[RCSE] Re: annual 2 meter diatribe
I'll do one better. I like 2M woodies. Or 2M nostalgia woodies. --Bill -- Bill Harris Bill Harris's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?action=getinfo&userid=1113 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=334330 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: First sailplane.
And my first sailplane was a Zaic Thermic 100. Bananna fuse, wavy wings, untrimmable, but fun to fly. I'm scratch building another, plan to r/c it. --Bill -- Bill Harris Bill Harris's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?action=getinfo&userid=1113 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=304468 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] ASK-18
Brett-- Go to Google (or the search engine of choice) and search for "alexander schleicher" (_with_ quotes, it narrows the field down a bit). There are many hits on that entry. Check with Bob Banka (Scale Model Research) at http://www.bobsairdoc.com/ . I think he has 3-views of the ASK18. --Bill Harris --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Does anyone have a 3-view or 2-view of an ASK-18 they could email me? Not > looking for anything perfect here...just something to get a good idea of > the profile and proportions. > > Thanks, > > Brett > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] AMA RULE CHANGE SUGGESTED ABOUT SKEGS
Do the GordySaur approach: "I don't follow the rules. If you don't like it, file a protest..." --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hi Guys, > This proposal shows how a well meant belief can determine how we do our > hobby. The author, a respected, knowledgeable modeler, mostly... RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] Paragon gasbag love
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Bill Swingle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > This causes me to ask; what do you think thermals the sweetest? > Within my limited gaggle of sailplanes, I'll have to say my Oly 99. Big undercambered wings, big tail/tail moment, it's a great nostalgic ride. --Bill Harris LSF#7652 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] RE: Model Aviation Soaring Column
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Mike Garton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > The abundance of CL in Model Aviation can be explained. > Content editor, Bob Hunt, is a hardcore CL guy. > The unbalanced space allotments bother me. > I have exchanged emails with Bob and he honestly > believes that CL is at least as popular as soaring. > From the NATS issue, you would guess that CL is > 5 times more popular than soaring. > > In August Bob Hunt sent a letter to the columnists > stating that column space and frequency were being > changed... This _is_ somewhat distressing. But from my perspective, AMA has gotten into an "arbitrary and capricious mode" that does not seem to represent me or anyone I fly with. I'm continue my AMA membership simply because it is a prerequisite to membership in local clubs and it does generally represent model aviation. The organization that supports my interest is LSF and I'll continue to support it. I'd suggest that folks write Bob Hunt about the unbalanced content, but I suspect that would be an exercise in futility. --Bill Harris LSF#7652 AMA 607983 and embarrassed. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] When a dollar was a dollar.
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], George Voss <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I'm afraid I'll have to disagree. While the molded planes are nice, (I have several) planes like the Addiction, Super V and other 'bagged' planes are just as competitive. If you take the time and energy, you can make a built-up strong > enough to handle a good launch, then it can/will be just as competitive as a molded plane. > > The point is, you don't NEED a molded plane to be competitive. You do need something will launch hard. That can be a built up or bagged plane. The built up can be strengthened with some carbon fiber and good building technique. You may > not be able to launch as high as a stronger plane, but with the tasks we currently use, you can still make your time on a consistent basis. > Exactly, George. The technology is here and we ought to embrace it if we want to. Key is "if we want to", and not "HAVE to". IMO. Moldies and baggies are very strong and competitive designs, but as I suggested, one can trade dollars for time and skill and buy an "ARF" that goes from box to winch in a day. But, as Mark Drela with his Allegro designs and Tony Estep with his Darkstar have demonstrated, a very strong and "zoomable" built-up can be designed and built at home that can be competitive with composite wings. Admittedly, these planes _may_ give up a bit of landing points being the RES body plan, but this built-up wing design can be adapted to full house design. Good points made. I have to run off for a while, but I'll be back later and pick up where we left off. --Bill Harris LSF#7652 <--yeah, Level I '73 R60/5 Toaster RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] When a dollar was a dollar.
--- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Jason Werner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Bill, > I have to disagree to some extent. Yes, models are WAY expensive. Yet > it is the nature of competition that drove it there. > > In all competition that requires equipment (and really in all > competitions), the first 90% of the "winner's" percentage comes easy. For > example, take landings. Most people with practice can hit 90s all the time > on their landings. > The next 5% takes time and dedication. But it is not a linear function. > To gain that next 5% of performance, it may take double the time it took you > to get the first 90%. Keep working that up to the 100% range any you get an > exponential component that many can never achieve. Jason-- I'll agree with you in principle but disagree with aspects of the competitive process. True, a kilobuck vacu-formed aeroplane can give you that last points advantage, but it still renders down to spending to buy points. Admittedly if one wants to be anal-competitive that is a good situation. Not everyone is, and for us luddites, there are RES and Nost contests. You made some good points. --Bill Harris LSF#7652 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] Channel Ethics question
Without a frequency board, you double-check and double-verify your channel before turning on the TX. BTW, "remotes" are used with TVs and VCRs. A transmitter is used in RC aviation. :) --Bill --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], "Stylin Steve" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I went back to my car after flying and walked back with my plane when > someone told me I should announce my channel. This guy came after me > while I was flying. > I showed him my giant numbers using the standard attachment on the > antenna but it seems people insist on hearing it vocally? > >I pointed out he had no numbers on his remote... > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] Torrey Pines issue
I may have missed this before, but: >Staff informs me that the suspension was caused >when the insurance carrier for the Academy of Model Aeronautics (AMA) >notified the City that it had suspended coverage for the group. My take on this is that the suspension of flight privleges was caused because AMA's insurance carrier suspended coverage and not a faul of Mr. Jebb. Why did AMA's insurance carrier suspend coverage? --Bill Harris LSF#7652 --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Jack Strother <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Fellas, > a couple of days ago I had asked you all to send a note to the city of San > > >Date: Mon, 23 Sep 2002 17:13:41 -0700 > >From: "Scott Peters Public" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Subject: Re: An LSF letter of Communication > >X-WSS-ID: 11916F951015689-01-01 > > > >Dear Jack: > > > >Thank you for your e-mail regarding the Torrey Pines Gliderport. > > > >I share your concern about the suspension of radio controlled flight > >operations and support resumption of RC operations as soon as possible. I > >want to explain what led to the suspension and tell you of efforts that > >are underway to get RC flyers back in the air. > > > >When I first found out about this, I went straight to the Real Estate > >Assets Department, which oversees the lease on the Torrey Pines > >Gliderport. They have assured me that the suspension of radio control air > >operations is temporary and that they are working with the lessee to > >resolve the situation. Staff informs me that the suspension was caused > >when the insurance carrier for the Academy of Model Aeronautics (AMA) > >notified the City that it had suspended coverage for the group. Proper > >insurance coverage is a condition of operation at the Gliderport for each > >of the user groups. > > > >On the positive side, The Real Estate Assets department, AMA, and David > >Jebb, the Torrey Pines Gliderport flight director, are working diligently > >with each other and the insurance carrier to reinstate coverage. At that > >time, radio control operations can resume. I am confident they will be > >successful. > > > >Michelle Blumen of my staff is closely monitoring the progress of the > >negotiations. You may contact her directly at > ><mailto:Mblumen@S...>[EMAIL PROTECTED] In the Real Estate > >Assets Department, Tim Rothans is overseeing the negotiations between the > >user groups and their insurance carriers. He can be reached at > ><mailto:Trothans@S...>[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >Thank you for your patience. > > > >Scott Peters RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off.
Re: [RCSE] Moldie-oldie?
LOL! No, "moldie-oldie" as in mildew-ey. You're thinking about "oldie-moldies"... Have a great Holiday! --Bill >From: Lex Mierop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: 'Bill Harris' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Moldie-oldie? >Date: Wed, 5 Dec 2001 06:52:59 -0800 > >Wouldn't that be built-up-oldie trivia? :-) > >I think the only plane that would qualify as moldie-oldie trivia would be >the Hobbie Hawk. Any others? > > -l > >-Original Message- >From: Bill Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2001 5:43 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Predator configuration, Oly II airfoil > > >The Olympic 99 uses a modified NACA 6409 with the trailing edge >stock placed flat on the building board which gives a slight reflex to the >true 6409. Lee Renaud derived the Oly 99 wing from the with the Thermic >100 > >wing. > >A bit of moldie-oldie trivia... > >--Bill > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Predator configuration, Oly II airfoil
The Olympic 99 uses a modified NACA 6409 with the trailing edge stock placed flat on the building board which gives a slight reflex to the true 6409. Lee Renaud derived the Oly 99 wing from the with the Thermic 100 wing. A bit of moldie-oldie trivia... --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Predator configuration, Oly II airfoil >Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 05:02:23 -0600 > >At 09:13 PM 12/4/2001 -0800, you wrote: > >Didn't the Oly II have an E-205 airfoil as did most of the earlier > >Airtronics sailplanes and gliders? Larry Jolly should know the answer to > >this puzzle. > > Jerry Miller > >No. I am not sure but I think the original Olympic used an undercambered >airfoil. The Oly II used a true flatbottomed airfoil similar to the >Drifter and Sailaire. The Aquilia used a modified E387 while the Sagitta >used a modified E205. The undercamber was removed from both while the >leading edge radius of the E205 was increased. I compared the modified >E205 and E387 airfoils to the true airfoils about 20 years ago when I was >first started developing my airfoil plotting program. Not sure exactly why >the modifications but I remember Lee mentioning that he liked to increase >the leading edge radius to improve the stall characteristics. I also know >he sometimes modified a design so that the components would fit into >existing kit boxes rather than to stock two different boxes. > >A side note on airfoils. Back in 1978, I designed a trainer for a fellow >club member who was interested in switching to sailplanes but was short on >cash. I used a shortened fuselage from my unsuccessful 1976 F3B model and >needed a quick airfoil. (This was 5 years before I wrote my first airfoil >plot program.) I was impressed by the nice handling characteristics of the >Sailaire so elected to use a similiar airfoil. I didn't have coordinates >for the Sailaire airfoil so I measured the leading edge radius, maximum >thickness, location of the maximum thickness, and trailing edge angle. I >scaled the measurements down to a 10 inch chord and connected the top >points with a No. 64 french curve. The reason for using that particular >french curve was that I knew from previous models that the shape of that >particular curve was very close to the E387 top surface aft of the maximum >thickness when plotted to a 10 inch chord length. The resulting model was >named for the star, Spica, and the typical sailplane landing. The Spica >was my most successful sailplane design and I sold about two dozen >semi-kits over the next few years. > >I always refered to the airfoil used on the Spica as a Generic California >Flatbottom airfoil because of it's similiarity to a lot of the airfoils >used in sailplane kits of that era. When Michael Selig began his original >Prinston wind tunnel tests of model airfoils, I suggested that he include a >typical flatbottom airfoil as a baseline airfoil for comparison. He >thought this was a good idea and ask me to build a wind tunnel model of my >airfoil. The name was too long so the name was changed to the model which >used the airfoil. That's the way the Spica airfoil came to be in Michael's >first group of airfoils published in SoarTech 8. > >Now for the rest of the story. A few years later, I was surprised to read >in a Hobby Lobby ad that one of the models they were imported used a >computer designed airfol called the Spica. After a little investigation, >Jim Martin confirmed that the German manufacturer had obtained the airfoil >from SoarTech 8. So, for all you Xfoil users, that's the way we did it in >the good old days. > >Chuck Anderson _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Wanted: vintage scale plan sources
Bob Holman carries vintage scale glider plans. http://www.angelfire.com/ct/bhplans/ or [EMAIL PROTECTED] or (909)885-3959. --Bill >From: "Andy Page" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Wanted: vintage scale plan sources >Date: Tue, 04 Dec 2001 17:09:31 -0800 > >Wanted: vintage scale plan sources. > >DFS Reiher, Rhonesperber, Minimoa are representative of >the types that interest me... > >Around 3 to 3.5 meters, reasonable wing loading, hi-startable? > >I've seen the S&E Modeller list, but I'm wondering if >more are available. Also, the S&E site says they will offer >updated plans (CAD, modern airfoils), but the estimated date >for these are "later in 2000", so it appears that this might >not be happening. > >Of course, a kit of one of these would be nice too. > > > >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Rubber ducky antenna's illegal in competition
Not to fan the Great Duckie Debate, but I agree with Jason. If a short or baseloaded antenna is type-certified by the manufacturer for that Tx, then it's useable. If not, then don't. Likewise, you _can_ get by with changing the Tx xtal to change channels or you can drive without wearing a seatbelt but that doesn't meant that it's good practice or it's prudent. --Bill >From: "Jason Werner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "RCSE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Rubber ducky antenna's illegal in competition >Date: Sun, 2 Dec 2001 17:46:24 -0500 > >David, > Not to blast you, but this has been discussed extensively in the past. >The simple answer is this: > > The AMA requires that their members abide by the FCC and all >local/national laws. The FCC type certifies the units and the modules to >work. There are lists of certified combinations of transmitters, contact >the FCC to get one. The transmitters are normally certified with their >installed antenna, and can only be operated "legally" with that, BUT in >some >cases the manufacturer (or 2nd party) has made more than one antenna >available and certified it. JR is a great example with their base loaded >whip antenna as they spent the money to certify most of their Txs with it. > So the answer is that most rubber ducky's and whips are not legal, but >in some cases they are. As the user of the transmitter, it is your >responsibility to know if your combination is legal or not, and abide b >that. Your local FCC office can provide you with the certification papers. > > On the AMA and legal side. The AMA is not going to hunt you down. It >is not their responsibility. BUT if you do cause injury/harm and a lawsuit >results, there is a small, very small chance that since you were using >illegal equipment (again technically), they you can be found at fault for >that accident. > > On the practical side, if it works you should be ok. The likelyhood >of >getting caught or fined (the normal FCC sanction) is small. Accidents are >rare also. > >Jason Werner > >- Original Message - >From: "David Goebel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "RCSE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2001 3:19 PM >Subject: [RCSE] Rubber ducky antenna's illegal in competition > > > > So are the Rubber Ducky (and all non factory antenna's) > > illegal in AMA competitions? If they're not certified > > by the FCC that is? > > Can I only use one for personal fun flying, or might that > > cause our AMA insured flying area too? > > -- > > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > Sorry to ask, but need to know, > > David Goebel > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Thaksgiving
LOL! I though that was Les Nessman who thought that... --Bill >From: Brett Jaffee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: Karlton Spindle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: Soaring List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Scale Soaring ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Thaksgiving >Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:40:31 -0800 > > > >Karlton Spindle wrote: > > > Turkeys do they soar in left hand circles or right hand circles? > >"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." > >-Mr. Carlson > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] auto paints
I recall reading about problems with Krylon, and Lustrecote is _muy_ expensive. I have the necessary hardware (compressor and paint guns), and it wouldn't be big deal to buy the software in quart or gallon quantities. It's a new building technique to add to my quiver... --Bill >From: Bill Johns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] auto paints >Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:57:36 -0800 > >At 02:43 PM 11/21/2001 -0600, Bill Harris wrote: >>I recall discussions here-- or somewhere-- about using automobile paint >>for painting sailplanes. > >Why??? > >Just Curious. > >Bill > >-- >Being happy doesn't mean everything's perfect, it just means you've decided >to see beyond the imperfections. > > >Bill Johns >Pullman, WA _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] auto paints
I recall discussions here-- or somewhere-- about using automobile paint for painting sailplanes. I'm trying to get away from the "rattle cans" of spray paint such as Krylon and Lustercote and towards using an airbrush/touch-up gun for painting my models. I'm also wanting to get away from the smallish cans of "hobby-poxy" and into a commercially available product, such as an auto finish. The use will be on 'glassed balsa and fiberglas fuses, and probably bagging mylars. But for the life of me I can't find those discussions in the RCSE archives (about a gazillion entries under "paint"). Could you jog my memory as to the type of auto paint I should get? Thanks, --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: Built-up Balsa slope kits?
Good point, Lincoln. It depends on how nice your slopes (and especially your landing zones) are. I've seen some slopes in pastures that look like gold fairways; my usual slopes are rocky, brushy and brambly, and landings can be thought of as "arrival events". To this end, Zagis and wings are "less destructable" than a fuselage'd plane. My usual sloper is a Zagi THL, weighing in a 12 oz, with a 5/32 CF spar to give spanwise rigidity for those signature cartwheel landings . Works well in 5-10mph lift, and can be ballasted for higher winds. --Bill >From: Lincoln Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Re: Built-up Balsa slope kits? >Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2001 14:05:30 -0500 > >While you are building your other airplane, you might want to get a Zagi >or Boomerang or something to learn how to deal with the slope without >destroying your plane. These foamy wings just bounce where another plane >would smash, and they can handle a fair amount of wind, particularly if >you tape on some lead roof flashing. > >If a plane is heavy enough, it doesn't have to be big to handle a lot of >wind. I flew my Tercel (a simple, small, wood polyhedral glider) in 20 >mph or more with lots of extra ballast and it was a blast. Little planes >don't break as easily and they are easier to land on the slope. I can't >recommend an aileron plane because I haven't had a suitable one. THe >only plane with ailerons, other than the Zagi, that I've flown on the >slope is a Mariah, and the roll rate was slow. That's another issue you >can expect with 2 meter and larger planes on the slope. > >If you have good landing areas and have learned to fly slope well, you >can have a lot of fun with the thermal planes you have on hand already, >at least when the wind is moderate. I've enjoyed flying an Olympic Two >and a couple of different hlg on the slope when the wind was reasonably >light. The Olympic would stay up when nothing else would. The only >problem is that on the slope you are much more prone to damage your >plane. > >Jeff wrote: > > > > Hi all. I'm in need of a slope plane and have never owned one before. >snip I was wondering > > if anyone could recommend a good balsa slope kit. I can put together >about > > anything and my only criteria is that it have ailerons, and I'd like it >to > > be reasonably sized (maybe around 2 meters or larger). Part of the >reason > > for the size is that around here, slope lift is pretty strong so it >needs to > > have some weight to it. >snip > >-- >Lincoln Ross _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] FLIGHT 587 and R/C MODELS
Evidence is pointing to catastrophic failure of composite (CF) components in the fin. Photos of the 587 stab are at: http://www.ntsb.gov/Events/2001/AA587/tailcomp.htm Good, non-talking_head coverage of the mishap is at: http://aviationnow.com/ And cutaway drawings of the affected parts are at: http://home.earthlink.net/~pjburke1/IMAGES/a300vertical.jpg --Bill >From: Paul & Rickie Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] FLIGHT 587 and R/C MODELS >Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2001 18:38:52 +0900 > >As will be remembered last year Gary Levitz lost his life in the >spectacular breakup and crash--with the props still turning--of Miss Ashley >II !! With our R/C gliders we know how deadly flutter can be to a model. >It is understandable how flutter likely took apart the elevator and the >subsequent porposing caused the wings to fold. > >Now we have major failure of components in a jet airliner, Flight 587, >leading to the tragic crash and loss of life. Turbulence! Fractured fin, >subsequent rudder flutter--the rudder separates from the fin--all resulting >in major component failure!!?? Has any one else had such a thought!? > >Paul Clark, SKY PILOT ONE, Osaka, Japan(AMA # 53 777 1) >http://www.kcat.zaq.ne.jp/skypilot/ >SKY PILOT'S HANGAR--RCHLG AFICIONADO > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Harley's comment on RDS
OK... moldies are noisier than composite planes, and an RES plane can be quieter than a full-house plane since it does not have linkage, gaps and ailerons to flutter. Ergo, an RES "should stay up longer, cover more ground from whatever height, launch higher, go faster, etc"? Numbers, not dogma... :) --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Harley's comment on RDS >Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2001 00:03:30 EST > > > I have no idea if that is a significant value, but it seems minor > > > compared to the other sources of drag. Again, IMO. > > > > > > I'm from Missouri... :) > >Wow! Lets see, Rads makes the plane quieter. Quieter means less drag and >that means higher efficiency. That means you stay up longer, cover more >ground from whatever height, launch higher, go faster, etc. > Just goes to show ya, you can lead a mule to waterDennis in New >Hampshire where Rads means I don't tear off horns on the branches. >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] RDS drag reduction, speed increase.
Give us empirical data to show that RDS gives % reduction in drag, and this x-% reduction in drag correlates to a y-% increase in "performance"-- speed, sink rate, whatever. I have "nothing against" the RDS system, and it seems to be a wonderful idea, but these discussions take on the flavor of religious dogma with little empirical data to demonstrate claims. Let me see a before-and-after set of numbers to evaluate. --Bill >From: "Harley Michaelis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bob Pope" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Bill Harris" ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] RDS drag reduction, speed increase. >Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2001 16:52:20 -0800 > >Just thinking, if 5% reduced drag could increase speed that much, a 16 >second run would be reduced to 15.2 seconds. If drag is reduced 12% as Bob >says, it would be reduced to 14.08 seconds. Wouldn't it be worthwhile to >find out? > > >- Original Message - >From: "Bob Pope" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Friday, November 16, 2001 3:09 PM >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Re: RDS in tails, drag reduction. > > > > Bill Harris wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > The refenced site is unavailable now, but I seem to recall that the > > > drag of the four linkages works out to be some 5% of the total drag. > > > I have no idea if that is a significant value, but it seems minor > > > compared to the other sources of drag. Again, IMO. > > > > > > I'm from Missouri... :) > > > > > > --Bill > > > > > > Closer to 12% and yes it is noticeable. > > > > Bob > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Bagging 101
I got the pump surplus about 20 years ago. The pump body is mounted on a steel plate and a 1/2hp electric motor drives the pump via a flex coupling. Your best bet would be to go to an air conditioning supply house and get one of the pumps they use to evacuate A/C systems. Those pumps are designed to pull a good vacuum and run all day and they would cost _much_ less than a pump from a laboratory supply company. --Bill >From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Bagging 101 >Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 16:03:00 -0500 > >Bill Harris wrote: > > > > My vacuum pump is a nice Gast carbon vane unit that'll pull 28" all day. > > I'll need to regulate that vacuum down so I don't end up with very, very > > thin wings. ;) > >Mind telling me the model number, and where you got it? > >I'm in the market for a new pump. > >Thanks. > >-- >Andrew E. Mileski >Ottawa, Canada _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Cumberland 2001
PIctures, pictures, we gotta have pics of the new plane. Update thy WebSite! --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Cumberland 2001 >Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 17:28:43 EST > >In a message dated 10/28/2001 10:03:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, >[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > ><< There were two highlights for the flying. First was getting on the >sticks > of Denny Maize's new sloper, the Hammerhead. It is so named based on the > appearance of the forward-swept wing. It's a great flyer. It's light > enough to go when most 60" slopers can't, but it can also handle lots of > ballast for rippin' acro. It's a great all around flyer; thermaling, >acro, > very fast. etc. Sounds like it will be VERY affordable, too. >> > >Hey Rudy > > I'm still trying to get your finger impressions out of the sticks:-) > >Denny Maize >Polecat Aeroworks >(717) 789-0146 >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://www.polecataero.com";>http://www.polecataero.com >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] F**K
Here are some folks to complain to if you found this post offensive: IP block admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ISP admin: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --Bill >From: Terry Keen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] FUCK >Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 00:25:41 +0-100 >Received: from [63.140.43.61] by hotmail.com (3.2) with ESMTP id >MHotMailBDA5DF220024400437603F8C2B3D0DB80; Sun, 28 Oct 2001 15:26:41 -0800 >Received: from flyby.airage.com ([192.168.1.62]) by List.airage.com > (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 35-56975U100L100S0V35) >with ESMTP id com for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Sun, 28 Oct 2001 >18:29:01 -0500 >Received: from mail.mstay.com ([209.239.224.131]) by flyby.airage.com >(Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 35-56975U100L100S0V35) >with SMTP id com for <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Sun, 28 Oct 2001 >18:27:59 -0500 >From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sun, 28 Oct 2001 15:27:49 -0800 >Message-id: ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >___ >This email was sent using a free, fully functional, promotional version >of JustMail. Get your free copy at: http://www.mstay.com/justmail.html > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Bagging 101
I've got my UpLink wing cores and I'm getting ready learn vacuum bagging. I have some extra "expendable" cores to practice on first. In addition to the several online bagging resources, I recall that someone had a videotape on bagging available. I can't find it now, does anyone know where/if it is available? Getting all the supplies up... pump, epoxy, bags, etc, etc. I note that CST offers vacuum bagging supply kits, such as the V1113 on page http://www.cstsales.com/vacuum-bagging-systems.htm . This kit seems to be complete and price-competitive, but what do I know starting out. Feedback on the supplies kit? Take care, --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Product licensing nightmare (long, but important)
My take is that Dillahunty is an ambulance-chaser and "EMI" (I thought that they had something to do with music royalties?) may very well represent Lockheed in trademark matters. Although they may legally have the right to question your "P-38", pursuing such a small fish is ethically bankrupt. You could contact Lockheed, but I doubt that they would know-- or care-- what their agent is doing on this issue. I'd call "EMI" and work up the food chain from this bottom-feeder and talk to a higher-up. I don't recall if this has been mentioned, but have any of the other scale kit/ scale plans/ scale model/ scale documentation suppliers been contacted by this company? The P-38-- and other warbirds-- are popular models. It might be cost-effective to refer this to your-- or your "trade association's" counsel. Or to AMA/IMAA (ha ha). This issue is small potatoes to DJA, but has far-reaching implications to the modelling community. --Bill >From: "Don Stackhouse @ DJ Aerotech" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], > [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Product licensing nightmare (long, but important) >Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 16:25:32 -0400 > >This matter potentially affects all modelers and model companies involved >with scale model aircraft. > >Approximately two weeks ago we were contacted by a Mr. David Dillahunty, >allegedly of "Equity Management, Inc."... _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Not even a newbie yet
Why an old design from Goldberg with a weak wing and die-crunching? If I were going to electrify a plane, I'd get something like a 2-M LilBird from Skybench: http://www.skybench.com/slbird.html . You'd start with a better plane and end up with a better plane... --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: "Andy Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Not even a newbie yet >Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 22:54:17 -0400 > > >- Original Message - >From: "Andy Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2001 3:56 PM >Subject: [RCSE] Not even a newbie yet > > > > I always hate a question with what is the best so I will try a little >better > > question. > > > > I have yet to fly a glider, I have gotten my transmitter so I'm ready to > > choose a plane. > > Looking for something that ends up close to $100 since I have a feeling >I > > may need > > to take a rake with me for the first month or so. > > > > Would you recommend an electric sailplane as a first plane or using a > > highstart. > > I live in Tallahassee Fla. So slope flying is out. > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Hi, try an electric Electra from Goldburg. I'm writing a column on the >ezone >on just this subject. > > >Ric Vaughn >Marietta, Ga. > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors
Use any of the above, in context. The swivel ball links would be overkill on a light TD sailplane and E-Z connectors would be inappropriate for the flaps of a 1/4 scale Feiseler Storch. I've revisited the linkage/servo setup and assembly sequence on the BBird I'm building and it may be easier/better to use a conventional clevis (Sullivan, of course) at the servo arm. Z-bends will be used at the rudder and elevator control horns. :) Good discussion on linkage... --Bill >From: "Charles Eaton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 13:29:36 -0700 > >OK - this is a good forum. > >Don't use E-Z connectors cause they unscrew and fall apart. > >Don't use ball links cause they come apart or the nut falls off. > >Don't use Z bends cause they are sloppy. > >Those are the only choices as far as I know, so what do we use? >- Original Message - >From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 12:21 PM >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors > > > > In context, exactly. I wouldn't use them on a sloper, or on control > > surfaces on a pattern ship or flaps on a full-house TD ship, but on a > > floater using 20-30oz micro servos I think they'll be OK. > > > > I think we get wary of non-clevis linkage when we are exposed early-on >to > > the cr@ppy hardware that comes with trainers... > > > > Take care, > > > > --Bill > > > > >From: Brett Jaffee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors > > >Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 11:30:38 -0700 > > > > > >Although I avoid using them when I can, I've had an EZ connector on the > > >elevator of my Renegade slope racer for about 5 years and it's never >come > > >loose. I've periodically checked it, and it's never needed tightening. > > >I've also used one for the throttle servo of my Extra 300 power plane, >and > > >have never had that come loose either. > > > > > >Bill Harris wrote: > > > > > > > > The Skybench BigBird I'm building uses "EZ connectors" at the servo >arm. > > > > With power planes, this type of connector is not recommended on the > > >basis > > > > that they can fail, loosening from the engine vibration and the >servo > > >loads > > > > (although I used them on throttle linkage without failure). > > > > > > > > I'm thinking that they would work perfectly well in this sailplane > > > > application: a light RES ship using micro servos. What is the > > >concensus? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > --Bill > > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.dubro.com/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/scstore/p-121.html?L+scstore+gnpb >5372+1003859549 > > > > > > > > _ > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > > >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send >"subscribe" > > >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > >-- > > >_ > > > > > >Brett Jaffee > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > >R/C Slope and Power Homepage > > >http://home.earthlink.net/~jaffee > > > > > >The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page > > >http://members.nbci.com/bjaffee/extra300/ > > > > > >OnTheWay Quake 3 Server Utility > > >http://www.planetquake.com/ontheway > > >_ > > > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and > > >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > _ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors
Those work well. I use them on my Windfree nostalgia ship where the flying stab has external linkage and I needed something that is secure but easily removable. --Bill >From: "Mike Bailey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 23:48:33 -0500 > >I have been using a clevis on one end and a dubro plastic clip that works >with just 1 bend instead of a Z. I don't remember what they are called. >Mike >- Original Message ----- >From: Charles Eaton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2001 3:29 PM >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors > > > > OK - this is a good forum. > > > > Don't use E-Z connectors cause they unscrew and fall apart. > > > > Don't use ball links cause they come apart or the nut falls off. > > > > Don't use Z bends cause they are sloppy. > > > > Those are the only choices as far as I know, so what do we use? > > - Original Message - > > From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2001 12:21 PM > > Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors > > > > > > > In context, exactly. I wouldn't use them on a sloper, or on control > > > surfaces on a pattern ship or flaps on a full-house TD ship, but on a > > > floater using 20-30oz micro servos I think they'll be OK. > > > > > > I think we get wary of non-clevis linkage when we are exposed early-on >to > > > the cr@ppy hardware that comes with trainers... > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > > --Bill > > > > > > >From: Brett Jaffee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >Subject: Re: [RCSE] E-Z connectors > > > >Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2001 11:30:38 -0700 > > > > > > > >Although I avoid using them when I can, I've had an EZ connector on >the > > > >elevator of my Renegade slope racer for about 5 years and it's never >come > > > >loose. I've periodically checked it, and it's never needed >tightening. > > > >I've also used one for the throttle servo of my Extra 300 power >plane, > > and > > > >have never had that come loose either. > > > > > > > >Bill Harris wrote: > > > > > > > > > > The Skybench BigBird I'm building uses "EZ connectors" at the >servo > > arm. > > > > > With power planes, this type of connector is not recommended on >the > > > >basis > > > > > that they can fail, loosening from the engine vibration and the >servo > > > >loads > > > > > (although I used them on throttle linkage without failure). > > > > > > > > > > I'm thinking that they would work perfectly well in this sailplane > > > > > application: a light RES ship using micro servos. What is the > > > >concensus? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > --Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.dubro.com/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/scstore/p-121.html?L+scstore+gnpb > > 5372+1003859549 > > > > > > > > > > _ > > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > > > >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > > > > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send > > "subscribe" > > > >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > >-- > > > >_ > > > > > > > >Brett Jaffee > > > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > >R/C Slope and Power Homepage > > > >http://home.earthlink.net/~jaffee > > > > > > > >The Unoffical Extra 300 Home Page > > > >http://members.nbci.com/bjaffee/extra300/ > > > > > > > >OnTheWay Quake 3 Server Utility > > > >http://www.planetquake.com/ontheway > > > >_ > > > > > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send >"subscribe" > > and > > > >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > _ > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send >"subscribe" > > and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] Not even a newbie yet
That is my experience, too. I built the Highlander as a "high wind" sloper with a flat wing and ailerons. At a recent contest held in high winds (15-30 mph) I took it specifically because it is less-destructable and can handle wind. Sadly, I had a pop-off on my first launch, nosed in from ~40' and stripped the rudder servo. At 44 oz AUW (11 oz loading) it doesn't work well in light air, but then, it's a sloper. --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: "Stefan Smets" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Frank Jarratt" ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Andy Roberts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "[RCSE] >Soaring List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] Not even a newbie yet >Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 22:30:28 -0700 > >At 06:55 AM 10/25/01 +0200, Stefan Smets wrote: > >> The "Highlander" is limited in airspeed: when winds are over 10 mph, go > >home; but it > >> bounces and repairs better than any built-up wood plane. > >Ah ? I was hoping to use my Highlander (I'm _still_ "working" on it) to >give > >slope-soaring a try (I never had an occassion to soar on the slope).. If >a > >wind over 10mph is too strong for the Highlander, would that be even > >possible then ? As I understand, winds on slopes are usually quite strong >? > >The Highlander, like any other "floater" type plane, will work fine on the >slope. It will work in heavier winds too, though as they increase it will >start to get bounced around. Then again, you can always add balast. >Still, it's heavier then a typical built-up balsa floater, and should work >better. My experience is with a flat winged Highlander with ailerons, and >it worked fine. The main concern with flying a rudder-elevator plane on >the slope is that you have plenty of rudder throw (as much as you can get), >so that you can get out of awkward situations. > > > > >Thanks, > >Stefan. > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] E-Z connectors
The Skybench BigBird I'm building uses "EZ connectors" at the servo arm. With power planes, this type of connector is not recommended on the basis that they can fail, loosening from the engine vibration and the servo loads (although I used them on throttle linkage without failure). I'm thinking that they would work perfectly well in this sailplane application: a light RES ship using micro servos. What is the concensus? Thanks, --Bill http://www.dubro.com/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/scstore/p-121.html?L+scstore+gnpb5372+1003859549 _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] sailplanes as art
Absolutely absolute. I live in an older country home with 7' ceilings, so for the most part, hanging aeroplanes from the ceiling is out. As wall hangings, they are superb. My Zagi resides above the TV and my mantle gets an HLG (Summer only, I worry about the heat in the Winter). Even back in the '80's, before I got indoctrinated into R/C, I had a silkspan-covered Thermic 50 on the wall. --Bill >From: "Scobie Puchtler or Sarah Felstiner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "RCSE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] sailplanes as art >Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 16:04:49 -0700 > >Sailplanes as art? absolutely. > >I have a lofty 2 story high entrance in my very open-plan house here in >Seattle. Hanging fairly high from the peaked ceiling is an all-white molded >mini-Salto. Just white with black canopy, all numerals and logos removed. >It >hangs from a single strand of 30lb test spectra at a nice bank angle as if >frozen in a turn. Occasionally the air currents in the house will get it >rotating very very slowly. When visitors look up (SO many people never look >up) and see it, they invariably think it's quite beautiful, and I get this >sentiment from folks who don't really even know what a glider is, much less >a molded model RC glider. When the sun comes through the clerestory window >and bounces off the glossy wing, it can cast these amazing patchy light >reflections that move in slow motion across the wall. And when the sun >shines through the skylight above, you can see the spar construction >outlined in the wings. It brings me as much visual pleasure as any other >art >in my home, while reflecting my passion for flight and lift. My wife and I >hung it together, and we BOTH love it. > >Lift, >Scobie. > > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] sailplanes as art
This has possibilities. I thought that this site http://www.maxpoweraero.com/homes/pageone.htm was a little extreme, but now that I think about it more... :) --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] sailplanes as art >Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2001 19:30:22 EDT > >In a message dated 09/29/2001 4:27:03 PM Central Daylight Time, >[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > > Some of the planes we fly are beautiful. My Eclipse is a gorgeous > > plane. Elegant sculpture. I would like to hang it on the wall in the > > living room. (I am single.) > > > > Is there any obvious reason why I should not do this?? Has anyone else > > done this? Got any ideas on the best way to hang them??? Any >comments > > most welcome. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bill > >Here's what I've decided I want to say SAILPLANES! to the world. A nice big >scale plane with a big fat fuselage, big enough to tote watermelons in, and >freeze it forever in a high bank turn and plant one wing in the ground and >use the cockpit and canopy as a mailbox. It doesn't even have to be >airworthy, just cosmetically intact (until the mailbox baseball gang shows >up...) > >Bill Wingstedt > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] the Tullahoma mishap
I had a wonderful time at the contest in Tullahoma Saturday. I ended up flying my venerable Oly 99; I had good flight times and so-so landings. Met some new folks, enjoyed flying with my old friends. I flew the Oly because I discombobulated my brandy-new BoT on it's first flight of the contest. :( Beautiful launch, but once she got off the line, she went into a nose-down right spiral that I couldn't recover from. Minimal damage, really: split the fuse aft of the wing, broke the wing-bolt mounting blocks loose and broke the right wing near the tip and the left wing at the polyhedral joint. Fixable. Fooey. Couldn't imagine why this happened: everything was checked and double-checked prior to the contest and things were perfect. I figured this was a combo of "stuff happens" and "dumb thumbs". On the drive back (3 hours, plenty of time to cogitate), I got to thinking about the damage to the wings. Both wings did have impact damage to the LE from a forward direction where they hit a bush and the ground. However, that left wing also shows breakage of the poly joint, the direction force seems to be from the bottom. Ah ha. I suspect that she went into that unrecoverable spiral because of failure of the poly joint on the left wing. As you may recall, I went to great lengths of strengthen the wing spar on this BoT. CF laminate added to the spar caps, end grain balsa shear webs, Kevlar tow wrap, and so on. This was my first strong wing, built with info I gleaned on RCSE. However, since this was a learning experience spead out over several months, I did incorporate one "achilles heel": I enclosed it the 1/8" ply poly joiner in vertical-grain balsa shear webs, making sure that the spar at that joint was strong and well-glued. The inner-panel side of the poly joint is Kevlar-wrapped, but I didn't wrap the outer-panel side of the poly joint since that would have involved cutting into the lower D-tube sheeting on that panel. I actually thought of potential problems with those ply joiners as I was gluing the wing tips on and finishing the wing, but since I had a series of "maybe I ought to..." delays, I decided that the stock, unwrapped outer joint would be "good enough". It wasn't. The poly joint on that wing failed by pulling the sparcaps from the full-width vertical grain balsa shear webs. The glue joints were good: the balsa web pulled apart. Had they been Kevlar-wrapped, I suspect that they would not have failed. Do correct me if my thinking errs. What to do? Repair the poly joint and take the time to wrap both outer poly joints in Kevlar tow. I'm even considering a layer or two 2-oz glas cloth on the bias under the Kevlar, but this may be an extreme over-reaction to toasting a plane. Since this was my first "strong wing", I was being careful and was launching it just a little stronger with each launch. This was a stronger launch on an unfamiliar winch and I may well have gotten a bit frisky on the ole pedal. Oh well. Goes to show, you can take care of 99.9% of the details, but it's that .001% that'll bite you. When I had earlier reservations about using the ply poly joiners, I also thought about using .125" CF laminate plate in place of the 1/8" ply. I may use the CF plate on the next phase "KillerBoT" wing, but I think that the ply will work for this wing. Opinions also welcome, since this is the time to fix that. All in all, enjoyed the event, and glad I figured out "why?". :) --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] a bit of help please !!
Can't do much about the personal correspondence you've lost, but the RCSE archive has most every RCSE post for a few years back: http://www.mail-archive.com/soaring@airage.com/ --Bill >From: "John McCloskey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] a bit of help please !! >Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 19:03:22 -0400 > >Well, sometimes things don't go the way they should, and this is one of >those times . My computer decided to pack up and ate about four plus >years worth of gleanings from the exchange and valuable info from >correspondence with many on the exchange . Plus addresses ! To top it off I >was just about to get back to my unfinished Graphite which has > waited through a move and building a house only to find every thing but >the instructions . so does any of you kind folks have a source of the >graphite manual ?? >AND ... any setup suggestions would be appreciated as well . >as always , all the best . John McCloskey > West Sunbury ,Pa. _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: Getting back on RCSE
That is what I have done, too. I use the "freebie" Hotmail account exclusively for RCSE and reserve my "mindspring" account for non-hobby use. I can access RCSE either via a Web Browser or an eMail program. --Bill >From: "Jeff Reid" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Re: Getting back on RCSE >Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 04:04:51 -0700 > > >Well it looks like the ISP that I have had for the past 6 years is going > >under so just incase I will need to how do I get back on RCSE? > >I had to do the same a while back. Get a hotmail account, that way >you'll have an email address that won't change if you change ISP's >again later on. (I us both hotmail and ISP mail account). > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Glider clubs Near Greenville SC
Jack, this is the only "SC soaring" club listed in the AMA directory: 4092 SOUTHEAST SOARING ASSOCIATION HOWARD KELLER 6 HIBOURNE CT GREENVILLE SC 29615-2820 There may be other low-profile groups... --Bill >From: "Jack Strother" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Glider clubs Near Greenville SC >Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2001 07:31:50 -0400 > >I know there is at least5 one, around here somewhere !!! >I am not at home and do not have my contact file. >can you help? >TIA > >Jack Strother [EMAIL PROTECTED] >LSF President LSF Level V >Loveland, OH > > >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Counterbalanced rudders on Nostalgia planes
Good points, Pat. But my take is that strengthening the wings using current materials (ie, CF laminates) is a reasonable and prudent exception to the class rules. Admittedly, us guys who are "worried about blowing up their planes on launch [ought to] learn to launch" (guilty! ask my flyin' buddies), but you cannot launch the planes as they were designed because the launch eqpt is different nowadays. Ray Hayes, who is unargueably one of the best designers, builders and pilots of this millenium writes at his Nostalgia WebSite: "Most clubs are geared to large composit sailplanes, their winches are hot, the tow lines are very heavy 280 lb test, the tow line diameter is extreme and therefore produces excess drag. What does this mean, well it means your light weight RES or Nostalgia sailplane will suffer on launch and it better have well engineered wing spars. This and the fact that RES and Nostalgia Classes cater to large wing spans means not much fun for pilots flying Gentle Ladies and etc.. If your club is interested in promoting the RES-Nostalgia Classes you can probably find someone with a docile winch no longer in use. String it up with 125 lb to 150 lb line, maybe use a 6 volt battery and you will be amazed at the gain in launch height and safety for your pride and joy." For me, this says it all. Indeed, lets keep NOS pure. No spoilers, unless they were in the original plans. If you can use them, no mico servos: must use a full-size servo, string and magnets. Use full size servos for the flight controls. No micro Rx's-- 555's are out, as are modern avionics such as 'puter Tx's and light Nicads. You need to use rubber bands in the wing mounts. No nylon bolts allowed. Monokote covering? If the plans were published before Monokote became available, use tissue and dope. Glues for assembly? No CA. Epoxy and Elmers only. And so on and so forth. I say that the rules, as they were originally developed, are adequate. External mods-- such as the c'bal rudder-- are contrary to the original plans. Spoilers and CF is allowed. Me? I'm going out to fly and have fun... Take care, --Bill >From: "Pat McCleave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "RCSE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Counterbalanced rudders on Nostalgia planes >Date: Thu, 16 Aug 2001 22:18:33 -0500 > >Jack, > >I question how one considers a plane to be so Nostalgic when you allow all >the modern technologies to the planes in the way of carbon fiber and such. >I flew my Windrifters, Sailaires, Drifter II's and such off of winches for >years and did not ever blow up a wing on launch. I did blow one up while >doing loops but that was because I thought I knew more than Tom Williams at >the time and put my shear webs in with the grain running horizontal rather >than vertical. No I did not know anything about how a shear web worked but >I thought I did. If you are going to have bends in the rules that allow >strengthening the wings which does help increase the overall flight >envelope >of the plane, I find it strange that you do not allow what was very common >fixes to a known problem back then to be allowed now. If guys are worried >about blowing up their planes on launch then learn to launch. A lot of >guys >have said it is not about winning but about flying the old birds the way >they were. Well a lot of us flew ours with modified rudders so we did not >have the common rudder flutter and the wagging tail and the slower turn >response and all the other things that went on with the balanced rudder >designs. A well built by original design Windrifter spar system would hold >up to lots and lots of launches on today's winches doing it the old way >with the captured hook and lots of kiting and circle towing. I had many of >launches in those days when there was no line left on the spool and the >plane was almost straight up over the turn around. So if you want to argue >about Nostalgia then lets keep them all totally old fashioned and let the >games begin. Just my 2 cents worth. > >See Ya, > >Pat McCleave >Wichita, KS >- Original Message - >From: Jack Iafret <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Marc Gellart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; RCSE <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Dave ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2001 1:17 PM >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Counterbalanced rudders on Nostalgia planes > > > > I myself am running a counterbalanced rudder on my Paragon as per the >rules > > (my first Paragon had it eliminated, non-legal) and I can tell you it is >a > > pain in the backside, but that is the way the rules are written. It's a >pain > > because it flutters on launch and breaks a lot but I have just outlined >the > > structure in CF to see if that helps. Not much you can do with sticks on >an > > open bay structure so I launch a little less severe. > > > > BTW, I will be sending out an announcement for rules change proposals >next > > month if you feel strongly, add this to the list to be voted on. I for >one > >
[RCSE] spoiler programming/setup
Here is how I've set up the spoilers on my RES ships (JR 8103 Tx): 1. Since it is RES, connect the rudder servo to the aileron channel and mix AILE->RUDD, RATE=100% SW=ON to control the rudder from the right stick. 2. Spoilers. One servo per spoiler. Pgm Mix 1: Mix SPOI->FLAP. INHibit pots 5,6,7. The Spoiler stick operates the spoilers on Channel 6 (flap) and Channel 7 (aux2) and you can adjust the travel and endpoint of each spoiler panel separately. There may be other (and/or better) way to do this, but this is what I've found works for me. It has been mentioned here that it may be advantageous (and possibly even legal) to actuate one spoiler panel with the rudder while turning. I may experiment with this later on. One way I imagine that this could be done is to mix right rudder with the right spoiler channel and left rudder with the left spoiler channel. It would be nice to be able to switch this on or off, but may not be possible with the 8103. Although, since I am mixing AILE->RUDD, I may be able to have the rudder/spoiler actuate only from the left stick and not the right stick, or vice_versa. A kludge, but workable. Ideas? Suggestions? Thanks, --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] Modifications to Sagitta 600?
Would it be nostalgia-legal to modify the balanced rudder on a nostalgia ship? I think not, but thought I'd ask. --Bill >From: "Marc Gellart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] Modifications to Sagitta 600? >Date: Tue, 14 Aug 2001 14:39:18 -0400 > >One other for sure what ever you do, get rid of the balanced rudder and >make >it a complete vertical stab and rudder, it cuts drag and has just as much >authority. > >Marc > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations
Great discussion, Don.
Quick question: the wingrod in this Windfree needs to be bent to the
dihedral angle of 16 degrees. The wingrod material I have is from
DreamCatcher and is listed as "high strength steel". It's polished, with a
precise diameter, so it's not "piano wire": Iknow nothing of the metallurgy
of this material. Is there any reason why it can't be bent to this angle?
Thanks,
--Bill
>From: "Don Stackhouse @ DJ Aerotech" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations
>Date: Thu, 09 Aug 2001 14:46:47 -0400
>
>Skye Malcolm writes:
>
>>It seems to me that you're on the right track with the steel rods. You =
>>might see if you can find one tempered. ...
>
>There are several different ways to harden different types if steels. One
>is by heat treating. The typical process is to heat it above the
>temperature where all the alloying elements go back into a solid solution
>("dissolve") in the iron (typically around 1500 degrees F for
>garden-variety hardenable steel alloys), then quench (rapidly cool) the
>part so that some of the alloying elements get caught in harder types of
>microstructures (such as martensite), since they don't have time to revert
>back to their fully-annealed types of microstructures (typically ferrite
>for plain-carbon alloys). The resulting fully hardened part is extremely
>hard but very brittle. Even dropping it on the floor could result in
>shattering (that's also why they have a warning on hammers to not hit the
>hardened face against another piece of hardened steel, it could shatter and
>send splinters of itself into various soft and fragile things, such as your
>eyes). Fully hardened alloys also often have very high internal stresses.
>In some cases, just letting it sit around for a while in that state could
>result in microcracking.
>
>For this reason, it is normal practice to "temper" a part after quenching.
>The part is re-heated to something less than the quench-hardening
>temperature (typically around 700 to 900 deg. F for common steel alloys,
>with the higher temperature resulting in a softer final part), then slowly
>cooling back to room temperature. The alloy loses some of its hardenss but
>gains back enough ductility to eliminate the brittleness.
>
>Another type of hardening is work hardening. The alloy is mashed,
>stretched, or otherwise physically abused, which causes the buildup of
>physical stresses and microstructure changes in the material that have
>essentially the same effect as heat treating. In the case of music wire,
>the alloy is AISI 1060 steel (that means it's an iron-carbon, or "plain
>carbon" alloy, with a carbon content of 0.60%). It is drawn through a
>series of dies to work it down from the initial ingot diameter to the final
>desired wire size. Each time it gets pulled through a die, it gets work
>hardened. After a few steps it's been cold-worked so much that it's just
>about fully hard and has lost almost all its ductility. It is then annealed
>(slowly heated and then SLOWLY cooled) to make it soft again, and then the
>drawing process is continued.
>
>They use the minimum number of annealing steps, so that the wire at its
>final diameter is nearly fully hard, about the same hardness as the best
>you could get from it by heat treating. It's quite brittle at that point,
>which is why music wire can crack and snap if you bend it and then try to
>straighten it. It's already been subjected to about all the work hardening
>it can stand, and if your bending back and forth imposes more on it, it
>says ENOUGH!!
>
>At that hardness it's also close to about the same hardness and strength as
>most tool steels, which is why it will leave nice semi-circular dents in
>the jaws of your diagonal cutters if you try to use them to cut it. This
>also means that going to a heat-treated version of some other alloy (with a
>few very exotic exceptions) is not likely to get you any significant
>improvement in bending strength. You might get some improvements in
>toughness, but the hardness and strength (and therefore the bending load at
>which it gets bent) is not likely to see much improvement.
>
>The stiffness of all steel alloys is nearly identical, so the tip
>deflection due to elastic bending (i.e.: bending from which it can still
>spring back to its original shape) will not be changed in any case.
>
>About the only thing you can do that will significantly improve the bending
>strength of the rod is a diameter change.
>
>>Also you might try shortening the rod instead of lengthing it. At some =
>>shorter length this will theoretically put more stress into the wing rod =
>>sleeves...
>
>This will increase the stresses in the connections between the joiner rod
>and the wing spars, but it will not change the stresses in the joiner rod
>itself in the middle. There are a certain number of inch-pounds bending
>moment created by the lift forces and the length of the wing panels, and
>the center of the joiner rod has
RE: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations
After looking at this more, and with this good advice, instead of 1/4" wide sparcaps, I'll use 3/8" wide sparcaps, tapered to 1/4", and maybe from .042 to .060 thick, as well as a stiffer 5/16" wingrod. A bit moer weight, but I'll look for other places to save weight. Take care, --Bill >From: "Matt Gewain" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations >Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2001 07:21:06 -0700 > >Bill; > >This calculation gives you the minimum spar cap size and the maximum >deflection at the maximum load. The stress in the spar caps (sigma) will >be >reduced in proportion to any increase in the cross section area of the spar >caps. Therefore, if you double the size of the spar caps the stress and >the >tip deflection go to half the previous value. Then you can stand on the >winch without any problems. > >Matt Gewain > > >-Original Message- >From: Bill Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2001 8:57 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations > >I'm building a Windfree nostalgia sailplane with strengthened wings, and >utilizing a balsa-core carbon spar construction with the built-up wing, per >the Allegro-Lite. > >Using Mark Drela'a "spar sizing" suggestions at: >http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/allegro2m/spar_sizing.txt >I get a spar that uses .042 and .028 single tapered (to .007) CF laminate >with a spar width of .25" and a spar height of .60" with a .25" steel >wingrod. This should withstand a "reasonable" winch load for this class of >sailplane, as well as be very light. In a way, this is a similar to the >"de-rated" spar used on the Allegro-Light-Electric. > >All looks good until I get to the estimated tip deflection calculation. >Yikes!!! It comes out to be 28 inches! Not much I can do here... the only >variable I could work with is the spar height, and that can't change. > >What does this "tip deflection" mean? Under what conditions does it occur? >From the formula d= b^2 sigma / (4Eh), there is no input for wing/winch >load, so I assume that this is the maximum deflection that the _spar_ will >take before failure. I'm guessing that the D-tube sheeting and LE/TE might >also fail before this maximum spar deflection is reached. > >It may not matter, but I'm picking at the details on this building >exercise... > >--Bill > > > >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations
>You might want to consider increasing the wingrod size. I am. The 1/4" size was chosen for weight considerations, and at best it was a "conservative" (read:marginal) choice. I will use 5/16". On my BoT-to-be, I used a 5/16" wingrod and strengthened the spar with carbon fiber, end-grain balsa webs and Kevlar wrap. From calculations, I estimate that these changes increased the winch load from about 20 pounds to 80 pounds. Thie in my "Phase II" KillerBoT (Phase I being dead stock). Eventually I will have a Phase X KillerBoT that will take full-pedal zoom launches, float like a butterfly and sting like a bee, as well as be nice to children and dogs. Hopefully my flying skills will catch up to the toy... :) --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] spar-sizing calculations >Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2001 19:26:12 EDT > >Bill, > You might want to consider increasing the wingrod size. With my BOT, >116" >with the increased spar buildup, I'm having a lot of trouble with my zoom >launches. The .25" wingrod just won't take it. I've bent the one that >come >with it a few times, (10")and straightened it. I went to a stainless steel >one 12" long, two launches and it was bent. Now this week I am trying a >.25" >music wire rod to see if it will spring back on it own. > >Thermals > Jerry Miller > SOSS-Medford, OR _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Bending music wire
I mis-spoke; I checked the adverts and the wingrod material is listed as "hardened". Which means it's not soft, I guess. I made up a bending jig and did some test bends. I turned a pair of "semi-circular" v-blocks to place the wingrod on, and made a small-radius anvil to press with, and fit this to a hydraulic press. Seems to work well enough. Thanks for the feedback! --Bill >From: Eddie Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Bending music wire >Date: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 13:51:58 +0930 > >At 10:58 30/07/2001 -0500, you wrote: >>On a related topic-- >> >>I have some commercial wingrod I'd like to bend for a couple of projects >>I'll be working on. The 1/4" wingrod material is "case-hardened" (North >>East Sailplanes, I think) and the 5/16" is "Ultrarod" from DreamCatcher. >>What I want to do is bend these wingrods (12-14" length) with a central >>bend of 10-15 degrees. >> >>Would it be do-able to bend the hardened wingrod? >> >>Otherwise, I have some 1/4" music wire I can use instead. >> >>--Bill > > >Bill I don't think that you would have case hardened material supplied as a >wind joiner >as it wouldn't work. Case hardening is just that ... the internal material >is still soft and >only made out of S1214 or similar. You can use a higher carbon content >material such >as K1045 and harden it to use as a wing joiner but I would bend it before >hardening. > >Spring steel or music wire that is usually used and is available from model >shops is >normally bent cold. but don't over bend it as suggested below or very >quickly it will over >bend in use again. > >What happens when you bend material is that the molecular structure gets >distorted (work >hardening) and tends to move on bending into a locking position if you >over bend and >straighten it back again the molecular structure unlocks and it becomes >weaker. > >This is the reason that they no longer reform coil springs in cars. > >Bend it only to the angle you need. > >Now this is the way to bend material I use a piece of 1" thick hard >rubber sheet, placing >the rod to be bent flat on it. On top of the rod place another say ... >1/2' dia rod and press it >down until the joiner reaches the correct angle. >This method produces a very localized bend (good for wing joiners) in the >material. > >I use a small press but if you have a 4 to 5" vice you can use that with >the rubber sheet vertical. > >>>4) Bend about 5-10 deg PAST the intended angle. Then bend back >>>to the intended angle. >>> >>> >>>Note 1: The reason for going "too far" and then returning is to relieve >>>the huge residual stresses (about 1/2 of yield stress!) in the steel >>>which >>>would otherwise remain. The bend will be much stronger then. > > >Eddie the Eagle > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] RE: CF Booms or pushrods as RX antennae (follow up
>antenna inside the boom. I do this on my 2M... Good, an authoritative answer, from experience. I was wondering if the "carbon boom/antenna" question was a urban legend, like the downwind turn. Seems to me that being a "sorta-conductor" in a CF-laminate tube that the carbon would not attenuate the signal too much. On a super-slippery design like the Allegro anything that can be done to clean up the airframe, the better. May not have a pratical significance, but it would from aesthetics... --Bill >From: Mark Drela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] RE: CF Booms or pushrods as RX antennae (follow up >Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 10:43:04 -0400 > >Before anyone does something risky like use the CF boom for >an antenna (see Don Stackhouse's post) I suggest they first >try simply running the antenna inside the boom. I do this >on my 2M and I get well over 100 ft in a ground range check. >There is no range degradation that I can detect. > >One should realize that a CF boom is not like the typical >shield used in coax cables. The latter must have the >shield grounded to the circuitry to function properly. >The CF boom is not grounded to the RX. EE majors can >probably give better specifics here. > >On HLG's I use one of the wire pushrods as the antenna >to save weight (DJ Aerotech has more info). Although >the pushrod is next to the CF boom, the system works fine. >The pushrod is much shorter than the standard antenna >so I get only about 50-60 feet of ground range, but this is >plenty for a small glider which can't be flown very far away. > >- Mark _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: [RCSE]
>>I've seen condensation above a 757 wing right after takeoff This is common. I think that this is an air pressure phenomenon where near-saturated air goes to supersaturated whne the pressuer is lowered. Which is what you would expect on the top of a wing at high AOAs. Remember your mad scientist days when you made a Milliken cloud chamber. Another visual example is in the movie "True Lies", where there is a aerial sequence of Harriers doing tight turns near sea level-- the vapor clouds in low pressure areas were frequently visible. --Bill (back to the bandwidth conservation mode) >From: Brett Jaffee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: Mark Drela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Re: [RCSE] >Date: Fri, 03 Aug 2001 19:01:19 -0700 > >Mark Drela wrote: > > > Yes and no. The conical shape is typical of transonic flow. > > But moisture can condense near much slower aircraft. > > All that's needed is very high humidity, from which > > you get condensation with only a slight drop in pressure. > >At the Pt Mugu airshow in southern California its pretty common to see this >sort of thing on any airplane making a fast fly by (say, over 600 mph). >Being that the base is right on the ocean, it's typically overcast or foggy >whenever they've had an airshow. > > > > > I've seen condensation above a 757 wing right after takeoff > > when we climbed through a very low cloud base (which is > > a 100%-humidity boundary). > >I saw this very thing from the ground near LAX last week. It was pretty >spectaclur, given that the entire wing erupted in a vapor cloud. I think >high angles of attack have a lot to do with it. I've seen pics of the >Concorde coming in for a landing with it's entire wing obscured in vapor, >and fighter planes also show these effects sometimes when the pitch up hard >to climb or turn. > >Brett > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Fw: Kit price (email virus warning)
>I just recieved the email below with a pif. doc. attached that had a virus. Yep, that virus has been making it's rounds. The webpage devoted to it's description and the tool for it is in the following link: http:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Below is a clip from the webpage describing the virus: = This worm arrives as an email message with the following content: Subject: The subject of the email will be random, and will be the same as the file name of the email attachment. Attachment: The attachment is a file taken from the sender's computer and will have the extension .bat, .com, .lnk or .pif added to it. Message: The message body will be semi-random, but will always contain one of the following two lines (either English or Spanish) as the first and last sentences of the message. Spanish Version: First line: Hola como estas ? Last line: Nos vemos pronto, gracias. English Version: First line: Hi! How are you? Last line: See you later. Thanks Between these two sentences, some of the following text may appear: Spanish Version: Te mando este archivo para que me des tu punto de vista Espero me puedas ayudar con el archivo que te mando Espero te guste este archivo que te mando Este es el archivo con la informacion que me pediste English Version: I send you this file in order to have your advice I hope you can help me with this file that I send I hope you like the file that I sendo you This is the file with the information that you ask for" _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
I agree, the Windfree is wonderful airplane. I enjoy flying the 1972 Windfree that I restored. However, this is the situation: Ever since I upgraded to Hollyday rubber on my hi-start, I don't have a medium hi-start. My soaring group uses a 12v winch. At the Nostalgia event at the MidSouth, they used 12v winches, the very same used by the full-pedal TD zoomers. Even though I am used to tapping the pedal to modulate the winch output, I felt as though I was going to fold the wings on my Nostalgia ships. I've got a pair of bent 5/32" wingrods from my Oly-99 to think about. Although it was designed to handle medium hi-start launches, that sort of equipment ain't commonly available nowadays. Since I an building a new Windfree from the current kit, this would be a good opportunity to incorporate: "structural modifications to enable the plane to handle modern launch equipment and techniques... some examples: - Substitute spruce for balsa - CF reinforcements - Larger joiner rods - Stronger tow hook systems" Since I know that I have a plane that can barely handle modern launch equipment, it would not be prudent to build the same plane, no? --Bill >From: "Stan & Mary Jo Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: "Digest Soaring" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing >Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 10:37:24 -0500 > >Bill: >I think you will find the 5/32 rods adequate for what type of launches it >was designed to handle. Sure the wings flex as do the rods, but that's some >built in safety. Just use a medium weight hi start and enjoy. Its a great >airplane. > >Stan >- Original Message - >From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2001 9:23 AM >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing > > > > On that Windfree project where I'm upgrading the wing joiner rod and >spar >to > > make a stronger wing... > > > > The stock Windfree has a pair of 5/32" joiner rods, one at the mail >spar, > > the other in a joiner box at 2/3 chord enclosed by the wing center/root > > sheeting (no secondary spar). As a conservative and weight-saving > > enhancement, I decided to use a 1/4" wingrod. However, while fiddling > > around with the joiner rod weights, I noted that the TWO 5/32" rods have >the > > same cross-sectional area as the ONE 1/4" wingrod. So I wonder if I'm > > side-stepping with the 1/4" wingrod in place of two smaller rods? In >other > > words, do the two 5/32" rods have the same "stiffness" or Sigma value as >one > > 1/4" rod?I can see that the stiffness of a rod is proportional to >the > > size, but I'm not sure if it's a direct proportion. > > > > --Bill > > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
On that Windfree project where I'm upgrading the wing joiner rod and spar to make a stronger wing... The stock Windfree has a pair of 5/32" joiner rods, one at the mail spar, the other in a joiner box at 2/3 chord enclosed by the wing center/root sheeting (no secondary spar). As a conservative and weight-saving enhancement, I decided to use a 1/4" wingrod. However, while fiddling around with the joiner rod weights, I noted that the TWO 5/32" rods have the same cross-sectional area as the ONE 1/4" wingrod. So I wonder if I'm side-stepping with the 1/4" wingrod in place of two smaller rods? In other words, do the two 5/32" rods have the same "stiffness" or Sigma value as one 1/4" rod?I can see that the stiffness of a rod is proportional to the size, but I'm not sure if it's a direct proportion. --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
Ah! Now this puts it all into perspective. And I'd not considered the wingloading that results from the acceleration and pullout in the zoom phase of the launch, and that is considerable. --Bill >From: tony estep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing >Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2001 10:09:16 -0700 (PDT) > >--- Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > how do you calculate the winch load from the speed > > of the > > plane? > > > > --Bill > > >The lift on a wing is: > >L = (.00237/2) * CL * S * V^2 > >where .00237 = density of air >S = area in sq ft >V = velocity in ft/sec >CL = coefficient of lift, which during the launch is roughly 1.0 > >The tension in the line = the lift generated by the wings, so you can >solve for V, which is where I get the 125 mph for my 2-meter plane to >create 150 lbs of line tension. As Joe Wurts points out in a recent >post on launch tension, a wind gust or a strong thermal will add lift. >However, the Brits measuring launch tension on their F3B planes got >nothing over 40 kg, about 88 lbs. This jibes with my 72 mph conjecture >(for a 3M plane) based on the maximum speed at which my winch can pull >in line when unloaded. > >Now 2 guys pulling a line in via a pulley certainly don't make the >plane fly faster than 72 mph. However, if the wind up there is 20 mph >and the plane is hanging there with no forward velocity, just kiting, >and the line is stretchy, and there's a thermal, and the flaps are down >allowing the CL to rise to, say, 1.2, and then they run like hell -- >who knows? Due to the plane's inertia, the tension in the line can >spike to a level much greater than that sustainable by wing lift. > >The line stretches in response to the increased tension. Then the pilot >resolves this unstable situation by pointing the nose straight down. >Let's say that there's 150 lbs of tension in the line, and that the >plane weighs 5 lbs. That's 30 g. So the plane accelerates downward with >an initial acceleration of 30 times the acceleration of gravity (!!!). >The acceleration declines linearly as the tension is taken up, until it >equals the acceleration of gravity. By that time the plane can be going >_fast_ (see http://www.mvsaclub.com/zoom.htm) > >Now when you pull the nose up you can generate a lot of wing-busting >force. Joe's "layups.xls" spreadsheet allows you to design for maximum >load both due to line tension and to the high-speed pullout. > >If the plane doesn't explode, you also generate a lot of altitude. >Dennis Phelan sez he has measured F3B launch altitude at about 1000 >feet when everything goes just right. > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing
With respect to the winch load values being quoted and using those values in the previously-posted formula for wingrod sizing, I'm getting some large wingrod sizes. For example, for a 2M wing, a 150 pound winch load requires a 7/16" wingrod, and a 50 pound winch load needs a 5/16" wingrod. These are hefty wingrods. I'm sure that this formula is correct, but I suspect that the winch load values tend to get overstated. 150-200 pounds is no doubt a value tha _can_ be reached with a strong winch and "full-pedal zoom launches". I also suspect that a 50 pound winch load is still quite respectable and would be a "strong" launch by a typical sport flyer, and even 30 pounds is a good launch. I've not measured these values, but plugging known wingrod sizes from planes that have been flown successfully for years into the formula I've back-calculated these 30-50 pound winch loads. Has anyone actually instrumented a sailplane to measure the load aty the towhook on launch? I'd be interested in seeing those values. --Bill >From: "Joe & Jan Wurts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Mark Drela" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Joiner sizing >Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 21:32:58 -0700 > > >I seriously doubt you will see 200 lb pull on your winch. > >This number is probably initiated by me. We will occasionally >(rarely) see this kind of load on an F3B winch. Much more frequent >on two man F3J towing however. With a little bit of headwind, >and some lift on tow, the line tension will grow extremely fast, >frequently far faster than the pilot realizes. This is how most >planes die on tow. I'd rate the 200 lbs case in the 99th percentile, >assuming that you have your plane set up well for launch (most >people have very conservative launch set-ups, which ends up >precluding the high launch tensions). > >I end up designing my planes for the 200 lb load case, and in >fact, design for deflection limits rather than plane failure. By my >calculations, the Icon gets to the 200 lb case at a little bit over >40 ksi compression max. on the upper spar. Using the 100 ksi >number, this points to about a 500 lb line load failure case. >Designing to failure at 200 lbs will get you an airplane that is >pretty flexible on an energetic tow. > >All that said, for F3B, the dead air line tension gets to only 50-60 >lbs, and in mild headwinds, about 100 lbs. Still, one thermal on >tow and the tension can quickly build towards the 200 lb number. >Smaller airplanes don't have this issue nearly as much due to >line drag losses reducing the power available. > >joe > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[RCSE] Have Esteem, will fly.
I've got my first full-house ship: one of my flyin' buddies bequeathed me an Esteem. Obechi-sheeted wings, 'glas fuse, T-tail. I don't think it's a Grand Esteem, although it's pretty nifty . Anything I should know about this bird? --Bill _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Oly 100 question
There wasn't a "100", so I guess you've got an Oly 99. The two wingrods are 5/32" music wire. Available at your LHS. --Bill >From: Carl Otto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Oly 100 question >Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 22:34:08 -0700 > >I am resurrecting an Oly 100 given to me by a friend. Its built as per >original plans, but doesn't have a wing rod. > >Where's the best source to get a replacement wing rod. I live in the SF >Bay >area. > >Thanks for any suggestions. > >Carl Otto > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Re: beefing up an airfoil
This makes sense. The standard recommendation on power planes is to leave the TEs square and NOT round them off; rounding them is said to produce flutter (the TE being an aileron). --Bill >From: Oleg Golovidov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: Oleg Golovidov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Re: beefing up an airfoil >Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 09:51:37 -0400 (EDT) > >Forwarding Mark Drela's reply to everybody. Mark forgot to CC the list when >replying. > >Thanks a lot, Mark. >One more comment/question. If the chop-off method is acceptable, it is much >easier to implement. Just plot the same airfoil for a larger chord. >The method with opening the arches requires doing some preprocessing of the >airfoil coordinates, right? Do you just use a spreadsheet to multiply the >y-coord by the fraction of the x-coord (distance from LE)? Actually, one >would >need to add/subtract the correction factor of say 0.005*x, correct? >Did you try to imply that if one chops off a good bit of the airfoil's tail >it's >no longer close to the original flow? >Oleg. > > >- Begin Forwarded Message - >From: Mark Drela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >Oleg, > >The "chop-off" method is usually OK, but on airfoils with >very thin rear ends like most of the new HLG stuff you'd >have to chop off quite a bit to get 1% thickness. I like >the other way better. > > >if you MUST have a thick trailing edge, do NOT round > >it, leave it square. > >Yes, absolutely. On a lifting airfoil, the bottom-surface >corner in particular should be sharp, otherwise the BL >might stick partway around the curve and turn the flow >upward and reduce lift. Of course if you -want- a >lower CL this might help, but reducing camber is >a far better way to do this. > >The rounding is deleterious only when the radius is >a significant fraction of the bottom BL thickness, >so this is less of a problem at smallish Re's. >Still, I don't see a good reason to round off the edge >in any case. > >- Mark > >- End Forwarded Message - > > >__ > > Oleg Golovidov > Engineous Software Inc. > www.engineous.com > (919)677-6700 x107 > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Practical application...
Great, this gives me something a bit more concrete to go on, a step above the "TLAR" criteria. Another side-question on this project: assume a two-piece, 2-meter wing, 550 in^2 area, "type 2" spar, what size wingrod would be needed to match the spar strength?For a respectable 50 pound winch load and a full-pedal 150 pound winch load? Again, thanks for your input. --Bill >From: Mark Drela <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Practical application... >Date: Sun, 08 Jul 2001 23:13:06 -0400 > > >Two approaches: > >1. Strengthen the existing [spruce] spar. > >2. Make a Balsa-Core Carbon spar > >Question is, how much lighter? > > >Here are some numbers I did some time ago: > >The Allegro-Lite spar (#2 type) is stressed for a 150 lb winch load. >Excluding the joiners, it weighs 3 oz. > >An equivalent spruce spar would be a 0.6" x 5" solid cross section >in the wing center (basically a floor plank). With optimal taper >towards the tips it would still weigh about 24 oz. > >A #1 type spar would be somewhere in between, depending on >the spruce/carbon mix. > >Obviously #2 type is by far the lightest solution. A 2M spar >which takes a still-respectable 50 lb winch load can weigh only 1 oz! > >- Mark >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] RES kit?
Based on comments and what I have seen at the field, I'd chose two: The 2-m Big Bird or 3-m Sky Bird from Skybench Aerotech at http://www.skybench.com/ and the Majestic from Laser Arts at http://members.aol.com/laserartco/ . Although the Majestic does has a CF tailboom, the wing, fuse and tailfeathers are wood and built-up, so it would qualify. --Bill >From: "Andy Page" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] RES kit? >Date: Thu, 05 Jul 2001 11:06:27 -0700 > >What's your pick for the best all-wood RES kit that's currently >available? _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com What's your pick for the best all-wood RES kit that's currently available? Â Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Profi mc-3030 for sale
Hopefully you did buy this Tx with a _surface_frequency_ since you are not using it for aircraft? >From: "Brad Brock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Profi mc-3030 for sale >Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 07:52:04 -0500 > >Multiplex Profi mc-3030 Transmitter for sale: $450.00 OBO >Almost new less that one month old. Came with all the switches and sliders >installed . Will include any TX crystal that multiplex has made available >in US. Multiplex aluminum case, hand rest, neck strap and charger cord >included. >I am into robotics and should have bought the mc-4000 for the advanced >mixing capabilities and extra channels. > >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Tullahoma RES Contest July 7: skids and skegs
So skegs will eventually be "out" when the new rules go into effect. I presume that "non-arresting skids" will be OK, as in Nostalgia. Question to interpretation on "non-arresting": some of my planes have a McCann "hooktooth" skeg ahead of the towhook, with the point facing backwards so it won't dig in and arrest. This is used as a _skid_ to keep the towhook out of the mud and to keep the fuse from getting scraped. It functions as a skid, but this could be open to challenge since it is sold as a (arresting) skeg. What would y'all think? At any rate, let me see if I can swing a trip up north next weekend... I'd love to fly with y'all. --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Chuck Anderson) >To: "James V. Bacus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Tullahoma RES Contest July 7 >Date: Tue, 03 Jul 2001 02:53:09 -0500 > >At 09:04 PM 7/2/2001 -0500, you wrote: > >At 08:37 PM 7/2/2001, Chuck Anderson wrote: > >>We will use rules > >>for the proposed AMA RES class except that skegs will be allowed. > > > >I thought skegs were allowed in AMA RES? > > > > > >Jim > >Downers Grove, IL > >Member of Chicago SOAR club > >ICQ 6997780R/C Soaring Page at >http://www.mcs.net/~bacuslab/soaring.html > > > >The RES rules just approved by the rules committe does include a ban on >skegs. I was expecting a cross proposal to delete the no skeg rule during >the final voting cycle but nobody bothered to submit the necessary >paperworkk. Therefore, during the final vote, we had the choice of >accepting the proposal as written with the skeg ban or voting down the >proposal. If we voted the RES proposal down, it would have been another 3 >years before we would have another chance to get an official RES class. >Since the only objectionable part of the proposal was the skeg rule, I >voted to accept the proposal. After all, the CD can opt to allow skegs as >I did. Note that the RES class to be flown at the Nats is not an official >event and is not bound by the rules we just voted in. The official rules >do not take effect until next January anyway. > > >Chuck Anderson >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Glassing balsa fuse
That is a good article. Another article on 'glassing a fuse is at Jim Ryan's site, in the Downloads section: http://home.fuse.net/ryan/ . For blotting up excess epoxy, I use a roll of toilet paper. "Roll" the roll on the surface to remove the excess, and when that "layer" of paper gets saturated, unroll it to expose fresh paper. --Bill >From: Dick Williamson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Stan & Mary Jo Myers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Glassing balsa fuse >Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2001 10:12:16 -0400 > >Stan, > >You asked: > >>Also, I remember reading about spraying 3m on the glass and putting on wax >>paper, can someone direct me the that article or briefly tell me how its >>done? >> > >An update of the original article in Model Aviation is on the Charles >River RC web site at: > >http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/construction/williamson_fiberglass.htm > >Dick > >-- >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >Dr. Richard C. WilliamsonPhone: 781-981-7857 >Room C-317 FAX:781-981-0122 >Lincoln Laboratory Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Massachusetts Institute of Technology >244 Wood Street >Lexington, MA 02420-9108 >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Travel Case/Box for Sailplanes
I recall that being discussed at great lengths here on occasion. Pop on over to the RCSE archive at http://www.mail-archive.com/soaring@airage.com/ and do a search. --Bill >From: Brad Willoughby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Soaring <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Travel Case/Box for Sailplanes >Date: Sun, 01 Jul 2001 01:27:18 +0100 > >RCSE'rs, > >I'm beginning to think about my trip back from Scotland to California >coming >up in September. I seem to have accumulated more sailplanes since I >arrived >here last October - not sure how that happened - but I'll need a way to get >them back. ;) > >Any suggestions for a ready-made case or box for international flight, or >any links to plans to build one? I don't mind building one (especially if >commercial cases will cost more than my planes), but I'd like plans to work >from. I'm sure you international competition folks have done this before. >Ideas? > >Any help would be great! >Cheers, >Brad >Edinburgh, Scotland > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] I soared every nite this past three weeks...
LOL! Ya woiks with what ya gots... --Bill >From: Jack Strother <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,[EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] I soared every nite this past three weeks... >Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 08:36:54 -0400 > >Just keep looking up !!! >sooner or later only your foot will get wet !!! >8-) > >At 07:23 AM 6/29/01 -0500, Bill Harris wrote: >>I wish I were that lucky... I'm so far down the totem pole that all I can >>do is stand between the dog and the fire hydrant... >> >>--Bill >> >> >>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>Subject: Re: [RCSE] I soared every nite this past three weeks... >>>Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 23:34:26 EDT >>> >>> >>>I know what you mean! I rescued a ten minute flight from 50 feet with 6 >>>minutes to go and got waved through the grocery checkout pushing a fully >>>loaded cart to a standing ovation. The next damn week, I blew a 5 minute >>>flight and all my credit cards went blank. Sailplanin's a tough way to >>>make a >>>living, especially with all the interruptions of the work week. Sprinkle >>>in a >>>little rain on the weekends and that'll be me climbing the clock tower! >>>Go >>>figure... :) >>> >>>Bill Wingstedt >> >>_ >>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com >> >>RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >>and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Next project...
Good point, Andy. I'm inclined to keep the Windfree simple, and not add spoilers. I've noticed that I raise the nose and mush it in for a spot landing pretty well. --Bill >From: "Andy Page" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Next project... >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 16:23:49 -0700 > >I'm thinking my Windfree will be 2 channel - like the original. >I flew my stretched Questor and an original standard class fairly >competitively, neither one had spoilers. Even if you don't win, >its great fun to do well with a less than state of the art design. >That way, you know it was your flying skill that made the difference. > >I always found that light, responsive models can be brought down >without spoilers by wagging the rudder at high angle of attack - >kinda like an alternating side slip. Not as effective as spoilers, >but it's something. > >Something large is another story... I think my Bird of Time will >have spoilers. > > >>From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>Subject: Re: [RCSE] Next project... >>Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:22:05 -0500 >>MIME-Version: 1.0 >>X-Originating-IP: [192.243.195.27] >>Received: from 192.243.195.27 by lw14fd.law14.hotmail.msn.com with >>HTTP;Thu, 28 Jun 2001 20:22:05 GMT >> >>IMO, the Windfree looks good in the air. Mark Smith did a lot of >>legendary flying in the mid-70's with that plane. >> >>Those long skinny wings and light weight seem to make it a bit squirrelly >>on launch. With 500 in^2 area and 26 oz weight it seems to be a marginal >>"open class" ship and probably will be out-competed by Unlimited RES >>ships. But I'll have fun, I already know humility... >> >>Ray Hayes does have a Nostalgia Page at >>http://www.skybench.com/nostalgia/nindex.html . >> >>Y'all, forgot to ask: spoilers on the Windfree, yea/nay? I've not seen >>spoilers on any of the Windfree pics I've seen, so they may not have been >>used on this plane. Practical, yes. Aesthetic, ??. >> >>--Bill >> >> >> >>>From: "Andy Page" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>Subject: Re: [RCSE] Next project... >>>Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:27:17 -0700 >>> >>>I also just finished a nostalgia model - an Airtronics Questor, >>>with the same mod I put on the first one 20 years ago, polyhedral >>>tip panels. Pretty much makes it a Super Questor, with a slightly >>>different planform. So, I guess its not legal for nostalgia. >>> >>>I have a Windfree on the board now, from the new kit. This one >>>always fascinated me back then, but I never had one. I can't wait >>>to fly it. Next project will be a Bird of Time. >>> >>>Andy >>> >>> >>> >>>>The BoT is on final to completion and it's time to start planning my >>>>next >>>>project... >>>> >>>>I'd just finished my two Nostalgia planes, refurbished 1972 Oly 99 and >>>>Windfree. I like the way the Windfree flies and looks in the air. But >>>>a >>>>30-year old classic like that is fragile and has too much "sentimental >>>>value" to be thrashed in contests and day-to-day flying. >>>> >>>>I've ordered a current Windfree kit from Ray Hayes at Skybench. I plan >>>>to >>>>add stronger wingrod and wing spars to withstand modern winches, and >>>>strengthen the fuse to survive the inevitable "dorked" landing. >>>> >>>>As you recall, the wings on the Windfree are long and skinny and plug >>>>into >>>>the fuse on 5/32 joiner wires. Each wing panel length is 48", the root >>>>chord is 7" and the tip chord is 4". D-tube construction, 555 in^2 >>>>area. >>>>Dihedral is 8*, with no poly. >>>> >>>>I propose to make the stronger spars using the pre-preg CF >>>>strip/endgrain-balsa and Kevlar-tow wrap composites, per Tony Estep's >>>>DarkStar ( http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/dark_star.htm ) or Mark >>>>Drela's >>>>Allegro-Lite >>>>(http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/allegrolite2m/markdrela_allegrolite2m.htm >>>>). The wingrod will be 5/16" or 3/8" aluminum or steel, with the 8* >>>>dihedral bent into it, and will
Re: [RCSE] Next project...
That is absolutely correct, Dave. The wings on my refurbished '72 Windfree flex a lot-- the wingrods and wing spars are "matched" in strength. The problem is that I have to carefully modulate the winch pedal else the wings will fold, and this limits my launch height. If I just used stiffer wingrods, the wing panels would indeed fail. If I just used stronger wing spars, the wingrods would fail (5/32" is pretty marginal!) Everything has to be considered as a functional unit: if I strengthen A, then B must also be beefed up. I believe that if I increase the spar stiffness by using a CF/composite spar coupled with a larger wingrod that the strength of the entire wing assembly will be usefully increased. I can do reasonable winch launches, although I do not see doing the zippy-da-do-da zooms that you get with a polycarbonate technowonder... Intuitively, "off the top of my head", I'm thinking that a 5/16" steel or 3/8" aluminum wingrod will be a good match to a wing of 99" wingspan and 555 in^2 area. It might well be that a 1/4" steel rod would be appropriate. And then again, in the Ray Hayes incarnation of the Windfree, he may already use larger wingrods and stiffer spars than the original '72 kit, so I may end up going with his recommendation. But good comments... --Bill >From: "Dxxx" >To: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Next project... >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 14:38:56 -0700 > >Bill, >I recommend that you don't use larger rods in the Windfree. I saw a 30 >year >old one fly last weekend, and it does develop MUCHO dihedral on launch, but >the wings never broke. I suspect that Mark and Rod Smith designed it using >the stock rods, to keep the wings intact. If you use larger (read >stiffer) >wing rods, you will move the stress to the end of the rod, and it will fail >there. IMHO, the wing needs to flex to survive. >Just my .02 worth. _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Lost sheep returns.
And don't forget the Zagiites... --Bill >From: Michael Lachowski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Lost sheep returns. >Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 08:14:28 -0400 (EDT) > > > Scale glider guys love the purity and joy of flying scale replicas. > > > > TD/F3J/F3B pilots think scale is for guys that can't handle >competition. > > > > Slopers are, well, slopers. > >I don't agree with you. >As the owner of a 1:2.9 Foka 4, 1:3 Salto, and 1:4 Pilatius B4 as well as >Several >Tragi 701's, 702, Ellipse 3, Ellipse 4, Escape, Dynamix, Miraj and a large >collection >of foamie and wood and glass slope ships plus a Sr Telemaster with a big >Saito for >aerotowing, I have some reasons to have opinions. > >F3b pilots think TD is for guys who can't handle competition. > >Scale guys actually do appreciate the workmanship and skills needed to >finish a model >while TD guys think raw kevlar and fiberglass looks good. > >Slopers just want to fly, why think are build nice planes. > >I just happen to like all kinds of sailplanes. As a result, I don't have >the time >to make my scale models nice and detailed... > > >You forgot the XC folks and of course the DLG folks think they are special >too. > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Is Profi the Answer?You bet ur arse!!
And I like Chevy's and don't like Macintoshes... It's just a tool... --Bill >From: Jack Strother <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Steven Meyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Soaring List ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Is Profi the Answer?You bet ur arse!! >Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 06:51:42 -0400 > >Steve, >you don't get itIts a 12 channel transmitter!!! >Most of the 72MHZ band is available for frequencies. >come on man lose the MR. Negative !!! >8-) >jack > > > >At 12:39 AM 6/29/01 -0500, you wrote: >>Yeh but then I would never get to fly cause the 12 channels that are >>available for the PROFI will most likely be in use. >> >> >>At 10:07 AM 6/28/2001 -0700, Karlton Spindle wrote: >>>SO get one! >>>Even on the Profi 3030 (designed in 1984) Page 81 of the book goes over >>>how >>>to set up a 6 servo wing ;) $435.00 For a TX for a plane that costs how >>>much? >>>No glider card needed! >>> >>> >>>In all honesty though Skip Miller has a good Stylus setup for 6 servo >>>wings. >>> >>>If any of you Profi 4000 pilots need one I will email the program for you >>>to >>>download in to your TX. Of If any of you Profi 4000 pilots have one >>>email >>>me the file so I can post it on our web page. >>> >>> >>>Smooth Sailing, >>>Karlton Spindle >>>... >> >>Steve Meyer http://SOARchicago.com/stmeyer/ >>[EMAIL PROTECTED] >> >>S.O.A.R. Web Page http://SOARchicago.com/ >>Message Boards http://SOARchicago.com/discus/ > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Out of Office AutoReply: [RCSE] Is Profi the Answer? (More on the sty 6 from ATL/NASA )
Wait til they get back from vacation and have several hundred folks on the List send them a polite note saying "don't do that"... --Bill >From: "Douglas, Brent" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: Out of Office AutoReply: [RCSE] Is Profi the Answer? (More on >the sty 6 from ATL/NASA ) >Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2001 01:00:00 -0500 > >I love messing with these OUT OF OFFICE Auto Replies. > >lol > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] I soared every nite this past three weeks...
I wish I were that lucky... I'm so far down the totem pole that all I can do is stand between the dog and the fire hydrant... --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] I soared every nite this past three weeks... >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 23:34:26 EDT > > >I know what you mean! I rescued a ten minute flight from 50 feet with 6 >minutes to go and got waved through the grocery checkout pushing a fully >loaded cart to a standing ovation. The next damn week, I blew a 5 minute >flight and all my credit cards went blank. Sailplanin's a tough way to make >a >living, especially with all the interruptions of the work week. Sprinkle in >a >little rain on the weekends and that'll be me climbing the clock tower! Go >figure... :) > >Bill Wingstedt _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Bird of Time pictures web page owner
Andrew's addy is listed at the bottom of the page as "andrewm at netwinder dot org" to foil the Spambots. --Bill >From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Bird of Time pictures web page owner >Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:21:36 -0400 > >[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > > I have another good photo of a BOT but your email address is not on your >web > > page and I don't have it. > >If you mean this page: > http://www.netwinder.org/~andrewm/rc/bot/ >then that would be me :) > >-- >Andrew E. Mileski >Ottawa, Canada >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] please REMOVE me from list, thanks
The subscribe/unsubcribe info does appear to be missing from the _replies_ from your and other messages from the AOL domain. I don't know if this header is on the original messages _to_ AOL addresses. If AOL is truncating the footer information from your email messages, then YOU need to get in touch with AOL and have them stop "editing" your private mail. --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] please REMOVE me from list, thanks >Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 12:09:55 EDT > >Sorry to cause such a fuss about being removed from mail list. Most of you >responded saying that there was info at the bottom of the email, sorry to >say >that my aol email has no such info. Thanks for the update, i may return at >a >later date. Chris _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] re: midsouth?
Quite OK. Now that you mention it, I recall that Martin Road does have one-way traffic signs during certain times of the day/week. I'm sure that the Midsouth organizers have taken care of that detail. --Bill >From: "paul behr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "'Bill Harris'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,"'Behrp'" ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] re: midsouth? >Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:37:27 -0400 > >My apologies. Wrong road name. Martin rd. is the road I was refering to. >Sorry for the confusion. > >Paul B > >-Original Message- >From: Bill Harris [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2001 11:14 AM >To: Behrp; [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] re: midsouth? > > >Unless I'm mistaken, doesn't one need a "military bumper sticker" to travel >through the Redstone Arsenal property on Rideout Road? It looks a lot >shorter, but I've always traveled the round-about way down Memorial, etc, >because I assumed that Rideout was _verboten_ to civilians. > >--Bill > > > >From: "paul behr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Subject: [RCSE] re: midsouth? > >Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 13:53:52 -0400 > > > >Anyone planning on attending the events on Friday afternoon should make > >very > >sure that you get to Rideout rd. prior to 3:00 pm. Redstone makes that >road > >one way traffic outbound (away from the field) from 3:00 pm to 6:00 pm > >monday - friday. > >important safety tip. > >Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 09:57:13 -0500 > >From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Subject: MidSouth? > >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > > > >Who all is attending the MidSouth in Huntsville this weekend? I plan to > >arrive Friday morning and fly the Nostalgia event Friday on afternoon. > >Otherwise, I'll be spectating and politicking-- I don't have a >competitive > >plane ready for the TD event so I'll sit that one out. > > > >Take care, > > > >--Bill > >_ > > > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and > >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] re: midsouth?
Unless I'm mistaken, doesn't one need a "military bumper sticker" to travel through the Redstone Arsenal property on Rideout Road? It looks a lot shorter, but I've always traveled the round-about way down Memorial, etc, because I assumed that Rideout was _verboten_ to civilians. --Bill >From: "paul behr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] re: midsouth? >Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 13:53:52 -0400 > >Anyone planning on attending the events on Friday afternoon should make >very >sure that you get to Rideout rd. prior to 3:00 pm. Redstone makes that road >one way traffic outbound (away from the field) from 3:00 pm to 6:00 pm >monday - friday. >important safety tip. >Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2001 09:57:13 -0500 >From: "Bill Harris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: MidSouth? >Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED] ><mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >Who all is attending the MidSouth in Huntsville this weekend? I plan to >arrive Friday morning and fly the Nostalgia event Friday on afternoon. >Otherwise, I'll be spectating and politicking-- I don't have a competitive >plane ready for the TD event so I'll sit that one out. > >Take care, > >--Bill >_ > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Flying in Tullahoma
>for kicking some butt at the Mid-South... In your dreams... ;) See ya'll there! --Bill >From: "Brian & Iva Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Flying in Tullahoma >Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 11:24:21 - > >We are setting up a triangle and practicing each morning Monday through >Thursday in preperation for kicking some butt at the Mid-South..If your >around and have an AMA card, Your welcome to join us at 10 AM each >morning..Chuck, Ben, Texas Donny,Herb,and flyin' Brian.. >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] JR 347 question?
I'm not familiar with the JR347, but go to the Horizon WebSite at http://www.horizonhobby.com/ and see if their on-line manual library includes the 347. --Bill >From: "Marc Webster" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] JR 347 question? >Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2001 09:09:35 -0700 > >Hello All, > >I have an old JR347 which has been gathering dust and I plan to use on a MM >glidertech Lil Hornet. I want to use 4 servos. My question is. On the >347 >what channels do the individual aileron servos get connected to. I >currently do not have a receiver or a manual for this radio so I have no >way >of checking. I need to know so I can purchase a micro receiver with the >correct channels. I am afraid that if I buy a 5 or 6 channel receiver, >that >one of the servos would need channel 7 or 8. I am currently looking at the >GWS 6 channel micro receiver. I know range with this receiver is an issue, >but I don't forsee myself flying it very far away. Another option is the >FMA 5 channel receiver. > >Any help will be greatly appreciated, > >Marc Webster >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] NEEDED WINGROD
Don Richmond: [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.hilaunch.com/ has excellent wingrods. --Bill >From: Tom Broeski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] NEEDED WINGROD >Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 06:53:04 -0400 > >I need a wing rod for the Shadow >1/2" x 14" with 5 deg bend > >Anyone have one or know a source? > >Tom > >-- >T&G http://adesigner.com/invention >32 Mount View Dr. >Afton, VA 22920 > >540 943-3356 Fax 540 943-4178 > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] JR Radio Repair...
Radio repair: Radio South in Pensacola FL: http://www.wtp.net/DBEST/radiosouth/RS1.html or Kraft Midwest (advertise in RCReport). --Bill >From: Les Grammer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] JR Radio Repair... >Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 20:50:07 -0700 > >I seem to have bad luck with JR radio's. Yet again I find myself with a >dead transmitter (and yes, I checked the fuse). It started automatically >'resetting' itself (going through a power off/on cycle) during a flight. >After I landed and we looked it over a bit, couldn't find anything. Set it >aside for a bit, and it just suddenly never came back from the power off >state. The shorting on/off seemed to be caused by movement of the antenna. > We could wiggle it around and readily get it to cycle off. checked the >wiring...no problem. So, looks like off to well, where? > >I have, of course, lost my list of names for JR repair service. What's >your favorite service outlet, and what type of repairs did you have? My >last repair experience was less than pleasing, but I'm not naming names. >I'll just ignore that suggestion this time around. > >-Les Grammer, NWSS > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] list seems messed up
Web only? If you're reading RSCE via the Yahoo group, anything is possible. "The list" via email works per usual. --Bill >From: Lincoln Ross <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] list seems messed up >Date: Sun, 10 Jun 2001 16:43:49 -0400 > >I was reading the soaring list on web only, but it shows no more >messages after June 3. Are the rest of you getting the messages? >-- >Lincoln Ross >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] spars and wing joiners
Thanks, Tony. Good information. I'm looking forward to trying your Dark Star (or derivative) some day. Take care, --Bill >From: tony estep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] spars and wing joiners >Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2001 07:09:18 -0700 (PDT) > >The stress in a spar concentrates at the upper surface (compression) >and the lower surface (tension). You can spread it over two or more >spars or have a single spar, but the determining factor is the >cross-sectional area of the caps * the compression (or tension) >strength of the material in the caps. For the formulas governing spar >strength, see >http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles/allegro2m/spar_sizing.txt >It turns out that the an excellent all-around deal is a single spar >made out of solid balsa with the grain top to bottom, capped with >carbon 1x thick on the bottom and 2x thick on top, where x is >determined by spar height, width, and the desired load on the wing. The >load in turn depends on span and how hard you zoom. > >The Dark Star web page >http://www.mvsaclub.com/articles/dark_star2.htm >shows the easiest way to make and install such a spar in a D-tube wing. > > >--- Bill Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I've been toying around with some ideas on spar/wing joiner design. > > Let me > > run a couple of ideas by you. > > > > Given: a built-up polyhedral wing, two piece, bolt-on to the fuse. > > Spruce/CF/shear-web spar at 1/3 chord with a 5/16" steel wing rod at > > the > > spar. This is more or less the conventional wing construction. > > > > Here is a modification of this basic design: put in a lighter > > "secondary > > spar" at 2/3 chord and use two 1/4" wing rods at the primary and > > secondary > > spars. The wing would be stronger and the loads would be distributed > > > > between the two spars and the two wing rods. > > Yep, I just got through refurbishing an Oly 99 and that how Renaud > > did the > > spars/joiners on the Oly. > > > > Second: What stresses are present in a wing, especially during the > > critical > > time of launch loadings? Looking at a straight dihedral wing, it > > would seem > > that the greatest stress is at the center at the wing joiner and > > decreases > > to the wing tips. I think that the stresses would be similar in a > > polyhedral wing, I'm nor sure if there would be a stress > > concentration at > > the poly joint. > > > > Thanks, > > > > --Bill > > _ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send > > "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >__ >Do You Yahoo!? >Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 >a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] motorcycles
I haven't dropped the R60 in many years, so the yearly thing may not be true. But the midset of being mentally prepared to drop the bike (or to have a mishap) every time you ride is good defensive riding, IMO. It ain't like a car where you simply hop in and go somewhere. Truth is, I've not ridden my R60 since I moved to Jasper 10 years ago-- it was "in storge" for 5 years, and I've been planning to get "tires and a battery" for the last 5 years. Finally did this year and when I get time to put the tires on and check over the bike, I'll start riding again. Cautiously, until I get my "sea legs" back, then I'll start making longer trips. --Bill >From: "Gavin Botha" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "Dennis Phelan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] motorcycles >Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 08:16:21 -0700 > >I have been riding bikes continously for over 30 yrs., and have competed in >everything from off-road Trials to 750cc Superbike and F1 Racing. The once >a year thing is absolutely false, I have'nt dropped a street bike in over >12 >yrs. I agree with Dennis, ride smart and enjoy! > >Gavin (garage stuffed with 5 motorcycles) Botha > > >Dudes, >Actually: >There are only two kinds of motorcyclists, those who have fallen and those >that >will. > >There's no truth to the once a year, so enjoy the sport. > >Dennis >--- tony estep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Just remember what every rider knows. If you ride on the street, you > > will fall once a year. It could be on an untraveled road into soft > > grass; or it could be in front of an oncoming 18-wheeler. But it will > > happen. > > > > > > > >I turned 40 last year and began seriously eyeing > > > >motorcycles. _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Celebs in RC Soaring
Nifty website. It amazes me how realistic the special effects have become over the past few years, much better than the "model-on-a-string" effect of years ago. I'm curious... how were the Harrier scenes done in _True Lies_? I assume that they really didn't have Ahrnohld flying a plane in downtown Miami. --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Celebs in RC Soaring >Date: Wed, 23 May 2001 10:37:45 EDT > >Pat, >Thanks for the kind words, but my work can hardly qualify me as a >celebrity. >My team and I are just a few of the thousand or so individuals who bring a >movie to the big screen. We did win an Emmy for Visual effects on Miracle >Landing for the 1/10 737. Recently my team did the 1/4 scale Hueys for >Charlie's Angels, a nice explosion all done in the camera no CG >enhancements, >The 1/4 scale aft fuselage and tail section MD11 for Castaway, Bell 212s >for >Segals Exit Wounds, 1/6 th B25 for the Doolittle crash for Pearl Harbor, >1/4 >scale MDX 900 for Travoltas Operation Sworfdish, and WE have just finished >14 >Biplanes for Stuart Little 2 in various sizes and versions. I have worked >everyday since JAN 3 except Easter and Mother's day. I am now ready to >start >training for the F3J finals and am desperately looking forward to some >model >and full-size glider flying. By the way I am lucky to have several people >you guys fly with helping me. LJMP crew who also fly RCsaiplanes are Steve >Addis, Dennis Brandt, Bob Pope, Dan Fink, and many others. You can check >out >some past work at LJMP.com .Thanks Larry >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] JR 8103 mix questions
Other good articles on radio programming are on the Charles River RC site,
at:
http://www.charlesriverrc.org/articles_radiosystems.htm
--Bill
>From: "Andrew E. Mileski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Subject: Re: [RCSE] JR 8103 mix questions
>Date: Tue, 22 May 2001 10:59:31 -0400
>
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> >
> > Try this article. It is attached. Let me know what you think.
>
>Ugh, a DOC file ...
>
>Digital trims are not only available on the sailplane model,
>rather this seems to be how all the new 8103's ship. It's
>only digital on ail/ele/rud and mechanical on spoil.
>
>Trim offset option has been removed from the menu. Trim
>settings are now remembered. To center the trim lever, switch
>to numeric trim display [you didn't mention this either] to see
>the trim value, and use this value in the centering menu.
>
>That's about as far as I read ("strings filename | fmt | less"
>isn't the easiest to read). I suggest writing in it HTML so
>all the world can enjoy it :)
>
>Here are a few of my favorite programming links:
>
>http://www.orlandobuzzards.org/Flaps.htm
>http://w3.nai.net/~trvlhby/jr/jr_radio_page2.html#anchor331664
>http://www.benodee.com/rc/jr8103_jm_escape.htm
>
>The first changed my life :) I never would have thought of
>setting the travel adjustment to 0, and let a mix do the work.
>I've found this technique to be helpful in other situations too.
>
>--
>Andrew E. Mileski
>RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and
>"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
_
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
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Re: [RCSE] Code of Conduct, and Failure to observe it.
Agreed, Jim. This guy sounds like he is in serious need of an "attitude adjustment". --Bill >From: "jim larkin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "'Soaring'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >CC: "F3F \(E-mail\)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: Re: [RCSE] Code of Conduct, and Failure to observe it. >Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 09:04:06 -0500 > >Nathan--it is truly sad, but you are doing the right thing. I see a >continued moral breakdown in the good ole USA. People now pay absolutely >no attention to speed limits, stop signs, red lights, and many other LAWS . > I blame this on the breakdown of the family structure. Someone needs to >be made an example of. Jim > - Original Message - > From: Nathan Woods > To: 'Soaring' > Cc: F3F (E-mail) ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2001 1:23 AM > Subject: [RCSE] Code of Conduct, and Failure to observe it. > > > Today was a low point in my soaring career. I observed many people >wanting to physically and bodily cause harm one particular RC pilot. > > For the past three years, we reserve the Torrey Pine Glider Park for one >full weekend for our annual International F3F contest. We sanction this >event through the AMA, we reserve the slope many months in advance, and it >gets published on a number of calendars. This year was no exception. > > F3F racing is a short course format, and as such, we allow fun flying to >occur on the southern portion of the slope. We have a full time Safety >Officer equipped with an orange vest, hand held radio, and large red flag. >We do this because TPG is an active hang glider and parasail park, and we >coordinate when they can launch and/or flyover our section of the course, >as well as the flight zone(s) of the RC pilots not involved with racing. > > In short, we do everything in our power to share the air and keep things >safe. But some people just have to "push it." > > There is a particular gentlemen who resides the to SoCal area, and is a >Club Officer of an AMA sanctioned slope club. This particular man has >appeared on race day two years in a row, with an attitude that is far >larger than his stature. This gentleman refuses to obey the rules of >conduct established by the TPG staff, the CD of the race, and the >parasailers and Safety Officer. Instead of flying south of our race >course, this gentleman prefers to fly aerobatics only a few feet south of >our turn pylon with his cheap foamy. > > As you can imagine, this is extremely distracting to a racing pilot who >is concentrating mightily on this turn suddenly to discover a big 3 meter >foamy filling his airspace. Because of his actions, we were forced to >refly a number of races, which greatly impacts our schedule and >organization. > > After the dozenth infraction, communication with him broke down and >everyone resorted to simply screaming expletives back and forth. Finally, >one pilot nearly crashed his glider into the cliff face trying to avoid the >big foamy that once again invaded our airspace. This particular pilot and >a few others nearby rushed at the offending pilot with the intent to >"educate" him. > > The owner and manager of the TPG port is a retired police officer and >quickly took action to break things up, as well as some cooler heads >amongst our racing group. No punches were thrown, no one completely lost >it, and no planes were lost. > > However, thanks to the repeatedly hostile and aggressive actions of this >gentleman, as President of the ASRO, I, along with the CD of the race, the >TPG port manager, and several dozen witnesses, am forced to take action and >write to the AMA seeking his abolishment from the sport. > > Sir, I do not personally know you, but I encourage you to contact me, >and prepare your defense to the AMA. Your actions, behavior, character and >conduct are totally unacceptable, and in my opinion, your continued >association and membership with the AMA is a detriment to the sport. > > Sadly, > > Nathan Woods > President > American Slope Racing Organization > www.sloperacing.com > _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] cutting Kevlar
I wonder if the "cloth cutter" (like a reallly sharp pizza cutter) works on Kevlar? I use one for cutting film covering and 'glas cloth and it works well. --Bill >From: Michael Ackerman-Simpson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] cutting Kevlar >Date: Thu, 17 May 2001 19:26:21 -0700 > >I was just working with some Kevlar and used a technique I learned from >my wife(she quilts) that I have not seen mentioned here. Kevlar is >slippery stuff and I always have a hard time following a straight line >when I cut it. The trick( if you are cutting across the bolt of >material, from selveged edge to selvedged edge) is to pull out one of >the yarns(bundles of fibers) all the way across the cloth, this gives >you a line of reference to cut to and even if it gets tugged out of line >you wind up with a straight cut. > >Mike in Arcata > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Harley's been cloned!
Not troubling-- those actuators have been around for a while and are no competition. --Bill >From: "Nathan Woods" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Harley's been cloned! >Date: Fri, 11 May 2001 06:21:47 -0700 > >Just saw something troubling on Hobby-Lobbies site: > >It looks as if there are some RADs clones coming out. > >Go here and search for this: "CH901 Hidden Control Horns" >http://www.hobby-lobby.com/ > >You might have to scroll down a little bit to see them. > > >Nathan Woods >Orange, CA >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] bounced mail
Good luck, that didn't work for me. I forwarded the errant emails to the CIS/AOL postmasters and the List admin and never got the first response or action. Ended up putting the postmaster@CIS/AOL on my Twit filter... --Bill >From: Paul Klissner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Aerofoam* <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: Re: [RCSE] bounced mail >Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 10:23:35 -0700 > >Yeah. Its been happening for quite awhile. >When I get the bounced messages for this post, I'll >post the bounced headers so they can be removed >from the list by the administrator. > >-Paul > >Aerofoam* wrote: > > > > I just got an "undeliverable" message from compuserveand from AOL in >regards > > to my last rcse post, There are apparently 2 accounts that are bouncing >rcse > > posts back to the sender. Has anyone else had this happen? > > > > Mark Mech > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > www.aerofoam.com > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" >and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Mid-South contest coming up !
Is the "Friday Practice Session" at the UAH campus still on? As I recall, the usual "UAH sports complex practice field (NASF's normal flying site)" is no longer in use since it is being bulldozed. --Bill >From: "Jon Stone" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Mid-South contest coming up ! >Date: Thu, 10 May 2001 21:54:22 -0500 > >Make your plans now for the Mid-South contest on June 22-24th in >Huntsville, >Alabama. This is the largest contest in the Southeast US with ~100 pilots >for each of the past several years. > >Also, check out our impressive list of sponsors for our contest raffle. >Molded planes, composite planes, and computer radios being some of the top >prizes. > >For a complete info and a printable registration form, go to the NASF web >page. > > http://home.hiwaay.net/~samfara/ > >Email your registration in, and get your frequency reserved. You can send >the check in the mail the next day. > >Everyone who has entered the Mid-South for the past few years should have >already received a complete program and entry form via email or snail mail. > >See ya in June ! > >Jon Stone >North Alabama Silent Flyers > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] Electrics at Glider fields
>he said that it was ok to fly electric but that the noise was kind of >worrisome...< Good post, Mark. It might be that he was not so much worried about the noise _per_se_, but that a "non-silent" plane flying at the field might set a bad precedent and attract (louder) glo-powered planes. At Polo fields and Sod farms we walk on thin ice-- wonderful places to fly, but we don't want to do anything to jeopardize our continued use of the field. --Bill >From: Mark Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: John Derstine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ed Berris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: RE: [RCSE] Electrics at Glider fields >Date: Fri, 4 May 2001 10:19:02 -0700 (PDT) > >I am a member and past VP of MRCSS, the same club to >which Ed Berris belongs, although I now live some 4 >hours away and am not close to the day to day >happenings there. Ed brought up this question in >preparation for a meeting with the club Le' Grand >Fromage last night. I am not sure what brought up this >discussion within our club on having electrics at our >club field but there are issues which could effect all >of us. Our club is chartered as promoting the >enjoyment of sailplane modeling and as such have no >specific charter to promote electrics. > >We have some great flying fields in this club and have >had outstanding relationships with the landowners for >many years. It has taken a lot of good PR and common >sense to keep what we have and our goal is not to >loose the fields we fly at. It looks like there is no >problem with the speed 600 30 second motor run floater >type of electric sailplane but our fear seems to be >with the high power high wing loading types. They can >be just as annoying to some as a fueled airplane >model. The question is how do you be fair about it? >Why one and not the other and when exactly is the line >crossed and who will be the judge. All tough >questions. > >What is the need to fly electric at our clubs fields >when there is a sister club specifically for electrics >locally with which there are many common members >between both clubs. > >I also belong to MARCS here in Madison, WI and while >the club is mostly power with it's own flying field, >we also have an autonomous soaring contingent who fly >at a local polo field. Last summer I was out flying my >Zagi 400 at the polo field and the land owner came >down to see if I was a member of the club. I assured >him I was and it seemed his concern was the noise of >the Zagi. He thought it was a fuel model and was >surprised it was electric. After showing him the model >and how it worked he said that it was ok to fly >electric but that the noise was kind of worrisome. In >our conversations I showed him my non powered >sailplanes and did a walk through of what we did and >how. He seemed like a good fellow with a genuine >curiosity about our hobby. I expressed my enjoyment of >the hobby and that it was my peaceful time and where I >got many of life's enjoyments and thanked him for >allowing me to do it on his property. He made a good >point that we all must remember, that these times are >also his time to relax and find peace from the weekday >stress of life. I took that to mean we all must exist >together and I now do not fly electric there for fear >he will not give his permission to fly when the lease >comes up for renewal. > >I agree there is a lot of knowledge and technology >swapping that can take place, but when our ability to >fly on someone else's property solely because of the >nature of RC Soaring (read quiet and peaceful) can be >compromised we have to be concerned. > >Cheers, > >Mark Miller > >__ >Do You Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices >http://auctions.yahoo.com/ >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] More Tennis Ball Cannons
'67, Senior year in highschool, developed the BS cannon. 12"length of 2" pipe, with pipe cap drilled for fuse on cherry bomb/M80. Pack with bovine droppings. The weapon to end all war, too terrible to use... --Bill >From: "Steven Bixby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] More Tennis Ball Cannons >Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2001 10:17:19 -0700 > > > Tennis Ball Cannon > >... > >Hey, I done that too. If anyone here went to Mesa (State) College in >Grand >Junction CO and lived in the dorms during the years between 84-88, you can >blame me and my roommate(s) for some of the late evening study disruptions. >We often didn't bother with projectiles, cuz the cannon alone made some >wunnerful "WHOOMP"s that echoed across the campus and generated instant >rush-out-and-crane-necks-around-the-square activity from the dorm RA's. > >We went a scary step further, tho. :) > >Instead of tennis-ball sized cans, we built one using six two-quart juice >cans. (Took awhile to drink through 3 gallons of juice once we decided to >do it.) And instead of tennis balls, we raided the bathrooms of toilet >paper rolls. Roll off enough to get a moderately loose fit, jam the torn >off portion in the core to block the flow through the core. Roll a couple >more feet off to get a dangling tail.Aim over the top of the trees in >the courtyard (from the dorm-room balconies, that is). Flick-the-Bic and >hold on.WHUUUMPH!I wish I had a picture of the TP'ed trees from >that semester. The flying roll spins off TP like crazy and leaves a nice >long streamer over the target. > >Ah the good ole' days. > > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Battery Failure?
New battery? How many times did you cycle it, and what was the observed capacity? --Bill >From: "Ed Whittenburg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Battery Failure? >Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2001 19:36:49 -0700 > >Hi, Sunday I flew my new Maraj for the second time at Los Banos, 1st >flight time 45 minutes no problems, about two hours later I recharged the >JR 5 cell 1100 with my Hobbico charger until it said it was fully charged, >I checked the voltage with my Hobbico voltage meter and it said it was >charged to 6.35 volts. 2nd flight lasted only about 15 minutes, when I made >a turn there was no response at the sticks, I checked the radio and it >seemed fine so all I could do is watch my new plane go into the lake, >luckly she floated to the edge but there is alot of damage to the wing. >Later I checked the voltage and it was only at 1.32 volts. What do you >think may have happened. Thank you Ed Whittenburg _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [RCSE] digital cams for soaring pictures
Good photos, Bob. Silicon imaging still has a way to go to catch up to halide imaging, but still, it's come a long way. It wasn't too long ago that the top-of-the-line $5000 Kodak digital camera wasn't any more sophisticated than today's $100 kid's toy digital. --Bill >From: "Robert Bingham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "courtice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: RE: [RCSE] digital cams for soaring pictures >Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2001 17:32:18 -0800 > >Thanks for the plug BTW ;-) > >I've been shooting a Canon D30 (SLR style Digital) since xmas, and it >shows. >The problem I've had with other digitals that are not SLR style is the >delay >from when you push down on the shutter button, to the time the picture is >actually taken. I think the Sony's do a fair job of attempting to fix the >problem with their newer DSC-P1, but there is still about a 1/2 second >delay, and it's still in the $700 range. The other option is to take >camcorder frame grabs. I've seen some good results from this, but only when >the video camera is within it's optical range (not digital range). I've not >had great luck with Epson, and Kodak camera for action shots. > >no matter how you slice it, digital has a fair way to go before you get the >quality of a good 35mm camera for less than $500 for action shots. If you >looking for static shots, then that's a whole other question there are >lots of choices everywhere. > >Bob Bingham >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://www.gliderking.com > > > >-Original Message- >From: courtice [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 4:40 AM >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] digital cams for soaring pictures > > >Aloha to all. I am looking for some input on choosing a digital camera to >purchase. I want to be able to take good looking in-flight shots something >like what Robert Bingham has been posting on his gliderking website. >http://www.gliderking.com. > >I don't want to spend a fortune, hopefully less than $500. > >Any suggestions or recommendations would be appreciated. > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.240 / Virus Database: 116 - Release Date: 3/23/01 > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] AWESOME STUFF, New vacation plans
So, let me guess where Denny's vacationing this year... ;) Agreed, Paul's vids are top-notch. The "Soar Utah" video is on my to-get list. --Bill >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] AWESOME STUFF, New vacation plans >Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 07:16:21 EST > >DUDES > > If you have not seen Soar Utah by Radio Carbon Art, it is an absolute >"must >have" for anyone even remotely interested in RC soaring, great scenery, >good >music, or just plain relaxing after a whole lot of 16 hour days in a row. >The filming is superb and the location is such that any of us from the east >coast will be calling our realtors to list the house. Paul's vidios are >always great but, he has out done himself this time. I am not much of a TV >guy but Paul has a talent for putting together vidios that make me want to >see more. The concentration of gorgeous scenery, superb airplanes and >awesome flying make this film something that you don't eant to miss. > >Thanks Paul and Aimee > >Denny Maize >Polecat Aeroworks >(717) 789-0146 >[EMAIL PROTECTED] >http://www.polecataero.com">http://www.polecataero.com >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Fiberglass Oly II fuselage
I recall that Dream Catcher carries 'glas fuses for some of the Airtronocs line. Check at http://www.dchobby.com/ . --Bill >From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: "RCSE" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Subject: [RCSE] Fiberglass Oly II fuselage >Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2001 15:46:25 -0800 > >It seems to me that someone makes a fiberglass fuselage for the Oly II. I >have come onto a set of uncovered wings that are just crying for a >fuselage. Anyone out there have a source? Thanks! >Dave Darling > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Soaring today in Tullahoma
Rub it in!!! I was smashing thumbs Friday doing carpentry with my carport-to-workshop remodeling project. Useful project, but I'd rather have been flying... --Bill >From: "Brian Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Subject: [RCSE] Soaring today in Tullahoma >Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2001 17:26:42 -0600 > >Man what a soaring day in Tullahoma Tn todayI have sunburned my >teeth...grinning into sky all day as I had to work to keep my model from >consistently trying to get outta sight..Brian Smith >_ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: [RCSE] CA remover
Heck, that all? If it ain't on an aeroplane, hit it with some lemon Pledge... --Bill On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 19:44:15 -0700 Aerofoam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Try a 100 year old maple end table I flew with 2 eagles today, I may have pics too!!! Mark Mech [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.aerofoam.com > Mark--You mean like on a mahagony dining room table ?Jim > - Original Message - RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Tug Question
John Derstine has some aerotowing info at his Scale Soaring site: http://geocities.com/~scalesoar/ And I think that Sailplanes Unlimited has aerotowing info, too: http://sailplanes.com/ --Bill On Sat, 3 Mar 2001 09:35:32 -0500 Chris & Debby Hawkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I plan to try aero towing this summer. The plane I am going to tow is a 3 meter ASW 28. What I need are tug recommendations and engine needs. Thanks...Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Wilga Plan
I think that Bob Holman carries plans for a Wilga. http://www.angelfire.com/ct/bhplans/ --Bill On Sat, 3 Mar 2001 09:12:06 -0300 =?iso-8859-1?Q?Edson_N=F3brega?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Guys Does somebody know where I can find a plan by plane Wilga in DXF or DWG? []'s an good flights. Edson Nóbrega Brazil RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Chrysalis fuse wt.
Here are the weights on my Chrysalis: AUW: 12.25 oz Wings: 4.25 oz (2-piece wings) Total fuse weight: 8 oz 1.5 oz 150 mAh battery 1 oz nose weight 555 Rx, HS55 servos: 1.4 oz "Bare" fuse: 4.1 oz Covered with transparent Monokote (fuse & wings), lightening holes in V-tail, 1/8" CF pushrods, bolt-on wings. Do post your results whne you get done. --Bill On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 18:38:19 -0800 Bill Johns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Idle curiosity. Would folks who have a Chrysalis weight just the fuse and report back to the masses. I'm wondering about the weight of the fuse less radio gear so if you have stuff in yours, could you please list the items so we can make a few estimates as to what the fuse and tail feathers together weigh. Thanks, Bill -- There is no such thing as a pretty good alligator wrestler. Bill Johns Pullman, WA RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: [RCSE] More on ARF Trainers - Hanger 9 Aspire vs GP Spirit
I've toyed with the idea of getting an ARF and electrifying it, but with all the extra work it'd need to make an ARF airworthy, I'd be better off building one. I'm thinking about doing this with Ray Hayes' 2-m Lil'Bird, BTW. --Bill On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 14:56:05 -0500 "Andrew E. Mileski" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don Munro wrote: > > Now... does anyone have any comments about the Hanger 9 Aspire as a > beginner's ARF trainer. I was not at all impressed with the Aspire. http://www.netwinder.org/~andrewm/rc/aspire.html I bought it with hopes it would just go together quickly and I could keep it in the back of the car. Neither was true. I'm currently building a Bird Of Time. I think it is a better deal, given the amount of time and effort I spent on the so calle "ARF" Aspire. -- Andrew E. Mileski RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] Spoiler servo installation
It'll be a tight fit no matter what.
I just retrofitted spoilers to an Oly 99 and here is a rundown of what I did:
1. I cut a 3/16" deep notch in the ribs just aft of the spar and framed a rectangular
spoiler bay out of 3/16" x 3/16" stick balsa. The floor of the bay is 1/32" balsa
sheet and is absent in the center where the servo fits.
2. The spoiler blade is 1-1/4" x ~10" (a even number of ribs) and made of 1/16" ply
faced with 3/32" balsa. The balsa faces outward and initally stands a bit proud of
the top surface of the wing. Sand the balsa to match the curve of the wing surface,
and paint or cover. The spoiler hinge is done with hinge-tape.
3. A 1/16" ply plate is glued between two ribs near the center of the spoiler bay at
the bottom of the wing. There is enough room to fit a sub-micro servo between the
spoiler blade and this ply plate. The servo is held to the play plate with
double-sided servo tape.
4. Actuation is by either an extended servo arm pushing against the (spring-closed)
spoiler blade or by a short linkage between the servo arm and the spoiler blade. Run
servo extensions to the wing root and thence a) to a Y-connector to the Spoiler
Channel or b) use two added extensions and run one servo from the Spoiler Channel and
mix SPOI with an AUX channel to run the other servo. The latter is preferred since
you can adjust each spoiler separately with the ('puter) Tx.
5. This is only one way to do spoilers, YMMV.
--Bill
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 13:46:41 -0600 "Stanley B. Koch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Is there any info showing servo installation of spoilers for Vintage or RES?
I'm having trouble with the Grand Esprit due to lack of space.
falconeye
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Re: [RCSE] Sprinkler System
I'd doubt that you can do much with a home-rigged system here. Restaurants have a fire-supression system (like Halon) installed around the stoves; I'd look in the Yellow Pages and see what is available. --Bill On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 11:16:35 -0800 (PST) Jeb Bushell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: My shop is a fire hazard. It contains loads of inflammable substances, including our heating oil tank. I figured I could rig a sprinkler system without too much trouble. Anyone done this? What's the scoop? Can you buy the gear in Home Depot? TIA Jeb Bushell Newtown Square, PA __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RCSE] How can beginners locate a sailplane club?
Two ways to do this. Go to the AMA site at http://www.modelaircraft.org/ pull up the page(s) for AMA clubs in your area and look for sailplane clubs. Another is to go to RC Soaring.com and look at Joe's Soaring Clubs page: http://www.rcsoaring.com/clubs.shtml --Bill On Wed, 14 Feb 2001 07:46:20 -0600 David Cole <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: While my website has stuff for everyone (such as links, info on wind forecasts), it is PRIMARILY aimed at helping beginners to find a sailplane club, choose a first glider and radio based on their situation, and get off to a good start building and flying. One of the items on my web site that is not as helpful to beginners as I would like is my information on how to locate a sailplane club in their area. Is there a comprehensive list of sailplane clubs? If not, what non-comprehensive online lists do you know of so I can add more links? Here's what I have so far on my "Sailplane Links" page (note that the items to the left in quotes are actual links on the web page): Searching for a Sailplane Club in Your Area "DARTS links" - See list of Sailplane Clubs web sites at top of page "AMA Club Lists" - Start here, find list of clubs for your area or state, then look at each club in your city or metro area. Since most clubs are for powered planes, look for keywords in the club name like "soar" or "silent" or "glider" or "sail". Thanks for any help! David Cole Fort Worth, Texas RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
