0-623-3429 Duluth, GA 30097-1511
=
> -Original Message-
> From: Greg Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:30 AM
> To: The.Rock; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>
>
> "
eralities get you! How shortsited can you be to simply make a blanket
> statement... certs don't prove anything... geez.
>
> Scott M. Baron
> CCNP, CCDP, MCP, CNA
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Greg Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2
That guy works at your place too? Wow, he must get around... :-)
--- Dennis
-Original Message-
From: J Roysdon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:46 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: OT: Venting about another employee [was Re: Cisco Certs
Becoming Paper CCXX
can you be to simply make a blanket
> statement... certs don't prove anything... geez.
>
> Scott M. Baron
> CCNP, CCDP, MCP, CNA
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Greg Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:30 AM
> To: The.Rock
Okay here we go again with this thread .where does it end. Enough
already!!
>From: Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Reply-To: Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: "'B J'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED
>B J wrote:
>>
>>The CCNA is far harder than any test one will encounter with a major in
>> Education, Anthropology, History, Business Management, etc. Do you really
>> think the dumbest CCNA isn't more knowledgable in many areas, one being
>> math, than your daughters first grade teacher
> > > Attorney/Law Professor (Retired)
> > > Lifetime member of AARP
> > > Oldest CCNP/CCDP in existence
> > >
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > > The.Rock
Once again, it totally depends on the subject matter being studied.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 1:11 PM
To: 'B J'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming
LOL.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Drew Simonis
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 1:05 PM
To: B J
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
B J wrote:
>
> The CCNA is far harder than any test one will enc
nal Message -
From: "Scott Baron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:40 AM
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>Has anyone noticed that people arguing the most that certs dont matter are
>the ones
B J wrote:
>
> The CCNA is far harder than any test one will encounter with a major in
> Education, Anthropology, History, Business Management, etc. Do you really
> think the dumbest CCNA isn't more knowledgable in many areas, one being
> math, than your daughters first grade teacher?
Why do
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > The.Rock
> > Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 12:33 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Reply to The Rock
> >
> >
> > oh yeah one more thing...In c
in the upper-diety range. You can live a
lifetime on that.
- Original Message -
From: "Scott Baron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:40 AM
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>Has an
essage-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> RG
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 10:52 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>
>
> Very well said!!
> - Original Message --
Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
Very well said!!
- Original Message -
From: "Greg Macaulay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "The.Rock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becomi
rney/Law Professor (Retired)
> Lifetime member of AARP
> Oldest CCNP/CCDP in existence
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> The.Rock
> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 12:33 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re
> -Original Message-
> From: Greg Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:30 AM
> To: The.Rock; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>
>
> "certs don't prove anything&q
Very well said!!
- Original Message -
From: "Greg Macaulay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "The.Rock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 10:30 AM
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citizen Reply
>
statement... certs don't prove anything... geez.
Scott M. Baron
CCNP, CCDP, MCP, CNA
-Original Message-
From: Greg Macaulay [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2001 9:30 AM
To: The.Rock; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Senior Citi
existence
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
The.Rock
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 12:33 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Reply to The Rock
oh yeah one more thing...In case you forgot, certs don't pro
From: Louie Belt [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 6:57 PM
To: Brad Shifflett; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
Actually, you are way too high on your estimate of CCIE's. As of February
28th 2001 there are 5432 worldwide, 2476 are in the US
Circusnuts wrote:
>
[snip]
> is about to be let go. We call him Mr. Debug, the RSP melter (long story).
Jeesh!
How'd he melt the RSP?
Thats gotta be a story worth tellin'!
;~)
_
FAQ, list archives, and subscription info: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/cisco.
iewed at:
http://www.cisco.com/warp/customer/625/ccie/ccie_program/ccie_present.html
Louie
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Brad Shifflett
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:42 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper
ECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 2:08 PM
To: Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
Hi,
My two bobs worth,
Any qualification is as good as the paper it is written on. In my
experience someone wi
CTED]>
To: "Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 4:08 PM
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
> Hi,
>
> My two bobs worth,
>
> Any q
9, 2001 4:22 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
>
> This issue is turning thisgs upside down from point of view.
>
> I would like to tell you my opinion. If CCNA,
ly complete the task, you then get to leave
while
> > > someone "breaks your network in any untold number of ways" you are
then
> > > told to fix it once again in a very limited time frame.
> > >
> > > If you can accomplish this, then you become a C
Bravo!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 4:22 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject:RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
This issue is turning
I believe that there are two distinctions that should
be made - and that you may disagree with. At least for
the bachelors degree, the experience is just that -
well beyond the actual academics. In addition, the
focus of the GE portion of the program is to diversify
- humanities, science, language
Well said!
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
Liang Mark J Civ AFRL/PROI
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 10:01 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CC
t;[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 1:22 PM
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
> I too am pursuing CCIE certification and have noticed
> a recent influx in people attempting and passing CCNP
> and
This issue is turning thisgs upside down from point of view.
I would like to tell you my opinion. If CCNA, NP, DA, DP and IE written
are not worth then your Bachelors and Graduate studies worth the same. Just
papers.
I learn to configure a cisco router before knowing all the cisco stuff.
I have
ink the CCIE
> > certification proves a lot. It proves you have the knowledge, the ability
> > and the troubleshooting skills. It also shows you can work under pressure
> to
> > accomplish a goal in a limited time.
> >
> > But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong
I respectfully disagree with your summary point. I
know at least three CCIEs (R/S) that can't network
their way out of a paper bag. The odds are good that
you'll find one that has the knowledge, but its not a
guarantee. BTW - I have a number of co-workers that
have failed the lab but can kick most
"The.Rock" wrote:
>
> oh yeah one more thing...In case you forgot, certs don't prove anything
> you really are an idiot if you think they "prove " something). The only
> prove your ability to regurgitate info that you supposedly learned. Having
> the know how, and knowing how to use are two diff
ot;discussions" so often before I have to
> say something...
>
> Brandon
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Christopher Kolp [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 3:07 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Subject: RE: Cisc
ical world and
lets keep ours about functionality.
Just another .02
Larry
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-Original Message-
From: Brandon Rose [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 2:31 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Reply t
ressure
to
> accomplish a goal in a limited time.
>
> But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong
>
> Louie Belt
> CCIE #7054
>
> -Original Message-
> From: The.Rock
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: 3/19/01 11:32 AM
> Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CC
ur own knowledge, ability, and
experience.
My $.02, but I can only read these "discussions" so often before I have to
say something...
Brandon
> -Original Message-
> From: Christopher Kolp [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 3:07 PM
> To: [EMAIL
newbies" and then loose whatever
> edge you think you have.
>
>
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> > The.Rock
> > Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 12:33 PM
> > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
:32 AM
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX - Reply to The Rock
oh yeah one more thing...In case you forgot, certs don't prove anything
you really are an idiot if you think they "prove " something). The only
prove your ability to regurgitate info that you supposedly learned.
your time "fending off evil newbies" and then loose whatever
edge you think you have.
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> The.Rock
> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 12:33 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Cisc
oh yeah one more thing...In case you forgot, certs don't prove anything
you really are an idiot if you think they "prove " something). The only
prove your ability to regurgitate info that you supposedly learned. Having
the know how, and knowing how to use are two different things. Lets say your
8
t; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Chris Haller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2001 11:57 AM
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
> I respectfully disagree with your summary point. I
> know at least th
My point was that more often then not, certified people aren't what they
seem. I like the fact that people want to learn more, because it keeps
"everyone" on their toes and learning about new technology. Part of the
problem is the industry's lack of insight into these so called certs. They
have pu
I too am pursuing CCIE certification and have noticed
a recent influx in people attempting and passing CCNP
and CCIE written, especially the recent addition of
hundreds of people on this board ...
Anyway, CCNA, CCNP, CCDP ... CCIE Written, this means
nothing. It is good, takes a good amoumt of w
You sounded like some newbies has stole your job. Do you have something against up and
coming people who just want to learn about Cisco and consequently be certified for it.
I do not belong to this group of guys for i have been on this business for 12 years
but i'm not insecure if too many o
x27;m doing. If your conscientious, do good
> work, & don't fall asleep @ the wheel as to where you should be working or
> what technology you should know- you'll always beat the TCP Magazine
salary
> $$$.
>
> Phil
>
> ----- Original Message -
> From
We'll said..
I'm reading the CCNA book now and I haven't taken the test yet. I've worked
in networking since early 90's and I have a good background about how
everything works, just not the Cisco IOS. But as I'm reading thru this book,
I can't believe really, how basic it is. I know how routing w
Your an idiot, and that is his whole point. Grades and certs don't mean
Sh*t. It's experience that matters in the end. I whole heartedly agree that
it is becoming just as much a PAPER thing, as well as another way for the
big companies to generate revenue. On the other hand, leave it up to the
com
ubject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
> Hi all,
>
> I am really getting fed up with this discussion of paper certification. I
read one mail
> saying that while interviewing some one, the candidate said that he
wanted to become a
> network engineer for better pay. Is the this g
Vincent - I'm not sure...he had the 2600 installation manual in front of him
(Appendix on rommon). He didn't know the rommon variables were
case-sensitive, I guess, and didn't have his tftp server set up
correctly...he probably won't forget this experience, though.
-e-
Vincent <[EMAIL PROTECTED
Hi Vincent,
Are you doing job in PSINET?
"Vincent" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
991juq$b3r$[EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:991juq$b3r$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
>
> 1)CCNP and CCDP is a staring point, from the name of the exam, you
will
> see.
>Foundation routing and switching. CCNP/DP j
Manoj
Here - - here, I feel your pain.adele
Manoj Sekhar wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am really getting fed up with this discussion of paper certification. I read one
>mail
> saying that while interviewing some one, the candidate said that he wanted to
>become a
> network engineer for better p
quot; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2001 3:41 AM
Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
> Hi all,
>
> I am really getting fed up with this discussion of paper certification. I
read one mail
> saying that while interviewing so
Right on Jim
""Jim McDowell"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
000701c0af62$7288d600$376b84d1@dude">news:000701c0af62$7288d600$376b84d1@dude...
> This archaic line of thought has been around for ages...in every
conceivable
> organization, since Ally Oop was a fetus...for example, "I had to wal
I think the old saying from college was:
When you get your B.S you think you know everything.
When you get your M.S. you know you know everything.
When you get your Ph.D you realize you know nothing.
Jim
"John Neiberger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
[EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTEC
Hi all,
I am really getting fed up with this discussion of paper certification. I read one mail
saying that while interviewing some one, the candidate said that he wanted to become a
network engineer for better pay. Is the this guy became a network engineer for serving
the company and people? E
Did he know how to collect information from cisco website?
If he did not know how to did it, I just wonder.
""EA Louie"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ¼¶¼g©ó¶l¥ó
007f01c0af4c$7ee0a240$[EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:007f01c0af4c$7ee0a240$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> some of the certs are like getting a "paper diploma
1)CCNP and CCDP is a staring point, from the name of the exam, you will
see.
Foundation routing and switching. CCNP/DP just a stepstone to CCIE
2)CCIE can demonstrate the lab and means they can do something.
CCIE is a stepstone to real networking world.
"John Neiberger"
sible, but I wouldn't go that far) to obtain a
> CCIE with no working experience.
>
> -e-
>
> - Original Message -
> From: Dar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: EA Louie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2001 6:52 PM
> Subject: RE: Cisco
OTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of
> EA Louie
> Sent: Sunday, March 18, 2001 6:41 AM
> To: Mike Davis; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Cisco Certs Becoming Paper CCXX
>
>
> some of the certs are like getting a "paper diploma" (which is what I
got...
>
I think a person's attitude regarding this situation depends entirely on
their experience. For me, I began in this field a little over two years
ago. Starting from scratch, not even knowing what a router was, I looked up
to the CCNA certification as something fairly lofty. All I did for months
some of the certs are like getting a "paper diploma" (which is what I got...
heheheh) So, if they are going to take the risk and study for the cert on
the hopes that they can get a job using the cert as leverage, more power to
them!
By virtue of the testing mechanism, the CCNA/CCNP/CCDA/CCDP wil
> I have
> had CCNA, CCNP, and yes even CCIE written folks who
> could not tell me what they 'should' acutally know.
Maybe it's just me, but comments like this have always bothered me,
regardless of whatever cert program we're talking about.
This might come off as a little stronger than I intend
Hi Mike;
I find your comment very interesting, most positions state how
many years of experience before applying. The only exceptions
that I have seen with certification positions, is in the programing field.
It's not the certification being a problem - it's the resources for
people to obtain exp
JUst because u think they dont know nothing, they really dont know nothing
. Can u post your grades here so that well see how smart u are? If u think
that you know more than people who are getting CCXX certified then why
dont u hurry up and take the lab. Dont u think that these people should
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