Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Friday 14 February 2003 10:03 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:31, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquer y= and it's a 30 day trial You are absolutely correct! There it is in living color. I just expired last week So very sorry to hear of your recent demise. Tell me How are your writing this... does heaven have broadband? (extremely large cheessy grin) hahahaha... wise ass. :) so can't get it. I've sent comments/concerns and won't be renewing until I get a reply. I'm not holding my breath. :) thanks for pointing that out though. It does look like they are getting better and better at treating the contributing members a little better. When I first joined it was pretty bad. James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:07 pm, Jack Coates wrote: On Thu, 2003-02-13 at 20:58, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 04:13 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: _ _ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Win4lin and VmWare both have trial versions available through the club and I believe their sites as well. James Thanks. I actually have vmware. It isn't for me. I know lots like it. It just adds so much overhead that I can't stand it. Then the crap you have to deal with on devices like etherenet etc. It is just easier to have a KVM switch and just jump back and forth. Win3lin is supposed to be fast though. Disagree with me and DIE Kill!! Die!! Er, sorry, wrong list :-) I LOL!!! did that for a long time and it was better than VMWare. However, I had to give the work laptop back when I changed jobs and had to minimize the number of computers overall when I moved (noise considerations, mainly). Still if you have more computers than you know what to do with a KVM is a heck of a lot nicer than multi-booting or virtualizing hardware any day. But if you only carry the one laptop and need to use tools in multiple OSs, VMWare can't be beat. Now that I can't argue with! Besides I sure don't want to be killed or die. ;) Have you tried that win4lin? It sounds like a way for me to get one step closer to putting mickeysoft further behind me at home. Well a dedicated box anyhow. It might work even better for you, since the performance hit you take with vmware. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. I begining to worry a little about the viability of the company. Has it been quieter (from the employees) than normal in the lists or is it just my imagination? Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquery= and it's a 30 day trial You are absolutely correct! There it is in living color. I just expired last week so can't get it. I've sent comments/concerns and won't be renewing until I get a reply. I'm not holding my breath. :) thanks for pointing that out though. It does look like they are getting better and better at treating the contributing members a little better. When I first joined it was pretty bad. James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:26, Lorne wrote: ... did that for a long time and it was better than VMWare. However, I had to give the work laptop back when I changed jobs and had to minimize the number of computers overall when I moved (noise considerations, mainly). Still if you have more computers than you know what to do with a KVM is a heck of a lot nicer than multi-booting or virtualizing hardware any day. But if you only carry the one laptop and need to use tools in multiple OSs, VMWare can't be beat. Now that I can't argue with! Besides I sure don't want to be killed or die. ;) Have you tried that win4lin? It sounds like a way for me to get one step closer to putting mickeysoft further behind me at home. Well a dedicated box anyhow. It might work even better for you, since the performance hit you take with vmware. P3-M/800, 384M RAM. Performance was fine with W98 in the virtual, poorer with W2K in the virtual of course but then W2K is dog slow on regular hardware too. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. I begining to worry a little about the viability of the company. Has it been quieter (from the employees) than normal in the lists or is it just my imagination? That's most likely pre-release workload. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Lorne wrote on Tue, Feb 11, 2003 at 08:28:42PM -0700 : Tried GNUCash yet? I liked it when I had use for something like that (I hate to manage money, I stay away from it when I can :) yea, about 6 months ago. It just didn't do it for me. I guess it is too much for this old fart. :) Mebbe I should go take another peak at it. Maybe it has changed. How about sql-ledger? May be overkill for what you want though. Blue skies... Todd - -- | MandrakeSoft USA | Sometimes you get what you want. | | http://www.mandrakesoft.com | Sometimes you get experience.| | http://www.mandrakelinux.com |--unknown origin | Mandrake Cooker Devel Version, Kernel 2.4.21pre4-5mdk -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+TT8xlp7v05cW2woRAm/iAKCQQFj0yOa08Xnw6wZEVSKrnjbfJACdFxQ6 I5F05uvGGyLDtfp8/ASr+HQ= =SBT8 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Friday 14 February 2003 10:15 am, Jack Coates wrote: On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:26, Lorne wrote: ... did that for a long time and it was better than VMWare. However, I had to give the work laptop back when I changed jobs and had to minimize the number of computers overall when I moved (noise considerations, mainly). Still if you have more computers than you know what to do with a KVM is a heck of a lot nicer than multi-booting or virtualizing hardware any day. But if you only carry the one laptop and need to use tools in multiple OSs, VMWare can't be beat. Now that I can't argue with! Besides I sure don't want to be killed or die. ;) Have you tried that win4lin? It sounds like a way for me to get one step closer to putting mickeysoft further behind me at home. Well a dedicated box anyhow. It might work even better for you, since the performance hit you take with vmware. P3-M/800, 384M RAM. Performance was fine with W98 in the virtual, poorer with W2K in the virtual of course but then W2K is dog slow on regular hardware too. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. I begining to worry a little about the viability of the company. Has it been quieter (from the employees) than normal in the lists or is it just my imagination? That's most likely pre-release workload. Good point. I didn't think of that. I've not had time to even think of 9.1 yet. dang it. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:31, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquery= and it's a 30 day trial You are absolutely correct! There it is in living color. I just expired last week So very sorry to hear of your recent demise. Tell me How are your writing this... does heaven have broadband? (extremely large cheessy grin) so can't get it. I've sent comments/concerns and won't be renewing until I get a reply. I'm not holding my breath. :) thanks for pointing that out though. It does look like they are getting better and better at treating the contributing members a little better. When I first joined it was pretty bad. James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:31, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquery= and it's a 30 day trial You are absolutely correct! There it is in living color. I just expired last week So very sorry to hear of your recent demise. Tell me How are your writing this... does heaven have broadband? (extremely large cheessy grin) so can't get it. I've sent comments/concerns and won't be renewing until I get a reply. I'm not holding my breath. :) thanks for pointing that out though. It does look like they are getting better and better at treating the contributing members a little better. When I first joined it was pretty bad. James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 2003-02-14 at 08:31, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 10:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquery= and it's a 30 day trial You are absolutely correct! There it is in living color. I just expired last week So very sorry to hear of your recent demise. Tell me How are your writing this... does heaven have broadband? (extremely large cheessy grin) so can't get it. I've sent comments/concerns and won't be renewing until I get a reply. I'm not holding my breath. :) thanks for pointing that out though. It does look like they are getting better and better at treating the contributing members a little better. When I first joined it was pretty bad. James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wednesday 12 February 2003 10:52 pm, Robert Wideman wrote: Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. Have you looked at GnuCash??? Rob Yea, I just didn't like the look and feel. I tried it. I even imported all my data and worked with it for awhile. Old habits die hard I guess. :) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Yea, I just didn't like the look and feel. I tried it. I even imported all my data and worked with it for awhile. Old habits die hard I guess. :) Ah, ye, it looks a little Winbloz 3.1 to me. Its supposedly the best one for linux. You might try using Quicken under Wine. Rob Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thursday 13 Feb 2003 2:52 am, Lorne wrote: On Wednesday 12 February 2003 10:11 am, Carroll Grigsby wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 09:50 pm, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. : James This lengthy (about 25 pages) comparative review of Win4Lin and Codeweaver may be of interest: http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=323 -- cmg Wow! Thank you very much! Very well written. I was getting ready to lament that it didn't compare it against VMWARE, but he does at the end. I just wish that these guys would do some sort of product you could try before you buy. Something that quits after 15 days or something. It would certainly put me one step closer to putting mickeysoft behind me for good. Win4lin is on the powerpack disks as a 15-day trial. I don't know whether that is available for download from Mdk, but it's worth a look. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wed, 2003-02-12 at 18:52, Lorne wrote: On Wednesday 12 February 2003 10:11 am, Carroll Grigsby wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 09:50 pm, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. : James This lengthy (about 25 pages) comparative review of Win4Lin and Codeweaver may be of interest: http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=323 -- cmg Wow! Thank you very much! Very well written. I was getting ready to lament that it didn't compare it against VMWARE, but he does at the end. I just wish that these guys would do some sort of product you could try before you buy. Something that quits after 15 days or something. It would certainly put me one step closer to putting mickeysoft behind me for good. __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Win4lin and VmWare both have trial versions available through the club and I believe their sites as well. James Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thursday 13 February 2003 11:45 am, Anne Wilson wrote: Wow! Thank you very much! Very well written. I was getting ready to lament that it didn't compare it against VMWARE, but he does at the end. I just wish that these guys would do some sort of product you could try before you buy. Something that quits after 15 days or something. It would certainly put me one step closer to putting mickeysoft behind me for good. Win4lin is on the powerpack disks as a 15-day trial. I don't know whether that is available for download from Mdk, but it's worth a look. Oh really!?! It sure is. Thanks. Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thursday 13 February 2003 04:13 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Win4lin and VmWare both have trial versions available through the club and I believe their sites as well. James Thanks. I actually have vmware. It isn't for me. I know lots like it. It just adds so much overhead that I can't stand it. Then the crap you have to deal with on devices like etherenet etc. It is just easier to have a KVM switch and just jump back and forth. Win3lin is supposed to be fast though. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thu, 2003-02-13 at 20:58, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 04:13 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Win4lin and VmWare both have trial versions available through the club and I believe their sites as well. James Thanks. I actually have vmware. It isn't for me. I know lots like it. It just adds so much overhead that I can't stand it. Then the crap you have to deal with on devices like etherenet etc. It is just easier to have a KVM switch and just jump back and forth. Win3lin is supposed to be fast though. Disagree with me and DIE Kill!! Die!! Er, sorry, wrong list :-) I did that for a long time and it was better than VMWare. However, I had to give the work laptop back when I changed jobs and had to minimize the number of computers overall when I moved (noise considerations, mainly). Still if you have more computers than you know what to do with a KVM is a heck of a lot nicer than multi-booting or virtualizing hardware any day. But if you only carry the one laptop and need to use tools in multiple OSs, VMWare can't be beat. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Thu, 2003-02-13 at 21:07, Jack Coates wrote: On Thu, 2003-02-13 at 20:58, Lorne wrote: On Thursday 13 February 2003 04:13 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Win4lin and VmWare both have trial versions available through the club and I believe their sites as well. James Thanks. I actually have vmware. It isn't for me. I know lots like it. It just adds so much overhead that I can't stand it. Then the crap you have to deal with on devices like etherenet etc. It is just easier to have a KVM switch and just jump back and forth. Win3lin is supposed to be fast though. Disagree with me and DIE Kill!! Die!! Er, sorry, wrong list :-) I did that for a long time and it was better than VMWare. However, I had to give the work laptop back when I changed jobs and had to minimize the number of computers overall when I moved (noise considerations, mainly). Still if you have more computers than you know what to do with a KVM is a heck of a lot nicer than multi-booting or virtualizing hardware any day. But if you only carry the one laptop and need to use tools in multiple OSs, VMWare can't be beat. Don't you have to be like Silver or something? I gave them 50.00 or so and that wasn't enough to get me anything. Well I guess I get to vote. :) Don't really know what my level is... I just send em some every month. (silver standard something like that.) Any who the link is http://www.mandrakeclub.com/modules.php?name=Downloadsd_op=searchquery= and it's a 30 day trial James I'm silver, but I just download the ISOs and it ain't on there. Theoretically I might could find it in the commercial apps section, but I haven't had a need to go looking. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 20:28, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 08:31 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 19:25, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) OOOps forgot KBudget and Kapitol the last one is from theKompany and supposed to be very much like M$Money. I didn't see any demo version or something a guy could try first. I don't mind paying, but I'd surely want more than what they offer without seeing it first. I've been burned too many times to buy on good faith. :) I'm still looking at some of the others though. Thanks again. True enough... but one thing. 24.95 (for the download version) is easier to swallow than the cost of a lot of other software out there. Hope you do find what you need James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wednesday 12 February 2003 05:25, you wrote: Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) Do not know about the others (I am Gnucash user myself) but sql-ledger is business orientated package requiring setting up apache, postgresql etc. Good thing but I would not suggest to someone finding Gnucash to be too much :-) Wahur Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 11 February 2003 09:50 pm, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. James This lengthy (about 25 pages) comparative review of Win4Lin and Codeweaver may be of interest: http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=323 -- cmg Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wednesday 12 February 2003 10:11 am, Carroll Grigsby wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 09:50 pm, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. : James This lengthy (about 25 pages) comparative review of Win4Lin and Codeweaver may be of interest: http://www.sudhian.com/showdocs.cfm?aid=323 -- cmg Wow! Thank you very much! Very well written. I was getting ready to lament that it didn't compare it against VMWARE, but he does at the end. I just wish that these guys would do some sort of product you could try before you buy. Something that quits after 15 days or something. It would certainly put me one step closer to putting mickeysoft behind me for good. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wednesday 12 February 2003 01:19 am, Vahur Lokk wrote: On Wednesday 12 February 2003 05:25, you wrote: Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) Do not know about the others (I am Gnucash user myself) but sql-ledger is business orientated package requiring setting up apache, postgresql etc. Good thing but I would not suggest to someone finding Gnucash to be too much :-) haha, sounds like fair warning. :) Wahur Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Wednesday 12 February 2003 01:00 am, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 20:28, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 08:31 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 19:25, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) OOOps forgot KBudget and Kapitol the last one is from theKompany and supposed to be very much like M$Money. I didn't see any demo version or something a guy could try first. I don't mind paying, but I'd surely want more than what they offer without seeing it first. I've been burned too many times to buy on good faith. :) I'm still looking at some of the others though. Thanks again. True enough... but one thing. 24.95 (for the download version) is easier to swallow than the cost of a lot of other software out there. Hope you do find what you need I can't disagree with that. A small price to pay if it will help balance the playing fielf come to think of it. :) James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne ___ ___ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com _ _ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. Have you looked at GnuCash??? Rob Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun Feb 09, 2003 at 05:09:06PM -0600, Vox wrote:
succession without a burp. Very odd. I usually find cooker to be
quite stable, but I tend to go this cycle: install release version,
wait until after cooker has settled down (gcc/glibc upgrades), track
cooker during the beta period, do a fresh install when the release
is out. I have to have a semi-stable system, and don't sync with
cooker daily... so I tend to take this route. Upgrades are really
simple even with a fresh install.
That's more or less how I do it too, without the fresh install. I
track cooker daily until release...then wait out the first 2 or 3
weeks after cooker re-opening and keep going on the daily tracking
until the glibc/gcc/whatever changes start, then I stop till I don't
get any need to uninstall this to continue and go back to daily
tracking. So far, my box has been behaving well :)
More adventurous than I... =) Sounds like a good plan tho... I may decide
to continue tracking cooker over the long term this time around... we'll
see. I usually do the base install for a while to test security updates
live... if I can get this UML stuff to work properly, I may not need to do
that anymore (use UML containers instead of testing live).
Soon I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc
directory to CVS then on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or
cvs diff to find the differences. Should be an interesting
project.
I've done that when admining the local LUG box with 3 other people,
that way we could track down and shoot whoever mungled the box ;) It
works well, for the most part, once you get used to it.
I'm thinking of an easy way to do upgrades... and of course, sanity checks.
Ie. think of this prior to an upgrade:
cd /etc
cvs commit
[reboot_installclean]
cd /etc
cvs diff
[check for anything major]
cvs co
Somewha abbreviated, but you get the idea. I think it would work awesome...
one would just have to get used to the many CVS/ directories. =)
Uhm...I've heard you can run EverCrack on WineX and play well, with
a few details (some sounds or some crap like that...I don't play
EverCrack :) google is your friend :)
If I'm going to sit down and play EQ, i want it to work 100%... =)
I've
Bah, you addicts are all the same :P
Well, I wish I was more of an addict. I don't think I've played in two
weeks... Starting to forget I even have it installed... =)
tried WineX, and while it's ok, doesn't really play to well on my
workstation with it's odd dual-head setup (2MB PCI video card and a
16MB AGP). It's caused strange issues for me in the past. So I've
Youch, I didn't know you could play EverCrack with such small
vidcards...hell, I thought you couldn't play tuxracer with them :)
I doubt the 2MB card would do any good... IIRC, it's a 2D card as well. The
AGP card should be ok tho. My workstation is definitely not a gaming
machine... (well, it would make a killer gaming machine if I got larger LCDs
and a proper dual-head AGP card with gobs of memory). I kinda just use this
machine for work... =)
got one machine that is a f/t cooker machine that dual-boots win2k.
It's helpful for the odd time i need to run win software (not often)
or testing stuff like samba.
I haven't had the misfortune of using a winbox in 6+ years :)
Lucky you.. =)
I play WC3 and D2 on my mac, so I'm not worried about that... =)
I want an a-book! :P
I'm telling ya... Apple makes some sweet hardware. It's a shame it's so
bloody expensive. =(
WineX is alright, and it's been cool to play with, but when I play
on my Linux workstation, which isn't often, I usually play the older
Loki games I've got... except SimCity3000 doesn't want to run on
cooker for some reason... haven't explored that one yet tho.
Unfortunately, Loki lived and died during my financial crisis, so I
never managed to get any of their games :/ I hope somebody comes up
with a working business doing linux games soon, tho, so I can get
rid of winex :)
I hear ya. Much nicer to play stuff native. Heck, people should just start
building games for Win/Mac/Linux.
Hmmm... speaking of which, I'm still waiting for NeverWinter Nights for
Linux (the client). I'm starting to get a little irked with Bioware... I
bought the damn game thinking the Linux client was coming soon, and have
played a total of 30mins on it. I'm starting to think about asking for my
money back, unfortunately it's been so long I doubt they would do it. =(
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
lynx -source http://linsec.ca/vdanen.asc | gpg --import
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msg65878/pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun Feb 09, 2003 at 03:28:24PM -0800, Jack Coates wrote:
I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc directory to CVS then
on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or cvs diff to find the
differences. Should be an interesting project.
I've always wanted to do that... I know people that do it for ~ and
consequently have 10 years of history in their .bash_profile :-) One of
these days.
Well, I don't much care about putting my homedir into CVS... it's such a
mess as it is, I think putting it into CVS would be an utter waste. /etc is
a very different story, however.
workstation, which isn't often, I usually play the older Loki games I've
got... except SimCity3000 doesn't want to run on cooker for some reason...
haven't explored that one yet tho.
Got and like a lot of Loki games, but haven't been able to play them
since I bought this laptop as the video is not really up to snuff. It
plays Civ2:CTP well enough, but I really don't have the hours and hours
to burn on that game like I did before I had a life :-)
I hear ya. I also have Civ2:CTP... can't say I've played it too much tho.
I really need to stop working so much so that I can play some of these games
I've amassed... =)
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
lynx -source http://linsec.ca/vdanen.asc | gpg --import
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msg65879/pgp0.pgp
Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
This time Vincent Danen [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes daring and writes: On Sun Feb 09, 2003 at 05:09:06PM -0600, Vox wrote: succession without a burp. Very odd. I usually find cooker to be quite stable, but I tend to go this cycle: install release version, wait until after cooker has settled down (gcc/glibc upgrades), track cooker during the beta period, do a fresh install when the release is out. I have to have a semi-stable system, and don't sync with cooker daily... so I tend to take this route. Upgrades are really simple even with a fresh install. That's more or less how I do it too, without the fresh install. I track cooker daily until release...then wait out the first 2 or 3 weeks after cooker re-opening and keep going on the daily tracking until the glibc/gcc/whatever changes start, then I stop till I don't get any need to uninstall this to continue and go back to daily tracking. So far, my box has been behaving well :) More adventurous than I... =) Sounds like a good plan tho... I may decide to continue tracking cooker over the long term this time around... we'll see. I usually do the base install for a while to test security updates live... if I can get this UML stuff to work properly, I may not need to do that anymore (use UML containers instead of testing live). I use my mom's computer for testing stuff that should work on release chuckle :) I keep her box on current-release always, and keep mine on cooker...that way she gets a stable system and I have a stable release to test stuff on. The rest of the computers here at home either have cooker or debian of some kind (it depends on who lost the coin flip...loser gets to install the box and chose the distro...installer admins the box...and my roommate is a debian user :) Tho the UML idea sounds good to me...I may have to test that one of these days :) Soon I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc directory to CVS then on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or cvs diff to find the differences. Should be an interesting project. I've done that when admining the local LUG box with 3 other people, that way we could track down and shoot whoever mungled the box ;) It works well, for the most part, once you get used to it. I'm thinking of an easy way to do upgrades... and of course, sanity checks. Ie. think of this prior to an upgrade: cd /etc cvs commit [reboot_installclean] cd /etc cvs diff [check for anything major] cvs co Somewha abbreviated, but you get the idea. I think it would work awesome... one would just have to get used to the many CVS/ directories. =) Yup, that should work nicely...and being able to go rollback a commit or two to fix mistakes is a good thing too :) Uhm...I've heard you can run EverCrack on WineX and play well, with a few details (some sounds or some crap like that...I don't play EverCrack :) google is your friend :) If I'm going to sit down and play EQ, i want it to work 100%... =) I've Bah, you addicts are all the same :P Well, I wish I was more of an addict. I don't think I've played in two weeks... Starting to forget I even have it installed... =) hehehe be thankful you don't have the time to become truly addicted...you may end up like the guy who killed himself because he lost everything he had to be able to pay his evercrack addiction :) tried WineX, and while it's ok, doesn't really play to well on my workstation with it's odd dual-head setup (2MB PCI video card and a 16MB AGP). It's caused strange issues for me in the past. So I've Youch, I didn't know you could play EverCrack with such small vidcards...hell, I thought you couldn't play tuxracer with them :) I doubt the 2MB card would do any good... IIRC, it's a 2D card as well. The AGP card should be ok tho. My workstation is definitely not a gaming machine... (well, it would make a killer gaming machine if I got larger LCDs and a proper dual-head AGP card with gobs of memory). I kinda just use this machine for work... =) I'm not much of a gamer either...my last real heavy addiction was the original Diablo...that thing I used to play 5hr a day on bnet...but I've been lucky enough not to get hooked on newer stuff :) got one machine that is a f/t cooker machine that dual-boots win2k. It's helpful for the odd time i need to run win software (not often) or testing stuff like samba. I haven't had the misfortune of using a winbox in 6+ years :) Lucky you.. =) Smart me, my contract for clients explicitly declares that winboxes are against my religion ;) I play WC3 and D2 on my mac, so I'm not worried about that... =) I want an a-book! :P I'm telling ya... Apple makes some sweet hardware. It's a shame it's so bloody expensive. =( I just saw a 17 G4 aluminum powerbook on ebay, the bid was at 900 bucks after almost 2 days...if I had the money
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 10 February 2003 09:48 pm, Jack Coates wrote: On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 20:41, Lorne wrote: On Monday 10 February 2003 03:19 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Monday 10 Feb 2003 9:08 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. Sorry to hear that - it's so good when it does work. I haven't really looked at the network problem at all - our lan is pretty light use except for the internet access. I avoid using that under windows because of the reduced security, so I haven't much info on what I can get going and what I can't with regard to networking. Anne As I understand it VMWare will do what I needed Win4Lin to do but at quite a bit more cost. There is another product that will run a bunch of windows apps. I can't recall the name of it for the life of me. It runs office, explorer, notes and some others beautifully. It is also commercial. AHHH... Crossover office by codeweavers. I've not checked out what they've done recently but a year ago when they released the first version it was pretty darned good! Used 1.2 when mdk9.0 came out and had to ask for my money back, sadly, as it had great difficulty installing Office 97, wasn't stable, and couldn't run Visio for beans (that was listed as bronze at the time, the Codeweavers guys get nothing but kudos from me for even undertaking the effort). What a stinking shame uncle billy and his gang of thieves can get away with not being required to play fair. What a daunting task these guys have, having to reverse engineering everything. Incredible job and I hope they keep making ground. Sorry to hear they are still having problems. I'm sure they are still working hard on it. I tell you, iexplore.exe running in Linux is a jarring sight. And you know something else, it was blazing fast; faster than any Win2K install I've ever seen. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
This time Lorne [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes daring and writes: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Tried GNUCash yet? I liked it when I had use for something like that (I hate to manage money, I stay away from it when I can :) Vox -- Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs. Kind of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_ technology than everyone else. -- Donald B. Marti Jr. msg65904/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 11 February 2003 08:12 pm, Vox wrote: This time Lorne [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes daring and writes: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Tried GNUCash yet? I liked it when I had use for something like that (I hate to manage money, I stay away from it when I can :) yea, about 6 months ago. It just didn't do it for me. I guess it is too much for this old fart. :) Mebbe I should go take another peak at it. Maybe it has changed. Vox Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 11 February 2003 08:25 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) Ahh.. that is what I LOVE about these lists! There is always something else you haven't heard of or thought of. No, actually I don't think I have tried any of them! ?? I remember looking around and tried several some time back. thanks. I'll go take a peak right now. :) James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 19:25, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) OOOps forgot KBudget and Kapitol the last one is from theKompany and supposed to be very much like M$Money. James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 11 February 2003 08:31 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 19:25, James Sparenberg wrote: On Tue, 2003-02-11 at 18:50, Lorne wrote: On Tuesday 11 February 2003 12:21 am, James Sparenberg wrote: I run Win4Lin 4 here. Just curious.. what can't you get running? I use it mostly for the occasional doc that OOo can't open as well as PSP and DreamWeaver. Any chance you have Microsoft money working? Codeweaver couldn't make it work.. If I could get either Microsoft money working or find a simple money manager for linux I liked, I'd be 98% free of microsoft. At home anyways. :) Now if I can just land that gig working on unix at work.. Have you tried Kmoney or sqlLedger? There is also FreeMoney (I like the name) and EuroBudget. For just a really nice Check book style accounting system I like CBB (Check Book Balancer) OOOps forgot KBudget and Kapitol the last one is from theKompany and supposed to be very much like M$Money. I didn't see any demo version or something a guy could try first. I don't mind paying, but I'd surely want more than what they offer without seeing it first. I've been burned too many times to buy on good faith. :) I'm still looking at some of the others though. Thanks again. James On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 07:05, Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com __ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 16:19, Franki wrote: That is an awesom application... I just checed it out... Only two things I can think of that it needs for use over here.. 1. MySQL support.. It's just so easy to add postgres to your system.. that it should not be a problem that it does not support MySQL 2. Australian GST support.. I am Australian and I do use SQL-Ledger to support our needs in calculating the GST, It's actually excellent for the AUD GST I am going to have a read thought the code and see if I can't provide those requirements.. There has been some talk about MySQL on the SQL-Ledger mailing list.. I wouldn't bother.. In theory, if its using DBI to access DB, then it should be possible, unless they are using stuff specific to Pg. The GST is another whole ballgame, My Girlfriend is a Bookkeeper, so if she can make me understand what is required for Aust GST.. then I will see if I can do it.. Check out http://www.minnesota.com/~tom/sql-ledger/howtos/ it may help you with your answers with GST and MySQL questions I am really excited, sql-ledger is an application I have been thinking about writing for ages.. didn't know someone already had. Yes they have and it's mature now.. well debugged and tested Cheers Mark Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 10:18, Jack Coates wrote: On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 06:36, Luca Olivetti wrote: Luca Olivetti wrote: I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye my four year old is the number one source of failure since I upgraded my power supply, he's a big fan of pushing buttons and pulling cords. My 16 month old like the nice power button with the green light on it... it goes on and off and on and off step away from the machine. My 4 and 6 year olds both have their own machines ;) -- ...Rob -- They that can give up liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -- Benjamin Franklin, 1706-1790 = Robert Goshko Axis Computer Consulting Services, Inc President Sherwood Park, Alberta, Canada http://www.axis-dev.ca/ Supporting the Revolution In Your World = Registered Linux User #260513GNU/Linux i686 2.4.20-2mdk-725ca 9:05am up 2:55, 4 users, load average: 1.22, 1.26, 1.26 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 10 Feb 2003 9:08 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. Sorry to hear that - it's so good when it does work. I haven't really looked at the network problem at all - our lan is pretty light use except for the internet access. I avoid using that under windows because of the reduced security, so I haven't much info on what I can get going and what I can't with regard to networking. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 10 February 2003 03:19 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Monday 10 Feb 2003 9:08 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. Sorry to hear that - it's so good when it does work. I haven't really looked at the network problem at all - our lan is pretty light use except for the internet access. I avoid using that under windows because of the reduced security, so I haven't much info on what I can get going and what I can't with regard to networking. Anne As I understand it VMWare will do what I needed Win4Lin to do but at quite a bit more cost. There is another product that will run a bunch of windows apps. I can't recall the name of it for the life of me. It runs office, explorer, notes and some others beautifully. It is also commercial. AHHH... Crossover office by codeweavers. I've not checked out what they've done recently but a year ago when they released the first version it was pretty darned good! Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon, 2003-02-10 at 20:41, Lorne wrote: On Monday 10 February 2003 03:19 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Monday 10 Feb 2003 9:08 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. Sorry to hear that - it's so good when it does work. I haven't really looked at the network problem at all - our lan is pretty light use except for the internet access. I avoid using that under windows because of the reduced security, so I haven't much info on what I can get going and what I can't with regard to networking. Anne As I understand it VMWare will do what I needed Win4Lin to do but at quite a bit more cost. There is another product that will run a bunch of windows apps. I can't recall the name of it for the life of me. It runs office, explorer, notes and some others beautifully. It is also commercial. AHHH... Crossover office by codeweavers. I've not checked out what they've done recently but a year ago when they released the first version it was pretty darned good! Used 1.2 when mdk9.0 came out and had to ask for my money back, sadly, as it had great difficulty installing Office 97, wasn't stable, and couldn't run Visio for beans (that was listed as bronze at the time, the Codeweavers guys get nothing but kudos from me for even undertaking the effort). I tell you, iexplore.exe running in Linux is a jarring sight. And you know something else, it was blazing fast; faster than any Win2K install I've ever seen. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Anne Wilson wrote: On Monday 10 Feb 2003 9:08 pm, Mark Weaver wrote: Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. Sorry to hear that - it's so good when it does work. I haven't really looked at the network problem at all - our lan is pretty light use except for the internet access. I avoid using that under windows because of the reduced security, so I haven't much info on what I can get going and what I can't with regard to networking. Anne As I understand it VMWare will do what I needed Win4Lin to do but at quite a bit more cost. -- Mark --- Paid for by Penguins against modern appliances(R) Linux User Since 1996 Powered by Mandrake Linux 8.2 9.0 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Luca Olivetti wrote: Jack Coates wrote: BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye my four year old is the number one source of failure since I upgraded my power supply, he's a big fan of pushing buttons and pulling cords. Oh, I have all buttons and switches disconnected, he managed to lock it up just using it, and since he has no root privileges he managed to lock it with userspace programs (yes, I just had to reboot because he did it again). I'm thinking it's time to give up on nvidia crap and go back to the nv driver (though it will be tough to explain him why he cannot play tuxracer, armagetron and cannon smash). Bye Good heavens! I, and my 6 year old grand daughter play those games with the i810 integrated vid card on my Dell Dimension. works just fine. -- Mark --- Paid for by Penguins against modern appliances(R) Linux User Since 1996 Powered by Mandrake Linux 8.2 9.0 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Anne Wilson wrote: On Saturday 08 Feb 2003 5:10 am, Mark Weaver wrote: If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. Have you considered win4lin for that need? Not everything works under it, but if your does the feeling of release is great. You run your windows app without having to re-boot. You get the windows functionality for that purpose, but with linux stability - and if it does go down, you can exit without bringing down your whole workstation. It's not free, but there's a money-back guarantee, I understand. Anne HI Anne, Actually I have tried that and one of those 'things' that didn't work was networking, and the accounting system software, which is why I was trying it in the first place. :( I was rather hoping it would work because I hate having to stop what I'm doing cause Winders has to crap. -- Mark --- Paid for by Penguins against modern appliances(R) Linux User Since 1996 Powered by Mandrake Linux 8.2 9.0 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sunday 09 February 2003 02:05 am, James Sparenberg wrote: Jack, Told my 2 year old that if he pushed that button his fingers would disapear. (In a calm voice.) He looked at me looked at his fingers smiled and said No daddy . But he didn't push the button. Take my tactic. The button on the front of the box has been disabled. (I pulled the switch out of the case.) If worse comes to worse. I pull the tail from the wall. James You know, you could set your BIOS so that a poweroff takes 4 seconds on the old button... :-) -- /\ Dark Lord \/ Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Jack Coates wrote: BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye my four year old is the number one source of failure since I upgraded my power supply, he's a big fan of pushing buttons and pulling cords. Oh, I have all buttons and switches disconnected, he managed to lock it up just using it, and since he has no root privileges he managed to lock it with userspace programs (yes, I just had to reboot because he did it again). I'm thinking it's time to give up on nvidia crap and go back to the nv driver (though it will be tough to explain him why he cannot play tuxracer, armagetron and cannon smash). Bye -- Luca Olivetti Note.- This message reached you today, it may not tomorrow if you are using MAPS or other RBL. They arbitrarily IP addresses not related in any way to spam, disrupting Internet connectivity. See http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/05/21/1944247 and http://theory.whirlycott.com/~phil/antispam/rbl-bad/rbl-bad.html msg65791/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat Feb 08, 2003 at 02:07:40AM -0600, Vox wrote:
Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or
twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff
occassionally.
I locked my cooker box tonight...after 60 days of uptime (power went
out, no UPS...lost around 30 or 40 days on that)...finally decided
to move stuff to the second 120gig HD I got...for some reason,
diskdrake didn't like the hdh disk...it didn't complain about hdg
(exactly the same model)...I fdisk/mkfs'ed hdh by hand and it
worked...but diskdrake ate my X...which tends to lock kboard and
mouse when you run the nvidia drivers...so hard reboot :( But...it's
my first lockup since I moved to cooker circa 8.2b1
It was strange. I was copying an ISO from one partition to another (two
separate drives) and it hung. Tried it again later, and moved 3 ISOs in
succession without a burp. Very odd. I usually find cooker to be quite
stable, but I tend to go this cycle: install release version, wait until
after cooker has settled down (gcc/glibc upgrades), track cooker during the
beta period, do a fresh install when the release is out. I have to have a
semi-stable system, and don't sync with cooker daily... so I tend to take
this route. Upgrades are really simple even with a fresh install. Soon
I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc directory to CVS then
on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or cvs diff to find the
differences. Should be an interesting project.
Yup. I would be Win-free, except for EverQuest. I hear it's coming out for
the Mac soon, which would be great, except the Mac version won't be able to
interact with the Win version, meaning separate servers. Meaning starting
all over again. =( I'll keep my 5GB Win2k partition specifically to play
it. My Wintendo, as it were.
Uhm...I've heard you can run EverCrack on WineX and play well, with
a few details (some sounds or some crap like that...I don't play
EverCrack :) google is your friend :)
If I'm going to sit down and play EQ, i want it to work 100%... =) I've
tried WineX, and while it's ok, doesn't really play to well on my
workstation with it's odd dual-head setup (2MB PCI video card and a 16MB
AGP). It's caused strange issues for me in the past. So I've got one
machine that is a f/t cooker machine that dual-boots win2k. It's helpful
for the odd time i need to run win software (not often) or testing stuff
like samba.
So there is *one* good thing about Windows, for me. =)
Nah, if you can WineX it, you don't need windows :)
Vox, who loves his WC3 and D2 on winex :)
I play WC3 and D2 on my mac, so I'm not worried about that... =) WineX is
alright, and it's been cool to play with, but when I play on my Linux
workstation, which isn't often, I usually play the older Loki games I've
got... except SimCity3000 doesn't want to run on cooker for some reason...
haven't explored that one yet tho.
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
lynx -source http://linsec.ca/vdanen.asc | gpg --import
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
This time Vincent Danen [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes daring and writes: succession without a burp. Very odd. I usually find cooker to be quite stable, but I tend to go this cycle: install release version, wait until after cooker has settled down (gcc/glibc upgrades), track cooker during the beta period, do a fresh install when the release is out. I have to have a semi-stable system, and don't sync with cooker daily... so I tend to take this route. Upgrades are really simple even with a fresh install. That's more or less how I do it too, without the fresh install. I track cooker daily until release...then wait out the first 2 or 3 weeks after cooker re-opening and keep going on the daily tracking until the glibc/gcc/whatever changes start, then I stop till I don't get any need to uninstall this to continue and go back to daily tracking. So far, my box has been behaving well :) Soon I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc directory to CVS then on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or cvs diff to find the differences. Should be an interesting project. I've done that when admining the local LUG box with 3 other people, that way we could track down and shoot whoever mungled the box ;) It works well, for the most part, once you get used to it. Uhm...I've heard you can run EverCrack on WineX and play well, with a few details (some sounds or some crap like that...I don't play EverCrack :) google is your friend :) If I'm going to sit down and play EQ, i want it to work 100%... =) I've Bah, you addicts are all the same :P tried WineX, and while it's ok, doesn't really play to well on my workstation with it's odd dual-head setup (2MB PCI video card and a 16MB AGP). It's caused strange issues for me in the past. So I've Youch, I didn't know you could play EverCrack with such small vidcards...hell, I thought you couldn't play tuxracer with them :) got one machine that is a f/t cooker machine that dual-boots win2k. It's helpful for the odd time i need to run win software (not often) or testing stuff like samba. I haven't had the misfortune of using a winbox in 6+ years :) So there is *one* good thing about Windows, for me. =) Nah, if you can WineX it, you don't need windows :) Vox, who loves his WC3 and D2 on winex :) I play WC3 and D2 on my mac, so I'm not worried about that... =) I want an a-book! :P WineX is alright, and it's been cool to play with, but when I play on my Linux workstation, which isn't often, I usually play the older Loki games I've got... except SimCity3000 doesn't want to run on cooker for some reason... haven't explored that one yet tho. Unfortunately, Loki lived and died during my financial crisis, so I never managed to get any of their games :/ I hope somebody comes up with a working business doing linux games soon, tho, so I can get rid of winex :) Vox -- Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs. Kind of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_ technology than everyone else. -- Donald B. Marti Jr. msg65803/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun, 2003-02-09 at 03:06, Ronald J. Hall wrote: On Sunday 09 February 2003 02:05 am, James Sparenberg wrote: Jack, Told my 2 year old that if he pushed that button his fingers would disapear. (In a calm voice.) He looked at me looked at his fingers smiled and said No daddy . But he didn't push the button. Take my tactic. The button on the front of the box has been disabled. (I pulled the switch out of the case.) If worse comes to worse. I pull the tail from the wall. James You know, you could set your BIOS so that a poweroff takes 4 seconds on the old button... :-) Dark, You must not have a kid *grin* if it doesn't work push it longer and harder is the motto. James -- James Sparenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun, 2003-02-09 at 14:33, Vincent Danen wrote: ... I'll be setting up CVS so I can commit the entire /etc directory to CVS then on an upgrade I can do stuff like cvs co or cvs diff to find the differences. Should be an interesting project. I've always wanted to do that... I know people that do it for ~ and consequently have 10 years of history in their .bash_profile :-) One of these days. ... workstation, which isn't often, I usually play the older Loki games I've got... except SimCity3000 doesn't want to run on cooker for some reason... haven't explored that one yet tho. Got and like a lot of Loki games, but haven't been able to play them since I bought this laptop as the video is not really up to snuff. It plays Civ2:CTP well enough, but I really don't have the hours and hours to burn on that game like I did before I had a life :-) -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Now *this* is the kind of linux application development that gets me giddy. *grin* Once you can make a business case to replace the back-end systems of a business with linux, *then* you have a real shot at converting the desktops (you listening Mark? *hehehe*). I might have to have Mr. Weaver see if he can't get an installation of this running on one of the boxes at work so we can do a real comparison study with Best/Sage MAS-200 SQL. It'd be interesting to see how this stacks up against a MSSQL mid-range accounting system. Hmm...another spring project... Jon 8^) Mark wrote: Looks like some people need to discover SQL-Ledger for their accounting system..http://www.sql-ledger.com been using it for some time and it is excellent, and even if I was forced to use M$ Win, I would still use SQL-Ledger as my accounting system. Cheers Mark On Sun, 2003-02-09 at 04:07, Jack Coates wrote: On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 21:10, Mark Weaver wrote: ... If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I bought VMWare 2 for 89 bucks when it first came out and have been using it ever since to keep a Windows system around for Visio. If you don't have the cash for VMware or Win4Lin, try Bochs. Or if you like to hit yourself in the head with a cinderblock for fun, you could try to get the accounting app to run in Wine :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
That is an awesom application... I just checed it out... Only two things I can think of that it needs for use over here.. 1. MySQL support.. 2. Australian GST support.. I am going to have a read thought the code and see if I can't provide those requirements.. In theory, if its using DBI to access DB, then it should be possible, unless they are using stuff specific to Pg. The GST is another whole ballgame, My Girlfriend is a Bookkeeper, so if she can make me understand what is required for Aust GST.. then I will see if I can do it.. I am really excited, sql-ledger is an application I have been thinking about writing for ages.. didn't know someone already had. rgds Frank -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jonathan I. Nori Sent: Monday, 10 February 2003 12:19 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!! Now *this* is the kind of linux application development that gets me giddy. *grin* Once you can make a business case to replace the back-end systems of a business with linux, *then* you have a real shot at converting the desktops (you listening Mark? *hehehe*). I might have to have Mr. Weaver see if he can't get an installation of this running on one of the boxes at work so we can do a real comparison study with Best/Sage MAS-200 SQL. It'd be interesting to see how this stacks up against a MSSQL mid-range accounting system. Hmm...another spring project... Jon 8^) Mark wrote: Looks like some people need to discover SQL-Ledger for their accounting system..http://www.sql-ledger.com been using it for some time and it is excellent, and even if I was forced to use M$ Win, I would still use SQL-Ledger as my accounting system. Cheers Mark On Sun, 2003-02-09 at 04:07, Jack Coates wrote: On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 21:10, Mark Weaver wrote: ... If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I bought VMWare 2 for 89 bucks when it first came out and have been using it ever since to keep a Windows system around for Visio. If you don't have the cash for VMware or Win4Lin, try Bochs. Or if you like to hit yourself in the head with a cinderblock for fun, you could try to get the accounting app to run in Wine :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
This time Vincent Danen [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes daring and writes: On Sat Feb 08, 2003 at 12:10:59AM -0500, Mark Weaver wrote: everytime one of the eh-hem...programs leaks so bad it stuffs the entire system, or explorer craps out and takes down the entire system. pa-Lease! I've been throwing everything thing I can think of and some things I've thought of myself that I'm rather proud of and I've only been able to totally freeze my Mandrake desktop bad enough that I had to do a hardboot all of two times. I've been running Mandrake since 7.0. ( now running Mandrake 9.0 ) strongest, most well thought out and best put together OS Ive ever seen, and I've seen a few. Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally. I locked my cooker box tonight...after 60 days of uptime (power went out, no UPS...lost around 30 or 40 days on that)...finally decided to move stuff to the second 120gig HD I got...for some reason, diskdrake didn't like the hdh disk...it didn't complain about hdg (exactly the same model)...I fdisk/mkfs'ed hdh by hand and it worked...but diskdrake ate my X...which tends to lock kboard and mouse when you run the nvidia drivers...so hard reboot :( But...it's my first lockup since I moved to cooker circa 8.2b1 Yup. I would be Win-free, except for EverQuest. I hear it's coming out for the Mac soon, which would be great, except the Mac version won't be able to interact with the Win version, meaning separate servers. Meaning starting all over again. =( I'll keep my 5GB Win2k partition specifically to play it. My Wintendo, as it were. Uhm...I've heard you can run EverCrack on WineX and play well, with a few details (some sounds or some crap like that...I don't play EverCrack :) google is your friend :) So there is *one* good thing about Windows, for me. =) Nah, if you can WineX it, you don't need windows :) Vox, who loves his WC3 and D2 on winex :) -- Think of the Linux community as a niche economy isolated by its beliefs. Kind of like the Amish, except that our religion requires us to use _higher_ technology than everyone else. -- Donald B. Marti Jr. msg65753/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 7 Feb 2003 23:35:17 -0800 Dave Laird [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Good evening, everyone... Good morning... sorta. On Friday 07 February 2003 09:47 pm, Vincent Danen wrote: On Sat Feb 08, 2003 at 12:10:59AM -0500, Mark Weaver wrote: In my experience you've got to try pretty damn hard to break Mandrake linux. For getting work done there's just no comparison between windows and Linux. the two of them don't even belong in the same breath let alone in the same ball park. and I'm not bashing windows just for the sake of it. My workstation at work dual boots win2K and Mandrake Linux. While I hacking out code for something at work I'm running Mandrake. My boss runs win98...he has to reboot sometimes 3-4 times...I just keep working. If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I was going to simply let this thread slide on by my workstation and keep my mouth shut, as it's Friday, and I am exhausted after a 60+ hour week. Then I remembered my little chart, and after finding it in the archive directory, and reviewing the results of nearly two years of comparitive studies and constant testing, particularly with regard to Windows XP versus Mandrake 9.0, I simply *had* to say something. Slide by... Ditto... my little chart consisted of updating /etc/reason4reboot on every version since about 7.2 -- sadly, 9.0 has been rebooted so many times that I gave up on this ritual. Between a huge volume of e-mail, plus constant involvement in various other writing projects, programming in Perl and Delphi and various other forms of database development, I would say I probably am as hard on a workstation as anyone else. For a fortunately brief period of time each year, I have performed quality analyses on two other workstations powered by Microsoft products and my own workstation running Mandrake. There is *not* a year but what the Mandrake box has handily won, but this year neither of the XP boxes stood a chance when it came to the race for efficiency. My laptop is always running 8 desktops, 3 users locally (3 sylpheed (7 accounts), 3 gnucash (avg 2 accounts open)), remote ssh'ed to 2 other users on my server (w/X sessions), a common galeon (3 windows with around 15 tabs open), several emacs windows (6 at the moment), 2 korganizers, ZERO ohphone (never fixed), etc. Here is a tiny sample: Current Uptime: Windows 2 days 6 hoursMandrake 14 months 9 days Windows = not used since 1998 Mdk 8.2 = 85 days (SCSI tight loop lockup) Mdk 9.0 = reboot instead of suspend/resume which requires hard reset Mean average: Windows 2+ days Mandrake 13 months+ My Windows record was 6 crashes in 1 hour -- had around 15 (IIRC) troubles open with M$ at the time. Last forced reboot Windows 2 daysMandrake NEVER Windows (pre-mid-98) -- duh! Mdk 8.2 and prior -- rare Mdk 9.0 -- several times per day until 'trigger' found to be suspend/resume Time consumed in last patch/upgrade: Windows 3.2 hours Mandrake .75 hours (45 mins) last Mdk -- 5 mins Viruses/worms Windows (2) Mandrake 0 None on any OS (lucky I guess) Hacked once -- Caldera evaluation Catastrophic faults Windows 9 Mandrake 0 Windows -- led to a heart attack Mdk 8.2 -- still have one system down Mdk 9.0 -- ext3 seems to be saving my bacon (failures which required user intervention and loss of use) Here's an anomaly that stands out: Most productive version of each brand: Windows 98 None! Mandrake 8.2 and up Mdk 8.2 and PRIOR I keep the Windows machines running only because the corporate databases are written entirely in FoxBase, but we are slowly beginning to phase that out in favor of Kylix, which means within the next year database development will be moved entirely to Mandrake workstations. I run NO Windows machines and will not support anyone else doing so -- I help my sister with her MS (multiple-sclerosis) consulting business -- she got tired of M$ crashes and asked me to install Linux 2 years ago. To be politically-correct, I am not here to bash Windows. However, given the number of times the Windows boxes have been patched and upgraded, I still cannot seem to do better than 2 or 3 days uptime before one or both of them crash or require a reboot. To be PC, I have no need to bash windows -- I let the fact speak for itself -- as stated on my web pages: This is a Micro$oft-free site -- one Windows-induced heart attack in 1998 was enough! To be less PC... Mdk 9.0 on my laptop is has been giving me tightness in the fists which hopefully won't translate into tightness in my chest... Am I happy with Mandrake? Yes... UNTIL 9.0 -- since, an emphatic NO! I've not been much help on this list since the release of 9.0; 9.1 will either
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Vincent Danen wrote: Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally. I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). Traced the problem to the kernel compiled with gcc3 and a not really up to date bttv driver, as well as a non functional alsa subsystem. Now I'm using 8.2 kernel and everything is almost fine. I didn't try cooker kernels because they caused strange problems on another test machine and I'm only using xfs on this one. Bye -- Luca Olivetti Note.- This message reached you today, it may not tomorrow if you are using MAPS or other RBL. They arbitrarily IP addresses not related in any way to spam, disrupting Internet connectivity. See http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/05/21/1944247 and http://theory.whirlycott.com/~phil/antispam/rbl-bad/rbl-bad.html msg65760/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Luca Olivetti wrote: I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye -- Luca Olivetti Note.- This message reached you today, it may not tomorrow if you are using MAPS or other RBL. They arbitrarily IP addresses not related in any way to spam, disrupting Internet connectivity. See http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/05/21/1944247 and http://theory.whirlycott.com/~phil/antispam/rbl-bad/rbl-bad.html msg65761/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Saturday 08 February 2003 09:06 am, Luca Olivetti wrote: Vincent Danen wrote: Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally. I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). Traced the problem to the kernel compiled with gcc3 and a not really up to date bttv driver, as well as a non functional alsa subsystem. Now I'm using 8.2 kernel and everything is almost fine. I didn't try cooker kernels because they caused strange problems on another test machine and I'm only using xfs on this one. Bye would be nice to know more about your lockups, since I don't get lockups. what sound chips and what video card and drivers are you using? when you say almost fine what sort of problems do you have with 8.2 still? what does lspcidrake say and what does cat /proc/pci say Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
et wrote: would be nice to know more about your lockups, since I don't get lockups. what easy, I used to use a program called vcr that captures from the tv card and compresses to divx on the fly. Works (or better, used to work, it doesn't with recent avifile versions) with 8.2 kernel, immediate lockup with 9.0 kernel. Something similar happened with ffmpeg. A couple other programs dealing with tv capture and processing have the same symptoms. One captures audio and video and processes them on the fly (sorry, I can't be more specific), so it needs full duplex audio. With 8.2 kernel it works fine with alsa (in fact that's the recommended driver), with 9.0 it doesn't work at all with alsa, it does with oss but it will lock hard the machine after a while. Tried a kernel rpm from SGI (all my filesystems are xfs) and had the same problems. The kernel rpm from SGI also was compiled with gcc3. With great pain I tried to recompile the 9.0 kernel srpm with gcc-2.96. I don't remember if I was successful in compiling it or not. I think I was, it solved this problem but it created others, so I stuck with 8.2 kernel. sound chips and what video card and drivers are you using? when you say almost fine what sort of problems do you have with 8.2 still? what does No, I don't really have problems with 8.2 kernel unless I'm using nvidia drivers, but that's not really a Mandrake or SGI fault. BTW, all the tests with 9.0 kernel have been made with the open source nv driver, just to keep the nvidia binary module out of the picture. lspcidrake say and what does cat /proc/pci say It's pretty common hardware: $ lspcidrake unknown : VIA Technologies|VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133] unknown : VIA Technologies|VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133 AGP] unknown : VIA Technologies|VT82C686 [Apollo Super] unknown : VIA Technologies|VT82C586 IDE [Apollo] usb-uhci: VIA Technologies|VT82C586B USB usb-uhci: VIA Technologies|VT82C586B USB unknown : VIA Technologies|VT82C686 [Apollo Super ACPI] via82cxxx_audio : VIA Technologies|VT82C686 [Apollo Super AC97/Audio] ohci1394: VIA Technologies|OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller bttv: Brooktree Corporation|Bt878 btaudio : Brooktree Corporation|Bt878 8139too : Realtek|RTL-8139 Card:NVIDIA GeForce2 DDR (generic): nVidia Corporation|NV11 (Geforce2 MX) unknown : Virtual|Hub [] unknown : Virtual|Hub [] $ cat /proc/pci PCI devices found: Bus 0, device 0, function 0: Host bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133] (rev 3). Master Capable. Latency=8. Prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xd800 [0xdbff]. Bus 0, device 1, function 0: PCI bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8363/8365 [KT133/KM133 AGP] (rev 0). Master Capable. No bursts. Min Gnt=12. Bus 0, device 7, function 0: ISA bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C686 [Apollo Super South] (rev 64). Bus 0, device 7, function 1: IDE interface: VIA Technologies, Inc. Bus Master IDE (rev 6). Master Capable. Latency=32. I/O at 0xd000 [0xd00f]. Bus 0, device 7, function 2: USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (rev 22). IRQ 11. Master Capable. Latency=32. I/O at 0xd400 [0xd41f]. Bus 0, device 7, function 3: USB Controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. UHCI USB (#2) (rev 22). IRQ 11. Master Capable. Latency=32. I/O at 0xd800 [0xd81f]. Bus 0, device 7, function 4: Bridge: VIA Technologies, Inc. VT82C686 [Apollo Super ACPI] (rev 64). IRQ 9. Bus 0, device 7, function 5: Multimedia audio controller: VIA Technologies, Inc. AC97 Audio Controller (rev 80). IRQ 5. I/O at 0xdc00 [0xdcff]. I/O at 0xe000 [0xe003]. I/O at 0xe400 [0xe403]. Bus 0, device 10, function 0: FireWire (IEEE 1394): VIA Technologies, Inc. OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller (rev 67). IRQ 5. Master Capable. Latency=32. Max Lat=32. Non-prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xde00 [0xde0007ff]. I/O at 0xe800 [0xe87f]. Bus 0, device 12, function 0: Multimedia video controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 (rev 2). IRQ 5. Master Capable. Latency=32. Min Gnt=16.Max Lat=40. Prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xde001000 [0xde001fff]. Bus 0, device 12, function 1: Multimedia controller: Brooktree Corporation Bt878 (rev 2). IRQ 5. Master Capable. Latency=32. Min Gnt=4.Max Lat=255. Prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xde002000 [0xde002fff]. Bus 0, device 13, function 0: Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL-8139 (rev 16). IRQ 11. Master Capable. Latency=32. Min Gnt=32.Max Lat=64. I/O at 0xec00 [0xecff]. Non-prefetchable 32 bit memory at 0xde003000 [0xde0030ff]. Bus 1, device 0, function 0: VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation NV11 (GeForce2
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat, Feb 08, 2003 at 08:52:01AM -0500, Pierre Fortin wrote: Mdk 9.0 -- several times per day until 'trigger' found to be suspend/resume I had terrible suspend/resume problems with 9.0 too (crash after every third or fourth resume). Switching to a stock 2.4.20 kernel has helped greatly. It's hung only twice on resume in two months (hard disk refused to spin back up, though everything else was working). The kernels in 7.2 and 8.1 were much better in this area. Never had a suspend/ resume problem in two years, on two different IBM laptops. To be fair, I don't think these problems are Mandrake's fault. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 21:10, Mark Weaver wrote: ... If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I bought VMWare 2 for 89 bucks when it first came out and have been using it ever since to keep a Windows system around for Visio. If you don't have the cash for VMware or Win4Lin, try Bochs. Or if you like to hit yourself in the head with a cinderblock for fun, you could try to get the accounting app to run in Wine :-) -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
... Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally. ... Clearly you don't own a newer ACPI-based i815 Sony Vaio :-) I've had to upgrade to a cooker kernel to get it to function at all (2.4.20-2mdk, was either that or compile my own from scratch). Now it is fine as long as I'm careful about video switches, but I can reliably kernel panic it by logging out of XFce or leaving VMware in fullscreen mode until the Windows it's now safe to turn off your computer screen. I've sent a note to Juan Quintela, but since I can't get the oops because it's video related, there's nothing he can do. Then there's swsusp, which is another excellent source of crashes. The mailing list is active with lots of patching going on, but no one has gotten a new Vaio to work properly yet as of beta 18. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 06:36, Luca Olivetti wrote: Luca Olivetti wrote: I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye my four year old is the number one source of failure since I upgraded my power supply, he's a big fan of pushing buttons and pulling cords. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Looks like some people need to discover SQL-Ledger for their accounting system..http://www.sql-ledger.com been using it for some time and it is excellent, and even if I was forced to use M$ Win, I would still use SQL-Ledger as my accounting system. Cheers Mark On Sun, 2003-02-09 at 04:07, Jack Coates wrote: On Fri, 2003-02-07 at 21:10, Mark Weaver wrote: ... If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I bought VMWare 2 for 89 bucks when it first came out and have been using it ever since to keep a Windows system around for Visio. If you don't have the cash for VMware or Win4Lin, try Bochs. Or if you like to hit yourself in the head with a cinderblock for fun, you could try to get the accounting app to run in Wine :-) Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Jack, Told my 2 year old that if he pushed that button his fingers would disapear. (In a calm voice.) He looked at me looked at his fingers smiled and said No daddy . But he didn't push the button. Take my tactic. The button on the front of the box has been disabled. (I pulled the switch out of the case.) If worse comes to worse. I pull the tail from the wall. James On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 09:18, Jack Coates wrote: On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 06:36, Luca Olivetti wrote: Luca Olivetti wrote: I can lock my 9.0 box at will, just capturing video or trying to use full duplex audio (when the load is high). BTW, minutes after writing this, my 3 years old son managed to freeze X (no, not the whole system, I was running mozilla remotely with no problem), but that's bound to happen with nvidia drivers :-\ Bye my four year old is the number one source of failure since I upgraded my power supply, he's a big fan of pushing buttons and pulling cords. -- James Sparenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED] Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 04 February 2003 01:22 am, Vincent Danen scribbled nervously: Well, that's just a load of crap and you know it. I think I use my workstation just as hard as any Win98 user does... and it's rock solid for me. Don't use the product in any user-workhorse mode? Yeah... right. Anyways, this is something you should bring up on cooker... I doubt it can be accomplished for 9.1, but if no one asks for it, we dont't think about it or know it's important to people. Can't be *that* important as this is the first I've heard of it in 3 years. Remember, we are not Windows. Ok, we may be missing some of the good features of Windows in some instances, but we're also missing a lot of the bad ones. Vincent, Um...what good features would those be? you mean not having to reboot everytime one of the eh-hem...programs leaks so bad it stuffs the entire system, or explorer craps out and takes down the entire system. pa-Lease! I've been throwing everything thing I can think of and some things I've thought of myself that I'm rather proud of and I've only been able to totally freeze my Mandrake desktop bad enough that I had to do a hardboot all of two times. I've been running Mandrake since 7.0. ( now running Mandrake 9.0 ) strongest, most well thought out and best put together OS Ive ever seen, and I've seen a few. In my experience you've got to try pretty damn hard to break Mandrake linux. For getting work done there's just no comparison between windows and Linux. the two of them don't even belong in the same breath let alone in the same ball park. and I'm not bashing windows just for the sake of it. My workstation at work dual boots win2K and Mandrake Linux. While I hacking out code for something at work I'm running Mandrake. My boss runs win98...he has to reboot sometimes 3-4 times...I just keep working. If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. -- Mark -- Powered By Mandrake Liinux 9.0 || Toshiba Portege ICQ# 27816299 -- Saying Open Source DRM is the same as saying Military Intelligence. Repeating it makes my brain hurt! author Unknown... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat Feb 08, 2003 at 12:10:59AM -0500, Mark Weaver wrote:
Well, that's just a load of crap and you know it. I think I use my
workstation just as hard as any Win98 user does... and it's rock solid
for me. Don't use the product in any user-workhorse mode? Yeah...
right.
Anyways, this is something you should bring up on cooker... I doubt it
can be accomplished for 9.1, but if no one asks for it, we dont't think
about it or know it's important to people. Can't be *that* important
as this is the first I've heard of it in 3 years. Remember, we are not
Windows. Ok, we may be missing some of the good features of Windows in
some instances, but we're also missing a lot of the bad ones.
Vincent,
Um...what good features would those be? you mean not having to reboot
Well, I dual-boot one machine for the express purpose of playing EverQuest
when time allows (maybe once or twice a week). So Win2k is good for that.
I figure if I don't install anything else, I might be able to get away
without doing a reinstall for a year... =)
everytime one of the eh-hem...programs leaks so bad it stuffs the entire
system, or explorer craps out and takes down the entire system. pa-Lease!
I've been throwing everything thing I can think of and some things I've
thought of myself that I'm rather proud of and I've only been able to totally
freeze my Mandrake desktop bad enough that I had to do a hardboot all of two
times. I've been running Mandrake since 7.0. ( now running Mandrake 9.0 )
strongest, most well thought out and best put together OS Ive ever seen, and
I've seen a few.
Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or
twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally.
In my experience you've got to try pretty damn hard to break Mandrake linux.
For getting work done there's just no comparison between windows and Linux.
the two of them don't even belong in the same breath let alone in the same
ball park. and I'm not bashing windows just for the sake of it. My
workstation at work dual boots win2K and Mandrake Linux. While I hacking out
code for something at work I'm running Mandrake. My boss runs win98...he has
to reboot sometimes 3-4 times...I just keep working. If I wouldn'tn have to
interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows
at all.
Yup. I would be Win-free, except for EverQuest. I hear it's coming out for
the Mac soon, which would be great, except the Mac version won't be able to
interact with the Win version, meaning separate servers. Meaning starting
all over again. =( I'll keep my 5GB Win2k partition specifically to play
it. My Wintendo, as it were.
So there is *one* good thing about Windows, for me. =)
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 00:47, Vincent Danen wrote: Agreed. It's pretty solid. I did manage to hang my cooker box once or twice, but hey, it's cooker. I expect this sort of stuff occassionally. You know, I can probably count on two hands the number of times my Linux boxes have crashed for something other than hardware. I've been using Linux for something like 7 years so this equates to a little more than a single crash every year. That is about right. At my former company the MDK 7.1 server was recently brought down accidentally after almost 18 months of uptime (someone was ssh'ed in and ran an init 0 on the wrong shell). Not bad. There's a joke that goes something like this: What's the difference between Windows and Linux developers? On hearing that a machine achieves 99.9% uptime, a Windows developer will put this in their marketing, congratulate themselves and throw a party in celebration. A Linux developer will try to determine what went wrong. Sad, but it's true. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Good evening, everyone... On Friday 07 February 2003 09:47 pm, Vincent Danen wrote: On Sat Feb 08, 2003 at 12:10:59AM -0500, Mark Weaver wrote: In my experience you've got to try pretty damn hard to break Mandrake linux. For getting work done there's just no comparison between windows and Linux. the two of them don't even belong in the same breath let alone in the same ball park. and I'm not bashing windows just for the sake of it. My workstation at work dual boots win2K and Mandrake Linux. While I hacking out code for something at work I'm running Mandrake. My boss runs win98...he has to reboot sometimes 3-4 times...I just keep working. If I wouldn'tn have to interact with the accounting system I wouldn't have to boot back into windows at all. I was going to simply let this thread slide on by my workstation and keep my mouth shut, as it's Friday, and I am exhausted after a 60+ hour week. Then I remembered my little chart, and after finding it in the archive directory, and reviewing the results of nearly two years of comparitive studies and constant testing, particularly with regard to Windows XP versus Mandrake 9.0, I simply *had* to say something. Between a huge volume of e-mail, plus constant involvement in various other writing projects, programming in Perl and Delphi and various other forms of database development, I would say I probably am as hard on a workstation as anyone else. For a fortunately brief period of time each year, I have performed quality analyses on two other workstations powered by Microsoft products and my own workstation running Mandrake. There is *not* a year but what the Mandrake box has handily won, but this year neither of the XP boxes stood a chance when it came to the race for efficiency. Here is a tiny sample: Current Uptime: Windows 2 days 6 hoursMandrake 14 months 9 days Mean average: Windows 2+ days Mandrake 13 months+ Last forced reboot Windows 2 days Mandrake NEVER Time consumed in last patch/upgrade: Windows 3.2 hours Mandrake .75 hours (45 mins) Viruses/worms Windows (2) Mandrake 0 Catastrophic faults Windows 9 Mandrake 0 (failures which required user intervention and loss of use) Here's an anomaly that stands out: Most productive version of each brand: Windows 98 Mandrake 8.2 and up I keep the Windows machines running only because the corporate databases are written entirely in FoxBase, but we are slowly beginning to phase that out in favor of Kylix, which means within the next year database development will be moved entirely to Mandrake workstations. To be politically-correct, I am not here to bash Windows. However, given the number of times the Windows boxes have been patched and upgraded, I still cannot seem to do better than 2 or 3 days uptime before one or both of them crash or require a reboot. Dave - -- Dave Laird ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) The Used Kharma Lot / The Phoenix Project Web Page: http://www.kharma.net updated 01/20/2003 Usenet News server: news.kharma.net Musicians Calendar and Database access: http://www.kharma.net/calendar.html An automatic random thought For the Minute: You are WRONG, you ol' brass-breasted fascist poop! - -- Bloom County -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+RLM1aE1ENZP1A28RAgCjAJ48v8Oso/lH5oaQe37Y1QUXbEv6PACfdzfn eW0C9UJX4QG74UBl3OeNPgk= =mC98 -END PGP SIGNATURE- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 04 February 2003 07:22, Vincent Danen wrote: On Tue Feb 04, 2003 at 09:54:32AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote: .. Well, be that as it may, did DrakX ever advertise this windows-alike behaviour? Did it say that if you did a package upgrade install that it would do what you seem to expect it to do? This isn't something you should be bitching about post-release... this is something you should bring up during development... I can't recall ever seeing any thread about this to date. To say that updates clobbered your system and DrakX didn't fix it for me when we never said it would do this, is not really acceptable. You should bring this up with the developers. Not sitting back and crying about it because you just assumed it was there. It is incredible to me that this obvious requirement seems to have been totally overlooked by Mandrake. which is more evidence that the developers just ignore industry experience and do not appear to actually be using the product in any user-workhorse mode. Well, that's just a load of crap and you know it. I think I use my workstation just as hard as any Win98 user does... and it's rock solid for me. Don't use the product in any user-workhorse mode? Yeah... right. Anyways, this is something you should bring up on cooker... I doubt it can be accomplished for 9.1, but if no one asks for it, we dont't think about it or know it's important to people. Can't be *that* important as this is the first I've heard of it in 3 years. Remember, we are not Windows. Ok, we may be missing some of the good features of Windows in some instances, but we're also missing a lot of the bad ones. We didn't set out to make a Windows clone, you know. Woow. No please no reinstalling will solve your Problems. I can't believe someone can get such an idea. IF there should be a system-restoring app, then it should not use bad design like re-installing to do its job. We are using linux, so if it will be done it should work like WinXP restoring and with given seperated configuration and apps the restoring should be functional without eating up disc-space like XP do. (saving the index of installerd rpm's and backing up conf-files should do the job , shouldn't it ?) For sure a nice idea for newbies. -- Regards Steffen counter.li.org : #296567. machine: 181800 vdr-box : 87 Please dont CC me, since if I have replied I'll watch the tread. Both mails will be filtered to the ML-folder. Thanks Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tuesday 04 February 2003 04:59 am, Steffen Barszus wrote: On Tuesday 04 February 2003 07:22, Vincent Danen wrote: On Tue Feb 04, 2003 at 09:54:32AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote: .. Well, be that as it may, did DrakX ever advertise this windows-alike behaviour? Did it say that if you did a package upgrade install that it would do what you seem to expect it to do? This isn't something you should be bitching about post-release... this is something you should bring up during development... I can't recall ever seeing any thread about this to date. To say that updates clobbered your system and DrakX didn't fix it for me when we never said it would do this, is not really acceptable. You should bring this up with the developers. Not sitting back and crying about it because you just assumed it was there. It is incredible to me that this obvious requirement seems to have been totally overlooked by Mandrake. which is more evidence that the developers just ignore industry experience and do not appear to actually be using the product in any user-workhorse mode. Well, that's just a load of crap and you know it. I think I use my workstation just as hard as any Win98 user does... and it's rock solid for me. Don't use the product in any user-workhorse mode? Yeah... right. Anyways, this is something you should bring up on cooker... I doubt it can be accomplished for 9.1, but if no one asks for it, we dont't think about it or know it's important to people. Can't be *that* important as this is the first I've heard of it in 3 years. Remember, we are not Windows. Ok, we may be missing some of the good features of Windows in some instances, but we're also missing a lot of the bad ones. We didn't set out to make a Windows clone, you know. Woow. No please no reinstalling will solve your Problems. I can't believe someone can get such an idea. IF there should be a system-restoring app, then it should not use bad design like re-installing to do its job. We are using linux, so if it will be done it should work like WinXP restoring and with given seperated configuration and apps the restoring should be functional without eating up disc-space like XP do. (saving the index of installerd rpm's and backing up conf-files should do the job , shouldn't it ?) For sure a nice idea for newbies. hmmm sounds like rtfd is not his friend, and I would sure have been suprized if he felt the same way had he considered the f1-rescue instead of enter to install, and the fact it is all spelled out in a manner even a 12 year old native english speaker could understand. I think the rescue mode is what he is asking for. or else he is asking for M$. and believe me, reinstalling over a botched install/configuratiion of M$anything does not neccessarly fix anything. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly to discover it is not one but some combination. That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas? It is...YES. BUT, if you know Linux, there are NO TWO LINUX BOXES THE SAME, including installations. An installation one day can be different the nexttrust me, i have had this happen. Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can we fix it? You presume too much. Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates applied, are rock solid. I agree, i have NOT had any problems with any of the updates at all. I have only had a minor issue with gurpmi that was on the newbie list in Jan and is fixed, then again after i got it fixed i reinstalled since i updated/installed too many PLF progs. Rob Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Franki wrote: there was one with apache getting loaded with apache 2 updates.. or at least trying... don't know of any other... Thanks, but apache is not installed in any of the Mandrake partitions on either of the two machines involved. -- Ron [Melbourne, Australia] The problems that we have created as a result of the level of thinking that we have done thus far cannot be solved at the same level of thinking at which we created them. - Albert Einstein. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Vincent Danen wrote: On Sun Feb 02, 2003 at 11:01:34AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote: That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas? Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can we fix it? You presume too much. Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates applied, are rock solid. I did tell you some. It's difficult because I fix each up only as it pops up during my work - which interrupts my work. Here's a partial recap. Probably more to come as I recall them. The harware is beautifullfy sound, both before, after, and during. Gateway machine is heavily firewalled. Other machine is on a LAN from the gateway machine. 1. KDE 3.0 panel had most of its icons changed to gearwheels. 2. KDE menu abbreviated - no Terminals or File tools or Control Centre (which is up all the time on its own desktop for managing printer jobs). 3. Mozilla printing just quit with no message.Required rpm -e on all the mozilla RPMs and reinstall. -- Ron [Melbourne, Australia] The problems that we have created as a result of the level of thinking that we have done thus far cannot be solved at the same level of thinking at which we created them. - Albert Einstein. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Vincent Danen wrote: Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can we fix it? You presume too much. Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates applied, are rock solid. Alas! My reply was inadvertenly attached to James Sparenburgs's message below. My apologies. All Linux partitions on both machines worked perfectly for about 6 months after expert installation. Then these problems started appearing on 3 of the partitions. Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with Windows 98 (but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with the Mandrake installer. -- Ron [Melbourne, Australia] The problems that we have created as a result of the level of thinking that we have done thus far cannot be solved at the same level of thinking at which we created them. - Albert Einstein. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 03 Feb 2003 8:28 am, Ron Stodden wrote: 3. Mozilla printing just quit with no message.Required rpm -e on all the mozilla RPMs and reinstall. This can happen at any time - it happened to me last week and I had not changed anything so far as I am aware, so it may or may not be relevant. Just my 2p worth. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 03 February 2003 03:40 am, Ron Stodden wrote: Vincent Danen wrote: Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can we fix it? You presume too much. Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates applied, are rock solid. Alas! My reply was inadvertenly attached to James Sparenburgs's message below. My apologies. All Linux partitions on both machines worked perfectly for about 6 months after expert installation. Then these problems started appearing on 3 of the partitions. Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with Windows 98 (but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with the Mandrake installer. I had two Mandrake Linux systems fail with disk in a horrible state in the past six months. Both were SiS AMD boards, the last a K7S6A (SiS745). Both hard disks came back to life with a low level format (One an IBM ATA 100 40GB drive, the other a Maxtor). I replaced the motherboard in the first system and have used it as a developoment machine/workstation for months without incident. The second system I reloaded with (gasp!) W2K which appeared to go well but within a week started acting flaky. Software installations failed, and simple tasks like burning CDs showed instability in disk throughput (fluctuating) buffer levels). After replacing the motherboard in the second system with a VIA chipset board (MS6378), the system appears to be rock solid. I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. Jim Tarvid Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 03 Feb 2003 12:27 pm, tarvid wrote: I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. I think this bears more investigation. I have a feeling that motherboard based problems have increased recently, and wonder if there is any correlation with the increased weight of heat sinks and fans required for high powered processors, and the inevitable extra strain on the supporting mobo. Seems to me that since mobos normally stand upright these days the strain must be great. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Then let all go with the new VIA ITX MB's and we will all be fine. FYI, 933mhz embedded proc with everything included (www.viatech.com) is $120 on pricewatch.com...complete system for less than $400. Rob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Anne Wilson Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 6:32 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!! On Monday 03 Feb 2003 12:27 pm, tarvid wrote: I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. I think this bears more investigation. I have a feeling that motherboard based problems have increased recently, and wonder if there is any correlation with the increased weight of heat sinks and fans required for high powered processors, and the inevitable extra strain on the supporting mobo. Seems to me that since mobos normally stand upright these days the strain must be great. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 03 Feb 2003 12:45 pm, Robert Wideman wrote: Then let all go with the new VIA ITX MB's and we will all be fine. FYI, 933mhz embedded proc with everything included (www.viatech.com) is $120 on pricewatch.com...complete system for less than $400. They look good value for systems that are not overstretched. However, a 933 processor is acceptable at this moment, but probably not enough for many newer games (I don't play them, so I'm guessing), the on-board video probably has the same limitation, and I don't think I could be satisfied with the AC97 sound either. I think this is a case of horses for courses. OTOH, if I'm right, then some mobos may prove more rigid than others and less prone to the problem. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon, Feb 03, 2003 at 06:45 -0600, Robert Wideman wrote: Then let all go with the new VIA ITX MB's and we will all be fine. FYI, 933mhz embedded proc with everything included (www.viatech.com) is $120 on pricewatch.com...complete system for less than $400. I'd really like to see 9.1 dealing with this hardware on the VIA ITX. Specs of the EPIA M9000 (that's the one with the included 933 cpu), offered in Germany by www.alternate.de for 189 EURO (around $205): - VIA C3 cpu 933 MHz - RAM up to 1024M (DDR, PC-200, PC-266) - Graphics: VIA CastleRock AGP (up to 64M shared memory) - Sound: VIA VT1616 6-channel AC97 Codec - NIC: VIA VT6103 10/100 Mbit USB 2.0, Firewire, 2x IDE (166), and all the rest. This may amount to a complete system with a 80G harddisk, DVD/CD-RW and floppy drive and 512M RAM to approx EURO 550-600 ($600-650). Sorry, I forgot the case, some $50 more. That's the cheapest you can get with these specs. Of course it's a very cheap way to upgrade an older 400MHz system which you can canibalize for harddisk, DVD, DC-RW, floppy and case. Anybody got that mobo already? wobo -- If you don't understand or are scared by any of the above ask your parents or an adult to help you. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
more likely it may be you are attempting to run at your hard drives faster speeds than the MObo, chipset and drives can stand and they are getting noise and chatter and EMF On Monday 03 February 2003 07:31 am, Anne Wilson wrote: On Monday 03 Feb 2003 12:27 pm, tarvid wrote: I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. I think this bears more investigation. I have a feeling that motherboard based problems have increased recently, and wonder if there is any correlation with the increased weight of heat sinks and fans required for high powered processors, and the inevitable extra strain on the supporting mobo. Seems to me that since mobos normally stand upright these days the strain must be great. Anne Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
RE: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Rob, Beautiful little board isn't it. I've got one I'm repairing (actually it's chassis I broke a wheel.) I installed it in a 1/10th scale car body . It's solid low noise and does anything you want except maybe hardcore gaming. LOVE IT! James On Mon, 2003-02-03 at 04:45, Robert Wideman wrote: Then let all go with the new VIA ITX MB's and we will all be fine. FYI, 933mhz embedded proc with everything included (www.viatech.com) is $120 on pricewatch.com...complete system for less than $400. Rob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Anne Wilson Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 6:32 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!! On Monday 03 Feb 2003 12:27 pm, tarvid wrote: I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. I think this bears more investigation. I have a feeling that motherboard based problems have increased recently, and wonder if there is any correlation with the increased weight of heat sinks and fans required for high powered processors, and the inevitable extra strain on the supporting mobo. Seems to me that since mobos normally stand upright these days the strain must be great. Anne -- Registered Linux User No.293302 Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Wobo, I've had it in the previos form. (800mhz version) for about 6 months. Not even a hiccup. Just gotta view the 9.0 errata for the install trick Only hiccup I've had is that the cdrom drive I bought doesn't like XP disks (I tried everything) Which to me just means it's a quality cdrom drive.*grin*.. James On Mon, 2003-02-03 at 05:24, Wolfgang Bornath wrote: On Mon, Feb 03, 2003 at 06:45 -0600, Robert Wideman wrote: Then let all go with the new VIA ITX MB's and we will all be fine. FYI, 933mhz embedded proc with everything included (www.viatech.com) is $120 on pricewatch.com...complete system for less than $400. I'd really like to see 9.1 dealing with this hardware on the VIA ITX. Specs of the EPIA M9000 (that's the one with the included 933 cpu), offered in Germany by www.alternate.de for 189 EURO (around $205): - VIA C3 cpu 933 MHz - RAM up to 1024M (DDR, PC-200, PC-266) - Graphics: VIA CastleRock AGP (up to 64M shared memory) - Sound: VIA VT1616 6-channel AC97 Codec - NIC: VIA VT6103 10/100 Mbit USB 2.0, Firewire, 2x IDE (166), and all the rest. This may amount to a complete system with a 80G harddisk, DVD/CD-RW and floppy drive and 512M RAM to approx EURO 550-600 ($600-650). Sorry, I forgot the case, some $50 more. That's the cheapest you can get with these specs. Of course it's a very cheap way to upgrade an older 400MHz system which you can canibalize for harddisk, DVD, DC-RW, floppy and case. Anybody got that mobo already? wobo -- If you don't understand or are scared by any of the above ask your parents or an adult to help you. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 03:37:37PM +0800, Franki wrote:
there was one with apache getting loaded with apache 2 updates.. or at least
trying...
don't know of any other...
apache2 is not in updates.
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 07:28:18PM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote:
That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas?
Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and
with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can
we fix it? You presume too much.
Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates
applied, are rock solid.
I did tell you some. It's difficult because I fix each up only as it
pops up
during my work - which interrupts my work.
I don't recall seeing any problems that were not user-driven.
Here's a partial recap. Probably more to come as I recall them.
The harware is beautifullfy sound, both before, after, and during.
Gateway machine is heavily firewalled. Other machine is on a LAN
from the gateway machine.
1. KDE 3.0 panel had most of its icons changed to gearwheels.
2. KDE menu abbreviated - no Terminals or File tools or Control Centre
(which is up all the time on its own desktop for managing printer jobs).
This was with the KDE 3.0.5a updates? I didn't experience this. Did
you send a message to Laurent asking about this? He built those
updates.
3. Mozilla printing just quit with no message.Required rpm -e on all
the mozilla RPMs and reinstall.
I've never seen this one before. Mozilla isn't in updates either.
Could have been cups or printer-drivers, but did you stop/start the
cups daemon and possibly closed/opened mozilla to refresh the printer
listings? Or did you do the install, with mozilla open, found you
couldn't print, and then did the rpm -e/rpm -ivh combo?
If this is all you have, your definition of clobbered and mine are
extremely different. To me, clobbered means making it unreliable
and/or completely unuseable. The first two issues, to me, are
cosmetic... certainly nothing to force a reinstall (although, again,
this is the first I've heard of that problem). The second is a
nuisance, but since it worked fine over here, I'm wondering how you
went about it, whether you did do the start/stop of your apps or
whether you followed the scenario above.
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 07:40:27PM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote:
Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and
with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can
we fix it? You presume too much.
Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates
applied, are rock solid.
Alas! My reply was inadvertenly attached to James Sparenburgs's
message below. My apologies.
All Linux partitions on both machines worked perfectly for about 6
months after
expert installation. Then these problems started appearing on 3 of the
partitions.
The KDE issues and the mozilla printing? Or was there more?
Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with
Windows 98
(but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with
the Mandrake installer.
The installer goes with the packages it's given... it doesn't install
something and go hey wait a minute and intelligently fix your problem
for you. Unless you're referring to another issue beyond the KDE
cosmetics and mozilla printing, I'm not sure why you think DrakX has
anything to do with it.
--
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Vincent Danen wrote: On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 07:40:27PM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote: Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with Windows 98 (but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with the Mandrake installer. The installer goes with the packages it's given... it doesn't install something and go hey wait a minute and intelligently fix your problem for you. It should restore your system to the same state as when it was originally installed, except for your customisation and data, which it and rpm knows to leave alone. This does imply checksums or backup copies on hand of installed unchanging files.The installer/reinstaller has access to the RPM library used at original installation. My point is that Win 98 does this. Plainly, or fortuitously, it was an important requirement and goal of installer implementation. New arrivals to Mandrake from Windows - near all of us? - expect no less, particularly when no other solution to a randomly clobbered system is offered. Recall that the i86 architecture fails to offer hardware memory block protection that would immediately trap any program's attempt to write-access outside its allocated or shared memory blocks.The CDC 6600 had this implemented, so the technology is nothing new - except to Intel. That's the major reason why i86 architecture is not safe, especially for multiple concurrent users, and not useable for critical missions. It is incredible to me that this obvious requirement seems to have been totally overlooked by Mandrake. which is more evidence that the developers just ignore industry experience and do not appear to actually be using the product in any user-workhorse mode. Unless you're referring to another issue beyond the KDE cosmetics and mozilla printing, I'm not sure why you think DrakX has anything to do with it. Explained above. -- Ron [Melbourne, Australia] The problems that we have created as a result of the level of thinking that we have done thus far cannot be solved at the same level of thinking at which we created them. - Albert Einstein. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon, 2003-02-03 at 14:54, Ron Stodden wrote: Vincent Danen wrote: On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 07:40:27PM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote: Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with Windows 98 (but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with the Mandrake installer. The installer goes with the packages it's given... it doesn't install something and go hey wait a minute and intelligently fix your problem for you. It should restore your system to the same state as when it was originally installed, except for your customisation and data, which it and rpm knows to leave alone. This does imply checksums or backup copies on hand of installed unchanging files.The installer/reinstaller has access to the RPM library used at original installation. It'd be great if it wold wax my car too -- I mean, I can manage the time to do the coin-op car wash and everything, but it's not the same as a really good hand-buff. My point is that Win 98 does this. Plainly, or fortuitously, it was an important requirement and goal of installer implementation. That may be the intention, but a reinstall of Windows over the same partition has never actually solved a problem for me -- and let me tell you, I've tried more than once :-) New arrivals to Mandrake from Windows - near all of us? - Primarily using Linux since 1998. expect no less, particularly when no other solution to a randomly clobbered system is offered. Recall that the i86 architecture fails to offer hardware memory block protection that would immediately trap any program's attempt to write-access outside its allocated or shared memory blocks.The CDC 6600 had this implemented, so the technology is nothing new - except to Intel. That's the major reason why i86 architecture is not safe, especially for multiple concurrent users, and not useable for critical missions. Let's take a moment to re-evaluate the hardware decisions that we've all made... Anyone using hardware-protected-memory big iron for a desktop or laptop, raise your hand! Personally, I'm gonna trade in my Vaio for an AS/400 (or whatever it's call this week) because it just raises eyebrows when you roll that big black box into a meeting :-) Seriously, the old saying applies here: Unix is user-friendly, it's just picky about who its friends are. If you want it to protect you from screwing up your system and make roll-back of mistakes a perfect and easy one-click operation, come back in five years and it might be there. In the meantime, try something that starts with user experience and then works towards power-usage and cool features instead of the other way around. It is incredible to me that this obvious requirement seems to have been totally overlooked by Mandrake. which is more evidence that the developers just ignore industry experience and do not appear to actually be using the product in any user-workhorse mode. The industry is pretty clear that it accepts Linux on the low-to-mid-range X86 server and may eventually accept it on desktops. Everything else is bleeding edge hackers. Unless you're referring to another issue beyond the KDE cosmetics and mozilla printing, I'm not sure why you think DrakX has anything to do with it. Explained above. -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Disk corruption - was Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Monday 03 February 2003 05:27 am, tarvid wrote: On Monday 03 February 2003 03:40 am, Ron Stodden wrote: Vincent Danen wrote: Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can we fix it? You presume too much. Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates applied, are rock solid. Alas! My reply was inadvertenly attached to James Sparenburgs's message below. My apologies. All Linux partitions on both machines worked perfectly for about 6 months after expert installation. Then these problems started appearing on 3 of the partitions. Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with Windows 98 (but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem with the Mandrake installer. I had two Mandrake Linux systems fail with disk in a horrible state in the past six months. Both were SiS AMD boards, the last a K7S6A (SiS745). Both hard disks came back to life with a low level format (One an IBM ATA 100 40GB drive, the other a Maxtor). I replaced the motherboard in the first system and have used it as a developoment machine/workstation for months without incident. The second system I reloaded with (gasp!) W2K which appeared to go well but within a week started acting flaky. Software installations failed, and simple tasks like burning CDs showed instability in disk throughput (fluctuating) buffer levels). After replacing the motherboard in the second system with a VIA chipset board (MS6378), the system appears to be rock solid. I am convinced that hardware is a factor in many bug reports. If bug reports included motherboard/CPU/diskdrive we might spot a correlation in a matter of weeks. Hey Jim, I would agree with you on the hardware. Any chance you are using an ATI card? I had an ATI Radeon all in wonder and had all kinds of weird problems. The worst was it would run for a week to 10 days and totally trash my hard drive data. I took back motherboards, drives... until someone suggested I go to Nvidia. Not a single problem since. ?? Jim Tarvid Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Tue Feb 04, 2003 at 09:54:32AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote:
Interestingly, a reinstall did not fix anything, like it does with
Windows 98
(but _NOT_ always) - which is a serious requirements or design problem
with
the Mandrake installer.
The installer goes with the packages it's given... it doesn't install
something and go hey wait a minute and intelligently fix your problem
for you.
It should restore your system to the same state as when it was originally
installed, except for your customisation and data, which it and rpm
knows to
leave alone. This does imply checksums or backup copies on hand of
installed
unchanging files.The installer/reinstaller has access to the RPM
library used
at original installation.
Ahhh... so you're not doing a fresh install, you're trying to tell it
to downgrade packages for you. I don't think the installer does this.
My point is that Win 98 does this. Plainly, or fortuitously, it was an
important
requirement and goal of installer implementation. New arrivals to Mandrake
from Windows - near all of us? - expect no less, particularly when no other
solution to a randomly clobbered system is offered. Recall that the i86
architecture fails to offer hardware memory block protection that would
immediately
trap any program's attempt to write-access outside its allocated or
shared memory
blocks.The CDC 6600 had this implemented, so the technology is
nothing new -
except to Intel. That's the major reason why i86 architecture is not
safe,
especially for multiple concurrent users, and not useable for critical
missions.
Well, be that as it may, did DrakX ever advertise this windows-alike
behaviour? Did it say that if you did a package upgrade install that
it would do what you seem to expect it to do?
This isn't something you should be bitching about post-release... this
is something you should bring up during development... I can't recall
ever seeing any thread about this to date. To say that updates
clobbered your system and DrakX didn't fix it for me when we never
said it would do this, is not really acceptable. You should bring this
up with the developers. Not sitting back and crying about it because
you just assumed it was there.
It is incredible to me that this obvious requirement seems to have been
totally
overlooked by Mandrake. which is more evidence that the developers just
ignore
industry experience and do not appear to actually be using the product
in any
user-workhorse mode.
Well, that's just a load of crap and you know it. I think I use my
workstation just as hard as any Win98 user does... and it's rock solid
for me. Don't use the product in any user-workhorse mode? Yeah...
right.
Anyways, this is something you should bring up on cooker... I doubt it
can be accomplished for 9.1, but if no one asks for it, we dont't think
about it or know it's important to people. Can't be *that* important
as this is the first I've heard of it in 3 years. Remember, we are not
Windows. Ok, we may be missing some of the good features of Windows in
some instances, but we're also missing a lot of the bad ones. We
didn't set out to make a Windows clone, you know.
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Mon Feb 03, 2003 at 08:44:59PM -0800, Jack Coates wrote:
[...]
My point is that Win 98 does this. Plainly, or fortuitously, it was an
important
requirement and goal of installer implementation.
That may be the intention, but a reinstall of Windows over the same
partition has never actually solved a problem for me -- and let me tell
you, I've tried more than once :-)
Agreed. The only way to rescue Windows from itself, in my experience,
is to make backups, format and reinstall on a clean partition.
Installing Windows overtop of itself has always created more problems
than what it fixed.
Let's take a moment to re-evaluate the hardware decisions that we've all
made... Anyone using hardware-protected-memory big iron for a desktop or
laptop, raise your hand! Personally, I'm gonna trade in my Vaio for an
AS/400 (or whatever it's call this week) because it just raises eyebrows
when you roll that big black box into a meeting :-) Seriously, the old
hehehe... no doubt! I think I need one of those as well.. just not
sure how I'd fit it in the cat... =)
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Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Ron is correct about the KDE failure. However, the updates may or may not be relevent. I had the very same thing happen. Only I was editting the menus via menudrake and did something with showing only KDE items. I ended up reloading 9.0 and have been very careful with the menus since then. On Saturday 01 February 2003 06:17 pm, James Sparenberg wrote: Ron, Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software installed you do. James On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 15:13, Ron Stodden wrote: Dave Laird wrote: O my GOD! Mandrake 9.1beta3 installed without one single hitch, error, or problem of any sort. This is AWESOME! When it's finished it's going to be the best Mandrake version ever. For the benefit of those of us sitting this dance out, could you please tell us more about what makes it so awesome? What has really changed from 9.0? Has the problem with attempts to apply a selection of 9.0-updates (supposed to be well tested compulsory security fixes) totally clobbering 9.0 as something useful been guaranteed fixed? This has happened consistently on 3 of my 9.0 partitions so far, and the only remedy is to go to another distribution until Mandrake has it corrected. So much for the wisdom of development and QA layoffs at MandrakeSoft. The first symptom is loss of most of the KDE task bar icons and abbreviation of the KDE menu. Mozilla printing and other things , like no longer any service command, get clobbered too. Stay release until this is absolutely corrected. -- Ron. [Melbourne, Australia] 20030119 Get Fastest Mandrake downloader, English-only, from: http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronst/ No Penguin Liberation Front (plf) access - no plf rsync server. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 16:01, Ron Stodden wrote: James Sparenberg wrote: Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software installed you do. My goodness, how would anyone possibly know? I usually read error messages and logs but then that's just me. and over the course of an update series I hit about 90% of them( the updates that is.) Actually IMHO MDK's job is to make sure that the software works the way the developer made it to work... which often is not the way I hope it will. But the only way as I see it for MDK to know of a problem is for us to complain about it effectively. As solid as 9.0 is on my desktops, and some of my laptops I control on my personal laptop it bytes. My question about what clobbered you was really intended to find out if I could offer some help. James There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly to discover it is not one but some combination. That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas? -- Ron. [Melbourne, Australia] 20030119 Get Fastest Mandrake downloader, English-only, from: http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronst/ No Penguin Liberation Front (plf) access - no plf rsync server. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun Feb 02, 2003 at 11:01:34AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote:
Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on
any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software
installed you do.
My goodness, how would anyone possibly know?
There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about
one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct
the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly
to discover it is not one but some combination.
That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas?
Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and
with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can
we fix it? You presume too much.
Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates
applied, are rock solid.
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
lynx -source http://linsec.ca/vdanen.asc | gpg --import
{FE6F2AFD : 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD}
msg65427/pgp0.pgp
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RE: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
there was one with apache getting loaded with apache 2 updates.. or at least
trying...
don't know of any other...
rgds
Frank
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Vincent Danen
Sent: Monday, 3 February 2003 3:13 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun Feb 02, 2003 at 11:01:34AM +1100, Ron Stodden wrote:
Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on
any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software
installed you do.
My goodness, how would anyone possibly know?
There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about
one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct
the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly
to discover it is not one but some combination.
That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas?
Sure, but everything tested out fine with the secteam, with QA, and
with me. Without knowing the symtomd (nevermind the packages), how can
we fix it? You presume too much.
Tell us what got clobbered. My 9.0 machines, with all updates
applied, are rock solid.
--
MandrakeSoft Security; http://www.mandrakesecure.net/
lynx -source http://linsec.ca/vdanen.asc | gpg --import
{FE6F2AFD : 88D8 0D23 8D4B 3407 5BD7 66F9 2043 D0E5 FE6F 2AFD}
Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft?
Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
I've two questions for this release. 1. Has anyone installed this on an older (say 2 year old) laptop and tried wireless. The last distro that worked well for me was 8.0 in this respect. 2. Has anyone played with hotplug devices in addition to pcmcia to see if the problem with trying to reload the entire pci bus is working? James On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 12:06, Dave Laird wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Good afternoon, Mark... O my GOD! Mandrake 9.1beta3 installed without one single hitch, error, or problem of any sort. This is AWESOME! When it's finished it's going to be the best Mandrake version ever. For the benefit of those of us sitting this dance out, could you please tell us more about what makes it so awesome? What has really changed from 9.0? How about some of the sub-applications? Does Knode handle Mime types now? Does Kmail function fully using SSL? How about some of the eye candy? I understand the latest-and-greatest has a *lot* more eye candy and pretties attached. How has the interface itself changed? What new tools (for configuration and such) are there available, or at least promised? C'mon, man, share the wealth. huge grin Dave - -- Dave Laird ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) The Used Kharma Lot / The Phoenix Project Web Page: http://www.kharma.net updated 01/20/2003 Year 2 of running Mandrake Linux workstation on a 100% Microsoft-free system. An automatic random thought For the Minute: The way of the world is to praise dead saints and prosecute live ones. -- Nathaniel Howe -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.0.7 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQE+PCjiaE1ENZP1A28RAgZSAJwKbTNCK2XNTUQJ+je2/sF+95yRtQCgmhP9 waST4egVqEvrbJ14D+HUJAo= =A0CL -END PGP SIGNATURE- Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Dave Laird wrote: O my GOD! Mandrake 9.1beta3 installed without one single hitch, error, or problem of any sort. This is AWESOME! When it's finished it's going to be the best Mandrake version ever. For the benefit of those of us sitting this dance out, could you please tell us more about what makes it so awesome? What has really changed from 9.0? Has the problem with attempts to apply a selection of 9.0-updates (supposed to be well tested compulsory security fixes) totally clobbering 9.0 as something useful been guaranteed fixed? This has happened consistently on 3 of my 9.0 partitions so far, and the only remedy is to go to another distribution until Mandrake has it corrected. So much for the wisdom of development and QA layoffs at MandrakeSoft. The first symptom is loss of most of the KDE task bar icons and abbreviation of the KDE menu. Mozilla printing and other things , like no longer any service command, get clobbered too. Stay release until this is absolutely corrected. -- Ron. [Melbourne, Australia] 20030119 Get Fastest Mandrake downloader, English-only, from: http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronst/ No Penguin Liberation Front (plf) access - no plf rsync server. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
Ron, Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software installed you do. James On Sat, 2003-02-01 at 15:13, Ron Stodden wrote: Dave Laird wrote: O my GOD! Mandrake 9.1beta3 installed without one single hitch, error, or problem of any sort. This is AWESOME! When it's finished it's going to be the best Mandrake version ever. For the benefit of those of us sitting this dance out, could you please tell us more about what makes it so awesome? What has really changed from 9.0? Has the problem with attempts to apply a selection of 9.0-updates (supposed to be well tested compulsory security fixes) totally clobbering 9.0 as something useful been guaranteed fixed? This has happened consistently on 3 of my 9.0 partitions so far, and the only remedy is to go to another distribution until Mandrake has it corrected. So much for the wisdom of development and QA layoffs at MandrakeSoft. The first symptom is loss of most of the KDE task bar icons and abbreviation of the KDE menu. Mozilla printing and other things , like no longer any service command, get clobbered too. Stay release until this is absolutely corrected. -- Ron. [Melbourne, Australia] 20030119 Get Fastest Mandrake downloader, English-only, from: http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronst/ No Penguin Liberation Front (plf) access - no plf rsync server. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
James Sparenberg wrote: Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software installed you do. My goodness, how would anyone possibly know? There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly to discover it is not one but some combination. That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas? -- Ron. [Melbourne, Australia] 20030119 Get Fastest Mandrake downloader, English-only, from: http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronst/ No Penguin Liberation Front (plf) access - no plf rsync server. Want to buy your Pack or Services from MandrakeSoft? Go to http://www.mandrakestore.com
Re: Fwd: [expert] Best Mandrake yet!!!
On Sun 2003-02-02 at 11:01:34 +1100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: James Sparenberg wrote: Specifically what updates clobbered you? I've not had this problem on any of my 9.0 boxes but then I might not have the same software installed you do. My goodness, how would anyone possibly know? There are presently 180 9.0-update RPMs.I would have installed about one third, so you must see that I would not be prepared to conduct the enormous amount of research to find out which, and then possibly to discover it is not one but some combination. That's inescapably Mandrake's job. N'est ce pas? And how do you imagine they should do their job, if they don't know what's broken? It's well possible that I missed it earlier, but yours was the first time I heard of the problem. Maybe I don't remember because of the unspecific description. Whatever. Sitting it out won't solve the problem if others don't encounter it. Regards, Benjamin. msg65385/pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
