Re: Drexciya-inspired LA Hip Hop
Has anyone seen the video for Smells Like Teen Spirit by the Robert Glasper experiment? One, semi-accurate, piece of feedback was that it sounds like it was recorded deep underwater in a nuclear sub. cheers C On 2019-09-30 16:15, kent williams wrote: Afrofuturism is a thing that Drexciya was doing almost 30 years ago, and their influence abides. http://pan-african-music.com/en/clipping-the-deep-drexciya/
Drexciya-inspired LA Hip Hop
Afrofuturism is a thing that Drexciya was doing almost 30 years ago, and their influence abides. http://pan-african-music.com/en/clipping-the-deep-drexciya/
Drexciyan Hip Hop
I'm thinking Jay Electronica beats here. Exhibit C anyone? New Orleans? Please don't tell me Stinson or Donald never had a dabble? cheers C
Fresh 12 of Detroit inspired hip-hop beats
I have a new 12 out, under a new alias Pavemental, full of synth heavy instrumental hiphop, with a lot of Detroit techno influence. The opening track is a collaboration with a multitalented singer Monika Horvat. Should be available in all better record stores, or directly from my Bandcamp: https://octex.bandcamp.com/album/streeteepy Jernej www.pavemental.com / www.octex.si
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Wow - thanks for the schooling Kamal! Much appreciated. MEK Stoddard, Kamal [EMAIL PROTECTED] urner.com To [EMAIL PROTECTED], 03/29/07 05:54 PM 313@hyperreal.org cc Subject RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop Not quite. It was actually brought to the lisland by the original east Indians that were brought there before the Africans. As was the ganjah and most of the rasta beliefs about word sound and power (which is the cornerstone of the nyhabingi order as well as their creed). The Indians that were brought over were all of the ancient Kashmir shaivite sect of Hinduism. A large part of their ritual is centered around the smoking of the ganjah and achieving a state of openness and power through the recitation of certain words/sounds of power while beating a very specific three part drum tune (father drum, kete drum, funde drum). The rasta's adopted this more mystical approach and blended it with the more progressive political views of the time (enter garvey)and a few kinda skewed ideas about emmanuel and emperor selassie and voila! Ratsa as a religion and political movement. I was raised rasta and spent a lot of time in the Binghi camps up in st anns. And even down there, few rastas willingly accept their east Indian roots. But check out the old school shaivites. You'll see what I mean. And I can't believe no ones mentioned Dread at the Controls mikey dread was one of the dub producers that stayed around, stayed progressive and didn't shy away from the digital. Imo, he was the only one besides tubby to achieve a proper balance of the really crazy digital sounds and effects and the original heaviness and sloppy thudding energy of the old ghetto sound. Check wall street dub, proper education, and jumping master for a good sample. I'm pretty sure he's got a website and when I went to ask about vinyl awhile ago, his wife answered the email address (only cause he was on tour!) and I ended up getting almost everything he's done on wax! Nice peeps. Others that haven't been mentioned are prince fari (in the dub poets section), nyhabinghi elders, and if you can find any of the maytals stuff in dub (think Trojan did a thing awhile ago) it's golden. Sorry for the long post. Back to the darks. K mwnb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 5:33 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica sorry, scratch that - it originated in the 40s but it took it's influences directly from the music of Africans enslaved in the islands MEK
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
I won't say how long I've been playing dub since it's scary. But my favorites remain King Tubby, Lee Perry, Augustus Pablo and the early Adrian Sherwood/Singers and Players/On-U era. The best dub in my opinion always starts with live studio playing. There's a lot of good all-electronic dub, but it's not really the same. A special nod to the best remix collection I've ever heard, Guerilla in Dub, which really captures the essence of the original dub sensibility using quite good house tracks as the foundation. fh - On 3/29/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Matisyahu (Hasidic Jewish reggae!) that dood is garbage. complete trash. a mockery of music. Fat Freddie's Drop (it should not go unmentioned) yeah their album and ep that i have is immediately loved by anyone who hears it, regardless of what their usual genre of choice is like. i tend to call them soul-reggae, but thats kind of redundant. going back to the earlier stuff (ska) you just need to have some Skatalites in your collection for instrumental reggae/ska i have this on heartbeat that is exceptionally wonderful stuff from the skatalites: http://www.discogs.com/release/564853 ill be breaking that one out soon as the weather is getting nicer and nicer some good labels: Wackie's Echo Beach Select Cuts Honest Jon's Ariwa dont forget blood and fire (they did the congos reissue), if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica the nyabinghi version of satta massagana performed by third world to open the movie rockers is ridiculous. the whole soundtrack and movie for that are pretty insane, theres some dub (lee perry dread lion) and lots of great roots and some of the most classic reggae jams from the mid-late 70s. and the movie is awesome. there's also a nyabinghi box set by trojan that has some nice stuff on it as well. tom
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
On 3/29/07, Fred Heutte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The best dub in my opinion always starts with live studio playing. There's a lot of good all-electronic dub, but it's not really the same. i like both styles really, theyre good for different moods. i especially like the early electronic stuff from the 80s, mad prof and sly+robbie and wackies style. modern electronic dub doesnt really do much for me to be honest. i have some records by twilight dub soundsystem, but i dont love them. a friend of mine is heavy into modern dub and dub influenced music, so he hooks me up with lots of mp3s but not much lasts more than a play or two before i delete it. but i have to say i believe the rhythm and sound stuff is amongst the best dub made by anyone in any era. i think you can stand that burial mix with the artists album up with any dub record and it will hold its weight. and i think they rhythm and sound CD is one of the best dub/experimental records ever. lovely. tmo
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
That weatherhall mix is s**t though yeah? Has anyone mentioned U-Roy yet...dunno...he's cool though -Original Message- From: Fred Heutte [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 3:44 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop I won't say how long I've been playing dub since it's scary. But my favorites remain King Tubby, Lee Perry, Augustus Pablo and the early Adrian Sherwood/Singers and Players/On-U era. The best dub in my opinion always starts with live studio playing. There's a lot of good all-electronic dub, but it's not really the same. A special nod to the best remix collection I've ever heard, Guerilla in Dub, which really captures the essence of the original dub sensibility using quite good house tracks as the foundation. fh - On 3/29/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Matisyahu (Hasidic Jewish reggae!) that dood is garbage. complete trash. a mockery of music. Fat Freddie's Drop (it should not go unmentioned) yeah their album and ep that i have is immediately loved by anyone who hears it, regardless of what their usual genre of choice is like. i tend to call them soul-reggae, but thats kind of redundant. going back to the earlier stuff (ska) you just need to have some Skatalites in your collection for instrumental reggae/ska i have this on heartbeat that is exceptionally wonderful stuff from the skatalites: http://www.discogs.com/release/564853 ill be breaking that one out soon as the weather is getting nicer and nicer some good labels: Wackie's Echo Beach Select Cuts Honest Jon's Ariwa dont forget blood and fire (they did the congos reissue), if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica the nyabinghi version of satta massagana performed by third world to open the movie rockers is ridiculous. the whole soundtrack and movie for that are pretty insane, theres some dub (lee perry dread lion) and lots of great roots and some of the most classic reggae jams from the mid-late 70s. and the movie is awesome. there's also a nyabinghi box set by trojan that has some nice stuff on it as well. tom -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.22/739 - Release Date: 3/29/2007 1:36 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.22/739 - Release Date: 3/29/2007 1:36 PM
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Well, U Roy is another alltime favorite. iirc I played one of his tracks at one of the 313 parties in Detroit. He is another elevated master if you ask me, but he's not a dub producer. He started as a DJ (record announcer in Jamaican parlance; what we call a DJ is the selector) with Duke Reid's sound system and King Tubby in the 1960s. Tubby was already developing the early version (non-vocal B side) cut-and-mix dub techniques that underlie all modern dance music. U Roy melded with that approach and did sing-jaying for remixes of a long list of Duke Reid's rock-steady and early reggae hits. He was enormously popular in Jamaica throughout the 1970s and cut innumerable tracks with most every major producer there. Although many people took the mike to introduce and talk over records in previous times, he more or less invented the modern form of toasting or chatting with a string of huge JA remix hits in the late 1960s through mid-1970s. Dub provided the mixing methods for modern dance music, and Daddy U Roy provided the vocal techniques for dancehall, hip hop and jungle. In a nutshell, dub came from version and merged with DJ and turned the whole world upside down :) There are many U Roy compilations, the three I like the most are Crucial Cuts, Dread in a Babylon and Natty Rebel. U Roy has a MySpace page now. Among others showing up to pay respects this week are Michigan Smiley. Too too much :) http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofilefriendid=61923224 I saw U Roy here in Portland in about 1985 as the by then nearly- forgotten opening act (!) for a long list of reggae stars-of-the- moment on a barnstorm US tour. He appeared in a white suit with a white bowler hat and utterly charmed the crowd :) fh - That weatherhall mix is s**t though yeah? Has anyone mentioned U-Roy yet...dunno...he's cool though
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Favourite of mine is the record called BEWARE, another SLY and ROBBIE epic...yabby u, skully and tommy...man, that's got a pre rave feeling for me... -Original Message- From: Thomas D. Cox, Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 5:37 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop On 3/29/07, Fred Heutte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The best dub in my opinion always starts with live studio playing. There's a lot of good all-electronic dub, but it's not really the same. i like both styles really, theyre good for different moods. i especially like the early electronic stuff from the 80s, mad prof and sly+robbie and wackies style. modern electronic dub doesnt really do much for me to be honest. i have some records by twilight dub soundsystem, but i dont love them. a friend of mine is heavy into modern dub and dub influenced music, so he hooks me up with lots of mp3s but not much lasts more than a play or two before i delete it. but i have to say i believe the rhythm and sound stuff is amongst the best dub made by anyone in any era. i think you can stand that burial mix with the artists album up with any dub record and it will hold its weight. and i think they rhythm and sound CD is one of the best dub/experimental records ever. lovely. tmo -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.22/739 - Release Date: 3/29/2007 1:36 PM -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.22/739 - Release Date: 3/29/2007 1:36 PM
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
tried yesterday to recall a CD I got recently that was all dub/Latin/instrumental artist's name is Luz Mob CD is called Luz Interpretations Growing up throughout the States, Luz Fleming drew from surroundings in urban San Francisco, Oakland and Brooklyn and rural Libre, Colorado. Studying under musical heavyweights such as Reggie Workman and Bill Dixon, Luz was influenced not only by improvisation and performance, but also by the hip-hop that surrounded his younger days in San Francisco's Mission District. This all seeps out in various guises in Luz's music; from his alto and baritone saxophone and bass clarinet constructions, to more dub and hip-hop rooted electronic production, you'd be hard-pressed sometimes to find where the Too $hort stops and the Eric Dolphy begins. With Luz Interpretations, Luz Mob has selected nine compositions from across different musical spectrums and reimagined them infused with a healthy smattering of bumping beats. Crossing genres from cumbia and bachata to dub and reggae to jazz and hip-hop, Interpretations is a tasty stew, flavored correctly with Luz's thick horn arrangements and varied spices from across the CrystalTop fam on every instrument in the symphony. It was created over a period of more than three years, as Luz sought out players across the country, from deepest Brooklyn to the mountains of Colorado, to the S.F.City by The Bay. Mixed by luminary New York engineer and producer Scotty Hard (Wu-Tang Clan, Medeski, Martin Wood, Prince Paul), Luz Interpretations takes you from J.T. The Bigga Figga to Disney's Jungle Book in less than an hour. http://www.crystaltop.com/artists.htm http://myspace.com/luzmobmusic
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
This site has quite a range of music including reggae, ragga and dancehall - it's all worth checking out - it's just a shame that they don't update it 'weekly' anymore: http://www.mixoftheweek.com/ Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Jeffrey Richards [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 05:09 To: 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel 4, 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX. VAT no. GB 626475817 #
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Oh and check out the discussion board on this site: http://www.bloodandfire.co.uk/db/index.php Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Robert Taylor Sent: 29 March 2007 08:30 To: 'Jeffrey Richards'; 313 Subject: RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop This site has quite a range of music including reggae, ragga and dancehall - it's all worth checking out - it's just a shame that they don't update it 'weekly' anymore: http://www.mixoftheweek.com/ Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Jeffrey Richards [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 05:09 To: 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel 4, 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX. VAT no. GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
soul jazz records have loads of brilliant stuff, u can try starting buying the 100%-600% dynamite cds which contain a mixture of stuff or you can find your preffered sound and buy them http://www.souljazzrecords.co.uk/ On 29/03/07, Jeffrey Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
- Original Message - From: Jeffrey Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 6:09 AM Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. There's a triple disk box set of Trojan dub that's excellent. It forms one of the two items of proper Jamaican dub in my collection, but I've listened to it loads. http://www.amazon.com/Trojan-Dub-Box-Set-Spec/dp/B6BXIF Tristan === [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.phonopsia.co.uk
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
A lot of those boxsets are mint - the DJ is one is excellent two and the Xmas and Kids ones are great for novelty value too! Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Tristan Watkins [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 08:42 To: Jeffrey Richards; 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 6:09 AM Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. There's a triple disk box set of Trojan dub that's excellent. It forms one of the two items of proper Jamaican dub in my collection, but I've listened to it loads. http://www.amazon.com/Trojan-Dub-Box-Set-Spec/dp/B6BXIF Tristan === [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.phonopsia.co.uk # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel 4, 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX. VAT no. GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
check out the man who not only saves the world from vampires and space invaders, but also wins the world cup and has met pac man: SCIENTIST! http://www.discogs.com/artist/scientist i'm not a terribly huge fan of dubstep in general, but kode9's sign of the dub is pretty awesome and freaky. On Mar 29, 2007, at 1:09, Jeffrey Richards wrote: where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m __ __ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
I can second any of the Scientists cartoon cover releases esp Wins the World Cup Also Dub Factor - Black Uhuru Starship Africa - Creation Rebel For the roots dub Any dub albums on Pressure Sounds, Blood and Fire are usually high quality and nicely packaged with plenty of meaninfull sleeve notes. For roots with vocals - The Congas - Heart of the Congas. Early Augustus Pablo is consistent in my book - minimal melodica and keys amongst a mighty wall of drum and bass, need to crank up the sound, it simply doesn't work otherwise. If you don't like all the roots style, try the non rasta political dub poetry of Linton Kwesi Johnson. Independent Intavenshan complilation, the dubs by Dennis Bovell are included. Theres tracks on there that can make a grown man weep. I think MEK is the dub ninja on this list, so step up MEK. Rav -Original Message- From: Matt Kane's Brain [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 12:48 To: Jeffrey Richards Cc: 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop check out the man who not only saves the world from vampires and space invaders, but also wins the world cup and has met pac man: SCIENTIST! http://www.discogs.com/artist/scientist i'm not a terribly huge fan of dubstep in general, but kode9's sign of the dub is pretty awesome and freaky. On Mar 29, 2007, at 1:09, Jeffrey Richards wrote: where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m __ __ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To view the terms under which this email is distributed, please go to http://disclaimer.leedsmet.ac.uk/email.htm
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Hehe LKJ shops in my local - he's a very nattily dressed and polite fellow. And a fantastic poet. Highly recommended. As well as the below, I would say an absolute must is the compilation of Lee Perry productions called Arkology - all the farmyard noises you'll ever need and some of the sweetest dub you'll ever hear Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Mann, Ravinder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 15:34 To: Matt Kane's Brain; Jeffrey Richards Cc: 313 Subject: RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop I can second any of the Scientists cartoon cover releases esp Wins the World Cup Also Dub Factor - Black Uhuru Starship Africa - Creation Rebel For the roots dub Any dub albums on Pressure Sounds, Blood and Fire are usually high quality and nicely packaged with plenty of meaninfull sleeve notes. For roots with vocals - The Congas - Heart of the Congas. Early Augustus Pablo is consistent in my book - minimal melodica and keys amongst a mighty wall of drum and bass, need to crank up the sound, it simply doesn't work otherwise. If you don't like all the roots style, try the non rasta political dub poetry of Linton Kwesi Johnson. Independent Intavenshan complilation, the dubs by Dennis Bovell are included. Theres tracks on there that can make a grown man weep. I think MEK is the dub ninja on this list, so step up MEK. Rav -Original Message- From: Matt Kane's Brain [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 12:48 To: Jeffrey Richards Cc: 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop check out the man who not only saves the world from vampires and space invaders, but also wins the world cup and has met pac man: SCIENTIST! http://www.discogs.com/artist/scientist i'm not a terribly huge fan of dubstep in general, but kode9's sign of the dub is pretty awesome and freaky. On Mar 29, 2007, at 1:09, Jeffrey Richards wrote: where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m __ __ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To view the terms under which this email is distributed, please go to http://disclaimer.leedsmet.ac.uk/email.htm # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. Channel 4, 124 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 2TX. VAT no. GB 626475817 #
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
On 3/29/07, Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hehe LKJ shops in my local - he's a very nattily dressed and polite fellow. And a fantastic poet. Highly recommended. As well as the below, I would say an absolute must is the compilation of Lee Perry productions called Arkology - all the farmyard noises you'll ever need and some of the sweetest dub you'll ever hear and a good starting point for eventually getting the black ark albums because they are generally the bomb. plus its nice having all the dub versions from the 7s and whatnot on that comp tom
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Oh, and I forgot to mention King Tubby meets The African Brothers In Dub. Not new, but it was only recently released in its entirety. -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
The Upsetters Mad Professor also has a number of good dub releases. Burnt Friedman as well Alpha Omega Dub Syndicate African Head Charge Bim Sherman Robotiks do some wicked dub (they are on Ariwa records) Sly Robbie - Drum Bass Stripped to the Bone (not dnb but proper dub drums and bass) - some explosive stuff on here Twilight Circus Dub Sound System (not really dub in the true sense but rather electronic instrumental reggae) Augustus Pablo Kodama and the Dub Station Band (stellar Japanese dub) Dry and Heavy (another great Japanese band) Matisyahu (Hasidic Jewish reggae!) Pitch Black (New Zealand electronic dub group had some music in Whale Rider but it's not on the soundtrack - sort of a cross between Leftfield and FSOL) The Black Seeds (another NZ band - if you like Fat Freddie's Drop then you might like this) http://www.theblackseeds.co.nz/ Fat Freddie's Drop (it should not go unmentioned) Admiral Tibet is a very cool modern roots artist who isn't afraid of using techy sounds another dub poet would be Mutabaruka U Roy has got to be my favorite deejay (vocalist) other vocalists: Horace Andy I-Roy John Holt Bunny Wailer Wailing Souls going back to the earlier stuff (ska) you just need to have some Skatalites in your collection for instrumental reggae/ska some good labels: Wackie's Echo Beach Select Cuts Honest Jon's Ariwa if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica I'll dig up a few more names when I get the time MEK Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote on 03/29/2007 11:41:49 AM: Hehe LKJ shops in my local - he's a very nattily dressed and polite fellow. And a fantastic poet. Highly recommended. As well as the below, I would say an absolute must is the compilation of Lee Perry productions called Arkology - all the farmyard noises you'll ever need and some of the sweetest dub you'll ever hear Rob Taylor VT Librarian x8599 Hatch Desk x1088 VT Library Users' Guide -Original Message- From: Mann, Ravinder [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 15:34 To: Matt Kane's Brain; Jeffrey Richards Cc: 313 Subject: RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop I can second any of the Scientists cartoon cover releases esp Wins the World Cup Also Dub Factor - Black Uhuru Starship Africa - Creation Rebel For the roots dub Any dub albums on Pressure Sounds, Blood and Fire are usually high quality and nicely packaged with plenty of meaninfull sleeve notes. For roots with vocals - The Congas - Heart of the Congas. Early Augustus Pablo is consistent in my book - minimal melodica and keys amongst a mighty wall of drum and bass, need to crank up the sound, it simply doesn't work otherwise. If you don't like all the roots style, try the non rasta political dub poetry of Linton Kwesi Johnson. Independent Intavenshan complilation, the dubs by Dennis Bovell are included. Theres tracks on there that can make a grown man weep. I think MEK is the dub ninja on this list, so step up MEK. Rav -Original Message- From: Matt Kane's Brain [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 29 March 2007 12:48 To: Jeffrey Richards Cc: 313 Subject: Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop check out the man who not only saves the world from vampires and space invaders, but also wins the world cup and has met pac man: SCIENTIST! http://www.discogs.com/artist/scientist i'm not a terribly huge fan of dubstep in general, but kode9's sign of the dub is pretty awesome and freaky. On Mar 29, 2007, at 1:09, Jeffrey Richards wrote: where can i find more of this Reggae type dub, that isn't just basic channel. I don't really know any of the artists, and when I try looking around on the internet it is mostly stuff I don't really seem to dig. I saw Damien Marley back in 97, and it was good, and I liked his single last year but outside of that I really haven't heard much that I like. Except for this Weatherall mix that seems to be good. And the Scion and Tikiman live gig that I heard. Recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Jeff --- Martin Dust [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m __ __ It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ -- matt kane's brain http://hydrogenproject.com aim - mkbatwerk [EMAIL PROTECTED] To view the terms under which this email is distributed, please go to http://disclaimer.leedsmet.ac.uk/email.htm
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
On 3/29/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Matisyahu (Hasidic Jewish reggae!) that dood is garbage. complete trash. a mockery of music. Fat Freddie's Drop (it should not go unmentioned) yeah their album and ep that i have is immediately loved by anyone who hears it, regardless of what their usual genre of choice is like. i tend to call them soul-reggae, but thats kind of redundant. going back to the earlier stuff (ska) you just need to have some Skatalites in your collection for instrumental reggae/ska i have this on heartbeat that is exceptionally wonderful stuff from the skatalites: http://www.discogs.com/release/564853 ill be breaking that one out soon as the weather is getting nicer and nicer some good labels: Wackie's Echo Beach Select Cuts Honest Jon's Ariwa dont forget blood and fire (they did the congos reissue), if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica the nyabinghi version of satta massagana performed by third world to open the movie rockers is ridiculous. the whole soundtrack and movie for that are pretty insane, theres some dub (lee perry dread lion) and lots of great roots and some of the most classic reggae jams from the mid-late 70s. and the movie is awesome. there's also a nyabinghi box set by trojan that has some nice stuff on it as well. tom
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica sorry, scratch that - it originated in the 40s but it took it's influences directly from the music of Africans enslaved in the islands MEK
Re: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Almost forgot the very excellent Dub Trio - killer band live too putting dub and punk back together making Tackhead proud http://www.dubtrio.com/ there's a new dub CD I just received but I can't recall by who or what it is called but it was pretty damn good I'll dig it up and post it later Matisyahu (Hasidic Jewish reggae!) that dood is garbage. complete trash. a mockery of music. well, yeah, he is very produced and commercial, sort of the hipsters reggae artist MEK
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
also check out this friend of mine from Bristol. Goes by the name of Hanuman. http://www.myspace.com/themightyhanuman he does up some cool breaks/dnb/dub dishes I have tons of his music that hasn't been released yet - MEK
RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Not quite. It was actually brought to the lisland by the original east Indians that were brought there before the Africans. As was the ganjah and most of the rasta beliefs about word sound and power (which is the cornerstone of the nyhabingi order as well as their creed). The Indians that were brought over were all of the ancient Kashmir shaivite sect of Hinduism. A large part of their ritual is centered around the smoking of the ganjah and achieving a state of openness and power through the recitation of certain words/sounds of power while beating a very specific three part drum tune (father drum, kete drum, funde drum). The rasta's adopted this more mystical approach and blended it with the more progressive political views of the time (enter garvey)and a few kinda skewed ideas about emmanuel and emperor selassie and voila! Ratsa as a religion and political movement. I was raised rasta and spent a lot of time in the Binghi camps up in st anns. And even down there, few rastas willingly accept their east Indian roots. But check out the old school shaivites. You'll see what I mean. And I can't believe no ones mentioned Dread at the Controls mikey dread was one of the dub producers that stayed around, stayed progressive and didn't shy away from the digital. Imo, he was the only one besides tubby to achieve a proper balance of the really crazy digital sounds and effects and the original heaviness and sloppy thudding energy of the old ghetto sound. Check wall street dub, proper education, and jumping master for a good sample. I'm pretty sure he's got a website and when I went to ask about vinyl awhile ago, his wife answered the email address (only cause he was on tour!) and I ended up getting almost everything he's done on wax! Nice peeps. Others that haven't been mentioned are prince fari (in the dub poets section), nyhabinghi elders, and if you can find any of the maytals stuff in dub (think Trojan did a thing awhile ago) it's golden. Sorry for the long post. Back to the darks. K mwnb -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 5:33 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop if you REALLY want to get to the heart of reggae then definitely check out Ras Michael and the whole Nyahbinghi movement it's totally stripped down the core of the music - the rhythm - very spiritual music and apparently started with the free and escaped slaves in Jamaica sorry, scratch that - it originated in the 40s but it took it's influences directly from the music of Africans enslaved in the islands MEK
(313) Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop
Great little mix hiding herewell worth checking Weatherall - Reggae/Dub/Hip Hop http://www.whistlebump.co.uk/audio/andrew_weatherall_whistlebump.mp3 m
(313) The Hip-Hop Archive
A colleague of mine curates the hip-hop archive at Stanford University. (More info: http://www.hiphoparchive.org/archive/ index2.htm) Does anything like this exist for house and/or techno? peace lks
(313) Detroit's Hip-Hop Mayor at +4
Early poll results indicate a win for Kilpatrick. Effect on techno music scene considered to be (ahem) minimal. -- Ian
(313) South American Hip Hop
At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? -- Ian
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
my partner has been downloading some of the stuff - i don't know any links, but there was something in the village voice a few weeks back - they might have a link. i like the song with the horse neighing. james www.jbucknell.com Ian Malbon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To 08/07/05 02:09 PM 313 List 313@hyperreal.org cc Subject (313) South American Hip Hop At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? -- Ian ForwardSourceID:NT00020496
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
On 8 jul 2005, at 6:09, Ian Malbon wrote: At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? Probably not what you're looking for, but it might interest you anyway, especially the Favela On Blast mix: http://www.cokemachineglow.com/reviews/miadiplo_arularet2005.html Cheers, Hans -- Hans Veneman http://technotourist.org http://vlokfeest.net
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
This is perhaps the best-known resource - heaps of mp3s. http://evil-wire.org/~ampere/mp3/funky/ Enjoy! Ian Malbon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/08/05 2:09 pm At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? -- Ian
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
There's a band/collective called Funk Careoca or some such who do crazy Brazillian influenced carnival style Hip Hop stuss- I've also heard a couple of albums from some South American Electro Acts which were bizzare funny and good all at the same time- I'll try and get then names and post them up cheers Jason On 8 Jul 2005, at 08:48, Simon Hindle wrote: This is perhaps the best-known resource - heaps of mp3s. http://evil-wire.org/~ampere/mp3/funky/ Enjoy! Ian Malbon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07/08/05 2:09 pm At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? -- Ian
RE: (313) South American Hip Hop
Not south american, but check out Orishas. They're an excellent cuban hip hop group. Search for Que Pasa and Represent by them. -Original Message- From: Ian Malbon [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2005 9:10 PM To: 313 List Subject: (313) South American Hip Hop At some point (I think on this list) there was a link to some great samples of hip hop coming out of the hills in Brazil. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy. My searches of the archives have proved fruitless. Can anyone remind me? -- Ian -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.10/43 - Release Date: 7/6/2005 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.10/43 - Release Date: 7/6/2005
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
i've seen this gritty brazilian movie o invasor recently and it had a nice tough though hip hop soundtrack done by the producer sabotage. it's just as you descibe it.. Electro- tinged, DIY stuff that was full of energy.. and still with good, detailed production in a nyc way (premier, pete rock). some samples: http://www.cliquemusic.com.br/artistas/artistas.asp?Status=DISCONu_Disco=10240
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
On Jul 8, 2005, at 3:48 AM, Simon Hindle wrote: This is perhaps the best-known resource - heaps of mp3s. http://evil-wire.org/~ampere/mp3/funky/ That's exactly the page I was seeking. Obrigado! -- Ian
Re: (313) South American Hip Hop
The name of the album I was talking about was: Slum Dunk presents Funk Carioca and its on Mr Bongo from London. There's also a new Grime EP coming out by MIA (nothing to to with the UR stuff of the same name) with a DJ Malboro who is one of the main guys from the outfit cheers Jason On 8 Jul 2005, at 17:08, Ian Malbon wrote: On Jul 8, 2005, at 3:48 AM, Simon Hindle wrote: This is perhaps the best-known resource - heaps of mp3s. http://evil-wire.org/~ampere/mp3/funky/ That's exactly the page I was seeking. Obrigado! -- Ian
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
that would be cool if you could put it up. i couldn't find it on p2p and i doubt it's readily avaiable at my local record store. On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.discogs.com/release/183348 it's a live tape of Bambaataa cutting up and juggling breaks from '83. It's rough as f*ck in terms of both production (typical cruddy Paul Winley pressing) and skills, but it has mad energy and can lay a pretty strong claim to being the blueprint for b-boy mixtapes. The actual tracklisting is the stuff of legend. A lot of the breaks have now been dug up and identified (e.g. Jackson Sisters), but for ages a lot of people were scratching their heads about this one. It was also the inspiration for Q-Bert's Camel Bobsled Race (his beat juggle and cut up of DJ Shadow tracks) which is frankly mind boggling. I've got a copy at here I might be able to make available At 7:26 pm + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not familiar with that link? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
the best i know of is on deep house pages 1164. Afrika Islam (son of Bambatta) -Zulu Nation WHBI 105.9FM, Newark 1982-83 this is my favourite electro/hiphop/breaks mix. brilliant. james www.jbucknell.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] et To 06/04/05 09:29 AM [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc 313@hyperreal.org Subject Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes that would be cool if you could put it up. i couldn't find it on p2p and i doubt it's readily avaiable at my local record store. On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.discogs.com/release/183348 it's a live tape of Bambaataa cutting up and juggling breaks from '83. It's rough as f*ck in terms of both production (typical cruddy Paul Winley pressing) and skills, but it has mad energy and can lay a pretty strong claim to being the blueprint for b-boy mixtapes. The actual tracklisting is the stuff of legend. A lot of the breaks have now been dug up and identified (e.g. Jackson Sisters), but for ages a lot of people were scratching their heads about this one. It was also the inspiration for Q-Bert's Camel Bobsled Race (his beat juggle and cut up of DJ Shadow tracks) which is frankly mind boggling. I've got a copy at here I might be able to make available At 7:26 pm + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not familiar with that link? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions? ForwardSourceID:NT0001CA3A
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
Indeed, the Q-Bert Camel Bobsled Race cover art was designed to be an almost exact parody of the Death Mix cover. Q-Bert http://stat.discogs.com/R/t/15898-001.jpg Bambaataa http://stat.discogs.com/R/t/183348-001.jpg carl morris Plug Two t +442920190151 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.discogs.com/release/183348 it's a live tape of Bambaataa cutting up and juggling breaks from '83. It's rough as f*ck in terms of both production (typical cruddy Paul Winley pressing) and skills, but it has mad energy and can lay a pretty strong claim to being the blueprint for b-boy mixtapes. The actual tracklisting is the stuff of legend. A lot of the breaks have now been dug up and identified (e.g. Jackson Sisters), but for ages a lot of people were scratching their heads about this one. It was also the inspiration for Q-Bert's Camel Bobsled Race (his beat juggle and cut up of DJ Shadow tracks) which is frankly mind boggling. I've got a copy at here I might be able to make available At 7:26 pm + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not familiar with that link? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
(313) pre-hip-hop mixes
so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
At 02:25 AM 4/5/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around You could listen to an Afrika Bambaataa DJ set from the present day. He hasn't bought any new records. -- unsigned short int to_yer_mama; matt kane's brain http://www.hydrogenproject.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] || AIM: mkbatwerk
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
i figure he's playing planet rocck and everythign around planet rock. but not so much the stuff before p[lanet rock eh whatever. a momentary curiosity. On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, matt kane's brain wrote: At 02:25 AM 4/5/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around You could listen to an Afrika Bambaataa DJ set from the present day. He hasn't bought any new records. -- unsigned short int to_yer_mama; matt kane's brain http://www.hydrogenproject.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] || AIM: mkbatwerk
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
not familiar with that link? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
Re: (313) pre-hip-hop mixes
http://www.discogs.com/release/183348 it's a live tape of Bambaataa cutting up and juggling breaks from '83. It's rough as f*ck in terms of both production (typical cruddy Paul Winley pressing) and skills, but it has mad energy and can lay a pretty strong claim to being the blueprint for b-boy mixtapes. The actual tracklisting is the stuff of legend. A lot of the breaks have now been dug up and identified (e.g. Jackson Sisters), but for ages a lot of people were scratching their heads about this one. It was also the inspiration for Q-Bert's Camel Bobsled Race (his beat juggle and cut up of DJ Shadow tracks) which is frankly mind boggling. I've got a copy at here I might be able to make available At 7:26 pm + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: not familiar with that link? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: what about Bambataa's Death Mix? early enough for you? At 6:25 am + 5/4/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so i'm curious, does anyone know where one could find some pre-hip-hop mixes online. i'm talking some real deal kool herc/afrika bambataa block party stuff from the late '70s. i've never seen any around suggestions?
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: now if anyone doesn't mind- i could easily start a thread regardi hip=hip that i've recently discovered. stuff that probably has more in common with carl craig than public enemy anyone? i'd be interested! you can reply of list if no one else is interested. jurren Let's do it - it's just as 'on topic' as some of the other stuff people want to discuss. Futuristic hip-hop I'm appreciating at the moment: *Viktor Vaughn - Vaudeville Villain OK, I have just discovered that this is in fact -MF Doom! No wonder I like it so much. Muffled 303 and 808s, unashamed synthiness and a love of eschewing the obvious, make this something I'd recommend to this list. One small patch of dubious lyrical content but mostly it's sound. You might also want to check out Madlib and MF Doom's Madvillain project. LP is due in a few days: http://www.stonesthrow.com/madvillain/ I heard an EP of a collaboration of Doom Lib a few weeks ago - *on Bluenote* (but I'd totalled my record allowance so didn't buy). That was also very good. Sorry the name escapes me. Check here: http://www.bluenote.com/artistpage.asp?ArtistID=3718tab=1 *Mr Lif - I Phantom. This is now quite old (2002?) Emile recently turned me on to it. It's brilliant. A lot of the same qualities as MFD but a lot more aware lyrically and I think more club-friendly too. *Boom Bip - Seed To Sun - again I'm late on this. Mostly good. But some noodly and indie-sounding moments which is not for me. Mostly very painterly with shades of dementia. And I do regard it as hip-hop. Mostly! *Masterminds - Subliminal EP. With Mr Lif 'No Test Redux'. Again I'm so late with this (it's from 2001) - but then again, I think many copies have been loitering in vaults for the last three years as the shop said they'd never seen them till now. - 'Subliminal' is filtered rock-riff hip-hop before OutKast and it's highly, highly recommended. 'No Test Redux' is a avant-downbeat loop to lose track of time to. Sweetly put together. k
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
thanks ken for the info, i'll keep my eyes out for those releases. two things i've heard recently [both 313 related] are the lacksydaisycal album, which was nice, reminding a bit of common on one or two songs, and jaydee has a hand in it aswell. some very nice tunes, but not the best hiphop album ever. worth to check if you like sv, j-dilla, common. another one is the jimmy edgar 12 on warp, as it was mentioned on littledetroit. after reading the description on the site, i had high hopes, but to my ears only the third track came close to achieving some of the praise it had been given. should probably listen to it once more. also saw a jaydee produced phat kat release on house shoe records (?) from detroit on the rushhour mailout. if i'm not mistaken this is the last track that was on the 2000demf mix by dego that used to be up on groovetech. anyone know more about phat kat/house shoe? i've got a remix by dwele that also features phat kat, so i assume he's done loads of things allready, anything i should keep an eye out for? http://www.bling47.com for more detroit hiphop. jurren _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
is my ban from 313 gone yet? My current fave is a rediscovered oldie out of the RZA´s magic hat, Shyheims Young Godz. Crazy beat, crazy mc´s, classic stuff!! I usually can tell most off the stuff that´s going on in a beat but this one remains a mystery... also on rotation is Missy´s Wake up from the last album which is incredible. Picture Eric B and Rakim´s Microphone fiend brake in outer space. Neptunes did it again, they may not be very original but they are d**m good. Another slammer for me is track by Elephant man with the T.O.K posse, pure blade runner dance hall Elephanti has been occupiing my decks a lot lately anyway, next to Baby Cham and the lot from Greensleeves ruff´n´ready!!! -Original Message- From: jurren baars [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: woensdag 10 maart 2004 14:50 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313@hyperreal.org Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP thanks ken for the info, i'll keep my eyes out for those releases. two things i've heard recently [both 313 related] are the lacksydaisycal album, which was nice, reminding a bit of common on one or two songs, and jaydee has a hand in it aswell. some very nice tunes, but not the best hiphop album ever. worth to check if you like sv, j-dilla, common. another one is the jimmy edgar 12 on warp, as it was mentioned on littledetroit. after reading the description on the site, i had high hopes, but to my ears only the third track came close to achieving some of the praise it had been given. should probably listen to it once more. also saw a jaydee produced phat kat release on house shoe records (?) from detroit on the rushhour mailout. if i'm not mistaken this is the last track that was on the 2000demf mix by dego that used to be up on groovetech. anyone know more about phat kat/house shoe? i've got a remix by dwele that also features phat kat, so i assume he's done loads of things allready, anything i should keep an eye out for? http://www.bling47.com for more detroit hiphop. jurren _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl The information contained in this e-mail communication is solely intended for the person/legal person to whom it has been sent, and as it may contain information of a personal or confidential nature, it may not be made public by virtue of law, regulations or agreement. If someone other than the intended recipient should receive or come into possession of this e-mail communication, he/she will not be entitled to read, disseminate, disclose or duplicate it. If you are not the intended recipient, you are requested to inform the sender of this e-mail message of this immediately, and to destroy the original e-mail communication. Neither Randstad Holding nv nor its subsidiaries accept any liability for incorrect and incomplete transmission or delayed receipt of this e-mail.
Re: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
also on rotation is Missy´s Wake up from the last album which is incredible. Yeah, this is my favourite cut on the album for sure - Jay-Z manages to rhyme 'David Beckham' with 'rectum' which is always a bonus :)
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
on the phat kat front - check Phat Kat aka Ronnie Cash - Dedication To The Suckers on House Shoes - another Jay Dee prod, heavy! Also has a handy Detroit Road Map on the cover... Other synthy hip hop: Def Harmonic on Altered Vibes, some very technoey synth moments on their stuff - deeply pleasing, the track 'Doing The Best I Can' is great, though some of their other tracks are marred by weak MCing in places. Altered Vibes is part of the Goya stable as far as I know, but these people sound American, anyone know where they're from? Blockhead also deserve an honourable mention in this category. Anyone else heard the new Pete Rock import on Up Above? - b-side is lurvely. P.S. Before anyone asks, Pete Rock is Richie Hawtin's evil twin, Blockhead is the secret UK downtempo project of Eddie Fowlkes and Def Harmonic use old transmat CDs as beer coasters, so ner! At 01:49 pm + 10/3/04, jurren baars wrote: thanks ken for the info, i'll keep my eyes out for those releases. two things i've heard recently [both 313 related] are the lacksydaisycal album, which was nice, reminding a bit of common on one or two songs, and jaydee has a hand in it aswell. some very nice tunes, but not the best hiphop album ever. worth to check if you like sv, j-dilla, common. another one is the jimmy edgar 12 on warp, as it was mentioned on littledetroit. after reading the description on the site, i had high hopes, but to my ears only the third track came close to achieving some of the praise it had been given. should probably listen to it once more. also saw a jaydee produced phat kat release on house shoe records (?) from detroit on the rushhour mailout. if i'm not mistaken this is the last track that was on the 2000demf mix by dego that used to be up on groovetech. anyone know more about phat kat/house shoe? i've got a remix by dwele that also features phat kat, so i assume he's done loads of things allready, anything i should keep an eye out for? http://www.bling47.com for more detroit hiphop. jurren _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl
Re: RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
Def Harmonic on Altered Vibes, some very technoey synth moments on their stuff - deeply pleasing, the track 'Doing The Best I Can' is great, though some of their other tracks are marred by weak MCing in places. Altered Vibes is part of the Goya stable as far as I know, but these people sound American, anyone know where they're from? I think they're connected to the Wobblyhead label in Milwaukee. I saw them in chicago last year knowing nothing about them, and I was rather impressed to say the least :)
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Other synthy hip hop: Def Harmonic on Altered Vibes, some very technoey synth moments on their stuff - deeply pleasing, the track 'Doing The Best I Can' is great, though some of their other tracks are marred by weak MCing in places. Altered Vibes is part of the Goya stable as far as I know, but these people sound American, anyone know where they're from? while cutting and pasting i suddenly realised def harmonic is NOT harmonic 33... m. pritchard (sp?) has a nice 12 out as harmonic33 on some german label. ooh this mail comes too late in the day... i'll see what i can come up with when i'm home. as it's a nice 12 that pritchard thingy especially the song 'where have they gone' i think tom churchil played a newer release on the same label in one of his recent mixes he posted here. _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
Mark Pritchard? Of Reload/Global Communication/Jedi Knights/Roobarb Custard/the other Aphex Twin fame? -Original Message- From: jurren baars [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 6:11 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Other synthy hip hop: Def Harmonic on Altered Vibes, some very technoey synth moments on their stuff - deeply pleasing, the track 'Doing The Best I Can' is great, though some of their other tracks are marred by weak MCing in places. Altered Vibes is part of the Goya stable as far as I know, but these people sound American, anyone know where they're from? while cutting and pasting i suddenly realised def harmonic is NOT harmonic 33... m. pritchard (sp?) has a nice 12 out as harmonic33 on some german label. ooh this mail comes too late in the day... i'll see what i can come up with when i'm home. as it's a nice 12 that pritchard thingy especially the song 'where have they gone' i think tom churchil played a newer release on the same label in one of his recent mixes he posted here. _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl # Note: Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You. #
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
because you put a question-mark in there... http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=5644 On Wed, 10 Mar 2004, jurren baars wrote: thanks ken for the info, i'll keep my eyes out for those releases. two things i've heard recently [both 313 related] are the lacksydaisycal album, which was nice, reminding a bit of common on one or two songs, and jaydee has a hand in it aswell. some very nice tunes, but not the best hiphop album ever. worth to check if you like sv, j-dilla, common. another one is the jimmy edgar 12 on warp, as it was mentioned on littledetroit. after reading the description on the site, i had high hopes, but to my ears only the third track came close to achieving some of the praise it had been given. should probably listen to it once more. also saw a jaydee produced phat kat release on house shoe records (?) from detroit on the rushhour mailout. if i'm not mistaken this is the last track that was on the 2000demf mix by dego that used to be up on groovetech. anyone know more about phat kat/house shoe? i've got a remix by dwele that also features phat kat, so i assume he's done loads of things allready, anything i should keep an eye out for? http://www.bling47.com for more detroit hiphop. jurren _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl
Re: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
m. pritchard (sp?) has a nice 12 out as harmonic33 on some german label. That's Alphabet Zoo - there's actually a couple of 12s and a CD album from Harmonic33 so far... The Danny Breaks releases on Alphabet Zoo are also well worth checking - 'The Jellyfish' from his 'Another Dimension' release kicks off the 20.02.04 radio show at www.spatialsounds.com (under 'sounds') - nice stuff in the Dabrye/Prefuse 73 kinda mould... Here's some links: http://www.discogs.com/label/Alphabet_Zoo http://www.rekkid.co.uk/alphabetzoo/ http://www.gmediamusic.com/partnerships/harmonic33.html And Rob, yes it's Mark Pritchard of Reload/GlobComm etc fame - doing much better solo work than Tom Middleton these days IMHO :) Cheers, Tom
RE: (313) what's your favorite track/album right now?/HIP HOP
There was a Harmonic33 12 on Alphabet Zoo called 'Kaleidoscopic Sounds EP', the first release on the label in fact, and yes it is indeed Mark Pritchard of Global Comms/Jedi Knights etc fame. I'm reliably informed that he is a massive hip hop head. I believe that Alphabet Zoo is Danny Breaks' label (for all you old Junglists out there). Wonderful 12 if you ever come across it, deep late night hip hop instrumentals in a crisp Primo/Spinna/Pete Rock style (and that isn't an idle comparison). Erm, let me think, ah yes, Mark Pritchard has a picture of Mad Mike tattoed on his left buttock and Danny Breaks is Juan Atkins' Uncle. At 06:10 pm + 10/3/04, jurren baars wrote: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Other synthy hip hop: Def Harmonic on Altered Vibes, some very technoey synth moments on their stuff - deeply pleasing, the track 'Doing The Best I Can' is great, though some of their other tracks are marred by weak MCing in places. Altered Vibes is part of the Goya stable as far as I know, but these people sound American, anyone know where they're from? while cutting and pasting i suddenly realised def harmonic is NOT harmonic 33... m. pritchard (sp?) has a nice 12 out as harmonic33 on some german label. ooh this mail comes too late in the day... i'll see what i can come up with when i'm home. as it's a nice 12 that pritchard thingy especially the song 'where have they gone' i think tom churchil played a newer release on the same label in one of his recent mixes he posted here. _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl
RE: (313) Re: 313 Best 2003/Hip-hop
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2003 11:51 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Re: 313 Best 2003 Oh yes oh yes - I can see what Ken's saying - take a listen to people like Beans, Boom Bip, Prefuse 73, Madlib, Mr. Lif, etc. I do have to say that if you want some coverage of great hip-hop check these two magazines - XLR8R and Grand Slam recently came across the later in a Barnes Noble of all places - fantastic magazine that covers all of my funk and soul addictions a little old and a litte new MEK Ken Odeluga wrote: Most Neglected Genre (by me): Hip-Hop. My feeling is that in terms of 'futuristic music' it's likely to have something of a renaissance year in 04. Interesting comment there, Ken! Hip-Hop as futuristic music? Not quite sure I understand what you mean in that sense, tho. When I see the term futuristic music the first thing that comes to my mind are, e.g., the tracks that Magda played in the Underground stage at this year's Movement/DEMF, not Hip-Hop. All the Hip-Hop I ever get exposed to (read: Not Much) seems like variants on the old time-honored theme. (Well OK, not OutKast, but they don't seem futuristic to me, just Different.) Or do I just not get out enough? ;-) Happy Christmas/Chanukah/Kwanza(a), - Greg I couldn't have said it better Michael! Cheers One might also check out at least one Rob Hood Track on Wire To Wire LP for more futuristic hip hop, plus a lot of Night Time World volume two, and of course the 11 Phases of Detroit comp. Also, Everyday by Model 500. Plus, as someone a lot wiser than me recently pointed out, although stuff by artists like Boards of Canada and Bola isn't ordinarily thought of as hip-hop, it owes a lot to what *is* ordinarily thought of as such, due mostly to the rhythmic structure used by The Boards et al. Basically, when I say futuristic I'm not narrowly meaning sci-fi sounds and beats. I'm thinking also of just the spirit of how something is put together, if it's done in an unconventional way. Another example might be the 'unreleased' Dwele LP. Not very hi-tech (from what I've heard, not much of it admittedly) but in ethos, it sounds way ahead. All in all I think hip-hop is very much a stone left unturned for future music, at least by me. Peace, k
Re: (313) Re: 313 Best 2003/Hip-hop
On Dec 29, 2003, at 2:00 AM, Odeluga, Ken wrote: Another example might be the 'unreleased' Dwele LP. Not very hi-tech (from what I've heard, not much of it admittedly) but in ethos, it sounds way ahead. Speaking of, anyone check out the Dwele Slum Village show at St. Andrews Hall in Detroit a few days ago? Was gonna head down and then got tied up... nothing like a homecoming crowd all wired from the holidays and needing some release... yeah! -- Matt MacQueen http://SonicSunset.com
(313) Hip Hop Mailing List
** Entertainment UK Limited Registered Office: 243 Blyth Road, Hayes, Middlesex UB3 1DN. Registered in England Numbered 409775 This e-mail is only intended for the person(s) to whom it is addressed and may contain confidential information. Unless stated to the contrary, any opinions or comments are personal to the writer and do not represent the official view of the company. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message from your system. Please do not copy it or use it for any purposes, or disclose its contents to any other person. Thank you for your co-operation. ** A friend has asked me if there is a hip hop mailing list like 313, he's trying to track down an old record. Does anyone know of such a list?? G.
Re: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno
That's just Eminem who has the antipathy to 'techno'. Proof is more open and gives props to eveyone. I think there's some social links. But not 'techno' so much as house/ghetto-tek. -- From: Andrew [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 9:22 PM Hi, I got to thinkin'...is there any links between the techno scene in Detroit and the hiphop scene? Been listening to Jaydee loads lately, and I'm sure I heard a reference to techno in one of his tracks (NOT slagging it off either, like Eminem) and his track 'Big Booty Express' (off the Welcome to Detroit LP on BBE) seems like a homage to Kraftwerk and techno...? Apologies if this has been discussed Andrew
Re: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno
Andrew Hodgson wrote: I got to thinkin'...is there any links between the techno scene in Detroit and the hiphop scene? Been listening to Jaydee loads lately, and I'm sure I heard a reference to techno in one of his tracks (NOT slagging it off either, like Eminem) and his track 'Big Booty Express' (off the Welcome to Detroit LP on BBE) seems like a homage to Kraftwerk and techno...? here are a couple of links i can think of: UR and hipnotech; hipnotech is a label that's released a couple of [so far 7?] 12s with instrumental hiphop. they're supported by UR. shake; anthony shakir does[did?] production for several detroit hiphop acts, and often produces hiphop himself. that hiphop compilation on sublime; featuring tracks by shake, dan bell, robert hood and more detroit techno producers. in that same veign: a couple of songs that came out through intuit-solar; that dan bell hiphop track on the first intuit-solar 12 is so good! antidote; planet e side-label, 4? releases so far, featuring lacksydaisycal, dwele, slum village and more. dwele; featuring both on recloose's 'i can't take it' and several slum village tracks, and soon his own album. dabrye; produces hiphop as dabrye, and house/techno as ... [rob theakston can probably provide with more info on this artist] slum village 'S.O.U.L.'; from the album 'trinity' samples, or uses the same sample as 'sharivari' if i'm not mistaken channel one 'technicolor'; was sampled for a hiphop track by sir mix-a-lot. collaboration between carl craig and kariem riggins for the detroit experiment. that's all i can come up with for now, but there are probably a couple more links. jurren _ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
Re: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno
There is an MC named S.U.N. (Scientific Universal Noncommercial) from Ypsilanti which is not too far from Detroit, he makes some really nice conscious underground hiphop. I produce techno but I play live keyboards with SUN sometimes, we have a show in June at the Blind Pig that I will be coming out from Chicago to do. I have never produced any tracks with SUN but we are talking about it, I am pretty interested in trying to make a more techy or electro sounding hiphop track and seeing how it comes out. So does this count as a techno/hiphop/Detroit connection? Ypsilanti is not quite Detroit, and I never lived in Detroit but I lived in Ferndale at Nine Mile. /dave -- Original Message - Subject: Re: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno Date: Sun, 04 May 2003 18:17:13 + From: jurren baars [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 313@hyperreal.org Andrew Hodgson wrote: I got to thinkin'...is there any links between the techno scene in Detroit and the hiphop scene? Been listening to Jaydee loads lately, and I'm sure I heard a reference to techno in one of his tracks (NOT slagging it off either, like Eminem) and his track 'Big Booty Express' (off the Welcome to Detroit LP on BBE) seems like a homage to Kraftwerk and techno...? here are a couple of links i can think of: UR and hipnotech; hipnotech is a label that's released a couple of [so far 7?] 12s with instrumental hiphop. they're supported by UR. shake; anthony shakir does[did?] production for several detroit hiphop acts, and often produces hiphop himself. that hiphop compilation on sublime; featuring tracks by shake, dan bell, robert hood and more detroit techno producers. in that same veign: a couple of songs that came out through intuit-solar; that dan bell hiphop track on the first intuit-solar 12 is so good! antidote; planet e side-label, 4? releases so far, featuring lacksydaisycal, dwele, slum village and more. dwele; featuring both on recloose's 'i can't take it' and several slum village tracks, and soon his own album. dabrye; produces hiphop as dabrye, and house/techno as ... [rob theakston can probably provide with more info on this artist] slum village 'S.O.U.L.'; from the album 'trinity' samples, or uses the same sample as 'sharivari' if i'm not mistaken channel one 'technicolor'; was sampled for a hiphop track by sir mix-a-lot. collaboration between carl craig and kariem riggins for the detroit experiment. that's all i can come up with for now, but there are probably a couple more links. jurren _ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
(313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno
Hi, I got to thinkin'...is there any links between the techno scene in Detroit and the hiphop scene? Been listening to Jaydee loads lately, and I'm sure I heard a reference to techno in one of his tracks (NOT slagging it off either, like Eminem) and his track 'Big Booty Express' (off the Welcome to Detroit LP on BBE) seems like a homage to Kraftwerk and techno...? Apologies if this has been discussed Andrew
Re: (313) Detroit Hip Hop and Techno
While the topic is detroit and hip, may I recommend detroit artist Jimmy Edgar who records as Morris Nightingale and Kristuit Salu. He does prefuse73 style hip hop / idm / techno influenced - definitely worth checking: check http://www.m3rck.net/html/discog/009.html for previews of his album and also: UPCOMING KRISTUIT SALU LIVE SHOWS: Detroit, MI - May 23 Cranbrook Art Museum Kristuit Salu @ sound/visual installation Detroit, MI - May 23-25 Hart Plaza Kristuit Salu @ MOVEMENT festival (formerly DEMF) cheers Matt --- [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(313) Broken Beat Hip Hop
Artist: Prefuse 73 Title: One Word Extinguisher Producer: Scott Herren Release Date: May 5, 2003 Record Label: Warp Catalogue: WARP105 Genre: Electronic Category: Experimental Techno, Glitch, Trip-Hop Track Listing: 01. The Wrong Side of Reflection (Intro) - :34 02. The End of Biters-International - 1:17 03. Plastic (featuring Diverse) - 2:44 04. Uprock and Invigorate (A Prefuse/Dabrye Production) - 3:46 05. The Color of Tempo - 3:24 06. Dave¹s Bonus Beats - 2:10 07. Detchibe - 4:08 08. Altoid Addiction (Interlude) - 1:01 09. Busy Signal (Make You Go Bombing Mix) A Prefuse/Daedelus Production - 2:41 10. One Word Extinguisher - 4:04 11. 90% of My Mind is with You - 3:15 12. Huevos with Jeff and Rani (featuring Mr. Lif on a Minidisc Mic) - 1:22 13. Female Demands - 2:29 14. Why I Love You (with Jenny Vasquez) - 2:55 15. Southerners (Interlude) - :23 16. Perverted Undertone - 3:18 17. Invigorate (A Prefuse/Dabrye Interlude) - 1:25 18. Choking You - 4:01 19. Storm Returns (A Prefuse/Tommy Guerrero Production) - 5:15 20. Trains on Top of The Game (Interlude) - 1:54 21. Styles That Fade Away with a Collonade (Reprise) - 4:26 22. Untitled - 1:22 23. Untitled - 2:59 Total Playtime: 1:00:03 Artist Bio: Prefuse 73 is the alias of Scott Herren, a hip-hop producer who, under the Prefuse name, has produced material in which many of the raps of MCs are buried in the production mix to become part of the sonic texture as opposed to a focal point. Herren began his career working in Atlanta commercial studios, but has since gone on to work on more experimental work. His first record under the Prefuse name, Vocal Studies and Uprock Narratives, not only buried but cut up and spliced raps as well as allowing some more straightforward vocals from several MCs. Herren has also worked under his own name and that of Savath Savalas. Geoff Orens, All Music Guide Album Reviews: Amazon [www.amazon.co.uk] One Word Extinguisher¹ is an apposite title for the new Prefuse 73 LP. Anyone who experienced Scott Herren¹s debut, Vocal Studies and Uprock Narratives, will already know about his unique approach to producing hip-hop, but if not, this follow-up is an even better place to check it. On his new joint, Herren excels once again at chewing up traditional beats and rhymes with his MPC and spitting them back out as quasi-cubist digital fragments, creating rapid-fire, neck-snapping snares and stuttering, karate-chop vocals. His technique makes for a highly original and slightly avant sound, though most of the genuinely breathtaking rhythm-and-verbal assaults here are tempered by a melodic fluidity that ensures cerebral stimulation as well as heavy head-nod action. Once again, Herren has straddled the worlds of glitch-beep electronica and hip-hop without missing a beat, and has ensured that he occupies a league of his own one that has to be heard to be believed. Paul Sullivan, Amazon UK All Music Guide [www.allmusic.com] Prefuse 73¹s first album for Warp should be the one that catapults Scott Herren into the programming firmament occupied by Warp mainstays like Autechre and Aphex Twin. A fascinating collection of glitchy breakbeats and inventive, melodic experimental techno, One Word Extinguisher is a set of electronica that¹s nearly as challenging as Autechre¹s relentlessly academic beat manipulation but just as funky and instantly gratifying as a Fatboy Slim flag-waver. (Certainly those famous former b-boys in Plaid could never hope to score a Foot Locker commercial.) But forget electronic music Herren is trying to take hip-hop to the next level with a vision of breakbeat music that, like the crunchy digital productions of Timbaland and Neptunes, pushes hip-hop production into the future. Quintessentially ¹70s and ¹80s innovations like samplers and analog mixers are giving way to digital software and CD mixers, and Herren welcomes the changeover; ³Huevos With Jeff and Roni,² one of the record¹s three vocal tracks, features Def Jux¹s Mr. Lif ³on a minisc mic.² Not that Russell Simmons is about to jump on the Prefuse bandwagon, or a Scott Herren line of urban fashionwear is in the cards, but One Word Extinguisher means as much to the future of underground rap as it does to experimental techno. Skater hero and lo-fi mastermind Tommy Guerrero, Ann Arborite Dabrye, and Plug Research¹s own Daedelus each stop by for intriguing co-productions. John Bush, All Music Guide
Re: (313) hip hop sampling detroit (was: Brandy/producers of pop that go the extra mile)
the original from J-lo/Beatnuts is: Light, Enoch Orchestra Disco Disque Project 3: (? 1975) * Hi-Jack Jennifer Lopez's Jenny From The Block these may (?) be cases where the sample actually comes from the 2nd generation track and not the original, and therefore it's not listed even if it's cleared and some royalties are passed down the line... on 12/27/02 12:52 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 27 Dec 2002, The Armchair DJ wrote: and don't forget that in the early days of producing, dre sampled almost the entirety of jj fad's blame it on the musik (off 1988's supersonic lp) from model 500's nite drive thru babylon. brian ***speaking of which, the last time i saw sir mix a lot's baby got back on a new compilation, i checked the credit and there is *still* no mention of the fact that it steals the beat from technicolor. i know atkins knows about this, so why don't these sorts of things get rectified in the credits in the future? not detroit related, but the usage of bob james' take me to the mardi gras (via run dmc's peter Piper) isn't credited on missy's work it. the beatnuts have been mentioning that jennifer lopez' jenny from the block samples them (what it is? i can't remember the exact title), but, though there's 3 sample credits on the single (including using bdp's south bronx), there's no mention of the beatnuts. i think one of the other credits is probably for the song that beat nuts also sampled that they're crying foul about. which would be a lack of originality, but hardly stealing from the 'nuts, and par for the course with the way all of the jlo tracks are produced (using set it off, using i've got five on it, etc, etc). i hope the 'nuts credited the sample they used that jlo also did, otherwise they're just calling attention to themselves and likely to get themselves in trouble. andrew -Original Message- From: Matthew MacQueen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2002 8:21 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Cc: Brendan Nelson Subject: RE: (313) re: Brandy/producers of pop that go the extra mile To be honest I don't have a hell of a lot of respect for Dr Dre. me neither. Except for surgery in 1984 when he was with the World Class Wreckin' Crew He'll prescribe for you, his potent elixir Two turntables, speakers, and a mixer He'll rock your party wherever you be Calling Dr. Dre to surgery LA is the place for you to be To witness Dr Dre in surgery He has a Ph.D in mixology to cut on the wheels so viciously. This cut which was an old WJLB Wizard favorite! ... bringing it back to 313, however tenuously in whatever decade. peace, Matt MacQueen albums out now: Sprung (http://bip-hop.com) More Destructive Than Organized (http://staalplaat.com) Highest Common Denominator (http://pieheadrecords.com) Physical and Mental Health (http://dialrecords.com) 74'02 (split with Hypo) (http://tsunami-addiction.com) check Cognition (http://techno.ca/cognition) for upcoming appearance and release updates __ Get your FREE personalized e-mail at http://www.canada.com
(313) hip hop sampling detroit (was: Brandy/producers of pop that go the extra mile)
On Fri, 27 Dec 2002, The Armchair DJ wrote: and don't forget that in the early days of producing, dre sampled almost the entirety of jj fad's blame it on the musik (off 1988's supersonic lp) from model 500's nite drive thru babylon. brian ***speaking of which, the last time i saw sir mix a lot's baby got back on a new compilation, i checked the credit and there is *still* no mention of the fact that it steals the beat from technicolor. i know atkins knows about this, so why don't these sorts of things get rectified in the credits in the future? not detroit related, but the usage of bob james' take me to the mardi gras (via run dmc's peter Piper) isn't credited on missy's work it. the beatnuts have been mentioning that jennifer lopez' jenny from the block samples them (what it is? i can't remember the exact title), but, though there's 3 sample credits on the single (including using bdp's south bronx), there's no mention of the beatnuts. i think one of the other credits is probably for the song that beat nuts also sampled that they're crying foul about. which would be a lack of originality, but hardly stealing from the 'nuts, and par for the course with the way all of the jlo tracks are produced (using set it off, using i've got five on it, etc, etc). i hope the 'nuts credited the sample they used that jlo also did, otherwise they're just calling attention to themselves and likely to get themselves in trouble. andrew -Original Message- From: Matthew MacQueen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, December 21, 2002 8:21 PM To: 313@hyperreal.org Cc: Brendan Nelson Subject: RE: (313) re: Brandy/producers of pop that go the extra mile To be honest I don't have a hell of a lot of respect for Dr Dre. me neither. Except for surgery in 1984 when he was with the World Class Wreckin' Crew He'll prescribe for you, his potent elixir Two turntables, speakers, and a mixer He'll rock your party wherever you be Calling Dr. Dre to surgery LA is the place for you to be To witness Dr Dre in surgery He has a Ph.D in mixology to cut on the wheels so viciously. This cut which was an old WJLB Wizard favorite! ... bringing it back to 313, however tenuously in whatever decade. peace, Matt MacQueen albums out now: Sprung (http://bip-hop.com) More Destructive Than Organized (http://staalplaat.com) Highest Common Denominator (http://pieheadrecords.com) Physical and Mental Health (http://dialrecords.com) 74'02 (split with Hypo) (http://tsunami-addiction.com) check Cognition (http://techno.ca/cognition) for upcoming appearance and release updates __ Get your FREE personalized e-mail at http://www.canada.com
(313) Hip Hop and Techno
I think it is a 'recurring theme' you can identify. I've been very fortunate to interview many big names in hip-hop and discuss it with people across the spectrum of that scene and it comes up a lot. I realise there is a group also who like hip-hop and listen to different styles. These people you mention are different. I am talking of the purist core. I know producers like Stacey try and share their music by talking to artists from the urban ranks and they come up up against the same kind of resistance. I think he met Jay-Z once. I find the same prejudice in techno, mind. Hip-hop is a big world and it's pretty much pop culture now, but as I have reiterated I am talking of the hardcore purist element at its core - which probably doesn't feel totally comfortable with the 'crossover' phenom anyway. I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world.
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
there isn't much crossover in the birthplace of hip hop in the south bronx/upper manhattan. when i'd go to the police athletics league gym on 118st and manhattan ave. any house, electro or techno cds i put on promptly got thrown off and replaced by hot 97 (bringing you blazin hip hop). i declined to dj at our block party because it was patently obvious that nobody was interested in hearing anything but hip hop (and the electric slide, of course). but block parties are a genre of their own. james I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... Sean.
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Bit late in the day to throw in my 2 cents, but the way I understand it is this: Rave is a term rarely in use these days in the UK, and then it is usually just used as a verb, ie to go raving. Its use as a noun to describe the large-scale semi-legal/illegal outdoor events that occurred in the late 80s/early 90s has largely dropped out of use in England because these events don't really happen anymore (thanks to the Criminal Justice Bill), except as large corporate sponsored events. It was also used to describe the music played at some of these events, a sound that diversified into jungle and happy hardcore. I think many people also used it to describe the more commercial music that was coming out - tunes like Smart Es' Sesam-E Street and Prodigy's Charly (incidentally Mills dropped this in his recent set at The End in London). I think rave is now seen primarily as an embarrassing word that parents and authority figures use to decribe something that the kids get up to. Now that large scale raves are happening in the US, it seems that the word has had something of a renaissance, but only in the US. -Original Message- From: glyph1001 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:45 PM Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) I will have to agree with robin here and I'm from the US. I read this article in an old DJ Magazine that talked about The Summer of Love and there was a part where someone would say (I'm paraphrasing here) you gonna rave? or have you raved yet? which meant taking a hit of e and going to a party and rave like mad. Indeed the Acid House and Rave are one of the same. \ I suggest doing some research at the mag's website. robin pinning wrote: The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) cheers robin... Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(313) Re: [313] Hip-hop Techno
From: Ian Dinsmor: I was working the other night, and in walks Jay Dee, only to ask for Herbert's Bodily Functions LP. Behold, the paths of hip hop and techno cross in ways. as mentioned allready, there was a sample of that album used on the album 'trinity'. the sample was even mentioned on the sleeve. jay dee also used a daft punk sample on 'raise it up' from 'fantastic volume 2'. the story behind this was, that he picked up a white label copy of that album, and figured it was some obscure techno band, so people probably would never find out where the sample came from. daft punk heard 'raise it up', and immediately spotted the sample. jay dee was then asked for a remix of one of their songs. ánd on 'trinity' there's another song that sounds A LOT like it's based on a sample from 'sharivari'. anyone know how those shake hip-hop tracks are received within the hip-hop community? or that album on sublime, or those hipnotech releases? jurren _ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
RE: (313) Re: [313] Hip-hop Techno
More precisely, that sample is from Tracks on the Rocks vol. 2, which was credited to Bangalter alone, not with his Daft Punk partner, Guy Manuel De Homem-Christo. I also heard a rumor that as a result of sampling the tune, Bangalter requested Jay Dee's assistance on a future work, rather than imposing a lawsuit for royalties. Matthew -Original Message- From: jurren baars [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 9:16 AM To: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: (313) Re: [313] Hip-hop Techno jay dee also used a daft punk sample on 'raise it up' from 'fantastic volume 2'. the story behind this was, that he picked up a white label copy of that album, and figured it was some obscure techno band, so people probably would never find out where the sample came from. daft punk heard 'raise it up', and immediately spotted the sample. jay dee was then asked for a remix of one of their songs.
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
On Wed, 13 Nov 2002, James Bucknell wrote: there isn't much crossover in the birthplace of hip hop in the south bronx/upper manhattan. when i'd go to the police athletics league gym on 118st and manhattan ave. any house, electro or techno cds i put on promptly got thrown off and replaced by hot 97 (bringing you blazin hip hop). i declined to dj at our block party because it was patently obvious that nobody was interested in hearing anything but hip hop (and the electric slide, of course). but block parties are a genre of their own. james I don't know if I'd expect cross over there though. The Black east coast, for reasons I don't completely understand, has always looked to hiphop as its dance music of choice. Not house (exception perhaps being the hip-house craze), not techno. Much more diversity in spots like detroit and chicago, largely because they'd created musics of their own that were played alongside of hiphop. peace lks
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Really? I stand corrected. Clearly, I'm not as down with the kids as I thought I was! -Original Message- From: Nicole Slavin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 6:05 PM To: Robert Taylor; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) I think rave is now seen primarily as an embarrassing word that parents and authority figures use to decribe something that the kids get up to. Nope, the kids i teach use it all the time to describe the parties they go to, which play music along the lines of pop/garage/rnb. Now that large scale raves are happening in the US, it seems that the word has had something of a renaissance, but only in the US. when i was in the US seemed to be pretty much used to describe anything with two or more people with a glowstick in tow. But then again, some US 313ers called me a raver for wearing coloured hairclips and bracelets! :) -Original Message- From: glyph1001 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:45 PM Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) I will have to agree with robin here and I'm from the US. I read this article in an old DJ Magazine that talked about The Summer of Love and there was a part where someone would say (I'm paraphrasing here) you gonna rave? or have you raved yet? which meant taking a hit of e and going to a party and rave like mad. Indeed the Acid House and Rave are one of the same. \ I suggest doing some research at the mag's website. robin pinning wrote: The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) cheers robin... Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED] Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
-Original Message- From: Nicole Slavin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Robert Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org 313@hyperreal.org Date: 13 November 2002 18:04 Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) I think rave is now seen primarily as an embarrassing word that parents and authority figures use to decribe something that the kids get up to. Nope, the kids i teach use it all the time to describe the parties they go to, which play music along the lines of pop/garage/rnb. Now that large scale raves are happening in the US, it seems that the word has had something of a renaissance, but only in the US. when i was in the US seemed to be pretty much used to describe anything with two or more people with a glowstick in tow. But then again, some US 313ers called me a raver for wearing coloured hairclips and bracelets! :) -Original Message- From: glyph1001 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:45 PM Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) I will have to agree with robin here and I'm from the US. I read this article in an old DJ Magazine that talked about The Summer of Love and there was a part where someone would say (I'm paraphrasing here) you gonna rave? or have you raved yet? which meant taking a hit of e and going to a party and rave like mad. Indeed the Acid House and Rave are one of the same. \ I suggest doing some research at the mag's website. robin pinning wrote: The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) cheers robin... Any views or opinions are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Channel Four Television Corporation unless specifically stated. This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If you have received this email in error, please notify [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Myself and the large majority of my close friends that are into techno were originally goose jacket, Public Enemy patch, Levi 501, kangol and fat laced addidas wearing hip hop heads in our early teens, though I dont listen to that much these days I still dust off the old BDP, PE, Stetsasonic albums from time to time. I think a lot of Hip Hop heads in the UK got into the whole rave scene over here in the late eighties/early nineties as being into hip hop got socially quite boring. Apart from the odd concert, unless you lived in London there wasn't much to do other than hang around amusement arcades and get into trouble. The whole rave/house scene was a lot more inviting and a lot of people discovered techno through that. Dont know about the young hip hop heads these days, but I mean we were listening to Cybertron before we had even heard of Chuck D, so it wasn't really that much of a leap. Though I do remember seeing Public Enemy live around the time of Nation of Millions and hearing Chuck D pan acid house as total crap. Stewart - Original Message - From: Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Cyclone Wehner [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 313 Detroit 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 1:48 PM Subject: RE: (313) 8-Mile You forget that most hip-hop headz hate techno, What are you basing that comment on? I'm not having a pop at you, its just that I've never found that to be the case at all! Sean. ___ Freeserve AnyTime, only £13.99 per month with one month's FREE trial! For more information visit http://www.freeserve.com/time/ or call free on 0800 970 8890
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
11/12/2002 9:01:23 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think a lot of Hip Hop heads in the UK got into the whole rave scene over here in the late eighties/early nineties as being into hip hop got socially quite boring. Over here? The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. --- -Ian Entropy (bhpc, happy vibe rec, new sample revolution, n.e. hardcore, boston) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.djentropy.com Soulseek: djentropy AIM: DJEntropy WinMX: djentropy422
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
hi entropy, 11/12/2002 9:01:23 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think a lot of Hip Hop heads in the UK got into the whole rave scene over here in the late eighties/early nineties as being into hip hop got socially quite boring. Over here? stewart's from here (UK)... The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... and yeah i was into hip-hop before properly getting into techno/house in a big way robin...
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
11/12/2002 9:12:49 AM, robin pinning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hi entropy, ello. :) The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. --- -Ian Entropy (bhpc, happy vibe rec, new sample revolution, n.e. hardcore, boston) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.djentropy.com Soulseek: djentropy AIM: DJEntropy WinMX: djentropy422
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) cheers robin...
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. Erm i am not interested in hardcore but Shut up and dance releasing records in 1987? kj -- DISCLAIMER De gemeente Almelo aanvaardt voor haar medewerkers geen enkele aansprakelijkheid voor eventueel onjuist, onrechtmatig of ontoelaatbaar geacht gebruik van e-mail (inclusief bijlagen). Dit e-mail bericht is door de gemeente Almelo gecontroleerd op de aanwezigheid van eventuele virussen. Wij kunnen echter geen garantie afgeven dat al onze e-mail berichten volledig virus vrij zijn. Het is daarom verstandig uw binnenkomende e-mail berichten zelf op de mogelijke aanwezigheid van virussen te controleren. --
Re: RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
11/12/2002 9:32:49 AM, Jongsma, K.J. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. Erm i am not interested in hardcore but Shut up and dance releasing records in 1987? Yeah, I have SUAD1 and its from 87 or 88. --- -Ian Entropy (bhpc, happy vibe rec, new sample revolution, n.e. hardcore, boston) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.djentropy.com Soulseek: djentropy AIM: DJEntropy WinMX: djentropy422
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
11/12/2002 9:31:55 AM, robin pinning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), I don't disagree that it may have been a form of proto-rave, but I don't feel it is anywhere at all in the same boat as what we call Rave nowadays, especially in this country. The Acid House Scene to me is more of a neo-hippie, political stance against club culture, that was for anyone; Rave is more of an underground, elitist, apathetic-about-politics (until recently anyway), scene that is very cultural and tight, as oppossed to a free love kinda hippie-ish thing in the Acid House Scene. this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - 1987 was We Are IE, which is generally considered to be the first Hardcore tune. Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) I have SUAD1 and its 87 or 88. And We Are IE was on plate in 87, it didnt get pressed until 89, but was being played before that. --- -Ian Entropy (bhpc, happy vibe rec, new sample revolution, n.e. hardcore, boston) [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.djentropy.com Soulseek: djentropy AIM: DJEntropy WinMX: djentropy422
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), I don't disagree that it may have been a form of proto-rave, but I don't feel it is anywhere at all in the same boat as what we call Rave nowadays, especially in this country. The Acid House Scene to me is more of a neo-hippie, political stance against club culture, that was for anyone; Rave is more of an underground, elitist, apathetic-about-politics (until recently anyway), scene that is very cultural and tight, as oppossed to a free love kinda hippie-ish thing in the Acid House Scene. aha, we differ in what we call Raveuk vs. us culture. fair enough... 1987 was We Are IE, which is generally considered to be the first Hardcore tune. i find that date hard to believei remember the tune coming out and being hammered on the sheffield (uk) pirate stations at the timei was in sheff from 89- you could be right tho SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) I have SUAD1 and its 87 or 88. And We Are IE was on plate in 87, it didnt get pressed until 89, but was being played before that. http://www.shutupanddance.co.uk cheers robin...
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
I will have to agree with robin here and I'm from the US. I read this article in an old DJ Magazine that talked about The Summer of Love and there was a part where someone would say (I'm paraphrasing here) you gonna rave? or have you raved yet? which meant taking a hit of e and going to a party and rave like mad. Indeed the Acid House and Rave are one of the same. \ I suggest doing some research at the mag's website. robin pinning wrote: The rave scene started over there, as their answer to our Hip-Hop scene. don't think that is truethe rave scene developed out of the northern soul scene (from what i've read)...original rave music was acid house (the other key ingredient to raves was the rapid take up of ecstacy at the same time) I don't agree that the Acid House Scene was the Rave Scene. I think it was definetly proto-rave, but I don't feel RAVE happened until after the Acid House Raids in 1989, and 1/2 the promoters went underground into the warehouses. That is when the culture grew, and it wasn't just a random occurence of club-rebellion. hmmm we'll agree to disagree... :) rave was defo happening around 88's summer of love (see the national newspaper headlines!!), this was quite a bit before hardcore happened which was 89/90 - Hence all the dancehall and street influences in the original Rave Music: Hardcore. that came later... nah, Hardcore started in 1987, with Lennie de Ice's We Are I.E., and the early SUAD releases. SUAD started in 1989 (i have a few of their releases, froma round the time) and i'm failry sure we are ie came out in 89 too (what a tune btw) cheers robin...
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
- Original Message - From: robin pinning [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:01 PM Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) aha, we differ in what we call Raveuk vs. us culture. fair enough... Yeah. Pump Up the Volume 3 covers this all pretty well I think. Time to fire it back up? :) Re: Cyclone and Stewart's comments about hip hop as an entry point, I think it's safe to say that techno has a number of different 'gateway' styles, from hip hop to industrial to trance or whatever you may be exposed to that gets you into the beat, since most people don't hear techno right outta pop music. While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. The hip hop scene is just so much bigger than the electronic music scene (at least in the states, which is kind of what this discussion was about) that if a few people 'convert' to techno it doesn't mean much about the mass attitude towards techno in the hip hop scene. Also, I think you'll find more people who are into techno that like hip hop than vice versa. You could probably even say that more white hip hop fans come to techno than other ethnicities. Whatever, my point was that hip hop culture *can* be pretty exclusive, and it's just as inane there as here... Tristan = Text/Mixes: http://phonopsia.tripod.com Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Mix in mp3, 'Live in Iowa City' available for a short time from http://phonopsia.isoprax.com
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... Sean.
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
i like hiphop :) check the last jazzy jeff album personally prefered above the last slum village album i know several hiphop heads, and many of them are pretty into the breaky side of techno - shake, carl craig, etc. At 12-11-2002 + 16:22, you wrote: While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... Sean.
(313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Well I have been covering hip-hop in the media for most of the 90s 'til now and I would disagree! I know what hip-hop headz (I mean headz) can be like! Your purist underground hip-hop head usually does have an adversion to techno. As far as 'electronica' they may - may- accept drum 'n' bass. Of course hip-hop pioneers were originally very open to all styles, but, as with any style, over time it produces 'purists'. The same purists probably decry RB samples and think P Diddy/Puff Daddy is the enemy. They have a musical 'ideal' and anything that veers away from that is somehow invalid. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... Sean.
RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
Count me in on that category. I can't really stand puffy and his camp (G-Dep and Craig Mack being the lone exceptions... sometimes). I'd rather listen to 7L and Esoteric, Cannibal Ox, Souls of Mischief, or Rasco than Nore, Cam'ron, Eve, etc... But I still love techno. -Original Message- From: Cyclone Wehner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 12:05 PM To: 313 Detroit Subject: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) Well I have been covering hip-hop in the media for most of the 90s 'til now and I would disagree! I know what hip-hop headz (I mean headz) can be like! Your purist underground hip-hop head usually does have an adversion to techno. As far as 'electronica' they may - may- accept drum 'n' bass. Of course hip-hop pioneers were originally very open to all styles, but, as with any style, over time it produces 'purists'. The same purists probably decry RB samples and think P Diddy/Puff Daddy is the enemy. They have a musical 'ideal' and anything that veers away from that is somehow invalid. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... Sean.
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
- Original Message - From: Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world. Tristan = Text/Mixes: http://phonopsia.tripod.com Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Mix in mp3, 'Live in Iowa City' available for a short time from http://phonopsia.isoprax.com
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
two words: ninja tunes On 11/12/02 12:33 PM, Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Original Message - From: Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world. Tristan = Text/Mixes: http://phonopsia.tripod.com Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Mix in mp3, 'Live in Iowa City' available for a short time from http://phonopsia.isoprax.com
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
also finkstroung r somewhere between hip hop and techno - Original Message - From: jonathan morse [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 8:35 PM Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) two words: ninja tunes On 11/12/02 12:33 PM, Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Original Message - From: Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world. Tristan = Text/Mixes: http://phonopsia.tripod.com Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Mix in mp3, 'Live in Iowa City' available for a short time from http://phonopsia.isoprax.com
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
prefuse 73 is - Original Message - From: jonathan morse [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 1:35 PM Subject: Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) two words: ninja tunes On 11/12/02 12:33 PM, Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: - Original Message - From: Sean Creen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Tristan Watkins [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; DJ Entropy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: 313@hyperreal.org Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: RE: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile) While I can see that many techno converts have come from a hip hop background, I'd be inclined to side with Cyclone that especially today, it's not terribly in-favor in the hip hop world. Even in the past this is true. I know plenty of current hip hop fans who are also massively into techno. Its certainly not true to say that hating techno is an ingrained part of the culture, as was suggested in the original post. Also, we need to be clear here on whether were talking about B-boys or Puff Daddy fans... I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world. Tristan = Text/Mixes: http://phonopsia.tripod.com Music: http://www.mp313.com Contact: [EMAIL PROTECTED] New Mix in mp3, 'Live in Iowa City' available for a short time from http://phonopsia.isoprax.com
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno (was 8-Mile)
also finkstroung r somewhere between hip hop and techno ooh, while were talking of fusions of hip hop and electronic music, may I recommend the new machine drum album urban biology and the new morris nightingale vs. kristuit salu album my mines i. Both on the miami label merck ( http://www.m3rck.net/ ). Machine drum is playing live at the warp x-mas pool party at aquarium on 20/12 in london too. Smallfish have stocks of the new album I think. IMHO much more soulful than prefuse and funkstorung. also the new prefuse 73 / mos def 12 is rather good. . [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: (313) Hip Hop and Techno
Slum Village are taking it somewhere, same with The Roots, and even Black Eyed Peas, and all have taken inspiration from electronic music, in the latter two cases drum 'n' bass, but I think that a lot of underground hip-hop is caught up in a romantic past. Take for example People Under The Stairs. Ugly Duckling. It's cool, conscious, fun, but is it really innovative? They're not open to fresh influences. There's actually more innovation in the more commercial sphere, production-wise, with the likes of Timbaland and The Neptunes. I don't think Puff is defining commercial hip-hop at the moment, and hasn't for a couple of years at least. I think he's plateaued and been superseded by Irv Gotti, etc. The hip-hop underground is probably bigger than it ever was, it exists separately from commercial hip-hop. Those bands do better as live touring acts. You have to remember that Eminem was very much part of the underground pre-Dre. Of course the headz will always say Infinite was his best work! :) I don't know. I've always seen the world of underground hip hop as being pretty receptive to incorporating or listening to other styles, but what percentage of the hip hop world is listenening to or participating in underground hip hop? I don't mean De La Soul, but the band that presses 1000 copies of their own record. If this was the culture Eminem came from, it's not the culture he helps define today. So yeah, I'm seeing mainstrem hip hop (which doesn't need to be defined by Puff Daddy) this way, but it's just a generalization. I know many exceptions, but I think the rule holds true. Hip hop is a big world.
