The problem is getting worse, not better, so it's time to move. I'll
make an announcement in the next few days giving details.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department
?
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude Fauchet
As I explained several weeks ago,a couple of us at my university are teaching a course on Virgil in translation next semester and thought it might work to assign a facing-page translation, i.e., the Loeb. Trouble is, even the revised Loeb is still too stiff sounding.
I've abandoned the Loeb
On 10/5/06, Helen Conrad-O'Briain [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Are there no second hand Mynors available on the internet?
I checked: not enough cheap ones for even a small class.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
Yesterday I was lecturing on these lines, which we all know by heart:
excudent alii spirantia mollius aera
(credo equidem), uiuos ducent de marmore uultus,
orabunt causas melius, caelique meatus
describent radio et surgentia sidera dicunt:
tu regere imperio populos, Romane, memento
(hae tibi
It's those exceptions, oratory and poetry, that give me pause. It's easy to be modest about poetry when you have something else to fall back on, such as a political career. So far as we know, Virgil didn't pursue that. He wrote about power, buthe didn't seek it. Of course,he did get influence,
=
cheaper than the OCT.)
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude
I'm planning to teach the Eclogues, Georgics, and Aeneid next semester
in translation. Has anyone used the Loebs for this? Some of my students
will be classics majors, but I'm assuming most will not.
---
Dr. David Wilson
agreed with
you and, if they didn't, then too bad for them. The old commentaries
weren't any more infallible than the modern ones, but there are still
things we can learn from them.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
forwarded for Andrea Severi
Hello, I'm studing the so called Christianus Maro (Erasmo), i.e.
Baptista Spagnoli, the Mantuan (Mantua 1447-1516). He was a carmelitan
friar and a very important poet for European Renaissance (England,
Germany above all..). Spenser and Milton knew before this
, and reception of the Roman poet Virgil. If it's not
about Virgil -- and maybe there's a famous Renoir painting of Dido that
I don't know about -- please don't post it here.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
. Donations are gladly accepted.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi
. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude Fauchet
, turns out to be based on very old -- and therefore very
relevant -- sources. Here, another case in point.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception
. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude Fauchet
My theory: fall of Troy = end of republican government. Virgil doesn't
know what comes next, but the change FEELS necessary, permanent. Cf.
September 11, 2001.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david
, if that would be appropriate.
Congratulations, Emma -- send us an abstract, but give it its own
subject heading.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception
it has yet to be replaced. (Cf. Epic and Romance by W. P. Ker.)
The original was in Italian and so is this:
http://www.classicitaliani.it/index178.htm
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
, interesting, and one that
commentators in the Middle Ages had a lot to say about. But whom did
Virgil draw forth from the circle of Judas, and did Erichtho animate
Virgil's corpse to do it?
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp
of our own James J. O'Hara's Death and the
Optimistic Prophecy in Vergil's Aeneid (Princeton, 1990).
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org david@virgil.org
English Department Virgil reception
Age of
Augustus really last forever, or will it give way to the Changefulness
that Pythagoras has just finished saying (at the beginning of Met. XV)
is the abiding principle of the universe?
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp
.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
English Department Virgil reception, discussion, documents, c
East Carolina UniversitySparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude Fauchet
At 08:19 AM 8/13/01 -0500, David Wilson-Okamura wrote:
Now the reason that I am mentioning this to the Virgil list is that, as
Kaske rightly points out, the rhetorical handbooks of the period do _not_
analyze images in this manner; imagery was not, and never had been, a
term in classical rhetoric
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
---
---
To leave
an example of this phrase until 1857! As early as 1693, Dryden is
using the phrase heroic verse, but this is still very late, and he
doesn't write as if the term were a new one.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
are
infected, go to http://www.sarc.com and follow the instructions for
removing [EMAIL PROTECTED]
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion
the historical chamber,
and we are tempted, because it has cost us so much effort, to infer that
what is secret (from us) was also sacred (for Virgil). This may be an
illusion.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL
earlier, I don't think I have been teaching the poem very
effectively.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
? Can't find it in the Selected Prose
or The Sacred Wood.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
At 04:51 PM 4/22/03 -0500, James Greenwald [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You could try Pauly-Wissova, if you can handle German.
I tried that this morning: no luck. Nothing in Kaster, either, I'm afraid.
---
David Wilson-Okamura
, the Oxford
Classical Dictionary, or the Oxford Companion to Classical Literature.
Nothing in Perseus, either. Any suggestions?
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil
Ovid. I don't endorse Maleuvre's position, but he has asked me to pass
along news of the update, and I am happy to do so. The URL, for those who
are interested, is http://www.virgilmurder.org
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamura
with
Aen. 10.653, in which Turnus is lured into a boat by a phantom-Aeneas, in
order to draw him away from the fighting and save his life.
-- Does anyone have a better source for phaselum intrare coactus?
---
David Wilson
faithfully, but firmly,
Dr. David Wilson-Okamura
Listowner, Mantovano
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
bibliography; just email a
notice with complete publication information, preferably in MLA format and
I will make sure that it goes in the next edition.
Yours faithfully,
David
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
but definitely worth bookmarking:
Charles H. Lohr
Traditio classicorum: The Fortuna of the Classical Authors to the Year 1650
http://www.theol.uni-freiburg.de/forsch/lohr/lohr-ch4.htm
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
on the matter.)
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
?
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
on this topic.
Yours faithfully,
David Wilson-Okamura
Listowner, Mantovano
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamura [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://virgil.org
English Department, East Carolina University, Greenville, NC 27858-4889
this year at
http://www.libroco.it but I haven't checked back since the spring. If
anyone knows where I can find a miniature bust of Poliziano, please email
me privately.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL
of the following:
(a) the Aldine octavos, which were endlessly pirated
(b) the apparatus criticus provided by the aforementioned Valerianus, which
was endlessly reprinted.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
East Carolina UniversityVirgil reception, discussion, documents, c
Wilson-Okamura
Listowner, Mantovano
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
).
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c.
---
---
To leave
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
(Frankfurt am Main: Klostermenn, 1957),
pp. 71-104.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2002 23:23:16 -0800
From: Neven Jovanovic [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I decided to use one of Ruaeus-like ad usum Delphini editions (London,
1819) with commentary in the proseminar (second year, undergraduate
students) on Georgics
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:05:19 +
From: Terry WALSH [EMAIL PROTECTED]
stiff with golden wire is Dryden's translation, which may be depended upon.
The phrase embodies a hendiadys, of a type common in the Aeneid.
Servius ad loc. also
. I'd start by looking at some of the items in
the online bibliography, under illustrations:
http://virgil.org/bibliography/
But perhaps others can add to this. (Emma?)
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
on the editorial procedures (as opposed to the
editorial rhetoric) of Aldus Manutius.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
to Emma Guest, who does
art history at Rutgers. Thank you, Emma.
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamura(651) 696-6643 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
English Dept., Macalester College, 1600 Grand Ave., St. Paul, MN 55105
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c.
---
---
To leave
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 16:09:05 +0100
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
For those not on the PAPY list, I thought this would be interesting in
light of our discussion. I for one am enormously grateful for the useful
discussion of Latin texts discovered at
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 23:29:39 +0100
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Thank you, Philip. I regretted not mentioning inscriptions the moment after I
punched the send button. But I actually did not know about the Gallus and
contemporary papyri. I have looked at
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 23:49:57 +0100
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I am struck by another humbling piece of ignorance in a field I am meant to
know
about. Do we have any Latin papyri from the Piso/Philodemus library at
Herculaneum? Or is it all like
:
James J. O'Hara
Department of Classics
CB# 3145, 101 Howell Hall
The University of North Carolina
Chapel Hill, NC 27599-3145
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 00:05:57 +0100
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Emmanuel Plantade's reply is extremely interesting, and I will enjoy trying
out
the new theory. I suspect that if it is correct it will end up by saying
something similar to, but perhaps
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 20:49:42 +0800
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Paul Roche wrote on the 26th September 2001:
Do listmembers know anything about the illustrated manuscript Holkholm
MS 311? Details from it are featured on the front cover of Wilkinson's
Georgics and
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2001 11:11:41 +0100
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dear List,
Thus sollicited!! M. Plantade and I have corresponded briefly privately,
but that in no way impedes our response to the list.
1. Homer or all of those who
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: Tim Saunders [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2001 21:48:29 +
I have been re-reading Aeneid 8.306-341 and was struck by the 6
instances of 5-word hexameters contained within this passage alone.
Seeing that I could not entirely
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2001 16:30:02 +0800
From: Peter J Dennistoun Bryant [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Is the name 'Maro' Celtic, or does it have a long and respectable
history as a Roman name?
Patrick Roper
Apparently Maro has a meaning in Etruscan
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 00:02:01 +0200
From: Robert Dyer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
John Geyssen a écrit :
Probably so named because of his lack of cooking skills since anthrax means
charcoal in Greek.
jg
That is the reason why the French name
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:34:05 -0400
From: Jim O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Salmon, Leigh Anne wrote:
Please help. I am to give a lecture on Anthrax this week. In doing my
research, I discovered that Virgil had referenced this disease
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:42:09 -0400
From: Jim O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED]
More: apparently the idea that Vergil was talking about anthrax appears
in the first paragraph of a lot of articles about anthrax
See also Dirckx JH. Virgil
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 08:58:40 -0400
From: Jim O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Patrick Roper is doubly right here, first in observing that it might
well have been that Vergil wanted the Aeneid destroyed because he wasn't
satisfied
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Mon, 03 Sep 2001 10:50:25 -0400
From: Jim O'Hara [EMAIL PROTECTED]
The discussions of the translations of Dido and others are informative and
fascinating. But many of the comments seem to depend on a view of great
poetry that focuses
been accepted for publication, please let me know _privately_, at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you. I remain
Yours faithfully,
David Wilson-Okamura
---
Dr. David Wilson-Okamura(651) 696-6643 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
English Dept
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c.
---
---
To leave
by Servius...
But I've gone on far too long. What think ye?
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 22:37:46 +
From: Leofranc Holford-Strevens [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Carissimi Mantovani,
Randi Ellevik asked me either to answer a question, or to post it to the
list, which her computer for technical reasons refuses
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 03:05:48 -0800
From: Federico Boschetti [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Apologies for crossposting... but I guess the members of your group
could be interested in homeric topics.
Two references:
http://altaseek.com/cgi-bin
positively that htis was not Vergil's grave or to
account for the ancient tradition which described it as such.
This, however, was written in 1896. Surely there is something more recent.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
to Otfried
Lieberknecht, Helen Conrad-O'Briain, and Gert de Ceukelaire.
For those with slow (or expensive) connections: it's not small (68
pages/191 kilobytes).
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL
list. (In
other words, if you have something to say, DON'T hit reply.)
David Wilson-Okamura
Listowner, Mantovano
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 11:59:05 -0600 (CST)
From: RANDI C ELDEVIK [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I really can't agree that Aeneas is callous and uncaring about Creusa's
demise. Look at the pertinent passage: his emotional reaction is
intense! It has
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: ddavis-henry [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 22:08:52 -0500
Creusa's separation from her family towards the end of book II is tough for
me to accept and to teach. I readily understand why her elimination from
the storyline
.)
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
The spamsters have done it again, for which I apologize to you all. If it's
any consolation, we probably get two or three attempts to spam the list
every day; the adult webmaster ad was fortunately an exception that somehow
got through.
Yours faithfully,
David Wilson-Okamura
Listowner, Mantovano
in the Georgics with that at the end
of Lucretius?
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://geoffreychaucer.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Chaucer: An Annotated Guide to Online Resources
!
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://geoffreychaucer.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Chaucer: An Annotated Guide to Online Resources
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: Michael-janck Snydert [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 17:58:38 UZT
Everything mirrors opposites, not to sound rambling or discouraging, but
infinity does exist - to quote the saying: we must repeat. Perhaps not
enough focus
.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://geoffreychaucer.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Chaucer: An Annotated Guide to Online Resources
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: Timothy Mallon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 10:22:36 PST
It is interesting that the _Iliad_ ends with a reflection: the last element
of the last word -damos is an adjective related to _damazein_ a word
frequently used
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: Timothy Mallon [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 11:09:51 PST
Remember though, that the *Homeric* Odysseus (presumably the one whom Aeneas
shadows in the first half of the A.) is neither bad nor unwise.
The idea of a character
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 16:16:13 -0600 (CST)
From: Rich Guerra [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I think actually looking upon a visual representation of the
shield would help me understand it's
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
From: Paul O. Wendland [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1999 17:53:27 -0600
A better place to start
from if you want to look for reflections of Aeneas' character in dying
Turnus is the nice parallel between Turnus' limbs being undone
message forwarded by listowner, David Wilson-Okamura
Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1999 14:07:32 -0600 (CST)
From: BBsuperstar [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I do not see the reason for Virgil including the images of the
shield in his work. I don't think this flows well with the rest of the
poem and It seems
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 22:54:42 -0800
From: Jeff Hiatt [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I am looking for precise information on similarities between The Aeneid
and The Odyssey. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you
in der Aeneis. Gottingen:
Vandenhoeck Ruprecht, 1964.
This will provide very precise information on the many parallels between
Homer and Virgil, and you don't need German to use it.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp
Dear Jim,
Wanted to offer belated thanks for your long note on the Ille ego...
lines. (I only just now got around to filing the printout.)
Yours faithfully,
David
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org
courtesy.
---
David Wilson-Okamurahttp://virgil.org [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Macalester College Virgil Tradition: discussion, bibliography, c
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 07:51:17 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time)
From: Donald Connor [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeneas says in 2.458 that he has climbed to the roof of Priam's palace,
from which vantage point he has a view of the events unfolding before him.
As he emphasizes
forwarded by listowner
From: ddavis-henry [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 22:04:12 -0500
I am just about to begin Book II of the Aeneid with my seniors and I am
never comfortable with Aeneas describing the death of Polites and Priam, at
the hands of Pyrrhus: what is his (Aeneas')
message forwarded by listowner
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 14:04:38 -0800
From: Gregory Hays [EMAIL PROTECTED]
These are the notorious verses alleged by Donatus and Servius to have
been removed from the beginning of the Aeneid by its first editors:
Ille ego qui quondam gracili modulatus
message forwarded by listowner
From: Ika Willis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I am currently researching a paper on gender issues in the
Georgics, looking especially at the 'laus ruris' in book 2 where the
farmer has a disconcertingly disembodied wife (referred to as
message forwarded by listowner
From: Jameel Jesani [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 2 Nov 1999 20:00:48 -
Dear all,
I am a Classics graduate faced with a challenge. I have recently agreed =
to tutor some very bright 12 year olds in Latin in order to boost =
scholarship opportunities at
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