RE: [Vo]:steorn talk#2 today at 5pm irish time + closeup shots of steorn talk#2 demo-rig
Abd wrote: And the answer was essentially to first give a bullshit answer, that a capacitor couldn't supply the instantaneous current needed. Put enough capacitance in there and you could vaporize the conductors if you shorted it. According to Sean, its not a matter of having enough capacitance... It's a matter of internal resistance, and the internal resistance of a battery is less than a capacitor; that's what's needed to deliver a very sharp risetime current pulse. So, its really both, how much and how fast; both are req'd for Orbo to work. And then, when the questioner asked a little more, he asked him to dream the dream a bit and talked about how important this could be. In other words, please stop asking this inconvenient question Didn't hear that comment... I've followed Steorn carefully, and do not think this is anything less than what they claim it to be... Regardless of whether it ends up as a mistake in their measurements or not, they are not con-artists... They are sincere. Either way, it won't take much longer to determine that... A matter of a few weeks. -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.725 / Virus Database: 270.14.139/2620 - Release Date: 01/13/10 23:35:00
[Vo]:Of Superconduction and Academic Stupidity
Very interesting comment section here... http://www.physorg.com/news182184493.html Quantum fluctuations are key in superconductors A guy with a login of Johanfprins makes several statements claiming to have a good model for superconduction and can make them to operate at room temp, or even 100C! Here are some of his comments, and a link to a It is already well understood; but the so-called experts (they should rather be called cranks) on superconduction do not want to understand it since it would mean that pairing of charge carriers ARE NOT REQUIRED. In fact ALL superconduction occurs owing to quantum fluctuations as allowed by Heisenberg's uncertainty relationship for energy and time. The underlying mechanism is the same for ALL superconducting materials from metals to ceramics once they have gone through a suitable phase transformation which allows quantum fluctuations to dominate. These conditions lead to a simple quadratic equation which models superconduction as movement of charge-carriers (not necessarily pairs) by means of quantum fluctuations. WHY IS IT SO DIFFICULT TO GET THIS MESSAGE THROUGH THE THICK SKULLS OF THE SUPERCONDUCTING EXPERTS? My model predicts what the properties of a material should be to superconduct above room temperature: And I have prototype substrates which do exactly this: I have offered to demonstrate them to Electronic Companies which have the infrastructure to develop devices on them: So far no takers. The simplest explanation of high temperature superconductivity consist in fact, movable electrons are attracted to hole stripes inside of superconductor lattice in such a way, their repulsive forces are compensating mutually - so that some electrons can move freely in resulting dense electron clouds, surrounding the holes. This behavior corresponds so-called pseudogap state and ballistic transport of electrons, as observed in graphene. At the moment, electron clouds are connected mutually, a superconductivity arises. The intriguing point of this model is in fact, the superconductive phase could be formed well outside of superconductor phase, i.e. near surface of insulator, to which electrons are attracted by electrostatic force. This behavior was revealed just by J.F.Prins experiments: http://www.iop.org/EJ/abstract/0268-1242/18/3/319/ Johan F Prins 2003 Semicond. Sci. Technol. 18 S131-S140 The diamond-vacuum interface: II. Electron extraction from n-type diamond: evidence for superconduction at room temperature And this comment sounds like what we say about some CF/LENR diehard skeptics: However, it is NOT my primary concern to convince physicts anymore. They have proved to be too stupid to even understand when Ohm's law applies. The physics community sufferred a frontal lobotomy in Belgium during 1927; and I doubt whether it is possible to activate a single synapse within a modern physicists bony skull: Especially the buffoons and cranks who are doing research on superconduction! -Mark
[Vo]: Yet another Wikipedia use of CF in a bad light...
Wikipedia's use of CF as an example for 'science by concensus' and 'burden of proof'... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof About 4/5s the way down the page. Examples in science As a general rule, the less coherent and less embedded within conventional knowledge a claim appears, the heavier the burden of proof lies on the person asserting the claim. ***The scientific consensus on cold fusion is a good example.*** The majority of physicists believe cold fusion is not possible, since it would force the alteration or abandonment of a great many other tested and generally accepted theories about nuclear physics. -Mark
RE: [Vo]: Yet another Wikipedia use of CF in a bad light...
Yes, it does... I can remember a college lecture in some science-related class (think it might have been ethology), where the point of one of the prof's lectures what to avoid using 'cute' or 'descriptive' labels for things in your research papers... I guess I just find it very sad that the acceptance of a completely new phenomenon of science ends up being delayed (partially) because of the label that got attached to it 20 years ago... its even more frustrating when that new science could be our way out of the age of oil! I wonder how future (100 yrs from now) science texts will look at this time, and whether references to this time will be 'it was just science operating as it should', or, 'science gone awry'! -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 05, 2010 1:58 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]: Yet another Wikipedia use of CF in a bad light... At 08:41 AM 1/5/2010, you wrote: Wikipedia's use of CF as an example for 'science by concensus' and 'burden of proof'... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof About 4/5s the way down the page. Examples in science As a general rule, the less coherent and less embedded within conventional knowledge a claim appears, the heavier the burden of proof lies on the person asserting the claim. ***The scientific consensus on cold fusion is a good example.*** The majority of physicists believe cold fusion is not possible, since it would force the alteration or abandonment of a great many other tested and generally accepted theories about nuclear physics. -Mark Mark, It would be helpful if more people distinguished between the *theory* of cold fusion from the observations of low-energy nuclear reaction experimental evidence. The theory of cold fusion - like-charged atomic nuclei joining together at room-temperature - may never get accepted. It would be unfortunate if the non-acceptance of the theory of cold fusion impedes the acceptance of LENR. Does this make sense? -Steve No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.725 / Virus Database: 270.14.126/2601 - Release Date: 01/04/10 23:35:00
[Vo]: Alternative sensors to CR39...
Could these be used instead of CR39 for LENR research... http://www.adsem.com/gpage4.html -Mark
RE: [Vo]:Back EMF vs Inductor Energy Storage
The energy is stored in the mag fld, not the inductor. Also, I've seen orbos that seemed to have a core with the toroid, and some that didn't, or at least it certainly didn't look like there was a core. I also was under the impression that the stator cores were NOT PMs, but simply iron cores. A few more thoughts, and I'll spare you the useless speculations... - Work is definitely being done as the permanent magnets on the rotor are being attracted to (accelerating towards) the stator cores. ABD seemed to imply, or state, that the only time any work was being done was after the rotor PMs passed the toroids... He also stated that the toroids must be fed constant current for a significant period after that point... I believe this is not the case. - From the oscilloscope screen shots, and contrary to ABD's comment, the toroids are only being pulsed for a short time as the rotor magnets pass TDC to overcome the cogging effect. From other PM motors like Sprain and Butch LaFonte, the single electromagnet (at the end of the PMs making up the stator) only needs a very short pulse to allow the rotor to pass the cogging point. The time for the mag-fld to build up and then collapse is considerably longer than the electric pulse. - When I mentioned some of the things that Thane Heins had learned over his time at Ottowa U, this forum pretty much dismissed it as nothing new. One of the keys to Orbo is something that Thane also discovered -- namely, that there is a time lag in the response of the magnetic material (magnetic permeability). It was this asymmetry that allowed enough of a lag in the collapse of the mag-fld of the coil, that generated a PUSH against the PMs after they passed TDC, thus causing acceleration; and in some cases, going from 2200rpms to 2300, 2400, 2500, 2600 in one or two second intervals. Accelerating his large rotor 100rpms/sec is no small force. - One more thing that Thane discovered, and my explanation might be a bit off, was that one could 'reroute' the energy that would cause the BEMF by using the proper core material (low or hi permeability??? Can't remember), thus keeping that energy out of the air-gap (btwn PMs in rotor and stator coil/core) and off of the rotor. It is kept within the core material of the stator (and he had VERY large cores), routing it to the opposite pole of the adjacent PM; i.e., he provided a closed 'magnetic circuit'. In some work that I'm involved in right now, we are using permanent magnets and we have them mounted to a soft iron housing, which basically acts like a wire to route the magnetic flux/fld from the south pole of one set of magnets to the north side of the other set. If you don't do this, you've got mag-fld squishing out all over the place... Not a pretty site! :-) - Thane eventually discovered that his system required a tuning of the coils resistance and inductance to optimize the acceleration effect. At first he was using rather modest coil windings, but he ended up using a very high resistance coil (lots of turns of very fine wire) to take advantage of the time lag. He also ended up with some very hefty 'U' shaped cores whose open end width was the same as the spacing of the PMs on the rotor in order to provide a magnetic circuit in which to route the BEMF energy. As for the time lag of magnetic materials (domains), I don't know if Thane ever went as far as to explain it from a physics point of view, but I'll take a stab -- Electrons (elec currents) are much lighter than nuclei (magnetic moments), so electric currents can respond much faster than magnetic domains. Thus, if one designs the PM/EM/COIL systems properly, they can take advantage of that time lag and put it to good use. -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.722 / Virus Database: 270.14.123/2592 - Release Date: 12/28/09 23:47:00
RE: [Vo]:Krivit Elsevier Encyclopedia Articles Publish
What an excellent Christmas present for the field of LENR research... Merry Christmas all! -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Thursday, December 24, 2009 11:44 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Krivit Elsevier Encyclopedia Articles Publish At 11:21 AM 12/24/2009, you wrote: That's great! For my database, please upload the abstracts here. If they don't have abstracts, the few paragraphs. - Jed Jed, There are no abstracts. Feel free to publish the introductions. Steve Cold Fusion - Precursor to Low-Energy Nuclear Reactions SB Krivit, New Energy Times, San Rafael, CA, USA 2009 Elsevier B.V. All rights reserved. On 23 March 1989, electrochemists M. Fleischmann and S. Pons claimed in a press conference at the University of Utah that they had achieved nuclear fusion in a tabletop chemistry experiment. Since then, evidence of fusion in what is now called low-energy nuclear reaction (LENR) research has grown only slightly stronger. Their hypothesis that a novel form of thermonuclear fusion was responsible for their experimental results is still unproved. On the contrary, LENR experiments have continued to demonstrate increasingly convincing evidence for some sort of nuclear process or processes - though not necessarily fusion - year after year. The suggestion that LENR research represented a new form of thermonuclear fusion has caused significant confusion. The two fields, thermonuclear fusion and LENR research, and their respective sets of phenomena are very different. Therefore, direct comparisons between the two are irrelevant. Cold Fusion: History SB Krivit, New Energy Times, San Rafael, CA, USA 2009 Elsevier B.V. All rights reserved. Introduction Research on low-energy nuclear reactions (LENRs) originated as the result of an electrolysis experiment that used the elements palladium (a heavy metal) and deuterium (an isotope of hydrogen). The first modern experiment was performed by Martin Fleischmann and B. Stanley Pons at the University of Utah in early 1985. Fritz Paneth and Kurt Peters of the University of Berlin preceded Fleischmann and Pons with a similar experiment in 1926. Fleischmann and Pons used an electrochemical method of generating nuclear energy, in the form of heat, in a way previously unrecognized by nuclear physicists. The two electrochemists announced their work at a press conference on 23 March 1989. They said that they had attained a 'sustained nuclear fusion reaction'. The media identified the discovery as 'cold fusion'. This event initiated a new field of science. It did not belong exclusively to chemistry, physics, or any other scientific discipline. As the field approaches its third decade, much has been learned, but certain significant facts remain unknown. However, this limitation is not unexpected, considering the novelty and scope of the subject matter. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.722 / Virus Database: 270.14.117/2583 - Release Date: 12/24/09 00:11:00
RE: [Vo]:New hypothesis about what Steorn is up to
Mauro wrote: maybe they are trying to make alternative energy INVESTORS to look like fools, and make them spend their money in a bogus project, so they don't invest it in a real one, and are afraid to invest in another in the future. Which would give them more time to perfect the technology before someone else comes out with it, or something similar... i.e., it buys them time. -Mark -Original Message- From: Mauro Lacy [mailto:ma...@lacy.com.ar] Sent: Friday, December 18, 2009 7:48 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:New hypothesis about what Steorn is up to The news that Steorn is advertising their own failure on Al Jazerra is mind boggling. What to make of this? Are these people extremely clever and using reverse psychology? Or are they what they appear to be: stupid, incoherent, and flapping around trying one scheme after another, like a candidate about to lose an election in a landslide? Here is my hypothesis Ver. 3.42: They are trying to give over-unity energy research a bad reputation. Someone, somewhere knows that magic magnetic motors really do work. This person wants to suppress the technology. So they are working preemptively to make everyone think these motors are the worst scam imaginable, with zero credibility to 5 significant decimal places. Just kidding. If you extend the intention of giving of bad reputation to the entire field of alternative energy research (includind Cold Fusion, by example) that start to sound more like a credible hypothesis. And also consider that maybe they are trying to make alternative energy INVESTORS to look like fools, and make them spend their money in a bogus project, so they don't invest it in a real one, and are afraid to invest in another in the future. Big PR tactics Steorn is taking since its very beginning, are compatible with both of these potential objectives. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.717 / Virus Database: 270.14.113/2573 - Release Date: 12/17/09 23:35:00
RE: [Vo]:Steorn Demo
Hoyt (the Insider) Stearns wrote, :-) The energy in the battery does not go to the kinetic energy of the rotor, it is used as an easy way to modify some parameters of the device. In watching the Launch 2009 video where some closeups and animations are shown, they show what looks like a small electromagnet; a metallic cylinder with a coil of fine copper wire around its end that faces the rotor. WHAT IF that metallic cylinder is not an iron core, but is a permanent magnet? This is the all PM motor, and the coil is used to 'modify some parameters' as Hoyt states. In all PM motors, the problem that must be solved is the cogging effect. Pulse these coils at the right time and they cancel or reduce the cogging effect of the PM stator magnets... Yes, agree that this demo really does not prove anything, and could have easily been configured (monitoring V and I) to be more definitive... NO, these guys are not stupid, so whatever they've done is probably well thought out. Whether it's a good strategy or not won't take more than a couple of weeks/months. -Mark
RE: [Vo]:Steorn Demo
Its explained in the YouTube video, Steorn Orbo Technology Launch 2009 The lower two rotors are a motor with PMs on the rotors and small coils (electromagnets?) on the stator. The EMs obviously require some DC electricity. The topmost rotor is a small generator which produces AC. To charge the battery they run the AC thru a very simple rectification circuit. So, yes, the motor part does require power, but apparently (much) less than they can generate, so it should be easy to demonstrate that this thing could be kept running for weeks, months when it should draw down the battery in a matter of days... -Mark -Original Message- From: Craig Haynie [mailto:cchayniepub...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 7:53 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Steorn Demo ... Let's see what their (Steorn's) reasons are for requiring a battery. If it really is transformation that they're tapping, they'll have to explain away the battery-requirement like a bunch of adults. Of course theyll be mocked for having a battery by anyone who believes they're doing nothing but fooling investors. We on this list, are indeed patient, but there are smoothing circuits and capacitors which could take the power from the generator and turn it into the equilibrium of a battery. Craig (Houston) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.716 / Virus Database: 270.14.108/2566 - Release Date: 12/14/09 23:52:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.716 / Virus Database: 270.14.108/2566 - Release Date: 12/14/09 23:52:00
RE: [Vo]:Falsifiability of cold neutrons in LENR
Horace wrote: I don't know why a neutron would not act like a neutron. Let me take a stab at that one... Perhaps because it's in a fully D-loaded palladium lattice, where other things aren't acting like they 'should'? ;-) Yeah, I know, that wasn't much help... -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 6:27 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Falsifiability of cold neutrons in LENR On Dec 10, 2009, at 12:21 PM, Jones Beene wrote: -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner That of course assumes the WL claim that neutron is thus absorbed within about ten nanometers is valid As you go on to imply, that particular version is almost certainly not valid, due to NA, and is probably undergoing revision as we speak ... ;-) but of greater interest would be this: Is there a version of the broader UCN dynamic, using published characteristics of the same instead of a tailor-made invention, which stands up better to criticism and do involve NA ? This might go back many years. The weight of evidence for helium in LENR, based on known reactions prior to 1989 together with lack of ~24 MeV gamma - still favors alpha release from Pd via adsorption of a neutron - and a subthermal neutron and with activation fits the bill if it will emit no gamma ... I don't know why a neutron would not act like a neutron.
[Vo]: neutron emission vs fission vs fusion
Today's 'serendipitous surfing' led me to this... Anyone familiar with Prof. Oliver K. Manuel's work/ideas on neutron emission? Identify ways to utilize the energy released in neutron emission - the largest known energy source. For example, the rest mass converted to useful energy is ~0.1% in nuclear fission, ~0.7-0.8% in nuclear fusion, and 1.2-2.4% in neutron emission. http://www.omatumr.com/abstracts2003/jfe-neutronrep.pdf -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.709 / Virus Database: 270.14.95/2546 - Release Date: 12/05/09 00:13:00
RE: [Vo]:terrifying online videos
This is pretty cool: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi7Srd-LSeE -Mark -Original Message- From: William Beaty [mailto:bi...@eskimo.com] Sent: Thursday, December 03, 2009 5:14 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:terrifying online videos Danyk666 and his microwave oven (Czech language) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_DKblzdbJI Yeesh! Like pouring a bucket of live spiders down your pants. And if you thought THAT was bad... danyk and his unshielded x-ray source http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzMXKxadnVw danyk makes a jacob's ladder http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cUJzQ0QPx9g danyk microwaves a cup of water http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DofLTIDszI danyk zaps a CDROM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7Re0njZ4mY danyk's flyback transformer stopped working (wait for it) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGV3fGo-_Cc danyk runs a light bulb w/wrong kind of AC http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqrstOfUDLA danyk Tesla Coil, carbon track growth http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AS6ZZnbvpA danyk TC, outbreak of RF-powered glass-meltery http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6cqZ7b4P00 and... danyk will kill you with his coffee\\ mug small shaded-pole motor http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HeG_CAOsG0 10 x 50Hz = 15,000RPM (or perhaps 30K) (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.709 / Virus Database: 270.14.91/2542 - Release Date: 12/02/09 23:32:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.709 / Virus Database: 270.14.91/2542 - Release Date: 12/02/09 23:32:00
RE: [Vo]:Global Warming
Here is an analysis of CRU source code used in some of the models: http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/11/crus_source_code_climategate_r.html But here's what's undeniable: If a divergence exists between measured temperatures and those derived from dendrochronological data after (circa) 1960, then discarding only the post-1960 figures is disingenuous, to say the least. The very existence of a divergence betrays a potential serious flaw in the process by which temperatures are reconstructed from tree-ring density. If it's bogus beyond a set threshold, then any honest man of science would instinctively question its integrity prior to that boundary. And only the lowliest would apply a hack in order to produce a desired result. -Mark -Original Message- From: OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson [mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 25, 2009 12:11 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Global Warming From Jeff Fink: THE GLOBAL WARMING SCAM There is interesting news as a result of leaked e-mails. It shows that the scientists who have been pushing the man made global warming agenda have been suppressing and altering data. ... Speaking of agendas, read: THE FAMILY, The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_1_9?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooksfield-keywords=the+family+the+se cret+fundamentalism+at+the+heart+of+american+powersprefix=The+famil http://tinyurl.com/ykhqfve The author, Jeff Sharlet, was interviewed on NPR last night. He had inside access to this family. What he had to say was both chilling (No pun intended) and bizarre. Here's one tiny example: The inner-most core within this family believes Jesus's fundamental message was not about love and understanding. They believe Jesus was really into absolute Power, and he whom possesses it. This family also doesn't believe the masses can't stomach the truth of Jesus's true message, so they don't preach it and instead spoon feed the masses drivel about love and tolerance while they scheme away in back rooms while attempting to influence our top lawmakers. Apparently, they have had some success. For example, there are U.S. senators who apparently subscribe to this belief and who have been helped along in their careers by this family. What a nice thought. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.82/2525 - Release Date: 11/25/09 07:31:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.82/2525 - Release Date: 11/25/09 07:31:00
[Vo]:RE: NET Bubble Fusion Story
Errors found in final version, so far: Some of the affidavits suggest that Butt have [had] been subjected to coercion by the senior professors who were conducting the fact-finding. ...has been demonstrated to be out [missing] of it's jurisdiction. -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 5:52 PM http://www.newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2009/NET33Cdfkj5.shtml#A1 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.78/2521 - Release Date: 11/23/09 07:52:00
RE: [Vo]:RE: NET Bubble Fusion Story
I must be brain-dead... sorry 'bout that post. I obviously meant it to go to Steve... :-/ -Mark _ From: Mark Iverson [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 10:15 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:RE: NET Bubble Fusion Story Errors found in final version, so far: Some of the affidavits suggest that Butt have [had] been subjected to coercion by the senior professors who were conducting the fact-finding. ...has been demonstrated to be out [missing] of it's jurisdiction. -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 5:52 PM http://www.newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2009/NET33Cdfkj5.shtml#A1 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.78/2521 - Release Date: 11/23/09 07:52:00 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.78/2521 - Release Date: 11/23/09 07:52:00
RE: [Vo]:RE: NET Bubble Fusion Story
yeah, I deserved that! :-) I was really trying to show all those OCD Vorts how few grammatical errors there are in your very lengthy, detailed, and fact-filled investigative articles! :-) -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Monday, November 23, 2009 11:04 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:RE: NET Bubble Fusion Story Butt head? At 10:15 PM 11/23/2009, you wrote: Errors found in final version, so far: Some of the affidavits suggest that Butt have [had] been subjected to coercion by the senior professors who were conducting the fact-finding. ...has been demonstrated to be out [missing] of it's jurisdiction.
RE: [Vo]:Please stop using .dat attachments
Thanks for the reminder... That was actually the result of hitting Send before thinking about it! It was late and I was dozing off! :-) -Mark _ From: Terry Blanton [mailto:hohlr...@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2009 6:49 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Please stop using .dat attachments Horace, I believe this is the result of using MS Outlook in the RTF or HTML mode to post on the list. If Mark or any others would set your format to plain text it will remedy the situation. Regards, Terry
[Vo]: Proton's internal structure...
This just out at PhysOrg... (see at bottom of msg) What I find funny, in a sad kind of way, is the following statement: So you have one set of data that tells you the mass-dependence picture doesn't work and another that tells you the density-dependence picture doesn't work, Arrington explained. So, if both of these pictures are wrong, what's really going on? And the experts dare say that fusion is IMPOSSIBLE under the conditions present in a CF cell? This can ONLY be said if one knows everything about nuclear interactions, and CLEARLY, they DON'T! -Mark === JLab experiment E03-103 made precise new measurements of the EMC effect in a variety of light nuclei. The results indicate that the effect does not depend on nuclear mass or density but rather on the microscopic structure of nuclei, usually neglected in high-energy measurements. This result hinges on the unusual structure of 9Be. Most of the time, it is in a configuration with two 4He-like clusters and an additional neutron orbiting around each other. The orbiting clusters yield a large radius and an anomalously low average density similar to that of the much less massive 3He. But the size of the EMC Effect in 9Be is much more similar to that of the denser nucleus of 12C. This is probably because most nucleons are contained within the high local densities of the clusters. The results suggest that the EMC effect may be entirely generated within these small, high-density clusters, where densities can briefly approach those in a neutron star. Credit: Image: Peter Mueller (Argonne National Lab) A recent experiment at the DOE's Thomas Jefferson National Accelerator Facility has found that a proton's nearest neighbors in the nucleus of the atom may modify the proton's internal structure. The result was published in the November 13 issue of the journal Physical Review Letters. When comparing large nuclei to small nuclei, past measurements have shown a clear difference in how the proton's constituent particles, called quarks, are distributed. This difference is called the EMC Effect. [deletions...] So you have one set of data that tells you the mass-dependence picture doesn't work and another that tells you the density-dependence picture doesn't work, Arrington explained. So, if both of these pictures are wrong, what's really going on? [deletions...] We want to isolate the quark structure during the moment when the proton and neutron are very close together. If we find a large effect in such a small and simple nucleus by looking when the proton and neutron are closest together, it will demonstrate that the EMC effect does not require a large, dense nucleus - it simply requires two nucleons coming into extremely close contact, Arrington explained. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.73/2513 - Release Date: 11/19/09 07:51:00 attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story
Steve: I really don't think it was a good idea to post her phone msg transcript! She must be itchin' to get fired... this will make it back to her superiors. -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 2:26 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story http://newenergytimes.com/v2/blog/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00
Recall: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story
Mark Iverson would like to recall the message, [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story. attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story
She must be one gutsy lady! And a good moral compass and high degree of integrity... -Mark -Original Message- From: Stephen A. Lawrence [mailto:sa...@pobox.com] Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 8:21 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story Steven Krivit wrote: http://newenergytimes.com/v2/blog/ Uh ... That page seems to include the work and cell phone numbers of the person with whom you've been corresponding at ONR. Is that appropriate? Shouldn't the cell number, at least, be blacked out or something? Sorry, I know that's not the point here, but it just kind of jumped off the page at me. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00
RE: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story
Steve wrote: ...but it has been re-assigned. As has she... Boy, they sure didn't waste any time did they! ;-) That's whatcha get for tryin to do the right thing nowadays... How did it get so bad? -Mark -Original Message- From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 10:07 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:ONR Inspector General Helps New Energy Times Break Story Sorry for the confusion and concern folks.Adam's mobile phone number got disconnected after I spoke with her on Feb. 17 and stayed that way for some time afterwards. I thought the number was dead, but it has been re-assigned. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00
RE: [Vo]: Proton's internal structure...
As a followup to this... Here's yet another example of the fact that there are still many things that modern science doesn't understand... and this is a weekly happening, if not daily: We are interested in seeing how these nanotube quantum dots work, and tracking what happens in them. We've already seen some unexpected features, such as an unusual energy exchange.* And this statement a bit earlier in the article: Some of the spectroscopic features observed with the superconducting probe include signals from cotunneling and unusual scattering processes. Let me translate... unexpected features, unusual energy exchange and unusual scattering processes = WTF! :-) And of course, cold fusion is IMPOSSIBLE since we know all there is to know about the atom... ;-) -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, November 20, 2009 5:09 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]: Proton's internal structure... On Nov 19, 2009, at 11:13 PM, Mark Iverson wrote: This just out at PhysOrg... (see at bottom of msg) What I find funny, in a sad kind of way, is the following statement: So you have one set of data that tells you the mass-dependence picture doesn't work and another that tells you the density-dependence picture doesn't work, Arrington explained. So, if both of these pictures are wrong, what's really going on? And the experts dare say that fusion is IMPOSSIBLE under the conditions present in a CF cell? This can ONLY be said if one knows everything about nuclear interactions, and CLEARLY, they DON'T! Good observation! -Mark === JLab experiment E03-103 made precise new measurements of the EMC effect ... [snip] Some related URLs: http://www.pg.infn.it/hadronic08/lectures/11_Gaskell.pdf http://conferences.jlab.org/elba/talks/solvignon.pdf http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2009-11/djna-ppp111809.php http://machineslikeus.com/news/protons-neighbors-may-alter-its- internal-structure http://www.scienceblog.com/cms/protons-party-pals-may-alter-its- internal-structure-27375.html http://www.physorg.com/news177787801.html Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.74/2515 - Release Date: 11/20/09 08:02:00
RE: [Vo]:Cold fusion bombs
RE: the discussion about chain reactions in LENR-type experiments... Not sure if I got the below reference from vortex-l or not, but, in a general sense, it seems that it is saying that under certain conditions, normally incoherent behavior can suddenly become coherent... i.e., the behavior of atoms or subatomic particles, at least locally, changes into something that rarely occurs in the bulk. This just seems to mirror what I perceive as occuring in the Pd lattice; namely, that conditions come about that cause some kind of coherent atomic/QM behavior that results in reactions that will never occur under normal bulk conditions... -Mark -- REFERENCE BELOW AU - Piot, B. A. TI - Wigner crystallization in a quasi-three-dimensional electronic system JA - Nat Phys PY - 2008/10/05/online PB - Nature Publishing Group SN - 1745-2481 UR - http://dx.doi.org/10.1038/nphys1094 Abstract When a strong magnetic field is applied perpendicularly (along z) to a sheet confining electrons to two dimensions (x-y), highly correlated states emerge as a result of the interplay between electron-electron interactions, confinement and disorder. These so-called fractional quantum Hall liquids (1) form a series of states that ultimately give way to a periodic electron solid that crystallizes at high magnetic fields. This quantum phase of electrons has been identified previously as a disorder-pinned two-dimensional Wigner crystal with broken translational symmetry in the x-y plane (2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8). Here, we report our discovery of a new insulating quantum phase of electrons when, in addition to a perpendicular field, a very high magnetic field is applied in a geometry parallel (y direction) to the two-dimensional electron sheet. Our data point towards this new quantum phase being an electron solid in a 'quasi-three-dimensional' configuration induced by orbital coupling with the parallel field. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.73/2513 - Release Date: 11/19/09 07:51:00 attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released
My definition of an insider is one who has at least done some experimental/theoretical research on the subject; LENR in this case. Duncan has now become an insider, by that definition. No, I disagree. Has he set up a lab and done some experiments? No. Has he delivered a theoretical paper at a conference? No. ALL he did was a personal peer-review. That's not 'research'. Yes, some will use any supportive statements to label a person as an insider... so what. My point was that at the time of the 60-Minutes piece, he most certainly was NOT, and that's why his assessment, along with being done on 60-Mins to reach a much larger audience, had the impact it did. He came in as a skeptic, but did, in a sense, an individual peer-review; did his own calculations to make sure the math was correct, check for good experimental process, etc., and came to a conclusion based on data... what any true scientist would do. So what if he is now considered an insider...he had the intended affect. Now get a small group of expert OUTSIDERS to do the same thing and issue their conclusions... not DOE; they couldn't put together an objective panel if their lives depended on it. Again, its a perception battle, and the goal is not to convince the diehard (pathological) skeptics like Park; its to persuade the average Science or Nature reader, the average researcher, who then writes or calls the journal editors and expresses their concern that a major breakthru is being held back because of political/egotistical reasons. When they realize this could be a clean source of power... what scientist doesn't want to wean the world off of oil? Duncan/60-Mins, and now this DIA Report increases the pressure on journal editors to give LENR papers a fair chance at peer-review... and that's exactly what's needed at this point in time. -Mark _ From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 17, 2009 7:55 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com; vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released Mark Iverson wrote: Jed, then you've got some extremely liberal definition of 'insider'! I was using the skeptics' definition. As I said, one of them called Duncan a charlatan because he concluded that Energetics Technology is correctly measuring 0.8 W in, ~20 W out. Any sane expert in calorimetry would reach this conclusion, but the skeptics say anyone who does becomes an insider and loses all credibility. My definition of an insider is one who has at least done some experimental/theoretical research on the subject; LENR in this case. Duncan has now become an insider, by that definition. The people who consulted in this review are listed on p. 6. Some of them are not known to have contributed to cold fusion but they are knowledgeable about the field and that makes them insiders as some people define it. This devolves into a no true Scotsman logical fallacy. Agreed, some may now refer to Dr. Duncan as somewhat of an insider, but his single assessment had MORE of a positive impact than anything that I can think of... it drastically reduced the negative aura surrounding LENR... I would not say drastically. There is still a lot of resistance and no good press in the mass media. It has had a welcome effect, and it has opened doors. That was mainly because it was broadcast on CBS. Gerischer was as qualified and prestigious as Duncan, and his review is even more positive than Duncan's, but it had no impact because no one has ever heard of it, apart from people who download his paper. Which is here, by the way: http://www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/GerischerHiscoldfusi.pdf - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.69/2508 - Release Date: 11/17/09 07:40:00
RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released
He has??? Wow, that's very good news... Do you know if he's just setting up, or have they had this lab up and running for awhile? Have they had any encouraging results, like exploding experiments! :-) You were right the first time... Blowhards. Actually, that's way too gentle a term for people like Park and Garwin. Thanks for the good news about Dr.D! -Mark _ From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 17, 2009 1:01 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com; vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released Mark Iverson wrote: Duncan has now become an insider, by that definition. No, I disagree. Has he set up a lab and done some experiments? No. Yes, he has now. That's my point. I am pleased he has! My point was that at the time of the 60-Minutes piece, he most certainly was NOT . . . That's true. But that's not how our friends the skeptics see it. Again, its a perception battle, and the goal is not to convince the diehard (pathological) skeptics like Park; its to persuade the average Science or Nature reader, the average researcher . . . That's true, and it is important. There is no point in trying to convince the blowhard . . . I mean diehard skeptics. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.69/2508 - Release Date: 11/17/09 07:40:00
RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released
I think this is an important statement... However, if by experts they mean Mosier-Boss, McKubre, etc., then less so since these people, altho certainly experts, are also insiders. I would hope that at least some of the experts were people who have never done any LENR research... -Mark _ From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 2:57 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released This refers to: http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2009/2009DIA-08-0911-003.pdf That is an astounding document. Even I think it is a little over-the-top. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.67/2506 - Release Date: 11/16/09 07:43:00 Outlook.jpg
RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released
Jed, then you've got some extremely liberal definition of 'insider'! My definition of an insider is one who has at least done some experimental/theoretical research on the subject; LENR in this case. Robert Duncan is an expert in calorimetry, but he most definitely is NOT and insider!!! Insiders are most likely also experts (duh!), and they are usually viewed as not objective since they are 'invested' in the research, thus, their opinions, although most knowledgeable about the matter, do not carry as much weight as an expert who has not actually done any research in the field. Its all about perceptions at this point in time... As I stated, I would hope that at least some of the experts were people who have never done any LENR research. The fact that Dr. Duncan was an expert but not an insider is what gave his assessment such a strong impact, not only on the media, but more importantly on the scientific world. What we need are more experts, NOT insiders, making independent assessments as did Dr.Duncan. But that takes guts, and integrity, now doesn't it... kudos to Dr. Duncan. Agreed, some may now refer to Dr. Duncan as somewhat of an insider, but his single assessment had MORE of a positive impact than anything that I can think of... it drastically reduced the negative aura surrounding LENR... win the perception battle, and all else will begin to follow a more rational scientific process. This report, although not a dam buster, is another major fracture/leak in the skeptics denial dam... lets all hope that Park and others are in its path when the dam finally bursts! ;^) -Mark _ From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 9:02 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released Mark Iverson wrote: However, if by experts they mean Mosier-Boss, McKubre, etc., then less so since these people, altho certainly experts, are also insiders. I would hope that at least some of the experts were people who have never done any LENR research... I understand where you are coming from, but this line of thinking soon leads to absurd conclusions. The only people qualified to make a serious analysis of cold fusion have either done the research, or they have done something similar. Robert Duncan, for example, is an expert in calorimetry, which is why CBS asked him to evaluate it. Heinz Gerischer was an expert in electrochemistry which is why he was invited to ICCF-2 as an observer. People with their level of knowledge look at the data for a few days and they conclude, as Gerischer put it: there is now undoubtedly overwhelming indications that nuclear processes take place in the metal alloys. (Britz is the only expert I know who was not convinced by the data, and I do not think his reasons for rejecting it are rational.) The fact is, when a sane, unbiased, qualified expert looks closely at cold fusion he is inevitably persuaded, because the indications really are overwhelming. And the moment that expert is persuaded he transmogrifies into an insider! Certainly in the eyes of the skeptics he loses all credibility. A well known skeptic called Duncan a charlatan when all he had done was evaluate the data to reach a conclusion. Now that Duncan has published SEM photos of material and attended a conference, he is well and truly an insider and therefore -- by these rules -- he is beyond the pale. Where does that end? How many scientists have to be convinced before we say that Britz and a few others left out in the cold are the real weirdos who lack credibility? It is a bit like a game of sardines (reverse hide-and-go-seek) where every time a player finds the person who is 'it' that player disappears from the game. There are already thousands of scientists who have observed the cold fusion effect, and -- judging by the reader response at LENR-CANR.org -- tens of thousands who have read papers and are certain the effect is real. Are they all insiders now? Have they all magically ceased to be reliable? Duncan was completely reliable and highly trusted before CBS called him. Is he now persona non grata in science, and if so, why? The whole notion of insiders and outsiders has no place in science. And in fact there are no insiders in cold fusion as far as I can tell. Cold fusion is supposedly insular but it sure don't seem that way. On the contrary, most researchers are competitive and make little effort to assist one another, and no effort to cover for others or hide other people's mistakes. Their backbiting is often as nasty, and often as unfounded, as the skeptical attacks. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.67/2506 - Release Date: 11/16/09 07:43:00
RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released
So the Intelligence community of the DoD looked into LENR, decided that there's enough sound scientific evidence to suggest that LENR just might be real, and because of the most extraordinary ramifications if it is real, is, with this report, warning government agencies and the scientific mainstream to WAKE THE F*CK UP or GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR A$$! ??? Or, someone on the inside found a conduit thru which to fight the 'perception'... -Mark _ From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Monday, November 16, 2009 11:25 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Re: New Energy Times News Flash: DoD Report Released At 05:43 PM 11/16/2009, you wrote: Terry, Good point regarding what might be in the classified report. These authors are all very likely to have confidential information of their own research and consulting with industry. I think their tone reflects something they know but can't say. I think they correctly highlight just how far behind the US has fallen and that our data and talent is being exploited by other countries.Basically they told our government to put up or shut up.. in my view, I see it as they told our government to get their heads out of the sand... and it was long overdue! Regards Fran No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.425 / Virus Database: 270.14.67/2506 - Release Date: 11/16/09 07:43:00
RE: [Vo]:GR now in serious question
For those who want to explore the criticisms of Relativity theory, there is a journal that focuses on that. From their Editorial Policy: Galilean Electrodynamics aims to publish high-quality scientific papers that discuss challenges to accepted orthodoxy in physics, especially in the realm of relativity theory, both special and general. In particular, the journal seeks papers arguing that Einstein's theories are unnecessarily complicated, have been confirmed only in a narrow sector of physics, lead to logical contradictions, and are unable to derive results that must be postulated, though they are derivable by classical methods. http://home.comcast.net/~adring/GEPolicy.htm -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2009 9:40 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:GR now in serious question On Oct 28, 2009, at 6:16 AM, Jones Beene wrote: What would be the effect of a small amount of mirror matter in our solar system ? Let's say our solar system drifted through a large cloud of mirror hydrogen from a mirror star supernova, which contained some heavier molecules. Would some of it become intermixed ? Yes and no. If the mirror matter has ordinary (positive) gravitational charge, i.e. attracts with ordinary matter as is conventionally believed, then yes. If the mirror matter has negative gravitational charge, as defined as cosmic matter in the Searching for Cosmic Matter article here: http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/CosmicSearch.pdf then it is unlikely we would drift through such a cloud because it would be repelled by our galaxy and solar system. However, even better, if negative gravitational charge mirror matter, cosmic matter, exists as described my article above, then the black holes in the center of our galaxy are manufacturing the stuff, and we are bathed in a constant flow of it as it moves outward from the center of the galaxy, forming a galactic halo, and thus beautifully accounting for the unusual momentum behavior of the galactic arms as described precisely by the MOND equation, as described on page 10. Mirror and ordinary photons couple with on the order of 5x10-9 times the charge of an electron. I also point out that gravimagnetic spin coupling will bond particles. This coupling, especially virtual photon coupling, results in the ability of mirror nuclei to weakly couple to ordinary matter nuclei, creating what I called meta- matter. There may be some heavy atoms that show up in the mass spectra of matter that has been exposed to mirror matter, but typically electrostatic accelerations will separate the nuclei. Their coupling is weak enough that supercentrifuges should be able to do the mass separation. We might be able to see energetic mirror matter using a graviphoton telescope. By symmetry, I showed graviphotons should weakly couple to the electromagnetic force. Magnetic lenses can thus be used to build a graviphoton telescope which would permit viewing of this alternate universe about us. The Searching for Cosmic Matter article was written as a stand- alone article, so much of it is a review of gravimagnetics. However, I get down to some practical means to look for mirror matter here on earth, on page 25 ff of the above article. I mention a sea water search method for cosmic mater on page 30. A substantial proportion of mirror matter in a mass sample will result in spontaneous cooling of the matter due to black body mirror photon radiation. Therefore, an IR camera provides a means to look for high density mirror matter geological samples. Cosmic matter, if it exists, arrives here as comic rays. About 90 percent of cosmic rays are hydrogen, i.e. protons, but they impact atmospheric molecules and cause a shower of particles, including gammas, neutrons, kaons, pions and mesons. It is necessary that the mirror charge is preserved in one particle type or another in the process, unless a mirror matter anti-particle is miraculously struck and annihilation occurs, and the most likely detectable surviving final cosmic product is the cosmic hydrogen atom or a cosmic proton bound into meta-matter. The sun captures cosmic rays and transforms their energy into thermal energy. It can therefore be assumed that, if cosmic rays contain cosmic matter, that the solar wind itself carries a proportion of cosmic matter outward from the sun. If even a microscopic amount of meta-matter could be isolated, then it would be possible to build the equivalent of a mirror photon CCD. Mounted on a telescope, we could see not only the mirror universe, but all the major mirror matter deposits on earth, even by looking directly through the earth. In addition to the science bonanza, such a device would open up vast new technologies, like heavy earth to orbit or earth to moon lifters. This is the ultimate prospector's dream - vastly more valuable than
[Vo]: RF improves molecular interactions...
Who was it that was using RF to enhance the CF/LENR reaction??? This from PhysOrg.com... http://www.physorg.com/news175281818.html As the authors report in an upcoming issue of Physical Review A, the radio-frequency (RF) radiation could serve as a second knob, in addition to the more traditionally used magnetic fields, for controlling how atoms in an ultracold gas interact. And they state, By adding RF radiation of the right frequency... Resonance, resonance, resonance... Its all about harmonic interaction. Most of science deals with getting interactions to occur using brute force; but find the right frequency and it all comes together and appears effortless. But we're dealing with such high frequencies that finding the right one can be like finding the proverbial needle in the haystack! And there are likely more than one frequency involved in the molecule, so what's harmonic with one is likely discordant with another... What's that old mathematical term... Least Common Multiple. -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.422 / Virus Database: 270.14.23/2447 - Release Date: 10/20/09 03:55:00
RE: [Vo]:Magnetricity
Yet another example of how the ego totally screws up the (scientific) process... Imagine where civilization could be now if ego's weren't involved... -Mark _ From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, October 16, 2009 7:53 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Magnetricity On May 11, 1997, at 2:34 AM, Robert Stirniman wrote: Magnetic Charge. Don't leave home without it. == References: F. Ehrenhaft, Phys Z, Vol 31 Page 478, 1930 F. Ehrenhaft, The Magnetic Current, Science Vol 94 pp 232-233. September 1941 F. Ehrenhaft, New Experiments about the Magnetic Current, Physical Review, Vol 65 pp 62-63, 1944 K. Joseph, Magnetic Currents - The Monopole?, Electric Spacecraft Journal, Issue #3 pp 18-23, January 1992. V.F. Mikhailov, Six Experiments with Magnetic Charge, Advanced Electromagnetism, Editors: Terrence W. Barrett, and Dale M. Grimes, World Scientific Publishing. 1995. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.20/2440 - Release Date: 10/16/09 06:32:00
RE: [Vo]:Fleischmann
Jed wrote: Fleischmann told me he has had the problem for a long time. I'm outraged, how could you be so insensitive to reveal in a public forum personal health details that someone told you!!! Me thinks this touches an emotional 'button' for both Jed and ABD... And that comment Jed made about Steve making a mountain out of a molehill... Perhaps you should revisit these posts in a week or two, and then ask yourself who over-reacted. -Mark -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, October 13, 2009 3:36 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Fleischmann On a completely personal note, I would not want to give the impression that I have Parkinson's. I have no idea what it is, and neither do the doctors. They call it essential tremor, where essential is medical jargon meaning 'built-in, always there,' or 'we don't have a clue what causes it.' There are many possible causes. On the other hand, Parkinson's runs in the family and my deceased relatives had the same kind of symptoms at my age, so it is a good bet that I do. You have to die of something and Parkinson's is not a bad way to go. Because it was free, I took part in a neurological medical study at Emory U. The doctors measured this and that and poked me with needles. They did not seem alarmed. They confirmed there is a problem but it is mild and requires no treatment. They said the best way to find out exactly what's wrong would be with an autopsy, but I would prefer not to undergo that just yet. No doubt it will get worse with age. I know from experience that exercise reduces the problem, and they confirmed that. Fleischmann told me he has had the problem for a long time. So did my mother, and others I have known who had it. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.13/2432 - Release Date: 10/13/09 06:35:00
[Vo]: including ALL the physics...
This sort of thing makes me wonder about scientists, or the scientific 'process'... For those of you more familiar with the details of atomic/molecular physics, can you please explain why you would even think that the magnetic orientation/properties of copper atoms in covalent bonds would be anything like in isolated copper atoms??? http://www.rdmag.com/Materials-Fuller-physics-helps-solve-materials-mystery/?wnnvz=cIpb87iV1KLyC3Pk -- quote from the article --- When making comparisons between experiment and calculation, we, and others, were often finding discrepancies that were then being explained away as systematic errors, imperfections in the samples, or other effects, said Professor Perring. But there are only so many times you can ignore these factors before you have to work out why they are there. The answer in the end was as straightforward as MAKING SURE TO INCLUDE ALL THE PHYSICS. [my emphasis] Calculations previously had been based on copper atoms being isolated; the correct shape of the magnetism of copper atoms when part of a covalent bond had not been taken into account. Copper-oxygen-copper bonds are a common feature of the copper oxide ceramic family, with the atomic level magnetism arising from the arrangement of electrons on each copper atom. Their bonding causes the spin distribution of the electrons to be changed quite dramatically from what would be found on a single isolated copper atom. -- -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.421 / Virus Database: 270.14.13/2432 - Release Date: 10/13/09 06:35:00
RE: [Vo]:Rothwell and Bad Science
If I understand Jed's requirements, he is asking for image-over-text, which means the image file is what one sees, but that there is text associated with each image that allows one to do full text searches. Thus, there is NO reason for Dr. Schwartz's concern about 'editing', since the original page images will be what people see... I still haven't seen an approval by Dr. Schwartz posted here on Vortex-l... And it's pretty much already written as I've seen at least two posts that suggested the verbiage! Wouldn't take him more than a minute or two to post it and clear all this up. -Mark -Original Message- From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax [mailto:a...@lomaxdesign.com] Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 5:47 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Rothwell and Bad Science At 10:00 AM 10/4/2009, you wrote: Mitchell's refusal of any rewriting of his work seems understandable to me. Would image pdf with underlying text for searchability satisfy both belligerents and put an end to this lengthy dispute? No rewriting has been proposed. File translation has been proposed. When you send in a paper for publication, that's what you normally get. In the translation, it is possible that some error might occur, it is possible that it might not be noticed. However, this can happen with all publication. Image with text is possible, I'm sure, but there is also a bandwidth issue. A simple solution has already been proposed, that Mitchell give Jed permission to copy the papers as hosted on newenergytimes.com. Now, if that is image with text, it might still be some problem for Jed. If Jed wants the library to be more complete, he might bend a little. If Mitchell wants his papers to be somewhat more available, he might bend a little. And if neither will bend, well, the rest of us will survive. I noticed that Jed retracted the extortion racket hyperbole. That was appropriate. And I also noticed that Mitchell stopped making the accusations that Jed was lying. That was also helpful. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.420 / Virus Database: 270.14.3/2415 - Release Date: 10/05/09 06:19:00
RE: [Vo]:Swartz is running a extortion racket
Dr. Swartz:
You should read carefully Stephen Lawrence's post today, 9/30/2009, at 6:16PM.
You might want to recind your comment since Stephen included quotes from as far
back as 5 Dec 2004
which CLEARLY show that Jed has ALWAYS admitted that he got the CD from you,
but that he couldn't
read it. Thus, your comment about his lying about getting the CD, and
finally admitting he got
it are obviously an exaggeration at the very least, if not a conscious attempt
to deceive.
All I want to know now is when are you going to post a reply to Vortex that
specifically gives Jed
permission to download and post your papers on lenr-canr's website
Shouldn't take you more than
2 or 3 minutes to compose that and post it here... I'll be looking for it in
the morning!
Cheers,
-Mark
_
From: Dr. Mitchell Swartz [mailto:m...@theworld.com]
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 7:37 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: bd...@cam.ac.uk
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Swartz is running a extortion racket
At 09:26 PM 9/30/2009, Rothwell, proven disingenuous, wrote:
Stephen A. Lawrence wrote:
Update: Dr. Swartz has posted the URL of one of his papers on Vortex,
as of about an hour ago. I don't know if it's one of the papers Jed was
considering uploading or not.
Rothwell: I have not considered uploading any paper by Swartz for the last 10
years.
There are three issues here:
First, the truth continues to slowly leak
out of disingenuous Jed, little by little, as his stories change.
--
Rothwell: Not since he first threatened me.
Second, what utter nonsense. This totally new fabrication
and story du jour by Rothwell is laughable.
Rothwell was asked for the proof of his libelous allegation of 'extortion'.
He has been silent except to attempt to change the subject over and over.
Therefore, Rothwell is not a man of honor.
He is shown to have been dishonest, and has failed to apologize.
-
Third, flashback:
NOTA BENE: Rothwell's latest decompensation and picking of
a fight followed a simple question:
Rothwell had posted:
{referring to the docs given to the DOE panel]
Rothwell: The documents they were given are listed here:
http://lenr-canr.org/Collections/DoeReview.htm#Submissions
- Jed
I thanked Jed, pointed out that I had not seen the table,
and that one observation was that when the papers which were
distributed to the DOE in 2004 (as they assembled to consider
CF/LANR) were examined, the table indicates that all of the papers
of Prof. Dash and I, although possibly referenced, were apparently
absent from the printed papers handed out to the DOE
--- even though ***ironically*** Dr.Dash and I were (and remain, I think)
the only ones who have actually conducted open cold fusion demonstrations
in the USA at a national meeting.
Methinks Rothwell protests too much -- for reasons unclear.
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05:52:00
RE: [Vo]:Why No Repulsion?
There is, it's just overcome by the forces causing the separation of charge... Understand that just as in a chemical battery, there is an active process keeping the charges separated, and it has to do with the turbulent columns of air moving vertically inside the cloud. It's been about 19 yrs since my involvement with this topic as a grad student, but back then there were at least two competing hypotheses as to the microphysics of cloud electrification. Not sure if that has been resolved or not... but convective cumulus clouds are not the nice calm gentle-looking puffs of cotton that they appear to be!! They are quite turbulent inside with significant regions of vertical shear... If I remember correctly, the vertical structure of a cumulus cloud has a positive region at the bottom, a pancake region of mostly negative charges near to the freezing level (~mid-cloud), and a positive region near the top... -Mark _ From: Chris Zell [mailto:chrisrz...@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, September 25, 2009 8:28 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Why No Repulsion? I was wondering if anyone knew a thorough answer to the question: How can a charged thunderstorm exist? I've asked meterologists this question but no one has any answer. How can a cloud carry any charge at all? Why doesn't the charge cause the cloud to instantly dissipate? If we can demonstrate electrostatic precipitation with a small cloud chamber, how can any thunderstorm exist at all? Another mystery: How can an electron cloud exist in a vacuum tube? How can it hold itself together? It just seems to me that there are exceptions to the idea that like charges always repel - a notion that might guide us to free energy. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.112/2394 - Release Date: 09/25/09 05:51:00
RE: [Vo]: PhysOrg article on breaking Plank's law
I see more and more instances of when some research is finding things that don't quite agree with 'theory' or 'whats expected', and it always involves some kind of experiment where a physical parameter is way beyond what science has explored. I distinctly remember a quote from one scientist that went something like this...The physical, or electrical, or magnetic properties of a nearly pure substance are, in many instances, quite different from that of the almost pure element. With nanotech, i.e., extremely small dimensions, we are seeing many kinds of unusual phenomena... graphene, a one atom thick sheet of carbon, has very unusual properties, and just might end up replacing the 'silicon' industry. Whenever I see an article that involves experiments with extreme conditions I try to save a copy... got a pile of articles! I think material science will be to this century what the transistor was to last century. -Mark _ From: Frank Roarty [mailto:froarty...@comcast.net] Sent: Monday, August 03, 2009 11:18 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Thomas Prevenslik; 'Jan Naudts'; bourgo...@edgecombe.edu; Garret Moddel; Knibbe, Peter W Subject: RE: [Vo]: PhysOrg article on breaking Plank's law Yes, It is actually one of the paths that led me into adopting Naudts' relativistic solution in that everyone was assuming the hydrogen orbital must be getting smaller because the only other variable in the energy equation was Planck's constant - or not so constant from a relativistic perspective :_) It is the opposite side of the same coin - I call it Lorentz contraction but you can also say Plank's constant gets smaller as the ratio of small to large vacuum flux Increases- I would even propose that it becomes much larger as the ratio goes in the opposite direction approaching C or an event horizon. I just converted a power point to html that touches on this http://www.byzipp.com/energy/excessHeat.htm Fran From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net] Sent: Monday, August 03, 2009 2:03 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]: PhysOrg article on breaking Plank's law It could also be relevant to the thread on Casimir cavities, and the possibility of seeing excess heat from the simply expedient of adding a nano-structured source of Casimir cavities, such as Raney Nickel, to an appropriate medium. Arata Zhang on a budget, so to speak. From: Chris Zell Thank you for posting this. While it deals with the micro level of reality, it still illustrates the problem with reductionism and saying that something is impossible because it violates a physical law. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.42/2279 - Release Date: 08/03/09 05:57:00
[Vo]: PhysOrg article on breaking Plank's law
In this article: Breaking the Planck's law, at the nanoscale http://www.physorg.com/news168101848.html http://www.physorg.com/news168101848.html One of the authors states: Current theory will not be valid once we push down to 1 nanometer spacing. Which is something that I've been saying for almost 2 decades; namely, that all theories are valid only within the range of physical parameters present in confirmatory experiments. Once you get beyond those, be it pressure, temperature, voltage, current, magnetic strength, etc., one cannot be certain that the 'laws of physics' (theory) will still apply. Thus, when one is looking at a phenomenon such as CF or Mills' hydrinos, at least some of the conditions are outside those of experiments which have defined theory. Is it all that difficult to imagine that hot-fusion theories breakdown, or don't even apply, when one is dealing with deuterium-loaded palladium at relatively normal temperatures? I think not... -Mark
RE: [Vo]:How to Build a UFO
LOL!!! That was hilarious! Thx Stephen... -Mark -Original Message- From: Stephen A. Lawrence [mailto:sa...@pobox.com] Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 8:05 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:How to Build a UFO Terry Blanton wrote: Speaking of UFOs on a slow Sunday, this guy has a very interesting interpretation of the lyrics to Hotel California: http://www.inthe70s.com/generated/lyricsmeaning.shtml The Eagles's Hotel California Although I think many of you have hit upon some very interesting ideas about the lyrics here (and justifiable ones at that -- especially the in limbo entries, as that is my 2nd choice regarding the meaning), nobody as yet has suggested that the song is about an alien abduction (yes, I believe in UFOs). [* Note well - the aliens' UFO/planet/people have apparently recreated the look of earth and earthlings to gain confidence and complicity by the abductees.] Here are arguments regarding my theory. 1) First off, the very opening lines certainly point to an abduction -- On a dark desert highway, cool wind in my hair; Warm smell of colitas rising up through the air. Up ahead in the distance I saw a shimmering light -- My head grew heavy, and my sight grew dim; I had to stop for the night. Dissecting these lines, we find the following: 2) 'On a dark desert highway' = aliens nearly always take and perform their experiments at night, and pick remote areas to do so. 3) 'UP' (ahead...) suggests he saw something 'ABOVE' another thing (his car)-- i.e., in this case, the something being the spacecraft. 4) smell of colitas = some abductees report a strange odor emanating from the aliens or in the craft itself (possibly a formaldehyde-like substance??). Nah, all wrong. It's actually all a big mondegreen. Here's the straight skinny, taken straight off a web page so you know it's got to be true: There was this fireworks factory just three blocks from the Hotel California . . . and it blew up! Big tragedy. One of the workers was named Wurn Snell and he was from the town of Colitas in Greece. One of the workers who escaped the explosion talked to another guy . . . I think it was probably Don Henley . . . and Don asked what the guy saw. The worker said, Wurn Snell of Colitas . . . rising up through the air. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.32/2266 - Release Date: 07/27/09 05:58:00
RE: [Vo]:Hydrino represents Lorentz contraction in the opposite direction from event horizon
Stephen wrote: Let's stop right there. The 'present', for any observer, has zero thickness along that observer's time axis. What is zero thickness for a human could be a lifetime at the subatomic level... It all depends on what scale you're talking about... And don't mix scales! -Mark
RE: [Vo]:More From the Steorn Jury
Ed: So what if he's Jewish, or his investors. His jewish teachings didn't cause or encourage his behavior, so why even mention it. And the fact that most of his investors are jewish is also irrelevent. What did cause his reprehensible behavior was good ol' greed, which knows no affiliations, religious, political or otherwise. It's simply a lack of integrity, which seems to be all too prevalent these days; epecially amongst our politicians. I would place the blame more on the parents... -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [mailto:stor...@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 7:51 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:More From the Steorn Jury Mark, The fact is that BM is Jewish and most of the investors he frauded are Jewish. Therefore, the Jewish community is especially outraged. This is not a slight against the Jewish community and provides no reason not to identify this fact. Of course they worked hard for their money and have reason to be outraged. However, I fail to see the relevances of your comment. The Jewish community is a fact of life in the same way the Catholic, Hispanic, or Baptist communities, for example, are a fact. I see nothing wrong with identifying such groups when they are likely to act in a particular way as a group. Ed On Jul 13, 2009, at 10:33 PM, Mark Iverson wrote: Ed: Although a significant proportion of the wealthy and powerful are jewish (and they probably worked hard and smart to get there), I think you could have left the religious background out of your statement and it still would have been accurate... -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [mailto:stor...@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 7:18 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:More From the Steorn Jury Come now, let's be realistic. He did not run because he would not have been safe anywhere in the world. When you damage so many people, many of whom are very powerful and well connected to the Jewish community, you will be killed very soon after leaving the US. Besides, his family was also at risk. He took the only rational path. Ed On Jul 11, 2009, at 8:07 AM, Mauro Lacy wrote: Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: I don't know why he didn't run. He didn't ran because he was a scapegoat. Scapegoats don't run, by their very definition. It's always better to blame it all on a lone shooter, than acknowledge the corruption within the system. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.9/2229 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.12/2235 - Release Date: 07/14/09 05:56:00
RE: [Vo]:More From the Steorn Jury
Ed: Although a significant proportion of the wealthy and powerful are jewish (and they probably worked hard and smart to get there), I think you could have left the religious background out of your statement and it still would have been accurate... -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [mailto:stor...@ix.netcom.com] Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2009 7:18 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:More From the Steorn Jury Come now, let's be realistic. He did not run because he would not have been safe anywhere in the world. When you damage so many people, many of whom are very powerful and well connected to the Jewish community, you will be killed very soon after leaving the US. Besides, his family was also at risk. He took the only rational path. Ed On Jul 11, 2009, at 8:07 AM, Mauro Lacy wrote: Stephen A. Lawrence wrote: I don't know why he didn't run. He didn't ran because he was a scapegoat. Scapegoats don't run, by their very definition. It's always better to blame it all on a lone shooter, than acknowledge the corruption within the system. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.9/2229 - Release Date: 07/11/09 05:57:00
[Vo]:Cold Fusion article on EDN's site...
FYI: Favorable CF article in EDN (Electronic Design News)... http://www.edn.com/blog/40040/post/1750043575.html?nid=2431rid=4465865 Comment section overall pretty reasonable, but with a few of the usual ignorant armchair scientists that are still parroting 20 year-old info. They obviously don't read *THIS* list! ;-) -Mark
Re: [Vo]:Marinov's ball-bearing motor
When I replicated the ball-bearing (marinov) motor about 12 years ago, I thought it might have something to do with longitudinal forces ala the Graneaus (Ampere-Neumann electrodynamics), since it only seemed to manifest with large currents. I didn't have an amp meter back then, but what kind of current do you get from a nearly shorted car battery?A sh*tload... Also showed this thing to Dr. Rueda (Inertia as a zero-point field Lorentzian force), and he was intrigued with it for a short while and was trying to apply the right-hand rule to it... But don't think it captured his attention for much longer than that. -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.92/2203 - Release Date: 06/26/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:Hiddink capacitor links
John: Sorry, I was NOT thinking of you when I wrote that... -Mark _ From: John Berry [mailto:aethe...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 12:14 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Hiddink capacitor links Again I didn't conceal or lie by omission. I said from the start that there is more and there was. My reasons for not giving it all at the start makes sense and was given. Also no results were distorted you must have misunderstood me. Rather a means for the electrons to do what was claimed was left out to simplify the job of communicating the idea as the whole thing is quite large and still not yet covered when we get to the aetheric part of it. Indeed what I first presented the idea I didn't even understand all these connections and it took a while. Giving further evidence that the electrons can gain the ability to leave a glass container and fly into the environment is not required to explain the idea unless someone objects that that should not be possible so I was waiting for that objection. I still have no indication that Bill B. read the post I made especially for him on account of him not having caught my first post on the subject. second post: Energy generating variable capacitor 0 replies Clearly it takes a lot of effort to write large emails and if no one is taking the time to read them as they are then investing more time will probably only reduce the odds of anyone reply, why? The more people are aware they don't know enough to reply the less likely they will be to step in. So since you asked for it (MJ WB) I hope that you will read and reply. I understand not having the time to read lengthy emails and that was my reason for keeping things concise. Implying that my motivation was a form of dishonesty is both confusing to me (I held back evidence that supports my case) and to me somewhat hostile. Hopefully this is simply misunderstanding on both sides. 2009/6/24 Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net Bill wrote: I suggest that it's a VERY bad idea to try distorting results by concealing any parts of it. Concealment is an element of deception, that's why the legal phrase says the WHOLE truth. Such concealment is what manipulative people do. You'd best avoid it. Bill, you're much to Diplomatic... I prefer the more descriptive, albeit blunt, statement, Lying by Omission! :-) Politicians have this down pat... If you don't ask them all the right questions, you'll never get the WHOLE truth. -Mark No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.89/2197 - Release Date: 06/23/09 05:54:00
RE: [Vo]:Hiddink capacitor links
Bill wrote: I suggest that it's a VERY bad idea to try distorting results by concealing any parts of it. Concealment is an element of deception, that's why the legal phrase says the WHOLE truth. Such concealment is what manipulative people do. You'd best avoid it. Bill, you're much to Diplomatic... I prefer the more descriptive, albeit blunt, statement, Lying by Omission! :-) Politicians have this down pat... If you don't ask them all the right questions, you'll never get the WHOLE truth. -Mark
RE: [Vo]:Smoke Ring?
Don't know Steven, I watched the other video link you supplied and surely one is inclined to take the word of those that say they saw it rise from the volcano... This is what's frustrating... SO many questions that need to be asked. If it was a common occurrence then whoever saw a ring rising from the volcano probably did not watch it ascent all the way up to cloudbase... More interesting things to look at. And its way too dark; more like smoke from a petroleum fire. Also, one can't tell how long the video clip was since the news probably just plays it in a loop. HOWEVER, the ring was obviously right at 'lifting condensation level' (cloudbase) since part of it was obscured inside the cloud, and if the ring maintained the near perfect circular shape with well defined edges for 10 minutes, I'd have to see it myself to feel comfortable with the smoke ring explanation, and so I could make some reasonable judgement as to why the turbulence wouldn't have at least partially distorted it... BTW, if I was in my ufo I'd probably hang around above that volcano too so people would think that my 'ride' was a smoke ring, while I was watching the human behavior down below! ;-) -Mark -Original Message- From: OrionWorks [mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, June 20, 2009 10:20 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Smoke Ring? From: Mark Iverson Steven: I did watch the video clip and would disagree with your above statement for the following reason... As a graduate student in the late 80's, I worked at the Atmospheric Sciences Center of the Desert Research Institute: http://www.dri.edu/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=115It emid=127 (now called the Division of Atmospheric Sciences) which is the research branch of the University of Nevada system. I worked under Dr. James Telford who was an expert in cloud microphysics (over 100 peer-reviewed publications). Clouds are NOT uniform stable structures; in fact, they are quite turbulent, with regions (turrets) of rising air columns (due to the fact that moist air is LESS dense than dry air) surrounded by descending (drier) air columns. If the diameter of the ring was much smaller than the dimension of the immediate cloud structure, I'd say you might be right and the ring was simply the boundary of one of the inherent structures of the cloud; but from what I saw in the video, the dimensions of the ring were quite substantial compared to the cloud, and therefore I think it unlikely to be so SHARPLY defined and consistent over the time of the video... i.e., the turbulence would have blurred the boundaries, if not disrupted them completely. -Mark Your description is highly detailed as to why my conjecture was probably incorrect. I must confess that I'm not a meteorologist. Ok, so, what do you think the UFO ring was? BTW, here is another interview where they tracked down the individual who recorded the phenomenon. http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/ireports/2009/06/18/dcl.irpt.knowles.ufo.cnn?iref=videosearch What is revealing was the video recorders' comment that the smoke ring was observed to have originated above the volcano ride. Smoke rings originating from the volcano ride are a very common observance at the amusement park. The rings tend to dissipate more quickly, except when there is no wind. When there is no wind they tend to hang around a tad longer allowing them to be videotaped and subsequently transformed into religious signs. Of course Vince Dinglelint, reporter at large, and from some undetermined future reference point, gave his explanation: Regarding the recent smoke ring phenomenon... Someone forgot to kick in their inertial dampers a few microseconds prior to folding space. But as always, Vince never leaves a return address. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.81/2189 - Release Date: 06/20/09 06:15:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.81/2189 - Release Date: 06/20/09 06:15:00
RE: [Vo]:Smoke Ring?
Steven wrote: The point behind this meandering follow-up post is the fact that the bubble rings these dolphins were manufacturing, once formed, were exceedingly stable as they traveled through the much more dense medium of water. They were quite circular as well. Now, consider the fact that atmospheric smoke rings have less viscosity to deal with, and it seems natural for me to assume that such phenomenon can remain stable in the sky for quite a while before eventually dissipating. Steven: I did watch the video clip and would disagree with your above statement for the following reason... As a graduate student in the late 80's, I worked at the Atmospheric Sciences Center of the Desert Research Institute: http://www.dri.edu/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=115Itemid=127 (now called the Division of Atmospheric Sciences) which is the research branch of the University of Nevada system. I worked under Dr. James Telford who was an expert in cloud microphysics (over 100 peer-reviewed publications). Clouds are NOT uniform stable structures; in fact, they are quite turbulent, with regions (turrets) of rising air columns (due to the fact that moist air is LESS dense than dry air) surrounded by descending (drier) air columns. If the diameter of the ring was much smaller than the dimension of the immediate cloud structure, I'd say you might be right and the ring was simply the boundary of one of the inherent structures of the cloud; but from what I saw in the video, the dimensions of the ring were quite substantial compared to the cloud, and therefore I think it unlikely to be so SHARPLY defined and consistent over the time of the video... i.e., the turbulence would have blurred the boundaries, if not disrupted them completely. -Mark -Original Message- From: OrionWorks [mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 8:28 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Smoke Ring? Terry sez: Whatever this UFO was, it scared the family: http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2009/06/16/dnt.va.ufo.sighting.wav y France, Brazil, Denmark and others have recently opened their UFO files. Is some sort of disclosure underway? Terry I watched the video this morning. No doubt many have seen it since the video has been playing on cnn.com for quite a while. It sure looks like a smoke/vapor ring to me, meaning it would appear to be derived from a natural phenomenon. I gather a major reason some appear to consider the apparition artificial in nature or deliberately manufactured (presumably by some advanced intelligence, i.e. our friends originating from Zeta Reticuli ;-) ) is that the apparition seems perfectly circular in its geometry. I think the reason I'm inclined to assume that the ring is a natural phenomenon is that it remains stationary in the sky. The fact that it also appears to be perfectly circular does not immediately suggest to me that it is artificial in nature. It's my understanding that many things in nature will assume a perfectly circular geometry precisely because a circle/sphere is the most energy efficient/economic topological surface to assume. Bubbles are a perfect example of a perfect sphere. Few here would assume that bubbles are the result of intelligently piloted craft! BTW, there was marvelous you-tube video someone on this list shared many months ago showing dolphins creating exquisitely formed bubble rings. What was extraordinary about this behavior was the fact that these dolphins seemed to know precisely when and/or how to disturb the ring in order to split the bubble vortex into two independent rings. One can not help but acquire the sense that cetations possess an incredible amount of intelligence - to be able to form and manipulate these playthings. It was sheer play for them. Of course, Douglas Adams had plenty to say on the subject of just how intelligent dolphins are. So long! And Thanks for all the fish! The point behind this meandering follow-up post is the fact that the bubble rings these dolphins were manufacturing, once formed, were exceedingly stable as they traveled through the much more dense medium of water. They were quite circular as well. Now, consider the fact that atmospheric smoke rings have less viscosity to deal with, and it seems natural for me to assume that such phenomenon can remain stable in the sky for quite a while before eventually dissipating. My two cents. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.73/2180 - Release Date: 06/17/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.80/2187 - Release Date: 06/19/09 06:53:00
[Vo]:Jed's temporary ban...
Hey Jed, time to go take a vacation and get some RR... Go climb a mountain with your kids. By the time you get back, Bill will have ended the ban...you won't even know it was in effect! Come to think of it, I could really use a vacation too. Now, should I use the 'p' word, or the 'r' word??? :-) -Mark
RE: [Vo]:Question for the Vort collective...
Thanks for the info Robin... I forgot about slow light; and I think there was an article in the last 6 months about a group of researchers actually stopping light. That's a little too beam me up for my taste. But my original posting was this: Has anyone heard of a 'photonic battery'... i.e., a way to store and controllably release photons? The key phrase being controllably release... Then I read your second post about phosphorescence and wiki'd it, and it seems there are some substances that release their 'trapped' photon energy in minutes to hours... That's not bad, but nowhere did it indicate that this release was controllable. It was controlled by the throw the dice quantum mechanical probabilities bullpucky... And John Berry's suggestion of using a black hole, although thought provoking, isn't really practical. Not too many black holes close by, thank religious topic ban in effect; insert favorite deity here. -Mark -Original Message- From: mix...@bigpond.com [mailto:mix...@bigpond.com] Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 3:54 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Question for the Vort collective... In reply to Mark Iverson's message of Wed, 10 Jun 2009 20:29:14 -0700: Hi, [snip] So, to summarize, although some physical/atomic phenomenon exists that kind of, sort of, acts like a photonic battery, there really isn't any commercial or practical product with reasonable functionality... Thx! -Mark BTW - all phosphorescent materials are essentially photonic batteries. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/Project.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.65/2171 - Release Date: 06/12/09 05:55:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.65/2171 - Release Date: 06/12/09 05:55:00
[Vo]:Question for the Vort collective...
Has anyone heard of a 'photonic battery'... i.e., a way to store and controllably release photons? -Mark
RE: [Vo]:Question for the Vort collective...
So, to summarize, although some physical/atomic phenomenon exists that kind of, sort of, acts like a photonic battery, there really isn't any commercial or practical product with reasonable functionality... Thx! -Mark _ From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2009 4:58 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Question for the Vort collective... I think you are stuck on the wrong geometric scale, John. All macro mirrors are lossy, but pico mirrors can be lossless . The implications of Mills’ CQM is that the “orbitsphere” which is the electron orbital, effectively “captures” and retains photons of various energy levels. In effect, the OS is a “mirrored photon container.” Jones From: John Berry A florescent substance in a mirrored container perhaps? A solar cell, a battery, a circuit and an LED bulb? A tree/forrest (burn it, put it out, re igntie it, allow photosynthisis to do it's thing). If IR light then any black object will absorb and re-radiate, again stick it n a mirrored box to keep it 'charged'. On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 5:55 AM, Jones Beene jone...@pacbell.net wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_gamma_emission -Original Message- From: itsat...@gmail.com [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Alexander Hollins I've mentally tried to create something similar for a thought experiement for a device to store sunlight for a roleplaying game im in. I'd be interested in this as well. My thought concept was a sphere, as perfectly mirrored as possible inside, but of a material similar to two way glass, so that a matching but opposite piece in physical contact allows passage of light. vacuum seam it. 2009/6/10 Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net: Has anyone heard of a 'photonic battery'... i.e., a way to store and controllably release photons? -Mark No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.61/2167 - Release Date: 06/10/09 05:52:00
[Vo]:Possible book of interest to Vorts...
FYI, The Crime of Reason and the Closing of the Scientific Mind Robert D. Laughlin, Reviewed by Edward Gerjuoy Basic Books, New York, 2008. $25.95 (186 pp.). ISBN 978-0-465-00507-9 -Mark
RE: [Vo]:grok is removed temporarily
Grok is a coward. If he really believed what he was preaching, then he wouldn't be afraid to use his real name. I think most everyone I'm aware of on this list has apologized at one time or another... It's what a person with integrity does when they realize their mistake or transgression. The fact that grok is incapable of such behavior (all he knows is arrogance and condescension), shows his true self; one lacking humility, reflection, self-awareness consciousness... Asking for an apology and real name are justified in this instance. He will, or already has, tried to blame others for his situation; he needs to point the finger in his direction. I doubt if he is even capable of that... Personal responsibility is something he hasn't shown either. -Mark -Original Message- From: William Beaty [mailto:bi...@eskimo.com] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 10:54 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:grok is removed temporarily On Sun, 7 Jun 2009, Harry Veeder wrote: Grok said no thanks, to the above. I am not sure why he should apologize for his off-topic postings, Political posting sent here, rather than to vtxB. If you expect him to reveal his true identity then that should be written in the rules. Nope. If any user misbehaves so badly that they draw complaints from the entire community, then I'll fix the problem, which includes crafting arbitrary and mysterious requirements on a whim. As with any professional community, people with real names are welcome, and people who hide their identities have marked themselves as probably criminal element in the eyes of the group ...although on internet, anonymity also means teenager, or newbie user. (Which of the three is worse?) To impress fellow professionals, always put your address and phone number in your sig. This is an unwritten societal rule which applies to the entire world, not just online or on vortex: try walking around downtown wearing a mask, see what happens. Perhaps vortex should require surrendering anonymity, but it's much work to do it right (to avoid fake identities.) If the political commentary incorporates *personal* insults, instead of There is very specifically no rule against insults on Vortex-L. However, people who habitually use personal insults will attract complaints from the entire community, and then... (see above.) (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:grok is removed temporarily
You know what they say... If it looks, walks and quacks like a duck (troll), it probably is. -Mark -Original Message- From: William Beaty [mailto:bi...@eskimo.com] Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 12:52 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:grok is removed temporarily On Sun, 7 Jun 2009, Mark Iverson wrote: I think most everyone I'm aware of on this list has apologized at one time or another... It's what a person with integrity does when they realize their mistake or transgression. Trademarks of the troll/flamer/fsckhead are, refusal to apologize, plus use of anonymous IDs to prevent any searches which would expose discussions of their misbehavior or history of being banned from many forums. Megalothymia - the need to be seen as being superior to other people. See this article: http://amasci.com/weird/fsckhead.html - A Troll Must Have An Exaggerated Sense of His/Her Own Importance - A Troll Must Refuse to Abide By Common Social Rules - A Troll Must Never Back Down When Caught In A Lie - A Troll Must Keep Coming Back Without Mending His/Her Ways My own secret: this describes everyone in my family, myself included! I've grown some since then though. Seen from inside, additional characteristics are: demonizing everyone around us, while spouting a stream of self-praise, self-aggrandizement. (It's because of an insecurity so profound that the alternative to self-prase is psychosis.) Other characteristics are: loner, warrior, solitary hunter, won't keep his lawn mowed or house painted, won't tolerate crowds, sees other people as opponents searching for weakness, or as cattle. We end up as criminals and transients, but also as police, also as political leaders. The village hangman doesn't get invited to many parties, but doesn't really notice. He will, or already has, tried to blame others for Trolls will frequently use a persecution defense when they are asked to cease their antisocial behavior. They may claim that they are being singled out because of their unpopular viewpoints (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.56/2162 - Release Date: 06/08/09 06:01:00
RE: [Vo]:110 MPG automobile engine
And one would think that this motor is a gutless wonder. Not so fast, but the motor is. Here are basic specs: HP2g Specs: - V8 Engine - 400 HP (horsepower) - 500 Ft. Lbs. Tq. (foot pounds of torque) - 110 MPGe (miles per gallon energy equivalent) - E-85 (ethanol fuel) - Made in the USA Is the guy Charles Pogue resurrected? So all you muscle-car lovers can have your cake and eat it too! -Mark -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [mailto:temal...@usfamily.net] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 6:27 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:110 MPG automobile engine http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009905300338 --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:110 MPG automobile engine
Looking into this some more... It looks legit. Only tidbit I've seen so far about the tech is that they are using very high compression and advanced electronics... And E85 ethanol as the fuel. They just pulled out of the X-prize competition... Here's the press release as to why: http://www.hp2g.com/pressrelease.html Here are the reasons why they pulled out: (1) X PRIZE reduced the prize amount for the Mainstream class of the competition from $7.5 million to $5 million; (2) in our opinion, a problematic conflict of interest occurred when X PRIZE allowed one of the accepted letter of intent contenders to be a part of the competition rule setting and ultimate team evaluation processes; and (3) the changing by X PRIZE of the race date from the summer of 2009 to the summer of 2010 resulted in the race no longer fitting into the business plan... Wonder who that contender was, and did *they* suggest the competition be put off a year??? Enquiring minds want to know... Since the HP2g vehicle would have easily won the competition, this would have been $7.5M (recently reduced to $5M) in prize money which HP2g was planning on using to start up engine manufacturing. Competitive forces trying to delay that effort??? Fortunately, in this evil, obsolete capitalistic society, Doug has plenty of interested investors to move this technology to market. -Mark -Original Message- From: Mark Iverson [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 10:09 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:110 MPG automobile engine And one would think that this motor is a gutless wonder. Not so fast, but the motor is. Here are basic specs: HP2g Specs: - V8 Engine - 400 HP (horsepower) - 500 Ft. Lbs. Tq. (foot pounds of torque) - 110 MPGe (miles per gallon energy equivalent) - E-85 (ethanol fuel) - Made in the USA Is the guy Charles Pogue resurrected? So all you muscle-car lovers can have your cake and eat it too! -Mark -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [mailto:temal...@usfamily.net] Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 6:27 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:110 MPG automobile engine http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2009905300338 --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.55/2160 - Release Date: 06/07/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:The Science of Greenhouse Effect...Time for some balance?
Give me the reference, even if its not peer-reviewed... -Mark -Original Message- From: leaking pen [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 10:41 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:The Science of Greenhouse Effect...Time for some balance? Im not too familiar with some of the mathematic principles mentioned, but i did find this First, he mis-applies the Virial theorem. The virial theorem applies to kinetic vs. potential energy, and it can be shown that for an atmosphere in equilibrium it is trivially satisfied by any hydrostically balanced atmosphere. The second error is that he misapplies Kirchoff's laws --in fact the so-called application of these laws bears no relation to the actual statement of the laws. Both of these errors are in the first 9 pages. You can spot the error in the virial theorem because the dimensions aren't right -- he applies the theorem to energy fluxes, rather than energy, and his result is just a fiction. as a comment on the paper. perhaps others here can make more sense of it. as for changing albedo... you mean, through increased city building, melting and spreading of the oceans, and deforestation? the albedo of the earth is indeed changing. 2009/6/3 Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net: Or has the balance always been there? Dr. Ferenc Miskolczi has quite a distinguished scientific career, including a number of years at NASA Langley. It's a long read, but well worth it... http://hpsregi.elte.hu/zagoni/NEW/ZM-MF_short.pdf And here is one of his later peer-reviewed publications: http://hpsregi.elte.hu/zagoni/NEW/2007.pdf -Mark Dr. Miskolczi's theses: 1.There are hitherto unrealized global average relationships between certain longwave flux components in the Earth’s atmosphere; 2.The new relations directly link global mean surface temperature to the incoming shortwave radiation F0 ; 3.The Earth’s atmosphere optimally utilizes all available incoming energy; its greenhouse effect works on the possible energetic top; 4.The classical semi-infinite solution of the Earth's atmospheric radiative transfer problem does not contain the correct boundary conditions; it underestimates the global average near-surface air temperatures and overestimates the ground temperatures; 5.Recent models significantly overestimate the sensitivity of greenhouse forcing to optical depth perturbations; 6.Resolving the paradox of temperature discontinuity at the ground, a new energy balance constraint can be recognized; 7.The Earth’s atmosphere, satisfying the energy minimum principle, is configured to the most effective cooling of the planet with an equilibrium global average vertical temperature and moisture profile; 8.The Earth-atmosphere system maintains a virtually saturated greenhouse effect with a critical equilibrium global average IR flux optical depth tauA = 1.87; excess or deficit in this global average optical depth violates fundamental energetic principles; 9.As long as the Earth has the oceans as practically infinite natural sources and sinks of optical depth in the form of water vapor, the system is able to maintain this critical optical depth and the corresponding stable global mean surface temperature; 10. The new transfer and greenhouse functions, based on the finite, semi-transparent solution of the Schwarzschild-Milne equation with real boundary conditions adequately reproduce both the Earth’s and the Martian atmospheric greenhouse effect; 11. The Kiehl-Trenberth 1997 global mean energy budget estimate (c.f. IPCC 2007 AR4 WG1 FAQ1.1. Fig.1.) is erroneous; the U.S. Standard Atmosphere (USST-76) does not represent the real global average temperature profile (not in radiative equilibrium, not in energy balance, not enough H2O); it should not be used as a single-column model for global energy budget studies; 12. The observed global warming on the Earth has nothing directly to do with changes in atmospheric IR absorber concentrations; it must be related to variations in the total available incoming F0 solar plus P0 heat energy (geothermal, ocean-atmosphere heat exchange, industrial heat generation etc.). Runaway greenhouse effect contradicts the energy conservation principle; global mean surface warming is possible only if the solar luminosity, the Earth-Sun distance and/or the planetary albedo changes (depending on the extent of the cryosphere, on cloud coverage, and/or on the varying surface properties according to land use change etc.); 13. Without water vapor feedback, the primary greenhouse sensitivity to a doubling CO2 theoretically would be about 0.24 K, according to the semi-transparent solution of the radiation equations
RE: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research
There was also a woman archaeologist who was studying digs in Mexico or elsewhere in Central/South America that strongly supported the conclusion that modern man has been in the Americas much longer than is the current mainstream thinking... Can't remember her name, but she was having a very tough time. -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:33 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research On May 31, 2009, at 6:57 PM, William Beaty wrote: Gerald Pollack, a sucessful maverick biochemist at the UW, is trying to collect a list of books which describe crazy fringe research projects and proposals not currently attracting any government funding. My own list is below. Any more suggestions? Book suggestions, NOT research proposals. Also, collections of taboo topics are desired over books about individuals. I don't now of a book, but the story of Helicobacter pylori is a classic. Here is an article (from csicop no less) that provides lots of references: http://www.csicop.org/si/2004-11/bacteria.html Maybe the subject is covered in one or more of the books below. It is still controversial because a large number of people have Helicobacter pylori without bad side effects. It may even prevent cancer. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. Beatyhttp://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/ beaty chem washington edu Research Engineer billbamascicom UW Chem Dept, Bagley Hall RM74 206-543-6195Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700 THE SOURCEBOOK PROJECT: FRONTIERS OF SCIENCE Compiled by WR Corliss INFINITE ENERGY MAGAZINE THE CONSCIOUS UNIVERSE Dr. Dean Radin FORBIDDEN ARCHEOLOGY Michael Cremo SEVEN EXPERIMENTS THAT COULD CHANGE THE WORLD, A do-it yourself guide to revolutionary science, Rupert Sheldrake FORBIDDEN SCIENCE, Suppressed research that could change our lives Richard Milton SCIENTIFIC LITERACY AND THE MYTH OF THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD Henry H. Bauer DEVIANT SCIENCE The Case of Parapsychology, James McClenon DARWIN'S CREATION MYTH, by Alexander Mebane COSMIC PLASMAS, by Hannes Aflven THE ELECTRIC UNIVERSE Thornhill Talbott DARK LIFE Michael Taylor THE DEEP HOT BIOSPHERE Thomas Gold THE ENCYCLOPEDIA OF IGNORANCE Ronald Duncan, Miranda Weston-Smith eds. Also, any tales of vindicated heretics? HIDDEN HISTORIES OF SCIENCE R. Silvers, ed. 1995 CONFRONTING THE EXPERTS, B. Martin, ed., 1996 THE ART OF SCIENTIFIC INVESTIGATION, W. Beveridge 1950 SCIENCE IS A SACRED COW, Anthony Standen 1950 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.50/2150 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.52/2152 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00
[Vo]:The Science of Greenhouse Effect...Time for some balance?
Or has the balance always been there? Dr. Ferenc Miskolczi has quite a distinguished scientific career, including a number of years at NASA Langley. It's a long read, but well worth it... http://hpsregi.elte.hu/zagoni/NEW/ZM-MF_short.pdf And here is one of his later peer-reviewed publications: http://hpsregi.elte.hu/zagoni/NEW/2007.pdf -Mark Dr. Miskolczi's theses: 1.There are hitherto unrealized global average relationships between certain longwave flux components in the Earth’s atmosphere; 2.The new relations directly link global mean surface temperature to the incoming shortwave radiation F0 ; 3.The Earth’s atmosphere optimally utilizes all available incoming energy; its greenhouse effect works on the possible energetic top; 4.The classical semi-infinite solution of the Earth's atmospheric radiative transfer problem does not contain the correct boundary conditions; it underestimates the global average near-surface air temperatures and overestimates the ground temperatures; 5.Recent models significantly overestimate the sensitivity of greenhouse forcing to optical depth perturbations; 6.Resolving the paradox of temperature discontinuity at the ground, a new energy balance constraint can be recognized; 7.The Earth’s atmosphere, satisfying the energy minimum principle, is configured to the most effective cooling of the planet with an equilibrium global average vertical temperature and moisture profile; 8.The Earth-atmosphere system maintains a virtually saturated greenhouse effect with a critical equilibrium global average IR flux optical depth tauA = 1.87; excess or deficit in this global average optical depth violates fundamental energetic principles; 9.As long as the Earth has the oceans as practically infinite natural sources and sinks of optical depth in the form of water vapor, the system is able to maintain this critical optical depth and the corresponding stable global mean surface temperature; 10. The new transfer and greenhouse functions, based on the finite, semi-transparent solution of the Schwarzschild-Milne equation with real boundary conditions adequately reproduce both the Earth’s and the Martian atmospheric greenhouse effect; 11. The Kiehl-Trenberth 1997 global mean energy budget estimate (c.f. IPCC 2007 AR4 WG1 FAQ1.1. Fig.1.) is erroneous; the U.S. Standard Atmosphere (USST-76) does not represent the real global average temperature profile (not in radiative equilibrium, not in energy balance, not enough H2O); it should not be used as a single-column model for global energy budget studies; 12. The observed global warming on the Earth has nothing directly to do with changes in atmospheric IR absorber concentrations; it must be related to variations in the total available incoming F0 solar plus P0 heat energy (geothermal, ocean-atmosphere heat exchange, industrial heat generation etc.). Runaway greenhouse effect contradicts the energy conservation principle; global mean surface warming is possible only if the solar luminosity, the Earth-Sun distance and/or the planetary albedo changes (depending on the extent of the cryosphere, on cloud coverage, and/or on the varying surface properties according to land use change etc.); 13. Without water vapor feedback, the primary greenhouse sensitivity to a doubling CO2 theoretically would be about 0.24 K, according to the semi-transparent solution of the radiation equations in a bounded atmosphere. But taking into account all the energetic constraints, the actual value is 0.0 K. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.52/2152 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research
Could be, but I don't remember her name... It's been years since I've read anything about her. -Mark -Original Message- From: bangdon12 [mailto:bangdo...@cox.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 10:36 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research Are you refering to Virginia Steen-McIntyre ? Chuck Kinney - Original Message - From: Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 9:10 PM Subject: RE: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research There was also a woman archaeologist who was studying digs in Mexico or elsewhere in Central/South America that strongly supported the conclusion that modern man has been in the Americas much longer than is the current mainstream thinking... Can't remember her name, but she was having a very tough time. -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 4:33 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Need big list of legit heretical research On May 31, 2009, at 6:57 PM, William Beaty wrote: Gerald Pollack, a sucessful maverick biochemist at the UW, is trying to collect a list of books which describe crazy fringe research projects and proposals not currently attracting any government funding. My own list is below. Any more suggestions? Book suggestions, NOT research proposals. Also, collections of taboo topics are desired over books about individuals. I don't now of a book, but the story of Helicobacter pylori is a classic. Here is an article (from csicop no less) that provides lots of references: http://www.csicop.org/si/2004-11/bacteria.html Maybe the subject is covered in one or more of the books below. It is still controversial because a large number of people have Helicobacter pylori without bad side effects. It may even prevent cancer. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. Beatyhttp://staff.washington.edu/wbeaty/ beaty chem washington edu Research Engineer billbamascicom UW Chem Dept, Bagley Hall RM74 206-543-6195Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700 THE SOURCEBOOK PROJECT: FRONTIERS OF SCIENCE Compiled by WR Corliss INFINITE ENERGY MAGAZINE THE CONSCIOUS UNIVERSE Dr. Dean Radin FORBIDDEN ARCHEOLOGY Michael Cremo SEVEN EXPERIMENTS THAT COULD CHANGE THE WORLD, A do-it yourself guide to revolutionary science, Rupert Sheldrake FORBIDDEN SCIENCE, Suppressed research that could change our lives Richard Milton SCIENTIFIC LITERACY AND THE MYTH OF THE SCIENTIFIC METHOD Henry H. Bauer DEVIANT SCIENCE The Case of Parapsychology, James McClenon DARWIN'S CREATION MYTH, by Alexander Mebane COSMIC PLASMAS, by Hannes Aflven THE ELECTRIC UNIVERSE Thornhill Talbott DARK LIFE Michael Taylor THE DEEP HOT BIOSPHERE Thomas Gold THE ENCYCLOPEDIA OF IGNORANCE Ronald Duncan, Miranda Weston-Smith eds. Also, any tales of vindicated heretics? HIDDEN HISTORIES OF SCIENCE R. Silvers, ed. 1995 CONFRONTING THE EXPERTS, B. Martin, ed., 1996 THE ART OF SCIENTIFIC INVESTIGATION, W. Beveridge 1950 SCIENCE IS A SACRED COW, Anthony Standen 1950 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.50/2150 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.52/2152 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.52/2152 - Release Date: 06/03/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:Inventors and Uberman/polyphasic sleep
Perhaps so, but it doesn't even compare to some of the comments he has made towards the members of this group... Nothing of his rantings indicate that he even has any sense of that either. At least I do... -Mark -Original Message- From: leaking pen [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 10:04 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Inventors and Uberman/polyphasic sleep That was unfair, mean spirited, and does not belong in this conversation. Alex 2009/5/31 Mark Iverson zeropo...@charter.net: I wonder what type of sleep schedule our primitive ancestors had. Ask grok... -Mark -Original Message- From: leaking pen [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 7:11 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Inventors and Uberman/polyphasic sleep That makes sense. Actually, hunh. like cats and most other hunting animals. I wonder what type of sleep schedule our primitive ancestors had. On Sun, May 31, 2009 at 6:07 PM, William Beaty bi...@eskimo.com wrote: On Sun, 31 May 2009, leaking pen wrote: on the uberman sleep schedule... im confused... Different groups seem to worship different schedules. As for me, I found that I'd be happily working away, when suddenly I'd hit a wall. I'd have to crawl off to collapse somewhere for a few minutes REM sleep. But then it would pass, and I'd leap up and go strong for several more hours. A fast-cycling biological clock, no theories, just empirical. And once this phenomenon grabbed me, it continued without further effort. However, to switch back to 8hr nightly sleep, *huge* effort was needed. (In a different situation we might say insomnia is no joke.) I also found what NOT to do: if I kept working through the haze, I'd wake up again, and could continue for hours. But the missed naps had bad effects, both healthwise and for avoiding something resembling schitzophrenia. So I learned to take the onset of groggyness very seriously, and not skip any naps, even if I was supposed to be in a work meeting, etc. After moving a couple years ago, i had a LOT of laundry to do. to get through it all, i spent 3 days setting my alarm clock at roughly hour intervals. get up with the alarm, change dryer and washer loads, fold clothes, back to sleep for an hour. I got about 6 actual hours of sleep a night, and fantastic sleep. Why spread it through the day? why not just artificially reset your sleep schedule by waking up for 10 to 15 ever 40 minutes or so? Once you get into that mode, you start sleeping and waking naturally with no alarm clocks. But sleeps might be 10-30 minutes long, with several waking hours between. And when sleep time arrives, there's no mistaking it, it's like drinking a large glass of vodka. (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2145 - Release Date: 05/31/09 05:53:00
RE: [Vo]:Inventors and Uberman/polyphasic sleep
I wonder what type of sleep schedule our primitive ancestors had. Ask grok... -Mark -Original Message- From: leaking pen [mailto:itsat...@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 7:11 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Inventors and Uberman/polyphasic sleep That makes sense. Actually, hunh. like cats and most other hunting animals. I wonder what type of sleep schedule our primitive ancestors had. On Sun, May 31, 2009 at 6:07 PM, William Beaty bi...@eskimo.com wrote: On Sun, 31 May 2009, leaking pen wrote: on the uberman sleep schedule... im confused... Different groups seem to worship different schedules. As for me, I found that I'd be happily working away, when suddenly I'd hit a wall. I'd have to crawl off to collapse somewhere for a few minutes REM sleep. But then it would pass, and I'd leap up and go strong for several more hours. A fast-cycling biological clock, no theories, just empirical. And once this phenomenon grabbed me, it continued without further effort. However, to switch back to 8hr nightly sleep, *huge* effort was needed. (In a different situation we might say insomnia is no joke.) I also found what NOT to do: if I kept working through the haze, I'd wake up again, and could continue for hours. But the missed naps had bad effects, both healthwise and for avoiding something resembling schitzophrenia. So I learned to take the onset of groggyness very seriously, and not skip any naps, even if I was supposed to be in a work meeting, etc. After moving a couple years ago, i had a LOT of laundry to do. to get through it all, i spent 3 days setting my alarm clock at roughly hour intervals. get up with the alarm, change dryer and washer loads, fold clothes, back to sleep for an hour. I got about 6 actual hours of sleep a night, and fantastic sleep. Why spread it through the day? why not just artificially reset your sleep schedule by waking up for 10 to 15 ever 40 minutes or so? Once you get into that mode, you start sleeping and waking naturally with no alarm clocks. But sleeps might be 10-30 minutes long, with several waking hours between. And when sleep time arrives, there's no mistaking it, it's like drinking a large glass of vodka. (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb at amasci com http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci
RE: [Vo]:Latest from Mylow
Unfortunately, the iron stator magnet does not hold its charge very well (an inherent issue with that type of magnet in any context), ... [deletions] Mylow said that there is a shop near him that he takes his stator magnet to re-magnetize it. Correct me if I missed something, but the STATOR magnet is IRON, not alnico! Its the stator (iron) that is demagnetizing, not the alnico magnets. Which makes sense; the alnico magnets are going to have a much stronger B-field than the iron, and perhaps the alnico magnets are forcing the magnetic domains in the iron to lose their alignment... Why the different magnets? There was some mention of asymmetry involved... is it asymmetric with respect to magnet material? Did he try using neodymiums? -Mark -Original Message- From: OrionWorks [mailto:svj.orionwo...@gmail.com] Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 10:35 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Latest from Mylow From Harry Veeder: Somewhere he said the bar magnets came from radioshack. I would like to see him cover the Aluminum disk with something non-magnetic. Yes, indeed! I tracked down some additional info on the subject. A very good description of Mylow's detailed explorations of the HJ configuruation can be found at the Pure Energy Systems web site, by Sterling D. Allan: http://pesn.com/2009/03/20/9501532_Mylow-replicates-Johnson-magnet-motor/ http://tinyurl.com/cwjkzy Mylow's rotor assembly consists of a flat aluminum disk (diameter 17 1/8 inches in diameter) with rows of alnico magnets glued to the surface in various asymmetrical configurations. Excerpts, and of particular interest to me: Mylow is aware of the eddy current phenomenon: If you drop a magnet down a tube of aluminum or copper, it will drop much more slowly due to the eddy currents being created as it passes by the aluminum or copper. He thinks that perhaps these eddy currents are part of what makes this motor work. That would be my suspicion as well. Unfortunately, the iron stator magnet does not hold its charge very well (an inherent issue with that type of magnet in any context), and the speed gradually diminishes. When I was on the phone with him a couple of nights ago, we were counting revolutions per minute, we timed it at around 77 rpm (36 rev in 28 seconds). That was after it had run nearly continuously for a couple of days (stopping temporarily to take measurements, video, etc). He has reported that the longest he has had it running without stopping has been about twenty-six hours. Mylow said that there is a shop near him that he takes his stator magnet to re-magnetize it. He said they have a big electromagnet, and the process includes quenching the magnet in a hydrogen bath for five minutes. After it is recharged, the magnet works best for about two to three hours, after which it begins growing weak. ... One thing that I've noted with a bit of paradoxical humor is that Mylow seems to be tape-measure challenged. As I was trying to get dimensions from him in our phone call, he didn't know that the smallest lines on his tape measure were 1/16 of an inch. I had him count how many lines there were between an inch. And the initial dimensions he gave me, as hard as he tried to give them to me accurately, were not right. So last night (3/19/09) he posted a video of the magnets next to a Data Scan Ruler so we could read the dimensions for ourselves. He is also a bit challenged in his spelling, punctuation, and grammar, but none of these things seems to slow him down. He is glad to share and answer questions people have. Remember that some people who appear to be challenged in easy things, are usually compensated by superior talent in other areas, such as intuition or following hunches. It may be thanks to his measurement ability challenge that he visually spaced the sets of seven magnets with gaps in-between, but ended up with the last set not fitting in symmetrically. If it were easy for him to make and calculate measurements, he probably would have had everything symmetrically arranged, and it would not have worked. So his handicap was actually part of the serendipity that enable him to stumble onto this success. I couldn't agree more. ;-) Without my spellchecker, well... I don't even want to go there. In regards to the energy issue, whether OU might exist, the following paragraph, IMO, is particularly revealing: He [Mylow] stopped by the place he goes to get the stator magnet remagnetized yesterday afternoon to get permission to give out their name and address as part of our reporting. They preferred that he not do that since they are doing this as a favor to him, and they only want to receive commercial orders. But if that point is made clear, they may permit him to reveal their identity. They also told him (paraphrasing), We can't keep remagnetizing your magnet for you. It costs us a
RE: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
I think I figured it out... Grok is not a real person. It’s a mediocre computer sci student's implementation of the Turing Test! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turing_test Barely passing grade if you ask me. But it'd probably keep the shrinks busy for a few hours. ;-) -Mark -Original Message- From: grok [mailto:g...@resist.ca] Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 7:56 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, mix...@bigpond.com mix...@bigpond.com mounted the barricade and roared out: I think salient question is What makes people feel frightened and insecure? It is indeed a salient question. Nevertheless, I think I would prefer to explore what makes us happy. ... People are happy when they get what they want, and they want to have their cake and eat it too. :) Pure socialism epitomizes fairness. Pure capitalism epitomizes freedom. That's a completely false juxtaposition. 'License' is not Freedom -- even tho' the capitalists make it their business to see to it that people do not make the distinction. Fact is, socialism is about Fairness AND Freedom -- because for one thing: being fair is all about being free. Think about it. To wit: What people really want is both fairness and freedom. They need not be totally mutually exclusive, but they must be to some extent. The point has been well-made that true freedom comes with understanding the real and concrete limits imposed by necessity -- i.e. it is only a false, ideal image we have of any 'Freedom' that doesn't have much, if anything, to do with real life. Understanding real limits allows us to understand just how we are _actually_ free in any meaningful sense. IOW we will never be totally happy. The problem with idealist thinking is that it deals in abstract absolutes - -- which have not much to do with Reality. People will be as happy as any animal can be, under communism (never for long, if ever, under capitalism). And who could want more. ; - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn5E0QACgkQXo3EtEYbt3HDiwCdF2lI24TyVZEvovifVwjPu3Ot MzIAnRJ2wy2josDnxurvxwbpH4xvG2P6 =tPgF -END PGP SIGNATURE- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.12.8/2086 - Release Date: 4/29/2009 6:37 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.12.8/2086 - Release Date: 4/29/2009 6:37 AM
[Vo]: 60 Minutes - One intelligent critique.
Out of all the comments on the 60-minutes website, there is ONE reasonable critique which shows the person put some effort to research the subject matter and he asks some legitimate questions. I'd be very interested in reading Jed's, Ed's and any other Vorts' analysis of this gentlemen's material (see below)? -Mark [copied from the 60-Minutes website RE: comments to the Cold Fusion segment] Posted by joclondon at 7:47 AM : Apr 21, 2009 The comments by Richard Garwood, in your report, were probably correct. He suggested there may have been an error in measuring the input of electrical energy. The possibility of a 'systematic error' in the test protocols was also mentioned by Prof John Huizenga in his 1989 report to the US Dept of Energy. (DOE/S-0073 DE90 005611.) The following mechanism, from established, orthodox physics, may explain the source of the error. (Originally proposed in 2006.) That the under-recording of input electrical energy is due to the development of a phase shift between the current and the voltage in the electrical supply circuit. This results from the generation, during the course of the experiment, of highly polarised bubbles, [1]between the electrodes of the electrolytic cell. The polarisation of the ions in the boundary layer of these bubbles is accentuated by the presence of the electrode field. The polarised bubbles introduce a small capacitance value into what was initially a conventional DC circuit. With a highly stable DC source of input energy this is not a problem. However, in many of the tests analysed researchers have utilised variously, high frequency DC or AC supplies. As examples see, Eccles [2], Yamazaki [3], Piantelli [4], Storms [5], and Patterson [6]. The phase shift phenomenon in resistive/capacitive circuits is well documented. Although it is normally only looked at in detail in power factor correction problems. How you measure the input energy in such circuits becomes critically important. Current and voltage should be measured seperately, ideally with continuous high speed recording. The unreported input energy is likely to give a high speed transient signal. The use of conventional watt meters to measure input electrical power is likely to be problematical. Also the use of too long a sampling interval, or moving coil devices or visual inspection may not detect the transient signal. The conditions which appear to favour the presence of 'excess heat' are also those which facilitate phase shift. 1) A pulsed or oscillating supply current. The high the frequency the better. 2) a large interfacial area between the electrolyte and the generated gas bubbles, between the electrodes. Storms [5], page 6, and Patterson [7] and [8], may not have produced a catalytic surface as claimed, but merely an efficient method for producing gas nucleation sites. 3) A highly ionised electrolyte. 4) A high voltage between the electrodes. Features 1) and 2) must occur simultaneously, features 3) and 4) are desirable and serve to enhance the basic reaction. Any future claims for the generation of excess energy, (not just electrolytic cells) should incorporate and document means for the detection of phase shift. [1] Leonard B Loed. Static Electrification, 1958. Pub: Springer, Berlin. Page 66. [2] Patent: US 2005/0236376 A1. [3] Patent: EP 0 392 325 A2. [4] Patent: WO 95/20816. [5] E Storms. J. Fusion Technol., 29 (1996) 261. [6] Patent: US 2006/093874. [7] Patent: WO 97/39164. [8] Patent: WO 05/03437. Posted by joclondon at 7:47 AM : Apr 21, 2009 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.12.1/2070 - Release Date: 4/20/2009 5:56 PM
RE: [Vo]:It will be ironic if 60 Minutes has a major effect
Jed wrote: So many energy problems could have been solved by now, and so many lives saved, if only scientists had done their job. It sure seems that when we most needed science, it failed us, utterly. Well, not the 'institution' of science, but the scientists turned politicians. And what do we expect when humans are administering science? Where is Lt.Cmdr. Data when you need him? :-) Picard/Data in 2012! -Mark -Original Message- From: Jed Rothwell [mailto:jedrothw...@gmail.com] Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 1:38 PM To: vortex-L@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:It will be ironic if 60 Minutes has a major effect If 60 Minutes has a major effect on public opinion, and helps free up funding for the field, that will not surprise me. But it will be ironic. It will demonstrate that scientists and decision makers in government tend to be more influenced by the mass media than by scientific publications. The tide does seem to be turning. Press coverage is more friendly than it used to be. More facts and fewer rumors are reported. But funding is still dreadfully restricted and I still fear that the researchers will not live long enough to make significant progress. Based on previous press reports favorable toward cold fusion, such as a report of the Arata experiment last year, I predict this event it will increase Internet chatter and traffic to LENR-CANR for a few weeks, and then fade away. But the effect may linger long enough to jog a few decision-makers to allocate a few more dollars, or perhaps a few million more! And that is all we need. We require an end to the beginning, if not the beginning of the end. We do not need Nature and Scientific American to wave a white flag and admit they were wrong. I predict that the present editors and writers at these journals will never do that, unless commercial products are rolled out, which I regard as highly unlikely under the present circumstances. But I could be wrong about them. I never imaged that Robert Park would give an inch. Of course he needs to give a mile, which he will never do. The other day I told Mizuno that Maddox died, and I related the famous quote about cold fusion will remain dead for a long time which is surely an enigmatic thing to say. Did he mean that he hoped it would revive only after he was gone? Mizuno responded: perhaps I should be angry at the man but honestly I pity him. Here was the most important and interesting discovery in his lifetime and he never even looked at it. What a wasted opportunity. That is how I feel about the whole history of cold fusion. So much talent wasted; so many years. So many energy problems could have been solved by now, and so many lives saved, if only scientists had done their job. I do not blame the mass media for this sad history. I blame scientists and scientific administrators at places like the DOE and the APS. The ones who never looked at the experiments. They never did their jobs. Huizenga and the DoE review panels. Of course there is plenty of blame to go around. Even the cold fusion researchers share a small tiny fraction of the blame for this fiasco, but they are more sinned against than sinning. - Jed No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.59/2064 - Release Date: 4/17/2009 7:08 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.59/2064 - Release Date: 4/17/2009 7:08 AM
RE: [Vo]:NIF Ready to Prove Cold Fusion, according to Softpedia ;)
Are the hot fusioneers so threatened by what's going on with CF that they are now trying to relabel their projects as 'cold fusion'??? The second paragraph of the NIF article starts out with this... Cold fusion is one of the main goals of scientific research today, for the simple reason that it relies on a very cheap fuel (heavy water that can be obtained from seawater) to create virtually limitless amounts of electricity, with zero-emissions. So they are claiming that 192 HUGE lasers focused on a pellet the size of a pea is 'cold'??? Sounds delusional to me... The real thing this time, not the 'character assassination' kind that was spoken 20 years ago... The tides are indeed turning... And quickly!! -Mark -Original Message- From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 1:07 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:NIF Ready to Prove Cold Fusion, according to Softpedia ;) http://news.softpedia.com/news/NIF-Ready-to-Prove-Cold-Fusion-Sustainable-108208.shtml No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.34/2032 - Release Date: 3/31/2009 6:02 AM
RE: [Vo]:NIF Ready to Prove Cold Fusion, according to Softpedia ;)
Perhaps he was just reporting what the scientist told him... In which case, the scientists really are threatened by the recent developments in CF! -Mark -Original Message- From: Terry Blanton [mailto:hohlr...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 12:55 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:NIF Ready to Prove Cold Fusion, according to Softpedia ;) I'm not sure of anything. :-) However look at the bottom tag words. He placed CF first. Or he could just be stupid. I guess we could apply Hanlon's Razor here. Terry On Wed, Apr 1, 2009 at 2:55 PM, Steven Krivit stev...@newenergytimes.com wrote: At 04:12 AM 4/1/2009, you wrote: Indeed the tides are turning. This reporter clearly knows it is not CF when he speaks of the effect on the hohlraum: Terry, Did *I* miss something? I thought for sure the reporter made an ignorant yet innocent mistake...how confident are you that the fellow understood the difference between hf and cf? I have alerts on all uses of the F word. Steve It works by focusing the light from 192 gigantic laser beams onto a small hydrogen pellet, with the purpose of obtaining temperatures that are high enough to initiate and sustain nuclear fusion. The shrewed fellow is taking advantage of recent news since he has CF as his first tag or keyword. I bet Steven was alerted by a news service because of that keyword. Terry No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.35/2034 - Release Date: 4/1/2009 6:06 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.35/2034 - Release Date: 4/1/2009 6:06 AM
RE: [Vo]:Sakaurajima volcano erupts
Horace: Have you ever been to Kodiak Island? -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2009 8:22 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Sakaurajima volcano erupts On Mar 10, 2009, at 5:59 AM, Jed Rothwell wrote: A Meteorological Agency video camera captured dramatic images of a volcano erupting a few hours ago in Japan, at 6 am local time. The video is here at the Asahi newspaper website (text in Japanese): http://www.asahi.com/video/news/TKY200903100244.html The location is at Sakurajima, Kagoshima pref. in south Kyuushu. A Met. Agency official is quoted in paragraph 1: There have been no volcano related earthquakes, tremors or other indications that a large scale eruption is likely, so we do not think that citizens need to evacuate at this time. The latest eruption is 2.5 km from the nearest settlement, where 15 people live. - Jed The latest volcano to threaten my location is 9,000 ft high Mt. Redoubt, even though I live about 200 miles away: http://www.skimountaineer.com/ROF/NorAm/Redoubt/RedoubtPlume.jpg As you can see, the volcanoes here are more about ash plumes than lava. The last eruption dumped ash over a 20,000 km^2 area. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Redoubt_(Alaska) Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.9/1992 - Release Date: 3/9/2009 7:20 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.10/1994 - Release Date: 3/10/2009 7:51 PM
[Vo]: Boswell windless turbine...
This sounds too good to be true... a wind generator that doesn't need any wind! HYPERLINK http://pesn.com/2009/03/11/9501531_Boswell_windless_turbine/http://pesn.com/2009/03/11/9501531_Bos well_windless_turbine/ -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.10/1994 - Release Date: 3/10/2009 7:51 PM
[Vo]:Griggs finally successful... LENR soon???
Well, it's great to see that one inventor who bucked the establishment seems to have come out on top... Let's pray that LENR/CF is right behind him... HYPERLINK http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/spinoff2000/ip3.htmhttp://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/spinoff2000/ip3.htm HYPERLINK http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh_-DUKQ4Uwhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh_-DUKQ4Uw HYPERLINK http://www.hydrodynamics.com/technology_review.htmhttp://www.hydrodynamics.com/technology_review.h tm HYPERLINK http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1095.0.htmlhttp://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1095. 0.html Also, check out the tongue-lashing that a ScienceNews reporter is getting after doing a piss-poor job on a LENR/CF anniversary article... HYPERLINK http://www.sciencenews.org/index/feature/activity/view/id/41220/title/Cold_Panaceahttp://www.scien cenews.org/index/feature/activity/view/id/41220/title/Cold_Panacea -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.9/1990 - Release Date: 3/8/2009 5:17 PM
RE: [Vo]:Griggs finally successful... LENR soon???
Hmmm, mention of Griggs is nowhere to be seen on their website. Have I got him mixed up w/some other water-related technology, Hydro-Catalysis perhaps??? Did he not live to see it succeed? -Mark _ From: Mark Iverson [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Monday, March 09, 2009 11:36 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Griggs finally successful... LENR soon??? Well, it's great to see that one inventor who bucked the establishment seems to have come out on top... Let's pray that LENR/CF is right behind him... HYPERLINK http://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/spinoff2000/ip3.htmhttp://www.sti.nasa.gov/tto/spinoff2000/ip3.htm HYPERLINK http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh_-DUKQ4Uwhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yh_-DUKQ4Uw HYPERLINK http://www.hydrodynamics.com/technology_review.htmhttp://www.hydrodynamics.com/technology_review.h tm HYPERLINK http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1095.0.htmlhttp://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1095. 0.html Also, check out the tongue-lashing that a ScienceNews reporter is getting after doing a piss-poor job on a LENR/CF anniversary article... HYPERLINK http://www.sciencenews.org/index/feature/activity/view/id/41220/title/Cold_Panaceahttp://www.scien cenews.org/index/feature/activity/view/id/41220/title/Cold_Panacea -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.9/1990 - Release Date: 3/8/2009 5:17 PM
RE: [Vo]:Replications of zero current electrolysis
Mr. Klum wrote: ... when provisional patents were discontinued some 13 months prior? I'm not sure since english is probably not your native language, but are you saying that provisional patents are no longer accepted by the Patent Office? In the U.S., they sure as hell are... after doing software for 25yrs, I took a promotion and became the Intellectual Property Liaison for the Systems RD Dept., and I know that our patent attorneys have filed several provisional patents in the last 12 months. -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.557 / Virus Database: 270.11.5/1979 - Release Date: 3/1/2009 5:46 PM
[VO]: Unstoppable Global Warming...
A little bit of the opposing evidence... HYPERLINK http://www.ncpa.org/pub/st/st279/st279.pdfhttp://www.ncpa.org/pub/st/st279/st279.pdf -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.19/1941 - Release Date: 2/9/2009 6:50 AM
RE: [Vo]:Scientists Agree Human-Induced Global Warming Is Real
So what? Here's a place that has 31,072 petition signatures, all with degrees, nearly half with PhDs/MDs. Science is NOT done by concensus! http://www.petitionproject.org/gwdatabase/Signers_BY_State.html http://www.petitionproject.org/gwdatabase/GWPP/Review_Article.html -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2009 1:38 PM To: Vortex-L Subject: [Vo]:Scientists Agree Human-Induced Global Warming Is Real http://www.physorg.com/news151609044.html http://tinyurl.com/75l6wh A group of 3,146 earth scientists surveyed around the world overwhelmingly agree that in the past 200-plus years, mean global temperatures have been rising, and that human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.10/1904 - Release Date: 1/20/2009 7:49 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.10/1904 - Release Date: 1/20/2009 7:49 AM
RE: [Vo]:Predictions for 2009
Interesting... See the list of quakes here: http://www.quake.utah.edu/req2webdir/recenteqs/Maps/Yellowstone.html This looks exactly like what Reno had less than a year ago... I think they called it and eq 'swarm'... Literally hundreds of small eqs per day, with the largest being between 4 and ~4.6; large enough to rock the house pretty good, which is about 5 to 7 miles (as the crow flies) SEast of where the swarm was centered (Verdi/Mogul, Nevada). It was highly unusual that so many eqs occur is such a limited area, perhaps a few sq.km. is all... And the vast majority were quite shallow as well, less than a few km... It occurred over the course of a few weeks and then died out... -Mark -Original Message- From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net] Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 8:32 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Predictions for 2009 The possibility of a supervolcano at Yellowstone may not really be on the time-table for 2009 - but perhaps some high level group should start to prepare for it anyway... (as if the New-Admin did not have enough problems to face already... however, this one puts the economic crisis to shame.) Why should anyone be concerned about a few hundred smallish earthquakes out there in the wilderness? In a word: Toba The Toba catastrophe theory, which is strongly backed by DNA statistics, suggests that a bottleneck in human population occurred 70,000 years ago, proposing that the human population was reduced to about 15,000 individuals or less, scattered into only a few population centers. The theory has many adherents in the science community because DNA analysis is so strong and predictable. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory Imagine the closeness of this very close-call - intelligent life on this planet came ever so close to total extinction - NOT happening at all! Some experts say that the bottleneck pushed populations back to as few as 5,000 scattered to three of four locations... not that 15,000 is all that much easier to digest. The Toba supervolcano was in Sumatra, Indonesia, site of many modern catstrophes and large volcanos, not to mention the giant rat. When it erupted at that fairly recent time - it triggered unimagineable environmental change, exacerbating the ice age perhaps. It was thousands of times more powerful than Mt St Helens, by comparison. The Toba theory is also based on this preserved geological evidences, but the evidences in genes (including mitochondrial DNA, Y-chromosome and nuclear genes) and the relatively low level of genetic variation with humans is very convincing. The gist of it all is that we are all very inbred already and that is why we can pinpoint a single eve even though her ancestors went back at least 2 million years- nevertheless, her mitochondrial DNA is shared by all the women in the world today. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitochondrial_Eve Yikes... and this supervolcano is what's in store assuming we do not suffer a prior catastrophic arctic methane release Makes you realize that there is a good reason for the apparent scarcity of intellignet life across the Universe Jones No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date: 1/3/2009 2:14 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date: 1/3/2009 2:14 PM
RE: [Vo]:Predictions for 2009
What's shakin' guys! Following up on what seismologists are calling the Mogul event, see this link for some pics and analysis... http://www.seismo.unr.edu/feature/2008/mogul.html In most of the pics (the first dated November 14, 2008) my house is about a cm from the upper-left corner of the map scale (lower right)! I'm in the foothills and am about 500' above the valley floor... They have concluded that this is not volcanic-related eq activity... If it was, I'd be toast in a matter of seconds anyway if Mogul did blow it's top, and if we just have a major eq in this area, my house will be a pile of sticks! Maybe I should get EQ insurance... One of the interesting pics shows the amt and direction of ground movement; up to 29mm! Pic is titled: GPS Time Series Since 4/26/2008 Looks like the fault may be pretty much along Interstate-80... Too bad this map doesn't show the vertical component of the mvmnt; prob'ly too small to msr. Pic titled: Cumulative Number of Earthquakes is also quite telling of just how quickly this activity escalated. Unfortunately, none of the maps show cumulative Eqs... But it'd be nearly solid yellow for that entire area of mogul. Rock-n-Roll!!! -Mark -Original Message- From: Mark Iverson [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 12:36 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Predictions for 2009 Interesting... See the list of quakes here: http://www.quake.utah.edu/req2webdir/recenteqs/Maps/Yellowstone.html This looks exactly like what Reno had less than a year ago... I think they called it and eq 'swarm'... Literally hundreds of small eqs per day, with the largest being between 4 and ~4.6; large enough to rock the house pretty good, which is about 5 to 7 miles (as the crow flies) SEast of where the swarm was centered (Verdi/Mogul, Nevada). It was highly unusual that so many eqs occur is such a limited area, perhaps a few sq.km. is all... And the vast majority were quite shallow as well, less than a few km... It occurred over the course of a few weeks and then died out... -Mark -Original Message- From: Jones Beene [mailto:jone...@pacbell.net] Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 8:32 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Predictions for 2009 The possibility of a supervolcano at Yellowstone may not really be on the time-table for 2009 - but perhaps some high level group should start to prepare for it anyway... (as if the New-Admin did not have enough problems to face already... however, this one puts the economic crisis to shame.) Why should anyone be concerned about a few hundred smallish earthquakes out there in the wilderness? In a word: Toba The Toba catastrophe theory, which is strongly backed by DNA statistics, suggests that a bottleneck in human population occurred 70,000 years ago, proposing that the human population was reduced to about 15,000 individuals or less, scattered into only a few population centers. The theory has many adherents in the science community because DNA analysis is so strong and predictable. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory Imagine the closeness of this very close-call - intelligent life on this planet came ever so close to total extinction - NOT happening at all! Some experts say that the bottleneck pushed populations back to as few as 5,000 scattered to three of four locations... not that 15,000 is all that much easier to digest. The Toba supervolcano was in Sumatra, Indonesia, site of many modern catstrophes and large volcanos, not to mention the giant rat. When it erupted at that fairly recent time - it triggered unimagineable environmental change, exacerbating the ice age perhaps. It was thousands of times more powerful than Mt St Helens, by comparison. The Toba theory is also based on this preserved geological evidences, but the evidences in genes (including mitochondrial DNA, Y-chromosome and nuclear genes) and the relatively low level of genetic variation with humans is very convincing. The gist of it all is that we are all very inbred already and that is why we can pinpoint a single eve even though her ancestors went back at least 2 million years- nevertheless, her mitochondrial DNA is shared by all the women in the world today. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitochondrial_Eve Yikes... and this supervolcano is what's in store assuming we do not suffer a prior catastrophic arctic methane release Makes you realize that there is a good reason for the apparent scarcity of intellignet life across the Universe Jones No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date: 1/3/2009 2:14 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date: 1/3/2009 2:14 PM No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1873 - Release Date
RE: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber
If we're talking stocks, have a look at a local outfit... www.nevadaexploration.com Check out the presentation on the results of Phase-I drilling at Fletcher Junction... www.tsx.com symbol NGE; on the american side it trades under the symbol NVDEF. Just to be up front about it, I do own shares... -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1872 - Release Date: 1/2/2009 1:10 PM
RE: [Vo]:Dark Energy was :The Memristor
Virtual... Schmirtual! The only reason physics uses the term 'virtual' is due to the inadequacies of the theories (mathematical equations) to properly model physical reality! If one looks at spacetime as being a seething plenum of random oscillations of some fundamental 'stuff ' at extremely small dimensions and extremely high frequencies, then what appear to be physical objects (i.e., subatomic particles) are simply LOCAL coherent oscillations/swirlings of that fundamental stuff. Just look out over the desert and what do you see? 'Nothing', you say! Of course, that's obvious! So you take another swig of that ice cold brewski, check out the Dime Box Babes for a few seconds, and then look up and, Holy Vortex Batman! That dust devil just appeared out of nowhere (a local, coherent swirling of stuff), swirled for a few moments, and then disappeared back into the nothingness (randomness) from whence it came… so too it goes with 'virtual' particles/photons/gravitons/yourfavoritetons! For some reason, these temporary coherent entities do not achieve the conditions necessary to become 'stable', and thus, they 'pop into and out of existence'. What are the conditions that result in stable, long-lived (subatomic/atomic) particles? Perhaps the intense conditions inside of a star, or that exised sometime shortly after the big bang (if that even really happened). Are there any good theories that start from this kind of fundamental view of spacetime? With this view, one can also see why probabilities figure so prominently in QM! -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [HYPERLINK mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 9:30 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Dark Energy was :The Memristor On Jan 2, 2009, at 7:16 AM, Jones Beene wrote: Horace, Thanks for a good analysis of this new theory vis-a-vis your theory and the mainstream thinking which precedes it. It can be noted that your objection: It seems to me this thinking is not right in that it leaves the question: what entity then remains to communicate via gravitons? is also a semantics issue that goes away - with a more complex definition of what is virtual in the sense that can be implied from their paper. Many of us may not like whatever new definition of 'graviton' or 'photon' emerges from this, since it could (possibly) imply something akin to flavor oscillations which are seen in the neutrino to rationalize how a graviton, for instance, can go from massless to at least expressing a mass-like effect. That is a form of 'communication'. I don't think the photon and graviton are analogous. The graviton is analogous to the virtual photon, which is the electromagnetic force carrier. If the physical law isomorphism I propose exists, then there necessarily exists an analog to the photon. I called it a graviphoton in order to be consistent with the naming conventions demanded by the isomorphism. The virtual particles, the virtual photon and graviton, are the force messengers, the real particles are quantized energy packets. The difference between them lies in the dimensions in which they reside. It is too bad this relationship was not understood when the graviton was named. Otherwise the graviton would have been named the virtual graviton, and the graviphoton would have been named the graviton. The existence of the graviphoton could have profound implications for astronomy. Best regards, Horace Heffner HYPERLINK http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber
Horace: I'll take your word on the fact that Nevada Gaming Regs allow for a min of 75%, but typical payouts are 88% to 96%. The min that I have seen is 84% -- I live in Reno, Nevada. The complementary term is called '%-Hold', which is what the casino ends up with out of 'total money wagered' or 'coin-in'. Realize that the casinos use the payout to attract customers, so it's no different than a price war by gas stations... If one casino raises their payout to attract customers, neighboring casinos will likely do the same. -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 10:20 PM To: Vortex-L Subject: Re: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber On Jan 1, 2009, at 6:48 PM, I wrote: I think there is a serious need to scientifically determine just how many problem gamblers would not have been exposed to their problem if they knew the full truth about gambling machines, and to determine how effective proper training in this regard can be in assisting treatment of existing patients. It is also clearly important to determine what means is effective for training the other 70% of people as well. The last sentence should read: It is also clearly important to determine what means is effective for training the people who lose the other 70% of money as well. On Dec 31, 2008, at 4:06 AM, Terry Blanton wrote: On Wed, Dec 31, 2008 at 1:45 AM, Horace Heffner hheff...@mtaonline.net wrote: On Dec 30, 2008, at 3:13 PM, Jones Beene wrote: At casinos, over 999 out of 1000 regular players are net losers. That is no secret. And it is of almost no deterrence to the losers. Those odds are not fixed, but vary with time gambling. Except where required by law: http://www.insidervlv.com/slotspayouts.html Terry I just noticed that: The following information was gathered by the various Gaming Commissions controlling their casinos within their jurisdiction. It is neither supplied by neutral parties, nor does it represent the minimum slots pay out required by law. The following wiki reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_machine states: ... the minimum payout in Nevada is 75%, and in New Jersey, 78%. That is an outrageous 22% to 25% take by a casino. A 75% pay out means if the customers put $1,000,000 through the machines that on average $750,000 is returned. A 75% pay out means if the customers put $1,000 through the machines that on average $750 is returned. So, if a customer has $250 and puts it through the machines in the form of 200 $5 bets, less than 4 hours gambling, he has put $1000 through the machines and thus can expect to have lost all his $250. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM
RE: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber
Horace wrote: The final player remaining after all the 19 others go broke would be given a prize that depends on how many bets he can make from his remaining purse before going broke. That would be a pretty illuminating contest, don't you think? Gee, if that isn't a loaded question, I don't know what is! :-) If you've only got $100, and you drop it all into a slot machine, and thus are now 'broke', that's your fault, not the casinos! That sounds way to liberal a mentality for me -- absolving the person from all responsibility for their actions. No one was holding a gun to their head forcing them to pull the handle... No, I don't think it'd be all that illuminating. Gaming is just another form of entertainment. Some peole spend $100+ to go see some concert that I wouldn't give a dime to go see. Who am I to judge what should be allowed for entertainment? When you go to a movie, or a concert, or the Indy 500, do you get a portion of your money back? Hell no! You're just as 'broke' as the person playing slots… perhaps more so. First, you have the option of walking away at any time, and second, at least with the slots, there is some chance that you'll walk away with much MORE that you started with!!! Can you say that about the Indy spectator or the movie-goer I don't think so! And just for the record, I may live in a gaming town, but I CHOOSE not to gamble... Well, most of the time! Some of the best places to eat are in the casinos! ;-) I can sit and have a nice dinner while watching everyone else go 'broke'... -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [HYPERLINK mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 11:07 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber On Jan 2, 2009, at 9:31 PM, Mark Iverson wrote: Horace: I'll take your word on the fact that Nevada Gaming Regs allow for a min of 75%, but typical payouts are 88% to 96%. The min that I have seen is 84% -- I live in Reno, Nevada. The complementary term is called '%-Hold', which is what the casino ends up with out of 'total money wagered' or 'coin-in'. Realize that the casinos use the payout to attract customers, so it's no different than a price war by gas stations... If one casino raises their payout to attract customers, neighboring casinos will likely do the same. -Mark Sure, but the principle is just the same, it just takes longer. Isn't it true that if the pay out is 95% it just takes 5 times as long on average to take the customer's purse away, and it also takes about 5 times as long for him to have less odds of having any money left than winning a major lottery? This gives me an idea. It might be a cool idea to put up a for-fun- only free slots web-site with a 95% payout. A fixed amount of imaginary money, say 20 or 50 bets worth, would be given to each entrant upon registering. The 20 players to last the most number of bets before going broke would be invited to a playoff to be televised and which would offer a significant prize to the winner. There could of course be playoffs in the event of ties. The final player remaining after all the 19 others go broke would be given a prize that depends on how many bets he can make from his remaining purse before going broke. That would be a pretty illuminating contest, don't you think? Best regards, Horace Heffner HYPERLINK http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM attachment: winmail.dat
RE: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber
Straight from the horses mouth... http://gaming.nv.gov/about_regulation.htm The Nevada Gaming Commission and the State Gaming Control Board comprise the two tiered system charged with regulating the Nevada gaming industry. The conduct and regulation of gaming in Nevada are governed by Chapters 462, 463, 463B, 464, 465, and 466 of the Nevada Revised Statutes; and are further clarified by the Regulations of the Nevada Gaming Commission and State Gaming Control Board. The Commission and Board administer the State laws and regulations governing gaming for the protection of the public and in the public interest in accordance with the policy of the State. The Regulations are here: http://gaming.nv.gov/stats_regs.htm#regs I do not know where it would be found, but one might start by looking at: Regulation 14 - Manufacturers, Distributors, Operators of Inter-Casino Linked Systems, Gaming Devices, New Games Inter-Casino Linked Systems and Associated Equipment. - Technical Standards for Gaming Devices and On-Line Slot Systems. -Mark -Original Message- From: Horace Heffner [mailto:hheff...@mtaonline.net] Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 11:18 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:Randum , Randumb, Randumber On Jan 2, 2009, at 9:31 PM, Mark Iverson wrote: Horace: I'll take your word on the fact that Nevada Gaming Regs allow for a min of 75%, but typical payouts are 88% to 96%. The min that I have seen is 84% -- I live in Reno, Nevada. The complementary term is called '%-Hol BTW, it is not my word. Here again is my reference as I posted it: The following wiki reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_machine states: ... the minimum payout in Nevada is 75%, and in New Jersey, 78%. You can check the reference yourself by searching the above article for minimum payout in Nevada. The source could of course be wrong. Any more current and authoritative source would be appreciated. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.2/1871 - Release Date: 1/1/2009 5:01 PM
RE: [Vo]:Solid compression - high controversy
When plate boundary stresses build up to a critical level, you get a local rupturing (fracturing) of the crust. What is that critical level?? Just like climate change and many other elements of nature that are too complex to fully understand, it depends on numerous things, like the type of rock and the direction of stress/forces. A given type of rock could have a considerably different shear strength along grain boundaries than perpendicular to them... one can see that without a very good 3D understanding of the crustal rocks along the entire length of a fault zone, and probably at least 10s of miles on either side of the fault, and 20 kilometers deep, it would be very difficult to accurately predict EQs from purely geophysical data. OTOH, I have an EE friend who monitors ELF geomagnetics, and he has successfully predicted two quakes while we were sitting in the kitchen chatting and watching the HP Dynamic Signal Analyzer... geomagnetics preceeding eqs usually manifest in the 1 to 10 Hz region. -Mark _ From: David Jonsson [mailto:davidjonssonswe...@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 9:53 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Solid compression - high controversy Hi On Tuesday Sweden had its greatest earthquake in a century. Nothing was damaged but it was still noticeable. It was a 4.7 Richter quake. Working with earthquakes is an important thing. Strong quakes can be very destructive. I can not see how traditional seismology is correct in explaining quakes. Most quakes seems to have a point origin. Plate tectonic stress do not cause points of increased stress but rather in large continuous areas or at the most in large surfaces or lines. Not in points. Further observations from space show a local change in elevation of the ground around the quake and there is also something going on in space above the epicenter prior to the quake. This implies a very local (compared to plate tectonic scale) cause of the quake. The only stress release which could cause a point wise collapse or breakdown is a point wise expansion or retraction which in turn would cause or be caused by a temperature increase or decrease which would require enormous energies to be removed or added to the point in the crust. Any process except heating seems unlikely to cause the expansion. These energies have to come from the interior, which has a lot of thermal energy, or from space, which seems rather void. Maybe the space effects alter the thermal conduction in the crust. Best regards, David David Jonsson Sweden phone callto:+46703000370 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.19/1857 - Release Date: 12/19/2008 10:09 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.19/1857 - Release Date: 12/19/2008 10:09 AM
[Vo]: Planet needs a cooler? Ace to the rescue!
Alrighty then... [images of Jim Carey and a weird hairdoo] I think it'd be great if this worked! Here's a guy who, although taking alot of college science classes still doesn't have a degree and no funding, and comes up with a very elegent and simple solution... And if you dismiss him outright because he doesn't have a degree, shame on you Frankly, I think this guy would fit right in at the dime box saloon... Some of the article is below, rest can be seen here: HYPERLINK http://www.physorg.com/news148887530.htmlhttp://www.physorg.com/news148887530.html -Mark Inventor's 'refrigeration system' for planet shows promise In the seclusion of his Maryland home, Ace has spent three years glued to the Internet, studying the Earth's climate cycles and careening from one epiphany to another - a 69-year-old loner with the moxie to try to solve one of the greatest threats to mankind. Now, backed by a computer model, the little-known inventor is making public a U.S. patent petition for what he calls the most practical, nontoxic, affordable, rapidly achievable and beneficial way to curb global warming and a resulting catastrophic ocean rise. Spray gigatons of seawater into the air, mainly in the Northern Hemisphere, and let Mother Nature do the rest, he says. The evaporating water, Ace said, would cool the Earth in multiple ways: First, the sprayed droplets would transform to water vapor, a change that absorbs thermal energy near ground level; then the rising vapor would condense into sunlight-reflecting clouds and cooling rain, releasing much of the stored energy into space in the form of infrared radiation. McClatchy Newspapers has followed Ace's work for three years and obtained a copy of his 2007 patent petition for what he calls a colossal refrigeration system with a 100,000-fold performance multiplier. The Earth has a giant air-conditioning problem, he said. I'm proposing to put a thermostat on the planet. Although it might sound preposterous, a computer model run by an internationally known global warming scientist suggests that Ace's giant humidifier might just work. Kenneth Caldeira, a climate scientist at the Carnegie Institution's Department of Global Ecology at Stanford University, roughly simulated Ace's idea in recent months on a model that's used extensively by top scientists to study global warming. The simulated evaporation of about one-half inch of additional water everywhere in the world produced immediate planetary cooling effects that were projected to reach nearly 1 degree Fahrenheit within 20 or 30 years, Caldeira said. In the computer simulation, evaporating water was almost as effective as directly transferring ... energy to space, which was surprising to me, he said. Ace said that the cooling effect would be several times greater if the model were refined to spray the same amount of seawater at strategic locations. [article continues...] No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.19/1857 - Release Date: 12/19/2008 10:09 AM
RE: [Vo]: Planet needs a cooler? Ace to the rescue!
Thomas, read the entire article... Here are some reasons why that might not matter... Added rainfall also would reduce atmospheric greenhouse gas levels, because cold raindrops carry more carbon dioxide back to the oceans than is released when water evaporates, he said. Caldeira's computer results could surprise many scientists because water vapor is a greenhouse gas widely recognized to be more powerful than carbon dioxide. The simulation suggests, however, that water vapor's cooling effects overwhelm its heat-trapping properties. [MI: gee, things are quite as simple/obvious as they might seem.] [MI: Also, we have to remember that even though we put a mon on the moon, fly probes thruout the solar system, and have harnessed the power of E=mc^2, there is still much we don't know] Douglas Davis, an atmospheric chemist at Georgia Tech University who's known Ace for years, lauded some of his inventions but called his global cooling idea big-time speculation because so little is known about the behavior of water in the atmosphere. 'In the case of the computer models that are used for global warming, I know that the hydrological cycle is a critical component of those models, and the hydrological cycle is not well understood,' Davis said, stressing that he's not a climate expert. -Mark -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [HYPERLINK mailto:temall...@usfamily.net mailto:temall...@usfamily.net] Sent: Saturday, December 20, 2008 10:52 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]: Planet needs a cooler? Ace to the rescue! Mark Iverson wrote: And if you dismiss him outright because he doesn't have a degree, shame on you Frankly, I think this guy would fit right in at the dime box saloon... Inventor's 'refrigeration system' for planet shows promise Spray gigatons of seawater into the air, mainly in the Northern Hemisphere, and let Mother Nature do the rest, he says. The evaporating water, Ace said, would cool the Earth in multiple ways: First, the sprayed droplets would transform to water vapor, a change that absorbs thermal energy near ground level; then the rising vapor would condense into sunlight-reflecting clouds and cooling rain, releasing much of the stored energy into space in the form of infrared radiation. It's not climate change that we reject, it's anthropogenic climate change. I have previously posted the URL of one of the G W deniers. He made the point that the number one green house gas is water vapor. --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- HYPERLINK http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.19/1857 - Release Date: 12/19/2008 10:09 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.19/1857 - Release Date: 12/19/2008 10:09 AM attachment: winmail.dat
[Vo]:Looking for RF engineer, bioelectromagnetics and data mining/algorithms experts...
If you know of anyone who has a solid track-record of designing successful RF/microwave circuits into the 10s of Ghz, please have them get in touch w/me... also looking for expertise in EM modeling of RF signals in biological tissue, and finally data mining/algorithm development. -Mark mailto:physics...@charter.net physics...@charter.net
RE: [Vo]:First commercial license
In the Comments section of the webpage that Steve posted is the following comment... Anybody heard of this guy/biz? -Mark My company, Black Super-hydrino Power (BSP) has a working prototype using a slightly different technology. It’s also based on neutrinos, but I use a double quantum-flexion loop process to allow the hydrinos to jump two excited super-states at once. This allows electrical power generation in a much simpler device than BLP. My 50kw prototype is one fourth the size of the BLP device and it will only cost $250 per kilowatt of installed power generating capability. This will allow fully capitalized electricity generation at a cost of 0.5 cents per kwh at the 1 gigawatt scale and 1 cent per kwh for the home model which is about the size of a standard dishwasher and powers an entire home. In addition, a BSP electrical generator capable of powering a standard sized SUV will cost $3000 and eliminate the need for hydrocarbon fuel or batteries. It will be approximately the size and weight of the V6 engine found in a Honda Accord. For security reasons we’re keeping BSP’s proprietary technology very tightly under wraps until commercial products are released in Q2 of 2009. Therefore BSP will not go public in the near future, but I am looking for additional early-stage investors. Please send the checks to my Newark, NJ PO box. -Mercy Posted By Mercy Vetsel, New York, NY : August 15, 2008 2:26 pm -Original Message- From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 10:44 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:First commercial license Well-timed PR http://money.cnn.com/video/#/video/news/2008/07/02/news.energyfix.07022008.cnnmoney No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.17/1847 - Release Date: 12/13/2008 4:56 PM
RE: [Vo]:First commercial license
After rereading it, this sounds like an uninformed skeptic posting a sarcastic comment... -Mark -Original Message- From: Mark Iverson [mailto:zeropo...@charter.net] Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 12:20 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:First commercial license In the Comments section of the webpage that Steve posted is the following comment... Anybody heard of this guy/biz? -Mark My company, Black Super-hydrino Power (BSP) has a working prototype using a slightly different technology. It’s also based on neutrinos, but I use a double quantum-flexion loop process to allow the hydrinos to jump two excited super-states at once. This allows electrical power generation in a much simpler device than BLP. My 50kw prototype is one fourth the size of the BLP device and it will only cost $250 per kilowatt of installed power generating capability. This will allow fully capitalized electricity generation at a cost of 0.5 cents per kwh at the 1 gigawatt scale and 1 cent per kwh for the home model which is about the size of a standard dishwasher and powers an entire home. In addition, a BSP electrical generator capable of powering a standard sized SUV will cost $3000 and eliminate the need for hydrocarbon fuel or batteries. It will be approximately the size and weight of the V6 engine found in a Honda Accord. For security reasons we’re keeping BSP’s proprietary technology very tightly under wraps until commercial products are released in Q2 of 2009. Therefore BSP will not go public in the near future, but I am looking for additional early-stage investors. Please send the checks to my Newark, NJ PO box. -Mercy Posted By Mercy Vetsel, New York, NY : August 15, 2008 2:26 pm -Original Message- From: Steven Krivit [mailto:stev...@newenergytimes.com] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 10:44 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:First commercial license Well-timed PR http://money.cnn.com/video/#/video/news/2008/07/02/news.energyfix.07022008.cnnmoney No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.17/1847 - Release Date: 12/13/2008 4:56 PM No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.17/1847 - Release Date: 12/13/2008 4:56 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.17/1847 - Release Date: 12/13/2008 4:56 PM
RE: [Vo]:Self-powered devices possible, researcher says...
Forgot to mention that the wording on this article, ...can covert energy at a 100 percent increase... seems to imply 100% 'increase' over the acoustic energy put in What, OU behavior? Well, we all know that those scientists must be 'delusional'... BTW, I'd like to correct one thing in my comment, ... and tastes like a duck, it probably WAS (not is) a duck! Could you pass the cranberry sauce please... -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 9:28 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Self-powered devices possible, researcher says... Hope you all had a very pleasant and filling Thanksgiving... now on to the cool stuff. http://www.physorg.com/news147353581.html Specifically, Cagin and his partners from the University of Houston have found that a certain type of piezoelectric material can covert energy at a 100 percent increase when manufactured at a very small size – in this case, around 21 nanometers in thickness. What's more, when materials are constructed bigger or smaller than this specific size they show a significant decrease in their energy-converting capacity, he said. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and tastes like a duck, it probably is a duck... Substitute resonant effect for duck... which is just more evidence that most all of science is built on the non-resonant behavior of bulk materials/molecules/atoms. What's possible if we were to find and exploit the resonant behavior of these systems/assemblages Granted, the resonant frequencies involved are probably very limited and in many cases a moving target... -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM
RE: [Vo]:Self-powered devices possible, researcher says...
Dam! Clicked on the link and it went to some other article... Here's the correct link: http://www.physorg.com/news147367357.html Also caught at the end of the article the following... We have demonstrated that when you go to a particular length scale – between 20 and 23 nanometers – you actually improve the energy-harvesting capacity by 100 percent. So the scientist was more accurate in his wording than the journalist... -Mark -Original Message- From: Mark Iverson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 9:57 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: RE: [Vo]:Self-powered devices possible, researcher says... Forgot to mention that the wording on this article, ...can co[n]vert energy at a 100 percent increase... seems to imply 100% 'increase' over the acoustic energy put in What, OU behavior? Well, we all know that those scientists must be 'delusional'... BTW, I'd like to correct one thing in my comment, ... and tastes like a duck, it probably WAS (not is) a duck! Could you pass the cranberry sauce please... -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 9:28 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Self-powered devices possible, researcher says... Hope you all had a very pleasant and filling Thanksgiving... now on to the cool stuff. http://www.physorg.com/news147353581.html Specifically, Cagin and his partners from the University of Houston have found that a certain type of piezoelectric material can covert energy at a 100 percent increase when manufactured at a very small size – in this case, around 21 nanometers in thickness. What's more, when materials are constructed bigger or smaller than this specific size they show a significant decrease in their energy-converting capacity, he said. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and tastes like a duck, it probably is a duck... Substitute resonant effect for duck... which is just more evidence that most all of science is built on the non-resonant behavior of bulk materials/molecules/atoms. What's possible if we were to find and exploit the resonant behavior of these systems/assemblages Granted, the resonant frequencies involved are probably very limited and in many cases a moving target... -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.12/1821 - Release Date: 11/30/2008 5:53 PM
RE: [Vo]:IEA admits major oil shortfall
I'm reading from latest posting, backwards, so it's not in the least surprising that this thread now has nothing to do with oil as the subject line suggests!!! :-) Given that, and just wanting to stir the pot a bit... Jed writes: As far as I am concerned, they should put automatic sensors in all automobiles and charge anyone who goes over the speed limit a hefty fine, say $1 per mile per minute; i.e., $15 for travelling at 70 mph in a 55 mph zone for 1 minute, automatically subtracted from your credit card 10 minutes after the sensor reports the violation. and I myself would not give a fig if some person at the insurance company was able to track my every automobile trip, if they charged me ~$100 less every month in return. If someone were to offer me $100 a month to tell them where I go every day I would be happy to do that, as long as it did not take any effort on my part. Those who sacrifice freedom for a little security (or comfort, i.e., lower insurance bills) deserve NEITHER! Think this was Ben (the lightning rod) Franklin... And that is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the slow erosion of our constitutional rights. Be prepared to justify your position with Supreme Court cases... -Mark No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.9.2/1782 - Release Date: 11/11/2008 7:32 PM
[Vo]:Give them an inch, they'll take a friggin' mile...
Democratic leaders in the U.S. House discuss confiscating 401(k)s, IRAs By Karen McMahan November 04, 2008 RALEIGH Democrats in the U.S. House have been conducting hearings on proposals to confiscate workers personal retirement accounts including 401(k)s and IRAs and convert them to accounts managed by the Social Security Administration. Triggered by the financial crisis the past two months, the hearings reportedly were meant to stem losses incurred by many workers and retirees whose 401(k) and IRA balances have been shrinking rapidly. The testimony of Teresa Ghilarducci, professor of economic policy analysis at the New School for Social Research in New York, in hearings Oct. 7 drew the most attention and criticism. Testifying for the House Committee on Education and Labor, Ghilarducci proposed that the government eliminate tax breaks for 401(k) and similar retirement accounts, such as IRAs, and confiscate workers retirement plan accounts and convert them to universal Guaranteed Retirement Accounts (GRAs) managed by the Social Security Administration. [snip] - end quoted article Here's the link... http://www.carolinajournal.com/articles/display_story.html?id=5081 Granted, they are only 'conducting hearings' at this stage, but just the fact they they are considering this kind of proposal is scary enough... The local financial radio program quoted one comparison: Parameters for average american: - 40 year work span - $60K/yr, investing 10% ($6K/yr) in a moderately conservative portfolio - avg of 10%/yr appreciation over that 40 yrs - avg of 3%/yr inflation At the end of the 40 yrs: Current 'flawed' retirement system $2.9M Proposed 'share more of your hard-earned $' program... $228,000 My only question is when will it become open season on Congress... Images of daffy and bugs... It's Duck season... No, wabbit season, no, Duck season... Wabbit season... You're both wrong, its Donkey season! :-) -Mark -Original Message- From: Terry Blanton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 09, 2008 10:32 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:Hyperion Takes First Orders http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/nov/09/miniature-nuclear-reactors-los-alamos Mini nuclear plants to power 20,000 homes £13m shed-size reactors will be delivered by lorry Nuclear power plants smaller than a garden shed and able to power 20,000 homes will be on sale within five years, say scientists at Los Alamos, the US government laboratory which developed the first atomic bomb. The miniature reactors will be factory-sealed, contain no weapons-grade material, have no moving parts and will be nearly impossible to steal because they will be encased in concrete and buried underground. The US government has licensed the technology to Hyperion, a New Mexico-based company which said last week that it has taken its first firm orders and plans to start mass production within five years. 'Our goal is to generate electricity for 10 cents a watt anywhere in the world,' said John Deal, chief executive of Hyperion. 'They will cost approximately $25m [£13m] each. For a community with 10,000 households, that is a very affordable $250 per home.' Deal claims to have more than 100 firm orders, largely from the oil and electricity industries, but says the company is also targeting developing countries and isolated communities. 'It's leapfrog technology,' he said. The company plans to set up three factories to produce 4,000 plants between 2013 and 2023. 'We already have a pipeline for 100 reactors, and we are taking our time to tool up to mass-produce this reactor.' The first confirmed order came from TES, a Czech infrastructure company specialising in water plants and power plants. 'They ordered six units and optioned a further 12. We are very sure of their capability to purchase,' said Deal. The first one, he said, would be installed in Romania. 'We now have a six-year waiting list. We are in talks with developers in the Cayman Islands, Panama and the Bahamas.' The reactors, only a few metres in diameter, will be delivered on the back of a lorry to be buried underground. They must be refuelled every 7 to 10 years. Because the reactor is based on a 50-year-old design that has proved safe for students to use, few countries are expected to object to plants on their territory. An application to build the plants will be submitted to the Nuclear Regulatory Commission next year. 'You could never have a Chernobyl-type event - there are no moving parts,' said Deal. 'You would need nation-state resources in order to enrich our uranium. Temperature-wise it's too hot to handle. It would be like stealing a barbecue with your bare hands.' Other companies are known to be designing micro-reactors. Toshiba has been testing 200KW reactors measuring roughly six metres by two metres. Designed to fuel smaller numbers of homes for longer, they could power a
RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
PM, Mark Iverson wrote: Ed wrote: As usual, your emotions get the better of logic Tell me how logic supports your conclusion of As usual when referring to my post? To me, I'd have to have read at least 4 to 6 postings on a topic in order to feel like I would be justified in using that phrase. Obviously, you think one or two (very small postings) are adequate. From what I've been reading of your posts (MANY more than 4 or 6 I might add) and others, there is a whole lot more emotion in them than in mine… The level of contempt and condescension in your postings toward the conservative viewpoint is very strong and if you can't see that, then perhaps you should copy some of your posts, delete your name from them and ask some people at the local store to rate the emotion in them on a scale of 1 to 10. Not whether they agree with them or not, just the emotional 'tone'… might be enlightening. In fact, there is very little emotion here. What prompted my post was that the s/n ratio on this list is pretty much in the toilet right now, again. Why don't you create a new list for political discussions and keep this list for what it was meant. That was my point… however poorly stated. Sorry about that… Or, take a vote, and if the majority of Vorts don't mind the engaging political rants, then I'll not try to keep that stuff out of here. To answer your assumptions and comments… I work in a company with offices all over the world, and with all kinds of people, from diverse backgrounds and religions, and enjoy our conversations and admire and respect their expertise. I work closely with at least 2 (former) Iranian citizens, and asked why they decided to come here and become U.S. citizens... Care to know why? One, Farshid, even converted from Islam to Zoroastrianism. Care to know why? My son-in-law has served three deployments in Iraq, and I'll take his word for what the place was like before we got there and when he left... And for how the average Iraqi citizen feels about our presence there. Frankly, I wish we weren't there at all… I also realize that the extremists I referred to are a small # of the muslim population, but you don't see the muslim leaders coming out in strong opposition to the radical sects. Why not? Perhaps they are too afraid? That in itself speaks volumes... You say that terrorist activity is not supported by the general region. Saudi Arabia has unlimited $ to help combat it, yet, are they? Not that I'm aware of. In fact, there are some who think that the Saudis are to some degree funding it. Have they sent in any equipment or security forces to help the Iraqi govt stabilize things? Their other neighbor, Iran, is doing everything it can to encourage the terrorist activities! So I reject your premise that the region doesn't support that behavior... And suggest that they could do a lot more to help… but the leaders in that area would rather build extravagant artificial islands and palaces. How did they get all that wealth? Capitalism perhaps? You said: We killed thousands and destroyed a society in an attempt to kill a few people who might try to hurt us in the future And that former 'society' killed a hundred times that many (of it's own people), so I guess your solution is to just turn a blind eye to it… we haven't taken any goods from that country, just the opposite, nor their pride. Granted, I'm not nearly caught up on the 250+ posting that are still unread, but I don't sense much 'love of country' in what I've read so far… As I've said before, I am no fan of the Bush admin, and am pretty much fed up with most all politicians… they are more concerned about the power struggle with the opposing party, and how to get back or maintain power, than legislating in a responsible manner what's best for the average citizen. I have no doubt that this country would be much better off if we eliminated the political parties altogether… people and politicians might begin to put country first instead of party. -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ] Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 4:40 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan As usual, your emotions get the better of logic. First of all, not all Muslims are suicide bombers nor is this an action that is supported by the general region. Also, how do you separate this action from when we operate when we bomb from the air? Of course, you can say that we are trying to hit bad people, which we miss on occasion, but we are sorry when innocent people are killed. We killed thousands and destroyed a society in an attempt to kill a few people who might try to hurt us in the future. But this is ok with you because we are acting in self defense, but the suicide
RE: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface
Thomas: Do you mean John Schnurer, of Xenia/Yellow Springs Ohio, whose father taught at Antioch college? -Mark -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 3:12 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface 60 minutes just did a segment on a brain to electrode interface, BEI. The late John Scheurner, whom I met on Vortex, worked on the first prototypes of the BEI. A scientist, paralyzed by ALS, was shown communicating by typing out messages. The first model was a cap with electrodes, the reporter put it on and a technician put conducting jell between the electrodes and the scalp. Then they showed a later model which is implanted in the brain. I had the same idea, but I decided that I didn't need another hole in my head. OTOH, if we could come up with a design where the skin were closed over the hole and the electrode just touched it. --- Get FREE High Speed Internet from USFamily.Net! -- http://www.usfamily.net/mkt-freepromo.html --- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1761 - Release Date: 11/1/2008 7:56 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1764 - Release Date: 11/3/2008 7:46 AM
RE: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface
So sorry to hear that... Damn. I knew John well, visited him several times, had many long phone conversations, and helped each other in tough times. Perhaps he'll send me a little hint from the other side... Nothing but fond memories, Take care John, -Mark -Original Message- From: thomas malloy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 8:55 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:BEI brain electrode interface Mark Iverson wrote: Thomas: Do you mean John Schnurer, of Xenia/Yellow Springs Ohio, whose father taught at Antioch college? Yes
RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
was created, i.e. take from one group and give to another. The only issue is which group pays and which group benefits and by how much... You open up a whole can of worms that I know a canful about... But perhaps some other time. The history of the income tax is a very interesting read... Bush and McCain favor the wealthy (trickle- down), Obama wants to now favor the middle class (trickle-up). This policy would seem to have benefit to the country now that the Bush policy has been shown not to work very well The diff between us is that, even though giving lip service to enough blame oto go around, there is absolutely no mention of specifics in any of your posts that I can remember... It's all Bush's fault! I reject that, as does Dr. Sowell; Congress has more influence on the domestic economy that the prez ever will, and that's the way it should be. RE: you comments on budget for science being frozen. From the govt's own statistics, the budget for science has had modest increases thruout Bush's admin except for the yr-2008 estimate... How much should we be spending in science? Isn't $50 Billion enough? And I love science... I challenge you to change your mindset, and instead of a constant increase, why not work on reducing the overhead and implementing other intelligent ways to run large organizations! Can you say, Spaceship One/Scaled Composites? A very good example of the fact that the private industry can do most anything MUCH MORE cost effectively than government... 200420052006 20072008 estimate estimate Department of Defense 61,510 66,467 69,323 71,755 69,856 Other national defense 3,835 4,179 3,720 3,726 3,079 Total national defense 65,345 70,646 73,043 75,481 72,935 Non-defense General science, space, and technology: NASA8,037 6,880 6,807 8,438 9,445 NSF 3,439 3,638 3,707 3,943 3,894 Atomic energy gen'l sci 2,701 2,809 2,966 3,013 3,192 Subtotal14,177 13,327 13,480 15,394 16,531 Energy 1,387 1,272 1,156 1,241 1,409 Transportation: NASA551 834 722 736 669 DOT and Other 571 472 588 590 512 Subtotal1,122 1,306 1,310 1,326 1,181 Health: NIH 24,498 26,039 26,695 26,974 27,580 Other 1,726 1,541 1,570 1,554 1,558 Subtotal26,224 27,580 28,265 28,528 29,138 Agriculture 1,694 1,758 1,779 1,795 1,734 Nat'l resources/envir 1,612 1,878 1,529 1,633 1,699 All other 1,818 2,079 2,233 2,743 2,384 Totak NON-defense 48,034 49,200 49,752 52,660 54,076 -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 7:24 AM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan On Nov 3, 2008, at 1:13 AM, Mark Iverson wrote: Ed, No biggee. And I didn't mean to insult your patriotism; what did I say that was untrue of religions and also made you feel that way? You seem to blame a religion for the actions of a few of its members. All religions have members who distort the basic views of their religion to justify their actions. It is very dangerous and, I suggest, anti-American to take this approach. For the most part, I agree that sincere and informed people should be able to discuss politics w/o questioning a person's patriotism... However, there are many insincere people who use the sincere person's conscience and sense of fairness to manipulate and/or suppress their point of view. Do I think this is happening on this forum? No, but it is used quite extensively these days in many venues and garb; it is insidious. Agreed I keep my mouth shut most of the time, so when I do open it, its usually based on facts, reason, and a reasonably well thought out position. And I admit that when I disagree with someone, my sarcasm tends to leak out... Hey, I'm human just like the rest of you characters. RE: the policies of the current Republican administration... Why is it that you and some of the other Vorts seem to completely IGNORE the fact that there is a bicameral Congress that also
RE: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan
and pride. As for my acrimonious feelings about this country, you seem not to understand the difference in feeling acrimonious about the actions of the Bush administration and a love of country. Apparently you approve of everything the administration has done. I hope you do not have a mortgage and have a good job that stays in this country. I will wait to see how you feel in the future if past actions are not personal enough to get your acrimony. Ed On Nov 2, 2008, at 4:55 PM, Mark Iverson wrote: Gee Ed, I don't know any christians, buddists, scientologists or any other belief systems that want to wipe out other belief systems; that would strap bombs on their children and handicapped, let alone 'sane' adults, all in the name of their religion/god. With all the acrimonious feelings you have about this country, sounds like you'd be much happier in Iraq or Iran! I'll buy your ticket... -Mark -Original Message- From: Edmund Storms [HYPERLINK mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 2:38 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Edmund Storms Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan How do you tell the good Christians from the bad Christians, Richard? Surely you know that bad Christians exist. I suggest you use the same method you would apply to Christians. Ed No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.8.5/1761 - Release Date: 11/1/2008 7:56 PM attachment: winmail.dat
