from:"dave"

On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 3:55 PM Peter C. Wallace  wrote:
snip

>
> Looks like it would be fine for a router type applications but not 
> mills/lathes
> that need real time feedback for threading, rigid tapping etc. It might
> allow LinuxCNC use without a real time kernel though.
>

My exact application.  Cutting wood with a router that could probably
move 300 ipm if I cranked it up.  Current settings are max 180 ipm and
2ips/s/s accel.  I would like to use your products but they are really
getting into overkill fully loaded cost/complexity to set up for this
thing.  Right now it is all running with a $20 BOB and an old HP
desktop with a PCI parallel port card that is older than the PC.

Dave

> Peter Wallace
> Mesa Electronics
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel

On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 3:25 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:
>
>
>
> > > Is the 7i92 less expensive?  Do we even know the price of this USB->DB25
> > > device?
> > >
> >
> > $65 + $25 shipping to the US.  Given the shipping cost of the 7i92
> > plus the cost of the cable needed it is less expensive.
>
> Not true I think.  2x $65 plus perhaps still $25 shipping to the US since the 
> 7i92H has two ports.   At that price point there are other MESA/PICO 
> solutions that also have a break out board so now you have to factor that 
> into the price too.
>
> And it's still USB.  Can it handle a 2500 line quadrature encoder?   The 
> control is the small part of the overall CNC conversion.  I found that buying 
> the CNC Cape for the BeagleBone  which all around seemed like the lowest 
> entry cost ultimately wasn't cheaper and it's sitting in a box.
>
> John
>
>

For my purposes I don't need two ports or the ability to read an
encoder.  One port is enough.  I am driving four steppers and reading
a few home switches.  This guy is claiming 150 kHz so way faster than
I need for 3200 microsteps per inch at 3 ips.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel

On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 2:18 PM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> Is the 7i92 less expensive?  Do we even know the price of this USB->DB25
> device?
>

$65 + $25 shipping to the US.  Given the shipping cost of the 7i92
plus the cost of the cable needed it is less expensive.

> Just perhaps this is what the guys in Poland did then they are selling a $2
> chip burried in a $10 cable for $100 each?  It could work.
>
Most likely what they have done.  I suspect that a Mach 3 UC-100 is
done that way too.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel

That is what the video is.  It is being used as an interface from a
Raspberry Pi 4 running LinuxCNC.  From the info on the website it is
LinuxCNC only.

Dave

On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 2:17 PM John  wrote:
>
> Does it even work with LinuxCNC?
>
> Sent from John's iPhone 4S
>
> On 2020-07-23, at 11:07 AM, Dave Matthews  wrote:
>
> > The biggest plus I see is that if it is easy to set up it might be a
> > good way to go, especially at $90 delivered.  I am not a big fan of
> > USB but it does seem to work fine for the Mach 3 crowd.  The biggest
> > negative I see for the Mesa products is that they are very difficult
> > to get set up for most people.  The LinuxCNC docs are set up for
> > people that have been using it for 20 years or those that want to
> > spend hours digging.  Even finding docs for setting up auto gantry
> > alignment on my parallel port router has been difficult.  I have found
> > a couple examples for Mesa setups but knowing what to edit on my setup
> > is not clear.  Stopconf works great but after that it gets real murky
> > real fast.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> > On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 12:52 PM John Dammeyer  
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> This might have been mentioned on the MACH CNC group but the reality is 
> >> that if you want LinuxCNC and two parallel ports the MESA 7i92 is less 
> >> expensive and not tied to potential speed issues via USB.   For example 
> >> WIN-10 won't run the USB based Smooth Stepper  but will run the Ethernet 
> >> Smooth Stepper with MACH4.
> >>
> >> So for LinuxCNC at $89 the 7i92H is just overall a better deal.  Or any of 
> >> the MESA or PICO based products.  For all the costs involved in CNC the 
> >> truth is during the learning curve part the broken tool bits and trashed 
> >> work is far more expensive but considered part of the costs.  Ethernet is 
> >> faster and less likely to have timing issues.
> >>
> >> My 2 cents.
> >>
> >> John
> >>
> >>> -Original Message-
> >>> From: Dave Matthews [mailto:n36...@gmail.com]
> >>> Sent: July-23-20 8:42 AM
> >>> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> >>> Subject: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel
> >>>
> >>> A link to a video for this thing showed up in my facecrap feed.  It
> >>> looks like a UC-100 only for LinuxCNC 2.9.  They are demoing on a Pi
> >>> 4.  Has anyone got any experience with the Linumeric-LPT v1?  Price
> >>> and ordering are not shown on the site, you are directed to email
> >>> them.
> >>>
> >>> Product Link - http://machmaker.pl/index.php?p=1_13
> >>>
> >>> VIdeo -
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txivr8j86t8=youtu.be=IwAR04UYfSGbRucny1aek0HVgJGrBkG0FiaxosNx_DQ
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel

The biggest plus I see is that if it is easy to set up it might be a
good way to go, especially at $90 delivered.  I am not a big fan of
USB but it does seem to work fine for the Mach 3 crowd.  The biggest
negative I see for the Mesa products is that they are very difficult
to get set up for most people.  The LinuxCNC docs are set up for
people that have been using it for 20 years or those that want to
spend hours digging.  Even finding docs for setting up auto gantry
alignment on my parallel port router has been difficult.  I have found
a couple examples for Mesa setups but knowing what to edit on my setup
is not clear.  Stopconf works great but after that it gets real murky
real fast.

Dave

On Thu, Jul 23, 2020 at 12:52 PM John Dammeyer  wrote:
>
> This might have been mentioned on the MACH CNC group but the reality is that 
> if you want LinuxCNC and two parallel ports the MESA 7i92 is less expensive 
> and not tied to potential speed issues via USB.   For example WIN-10 won't 
> run the USB based Smooth Stepper  but will run the Ethernet Smooth Stepper 
> with MACH4.
>
> So for LinuxCNC at $89 the 7i92H is just overall a better deal.  Or any of 
> the MESA or PICO based products.  For all the costs involved in CNC the truth 
> is during the learning curve part the broken tool bits and trashed work is 
> far more expensive but considered part of the costs.  Ethernet is faster and 
> less likely to have timing issues.
>
> My 2 cents.
>
> John
>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Dave Matthews [mailto:n36...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: July-23-20 8:42 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: [Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel
> >
> > A link to a video for this thing showed up in my facecrap feed.  It
> > looks like a UC-100 only for LinuxCNC 2.9.  They are demoing on a Pi
> > 4.  Has anyone got any experience with the Linumeric-LPT v1?  Price
> > and ordering are not shown on the site, you are directed to email
> > them.
> >
> > Product Link - http://machmaker.pl/index.php?p=1_13
> >
> > VIdeo -
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txivr8j86t8=youtu.be=IwAR04UYfSGbRucny1aek0HVgJGrBkG0FiaxosNx_DQ
> > iKoZXNBPOXl1Raue3A
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
>
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[Emc-users] Machmaker USB -> Parallel

A link to a video for this thing showed up in my facecrap feed.  It
looks like a UC-100 only for LinuxCNC 2.9.  They are demoing on a Pi
4.  Has anyone got any experience with the Linumeric-LPT v1?  Price
and ordering are not shown on the site, you are directed to email
them.

Product Link - http://machmaker.pl/index.php?p=1_13

VIdeo - 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txivr8j86t8=youtu.be=IwAR04UYfSGbRucny1aek0HVgJGrBkG0FiaxosNx_DQiKoZXNBPOXl1Raue3A

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Calculating table acceleration. Was: Need help with Bostomatic BD18-2 to linuxcnc

2020-07-23 Thread dave engvall




On 7/23/20 7:53 AM, Bari wrote:
It's really not a big deal. Engineering and science is full of math 
operations that you have to jump to all the time. If it is too 
difficult find someone else that is not a complainer to help you.



On 7/23/20 12:34 AM, Chris Albertson wrote:

Why on Earth do people still use US units?   OK if your final result 
must
be expressed that way, but do the math in metric then convert at the 
end.


Careful Chris ... you are being  logical. ;-) Politics and logic are 
rarely in the same room. But then I'm an old grump. We had our chance 
to convert when we build the interstate hwy system. If we had 
converted to Km and liters at that time we might be metric by now. Any 
manufacturing that competes internationally converted long ago. The 
military converted long ago but in the '60's the grid was metric but 
the heights were still in feet.

   Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] wondering what the status is on S curve jerk control getting added into linuxcnc

2020-07-23 Thread dave engvall


A couple of sources:
http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/motion/softdmc.pdf  50 us cycle -:)

Some years ago a masters candidate in ME at UBC did her thesis on motion 
control with jerk limiting and sine wave accel. I used to have a copy of 
it but cannot find it.
IIRC is would be post 2005 and author's name was something like Silvia 
M(a)cFarland.
On the one axis motion controller what cycle time were you using and did 
faster cycle times smooth it any?


Dave

On 7/22/20 1:51 PM, andrew beck wrote:

hey guys

I have a relatively high speed machine (3kw motors 16mm pitch ballscrews)
  35mm linear rails, and weights 5.8 ton.  I think it used to go 20m/min
with the heidenhain control.  I have been noticing a bit of jumping around
when doing parallel finishing 3d passed on it at high speed.  and talked to
a couple of linuxcnc guys and found out that linuxcnc doesn't have any jerk
control.  just sending out a email here seeing what the current progress is
on that.

at high speed high precision linuxcnc definitely needs some work at some
stage.

apart from this I am completely happy with linuxcnc.  this would be a nice
thing to solve though.  and if someone with the right skills wanted to fix
it I would be happy as to chip in to pay something for the time.  as I run
a business in my machine shop where everything runs linuxcnc

in the mean time I will try to get around the issue by programming in cam

regards

Andrew

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Re: [Emc-users] off topic: pwm with a stepper driver/motor

2020-07-13 Thread Dave Matthews

It may just be my age but wouldn't it be easier to just use a 555 (do they
still make them) and a knob to tweak the pulse rate to match the star?  Add
a slew button to change the speed while the button is pushed and a
direction switch to toggle the direction pin on the driver.  I guess I
don't see the need for a computer to run a stepper at a constant speed.

Dave

On Mon, Jul 13, 2020, 22:46 R C  wrote:

> well,  I can calculate what the speed needs to be, also I can actually
> "observe" it too..  by pointing the  telescope at a star and see how
> much the deviation is.  I have encoder to check the actual speed of a
> shaft.
>
> I found some information in a manual/tech-sheet that comes with the
> drivers, so I am trying to figure out what the best stepping rate is and
> what the best way of actually sending pulses to the stepper-driver is.
>
> I wrote some c-code that runs the motors in pthreads, I just want to
> know what the best way is.  pulse lengths, pause/gap length etc.
> (basically the best way to use a dm542  (all those steppers are sorta
> the same I understand)
>
> The driver tech-sheet  basically says it can do pretty all it's
> available micro stepping with a 1.8 degree stepper motor, I wonder if
> that is really true.
>
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 7/13/20 8:35 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:
> > A fast control loop that drives each motor at a given speed and a second
> > slower control loop that figures out what that speed should be.   The
> > second loop typically uses "PID" even if only in fact the "P" is used.
> >
> > That can be used to drive any number of motors all at their correct
> speeds.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 13, 2020 at 7:28 PM R C  wrote:
> >
> >> Interesting,
> >>
> >>
> >> but I already have the motors,  and  the gears are on their way.   What
> >> I was really looking for is how to drive the stepper-drivers, he DM542
> >> series ones.
> >>
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On 7/13/20 7:53 PM, cogoman via Emc-users wrote:
> >>> I recently discovered geared stepper motors.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> http://www.zyltech.com/nema-17-stepper-motor-geared-planetary-gearbox-1-7-a-3-1-nm-435-ozin/
> >>>
> >>> I've been happy with zyltech in the past.  I bought one of these for
> >>> evluation, but the specs seem to be great for CNC. Low enough current
> >>> to work with a stepstick, High enough torque for a fairly powerful
> >>> machine, and less than 4 mH inductance should let it step pretty fast.
> >>>
> >>> 5.18:1 gear ratio should reduce that 4 meter spur gear, but the link
> >>> below has higher gear ratios that would reduce that spur gear greatly!
> >>> Backlash could be a problem for CNC, but if you are only going one
> >>> way, the less precision gearboxes might be fine.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> https://www.omc-stepperonline.com/geared-stepper-motor/?sort=p.price=ASC
> >>>
> >>> Once you visit the stepperonline web page you know as much about them
> >>> as I do, but their offerings might be just right for your application.
> >>>
> >>> On 7/9/20 2:23 PM, R C wrote:
> >>>> Hello,
> >>>>
> >>>> this is (probably) off topic, been seen that happen.  If it is please
> >>>> ignore it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I am building a "motorized"  telescope mount (dobsonian) with what is
> >>>> called an equatorial platform, it has 3 axis which I am going to
> >>>> drive with stepper motors.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> The stepper motors I use with a stepper driver, those common DM542
> >>>> ones, the stepper motors themselves are 2A and 1.8 degrees per step.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> What I want to accomplish with the equatorial platform)  (it
> >>>> compensates for the rotation of the earth) is that,  the start and
> >>>> end position accuracy is not that important,  smooth and
> >>>> constant/consistent movement is.  for the azimuth/altitude precision
> >>>> is not a really big deal, but you'd want to move these 2 axis
> >>>> somewhat swift.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> So there are a few factors to decide.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I probably want micro stepping,  what settings on the driver for
> >>&

Re: [Emc-users] SSD reliability

2020-07-04 Thread Dave Cole

I have a number of Samsung EVO SSDs running in production equipment.  
They were either original or replacements for rotating drives.

Most of these PCs are on 24x7 and I have yet to have a SSD failure.
I think I started using Samsung SSD drives right after Samsung 
introduced them.  However I think they were called something else before 
they got the EVO name.
Most of the computers are running Linux.   A few are running Windows 
10.  (Off the internet)   Two are running Windows XP with the software 
modified so they don't randomly write to the drives.


The good thing:   They have never failed.   The bad thing:  The 
customers don't call me every few years to replace drives!


For a while I was having motherboard failures due to he bad capacitors 
that were installed on millions of motherboards, then hard drives would 
fail about every 2-3 years, and then power supplies would die.
Now, with good motherboards void of the lousy capacitors, power supplies 
are the number one issue.


I think I also have 6-8 EVO drives installed in laptops running Linux 
and Windows 7 and 10.  Both for laptops that I use and my family uses.
I am also sold on Samsung Monitors.  I have a number of them and have 
installed a number of them and none of them have died.


The Samsung SSDs are crazy reliable.

Dave



On 7/3/2020 2:39 PM, Ted wrote:
I'm quite partial to traditional 2.5" SATA SSD's; I have about 30 
servers with SAS/SATA slots running either Kingston or Sandisk 3Gb/s 
SSD's in 480Gb capacities. My home SAN runs 20 x 1TB SSD's (also 
Kingston) and if I rummage through my gig bag, I'll probably find half 
a dozen 1tb M2 SSD's in sata/usb3 cases. After about 6+ years in 24-7 
run capacity (yes, servers do get rebooted and wiped/rebuilt of 
course) in effectively webserver / asset server /db server setups - 
meaning lots of writes, I have yet to have a 2.5" 3GB/s SATA ssd fail.


Conversely, those "ultra-awesome" Crucial Micron M2 SSD modules I have 
had fail on 4 separate occasions - all of them within "warranty," and 
Crucial was not able/willing to RMA any of them - completely lousy 
customer service, which tempted me to just "buy and replace" through 
amazon (no I didn't, morally incorrect, but tempting). I also have 
some of the hybrids (both early Hitachi, whatever Apple was using in 
the early mac pro tubes) - many of those have failed, so I avoid 
hybrids like the plague, even if that new Fire series from Seagate is 
touted as the next best thingfor full transparency, I do have 
another SAN shelf with 24 1TB 2.5" traditional spindles (because it's 
an SAS-only shelf without interposers) that has been a solid performer 
for a long time - probably up 5+ years now, the only time off was 
moving the server racks and power failures. It's a Netapp shelf, so 
somewhat surprising that it has held up so well (nothing to do with 
the drives however).


Which just goes to show that mileage may vary wildly. I could have a 
dozen drives go out within 5 minutes of hitting send, or not. But for 
power savings and speed*, and not having to worry about what happens 
if a server is mounted directly on top of the UPS stack, or how the 
drives get transported, SSD media is a benefit in my book.


(* - my server installs have shown to run faster against the default 
SAS 72GB slow drives that my servers come with - some folks have shown 
that SSDs can be slower than fast HD's with specific testing, and that 
stable platters consume less continuous power than idle SSDs during 
initial writing. My power bill tells a different story.)


Cheers,

Ted.




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Re: [Emc-users] fitting chuck to backplate on a BS-1 clone

2020-07-01 Thread dave engvall

Measure from an arbitrary center to perimeter and calculate from three 
points. Adjust and remeasure.


On 7/1/20 9:08 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

Greetings all;

I had to drill a pin hole and drive this backplate with a dead blow
hammer to get it locked to this BS-1 well enough to machine a register
shoulder, but finally got that done although I haven't tested it for fit
yet, but the chucks internal shoulder is 130.06 mm and the register is
now 130.05.

Bolt holes for its 8mm cap screws to mount it are I'd assume at 0, 120,
and 240 degrees.

I'll have to use a 1/4" endmill to drill the holes, which I'll spiral to
make an 8mm hole. No room above it on this mill for anything that looks
like a drill it, I'm only a few mm from the G0704's upper stop.

My problem is getting an accurate diameter for the bolt circle. I can put
the  center of the 1/4" tool at say 4mm from the ledger, and the spiral
till reduce that to around 2.8 mm between the bolthole and the ledger.
That should get it within a mm.

The diameter is quoted at 145 mm, but that would mean using my holefinder
to find the center of a 20 some mm hole in the BS-1.  That would work IF
I can figure out how to get it into the machine with my lack of room.

How do you folks find a center when there is not room enough to use your
regular tools?

Thanks.

Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] q for Chris on 5mm cal routine

2020-06-17 Thread Dave Matthews

On Wed, Jun 17, 2020 at 1:04 PM Chris Albertson
 wrote:
>
> Gene,
>
>
> I just went and looked at the Ender3 printer.  There is one major
> difference between your Ender3 and My Anet A6.   Yours uses a "Bowden Tube"
> type feed system and mine is direct drive.  So on your system, the motor
> that moves the PLA filament is mounted to the frame and pushes the
> filament into the Teflon tube.   On my printer, the motor is an
> integral part of the print head and those "pusher gears" are just a few mm
> above the nozzle. They use fins and a fan to keep heat from the motor.
> The advantage of your is a lighter head that can move faster and more
> accurately.   Mine has better control of plastic quantity and flow rate.
>  People will argue which is best.
>

This post reminded me that I had a problem with the feed on my CR-10s
at one time.  The grub screws on the filament feed gear were slipping
on the shaft.  I ended up getting some gears with two screws and that
took care of the problem.  Check to see if the filament feed gear is
slipping.  I am guessing the Ender and CR-10 used the same design and
parts.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Health update

2020-06-10 Thread dave engvall





On 6/10/20 12:47 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:
Gene,
Take care and be careful. Can't say much more as you probably won't 
listen anyway. ;-)
Be glad you live in a time when cardiac care is pretty well understood. 
Else you'd be

long gone.
Dave


On Wednesday 10 June 2020 15:17:19 Chris Albertson wrote:


Gene,

Just take it easy and do what the doctors tell you.

That would be VERY boring.  They asked if I was interested in doing any
cardiac rehab.  The last time I did call and check, but when he asked
what I was doing and I said I was up an a ladder wiring up a cnc machine
I though he was going to have a heart attack.  His last words before the
call ended was that if I was doing that, he couldn't do a thing for me.
I still get a VBG just remembering that.

As for stuff to do that is not so physically demanding, it seems your
printer came at the right time.  You can use it for simple things but
also for projects that require a great deal of thinking. Someone
asked a while back for a palm-sized  printable continuously variable
gearbox. (think of using rubber balls for "gears" so the effective
radius depends on "latitude")  Some one else asked me to make a small
toy for kids 8 and up. There is lots to do in the space where machines
weigh in at 100 grams or less.

Now if I can put the last 2 motors I bought to work, using this printers
output to help do it, then we'll see what other trouble I can get into.

The first one replaces the 1600 on the sheldon's Z, and the 2nd one will
run that BS-1.

Cheers, Gene Heskett





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Re: [Emc-users] pix too big, rejected, so Chris is only other receiver.

2020-06-05 Thread Dave Matthews

On Fri, Jun 5, 2020 at 8:34 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
>
> After doing that one, i took the right post slider loose and loosened its
> fit on the vertical, as I noted there were Z movements that weren't
> making to the other end of the bar.
>
> And raised the tension in the x belt which turned out to be slack enough
> it was just laying on the right end idler pulley.
>
> But before I try another 10 hour print, I'd like to see an improved much
> better filled tooth profile, my guess is that its 10% or less, no high
> strength fill behind what might be called teeth.  I'd like to see a 100%
> fill for at least 4mm behind the teeth, but cura isn't doing any of
> that.  Those teeth are 100% crushable all the way to the bore
> reinforcement.

Do yourself a big favor and print a calibration cube and a benchy.
You may also want to do a temperature tower to figure out your
filament.  Printing real parts before you get the numbers figured out
is a waste of time.  When I got done with it I found that I could do
most things by taking the Cura defaults and setting bed temp to 60 and
filament in the 190-200 region.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] missing feature of openscad

2020-06-02 Thread Dave Matthews

On Tue, Jun 2, 2020, 20:09 Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Tuesday 02 June 2020 18:22:20 Chris Albertson wrote:
>
> > Cura has about 200 settings that you can change.   You might try
> > printing on a raft or using say 50% infill density and Gyroid pattern
> > I print small gears with 1.6 wall thickness.   Slowing the speed to
> > 30mm/sec works some times
> >
> That last was so disappointing that I now have a 12 tooth gear, with a
> hub 12mm high, printing at 30mm and 100% infill.  That of course
> disclosed that I wasn't anywhere near close enough to the bed for
> adhesion, so I raised the rear of it about a turn of the wheels.  Then
> it started sticking.  But there so little spring left to lift the bed
> that I'm going to modify the z switch to lower it another 1/8 ", which
> will compress the springs and make them far more repeatable.
>

I found that cleaning the glass with alcohol and then giving it a spray of
aquanet hairspray helped adhesion a lot.  I usually had to let the glass
cool completely to get the parts off.

Dave

>

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Re: [Emc-users] missing feature of openscad

2020-06-02 Thread Dave Matthews

On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 11:39 AM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> On Tuesday 02 June 2020 05:57:59 Chris Albertson wrote:
>
> > Docs?  The entire printer is open source.
>
> No it is NOT!  The Cura slicer is windows only. And there will be a
> language barrier that prevents a request for that source code from ever
> being replied to.  Been there, done that too many times already.
>
When I go to the Cura downloads page it lists - Ultimaker Cura 4.6.1
Linux, 64 bit

https://ultimaker.com/software/ultimaker-cura

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Face Milling

2020-05-21 Thread dave engvall

Round inserts are nice if you have the power and stiffness to use them. 
Only in desperation would I use a fly cutter simple because of the 
unbalanced load.

Because of their radius the round inserts will give a nice finish.
Have fun.

Dave

On 5/20/20 9:56 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:

I've been surfacing a casting that is larger than my machine envelope.   Not only 
that although pattern was 5/8" thick MDF the casting ended up with thicker and 
thinner parts.   With it shimmed and moving clamps around I managed to flatten the 
bottom and then clamp it down and surface the top.  But it took a long time.

I found LinuxCNC easy enough to use for this.  Just kept resetting x or y home 
and restarting the G_code.

Anyone used one of these?
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000890081459.html

Or with the round carbide inserts
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32952847637.html

Alternatively since I use the Tormach Tooling at a much higher price there is 
this flycutter.
https://tormach.com/tts-superfly-cutter-kit-33031.html

John




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Re: [Emc-users] internal cleaning a BS-1

2020-05-18 Thread dave engvall

Years ago I would have said Lubriplate but today there are lots of Li 
greases and lubricants in general have improved a lot.
Any NLGIG 2 should do. At the speeds it is  going to turn you should not 
have to worry about over packing the lube.
Have fun getting it in place. I use a 3/4 T lever hoist  even for 
lighter motors. Not worth  messing up the body getting something in place.

Stay safe.
Dave

On 5/17/20 9:31 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

Greetings all;

It looks like I am going to have to dis this $600 piece of junk and take
it to the car wash to clean out the manufacturing debris.

Which brings up a need to re-lube it as I put it back together.

It has oil ports, push the teeny ball types, but it seems like it really
should be greased, probably with an EP additive, so what do I stop and
get at the car parts store?

Sta-Put or ??


Cheers, Gene Heskett




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[Emc-users] OT Chinese DRO

2020-05-08 Thread dave engvall

HI all,
My ancient Acu-rite III DRO has gone flaky. I ordered one off the
following link.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-3-Axis-Digital-Readout-DRO-TTL-Linear-Glass-Scale-Encoder-for-Milling-Lathe-US/383318755364?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D226424%26meid%3Dcfa3ce45df724f6caf6f3f9e3f504aca%26pid%3D15%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D12%26mehot%3Dpf%26sd%3D143473346840%26itm%3D383318755364%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DSimplAMLv5PairwiseWebWithBBEV2bDemotion%26brand%3DUnbranded&_trksid=p2047675.c15.m1851

The instructions give two possible connection patterns: both for A+, B+,
gnd and +5v. No instructions for A+, A-, B+, B-, gnd and +5v.
No joy. An internal autoresetable fuse saves idiots from themselves. I
emailed the vendor and got back a 'yes we have no bananas' type answer.

"Hi David, thanks for your shopping in our store.
So pleased to serve for you.
Yes, it's no need to do that without having to use opto-couplers to
isolate the connection.

Best regards,
Ebay seller-tradeparts-shop"

I'm still convinced that I need the opto's but thought I'd bounce this
off the list.

BTW - it works fine with one of their scales.

Once I get both types of scales going I will do a comparison against
each other and against Jo blocks and boring machine standards.

Has anyone else tried these and how did you make it work? As always
thanks in advance.

Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] need a couple boring bar holders, odd size

2020-05-03 Thread dave engvall


HI Gene,
Being always caught outside the box but still having to think I made a 
large t-nut that goes in the cross-slide, then a block of steel large 
enough to accommodate a couple of 1/2" gr 8 cap screws and a hole 
centered between the bolts but obviously at 90 degrees with the proper 
taper for a 5C.
The collet just hangs out the rear of the block and I can clamp up 
boring bars of varying size using a bronze nut threaded for the rear 
thread of the collet,
Naturally I ended up making a wrench to  fit the nut. Nothing is ever 
easy. :-)  YMMV


Dave
On 5/3/20 10:57 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

But the odd size is 7/8" because that is the size of the brass rod I made
about 100 tap hats from.

This is to go with the gcode I've written to stop broken taps forever.

I'll need to dedicate a 3/4" to lock a probe into forever, and a matching
7/8" to hold the tap-hat in.

The one bar holder I have, came with the qctp kit is a 250-204, is 3/4"
with the sleeve or 1" without it.  And side of tool wedging screws,
which I hate because they damage the tools if tightened enough to hold
the tool. I'd druther have a good fit and draw screws to squeeze the
steel across the gap.  I made one sorta like that for the 7x12 many
years ago but thar doesn't give me the qctp's fine veritcal position
needed for this.

Banggood doesn't have, Shars doesn't have. Am I going to have to make
them?

What I need is 7/8" that I can mill a shallow antirotation notch in the
edge of to engage the 4mm cap screw inset into the side of the tap hat.

Cheers, Gene Heskett




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Re: [Emc-users] Machine accuracy

2020-05-03 Thread dave engvall




On 5/3/20 4:32 AM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:

On Sat, 2 May 2020 at 16:29, N  wrote:


Did not check check then moving but expect a lot less accuracy then at move,

Bear in mind that when the tool position matters the tool is often
stationary in the important direction.

Then it will be more than good enough for drilling, I do not have to do 
measurements by hand anymore then drilling/threading for example hole for 
cooling fins. Searched manual and did not immediately found how to control 
movement in (X,Y) plane with good position accuracy while less is required in Z 
direction.


Regards Nicklas Karlsson

Hi Nicklas,
    As the owner of an aging  (1960's vintage) BP size mill one 
develops habits which tend to minimize offsets from wear. To wit: holes 
are always approached from -X +Y.  Reference position is upper left of 
the fixed jaw on the vise.
For openings for cooling fans, etc I simply helix into the hole. I start 
just above the surface and climb cut where Z = depth and P defines the 
number of passes  for full depth. Nice pretty holes are helped by a 
couple of skim passes. Accuracy is always defined by the application 
e.g. good enough!

I would like to think I can hold sub thou tolerances but I know better.
I once made a bunch of 1018 CD pillow blocks for a robotics club. I 
bothered to measure them afterward just for grins. They were -.003 in X 
and Y with a std dev of 0.001". Those were done on my Mazak which had a 
long history machining aluminum parts. I would not expect anything close 
to that on my small mill.
However, being careful with hole placement I can drill holes that 
machine screws will go thru and match the threaded hole. Bear in mind 
that machine screws are often -.003" so that helps. Normally one can 
tune following error to be much less than the backlash so backlash and 
lack of rigidity are probably major contributing factors to off 
tolerance. Just thinking out loud. Sorry for the length of post but ...

Have fun and stay safe.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Encoder reset on homing to index

2020-04-26 Thread dave engvall

Not that I know much about this but: It is my understanding that the 
rotary because it has less quantatization error does a better job on 
control but unless your machine is very tight a poorer job on position. 
Early on I tried my machine with a 5 um linear glass scale. It was very 
difficult to tune. Later on tuning with a rotary encoder was a cinch by 
comparison. I've not tried both scales yet but that is where I'm headed. 
Conversation with Stu and the group that did the installation might shed 
some light. Does the information  coming off the sensors need to be 
reallocated. Just thinking(?) out loud.


On my machine, a well worn BP size, using I has never given me better 
following error. I get by with P, FF1, FF2, zero or very small D and no I.


just my tuppence!

Dave

On 4/25/20 10:56 PM, David Berndt wrote:

The rotary loop works fine by itself.

The linear loop, as it's just an I term is pretty useless/non 
functional by itself. Maybe you could argue it's ok for really small 
values of I, but then the settling time when using both PID loops 
combined is terrible. I was under the impression that was as 
designed/expected based on the 
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Combining_Two_Feedback_Devices_On_One_Axis


Side question. When doing touchoff/tool touchoff is commanded position 
or actual position used?




Maybe I'll look at a different PID strategy. Perhaps I could add the 
pid.y2.error value from the linear encoder to the pid.Y.command then 
the servo encoder will really have its thumb in the tuning pie. The 
linear encoder won't have to run any actual gain, just spit out the 
current error vs commanded.


-Dave


On Sat, 25 Apr 2020 23:44:46 -0400, Peter C. Wallace  
wrote:



On Sat, 25 Apr 2020, David Berndt wrote:


Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2020 23:13:59 -0400
From: David Berndt 
To: Peter C. Wallace 
Cc: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 


Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Encoder reset on homing to index
Resent-Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2020 23:39:11 -0400
Resent-From: "David Berndt" 
Resent-To: "emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net" 


Resent-cc: "Peter C. Wallace" 
 Trying this again for the second time, no more attachments, only a 
google photos link. I really mean it this time.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/xMK4Ep69i1SpznC58

Here are some halscope screenshots. Would saving the halscope data and
distributing that be better/prefered? Not sure what the policy is here.


This isn't really revealing much to me. All the index-enables fire,
commands go to zero, feedback goes to 0 and then the PID.y.output takes
off, PID.y2(linear).output eventually catches on and doesn't do 
anything

to help, seems to add fuel to the fire instead of acting in an opposite
direction it should.

Please see screenshots, any thoughts are appreciated.

-Dave



The runaway almost suggests you have one PID loop with negative 
feedback and one with positive feedback. Have you tried each loop 
individually?





On Sat, 25 Apr 2020 14:44:54 -0400, Peter C. Wallace 
wrote:


On Sat, 25 Apr 2020, David Berndt wrote:


Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2020 14:21:45 -0400
From: David Berndt 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
,

   Peter C. Wallace 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Encoder reset on homing to index
Thanks for the feedback Peter.
 I took the time to re-order my hal file (it's a bit of a disaster 
with all the other non motion going-ons in there).

 Here is the relevant start of m addf's
  addf hm2_5i25.0.read  servo-thread
addf motion-command-handler   servo-thread
addf motion-controller    servo-thread
addf pid.x.do-pid-calcs   servo-thread
addf pid.y.do-pid-calcs   servo-thread #rotary
addf pid.y2.do-pid-calcs  servo-thread #linear
addf pid.z.do-pid-calcs   servo-thread
addf pid.a.do-pid-calcs   servo-thread
addf pid.s.do-pid-calcs   servo-thread
 addf sum2.3   servo-thread #pid.y.output 
+pid.y2.output -> 'y-output' -> hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogout1

 addf hm2_5i25.0.write servo-thread
  I excluded all the stuff below which is are things like servo 
amp ready, amp fault, coolant, spindle speed, spindle amp draw, 
f-error tracking, stuff that happens in servo-thread but isn't 
exciting or relevant to motion in a realtime way.
 Yes, PID.y.index-enable, pid.y2.index-enable, 
hm2encoder.03.index-enable, and hm2...encoder.01.index-enable 
are all plumbed up and I show them going TRUE during homing.
 When I went out to the cold mill this AM and started fooling 
around I noticed I was getting some following errors even in my 
previously configured "acceptable" config which was driving 
axis.1.motor-pos-fb from the rotary encoder still. Some 
hal-scoping around shows that maybe with the change I need some 
re-tuning at higher speeds.
 The need for retuning made me think that perhaps if the tuning 
was questionable and that lead to a bit of runaway condition at 
higher speeds then perhaps if I just decreased th

Re: [Emc-users] cloning hard drive to new SSD

2020-04-23 Thread Dave Cole

Look up R-Drive image.   It works with Windows and will clone just about 
anything.  Linux drives are no big deal.

Its not free, but its not expensive either.
I have two USB to IDE/Sata adapters that I used to clone drives.  Or you 
can use one adapter and save the image from one drive and restore it 
onto the other drive in two different sessions.   That way you can also 
keep a backup of the image on another drive.


Dave

On 4/22/2020 10:22 PM, andrew beck wrote:

Hey guys.

Just a quick question here

I recently heard some funny clanking noises in my old 2nd hand hard drive
on my VMC and thought I better change it out and get a SSD in there.

I have a bunch of stuff loaded onto the hardrive for probe basic gui and
other stuff and would like to clone the drive and keep everything.

I can manage a windows cloning I am just not sure if the process will work
on a linux system.  I am using a crucial brand SSD and can download the
drive cloning software (it is rebadged acronis cloning software)

anyway some help would be appreciated.


regards

Andrew

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Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc on modern hardware

2020-04-19 Thread Dave Matthews

It was free from when we cleaned out the FIL's place.  The one before
that was in the heap of rubble of retired computers.  No reason to buy
new to run a router.

Dave

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 2:08 PM N  wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > For reasons I dont understand, many people prefer to use extremely legacy
> > hardware to run linuxcnc.
>
> Plenty available cheap and no reason to user newer.
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

2020-04-14 Thread dave engvall

I was just going to comment that if you have to circular mill then the 
initial use of a drill might be faster and safer.


Dave

On 4/14/20 4:03 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:

So if I don't have a center cutting end mill then it's probably a good idea to 
drill a hole so that the overlap criteria can be met?  I guess plan the hole in 
the CNC part drawing?


-Original Message-
From: dave engvall [mailto:dengv...@charter.net]
Sent: April-14-20 11:37 AM
To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

I've never had much luck with plunging end mills full dia. Probably
works better with HSS , not so brittle. However, I plunge cut at 40%
overlap and 15 - 18 ipm at 2200 with .25 carbide. Get fair life doing
that. On the same rather flexible mill using a 1/2" rougher I'm good for
.1" radial cuts. That works well when they overlap as in really rough
profiling. In general I'm working with 1018 crs or A36.� Doing full dia
plunge cuts it is easy to run out of stiffness and power with a 1 hp
belt-driven spindle.

I still have hopes of getting the Mazak operational again and that will
be a game changer.

Dave

On 4/14/20 10:55 AM, Sam Sokolik wrote:

we have various forms of these type calculators that seem to work well

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Valenite-SPEED-AND-FEED-CALCULATOR-1981-Datailzer-Slide-

Charts/164146745960?hash=item2637e89268:g:V~oAAOSwIGleb93M

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:50 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:


Thanks.  The last bit of LinuxCNC milling with a 6mm carbide plunging into
HRS broke two of them.  I'm really not doing this right yet.  So any
examples of feeds, speeds and coolant are really helpful.

John Dammeyer


-Original Message-
From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
Sent: April-14-20 10:38 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

sorry - forgot a few things.. The mill was a resharpened at about .47".
(why it took 2 tries to get the size where I wanted it)  the timing gear
was aluminum.

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:26 PM Ed  wrote:


On 4/14/20 9:53 AM, Sam Sokolik wrote:

now to upgrade the spindle encoder...

https://youtu.be/VmWeXS6y-lg

On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 9:00 PM andy pugh 

wrote:

On Sat, 11 Apr 2020 at 02:50, Ed  wrote:


I'm thinking gear hobs or single cutters.

I have been thinking of making gear hobs this way for a while. What
holds me back is that I am not sure that I know how to heat treat

the

hob to a state that will cut the materials that I want to make gears
out of.

--

Heat treating D2 is not a problem here and would work well if a little
slower than M2 high speed. A higher temp furnace is in the plans. I

keep

some D2 on hand.

I am being pushed by a couple customers to get my horizontal/hobbing
machine finished and that will be able to do this kind of work. Soon I
will be paging Andy to help with the setup. :-)

Ed.




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Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

2020-04-14 Thread dave engvall

IIRC a full dia plunge with a non-center cutting end mill is an 
experiment in friction welding. ;-)


Dave

On 4/14/20 11:31 AM, andy pugh wrote:

On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 19:26, John Dammeyer  wrote:


And I don't think one should plunge into HRS with a 4 flute mill.

Was it a centre-cutting mill? 4-flute ones often are not.




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Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

2020-04-14 Thread dave engvall

I've never had much luck with plunging end mills full dia. Probably 
works better with HSS , not so brittle. However, I plunge cut at 40% 
overlap and 15 - 18 ipm at 2200 with .25 carbide. Get fair life doing 
that. On the same rather flexible mill using a 1/2" rougher I'm good for 
.1" radial cuts. That works well when they overlap as in really rough 
profiling. In general I'm working with 1018 crs or A36.  Doing full dia 
plunge cuts it is easy to run out of stiffness and power with a 1 hp 
belt-driven spindle.


I still have hopes of getting the Mazak operational again and that will 
be a game changer.


Dave

On 4/14/20 10:55 AM, Sam Sokolik wrote:

we have various forms of these type calculators that seem to work well

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Valenite-SPEED-AND-FEED-CALCULATOR-1981-Datailzer-Slide-Charts/164146745960?hash=item2637e89268:g:V~oAAOSwIGleb93M

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:50 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:


Thanks.  The last bit of LinuxCNC milling with a 6mm carbide plunging into
HRS broke two of them.  I'm really not doing this right yet.  So any
examples of feeds, speeds and coolant are really helpful.

John Dammeyer


-Original Message-
From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
Sent: April-14-20 10:38 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Non-circular boring. Linuxcnc style.

sorry - forgot a few things.. The mill was a resharpened at about .47".
(why it took 2 tries to get the size where I wanted it)  the timing gear
was aluminum.

On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 12:26 PM Ed  wrote:


On 4/14/20 9:53 AM, Sam Sokolik wrote:

now to upgrade the spindle encoder...

https://youtu.be/VmWeXS6y-lg

On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 9:00 PM andy pugh 

wrote:

On Sat, 11 Apr 2020 at 02:50, Ed  wrote:


I'm thinking gear hobs or single cutters.

I have been thinking of making gear hobs this way for a while. What
holds me back is that I am not sure that I know how to heat treat

the

hob to a state that will cut the materials that I want to make gears
out of.

--

Heat treating D2 is not a problem here and would work well if a little
slower than M2 high speed. A higher temp furnace is in the plans. I

keep

some D2 on hand.

I am being pushed by a couple customers to get my horizontal/hobbing
machine finished and that will be able to do this kind of work. Soon I
will be paging Andy to help with the setup. :-)

Ed.




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[Emc-users] Easy to heat treat high speed tool steel

2020-04-11 Thread Dave Pape

Have a look at Uddeholm Vanadis 4 Extra SuperClean. Uddeholm has more types
of tool steel to choose from. This is from Uddeholm PDF.

Pre-heating temperature: First pre-heating at600–650°C (1110–1200°F) and
second at 850–900°C (1560–1650°F)Austenitizing temperature: 940–1180°C
(1725–2160°F), normally 1020°C (1870°F).• For large sections, i.e. >70 mm
(2.75") use 1060°C (1940°F).• For the very best wear resistance use
1100–1180°C (2010–2160°F).Soaking time: 30 min. for hardening tempera-tures
up to 1100°C (2010°F), 15 min. fortemperatures higher than 1100°C
(2010°F).Note:
Soaking time = time at hardening tem-perature after the tool is fully
heated through.A holding time of less than recommended timewill result in
loss of hardness.Protect the tool against decarburization andoxidation
during hardening.Further information can be found in theUddeholm brochure
“Heat treatment of toolsteels.

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Re: [Emc-users] Home use index problem (In step + dir mode)

2020-04-10 Thread dave engvall

On 4/10/20 1:01 PM, Peter C. Wallace wrote:

On Fri, 10 Apr 2020, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2020 16:50:15 -0300
From: Leonardo Marsaglia 
Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"

To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 

Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Home use index problem (In step + dir mode)

Thank you Peter for your quick response.

I just checked my ini file and the entry is like this HOME_USE_INDEX 
= YES.
I also have set SEARCH VEL and LATCH VEL at 10 and 5 respectively. I 
even
inverter the differential pins on the Z pulse just to be sure they 
weren't
backwards but the behaviour is the same. I'll keep playing with it 
but for

now I can only set the index pulse to on manually.

Do you have a home switch and is it working?
If you want to home to index only you must set HOME_SEARCH_VELOCITY to 0

Just to muddy the water: I don't use the home switch, just manually 
adjust starting point so a laser pointer is coincident with a hole in a 
tab (x & y). Kick off homing and it picks up the index and moves to the 
appropriate axis zero. It is about as lazy as one can get and still have 
it work. For Z I set the cam so it jsut touches the tab on the limit 
switch.

Dave

Is it talking about using the step mode in velocity to drive the 
servo in
velocity mode? Because I'm using it in velocity mode but just as 
suggested

to close the loop internally and gain more accuracy at the output. Not
closing the loop with the motor encoder.

If you are using a pncconf generated hal file, the stepgen will always be
in velocity mode. though it may have internal (from stepgen) or 
external (from encoder) position feedback

Anyway these servos I don't think can't take pulses as velocity 
command. I
have the hardware to output +/- 10 volts but I rather use them as 
step and
direction to avoid mounting encoders on the screws. I don't think 
using the

encoder on the motor to be the best idea because the motor is coupled to
the ballscrew by means of a toothed belt.

Do the servos have a emulated encopder output (you mentioned a Z 
signal, is that from the drive?)

El vie., 10 abr. 2020 a las 16:31, Peter C. Wallace ()

On Fri, 10 Apr 2020, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2020 16:11:18 -0300
> From: Leonardo Marsaglia 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 

>
> Subject: [Emc-users] Home use index problem (In step + dir mode)
>
> Hello guys again,
>
> I'm testing the homing of the X axis with a push button and that works
> except when the index pulse has to trigger. That never happens.
>
> I'm using the 7i52S to move my servo with step + dir for position 
command
> right to the drive. In LCNC the stepper is working in velocity mode 
like

> it's recommended. I'm reading the Z pulse of the servo motor thru the
same
> 7i52S using one of the encoder inputs. I'm only reading Z because I 
don't

> need A and B for my purposes now.
>
> The problem is, I can't make the homing with index feature to work. 
I can

> see the index pulse triggering to FALSE when the shaft completes the
turn,
> and I even set the pin to TRUE again manually to see if the homing
sequence
> stops, but the motor keeps turning at final velocity waiting for the
index
> to happen.
>
> I'm even monitoring the joint.0.index-enable pin with Halmeter to 
be sure
> the signal is linked and it's working ok. The only thing I find 
strange

is
> that I need to set the index-enable pin to TRUE by myself. The homing
> sequence doesn't seem to be doing that.

It  sounds like you dont have homing to index enabled in your ini file
(if motion does not set index-enable, it will not look for it going 
false)

That said I dont think this will work correctly on step/dir systems
without
encoder feedback. The reason is that on index detection, the reported
position
on encoders is zeroed, (and motion expects this behavior) this is not 
done

on
stepgens. The hardware for capturing the index and the stepgen count at
index is in the firmware, (allowing stepgens to emulate encoder 
behaviour)

but the hm2 driver has no support for this option.

>
> I'm using LCNC 2.8.0-pre1-5538-g21d7db0. I was thingking maybe this
> feature is not allowed with steppers and that's why I can't use it? 
But

the
> homing sequence is actually waiting for that index pulse so I don't 
think

> this is the case.
>
> I'm surely missing something here, but without your help I'm a 
little bit

> lost.
>
> As always thank you for your support!
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

(\__/)
(='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your
(")_("

Re: [Emc-users] Gecko Failure

2020-04-06 Thread Dave Cole



I agree, however I wonder how long you have to wait until the Phoenix 
connector rises again???  ;-)


And perhaps it needs to be further burnt to complete "ashes" ??

Perhaps a call to the Phoenix connector support hotline is in order?

;-)

Dave

On 4/6/2020 9:58 AM, andy pugh wrote:

On Mon, 6 Apr 2020 at 14:55, andy pugh  wrote:


I wonder if that is a real or fake Phoenix connector?

I suppose you will know if a new connector arises from the ashes.




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Re: [Emc-users] Gecko Failure

2020-04-06 Thread Dave Cole


I'd contact Geckodrive and send them that picture.

Dave

On 4/6/2020 12:24 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:

Anyone ever run into this sort of thing with a G213V driver?
http://www.autoartisans.com/mill/G213V-Failure.jpg

It was running the Knee with a 1200 oz-in motor and 60VDC power supply.

John



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[Emc-users] spi connections

2020-03-28 Thread dave engvall


Hi all,

I'm working (slowly) on a Rspi4b to 7i90 to 5i33 system. After a few 
speed bumps ( I ordered the wrong connector) I think I have things 
worked out. The geometry isn't pretty but should work  unless my 
cognition has drifted off into never-neverland.


So 40 pin idc plugs into spi bus and solders to the jepler interface 
board (osh-park). 26 pin on the jepler board (solder connection) plugs 
into the 7i90. This looks weird since the Rpi4 is at rt angles to the 
7i90 but a bit of creative milling of aluminum will at least mount it 
securely.  Plans are for a 60 mm cooling fan.


Now the question. What is the probably impedance across these connectors 
and do I need the smd resistors? Do I need to match the impedance or 
just load the lines? Gene is using 88 ohm grain of wheat resistors. The 
pads are for smd ... like 1206 (imperial). Connectors in general unless 
they are very good have an impedance bump anyway.


This would be cleaner with a rt angle 26 pin but they were weeks out. ;-)

Maybe Peter will chime in here. :-)

Dave

ps. if one gets a 929852-01-10 then you can split it into the 40 pin and 
the 26 pin. Don't ask me how I know. ;-)





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Re: [Emc-users] Had to share

2020-03-28 Thread dave engvall

You can say what you want about Spam. Once a year is about the right 
dose for me. However in the late 50 when I was spending summers on a 
fire lookout Spam was an easy meal. Bearing in mind that by the time you 
go up all the snow has melted and that was the only refrigeration.


During and after the Korean 'war'  Spam saved a lot of Koreans from 
starvation. The US Army kitchens were throwing it in the dumpsters so it 
got scavengedby locals. Spam with kimchi anyone?


Dave

On 3/27/20 2:45 PM, Marcus Bowman wrote:

Spam, spam, double-spam, egg, spam, spam and spam.
Loved the video; wouldn't eat the end product, though.

Marcus

On 27 Mar 2020, at 11:25, andy pugh wrote:


https://youtu.be/GX68sOHZ12M

For maximum enjoyment turn on auto-captions. They really can't handle
his accent.

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc openlung ventilators

2020-03-24 Thread Dave Cole

When I was 15, (> 45 years ago) I had double pneumonia and I was
hospitalized for 10 days. It seemed like weeks.
Two large penicillin injections in my rump each day. Breathing
treatments every hour at the beginning and then less frequently as I
improved. You wouldn't believe the amount of crap I managed to cough
up. The breathing solution was some type of saline solution. You could
do almost the same thing by inhaling saline mist. Think spray bottle,
etc. It didn't taste good but it loosened the phlegm.

I was never put on a ventilator.
At the beginning I waited for each breathing treatment. Breathing was
hard and painful. And I was in great shape at the time. I was an avid
bike rider and did more than 100 miles per day sometimes. So I've
been there, and I'm not looking forward to a repeat. Once is enough.

Keeping your lungs inflated is really important.
A CPAPs primary purpose is to keep your airways inflated. Its my
understanding that a Ventilator does the same thing, except that it
periodically drops the pressure so you can exhale easier (if you can
exhale) and it also injects some oxygen as well. Of course most
people on Ventilators are also intubated. Not so with a CPAP.

If you have an Oxy-fuel welding setup, you have an oxygen tank.
Medical oxygen flowmeters are cheap, but a tig/mig welding flow meter
could work as well. Not a lot of flow is needed unless you are in
really bad shape, and likely not needed all of the time. (Typical flows
are on the web)

Oximeters are also cheap. A lot of people already have them.

Pray you don't need a real ventilator.

What you are coughing up will tell you a lot:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-6303513/What-does-colour-phlegm-mean-cold-pneumonia-lung-cancer.html

Dave

On 3/24/2020 11:02 AM, dave engvall wrote:

Implications?

Gleaned from a medical site.

"Coronavirus is enveloped, meaning the virus has coating on the
outside of it. As it happens, the envelope means that the virus
doesn’t survive well outside of the body—they usually can’t last
longer than 24 hours outside of the body and usually only last less
than 12. This is a good thing in terms of containing an outbreak. It
also means coronavirus can be killed by hand sanitizer and soaps,
which isn’t the case with other types of viruses (most notoriously
norovirus), so your biggest defense against coronavirus is washing
your hands. The problem with viral envelopes is that they allow the
virus to more easily evade your immune system. So, the enveloped virus
has a disadvantage outside of a person, but once it gets in, the
envelope gives it a dangerous edge. Enveloped viruses (which include
influenza) tend to cause longer, more problematic infections for this
reason and are more difficult to develop a vaccine for because of the
envelope".

Remember, FDA regs are meant to be all encompassing not just virus
specific. A virus is an obligate intracellular parasite. They are not
very tough extracellular. I think this makes the sterility barrier
much lower. However, a damp warm environment is just perfect for
bacterial and fungal growth. Still having a sub micron filter in line
screens a lot of junk.

Changing subjects slightly I read an unconfirmed note that one of the
early symptoms of corona virus infection was a loss of smell.
Interesting but single source.

Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] linuxcnc openlung ventilators

2020-03-24 Thread dave engvall


Implications?

Gleaned from a medical  site.

"Coronavirus is enveloped, meaning the virus has coating on the outside 
of it. As it happens, the envelope means that the virus doesn’t survive 
well outside of the body—they usually can’t last longer than 24 hours 
outside of the body and usually only last less than 12. This is a good 
thing in terms of containing an outbreak. It also means coronavirus can 
be killed by hand sanitizer and soaps, which isn’t the case with other 
types of viruses (most notoriously norovirus), so your biggest defense 
against coronavirus is washing your hands. The problem with viral 
envelopes is that they allow the virus to more easily evade your immune 
system. So, the enveloped virus has a disadvantage outside of a person, 
but once it gets in, the envelope gives it a dangerous edge. Enveloped 
viruses (which include influenza) tend to cause longer, more problematic 
infections for this reason and are more difficult to develop a vaccine 
for because of the envelope".


Remember, FDA regs are meant to be all encompassing not just virus 
specific.  A virus is an obligate intracellular parasite. They are not 
very tough extracellular.  I think this makes the sterility barrier much 
lower. However, a damp warm environment is just perfect for bacterial 
and fungal growth. Still having a sub micron filter in line screens a 
lot of junk.


Changing subjects slightly I read an unconfirmed note that one of the 
early symptoms of corona virus infection was a loss of smell. 
Interesting but single  source.


Dave



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Re: [Emc-users] Question about index pulse on high resolution encoder

2020-03-22 Thread dave engvall

just checked the price on ebay. ouch! glad I don't do anything that 
really need one.


On the other hand that $800 only buys about 1.5 glass scales.

Dave

On 3/22/20 3:20 PM, andy pugh wrote:

On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 at 22:01, Gene Heskett  wrote:


That is an impressive widget. :-)

So was the price.

They turn up on eBay.




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Re: [Emc-users] Question about index pulse on high resolution encoder

2020-03-22 Thread dave engvall


That is an impressive widget. :-)

On 3/22/20 12:08 PM, andy pugh wrote:

On Sun, 22 Mar 2020 at 18:27, dave engvall  wrote:


I bought one of these a few years ago when they were somewhat less
expensive. The polarizer helps the beam considerably. I think one can
get something on the order of 0.01" repeatability using your eye.

This is for cam grinding. 0.01" is far too much. 0.01mm would be more like it.

The widget I linked to has a resolution of 0.0001mmm or 0.04"




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Re: [Emc-users] Question about index pulse on high resolution encoder

2020-03-22 Thread dave engvall


https://www.amazon.com/Laser-Center-Edge-Finder-polarizer/dp/B00WVG4DF4

I bought one of these a few years ago when they were somewhat less 
expensive. The polarizer helps the beam considerably. I think one can 
get something on the order of 0.01" repeatability using your eye. A 
sensor and a pin hole should do better. There just ain't no free lunch.


Dave

On 3/22/20 11:09 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Sunday 22 March 2020 12:57:34 Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:


You would have to turn the coolant off to measure, but have a look
at laser triangulation distance sensors:
https://www.micro-epsilon.co.uk/news/2018/2018-05-15-optoNCDT-1750LL
/ (specifically mentions grinding wheels)

  Thanks for the link Andy. But these I assume measure distance,
reflecting the beam against a surface and then receiving it and
measuring the time elapsed between the two events am I right?

I was thinking in something more like two IR barriers transversally
crossed by the wheel. The problem is, this is just an idea it came to
me because geometrically ,for me, this is the simplest way I came up
with to measure the wheel radius only depending on the accuracy of the
ballscrew and the motor driving it. But I don't really know if one can
achieve good levels of repeatability with such a setup.

That would be quite a heavy reponsibility on the ability to repeatedly
dial in half of the beam blocked. I measured the bed wear of mt lathe
with a 38 cartridge bore siting leser and an ir cell fixed to the point
of a dead center in the tailstock, with the laser moditied for power
thru a contact on the other end of a 18" tail sticking out of the back
of the spindle and a cutoff blade raised high enough to block it fully.
Fist adjusting thetail stock to center the beam on it photocell.  Then
mount the cutoff tool and advanced it in front of the receiver cell
until half the beam was being cut off by the cutoff blade.  Touched off
x at 0. at that point, jogged z a short distance each way to check
for torque on the carriage, found under a thou, the jogged toward the
spindle and recorded both z and the x jog offset.  Every inch of travel.
pretty close to a straight line for almost 20" of Z but then the bed
wear closer to the spindle started to show so I wound up at he spindle
pretty close to zero. Then I picked out the peaks and composed a
settings table for a lincurve from that, inserted the lincurves output
thru h offset to modify the x to keep its =- a thou or better over the z
range checked. Taint perfect but it plenty close enough for the girls
I've gone with.  Ranges up to 8 thou if disabled. Using the method I've
described I that methods accuracy budget would show that friction in the
home switch would account for the huge majority of the errors, and I
found those to be repeatable to .0002". or better.  More than enough to
measure thermal effects.


El dom., 22 mar. 2020 a las 13:52, Leonardo Marsaglia (<

ldmarsag...@gmail.com>) escribió:

You only need one beam. I would use the first beam interruption as a


second home switch of sorts, setting that with the home_offset when
you install a new wheel. The established home offset then becomes
your new wheel reference. This should then be considered a fixed
reference and a suitable distance from the work to prevent
accidental contact during setup.

   I was thinking about using the two beams that are transversally
cut by the well because that way I can measure the length of a
circular portion and have an exact measure of the radius
independently of the home distance or the part diameter being known.
The only thing that would matter with this approach would be to know
exact distance between one beam and the other and they off course
must be perfectly perpendicular to the wheel axis of movement.

And obviously Leonardo, make a youtube video and tell us about it
when


its working. :)

  Be sure I'll let you guys know as soon as I do something. In fact,
I can't wait to see and show you the mazak turning with LCNC. After
that, I hope I can start converting the grinder as soon as poosible!



El dom., 22 mar. 2020 a las 10:41, Thaddeus Waldner
()

escribió:

The most


primitive idea I have is to measure the wheel before placing it
into the machine and then keep track of its diameter as it gets
dressed. But sometimes we have to adjust the offset of the
dressing tool because a diamond just detaches from the tool and
then you need to correct for

that


difference.

I don’t know what the dressing system looks like, but if it’s
motorized in both axis( cut depth and motion across the wheel) then
why don’t you touch off the dressing point? You could do an initial
homing when machine starts, and again after each dressing
operation. Use the info to determine dressing point depth of cut
and also to infer actual wheel diameter. You could also use it to
catch the event of a diamond point being knocked loose, and alarm
the operator.



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[Emc-users] connector ignoramus

2020-03-18 Thread dave engvall

Hi,

Or maybe it is web search dumb. Usually I do better but:

I have the osh park board for Rpi4b to 7i90 ordered. However I think I
can plug a 40 pin (2 x 20) idc directly into the pi and come off the
other side of the board with a 26 pin (2x13) directly into the 7i90. No
cable to fool with. Just carefully making mounting that matches the
physical requirements. Using a right angle connector to get to the 7i90
would make things neater. IOW 40 pin to osh-park board to 26 pin (R/A)
or straight to 7i90.

My small mill now has glass scales (0.0002) on X and Y so making simple
stuff is easy, especially out of aluminum. I do almost nothing in Al so
I am continually amazed at how easy it mills. Especially with Zr
coating. Surplus Boeing from a long time ago; before they closed the
surplus store.

Part numbers from Mouser, Digikey, Allied would be most helpful.

TIA

I suspect I'm house bound ... with a 100' leash to reach the shop for
several weeks but UPS/BBT (big brown truck) still works. Stats say one
is fairly safe unless you have a condition that makes you more vulnerable.

This state has been really hit hard; the nursing home in Kirkland didn't
help. Even worse is that a person can pass it on before they have symptoms.

https://informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/covid-19-coronavirus-infographic-datapack/?fbclid=IwAR0CAPMO2oHOLZyB07vBhdbLvAjUcQ6RiifnOZJDt6sdMrSV1MWL-2Y0bv8

Hang tough, be careful.

Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] back to my out of whack encoder

2020-02-24 Thread dave engvall

It is unusual for epoxy not to stick. Pocket eh? Take a Q-tip with 
either lye or muriatic acid and etch. Then wash with water, then 
degrease with iso-propanol, trichoroethylene, perchlor (dry cleaning 
solvent),  etc. This assumes the pocket is aluminum which is amphoteric. 
... reactive with either acid or base.  If it is steel then think I'd 
polish with a dremel. At room temp JB-weld will cure out well in 24 hrs. 
Every 10 C down halves the reaction rate. If you can position quickly 
the 5 min Devcon or equivalent (clear) should work. If you can clamp it 
in  position after adjusting quadrature then raising the temp will do 
good things. I routinely cure at approx 150 F. NOTE: have  no idea what 
the max storage temp is on the device. ;-)


I've  used JB-weld to mount blocks for a scope. ... need to remove them 
 heat to 250 F and then apply chisel or screwdriver. Even then it 
can take a decent hit to break them loose.


BTW - I've had pretty good luck with lacquer thinner as a degreaser.  
Brownells recommends gasoline as a degreaser for their bluing kits.


Hope this helps. Hang in there.  as always YMMV.

Advice is always worth about what you pay for it. ;-)

Dave

On 2/23/20 5:19 PM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:

Gene,
  I have seen this advertised several times but have never tried it. I saw
the same type of stuff used on my son's knocked out tooth. The dentist
glued it to the adjoining teeth. It lasted in that environment for over a
year.

https://justdiy.com/bondic-review/
This is not exactly the same thing but it is close.

Stuart

On Sun, Feb 23, 2020, 6:07 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:


Greetings all;

This is turning into a PITA.

After a weeks cure time I went to remove the blown ATS-667 from that
pocket in my bracket, using a 1/4" wood chisel and a very small bit of
alu for a hammer, it came loose so easy I could have just lifted the
leads by hand.  This was with the pocket scratched up with my pocket
knife and washed down with brake cleaner before applying the jbfastweld.

Anybody got a foolproof method of making it stick?

Anodize it maybe.

Quick recipe for that?

Then use the slow jbweld to give me time to adjust some 0-80 screws to
push it around till the quadrature is good. Then ignore it for a week to
cure...

Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
  - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page <http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene>


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Re: [Emc-users] Kinematics, headless CNC

2020-02-22 Thread dave engvall


hi Nicklas:

I think you keep the X as linear and do a Cartesian to polar conversion 
for the Y. This is sometimes done to get a really stiff Y axis. Years 
ago I saw a utube of a shop doing one with a decently large rotary 
table; as in 18" or more.


Dave

On 2/22/20 12:50 AM, Nicklas Karlsson wrote:

Did not find list of kinematics module but. Do not think this kind of 
kinematics module exist, scara however come close and so could be a good 
starting point.


No attached drawing.

Trying to attach smaller version of drawing:



If it doesn’t work, see here:
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AmALSPKTMQBkwTRPcAo195PaFmAh 
<https://1drv.ms/u/s!AmALSPKTMQBkwTRPcAo195PaFmAh>

This does have one rotary axis and one linear axis so I’m pretty sure that 
simply setting the AXIS=2 with trivkins component won’t work.
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Re: [Emc-users] Feeds and speeds

seed oils are long chain fatty acids linked to a glycerin. Feed stock 
for varnish and other coatings.


Enough double bonds so there is lots of opportunity for cross-linking. 
With out dryers (catalysts) they just turn gummy.  Organic cobalt compds 
have been used for years as dryers for the arts, finishes for wood, etc.


Dave

On 2/19/20 11:59 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Wednesday 19 February 2020 14:29:42 dave engvall wrote:


Lots of illocut products on web... which one do you recommend?

Indeed kerosene works well for threading Al and cutting. Probably less
flammable also but being lazy I didn't check the flashpoints.


The highest flashpoint stuff I've fed a mister is safflower oil, sold as
cooking oil in the grocery stores.. Worked great squaring up a huge
block of dead soft alu that I was making to space a bearing on down the
shaft about 1.5" to get away from a worn spot created by the eccentric
collar of a fafner bearing, but it made such a mess of the area to clean
up that I've never made that mistake again.

Dave

On 2/19/20 11:05 AM, Marshland Engineering wrote:

Ilocut is far superior to WD40. If I could send samples, I would
send some.



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Cheers, Gene Heskett


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Re: [Emc-users] Feeds and speeds


Lots of illocut products on web... which one do you recommend?

Indeed kerosene works well for threading Al and cutting. Probably less 
flammable also but being lazy I didn't check the flashpoints.


Dave

On 2/19/20 11:05 AM, Marshland Engineering wrote:

Ilocut is far superior to WD40. If I could send samples, I would send some.



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Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture --> printer driver postscript <-> g-code

postscript isn't a bad language for 2D. ... and yes years ago I did 
exactly that.


Dave

On 2/19/20 7:52 AM, andy pugh wrote:

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, 19:41 N,  wrote:


Printers talk postscript while CNC machines talk g-code, well not always
but quite often.


And just as some folk hand-write G-code, I know a chap who habitually
creates graphics in raw postscript.

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Re: [Emc-users] Feeds and speeds

Indeed WD-40 seems to work well for Al. I have some Al that is plain 
touchy. Creates heat very quickly and then I get adhesion. 6061-T6 seems 
to be OK.


Dave

On 2/19/20 4:32 AM, Stuart Stevenson wrote:

For aluminum I like WD-40.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 3:41 AM Marshland Engineering <
marshl...@marshland.co.nz> wrote:


Been machining for a living for 18 years.  One off and small runs. Been
there,
flood coolant, mist spray and now unless I'm doing steel or heavy aly, I
have
reverted to a 5 cc syringe with a thin needle and I spot the material or
cutter as it runs with neat cutting oil. If I'm surfacing a plate or
machining
around a big block, I put a few drops of cutting fluid on it and then
smear it
with a 1.5 inch paint brush.

I think I have said this before, but, Castrol Ilocut 154 (think mine was
called 64 when I bought a 20 litre drum 25 years ago and still using it
daily)
is a neat cutting oil that is fantastic.

If I skim 2 bits of aly, one dry and one with oil, I can easily see the
difference. Drip oil with deep pockets and then remove the swarf with
compressed air. Running the mister all the time makes every thing sticky.

I never mill aly without fluid. Aly friction welds to easily.

Aliexpress, 20 syringes with needles for a couple of $$

I now have syringes next to the drill press, mill and lathe.

I still use flood with steel if I have to remove heat.

Flood if you have a fully closed in machine.

Still use HSS for plastics. Seems to cut the best.

Cheers Wallace.





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Re: [Emc-users] RPI4 is pretty close to a decent machine - now linear scales and servos




On 2/19/20 4:16 AM, Les Newell wrote:

On 18/02/2020 23:54, Marshland Engineering wrote:
Just a correction, I have setup a few stepper systems with LinuxCNC 
and step
and direction is no problem. The problems came in when using 2KW 
servo drives

and linear scales on the axis.


The subject of using linear scales for feedback pops up every so often 
on this list and always the recommendation is not to do it. I just 
checked back through the list history and you were also told this. 
It's not a LinuxCNC or competence issue. It's a hardware issue.


Feedback loops like a very stiff connection between the motor and the 
encoder. Even a tiny amount of backlash or spring has a major effect 
on loop stability. Have you ever tried driving a car with badly worn 
steering? It's hard to keep a straight line. Linear scales have have 
the same effect on the feedback loop. If you fit encoders directly on 
your motors most of your tuning issues will go away. If the machine is 
very stiff and has very little backlash you MAY get away with using 
velocity mode drives with your scales. Even then it's likely to be 
twitchy to set up. In fact this was also suggested to you at the time.


Using linear scales for secondary feedback in addition to encoders on 
the motors can in some cases improve accuracy but this is a pretty 
advanced configuration and off hand I don't know of anyone who has 
done it with LinuxCNC. It is done on some high end commercial machines.

http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Combining_Two_Feedback_Devices_On_One_Axis


I have purchased and tried a 80V 20A Servo Drive upgrade Geckodrive 
G320X

DG4S-08020 DCS810 from ebay and it worked well on a small motor.


See above. A motor with a directly connected encoder is easy to set 
up. If you tried the G320 on your linear scale setup you would have 
had exactly the same tuning issues.


I think having the servo tuning external to the PC is a good option. 
This makes the

LinuxCNC servo installation much easier.


I have used position mode drives (step/direction), velocity mode and 
torque mode with LCNC, Mach, Eding CNC, my own custom controller and 
others. I've tested Gecko, Mesa, Rutex, Granite Devices, Xylotex, 
Kinco, Bosch, Yaskawa and others in various configurations so I have a 
reasonable sample set. In my opinion the best control scheme overall 
is torque mode with LinuxCNC doing the feedback. Velocity mode comes 
second and position mode (step/dir) a long way behind.


The drives like Gecko, Rutex R9x series and Xylotex are very basic and 
you have no way of knowing what following errors you are getting until 
the drives trip. It's difficult to get a really good tune without 
knowing what the drive is doing.


Configuring digital drives such as Kinco, Yaskawa etc with a couple of 
buttons and a tiny LED display is frustrating to say the least. GD, 
the later Rutex drives Kinco, and many other digital drives have their 
own tuning software (mostly Windows only) but I haven't yet found one 
that is easier to use than LinuxCNC with Halscope. Some drives have 
auto tuning but I've not yet seen auto tuning that does a really good 
job.


My Hurco mill came with Yaskawa brushless servos in velocity mode. The 
velocity tuning in the drives was very touchy and I struggled to get a 
good balance between accuracy and oscillation. Some hunting is to be 
expected with velocity drives but this was too much for my liking. I 
then switched to torque mode and my problems went away. No hunting and 
much lower following error. My lathe is torque mode with Mesa 2KW 
drives. Again very smooth, no hunting and very low following error. 
They are not without their issues though (see below). My router uses 
Bosch analog velocity mode drives. Following error is adequate for a 
router but being velocity mode they do hunt a bit when the machine is 
stationary. I will say velocity mode is generally a little easier to 
tune than torque mode so if you aren't fanatical about pushing the 
limits of your machine and you can put up with the hunting it's not a 
bad way to go.


Here are some of my impressions of various drives:

Gecko G320. Step/dir DC brushed. Rather rudimentary feedback loop. 
Fixed following error limit. You need to take them apart and attach an 
oscilloscope to tune them properly. I suffered from issues with random 
tripping that I never fully solved. Physical pots to adjust which is 
nice. Would I buy again? No.


Mesa 7i29. Analog PWM DC brushed. Cheap and powerful. Generate lots of 
electrical noise so it's well worth adding some filtering. I had 
issues with noise pickup on the encoder inputs, to the point where I 
ended up using them for my handwheels and used a separate encoder 
board for the servos. The onboard dc-dc converter let the smoke out 
once but I managed to fix it by replacing a couple of small surface 
mount transistors. I've run my lathe on this drive for many years and 
the DC-DC converter circuit looks pretty well designed so I am

Re: [Emc-users] Feeds and speeds

2020-02-18 Thread dave engvall


Hi all,

By hot roll I assume you mean something like A36. Alloy comp not 
controlled just mechanical. It tends to be low alloy scrap plus 4140.


Using a  TiAlN coated 1/4 carbide I can  use 2200 rpm and 11 ipm, doc 
0.05, any more and it screams at me. This is basically slotting, on a 
side cut same rpm,  and feed, .7 doc for radial of only .025.  Makes for 
a lot of passes. This  is on a Cinci contourmaster 1963 vintage, 
converted to servos. Going deeper and slower doesn't seem to help. Since 
TiAlN likes to run hot I machine dry. It is not unusual for small jobs 
to run for a couple of hours.


On a machining site someone recommended ... increase the feed until you 
break a mill, then back off 10%. Pretty aggressive.


Rumor has it that AlCrN coated carbide  with flood coolant lasts a long 
time; and that was in a production environment. If ... (when) I get my 
big machine up I'll give more serious stuff a go.


I do a lot of A36 because it is cheap and OK for experimental work but 
CR machines like a dream by comparison. HTH


Dave


On 2/18/20 10:09 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:


Thanks everyone.  The trouble with the machinist workshop program and some of 
the others is they are targeted at production speeds.  I'm not even sure about 
the alloy of Hot Rolled Steel which is what will be used here.

The part is designed to hook around the ears of a pipe crucible so accuracy 
isn’t that big a deal and at the moment, HSS is all I have.  With manual 
machining, as Wallace said, you can turn the hand wheels and get a feel for 
what it should do.And yes the machine is pretty rigid.  
http://www.autoartisans.com/milton.htm  This picture was when it first arrived.

I do have a coolant pump but have yet to use it.  Not sure what kind of coolant 
to use.   A large part of my machining has been aluminium castings.  I've not 
yet set up mist coolant.  Any suggestions for what type of coolant to use for a 
machine that is only used occasionally?

All things considered the CNC conversion is the easy part.  My heart is always 
in my throat a bit when first start running a CNC program.  That's the really 
hard part.

John



-Original Message-
From: Stuart Stevenson [mailto:stus...@gmail.com]
Sent: February-18-20 7:04 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Feeds and speeds

John,

Do you have flood coolant or mist coolant?

I would be inclined to try the cut full depth if you have flood or mist
coolant. 1/4 inch is on the borderline of having the strength necessary to
make a full depth cut.  I would think 5.5ipm might be a little aggressive
but I would leave it programmed at that feed and speed and turn the
feedrate to about 20% to start the cut. After you get into the cut I would
move the feedrate up about 10% to see, hear and feel how mill is cutting. I
would keep moving the feed up until I saw, heard or felt the mill working
too hard. I would then start turning the speed up a little at a time to see
how the mill responds.
I think 30sfm might be a little slow but you can adjust the speed after
entering the cut.
If you can adjust the feed and speed to make the full cut sound good and
you have another part to run I would change your program to enter the cut
as you did the first time but the add lines to make it more aggressive
after you have entered the cut.
If you are leaving a little material to clean up the you can drastically
increase the speed and feed after you turn around at the end of the slot.
Is the slot you are cutting wide enough to allow at least .010 thou. for a
finish pass and maybe a spring pass.
I would make the finish pass and spring pass in a conventional cut rather
than a climb cut.
Stuart


On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 8:47 PM John Dammeyer 
wrote:


I've got Mecsoft AlibreCAM generating the tool paths for this in the
attached photo.  It's Cold Rolled steel 3/16" thick.  I'm using a 1/4" HSS
end mill.  I'm trying to figure out, using Machinists tool box, exactly
what feeds and speeds could be used for milling the slot.

I was thinking 30 SFM and with a 4 flute end mill doing 0.003" per flute
the toolbox comes out with  460RPM, 5.5ipm for S460 and F5.5 and 10% of
tool diameter for depth per pass so 0.025"

Is that too conservative or likely to break something?  Doing it manually
I'd do it by feel but once it's automatic it's harder to decide SFM and
chip load.



Thanks
John


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Re: [Emc-users] preempt-rt on the pi4b

2020-02-18 Thread Dave Matthews

On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 4:23 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> >
> Humm, yur right, so until I can fix that, add lathe-stf to the end of the
> address bar, and that will get you a directory listing, find
> linuxcnc4pi4b in that list and click on it.  You should be there.
>
That did the trick.  I grabbed linuxcnc-uspace_2.9.0~pre0_armhf.deb
while I was there.  Guessing that is what I want to install when I
have time to play with this.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] preempt-rt on the pi4b

2020-02-18 Thread Dave Matthews

On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 3:37 PM Gene Heskett  wrote:

>
> Assuming it already has the full raspbian 10.2 or later image on the u-sd
> card, goto my site in the sig, find the lathe-stf link, click on it,
> find the linuxcnc4pi4b directory and download rt-kernel.tgz.  Unpack it
> in /, reboot, and it should show a uname -a of:
> Linux rpi4.coyote.den 4.19.71-rt24-v7l+ #1 SMP PREEMPT RT Thu Feb 6
> 07:09:18 EST 2020 armv7l GNU/Linux
>
Not finding it on the url in your sig.  The word lathe appears on the
page twice.  There is a link near them but that goes 404.

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] RPI4 is pretty close to a decent machine control

2020-02-18 Thread dave engvall



On 2/17/20 5:18 PM, Ed wrote:

On 2/17/20 6:20 PM, John Dammeyer wrote:

From: Sam Sokolik [mailto:samco...@gmail.com]
Because your examples are not running a full operating system...
I don't buy that.  That's like saying.  Look.  The ride is a tad 
uncomfortable but that's to be expected.  After all this is a 10 Ton 
gravel truck.  But look at what it can carry.  True it's only 
groceries today and most days but that one time it will come in so 
handy...  dear...


John

I'll buy that because it is true. Linuxcnc carries the baggage of 
being a motion controller with attached OS. If you like using a go 
between board that uses a $2 chip that sings and dances go gettum. 
Check and see the availability of that chip in a couple years.


Many CNC users don't measure machine life in weeks or months or years 
but DECADES. My first LCNC machine is still going strong after almost 
20 years, step and direction to Gecko 320's. Where will the Pi be in 
20 years or your $2 chip?


Not to knock using a Pi or whatever but to point to the fact that a PC 
running LCNC is the point to measure from and will remain so.


The $2 chip solution may a great thing esp in a headless setup as a 
facilitator but I would buy backups.



Ed.


Quote on a BP dealer site:

"Knee Mill Series I is the most popular vertical milling machine ever 
made with over 370,000 machines built over the past 70-plus years."


I suspect people that buy Griz mills, etc. start out bare and work into 
axis motor drives and maybe eventually full cnc. Part of that is cash 
flow; if you are young and have a family there simply isn't enough 
money. It gets better after the kids leave home and the dog dies. :-)


In the early 2000's manual mills could be had for hauling them off. I 
bought a Mazak V5 for $1500 ...  with a dead  control. Of course getting 
it here and shoehorned into the shop, adding new servo drives, etc is 
another story, a long story.


Speaking of motion control; we have no control over the availability of 
usable cpu's. So far we've been lucky. I like the idea of motion 
residing in a microcontroller but in terms of something surviving for 
years I think that a product based  on a popular FPGA series has the 
best chance of being viable over time. Use the FPGA only for motion and 
a general purpose computer for all the non-realtime stuff. Can I do this 
... not a chance. I do best at ideas and let the really smart people do 
the rest.


Dave









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Re: [Emc-users] [Emc-developers] Looking to make hex offset list for NML status shared memoryr

2020-02-17 Thread Dave Matthews

On Mon, Feb 17, 2020, 18:09 John Dammeyer  wrote:

>
> You're right of course.   I don't think the target is existing BBB users.
> I think the target market is people whos PCs are running MACH and the
> hardware has potentially reached end of life.   I found with this latest
> set of PCs I bought that the motherboard hardware is too new for WIN-XP.
> So one has to find drivers.  It's like plugging in an ASUS USB WiFi
> module.  Doesn't work with WIN-XP.  Does with WIN-7.  Could never find a
> driver for LinuxCNC.
>

The Mach 3 guys will just buy a $115 uc100 and plug into the BOB or the new
$50 Sainsmart BOB/motion controller board and plug into a USB port.  That
is pretty much the standard set up for Gatton CNC builders.

Dave

>

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[Emc-users] just call me grumpy! (7i43)

2020-02-15 Thread dave engvall


Hi all,

A quick look at web sources seems to indicate that the EPP on some 
motherboards simply doesn't  work.


In my case I'm having problems with a 7i43 -5i33.

Has anyone gotten the 7i43/5i33 to work with a D525 intel board? If so 
would you please share the magic incantations necessary.


A thumbs up/thumbs down would be helpful. This was supposed to be a temp 
fix while I picked up the radiator cap and ran something else underneath.


Comments, incantations welcome.

Dave



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Re: [Emc-users] trying to connect a encoder from cnc spindle motor to schiender vfd

2020-02-15 Thread dave engvall


partial reply to Gene's comments.

https://www.analog.com/media/en/reference-design-documentation/reference-designs/CN0276.pdf

On 2/14/20 6:20 PM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Friday 14 February 2020 16:30:51 Andy Pugh wrote:


On 14 Feb 2020, at 20:55, Gene Heskett  wrote:

The coils are usually isolated, with op-amp bias supplied to one end
of the coils, so you get sin plus and minus and cosine + and -

I don’t think we are talking about coils here.


I was Andy, see the link Dave Engval posted to a pdf from a maker of such
that described sin/cos encoders well. I've never used one but that was a
well written tome, including the math I got lost in. What they didn't
cover to my satisfaction was how they made a single cycle per turn into
a many cycles per turn with index at the outout. Proprietary stuff
inside the IC they were discussing, and which some would call magic, and
which could result in a lag between position and output.  But thats just
a SWAG since I have zero experience with the care and feeding of such
critters.

Cheers, Gene Heskett



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Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture

2020-02-14 Thread dave engvall


John, et al:

The good thing about linuxcnc is that is can accommodate a wide range of 
user skill; from those who just want to make  chips to those that want 
to dig into the internals, to  those that can actually write internals. 
Ditto on the range of machines. Linuxcnc nee emc was tested on rather 
good sized machines at Boeing, GM and probably others. I think we have a 
few users that have machines in the 10 Kg region or more. I land 
somewhat in the middle with my big machine being 4200 Kg. On the other 
hand there are machines that one could pick up and walk out the door with.


Because linuxcnc is open source there are a variety of controls 
available, steppers as well as servo, including the ability to use 
rotary incremental encoders,  glass scales,  and resolvers.


Further history is here:

http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/common/emc-history.html

The first system ran on a rather expensive VME bus system but things got 
cheaper when STG (Servo to Go ( only $888 )) offered an isa bus card.


Nuff blithering: back to getting something done. ;-)

Dave

On 2/14/20 12:59 AM, John Dammeyer wrote:

-Original Message-
From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
Sent: February-13-20 9:51 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture

Yes, you do need a special PC.   This means a PC you use for Linux CNC and
not the one already on your desk.

I think that Chris made a lot of good points.  Since I'm upgrading my mill to 
CNC and using a dual boot PC and either LinuxCNC or MACH3 on WIN-XP/7 perhaps 
can add a slightly different view point.

When I designed the E-Leadscrew Electronic Lead Screw controller the feedback 
from the non-CNC people was that they wanted something more than just 
electronic gearing (now commonly also called an ELS) but not something as 
extensive as full CNC.  So what exactly does that mean?  For that matter what 
does open source mean?  Those are both really good questions.

I'll pass on the lathe description for now and address a milling machine.   
I've managed to get along for a number of years with a DRO and power feed on 
the X axis.  Adding a 5C collect spin indexer and a small rotary table indexed 
by my ELS I've found I have been able to create quite a few different things 
without CNC.  So why has it taken so long to convert to CNC when my JGRO based 
CNC router ran MACH3 from the start.  It's not like I'm afraid of it.

Quite simply for many milling (or lathe projects) that are one-of, the precise 
feedback of a DRO on all three axis and power feed relieves the boredom to a 
certain extent.  But what would improve any mill is power feed on all three 
axis along with the DRO.  And the power feed, if augmented by begin/end 
positions would allow all sorts of linear mill operations including peck 
drilling and, with spindle feedback, like threading on a lathe, power tapping.  
No G-Code based CNC code required.  And unfortunately no I,J motion for arcs.  
Although even those kinds of motions could be set up just as easy as 
co-ordinated motion like the tapering I have on my ELS.

So now we're back to the question that Chris raised about a PC or a dedicated 
embedded controller and relates to my first question above.  LinuxCNC and the 
PC worked because it used the parallel port, or if an add on card was added 
closed loop servo control was possible.  But at some point we cross the line 
from a PC running the CNC software to the PC serving as the interface to custom 
hardware with FPGAs and/or processors dealing with the motion control.  So the 
line has become blurry.

The costs, and they are always important, break down to the high powered 
trajectory planner and user feedback,  the actual motion signals and finally 
the electrical interface often referred to as a Break Out Board.Some of the 
ancillary hardware combines the BoB and the motion control into one package.  
Other solutions use Ethernet to something that creates the motion signals 
coupled to a BoB.  And above both is the trajectory planning/control and user 
interface.

But unless you use a parallel port that is part of the PC the reality is the 
system has already been broken into a CNC controller of some sort that costs 
between $100 and $300.  If you decide to use a MESA Ethernet solution with 
terminal strips and stepping engines etc. there is nothing in the rule book 
that says that the user interface and trajectory planner has to be LinuxCNC.

And on the other side if you are using LinuxCNC if the HAL file loads an 
equivalent to:
loadrt hm2_eth board_ip="192.168.1.121" config=" num_encoders=0 num_pwmgens=0 
num_stepgens=5"
there's absolutely no reason the device with the above IP address has to be a 
MESA product.

It could, in fact, just as easily look like the $300 CNC controllers with LCD 
displays, buttons terminal strips etc. to connect to Servo or step motors etc.  
And that $300 CNC controller might just

Re: [Emc-users] trying to connect a encoder from cnc spindle motor to schiender vfd

2020-02-14 Thread dave engvall

a bit overdone for your app but this should give you an idea. page down
to fig 16.

https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/technical/document/application_note/group0/6a/82/83/37/61/69/4e/74/DM00497286/files/DM00497286.pdf/jcr:content/translations/en.DM00497286.pdf

Dave

On 2/13/20 11:01 PM, andrew beck wrote:

Chris. I'm still learning electronics. Could you expand a bit on this
please.

Maybe draw a napkin sketch of it. Sorry to be a bit slow on the uptake

On Thu, Feb 13, 2020, 5:46 AM Chris Albertson
wrote:

A sin and cos are 90 degrees apart. All you should need to do is threshold
the signal and you have A/B quadrature.Many ways to threshold it but
you want the one with least noise.

A simple way to convert a sin wave to a square wave is to amplify then clip
it with diodes. A comparator can also convert the signal.

The point to remember is that sin/cos is quadrature and all that is needed
is some signal conditioning.

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:46 PM andrew beck
wrote:

Hi guys

wondering if anyone has any ideas here.

run

the card in full encoder closed loop control in the vfd I can get 200
percent of the torque right down to 0 rpm for 30 seconds or so which is
pretty useful. I am currently just running the drive in Variable

frequency

control which rapidly looses torque at low rpm.

Anyway they have a bunch of cards I can use but don't have a encoder card
that is suitable for sin cos encoders. I have no trouble changing the
encoder but am not sure if I can get a source of encoders that spin up to
10k rpm.

Anyone have any suggestions?

regards

Andrew

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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue

2020-02-12 Thread dave engvall

  I happen to use some of the quick setting JBweld today. I misspoke, 
it is not clear, grayish and black for the two parts. It may be just 
carbon black but who knows.


Almost every hardware store has Devcon products, slow setting and fast. 
At least some are clear. Sorry for the confusion. IIRC Devcon was pretty 
much the first entry into small tubes of 2 part epoxy.


Dave

On 2/12/20 11:52 AM, David Berndt wrote:
Not directly glue advise. But gear tooth sensor advise. Don't let the 
heads of those things rip off and go through my gear head mill's bevel 
gear teeth. Not pretty. No teeth broke but there is a surprising 
amount of quite hard metal in the middle of something like an Allegro 
ATS675 it seems. The gears were nowhere near silent before, but 
they're louder now for the experience.



-Dave

On Tue, 11 Feb 2020 13:27:48 -0500, Gene Heskett 
 wrote:



Greetings all;

I went tp play with the lathe after reboot the rpi4 with cpu_freq raised
to 800 megs.

All of a sudden the spindle tach got noisy, then quit. removeing the
heads lid, I could see a good coat of the 5w20 I've been useing for
spindle oil had flung out of the side face of the bronze bearing and
given my encoder assembly a good coat of it.

Removeing it for a better look I found 2 of the 667's loose with 
signs of

the bull gear touching them, with one having vibrated enough to break
its wraping wire connections. They were glued into pockets machined in
the mounting bracket which if the glue worked had them spaced about 5
thou away from the bull gear in a curved alu bracket made of of 7075
scrap. I've made a wooden c clamp with a #6 wood screw which is
currently sitting with the point of the screw in the middle of the face
of the loose index generating 667 after the alu was well washed by
acetone and then filling its pocket in the bracket with shoe goop, same
stuff as go-2.  And tomorrow I'll do the same with the other.

Cleaned up with acetone of course.

Previous attempts to glue then in place with super glue were very short
lived, loose in a week.  Ditto with gelled super glue.

The go-2 lasted about 2 years.

What sort of glue can I use that can withstand an oily environment of
light 00w20 for many years?

Thanks all.

Cheers, Gene Heskett



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Re: [Emc-users] trying to connect a encoder from cnc spindle motor to schiender vfd

2020-02-12 Thread dave engvall

Check the max frequency on any encoder you look at. The inexpensive ones 
max out at 200 K. Frequency is not a problem is you want to throw $$ at 
it. It is very hard to win; lots of counts at the high end but not many 
when you are creeping. There just ain't no free lunch.


Dave


On 2/11/20 10:43 PM, andrew beck wrote:

Hi guys

wondering if anyone has any ideas here.

I have a heidanhain spindle motor that runs up to 1 rpm and has a 5v
sin cos encoder on it.  I am currently controlling the motor with a
schiender vfd.  I am talking to the support engineers here in New Zealand
about buying a encoder card so I can get better low down torque.  If I run
the card in full encoder closed loop control in the vfd I can get 200
percent of the torque right down to 0 rpm for 30 seconds or so which is
pretty useful.  I am currently just running the drive in Variable frequency
control which rapidly looses torque at low rpm.

Anyway they have a bunch of cards I can use but don't have a encoder card
that is suitable for sin cos encoders.  I have no trouble changing the
encoder but am not sure if I can get a source of encoders that spin up to
10k rpm.

Anyone have any suggestions?

regards

Andrew

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Re: [Emc-users] trying to connect a encoder from cnc spindle motor to schiender vfd

2020-02-12 Thread dave engvall

http://pico-systems.com/osc2.5/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=31=2n4hbnn63oqt9ncdlervb08tv6

On 2/12/20 1:52 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Wednesday 12 February 2020 01:49:34 andrew beck wrote:

the option I just thought of while googling is, can I convert the sin
cos format in to a normal TTL or something like that? even 1000 ppr
would be heaps it is only on the spindle.

One thing you might try, is to use a couple of those $2 rs485 to ttl
boards. I bought an encoder to put on the rear of the spindle motor,
only to find on its arrival it had a balanced output of only a few
millivolts, nothing ttl about it. So I made a small hammond box with
two of those in it to translate it to ttl for feeding the encoder in the
5i25. Works a treat. But because the sin/cos is generally magneticly
generated, its signal may get weak enough to miss count at very low
speeds, which might lead to enough error to make sloppy threads when
rigid tapping with a peck routine. It might miscount at the turnaround
at the bottom of the hole.

I just want to get the data into the vfd so It knows when the motors
is slowing down. and so I can rigid tap and the existing encoder is a
high quality heidenhian one so might be good to keep it if it is not
too much trouble.

ISTR Jon has a board for that, see at PicoSystems.com.

regards

Andrew

On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 7:43 PM andrew beck

wrote:

Hi guys

wondering if anyone has any ideas here.

I have a heidanhain spindle motor that runs up to 1 rpm and has
a 5v sin cos encoder on it. I am currently controlling the motor
with a schiender vfd. I am talking to the support engineers here in
New Zealand about buying a encoder card so I can get better low down
torque. If I run the card in full encoder closed loop control in
the vfd I can get 200 percent of the torque right down to 0 rpm for
30 seconds or so which is pretty useful. I am currently just
running the drive in Variable frequency control which rapidly looses
torque at low rpm.

Anyway they have a bunch of cards I can use but don't have a encoder
card that is suitable for sin cos encoders. I have no trouble
changing the encoder but am not sure if I can get a source of
encoders that spin up to 10k rpm.

Anyone have any suggestions?

regards

Andrew

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Cheers, Gene Heskett

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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue

I like the idea of iso-propanol. The only thing that would improve the 
process is vapor degreasing. The trick of a non-filled epoxy as a primer 
is good. Why didn't I think of that. ;-)


The Navy uses acetone for degreasing  before using loc-tite on their 
nuclear stuff. Degrease, blow dry, add primer, insert fastener. Who know 
what grade of acetone they use ... probably analytical grade. ;-) Or the 
really fancy stuff for  pesticide residue analysis.


Please understand...if I'm not careful I can learn something everyday.

Dave

On 2/11/20 4:38 PM, Bruce Layne wrote:



On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:30 AM Gene Heskett 
wrote:


Cleaned up with acetone of course.


Cleaning with acetone will result in a good epoxy bond.  Cleaning with
isopropyl alcohol will result in an excellent epoxy bond.  Commercial
acetone, at least in the US, is recovered from industrial processes.
It's distilled, but a trace amount of the waste oil remains in the
acetone after the distillation process and will leave a slight oily film
on your parts after the acetone evaporates.  It's not enough to feel or
see, but it's enough to prevent the best possible epoxy bond.

Maybe remove most of the oily gunk with acetone, scrub with 60-100 grit
sandpaper to create a rough surface for the epoxy to grab, then flood
with isopropyl alcohol to thoroughly degrease the part prior to applying
epoxy.  I'll sometimes use a clean blue paper shop towel or toothbrush
with the alcohol at first if some physical scrubbing is still needed.
I'll finish the job with a spray bottle with isopropyl alcohol to blast
off the last traces of oil, allowing the alcohol and suspended oil to
drip off the part, and then I don't touch the part with my bare hands.
You've made your own printed circuit boards and the process is similar
to the final step of cleaning the bare copper board before the etch
resist process.  When the board is clean of oxides and oil free, the
solvent will uniformly wet the board, drip off the bottom edge, and the
board will dry from the top down leaving a matte finish.

Pro Tip:  for the very best bond when using a filled epoxy, first paint
the bare surface with a thin layer of raw epoxy (resin and hardener)
before applying the filled epoxy (such as JB Weld).  The unfilled epoxy
can more easily penetrate the fine scratches on the substrate, and the
filled epoxy then binds to the unfilled epoxy.  That's a tip from people
who build composite fiberglass airplanes.




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Re: [Emc-users] Open source CNC architecture

If " 'nix" were suddenly removed from the world the internet and a whole 
bunch of other thing would disappear.


Just to rock the boat: mesa (PCW) has a very nice motion controller for 
an FPGA. 50 us cycle time, etc. "ALL" someone has to do is wrap  interp 
and all the other non-motion stuff around it. Of course it is single 
source, etc.


Dave

On 2/11/20 12:05 PM, Chris Albertson wrote:

You care where the loop are because if they are in your PC you need a
special PC with a special OS.   But look at how most 3D printers work.
They are just like 4 axis milling machines, typically using 4 stepper
motors and no one needs a special PC or OS to make prints.   In all cases
the designers have pushed all the real-time function out to a $2 chip.

Back when LinuxCNC was first designed, decades ago there were no $2 chips
that could work.   But today the $2 chip is more powerful than the entire
PC was back in the day.   Doing the work on the PC under Linux was a cost
cutting measure but today it dramatically raises the cost because of the
difficulty of interfacing a PC to a milling machine.   And the need for a
special PC and OS has dramatically reduced the widespread use of LinuxCNC.

Linux is popular in the world if it is hidden.  Look at Android phones.
Everyone uses them but no one needs to learn how to recompile a kernel on
their phone.  They "just work".   Linux has become the #1 OS but only
because it is hidden from users.

Another example of real-time motion control software "done right" is
Cleanflight or BetaFlight (both are nearly the same) This software
controls the motor in a drone.   The control loops run at 2 to 8 KHz and
the software can be configured to run on all kinds of different hardware
then downloaded to the flash ROM on a chip.What is impressive is that
this configuration process is way-easy even for those who know nothing
about computers and software. It is entirely done inside a graphical
web browser.   Users can set which serial ports do what functions and
select protocols anyhow the videos setup.  All using Chrome.Cleanflight
is a model of how this can be done. It is all open sourced.

That said, when some thing works few people are motivated to replace it.

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 5:17 AM Les Newell 
wrote:


What I really
meant was that with a printer, all the critical timing happens in the
printer.  There are no servo-loops on the PC and you don't need a

real-time

OS to print to paper.

Who cares where the servo loops or trajectory planning are? When the end
user presses a button to move the machine they don't care how it is
implemented. They only care that it works. Running a machine takes CPU
cycles. You can either use the CPU in your PC or an external one. What
difference does it make?

Think of your printer example. Do you know or care how much processing
is done in the PC? For example the driver may convert your print page to
PostScript and send that to the printer. The printer then renders that
PostScript to an image of the page. Alternatively the driver may render
the print to a bitmap image of the page and send that to the printer.
The only real difference is in where the processing is done. To the end
user the experience is exactly the same.

Les



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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue

AFIK Araldite is a non-filled epoxy. I've always taken that as the Brit 
name for plain epoxy.  OTOH JB also make a clear 5 min expoy as do 
others. I grew up with a  quart of (Shell at the tme) Epon828 in the 
cupboard. Handy stuff. I once mixed an epoxy using tri-mellitc  (sp??) 
anhydride  as a catalyst. Beautiful yellow color and good to 300-400 F. 
That was about 60 years ago so spelling, etc is iffy.


On 2/11/20 11:57 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Tuesday 11 February 2020 14:20:01 Marcus Bowman wrote:


On 11 Feb 2020, at 18:34, Chris Albertson wrote:

"JB Weld" Epoxy.  It is a mixture of two part epoxy and steel
powder.   Get it at any auto parts store or Home Depot.

On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 10:30 AM Gene Heskett 

wrote:

What sort of glue can I use that can withstand an oily environment
of light 00w20 for many years?

My bet would be on Araldite or the equivalent of JB Weld.
I would roughen the aluminium surface, and try to give it an undercut
'key' of some sort. I would do the same with any plastic. I might even
put some fine copper wire around the package and leave flying ends so
that they too would provide some extra security if they are embedded
in the epoxy.


Thanks Marcus, thats two votes for JBW now. I'll get some fresh stuff and
give it a try.

Cheers, Gene Heskett



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Re: [Emc-users] question about glue