Re: [newbie] external hardware mouse
Rosemary McGillicuddy wrote: Hi All I've noticed that since using external hardware mouse in Mandrake 10.1 that I don't have a problem with disconnections from server all the time, or difficulty logging on in the first place, which was happening frequently before. I don't know whether it is being in linux, the modem, or a combination! It's very nice though Rosemary If you mean external modem(which I think you do). External modems(hardware) Linux does prefer :-) Mike Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] external hardware mouse
On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:18, mike wrote: Rosemary McGillicuddy wrote: Hi All I've noticed that since using external hardware mouse in Mandrake 10.1 that I don't have a problem with disconnections from server all the time, or difficulty logging on in the first place, which was happening frequently before. I don't know whether it is being in linux, the modem, or a combination! It's very nice though Rosemary If you mean external modem(which I think you do). External modems(hardware) Linux does prefer :-) Mike Indeed - modem it is! :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] external hardware mouse
On Sunday 20 February 2005 07:36 pm, Rosemary McGillicuddy wrote: On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:18, mike wrote: Rosemary McGillicuddy wrote: Hi All I've noticed that since using external hardware mouse in Mandrake 10.1 that I don't have a problem with disconnections from server all the time, or difficulty logging on in the first place, which was happening frequently before. I don't know whether it is being in linux, the modem, or a combination! It's very nice though Rosemary If you mean external modem(which I think you do). External modems(hardware) Linux does prefer :-) Mike Indeed - modem it is! :-) Good because I haven't seen a hardware mouse (bus mouse) since DOS days Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
RE: [newbie] OT: Hardware Issues
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Marc Hultquist Sent: Thursday, July 29, 2004 11:25 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [newbie] OT: Hardware Issues Morning / Afternoon and evening everyone. I just wanted to ask, my play machine at home, at the moment runs as a dual booting system, with both windows XP Pro and MDK 10.0 Community, now it was running fine up untill last night, I bought a processor and GFX card for the machine, now when I put both in the machine, it wont send a signal to the screen, however if I leave the new gfx card in the machine, and simply put the old processor back into the machine, it works, although now I have kernel panics in linux, and my windows xp has lovely Blue Screens of death ? The only thing I can think of is that the machine has now got corrupted system files ? Maybe when I put the new proc in ? The machine as I said is only a play machine and therefore has a celeron processor in it, I put a new Celeron D proc in, but as I noticed this wont work, but now if I put my old Celeron standard 1.7Ghz chip back into the pc, it starts the screen fine, and sends a signal and everything to the screen ? The OS is not a problem as I have bought a new hdd for the machine and well it was going to be replaced anyway so its not the biggest problem, the problem I am now worried about is that I have in some way stuffed up my socked on my MOBO by putting in a Celeron D chip as apposed to putting a normal Celeron chip in ? Is this possible? They are both socket 478 chips, nothing wrong there, I just dont think the D chip is compatible with my mobo ? But my well main query though, even though its not the biggest train smash, is why all of a sudden do I now get it that the OS's on the machine suddenly BOTH don't work ? -- Marc Hultquist ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) Computerkit Systems (Pty) Ltd http://www.cks.co.za (P) +27 11 695 5317 (F) +27 11 312 1408 (C) +27 82 563 2861 Quote: Its a bad idea for geeks to be on low-carb diets. Low-carb means no sugar, no sugar means cravings, cravings mean a loss of concentration, losing concentration makes geeks irritable and geeks run the computers that run the world's banks and militaries !!! . . . . . . . . YE GODS !!! Give me a frosted chocolate cake before we plunge into anarchy !!! - (c) J.D. Illad Frazer(Userfriendly.org) Confidentiality Notice: You need to check out your motherboards web site for details of what you need to do to go to the new Celeron D. I would guess it is just a bios upgrade. Tony. -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Business Computer Projects - Disclaimer -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- This message, and any associated attachment is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify either the sender or [EMAIL PROTECTED] immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not necessarily the views of Business Computer Projects Ltd., unless specifically stated. Whilst every effort has been made to ensure that emails and their attachments are virus free, it is the responsibility of the recipient(s) to verify the integrity of such emails. Business Computer Projects Ltd BCP House 151 Charles Street Stockport Cheshire SK1 3JY Tel: +44 (0)161 355-3000 Fax: +44 (0)161 355-3001 Web: http://www.bcpsoftware.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware reboot
On Sunday 04 July 2004 11:44 pm, Marek Pawinski wrote: -Hi - -I had a problem where one of my machines would reboot every 8 days or so. -Now it reboots every few hours. The CPU fan seems to be working every time -i look. I tried knoppix on it as well so its not the OS looks like it. Not -being much of a hardware man i wonder if anyone knows what could cause -this ? - -Marek Sounds like hardware. Probably getting hot. Check all your fans, blow out all the dust. Install lm_sensors and gkrellm - monitor your temperatures. Run a program like memtest86 or the torture test on mprime. Watch your temp via gkrellm while it runs - see if the temp goes way up and it locks up. Memtest86 will check your memory in case something is bad there. HTHs! -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware reboot
Marek Pawinski wrote: Hi I had a problem where one of my machines would reboot every 8 days or so. Now it reboots every few hours. The CPU fan seems to be working every time i look. I tried knoppix on it as well so its not the OS looks like it. Not being much of a hardware man i wonder if anyone knows what could cause this ? Marek If the machine is not running hot, then I would check the power supply. You may also want to check the line voltage feeding the machine. You may need to get a UPS for it, just to handle voltage dips. Sometime just putting is a larger power supply will do the trick. I had to add a small UPS to my two of my sisters' machines. One would reboot or lock up every time the AC kicked in, and the other would have problems every time the silo unloader or bulk tank compressor would start... Mikkel -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with Ketchup! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware reboot
On Mon, 2004-07-05 at 13:44, Marek Pawinski wrote: Hi I had a problem where one of my machines would reboot every 8 days or so. Now it reboots every few hours. The CPU fan seems to be working every time i look. I tried knoppix on it as well so its not the OS looks like it. Not being much of a hardware man i wonder if anyone knows what could cause this ? Marek Sounds like a heat issue; you might want to get all the dust blown out of the inside of the box - especially in the power supply - then see how it goes from that point on. stephen kuhn - proprietor __ illawarra computer services :: a kuhn media australia venture http://kma.0catch.com :: mobile 0410.728.389 Serving Sydney, The Illawarra, South Coast and Rural NSW __ * This message was composed on a 100% Microsoft free computer * We expressly refuse to utilise Microsoft DRM encoded documents __ Certified virus-free since we don't use Microsoft products Every morning, I get up and look through the 'Forbes' list of the richest people in America. If I'm not there, I go to work -- Robert Orben Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware reboot
On Sunday 04 July 2004 10:44 pm, Marek Pawinski wrote: Hi I had a problem where one of my machines would reboot every 8 days or so. Now it reboots every few hours. The CPU fan seems to be working every time i look. I tried knoppix on it as well so its not the OS looks like it. Not being much of a hardware man i wonder if anyone knows what could cause this ? Marek Check the power supply fan, is it running? If not that will cause the reboot. Just replaced a power supply for that reason, sucker got hot enough that it failed shortly after I replaced the fan. -- Dennis M. Linux user #180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] Troubleshooting hardware
On Fri, 18 Jun 2004 15:58:35 -0500 Mikkel L. Ellertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dumb question time - Are the connectors on that cable labeled for where they should be plugged in? (Motherboard, drive 0, drive 1) If so, are you plugging things in the correct place? You may also have to try cable select instead of master/slave... Mikkel -- They are labled... the end connector says it's the master one... and it's installed properly. I've never used cable select setting before - and it may work and allow me to avoid the issue altogther but if it's possible I would like to understand what's going on in addition to getting things working better than intermittently - failing that, getting things working would be good enough. If I understand correctly, a disk that sits at drive 0 would be looking for the boot record in one place and that same disk at drive 1 would be looking to boot from the same place but would want to see a different label - hdb as opposed to hda. Would this be basically correct? Curt Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] Troubleshooting hardware
C. Tresenriter wrote: On Fri, 18 Jun 2004 15:58:35 -0500 Mikkel L. Ellertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dumb question time - Are the connectors on that cable labeled for where they should be plugged in? (Motherboard, drive 0, drive 1) If so, are you plugging things in the correct place? You may also have to try cable select instead of master/slave... Mikkel -- They are labled... the end connector says it's the master one... and it's installed properly. I've never used cable select setting before - and it may work and allow me to avoid the issue altogther but if it's possible I would like to understand what's going on in addition to getting things working better than intermittently - failing that, getting things working would be good enough. If I understand correctly, a disk that sits at drive 0 would be looking for the boot record in one place and that same disk at drive 1 would be looking to boot from the same place but would want to see a different label - hdb as opposed to hda. Would this be basically correct? Curt Not exactly how I would explain it. Think of it this way - the drive connected to drive 0 acts like it is jumpered as master, and the one on drive 1 acts like it is jumpered as slave. So you can swap the drive assignments by changing where the drive is plugged in, instead of having to change jumpers on the drive. On the first IDE interface, the drive on drive 0 will be /dev/hda, and on drive one /dev/hdb. If I were you, I would try changing to cable select, and see if that fixes the problem. I know that one setup I have does not work right when useing the cable select cable, and jumpering as master, or slave. (The drive also says to use cable select if possible...) As far as booting goes, if you have a drive on drive 0, that is normaly the drive the system will dry and boot from. Some BIOS will let you boot from other drives, but the default is IDE0, drive C, or the first hard drive - depending on what the BIOS calls it. While may be able to boot from a drive on drive 1 (IDE1), it is better to have the boot drive on IDE0, because LILO gets confused if you boot from IDE1, and later add a drive on IDE0. The BIOS numbering of the drives changes, and LILO uses the BIOS number to load things. (Grub, and the kernel are smarter...) Mikkel -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with Ketchup! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] Troubleshooting hardware
On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 08:56:13 -0500 Mikkel L. Ellertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If I were you, I would try changing to cable select, and see if that fixes the problem. I know that one setup I have does not work right when useing the cable select cable, and jumpering as master, or slave. (The drive also says to use cable select if possible...) Well that seems to have solved the issue, it's booting from the primary channel, master position on the cable. Guess I'll leave well enough alone. Thanks Mikkel! Curt Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] Troubleshooting hardware
On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 13:57:08 -0500 C. Tresenriter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well that seems to have solved the issue, it's booting from the primary channel, master position on the cable. Guess I'll leave well enough alone. Appears I spoke too soon. Once I put the CD/DVD back on the cable I got the error again. BOth units are set to the cable select position. H. ? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] Troubleshooting hardware
C. Tresenriter wrote: I'm trying to determine if my hard disk is bad or if the problem is motherboard related or something else entirely. When booting 10. CE, after running POST, I occasionally get: Disk boot failure: Insert systems disk and press enter to continue Yesterday I received a replacement mobo from ASUS, plugged everything in, Mandrake started up - everything worked. I switched to another machine via KVM switch where I was installing Slackware. When that install was complete, I switched back to the mdk machine to do some googling only to find the above mentioned error on the screen. I downloaded seagate's diagnostic tools and ran the long test on the hd. Three or four hours later, it informed me that the drive and cable had passed all the tests. Since the install was new and untweaked I thought I'd try to re-install mdk. The partitioning and install was flawless but on reboot I received the error message again. Later, on a whim I put the drive in the secondary slave position on the primary channel (it was installed as hda and the jumper is set to the master position) and lo and behold it booted and ran. I then put it back on the master connecter IDE cable and again it started the OS. I've switched them back and forth several times this morning and it has booted and run every time. On the seconday channel I get the error whtaever the position on the cable. My #2 machine is not in a state, at present, that I can use it to check the drive there. The Seagate techs told me that the error message would indicate a damaged boot sector and *I* thought that if the boot sector was bad (if, in fact it is) that it would never get to the stage where lilo runs. In an effort to figure out where to go next, I'm wondering if it's possible that *if* the boot sector *is* bad, could it still work on occasion?... or sholud I just exchange the drive to be safe? Since the behavior is intermittent, I'm thinking that the mobo may be the problem - although I'd expect that ASUS checked it out before sending it to me. Also... why does the drive run in either master or slave position on the cable (primary IDE channel only) with the hd jumper set to master? ...and yes, I'm sure it's not at the cable select position. The cable is a Cables Unlimited 18 2 device ATA 133 rounded - shielded cable. Specs: A7V8X-X Athlon XP 2700+ 512 MB DDR Seagate ST380013A 80G hard disk Enlight model EN 8420934 ATX 420W power supply I'd appreciate any thoughts anyone might have before I tear out what little hair I have left. Curt Dumb question time - Are the connectors on that cable labeled for where they should be plugged in? (Motherboard, drive 0, drive 1) If so, are you plugging things in the correct place? You may also have to try cable select instead of master/slave... Mikkel -- Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with Ketchup! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Join the Club : http://www.mandrakeclub.com
Re: [newbie] supported Hardware list
I am looking for the published list of supported hardware, but I cannot access anything from here: http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/hardware.php3 Yep. The page seems to be broken. -- Mandrake HowTo's More: http://twiki.mdklinuxfaq.org Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] supported Hardware list
Anguo, For the LCD just use the generic LCD at the correct size. I use an Hitachi and have no probs. I use this with a Geforce 4 and have the latest Nvidia drivers and it works fine with 9.1 and 9.2. Tony. -Original Message- From: Anguo [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2003 5:46 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [newbie] supported Hardware list I am looking for the published list of supported hardware, but I cannot access anything from here: http://www.mandrakelinux.com/en/hardware.php3 In case anyone knows, I am specifically looking information on the LCD monitor Nec Multisync LCD 1760nx with a nVIDIA GeForce 4 MX graphic card. The nvidia drivers shipped with the powerpack completely messed X whilst an install from the free CDs (without the nvidia drivers) went fine. Thanks, Anguo -- In the news: Stallman: Software patents victimise developers Software patents are victimising developers with a system which is making it increasingly difficult to write programs, according to free software guru Richard Stallman Read more: http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t269-s2107481,00.html -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Business Computer Projects - Disclaimer -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- This message, and any associated attachment is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify either Tony S. Sykes or the postmaster mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not necessarily the views of Business Computer Projects Ltd., unless specifically stated. Whilst every effort has been made to ensure that emails and their attachments are virus free, it is the responsibility of the recipient(s) to verify the integrity of such emails. Business Computer Projects Ltd BCP House 151 Charles Street Stockport Cheshire SK1 3JY Tel: +44 (0)161 355-3000 Fax: +44 (0)161 355-3001 Web: http://www.bcpsoftware.com http://www.bcpsoftware.com/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
On Saturday 30 August 2003 09:47 am, Anne Wilson wrote: A Soltek board, just bought, says that using a 2x graphics board will fry the mobo (wrong voltage). The G-Force2 MX-400 is a 2x/4x board. Is it safe to assume that it will have the right voltage, merely falling back to 2x if the mobo doesn't have the later standard agp? I have not used a Soltek mother board before but I have done that with other brands of boards and everything worked fine. Marc KM5KW Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
On Saturday 30 Aug 2003 4:18 pm, Bart Salien wrote: Op Saturday 30 August 2003 16:47, schreef Anne Wilson: Anne , Normaly all AGP 4x should be backwards compatible with a AGP 2x . Unless they ran out of money to properly implement the AGP bus on your mobo ? Hi, Bart. No, that's not the problem. I'm really just asking whether it's safe to use (in terms of voltage) on a modern mobo. I'm assuming that anything that's 4x is OK. Am I right? Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Have you visited http://twiki.mdklinuxfaq.org yet? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
Op Saturday 30 August 2003 16:47, schreef Anne Wilson: Anne , Normaly all AGP 4x should be backwards compatible with a AGP 2x . Unless they ran out of money to properly implement the AGP bus on your mobo ? Bart. A Soltek board, just bought, says that using a 2x graphics board will fry the mobo (wrong voltage). The G-Force2 MX-400 is a 2x/4x board. Is it safe to assume that it will have the right voltage, merely falling back to 2x if the mobo doesn't have the later standard agp? Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
Op Saturday 30 August 2003 17:24, schreef Anne Wilson: Anne , Normaly all AGP 4x should be backwards compatible with a AGP 2x . Unless they ran out of money to properly implement the AGP bus on your mobo ? Hi, Bart. No, that's not the problem. I'm really just asking whether it's safe to use (in terms of voltage) on a modern mobo. I'm assuming that anything that's 4x is OK. Am I right? Anne Anne , follow this link to a discussion on the different voltages . http://www.techimo.com/forum/t75574.html Bart. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
On Saturday 30 Aug 2003 4:44 pm, Bart Salien wrote: Op Saturday 30 August 2003 17:24, schreef Anne Wilson: Anne , Normaly all AGP 4x should be backwards compatible with a AGP 2x . Unless they ran out of money to properly implement the AGP bus on your mobo ? Hi, Bart. No, that's not the problem. I'm really just asking whether it's safe to use (in terms of voltage) on a modern mobo. I'm assuming that anything that's 4x is OK. Am I right? Anne Anne , follow this link to a discussion on the different voltages . http://www.techimo.com/forum/t75574.html Bart. Thanks, Bart, but that has just left me even more confused. It would seem that the answer should be that I'll be ok, but otoh, there are some boards that would fit and not be compatible, which would fry everything. Worrying! Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Have you visited http://twiki.mdklinuxfaq.org yet? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
On Saturday 30 Aug 2003 6:27 pm, Greg Meyer wrote: On Saturday 30 August 2003 10:47 am, Anne Wilson wrote: A Soltek board, just bought, says that using a 2x graphics board will fry the mobo (wrong voltage). The G-Force2 MX-400 is a 2x/4x board. Is it safe to assume that it will have the right voltage, merely falling back to 2x if the mobo doesn't have the later standard agp? It should work fine. The 2x/4x video cards are built to run using either 3.3v or the lower 1.6v of the 4x mobo's. The problem is if you put a 2x only (3.3v) card in a 4x mobo, you may burn it out. In fact, the agp slot should be keyed so that you cannot physically insert a 2x card into the slot. If the card fits, it should work. Thanks, Greg Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Have you visited http://twiki.mdklinuxfaq.org yet? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware Guru Please - advice needed
On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 02:47, Anne Wilson wrote: A Soltek board, just bought, says that using a 2x graphics board will fry the mobo (wrong voltage). The G-Force2 MX-400 is a 2x/4x board. Is it safe to assume that it will have the right voltage, merely falling back to 2x if the mobo doesn't have the later standard agp? Anne, which mobo do you have? I'm using a Soltek SL-75KAV mobo with an nVidia GTS2 Pro 2x/4x graphics card. The manual for this mobo says it is AGP v2.0 compliant and supports 1, 2 and 4x modes (66 MHz). IIRC the BIOS setup has a choice of 2x or 4x mode - I have it set on 4x I think. Sharrea -- Help Microsoft stamp out piracy - give Linux to a friend today Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] still hardware problems
On Tuesday February 11 2003 01:37 pm, Yaakov wrote: Hi i wrote some time ago about the slow handling of mandrake (i mean that it takes too much time until the programs start up). so i downloaded the kernel 2.4.19-24mdk as someone suggested (thank you greg!). with this update there are some improvements!! but konquero and the games are still slow. so anybody got an idea what to do? i think the problem could result because of my chipset,... here are the information about my current system: P4 2,53GHz; Epox 4G4A with Intel i845G chipset; Radeon 8500; Seagate Barracuda 80GB (2x) thx for helping me regards Hannes kernel-2.4.21-0.pre4.5mdk is advertised to have some additional patches tryin to fix the i845's inherent problems. -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:12 pm, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:06 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: Well.. for starters, P4's have MUCH better thermal resistance, not to mention a thermal diode that can regulate the core CPU temperature if the fan happens to fail, or if the heatsink happens to fall off.. Many 3rd party tests have shown that a P4 cpu can run even without a heatsink, with no damage to the CPU at all. It slows down if it detects temperature overload, and prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). depends on how you define performer Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Monday 27 January 2003 04:04 am, Anne Wilson wrote: On Sunday 26 Jan 2003 11:12 pm, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:06 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: Well.. for starters, P4's have MUCH better thermal resistance, not to mention a thermal diode that can regulate the core CPU temperature if the fan happens to fail, or if the heatsink happens to fall off.. Many 3rd party tests have shown that a P4 cpu can run even without a heatsink, with no damage to the CPU at all. It slows down if it detects temperature overload, and prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). Dertainly that's implied in most of the reviews I've read, which is why they started the comparative numbering system. Anne the comparative numbering system is something they have been doing for years, and it seems to me to be a comparative pricing system more than speed. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Monday 27 Jan 2003 3:31 pm, et wrote: On Monday 27 January 2003 04:04 am, Anne Wilson wrote: On Sunday 26 Jan 2003 11:12 pm, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:06 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: Well.. for starters, P4's have MUCH better thermal resistance, not to mention a thermal diode that can regulate the core CPU temperature if the fan happens to fail, or if the heatsink happens to fall off.. Many 3rd party tests have shown that a P4 cpu can run even without a heatsink, with no damage to the CPU at all. It slows down if it detects temperature overload, and prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). Dertainly that's implied in most of the reviews I've read, which is why they started the comparative numbering system. Anne the comparative numbering system is something they have been doing for years, and it seems to me to be a comparative pricing system more than speed. Wasn't it Cyrix/IBM that used to do it? Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
Paul wrote: Yup, no problem. I am of course NOT going to twiddle the running drives around, but they function wonderfully either on the side or straight up. changing hd position was meant to be after power off and spin down. i have seen drives develop problems and only run at new angle. i know of one drive that is running for 8 years now, raised 1.5 on left side. So it is the mobo, as Marc and et also already suspected. Too bad. This ASUS board was pricey. But then, even good things can die an early death. do not give up on board. i had a problem with one box where cpu was over heating. adding a fan and clearing drive cables from around cpu allowed air to flow and cpu cooled down. adding silicon heat sink compound will help make cpu run cooler, if you have not already applied. Re temperature/sensors: I did indeed have Gkrellm set up wrong. The high value as reported by sensors is +40C (I found a multiplier x2 in Gkrellm) and the limit is reportedly +60C, so that should be all fine. if you improve air flow and now that you have sensors straight, test again. all is not lost yet. Thanks for all the help, once more. most welcome. You are a wonderful bunch people!! my last wife does not think i am. but that is why she is my ex. :) peace out. tc,hago. g . -- think green... save a tree, save a life, save time, save bandwidth, save storage. send email... text/plain - disable pgp/gpg/geek code attachments =+= if you are proud to be an american, then buy made in america. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
1/26/03 1:46:32 AM, Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In reply to Stephen's mail, d.d. 26 Jan 2003 12:21:17 +1100: What if there is a mercury switch in either the PSU or somewhere within the casing itself that would cause this? I have been thinking about this also, but I have not been able to find a switch like that. More and more I feel that this is a faulty contact/connector or something. I booted from a floppy and carefully started fiddling with the power cables to try and track a broken/nearly broken one. No luck there either. (Uptime now, PC still on the side, is 11.33 hours...) Paul -- Never lend books -- nobody ever returns them; the only books I have in my library are those which people have lent me. -Anatole France http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Here is a old trick that has been used for troubleshooting this type of problem since the dawn of time, long before PCs since just after the invention of the printed circuit board almost prehistoric. Get your self a brand new pencil with a big new pink eraser. Next just to be on the safe side wrap the metal cylinder that holds the eraser on the pencel with a wrap or 2 of electrical tape. Now you can use the eraser end of the pencil as a safe and effective probe It will be well insulated to avoid damage to components and the insulation will also protect you if the pencil should contact anything that is high voltage. The rubber eraser is also a great NON SLIP surface to probe components with and the pencil is thin enough to reach into tight spaces. use it to reach inside the machine while it is running and wiggle various parts and points near plug in connectors. Try to use the eraser to gently push down on parts to simulate the down ward force thet gravity would create while the machine is on its side and see where you have to push to make it work or lay the machine on its side and support it however necessory to alow you to gently push on parts and see where you need to push to make it stop running. This should help to pinpoint the problem. You may find that it is not a bad connection or intermittent short but a cracked circuit trace on a board, a pain in the butt to repair if that ends up being the case. Another use for the pencil eraser is if you find a suspect connector you can use the eraser to clean contacts to remove oxides or dirt that can cause this type of problem. The eraser is mildley abrasive and will pollish up and clean edge connectors on a circuit board fast and easy. Good luck, these intermittant problems can be a mind bender. Marc Gee this was fun I think that now I may write a book and call it A Thousand And One Uses For The Number Two Pencil, I am shure it will be a best seller Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 January 2003 02:43 am, Paul wrote: In reply to g's mail, d.d. Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:56:31 +: knowledge of your back broke desktop/tower contents would be helpful. if it is still running, i would suggest 3 possible problems to go after first. #1 = power supply: does fan stop? No, it keeps going. do you lose all voltages? No. There is still power on the mainboard led and the leds of the network cards. #2 = heat: are you testing with covers on or off? Both. Same result. do you have good air circulation? cpu have correct heat sink and fan? Yes and yes. is memory over heating? No, it is not. I cannot imagine that it does. I can leave the PC off for 2 hours, which should be enough to cool off most parts. When I switch the PC on in the upright position (and refrain from smoking ;) it stops within 2 minutes. The hybernate led starts blinking and that's it. Which really is weird, since I have the BIOS set to never go into hybernate. does mainboard have heat sensors? Yes, they both show on LM Sensors (through Gkrellm). The CPU (Athlon 1200) shows 78C (149F) and something else shows 29.2C (75.5F). I am not sure if I set the multiplier readings in Gkrellm correctly, but this is what I also could see (plus or minus a few degrees) when then machine was still upright. So no change there. #3 = harddisk: is drive new? if used, was it previously mounted flat or on side? The drives (2 x 30Gb ata100) came with the system. It is a little over 1.5 years old now. The drives previously were mounted flat, now they are on the side. if drive is flat and stops, flip upside down, still run? if drive on side and stops, flip to other side, still run? if drive is flat and stops, turn to side, still run? if drive on side and stops, turn to flat, still run? I'd have to try these out sometime. I'll let you know. Thanks for the ideas. Paul think green... save a tree, save a life, save time, save bandwidth, save storage. send email... text/plain - disable pgp/gpg/geek code attachments I like this!!! :-) I think it is time to upgrade the mother board. this sucker has a microscopic crack, or one of the mount screws that should be isolated is shorting that board to the box... can you take the MoBo out and set it on a wooden or plexiglass sheet (to insulate it) connect a power supply and video card and see it it boots, and if it does, pick the board up (use insulting gloves) and see if sitting sideways makes the difference. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday January 26 2003 01:43 am, Paul wrote: Yes, they both show on LM Sensors (through Gkrellm). The CPU (Athlon 1200) shows 78C (149F) and something else shows 29.2C (75.5F). I am not sure if I set the multiplier readings in Gkrellm correctly, but this is what I also could see (plus or minus a few degrees) when then machine was still upright. So no change there. Type 'sensors' in a terminal if you aren't sure you have gkrellm configured correctly. If 'sensors' is showing 78C, that's your weirdness problem. First of all, AMD Athlon's (unlike Intels) don't have an internal diode for reporting the actual core temp. An external probe is used. AMD says to add 10 to 20C to the probe temp to better approximate the actual core temp. IME, about 12C (10C from a pin probe, to 15C for a contact probe) is the typical amount to add. To illustrate, silicon is an insulator. Measuring the internal temp of a cpu with an external probe is sort'a like tryin to measure the temp of electrical wires inside a wall, by mashing a thermometer against the plaster. OK, maybe that's a little exageration, but you get the idea ;) AMD specs Athlons to fail at 90C core temp. This upper limit will be lowered if you overheat the core even once, but it usually takes several times. When you see 78C from the probe, your core temp is probly 90C, maybe even as high as 98C. Poof! You're lucky the system quits, rather than completely fryin that Athlon and the motherboard. Re-mount your heatsink on that athlon squarely and firmly using thermal grease, not a thermal pad. The $2 grease from Radio Shack is all you need. Apply a thin layer. Keep your case temp as close to room temp as possible. You should be able to keep that cpu under 55C from the probe, even under sustained 100% load. 'Course the 55 probe is really upper 60's core temp, but far enough under 90C that even occasional spikes in the core temp shouldn't cause failure. After fixin your heatsink, see if the system won't run properly (upright). If it's still runnin too hot, try pointing a table fan into the case with the cover off. If you can then run at more normal temps, you need to improve your heatsink, fans and case ventilation. If you still have weirdness with improved cooling, it's likely you overheated the core one too many times and the cpu is internally damaged. You may have also caused some damage to the capacitors on the motherboard, particularly those surrounding the cpu socket. If you suspect you've permanently damaged the cpu/mobo, all is still not lost. Underclock it, if the mobo supports it. The multiplier on that 1200 is not locked. Keep the FSB at spec, but try dropping the multiplier by .5 to as much as 2. IOW's, if it's 9x133, try droppin the multiplier to 8 or 8.5. If it's a 100mhz FSB cpu (12x100), try 10 or 11x100. Might keep you goin till you can replace the system. If it comes to that, I strongly suggest you only use AMD recommended power supplies, motherboards, and heatsinks, if you aren't now doin so. -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
Paul wrote: No, it keeps going. No. There is still power on the mainboard led and the leds of the network cards. Both. Same result. Yes and yes. No, it is not. I cannot imagine that it does. I can leave the PC off for 2 hours, which should be enough to cool off most parts. When I switch the PC Yes, they both show on LM Sensors (through Gkrellm). The drives (2 x 30Gb ata100) came with the system. It is a little over 1.5 years old now. The drives previously were mounted flat, now they are on the side. I'd have to try these out sometime. I'll let you know. Thanks for the ideas. ok. from your replies, it is now to decide if problems is with mainboard or if you have a harddrive problem. with box in normal upright position, put harddrive on it's side. does system stay up? I like this!!! :-) glad you enjoyed. peace out. tc,hago. g . -- think green... save a tree, save a life, save time, save bandwidth, save storage. send email... text/plain - disable pgp/gpg/geek code attachments =+= if you are proud to be an american, then buy made in america. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 Jan 2003 2:17 pm, Tom Brinkman wrote: On Sunday January 26 2003 01:43 am, Paul wrote: Yes, they both show on LM Sensors (through Gkrellm). The CPU (Athlon 1200) shows 78C (149F) and something else shows 29.2C (75.5F). I am not sure if I set the multiplier readings in Gkrellm correctly, but this is what I also could see (plus or minus a few degrees) when then machine was still upright. So no change there. Type 'sensors' in a terminal if you aren't sure you have gkrellm configured correctly. If 'sensors' is showing 78C, that's your weirdness problem. First of all, AMD Athlon's (unlike Intels) don't have an internal diode for reporting the actual core temp. An external probe is used. AMD says to add 10 to 20C to the probe temp to better approximate the actual core temp. IME, about 12C (10C from a pin probe, to 15C for a contact probe) is the typical amount to add. To illustrate, silicon is an insulator. Measuring the internal temp of a cpu with an external probe is sort'a like tryin to measure the temp of electrical wires inside a wall, by mashing a thermometer against the plaster. OK, maybe that's a little exageration, but you get the idea ;) AMD specs Athlons to fail at 90C core temp. This upper limit will be lowered if you overheat the core even once, but it usually takes several times. When you see 78C from the probe, your core temp is probly 90C, maybe even as high as 98C. Poof! You're lucky the system quits, rather than completely fryin that Athlon and the motherboard. Re-mount your heatsink on that athlon squarely and firmly using thermal grease, not a thermal pad. The $2 grease from Radio Shack is all you need. Apply a thin layer. Keep your case temp as close to room temp as possible. You should be able to keep that cpu under 55C from the probe, even under sustained 100% load. 'Course the 55 probe is really upper 60's core temp, but far enough under 90C that even occasional spikes in the core temp shouldn't cause failure. After fixin your heatsink, see if the system won't run properly (upright). If it's still runnin too hot, try pointing a table fan into the case with the cover off. If you can then run at more normal temps, you need to improve your heatsink, fans and case ventilation. If you still have weirdness with improved cooling, it's likely you overheated the core one too many times and the cpu is internally damaged. You may have also caused some damage to the capacitors on the motherboard, particularly those surrounding the cpu socket. If you suspect you've permanently damaged the cpu/mobo, all is still not lost. Underclock it, if the mobo supports it. The multiplier on that 1200 is not locked. Keep the FSB at spec, but try dropping the multiplier by .5 to as much as 2. IOW's, if it's 9x133, try droppin the multiplier to 8 or 8.5. If it's a 100mhz FSB cpu (12x100), try 10 or 11x100. Might keep you goin till you can replace the system. If it comes to that, I strongly suggest you only use AMD recommended power supplies, motherboards, and heatsinks, if you aren't now doin so. Tom - I'm not doubting you, and I'll certainly keep this post for reference, but how is that affected by orientation? Why would it run longer if on its side? Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 Jan 2003 5:04 pm, Tom Brinkman wrote: On Sunday January 26 2003 09:11 am, Anne Wilson wrote: Tom - I'm not doubting you, and I'll certainly keep this post for reference, but how is that affected by orientation? Why would it run longer if on its side? Anne Heat rises : Seriously, if he's runnin it on it's side, the heat rises out of the case better, maybe?. A table fan blowin into an upright case would probly be better tho. In any event, 78C from a probe is WAY TOO high for an Athlon. Another posssible explaination is if he's usin a heatsink that is heavier than AMD recommends. These heavy heatsinks don't sit squarely on the cpu's die when the case is upright and gravity is pullin 'em down. Specially if the spring clip tension is to low. Which is why AMD specs a maximum weight (200 or 300 grams IIRC) and retention clip tensions. Anyhow, all their recommended heatsinks fall within this weight requirement. A lot of the super duper fancy expensive one, are also overweight. Specially the copper ones. Even if the cause is somethin else, anything over low 60C's (max, under extreme load) for an Athlon is intolerable, an must be sorted out, sooner the better if it's not already too late. Thanks for the explanation. Yes, my Athlon 900 runs around 50C, 24x7. I do worry about the weight of current heatsinks and fans - to say nothing of the fact that I have a heart attack every time I have to try to deal with those clips :). Are there specialist fans that are lighter weight? Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sun, January 26 2003 11:28 am, Anne Wilson wrote: *snip* Thanks for the explanation. Yes, my Athlon 900 runs around 50C, 24x7. I do worry about the weight of current heatsinks and fans - to say nothing of the fact that I have a heart attack every time I have to try to deal with those clips :). Are there specialist fans that are lighter weight? And see.. this is why I spent the extra 20 bucks and bought a Pentium IV 1.6, instead of the Athlon 1800 (which runs at 1400mhz I think) -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- To err is humor. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 Jan 2003 5:47 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: On Sun, January 26 2003 11:28 am, Anne Wilson wrote: *snip* Thanks for the explanation. Yes, my Athlon 900 runs around 50C, 24x7. I do worry about the weight of current heatsinks and fans - to say nothing of the fact that I have a heart attack every time I have to try to deal with those clips :). Are there specialist fans that are lighter weight? And see.. this is why I spent the extra 20 bucks and bought a Pentium IV 1.6, instead of the Athlon 1800 (which runs at 1400mhz I think) No, I don't see. Why? Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
1/26/03 10:24:16 AM, Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In reply to g's mail, d.d. Sun, 26 Jan 2003 15:05:48 +: from your replies, it is now to decide if problems is with mainboard or if you have a harddrive problem. with box in normal upright position, put harddrive on it's side. does system stay up? Yup, no problem. I am of course NOT going to twiddle the running drives around, but they function wonderfully either on the side or straight up. So it is the mobo, as Marc and et also already suspected. Too bad. This ASUS board was pricey. But then, even good things can die an early death. If it is a cracked trace on the mobo dont call it beyond repair yet. It could be a problem that can be repaired by caveman technology. If you can discover what way the board needs to be flexed or bent to keep it working maybe you can do something as simple as install a mechanical device in the case to push or pull it in the correct direction. I once had a rather expensive shortwave receiver with similar problems and I could not find the problem after several hours of troubleshooting. I ended up unscrewing the circuit board and sticking a cigarette butt under the board and screwing it back down this flexed the board enough to make it work. This was by no means a good professional repair but it did continue to reliably work for many years. I would give it a try, you got nothing to loose and if you can make it work well for a couple of years what more do you need. by then you will probably be ready to upgrade. I have also seen another problem similar to this once in a computer try having a long hard look at the electrolitic capactiors near the cpu. look for bulged tops and or wiggle them a bit to see if one has become loose. I have seen the the leads actually pill loose from the bottom of this type of capacttor before and do some odd things. Just a long shot Marc Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sun, January 26 2003 11:49 am, Anne Wilson wrote: *snip* Thanks for the explanation. Yes, my Athlon 900 runs around 50C, 24x7. I do worry about the weight of current heatsinks and fans - to say nothing of the fact that I have a heart attack every time I have to try to deal with those clips :). Are there specialist fans that are lighter weight? And see.. this is why I spent the extra 20 bucks and bought a Pentium IV 1.6, instead of the Athlon 1800 (which runs at 1400mhz I think) No, I don't see. Why? Anne Well.. for starters, P4's have MUCH better thermal resistance, not to mention a thermal diode that can regulate the core CPU temperature if the fan happens to fail, or if the heatsink happens to fall off.. Many 3rd party tests have shown that a P4 cpu can run even without a heatsink, with no damage to the CPU at all. It slows down if it detects temperature overload, and prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- You will pass away very quickly. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:06 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: Well.. for starters, P4's have MUCH better thermal resistance, not to mention a thermal diode that can regulate the core CPU temperature if the fan happens to fail, or if the heatsink happens to fall off.. Many 3rd party tests have shown that a P4 cpu can run even without a heatsink, with no damage to the CPU at all. It slows down if it detects temperature overload, and prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
In reply to Anne's mail, d.d. Sun, 26 Jan 2003 17:49:45 +: And see.. this is why I spent the extra 20 bucks and bought a Pentium IV 1.6, instead of the Athlon 1800 (which runs at 1400mhz I think) No, I don't see. Why? I guess these do not suffer from 'overweight problems' of fans. ;) Paul -- Never lend books -- nobody ever returns them; the only books I have in my library are those which people have lent me. -Anatole France http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sun, January 26 2003 5:12 pm, Ronald J. Hall wrote: *snip* Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). Really dependant upon what your doing, AMD's ARE better performance/mhz usually.. but.. also at the cost of stability. When I was a technician at a local pc service center, I can't even begin to tell you about the compatibility issues between motherboards and video cards. One guy had a GF4 Ti 4400.. and a AMD XP1800+.. in a Soyo board.. and the card refused to work in anything having to do with 3D.. He bought the card from us, and swore up and down the card was faulty... I put the card into my test system. (A P3 500) and installed several games that he'd brought, saying the card locked up in em.. and it ran beautifully... no problems.. took the ATI Rage128 that I had in the test system.. put it into the Xp1800.. and *IT* ran beautifully.. with no problems, whatsoever... now, for the kicker.. we underclocked his 1800 (which was clocked to 1600mhz, per AMD's settings...) to 1500mhz clockspeed (which the board then recognized the CPU as a XP 1699 (or something like that..) and the GF4 ran without a hitch.. So.. I assumed a heat problem.. not true... the CPU wasn't even hitting 110F (or about 45C) according the motherboard's system diags.. and this was AFTER running some 'cpu burn' tests that output gibberish into each register, causing the CPU to peg 100% usage for like 20 minutes.. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- The time was the 19th of May, 1780. The place was Hartford, Connecticut. The day has gone down in New England history as a terrible foretaste of Judgement Day. For at noon the skies turned from blue to grey and by mid-afternoon had blackened over so densely that, in that religious age, men fell on their knees and begged a final blessing before the end came. The Connecticut House of Representatives was in session. And, as some of the men fell down and others clamored for an immediate adjournment, the Speaker of the House, one Col. Davenport, came to his feet. He silenced them and said these words: The day of judgment is either approaching or it is not. If it is not, there is no cause for adjournment. If it is, I choose to be found doing my duty. I wish therefore that candles may be brought. -- Alistair Cooke Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sun, January 26 2003 1:03 pm, Paul wrote: *snip* I guess these do not suffer from 'overweight problems' of fans. ;) Paul No, it's because P4's don't overheat.. period. They throttle their clock speed, to reduce heat. if they detect overheating, so where thermal management on an Athlon means protecting the cpu from itself, thermal management on a Pentium IV just keeps the CPU from slowing down.. -- Chuck Burns, Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---==--- To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. -- Thomas Edison Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sunday January 26 2003 05:12 pm, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 26 January 2003 06:06 pm, Chuck Burns wrote: prevents the core temp. from reaching critical levels.. (Not to mention the 400-533mhz cache speeds, compared to athlon's measly 200mhz.. :p) Thats interesting. I always thought that AMDs' chips were better performers at the same speed rangefrom what I've read. (but I'm no expert). Not so, Athlons are much better performers at the same clock speed ;) Athlons in the 1.6g range out perform P4's of the 2+ ghz variety, at less cost. It's not so much that AMD's are so great, it's more like P4's and even more so, the available motherboard chipsets for them suck really big time. Intel has used M$ type tatics to crush competition, but has yet to produce any decent i8whatever chipsets. 400-533mhz is the same type of PR ballyhoo both manufacturers use for those that fall for it. And it's not cache speeds, its FSB speeds multiplied by marketing smoke'n mirrors. FSB for all but the very *most recent cpu's is 133mhz. AMD pretends they double this to 266. Intels goes off the charts with claims of 3 and 4 times multiplication by magic (*most recent being 166 mhz FSB, either vendor. In that case AMD claims 333mhz, 2x 166). 'Sides, front side bus speeds aren't dictated by the cpu, they're set by the (motherboard's) chipsets. And on either system, everything STILL has to go thru the old 33mhz PCI bus anyhow. So much for '533mhz cpu' PR B$. AMD's worst short fall IMO, an I beleive it's why they're not acceptable on the server or even laptop markets is the lack of an **internal diode to report/regulate heat. Intels' have had this since early Pentiums. OTOH, it's a recent Intel copout also. As some of you have said, the diode in new Intels allows the cpu to slow down, even shutdown to avoid overheating. In the case of laptops, avoid overheating and conserve power. So just when you need power, the cpu kneels down, badly ;( Which is another reason P4's suck. An why somebody posted recently that a 40 minute kernel compile took 80 minutes on their new 1.6 gig P4 laptop. (**OK, the newer Athlon XP's have a rudimentary internal diode implemtation, but it's almost a year now, with no decent motherboard support from any vendor. Asus and Gigabyte have tried, most others haven't.) A better marketing approach, judging by popularity, seems to be the worst old past junk. VIA buys up failed Cyrix crap for practically nothin, and PR's it sucessfully as 'silent' and 'fanless' (VIA C3's, the 'C' stands for Cyrix, 3rd attempt). PR claims of 800mhz produce benches an ancient K6-300 could beat hands down. Which BTW can also be run silent and fanless on junk motherboards an power supplies. At least the K6 was an i586 cpu, the C3's are a 586/486 mix. So the buyer has choice ; For me, I'm just nursin my tired ol' overclocked Tbird 1.4/VIA (1.5ghz, out performs a 1.8g/i8xx P4) along till it dies. It's startin to run hotter lately ;( Maybe 64 bit desktop cpu's will be the rage by then ;) Had a P3-450 oc'd to 600 on a Intel BX chipset, before. The hardware people are willin to buy's been goin down hill since ... includin me -- Tom Brinkman Corpus Christi, Texas Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Saturday 25 Jan 2003 8:00 pm, wrote: Okay... I tried every trick in the book (and outside of it). And it is still a riddle. I just about took the entire machine apart again, put it back together with basically just the video card and the mainboard. No CDRom, no soundcard, no nothing. Standing upright it collapses within 15 minutes. Most of the time I only had to wait 1 or 2 minutes, which helped speed up the experiments. *wry grin* I tried every card combination, took the power supply apart (nothing strange in there), and still I come up with the same thing. At the moment the PC is on its side again and it runs. Since 5 minutes now, but I am confident that it will stay up. I am at my witt's end with this. Thanks for all the help and suggestions. I have the impression that this PC will remain on its side for the rest of its life, unless someone can come up with the ultimate solution. I just hope I can burn legible CD's with this setup, for backup reasons. There's only one solution, then. Pretend your tower was a desktop all along :) Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
In reply to Anne's mail, d.d. Sat, 25 Jan 2003 20:10:26 +: There's only one solution, then. Pretend your tower was a desktop all along :) Woohahahahaa!!! It is a tower with a bad back! ;) Thanks for the grin. Paul -- The more we live by our intellect, the less we understand the meaning of life. -Leo Tolstoy http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: moment the PC is on its side again and it runs. Since 5 minutes now, but I am confident that it will stay up. knowledge of your back broke desktop/tower contents would be helpful. if it is still running, i would suggest 3 possible problems to go after first. #1 = power supply: does fan stop? do you lose all voltages? #2 = heat: are you testing with covers on or off? do you have good air circulation? cpu have correct heat sink and fan? is memory over heating? does mainboard have heat sensors? #3 = harddisk: is drive new? if used, was it previously mounted flat or on side? if drive is flat and stops, flip upside down, still run? if drive on side and stops, flip to other side, still run? if drive is flat and stops, turn to side, still run? if drive on side and stops, turn to flat, still run? peace out. tc,hago. g . -- think green... save a tree, save a life, save time, save bandwidth, save storage. send email... text/plain - disable pgp/gpg/geek code attachments =+= if you are proud to be an american, then buy made in america. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
On Sun, 2003-01-26 at 11:56, g wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: moment the PC is on its side again and it runs. Since 5 minutes now, but I am confident that it will stay up. knowledge of your back broke desktop/tower contents would be helpful. if it is still running, i would suggest 3 possible problems to go after first. #1 = power supply: does fan stop? do you lose all voltages? #2 = heat: are you testing with covers on or off? do you have good air circulation? cpu have correct heat sink and fan? is memory over heating? does mainboard have heat sensors? #3 = harddisk: is drive new? if used, was it previously mounted flat or on side? if drive is flat and stops, flip upside down, still run? if drive on side and stops, flip to other side, still run? if drive is flat and stops, turn to side, still run? if drive on side and stops, turn to flat, still run? What if there is a mercury switch in either the PSU or somewhere within the casing itself that would cause this? -- Sun, 26 Jan 2003 12:20:00 +1100 12:20pm up 9 days, 22:03, 4 users, load average: 0.19, 0.17, 0.08 -- |____ | kuhn media australia| | / ,, /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | | .\__/ || | | |=| | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kuhn| | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | | ;/ / | | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389| | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU | -- linux user:267497 * RH 8.0 * PC/Mac/Linux/Networking/Consulting -- And if you wonder, What I am doing, As I am heading for the sink. I am spitting out all the bitterness, Along with half of my last drink. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
In reply to g's mail, d.d. Sun, 26 Jan 2003 00:56:31 +: knowledge of your back broke desktop/tower contents would be helpful. if it is still running, i would suggest 3 possible problems to go after first. #1 = power supply: does fan stop? No, it keeps going. do you lose all voltages? No. There is still power on the mainboard led and the leds of the network cards. #2 = heat: are you testing with covers on or off? Both. Same result. do you have good air circulation? cpu have correct heat sink and fan? Yes and yes. is memory over heating? No, it is not. I cannot imagine that it does. I can leave the PC off for 2 hours, which should be enough to cool off most parts. When I switch the PC on in the upright position (and refrain from smoking ;) it stops within 2 minutes. The hybernate led starts blinking and that's it. Which really is weird, since I have the BIOS set to never go into hybernate. does mainboard have heat sensors? Yes, they both show on LM Sensors (through Gkrellm). The CPU (Athlon 1200) shows 78C (149F) and something else shows 29.2C (75.5F). I am not sure if I set the multiplier readings in Gkrellm correctly, but this is what I also could see (plus or minus a few degrees) when then machine was still upright. So no change there. #3 = harddisk: is drive new? if used, was it previously mounted flat or on side? The drives (2 x 30Gb ata100) came with the system. It is a little over 1.5 years old now. The drives previously were mounted flat, now they are on the side. if drive is flat and stops, flip upside down, still run? if drive on side and stops, flip to other side, still run? if drive is flat and stops, turn to side, still run? if drive on side and stops, turn to flat, still run? I'd have to try these out sometime. I'll let you know. Thanks for the ideas. Paul think green... save a tree, save a life, save time, save bandwidth, save storage. send email... text/plain - disable pgp/gpg/geek code attachments I like this!!! :-) -- Never lend books -- nobody ever returns them; the only books I have in my library are those which people have lent me. -Anatole France http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT Hardware weirdness 2
In reply to Stephen's mail, d.d. 26 Jan 2003 12:21:17 +1100: What if there is a mercury switch in either the PSU or somewhere within the casing itself that would cause this? I have been thinking about this also, but I have not been able to find a switch like that. More and more I feel that this is a faulty contact/connector or something. I booted from a floppy and carefully started fiddling with the power cables to try and track a broken/nearly broken one. No luck there either. (Uptime now, PC still on the side, is 11.33 hours...) Paul -- Never lend books -- nobody ever returns them; the only books I have in my library are those which people have lent me. -Anatole France http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
Paul, Is your graphics card seated correctly, no access weight on it, monitor cord not pulling on it while upright? Same with cpu not got a large fan on it which the clips are not in correctly? Tony. -Original Message- From: Paul [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 3:30 PM To: newbie Subject: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness Hello all, Forgive this OT post, but can someone point me into the right direction? My PC is going nuts. When it is upright, it won't boot properly (powers off immediately after switching it on). When it lies on the side, the system keeps running without a problem when switched on. Already had the entire internals apart and back together again, to no avail. What can be wrong here??? I tried all I can think of. Thanks. Paul -- We must believe in luck. For how else can we explain the success of those we don't like? -Jean Cocteau http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- Business Computer Projects - Disclaimer -+-+-+-+-+-+-+- This message, and any associated attachment is confidential. If you have received it in error, please delete it from your system, do not use or disclose the information in any way, and notify either Tony S. Sykes or the postmaster mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] immediately. The contents of this message may contain personal views which are not necessarily the views of Business Computer Projects Ltd., unless specifically stated. Whilst every effort has been made to ensure that emails and their attachments are virus free, it is the responsibility of the recipient(s) to verify the integrity of such emails. Business Computer Projects Ltd BCP House 151 Charles Street Stockport Cheshire SK1 3JY Tel: +44 (0)161 355-3000 Fax: +44 (0)161 355-3001 Web: http://www.bcpsoftware.com http://www.bcpsoftware.com/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
On Friday 24 Jan 2003 3:29 pm, Paul wrote: Hello all, Forgive this OT post, but can someone point me into the right direction? My PC is going nuts. When it is upright, it won't boot properly (powers off immediately after switching it on). When it lies on the side, the system keeps running without a problem when switched on. Already had the entire internals apart and back together again, to no avail. What can be wrong here??? I tried all I can think of. Um, can't even begin to think of a reason, other than a loose connection somewhere. If you've looked at all the internals, maybe there's a probelm with the power cable? But tell me, just why on earth did you try booting it on its side??! Or was it just an accident? David -- Registered Linux User #207521 The only reason some people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory. (Paul Fix) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
On Friday 24 Jan 2003 4:05 pm, David Robertson wrote: On Friday 24 Jan 2003 3:29 pm, Paul wrote: Hello all, Forgive this OT post, but can someone point me into the right direction? My PC is going nuts. When it is upright, it won't boot properly (powers off immediately after switching it on). When it lies on the side, the system keeps running without a problem when switched on. Already had the entire internals apart and back together again, to no avail. What can be wrong here??? I tried all I can think of. Um, can't even begin to think of a reason, other than a loose connection somewhere. If you've looked at all the internals, maybe there's a probelm with the power cable? But tell me, just why on earth did you try booting it on its side??! Or was it just an accident? Don't you do that when you're checking on hardware jobs you've just done? I always do before righting it and closing the case. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
On Friday 24 Jan 2003 4:25 pm, Anne Wilson wrote: Don't you do that when you're checking on hardware jobs you've just done? I always do before righting it and closing the case. Anne Well, no. but maybe that's because I'm not a computer professional! I'm a gynaecologist, actually. Might be worth trying with some of my patients.. David -- Registered Linux User #207521 The only reason some people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory. (Paul Fix) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
In reply to David's mail, d.d. Fri, 24 Jan 2003 16:05:24 +: Um, can't even begin to think of a reason, other than a loose connection somewhere. If you've looked at all the internals, maybe there's a probelm with the power cable? I suspect some loose connection 'somewhere'. The stranger it becomes: when the thing shuts down, there is still power (led on mainboard stays on as do the leds on both NICs). But tell me, just why on earth did you try booting it on its side??! Or was it just an accident? Yes, that happened by accident. I got up and accidentally leaned on the side of the machine and 'click'. And it is still running (uptime 22 hrs). This PC is over 1.5 years old and the problems only started some months ago... That beats and bites. Thanks for the tips Paul -- We must believe in luck. For how else can we explain the success of those we don't like? -Jean Cocteau http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
- Original Message - From: Anne Wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 24, 2003 4:38 PM Subject: Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness On Friday 24 Jan 2003 4:32 pm, David Robertson wrote: On Friday 24 Jan 2003 4:25 pm, Anne Wilson wrote: Don't you do that when you're checking on hardware jobs you've just done? I always do before righting it and closing the case. Anne Well, no. but maybe that's because I'm not a computer professional! I'm a gynaecologist, actually. Might be worth trying with some of my patients.. Somehow, I can see the similarity g Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Only a woman could get away with saying that.. Margot Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
In reply to et's mail, d.d. Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:41:39 -0500: describe further... the pci cards sit horzontal and mother board vertical, when you say When it lies on the side. and when you say it won't boot properly (powers off immediately after switching it on) does power off mean no ac at all? no lights? That is the weird part. There still is power. The indicator led on the mainboard is still on. It is as if the system goes into sleep/hybernate/standby immediately. is all the mem modules all the way down, no cards touching at all?. I would There is only 1 256Mb DIMM in there, I reseated that yesterday. Should be okay. remove all unneeded cards (leave only vid card) and see if the problem went away, adding one card at a time untill probelm repeats. also consider I will give that a go as soon as I have time for it. Good idea, thanks. the power supply may be about to be replaced It was replaced about 3/4 years ago when the original one died (fan stopped running, nearly overheating the power supply, thank the gods for Gkrellm and lm-sensors). I may take that one out and reseat it also. Thanks everyone, for the help. I really appreciate it. Paul -- We must believe in luck. For how else can we explain the success of those we don't like? -Jean Cocteau http://nlpagan.net - Linux by Mandrake - Sylpheed by Hiro Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: hardware weirdness
On Sat, 2003-01-25 at 02:29, Paul wrote: Hello all, Forgive this OT post, but can someone point me into the right direction? My PC is going nuts. When it is upright, it won't boot properly (powers off immediately after switching it on). When it lies on the side, the system keeps running without a problem when switched on. Already had the entire internals apart and back together again, to no avail. What can be wrong here??? I tried all I can think of. Thanks. Paul Could be that you have a side-winding hard drive. Actually, could be on the way out. If you have the drive sitting in any other position than the one that works, and it chokes and pukes, there is a problem with the heads in the drive. Try a different hard drive - you might find that no matter what position you put your case, it will work (with a different drive). Cheese! (sorry, Cheers!) -- Sat, 25 Jan 2003 07:30:00 +1100 7:30am up 8 days, 17:13, 6 users, load average: 0.00, 0.07, 0.17 -- |____ | kuhn media australia| | / ,, /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | | .\__/ || | | |=| | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kuhn| | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | | ;/ / | | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389| | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU | -- linux user:267497 * RH 8.0 * PC/Mac/Linux/Networking/Consulting -- I go on working for the same reason a hen goes on laying eggs. -- H.L. Mencken Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael -- Sridhar Dhanapalan [Yama | http://www.pclinuxonline.com/] Microsoft has knowingly and willfully concealed information regarding security flaws in computer hardware from the [National Security Agency] out of fear that revealing such flaws would reduce the number of copies of its products that would be purchased by the government... I have raised this issue internally with Microsoft, and in return have been the subject of both bribes and threats. -- Ed Curry, Computer Security Specialist, in a letter to US Defence Secretary William Coen Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
Thanks Sridhar, good to see you are still lurking here. Your occassional advice has been invaluable from time to time. On Fri, 10 Jan 2003 02:42, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
On Fri, 2003-01-10 at 00:42, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael Maybe they're trying to say that linux runs on a wider variety of hardware than does Microsloth? Maybe they're just trying to prove that linux users are going to find out the information they need anyways - with or without the help of ZDnet? (Wow - ZDnet ain't gonna help me no mo! Oh, woe is me!) NOT!! -- Fri Jan 10 06:45:00 EST 2003 6:45am up 20:27, 5 users, load average: 0.10, 0.20, 0.30 -- |____ | kuhn media australia| | / ,, /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | | .\__/ || | | |=| | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kuhn| | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | | ;/ / | | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389| | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU | -- * linux user:267497 * RH 7.3+ * PC/Mac/Linux/Networking/Consulting -- I have a rock garden. Last week three of them died. -- Richard Diran Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
On Thursday 09 January 2003 01:42 pm, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael Welcome back, Sridhar ! - Missed you. === Powered by Linux- Mandrake 9.0 Registered Linux user # 214073 at http://counter.li.org Source : my 100 % Microsoft-free personal computer. === Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
Sridhar: Are you aware of another Linux HCL? I sometimes refer to the Mandrake list, but sometimes its a good idea to get a second opinion. -- cmg On Thursday 09 January 2003 08:42 am, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database
I visited the zdnet hardware database at http://lhd.zdnet.com/ around Christmas and found that it had been hacked. Instead of the very helpful database (which I referred to a lot), there was a pic of a mostly nekkid lady plus the usual w3 r l33t h@x0rz language below it. Afterwards, the site seemed to go back and forth for a while between being completely down and being just a blank page, and now seems to be just plain gone. If the site was actually hosted on a MS server then perhaps it was just poetic justice, but if it was a Linux server... :( Try http://www.linuxhardware.org/. Content is a little lean right now, but hopefully it will get better. And of course Mandrake, Redhat, and Suse each maintain their own hardware compatability lists. Sincerely, Jim Hubbard .--. |o_o | |:_/ | // \ \ (| | ) /'\_ _/`\ \___)=(___/ Rockingham County Linux Users Group www.rock.lug.net -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Carroll Grigsby Sent: Thursday, January 09, 2003 8:13 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [newbie] Linux Hardware Database Sridhar: Are you aware of another Linux HCL? I sometimes refer to the Mandrake list, but sometimes its a good idea to get a second opinion. -- cmg On Thursday 09 January 2003 08:42 am, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Microsoft Apologist (and ZDNet editor) David Berlind took it down a while ago. On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 23:33:58 +1300, Michael Adams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Has the ZDNet database moved or is it just down for two days now? -- Michael Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sunday 29 Dec 2002 10:03 pm, Anne Wilson wrote: Till then I leave you with the thought that like any hardware or compy junky, I tried? :) Thx for saving me the trouble of ripping my pink hair out. Well, I've just wasted another day, trying to revive a dodo :) Some of us don't know when to give up. But then I didn't give up - and the dodo lives again! Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sunday 29 Dec 2002 3:52 am, Joeb wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:38:55 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 06:06 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Besides the label (watt listing or model )or your comp manual, if it is a pre-built system, you could use a voltage meter to check the output. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? The form factor is different. They are made to fix different case types, through there are some that are supposedly usable in either. Charles hm ... volt meter... i think we have one.. and b/f is very good @ electronics. I asked about the AT/X thing cause this mobo is bizarre. It accepts both factors. And I have a 250 watt P/S case available...and if the original p/s that came with the comp is underpowered I'll just use the ATX 250 watter. - FemmeFatale Using the ATX power supply may not work for you. Even though the board may accept either one (I've got a board like that), the power switch on the case won't! Most likely, the power switch is a mechanical switch that actually has wires from the power supply going to it. ATX power supplies don't have these power wires, instead the momentary contact switch used as the power switch goes to the system board (that's why many ATX power supplies have a physical on/off switch on the power supply itself). Unfortunately, without the momentary switch, you won't be able to turn the computer on/off. This sounds like an older system. What are you trying to run that you don't thing the 250 watts will be enough? Joeb I've come to this rather late, but since I've had one of these boards, I'll add my 2p worth :) On a board that old it's unlikely that you have peripherals that would need a higher power supply. I would say that there is a very high chance that Joeb is right, and ATX won't work, though it wouldn't be a problem to try it. I did, got nowhere, and switched it back to AT power supply without causing any problem. ATX of course supports more power handling capability, but I agree with Joeb that the likely cause of problems is because the case is wired for mechanical on/off. Even the 4-second delay for power off didn't work on mine. HTH Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
snip Hehe, but I like the experiment! It sounded fun! :( Party pooper... K i'll play safe look where you suggest... Sigh... Can I at least play in my room Dad? snip Try eggs in a microwave then - safeish but VERY messy *G* Best if you paint faces of Bill M$ on them first. I thought it had been decided that the only expperment worth microwaving was old CDs. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 09:17 AM 12/29/2002 +, you wrote: I've come to this rather late, but since I've had one of these boards, I'll add my 2p worth :) On a board that old it's unlikely that you have peripherals that would need a higher power supply. I would say that there is a very high chance that Joeb is right, and ATX won't work, though it wouldn't be a problem to try it. I did, got nowhere, and switched it back to AT power supply without causing any problem. ATX of course supports more power handling capability, but I agree with Joeb that the likely cause of problems is because the case is wired for mechanical on/off. Even the 4-second delay for power off didn't work on mine. HTH Anne Well your opinion totally screwed killed the pooch on that one Anne. Thx. I'll be calling the SPCA shortly. Till then I leave you with the thought that like any hardware or compy junky, I tried? :) Thx for saving me the trouble of ripping my pink hair out. - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sunday 29 Dec 2002 9:01 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: At 09:17 AM 12/29/2002 +, you wrote: I've come to this rather late, but since I've had one of these boards, I'll add my 2p worth :) On a board that old it's unlikely that you have peripherals that would need a higher power supply. I would say that there is a very high chance that Joeb is right, and ATX won't work, though it wouldn't be a problem to try it. I did, got nowhere, and switched it back to AT power supply without causing any problem. ATX of course supports more power handling capability, but I agree with Joeb that the likely cause of problems is because the case is wired for mechanical on/off. Even the 4-second delay for power off didn't work on mine. HTH Anne Well your opinion totally screwed killed the pooch on that one Anne. Thx. I'll be calling the SPCA shortly. Till then I leave you with the thought that like any hardware or compy junky, I tried? :) Thx for saving me the trouble of ripping my pink hair out. Well, I've just wasted another day, trying to revive a dodo :) Some of us don't know when to give up. Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage(Watts?) of a P/S
On Sun, 2002-12-29 at 09:50, FemmeFatale wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale One of the more simple ways of finding the wattage of a power supply is to do the following: 1.) Stand on a linoleum floor that is excessively wet - if the lino is not wet, pour approximately 10 litres of water on the floor to make it the necessary wetness. 2.) Plant your bare feet solidly on the wet lino. 3.) Plug in the power supply, and turn it on - you'll know it's on when the little fan starts going round and round 4.) Using a handy dandy butter knife, jab forcefully into the little vents along the side of the power supply. 5.) Once you make contact with a delicate open contact point, you'll be able to gauge the amount of watts by the distance you are thrown. As per the following: 60 watts - 2 meters 100 watts - 5 meters 150 watts - 10 meters 200 watts - 15 meters ...and so on... Actually, the easiest way is probably to get the part ID and surf the net for it...saves butter knives... -- Sun Dec 29 09:55:00 EST 2002 9:55am up 15:33, 6 users, load average: 0.28, 0.27, 0.48 -- |____ | kuhn media australia| | / ,, /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | | .\__/ || | | |=| | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kuhn| | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | | ;/ / | | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389| | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU | -- * linux user:267497 * RH 7.3+ * PC/Mac/Linux/Networking/Consulting -- Reality continues to ruin my life. -- Calvin Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 05:52 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700, you wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci Dumb question, I'm sure, Femme, but did you look at the PS itself? Usually there's a sticker on it of some kind. not dumb at all... heh maybe I wasn't clear. Good friend (PC Guru works in IT) says PS units are often mislabelled as to their power. I tend to believe that to be possible...well I checked for a sticker... nada. So ... that leaves some way of determining it by myself. That clearer? :) - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 06:06 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Besides the label (watt listing or model )or your comp manual, if it is a pre-built system, you could use a voltage meter to check the output. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? The form factor is different. They are made to fix different case types, through there are some that are supposedly usable in either. Charles hm ... volt meter... i think we have one.. and b/f is very good @ electronics. I asked about the AT/X thing cause this mobo is bizarre. It accepts both factors. And I have a 250 watt P/S case available...and if the original p/s that came with the comp is underpowered I'll just use the ATX 250 watter. - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Saturday 28 December 2002 05:50 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Generally the model number will have the wattage embedded in it. For example: Model ATX-350-12V The 350 is the wattage. Usually the power is equal to the current times the voltage. You have to watch what you are using on this. As the power supply robs Peter to pay Paul. My supply (which is the model above) has 12V at 15Amps max and 5V at 35 Amps max .. (12*15)+(5*35) = 355 watts. (Generally, this is what you can use to roughly determine what the wattage of the supply). It also shows 3.3v at 20A and -5V at .5AMPS and and -12V at .5AMPS (3.3*20)+(5*.5)+(12*.5)= 72.25 This would give a total wattage as 427Watts but remember the rob Peter to pay Paul. The supply cannot supply all of the voltages at the max current as it will blow a fuse. Now, have I thoroughly confused the issue. David -- -- ( )_( ) ( OO ) ( ) o Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:36:48 -0700, you wrote: At 05:52 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700, you wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci Dumb question, I'm sure, Femme, but did you look at the PS itself? Usually there's a sticker on it of some kind. not dumb at all... heh maybe I wasn't clear. Good friend (PC Guru works in IT) says PS units are often mislabelled as to their power. I tend to believe that to be possible...well I checked for a sticker... nada. So ... that leaves some way of determining it by myself. That clearer? :) Clear. ;-) - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert peace, Rog For every fatal shooting, there were roughly three non-fatal shootings. And folks, this is unacceptable in America. It's just unacceptable. And we're going to do something about it. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 06:44 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 05:50 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Generally the model number will have the wattage embedded in it. For example: Model ATX-350-12V The 350 is the wattage. Yay! Thx that worked :) Heh now to figure out if I should bother with the 250Watt ATX Or leave it at AT 220 W? any suggestions?? its a pII 200 I believe... or 233... Not sure offhand. And will serve files (Mp3's from ftp/apache, possibly serve as some sort of firewall... depending... i have a router... and um.. not much else). So which size of PS do I need offhand do you think? - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Saturday 28 December 2002 07:15 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: At 06:44 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 05:50 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Generally the model number will have the wattage embedded in it. For example: Model ATX-350-12V The 350 is the wattage. Yay! Thx that worked :) Heh now to figure out if I should bother with the 250Watt ATX Or leave it at AT 220 W? any suggestions?? its a pII 200 I believe... or 233... Not sure offhand. And will serve files (Mp3's from ftp/apache, possibly serve as some sort of firewall... depending... i have a router... and um.. not much else). So which size of PS do I need offhand do you think? - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Depends on what you are doing with it. Outside of the CPU, the most current draw will be the disk drives and the new ones draw very little power. Of course a high powered graphics accelerator will draw a lot of power, but I assume that doesn't apply here. Lots of memory will be negligible also. I used to have a 233MHZ pentium, so-so graphics card, 2 five and 1/4 inch hard drives, 1-floppy and a CDROM on a 220Watt supply. David -- -- ( )_( ) ( OO ) ( ) o Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 07:23 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 07:15 pm, FemmeFatale wrote: Depends on what you are doing with it. Outside of the CPU, the most current draw will be the disk drives and the new ones draw very little power. Of course a high powered graphics accelerator will draw a lot of power, but I assume that doesn't apply here. Lots of memory will be negligible also. I used to have a 233MHZ pentium, so-so graphics card, 2 five and 1/4 inch hard drives, 1-floppy and a CDROM on a 220Watt supply. David k well that answers that question. Hm.. now all I need to figure out is if i'm too lazy to switch it to a diff box...or not... :D Thx luv. You've been a big help :) - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Saturday 28 December 2002 23:06, Charles A Edwards wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Besides the label (watt listing or model )or your comp manual, if it is a pre-built system, you could use a voltage meter to check the output. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? The form factor is different. They are made to fix different case types, through there are some that are supposedly usable in either. Charles Get hold of portable property. -- Charles Dickens, Great Expectations -- Mandrake Linux 9.1 Kernel- 2.4.20-2mdk -- Plenty of info on the net ... safer than speculation or butter knife experiments ;-) http://www.pcguide.com/ref/mbsys/mobo/form.htm http://www.webopedia.com/ http://whatis.techtarget.com/ -- Derek Byram [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux user 264346 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Saturday 28 December 2002 05:50 pm, you wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Hard to tell without delving into the innards. The rating is supposed to be assigned dependant on the capability of the components. (Regulator chip and or output transisters.) Can't check it with meters because the rating is capability, not necessarily what you are asking of it. Basically, the bigger the heat sinks, fans, and output components, the higher the rating. (ability to dissipate heat) Lot's of ways to cheat. Lee -- Registered Linux user #223705 Give me ambiguity or give me something else. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 09:52 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 05:50 pm, you wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Thx. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? Merci - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Hard to tell without delving into the innards. The rating is supposed to be assigned dependant on the capability of the components. (Regulator chip and or output transisters.) Can't check it with meters because the rating is capability, not necessarily what you are asking of it. Basically, the bigger the heat sinks, fans, and output components, the higher the rating. (ability to dissipate heat) Lot's of ways to cheat. Lee I found it thx. Person on this list gave me the mysterious way to tell by reading some numbers embedded beside letters. Heh, merci for advice though. - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 01:59 AM 12/29/2002 +, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 23:06, Charles A Edwards wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Besides the label (watt listing or model )or your comp manual, if it is a pre-built system, you could use a voltage meter to check the output. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? The form factor is different. They are made to fix different case types, through there are some that are supposedly usable in either. Charles Get hold of portable property. -- Charles Dickens, Great Expectations -- Mandrake Linux 9.1 Kernel- 2.4.20-2mdk -- Plenty of info on the net ... safer than speculation or butter knife experiments ;-) http://www.pcguide.com/ref/mbsys/mobo/form.htm http://www.webopedia.com/ http://whatis.techtarget.com/ Hehe, but I like the experiment! It sounded fun! :( Party pooper... K i'll play safe look where you suggest... Sigh... Can I at least play in my room Dad? - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sunday 29 December 2002 02:39, FemmeFatale wrote: At 01:59 AM 12/29/2002 +, you wrote: On Saturday 28 December 2002 23:06, Charles A Edwards wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: SNIP there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? SNIP Plenty of info on the net ... safer than speculation or butter knife experiments ;-) http://www.pcguide.com/ref/mbsys/mobo/form.htm http://www.webopedia.com/ http://whatis.techtarget.com/ Hehe, but I like the experiment! It sounded fun! :( Party pooper... K i'll play safe look where you suggest... Sigh... Can I at least play in my room Dad? - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert -- Derek Byram [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux user 264346 Try eggs in a microwave then - safeish but VERY messy *G* Best if you paint faces of Bill M$ on them first. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:38:55 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 06:06 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 15:50:00 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject says it all... any ideas besides reading a label? Besides the label (watt listing or model )or your comp manual, if it is a pre-built system, you could use a voltage meter to check the output. Oh Is there any diff between AT ATX P/S's? The form factor is different. They are made to fix different case types, through there are some that are supposedly usable in either. Charles hm ... volt meter... i think we have one.. and b/f is very good @ electronics. I asked about the AT/X thing cause this mobo is bizarre. It accepts both factors. And I have a 250 watt P/S case available...and if the original p/s that came with the comp is underpowered I'll just use the ATX 250 watter. - FemmeFatale Using the ATX power supply may not work for you. Even though the board may accept either one (I've got a board like that), the power switch on the case won't! Most likely, the power switch is a mechanical switch that actually has wires from the power supply going to it. ATX power supplies don't have these power wires, instead the momentary contact switch used as the power switch goes to the system board (that's why many ATX power supplies have a physical on/off switch on the power supply itself). Unfortunately, without the momentary switch, you won't be able to turn the computer on/off. This sounds like an older system. What are you trying to run that you don't thing the 250 watts will be enough? Joeb Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage (Watts?) of a P/S
At 09:52 PM 12/28/2002 -0600, you wrote: On Sat, 28 Dec 2002 16:38:55 -0700 FemmeFatale [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 06:06 PM 12/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: Using the ATX power supply may not work for you. Even though the board may accept either one (I've got a board like that), the power switch on the case won't! Most likely, the power switch is a mechanical switch that actually has wires from the power supply going to it. ATX power supplies don't have these power wires, instead the momentary contact switch used as the power switch goes to the system board (that's why many ATX power supplies have a physical on/off switch on the power supply itself). Unfortunately, without the momentary switch, you won't be able to turn the computer on/off. This sounds like an older system. What are you trying to run that you don't thing the 250 watts will be enough? Joeb Nothing... Just wanted to get rid of another AT case if I can. I have 3 now, and am getting rid of 2 as soon as I can. Maybe someone in Edmonton wants em? Cause I sure don't. :) - FemmeFatale Good Decisions You boss Made: We'll do as you suggest and go with Linux. I've always liked that character from Peanuts. - Source: Dilbert Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] strange hardware question .. how to tell the Wattage(Watts?) of a P/S
On Sun, 2002-12-29 at 15:56, FemmeFatale wrote: Nothing... Just wanted to get rid of another AT case if I can. I have 3 now, and am getting rid of 2 as soon as I can. Maybe someone in Edmonton wants em? Cause I sure don't. :) - FemmeFatale Too bad y'all don't wanna send 'em here to convictland...need more cases to mod !! -- Sun Dec 29 16:20:00 EST 2002 4:20pm up 21:58, 6 users, load average: 0.45, 0.43, 0.32 -- |____ | kuhn media australia| | / ,, /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | | .\__/ || | | |=| | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kuhn| | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]| | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | | ;/ / | | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389| | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU | -- * linux user:267497 * RH 7.3+ * PC/Mac/Linux/Networking/Consulting -- Increased sunspot activity. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] laptop hardware question (sorry)
On Sunday 08 December 2002 00:02, Andrei Raevsky wrote: Hi, This is somewhat an illegitimate question, as it deals with hardware and not with linux per se. However, since there are quite a few helpful folks around here, and since my laptop runs Mandrake 9, I dare this breach of etiquette: I was given an old Quantex N30W-15 (on which Mandrake 9 runs without any problems, by the way - except for the Winmodem which one can easily fix with the RPMs available on the Linmodem.org site). It runs on a BAT30WL Lithium Ion Battery (rated 11.1V-4800mAh). I used my laptop at home 99% of the time so I do not need to run it on batteries. How should I best use this battery? Should I keep it plugged in and constanting charging, should I always use it on battery and thereby empty the battery daily, or is there anything else I should do to maximize my battery's life? Thanks in advance for your advice and sorry for the off-topic question, Andrei Every time you charge a Li-ion battery you shorten it's life (i.e. the uptime) a little. Taking it out and unloading and loading it every once in a while (monthly or so) will keep it in shape for years to come. Good luck, HarM Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] laptop hardware question (sorry)
Hi, Ok. But does keeping my laptop with the battery inside CONSTANTILY connected to the power outlet qualify as recharging or not (since the battery does not really discharge the battery to being with, right?). Thanks, Andrei Every time you charge a Li-ion battery you shorten it's life (i.e. the uptime) a little. Taking it out and unloading and loading it every once in a while (monthly or so) will keep it in shape for years to come. Good luck, HarM Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com _ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] laptop hardware question (sorry)
On Tuesday 10 December 2002 16:53, Andrei Raevsky wrote: Hi, Ok. But does keeping my laptop with the battery inside CONSTANTILY connected to the power outlet qualify as recharging or not (since the battery does not really discharge the battery to being with, right?). Thanks, Andrei Usually, yes! when the voltage goes down it recharges immediately, thus decreasing the life span. Depending a little on what sort of charger it's using it might even start to push the voltage up to a higher level creating all sorts of problems. Especially older types of batteries are hard to come by. I even once built my own for a compaq contura using plain Ni-cadmium rechargeables:o) So take good care if it. Good Luck, HarM Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] laptop hardware question (sorry)
On Sunday 08 Dec 2002 H:02 am, Andrei Raevsky wrote: Hi, This is somewhat an illegitimate question, as it deals with hardware and not with linux per se. However, since there are quite a few helpful folks around here, and since my laptop runs Mandrake 9, I dare this breach of etiquette: I was given an old Quantex N30W-15 (on which Mandrake 9 runs without any problems, by the way - except for the Winmodem which one can easily fix with the RPMs available on the Linmodem.org site). It runs on a BAT30WL Lithium Ion Battery (rated 11.1V-4800mAh). I used my laptop at home 99% of the time so I do not need to run it on batteries. How should I best use this battery? Should I keep it plugged in and constanting charging, should I always use it on battery and thereby empty the battery daily, or is there anything else I should do to maximize my battery's life? Thanks in advance for your advice and sorry for the off-topic question, Andrei Have a look at this http://www.mbi.panasonic.co.jp/oembatteries/english/e_ion/out_eion/atteion.htm -- http://www.poogle.co.uk Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] laptop hardware question (sorry)
On Sun, 2002-12-08 at 11:02, Andrei Raevsky wrote: Hi, This is somewhat an illegitimate question, as it deals with hardware and not with linux per se. However, since there are quite a few helpful folks around here, and since my laptop runs Mandrake 9, I dare this breach of etiquette: I was given an old Quantex N30W-15 (on which Mandrake 9 runs without any problems, by the way - except for the Winmodem which one can easily fix with the RPMs available on the Linmodem.org site). It runs on a BAT30WL Lithium Ion Battery (rated 11.1V-4800mAh). I used my laptop at home 99% of the time so I do not need to run it on batteries. How should I best use this battery? Should I keep it plugged in and constanting charging, should I always use it on battery and thereby empty the battery daily, or is there anything else I should do to maximize my battery's life? Thanks in advance for your advice and sorry for the off-topic question, Andrei Just about once a month, discharge the batter completely and let it recharge - that should keep it alive for longer...(at least that's what we used to do at MCI) -- Sun Dec 8 11:10:00 EST 2002 11:10am up 13:08, 4 users, load average: 1.04, 0.82, 0.74 .o0 linux user:267497 0o. |____ | kühn media australia | / \ /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | .\__/ || | | | | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kühn | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | ;/ / | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389 | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU Coralament*Best Grötens*Liebe Grüße*Best Regards*Elkorajn Salutojn Remind me not to fix mtrr.c after half a litre of wine in future. - Alan Cox Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
On Tue, 2002-11-26 at 05:52, FemmeFatale wrote: Duct tape. It solves everything. Or so says my friend Red Green *Smiles innocently* --- Femme Even dating problems? -- Wed Nov 27 07:30:00 EST 2002 .o0 linux user:267497 0o. |____ | kühn media australia | / \ /| |'-. | http://kma.0catch.com | .\__/ || | | | | _ / `._ \|_|_.-' | stephen kühn | | / \__.`=._) (_ | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | |/ ._/ || | email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] | |'. `\ | | |icq: 5483808 | ;/ / | | | | smk ) /_/| |.---.| | mobile: 0410-728-389 | ' `-`' | Berkeley, New South Wales, AU Coralament*Best Grötens*Liebe Grüße*Best Regards*Elkorajn Salutojn By golly, I'm beginning to think Linux really *is* the best thing since sliced bread. (By Vance Petree, Virginia Power) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie-it] hardware
Alle 22:54, domenica 24 novembre 2002, hai scritto: Alle 18:13, domenica 24 novembre 2002, masco ha scritto: praticamente il masterizzatore viene visto contemporaneamente come lettore ATAPI/IDE...e come SCSI come posso sistemare le cose vedendo sia il masterizzatore come SCSI sia il lettore crd-8322B come scasi ed eliminando le altre voci in /etc/lilo.conf hai una roga che inizia con 'append' e chiama una associazione risorsa-dispositivo supponiamo che tu abbia il masterizzatore come secondary-master quindi hdc avrai una hdc=ide-scsi ora, se il cd è il primary-slave aggiungi hdb=ide-scsi salva e ricarica lilo al riavvio anche il cdrom verrà visto come scsi a questo punto dovrai correggere /etc/fstab rimuovendo le chiamate ai cd relative a hdc e hdb e correggendole in scd0 e scd1 più o meno così (okkio dipende da come li hai collegati, fai due controlli...) /dev/scd0 /mnt/cdrom auto users,iocharset=iso8859-15,exec,codepage=850,ro,noauto 0 0 /dev/scd1 /mnt/master auto users,iocharset=iso8859-15,exec,codepage=850,ro,noauto 0 0 se usi supermount, saranno leggermente diversi (usa i tuoi attuali come esempio...) il fatto che vengano visti sia come eide che come scsi , dipende dal supporto ai cd eide del kernel, per non farli vedere *anche* come eide potresti rimuoverlo, ma non hai nessun fastidio a lasciare tutto come è.. grazie a chi mi può dare una mano mario bye miKe _Grazie mille a Fabio e a Mike Mario __ Slackware 8.1 GNU/Linux 2.4.19 @ hp Xe3 R.U.#219755 - S.R.U.#705 - R.M.#110932
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
Dennis Myers wrote: On Sunday 24 November 2002 05:26 pm, Paul wrote: Hi all, I know this is off topic, but perhaps a hardware guru has a tip for me. Usually my PC is on and running 24/7. This weekend I switched it off (friday) because I went to London. This evening (Sunday) I switched it on again. Somewhere in POST, it switched off and a led started blinking as if it had gone into sleep-mode or something like that. After a restart, boot went into Mandrake boot and during load of postfix it switched off again. This repeated about 12 times, each time in a different place. Also, at least 4 times, the CMOS CPU speed setting was wrong (900 instead of 1200 Mhz). Very worrying was when the PC switched off during fsck-ing a partition. (Of course, partitions get bashed when the system powers down during boot.) The last boot (clearly) worked, although it took over half an hour to check all partitions (some EXT2, some EXT3). Who has a clue what could trigger this weird hardware behaviour? Thanks, Paul This is a wild guess, but check your RAM it could be going to the dark side. HTH You say your computer is on 24/7 , then it's not really suprizing that it took you half an hour to complete fsck, after all you're doing something the equivelant to defragging your filesystem. I think that is also a clue to your second problem, since fsck takes resource, there's a lot of numbercrunching to do, I guess you overloaded it. I , like you, tend to leave my computer on much of the time but I take the opportunity when convenient to reboot just to get regular fsck's, otherwise you build up a bigger and bigger job when you do. I bet you go in and out of your spare partitions as well so they will have to be fsck 'ed , and the computer counts the number of times you access these partitions too. No, I don't think you have anything wrong, it's just the system's way of telling you to do it more often, that's all. John -- John Richard Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
On Monday 25 Nov 2002 9:19 am, Paul wrote: In reply to Spencer's mail, d.d. Sun, 24 Nov 2002 16:18:47 -0800: again. Somewhere in POST, it switched off and a led started blinking as if it had gone into sleep-mode or something like that. After a restart, boot went into Mandrake boot and during load of postfix it switched off Change your cpu fan. It's starting to give up the ghost;-) Hi Spencer, Somehow I do not think it is the fan. This happened while the machine and the room it is in were rather cold. The PC switched off after being 'up' for only 30 seconds. Thanks for the idea though. Paul I have known a couple of computers that will not start first time (and sometime a few more times) after a cold night. Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
There could be several possibilities, some already listed here and more that could be thought up. It may not be important to worry about it, Paul. Assuming that you are doing regular backups and continue to run the computer 24/7, I would just let it be. My NT 4.0 server use to do this to me once in a while when it had been several months since shutting down, and I had let it go cold before booting up. My server is old stuff, so I am sure that it was waking up like I do every morning, feeling my age and creaking a bit here and there. :-) It would be more a concern if you now notice anything new happening, idiosyncrasies or problems, that weren't there before you shutdown. That's when I would definitely run tests on the hardware to make sure that the shutdown wasn't trying to tell you of impending doom. That's how I would handle it, for now. T - Original Message - From: Paul [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi all, I know this is off topic, but perhaps a hardware guru has a tip for me. Usually my PC is on and running 24/7. This weekend I switched it off (friday) because I went to London. This evening (Sunday) I switched it on again. Somewhere in POST, it switched off and a led started blinking as if it had gone into sleep-mode or something like that. After a restart, boot went into Mandrake boot and during load of postfix it switched off again. This repeated about 12 times, each time in a different place. Also, at least 4 times, the CMOS CPU speed setting was wrong (900 instead of 1200 Mhz). Very worrying was when the PC switched off during fsck-ing a partition. (Of course, partitions get bashed when the system powers down during boot.) The last boot (clearly) worked, although it took over half an hour to check all partitions (some EXT2, some EXT3). Who has a clue what could trigger this weird hardware behaviour? Thanks, Paul Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
In reply to John's mail, d.d. Mon, 25 Nov 2002 11:20:53 +: Hi John, I am not worried about the time it took to complete the fsck. After all, when I do a normal reboot, after 15 or so of these, it also takes that long. My main problem is that the computer won't start up regularly after being switched off for a while. I thought it might be the backup battery on the mainboard that is playing up (since the cpu speed is messed up) but then the rest of the settings remain fine. opportunity when convenient to reboot just to get regular fsck's, otherwise you build up a bigger and bigger job when you do. I bet you go in and out of your spare partitions as well so they will have to be fsck 'ed , and the computer counts the number of times you access these partitions too. No, I don't think you have anything wrong, it's just the system's way of telling you to do it more often, that's all. I tend to reboot the machine every week, just for security's sake. And to avoid unnecessary checking. Thanks for the info, anyway :) Paul -- Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent perspiration. -Thomas Alva Edison http://nlpagan.net-Linux Mandrake 8.2 - Sylpheed 0.8.6 Help Microsoft combat software piracy: give Linux to a friend today! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
In reply to Technoslick's mail, d.d. Mon, 25 Nov 2002 08:02:53 -0500: There could be several possibilities, some already listed here and more that could be thought up. It may not be important to worry about it, Paul. Assuming that you are doing regular backups and continue to run the Backups are holy on my computers :) computer 24/7, I would just let it be. My NT 4.0 server use to do this to me once in a while when it had been several months since shutting down, and I had let it go cold before booting up. My server is old stuff, so I am sure that it was waking up like I do every morning, feeling my age and creaking a bit here and there. :-) It would be more a concern if you now notice anything new happening, idiosyncrasies or problems, that weren't there before you shutdown. That's when I would definitely run tests on the hardware to make sure that the shutdown wasn't trying to tell you of impending doom. This machine is little over a year old and has not let me down since I got it (except for a busted fan in the power supply, which was fixed by a new power supply). The shut of the system went smooth as ever. As Anne said that she knows of more computers that do not want to start after a cold night, I will, for now, leave it at that. That my PC is just one of the tropically inclined ones *grin* (Thanks for that info, Anne!) Paul -- Genius is one percent inspiration and ninety-nine percent perspiration. -Thomas Alva Edison http://nlpagan.net-Linux Mandrake 8.2 - Sylpheed 0.8.6 Help Microsoft combat software piracy: give Linux to a friend today! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
On Monday 25 Nov 2002 4:36 pm, Paul wrote: As Anne said that she knows of more computers that do not want to start after a cold night, I will, for now, leave it at that. That my PC is just one of the tropically inclined ones *grin* (Thanks for that info, Anne!) My sister's pc is one of those that suffer from chilblains. I could only tell her to keep it as warm as she can. She has had no problems all summer, but as soon as it came colder again so have the problems Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
At 08:02 AM 11/25/2002 -0500, you wrote: There could be several possibilities, some already listed here and more that could be thought up. It may not be important to worry about it, Paul. Assuming that you are doing regular backups and continue to run the computer 24/7, I would just let it be. My NT 4.0 server use to do this to me once in a while when it had been several months since shutting down, and I had let it go cold before booting up. My server is old stuff, so I am sure that it was waking up like I do every morning, feeling my age and creaking a bit here and there. :-) It would be more a concern if you now notice anything new happening, idiosyncrasies or problems, that weren't there before you shutdown. That's when I would definitely run tests on the hardware to make sure that the shutdown wasn't trying to tell you of impending doom. That's how I would handle it, for now. T Duct tape. It solves everything. Or so says my friend Red Green *Smiles innocently* --- Femme Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
In reply to Technoslick's mail, d.d. Mon, 25 Nov 2002 16:37:37 -0500: have seen this happen when the core temperature of the box is maybe as high as 60 degrees F, or 15.5 degrees C. This is not a standard or a determined threshold by any means, just what I have noticed. Certainly, a drive that is spinning for weeks on end may find start-up from cold to be an issue. If you are set for a fast-boot in the BIOS, try changing it to a thorough one. I would be surprised if that change (if needed) didn't solve the problem. Now this is really hitting home. The temperature here in the room was still low, could well be around the 15C that you mention. Tonight I am going to set up this machine for a thorough post. And next time I shut it, I will see if that makes a difference. Thanks! Paul -- You are scrupulously honest, frank, and straightforward. Therefore you have few friends. http://nlpagan.net-Linux Mandrake 8.2 - Sylpheed 0.8.6 Help Microsoft combat software piracy: give Linux to a friend today! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: [newbie-it] hardware
Alle 18:13, domenica 24 novembre 2002, masco ha scritto: salute a tutti,volevo sapere come posso configurare bene il cd rom e il masterizzatoremi sono accorto che nel MCC alla voce lettori cdrom mi compaiono tre voci unknown crd-8322B dispositivo/dev/hdcATAPI/IDE unknown cd-writer+9100c dispositivo/dev/hdb/ATAPI/IDE Hp cd-writer+9100c dispositivo/dev/scd0.SCSI praticamente il masterizzatore viene visto contemporaneamente come lettore ATAPI/IDE...e come SCSI come posso sistemare le cose vedendo sia il masterizzatore come SCSI sia il lettore crd-8322B come scasi ed eliminando le altre voci grazie a chi mi può dare una mano mario E' tutto a posto; giustamente mcc vede sia il supporto fisico (ATAPI/IDE), sia l'emulazione scsi, che ti permette di utilizzare il masterizzatore. Per mettere in emulazione anche il cd-rom, ti rimando all'archivio della lista (la domanda è praticamente un HOW-TO. Uno spunto se ti va di arrivare per deduzione alla soluzione: dai un'occhiata a lilo.conf;-) Vale. -- - -- Fabio Manunza -- ## n° macchina 140545 ## -
Re: [newbie] OT: Hardware boot problems
On Sunday 24 November 2002 05:26 pm, Paul wrote: Hi all, I know this is off topic, but perhaps a hardware guru has a tip for me. Usually my PC is on and running 24/7. This weekend I switched it off (friday) because I went to London. This evening (Sunday) I switched it on again. Somewhere in POST, it switched off and a led started blinking as if it had gone into sleep-mode or something like that. After a restart, boot went into Mandrake boot and during load of postfix it switched off again. This repeated about 12 times, each time in a different place. Also, at least 4 times, the CMOS CPU speed setting was wrong (900 instead of 1200 Mhz). Very worrying was when the PC switched off during fsck-ing a partition. (Of course, partitions get bashed when the system powers down during boot.) The last boot (clearly) worked, although it took over half an hour to check all partitions (some EXT2, some EXT3). Who has a clue what could trigger this weird hardware behaviour? Thanks, Paul This is a wild guess, but check your RAM it could be going to the dark side. HTH -- Dennis M. linux user # 180842 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
