Re: [MBZ] 124 Control Arm Bushings
John, The dealer is either lazy or mis-informed: You can buy the bushings separately, for something like $100 per side (list price). Labor to install shouldn't be more than a couple hours per side, plus alignment. I have a hard time seeing this job over $500-$600, even at the dealership. They need to pull the control arms, with the spring compressor, but it's not THAT difficult or time consuming. The ball joints are replaceable separately, if they are good, you do NOT have to change them. Now, for cars with an M104 or M119 engine, the control arms are different. The bushings are still replaceable separately, however the ball joints are NOT... they are welded into the arm, requiring complete replacement of the arm. The whole new arm is bloody expensive at ~$400/each, list. If so inclined, you can choose to have Sportline bushings installed, intead of the squishy stock bushings. The price is almost the same. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 09:20:17 -0500 From: John Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 124 Control Arm Bushings I brought my '91 300D 2.5 74k miles in to the dealer to diagnose a slight clunking sound in the front end over uneven pavement. They say the noise is the control arm bushings, which sounds reasonable, but they say that they have to change the ball joints, that it is all one piece. Total price for job, $900 including 4 wheel alignment. I didn't want to let them do the work until I had a second opinion. Is this true that they have to change the ball joints along with the control arm bushings? They said the ball joints had no play at all in them. John Peterson Kingston RI 1991 300D 2.5 74k
Re: [MBZ] Clicking noises from behind glovebox
Hi Aaron, I've heard what you describe and I agree that the source of the noise is the 7-port vacuum manifold. However I have *no* idea if it's the manifold itself that's the problem, or if it's getting an erratic, or weak, signal from the ACC brain (pushbutton unit). I'd love to hear if anyone else has encountered this. I forget which of my cars does this occasionally, but it hasn't been bad enough (or frequent enough) for me to make a mental note to fix it. (Yet...!) ;-) -Dave M. -- Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 13:23:25 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Clicking noises from behind glovebox Hi all, My 1987 300D has recently developed this problem, and I'm sure other 124 owners have experienced this as well. On a cold morning after initial startup, I hear a constant clicking noise from behind the glovebox that goes away after about 5 minutes. It's definitely ACC related - there's no clicking noise if the ACC is switched off. My first guess is the vacuum manifold behind the glovebox - do these go bad after a while and cause the clicking issue? -Aaron 1987 300D 1987 300TD
Re: [MBZ] way too much for this car
Book values are meaningless, and usually way low, for cars that are rare and/or were imported in limited numbers. I think there were maybe 1500 diesel wagons imported to the USA back in 1987 and I bet less than 5% remaining today are anywhere near as clean as this one. That was also the last year Mercedes imported ANY diesel wagon to the USA. I would have expected it to sell for mid-teens since it was almost entirely restored. $3615 wouldn't even cover the cost of the *parts* that were recently installed on that car. If you want the ultimate diesel wagon in the USA, you have exactly one choice... from almost 20 years ago. -- Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 13:33:14 -0800 From: Gabriel S. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] way too much for this car That car isn't even worth even $4,000. Whoever payed 10K for it got ripped off. Here is how its appraised in the kelly blue book: *$3,615 - in excellent condition with all options (including leather)*
Re: [MBZ] Opinions (was: WAY too much for this car)
Hi Donald, I understand where you're coming from, and usually I'd agree that is was a little on the high side. And, I don't trust photos that much either. However, if you read the entire text of the ad, almost every high-dollar failure has been addressed. That includes the A/C system, tranny, and rear SLS not to mention almost everything else. The other thing that's hard to determine sight unseen is horsepower, and trying to get anyone to clock it properly with a GPS and stopwatch is nearly impossible. This guy even provided a DYNO graph, for cryin' out loud. The only thing I saw that I could gripe about was an aftermarket hood pad (not 'Genuine Mercedes'). Even the console wood was restored. Another list member paid $9k for a sedan in mint condition (not restored) in the past year and has been more than happy with the purchase. Yeah, you can buy a wagon for $4-$5k, and pat yourself on the back thinking you got a great deal, then spend another $5k over the following few years fixing everything that's not perfect. Me, I'd rather buy the right car up front and spend my weekends and evenings doing something fun. I still say it was worth $10k. Remember, you can't compare 1990's W124 model pricing to this particular car - apples and oranges! Just because a 1993 300D will sell for half that, ditto for an E320 wagon, doesn't mean this 87 is overpriced. As to the previous sale falling through, I bet it was either an overzealous bidder, or someone couldn't get a loan, or something along those lines. If there's something really wrong with the car, then yes it's not worth $10k. As detailed and anal as that guy appears, I'd be surprised if that was the case though. I think Marshall summarized it best, though. The value is determined by what someone is willing to pay, and in this case it was north of $10k. I wonder what it would have fetched via the duPont Registry, instead of a limited-time eBay ad. =) +dm -- Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 15:59:22 -0600 From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Opinions are like a**holes (was WAY too much for this car) You are both wrong (and right). I do understand that something is worth whatever you can get someone to pay for it, but there are limits. Sometimes, people pay too much and other times too little. This particular wagon is unique, it is in great condition, and it is a highly desirable car. But, I do agree the price paid was MUCH too high for this car. This exact wagon was on ebay a few weeks ago and now it is back. I wonder why the sale was not finalized before? I find it hard to swallow that over $10,000 for this car is equivalent to stealing it. A car with this many miles (in this condition) just doesn't EVER sell for this kind of money. So, how does paying more than anybody else has for a car indicate that they stole it. Having said that, I would love to have a perfect 1991 Jeep Grand Waggoneer with all the options and in pewrfect shape. They are selling on some websites for over $22,. If I had an extra $20K (that my wife didn't know about) and I could find one, I might be the proud owner of a Waggoneer. I also think relying on the bluebooks just won't work right now. These particular cars are selling for much more than KBB or NADA or Edmunds has them listed. Any older Mercedes (if it is in this kind of shape) will always bring more than the books say. It is a seller's market for these Diesel Wagons. My stepbrother bought one just like it last year with only 140,OOO miles and real leather seats (they were not brand new, but they are perfect). It also had NO dings and scrapes like this one has. He paid $6500 for it. He thought he got a great deal - maybe he did. I wouldn't pay that much for one of these, but a LOT of people will. Donald H. Snook
Re: [MBZ] ADMIN: Gabriel
Gosh, and we were almost starting to tolerate the little tyke. (Not!) You should sign him up for Banned, if he's not already over there. He was already on my 'ignore' list, but thanks for saving me the trouble in the future. =) +dm -- Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 20:13:12 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] ADMIN: Gabriel Just wanted to let everyone know that Gabriel has become the first member to be banned from the list. Sorry it has come to that but he just didn't seem to get with the program. His comments were not conducive to a friendly list environment. Anyway, now things should get back to normal.
Re: [MBZ] OM602/603 Vacuum Pump Dam Gasket
I'll second that request. My engine is one of the rare few that require the dam gasket, and they are no longer available for purchase anywhere that I know of (but they do come with all new vacuum pumps - go figure.) I'm fresh out of spares, so if anyone has extras (after Tan gets one), I'm also in the market. ;-) For those of you scratching your head, here's a photo to clear things up: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_misc/vac_pump_gaskets.jpg :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 23 Nov 2005 06:29:21 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] OM602/603 Vacuum Pump Dam Gasket Anyone on the list has a Dam gasket and not going to use it? If so, I would like to buy it. Thanks. Tan
Re: [MBZ] ACC madness
Casey, The 7-port manifold is part number 124-800-07-78, about $100 (ouch) from Rusty. Those of you wondering what we're talking about, check out this photo: http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/O404573890OES.JPG The EPC seems to indicate that the same item is use on all W124's regardless of model year or powertrain. As to the probability of it being bad, or how to test it, I really don't know. I would think that it could be bench tested with a 12V supply and a MityVac but I've never had a need to (yet). Maybe Aaron could locat a used one from Pick-n-Pull for you? As a temp fix, your theory about plumbing in a manual trigger should work fine. Or just connect a T to the main vacuum feed line for the winter. Even on max defrost, I think the footwell flaps remain open (but I'd have to check the ACC manual to verify that.) :-) -dm -- Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2005 07:44:46 -0800 From: Zeitgeist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] ACC madness On 11/26/05, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You _are_ sure that the pod works, and doesn't have a microscopic leak? The footwell pod gets a vacuum restrictor in its line, so it is the most sensitive to the beginnings of a diaphragm tear. Last year I just split the supply line for vacuum to the 7 port manifold and sent it directly to the footwell pod (always on) -- the pod held vacuum just fine. I can't remember if you've proven the system out already. (No leaks, voltage as req'd to the vacuum valve.) No, I've been lazy so far and haven't done a stellar job of diagnostics yet. The cryptic references, unhelpful diagrams and wooden prose of the CD's repair procedures make my eyes glaze over... Casey Olympia, WA
[MBZ] Cool E55 commercial
A buddy of mine recently informed me that he purchased a W211 E55. I am currently turning multiple shades of green with envy. I now need to make an out of state road trip to go beg for a ride. For those of you not familiar with the beastly E55, here's a cute commercial that very accurately conveys what the car is capable of: http://www.classic-roadster.de/albums/Filme-amg/AMG_E55_The_Monster_Adve rtise.mov Note: The W210 (previous generation, 99-03) E55 was *not* supercharged, and was approximately as fast as my 'old-school' W124 Q-ship. The W211 version, however, has a WHOLE 'nuter beast under the hood, as seen in the ad above! By comparison, my little M119 just has a couple of hamsters on steroids under the bonnet. :-) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] OM603 oil consumption (was: turbo seal?)
Howdy Nick, It sounds like you may have a few different issues here. My comments: 1) Don't use any oil that is xW-30 or thinner. The second number is the important one, not the first. You want the Mobil-1 5W-40 or 15W-50 variants. Oil consumption may increase with that 5W-30 (or, heaven forbid, even thinner oil) in the crankcase. 2) You've not mentioned the number of miles per quart. In my limited experience, a good, tight OM60x engine should use a quart of oil or less per 6000 miles or so. I wouldn't lose sleep over 4k per quart, but any worse than that and I'd want to know where it was going. If you're in the 2k - or 1k (!) - range, that's bad. 3) The oil leak on the passenger side under the head, above the thermostat housing, is somewhat common - and it's NOT the cause of your problems. There's a pressurized oil passage in that corner. Slightly tightening the two bolts that 'bookend' the passage may slow the leak, but this is not without some risk. I did it on my white '87 and it helped a little. Make sure it's not just a leak from the chain tensioner, which may be cured with a new aluminum seal. 4) The oil leaks at the injection pump are also somewhat normal, although annoying. Re-sealing the injection pump is a pretty major job, but it sure is nice to have a leak-free pump. I've done this on my cars. You can change a couple of the gaskets without removing the pump but it's still a LOT of work. Again, this has nothing to do with your oil consumption problem. 5) The smoke at startup wouldn't bother me much, as long as oil consumption was not excessive. My guesses would be valve guides/seals, failing turbo seals, or the head gasket failure by the #1 cylinder. None of these are particulary common problems however, and all are kind of hard to troubleshoot. 6) Low power - is this low power off-idle (pulling away from a stop sign), or low power at mid/high RPM under full load? This could be a simple as a slightly blocked ALDA line, or fuel filters in need of replacement, or it could indicate the head gasket problem (but I'd expect more smoke if that was the case). 7) Although it's not likely, it's a remote possibility that the engine really does NOT like the thin 5W-30 oil you're currently using, and maybe just switching back to 15W-50 might reduce consumption noticeably. It's worth a shot, IMO... :-) Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) -- Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 08:23:02 -0800 (PST) From: Nick Gough [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] turbo seal? Marshall, During the last 3 weeks, when I did not have the car plugged-in at night during the colder weather, it blew blue smoke out the tailpipe upon statrup. As soon as the engine warms up just a little bit, the smoke disappears. It is also a bit slower than normal, too. I changed the oil and filter about 6 weeks ago and thought I'd try using 5w30 Mobil 1 after searching all over for the new 10w40 Truck SUV Mobil 1. I've gone thru 2 additional qts since then. I don't want to sell the car, either. I will be keeping it for awhile longer. If this is a head gasket leak, that would explain some oil residue on the pass side of the front of the engine, as well as some on the injector pump. The car leaks small amounts of ATF, but not motor oil that I can tell. The coolant reservoir is clean and always at the proper level. I will check out the areas around the head gasket in the front. Thx. Nick Gough 86 300 SDL 171k 93 300E 2.8 127k 97 Jetta 70k
Re: [MBZ] 300E, 305K miles
This would be a 300E with a 3.0L, M103 inline 6 engine. It's quite a robust powerplant really, but old-school technology with quasi-mechanical fuel injection that is a real bear to keep working properly. (Don't ask how I know.) It's also underpowered, IMO. However, the engines should last a LONG time. They usually need a valve job (guides/seals) by 150k, the symptom is high oil consumption (quart per 1500 miles or worse). But the bottom ends usually last almost as long as the diesels. If properly maintained, I wouldn't be surprised to see 500k+ on the original engine, with a couple of valve jobs in between. 300k wouldn't scare me away if the car was cheap, ran well, didn't blow smoke or puke fluids. I'll probably end up selling my pristine 300E eventually, simply because I just don't like the anemic (torque-free) powerplant, and the (relative to a diesel) poor MPG. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2005 17:32:30 -0500 From: Tom Scordato [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] E 300 305K miles Larry T is reported to have said Also, with 305k what kind of work has been done to the engine tranny? If it were a diesel it *might* be on the original engine, but I doubt a gasser would I know nothing about these cars whether they last 40,000 miles or 900,000 miles. Like you Larry, I am still in the last century with the 617.9 four and five banger non turbo diesels. If anyone are interested in going back and forth with the seller contact me off line, [EMAIL PROTECTED] I believe drive train is original though. Like you Larry, I am still in the last century with the 617.9 four and five banger non turbo diesels. thanks Larry T. Tom Scordato Bellefonte PA 1977 300D 261K miles 1979 240D 76K miles
Re: [MBZ] 1991 350 SDL
Hi, Tom's answer pretty much mirrors my thoughts. Could be a really nice car if you want a late W126 diesel, and are willing to deal with potential engine problems. If you're not familiar with the ill-fated, rod-bending 3.5L diesel, here's some info for you: http://www.mbz.org/info/complaints/350SD/ :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2005 22:39:59 -0600 From: Tom Hargrave [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1991 350 SDL All depends, has the engine been replaced yet. And if not, does it use any oil? If the first answer is Yes then it's probably worth the price. If both answers are no then it's probably still worth the price as long as you understand that you may be facing engine issues in the near future. If the engine has not been replaced and it's using any amount of oil then I'd run away, fast. And then, maybe Kaleb can buy it for $500.00.. Thanks, Tom Hargrave 256-656-1924 www.kegkits.com
Re: [MBZ] Photos of K-Mac rear camber kit
Hi Aaron, Wow, I almost missed your post buried in the digest! Anyway, you are correct on all counts. To reduce negative camber, the bottom of the tire is pulled inward, same as AMG did on the original Hammer. The tie rod eccentrics must allow more adjustment but I don't know the specs. There's also a factory tie rod eccentric that allows more adjustment - it's buried in the EPC somewhere, the cost is quite high, and I don't know if it's any help without the camber adjustment anyway. :-) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) -- Date: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 00:39:20 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Photos of K-Mac rear camber kit Dave, I know I'm jumping into this topic a bit late. From what I see, the KMAC bushings replace the inner bushing on the big spring link and the bushing on the rear tie rod, correct? So to decrease negative camber, adjustment of the eccentric bolts would pull the inner part of the rear wheel *closer* to the car, wheras the Speedtek adjustable camber arms push the top of the wheel *outward*? Do the KMAC eccentric bolts for the tie rod offer a bigger range of adjustment compared to the stock tie rod eccentrics? -Aaron 1987 300D 1987 300TD
Re: [MBZ] Replacement Key was: my wife did it!
Andrew, It's possible the locks were changed, resulting in your current dilemma. Try the trunk lock too. Another possibility is that the locks are original, but MB has the wrong data on file for the key code for your VIN. This is rare, but it does happen. I had that problem on my 1984 300D. They won't believe you - and will insist the locks were changed - unless you can produce one of the original master keys with the red dot. None of the options to rectify this are pleasant. You'll need to extract what's left of the broken key, and get a locksmith to make copies of it. Several of them. Keep one at home in a safe place, away from the car. If you're really anal, you can have all the locks on the car converted to fit the dealer's VIN-cut key, eliminating any future headaches. Lesson to everyon else: If you don't have AT LEAST one spare key for your car, get one immediately. For cars with 'security' keys (W124, 201, 140, etc) it's cheaper to buy the dealer VIN-cut keys - call Rusty. Even if you have an old double-cut key (like on the W123's), it's still a good idea to order one dealer key just to make sure the VIN-cut key fits your locks. Or just order a new ignition lock tumbler, which will include a new steel VIN-cut key. If the tumbler is 20+ years old, I strongly recommend doing this as preventive maintenance anyway. I replaced both my W124 tumblers (1986 1987) in the past year, and the old tumblers showed *significant* wear, although they were still operating acceptably. I did the same for my dad's 1987 300D as well - it was also quite worn. If you wait until it seizes up, it's either 5 hours or $500+ to repair. Do it now in 5 minutes and $75 for the new tumbler... :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 12:28:59 -0700 From: Chuck Landenberger [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Replacement Key was: my wife did it! Andrew, Simple conclusion IMHO. A PO had new ignition and door locks installed hence the VIN match won't work Take care, Chuck Phoenix AZ On Dec 8, 2005, at 12:15 PM, andrew strasfogel wrote: And MY son's friend broke off his ONLY key in the door lock (1985 300D). He (son) obtained a replacement key from the dealer based on the VIN but it fits neither the front PS door (the broken key is still lodged in the driver's sdie door lock) nor the ignition. Suggestions, anyone?
Re: [MBZ] Trans shifting hard on 123 when cold
Lee, My 1984 300D was using about 1 quart of oil per 1500 miles when I bought it. I switch to Mobil-1 synthetic and drove the snot out of it, and over the next 10kmi or so the oil consumption gradually about halved... got to a quart per 2500-3000 miles or so at best. You might just need to give it some TLC. Also, if the car has the old 'round tube' PCV breather from valve cover to air cleaner, replace it with the flat rubber part instead. I think that was a good part of my improved oil consumption. Don't let the repair shop scare you. About the tranny shifting, it could be slightly misadjusted, or have a vacuum leak. If the tranny fluid hasn't been changed in over 25kmi, that's the FIRST thing to do. Replace the fluid and filter, make sure both the pan AND torque converter are drained. If it's not leaking badly (I assume it's not), use Mobil-1 synthetic ATF. This can significantly improve the cold shifting characteristics. However, the W123 vintage trannies (through 1984) are known for neck-snapping 1-2 upshifts when warm, let alone cold...! :-) Best regards, Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 20:06:39 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Trans shifting hard on 123 when cold yet another reason to learn how to work on your car yourself otherwise you will go broke at the dealer. Lee Einer wrote: Hi, all- My wife's 1980 300CD is in the shop. I brought it in to have the glow plugs replaced because they were demonstratably bad (murder to get started when cold, white smoke on start-up, glow plug light on dash blinking.) Then, the dealership called back and said they found a bad injector which needed replacing. OK. They just called back and asked me how much deeper they should go because it is burning oil and the trans isn't shifting right. OK, by how much deeper, they mean, into my pockets, I get that, but the trans thing I am curious about- The trans shifts just fine when the beast is warmed up. It shifts whiplash-stiff when the car is cold. How concerned should I be about this?
Re: [MBZ] LeMans Audi R8
Wow. Note there's no paddle shifters, he has to take his hand off the wheel to shift that beast. Brave guy, what with rock walls all around...! =) +dm -- Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2005 21:55:51 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] LeMans Audi R8 LeMans Audi R8 demo run @ Rally de Catalonia in Spain http://www.isellbendrealestate.com/video_clips/2005_gemenos_castellana.wmv Turn up your sound on this one. 10MB download.
[MBZ] 1 Viper + 1 Ferrari + 1 Idiot
Freakin' IDIOT! *shakes head* Oh yeah - that's one more reason ABS is a good idea on street cars. http://www.break.com/articles/vipervsferrari.html?t=4422 -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 1 Viper + 1 Ferrari + 1 Idiot
Good catch, Dave. My guess it that they had a couple of roadside cameramen along the route to get footage that wasn't in-car. The Viper driver probably was trying to show off a little for the camera and overcooked it. I can't imagine anyone purposely diving off a cliff for kicks - the guy was lucky he wasn't hurt worse. =) +dm -- Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 13:34:58 -0500 From: dave walton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1 Viper + 1 Ferrari + 1 Idiot It's a good video, but me thinks it is more than coincidence that of all the places along a multi-mile road course, they happen to have a cameraman standing at the roadside roughly half way between where the car comes around the corner, passes by, and then happens to go over the edge. -Dave Walton 94 S350, 99 E300 On 12/9/05, Dave M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.break.com/articles/vipervsferrari.html?t=4422
Re: [MBZ] LeMans Audi R8
No automatic tranny on that puppy, not even a paddle-shift manual. Watch his right hand closely - that's a good ol'-fashioned stick shift. About his lines, remember that was probably more of an exhibition run for the masses. I could be wrong, though... but I have a hard time imagineing they run actual timed races along rock walls and cliffs like that. (Well, then there's the Isle of Man TT... where a couple participants die every year...) O_o Still a cool video, though! -Dave M. -- Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 22:20:57 -0700 From: Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] LeMans Audi R8 LeMans Audi R8 demo run @ Rally de Catalonia in Spain http://www.isellbendrealestate.com/video_clips/2005_gemenos_castellana.wmv Turn up your sound on this one.? A most powerful car. I presume it has an automatic transmission. The car certainly does accelerate very quickly. The driver, though seemed a little tentative and lacking smoothness in several spots and in some corners took less than an ideal line through. Not that I would do much better -- or even as well. Craig
[MBZ] OT: Super Caddy
Wow! Anyone care to mimic this with an ol' 6.9...? :-) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) -- Forwarded message -- From: Tim W [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Dec 14, 2005 4:10 AM Subject: Caddy To: Dave M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.schwartzperformance.com/cadillac.htm Couldn't stop chuckling while reading this... Very impressive for an old American boat. Tim W.
Re: [MBZ] Vacuum pump question answered, plus rant
Hi Brian, I missed the type of car here, but I gather it's a W124 or W126 with an OM603 engine. I've tinkered with those a little myself, and have a couple of comments. First, you need to test vacuum directly at the port on the pump - disconnect the hose that goes to the 4-way branch fitting. If there's zero vacuum from the pump, the pump is bad (or the port is blocked somehow). The pump isn't cheap, either. If the pump does NOT have 4 Torx-head screws in the front cover, it should be replaced on principle even if it is working OK. Anyway, if there is a leak on any of the vacuum 'consumers', that can cause all the other vacuum operated items to not function. That would be the emissions junk (which can be disabled), the tranny (which will shift harshly with no vacuum), and the climate control vent flaps. The large port on the vac pump feeds both the power brake booster *and* the engine shutoff. If the engine won't shut off, it could be the diaphragm on the injection pump, a leak in the brake booster pipe, or (once again) a bad vacuum pump. It sounds like you have verified that the pump is bad, but first I'd want to disconnect both ports, plug the large one, and measure at the small one. A big leak on the main port could possibly cause no vacuum present at the small port. (?) Don't mess around with that idler pulley - the serpentine belt system is not something to screw with, it can cause the timing cover to fracture (read to fix). If the belt isn't perfectly parallel at the tensioner/idler pulleys, REPLACE the idler lever. The idler puley only needs replacement if the bearing is bad. Only use an OE (Genuine Mercedes) belt shock - the eyelet bushings are different than the OEM (aftermarket) shocks. I'm sorry you had a bad experience with that shop. I remember Stefan's name from the previous (MBZ.org) list, I had forgotten he sold the car. Wasn't that a 350SDL...? Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) -- Date: Wed, 14 Dec 2005 22:37:38 -0500 From: Brian Smyla [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Vacuum pump question answered, plus rant Thanks to all those that replied to my question about the vacuum pump port. I had the engine replaced with a used one, and the shop that did the work warranted the engine for 30 days. The day after I picked the car up, the engine wouldn't stop. I took it back to have the problem resolved, and was told the problem was in the vacuum transducers near the turbo. I took the car back, then discovered that there wasn't any vacuum on the small port on the pump. Also, the climate control had air coming from the defrost ports only, and the shifting was very hard, as was mentioned in some of your replies. I had a very bad experience with this engine replacement. The shop owner claims to have many years experience working on MBZ products, but when I picked the car up, the heat didn't work (mechanic said it was a problem with my climate control), the starter engaged intermittently, the idler pulley was chafing the back side of the belt, a turbo support bracket was missing, and various bolts were missing here and there. I spent three hours checking the climate control, only to finally figure out that the mechanic had left a plug in the return water pipe where it connects to the heater hose that comes off the monovalve. I returned the car for repair of the other problems. They fixed the starter issue, installed the turbo bracket ( after arguing with me on the phone for 5 minutes that the bracket didn't exist ), told me the idler pulley wasn't part of what was warranted ( the idler pulley was from the replacement engine, and I told him that since it wasn't under warranty, I wanted my old one back ), and said the shutoff problem was in the emission control transducers, which I know is BS, because there's no vacuum on the port to start with. If anyone's interested, the shop is Chaney's Auto Service in Ringgold, VA. I'm not going back. Oh, and he charged me $2000 for the replacement engine, labor to remove the replacement engine from the donor vehicle, promised me a 10% cash discount from the original quoted price, then added enough miscellaneous parts (motor mounts, used starter, hoses, etc..) to make up the difference. Go figure. And no, it's not worth going to court over. And to make matters worse, I bought the car from Stefan Schultze, who assured me that the only thing wrong with it was bad hood hinges. Flew to Indiana to pick it up, where he told me that the heater had been intermittently working. Drove it back, then discovered it had a cracked head. All 6 cylinders. Refused to reply to follow up emails asking for a $1k concession. I know, my fault, caveat emptor and all that. Thanks for letting me vent. Brian Smyla
Re: [MBZ] Sweet Vegas Ride, Yo
The car looks nice, but wow, he's posting NADA book values in pesos! What's up with that? Kaleb might offer an extra ten-spot over his usual $500 for this one. =) +dm™ -- Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 09:15:13 -0700 From: Bob Rentfro [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Sweet Vegas Ride, Yo Mercy http://makeashorterlink.com/?N2BD3415C Bob Rentfro '77 300D 144K Litchfield Park, AZ
Re: [MBZ] Filling tires with nitrogen
The whole idea of filling my tyres with nitrogen is fascinating. However, I just wouldn't feel comfortable unless it was Mercedes-approved nitrogen. Even better if it's diesel-rated. Anyone have a part number for Rusty to quote a price on? Don't forget to Red Loc-Tite on the adapters to the Schrader valves, so no IffyBoob employee can accidentally contaminate that pristine N with a little H or O2. :-) +dm™ -- Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:40:11 -0700 From: Tom Reynolds [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Filling tires with nitrogen Yes, chemical reaction with compressed air and aluminum wheels, not so with inert nitrogen gas. Less tire filling. Yea! Tom SS, OK At 10:49 AM 12/15/2005 -0800, you wrote: I understand it helps to prevent leaks with aluminum wheels. Exactly why, I am not sure? Randy
[MBZ] OT: Bike racing (was: Filling tires with nitrogen)
I've been waiting for someone to mention bike racing. Here's a little taste of Moto GP for the uninitiated: http://media.putfile.com/MotogpLifessweetdrug Suddenly NASCAR looks like a bunch of hicks chasing their tails in a high-speed rush hour traffic jam, no? dons flame suit =) +dm™ -- Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 17:46:31 -0700 From: Tom Reynolds [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Filling tires with nitrogen (was Re: Year End Specials) I don't think as fast, though. Ah well, it was just a conversation starter. Anyone wanna talk about F1 or bike racing? grin Tom Sand Springs, OK
Re: [MBZ] Filling tires with nitrogen
And in a former life, I used to amateur race production sportbikes (a 1997 GSX-R750, to be exact). Metal caps with gaskets were indeed required and part of the tech inspection. I didn't often near 150mph as the tracks I raced on didn't have long enough straights... Thunderhill was the fastest, probably mid-140's every lap. Sears Point (now Infineon) was a bit slower, but a lot hairier, and almost more fun in a sadistic sort of way (those of you who have turned a wheel in angst there know what I mean.) I've found cracked plastic caps on some of my vehicles in the past. I try to use only metal caps with gaskets on all my cars (and bike). Be careful, some are better than others - some metal caps have no gaskets, or poor gaskets. Plastic caps are useless except to keep dirt out of the Schrader. =) +dm -- Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 20:32:47 -0500 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Filling tires with nitrogen I used to work for a guy who raced production and showroom stock motorcycles. Tech inspection required metal valve caps with gaskets inside. Unless you've got caps like that, The Schrader valve is the only thing holding the air in. (on the motorcycles, the valve is precisely radial to the axle, and the valves can open from centripetal force at 150mph, so the caps are needed)
[MBZ] AMG Hammer for sale, cheep cheep
For $5k, *someone* needs to pick this thing up. Definitely a project car, but considering the insane rarity of these things...! I think 13 built worldwide? Check out the photos at the link in one of the posts. AMG had to do a lot of reinforcement of the stock 6-cyl subframe. Note the 'Holy Grail' 190MPH speedometer face, too. http://www.mercedesshop.com/shopforum/showthread.php3?t=91940 I'm almost glad it's not near Boise, or I'd probably already have it in my garage. Too far away for me to trailer it back to Idaho. But just think, with a 6.0L M119 under the hood... :-) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban
Hi Casey, 1) I think I originally received the wrong seals, and mistakenly thought the next set of OE seals was was much better. The first set may have been gasser seals instead of diesel. I'm still not positive what happened there. Either way, the cost difference is minimal, and given the complexity of this job I would still recommend OE seals. I am curious to know if the aftermarket seal kits include the plastic installation tubes or not (these protect the seals as they're installed). Photo here: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_head_replacement/valve_seals.jpg 2) I bought the Sir Tools valve spring compressor. You need 3 pieces - the bridge, the handle, and the foot. There are no instruction and half the battle was figuring out how to use the stupid thing. It's complete junk (the metal bends if you look at it the wrong way), but it does work. If I was expecting to do more than one valve seal job (on any Mercedes engine), I'd seriously consider springing for the OE dealer tool kit (at 3x the cost). Photo of all 3 pieces is here: http://www.w124performance.com/images/tools/valve_spring_tools.jpg Details on that OE tool kit, which works on a bunch of engines, is in this PDF: http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/tools/OM60x_valve_tools.pdf =) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 19 Dec 2005 12:40:05 -0800 From: Zeitgeist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban So, in an effort to diagnose and (hopefully) fix my OM603's excessive blue smoking problem upon acceleration, I picked up a cheap rebuilt 350 SDL turbo on ebay ($150), thinking it might stem a source of oil entering the intake stream--it didn't. My recent compression test didn't reveal any anomalous readings in any of the cyls, especially #1, which had been thought to be a candidate for a breached chain vault leak--it wasn't. So, now I'm back to valve stem seals as the prime culprit. Anyone know who's the best tool source and brand name for the valve spring compressor used to get at the seals while the head is still installed? I seem to remember Dave M saying to only use MB stem seals. Any other thoughts? btw: I was able to re-clock the turbo and significantly shorten my IC plumbing, while installing a bigger breather setup. I'll post pics and a write up on Rusty's web forum. Casey Olympia, WA
Re: [MBZ] Highway Debris 1 - Gas Tank 0
I'm confused too. There was never an E420 wagon - nor any V8 engine in a 124 station wagon, that I know of. It must have been an E320 wagon. All the 124 sedans have the tanks in the trunk, where it's nearly impossible to puncture them with road debris. I do believe the 124 wagon tank is exposed under the car, though - that would make a lot more sense. =) +dm™ -- Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:25:13 -0800 (PST) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Highway Debris 1 - Gas Tank 0 Uhh, read what the car is again, 1995 E420 wagon. Wagon tanks are underneith. -Curt
Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban
Hi Casey, I forget which, but I bought mine from either Baum Tools or Performance Products. The bridge and handle are likely the same for M102/103, but the foot piece is - I think - specific to the OM601/2/3 engines. At approximately $200 for all three, there may be a gun and a mask involved when placing your 'order'. I also noticed the head supply thinned out rapidly. There were several available a couple of months ago, but not anymore. If you can afford it, I would seriously think about a new #22 head (OE dealer - NOT aftermarket) since you will be, uh, breathing a little harder than normal on it. Only the #22 has the revised oil passage in front of the #1 cylinder. I'm not sure if that's the only change between it and the #20, or if there are other things too. I don't know the difference between the #17 and #20. The oil passage difference can be seen in this photo: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_head_replacement/heads-front.jpg :-) HTH, Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:16:53 -0800 From: Zeitgeist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban Dave, Rusty's site shows a stem seal set similar to the pics you have of the OE versions (with a two-pack of stem condoms). Where did you purchase the SIR valve spring compressor? Samstag's site doesn't show a version for the OM60X engines, and ZD MAK shows something that looks similar, but sez it's for M102 and M103 engines. http://makeashorterlink.com/?G2E33185C I'm also considering using this opportunity to finally replace my #14 head, but of course, the supply of #17 -- #22 heads seems to have all but dried up. Other than PGA and Silver Star, are there any other reputable MB breakers out there to consider as potential sources? Casey Olympia, WA
Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban
Hi Tan, I think it's an optical illusion. Some of the holes are different, but it's not a huge change. There are dark areas on the old head that can look like holes but really aren't. The block has large openings, and the head gasket has smaller holes to control fluid passage. Kind of an odd setup, really. If you poke around on my website, you can see photos of the block surface and the head gaskets too, for reference: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_head_replacement/ :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 13:20:27 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban Dave, I noticed that the holes (oil and coolant pathways) on the new head are quite different from the old head at several locations. So the holes on the new head match the holes on block perfectly? Tan
Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban
Believe me, Tan, both times I had the head off, *I* was amazed the engine ran when I got it back together! ;-) When I replaced the head, I was concerned about the wear on the timing device cam, as shown in that photo. However I did not replace it at that time. I've seen much worse, and since I was short on funds, I left it alone. A few years later when my timing cover broke, I decided it would never be easier to change the silly thing so I replaced it then. The wear had not gotten any worse in the ~20kmi in between. That part is not cheap, but I feel better with a fresh one installed. I would re-use the old/worn one on a different car if necessary, though. Photos of the new old timer are here: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_timing_cover/ :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2005 07:13:57 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] OM603 smoking ban Dave, I am always mazed that guys like you on the list can put an engine together and it still runs! Speaking of the pictures at your website, I noticed the time device has some considerable wear http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_head_replacement/timing_device_cam1.jpg Did you replace it? Tan
Re: [MBZ] MityVac
I learned the hard way - over many years - that the MityVac is an *awful* tool for bleeding brakes, regardless of how much they hype that use for it. Pressure bleeding is the ONLY way to go. My MityVac doesn't go anywhere near brake fluid anymore. I use it all the time for testing vacuum system components, and boost pressure related items. If anyone needs the full MityVac Silverline kit, here's a great deal: http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/MIT-4050.html :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 21 Dec 2005 22:33:04 -0500 From: Scott Ritchey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] MityVac Kaleb: If the silverline is the metal one and you get brake fluid in it, it will never be right again. Disassembly and cleaning may fix it for a while but the corrosion will come back. Disassembly is fairly obvious, as I recall; just don't lose any parts. I threw my silverline out and bought the cheaper plastic version; no problems yet but I also use a pressure bleeder now. Scott Ritchey Kittrell NC 1982 300SD 220K 1979 300TD 350K
[MBZ] OT: Ferrari Porn, from France
Listen to those bias-ply tyres howl! Wow. The ending is great... http://500ecstasy.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2696 (click the link in the first post) =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
[MBZ] Limo console wood install report (W124)
Hi all, I wanted to add some extra electrical switches in my W124, and prefer a factory appearance. Thanks to Aaron Lam, I learned there was a wood trim piece used in the long wheelbase (limo) version W124 in Europe. This has extra switch holes for (I assume) the 2 extra windows in the 6-door chassis. I picked up one of these 'limo wood' panels for my 1994 E500, which originally had 1 aftermarket switch added for the BergWerks first gear start (FGS) kit - normal position has stock upshifts, the other position selects a programmable upshift speed for the 1-2 part-throttle upshift. Anyway, I wanted to replace that funky FGS switch with a factory switch. And, I wanted to add a switch to turn on the stereo without the key in the ignition. (On the E500, this is a big deal, with the key in position 1 the current draw is nearly 20 amps!) I also wanted to add a momentary contact type switch for my Valentine-1. I specifically wanted it set up so that when the key is turned off, and then the car is re-started, the V-1 does NOT turn back on. So, I wired up a relay to act as a 'latching' relay... momentary contact triggers the V-1 power module (and relay), but when the key is turned off, the relay un-latches - requiring a press of the switch to turn it back on. In case you're wondering why, it's because of the irritating 'startup dance' that the V-1 goes through at each power-up. I don't use it all the time, and hate listenting to that screeching every time I forget to turn off a regular rocker switch (which is what I have right now in the diesel.) See links below for photos. The switch in the 'fader' position is actually an ACC recirculation switch, which controls the V-1. When energized, the red LED stays on. I used this switch because it was the only one I found which has normally closed (NC) *and* normally open (NO) contacts, allowing use of only one relay instead of two. Push up/on closes the NO contacts, push down/off breaks the NC contacts. The right side 'child safety' switch is for the FGS speed selection, replacing the goofy round switch on the old wood panel. The next one down is a factory dual-tone horn switch, which I have set up to turn the radio on off without the key. Next to the left (in the center) is a central lock/unlock switch, which is at present not used. To the left of that is a 'trunk release' switch with integrated alarm LED, again, this is not functional. I may work on making those functional in the future, but for now they're just filling the empty spaces. All are wired so the backlight illumination works - no dead/dark switches, lol. Photos: Stock 1994 E500 Burled Walnut console wood: http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/94_E500/restoration/limo_wood_before.jpg New limo wood piece: http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/94_E500/restoration/limo_wood_after.jpg Stock limo wood, side by side: http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/94_E500/restoration/limo_wood_both.jpg Zebrano 'limo' wood, destined for the blue diesel later this winter: http://www.w124performance.com/images/W124_stuff/limo_woods.jpg Sorry for the lousy photos. I'm still using a 'loaner' 2MP camera from work, about 5 years old (translation - a fossil in digicam years.) I'd like to get a better 'after' photo without the flash glare. I'll get a better one eventually. My old/stock 1994 wood trim panel is for sale, pretty cheap, since I have no use for it. Email me for details. =) Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] Limo console wood install report (W124)
Hi Aaron, Nah, I'm too lazy to pull everything back to the main distribution points. I tapped into one of the gray/blue wires feeding the window switches. ;-) Interestingly, while most MB switches require switching the negative/ground lead (due to internal wiring of the illuminations LED's), the recirc switch actually allows positive switching because it has a separate ground soley for the two LED's. The only other switch I've found that does this is the defroster, which has two NO contacts, one of which is tied to the red LED. In the recirc switch, the red LED is totally separate, which is kinda cool - gives you more options. You come across these things in your PnP travels much? :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 19:19:10 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Limo console wood install report (W124) Dave, For illumination did you splice into the existing grey/blue wires in the center console, or did you run wires under the dash to the main illumination distribution block thingy? -Aaron 1987 300D 1987 300TD
Re: [MBZ] nice SDL
I believe those are forged aluminum wheels, 16 x 7.0 or 7.5, used on the original CLK (C208 chassis). I'm not too crazy about how they look on any car, but I hear they are very light weight, more than most Mercedes wheels. Definitely NOT a proper fitment for any S or SL class - the offset is all wrong. =:-o -dm -- Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2005 21:27:24 -0800 From: Alex Chamberlain [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] nice SDL Interesting wheels. I think I've seen that design on a W202 or maybe a W210, but not on any S-class. I hope he didn't use spacers to get them to fit. On 12/22/05, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mercedes-Benz-300-Series-SDL-05755038677111853_W0QQitemZ4599349997QQcategoryZ6330QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Re: [MBZ] 93 S-Class diesel (new engine?)
I noticed it has a 'MPG' gauge. I thought only gas models had this - those are simply vacuum gauges. What in the world would drive a MPG gauge on a diesel? Boost pressure or something? Bizarre! BTW - I agree, this looks like a beater. And I don't trust the seller's feedback. And I don't like private bidding. And I'd want some kind of verification of the 'recent' engine. If it does have a factory crate motor in there, it's almost worth it as a parts car, if the reserve is low enough. Hmmm. O_o +dm -- Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 10:34:02 -0700 From: Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 93 S-Class diesel (new engine?) On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 10:57:29 -0600 Rick Knoble [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: eBay car, if anyone wants me to check it out, it is not to far from my work. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4599601326 Yes, but check out his feedback. Makes me leery. Craig
Re: [MBZ] 603 HP
Here ya go, Kaleb: 603.96x = 148hp @ 4600, 201lb-ft @ 2400 603.970 = 133hp @ 4000, 228lb-ft @ 2000 603.971 = 148hp @ 4000, 229lb-ft @ 2200 Max RPM (+/- 150rpm): 603.96x = 5150rpm 603.970 = 4250rpm 603.971 = 4750rpm For 1987 models with the trap oxidizer, the power dropped to 143hp and 195 lb-ft, at the same rpm's. I tweaked my pump to have the max RPM limit at the upper tolerance (5400 rpm). Nitpickers will note that the older published specs show +/- 150rpm, while later specs from the WIS show +/- 250rpm and a 5400rpm limit. The assorted spec sheets are here: http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/OM60X/ :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Sun, 25 Dec 2005 10:00:30 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 603 HP What is the horsepower rating of the various 603's? Im thinking the 3.0 is 148 but not sure about the 3.5 in the 126 and in the 140.
Re: [MBZ] 93 S-Class diesel (new engine?)
Yes. The last revision of the OM603 head, casting #22, has a modified oil passage. The previous castings were mostly open to the head gasket, and sometimes the gasket would blow out into the timing chain cavity and #1 cylinder. The new casting moves the passage internal to the head with a hole at either end. In retrospect, I don't understand why it wasn't designed like that in the first place. A photo of the heads side by side, showing the oil passage difference, is here: http://www.w124performance.com/images/OM603_head_replacement/heads-front.jpg :) -Dave M. On 12/26/05, dave walton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I used a dial indicator with a magnetic base to measure how far the top of the pistons protruded from the block. Bent rods don't come up as far. Also measure the roundness of the cylinders at top, middle, and bottom. Didn't Mercedes change the oil passage in front of the #1 cylinder on the 603.97x heads in the latest versions? Thanks -Dave Walton
Re: [MBZ] Admin, transition complete
OK, after the upgrade, has anyone else on digest noticed a change in the digest format? The posts are no longer numbered. See below for an example. I don't miss the lack of 'message ID' or 'content type', but I'd sure like to get the 'message number' back! I only pick out topics from the digest index I want to read, and this allows me to quickly locate the post within the digest. Yeah, yeah, I know all you Gmail users love the threaded feature, but I don't like it (and I hate how Gmail handles labels and won't save things in Sent Items if you delete the thread. Grumble.) =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) New 'updated' digest format: * -- Forwarded message -- From: OK Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 12:13:05 -0600 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Admin, transition complete That's what I do also - I find the Gmail easier to read than the digest. All the messages with a common subject line are grouped together in one thread. * Previous digest format: * -- Message: 4 Date: Sat, 24 Dec 2005 18:01:51 -0500 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Merry Christmas Happy New Year To: 911/993/996 digest [EMAIL PROTECTED],Ferrari List [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=iso-8859-1; reply-type=original Best wishes to all my cyber-friends. I depend on all ya'll to keep me exposed to the world - and you never let me down! *
Re: [MBZ] 1987 300DT
Hi Tom, Yep, that's a W124 chassis, 124.133 to be exact. The engine is an OM603.960, six-cyl turbo with aluminum head. T'was only imported to the USA in 1987. There was a 5-cyl version imported from 1990-1993 (124.128 with 5-cyl OM602 engine), that model has less power but better fuel economy. A more detailed look at stengths/weaknesses is at this link (text file): http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/articles/124.1x3_buying_tips.txt BTW, I completely agree with Casey's assessment. :) My dad sis each have one too. :-) Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) 1987 300D - 247kmi (R.I.P.) -- Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 17:33:00 -0500 From: Tom Scordato [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 1987 300DT WDBEB33D9HA285947 Above is the Vin. Can anyone tell me about these cars? Got to start planning for when there will be much, much fewer 123 chassis diesel in the next 10 to 15 years. Need chassis number (is it 124??) Engine style is it a 6 cyl? strengths and weakness. Production years Cars look very nice. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4599012330 Regards Tom Scordato Bellefonte PA
Re: [MBZ] Admin, transition complete
Kaleb, I think I may have figured it out. I had originally selected 'MIME' format, and that doesn't have the post numbers, and each post starts with that 'forwarded message' header. I switched back to 'Plain Text' and so far, it looks good. I hope it's really that simple! :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 17:26:55 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Admin, transition complete Im not sure why it does or does not do that. I do know before some of the lists numbered them and some didnt. Im not sure if its anything I can control but I will do some digging. Dave M. wrote: OK, after the upgrade, has anyone else on digest noticed a change in the digest format? The posts are no longer numbered. See below for an example. I don't miss the lack of 'message ID' or 'content type', but I'd sure like to get the 'message number' back! I only pick out topics from the digest index I want to read, and this allows me to quickly locate the post within the digest. Yeah, yeah, I know all you Gmail users love the threaded feature, but I don't like it (and I hate how Gmail handles labels and won't save things in Sent Items if you delete the thread. Grumble.) (snip)
Re: [MBZ] Germanic inter-species crossover wheel adaptation?
Casey, I don't know for sure, but I can't see why that would NOT work, as long as the center hub diameter is correct. Remember the MB's are hubcentric, so that is a big deal. There are a *lot* of MB factory wheels in the 16x7.0 and 16x7.5 size with correct offset, at pretty decent prices if you're patient (say, $400 or less for a set with used tires). Do you just not like the looks of most of them? I had a set of 202 Sport wheels, and 208 (CLK) wheels, on my white car. Photos here, in case you missed them: W202 Sport: http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/87_300D_white/new_wheelsL.jpg C208: http://www.w124performance.com/images/cars/87_300D_white/snow_shoes.jpg :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 26 Dec 2005 23:41:32 -0800 From: Zeitgeist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Germanic inter-species crossover wheel adaptation? Has anyone successfully adapted wheels from another (preferably German) car make into the MB realm? I'm fantasizing about upgrading my 124 to 16 rims, but I'm not too smitten by the prices or choices out there. These Audi units seem to be nifty looking and run the same 5x112mm bolt pattern, w/35mm ET as 17 AMG monoblocks: http://makeashorterlink.com/?U2F612F5C -- Casey Olympia, WA Biodiesel: I drive in a persistent vegetative state '87 300TD intercooler (211k)
[MBZ] Cheap 617.952 engine in Texas
Anyone need a turbo motor from a 1984 300D? http://www.mercedesshop.com/shopforum/showthread.php3?t=138079 $125 ain't bad, if you're somewhere near Beaumont. =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 124's
If it has ASD, is a decent color combo, is in nice shape, and located in the west or southwest... *I* might be interested myself! Hopefully it still has R-12 and wasn't downgraded to R-134a in the past. Seriously, the price is decent if the car is in good shape. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 12:47:09 -0500 From: Sunil Hari [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 124's My MB mechanic is trying to sell me a 1992 300D 2.5T with 280Kmi on it - new transmission at 150Kmi, front end rebuilt this summer, new head, new timing chain, valve job, new tires, and everything works. Few dents, no rust. He wants $4500 for it. What's the consensus on that price? I'm interested, despite it having an auto tranny, because i've heard such good things from you people about the 124 sedans.
Re: [MBZ] Rear suspension link replacement - update
Sounds good, Aaron. I thought it would settle down after a little bit. I'm curious what your final alignment specs turn out to be, with no camber adjustment. Couple more questions: 1) 17x8.25 wheels? That's a rather unusual size, and sounds suspiciously like the 500E Evo wheels! What shoes you runnin' on the car these days? ;-) But yeah, you're on the ragged edge of tire clearance without rolled fenders, that's for sure. Bet it looks fantastic, though. 2) Did you go with Sportline front control arms, and are they early or late style? :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 14:29:36 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rear suspension link replacement - update Thanks everyone! Perhaps the cause of my lack of negative camber was due to the old camber strut being somewhat worn out...? Anyhow, after driving around for a bit yesterday, I measured the height from the center of the center cap to the tip of the fender, and it's about 14 - pretty much what it was before swapping out the links. I suppose I should get the rear fenders rolled soon. Peter: Yes, with stock wheels/tires/suspension, the rear tire *shouldn't* touch the fender. I'm right at the limit of clearance - I have 235/45/17 rear tires on a 17x8.25 ET34 wheel. Previously, I had *just* enough negative camber to avoid rubbing, even with two passengers and luggage in the trunk! Dave: I'll take some pics of the aluminum arm soon. As for alignment, I'm waiting for my new front LCA's to arrive, so I'll install those and the new rear tie rod before taking it to the stealer for the final alignment. The rear bushing at the wheel carrier end of the spring link needs some funky special tool (which I don't have) and the local MB indy can do it for about $100 (parts + labor) so I'll probably go that route. -Aaron 1987 300D 1987 300TD
[MBZ] Delivery valve socket for sale
It's not mine - just passing along the info. It's not OE, it's a Sir Tools item, part# M0019. Can't beat the price, though - $10 + SH: http://www.mercedesshop.com/shopforum/showthread.php3?t=140389 For reference, the OE tool is Mercedes part number 617-589-01-09-00 and is probably $35-$40 from Rusty. Considering that, it's somewhat ridiculous that ST bothered making a copy that sells for more money: http://shoptoolsshoptools.com/shopexd.asp?id=1044 O_o -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] MB Tex / cold weather
While Leatherique will clean MB Tex just fine, it's mostly a waste of money. The MB Tex won't absorb any of the pricey Rejuvinator Oil like real leather does. I would just use a good vinyl cleaner, like Meguiars or 3M, and then use Formula 303 when the seats are all cleaned up. I also use 303 on the dash and any other vinyl parts. Great stuff. I save Leatherique for leather only. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 18:35:57 -0500 From: Tom Scordato [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] MB Tex / cold weather To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] 303 Aerospace Protectant. Just do not let the bottle and liquid freeze. Tom - Original Message - From: LT Don [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 12:13 PM Subject: [MBZ] MB Tex / cold weather My driver's seat is looking like it could use some attention. Is there any conditioner that can be used in cold weather (~30F)? I seem to remember that Leatherique needs warmer temps to work.
Re: [MBZ] Rear suspension link replacement - update
Aaron, Wow, I didn't know there were R129 wheels in that size. Very interesting! It was probably smart to get the late style LCA's, now you have the option of running whatever brakes you want. It's a shame the Sportline LCA's are so blasted expensive (~$700 wholesale per pair, dealer only). Thanks for the tip on the wheel catalog, I'll try to pick one of those up. Also thanks for the tip on the Koken tools. I assume they must be better kwality than the ST stuff, which to date I have not been impressed with... :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 16:58:07 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rear suspension link replacement - update Dave, the fronts are the 5-spoke 17x8 ET37 E430 sport wheels, and the rears are R129 wheels which look EXACTLY like the fronts but are 17x8.25 ET34. As for the control arms, I went with the regular 124-330-35/34-07 ones - late style with the non-removable ball joint. They were a LOT cheaper than the Sportline ones, that's for sure! On a side note, you should pick up the 2006 Geniune Mercedes-Benz Accessories Wheels brochure from your local MB dealer. They have LOTS of neat looking wheels with part numbers and all dimensions. The W209, R171, and W203 all have a good selection of 17x7.5 ET37 wheels, which IMO is the perfect size wheel for a lowered non-500E 124! If you can't get ahold of the catalog, I can send one over... -Aaron
Re: [MBZ] Is this an OM 612?
The opening bid for that Sprinter engine ain't bad. But look at the seller's other items! OMG! How does he sell ANYTHING? His prices for used parts are almost as high as new. Fifty bucks for a USED battery tray? That guy is smoking some REALLY good crack. =:-O -dm -- Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2005 21:39:07 -0500 From: Tjohn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Is this an OM 612? Is this a Sprinter engine? Seems like a good price if so... I just wish I had the funds to make one work in my 126... I have dreams of increased horsepower and mileage. http://makeashorterlink.com/?P1FB2206C Tjohn 82 300 SD 220K
Re: [MBZ] Looking to rent differential bushing puller/press tool
Aaron, I think PP sells the equivalent SirTools (?) version for $112, PP p/n 58-076. They call it a 'Sub Frame Bushing Tool', but it's for the differential-to-subframe bushings, not the subframe-to-body bushings like you'd think. I don't have one, so if you buy it and want to re-sell it when you're done, I'd be interested. That would almost be the cost of a rental, lol. Seriously, I don't know if anyone rents that tool, but you could try PP and Rusty. PP tool: http://tinyurl.com/bfves :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 01:05:55 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Looking to rent differential bushing puller/press tool Hello all, Does anyone know where I can rent the puller/press tool to rr the two bushings at the rear of the differential where it mounts to the subframe? The factory tool from MB (124-589-01-43-00) is around $500!! :O -Aaron 1987 300D 1987 300TD
Re: [MBZ] VERY Nice 124 2.5 on ebay Central Indiana - no affiliation.
It looks nice, but wow the bid price sure shot up there for a car with over 200k, no leather, and no ASD. Hmmm. Also, I didn't realize Kumho tyres were made in Germany! Learn sumthin' new every day. All this time I thought they were Korean. The car does look nice, though... and as usual, is too far away from me. :-) +dm -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 08:56:04 -0600 From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] VERY Nice 124 2.5 on ebay Central Indiana - no affiliation. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1-family-owned-non-smoker-24-pix-NICE-TURBO-DIESEL_W0QQitemZ4599776367QQcategoryZ6330QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Donald H. Snook
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat!
Hi Tan, Well, the good news is, your auxiliary fan switch still works - this part is often dead after 10+ years (at least it has been on every W124 owned by my family.) That also means your dash gauge is probably accurate. So you are either not getting coolant flow, or the radiator is not doing it's job properly. Since the radiator outlet is cold, my guess is you have a lack of coolant flow? I'd think if the radiator was bad, it wouldn't happen suddenly, and the outlet would be hot. You can test the t-stat in a pot of hot water, it should visibly open fully by ~94°C, before the water is boiling. No pressure is needed to make the t-stat open. I'd pull the water pump and replace it. I suspect the impeller could be separated from the shaft - not likely, but I'm fresh out of other ideas. I'd get a rebuilt pump from the dealer (or OE from Rusty), that was the most economical option the last time I checked. Please keep us updated, I'm curious what the root cause is. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 08:45:33 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! Yesterday I noticed our 190Dt started to overheat. Outside temp was around 60F's but the coolant temp shot up to 120C degrees. The auxillary fans came on but the temp still won't come down. Last night I inspected the belt drive system, replaced the fan clutch with a good used one and also the belt. Rest of the belt drive parts are fairly new. Also replaced the thermostat with a god used one. But the car still overheats. Temp stayed around 118c. The coolant overflow tank is clean with no oil trace. The upper radiator hose was not pressurized when the car cooled down. One thing I noticed was throughout whole time I was testing the car the lower radiator hose was cold. It seems to me the coolant did not get circulated through the radiator at all. I want to suspect the thermostat was the culprit but the one I just put in was a known good one, actually came off the same car when I did preventative maintenance. Any possibility that the water pump could be bad (put in about 80k miles ago)? What usually happens when the water pump goes out? Also how does the thermostat work exactly? I understand the the bimetal parts expand at the different rate when the coolant temp rises but what exactly open the valves? Does the expansion rate difference of the bi-metal opens the valve or the pressure in the coolant system (applied by the water pump) push open the valve? Any troubleshooting ideas are greatly appreciated. Tan
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat!
Shoot - I don't have it either. I'll copy the list: =) On 12/28/05, Joe Knight [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yuck! Sounds like you're going to have to drain the cooling system anyway so you might want to check the rad for flow with a hose soon as its empty, but given the onset of symptoms it does sound most likely to be a water pump failure of some sort. (hm, don't seem to have Tan's addy so this to you only, Spud) j
Re: [MBZ] Nice Unimog for $110k
Yeah, I noticed that $25k number in the text also. Any idea what the market value is on this thing? I'm wondering if the misprint is in the text, and reserve is under $125k. (??) I could see that CDI engine alone selling for $25k! =) +dm On 12/28/05, Joe Knight [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Looks like a misprint. (Reserve?) price is said to be under $25K in the Vehicle Description. Apparently there've been some offers; be slightly interesting to see what if finally goes for. j On 12/28/05, Dave M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Drat, they only have one at that bargain-basement price. And here I was hoping for a matched pair. :-( That would definitely one-up the Hummer crowd, though. There's a 6-cylinder CDI engine hidden in there with 280hp. What a sweet machine! :-) -dm -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 11:45:51 -0500 From: dave walton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Nice Unimog for $110k http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4600415563
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat!
Tan, I think the new pumps are OK, but I forget. I recall that last time I checed, the rebuilt pumps from the dealer (or Rusty) were a lot less than new. Maybe that's no longer true? I generally prefer dealer parts due to the warranty. I believe the dealer parts you buy through Rusty also carry the dealer warranty (ask him for details - I'm not sure on that.) Brian Toscano had done some research on OM60x water pumps, I think - maybe he can add his $0.02? Oh, btw - I would still test the t-stat (or install a new dealer t-stat), and it wouldn't hurt to put a garden hose in the top of the radiator and make sure there's good flow. If the flow is normal and outlet is still cold, to me that once again points to the water pump. If flow is restricted, the radiator may be the problem (plugged). :-) +dm -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 09:22:47 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! Dave and all, I am more leaning toward to a bad water pump. When I turned the heater on which in turn turned the (electric) auxillary water pump the temp droped maybe 2 degrees. My feel was that the coolant was plainly not flowing throught the system, even the closed circuit. What's the story on the water pump? I guess the new Laso or Geba pumps at Rusty's website are no good? Tan
Re: [MBZ] VERY Nice 124 2.5 on ebay Central Indiana - no affiliation.
Hi Craig, ASD is a traction control of sorts. Basically, cars with ASD have a limited-slip differential that has something like 20-40% locking all the time, via internal clutches in the ring gear carrier. When the computer senses wheelspin, it engages an external hydraulic system that locks the diff up 100%, and triggers an orange warning triangle in the center/top of the speedometer. It's easy to spot cars with ASD, just look for the little square 'window' in the speedometer. Cars with ASR (an electronic system without mechanical limited-slip or any hydraulics) have the same little speedo warning light, but control traction by reducing engine power and/or applying the rear brake to the spinning wheel. Only gas cars have ASR. It was optional on some 1990's cars, standard on others. I believe it's only on M104/M119/M120 engines but that may not be an accurate statement. ASR was never offered on diesels. Diesels have ASD as optional equipment. The only gas car that ever had ASD were the three different 190E-16's (but only models shipped outside USA and Japan.) The USA got a neutered version of the base 201.034 for some reason, and we never saw the way cool 201.035 or 201.036 (Evolution I and II) make it across the pond. The 4Matic has yet a third system which is similar to ASD, complete with speedo warning light... but MB doesn't say the 4Matic has ASD. The 4Matics have limited slip front rear diffs, and I think they have the hydraulic locking for at least the rear. Confused yet? :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 11:21:17 -0700 From: Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] VERY Nice 124 2.5 on ebay Central Indiana - no affiliation. On Wed, 28 Dec 2005 09:34:05 -0700 Dave M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It looks nice, but wow the bid price sure shot up there for a car with over 200k, no leather, and no ASD. Forgive my ignorance, what is ASD? Craig
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat!
I think Marshall got the numbers confused. I just checked the OM602/603 factory manual, section 20-005. The chart there says that non-turbo 602 engine t-stats start opening at 85C, and are fully open by 100C. However the turbo 602 and 603 engine t-stats start opening at 80C, and are fully open at 94C. Either way is somewhat irrelevant, as both should be fully open by the time a pot of water is boiling, for test purposes. :-) +dm -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 13:57:45 -0500 From: Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! Dave M. wrote: Hi Tan, You can test the t-stat in a pot of hot water, it should visibly open fully by ~94?C, before the water is boiling. No pressure is needed to make the t-stat open. I'd pull the water pump and replace it. I suspect the impeller could be separated from the shaft - not likely, but I'm fresh out of other ideas. I'd get a rebuilt pump from the dealer (or OE from Rusty), that was the most economical option the last time I checked. Please keep us updated, I'm curious what the root cause is. WRONG. The 603.96 602.96 thermostats start opening at 80 and are fully open at 100 deg. C. Be SURE there's not a big air bubble (that will cause the exactly what you seem to be describing). I have never had a bad 60x water pump. I've had 3 bad radiators. Marshall
Re: [MBZ] 124 front control arm removal
Aaron, I think that's just old-school Mercedes over-engineering. I'd love to see the car that actually requires the special tool. IIRC, if you jam a screwdriver into the slot and pry/twist, that should provide enough separation, in the event a BFH didn't work in the first place. Maybe this is a bigger problem in the rust belt. =) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 17:19:54 -0800 From: Aaron Lam [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 124 front control arm removal Hi all, The FSM mentions the use of a spreader tool to expand the joint in the steering knuckle in case it's too tight. Has anyone actually had to use this tool to rr the control arms, or will a BFH / prybar do the job? -Aaron
Re: [MBZ] WTF?
Sadly, no, he will not get the boot. He's a Power Seller, which means he can do anything short of selling crack on eBay and get away with it. See, eBay makes money off these jokers, no matter how badly they screw their victims (er,I mean customers). That's why Big Buffoon is still around after years of continuous problems. He consistently gets eBay to remove a lot, if not most, of his negative feedbacks. Bottom line, eBay officials are not our friends - they are interested in making money. Extreme care should be taken with any seller that has a questionable feedback record. BTW, this Ideal bozo has a cheaper scolding here - save 90% over his other rant: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=8025646444 I wonder if he has any idea how much those listings are costing him! -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 23:08:15 -0500 From: Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] WTF? Well actually that listing violates eBay rules by a mile. If someone complains he will get the boot. Mac
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! -update
Tan, Refresh my memory. Did the problem happen overnight, meaning the car has been running at 100C for a while and suddenly popped to 120C? Or has it gradually been climbing from 100C to 120C over the past months/years? If it was an overnight thing, I'd lean towards the water pump as suspect - or at least worth a closer look. You can always re-install it if the impeller is properly attached and intact. If the problem has been slowly getting worse, with temps higher every few months, I would *strongly* suspect the radiator is bad (corroded internally). It may flow just fine, but be unable to transfer heat properly. This assumes the fins are all clean in the condenser AND radiator. The bubble theory mostly applies to when the cooling system is first filled. If you've been driving the car for months, a bubble should NOT just suddenly appear out of nowhere. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 07:22:51 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! -update I am pretty positive on the first two but not last one. The thermostat on OM602 only goes in one position. There is a tab in the thermostat housing that sits in a small recess on the thermostat. Put it in other ways the housing would not close properly. I missed it when I put the second thermostat in and found that out when I started to fill the rediator from the upper hose. The coolant came out right there. So that should tell me the radiator flows ok, right? On the 190Dt it is hard to get the hose clamp for the upper hose end on radiator so I detached from the engine end and filled radiator from there. It is possible there may be an air bubble trapped in the head. How do you normally purge the air in the head - by filling the engine from the upper hose? Tan --- Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Did the boil test last night, the thermostat I just took off the car opened nicely near the boiling point. Fully opened when the water was boiling. Also checked the upper hose again, no pressurized syndrome. So I guess new pump is the next course of action. I still have a Laso pump on hand. Would you all think dealer parts is superior than the OEM parts on this one? I think the pump you have ready to put in is the superior one, but only because I'm still not convinced that it will make any difference and using it will allow you to conduct the test immediately. You're _sure_ the radiator flows well, the thermostat is in the right way around, and that there's no huge air bubble trapped in the head? -- Jim
Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat!
Fascinating. This isn't the first time I've found conflicting information in different publications. In summary: TheTDM says turbo is 80-100, while non-turbo is 85-94. The FSM says turbo is 80-94, while non-turbo is 85-100. The CD-ROM is vague but implies 85-100 for both. The EPC only shows opening temps, and says turbo is 80C, while non-turbo is 85C (not the same part number). :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 11:48:00 -0500 From: Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! Dave M. wrote: I think Marshall got the numbers confused. I just checked the OM602/603 factory manual, section 20-005. The chart there says that non-turbo 602 engine t-stats start opening at 85C, and are fully open by 100C. However the turbo 602 and 603 engine t-stats start opening at 80C, and are fully open at 94C. Either way is somewhat irrelevant, as both should be fully open by the time a pot of water is boiling, for test purposes. TDM 1985 (p 231) shows OM60x.91/92 nonturbo engines use a thermostat that starts opening at 85 and is full open at 94. The 1988 TDM (p 304) also shows OM60x.91/92 nonturbo engines use a thermostat that starts opening at 85 and is full open at 94 and the OM60x.96 turbo engines use a thermostat that starts opening at 80 and is fully open at 100 deg. C. The descriptions in section 20-005 of the engine manual are for illustration only and imply that both turbo and non turbo engines use the same thermostat - but they don't. Check the part numbers for turbo and non-turbo 60x engines. Marshall
Re: [MBZ] Mercedes Digest, Vol 1, Issue 25
Tan, The OM60x cars just seem to plug up radiators for some reason. I don't understand why. If you have not done so, replace the plastic coolant tank (the one with the radiator cap) with a new one. The originals don't have the silica pack inside, the new ones do. This helps control deposits corrosion, according to the FSM. More details are here: http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/OM60X/OM603_radiator_notes.pdf http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/OM60X/OM603_high_temps.pdf :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 11:13:23 -0800 (PST) From: Tan Qu [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] SOS - '87 190Dt Overheat! -update Jim, If my radiator/engine internal indeed are clogged up I'd really go nuts - I have beening flushing/refilling with MB coolant just about once a year! Tan
Re: [MBZ] WOW, this guy has bad feedback
Whaddya mean? He's ranked fourth on all of eBay, with over 510,000 positive feedbacks! Half a million people can't all be wrong. He just got a bad rap over a few (thousand) negatives along the way. We should probably feel sorry for him, poor guy. Want a chuckle? Read the description of his MB piston for sale: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=7575498611 This is a perfect example of eBay allowing someone with an abominable feedback record to continue selling, due to their high volume of sales and therefore large revenue source for eBay. O_o -dm -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 22:45:26 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] WOW, this guy has bad feedback http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=8026449881
Re: [MBZ] WTF?
Then I'm a sleazebag too. :) I finally stopped leaving feedback (when I'm selling something) until the buyer leaves positive feedback for me. I tell them right up front to leave feedback for me if they're happy, and email me immediately if they're not so we can work out a resolution. Half the time I get no feedback at all, and I'm sure not going to pad their positives while they give me nothing! As a buyer, I leave feedback immediately if it's positive, and I don't bother leaving negatives or neutrals - not worth the risk of losing my 100% positive record for some retaliatory scumbag. I'd attempt the 'feedback snipe' but eBay can't even commit to a firm 90 day limit, so the scumbag may still be able to retaliate even if you time it to 89.99 days. +dm -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 22:40:37 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] WTF? I dont leave feedback till its left for me, does that make me a sleezebag?
Re: [MBZ] WTF?
True, eBay isn't making much... but the listing fees (regardless of if the item sells) are based on opening bid price. He'd same some $$ if the opening bid was $0.99 instead of $600. It makes no sense to me for him to list more than one, with a useless title, at a high price. Very weird. =) -- Date: Thu, 29 Dec 2005 20:21:29 -0500 From: Lee Levitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] WTF? Hey, when he has a listing for something that doesn't exist, so that people know to contact him directly, Ebay is not making very much on the listing... Lee
Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt Odometers/Speedometers
If it's just a simple busted gear, yeah, fix it yourself. Otherwise it may need the attention of a professional. My 1987 300D speedo trip odometer was acting up for a long time and finally died - after resetting it would 'click' at 0.9 miles, and not roll forward. Continual resetting over many miles might, eventually, get it counting properly again. I sent it to Overseas Speedo for repair, and it came back doing the same thing. I sent it back a second time, they spent more time on it, but it still does the same thing! I gave up, got it working (after a bazillion reset cycles), and just don't touch the reset button anymore. I'm toying with the idea of changing my rear axle ratio anyway, which would require a new/different speedo, and I figure at that point I'll get one that WORKS. Otherwise I may send it in to a different VDO repair shop and see if they have better luck fixing whatever the problem is. YMMV, etc... :) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 2 Jan 2006 20:02:03 -0600 From: Nick Wellinghoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Rebuilt Odometers/Speedometers If you just need to rebuild your odo don't waste your money sending it someone who is just going to replace the one little plastic gear in there that breaks over time. I bought the gear for 5 bucks and replaced it myself. Total time, 30 min. N
[MBZ] Nice little VeeDub
I thought it was a bit much to compare a purpose-built race car with stock exotics, but it's still pretty cool... http://www.lookatentertainment.com/v/v-1172.htm =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
[MBZ] The Atom
Driving nirvana? Well I'd sure like to give it a try... http://www.lookatentertainment.com/v/v-1866.htm I think a different bike with a pro rider would have equaled the lap time, if not beat it. The CBR600RR is not the quickest production bike out there, and I'm not talking about exotics either. Oh btw, note the Atom was only topped by the Enzo - wow. Wonder if it's street legal in the USA. =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 124 leaking wndshld
Wilton, I have had this problem for years, but it only drips in major rainstorms, and usually only when there's serious wind blowing too. I was never able to figure out exactly where it was coming from. My windshield needs replacement before springtime, so hopefully if that's done properly it will cure the problem. I'm hoping the leak is not from elsewhere, such as the sunroof or roof trim areas, as then I'd need to locate the problem and fix it. Please let us know what you find with your car. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 10:36:54 -0500 From: wilton strickland [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 124 leaking wndshld Wndshld on my otherwise showroom 87 300D has slow-drip leak at upper lft corner. PO had new wndshld installed abt June 04. Tips on sealing the leak? Wilton 87 300D 95KMI
[MBZ] Pimped 190E
This is wrong on s many levels... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4599940334 Look closely - it's got hydraulics too. (*shudder*) O_o -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 140 3.5 fuel mileage
No, at least not in the USA they didn't. All the W140.134 models from 1992-95 in the USA have the same 4-speed 722.3 transmission. It was the gassers, after 1995 I think, that got the new, beefy 722.6 five-speed auto in the USA. The lucky folks across the pond got the W140.135, which had both the OM606 turbo motor (which we NEVER saw), and that engine was mated with the same 722.6 five-speed auto. Now THAT would be one heckuva car!! What a shame MB never imported them. I bet they'd have the highest resale value of any W140 chassis. :) +dm -- Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2006 04:00:32 -0500 From: Jeff Zedic [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 140 3.5 fuel mileage Yes something did change...the later ones got the 5 speed auto box! Jeff Zedic Toronto
Re: [MBZ] 140 3.5 fuel mileage
Yes, but the S320 had a *different* 5-speed tranny, the 722.5, which is sort of a 722.3 with a tacked-on 0.75 overdrive fifth gear. This tranny was too weak to take the torque of either the diesel or V8 engines, so it was only used behind the 6-cyl engines like the M104. The 722.5 doesn't have a very good reputation for reliability. The early W140 diesel V8's got the bulletproof 722.3 four speed, and the later ones got the much stronger 722.6 five speed. I'd *love* to swap the 722.6 tranny into my E500, but besides clearance issues in the body tunnel, there are a lot of electronic controls that wouldn't play nice with the old W124 computers. :) +dm -- Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2006 09:45:09 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 140 3.5 fuel mileage Well the 300SE/S320 had the 5 speed from the beginning. Dave M. wrote: No, at least not in the USA they didn't. All the W140.134 models from 1992-95 in the USA have the same 4-speed 722.3 transmission. It was the gassers, after 1995 I think, that got the new, beefy 722.6 five-speed auto in the USA. The lucky folks across the pond got the W140.135, which had both the OM606 turbo motor (which we NEVER saw), and that engine was mated with the same 722.6 five-speed auto. Now THAT would be one heckuva car!! What a shame MB never imported them. I bet they'd have the highest resale value of any W140 chassis. :) +dm
Re: [MBZ] Center A/C Vents (W123)
I missed this thread earlier. I posted my writeup on how to replace
the W123 center vent vacuum pod on Rusty's forum. Click this link for
the full how-to procedure, including the part numbers to order:
http://buymbparts.com/forum/showthread.php?t=606
:)
-Dave M.
--
Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 15:21:56 -0500
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Center A/C Vents
Thanks to Lee and Alan (and others) who shared the tricky procedure to
replace the pods behind the dash. I plan to check the lines before
attempting to get at the pods in hopes of finding a leak in the line before
working on the pods.
My wife has small hands - so I hope to enlist her help if we have to work
behind the dash --
Thanks again -
Sincerely,
Larry T ('78 240D - 286k)
Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5?
Kaleb, I would get the diesel. If you can find one with a documented factory crate motor, great - they are out there, just not easy to locate. Otherwise, get one that runs good and doesn't use oil. Tear the engine down and replace the rods BEFORE they bend and destroy the cylinder walls. Yeah, it will cost you $1k for new rods up front (plus gaskets and labor time), but the engine should last as long as any other 603 diesel afterwards - assuming the cylinders are still nice and round. The other advantage is, since you have to disassemble most of the engine anyway, you can replace ALL external seals and get a 100% leak-free motor. If you go for the gasser, the 500 is the only one to consider. The 320 is too gutless, and why bother with the 420 when the 500 will be identical in maintenance cost (same M119 engine) but offer an extra 40 ponies on demand, with very little loss in MPG. Forget the 600 for obvious reasons. My sister picked up a very nice 1994 S500 recently and they really like it. Fuel economy is rather poor, figure 13-15 around town (depending on the weight of your foot), and 18-22 on the freeway. Later cars (1996-up?) got the M119.98x engine with distributorless ignition (very cool), as well as the 5-speed automatic tranny. The S500 is surprisingly quick for such a large car. If you lack restraint, a Valentine-1 is a wise accessory to purchase. (Trust me.) Some day I wouldn't mind getting a W140 myself, and it would either be the S350 (with an intercooler, and the full-load screw tweaked, buwaaa-hah-hahaha!) or the S500. Such a shame we never got the 180hp S300 with the turbo 606 motor over here. I'd be all over one of those! :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 08:46:52 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5? How many folks here have a 3.5 in a 140, well, or a 126? Bent rods? Thinking about looking for another 140 in the near future and am really concidering a 3.5 and risking the rods bending. If not that I would either go with the next economical choice of a 320 with the 104 or most likely all out with a 500. Anybody got a 500 and if so what sort of mileage do you get? Probably better off going this route over the diesel anyways. -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK
Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5?
My personal opinion is not *if* an original 3.5 will bend the rods, but *when*. Also remember that most owners think adding a quart of oil every 1kmi is perfectly normal. For a high-mileage M103, it is... but NOT on an OM603. But hey, if you get an S350 cheap enough, just drive it until the engine is shot and then fork over the $$$ for a crate motor. Or, consider swapping in a cheap/used 3.0L long block. (Intercooled, of course. Heh-heh.) =) +dm™ (intercoolers on the brain today) -- Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 10:29:57 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5? got plenty of 126's, had a 140 before, thinking about one again. I have seen several on ebay lately with 200-250K miles. Surely those are OK by now.
Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5?
If operating costs are not a big deal, then yeah go with the gasser. But remember the gasser (S500) will bet getting about 14mpg around town, compared with probably 24mpg on the diesel (S350). That's a BIG difference in the wallet if you drive a lot of miles, even after adjusting for the fact that D#2 is a few pennies more than premium petrol in most places. I don't think the S420 or S320 will offer much, if any, benefit in around-town economy. They'd probably be a little better on the freeway though. Even at 16mpg, the diesel is still FIFTY PERCENT more efficient. YMMV, etc... =) Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 (5.0L M119.974) 1987 300D (3.0L OM603.960) -- Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 13:16:27 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5? Im sure gas would be the choice anyways since she doesnt like diesel
[MBZ] Importing non-US car to the USA? (was: rodbender)
Craig, Importing a car to the USA that was never originally sold here just about takes an act of Congress, or some sort of diplomatic powers. Usually it requires making the whole car meet DOT regs, which can be obscenely expensive. There are a few loopholes, but I think those are few and far between. For instance, if you are moving from another country to the USA permanently and want to bring your personal car over, I think that's possible. (??) Not many people would fall into that category, though. Believe me, I'd LOVE to find a way to get a W124 E60 AMG Limited across the pond, but it'd probably easier to import all the parts needed to build the car and then assemble it here - same with the W140.135 that has the 606 turbo motor. Stupid import laws! I wonder if that car was sold in Canada? It's marginally easier to get a Canadian car to the USA - I think. (???) +dm -- Date: Sun, 8 Jan 2006 15:29:53 -0700 From: Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] anybody with a 603 3.5? Such a shame we never got the 180hp S300 with the turbo 606 motor over here. I'd be all over one of those! Any chance of importing one from wherever they were sold? Craig
Re: [MBZ] Fuel pressure test kits for K-jetronic(CIS)
Is this the same as the CIS-E system used on the early M103 engines? 1986 through 1990-something 300E? I've been wanting to get that too, since my 300E has some annoying issues that I haven't been able to resolve (hard to start when warm, misfire at idle when warm). How about these kits: http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/TA-33865.html http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/OTC-6552.html :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Sun, 08 Jan 2006 22:19:23 -0500 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fuel pressure test kits for K-jetronic(CIS) Hendrik Riessen wrote: Yeah well I am in the market for a test kit. The cheapest I have found in Oz is about AU$600 http://www.autotools.com.au/catalogue/product.php/10/19/224 That's a big universal kit. For K-jet, you just need something you can put in the control circuit with a gauge and a shutoff valve. With the valve open, you read control pressure. With the valve shut, control pressure rises to match system pressure and you see what the regulator is set for.
Re: [MBZ] Cracked diesel head on 124 series
Hi Dennis, Go to this link, skip down to #16: http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/articles/124.1x3_buying_tips.txt :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2006 21:12:38 -0800 From: Woodlandtaylors [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Cracked diesel head on 124 series Can someone provide me a link that discusses the cylinder head cracking issue as it relates to the casting # and exactly where to view the casting marks? Dennis T
Re: [MBZ] Cracked diesel head on 124 series
Yeah, wow, I'll second that. Don't suppose she's single, eh? ;-) Seriously though, the 'low power' issue is probably either an ALDA adjustment, or a plugged line between the intake and ALDA. When running properly, this is not a slow car. A full buyer's guide to this model is here: http://www.w124performance.com/docs/mb/articles/124.1x3_buying_tips.txt :-) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 11:52:08 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Cracked diesel head on 124 series WOW, thats some daughter you got there. Woodlandtaylors wrote: Don, Thanks, the 1987 Wagon that was on Craiglist in Portland Oregon for $1895 the other day is available again. The purchaser reports he changed the glow plugs and it starts instantly now. He purchased it for his girlfriend to use for her real estate business but she does not like it. Hates diesel and says it does not accelerate satisfactory for her and would rather have a MLxxx. He asked for his money back, which the original owner said no way a deals a deal - but did give him a list of people that had contacted him. I was first on the list; my daughter who drives a 300CD would like to get the wagon so I'm going to look at it this morning. I'm a little 'gun shy' after what has transpired but it is worth the time to look. Its needs some work but the daughter wants to tackle it, she changes the oil in the 300CD herself and replaced the turbo - I figure if she can do that she can tackle anything. If it does not suit her perhaps someone on the list may be interested. Sorry for the saga, Dennis T
Re: [MBZ] 124 parts
Hi Sunil, 1) Should be pretty easy. Any hood from 1986-1993 in Smoke Silver will work, although the color may be slightly off . I'd try to find one locally, as shipping a hood is both expensive and risky (hard to avoid damage in transit). I've got a spare trunk lid in Smoke Silver, but no hood, sorry. 2) The seat back will be harder to find used - most places will want to sell you a whole seat. Might consider buying a pair of late model leather seats as an upgrade, but otherwise just buy a new Tex backrest from Rusty. :) -dm -- Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 12:28:57 -0800 From: Sunil Hari [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 124 parts I'm seriously considering buying that 1992 300D with 280Kmi on it (the two-owner one, smoke silver, complete records and completely rebuilt). Two questions before I part with my cash: 1) How easily can I get a smoke silver hood for a 124 car? And how much will one cost me? Anyone out there -happen- to have an extra one? 2) There's a tear in the MB-Tex. Is this repairable? If not, how much would a new one cost? Also, does anyone have the backrest portion of MB-Tex for a driver's 124 seat (beige)? Thanks! -- Sunil Hari [EMAIL PROTECTED] 513-205-7474
Re: [MBZ] Here comes an oil thread
Hi Don, 1) Yes. 2) You betcha. 3) 5W-40 first choice, 15W-50 second choice, nothing else. 4) Uh - the answer to that is 'Mobil-1'. The 5W-40 is very similar to Delvac-1, and I believe both it and the 15W-50 have friction modifiers. Both would be fine for most motocycles with wet clutches, and I have used various M-1 weights in my bikes. However, for motorcycle use there is a special formula of Mobil-1 in various weights, that is designed for the MUCH different shearing loads seen in motorcycles, since the engine oil also lubes the sequential gearbox and clutch. In a nutshell, if the 'car' M-1 makes your bike act funny, use the 'bike' M-1. Most bikes aren't that picky though, despite some people's claim to the contrary. FWIW, my 300E uses about a quart every 1500 miles or less. I fill with M-1 5W-40, then when it needs oil, I top up with 30W dino. By the time it's due for a change, I probably still have more than half M-1 in the crankcase. Maybe I'll try new valve seals in that engine and see if it helps... :) -Dave M. -- Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 16:22:50 -0600 From: Donald Snook [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Here comes an oil thread -- Sorry in advance it is a new topic though its about a gasser Okay, I am fully aware of the great level of debate regarding oil brands. Dr. Booth had me convinced to switch and was going to but then I sold the diesel. So, here's my question. Is Mobil 1 worth it in a gas engine. I know that Mobil 1 is excellent at keeping soot in suspension and lasts longer without breakdown in the harsh environment of a diesel engine, but I have a few questions for my new (to me) purchase 1990 300SEL 122k miles. 1. Should I use Mobil 1? 2. Does it offer the benefits that it does for diesels? 3. What weight should I use? These engines have some issues with valve seals after high mileage. This car does not use/burn any oil in 3000 miles. Which makes me think two things, it will eventually need the seals or it may have already had them done. The original owner (bought it new sold it in 2003) had an extended warranty and evidently had a lot of work done, so it is possible it was already done. It had 76,000 when it was sold in 2003. Is there any oil or additive, or snake oil that can prolong that I can add or use to prolong the life of the valve seals?
Re: [MBZ] 603 #17 head on ebay no affiliation
Nah, the wrong category won't affect it much at all. All the serious eBayers use the search function. Unless the auction title is either really bad, or has misspelled words, most people will still find it. You can set up automatic searches on eBay for somewhat rare items like this, where eBay will email you when something is listed. I used to have that set up for 603 heads, but stopped after my white car got totalled... I bet this ends up in the $1k range though. Side note - looks like it has vertical prechambers, based on the lock ring style. Probably came off a 1986/87 engine, where it had already replaced a cracked #14. :) +dm™ -- Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 23:45:41 -0500 From: Tjohn [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 603 #17 head on ebay no affiliation I'm not so sure. This thing is mis-listed under the instrument clusters section and may cut down on the views. I tried to post this auction this morning, but it didn't go thru. It's had about a hundred views today. Tjohn 82 300 SD 225K
[MBZ] A/C evaporator cleaners?
Hi all, I need to pull the dash to replace the vac pods on my 124, and figure I might as well clean the evaporator while I have easy access to it. There are foaming cleaners that are supposed to lift off the dirt crud and rinse them away, down the drain tubes. I'm having a hard time finding vendors for this stuff, though. This is the only one I've located so far: http://www.ackits.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=dwd2 Is this what I want to buy, or does someone else know of a better product and/or vendor? Note there are two different items here - the DWD2 product, and the cheaper 'core treatment' can that's displayed, and the prices are very different ($40 vs. $15). Rusty, do you sell stuff like this? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks! :-) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
[MBZ] New vehicle for women
Very cool - check out the video (1.6MB download): http://s27.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2FYVNWYSBSNWV180Z4ZNUQKMSW Of course, the obvious problem here is the nice lady losing her car (or truck) in her purse, or accidentally opening it at the wrong time (like in the bathroom). I know Kaleb would love the technology, though - he could fit thousands of parts cars on a shelf! =) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 124 rear speaker
Hi Wilton, The rear speaker covers are a real nuisance. There are a couple of clips plus some plastic 'hooks' that will break if you pry in the wrong area. And, they're even more fun to get properly re-installed. I hate touching them. I forget exactly which section you need to pry on, but I think it's the part closer to the center and/or front of the car. Also check out the section of the factory manual, job 82-7836. :) -Dave M. -- Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2006 09:31:55 -0500 From: wilton strickland [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 124 rear speaker Again: How are rear speaker grilles in 87 300D/124 secured to hat shelf? 'Want to remove one temporarily to run charging cable to mobility scooter in trunk. need abt 5/8 inch hole into trunk to insert plug on end of wire, then close the hole back around wire. Can speaker grille be pried out (friction fit/springs), or does it have screws, etc? BTW, I know how to remove rear seat and backrest -- just unable any more. Wilton
Re: [MBZ] Coked up intake
No no no, the 606 is still indirect injection with prechambers, same as the older diesels. The difference is that it's a hemispherical combustion chamber, with the injector in middle of 4 valves. The prechamber and injector are buried deep in the middle of the cylinder head, not outside like the older cars. And the glow plugs are super long to be able to reach in that far. We didn't get a real direct-injection engine from MB in the USA until 2005. +dm -- Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2006 18:16:19 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Coked up intake the 606 is direct injection? I didnt know that.
Re: [MBZ] Power Steering pump failure.
For older p/s pumps, roughly up to the mid-80's and/or with V-belt drive, some form of approved ATF is fine; with Mobil-1 probably being the preferred ATF. For newer pumps, I'm kind of changing my thinking back to Constantine's, especially on any car with the expensive dual-converter pump (most with SLS have this). The MB fluid might even be synthetic, for all we know - I haven't investigated that, but I know it's a little spendy at $7-$8 per bottle wholesale. Now, for the SLS fluid (which goes to a different section of the same pump), you can NOT use ATF. That definitely requires special hydraulic fluid. Not a lot of cars have SLS, though - wagons, and a handful of later sedans, but that's about it. I guess it wasn't a very popular option for some reason. :) -dm -- Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2006 21:33:34 -0500 From: Werner Fehlauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Power Steering pump failure. Constantine - I'll take the bait and argue your supposition that there is some kind of magic engineering in Mercedes-Benz PS pumps that require special snake oil. My '90 D has now gone for over 130,000 miles on ATF (put in by a major dealer originally, and subsequently changed by me every 30k with Mobil1 synthetic). No leaks, and no problems. I've also changed out the PS oil in my daughter's '77 300D, my '84SD, and my '83SD. All work just fine. And I'll live with the superior cold flow characteristics and high temperature compatibility of Mobil1 any day over whatever dino oil they were thinking of many years ago in Stuttgart. Sorry, but I just won't buy the argument that some old Mercedes spec has to be followed, perhaps just because their engineers either hadn't heard of Synthetic ATF or they hadn't personally tested it first. And Mobil1 will NOT cause O-rings and seals that normally are exposed to an oil, to swell and leak as some urban legend will opine. Werner - Original Message - From: Constantine N. Polites [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2006 4:16 PM Subject: [MBZ] Power Steering pump failure. I just finished rebuilding my tandem pump. I sent part of the work out because I didn't have the right puller. The Vickers pumps made for MB require a special hydraulic oil. If you use ATF fluid, eventually there will be a failure both internally and externally. Internally, the O rings will swell and restrict flow. Externally, the main seal will deteriorate and you will have a leak. That leak will also keep the main bearing from being properly lubricated and again you will have a mechanical failure. I'd look first of all at the tiny O rings. If they are swollen replace them. Even though I did use the proper hydraulic oil, apparently the PO didn't. So I experienced the above conditions. This may have nothing to do with your conditions but it may help. Regards, Constantine
[MBZ] Evaporator cleaning - update
Hi all, I posted a few days ago, asking for recommendations for A/C evaporator cleaners. I was looking for one of those foaming aerosol products that's supposed to lift crud off the fins, and rinse it down the drain tubes. I found a couple of rather pricey options on the internet ($15-$40 per can), but was hoping to locate something local so I could get it done sooner. On Friday, I called a number of major McParts places, HVAC suppliers, and Auto A/C specialty shops. NOBODY had anything, and most had no idea what I was talking about, let alone heard of any specific products like this. Most were surprised when I told them that I had found several on the internet and just wanted a local supply! Quite a disappointing venture, at the outset. One local wholesale HVAC supplier had something that sounded promising, but when I looked up the product name with Google and got a data sheet, it clearly stated not for use on evaporators - apparently it doesn't play nice with bare aluminum! (It's designed for condenser coils, outdoor industrial stuff.) I decided to stop by this place anyway, to pick up a can of the condenser coil cleaning stuff for my home A/C unit this spring. Lo and behold, when I walked in, there on the shelf, five feet inside the front door, was this gem: http://tinyurl.com/cdddo (Nu-Calgon Evap Foam, for those too lazy to click) At a whopping $7.50 per can, I grabbed four cans, along with the gallon jug of condenser cleaner. The guy who rang up the sale had to figure out where it was in the computer, he didn't even know they had this stuff on the shelf! Go figure. Although the can doesn't include a fancy long flexible tube like the spendy stuff, it will spray in any position, including upside down sideways, which is good because that's necessary for full cleaning on the W124. First I replaced my rotted foam drain tubes, to keep the rinse out of the passenger compartment. Then with the A/C fan removed, I plastered every visible section of the evaporator with the Evap Foam. I let it 'break down' for about 5 minutes, then repeated the treatment twice more. I used compressed air to blow the foam further into the evaporator and applied it one last time, then used a garden sprayer with water to rinse the evaporator clean (the water drains out the tubes under the car). The evaporator looks much cleaner now, and hopefully will work better in the summer heat. On a side note, I found this rant about a BG evap cleaning product, which looks an like a repackged DWD2 product with the BG name on it: http://www.badnissaninfiniticars.com/frigi.htm Even if it does work as described, I agree with the author of that page - it's false marketing to show what looks like before and after photos when they are really old, used and new, never installed. Check out the video linked there as well. Here's the DWD2 website again, for reference: http://www.dwd2.com/ And, this is the site selling DWD2 a little cheaper than above: http://www.ackits.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=dwd2 Anyway, if you can find the Nu-Calgon product locally at a decent price, I think it's worth a try if your evaporator could use a little TLC. It's available on the internet (try eBay and Google) if you can't find it locally. I can't say I'd spring for the $25-$50 (with SH) that it would cost to buy the other products available. YMMV, etc... :-) Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] Evaporator cleaning - update
Crap. My note below in parenthesis messed up the link. This one works: http://tinyurl.com/cdddo Thanks for the heads-up, Joe! :) +dm On 1/15/06, Joe Knight [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your tinyurl wouldn't work for me, but a little googling did. Glad to hear you found something locally. j On 1/15/06, Dave M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all, I posted a few days ago, asking for recommendations for A/C evaporator cleaners. I was looking for one of those foaming aerosol products that's supposed to lift crud off the fins, and rinse it down the drain tubes. I found a couple of rather pricey options on the internet ($15-$40 per can), but was hoping to locate something local so I could get it done sooner. On Friday, I called a number of major McParts places, HVAC suppliers, and Auto A/C specialty shops. NOBODY had anything, and most had no idea what I was talking about, let alone heard of any specific products like this. Most were surprised when I told them that I had found several on the internet and just wanted a local supply! Quite a disappointing venture, at the outset. One local wholesale HVAC supplier had something that sounded promising, but when I looked up the product name with Google and got a data sheet, it clearly stated not for use on evaporators - apparently it doesn't play nice with bare aluminum! (It's designed for condenser coils, outdoor industrial stuff.) I decided to stop by this place anyway, to pick up a can of the condenser coil cleaning stuff for my home A/C unit this spring. Lo and behold, when I walked in, there on the shelf, five feet inside the front door, was this gem: http://tinyurl.com/cdddo (Nu-Calgon Evap Foam, for those too lazy to click) At a whopping $7.50 per can, I grabbed four cans, along with the gallon jug of condenser cleaner. The guy who rang up the sale had to figure out where it was in the computer, he didn't even know they had this stuff on the shelf! Go figure. Although the can doesn't include a fancy long flexible tube like the spendy stuff, it will spray in any position, including upside down sideways, which is good because that's necessary for full cleaning on the W124. First I replaced my rotted foam drain tubes, to keep the rinse out of the passenger compartment. Then with the A/C fan removed, I plastered every visible section of the evaporator with the Evap Foam. I let it 'break down' for about 5 minutes, then repeated the treatment twice more. I used compressed air to blow the foam further into the evaporator and applied it one last time, then used a garden sprayer with water to rinse the evaporator clean (the water drains out the tubes under the car). The evaporator looks much cleaner now, and hopefully will work better in the summer heat. On a side note, I found this rant about a BG evap cleaning product, which looks an like a repackged DWD2 product with the BG name on it: http://www.badnissaninfiniticars.com/frigi.htm Even if it does work as described, I agree with the author of that page - it's false marketing to show what looks like before and after photos when they are really old, used and new, never installed. Check out the video linked there as well. Here's the DWD2 website again, for reference: http://www.dwd2.com/ And, this is the site selling DWD2 a little cheaper than above: http://www.ackits.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=dwd2 Anyway, if you can find the Nu-Calgon product locally at a decent price, I think it's worth a try if your evaporator could use a little TLC. It's available on the internet (try eBay and Google) if you can't find it locally. I can't say I'd spring for the $25-$50 (with SH) that it would cost to buy the other products available. YMMV, etc... :-) Best regards, -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] CR report on headlight bulbs
Lee, what brand/model bulbs did you order? I'm curious to hear what you get, and how they work. Another source is www.powerbulbs.com and they do ship from across the pond. :) +dm -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 10:03:14 -0500 From: Lee Levitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] CR report on headlight bulbs Harry writes: Nothing big, I was going to sucker up the money and try a set of Sylvania Silverstars, one of the tested sets. The other four were: APC Plasma Ultrs White; GE Nighthawk; Philips Crystal Vision and Wagner TruView. Check out www.rallylights.com. I ordered a set of their high performance bulbs for the ecode lamps I'm installing in my W124. Haven't got them in yet, so I can't comment on the results. Lee '93 300D 2.5 181K
Re: [MBZ] nice 2.5 turbo for those that have wrecked theirs
Wow! A diesel 124 with leather! Those are awfully rare in the 1990-95 range. The pleated leather door panels look so much nicer than flat, perforated Tex. The final price was a little high, IMO, but probably reasonable considering the car is barely broken in at 56kmi. Then again, if it was a little old lady who drove one mile each way to church and the grocery store...! ;-) +dm -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 10:32:10 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] nice 2.5 turbo for those that have wrecked theirs http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4604735011
Re: [MBZ] 84 300SD Starter Question
Alan, In my experience, jump-starting a diesel - whether it's a little VW diesel, or an MB diesel - is very different than your typical gas engine. To make a long story somewhat shorter, I finally learned that 6 gauge, or even 4 gauge, booster cables are nearly useless. 2 gauge is barely adequate, but it's hard to find anything larger unless you make them yourself from welding cable. The smaller cables make the engine turn over very slowly. Bigger cables, or doubling-up two pairs of smaller ones, made a HUGE difference even on my little VW diesel 4-banger. The best deal I know of is at AutoZone. They have a nice set of 2-gauge, 20-foot cables, made in USA, with beefy clamps for $39. I looked all over and that's the best deal I could find for seriously heavy-duty cables. While your 300SD *could* have some other electrical issues, my money is on the booster cables you were using. Try bigger ones, or simply get the battery fully charged - that will eliminate that possibility quickly. If a fully-charged Group 49 battery is having trouble spinning the engine, you either have wiring problems, or a starter going out. :-) -Dave M. -- Date: 16 Jan 2006 20:25:21 - From: Alan Duff [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 84 300SD Starter Question I'm looking at a 1984 300SD with 231k miles. In attempting to start it using booster cables, with a hot jump battery, the starter spings very slowly. Never gets fast enough to start and he jumper cables get hot to the touch. Is this a bad starter or some other problem in the electrical system? Alan Duff Knoxville, TN
Re: [MBZ] Fat lotta good
For those of you wondering what it's like in Bolton Landing, where Johnny lives, in the Adirondacks... let's just say the residents there would consider a vacation to Alaska with Eskimos in the middle of winter to be a nice warmup. Say Johnny, do you have electricity out to your igloo now? ;-) -Dave M. (ex-Adirondack resident, now in tropical Idaho) -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:15:16 -0500 From: John Berryman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fat lotta good Here's the sure start cold weather recipe: a real good battery and starter, a functioning pre-glow system, extra valve clearance, Mobil 1, block heater not needed above 0 degrees F. A hard wired timer and dedicated circuit for the outlet you plug your block heater into. There is definitely an art to starting a diesel in a cold climate. I have a black-belt in cold start. I live in the Adirondack region of NY and drive MB diesels exclusively. Johnny B
Re: [MBZ] 450hp 126
The insane part is that the long block is capable of surviving with 200% more power. The Crazy Finns have proved it. Just need to modify the exhaust and fuel delivery as Mitch described! The tranny may need the clutch packs from an SL600 (which also uses the same basic 722.3 trans). :) +dm -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:22:46 -0500 From: Mitch Haley [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 450hp 126 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: i'm triing to imagine how much stuff would have to be strengthened on my SDL to handle the additional 300 horsepower... hmmm Injection pump, turbocharger, intercooler and transmission for starters. IP would need big modifications, turbo would need to be replaced with much larger, big intercooler purchased and plumbed, tranny can probably make do with valve, governor and modulator changes.
Re: [MBZ] nice 190D
That's a factory leather steering wheel, replacing the crappy vinyl steering wheel. The wheels are mostly all interchangeable up to 1999, although some later ones may need a new/different contact ring for the airbag (if applicable). The car looks pretty nice - too bad it's not a stick, and closer to Idaho. :) +dm -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:43:14 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] nice 190D yea, its non air bag, but the steering wheel is still different than any I have seen before. Jim Cathey wrote: Is that steering wheel aftermarket? Looks like a non-airbag model. Consistent with its early year and the 2.2l 4-cylinder engine
Re: [MBZ] RARE and sought after 60x IP locking tool
That's the lock tool for all OM60x injection pumps, and most - but not all - 617.95x pumps. For a while, a year or three ago, MB dealers in the USA were claiming they couldn't get that tool - no idea why. It's still on the MB price list and should be available but I don't know if anyone has tried lately. The OE part number is 601-589-05-21-00, and the price should be about $25 from Rusty. Here's a photo of the genuine item: http://www.w124performance.com/images/tools/IP__lock_tool.jpg For the record, I would NOT buy the tool from that seller on eBay = he's got an aftermarket copy, which has been reported to be of poor quality, and not fit correctly (i.e., may not be usable). And, the eBay price sucks, when you can get the genuine MB tool for less from Rusty!! BTW - if anyone has bought one of these from a dealership in the past year or so, please let us know that they are now available once again. ;-) -Dave M. -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:52:24 -0600 From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] RARE and sought after 60x IP locking tool http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mercedes-diesel-injection-pump-cam-Tool-Repair-Tools_W0QQitemZ4605462495QQcategoryZ43998QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem --
Re: [MBZ] 300D 2.5L Turbo Diesel
Well, since he says it turns over and the cam turns, I'd say: 1) Bad glow relay (easy to test, check for +12v at the plugs) 2) Fuel delivery problems - vac shutoff stuck down? It's pretty much gotta be one or the other, either no glow or no fuel. Not much else to go wrong - this is assuming it cranks normally and has SOME compression. Why do these deals always have to be 3000 miles away? Sheesh... I'd snag this if it were near me (and if the price stays cheap enough, which it probably won't.) :) +dm -- Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 18:57:19 -0700 From: Craig McCluskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] 300D 2.5L Turbo Diesel http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=4605490544 Currently at $111.50, with no reserve. Any idea what could be wrong? Craig
[MBZ] Part numbers for plastic vacuum tubing
Hi all, I recently was looking up some part numbers for the Tecalan (plastic) vac tubing used on most MB's. Here's some updated information. I'm not sure if all these part numbers are still available, I may try to order a few of the oddball ones and see what shows up. I have ordered most of these in the past with good results. If your tubing is original, it may snap like dry twigs if you look at them wrong - worth checking, and replacing, if you haven't already done so. They're mostly under $3 per meter, MSRP - call Rusty to order. Some of the fittings splitters are a little higher, they can be $2-$6 each. Vacuum line (plastic Tecalan pipe, 4mm OD, 1mm ID) = 000-158-14-35 - Transparent (sort of white) 000-158-35-35 - Red? 000-158-88-35 - Transparent with brown stripe 000-158-89-35 - Transparent with red stripe 000-158-90-35 - Transparent with yellow stripe 000-158-91-35 - Transparent with blue stripe 000-158-92-35 - Transparent with gray stripe 000-158-93-35 - Transparent with black stripe 000-158-94-35 - Transparent with green stripe 000-158-96-35 - Transparent with violet brown stripe 000-158-97-35 - Transparent with violet red stripe 000-158-98-35 - Transparent with violet yellow stripe 000-158-99-35 - Transparent with violet blue stripe 000-997-39-52 - Brown 001-997-81-52 - Black 116-276-06-30 - Black with white lettering 123-276-16-30 - Black with red stripe Rubber fittings hose (3.5mm ID) = 117-078-02-81 - 90-degree L shaped fitting 117-078-05-81 - 45-degree V shaped fitting 117-997-09-82 - Rubber hose (order by the meter) Black loom (looks like thick heat shrink tube) === 040621-008200 - 8mm ID 040621-011200 - 11mm ID (most useful on my car) 040621-012200 - 12mm ID 040621-014200 - 14mm ID (notice the pattern here? Larger smaller are available too...) Branch fittings (splitters) === 601-078-02-45 - Y shaped 2-port branch fitting (1 in, 2 out) 601-078-04-45 - Y shaped 3-port branch fitting (1 in, 3 out) 601-078-05-45 - Y shaped 4-port branch fitting (1 in, 4 out) 601-078-06-45 - F shaped 2-port branch fitting (1 in, 2 out) If anyone orders these parts, and finds any of my information to be inaccurate, PLEASE let me know and I'll update the list. About half the numbers have been verified from past orders, the rest are best guess from EPC data. I also posted this on Rusty's forum for future reference: http://buymbparts.com/forum/showthread.php?t=100 :) -- Dave M. Boise, ID 1994 E500 - 95kmi (Q-ship) 1987 300D - 261kmi (Sportline)
Re: [MBZ] 1990 Mercedes Benz 300D 2.5 Turbodiesel
You think a 2.5 is fast? You should try my 87 300D... with the full-load screw turned up a half turn, it now outruns my stock 1986 300E at the dragstrip. Not by much, but it's got a better ET. The 300E will slowly pull away over 90mph, though. Another half-turn should cure that, heh-heh. Oh yeah - and that's despite the diesel's 2.65 axle, while the 300E enjoys the advantage of a 3.07! :) -dm -- Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2006 17:06:54 -0500 From: John Peterson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] 1990 Mercedes Benz 300D 2.5 Turbodiesel I am really wanting to drive the 87 TD. I haven't found anyone with one around here yet. I think the 2.5 is fast. Anyone have one in RI or MA? I'd like to see one.
