Archimago;686523 Wrote:
The interesting thing here too is that many music lovers (including
myself) seek out some of these early 80's CD's because they're not
over-compressed and loud like modern remasters, also, many are not
EQ'ed to compensate for those little white iPod earbuds or the
Back to topic:
I operate still TT3 with Logitech defaults, but [IRQ-47] with 45
instead of 40 buffer set to 3500: (with activated display on
infrared)
The treble are thus slightly more present, more similarly to vanilla
TT3, however further with marginal better sound stage.
Worse bass
TheOctavist;686590 Wrote:
vinyl at its best is about 12 bit resolution.
16 bit is plenty. everytime i see someone touting a 24.bit
vinyl.ripi laugh...because it is an epic waste.
sure, space is cheap..but why waste it? water is cheap too but i dont
fill up.a cooling tower to haveva
Jacky;686600 Wrote:
Back to topic:
I operate still TT3 with Logitech defaults, but [IRQ-47] with 45
instead of 40 buffer set to 3500: (with activated display on
infrared)
The treble are thus slightly more present, more similarly to vanilla
TT3, however further with marginal better
Folks.
SBGK is not coming up with any general news over here.
That ethernet cables make a difference has been discussed at lenght at
several places. There have been reviews. There have been measurements.
(I've been even in close contact to the Meicord Designers -- btw.)
That a server OS setup
Phil Leigh;686486 Wrote:
My timer is up (only 30 mins)
Yes jitter exists - and it seems according to MOST research and
certainly my experience FWIW you need a hell of a lot of it in order to
hear it!
But Phil, audiophiles can hear everything, they hear bats
communicating at night, they can
soundcheck;686609 Wrote:
(...) ethernet cables make a difference (...)
(...) server OS setup makes a difference (...)
This is just crazy! But hey, it's also entertaining. Wait a moment and
let me get some popcorn so that I do not miss anything :-)
--
carp
Carsten
carp;686620 Wrote:
This is just crazy! But hey, it's also entertaining. Wait a moment and
let me get some popcorn so that I do not miss anything :-)
See.
You seem to live not that far away from Meicord.
Why don't you stop by and get yourself some lessons in german
engineering.
These guys
Soundcheck
Based on the simple facts that the music data is buffered on the
player, and that all the right data bits are present and correct long
before they are converted to either SPDIF or an analogue output, can
you please outline what aspects of the server
OS/configuration/whatever, and what
probedb;686617 Wrote:
But Phil, audiophiles can hear everything, they hear bats
communicating at night, they can hear the RF interference caused by a
super nova in another galaxy, they can hear the movement of tectonic
plates in the earths crust, they can hear.oh what it must be like
to
musicom;686578 Wrote:
It would be inappropriate to ignore the analog performance of the
product as most users will use the device with the analog outputs.
Please read the full review (digital AND analog) which is available on
Stereophile's website and from which the recommendations provide
darrenyeats;684661 Wrote:
Back to the topic, had a look in Audacity. Indeed, SACD Hybrid's CD
layer (bottom) has had dynamic compression applied compared to early CD
release (top).
It's not the worst I've experienced, and perhaps some aspects of the
master might be good - but look at all
I have been very impressed with the Touch via my Benchmark DAC. It has
replaced my C.E.C. transport! I believe a lot of it has to do with hard
disk drive derived music. It just seems smoother, more analog like, with
outstanding seperation/soundstage--and very nice detail retrieval
without
soundcheck;686625 Wrote:
See.
You seem to live not that far away from Meicord.
Why don't you stop by and get yourself some lessons in german
engineering.
These guys are pretty skilled telecommunicaton engineers and willing to
support people with limited knowledge around the subject.
While you all debate, Karen Carpenter's sweet voice has me melting in my
listening chair.
That is what it's all about, right?
--
steveinaz
- transport: squeezebox touch/channel island audio ps
- dac: benchmark dac/pre
- linestage: placette passive
- power amplifier: parasound hca-1500a
-
chill;686633 Wrote:
Soundcheck
Based on the simple facts that the music data is buffered on the
player, and that all the right data bits are present and correct long
before they are converted to either SPDIF or an analogue output, can
you please outline what aspects of the server
IMO, poor mastering and bad speaker choices = #1 reasons for digital
dissatisfaction. I think jitter has just become the next factor to
blame. ever notice the only time you think about jitter is when things
don't sound right? Does anyone think about high jitter when listening
to Morph the Cat?
Soundcheck,
With all respect, in your last reply you didn't say anything about the
influence of the OS on the LMS which is feeding the SBT and the
Ethernet cable which connects the 2 devices. That was the original
subject of this thread and you expressed some bold statements about it.
--
mhaas
mhaas;686647 Wrote:
All recommendations for the Meicord cables on the website are based on
purely subjective impressions of people who can hear grass grow.
+1
Or, I would add can hear hairs splitting ..
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.-
Moynihan
The LMS
probedb;686617 Wrote:
But Phil, audiophiles can hear everything, they hear bats
communicating at night, they can hear the RF interference caused by a
super nova in another galaxy, they can hear the movement of tectonic
plates in the earths crust, they can hear.oh what it must be like
to
Dear soundcheck, SBGK and all the others willing to take hifi to the
next level,
you are so right! I also experienced the astonishing positive effect of
an optimized ethernet connection on the sound quality of my
sequeezeboxes (and other audio streaming devices in general). I
invested quite some
mhaas;686653 Wrote:
Soundcheck,
With all respect, in your last reply you didn't say anything about the
influence of the OS on the LMS which is feeding the SBT and the
Ethernet cable which connects the 2 devices. That was the original
subject of this thread and you expressed some bold
soundcheck;686676 Wrote:
I didn't notice that you didn't realize what's being done on the OS
side.
It's pretty much what I do with TT3.0 on the Touch.
Getting rid of pretty much everything which has nothing to do with the
LMS server path. And then you try to make that task run as
soundcheck;686676 Wrote:
The gamers are years ahead of optimizing their gaming servers and
networks.
It's really interesting to see what they've done. (speedguide.net)
Cheers
Gamers are dealing with realtime and reducing lag to improve it.
Squeezebox devices are all buffered.
2
A comment to cables and connections:
It doesn't matter if we talk USB/SPDIF/Ethernet/Power/RCA cables, or
even board traces they all show filter and antenna characteristics and
also can cause nasty groundloops. Innappropriate connectors or
connections are causing impedance mismatches thus
Jeff Flowerday;686678 Wrote:
Gamers are dealing with realtime and reducing lag to improve it.
Squeezebox devices are all buffered.
2 completely unrelated adventures.
You don't understand what we're talking about. Sorry, I can't help with
that.
--
soundcheck
::: ' Touch Toolbox 3.0 and
mhaas;686677 Wrote:
Sorry to having to press you here: This thread is about the OS tweaks on
the SERVER side - LMS, not the PLAYER - TT3.
Just read my post again.
mhaas;686677 Wrote:
BTW the gamers are optimizing to increase the speed of the network they
need for the large amount of
Can someone post the default values for this registry setting. I want to
try the default registry values with Fidelizer. I am now running with
TT3.0 + Logitech Default prio/buffer + Process Lazzo without Fidelizer.
Sounds good though.
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows
soundcheck;686676 Wrote:
I didn't notice that you didn't realize what's being done on the OS
side.
That wasn't the question. What many would like to hear is an
explanation for how the server side (OS, priorities etc) can feasibly
have an effect on the playback being performed by the
soundcheck;686682 Wrote:
A comment to cables and connections:
It doesn't matter if we talk USB/SPDIF/Ethernet/Power/RCA cables, or
even board traces they all show filter and antenna characteristics and
also can cause nasty groundloops. Innappropriate connectors or
connections are causing
For those who hear a difference using different server settings, an easy
experiment - run LMS on a laptop, running on battery power, wirelessly
to the squeezebox. Is there still a difference?
--
darrell
darrell's Profile:
Just to add a bit to my own post - I should say that it probably isn't
even necessary to pull the ethernet cable out to experience this
'golden period' at the end of a track. If you only have one track
queued, the data transmission for that track seems to finish 30 seconds
before the end anyway.
Soundcheck,
you are avoiding the topic of this thread and still haven't given any
reasons why server OS and cables between the server and the player
would influence the SQ.
If, say, a flac file is downloaded from the other end of the world over
the Internet directly to the player and then played,
maggior;686501 Wrote:
I've used the ART USBPhonoPlus v2. I think it's a great little device.
It supports both line level and phono level signals, with built in RIAA
eq. You can plug headphones directly into it, and it has a line out.
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
On the ART
I know one thing, that I know nothing (Ancient Greek: #7955;#957;
#959;#7990;#948;#945; #8005;#964;#953;
#959;#8016;#948;#8050;#957; #959;#7990;#948;#945; hèn oîda
hóti oudèn oîda) said Socrates about Genuine Wisdom (see also
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_that_I_know_nothing)
Don't want to
Boys.
It's weekend. Do me a favour.
I assume all you guys who hang around here are running a W7 server.
I also assume that you all got a pretty high quality stereo at home.
I also assume that you all run a Touch (hopefully not in the bathroom,
otherwise you wouldn't hang around in the
soundcheck;686693 Wrote:
Boys.
It's weekend. Do me a favour.
I assume all you guys who hang around here are running a W7 server.
I also assume that you all got a pretty high quality stereo at home.
I also assume that you all run a Touch (hopefully not in the bathroom,
otherwise you
pski;686668 Wrote:
Not to mention the other obvious benefits they possess: The ability to
remember tube part numbers up to ten characters and their associated
sound as well as well as their damnable ability to make patterned white
bread toast on their amplifiers without have to miss a single
soundcheck;686693 Wrote:
Boys.
It's weekend. Do me a favour.
[...]
Server:
1. Install TCPOptimizer with optimum settings (free of charge)
2. Install and Run Fidelizer (free of charge)
Touch:
1. Install my Toolbox. (Free of charge)
and listen. It's that easy.
I can't do more
evdplancke;686692 Wrote:
I know one thing, that I know nothing (Ancient Greek: #7955;#957;
#959;#7990;#948;#945; #8005;#964;#953;
#959;#8016;#948;#8050;#957; #959;#7990;#948;#945; hèn oîda
hóti oudèn oîda) said Socrates about Genuine Wisdom (see also
soundcheck;686693 Wrote:
I can't do more for you than that.
Oh. What about an answer to the question that might move this
discussion along then?
chill;686686 Wrote:
So, in a blind test, do you think you'd be able to hear an improvement
in the last 30 seconds of a track?
and I suppose
evdplancke;686692 Wrote:
I know one thing, that I know nothing (Ancient Greek: #7955;#957;
#959;#7990;#948;#945; #8005;#964;#953;
#959;#8016;#948;#8050;#957; #959;#7990;#948;#945; hèn oîda
hóti oudèn oîda) said Socrates about Genuine Wisdom (see also
Jeff Flowerday;686703 Wrote:
SBGK has clearly indicated that he hears no difference when unplugging
the cable, yet the change of one priority on the server makes a big
difference.
Apparently no problem claiming two mutually exclusive ideas at the same
time .
And avoiding to see the logical
evdplancke;686692 Wrote:
1) Why does some Ethernet cables have different throughput? Is this not
related to the noise they are carrying on? What happens to this noise
when it reaches the Touch? Can't he interfere in any way with the
perfectly reconstucted signal in the signal path
adamdea;686706 Wrote:
As a matter of fact mate i think most of us were able to predict from
the outset that you were about to do.
You are basically asking people to prove that unicorns don't exist, and
indicating on top that you will only be satisfied by evidence from
people who have seen
adamdea;686706 Wrote:
As a matter of fact mate i think most of us were able to predict from
the outset that you were about to do.
You are basically asking people to prove that unicorns don't exist, and
indicating on top that you will only be satisfied by evidence from
people who have seen
I use the ART USB V.2 with a Sony belt drive and an Audio Technica
cart.
I don't diddle with output from a equalization basis so I use a simple
program called spin-it-again.
It presents a cassette recorder analogy: start play-hit record-play
side-pause-flip and repeat.
At that point the
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
On the ART Website there is no information about bitrate output.
One of the reviews on Amazon states: A/D D/A: 16 bit, 44.1kHz or
48kHz, USB selectable.
Although I tend to agree that 16 bits is overkill for listening to
Just a few comments on the conversion process. Over the past 10 years
I've converted about 2,000 LPs and open reels to digital, so have my
process down fairly pat.
I see no big need to comment on the vinyl playback end of things - if
you've been happy with your rig for playing records, it'll be
Ambrose;686637 Wrote:
Ah ha! I see you are a fellow colchester resident Darren! I have a few
SACDs / DVD Audios on Ebay currently if interested?
Genesis, Doobie Brothers, Queen, Dire Straits, Porcupine Tree Joe
Satriani.
Can you recommend any Good Rock High Res downloads from HD Tracks for
pski;686710 Wrote:
Noise is an analog term. Since the derived data is digital, noise
on the line is irrelevant. See #2.
There no such thing as a digital signal. What is commonly named digital
signal is a saturated analog signal. Though this analog signal is
relevant for data reconstruction.
evdplancke;686711 Wrote:
[...]
For unicorn, I believe like you probably that there are enough
scientific evidence they don't exist so we are not in any of above
categories.
Just being curious: what was the difference between unicorns exist
and server tweaks and ethernet cables have
evdplancke;686724 Wrote:
You did not answer the question: what happens of the noise that reaches
the Touch. It might have little incidence on data reconstruction though
higher noise will result in higher packet retransmission, but it is
going into the Touch anyway, not in the bits of data,
chill;686726 Wrote:
So just unplug the damn cable! What's in the buffer by that stage is
not a saturated analogue signal, but a stored representation of ones
and zeros. Pull the cable - eliminate the effects of the server and
the transmission noise. Can you hear a difference?
Indeed - so
superbonham;686723 Wrote:
Just being curious: what was the difference between and again in your
opinion?
Cheers
superbonham
No difference. But claiming these statements are false without evidence
of it is no genuine wisdom.
--
evdplancke
Phil Leigh;686727 Wrote:
Indeed - so far nobody has answered this question except to say that the
buffer isn't big enough to hold enough music to form an opinion... Which
is complete and utter rubbish as far as I am concerned. I'm still not
sure that people understand we have really bad
Another test would be: Put a SD card with the same track as on the
server into the Touch and play the music from that card. You bypass the
entire netwerk transmission so it should produce a much better sound.
But personally I believe one won't hear any difference.
--
Hofstede
Phil Leigh;686727 Wrote:
Indeed - so far nobody has answered this question except to say that the
buffer isn't big enough to hold enough music to form an opinion... Which
is complete and utter rubbish as far as I am concerned. I'm still not
sure that people understand we have really bad
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Thanks very much for your detailed post.
You're welcome!
guidof;686694 Wrote:
Do you know if 16 bits is max. with the ART unit?
As pski pointed out, yes, it does 16 bit only. If you want to do 24
bit and/or higher sampling rates, you are likely moving into the
evdplancke;686734 Wrote:
Cognitive process passes through a kind of mental representation that
may need some more time.
Except that differences due to improved ethernet cables and server
priority tweaks are always 'instantly' apparent.
--
chill
evdplancke;686732 Wrote:
No difference. But claiming these statements are false without evidence
of it is no genuine wisdom.
evdplancke Wrote:
For unicorn, I believe like you probably that there are enough
scientific evidence they don't exist so we are not in any of above
categories.
As it happens, I've been researching USB audio interface devices to a
little home studio recording. There are some devices in this category
support 24 bit with 96 kHz sampling. The only problem with devices
like this are:
1) The inputs are typically designed for a studio environment, using
chill;686741 Wrote:
Except that differences due to improved ethernet cables and server
priority tweaks are always 'instantly' apparent.
I fully agree with the server priority tweak. The improvement is
instantly apparent. The improvement is that the menu display is much
more responsive to the
What is it with some people who think they can second-guess qualified
engineers who obviously know what they are talking about (and often
provide references to reputable sources to prove it)? It's a disease,
this everyone's opinion is equally valid mentality. No, Some people
know what they are
evdplancke;686734 Wrote:
The fact that the buffer is too short to judge might be precisely the
consequence that we have bad aural memory.
Cognitive process passes through a kind of mental representation that
may need some more time.
No we are very good at detecting immediate changes and
evdplancke;686711 Wrote:
You don't get the point here: I said people who claim they don't know if
unicorn exist are wiser than people who claim they don't exist without
any scientific evidence of it.
For unicorn, I believe like you probably that there are enough
scientific evidence they
Well personally I do feel the A/D converters are important. I started
with the internal sound card on my motherboard, went to a Presonus
Firestudio Mobile and then settled on a RME Fireface UC.
Each was a notable improvement in sound quality.
If you can afford it I'd recommend the RME
Improve the Touch?
Flac, DAC, and Jack.
Done.
--
steveinaz
- transport: squeezebox touch/channel island audio ps
- dac: benchmark dac/pre
- linestage: placette passive
- power amplifier: parasound hca-1500a
- speakers: harbeth compact 7es-3 monitor
steveinaz;686755 Wrote:
Improve the Touch?
Flac, DAC, and Jack.
Done.
+2/3 since I prefer Maker's Mark or Basil Hayden's to Jack. Give them a
try, you might be pleasantly surprised.
--
ralphpnj
Lock, Stock and Two Smoking Barrels - Snatch - The Transporter -
Transporter 2 (oops) -
adamdea;686749 Wrote:
You started this off by saying you knew who was wiser.
I did not say that. I said I have my opinion about it. Opinion are not
facts. Therefore I let anyone make its own opinion.
adamdea;686749 Wrote:
Now tell me
a. who was saying they don't know if server tweaks
The fact that the buffer is too short to judge might be precisely the
consequence that we have bad aural memory.
Cognitive process passes through a kind of mental representation that
may need some more time.
No we are very good at detecting immediate changes and processing
- If you've ever setup a graphic equalizer to make a cool design, with
no regard to sound---you might be an audio redneck.
- If your subwoofer doubles as your coffee tableyou might be an
audio redneck.
- If the tops of your Cerwin Vegas have ever been covered in saran
wrap, in preparartion
steveinaz;686771 Wrote:
- If you've ever setup a graphic equalizer to make a cool design, with
no regard to sound---you might be an audio redneck.
- If your subwoofer doubles as your coffee tableyou might be an
audio redneck.
- If the tops of your Cerwin Vegas have ever been covered
what is the pull the cable test, can someone explain it together with
the expected results ?
--
SBGK
SBGK's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=52003
View this thread:
evdplancke;686782 Wrote:
Some evidences that unicorn does not exist: nobody did never attest to
have seen a unicorn dead, alive or fossile or any track of it.
What if I claimed that I have seen a unicorn?
And what if I claimed that a farfetched server tweak improved the sound
of my streaming
SBGK;686814 Wrote:
LMS allows you to change the priority from the settings menu, do you
hear any difference when you select high as opposed to normal or low
priority ? I do.
Fine. What do you hear with the cable pull test?
--
Phil Leigh
You want to see the signal path BEFORE it gets onto
darrell;686850 Wrote:
SBGK has replied The bits are already in the buffer a couple of times
in response to pleas to run the pull the wire test. Perhaps he really
thinks that his server settings improve the accuracy of the queue of
bits in the buffer - that somehow TCP/IP is capable of
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