much better performance with the Trango vs. Mikrotik in my experience. Why horizontal pol? Vertical cuts through the foliage much bettter, at least with the NorCal foliage we have here. tim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Tim Edwards, Chief Engineer t...@telescience.net TeleScience Networks http://telescience.net 11101 Hiway 1, #102415-663-8891 Point Reyes Station, CA 94956-1375 =-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Chuck Hogg wrote: I find that the Trango 900 can handle the noise and capacity much better than MikroTik/XR9. I have a few hundred on Trango and it works better imo than XR9's. Canopy's GPS synch is the only reason I would prefer their 900MHz option. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:49 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question I'm actually about to test something similar in a few days. We have a 2.5 mile link to put in with half a mile of it through trees with .25 miles of that running right over a creek. Doing it on the cheap, or trying to. Have 2 Mikrotik 411 boards on both sides running a transparent bridge using XR9 cards attached to a pac wireless grid antenna setup with horizontal polarity. The antennas are up and the boxes are configured, just have to go out tonight or tomorrow and run power to them and try to see what kind of throughput we can get, if any. Haven't tried it before but we'll see. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Patrick D. Nix, Jr Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 3:38 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] 900Mhz question We've been using the Trango 900Mhz gear and are familiar with
Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question
Cordless phones, baby monitors, PAGING SYSTEMS, and the bane for rural Iowa users is the new GPS positioning systems on every big farmer's tractor. They make 900 MHz worthless even with filters; they use the entire allotment. Telemetry, talking refrigerators, and other consumer devices also use 900 MHz. It also propagates much better than 2.4 so noise can be coming from a LONG ways away. At 10:55 AM 9/3/2009, you wrote: I am curious about 900 noise. My 2.4 gear sees noise levels of about -98 to -102, but the XR9 setup I have with H120 sector see -80 to -85 or so. I am in a small town of 5000 and I am curious what might be generating such a high noise floor. Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Thursday, September 03, 2009 10:42 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question Lol, and the answer is because horizontal usually has less noise. Whcih has nothing to do with the size of the wave cycle. Unless someone knows something I dont - which is always possible. On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 11:15 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: heh, the question was why folks doing 900 preferred horizontal -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 9:41 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: Folks like horizontal for 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long I knew that but couldnt figure out why you specified horizontal. I guess you might have said Folks like 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long. Thanks! -RickG On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 9:51 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: same size. The electromagnetic wave is the same, polarity refers to the orientation of the wave. up and down or side to side. 13 inches is the wavelength (length of a single cycle). -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 7:33 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question The wave size of vertical would be different? -RickG On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Paul Ricepaul.r...@boomerang-networks.com wrote: Folks like horizontal for 900 MHz due to the size of the wave cycle approx 13 inches long -- From: RickG rgunder...@gmail.com Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 11:02 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question But look at all the experience you are gaining :) On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 10:36 AM, Robert Westrobert.w...@just-micro.com wrote: Why horizontal polarity? Cause I'm a total idiot when it comes to 900mhz and as my luck usually runs, if I go by the book nothing works until I do what I'm not supposed to do. But, also as my luck runs, the opposite of what I try first will work So it actually won't matter what I do including sitting the antennas 5 feet in front of each other, it will never work the first time out. :) Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tim Edwards Sent: Wednesday, September 02, 2009 12:33 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question I'm with Chuck, much better performance with the Trango vs. Mikrotik in my experience. Why horizontal pol? Vertical cuts through the foliage much bettter, at least with the NorCal foliage we have here. tim -- =-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Tim Edwards, Chief Engineer t...@telescience.net TeleScience Networks http://telescience.net 11101 Hiway 1, #102415-663-8891 Point Reyes Station, CA 94956-1375 =-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Chuck Hogg wrote: I find that the Trango 900 can handle the noise and capacity much better than MikroTik/XR9. I have a few hundred on Trango and it works better imo than XR9's. Canopy's GPS synch is the only reason I would prefer their 900MHz option. Regards, Chuck Hogg Shelby Broadband 502-722-9292 ch...@shelbybb.com http://www.shelbybb.com -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Robert West Sent: Monday, August 31, 2009 4:49 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] 900Mhz question I'm actually about to test something similar in a few days. We have a 2.5 mile link to put in with half a mile of it through trees with .25 miles of that
Re: [WISPA] Ever see Ethernet cables fail so that ...
Curious if you blew any water out of the low end of the cat5? I had a similar thing happen one time. It was atmospheric pumping caused by pressure changes; at least that was the theory. At 06:18 PM 9/5/2009, you wrote: Believe me, I tried replacing the end connectors before rerunning the cables. On Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 6:44 PM, Scott Reedscottr...@onlyinternet.net wrote: Yes, that is possible. Could also be the connectors. IDC (Insulation Displacement Connects) can work loose and/or corrode, especially when subjected to unnatural stress such as lightning. rabbtux rabbtux wrote: All, I have a sub that has had Several failures. The last one is understandable, in that there was a direct lightning strike in their yard winthin 75' of CPE (NS5). Its Ethernet port was bad, yet the radio was fine?? The one before that, the power company worked on the power and said their oops may have caused problems. It did even though my equipment was plugged into a UPS. They now have a brand new quality surge protector for the equipment. Anyway, the customer calls and says no internet, and that the POE box light is not on. Fine, I instruct customer to remove compatible power from the router we installed and plug into the injector. She does, and I see pings from the AP. I go on site to replace power supply later that day. I find No ethernet connectivity thru the injector to the NS5. I also find the workstation plugged into router has no ethernet connectivity to the router. I plug my laptop into router and verify that all link lites seem to work on all ports, yet the usb-ethernet adapter I installed 2 weeks ago is not seen by the workstation. yes I tried several usb ports. A couple weeks ago, I verified that our outdoor cable was good. Now as I look for answers, the only suspect is the ethernet cable. It has been in service 4-5 years, and I noticed a few staples had pulled out and left a 3 foot loop between the carport and house dangling. My theory is that this cable has an intermittent short that has fried the power supply, the ethernet port on the NS5, and the workstation ethernet port plugged into the router?? QUESTION: Have you guys seen stuff like this happen? Because this is a Bus. sub I will head out there shortly to 'finish up'. I will rip out and replace our cable, the NS5 , and probably the usb-ethernet port we put in. Sure would be nice to know I've hit the right things. your feedback is greatly appreciated! Thanks, Marshall Rabbit Meadows Technology WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.78/2347 - Release Date: 09/05/09 05:51:00 -- Scott Reed Sr. Systems Engineer GAB Midwest 1-800-363-1544 x4000 Cell: 260-273-7239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Some great photos
And the Wireless Internet antenna is a discone. Unity gain, omnidirectional. It looks more like a scanner antenna or multiband close comm antenna. At 10:31 PM 9/6/2009, you wrote: It should be clear, I posted that link with no thought to politics, it was simply to show our troops in action in a field that each one of us is a part of, or is very close to us. Please folks, lets not make it political. Don't take your organs to heaven, heaven knows we need them down here! Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 2.4 Frequency coordination
Good idea, but it won't let me. I receive this message: message=bad band and/or channel, see 'wireless info' for supported channels;code=4 Apparently, it IS possible with the Wili cards, but still don't have a total answer to my query. Can anybody help a fellow WISPA member? Hasn't anybody thought about doing this or is doing this? You could squeeze a couple more sectors on a tower if this is possible. Mike At 08:36 AM 9/9/2009, you wrote: I believe you can but you'll need to use the CLI Int wireless set wlan1 frequency=2406 On 9/9/09, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: I have some questions on the frequency agility of Mikrotik equipment, FCC regs, and frequency coordination. There are 3 non-overlapping channels at 2.4G; 1, 6 and 11. That makes an assumption we are using 20MHz channel size. Some of the newer radios can run 10MHz and 5MHz channel sizes. Using the RouterOS interface, the only choice for channel selection is the center frequency of each of the 11 channels available in the US. So, the only choice, say for channel 1 is 2412MHz. When using 20MHz channel size, the RF will occupy 2401 to 2423 according to FCC rules, on channel 1. If I want to deploy a device capable of running 10MHz channel width, is there a way to set the channel frequency to say 2406? The signal would occupy 2401 to 2411, and still be within the definition of channel 1. Would a Mikrotik Extended Frequency License allow this frequency agility? Would every CPE connected to such an AP also be required to have the license? Is this within FCC rules? Are any of you doing this? If so, what equipment are you using? Thanks! Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 2.4 Frequency coordination
And when I look at wireless info, I see this: 2ghz-b-channels=2412:0,2417:0,2422:0,2427:0,2432:0,2437:0,2442:0,2447:0, 2452:0,2457:0,2462:0 So the Extended Frequency License will allow me to modify these? Any other way? I'd hate to have to buy an extra license for every CPE device. I would however buy one for the AP. It may steer me away from using MT for these customer sites IF I decide to try this. Mike *** Good idea, but it won't let me. I receive this message: message=bad band and/or channel, see 'wireless info' for supported channels;code=4 Apparently, it IS possible with the Wili cards, but still don't have a total answer to my query. Can anybody help a fellow WISPA member? Hasn't anybody thought about doing this or is doing this? You could squeeze a couple more sectors on a tower if this is possible. Mike At 08:36 AM 9/9/2009, you wrote: I believe you can but you'll need to use the CLI Int wireless set wlan1 frequency=2406 On 9/9/09, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: I have some questions on the frequency agility of Mikrotik equipment, FCC regs, and frequency coordination. There are 3 non-overlapping channels at 2.4G; 1, 6 and 11. That makes an assumption we are using 20MHz channel size. Some of the newer radios can run 10MHz and 5MHz channel sizes. Using the RouterOS interface, the only choice for channel selection is the center frequency of each of the 11 channels available in the US. So, the only choice, say for channel 1 is 2412MHz. When using 20MHz channel size, the RF will occupy 2401 to 2423 according to FCC rules, on channel 1. If I want to deploy a device capable of running 10MHz channel width, is there a way to set the channel frequency to say 2406? The signal would occupy 2401 to 2411, and still be within the definition of channel 1. Would a Mikrotik Extended Frequency License allow this frequency agility? Would every CPE connected to such an AP also be required to have the license? Is this within FCC rules? Are any of you doing this? If so, what equipment are you using? Thanks! Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] 2.4 Frequency coordination
Thanks for the explanation Jack, and thanks to others for their input. The radios I am finding are agile down to 5 MHz. So the example I used would put the center of a sub channel 1 device at 2407. If it is a 10MHz device, their very well could be spurious emissions below 2400, but not likely. With a 5 MHz channel size, the emissions should be well above the band edge. I know there is a definition of frequency hopping devices, and of 802.11 specs. Just because there are 11 channels designated for the US, one doesn't have to comply with that particular channel spacing, as long as the device is not transmitting outside the band, either lower or upper, right? When the 802.11 devices first came out, we were able to tune them to use the amateur allocation at 2.4. We were able to build a wireless network for ham use on ham frequencies. And just as a point of reference, I DO NOT feel comfortable changing the country code on the interface to allow additional frequency agility. I might however try a 5 MHz channel setting at 2407 unless I'm told one must adhere to the US channel spacing. I would use a spectrum analyzer and look at the signal. Now where did my P3D stuff go anyway? Mike At 02:08 PM 9/9/2009, you wrote: Be Careful!! Selecting another Country Code is unwise if you are going to operate near the band edges because of spurs (spurious emissions). Here's an explanation. A 20-MHz (or 10 MHz or 5 MHz) channel is really more than 20 MHz (or 10 MHz or 5 MHz) wide when you consider that all of the 20 MHz (10, 5) energy does not remain within the channel. A little bit of it spills over outside the channel. That spill-over can cause interference to the legal users of the frequency space just below or above the band. If they complain and the FCC investigates why you are on center frequency that is too close to the edge of the band with spurs spilling over outside the band then you are likely looking at a pretty stiff fine. During the equipment certification process (anyone remember that?) spurious emission levels are tested and verified to be below a level that will cause an interference problem but if you select a non-US country code and choose a center frequency too close to the band edge with spurs extending outside the band at too high a level than you will have no one to blame but yourself. So be careful. If you (Mike) select a 2406 center frequency with a 10-MHz wide channel, the signal doesn't necessarily remain within the definition of Channel 1. The only way to be sure that your spurious emission levels are legal is to test that combination in a lab and measure the spurious levels at each frequency. Your idea of using narrower channels is OK (although keep in mind the throughput capacity of the narrower channels is less than a standard-width channel) - just don't use a narrower channel that is too near the edge of a band. How near is too near?? Lab testing is the only way to find out. jack Cameron Kilton wrote: I have you tried just setting your MT to a different country and see if it becomes available? I know brazil gives you access to above the 2462 limit which is nice because we can you much more above that in unlicensed spectrum. -Cameron -Original Message- From: mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.orgwireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2009 2:07 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] 2.4 Frequency coordination And when I look at wireless info, I see this: 2ghz-b-channels=2412:0,2417:0,2422:0,2427:0,2432:0,2437:0,2442:0,2447:0, 2452:0,2457:0,2462:0 So the Extended Frequency License will allow me to modify these? Any other way? I'd hate to have to buy an extra license for every CPE device. I would however buy one for the AP. It may steer me away from using MT for these customer sites IF I decide to try this. Mike *** Good idea, but it won't let me. I receive this message: message=bad band and/or channel, see 'wireless info' for supported channels;code=4 Apparently, it IS possible with the Wili cards, but still don't have a total answer to my query. Can anybody help a fellow WISPA member? Hasn't anybody thought about doing this or is doing this? You could squeeze a couple more sectors on a tower if this is possible. Mike At 08:36 AM 9/9/2009, you wrote: I believe you can but you'll need to use the CLI Int wireless set wlan1 frequency=2406 On 9/9/09, Mike mailto:m...@aweiowa.comm...@aweiowa.com wrote: I have some questions on the frequency agility of Mikrotik equipment, FCC regs, and frequency coordination. There are 3 non-overlapping channels at 2.4G; 1, 6 and 11. That makes an assumption we are using 20MHz channel size. Some of the newer radios can run 10MHz and 5MHz channel sizes. Using the RouterOS interface, the only choice for channel selection is the center frequency
Re: [WISPA] Need Lightning Arrestor Advice
I'm not sure which Ethernet surge protection I'd recommend, but PolyPhaser does it best, in my opinion, for RF. At 10:51 PM 9/16/2009, you wrote: Hello all, I am part of a group installing a wireless network in rural Honduras for a growing educational system with a chapter of Engineers Without Borders (http://ewb-usa.org). We are creating a 7 node wireless network spanning a 3 mile radius. Since Honduras is very prone to rain storms and lightning strikes, we need to protect our equipment from the lightning. We plan on doing the following: 1) Place an arrestor between the radio and the antenna 2) Place an arrestor in the POE injector Some of the following criteria we are thinking: Amount of lightning strikes: One or Many Insertion Loss: Small as possbile Frequency : 2.4-5.8 GHZ When searching the internet, I see many many types of lightning arrestors given my criteria. Does anyone have any recommendations through their experience with lightning arrestors? What do you use? Thanks! James WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions
In my experience NO USB wireless dongle has been without their problems. I avoid them like H1N1. At 09:47 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote: I bought a bunch of those a year ago for 6 bucks each. They use the Ralink chip. A year ago the drivers were a mess but run okay now, at least the ones I still have. Mine are black, not white. Small though. The driver also supports 5ghz so I thought maybe the ralink chip supported both and the 5 was disabled. I never got around to looking into that, would have been nice to have a usb adapter that was dual band and under 10 bucks. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 8:40 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions http://www.edimax.us/ EW-7207APg -RickG On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 5:35 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net wrote: I'm looking for suggestions on an 802.11 router with multiple LAN ports where I can disable the NAT capability... making it a bridge. I used to use the TrendNet TEW-452BRP, but it's EOL and the TEW-633GR is too expensive ($100). I'm looking for something in the $30 - $45 area. No Linksys, I don't want to tarnish my name. :-p - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions
Not sure if Linksys has fixed it, but we determined a while back the lockup problem with them was the lack of robustness in their power supply. They work fine in the city where the electricity doesn't sag or spike, but in the country they are always locking up. Wind blows trees against lines, farmer turns on huge corn dryer ... At 11:13 PM 9/20/2009, you wrote: We're a Linksys dealer but the new routers suck, in my opinion. Better than the belkin or netgear though so for home use, they are fine. We keep stock firmware on the home users and the new ones don't support DD-WRT for the most part anyhow. And yeah, it's easy to walk them through things over the phone with the Linksys, the netgears are a nightmare with their auto-config crap. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Kevin Neal Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 11:04 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions WRT54G post Cisco buyout, yes, major major problems. One of the things I tell our customers when we sell them the WRT54GL is: We've been in this business and been through a lot of different routers and these WRT54GL's have the best proven track record in our experience. There may be other products from all kinds of vendors that may work just as well, but we have experience with these and KNOW they work well. These are routers we purchase and keep in stock on all of our trucks and at our office to sell, we don't load any custom firmware on them, and rarely do we have to walk someone through upgrading the firmware. I have had a few problems with customers having FTP issues though, the quick fix is to update the firmware in the router, if that fails we always have DD-WRT or Tomato. -Kevin On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 4:11 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: Something like 80% of the time I've been to a network had Linksys, it's been broken. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.com Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:08 PM To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions Not with multiple lan and at 50 bucks. Why not Linksys? You can always put third party firmware on it if you want. I use DD-WRT on them when I have use one. I've even taken a few of them out of the factory case and put them in other boxes with the CPE. At 55 bucks, they are certainly cheap and with the DD-WRT, they are much more configurable. Robert West Just Micro digital Services Inc. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Gino Villarini Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:58 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Router suggestions Mikrotik? Gino A. Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:36 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] Router suggestions I'm looking for suggestions on an 802.11 router with multiple LAN ports where I can disable the NAT capability... making it a bridge. I used to use the TrendNet TEW-452BRP, but it's EOL and the TEW-633GR is too expensive ($100). I'm looking for something in the $30 - $45 area. No Linksys, I don't want to tarnish my name. :-p - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe
Re: [WISPA] Net Neutrality
should not be able to tell me (or you) what we can or can't send or who we can or can not send it to or receive it from. I think I stated that very clearly. Do you agree? Respectfully, jack John Vogel wrote: Free speech itself is not so much the issue, as presented by most who would argue for net neutrality, but rather application/traffic type. If it were not for the change in the way network traffic has evolved, moving from a bursty/intermittent type of traffic to a constant, high bit rate streaming, there would probably not be much of an issue, as most ISPs don't really care so much what you say or view over their networks. Those ISPs who have fallen afoul of the NN advocates have done so primarily because they were attempting to address a particular type of traffic pattern, rather than whatever content may have been transmitted in that traffic pattern. (e.g. bittorrent, lots of connections, constant streaming at high bandwidth utilization) Although I hesitate to use analogies... If I own a public restaurant, I reserve the right to refuse service to anybody who is determined to converse with other patrons in that restaurant by shouting everything they say, Likewise, if they choose to communicate using smoke signals, (cigarette or otherwise) I or the State/City have rules regarding that, and will restrict their speech in that manner. What they are communicating is immaterial. While they DO have a right to free speech, arguing that they should be allowed to communicate that speech via smoke signals, and subsequent complaints about the infringement of their free speech right by restricting the way in which they choose to communicate is somewhat disingenuous. There are really two different issues in play here. Conflating them under the banner of free speech does not address both issues adequately. John Jack Unger wrote: The government is actually protecting your freedom to access any Internet content you choose and your freedom to say whatever you want to say. The arguement that you can just move to another ISP is false because, as most WISPs know, many rural citizens don't have ANY ISP or maybe just one wireless ISP to choose from therefore they can't just move to another ISP if the first ISP doesn't like what they have to say and shuts them off. Further, even if you have more than one ISP, how are you going to get the news or get your opinions out if BOTH ISPs (or ALL ISPs) disagree with your opinion and shut you off. Your arguement is like saying I enjoy Free Speech right now but I don't want the government to interfere in order to protect my Free Speech when ATT doesn't like what I have to say and shuts my Internet service off. If ATT wants to take your Free Speech away then you are saying to the Government Hey, let them take it! I'd rather lose my freedom then have you telling ATT what to do. STOP protecting my Free Speech right now!!!. Mike Hammett wrote: What I don't like about it is another case of the government telling me what to do. More regulations is less freedom. If someone doesn't like the way ISP A operates, move to ISP B. If they don't like ISP B, find ISP C, or start ISP C, or maybe you shouldn't be doing what you're wanting to in the first place. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com From: Jack Unger Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 4:38 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net Neutrality Congress and the FCC would define reasonable. It's their job to write the laws and make the rules. Net neutrality (NN) is about free speech. NN would prohibit your carrier from delaying your packets or shutting off your service because they didn't like what you had to say or what web site you wanted to surf or post to. NN is anti-censorship therefore NN is pro-freedom. If you write a letter to your local newspaper, the editor can refuse to print it. WITHOUT Net Neutrality, your carrier can decide to block your packets. Net neutrality is about remaining a free nation. What's not to like about that? Josh Luthman wrote: Who's definition of unreasonable... On 9/19/09, Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.commailto:jun...@ask-wi.com wrote: The proposal doesn't say you have to provide unlimited bandwidth. Reasonable network management policies are allowed. Robert West wrote: Another unfunded mandate. If I were to provide net
Re: [WISPA] Organite defense
WTF? I hope you're not smoking that sh1t! At 10:28 AM 9/23/2009, you wrote: Never heard of such a thing. This is very interesting: http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message519074/pg1 On Tue, Sep 22, 2009 at 9:55 PM, Robert West robert.w...@just-micro.comwrote: Anyone else tired of these do-gooders and their organite gifting of your towers? Here I am, minding my own business and they come and place this darned organite near my tower, messing up all the funny shaped clouds I've been working so hard to create for the government and their secret weather control project. I'm looking for something that can counter act this most powerful substance. Any ideas? My handlers at the NSA won't help, you all know how THAT goes! Always their needs, never mine. National security this, weather control that, blah, blah, blah Whatever. In case you aren't in the loop and haven't received your secret and confidential memo, look it up on You Tube. It will explain the danger. I feel like I need to sprinkle maybe some ground up goat spleen or something around the tower for protection from the organite energy waves... It works to slow my electric meter, maybe it will defend against this as well. Too bad Granny from the Beverly Hillbillies isn't with us any more, she would certainly know the fix for this. Suggestions are welcome. The serious side of this is that I see it's been going around and I just saw it. More crazies messing about the towers. I had a long conversation with a customer today about all of this, she was concerned about these weather experiments and wanted to know if we were involved. How do you defend against stupidity? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Link Planning Software
... and a flashing light hooked to a Digital Loggers switch on the tower for sunset site surveys. :-) a light: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200365214_200365214 a 24 volt power supply: http://www.trcelectronics.com/Meanwell/se-450-24.shtml a Digital Loggers IP switch: http://digitalloggers.com/lpc.html spare CAT5 on the tower, 2 pairs positive, 2 pairs negative 200' CAT5 we use has about 12V drop so the light gets 12V At 02:10 PM 9/27/2009, Marlon wrote: Feet on the ground. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] OT - Text Messages
!) an anomaly of some sort 2) the apple doesn't fall far from the tree 3) she FOUND boys in a big way 4) all of the above I pick 4) all of the above. If you read Verizon's TOS, text messages are not guaranteed to be delivered, take the least cost path, and might arrive well after they are sent. My experience is they handle messaging from their network quite well, from other networks less well, and from the Internet not well at all. I have certain equipment sending me email (text) messages through an SMTP relay server. Sometimes the messages arrive right away, some times in a few minutes, and sometimes hours later! 30 thousand! Maybe there is an option 5) she is engaging in some sort of e-enterprise and is blazing some trails, but, that would fall under 2) the apple doesn't fall far from the tree! :-) At 11:41 PM 9/28/2009, you wrote: For a fact! Now that I am thinking of it...what kind of bandwidth do the telcos have to provide for this, now industry standard technology of txt? I know that a text message does not consist of much traffic, but add to that the new millions of millions subscribers to unlimited text. It could add up... Or add the txt msg with a pic...now we are getting into some bandwidth. Or then add the GPS, google me, check my stocks...ect. traffic. I would love to see the cellular carriers bandwidth usage stats. V -Original Message- From: Josh Luthman [mailto:j...@imaginenetworksllc.com] Sent: Monday, September 28, 2009 11:32 PM To: li...@stlbroadband.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] OT - Text Messages Seriously 30k? On 9/29/09, St. Louis Broadband li...@stlbroadband.com wrote: I am reviewing my ATT wireless bill. I have myself, my mother and my daughter on a family plan. My mother received 8 text messages, which I am sure she does not know that she has. I received 297 text messages. Some of those were forwards from another email account. However, my 18 year old daughter received 30,500 text messages! How can this be? How can they type on a qwerty board, or actual phone keypad faster than I on a laptop/computer? She has a facebook account, a twitter, and many other accounts/tech that I am not familiar with. Is this a sign of the times or of my age? I started in the Internet industry in 1993. I remember my first AOL annual bill totaling over $5k and this was for 28.8 kbps. That is when I figured that this industry was going to be profitable...darn me for daring to going into fixed wireless. Just had to rant...30,500 txt msgs...omg! Victoria WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Multipath
Multipath and/or scintillation. It looks like the sun is shining and 65 degrees in Salem. Sun beating on that metal surface can cause heat waves to rise in front of the antenna causing scintillation. Sometimes this stuff is black magic and moving a CPE a couple feet one way or another can make a world of difference. No trees or branches in the Fresnel zone waving in the breeze? I'd try adjusting the tilt as suggested, them putting a pipe section in the J mount and moving it up 2.5' or so. Hope you figure it out. Let the list know. At 01:39 PM 9/29/2009, you wrote: I am curious if anyone thinks this is multipath and has a suggestion on how to fix. This just happens to be my dads house, radio mounted to a j-mount on eve of house, clear LOS to tower 1 mile away, -56 signal. This eve is over the porch roof to the east and signal shoots over the south plane of the roof which is an approx 30deg angle. I was over this morning and he is complaining the Internet is not working and I go in to do some troubleshooting. I setup a constant ping to the AP and I am getting 1ms, I start to browse and the pings jump to 300ms and random lost packets. Configure a new radio in the house and have a -75 signal in the house, try the ping thing again and all seems fine. I replace he radio on the roof and I am back to the poor ping times again. Now I don't understand multipath as well I should but it seems to make sense in this case. Is it possible to reduce or remedy without moving the radio to a totally different location? Mark McElvy AccuBak Data Systems, Inc. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Airports a Problem?
Agreed. Planes flying through the Fresnel zone will have more of an impact on B type modulation than on say G. You might see selective fading because of multipath, but OFDM or some other robust modulation technique will recover from an aircraft on approach at 250 mph flying through the Fresnel zone. Just make sure your links have sufficient fade margin. At 08:35 AM 9/30/2009, you wrote: Unless the base of the runway is in the Fresnel zone... an airplane flying through it is only going to cause a minor interruption... maybe a few seconds? I would bet it is going to be okay WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
The Atheros Deliberant cards will do half and quarter channels on G. At 10:42 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: If you aren't sectorized, you should do that first. Neither normal b or g or b/g are ideal in high noise. I don't mix. I like a little better g-mode on 10mhz channels using radio cards that support listening on 5/10 mhz channels like the xr2. (Many listen on 20mhz) You're more than twice as likely to find a clearer channel. On Thu, Oct 01, 2009 at 09:58:30AM -0500, Jason Hensley wrote: In 2.4 land, if you have a lot of noise, which protocol is better - B or G? Is it better to run an AP as locked into one mode or is it OK to do a mix? Max I want off of 2.4 customers is 3meg so not that worried about the extra speed that G will provide, but, I would like to know which is more stable? I've always thought that B was more stable overall but just provided less bandwidth. I've gotten some info that may counter that. What's the real-world experience with folks in a high-noise environment, combined with a higher useage AP? I've got an AP that we've run in B mode only for a while. We've started having problems with it - speeds go from 3meg at the customer to 200k and fluctuate constantly. We've worked with RTS, ACK timeouts, etc etc and nothing seems to have improved the stability. For testing purposes we put up another AP right next to the one we're having trouble with. Switched two of our gaming clients to that one (setup as G mode only) and they seem to be doing better, but not quite as good as we feel they could be. This is on Deliberant AP's (Duos). The backhaul part of it is not the issue - we can pull close to 15meg back to our office when cabled into the AP. We have other Deliberant APs that are running MANY more clients than this one so we know it's not limitations of the equipment. AP is on top of a water tower. Have taken all clients off and brought them back on one by one and it did not reveal anything significant. With just one customer on the AP started acting up again. Swapped radios in the AP thinking we could have one going bad and still no luck. 2.4 antennas are H-pol. We have a ton of noise in the area, but we've been through basically every channel and it did not help either. Other AP's in the vicinity are performing fine. Thought of the multipath issue so we raised our test AP up a little higher than the other one. As I said, the test AP seems to be better, but next to it on top of the tower we can get around 8 or 9 meg down (locked into G mode), but at the CPE's we're still barely getting 2.5-2.8meg. Any thoughts? We changed everything we can. The new test AP has a 9db antenna compared to the 13db on the production AP. Other than that, they are identical as far as equipment goes. So, back to the subject question though, what's real-world experience with G-only mode in the field? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
Yeah, I think they use the same cards -- Willi Atheros. Goota set IEEE mode to G first, then half/quarter channels are available. At 11:04 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: Mike - you mean 5mhz and 10mhz channels? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: The Atheros Deliberant cards will do half and quarter channels on G. At 10:42 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: If you aren't sectorized, you should do that first. Neither normal b or g or b/g are ideal in high noise. I don't mix. I like a little better g-mode on 10mhz channels using radio cards that support listening on 5/10 mhz channels like the xr2. (Many listen on 20mhz) You're more than twice as likely to find a clearer channel. On Thu, Oct 01, 2009 at 09:58:30AM -0500, Jason Hensley wrote: In 2.4 land, if you have a lot of noise, which protocol is better - B or G? Is it better to run an AP as locked into one mode or is it OK to do a mix? Max I want off of 2.4 customers is 3meg so not that worried about the extra speed that G will provide, but, I would like to know which is more stable? I've always thought that B was more stable overall but just provided less bandwidth. I've gotten some info that may counter that. What's the real-world experience with folks in a high-noise environment, combined with a higher useage AP? I've got an AP that we've run in B mode only for a while. We've started having problems with it - speeds go from 3meg at the customer to 200k and fluctuate constantly. We've worked with RTS, ACK timeouts, etc etc and nothing seems to have improved the stability. For testing purposes we put up another AP right next to the one we're having trouble with. Switched two of our gaming clients to that one (setup as G mode only) and they seem to be doing better, but not quite as good as we feel they could be. This is on Deliberant AP's (Duos). The backhaul part of it is not the issue - we can pull close to 15meg back to our office when cabled into the AP. We have other Deliberant APs that are running MANY more clients than this one so we know it's not limitations of the equipment. AP is on top of a water tower. Have taken all clients off and brought them back on one by one and it did not reveal anything significant. With just one customer on the AP started acting up again. Swapped radios in the AP thinking we could have one going bad and still no luck. 2.4 antennas are H-pol. We have a ton of noise in the area, but we've been through basically every channel and it did not help either. Other AP's in the vicinity are performing fine. Thought of the multipath issue so we raised our test AP up a little higher than the other one. As I said, the test AP seems to be better, but next to it on top of the tower we can get around 8 or 9 meg down (locked into G mode), but at the CPE's we're still barely getting 2.5-2.8meg. Any thoughts? We changed everything we can. The new test AP has a 9db antenna compared to the 13db on the production AP. Other than that, they are identical as far as equipment goes. So, back to the subject question though, what's real-world experience with G-only mode in the field? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
I have a lot of Deliberant CPE in my network, just a few of their APS. But the newer generation stock with Atheros cards supports 20/10/5 MHz channels. From their site, concerning the Duos: Product contains: * Dual-Radio with adjustable RF Output Power * Rugged cast aluminum hinged enclosure * Full, half, and quarter bandwidth channels * Multi-BSSID support (VSSID) with VLAN tags * PoE built-in for single cable installation * Configurable Multi-mode AP * AP mode/AP client mode * WDS * AP router/AP client router * AP repeater * Redundant PtP bridge with STP At 11:37 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: Yeah, I think they use the same cards -- Willi Atheros. Goota set IEEE mode to G first, then half/quarter channels are available. At 11:04 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: Mike - you mean 5mhz and 10mhz channels? Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Mike m...@aweiowa.com wrote: The Atheros Deliberant cards will do half and quarter channels on G. At 10:42 AM 10/1/2009, you wrote: If you aren't sectorized, you should do that first. Neither normal b or g or b/g are ideal in high noise. I don't mix. I like a little better g-mode on 10mhz channels using radio cards that support listening on 5/10 mhz channels like the xr2. (Many listen on 20mhz) You're more than twice as likely to find a clearer channel. On Thu, Oct 01, 2009 at 09:58:30AM -0500, Jason Hensley wrote: In 2.4 land, if you have a lot of noise, which protocol is better - B or G? Is it better to run an AP as locked into one mode or is it OK to do a mix? Max I want off of 2.4 customers is 3meg so not that worried about the extra speed that G will provide, but, I would like to know which is more stable? I've always thought that B was more stable overall but just provided less bandwidth. I've gotten some info that may counter that. What's the real-world experience with folks in a high-noise environment, combined with a higher useage AP? I've got an AP that we've run in B mode only for a while. We've started having problems with it - speeds go from 3meg at the customer to 200k and fluctuate constantly. We've worked with RTS, ACK timeouts, etc etc and nothing seems to have improved the stability. For testing purposes we put up another AP right next to the one we're having trouble with. Switched two of our gaming clients to that one (setup as G mode only) and they seem to be doing better, but not quite as good as we feel they could be. This is on Deliberant AP's (Duos). The backhaul part of it is not the issue - we can pull close to 15meg back to our office when cabled into the AP. We have other Deliberant APs that are running MANY more clients than this one so we know it's not limitations of the equipment. AP is on top of a water tower. Have taken all clients off and brought them back on one by one and it did not reveal anything significant. With just one customer on the AP started acting up again. Swapped radios in the AP thinking we could have one going bad and still no luck. 2.4 antennas are H-pol. We have a ton of noise in the area, but we've been through basically every channel and it did not help either. Other AP's in the vicinity are performing fine. Thought of the multipath issue so we raised our test AP up a little higher than the other one. As I said, the test AP seems to be better, but next to it on top of the tower we can get around 8 or 9 meg down (locked into G mode), but at the CPE's we're still barely getting 2.5-2.8meg. Any thoughts? We changed everything we can. The new test AP has a 9db antenna compared to the 13db on the production AP. Other than that, they are identical as far as equipment goes. So, back to the subject question though, what's real-world experience with G-only mode in the field? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
You don't say if you are using 5Mhz or 10MHz channels. I assume 10 with 40 customers. With the smaller bandwidth and slower speeds I think fractional channels limit the number of subscribers you can put on an AP. Does anybody have any empirical data on the number of users that can use a 5MHz and 10MHz Ap? I am not doing it, but think 40 is too many for a 5MHz channel, and has to be approaching the limit for a 10MHz channel. Thoughts? At 06:13 PM 10/1/2009, you wrote: I dunno? Not a ton. Maybe 40 at the most. This segment of our network is very small. We mainly focus on big businesses. On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 2:37 PM, Ryan Spott rsp...@cspott.com wrote: -- oh, wait, this is not the Canopy list. LOL! :) How many users per AP? ryan On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 1:08 PM, Jayson Baker jay...@spectrasurf.com wrote: I'll tell you what we do, but won't get into defending it for the next month -- oh, wait, this is not the Canopy list... Our 2.4GHz spectrum is completely filled with vertical Canopy. We run UBNT AP's. Fixed at 2mi ACK. No RTS. Fixed G-only. Horizontal polarity. Max data rate of 54Mbps. Sectors. Customers are all within 2 miles, use Loco2's. Customers are Auto ACK. No RTS. Fixed G-Only. Horizontal. Max 54Mbps. On almost every single install we get at least 12Mbps down, 6Mbps up (our rate limit). Without limit, we usually see up to 18. Funny... those lusers on the other guys Canopy pay like $40/mo for 1.5Mbps. We give 12Mbps for $24.95/mo. Don't use B. It's DSSS. G is OFDM. Performs much better. On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 8:58 AM, Jason Hensley ja...@jaggartech.com wrote: In 2.4 land, if you have a lot of noise, which protocol is better - B or G? Is it better to run an AP as locked into one mode or is it OK to do a mix? Max I want off of 2.4 customers is 3meg so not that worried about the extra speed that G will provide, but, I would like to know which is more stable? I've always thought that B was more stable overall but just provided less bandwidth. I've gotten some info that may counter that. What's the real-world experience with folks in a high-noise environment, combined with a higher useage AP? I've got an AP that we've run in B mode only for a while. We've started having problems with it - speeds go from 3meg at the customer to 200k and fluctuate constantly. We've worked with RTS, ACK timeouts, etc etc and nothing seems to have improved the stability. For testing purposes we put up another AP right next to the one we're having trouble with. Switched two of our gaming clients to that one (setup as G mode only) and they seem to be doing better, but not quite as good as we feel they could be. This is on Deliberant AP's (Duos). The backhaul part of it is not the issue - we can pull close to 15meg back to our office when cabled into the AP. We have other Deliberant APs that are running MANY more clients than this one so we know it's not limitations of the equipment. AP is on top of a water tower. Have taken all clients off and brought them back on one by one and it did not reveal anything significant. With just one customer on the AP started acting up again. Swapped radios in the AP thinking we could have one going bad and still no luck. 2.4 antennas are H-pol. We have a ton of noise in the area, but we've been through basically every channel and it did not help either. Other AP's in the vicinity are performing fine. Thought of the multipath issue so we raised our test AP up a little higher than the other one. As I said, the test AP seems to be better, but next to it on top of the tower we can get around 8 or 9 meg down (locked into G mode), but at the CPE's we're still barely getting 2.5-2.8meg. Any thoughts? We changed everything we can. The new test AP has a 9db antenna compared to the 13db on the production AP. Other than that, they are identical as far as equipment goes. So, back to the subject question though, what's real-world experience with G-only mode in the field? WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
We get a capital fee up front that covers most of the equipment charges. It was harder a few years ago with $380.00 radios, but like most electronic stuff they keep getting better and cheaper. Soon they will just be giving them to us. :-) At 06:49 PM 10/1/2009, you wrote: Like I said, we have a 1 Day ROI. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
I built one of the very first Canopy networks back in 2002. Joe Schneider even sat at my desk and helped configure the first cluster. We even helped them iron out some problems with the early CMM. Ken Magro was near the top of my speed dial list. The only serious competition at the time was Alvarion frequency hoppers. The system worked well except over water paths, where we had scintillation, where water towers were near the path; in other words, wherever there were multi path issues it didn't work well. My only point is that in Urban areas, Canopy is a good choice if there is a lot of contention for spectrum and you need to win. If you are in a rural setting, with longer distances with path obstacles and multi path, OFDM modulation just works better, and it's cheaper. Apples and oranges troops! Neither is better than the other, and there is a solution that will solve most of your engineering problems. At 01:24 AM 10/2/2009, you wrote: Here was the original part of the message (that somehow got left off your reply): For a very long time we got caught in the Canopy mentality my Canopy is better than your any other vendor here We finally opened our eyes, got jumped out of the gang, and are very happy we did. It seems a lot of Canopy operators have the mentality that WiFi sucks -- probably because they too started with it years ago, when it really did suck.And I am buying Canopy AP's and SM's for way less than MSRP WAY LESS. Travis Microserv Butch Evans wrote: On Thu, 2009-10-01 at 19:47 -0600, Travis Johnson wrote: As soon as you can offer 7ms latency to 100 people off the same AP using WiFi based radios, please let me know. I will buy 200 AP's and 5,000 CPE. ;) That kind of density is NOT necessary for MANY WISPs. I know that is the cry that nearly ALL Canopy Koolaid drinkers use, but it does not apply to everyone. For those that need it...Canopy offers a very nice solution that works, works well and is affordable because it is NEEDED. For those that don't...Canopy is WAY to expensive to be worth the extra $$. Don't take this as a jab because it isn't intended that way, but why would you post a message that indicates that someone was inviting you to switch your Canopy out for WiFi? Nobody made such a suggestion and (IMHO) reacting in the way you did is just plain rude. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] To G or not to G :-)
At 11:15 PM 10/3/2009, Lawrence wrote: ... All things being equal (which they often aren't) 802.11b will give you a higher S/N and C/I than 802.11g, because in almost all cases and especially at higher speeds. 802.11g has to lower the PA power because of the PAPR of OFDM and meeting the 802.11g EVM spec. Given, and considering OFDM modulation vice CCK, there are a couple things to note. With G, and the faster data rates, client transactions are over faster and tend to give the AP back sooner, especially if the operator elects to transmit the PLCP header with a short (56 bit) preamble. This is true for at least 90% of the traffic on my network which is very bursty activity. Get 'em out of the way faster! Additionally, OFDM survives in a multi-path environment much better. In my environment, water towers, barns, machine sheds, silos all seem to reflect the signal around. Having said all that we didn't use 802.11b at all because it's data rates are too low for video. There are some links which, because of a lower signal to noise, where B just works much better. But, while they are on are using the resources of the sector much longer than their G counterparts. Also while we supported 2.4 GHz, we mostly deployed at 5.8 GHz ISM because of the increased power available there and the pollution was much less, but that maybe different now. In my environment neither is saturated. 2.4 works better because of the variability in terrain. Signals arriving over corn fields also work better than signals arriving over bean fields. :-) There is no substitute for link margin, you can never really have enough. I like to do installs this time of year. Foliage is at maximum growth for the year. Crops are mature and waving in the breeze. The leaves are drying but still on the trees. Rain water collects in those trees. If it works now, and I have sufficient fade margin, it will only get better this winter as the leaves drop. Tne of the down sides of fitting a 5 or 10 MHz channel in a sweet spot is that it can change at any time. This is true of any public frequency, but the effects on a half or quarter channel are less pronounced, and the fractional channels give an immediate boost in the SI over a 20 MHz channel size. I think there is room for ANY lively discussions on this list; administrative, technical or otherwise. Long live wireless and free enterprise! Mike WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
[WISPA] XBOX 360
I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
Huh? How does that help? At 10:52 PM 10/4/2009, you wrote: As my father told me, a poor workman blames his tools. . . . J o n a t h a n -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 9:41 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
They ARE behind a double nat. They are a rural pocket of family I feed with a sector, then have a repeater on one of the buildings. I put a robust client in the house, and a switch. This one has a long Ethernet cable from the switch to the XBox. They tested at almost 2M down and almost 3M up. Have you set up QOS queues for XBox? Mike At 10:15 PM 10/4/2009, you wrote: What kind of network topology do you have between your head end and their Xbox? Two or more layers of NAT, from what I read, bother the Xbox. What kind of bandwidth does he get after a speed test? Xbox uses a lot more then I expect. I remember at a LAN party the 1.5 meg T1 was full by 3-4 Xboxes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Sun, Oct 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I at least 15% of my customers use 360 and none have problems... and two of them (myself included) are highly intolerant of network issues. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 9:41 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
The router is a client in the house and managed by us. XBox itself has never protested that the router isn't working properly, just that, as he says it, 'I'm lagging. At 06:39 AM 10/5/2009, you wrote: I think double nat can cause a problem for that sometimes. A low quality home firewall/router can also contribute. Lend the customer a different router and see if that helps. On Mon, Oct 05, 2009 at 06:18:57AM -0500, Mike wrote: They ARE behind a double nat. They are a rural pocket of family I feed with a sector, then have a repeater on one of the buildings. I put a robust client in the house, and a switch. This one has a long Ethernet cable from the switch to the XBox. They tested at almost 2M down and almost 3M up. Have you set up QOS queues for XBox? Mike At 10:15 PM 10/4/2009, you wrote: What kind of network topology do you have between your head end and their Xbox? Two or more layers of NAT, from what I read, bother the Xbox. What kind of bandwidth does he get after a speed test? Xbox uses a lot more then I expect. I remember at a LAN party the 1.5 meg T1 was full by 3-4 Xboxes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Sun, Oct 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I at least 15% of my customers use 360 and none have problems... and two of them (myself included) are highly intolerant of network issues. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 9:41 PM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook | Midcoast Internet Solutions - Wireless and DSL KB1IOJ| Broadband Internet Access, Dialup, and Hosting http://f64.nu/ | for Midcoast Mainehttp://www.midcoast.com/ */ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
I don't see it using a lot of bandwidth, and it seems to burst pretty quickly when I do see the traffic. But, if the game has to keep track of his position relative to the other players, wouldn't that require a fairly constant packet exchange with the server? At 08:37 AM 10/5/2009, you wrote: I think the NAT isn't the issue here. The nat gets to the xbox when it comes to A. connecting to a game. or B. Hosting a game. Once they are in a game it shouldn't be a nat issue. The xbox 360 doesn't use much when it comes bandwidth. But think about it more like a VOIP call. Its very sensitive to jitter and packet loss. Also, When it comes to the xbox world the servers aren't always up to par. This is because most games have the user hosting a server and everyone connects to that person. Well most people don't have the internet for that. Or they are far away and the latency just getting to them is bad. So you may not be the bad guy here. Nick Olsen Brevard Wireless (321) 205-1100 x106 From: jp j...@saucer.midcoast.com Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 7:39 AM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I think double nat can cause a problem for that sometimes. A low quality home firewall/router can also contribute. Lend the customer a different router and see if that helps. On Mon, Oct 05, 2009 at 06:18:57AM -0500, Mike wrote: They ARE behind a double nat. They are a rural pocket of family I feed with a sector, then have a repeater on one of the buildings. I put a robust client in the house, and a switch. This one has a long Ethernet cable from the switch to the XBox. They tested at almost 2M down and almost 3M up. Have you set up QOS queues for XBox? Mike At 10:15 PM 10/4/2009, you wrote: What kind of network topology do you have between your head end and their Xbox? Two or more layers of NAT, from what I read, bother the Xbox. What kind of bandwidth does he get after a speed test? Xbox uses a lot more then I expect. I remember at a LAN party the 1.5 meg T1 was full by 3-4 Xboxes. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Sun, Oct 4, 2009 at 10:53 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: I at least 15% of my customers use 360 and none have problems... and two of them (myself included) are highly intolerant of network issues. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: Mike Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 9:41 PM To: ; WISPA General List Subject: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- /* Jason Philbrook
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
They haven't gotten any not good enough messages from the xbox. I assume the fix of which you speak was done on the client router and not your core equipment? Ping times from my monitoring position, through a wireless router in my home, out a customer client (I have us set up just like a customer) through my core, back out a sector, to their repeater sector, out their repeater, through a client in the house and finally a switch varies from 4ms to 7ms USUALLY. The client sector facing my tower is set up as a bridge. The repeater connected to it is set up to do DHCP and NAT. The client in the house is set up as a bridge to let the repeater do all the DHCP/NAT. So, there really is only one place the IPs are natted. I will tell him to 1) make sure his firmware is the latest. I think you can just update from the Xbox, tight? 2) to try different games or a different group of users to see if it's the server or not. I guess I never knew the servers were out in other users homes, kinda like P2P or a sort of distributed computing? I guess I thought the Xbox live servers were centrally located. Mike At 09:02 AM 10/5/2009, you wrote: The only issue we have with Xbox are situations where XBOX Live tells the end user that their router is not a high enough level of compatibilty, so it is not allowed to connect with all Xbox live sessions.. (sorry I forget the exact term they use). To Fix that it requires two things... 1) The port forward rules... TCP/UDP 3074 and UDP 88. 2) for Linksys under security, uncheck everything Block Anonymous Internet Requests , Filter Multicast , Filter Internet NAT Redirection , Filter IDENT(Port 113). Not every thing there matters, but I forget which one or two is relevent. For us Xbox performance has not been an issue, and it should be noted that we only have residential customers on Trango 900Mhz sectors, averaging 40 homes per sector. There is just a big a chance that the XBOX users are getting congestion on XBOX's Hosted Server side of the connection, dependant on which they are using to establish connection. If you suspect your network, then I'd look for basic network quality type things like latency and packet loss on all hops end to end. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: Mike m...@aweiowa.com To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, October 04, 2009 10:41 PM Subject: [WISPA] XBOX 360 I have a couple XBOX 360 players saying they are having lag issues. It seems a low bandwidth consumer. How are you guys optimizing for them? I'd like to try and make them happier. Is there a down side? I know Marlon asked last winter but a good answer never appeared on the list. Thanks WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] XBOX 360
I'm ashamed to admit I don't know the name, but it looks VERY familiar to the old Wolfenstein with updated backgrounds. I can find out what the game is. It's pretty gory shoot 'em up commando stuff. At 10:54 AM 10/5/2009, you wrote: I hate IPX. I really do. From what I know Left 4 Dead on the Xbox is using central hosting servers now. I believe the games with larger volume players such as Bad Company do this as well. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 When you have eliminated the impossible, that which remains, however improbable, must be the truth. --- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle On Mon, Oct 5, 2009 at 11:53 AM, Jeremy Parr jeremyp...@gmail.com wrote: 2009/10/5 David E. Smith d...@mvn.net: Mike Hammett wrote: I miss it back in the day when game servers were centrally hosted. These things, like many things, seem to go in cycles. We've gone from central (text-based MUDs, games on the old AOL and CompuServe) to distributed (DOOM and Quake, the first couple generations of FPS games) to centralized (more recent FPS games based on the Half-Life engine, though players still can host their own) to some of each (right now, where there's a good mix of people playing centralized MMO games like World of Warcraft, along with player-hosted PS3 and 360 games). Back in my day, we had to run Fossil or IPX if we wanted multiplayer. None of this fancy schmancy IP connectivity! You kids today have it too good! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] NetEqualizer Question
Current connections is a snapshot. You'd have to keep hitting refresh to see connections, some of which happen and are over in a fraction of a second. The penalty kicks in when the pipe begins to get full. Then it looks at IPs with multiple connections, and persistent connections. The only setting you really HAVE to do is set your trunk up and trunk down. It is a nice device and will keep you from having to buy more bandwidth. It just makes everybody play fair in an agnostic sort of way. Mike At 09:53 PM 10/6/2009, you wrote: Anyone running a NetEqualizer? I set one up on our network but noticed the Active Connections list is very low - although the configuration is set to monitor up to 3000 connections, less than 200 are ever recognized by the system. Anyone have input on that? My understanding is from this connection list the system will interject latency when the upstream pipe is reaching saturation - with only 200 connections available that doesn't seem like a sufficient amount to gracefully throttle much of anything. BTW, running v2.40a 1u Thanks, `S WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] NetEqualizer Question
I keep a browser open with three windows on the monitoring machine: http://192.168.100.2:3000/thptStats.html (change your ip. It updates automatically. I zoom it to see 3 graphs) http://192.168.100.2/cgi-bin/arbi/doGetbrain.cgi (I hit refresh when I want to see connections) http://192.168.100.2/cgi-bin/arbi/doArblog.cgi ( I set this up to refresh every 30 seconds, and shows who is getting penalized) Really, once the novelty wears off and you have it set right, you can just leave it and it will do it's job. Mine has been in over 2 years without a hitch. At 09:53 PM 10/6/2009, you wrote: Anyone running a NetEqualizer? I set one up on our network but noticed the Active Connections list is very low - although the configuration is set to monitor up to 3000 connections, less than 200 are ever recognized by the system. Anyone have input on that? My understanding is from this connection list the system will interject latency when the upstream pipe is reaching saturation - with only 200 connections available that doesn't seem like a sufficient amount to gracefully throttle much of anything. BTW, running v2.40a 1u Thanks, `S WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] NetEqualizer Question
RF is more my forte, but I encountered something like that and dealt with it by using netmap and 1:1 mapping in MT. I'm not sure what they have changed. NetEqs response is: You simply need to put your Radio's in Bridging mode and set your router at your head end to do DHCP and NAT (instead of doing DHCP and NAT at your AP's). Mike At 10:36 PM 10/6/2009, you wrote: Mike- Thanks - I have a feeling something is still wrong, the connection count is just too low - there are 10's of 1,000s of connections on our network and this thing is only showing 120 or so at a time. Investigating this closer, I see (even when refreshing and taking into consideration this is a snapshot) that the only connections are from nodes within the device's management IP subnet - does that seem right to you? It's on a very tight subnet which 95+% of our customers are not a part of. I thought the bridge IP was transparent, perhaps not? Was this fixed or remedied in later firmware revisions? Thanks, `S -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Tuesday, October 06, 2009 8:27 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] NetEqualizer Question Current connections is a snapshot. You'd have to keep hitting refresh to see connections, some of which happen and are over in a fraction of a second. The penalty kicks in when the pipe begins to get full. Then it looks at IPs with multiple connections, and persistent connections. The only setting you really HAVE to do is set your trunk up and trunk down. It is a nice device and will keep you from having to buy more bandwidth. It just makes everybody play fair in an agnostic sort of way. Mike At 09:53 PM 10/6/2009, you wrote: Anyone running a NetEqualizer? I set one up on our network but noticed the Active Connections list is very low - although the configuration is set to monitor up to 3000 connections, less than 200 are ever recognized by the system. Anyone have input on that? My understanding is from this connection list the system will interject latency when the upstream pipe is reaching saturation - with only 200 connections available that doesn't seem like a sufficient amount to gracefully throttle much of anything. BTW, running v2.40a 1u Thanks, `S --- - WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --- - WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
