Re: [AFMUG] powercode assistance.

[Josh Luthman]

Is the router the Mikrotik Hotspot?

Your issue is your network I expect.  Need details as to what IP your
router is and what IP the BMU is.  Are these devices adjacent or is there a
router in between?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 9:17 PM, Mike Delp  wrote:

> I have a situation with a mikrotik hotspot on a network that is on a
> private address scheme, behind powercode.  The user manager is on a public
> IP address in front of powercode. The router cant traceroute to the user
> manager, and it cant contact the public world. My powercode configurations
> are a little rusty.
>
> The router is in powercode as an infrastructure device.
>
> Thanks
> Mike
>
> 636-748-7345
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[Faisal Imtiaz]

[URL=http://media.photobucket.com/user/amstang/media/untitled.jpg.html][IMG]http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt322/amstang/untitled.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

- Original Message -
> From: "George Skorup" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 9:14:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

> I prefer blonde chicks. My mom says they're high maintenance though.
> 
> On 8/19/2016 7:09 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
>> Why disparage blondes?  Maybe a Ryan Lochte moment?
>>
>>
>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:51 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio
>>
>> No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.
>>
 Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.
>>
>> See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
>> +, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
>> up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
>> some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
>> wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I
>> wrong?
>>
>> Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
>> present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.
>>
>> On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>> It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do +
>>> and - then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
>>> If I can make it less confusing please let me know how. Obviously if
>>> you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio
>>>
>>> Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
>>> so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
>>> know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
>>> week.
>>>
>>> On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
 Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads
 at the sites.

 I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself
 and forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(

 On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
> The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the
> POE does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and
> if any of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is
> bonding + to chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds -
> to chassis is gonna blow a fuse or let the smoke out.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>> Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing
>> isn't tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no,
>> because obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them
>> marked. And the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just
>> a polarity indicator and has no bearing on what's what.
>>
>> Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using
>> these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs,
>> return on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48
>> POE boxes and ain't buyin no more.
>>
>> I suppose sometimes I over-think things.
>

>>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[Chuck McCown]

I like 'em all.  I think I married a blonde, but she has been a redhead at 
times.  Not really sure.


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 7:14 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

I prefer blonde chicks. My mom says they're high maintenance though.

On 8/19/2016 7:09 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Why disparage blondes?  Maybe a Ryan Lochte moment?


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.


Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I 
wrong?


Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.

On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + 
and - then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how. Obviously if  you 
put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads at 
the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself and 
forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the POE 
does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and if any 
of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is bonding + to 
chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - to chassis is 
gonna blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing 
isn't tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, 
because obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them 
marked. And the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just a 
polarity indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, 
return on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 POE 
boxes and ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

[AFMUG] powercode assistance.

[Mike Delp]

I have a situation with a mikrotik hotspot on a network that is on a
private address scheme, behind powercode.  The user manager is on a public
IP address in front of powercode. The router cant traceroute to the user
manager, and it cant contact the public world. My powercode configurations
are a little rusty.

The router is in powercode as an infrastructure device.

Thanks
Mike

636-748-7345

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[George Skorup]

I prefer blonde chicks. My mom says they're high maintenance though.

On 8/19/2016 7:09 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Why disparage blondes?  Maybe a Ryan Lochte moment?


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.


Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I 
wrong?


Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.

On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + 
and - then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how. Obviously if  
you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads 
at the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself 
and forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the 
POE does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and 
if any of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is 
bonding + to chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - 
to chassis is gonna blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing 
isn't tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, 
because obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them 
marked. And the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just 
a polarity indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, 
return on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 
POE boxes and ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[George Skorup]

True, but there's connectorized. Antenna is connected to tower steel.

On 8/19/2016 7:53 PM, Bill Prince wrote:

No plastic Canopy SM has anything tied to chassis. They float.

bp


On 8/19/2016 4:32 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds 
board/chassis to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.


On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: 
Friday, August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: 
[AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. 
The CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power 
source but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for 
the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Bill Prince]

No plastic Canopy SM has anything tied to chassis. They float.

bp


On 8/19/2016 4:32 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds 
board/chassis to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.


On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: 
Friday, August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. 
The CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power 
source but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for 
the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[chuck]

I remember some TVs had a warning sticker on the back about hot chassis.
I had a big home made discharge probe thingy.  Couple pieces of broom stick 
for handles.

Bored through the middles for a wire.  Bare wire sticking out the ends.
One to chassis and slide the probe wire up under the anode rubber thingy and 
POW.


Picture tubes didn't bother me so much but caps had more of a wallop.
They would blow sparks and bits of molten wires etc.

In college we had these nice lab benches with switched outlet strips built 
in.
Some joker would plug in an electrolytic cap now and then and wait for some 
poor unsuspecting soul to switch on the power.

Lots of noise, confetti, smoke and flying cap shards.
Always wondered how toxic the smoke was.

-Original Message- 
From: Ken Hohhof

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:05 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Around 1976 I worked for a company that made OEM TV sets for Sears and
KMart.  We never had one with a hot chassis, I would have remembered that.

I do remember that one of the high voltage designers electrocuted himself.
At home.  On his ham radio setup.

I never got used to discharging the second anode on the CRT.  25 kV is
scary.  CRT is a capacitor and holds a charge, as do triplers.  As do
electrostatic voltmeters.  But that 2 kW ham radio amp had lots of voltage
and current available.  Stopped his heart.  He was able to tell his wife to
call 911 but they were too late.


-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:41 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

TVs used to have a hot chassis.  They were in a wooden box though...

-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I understand why an an engineer using a RF device would do that, they want
zero impedance from the RF ground to the rest of the world. You can still DC
isolate it but it takes a little bit of doing at microwave frequencies.

If you choose 48 volts as a design engineer, you are choosing a voltage that
historically has been -48 in the telcom industry.

I don't understand why a router designer would need to bond their logic
grounds to the chassis.
If it is phy isolated ethernet in and out, there is no problem in having a
hot ground plane with respect to the case of the device.

So, I guess you could make an isolated mount for MT routers...

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.

On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: Friday, 
August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both -48v. 
Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[Ken Hohhof]

Why disparage blondes?  Maybe a Ryan Lochte moment?


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.


Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I wrong?

Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.

On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + and - 
then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how.  Obviously if  you 
put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads at 
the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself and 
forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the POE 
does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and if any 
of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is bonding + to 
chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - to chassis is gonna 
blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing isn't 
tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, because 
obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them marked. And 
the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just a polarity 
indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, return 
on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 POE boxes and 
ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[George Skorup]

I see what you mean. Right. I tried this yesterday with a spare Trango 
ApexPlus on the bench. All pairs jumped to negative. Shield tied back to 
the + terminal. Radio worked. Green LED on the card was on. Yeah, if I 
took the shield/drain directly to the power supply, and removed the + 
wire from the card, then the card LED wouldn't light up due to open circuit.


I do this here with one of the guys all the time. We say exactly the 
same thing, just different ways and end up confusing each other. I may 
or may not do that on purpose occasionally for the lulz. I plead the fif.


On 8/19/2016 6:57 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
OK, I presume if you put all pins to -48 you only be connecting a 
single -48 wire.


If you connect a return, then yes the LEDS will light but not 
necessarily mean anything.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.


Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I 
wrong?


Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.

On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + 
and - then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how. Obviously if  
you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads 
at the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself 
and forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the 
POE does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and 
if any of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is 
bonding + to chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - 
to chassis is gonna blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing 
isn't tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, 
because obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them 
marked. And the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just 
a polarity indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, 
return on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 
POE boxes and ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Ken Hohhof]

Around 1976 I worked for a company that made OEM TV sets for Sears and 
KMart.  We never had one with a hot chassis, I would have remembered that.


I do remember that one of the high voltage designers electrocuted himself. 
At home.  On his ham radio setup.


I never got used to discharging the second anode on the CRT.  25 kV is 
scary.  CRT is a capacitor and holds a charge, as do triplers.  As do 
electrostatic voltmeters.  But that 2 kW ham radio amp had lots of voltage 
and current available.  Stopped his heart.  He was able to tell his wife to 
call 911 but they were too late.



-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:41 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

TVs used to have a hot chassis.  They were in a wooden box though...

-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I understand why an an engineer using a RF device would do that, they want
zero impedance from the RF ground to the rest of the world. You can still DC
isolate it but it takes a little bit of doing at microwave frequencies.

If you choose 48 volts as a design engineer, you are choosing a voltage that
historically has been -48 in the telcom industry.

I don't understand why a router designer would need to bond their logic
grounds to the chassis.
If it is phy isolated ethernet in and out, there is no problem in having a
hot ground plane with respect to the case of the device.

So, I guess you could make an isolated mount for MT routers...

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.

On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: Friday, 
August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both -48v. 
Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[chuck]

OK, I presume if you put all pins to -48 you only be connecting a single -48 
wire.


If you connect a return, then yes the LEDS will light but not necessarily 
mean anything.


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.


Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I wrong?

Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.

On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + and - 
then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how.  Obviously if  you 
put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads at 
the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself and 
forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the POE 
does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and if any 
of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is bonding + to 
chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - to chassis is gonna 
blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing isn't 
tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, because 
obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them marked. And 
the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just a polarity 
indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, return 
on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 POE boxes and 
ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[George Skorup]

No, it's not confusing the way it is now. I just had a blonde moment.

>>Obviously if  you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.

See, now that's confusing. I removed all jumpers and put positive to the 
+, negative to - as you have them marked and the green LED still lights 
up. Reverse them and the red LED comes on instead. Perhaps that's where 
some of my confusion is coming from. It looks like the LEDs are just 
wired to the input block and are independent of the POE circuit. Am I wrong?


Don't get me wrong, the LED is nice to have to know there's power 
present, but it's not essential. Meaning I could live without them.


On 8/19/2016 9:02 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + 
and - then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how.  Obviously if  
you put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads 
at the sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself 
and forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the POE 
does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and if 
any of those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is bonding 
+ to chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - to chassis 
is gonna blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing 
isn't tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, 
because obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them 
marked. And the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just a 
polarity indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using 
these for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, 
return on shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 
POE boxes and ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Ken Hohhof]

My impression is that anything powered by an 802.3af/at POE needs to be 
agnostic about grounding of the input, have its own floating input switching 
power supply, after which they can ground whatever they want.  Trust but 
verify.  It's kind of confusing, it seems the POE is supposed to use +48V 
but in many cases is floating.



-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 6:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I understand why an an engineer using a RF device would do that, they want
zero impedance from the RF ground to the rest of the world. You can still DC
isolate it but it takes a little bit of doing at microwave frequencies.

If you choose 48 volts as a design engineer, you are choosing a voltage that
historically has been -48 in the telcom industry.

I don't understand why a router designer would need to bond their logic
grounds to the chassis.
If it is phy isolated ethernet in and out, there is no problem in having a
hot ground plane with respect to the case of the device.

So, I guess you could make an isolated mount for MT routers...

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.

On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: Friday, 
August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both -48v. 
Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[chuck]

TVs used to have a hot chassis.  They were in a wooden box though...

-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:38 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I understand why an an engineer using a RF device would do that, they want
zero impedance from the RF ground to the rest of the world. You can still DC
isolate it but it takes a little bit of doing at microwave frequencies.

If you choose 48 volts as a design engineer, you are choosing a voltage that
historically has been -48 in the telcom industry.

I don't understand why a router designer would need to bond their logic
grounds to the chassis.
If it is phy isolated ethernet in and out, there is no problem in having a
hot ground plane with respect to the case of the device.

So, I guess you could make an isolated mount for MT routers...

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.

On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: Friday, 
August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both -48v. 
Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[chuck]

I understand why an an engineer using a RF device would do that, they want 
zero impedance from the RF ground to the rest of the world. You can still DC 
isolate it but it takes a little bit of doing at microwave frequencies.


If you choose 48 volts as a design engineer, you are choosing a voltage that 
historically has been -48 in the telcom industry.


I don't understand why a router designer would need to bond their logic 
grounds to the chassis.
If it is phy isolated ethernet in and out, there is no problem in having a 
hot ground plane with respect to the case of the device.


So, I guess you could make an isolated mount for MT routers...

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 5:32 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.

On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: Friday, 
August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both -48v. 
Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[George Skorup]

Every MikroTik, UBNT and Canopy radio I've ever used bonds board/chassis 
to ground. And those are definitely negative ground.


On 8/19/2016 6:27 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. Sent: 
Friday, August 19, 2016 4:42 PM To: af@afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 
48v and -48v
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. 
The CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power 
source but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for 
the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[chuck]

Are they truly +48 or just 48?

-Original Message- 
From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:42 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v 

I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[chuck]

Yep, a referendum on the process, not the reefer madness.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 3:39 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

I’m not sure that’s a correct reading of the article.  This was a state job, 
I’m guessing with a union contract that included arbitration?  The arbitrator 
said he should not be fired but rather be suspended without pay for 6 months 
and be subject to random drug testing for a year.  The lower court overturned 
the arbitrator’s decision saying it was contrary to state policy against 
marijuana use.  The supreme court overruled the lower court and let the 
arbitrator’s ruling stand.

“All seven justices agreed that the lower-court judge was wrong to overturn the 
arbitrator’s ruling, saying that although state policy on drug use in the 
workplace allows for firing workers it does not require it.”

It sounds like they were in the clear firing the worker if it weren’t for his 
ability to take it to arbitration.


From: That One Guy /sarcasm 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance pay 
out the death benefit

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza  
wrote:

  Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes... 


  On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm"  
wrote:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
 

The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee for 
doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime


-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.




-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

[AFMUG] Something new

[chuck]

https://youtu.be/s32uO9zQgEI
Sorry about the lousy audio.  This shows testing of a prototype mag mount 
accessory to our tower mounts.
I think I can improve on this but it starts to cut loose at about 100-120 lbs 
of force.  So I would not rate it over 50 lbs.
If there were 4 of these on one of our P mounts you could probably safely mount 
a 100-200 lb antenna on it.  

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Bill Prince]

Might want to check, but all the Dragonwave radios that I've ever 
touched used -48V, but did not connect the return to the chassis. IOW, 
the return is isolated from the chassis (AKA "floating"). So it probably 
can be used along side some +48V equipment.



bp


On 8/19/2016 3:41 PM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:
I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. 
The CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power 
source but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for 
the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[chuck]

48 vs +48 vs -48.

I am wondering how many truly +48 things are out there people are using.

-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 2:16 PM 
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v 

AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was thinking
maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.]

I looked it up, you are correct that everything you listed is +48v. The 
CCR uses a bullet connector so there is no ground from the power source 
but since it can also be powered via PoE, I expect it to be +48.


The site has a Dragon Wave and that old Cambium radio that are both 
-48v. Oh the joys of moving away from AC power bricks to straight DC.


Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 1:16 PM, George Skorup wrote:
AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though 
that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Bill Prince]

I think arbitration goes both ways. If both parties have agreed to 
arbitration, I think they both are obliged to comply with the ruling.


bp


On 8/19/2016 2:39 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:
I’m not sure that’s a correct reading of the article. This was a state 
job, I’m guessing with a union contract that included arbitration?  
The arbitrator said he should not be fired but rather be suspended 
without pay for 6 months and be subject to random drug testing for a 
year. The lower court overturned the arbitrator’s decision saying it 
was contrary to state policy against marijuana use.  The supreme court 
overruled the lower court and let the arbitrator’s ruling stand.
“All seven justices agreed that the lower-court judge was wrong to 
overturn the arbitrator’s ruling, saying that although state policy on 
drug use in the workplace allows for firing workers it does not 
require it.”
It sounds like they were in the clear firing the worker if it weren’t 
for his ability to take it to arbitration.

*From:* That One Guy /sarcasm 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 4:24 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF
probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the 
insurance pay out the death benefit
On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:


Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes...

On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm"
> wrote:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html



The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an
employee for doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting
arrested for the crime
-- 
If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see

your team as part of yourself you have already failed as part
of the team.



--
If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your 
team as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Ken Hohhof]

True.

But once Gary Johnson is elected President ...


-Original Message- 
From: Christopher Tyler

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:56 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

And it was the state supreme court not the US Supreme court that ruled. So 
only applied to Connecticut anyway.


--
Christopher Tyler
MTCRE/MTCNA/MTCTCE/MTCWE
Total Highspeed Internet Services
417.851.1107

- Original Message -
From: "Ken Hohhof" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:39:23 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

I’m not sure that’s a correct reading of the article.  This was a state job, 
I’m guessing with a union contract that included arbitration?  The 
arbitrator said he should not be fired but rather be suspended without pay 
for 6 months and be subject to random drug testing for a year.  The lower 
court overturned the arbitrator’s decision saying it was contrary to state 
policy against marijuana use.  The supreme court overruled the lower court 
and let the arbitrator’s ruling stand.


“All seven justices agreed that the lower-court judge was wrong to overturn 
the arbitrator’s ruling, saying that although state policy on drug use in 
the workplace allows for firing workers it does not require it.”


It sounds like they were in the clear firing the worker if it weren’t for 
his ability to take it to arbitration.



From: That One Guy /sarcasm
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance 
pay out the death benefit


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza  
wrote:


 Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes...


 On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm" 
 wrote:


   
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html

   The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee 
for doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime



   -- 

   If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team 
as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.





--

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team. 

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Christopher Tyler]

And it was the state supreme court not the US Supreme court that ruled. So only 
applied to Connecticut anyway.

-- 
Christopher Tyler 
MTCRE/MTCNA/MTCTCE/MTCWE 
Total Highspeed Internet Services 
417.851.1107

- Original Message -
From: "Ken Hohhof" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:39:23 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

I’m not sure that’s a correct reading of the article.  This was a state job, 
I’m guessing with a union contract that included arbitration?  The arbitrator 
said he should not be fired but rather be suspended without pay for 6 months 
and be subject to random drug testing for a year.  The lower court overturned 
the arbitrator’s decision saying it was contrary to state policy against 
marijuana use.  The supreme court overruled the lower court and let the 
arbitrator’s ruling stand.

“All seven justices agreed that the lower-court judge was wrong to overturn the 
arbitrator’s ruling, saying that although state policy on drug use in the 
workplace allows for firing workers it does not require it.”

It sounds like they were in the clear firing the worker if it weren’t for his 
ability to take it to arbitration.


From: That One Guy /sarcasm 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance pay 
out the death benefit

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza  
wrote:

  Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes... 


  On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm"  
wrote:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
 

The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee for 
doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime


-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.




-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Ken Hohhof]

I’m not sure that’s a correct reading of the article.  This was a state job, 
I’m guessing with a union contract that included arbitration?  The arbitrator 
said he should not be fired but rather be suspended without pay for 6 months 
and be subject to random drug testing for a year.  The lower court overturned 
the arbitrator’s decision saying it was contrary to state policy against 
marijuana use.  The supreme court overruled the lower court and let the 
arbitrator’s ruling stand.

“All seven justices agreed that the lower-court judge was wrong to overturn the 
arbitrator’s ruling, saying that although state policy on drug use in the 
workplace allows for firing workers it does not require it.”

It sounds like they were in the clear firing the worker if it weren’t for his 
ability to take it to arbitration.


From: That One Guy /sarcasm 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 4:24 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance pay 
out the death benefit

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza  
wrote:

  Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes... 


  On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm"  
wrote:


https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
 

The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee for 
doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime


-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.




-- 

If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as 
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Jaime Solorza]

Yikes... You probably just ripped one wing off flies when you were young..
Gave them false hope

On Aug 19, 2016 3:25 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm" 
wrote:

> probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance
> pay out the death benefit
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes...
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm" <
>> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-
>>> for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/1
>>> 9/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
>>>
>>> The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee
>>> for doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime
>>>
>>> --
>>> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team
>>> as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
>>>
>>
>
>
> --
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team
> as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
>

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[That One Guy /sarcasm]

probably cheaper to push the dope fiend off a tower and let the insurance
pay out the death benefit

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes...
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm" <
> thatoneguyst...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-
>> for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/
>> 19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
>>
>> The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee
>> for doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime
>>
>> --
>> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team
>> as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
>>
>


-- 
If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

[AFMUG] Pmp430 5.7 sm's for sale with power supply

[TJ Trout]

$30 ea with old style psu. Have many available.

Re: [AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[Jaime Solorza]

Yep.   You have provide medical and rehab assistance sometimes...

On Aug 19, 2016 3:17 PM, "That One Guy /sarcasm" 
wrote:

> https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-
> rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/
> 2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html
>
> The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee
> for doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime
>
> --
> If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team
> as part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.
>

[AFMUG] OT: just WTF

[That One Guy /sarcasm]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/court-rules-for-connecticut-state-worker-fired-for-smoking-pot/2016/08/19/d4122b74-6630-11e6-be4e-23fc4d4d12b4_story.html

The supreme court has now ruled that you cant actually fire an employee for
doing drugs in your company vehicles and getting arrested for the crime

-- 
If you only see yourself as part of the team but you don't see your team as
part of yourself you have already failed as part of the team.

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Luthman]

I should have bought Apple stock when I first knew what a stock was...

What's going on here I'm defending Ubiquiti.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:13 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> They should have done wiz-bang features first, backwards compat later. Or,
> just not announced 3 hardware revisions so fast, there's that to.
>
> At least AF line is solid. EdgeOS line is getting there, just needs mpls
> done in hardware and a few new 10G models.
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 3:09 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
> Blah blah blah I'm losing bet blah =P
>
> Everyone makes mistakes.  Making improvements is all you can really ask of
> anyone or a company.  I'm sure you've had that one employee that you should
> have fired earlier but didn't for one reason or another.
>
> If they can pull it off I'd be incredibly shocked and excited.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> They're slower than Christmas. Been stuck a year on interop, hacked off
>> an RF team, and then did better in a few months than the other team did in
>> a year. It's sad, really.
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016 3:00 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> "Before August was the bet"
>>>
>>> But I'll give you an extra 11 days because I'm such a nice guy =)
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hey, there's still a week!

 On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
 wrote:

> And no sync...
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Yep :)
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:

> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>  wrote:
> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
> kerploaded.
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds <
> j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
> >>
> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Josh Luthman
> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >>> 1100 Wayne St
> >>> Suite 1337
> >>> Troy, OH 45373
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
> j...@kyneticwifi.com>
> >>> wrote:
> 
>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it
> would sync
>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
> 
>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>  wrote:
> >
> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
> would rise
> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
> >  

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[George Skorup]

AF5 and 24's. Virtually any 802.3af or at device. Multiple MikroTik 
products. Other UBNT stuff. I'm sure there's more.


On 8/19/2016 11:11 AM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was thinking
maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Reynolds]

They should have done wiz-bang features first, backwards compat later. Or,
just not announced 3 hardware revisions so fast, there's that to.

At least AF line is solid. EdgeOS line is getting there, just needs mpls
done in hardware and a few new 10G models.

On Aug 19, 2016 3:09 PM, "Josh Luthman"  wrote:

Blah blah blah I'm losing bet blah =P

Everyone makes mistakes.  Making improvements is all you can really ask of
anyone or a company.  I'm sure you've had that one employee that you should
have fired earlier but didn't for one reason or another.

If they can pull it off I'd be incredibly shocked and excited.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> They're slower than Christmas. Been stuck a year on interop, hacked off an
> RF team, and then did better in a few months than the other team did in a
> year. It's sad, really.
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 3:00 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> "Before August was the bet"
>>
>> But I'll give you an extra 11 days because I'm such a nice guy =)
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey, there's still a week!
>>>
>>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 And no sync...


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> Yep :)
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds >> > wrote:
>>>
 GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
  wrote:
 > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
 kerploaded.
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
 >>
 >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
 >>
 >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
 >> wrote:
 >>>
 >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> Josh Luthman
 >>> Office: 937-552-2340
 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >>> 1100 Wayne St
 >>> Suite 1337
 >>> Troy, OH 45373
 >>>
 >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com>
 >>> wrote:
 
  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it
 would sync
  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
 
  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
  wrote:
 >
 > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
 would rise
 > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
 >  wrote:
 >>
 >> Yep I'm here
 >>
 >> Josh Luthman
 >> Office: 937-552-2340
 >> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >> 1100 Wayne St
 >> Suite 1337
 >> Troy, OH 45373
 >>
 >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown" 
 wrote:
 >>>
 >>> I saw him yesterday.
 >>>
 >>> From: Josh 

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Luthman]

Blah blah blah I'm losing bet blah =P

Everyone makes mistakes.  Making improvements is all you can really ask of
anyone or a company.  I'm sure you've had that one employee that you should
have fired earlier but didn't for one reason or another.

If they can pull it off I'd be incredibly shocked and excited.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 4:03 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> They're slower than Christmas. Been stuck a year on interop, hacked off an
> RF team, and then did better in a few months than the other team did in a
> year. It's sad, really.
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 3:00 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> "Before August was the bet"
>>
>> But I'll give you an extra 11 days because I'm such a nice guy =)
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey, there's still a week!
>>>
>>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 And no sync...


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> Yep :)
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds >> > wrote:
>>>
 GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
  wrote:
 > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
 kerploaded.
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
 >>
 >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
 >>
 >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
 >> wrote:
 >>>
 >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> Josh Luthman
 >>> Office: 937-552-2340
 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >>> 1100 Wayne St
 >>> Suite 1337
 >>> Troy, OH 45373
 >>>
 >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com>
 >>> wrote:
 
  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it
 would sync
  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
 
  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
  wrote:
 >
 > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
 would rise
 > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
 >  wrote:
 >>
 >> Yep I'm here
 >>
 >> Josh Luthman
 >> Office: 937-552-2340
 >> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >> 1100 Wayne St
 >> Suite 1337
 >> Troy, OH 45373
 >>
 >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown" 
 wrote:
 >>>
 >>> I saw him yesterday.
 >>>
 >>> From: Josh Reynolds
 >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
 >>> To: af@afmug.com
 >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few
 months to
 >>> go though :P
 >

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Reynolds]

They're slower than Christmas. Been stuck a year on interop, hacked off an
RF team, and then did better in a few months than the other team did in a
year. It's sad, really.

On Aug 19, 2016 3:00 PM, "Josh Luthman"  wrote:

> "Before August was the bet"
>
> But I'll give you an extra 11 days because I'm such a nice guy =)
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey, there's still a week!
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> And no sync...
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Yep :)

 On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
 wrote:

> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>
>> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>>>  wrote:
>>> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
>>> kerploaded.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Josh Luthman
>>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> > 1100 Wayne St
>>> > Suite 1337
>>> > Troy, OH 45373
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds <
>>> j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Josh Luthman
>>> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> >>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> >>> Suite 1337
>>> >>> Troy, OH 45373
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
>>> j...@kyneticwifi.com>
>>> >>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it
>>> would sync
>>>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
>>> 
>>>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>>>  wrote:
>>> >
>>> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
>>> would rise
>>> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Josh Luthman
>>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> > 1100 Wayne St
>>> > Suite 1337
>>> > Troy, OH 45373
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
>>> >  wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Yep I'm here
>>> >>
>>> >> Josh Luthman
>>> >> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> >> 1100 Wayne St
>>> >> Suite 1337
>>> >> Troy, OH 45373
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown" 
>>> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I saw him yesterday.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> From: Josh Reynolds
>>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
>>> >>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few
>>> months to
>>> >>> go though :P
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>>
>>> >
>>>
>>
>>
>
>>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Luthman]

"Before August was the bet"

But I'll give you an extra 11 days because I'm such a nice guy =)


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> Hey, there's still a week!
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> And no sync...
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yep :)
>>>
>>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hey Reynolds.  It's August.


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:

> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>>  wrote:
>> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
>> kerploaded.
>> >
>> >
>> > Josh Luthman
>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>> > 1100 Wayne St
>> > Suite 1337
>> > Troy, OH 45373
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds <
>> j...@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Josh Luthman
>> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> >>> 1100 Wayne St
>> >>> Suite 1337
>> >>> Troy, OH 45373
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
>> j...@kyneticwifi.com>
>> >>> wrote:
>> 
>>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it
>> would sync
>>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
>> 
>>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>>  wrote:
>> >
>> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
>> would rise
>> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
>> >
>> >
>> > Josh Luthman
>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>> > 1100 Wayne St
>> > Suite 1337
>> > Troy, OH 45373
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
>> >  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Yep I'm here
>> >>
>> >> Josh Luthman
>> >> Office: 937-552-2340
>> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> >> 1100 Wayne St
>> >> Suite 1337
>> >> Troy, OH 45373
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown" 
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I saw him yesterday.
>> >>>
>> >>> From: Josh Reynolds
>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
>> >>> To: af@afmug.com
>> >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few
>> months to
>> >>> go though :P
>> >
>> >
>> >>>
>> >
>>
>
>

>>

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Reynolds]

Hey, there's still a week!

On Aug 19, 2016 2:52 PM, "Josh Luthman"  wrote:

> And no sync...
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> Yep :)
>>
>> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!


 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:

> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>  wrote:
> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
> kerploaded.
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
> >>
> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Josh Luthman
> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >>> 1100 Wayne St
> >>> Suite 1337
> >>> Troy, OH 45373
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
> j...@kyneticwifi.com>
> >>> wrote:
> 
>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it would
> sync
>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
> 
>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>  wrote:
> >
> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
> would rise
> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
> >  wrote:
> >>
> >> Yep I'm here
> >>
> >> Josh Luthman
> >> Office: 937-552-2340
> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
> >> 1100 Wayne St
> >> Suite 1337
> >> Troy, OH 45373
> >>
> >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown" 
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I saw him yesterday.
> >>>
> >>> From: Josh Reynolds
> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
> >>> To: af@afmug.com
> >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few
> months to
> >>> go though :P
> >
> >
> >>>
> >
>


>>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Luthman]

And no sync...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 3:50 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> Yep :)
>
> On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman <
>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>>>
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)

 On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
  wrote:
 > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
 kerploaded.
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds 
 wrote:
 >>
 >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
 >>
 >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
 >> wrote:
 >>>
 >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> Josh Luthman
 >>> Office: 937-552-2340
 >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >>> 1100 Wayne St
 >>> Suite 1337
 >>> Troy, OH 45373
 >>>
 >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds <
 j...@kyneticwifi.com>
 >>> wrote:
 
  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it would
 sync
  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
 
  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
 j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
  wrote:
 >
 > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun
 would rise
 > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
 >
 >
 > Josh Luthman
 > Office: 937-552-2340
 > Direct: 937-552-2343
 > 1100 Wayne St
 > Suite 1337
 > Troy, OH 45373
 >
 > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
 >  wrote:
 >>
 >> Yep I'm here
 >>
 >> Josh Luthman
 >> Office: 937-552-2340
 >> Direct: 937-552-2343
 >> 1100 Wayne St
 >> Suite 1337
 >> Troy, OH 45373
 >>
 >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
 >>>
 >>> I saw him yesterday.
 >>>
 >>> From: Josh Reynolds
 >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
 >>> To: af@afmug.com
 >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
 >>>
 >>>
 >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few
 months to
 >>> go though :P
 >
 >
 >>>
 >

>>>
>>>
>>

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Reynolds]

Yep :)

On Aug 19, 2016 2:41 PM, "Josh Luthman"  wrote:

> Hey Reynolds.  It's August.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman  > wrote:
>
>> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>>>  wrote:
>>> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
>>> kerploaded.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Josh Luthman
>>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> > 1100 Wayne St
>>> > Suite 1337
>>> > Troy, OH 45373
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>>> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>>> >> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Josh Luthman
>>> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> >>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> >>> Suite 1337
>>> >>> Troy, OH 45373
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds >> >
>>> >>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it would
>>> sync
>>>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
>>> 
>>>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
>>>  wrote:
>>> >
>>> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun would
>>> rise
>>> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Josh Luthman
>>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> > 1100 Wayne St
>>> > Suite 1337
>>> > Troy, OH 45373
>>> >
>>> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
>>> >  wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Yep I'm here
>>> >>
>>> >> Josh Luthman
>>> >> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> >> 1100 Wayne St
>>> >> Suite 1337
>>> >> Troy, OH 45373
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I saw him yesterday.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> From: Josh Reynolds
>>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
>>> >>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few months
>>> to
>>> >>> go though :P
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>>
>>> >
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?

[Josh Luthman]

Hey Reynolds.  It's August.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:21 PM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> Bunch of people had the NDA the last swing.  We'll see in August!
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:18 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
>
>> GA before August was the bet. Also, NDA prevents a lot :)
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:13 PM, Josh Luthman
>>  wrote:
>> > Pretty sure if sync was working every mailing list would have
>> kerploaded.
>> >
>> >
>> > Josh Luthman
>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>> > 1100 Wayne St
>> > Suite 1337
>> > Troy, OH 45373
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 9:11 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> You'd be out $500 but you never agreed before the show :/
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 21, 2016 8:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" 
>> >> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Oh that's right.  What should I expect to win?
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Josh Luthman
>> >>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> >>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> >>> 1100 Wayne St
>> >>> Suite 1337
>> >>> Troy, OH 45373
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Mar 21, 2016 at 8:53 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> >>> wrote:
>> 
>>  "What if my bet was GA before August and a sidebet on if it would
>> sync
>>  with AF5X given the same sync parameters (50/50,75/25,etc)?"
>> 
>>  On Mar 21, 2016 6:07 PM, "Josh Luthman" > >
>>  wrote:
>> >
>> > What was the bet exactly?  Weren't you gambling that the sun would
>> rise
>> > in the west or a day is coming that doesn't end in "y"?
>> >
>> >
>> > Josh Luthman
>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>> > 1100 Wayne St
>> > Suite 1337
>> > Troy, OH 45373
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 17, 2016 at 10:26 AM, Josh Luthman
>> >  wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Yep I'm here
>> >>
>> >> Josh Luthman
>> >> Office: 937-552-2340
>> >> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> >> 1100 Wayne St
>> >> Suite 1337
>> >> Troy, OH 45373
>> >>
>> >> On Mar 17, 2016 9:30 AM, "Chuck McCown"  wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> I saw him yesterday.
>> >>>
>> >>> From: Josh Reynolds
>> >>> Sent: Thursday, March 17, 2016 7:12 AM
>> >>> To: af@afmug.com
>> >>> Subject: [AFMUG] Luthman are you in Louisville?
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Just curious if your wallet is ready. There's still a few months
>> to
>> >>> go though :P
>> >
>> >
>> >>>
>> >
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

What NOT to do is try and attach GPS as a side-kit to an existing TDMA
protocol. That was a terrible idea.

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:37 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> Looks like IEEE 1588v2 is more complicated than that, more like NTP.  Or
> telco Stratum clocks.
>
> It may assume each client has a free running clock and just needs periodic
> timing adjustments to keep it in sync with the master.
>
> I guess an example of what NOT to do is that thing Ubiquiti tried.
>
>
> -Original Message- From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 2:29 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Props to Netonix
>
>
> Well, that assumes every baud would be a timing pulse.  I think you could do
> that on the physical layer OK.  Just make one end GPS referenced and use
> some kind of sync extractor.  Count up 125,000,000 bauds and you have one
> second.
>
> -Original Message- From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:27 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
> With GigE, you are sending 125 Mbaud.
> So that would be an 8 nanosecond timing granularity.
> Should be good enough.  Forrest would know for certain.
>
> -Original Message- From: Adam Moffett
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:11 PM
> To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
> Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across
> ethernet.
>
> I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps
> GPS clock.
>
> Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have
> an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Josh Reynolds" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
>> Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave
>> networks?
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
>>>
>>>  That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.
>>>
>>>  What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I
>>> really
>>>  don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should
>>> be
>>>  heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?
>>>
>>>
>>>  From: Eric Muehleisen
>>>  Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
>>>  To: af@afmug.com
>>>  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>>>
>>>  Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.
>>>
>>>  On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
>>> 
>>>  wrote:


  In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
 item
  out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
 simple
  to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having
 the
  variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up
 the
  good work!

  Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


  Erich Kaiser
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291

>>>
>>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Fw: Props to Netonix

[Ken Hohhof]

Looks like IEEE 1588v2 is more complicated than that, more like NTP.  Or 
telco Stratum clocks.


It may assume each client has a free running clock and just needs periodic 
timing adjustments to keep it in sync with the master.


I guess an example of what NOT to do is that thing Ubiquiti tried.


-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 2:29 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] Fw: Props to Netonix

Well, that assumes every baud would be a timing pulse.  I think you could do
that on the physical layer OK.  Just make one end GPS referenced and use
some kind of sync extractor.  Count up 125,000,000 bauds and you have one
second.

-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

With GigE, you are sending 125 Mbaud.
So that would be an 8 nanosecond timing granularity.
Should be good enough.  Forrest would know for certain.

-Original Message- 
From: Adam Moffett

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across
ethernet.

I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps
GPS clock.

Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have
an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.


-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave 
networks?


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

 What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I 
really
 don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should 
be

 heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


 From: Eric Muehleisen
 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

 Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 


 wrote:


 In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an 
item
 out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
simple
 to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having 
the
 variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up 
the

 good work!

 Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291

[AFMUG] Fw: Props to Netonix

[chuck]

Well, that assumes every baud would be a timing pulse.  I think you could do
that on the physical layer OK.  Just make one end GPS referenced and use
some kind of sync extractor.  Count up 125,000,000 bauds and you have one
second.

-Original Message- 
From: ch...@wbmfg.com

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:27 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

With GigE, you are sending 125 Mbaud.
So that would be an 8 nanosecond timing granularity.
Should be good enough.  Forrest would know for certain.

-Original Message- 
From: Adam Moffett

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across
ethernet.

I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps
GPS clock.

Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have
an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.


-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave 
networks?


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

 What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I 
really
 don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should 
be

 heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


 From: Eric Muehleisen
 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

 Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 


 wrote:


 In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an 
item
 out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
simple
 to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having 
the
 variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up 
the

 good work!

 Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[chuck]

With GigE, you are sending 125 Mbaud.
So that would be an 8 nanosecond timing granularity.
Should be good enough.  Forrest would know for certain.

-Original Message- 
From: Adam Moffett

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across
ethernet.

I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps
GPS clock.

Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have
an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.


-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave 
networks?


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

 What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I 
really
 don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should 
be

 heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


 From: Eric Muehleisen
 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

 Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 


 wrote:


 In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an 
item
 out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
simple
 to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having 
the
 variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up 
the

 good work!

 Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Ken Hohhof]

Sounds like it may be applicable or in use for LTE small cell deployment?
http://www.cambiumnetworks.com/blog/network-timing-for-the-3g-and-4glte-small-cell-backhaul-the-future-is-here/


-Original Message- 
From: Adam Moffett

Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 2:11 PM
To: af@afmug.com ; af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across
ethernet.

I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps
GPS clock.

Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have
an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.


-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave 
networks?


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

 What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I 
really
 don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should 
be

 heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


 From: Eric Muehleisen
 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

 Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 


 wrote:


 In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an 
item
 out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
simple
 to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having 
the
 variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up 
the

 good work!

 Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Adam Moffett]

Maybe, but in more general terms it propagates a clocking signal across 
ethernet.


I don't think there's any reason it couldn't be used to propagate a 1pps 
GPS clock.


Like any good standard, there's more than one to choose from.  You have 
an ITU and IEEE variant that do the same thing only different.



-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Reynolds" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 2:51:24 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave 
networks?


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:

 That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

 What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I 
really
 don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we 
should be

 heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


 From: Eric Muehleisen
 Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
 To: af@afmug.com
 Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

 Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

 On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 


 wrote:


 In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with 
an item
 out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
simple
 to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  
Having the
 variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up 
the

 good work!

 Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Luthman]

I used to bounce around and see every booth but anymore it's just hard to
really elevate one product over the other without having it.  It's a lot of
money to have and try those products.  It's cheaper to let other people
test them out for me.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:57 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Josh only makes it to 2 or 3 booths per show.  ;-)
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Josh Reynolds" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, August 19, 2016 1:42:54 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
> It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how
> many find out about new packetflux products (for example).
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman
>  wrote:
> > To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has
> the
> > time to test all of them to find the good ones.
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4
> years.
> >>
> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
> >>  wrote:
> >> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
> >> > item
> >> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
> >> > simple
> >> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
> Having
> >> > the
> >> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up
> the
> >> > good work!
> >> >
> >> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Erich Kaiser
> >> > North Central Tower
> >> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> >> > Office: 630-621-4804
> >> > Cell: 630-777-9291
> >> >
> >
> >
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

I normally stagger to all of them after the first night. :P

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:57 PM, Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Josh only makes it to 2 or 3 booths per show.  ;-)
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
>
>
> 
> --
> *From: *"Josh Reynolds" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, August 19, 2016 1:42:54 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
> It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how
> many find out about new packetflux products (for example).
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman
>  wrote:
> > To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has
> the
> > time to test all of them to find the good ones.
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4
> years.
> >>
> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
> >>  wrote:
> >> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
> >> > item
> >> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
> >> > simple
> >> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
> Having
> >> > the
> >> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up
> the
> >> > good work!
> >> >
> >> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Erich Kaiser
> >> > North Central Tower
> >> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> >> > Office: 630-621-4804
> >> > Cell: 630-777-9291
> >> >
> >
> >
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Luthman]

There are a lot of booths.  There are a lot of products at those booths.
That's like saying every single product at every single booth is
fantastic...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how
> many find out about new packetflux products (for example).
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman
>  wrote:
> > To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has
> the
> > time to test all of them to find the good ones.
> >
> >
> > Josh Luthman
> > Office: 937-552-2340
> > Direct: 937-552-2343
> > 1100 Wayne St
> > Suite 1337
> > Troy, OH 45373
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4
> years.
> >>
> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
> >>  wrote:
> >> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
> >> > item
> >> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
> >> > simple
> >> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
> Having
> >> > the
> >> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up
> the
> >> > good work!
> >> >
> >> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Erich Kaiser
> >> > North Central Tower
> >> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> >> > Office: 630-621-4804
> >> > Cell: 630-777-9291
> >> >
> >
> >
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Mike Hammett]

Josh only makes it to 2 or 3 booths per show. ;-) 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 




- Original Message -

From: "Josh Reynolds"  
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:42:54 PM 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix 

It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how 
many find out about new packetflux products (for example). 

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman 
 wrote: 
> To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has the 
> time to test all of them to find the good ones. 
> 
> 
> Josh Luthman 
> Office: 937-552-2340 
> Direct: 937-552-2343 
> 1100 Wayne St 
> Suite 1337 
> Troy, OH 45373 
> 
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote: 
>> 
>> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4 years. 
>> 
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 
>>  wrote: 
>> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an 
>> > item 
>> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very 
>> > simple 
>> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised! Having 
>> > the 
>> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome! Keep up the 
>> > good work! 
>> > 
>> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out! 
>> > 
>> > 
>> > Erich Kaiser 
>> > North Central Tower 
>> > er...@northcentraltower.com 
>> > Office: 630-621-4804 
>> > Cell: 630-777-9291 
>> > 
> 
> 

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

Hey, you keep Bitlomat out of this...

They are nice folks.

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:52 PM, Josh Luthman
 wrote:
> There are a lot of booths.  There are a lot of products at those booths.
> That's like saying every single product at every single booth is
> fantastic...
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:42 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:
>>
>> It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how
>> many find out about new packetflux products (for example).
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman
>>  wrote:
>> > To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has
>> > the
>> > time to test all of them to find the good ones.
>> >
>> >
>> > Josh Luthman
>> > Office: 937-552-2340
>> > Direct: 937-552-2343
>> > 1100 Wayne St
>> > Suite 1337
>> > Troy, OH 45373
>> >
>> > On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds 
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4
>> >> years.
>> >>
>> >> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
>> >>  wrote:
>> >> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
>> >> > item
>> >> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
>> >> > simple
>> >> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
>> >> > Having
>> >> > the
>> >> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up
>> >> > the
>> >> > good work!
>> >> >
>> >> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Erich Kaiser
>> >> > North Central Tower
>> >> > er...@northcentraltower.com
>> >> > Office: 630-621-4804
>> >> > Cell: 630-777-9291
>> >> >
>> >
>> >
>
>

[AFMUG] ePMP 1000 2.4 integrated and Allot Netenforcer for sale

[Yent, Timothy M]

I still have the following items for sale.  Offers accepted

9   New ePMP 1000 integrated 2.4Ghz in original box 70.00ea
6   New ePMP 1000 integrated 2.4Ghz no box  70.00ea

8 Used ePMP 1000 integrated 2.4Ghz   50.00ea

1  Allot NetEnforcer AC-1440   Make offer
1  Allot NetEnforcer Bypass  Make offer

Tim

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

Isn't SyncE for supporting Telco/TDM circuits over ethernet/microwave networks?

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:42 PM, Ken Hohhof  wrote:
> That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.
>
> What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I really
> don’t know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should be
> heading.  Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?
>
>
> From: Eric Muehleisen
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix
>
> Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 
> wrote:
>>
>> In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an item
>> out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very simple
>> to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having the
>> variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
>> good work!
>>
>> Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

It's not like he hasn't had a booth at shows. That seems to be how
many find out about new packetflux products (for example).

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:34 PM, Josh Luthman
 wrote:
> To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has the
> time to test all of them to find the good ones.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:
>>
>> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4 years.
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
>>  wrote:
>> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
>> > item
>> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
>> > simple
>> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having
>> > the
>> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
>> > good work!
>> >
>> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>> >
>> >
>> > Erich Kaiser
>> > North Central Tower
>> > er...@northcentraltower.com
>> > Office: 630-621-4804
>> > Cell: 630-777-9291
>> >
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Ken Hohhof]

That would seem to be a non trivial addition, and vendor specific.

What is the status of radio manufacturers adding SyncE support?  I really don’t 
know anything about SyncE, but that seems like the way we should be heading.  
Does SyncE apply to optical interfaces also?


From: Eric Muehleisen 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 1:36 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

  In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an item 
out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very simple to 
use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having the 
variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the good 
work!


  Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Luthman]

For only PMP100 and PMP450 that's a hard sale.  Might argue ePMP but I feel
Chris would just tell everyone else to use integrated GPS like he does.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:36 PM, Eric Muehleisen  wrote:

> Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser  > wrote:
>
>> In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
>> item out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
>> simple to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
>> Having the variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!
>> Keep up the good work!
>>
>> Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Carl Peterson]

And isolated DC input so we could run them at -48 without DC-DC converters

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:36 PM, Eric Muehleisen  wrote:

> Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser  > wrote:
>
>> In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
>> item out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
>> simple to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!
>> Having the variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!
>> Keep up the good work!
>>
>> Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>


-- 

Carl Peterson

*PORT NETWORKS*

401 E Pratt St, Ste 2553

Baltimore, MD 21202

(410) 637-3707

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Eric Muehleisen]

Cherry on the top would be the ability to provide sync over power.

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser 
wrote:

> In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an item
> out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very simple
> to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having the
> variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
> good work!
>
> Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Luthman]

To be fair there's a million products that come out and not everyone has
the time to test all of them to find the good ones.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Josh Reynolds  wrote:

> It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4 years.
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
>  wrote:
> > In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an
> item
> > out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very
> simple
> > to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having
> the
> > variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
> > good work!
> >
> > Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
> >
> >
> > Erich Kaiser
> > North Central Tower
> > er...@northcentraltower.com
> > Office: 630-621-4804
> > Cell: 630-777-9291
> >
>

Re: [AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Josh Reynolds]

It's nice the AFMUG crowd is finally seeing this after the past 3-4 years.

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Erich Kaiser
 wrote:
> In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an item
> out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very simple
> to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having the
> variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
> good work!
>
> Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>

[AFMUG] Props to Netonix

[Erich Kaiser]

In all my years of doing this this is the most impressed I am with an item
out of the box, I am very impressed with the Netonix switches, very simple
to use, great features, and best of all it works as advertised!  Having the
variable voltage input on DC version is absolutely awesome!  Keep up the
good work!

Even the DIN mount is impressive and well thought out!


Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.]

v is 2 pair power while vh has power on all pairs, though it self 
detects so it may allow 2 pair power.


The switch is capable of 1.5amps in vh mode while only .75 in v.

Gilbert


On 8/19/2016 9:09 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what 
is the significance to the “v”.

*From:* Josh Luthman 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair 
power and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change 
the pinout.


The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.  
It's obviously created by a WISP guy.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser 
> wrote:


Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.
Inline image 1

Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com 
Office: 630-621-4804 
Cell: 630-777-9291 

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser
>
wrote:

Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!
Inline image 1
Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com 
Office: 630-621-4804 
Cell: 630-777-9291 
On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser
> wrote:

If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and
820C is higher due to dual radio/core.
Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com

Office: 630-621-4804 
Cell: 630-777-9291 
On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup
> wrote:

Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for
power, or can it be supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only?
40W over only two pairs seems like it would be ungood.
I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24
radios which use all four pairs. Then the next
question is per pair polarity, which I assume is
different for the 820S vs AF.

We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs
with the jumpers removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are
max 32W or so. And in the real world, I see them
pulling about 25-27W.

On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

So looking at Cambium Forums

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939



http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740


https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612

So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at
pinouts.
I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio
when I get the Netonix switch.
Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com

Office: 630-621-4804 
Cell: 630-777-9291 
On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser
> wrote:

I found a post on the forums about IP20C working,
BTW these units work + or - 48v DC directly into
the unit. Also if you have the POE Unit it can do
a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com

Office: 630-621-4804 
Cell: 630-777-9291 
On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz

Re: [AFMUG] Telescoping Mast me lil brudder made

[Jaime Solorza]

This one goes 28 ft.One he is making me will go 40

On Aug 19, 2016 8:06 AM, "Ty Featherling"  wrote:

> Great pictures Jaime. How heavy is it? And what is the max height?
>
>
>
> -Ty
>
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Jaime Solorza 
> wrote:
>
>> This is his prototype he is letting use for some site surveys...
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] Telescoping Mast me lil brudder made

[Jaime Solorza]

Super light My amp head weighs 32 and this is way lighter... I will ask

On Aug 19, 2016 8:06 AM, "Ty Featherling"  wrote:

Great pictures Jaime. How heavy is it? And what is the max height?



-Ty

On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> This is his prototype he is letting use for some site surveys...
>

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Adam Moffett]

24 Volt-hours


-- Original Message --
From: "Josh Luthman" 
To: "af@afmug.com" 
Sent: 8/19/2016 12:23:14 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?


You thought it was 24 vertical horizons didn't you?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 12:18 PM,  wrote:
Oh, I thought perhaps it was Vertical voltage vs Horizontal 
voltage


From:Faisal Imtiaz
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:11 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

V = Volts ?

24VH = 24V high Power
24V  =  24V (regular power)

:)

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net



From: ch...@wbmfg.com
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 12:09:03 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what 
is the significance to the “v”.


From:Josh Luthman
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
To:af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair 
power and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change 
the pinout.


The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems. 
 It's obviously created by a WISP guy.



Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.




Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!




Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:
If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is 
higher due to dual radio/core.



Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup 
 wrote:
Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can 
it be supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs 
seems like it would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will 
power AF5 and 24 radios which use all four pairs. Then the next 
question is per pair polarity, which I assume is different for 
the 820S vs AF.


We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the 
jumpers removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in 
the real world, I see them pulling about 25-27W.


On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

So looking at Cambium Forums

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939

http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740

https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612

So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.

I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get 
the Netonix switch.



Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:
I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these 
units work + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you 
have the POE Unit it can do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc 
or something.



Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
 wrote:

>>I think it's -48 or optional +24

Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is 
basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on 
any polarity and and put out -48dc for the radio).



Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: 
supp...@snappytelecom.net




From: "Sean Heskett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
I think it's -48 or optional +24
-Sean

On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  
wrote:
The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the 
SAF Lumina?


On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
here's the data from the 

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Josh Luthman]

You thought it was 24 vertical horizons didn't you?


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 12:18 PM,  wrote:

> Oh, I thought perhaps it was Vertical voltage vs Horizontal voltage
>
> *From:* Faisal Imtiaz 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 10:11 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>
> V = Volts ?
>
> 24VH = 24V high Power
> 24V  =  24V (regular power)
>
> :)
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> 7266 SW 48 Street
> Miami, FL 33155
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *ch...@wbmfg.com
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Friday, August 19, 2016 12:09:03 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>
> H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what is
> the significance to the “v”.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>
> Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair
> power and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the
> pinout.
>
> The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.
> It's obviously created by a WISP guy.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>
>> Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.
>>
>> [image: Inline image 1]
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser <
>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!
>>>
>>> [image: Inline image 1]
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser <
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>>
 If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher
 due to dual radio/core.


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291


 On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup 
 wrote:

> Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be
> supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it
> would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios
> which use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity,
> which I assume is different for the 820S vs AF.
>
> We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the
> jumpers removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real
> world, I see them pulling about 25-27W.
>
> On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:
>
> So looking at Cambium Forums
>
> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-
> 820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-
> for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939
>
> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-
> FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740
>
> https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612
>
> So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.
>
> I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the
> Netonix switch.
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>
>> I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units
>> work + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit
>> it can do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <
>> fai...@snappytelecom.net> wrote:
>>
>>> >>I think it's -48 or optional +24
>>>
>>> Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is
>>> basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any 
>>> polarity
>>> and and put out -48dc for the radio).
>>>
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> 7266 SW 48 Street
>>> Miami, FL 33155
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <305%20663%205518%20x%20232>
>>>

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Bill Prince]

Subpanels add another level of separation. Typically all the neutrals 
are bonded to ground in the subpanel, which then get bonded again in the 
main panel. I can't help but think that the bonding in the subpanel will 
attenuate the signal getting to the main panel. If the two outlets are 
both going to the same subpanel, you're probably OK. However, if one 
plug goes to the subpanel, and the other goes to the main panel (or yet 
another subpanel), then I think you're going to have problems.



bp


On 8/19/2016 9:14 AM, Adam Moffett wrote:

Yeah the total wire distance.  Understood.
This utility room has it's own subpanel which is newer than the rest 
of the wiring in the building.  If they made a new home run for this 
sub panel then it might be 100+ feet of extra wire to get there.
I've read the best case distance for homeplug is 300m, but maybe half 
that in real life.  It's hard to believe they can't go a little 
farther.  If 300m is the best we can hope for, then why did any ISP 
ever think BPL would work for last mile distribution?  Was BPL 
radically different from homeplug?
Something like 10meg at 1000m would be more useful to me than gigabit 
across the room.

-- Original Message --
From: "Bill Prince" >
To: af@afmug.com 
Sent: 8/19/2016 1:10:57 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug


With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located 
because they have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 
floors away, then the signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and 
then back up to the other homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.



bp


On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling broadband over 
powerlines equipment?
I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility 
closet to an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) 
in the hallway just outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from 
inside the apartment itself.  I get a similar result going the other 
waywith the one homeplug unit in the apartment, I can get a weak 
signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility closet.
It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of 
equipment would make it happen.
This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how 
much homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a 
little while.  I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut 
handholes in the drywall and patch them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Adam Moffett]

With the device unplugged, measure resistance from the - input to either 
the chassis or to the ground connection if it has one.  If you get 
little or no resistance then you're definitely looking at +48v.


I don't think that's definitive though...there could be a "ground" bus 
on the circuit board that isn't connected to actual earth ground.




-- Original Message --
From: "Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr." 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 12:11:49 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v


I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[chuck]

Oh, I thought perhaps it was Vertical voltage vs Horizontal voltage

From: Faisal Imtiaz 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:11 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

V = Volts ? 

24VH = 24V high Power
24V  =  24V (regular power)

:)

Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net




  From: ch...@wbmfg.com
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 12:09:03 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

  H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what is the 
significance to the “v”. 

  From: Josh Luthman
  Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

  Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair power 
and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the pinout.

  The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.  It's 
obviously created by a WISP guy.


  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message. 






Erich Kaiser 
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

  Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports! 





  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291


  On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher 
due to dual radio/core. 


Erich Kaiser 
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup  
wrote:

  Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it 
be supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it 
would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios which 
use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity, which I assume 
is different for the 820S vs AF.

  We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the 
jumpers removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real 
world, I see them pulling about 25-27W.


  On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

So looking at Cambium Forums 


http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939



http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740


https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612


So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.

I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get 
the Netonix switch.


Erich Kaiser 
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

  I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units 
work + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit it 
can do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something. 


  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291


  On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
 wrote:

>>I think it's -48 or optional +24

Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is 
basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any polarity and 
and put out -48dc for the radio).


Faisal Imtiaz
Snappy Internet & Telecom
7266 SW 48 Street
Miami, FL 33155
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: 
supp...@snappytelecom.net




  From: "Sean Heskett" 
  To: af@afmug.com
  Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

  I think it's -48 or 

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Josh Luthman]

Different protocols.  2.4 GHz in WiFi is limited to some distance, hardware
limited to something like 32km.  2.4 GHz isn't limited to 20 miles.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 12:14 PM, Adam Moffett  wrote:

> Yeah the total wire distance.  Understood.
>
> This utility room has it's own subpanel which is newer than the rest of
> the wiring in the building.  If they made a new home run for this sub panel
> then it might be 100+ feet of extra wire to get there.
>
> I've read the best case distance for homeplug is 300m, but maybe half that
> in real life.  It's hard to believe they can't go a little farther.  If
> 300m is the best we can hope for, then why did any ISP ever think BPL would
> work for last mile distribution?  Was BPL radically different from
> homeplug?
>
> Something like 10meg at 1000m would be more useful to me than gigabit
> across the room.
>
>
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Bill Prince" 
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: 8/19/2016 1:10:57 AM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug
>
>
> With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located because
> they have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 floors away,
> then the signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and then back up to
> the other homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.
>
>
> bp
> 
>
>
> On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>
> Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling  broadband over
> powerlines equipment?
>
> I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility closet to
> an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) in the hallway
> just outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from inside the apartment
> itself.  I get a similar result going the other waywith the one
> homeplug unit in the apartment, I can get a weak signal on an outlet down
> the hall from the utility closet.
>
> It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of
> equipment would make it happen.
>
> This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much
> homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a little
> while.  I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes in the
> drywall and patch them back upbut I'm not.
>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Adam Moffett]

Yeah the total wire distance.  Understood.

This utility room has it's own subpanel which is newer than the rest of 
the wiring in the building.  If they made a new home run for this sub 
panel then it might be 100+ feet of extra wire to get there.


I've read the best case distance for homeplug is 300m, but maybe half 
that in real life.  It's hard to believe they can't go a little farther. 
 If 300m is the best we can hope for, then why did any ISP ever think 
BPL would work for last mile distribution?  Was BPL radically different 
from homeplug?


Something like 10meg at 1000m would be more useful to me than gigabit 
across the room.



-- Original Message --
From: "Bill Prince" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 1:10:57 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located because 
they have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 floors 
away, then the signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and then 
back up to the other homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.




bp 
On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling  broadband over 
powerlines equipment?


I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility closet 
to an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) in the 
hallway just outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from inside 
the apartment itself.  I get a similar result going the other 
waywith the one homeplug unit in the apartment, I can get a weak 
signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility closet.


It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of 
equipment would make it happen.


This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much 
homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a little 
while.  I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes in the 
drywall and patch them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.]

I believe both my Netonix Switch and Mikrotik CCR both are +48v.

Gilbert

On 8/19/2016 7:06 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was thinking
maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Josh Luthman]

V is Volts.

So there's 24v, 24vh (high power), 48v, 48vh


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 12:09 PM,  wrote:

> H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what is
> the significance to the “v”.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>
> Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair
> power and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the
> pinout.
>
> The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.
> It's obviously created by a WISP guy.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>
>> Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.
>>
>> [image: Inline image 1]
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser <
>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!
>>>
>>> [image: Inline image 1]
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser <
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>>
 If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher
 due to dual radio/core.


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291


 On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup 
 wrote:

> Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be
> supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it
> would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios
> which use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity,
> which I assume is different for the 820S vs AF.
>
> We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the
> jumpers removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real
> world, I see them pulling about 25-27W.
>
> On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:
>
> So looking at Cambium Forums
>
> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Mic
> rowave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939
>
> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Comp
> atibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740
>
> https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612
>
> So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.
>
> I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the
> Netonix switch.
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>
>> I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units
>> work + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit
>> it can do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <
>> fai...@snappytelecom.net> wrote:
>>
>>> >>I think it's -48 or optional +24
>>>
>>> Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is
>>> basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any 
>>> polarity
>>> and and put out -48dc for the radio).
>>>
>>>
>>> Faisal Imtiaz
>>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>>> 7266 SW 48 Street
>>> Miami, FL 33155
>>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232
>>>
>>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email:
>>> supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> *From: *"Sean Heskett" 
>>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>>> *Sent: *Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
>>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>>>
>>> I think it's -48 or optional +24
>>> -Sean
>>>
>>> On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>>>
 The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the SAF
 Lumina?

 On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

 here's the data from the manual.  we installed ours a year ago and

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Faisal Imtiaz]

V = Volts ? 

24VH = 24V high Power 
24V = 24V (regular power) 

:) 

Faisal Imtiaz 
Snappy Internet & Telecom 
7266 SW 48 Street 
Miami, FL 33155 
Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 

Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net 

> From: ch...@wbmfg.com
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 12:09:03 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

> H would probably mean “High” power? What does the VH mean? Or what is the
> significance to the “v”.
> From: Josh Luthman
> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
> Also 24VH but that's kind of going away. The H actually means 4 pair power 
> and I
> think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the pinout.

> The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems. It's
> obviously created by a WISP guy.
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser < er...@northcentraltower.com >
> wrote:

>> Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.

>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser < er...@northcentraltower.com 
>> >
>> wrote:

>>> Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!

>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>> On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser < er...@northcentraltower.com 
>>> >
>>> wrote:

 If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher 
 due to
 dual radio/core.
 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291
 On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup < geo...@cbcast.com > 
 wrote:

> Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be 
> supplied
> power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it would be 
> ungood.
> I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios which use all 
> four
> pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity, which I assume is 
> different
> for the 820S vs AF.

> We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the jumpers 
> removed
> on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real world, I see 
> them
> pulling about 25-27W.

> On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

>> So looking at Cambium Forums
>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939
>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740
>> https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612
>> So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.
>> I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the 
>> Netonix
>> switch.
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser < 
>> er...@northcentraltower.com >
>> wrote:

>>> I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units work 
>>> + or -
>>> 48v DC directly into the unit. Also if you have the POE Unit it can do 
>>> a range
>>> from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz < 
>>> fai...@snappytelecom.net >
>>> wrote:

 >>I think it's -48 or optional +24
 Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is 
 basically a dual
 port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any polarity and and put 
 out
 -48dc for the radio).
 Faisal Imtiaz
 Snappy Internet & Telecom
 7266 SW 48 Street
 Miami, FL 33155
 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

> From: "Sean Heskett" < af...@zirkel.us >
> To: af@afmug.com
> Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

> I think it's -48 or optional +24
> -Sean

> On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup < geo...@cbcast.com > wrote:

>> The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the SAF 
>> Lumina?

>> On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

>>> here's the data from the manual. we installed ours a year ago and i 
>>> thought the
>>> PoE cambium supplied was an 802.3at but 

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.]

Thank you for the answer. I will try that unit.

Gilbert


On 8/18/2016 6:34 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Mean Well RSD200C-48 will work just fine. Put it between your 48v UPS 
load side and -48 gear. The output of the RSD is floating and you 
should have no problem tying the + side to ground.


On 8/18/2016 8:19 PM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:
I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 
though that I am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get 
-48v for the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are 
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each 
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.


Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[chuck]

H would probably mean “High” power?  What does the VH mean?  Or what is the 
significance to the “v”.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 10:06 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair power and 
I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the pinout.

The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.  It's 
obviously created by a WISP guy.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

  Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message. 






  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291



  On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports! 





Erich Kaiser 
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser  
wrote:

  If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher 
due to dual radio/core. 


  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291


  On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup  wrote:

Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be 
supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it would 
be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios which use 
all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity, which I assume is 
different for the 820S vs AF.

We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the jumpers 
removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real world, I see 
them pulling about 25-27W.


On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

  So looking at Cambium Forums 

  
http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939


  
http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740


  https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612


  So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.

  I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the 
Netonix switch.


  Erich Kaiser 
  North Central Tower
  er...@northcentraltower.com
  Office: 630-621-4804
  Cell: 630-777-9291


  On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser 
 wrote:

I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units 
work + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit it 
can do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something. 


Erich Kaiser 
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz 
 wrote:

  >>I think it's -48 or optional +24

  Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is 
basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any polarity and 
and put out -48dc for the radio).


  Faisal Imtiaz
  Snappy Internet & Telecom
  7266 SW 48 Street
  Miami, FL 33155
  Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232

  Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: 
supp...@snappytelecom.net


--

From: "Sean Heskett" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

I think it's -48 or optional +24

-Sean 

On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  
wrote:

  The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the 
SAF Lumina?


  On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

here's the data from the manual.  we installed ours a year 
ago and i thought the PoE cambium supplied was an 802.3at but that could have 
been for the PMP450i APs we deployed at the same time. 

Power Input Specifications
• Standard Input: ‐48 VDC
• IDU DC Input range: ‐40 to ‐60 VDC 

Power Consumption Specifications
• Maximum Power Consumption 6‐11 GHz: 

40W; 13‐38 

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Adam Moffett]

Not sure.  Presumably a 48V poe device could have a negative ground.  I 
was told not to connect -48 to a Cambium 450i, which might imply there's 
a negative ground there.


Packetflux PDU has a negative ground.  It's not specifically 48v, but I 
think it accepts 10-60.  When I connected -48 to it I saw that you 
couldn't actually switch the loads on and off unless you turned off all 
of them.  Oh, and all the current went through one port...I think the 
one with the shortest cable.


Harris Stratex XP4 had three connectors on the power plug: +V, -V, and 
Common.  That one could be connected as either +48 or -48.


I'm not sure I've seen anything specific that was +48...excepting maybe 
the 450i, but that's not confirmed.




-- Original Message --
From: "Chuck McCown" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/19/2016 10:06:21 AM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v


Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that 
I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the 
PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking

maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Adam Moffett]

You think this one's better than average?  It's certainly cheaper than 
average so maybe worth a shot.  :)



-- Original Message --
From: "Jeremy" 
To: af@afmug.com
Sent: 8/18/2016 9:55:22 PM
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug


http://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=12286

On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 7:38 PM, Adam Moffett  
wrote:
Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling  broadband over 
powerlines equipment?


I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility closet 
to an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) in the 
hallway just outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from inside 
the apartment itself.  I get a similar result going the other 
waywith the one homeplug unit in the apartment, I can get a weak 
signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility closet.


It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of 
equipment would make it happen.


This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much 
homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a little 
while.  I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes in the 
drywall and patch them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Josh Luthman]

Also 24VH but that's kind of going away.  The H actually means 4 pair power
and I think people would assume the extra amps doesn't change the pinout.

The interface has lots of warnings added in after real life problems.  It's
obviously created by a WISP guy.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:57 AM, Erich Kaiser 
wrote:

> Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.
>
> [image: Inline image 1]
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser <
> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>
>> Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!
>>
>> [image: Inline image 1]
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser <
>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>
>>> If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher
>>> due to dual radio/core.
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be
 supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it
 would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios
 which use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity,
 which I assume is different for the 820S vs AF.

 We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the jumpers
 removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real world, I
 see them pulling about 25-27W.

 On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:

 So looking at Cambium Forums

 http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Mic
 rowave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939

 http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Comp
 atibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740

 https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612

 So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.

 I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the
 Netonix switch.


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291


 On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser <
 er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:

> I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units work
> + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit it 
> can
> do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <
> fai...@snappytelecom.net> wrote:
>
>> >>I think it's -48 or optional +24
>>
>> Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is
>> basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any 
>> polarity
>> and and put out -48dc for the radio).
>>
>>
>> Faisal Imtiaz
>> Snappy Internet & Telecom
>> 7266 SW 48 Street
>> Miami, FL 33155
>> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <305%20663%205518%20x%20232>
>>
>> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net
>>
>> --
>>
>> *From: *"Sean Heskett" 
>> *To: *af@afmug.com
>> *Sent: *Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
>> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>>
>> I think it's -48 or optional +24
>> -Sean
>>
>> On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>>
>>> The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the SAF
>>> Lumina?
>>>
>>> On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>>
>>> here's the data from the manual.  we installed ours a year ago and i
>>> thought the PoE cambium supplied was an 802.3at but that could have been
>>> for the PMP450i APs we deployed at the same time.
>>>
>>> Power Input Specifications
>>> • Standard Input: ‐48 VDC
>>> • IDU DC Input range: ‐40 to ‐60 VDC
>>>
>>> Power Consumption Specifications
>>> • Maximum Power Consumption 6‐11 GHz:
>>>
>>> 40W; 13‐38 GHz: 35W
>>>
>>> PoE Injector Mechanical Specifications
>>> • Dimensions – 134mm(H), 190mm(W),
>>>
>>> 62mm(D), 1 kg
>>>
>>> PoE Injector Environmental Specifications
>>> • 33°C to +55°C (‐45°C to +60°C 

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Erich Kaiser]

Also when enabling the port into VH mode you get this message.

[image: Inline image 1]


Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 10:55 AM, Erich Kaiser 
wrote:

> Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!
>
> [image: Inline image 1]
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser  > wrote:
>
>> If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher
>> due to dual radio/core.
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be
>>> supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it
>>> would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios
>>> which use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity,
>>> which I assume is different for the 820S vs AF.
>>>
>>> We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the jumpers
>>> removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real world, I
>>> see them pulling about 25-27W.
>>>
>>> On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:
>>>
>>> So looking at Cambium Forums
>>>
>>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-Mic
>>> rowave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939
>>>
>>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-Comp
>>> atibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740
>>>
>>> https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612
>>>
>>> So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.
>>>
>>> I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the
>>> Netonix switch.
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser <
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>>
 I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units work
 + or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit it can
 do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.


 Erich Kaiser
 North Central Tower
 er...@northcentraltower.com
 Office: 630-621-4804
 Cell: 630-777-9291


 On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz <
 fai...@snappytelecom.net> wrote:

> >>I think it's -48 or optional +24
>
> Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is
> basically a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any 
> polarity
> and and put out -48dc for the radio).
>
>
> Faisal Imtiaz
> Snappy Internet & Telecom
> 7266 SW 48 Street
> Miami, FL 33155
> Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <305%20663%205518%20x%20232>
>
> Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net
>
> --
>
> *From: *"Sean Heskett" 
> *To: *af@afmug.com
> *Sent: *Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?
>
> I think it's -48 or optional +24
> -Sean
>
> On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>
>> The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the SAF
>> Lumina?
>>
>> On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> here's the data from the manual.  we installed ours a year ago and i
>> thought the PoE cambium supplied was an 802.3at but that could have been
>> for the PMP450i APs we deployed at the same time.
>>
>> Power Input Specifications
>> • Standard Input: ‐48 VDC
>> • IDU DC Input range: ‐40 to ‐60 VDC
>>
>> Power Consumption Specifications
>> • Maximum Power Consumption 6‐11 GHz:
>>
>> 40W; 13‐38 GHz: 35W
>>
>> PoE Injector Mechanical Specifications
>> • Dimensions – 134mm(H), 190mm(W),
>>
>> 62mm(D), 1 kg
>>
>> PoE Injector Environmental Specifications
>> • 33°C to +55°C (‐45°C to +60°C extended)
>>
>> PoE Injector Power Input Specifications
>>
>>-
>>
>>Standard Input: ‐48 or +24 VDC (Optional)
>>-
>>
>>DC Input range: ±(18/40.5 to 60) VDC
>>
>>(+18VDC extended range is supported as part of the nominal +24VDC
>>support)
>>
>>PoE Injector Interfaces
>>-
>>
>>   GbE Data Port supporting
>>
>>   10/100/1000Base‐T
>>   -
>>
>>   Power‐Over‐Ethernet (PoE) Port
>>   -
>>
>>   DC Power Port –40V to ‐60V (a PoE
>>
>>   supporting two 

Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

[Erich Kaiser]

Confirmed. PTP820S POE works on 48VH ports!

[image: Inline image 1]


Erich Kaiser
North Central Tower
er...@northcentraltower.com
Office: 630-621-4804
Cell: 630-777-9291


On Tue, Aug 16, 2016 at 7:27 AM, Erich Kaiser 
wrote:

> If I remember correct the 820S is around 30w or less and 820C is higher
> due to dual radio/core.
>
>
> Erich Kaiser
> North Central Tower
> er...@northcentraltower.com
> Office: 630-621-4804
> Cell: 630-777-9291
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 10:58 PM, George Skorup  wrote:
>
>> Question is, does the 820S need all four pairs for power, or can it be
>> supplied power on 1,2 & 3,6 only? 40W over only two pairs seems like it
>> would be ungood. I know the Netonix switches will power AF5 and 24 radios
>> which use all four pairs. Then the next question is per pair polarity,
>> which I assume is different for the 820S vs AF.
>>
>> We inject power to Exalt G2 radios using GIGE-POE-APCs with the jumpers
>> removed on 4,5 & 7,8. But those are max 32W or so. And in the real world, I
>> see them pulling about 25-27W.
>>
>> On 8/15/2016 8:58 PM, Erich Kaiser wrote:
>>
>> So looking at Cambium Forums
>>
>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-820-Licensed-
>> Microwave/can-i-use-the-PTP650-PoE-Injector-for-PTP820-radio/td-p/42939
>>
>> http://community.cambiumnetworks.com/t5/PTP-FAQ/PTP-650-
>> Compatibilty-with-802-3at-standard-PoE/td-p/50740
>>
>> https://forum.netonix.com/viewtopic.php?f=6=612
>>
>> So it looks like PTP820 and PTP650 are both 802.3at pinouts.
>>
>> I will try it on Wednesday with a spare PTP820S Radio when I get the
>> Netonix switch.
>>
>>
>> Erich Kaiser
>> North Central Tower
>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>> Office: 630-621-4804
>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:41 PM, Erich Kaiser <
>> er...@northcentraltower.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I found a post on the forums about IP20C working, BTW these units work +
>>> or - 48v DC directly into the unit.  Also if you have the POE Unit it can
>>> do a range from 24vdc up to like 50vdc or something.
>>>
>>>
>>> Erich Kaiser
>>> North Central Tower
>>> er...@northcentraltower.com
>>> Office: 630-621-4804
>>> Cell: 630-777-9291
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 7:36 PM, Faisal Imtiaz >> > wrote:
>>>
 >>I think it's -48 or optional +24

 Correct... the optional = another piece of equipment which is basically
 a dual port dc to dc converted (it can take 24vdc on any polarity and and
 put out -48dc for the radio).


 Faisal Imtiaz
 Snappy Internet & Telecom
 7266 SW 48 Street
 Miami, FL 33155
 Tel: 305 663 5518 x 232 <305%20663%205518%20x%20232>

 Help-desk: (305)663-5518 Option 2 or Email: supp...@snappytelecom.net

 --

 *From: *"Sean Heskett" 
 *To: *af@afmug.com
 *Sent: *Monday, August 15, 2016 7:57:50 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [AFMUG] netonix work with PTP820S?

 I think it's -48 or optional +24
 -Sean

 On Monday, August 15, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:

> The ± is confusing. Does it support either polarity like the SAF
> Lumina?
>
> On 8/15/2016 5:58 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> here's the data from the manual.  we installed ours a year ago and i
> thought the PoE cambium supplied was an 802.3at but that could have been
> for the PMP450i APs we deployed at the same time.
>
> Power Input Specifications
> • Standard Input: ‐48 VDC
> • IDU DC Input range: ‐40 to ‐60 VDC
>
> Power Consumption Specifications
> • Maximum Power Consumption 6‐11 GHz:
>
> 40W; 13‐38 GHz: 35W
>
> PoE Injector Mechanical Specifications
> • Dimensions – 134mm(H), 190mm(W),
>
> 62mm(D), 1 kg
>
> PoE Injector Environmental Specifications
> • 33°C to +55°C (‐45°C to +60°C extended)
>
> PoE Injector Power Input Specifications
>
>-
>
>Standard Input: ‐48 or +24 VDC (Optional)
>-
>
>DC Input range: ±(18/40.5 to 60) VDC
>
>(+18VDC extended range is supported as part of the nominal +24VDC
>support)
>
>PoE Injector Interfaces
>-
>
>   GbE Data Port supporting
>
>   10/100/1000Base‐T
>   -
>
>   Power‐Over‐Ethernet (PoE) Port
>   -
>
>   DC Power Port –40V to ‐60V (a PoE
>
>   supporting two redundant DC feeds each supporting ±(18‐60)V is
>   available)
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 4:35 PM, George Skorup 
> wrote:
>
>> I thought they were -48? Or is that only the direct power input?
>>
>> On 8/15/2016 5:33 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> PTP820S is 802.3at (i believe 30W)
>>
>> -sean
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 15, 2016 at 3:59 PM, Erich Kaiser <
>> 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[Simon Westlake]

Well, it's not every day I get offered a speaking spot on AFMUG, so I 
will happily take the opportunity!


Site is at https://sonar.software, there is a pricing calculator on the 
front page if you want to run the numbers.


The current release has a complete billing system (with usage based 
billing) and CRM, inventory management, IPv4+IPv6 IPAM, various 
provisioning options (DHCP, RADIUS, MikroTik, Procera, Telrad), a 
ticketing system, and a bunch of the typical things you'd expect (Form 
477 generator, elevation profiles, mapping, etc.) Next release will have 
a field management/scheduling system, which is coming out next month. 
We're launching a CDR rating engine pretty soon, and the release after 
that will be a network monitoring module, which will bring us to 1.0. 
After that, we have a massive list of stuff to add to improve on current 
features, as well as adding some new ones I haven't talked about yet. 
We'll be at 1.0 by WISPAPALOOZA.


We have a lot of fairly unique features I think - for example, a full 
REST API (https://sonar.software/apidoc/) which has already been used by 
a lot of people to build some pretty cool stuff. We also have a GitHub 
account at https://github.com/sonarsoftware that has a bunch of things 
we've built to interface with the API that we give away for free, 
including a customer portal you can download and customize to your 
hearts content.


There's a lot more neat stuff we have built in.. full real time search 
of all your customer/network data, an interface completely optimized for 
mobile devices, billing that scales to millions of accounts, as well as 
a lot of little features that I think are pretty unique (as a single 
example, you can configure Sonar to track whenever a customer views an 
email Sonar sends, so that you can see if they viewed a ticket response, 
or looked at their bill.)


Bunch of videos at https://sonar.software/casts if you want to check it 
out - some of them are of a fairly old version of Sonar, but they should 
give you a good idea of how it works and what it does. I'll be updating 
them all once we hit 1.0. System is fully documented internally - each 
page has documentation available while you're logged in. If you want to 
check it out, go to https://sonar.software/home, create an account, and 
you can have your own Sonar instance to play with in <90 seconds.


On 8/19/2016 10:08 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Tell us more.  Price, capabilities, URL etc.
*From:* Simon Westlake 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:54 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Sonar
Yes, it's been available since early this year. You can sign up on the 
site and get immediate access.


On 8/19/2016 9:45 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Is anything released?
*From:* Jon Bruce 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.


On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a 
competitor?

*From:* Jon Bruce 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  
Each is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC 
address.


PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in 
but I haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave 
you curled up in a ball, crying.


Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I 
asked once what the difference was, what they were meant to do 
differently and why there are two and was met with documentation 
removed from their site and several support calls and emails ignored.


I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.

On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 
relay IP per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to 
the specified address. I still say the way to go is static 
management IP on the SMs.


Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM 
itself or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, 
that would be a good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that 
off for the SM itself.


On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
That gives me something to try in our lab :)
-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup > wrote:


Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up
and get the option 66 info for the config URL, then download
   

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[Josh Luthman]

https://sonar.software/

Scroll.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Aug 19, 2016 at 11:08 AM,  wrote:

> Tell us more.  Price, capabilities, URL etc.
>
> *From:* Simon Westlake 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:54 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Sonar
>
> Yes, it's been available since early this year. You can sign up on the
> site and get immediate access.
>
> On 8/19/2016 9:45 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Is anything released?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.
>
>
> On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
> WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a
> competitor?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each
> is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.
>
> PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I
> haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up
> in a ball, crying.
>
> Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once
> what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why
> there are two and was met with documentation removed from their site and
> several support calls and emails ignored.
>
> I hope that helped a little.
>
> If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.
>
> On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably
> wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP
> per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified
> address. I still say the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.
>
> Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself
> or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a
> good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.
>
> On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
>
> That gives me something to try in our lab :)
>
> -Sean
>
> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>
>> Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get the
>> option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains
>> a static management IP?
>>
>> Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on a
>> dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options
>> you need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd
>> act upon the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.
>>
>> On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to deploy SMs
>> with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one reason or
>> another.
>>
>> Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config (dhcp
>> option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to give
>> an ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have
>> to keep track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and
>> not our calix.
>>
>> Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on the
>> side or something.
>>
>> Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm
>> wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent
>> the wheel.
>>
>> Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe I'm
>> blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/
>>
>> -Sean
>>
>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup <
>> javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','geo...@cbcast.com');> wrote:
>>
>>> I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's
>>> management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.
>>>
>>> We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + DMZ on
>>> the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work through
>>> NAT mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on
>>> my SM at home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.
>>>
>>> On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>>
>>> Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.
>>>
>>> I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that seems not
>>> possible :-/
>>>
>>> -Sean
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  wrote:
>>>
 From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan on
 managing via the public IP.

 Option 82, in 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[Josh Reynolds]

HTTPS://Sonar.software

On Aug 19, 2016 10:08 AM,  wrote:

> Tell us more.  Price, capabilities, URL etc.
>
> *From:* Simon Westlake 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:54 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Sonar
>
> Yes, it's been available since early this year. You can sign up on the
> site and get immediate access.
>
> On 8/19/2016 9:45 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
>
> Is anything released?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.
>
>
> On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
> WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a
> competitor?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each
> is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.
>
> PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I
> haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up
> in a ball, crying.
>
> Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once
> what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why
> there are two and was met with documentation removed from their site and
> several support calls and emails ignored.
>
> I hope that helped a little.
>
> If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.
>
> On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably
> wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP
> per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified
> address. I still say the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.
>
> Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself
> or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a
> good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.
>
> On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
>
> That gives me something to try in our lab :)
>
> -Sean
>
> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>
>> Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get the
>> option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains
>> a static management IP?
>>
>> Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on a
>> dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options
>> you need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd
>> act upon the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.
>>
>> On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to deploy SMs
>> with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one reason or
>> another.
>>
>> Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config (dhcp
>> option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to give
>> an ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have
>> to keep track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and
>> not our calix.
>>
>> Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on the
>> side or something.
>>
>> Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm
>> wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent
>> the wheel.
>>
>> Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe I'm
>> blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/
>>
>> -Sean
>>
>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup <
>> javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','geo...@cbcast.com');> wrote:
>>
>>> I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's
>>> management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.
>>>
>>> We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + DMZ on
>>> the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work through
>>> NAT mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on
>>> my SM at home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.
>>>
>>> On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>>
>>> Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.
>>>
>>> I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that seems not
>>> possible :-/
>>>
>>> -Sean
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  wrote:
>>>
 From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan on
 managing via the public IP.

 Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting via the SU mac
 address, along with what 'circuit' (AP) it came from. I 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[chuck]

Tell us more.  Price, capabilities, URL etc.  

From: Simon Westlake 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:54 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

Yes, it's been available since early this year. You can sign up on the site and 
get immediate access.


On 8/19/2016 9:45 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  Is anything released?

  From: Jon Bruce 
  Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

  Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.



  On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a 
competitor?

From: Jon Bruce 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each is 
on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.

PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I 
haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up in a 
ball, crying.

Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once 
what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why there 
are two and was met with documentation removed from their site and several 
support calls and emails ignored.

I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.


On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:

  The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP per 
VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified address. I 
still say the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.

  Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself 
or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a good 
feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.


  On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.   

That gives me something to try in our lab :)

-Sean 

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:

  Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get 
the option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains 
a static management IP?

  Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on 
a dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options you 
need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd act upon 
the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.


  On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to 
deploy SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one 
reason or another. 

Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config 
(dhcp option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to 
give an ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have 
to keep track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and not 
our calix.

Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on 
the side or something.

Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm 
wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent the 
wheel.

Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe 
I'm blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/  

-Sean 

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup 
 wrote:

  I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's 
management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.

  We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + 
DMZ on the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work 
through NAT mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested 
on my SM at home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.


  On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also. 

I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that 
seems not possible :-/

-Sean


On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  
wrote:

  From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan 
on managing via the public IP.  

  Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting via 
the SU mac address, along with what 'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in 
your situation if you want to use powercode to hand out 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[Simon Westlake]

Yes, it's been available since early this year. You can sign up on the 
site and get immediate access.


On 8/19/2016 9:45 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

Is anything released?
*From:* Jon Bruce 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.


On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a 
competitor?

*From:* Jon Bruce 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  
Each is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC 
address.


PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in 
but I haven't made it work (yet). Calling support will only leave you 
curled up in a ball, crying.


Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked 
once what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently 
and why there are two and was met with documentation removed from 
their site and several support calls and emails ignored.


I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.

On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 
relay IP per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the 
specified address. I still say the way to go is static management IP 
on the SMs.


Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM 
itself or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that 
would be a good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off 
for the SM itself.


On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
That gives me something to try in our lab :)
-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup > wrote:


Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up
and get the option 66 info for the config URL, then download
its config which contains a static management IP?

Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM
management on a dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server
instance and the various options you need? Customer/user/data
VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd act upon the
Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.

On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to
deploy SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the
time for one reason or another.
Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch
config (dhcp option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if
the SM is bridged to give an ip to their router or our managed
calix router.  I'd prefer to not have to keep track of router
MACs especially if the router is the customer's and not our calix.
Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that
up on the side or something.
Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and
I'm wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't
have to reinvent the wheel.
Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so
maybe I'm blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/
-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup
 wrote:

I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign
the SM's management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the
customer equipment.

We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with
NAT + DMZ on the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP
responses don't work through NAT mode, even with DMZ. And
L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on my SM at
home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.

On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.
I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but
that seems not possible :-/
-Sean


On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak
 wrote:

From how I understand it that is not possible unless
you plan on managing via the public IP.
Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows
accounting via the SU mac address, along with what
'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in your
situation if you want to use powercode to hand out
public addresses you will need a static management
network for CPEs.
On 

Re: [AFMUG] Sonar

[Josh Luthman]

It's a cloud thing so there's no release but it's available in its
beginning stages.  They started sign ups at Wispamerica.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Aug 19, 2016 10:45 AM,  wrote:

> Is anything released?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.
>
>
> On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
> WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a
> competitor?
>
> *From:* Jon Bruce 
> *Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
>
> We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each
> is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.
>
> PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I
> haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up
> in a ball, crying.
>
> Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once
> what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why
> there are two and was met with documentation removed from their site and
> several support calls and emails ignored.
>
> I hope that helped a little.
>
> If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.
>
> On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably
> wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP
> per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified
> address. I still say the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.
>
> Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself
> or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a
> good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.
>
> On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>
> Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
>
> That gives me something to try in our lab :)
>
> -Sean
>
> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:
>
>> Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get the
>> option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains
>> a static management IP?
>>
>> Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on a
>> dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options
>> you need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd
>> act upon the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.
>>
>> On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>
>> right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to deploy SMs
>> with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one reason or
>> another.
>>
>> Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config (dhcp
>> option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to give
>> an ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have
>> to keep track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and
>> not our calix.
>>
>> Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on the
>> side or something.
>>
>> Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm
>> wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent
>> the wheel.
>>
>> Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe I'm
>> blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/
>>
>> -Sean
>>
>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup <
>> javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','geo...@cbcast.com');> wrote:
>>
>>> I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's
>>> management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.
>>>
>>> We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + DMZ on
>>> the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work through
>>> NAT mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on
>>> my SM at home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.
>>>
>>> On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:
>>>
>>> Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.
>>>
>>> I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that seems not
>>> possible :-/
>>>
>>> -Sean
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  wrote:
>>>
 From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan on
 managing via the public IP.

 Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting via the SU mac
 address, along with what 'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in your
 situation if you want to use powercode to hand out public addresses you
 will need a static management network for CPEs.

[AFMUG] Sonar

[chuck]

Is anything released?

From: Jon Bruce 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:44 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.



On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a competitor?

  From: Jon Bruce 
  Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

  We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each is 
on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.

  PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I 
haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up in a 
ball, crying.

  Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once 
what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why there 
are two and was met with documentation removed from their site and several 
support calls and emails ignored.

  I hope that helped a little.

  If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.


  On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:

The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP per 
VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified address. I 
still say the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.

Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself or 
not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a good 
feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.


On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

  Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.   

  That gives me something to try in our lab :)

  -Sean 

  On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:

Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get 
the option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains 
a static management IP?

Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on a 
dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options you 
need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd act upon 
the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.


On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

  right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to deploy 
SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one reason or 
another. 

  Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config (dhcp 
option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to give an 
ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have to keep 
track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and not our 
calix.

  Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on 
the side or something.

  Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm 
wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent the 
wheel.

  Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe 
I'm blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/  

  -Sean 

  On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup 
 wrote:

I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's 
management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.

We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + DMZ 
on the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work through 
NAT mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on my SM 
at home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.


On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

  Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also. 

  I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that seems 
not possible :-/

  -Sean


  On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  wrote:

From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan 
on managing via the public IP.  

Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting via the 
SU mac address, along with what 'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in your 
situation if you want to use powercode to hand out public addresses you will 
need a static management network for CPEs. 



On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 9:05 PM, Sean Heskett  
wrote:

  Thx joe, 

  So if it sends the same 0a:00:3e MAC for the bridged device, 
how do you get the dhcp server to send the management IP to the SM since that 
would be the same MAC?? 

  

Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

[Jon Bruce]

Yes, Sonar. It's looking really good.


On 8/19/2016 10:21 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a 
competitor?

*From:* Jon Bruce 
*Sent:* Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode
We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  
Each is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.


PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but 
I haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you 
curled up in a ball, crying.


Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked 
once what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently 
and why there are two and was met with documentation removed from 
their site and several support calls and emails ignored.


I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.

On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay 
IP per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the 
specified address. I still say the way to go is static management IP 
on the SMs.


Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM 
itself or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that 
would be a good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for 
the SM itself.


On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.
That gives me something to try in our lab :)
-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup > wrote:


Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and
get the option 66 info for the config URL, then download its
config which contains a static management IP?

Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM
management on a dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance
and the various options you need? Customer/user/data VLAN would
be another DHCP server where you'd act upon the Agent-Remote-ID
option 82 info.

On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to
deploy SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the
time for one reason or another.
Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config
(dhcp option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM
is bridged to give an ip to their router or our managed calix
router.  I'd prefer to not have to keep track of router MACs
especially if the router is the customer's and not our calix.
Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that
up on the side or something.
Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and
I'm wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't
have to reinvent the wheel.
Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so
maybe I'm blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/
-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup
 wrote:

I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the
SM's management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the
customer equipment.

We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with
NAT + DMZ on the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP
responses don't work through NAT mode, even with DMZ. And
L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on my SM at home.
So far I'm not too thrilled with it.

On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.
I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that
seems not possible :-/
-Sean


On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak
 wrote:

From how I understand it that is not possible unless
you plan on managing via the public IP.
Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows
accounting via the SU mac address, along with what
'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in your situation
if you want to use powercode to hand out public
addresses you will need a static management network
for CPEs.
On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 9:05 PM, Sean Heskett
 wrote:

Thx joe,
So if it sends the same 0a:00:3e MAC for the
bridged device, how do you get the dhcp server to
send the management IP to the SM since that would
be the same MAC??
-Sean

 

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[chuck]

They heat up the neutral and use the hots for a counterpoise as I understand 
it.  That is how it can work across phases.  

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:28 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

I think (but I don't know for sure) that it also makes a difference which phase 
you're on. Most homes have split phase power, where half the breakers are on 
phase A, and the other half are on phase B. If you go through the outlets in a 
typical room, they will alternate phases as you go around the room. First plug 
is phase A, the next is phase B, then back to phase A, and so on.

If the homeplug signal is propagated on the hot lead, then you must lose it 
altogether when you have to jump phases? IDK, but I've always wondered.


bp


On 8/19/2016 7:05 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  As well as noise generators on the circuit.

  From: Bill Prince 
  Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 11:10 PM
  To: af@afmug.com 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

  With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located because they 
have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 floors away, then the 
signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and then back up to the other 
homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.



bp


On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling  broadband over 
powerlines equipment?

I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility closet to 
an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) in the hallway just 
outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from inside the apartment itself.  I 
get a similar result going the other waywith the one homeplug unit in the 
apartment, I can get a weak signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility 
closet.  

It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of 
equipment would make it happen.

This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much 
homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a little while.  
I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes in the drywall and patch 
them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Bill Prince]

I think (but I don't know for sure) that it also makes a difference 
which phase you're on. Most homes have split phase power, where half the 
breakers are on phase A, and the other half are on phase B. If you go 
through the outlets in a typical room, they will alternate phases as you 
go around the room. First plug is phase A, the next is phase B, then 
back to phase A, and so on.


If the homeplug signal is propagated on the hot lead, then you must lose 
it altogether when you have to jump phases? IDK, but I've always wondered.


bp


On 8/19/2016 7:05 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

As well as noise generators on the circuit.
*From:* Bill Prince 
*Sent:* Thursday, August 18, 2016 11:10 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com 
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located because 
they have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 floors 
away, then the signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and then 
back up to the other homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.


bp


On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling broadband over 
powerlines equipment?
I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility 
closet to an apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) 
in the hallway just outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from 
inside the apartment itself.  I get a similar result going the other 
waywith the one homeplug unit in the apartment, I can get a weak 
signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility closet.
It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of 
equipment would make it happen.
This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much 
homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a 
little while.  I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes 
in the drywall and patch them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

[Chuck McCown]

WRT PC, wasn’t Simon working on something that possibly could be a competitor?

From: Jon Bruce 
Sent: Friday, August 19, 2016 8:07 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs.  Each is on 
it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.

PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I 
haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled up in a 
ball, crying.

Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked once what 
the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and why there are 
two and was met with documentation removed from their site and several support 
calls and emails ignored.

I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.


On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:

  The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably wouldn't 
work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay IP per VLAN. The 
AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the specified address. I still say 
the way to go is static management IP on the SMs.

  Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM itself or 
not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that would be a good 
feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for the SM itself.


  On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.   

That gives me something to try in our lab :)

-Sean 

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup  wrote:

  Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and get the 
option 66 info for the config URL, then download its config which contains a 
static management IP?

  Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management on a 
dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the various options you 
need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be another DHCP server where you'd act upon 
the Agent-Remote-ID option 82 info.


  On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to deploy 
SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the time for one reason or 
another. 

Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config (dhcp 
option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM is bridged to give an 
ip to their router or our managed calix router.  I'd prefer to not have to keep 
track of router MACs especially if the router is the customer's and not our 
calix.

Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up on the 
side or something.

Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm 
wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have to reinvent the 
wheel.

Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so maybe I'm 
blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/  

-Sean 

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup 
 wrote:

  I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the SM's 
management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the customer equipment.

  We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT + DMZ on 
the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP responses don't work through NAT 
mode, even with DMZ. And L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on my SM at 
home. So far I'm not too thrilled with it.


  On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also. 

I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that seems 
not possible :-/

-Sean


On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  wrote:

  From how I understand it that is not possible unless you plan on 
managing via the public IP.  

  Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting via the 
SU mac address, along with what 'circuit' (AP) it came from. I think in your 
situation if you want to use powercode to hand out public addresses you will 
need a static management network for CPEs. 



  On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 9:05 PM, Sean Heskett  
wrote:

Thx joe, 

So if it sends the same 0a:00:3e MAC for the bridged device, 
how do you get the dhcp server to send the management IP to the SM since that 
would be the same MAC?? 

-Sean 

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak  
wrote:

  Sean, 

  No problem!

  Cambium 450/EPMP behave the same way I am pretty sure without 
looking at my notes. This post describes it perfectly and also has a raw dump 
of the dhcp 

Re: [AFMUG] Telescoping Mast me lil brudder made

[Ty Featherling]

Great pictures Jaime. How heavy is it? And what is the max height?



-Ty

On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 2:34 PM, Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> This is his prototype he is letting use for some site surveys...
>

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[Chuck McCown]

Curious, what types of things use +48?

-Original Message- 
From: Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr.

Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 7:19 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear powers
at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 though that I
am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I get -48v for the PTP800?

The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was thinking
maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.

Thank you,

Gilbert

Re: [AFMUG] DHCP option 82 + Canopy + Powercode

[Jon Bruce]

We're using PC with DHCP for management of SMs and for public IPs. Each 
is on it's own VLAN and IPs are given out by PC based on MAC address.


PC can do RADIUS and has it (sort of half, almost, kinda) built in but I 
haven't made it work (yet).  Calling support will only leave you curled 
up in a ball, crying.


Under Network -> Servers, there is RADIUS and Canopy RADIUS.  I asked 
once what the difference was, what they were meant to do differently and 
why there are two and was met with documentation removed from their site 
and several support calls and emails ignored.


I hope that helped a little.

If anyone can share information on RADIUS and PC, I would love it.

On 8/19/2016 1:19 AM, George Skorup wrote:
The only thing is full relay vs insertion only. Full relay probably 
wouldn't work in this scenario. Because you can't define the L3 relay 
IP per VLAN. The AP is going to relay all DHCP requests to the 
specified address. I still say the way to go is static management IP 
on the SMs.


Wait... am I being stupid again? Is option 82 inserted for the SM 
itself or not? Been a while since I messed with it. If it does, that 
would be a good feature request for Cambium. Let us turn that off for 
the SM itself.


On 8/19/2016 12:03 AM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Good call on the VLANs George!  I think that might be the ticket.

That gives me something to try in our lab :)

-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup > wrote:


Does PC do the zero-touch config? Why can't a new SM come up and
get the option 66 info for the config URL, then download its
config which contains a static management IP?

Or, what about separating things in VLANs? Put your SM management
on a dedicated VLAN with its own DHCP server instance and the
various options you need? Customer/user/data VLAN would be
another DHCP server where you'd act upon the Agent-Remote-ID
option 82 info.

On 8/18/2016 11:25 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

right now everything is static (mgmt and public ip) we try to
deploy SMs with NAT enabled but that's not possible half the
time for one reason or another.

Once we move to powercode I want to use their zero touch config
(dhcp option 66) to config the SM and then option 82 if the SM
is bridged to give an ip to their router or our managed
calix router.  I'd prefer to not have to keep track of router
MACs especially if the router is the customer's and not our calix.

Powercode doesn't use RADIUS so I'd probably have to set that up
on the side or something.

Like I said I want to make this as automagic as possible and I'm
wondering if anyone has already gone thru this so I don't have
to reinvent the wheel.

Powercode didn't have any ideas of how to accomplish this so
maybe I'm blazing a trail on the cutting edge :-/

-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, George Skorup > wrote:

I assume you're doing bridge mode? Use RADIUS to assign the
SM's management IP. Then DHCP + Op 82 is used for the
customer equipment.

We just do static management IP on the SMs. Playing with NAT
+ DMZ on the customer side. Traceroute and other ICMP
responses don't work through NAT mode, even with DMZ. And
L2TP tunnels. I forget what else I tested on my SM at home.
So far I'm not too thrilled with it.

On 8/18/2016 10:08 PM, Sean Heskett wrote:

Hu that's the conclusion we were coming to also.

I'm trying to find a way to make it all automagic but that
seems not possible :-/

-Sean


On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak 
wrote:

From how I understand it that is not possible unless
you plan on managing via the public IP.

Option 82, in its simplest form, just allows accounting
via the SU mac address, along with what 'circuit' (AP)
it came from. I think in your situation if you want to
use powercode to hand out public addresses you will
need a static management network for CPEs.



On Thu, Aug 18, 2016 at 9:05 PM, Sean Heskett
 wrote:

Thx joe,

So if it sends the same 0a:00:3e MAC for the
bridged device, how do you get the dhcp server to
send the management IP to the SM since that would
be the same MAC??

-Sean

On Thursday, August 18, 2016, Joe Novak
 wrote:

Sean,

No problem!

Cambium 450/EPMP behave the same way I am
pretty sure without looking at my notes. This
post describes it perfectly and also has a 

Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

[Chuck McCown]

As well as noise generators on the circuit.

From: Bill Prince 
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 11:10 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] BPL / Homeplug

With homeplug, it's not how close individual plugs are located because they 
have to go through the breaker panel. If the panel is 3 floors away, then the 
signal has to go down to the breaker panel, and then back up to the other 
homeplug unit. The total distance is the issue.



bp


On 8/18/2016 6:38 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

  Is there any equipment manufacturer still selling  broadband over powerlines 
equipment?

  I tried a cheap netgear homeplug kit to get data from a utility closet to an 
apartment 3 floors apart.  It works (with weak signal) in the hallway just 
outside the apartment, but doesn't connect from inside the apartment itself.  I 
get a similar result going the other waywith the one homeplug unit in the 
apartment, I can get a weak signal on an outlet down the hall from the utility 
closet.  

  It seems like if I'm that close, then maybe just a better piece of equipment 
would make it happen.

  This is a temporary and freebie thing, so before you tell me how much 
homeplug sucks, just be aware that I only need it to work for a little while.  
I could run ethernet if I was willing to cut handholes in the drywall and patch 
them back upbut I'm not.

Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

[Chuck McCown]

It is a bit confusing.  I could label them 1&2.  I think if you do + and - 
then the green LED will come on if opposite the red.
If I can make it less confusing please let me know how.  Obviously if  you 
put all pins to the -48 no leds will come on.


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2016 6:51 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] GIGE-POE-APC and -48 radio

Oh, I see. Chuck made things easy by marking + and - on the input block
so you know what's what on the jumper diagram on the back of the card. I
know he's explained this before. Apparently I'm just a little slow this
week.

On 8/18/2016 7:44 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yep. That's why I'm going to have a RSD to separate all "-48" loads at the 
sites.


I think I'm working on too many things at once and confusing myself and 
forgetting things, because I've done this before. :(


On 8/18/2016 7:35 PM, Bill Prince wrote:
The Trango bonds their return to chassis, regardless of what the POE 
does. So you need to check what else is on that power feed, and if any of 
those devices also bond to chassis. If one or more is bonding + to 
chassis (that's Trango), then any other that bonds - to chassis is gonna 
blow a fuse or let the smoke out.



bp


On 8/18/2016 5:21 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Chuck, can you verify for me again.. the earth side of this thing isn't 
tied to the negative side of the input block? I'd say no, because 
obviously the green LED is on when wired as you have them marked. And 
the red LCD when it's backwards. So the LEDs are just a polarity 
indicator and has no bearing on what's what.


Just trying to wrap my mind around any potential issues when using these 
for powering the old Trango radios (-48 on all four pairs, return on 
shield) which I'm about to do. I'm out of Trango's -48 POE boxes and 
ain't buyin no more.


I suppose sometimes I over-think things.

Re: [AFMUG] 48v and -48v

[George Skorup]

Yep. Not really reverse, it's still input -> output. Both the input and 
output are floating. Just wire - to - and + to +. Yes, your "-48" from 
the rectifier goes on the negative terminal of the input on the RSD.


And you can get either the RSD-200C-48 or 300C-48. 200 or 300W as the 
names suggest. 38 to 62VDC input (IIRC), regulated 48v output.


On 8/19/2016 2:17 AM, Cassidy B. Larson wrote:
Is this doable in reverse? We have a -48v UPS/battery bank, want to 
convert to traditional 48v on the load side?  Looking at putting a 
Netonix at this site.




On Aug 18, 2016, at 7:34 PM, George Skorup > wrote:


Mean Well RSD200C-48 will work just fine. Put it between your 48v UPS 
load side and -48 gear. The output of the RSD is floating and you 
should have no problem tying the + side to ground.


On 8/18/2016 8:19 PM, Gilbert T. Gutierrez, Jr. wrote:
I have a site that I am converting to DC from AC. All of the gear 
powers at traditional 48v with a negative ground. I have a PTP800 
though that I am told is -48v (ground tied to positive). How do I 
get -48v for the PTP800?


The site has a NewMar DIN-UPS 48-10. It states that the outputs are 
isolated (it has 2) but I do not think they are isolated from each 
other, just from ground. To tell you the truth I am lost. I was 
thinking maybe a DC to DC converter of some sort.


Thank you,

Gilbert