Re: FW: Remarks on Internet site - from Egged Site
15 2004, 21:15,Diego Iastrubni: , 15 2004, 20:51,Lior Kaplan: I've also check what Tzafrir said with Mozilla FireBird 0.7. The search works fine... No we just need a Konqi confirmation for the site. borked... it goes well, until the load map link is loaded... then... it's a mess. kde3.1.3. I will try 3.2 soon. Works ok with 3.2. The menus are a mess, but everything else works fine including map selection. Their photos of central stations are ancient history BTW, even though the title for the images says today. -- Oded ::.. Law of the Jungle: He who hesitates is lunch. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Two DSL and home networking questions, and a sad story
Sad story first: I went to a friend's place to help him setup DSL for his new (first) Linux. we installed Fedora Core 1 a few days back at the office. He has a DLink wireless router (can't remember the exact model, one or the more fancy ones), and he got Barak to replace his USB modem with an Alactel SpeedTouch 510. The point of the excerise would be to eventually get the DLink router to dial through the DSL modem by itself so no computer need be running for the connection to work. The guy tried the wizards for both gadgets but nothing seemed to work. First order of buisness is to get his Fedora to dial out with the modem connected directly to the NIC. no go. apparently the modem comes unconfigured, and according to the manual there are two ways to get it going - install the dialer program that comes on the CD on your windows computer, or upload a configuration file using the modem's web interface. Another problem - the modem refused to load the configuration file supplied (either of two available, which are similar but not identical). I got the modem to save its current configuration and backup it to a download file, then modified it with the data from the supplied config files and uploaded it. another hint - use Mozilla, for some reason it doesn't like the uplaod when Konqueror does it. At this point the fedora dialer still didn't like the modem but after fiddling with it for an hour or so I decided it might be the linux and plugged in my Mandrake 9.2 installed laptop. a couple of 'next','next','finish' and the internet was runing nicely. back to fedora but no go. Question 1: - The pppd and rp-pppoe versions in both computers are the same version. - Another computer with fedora core had the same issue as the first. - The configuration generated by the distro DSL dialup tools is similar but not identical between Mandrake and Fedora, but running manually the exact same command that was successful in Mandrake failed the same way in Fedora. - enabling debug in pppd got me this: As soon as the pppoe connection is up, pppd starts with rcvd [LCP ConfReq id=xxx mru 1492 auth pap magic ] sent [LCP ConfReq id=xxx mru 1492 magic ] sent [LCP ConfAck id=xxx mru 1492 auth pap magic ] rcvd [LCP ConfAck id=xxx mru 1492 magic ] and then goes on with the PAP authentication. the Fedora pppd does this: rcvd [LCP ConfReq id=xxx mru 1492 auth pap magic ] sent [LCP ConfReq id=xxx mru 1492 magic ] sent [LCP ConfRej id=xxx mru 1492 auth pap magic ] rcvd [LCP ConfAck id=xxx mru 1492 magic ] and then pauses and fails. I couldn't figure out why. Question 2: Did any body got a home router to dial the SpeedTouch ? If I understand correctly the SpeedTouch can also dial itself but I couldn't figure out how to set up the ppp connection, and the manual didn't help (it has examples, but only for PPPoA). The DLink router has a specific WAN RJ45 connector and its PPPoE configuration is under the WAN section, so I assume that it only works when the modem is connected to the WAN port. but I read somewhere that it will not work when connected to the WAN port unless you turn off all of its router functionality and convert it to a dumb modem - which I have no idea how to do. Any hints will be appreciated. -- Oded ::.. Real punks help little old ladies across the street because it shocks more people than if they spit on the sidewalk. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
MP3 in Fedora Core 1
Hi list. I know this issue has been discussed here in the past, specifically about XMMS and the missing MP3 input plugin. Well, I got XMMS to play, but that just half the problem - I want KDE and GNOME to play MP3. Both aRts (for KDE) and gstreamer (for GNOME) that came with Fedora Core 1 seem to lack the capabilities to play MP3s. they play vorbis files just fine, but when asked to play MP3 files, both aRts based the gstreamer based applications just refuse to play - no error messages at all. Anybody manages to get that to work w/o installing lame from sources and recompiling kdemultimedia and gstreamer ? -- Oded ::.. Everywhere I go I'm asked if I think the university stifles writers. My opinion is that they don't stifle enough of them. -- Flannery O'Connor = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Hebrew CMS engines
12 2004, 10:06,Shlomi Fish: Well, pardon me, but I think you're wrong. Adding Hebrew support to an already complete CMS, will probably easier than writing a complete CMS from scratch with Hebrew in mind. Especially given the fact that HTML supports Logical Hebrew quite transparently. Unlike what most people think, making a non-BiDi aware HTML application, especially the more complicated ones using CSS bells and whistles, is a lot more work then just adding dir=rtl to the html tag. the main caveat is of course the CSS 'right'/'left' semantics (which should have been 'first'/'last' if you ask me) that aren't reveresed. the least of your problem is finding all the places where HTML generation has these 'right' or 'left' values hard coded, and replace them with something that understand the rendering direction of the document. Then you'll run into the BiDi display problems specific to each browser (assuming you want to be x-platform or something) of which there are many and all of them are trouble. All of this is from experience as I am also one of the build it yourself crowd and am currently writing a wiki from scratch built with hebrew in mind. -- Oded ::.. And remember, when you look into the pit, the pit looks back into you. -- Anonymous INTERCAL hacker To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: inside rpms...
09 2004, 23:43,Diego Iastrubni: 1) the file list, find . -type d | sed '1,2d;s,^\.,\%attr(-\,root\,root) \%dir ,' ... %files -f ../file.list.kfiresaver3d does anyone have a better trick? I dont like the cd. Sometimes I am lazy and I just do /. It does the trick. Yes - find out which files you need and only list those files. if RedHat had intended %file to be automatic, they wouldn't have wrote it that way - you'd get some inteligent wildcard parser instead. the -f switch is a shortcut for the lazy folks, but its not what you're supposed to do. %files is used to mark special files (configuration and docs) and set correct attributes. using -f nullifies that capability. For most software packages, I just list the primary directories that I know are used for the installation (/usr/bin, /usr/lib, /etc, etc') and set the correct flags for each. If for some reason I have problems, I can go in and tweak it (something that is very hard or impossible using -f). I rarely need a list of more then 10 entries, usually much less. 2) I am maintaining a cvs build of kdevelop, which I compile it into an rpm. The rpm is available in iglu. For some reason I build the rpm, and now I get this problem when I try to install the rpm: kdevelop-3.0-cvs_20040109.i586 (due to unsatisfied devel(libdb-3.3)) (Y/n) The package name should be libdb3.3-devel-3.3.11-16mdk. Mandrake changed the way the name packages lately (its been going on since before 9.2 and they haven't completed the change yet) to something that there is hope that the uninitiated will understand better. This dependency is not in my spec, so I dont even know from where the problem comes. In the post build stage, RPM looks for dependencies by examining binary files with ldd. That's why, for example, building Java RPMs on my system (not from sources of course) results in ODBC and ALSA dependencies. 3) I am trying to make an rpm out of the _binary_ OpenOffice found now on [EMAIL PROTECTED] lib]# rpm -Uhv /mnt/source/rpm/RPMS/i586/OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco.i586.rpm error: Failed dependencies: libcrypto.so.0 is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco libjawt.so is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco libreadline.so.4.1 is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco libssl.so.0 is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco libtcl8.3.so is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco libtk8.3.so is needed by OpenOffice-1.1-3cuco Its the same problem as (2) - that is the RPM binary dependancy scanning. the problem this time is that your current RPMs do not advertise the capability that the RPM dependancy scanning method reports. [EMAIL PROTECTED] lib]# rpm -qf /usr/lib/libssl.so libopenssl0.9.7-devel-0.9.7b-4mdk what does rpm -q --provides libopenssl0.9.7 say ? it should say libcrypto.so.0 along with other capabilities for the installation to work. -- Oded ::.. A journey of a thousand miles begins with a broken fan belt and a leaky tire. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [SOLVED] Re: Upgrading KDE 3.1.3 to 3.1.4 on Debian Sid breaks fonts
11 2004, 04:24,Gad: I've managed to play around with the fonts and I discovered that the font I was using (Ann) probably doesn't have a UTF8 version, so it was displaying as gibberish. Correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC fonts do not have a utf-8 version or a cp1255 version. they have entity groups or something other which corresponds to various languages code sets and its up to the rendering engine to convert from the current character set's character code to the correct entity location in the font file. i.e - the character code for aleph in ISO-8859-8 is different from the one for ISO-10646, but I can still use the same font for both. -- Oded ::.. I'm not confused; I'm just well-mixed. -- Robert Frost To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Hebrew CMS engines
11 2004, 00:45,Gil Freund: I am looking for a CMS (content management system) for web sites that will support a bilingual site (hebrew and english, preferably with UTF-8). This is not for a member type site, such as plone, nuke's, wiki's or blogs, but more of information site with a limited and finite number of editors. There are several Hebrew nuke derivatives around, though I found none of them to be well designed or well implemented. I'm still not sure if its mostly a problem with the original phpnuke design or the level of the avarage Israel PHP programmer (I suspect both ;-). -- Oded ::.. Document code? Why do you think they call it 'code?' To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Barak Cables over PPTP
On Sunday 04 January 2004 07:02, Ittay Dror wrote: Hi everyone, I'm trying to setup a dialer to Barak over PPTP (and Ethernet). Does someone have a ready-made script (for Mandrake 9.1) so that I don't have to mess with it myself? Also, instructions for how to make a connection sharing (not a gw) so another computer can use its own dialer will be appriciated. try DrakConnect. it does ok in 9.2, I have no reason to believe it won't be ok for 9.1. you might need to update your PPTP client though. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: The Proliferation of Linux and its Effect on Programmers
04 2004, 18:56,Oleg Goldshmidt: A more realistic example: if I am BMW and my iDrive system in the 700 series runs on Windows and keeps crashing then I have to factor the cost of crashes (in fixes, recalls, returns, lost customers, lost reputation, etc) when I consider switching to linux (while assuming that Linux-based iDrive won't crash all that much, of course). Except that most buisness decision makers aren't developers by training, or system administrators or even semi-technical people at all. as such they often fail to factor in real costs such as: - developers' down time due to system failures or lack of documentation. - system down time due to required upgrades or security patches to operating system. Because they are so used to having their home computers down for days as a result of viruses and spontaneus system crashes, managers cannot even entertain the possibility that there are better alternatives. When you come up to an IT manager and tell him - my software has a 99.999% uptime, he might believe you but he considers this as the figure w/o factoring in the above mentioned problems which are never factored. its impossible to explain this to people who do not have technical know how themselves. -- Oded ::.. Nick : Playing strip poker with an exhibitionist somehow takes the challenge out of it. -- from Metropolitan To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Bayesian filtering (Re: Suggentions for server side spam control)
01 2004, 00:34,Gil Freund: occasionally scan user's inboxes by grepping for known keywords to extract SPAM that they got and then feeds it to the dictionary. I also have some dummy accounts which exist for the sole purpose of attracting SPAM. How do you feed it? I thought SA reads MBOX and Maildir formats only? I don't use SA - I use bogofilter (see my previous message), which likes mboxs (not Maildir though) but can also cooperate with STDIN. I actually have two mail targets which gobbles everything sent to them and feed it to bogofilter's dictionary as either SPAM or HAM respectivly. I almost never use them though because bogofilter also classifies IP addresses and I fear it might classify the IP of the mail server itself (which will of course appear in all the emails) as a SPAM source. -- Oded ::.. We're programmers. Programmers are, in their hearts, architects, and the first thing they want to do when they get to a site is to bulldoze the place flat and build something grand. We're not excited by incremental renovation: tinkering, improving, planting flower beds. -- Joel Spolsky / Things you Should Never Do, Part I To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Suggentions for server side spam control
On Wednesday 31 December 2003 17:40, Baruch Birnbaum wrote: Do you have experience with any of them as a server side spam control software? Is there anything else? I'm using bogofilter by ESR. its wasn't trivial to setup on my Postfix/Cyrus system, and it requires a very large volume of test email to be effective, but I got it to dump email that it sure is SPAM and after a couple of months of running it I get almost no SPAM that it isn't marked and the ammount of suspect as SPAM has diminished greatly. I expect it to get better as I feed it more SPAM, which I do regularly from the stuff that still lends in my inbox and the stuff I get from my unprotected work email. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Suggentions for server side spam control
On Wednesday 31 December 2003 20:57, Gil Freund wrote: This is interesting. I use SpamAssassin via amavis on a few systems that use Cyrus as MDA, but haven't figured out a reasonable way to set bayesian filtering on such a mail store. Could you elaborate on how you set up cyrus and bogofilter. The same setup should also be usable (I guess) for SpamAssassin bayesian filtering. Lets ignore the problem of teaching bogofilter for a second here. I wrote a simply script (attached) that runs bogofilter and then resends the output through the system's sendmail. The attached script does other things - it changes the subject of the message to reflect the SPAM level of the message as OE and other dumb email clients can't filter on arbitary headers, and it also rejects SPAM emails and store them in an mbox for later. I then installed that script as the content_filter for postfix, which was very simple to do. you might also want to check bogofilter's homepage for other success stories. -- Oded bogofilter2sendmail Description: application/shellscript
Re: Bayesian filtering (Re: Suggentions for server side spam control)
On Wednesday 31 December 2003 20:59, Gil Freund wrote: I wonder, does bayesian filtering make sense on a domain level (i.e. the same DB for all users) and not having each user teach the system his/her own rules? Good question. I have no idea :-) I've set it up anyway, and it looks to be working OK (that is no complaints from users so far :-). I know its not nice to do, but I occasionally scan user's inboxes by grepping for known keywords to extract SPAM that they got and then feeds it to the dictionary. I also have some dummy accounts which exist for the sole purpose of attracting SPAM. All in all I think SPAM is generally the same for all the users - viagra ads and other suspect materials, nigerian scams and yambateva. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Some thoughts about the linux.org.il Site
30 2003, 19:33,Orna Agmon: As one of the iglu.org.il webmasters, my time is limited, and I have many other interests. If you wish me to set up a Wiki, then that can be done very easily. We already have an Israeli linux wiki, where not so many people contribute (and one person set it up). Given the little time we have to do such things, I suggest combining forces rather than splitting. http://linuxil.objectis.net/ Is it really a wiki ? because it doesn't seem to be editable even for registered users. the most that I can do is create new pages under my member home page. this is not the most useful format for collaberation. I probably missed something. -- Oded ::.. [alt.usage.english, Date: 13 Aug 1994 14:59:08 MET] It seems to be impossible to parody PC. Any suggestion, no matter how outrageous, will be taken seriously by someone out there. I'm now convinced there must be people who use vertically challenged (short) and metabolically challenged (dead) with a straight face. Until people stop this madness, there's little hope of succeeding with sane proposals like avoiding he and man as gender-neutral terms. -- Keith Ivey To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Automatically unmonuting an idle partition
I'm working on tightening the security of my laptop (installed with RH9). I'm trying to figure out a way to automatically unmount a partition that has been standing idle for some time. 'Idle' means, of course, that no reads or writes were made from/to that partition. Any hints on tools, scripts or APIs are welcomed. Mandrake's supermount might do the work for you. it actually automounts whenever the specified device becomes idle and not after a timeout and remounts it immidietly on access. it is usually used to support removable media but I guess nothing prevents it from being used on static partitions. -- Oded ::.. How many people work here? Oh, about half. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Automatically unmonuting an idle partition
29 2003, 18:43,Diego Iastrubni: , 29 2003, 15:42,Oded Arbel: I'm working on tightening the security of my laptop (installed with RH9). I'm trying to figure out a way to automatically unmount a partition that has been standing idle for some time. 'Idle' means, of course, that no reads or writes were made from/to that partition. Any hints on tools, scripts or APIs are welcomed. Mandrake's supermount might do the work for you. it actually automounts whenever the specified device becomes idle and not after a timeout and remounts it immidietly on access. it is usually used to support removable media but I guess nothing prevents it from being used on static partitions. but then it gets mounted just by ls /mnt/mydisk. this is not what he wanted. When he said he wanted to automaticly unmount idling partitions, I was under the impression that he also wanted them to automaticly remount when required, because this sounds to me like a useful feature, but I may have been mistaken. -- Oded ::.. The Marines: The few, the proud, the not very bright. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Automatically unmonuting an idle partition
29 2003, 19:13,Diego Iastrubni:
, 29 2003, 18:50,
Oded
Arbel:
When he said he wanted to automaticly unmount idling partitions, I was
under the impression that he also wanted them to automaticly remount when
required, because this sounds to me like a useful feature, but I may have
been mistaken.
read the first sentence :
I'm working on tightening the security of my laptop (installed with RH9).
Got that. but I'm sure I'm not the first person who fails to see how
tightening security is related to autounmounting partitions.
--
Oded
::..
My employer doesn't even agree with me about C indentation style.
-- Used as a disclaimer
{.n+zwfj)mXze{^{.n+^,jirzfXze{
Re: Automatically unmonuting an idle partition
29 2003, 23:53,Sharon Dagan: This partition is actually encrypted. If the machine is stolen while powered on and the partition is mounted, automatic unmounting will (hopefully) save the day. Oh.. One thing simple that I would have done is put in a cronjob that runs every 5 minutes or so. put in a shell script in that uses lsof to see if someone is holding open files on the partition. if it finds no open files it can unmount it immidietly or it can simply remember the timestamp or something and unmount it later. I'm sure you can figure out the exact policy you want. -- Oded ::.. I'd rather you do it wrong, than for me to have to do it at all. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Suggestions for open source backup program
28 2003, 15:43,Baruch Birnbaum: Hi linux-il, I need a backup software for linux that should: How about Arkeia ? its not open source but its great, reasonably priced and have a free version for a linux server and two clients. -- Oded ::.. Tragedy is when I cut my finger. Comedy is when you walk into an open sewer and die. -- Mel Brooks To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mozilla keyboard freeze
On Wednesday 24 December 2003 18:43, Ilya Konstantinov wrote: I must say it's sad that on Linux at 2003 multiplexing multiple sound sources still doesn't work like magic. It works for me. (And no, aRts is no solution. Its' lags are inacceptable for movies/games.) Its configurable, and even the default of half a second is usable for most sound requirements (playing MP3s and such). if you want low-latency gaming, configure it to have a smaller buffer, and it it has a higher latency then advertised, suid root the daemon and tell it to use priority scheduling. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Fwd: [linux-elitists] Fwd: [vox] Microsoft interested in our feelings
21 2003, 07:20,Behdad Esfahbod: On Fri, 19 Dec 2003, Diego Iastrubni wrote: linux? what linux? in 5 years i would like to use the hurd! :) What does the hypothetical hurd has promised you to do that you like to use it? Is it the name that is better than linux? IMHO forget about hurd. It's simply dead. Who's gonna write all these drivers again? The best is that they need porting every driver from linux to so called hurd which may be simply an implementation of linux's internal interface... as hirds... I do believe that the hurd can offer a much better user experience then linux, for the home user as well as the hobist (don't know about buisness servers). the more extensible nature of the hurd's architecture and the much better designed API (well it was designed, which is usually better then evolved which is what the Linux API did) will probably make integration of system components much better then it is in Linux. The current status in Linux is a disaster. installation of a new hardware piece is ten times more difficult then in any other competing OS, even taking into account all the neat scripts that people write in order to circumvent the shortcomings of the kernel. (yes, I know 2.6 is much better then how it used to be, but its still not good enough). Unfortunatly as other people have mentioned - the HURD is seriously lacking in developers, especially driver writers. Linux is to blame for most of that. and at this stage HURD developers had best put all their efforts into porting Linux drivers to HURD as this is the fastest route to getting more people to install HURD, get more testing done and get more developers in the project. In 5 years I hope to be using HURD on my primary computer, but I really hope it won't take 5 years. Oh, and in 5 years I'd also like to see the current XFree86 scrapped in favor of a better performing, better looking, easier to configure alternative. Fresco would be neat, but I'd settle for Keith Richard's work or getting everything to run on XDirectFB. -- Oded ::.. You are only young once, but you can stay immature indefinitely. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Fwd: [linux-elitists] Fwd: [vox] Microsoft interested in our feelings
21 2003, 14:52,Shlomi Fish: since Mandrake 7.2 I never had to re-compile the kernel, except UML kernels for kernel development HURD offers something very interesting in this areana: you won't need UML with HURD because each user can run her own drivers/filesystems/etc or even a full kernel on a running system w/o affecting other users. Is the situation considerably better in x86-based BSD systems? Not AFAIK. marginly better I might say. And what are you referring by shortcomings of the kernel? What is wrong with the kernel, exactly? There are tons of problems, one that comes to mind now (because I just ran into it today) is that if a process is blocked on IO, inside the kernel, nothing you can do in user space can free it. you can't interrupt it or even kill -9 it. if you can't fix the problem at the root, you might as well reboot. Unfortunatly as other people have mentioned - the HURD is seriously lacking in developers, especially driver writers. Linux is to blame for most of that. KImageShop is seriously lacking in developers, and the GIMP is to blame for most of that. Can you blame people for wanting to contribute to a fully functional, full-fledged working system that to something that does not work yet, and has not for countless years? No. never meant to say anything bad about the people working on Linux, but you have to agree that if Linux had not existed, HURD would have had many more developers, may be even to the point that it would have been usable about now. BTW - as Debian GNU/Hurd have been mentioned here, here are the installation instruction if anybody wants to try it out. http://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/hurd-install -- Oded ::.. You are caught in a maze of twisty little Sendmail rules, all obscure. -- Sendmail: Theory and Practice / Avolio Vixie To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Fwd: [linux-elitists] Fwd: [vox] Microsoft interested in our feelings
21 2003, 19:41,Shlomi Fish: Is the situation considerably better in x86-based BSD systems? Not AFAIK. marginly better I mightsay. Hmmm... so it's not as much a problem of Linux as it is the problem of the wacky i386 architecture. And since Linux has to run there, I think that it can be done better, as 2.6 proves - or tries to at least: I have no real experience with that as I haven't been running 2.6 long enough, but the architecture looks so much better. And I think you can do even better then that. No. never meant to say anything bad about the people working on Linux, but you have to agree that if Linux had not existed, HURD would have had many more developers, may be even to the point that it would have been usable about now. And in the meantime everyone would have used a BSD clone... ;-) I feel your pain.. I'm not a great believer in the concentration of effort/let's have just one alternative belief. The existence of KDE does not necessarily makes GNOME progress any slower. (and vice versa). And so, I'm not sure the rise of Linux has slowed down the Hurd considerably. point taken. -- Oded ::.. I've never been canoeing before, but I imagine there must be just a few simple heuristics you have to remember... Yes, don't fall out, and don't hit rocks. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Fwd: [linux-elitists] Fwd: [vox] Microsoft interested in our feelings
21 2003, 19:42,Gilad Ben-Yossef: On Sunday 21 December 2003 18:37, Oded Arbel wrote: HURD offers something very interesting in this areana: you won't need UML with HURD because each user can run her own drivers/filesystems/etc or even a full kernel on a running system w/o affecting other users. Which is exactly what UML does. The fact the in HURD it will be your_kernel talking to the microkernel and on Linux it's UML talking to the host kernel is moot It is if you want to run a full OS, but the HURD allows you to run just a filesystem (and pretend its root - a-la chroot), or just a specific driver or any combinartion of hirds that you feel like using, and most times you don't even need super-user premission to do that. Is the situation considerably better in x86-based BSD systems? Not AFAIK. marginly better I might say. Technically, that's wrong. Darwin for example is a BSD system running on top of the Mach microkernel, the same one that HURD used in the begining of the project. And the situation with Darwin is marginly better then in Linux regarding most of the problems Ive mentioned. HURD has a bit different approach then Darwin to how the kernel works with the rest of the system, and I think the situation there is much better (again, not taking into account amount, quality and availability of hardware drivers as this is clearly not a fair comparison). There are tons of problems, one that comes to mind now (because I just ran into it today) is that if a process is blocked on IO, inside the kernel, nothing you can do in user space can free it. you can't interrupt it or even kill -9 it. if you can't fix the problem at the root, you might as well reboot. But have you ever asked yourself why this is so? snip But now consider what happens if you are doing IO. I mean real IO here - talking to some hardware or such. As the kernel, you started handling the request and sent some instructions to the hardware, like wrote some stuff to a region of memory the card reads via DMA for example. Yes, but mostly the problems are with simple stuff like PIPEs, network sockets and such, and I think that the kernel should make allowences for those, or atleast for the KILL signal. And after this too long a speech, maybe all you need is to add soft to the NFS volume mount options? :- because it doesn't help any- it blocks as well, especially if portmap isn't running.. besides, why soft isn't the default ? we know that the abstraction doesn't work so why try to enforce it ? -- Oded ::.. No program done by an undergrad will work after she graduates. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Hurd (Was: Microsoft interested in our feelings)
21 2003, 18:37,Oded Arbel: BTW - as Debian GNU/Hurd have been mentioned here, here are the installation instruction if anybody wants to try it out. http://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/hurd-install Correction- don't use that manual. look for a debian package called crosshurd. AFAIU (haven't tried this myself yet - will do once I get my secondary home computer to boot) you need to have Debian GNU/Linux running, and then use crosshurd to install Debian GNU/Hurd on another partition. -- Oded ::.. Hobbes: 'Did you ask your mom if you could jump off the roof?' Calvin: 'Questions I know the answers to I don't need to ask, right?' To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Hebrew Wikis? (was: Re: Document managment and workflow)
On Wednesday 17 December 2003 16:39, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yishay Mor wrote: As a QD alternative, I've used JSPWiki (.org). Its a wiki (surprise), Which reminds me a question I'm bothering with for quite a while - is anyone aware of Hebrew-enabled Wiki engines? The only one I found so far is the Hebrew Wikipedia effort, and I'm not sure I like their interface (I easely get lost in their document hierarchy). I'm actually working on a PHP based wiki with a lot of other interesting stuff. its only at the beginning, but I already got many features of the features I'm aiming for. you can look at it at http://www.typo.co.il (and please don't make a mess). while the interface is english only currently (mainly due to the fact that I do a lot of the editing on non-unicode friendly terminals), its all gettext ready and I'll build a catalog once the todo list has shrunk down to manageable size. Currently it does offer page editing limitation - pages are owned and owners can limit editing to logged in users, friends, owner only or to lock the page completly. unfortunatly the user registeration screens do not work at the moment, and some of the interface is hidden from anonymous users. One more warning - the styling engine is very week and offer nothing but the most rudimentary abilities. unless someone else wants to take it over, it will stay that way until all the other stuff is done. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Ynet: MoF considers using Linux (probably Mandrake) for desktops
14 2003, 12:09,Nadav Har'El: Even more so when it comes to Hebrew support (which is the issue discussed here) - if Mandrake has better Hebrew support (does it?) It does. mostly due to the efforts of several Israeli guys (I won't name names as I'm sure to forget some), Mandrake is AFAIK the most hebrew supporting distro around. If I'm not mistaken, its also the only distro that offers hebrew speaking installer (to some degree). -- Oded To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Slow KDE?
14 2003, 12:40,Ben-Nes Michael: The only thing that bother me is how robust is the portage system, is it good enough to Servers ? ( I mean while updating, resolving dependencies ) I don't think it will ever be - its geared towards source packages (I understand there is some support for binary only packages, but have never tried using them). as such it will always fall behind packaging systems designed to handle binary only packages, which is what you'd use for server installation, especially large scale installs. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want to compile sources for each of my servers. even if we ignore the slowness of the process (several orders of magnitude slower then binary only install), compiling all packages from sources intoroduces a large amount of discrepancy between boxes that should be as identical as possible. this is not good for large or even medium scale installations. -- Oded To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: clarification
11 2003, 16:43,Oded Arbel: offering is based) being install by IBM in National Security offices across Sorry about the above mistake - just to make things clear, when I wrote National Security I actually meant Social Security - BITUACH LEUMI. -- Oded ::.. Any nitwit can understand computers. Many do. -- Ted Nelson To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Hebrew HTML Help: Bullets or Numbers in Lists appear at the right
14 2003, 17:01,Shlomi Fish: Hi! In the document: http://t2.technion.ac.il/~shlomif/rub-a-dub/rub-a-dub-dub-heb_final.html I have no idea what is causing it. Both the body and the ol and ul tags have a dir=rtl attribute. This document was generated from an OpenOffice document, so something may be wrong there, but I tried everything I can think of. The first thing to do is a minimal test case. it can be seen that it is the p tag contained directly inside the li tag that causes it. remove it or replace it with span and everything should work normally. -- Oded To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: clarification
11 2003, 08:19, : Regarding your article: Open questionDear Open Source Friends, Here is my reply: I had come across Prof. MacCormack's paper and I also found it very interesting. I agree with him that the state of the art of TCO measurement is not where we would like it to be and that fact adds a lot of uncertainty into the equation. Nonetheless, for public policy purposes, one has to take a position. Given the existing evidence, and given the institutional history of the Israeli government (pays bloated salaries) as well as the unfortunate economic situation in Israel (huge national budget deficit), I believe, as I stated in the conclusion of the article, that it would be pre-mature to switch to open source solutions in the Israeli public sector. There is a greater probability that expenses will increase rather than decrease following such a move. The Israeli government should therefore postpone a switch until more comprehensive studies are conducted and more evidence is collected. The Israeli government has been risking taxpayer money for far too long in almost every sphere of its activities. Note that I am not saying that the switch should never take place. I'm only saying that now is not the right time in Israel. While I fully understand the p[roblem, I do not think that your article presented any hard data relevant to the situation. in fact - there is simply no empherycal evidence that switching to open source would increase computerization costs in the government sector or elleviate costs. Evidence from other sectors does indicate that switching to open source and specifically free software (please don't confuse the two terms) does reduce total costs - in the private and military sector. In addition to the important distinction between open source software and free software, its also important to understand that open source does not mean 'non-commercial'. for example of a fully commercial but open source software, you might take the StarOffice software suite by Sun. Another prime example is the OpenOffice software suite (on which the Sun StarOffice offering is based) being install by IBM in National Security offices across Israel. while being essentially both open source and free software, Open Office is backed by IBM support and integration services as an end-user product for Israeli National Security services. in that essence it is not much different the Microsoft's commercial MS-Office offering, except of course having all the known advantages of being an open source community developed project. It might be more correct to conclude that unless backed by high-end integration and support services at the level offered by the commercial competitors, switching to open source software is risky in very large government projects. Ss this kind of support is offered by many major software house and software providers, both international and Israeli based, the conclusion that open source software is inherintly risky seems premature. I understand your concern for shared source. Perhaps its not ideal. But, on the other hand, intellectual property rights must be clearly defined and protected. If they aren't, I bet software innovation will also come to a screeching halt. There's a similar problem in the pharmaceutical industry with parallel importation and lax enforcement of the TRIPS agreement. Please read the US Federal Trade Commity research regarding patents (as an IP rights protection mechanism) and innovation in hi-tech industries, specificly comparing computer software and hardware to pharmaceutical and bio-technology sectors. The conclusions the draw are very interesting, particularly regarding your last comment. http://www.ftc.gov/os/2003/10/innovationrpt.pdf Of course we have completly failed to discuss the effects that using commercial (and expensive) software products has on the Israeli public itself - as the internet and other electronic and computerized communications are being used more and more to allow Israeli citizens to communicate directly with government offices, its important to keep the communication protocols used open and free so that free software can be used to access those channels, preventing the Israeli citizens from being required to purchase an expensive software suite to receive government services. The fact is that propriatery commercial software products, and specifically Microsoft's software products make it all to easy to create closed Microsoft Only access to public services, while using same software to enable open and free access becomes much more difficult (consider the platora of Internet Explorer and MS-Word required governmental web sites for a good example). This financial effects of this scenario are easy to surmise. -- Oded ::.. But what we need to know is, do people want nasally-insertable computers? To
Re: clarification
On Thursday 11 December 2003 22:31, Oron Peled wrote: Two fixes (for an otherwise correct and focused answer) and some additions. On Thursday 11 December 2003 16:43, Oded Arbel wrote: In addition to the important distinction between open source software and free software ... The distinction you refer too is between the two ideologies (about *why* this software is needed). The software itself is practically the same as both the open source definition and the free software definition gives the same rights. Not exactly. you seem to refer to GNU's notion of open source, a notion I did not mention. Open Source is software that has the source available (freely or for a charge) but it does not infer that the software itself is free. for example, software distributed under the Aladin so called Public License is open source - you get the source and are allowed to tinker with it and fix it for your own purposes, but it is not free you are not allowed to redistribute it and are forced to resubmit your changes to the copyright holder. So as far as technical/economical merits are concerned, open-source and free software are the *same* (and correctly bundled as a single acronym -- FOSS). I beg to differ. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Cable Internet, 012, and what's between it...
On Tuesday 09 December 2003 23:07, Dan Fruehauf wrote: Recently (actually today) i acquired a broadband cable connection through the new (and pretty tempting) deal of AZTV and 012.net. While writing this email, i didnt disconnect from 012, but i'm willing to, mainly because one of the comments i got from their support, translating to english it was something in the form of : hey, if you disable DHCP access and move everybody to dialers and such, people not using windows will be unable to connect through you, it might be even 10% of your users we dont care, they are probably very few... Unfortunately I'm not surprised. when I first got an ISDN line (about 3 years ago) I bought an account with 012.net. I still don't know why, but I could never connect to them - after authentication all I got on the line was errors. Unfazed I called 012 tech support at which time they specifically told me, in not so many words, that I can go look where the sun doesn't shine as they don't support Linux, has no intention to support Linux, don't really care about Linux users and I can forget about getting my money back and I still owe them the next 2 months' fees as I signed a 3 month service commitment. My conclusion after this was - never do business with 012. Other ISPs on my not getting any more money from me list are: * Barak - blamed me for stealling bandwidth after they disconnected my 2B ISDN line which was running over a year w/o problems. * Internet Zahav - have sucky tech support and specifically told me they only provider support for windows users and only for web browsing problems when I called with remote access problems. they also have a badly configured transparent proxy. * Netvision - unilaterally changed the pricing program for a friend of mine (to the more expensive one of course), and I know for a fact that they tend to do this often. for example - they offer an ADSL bundle in which they buy the ADSL line which then belongs to them and they won't turn it over to the client when she wants to move to another ISP. * BezeqInt - part of the Evil Empire from Hell(tm). in the past I had problems with their tech support but I'm told they are much better now. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I wish stack traces had line numbers
But they don't. instead they have memory addresses and the function name. so I've been thinking - suppose I have a binary with debugging information, and the source code and a stack trace - shouldn't I be able to extrapolate from it in what line in the code each frame in the stack is ? Note: I don't have a core dump - just a textual stack trace. -- Oded ::.. Civilization, as we know it today, owes it's existence to the engineers. These are the men who, down the long centuries, have learned to exploit the properties of matter and the sources of power for the benefit of mankind. -- L. Sprague DeCamp = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: I wish stack traces had line numbers
07 2003, 18:43,Muli Ben-Yehuda: On Sun, Dec 07, 2003 at 06:24:02PM +0200, Oded Arbel wrote: But they don't. instead they have memory addresses and the function name. so I've been thinking - suppose I have a binary with debugging information, and the source code and a stack trace - shouldn't I be able to extrapolate from it in what line in the code each frame in the stack is ? Of course. disassemble each function, and correlate memory address in the disassembly to the memory address you have. Am I missing something? Nothing that I can think of. I had the the idea that it should work out something like how you describe, but I guess I was hoping to get a more pragmatic answer, maybe pointing me at some utilities that already do part of the work - I don't fancy doing this myself, as I haven't got the time. Then I got objdump to give me all the info that I need, so I'm ok now, thanks :-) -- Oded ::.. Real punks help little old ladies across the street because it shocks more people than if they spit on the sidewalk. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: 1 step Kpilot hebrew support
04 2003, 12:31,Shachar Shemesh: Rant I don't understand why KDE systematically refuses to use the locale information for it's activity. I agree this is a problem, but often the case is that you want your application to work differently then what the system is configured for, and setting up the env for each run (for example, in a .desktop entry) is not a good way to go. kpilot is a good example: while my system is set for UTF-8, I'd want kpilot to use ISO when synching. that are independantly configured. Not suprisingly, not everything has a GUI, makeing one go through the sources (as I had to do just now) Its always a work in progress. setting up something to be configurable is alot easier then building a GUI for the configuration. the KDE project is investing a lot of resources in making building configuration interfaces as easy as possible [1][2], but it still takes programmers and time to convert all the applications[3]. That being said, KPilot in KDE 3.2 has GUI for charset configuration. [1] See KConfigXT http://developer.kde.org/documentation/tutorials/kconfigxt/ kconfigxt.html [2] unlike the friends from GNOME. sorry, couldn't resist ;-) gconf? come-on! [3] insert standard don't-complain-if-you-won't-help rant, if you like, -- Oded ::.. The only difference between a madman and myself is that I am not mad -- Salvadore Dali To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: RedHat equivalent of make-kpkg?
On Wednesday 03 December 2003 08:39, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there any red-hat equivalent for Debian's make-kpkg? For those who don't know what it is - make-kpkg allows one to take a vanilla kernel source and build .deb files for the kernel image, modules etc. There is really no need for a specialized method of building kernel packages. the RPM building procedure is sufficient for that purpose. get a kernel source RPM, modify the configuration and rebuild it. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: RedHat equivalent of make-kpkg?
03 2003, 10:51,[EMAIL PROTECTED]: That wouldn't cut it because then I depend on having a kernel source RPM for the particular version I want. Oded Arbel wrote: On Wednesday 03 December 2003 08:39, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there any red-hat equivalent for Debian's make-kpkg? For those who don't know what it is - make-kpkg allows one to take a vanilla kernel source and build .deb files for the kernel image, modules etc. There is really no need for a specialized method of building kernel packages. the RPM building procedure is sufficient for that purpose. get a kernel source RPM, modify the configuration and rebuild it. And that being different from your situation where you need a kernel source tree of the version you want, in what way ? -- Oded ::.. More Important then to win is to win dirty. -- Fishizm To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: RedHat equivalent of make-kpkg?
03 2003, 12:23,[EMAIL PROTECTED]: Oded Arbel wrote: And that being different from your situation where you need a kernel source tree of the version you want, in what way ? In the way that it would make me dependent on finding a .srpm file for the kernel I want to compile. Not so. nothing stopping you from pointing the RPM to another source tarball then the one it originally contained. -- Oded ::.. Instructions for life: 18. Judge your success by what you had to give up in order to get it. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: RedHat equivalent of make-kpkg?
03 2003, 12:50,Tzafrir Cohen: On Wed, Dec 03, 2003 at 12:30:00PM +0200, Oded Arbel wrote: 03 2003, 12:23,[EMAIL PROTECTED]: Oded Arbel wrote: And that being different from your situation where you need a kernel source tree of the version you want, in what way ? In the way that it would make me dependent on finding a .srpm file for the kernel I want to compile. Not so. nothing stopping you from pointing the RPM to another source tarball then the one it originally contained. Have you tried it? yes successfully? yes. not recently though, and I wouldn't attempt to modify a 2.4 srpm for a 2.6 installation. building a new spec would probably be a better idea if it weren't for the rpm target in the kernel Makefile. -- Oded ::.. Courage is like love; it must have hope for nourishment. -- Napoleon To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Hebrew and MDK 9.2
02 2003, 19:23,Amichai Rotman: Hi All, I Have downloaded the ISOs of MDK 9.2 shortly after it became available. I installed the system and all seemed fine. I have noticed the Hebrew support files are missing. For instance, the Hebrew files for Open Office 1.1.0RC4, The KOffice Hebrew files OpenOffice and KOffice do not have (yet) a hebrew package. both do support hebrew writing and reading but not localization of menus and dialogs. and more. For example ? -- Oded ::.. For future reference - don't anybody else try to send patches as vi scripts, please. Yes, it's manly, but let's face it, so is bungee-jumping with the cord tied to your testicles. -- Linus Torvalds on LKML regarding patch submission policy To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: two network cards q
01 2003, 19:48,Shimon Panfil: Hi folks, on my machine with 2 ethernet cards different kernels see these two cards in different order. How can I appoint specific device for specific interface? Kernel parameters? Are these two diferent cards or the same ? if its different cards then you can setup modules.conf with alias eth0 driver1 alias eth1 driver2 -- Oded ::.. Software is like Entropy: it's hard to grasp, weighs nothing and obeys the Second Law of Thermodynamics, i.e. it always increases -- Norman Augustine To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: adding windows hebrew fonts??
29 2003, 23:17,Aaron: Hi all, I once had Mandrake and its font utility let me install all my windows fonts on linux including the hebrew ones. Anyone know how to do the same thing on Redhat??? If you are using KDE, then you can use the KControl font installer. if you run it as an unpriviliged user it will install the fonts on your home directory only for your user, but running it as root will install fonts for the system. There are some settings to be configured before you can start installing, but the defaults are usually ok and whats not is very straight-forward. In case you might wonder - it does not install fonts in a KDE specific way so that any X client can use the new fonts. -- Oded ::.. Murphy's Law is recursive. Washing your car to make it rain doesn't work. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: extended Israeli keyboard layout
30 2003, 11:45,Tzafrir Cohen: A second approach claims that the software should detect the user's input and if the user in in right-to-left mode translate the parens reversed. Currently this is only implemented by QT (= 3.1). Horribly. In Qt 3.1 if you type a hebrew paragraph and then an open paren and then try to type a latin char, the paren chracter changes direction. this is very confusing and anoying. Qt 3.2 fortunatly does a much better job. IIUC, X currently (4.3) generates 'open paren' and 'close paren' and its up to the toolkit to generate the correct glyph according to the paragraph direction. this is ok until you need to store text and render stored text, where the characters are 'right paren' and 'left paren'. -- Oded ::.. 'Is not a quine' is not a quine is a quine. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: extended Israeli keyboard layout
30 2003, 12:23,Tzafrir Cohen: On Sun, Nov 30, 2003 at 12:27:40PM +0200, Oded Arbel wrote: 30 2003, 11:45,Tzafrir Cohen: A second approach claims that the software should detect the user's input and if the user in in right-to-left mode translate the parens reversed. Currently this is only implemented by QT (= 3.1). Horribly. In Qt 3.1 if you type a hebrew paragraph and then an open paren and then try to type a latin char, the paren chracter changes direction. this is very confusing and anoying. Qt 3.2 fortunatly does a much better job. Does QT 3.2 actively do anything if you have XFree 4.3? What do you mean ? I do have 4.3. I'm not sure about the correctness, but in both GTK+2 and Qt3.2, SHIFT-0 generates a 'close parens' when XKB has a latin group active and 'open-parens' when XKB has a hebrew groups active. this sounds like what you described X does. The only problem is that if you are typing in an LTR paragraph and switch to hebrew group or write in an RTL paragraph and switch to a hebrew group, then type a 'close paren' the result looks awkward. -- Oded ::.. A bug in the code is worth two in the documentation. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: can't save data on disk-on-key
On Saturday 29 November 2003 20:17, Shlomo Solomon wrote: was gone. I can only guess that kudzu periodically checks and updates fstab (maybe a cron job - I didn't check). Please note that when you plug the dongle while running, what is responsible for mounting the driver (and putting an icon on your desktop) isn't kudzu (which only runs at startup) but hotplug. hotplug obviously detected the removal of the disk when you unplugged the device and removed the entry from fstab. Did you try to call mount manualy with all the parameters instead of relying on the proper fstab entry ? -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mail and Hebrew]
24 2003, 15:40,Shachar Shemesh: Mozilla from totally unusable for Hebrew to bearable, with no better alternative, at least as far as I'm concerned. KMail is the obvious alternative, but there are other Qt based mailers, all are quite usable. Personally, I think what kmail is doing is the worst possible. Kmail is autodetecting the directioness of the each paragraph based on the first character of that paragraph. This is not KMail's doing but the way Qt does text editing. the reason this was done was lack of experience with the way Windows does BiDi editing and too much reading of the infamous Unicode TR#9. There are two problems with this, both pretty grave. A. There is no way to override this, in case I'm not happy. Qt 3.2 fixes this problem - you can change the inherent directionality of a text buffer (currently with CTRL-SHIFT a-la windows. don't know if this is configurable). everything that runs on top of Qt 3.2 will get this behavior. B. Kmail keeps this information to itself. As it should. as long as you do text only messaging, the directionality of text is implicit (and for lack of better standards should be detected using the rules set in above mentioned document), and there is no way for KMail to pass that information along to the recipient. as KMail currently does only text messaging I don't consider this a problem. The recipient's MUA should detect that the text is hebrew and render it accordingly. I have never had problems sending hebrew email from KMail to other clients - if the client supports hebrew properly then it will display it from right to left. -- Oded ::.. Act as if it were impossible to fail. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mail and Hebrew]
As you managed to misquote everything I wrote, I will simply start from scratch: Kmail is a text only MUA. it can read HTML mail but it can only send plain text. this is fine for me : I don't need to send HTML, but YMMV. so in the next paragraph I'm not talking about HTML at all, and anything HTML related is irrelevant, including Mozilla's insistance to send BiDi text as HTML. text/plain messages cannot contain embeded directionality indication and there is currently no agreed standard on how to indicate directionality in RFC822 text/plain messages. nobody is even trying - its considered completly redundant. But people do send BiDi text using text/plain messages - how shall we render them ? I say each MUA to its own. if your MUA doesn't render BiDi text the way you want, fix it or switch - I'm happy with mine. Your previous message seems to imply that all email messages that contain hebrew must be sent using HTML, an opinion which I completly disagree with. I have never had problems sending hebrew email from KMail to other clients - if the client supports hebrew properly then it will display it from right to left. I believe that's because people are so used to getting incorrectly sent hebrew messages. I know that at least Outlook Express, Outlook and several web mail software products render kmail generated hebrew email properly. -- Oded ::.. Top 25 Explanations by Programmers why their programs doesn't work: 9.There is something wrong in your test data. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Mail and Hebrew
23 2003, 09:55,Kfir Lavi: P.S. I see you use actcom, their mail server supports IMAP. Gil yes, but i really don't want to put my mails in their server. Or i don't understand something? Why won't you ? its much safer then putting it anywhere else, you can filter mail and distribute to folders on the server, and a good email client will make you feel like the email is still stored locally. -- Oded ::.. It's not *you* that is the problem, it's all the other people on the net. -- Peter da Silva To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: BH (Black Hole) decompression tool
23 2003, 13:55,Iftach Hyams: Does anyone know of such a tool ? For linux ? Not as far as I know. BH is a really obscure compression format and I know about 2 programs in the world (total) that do support it. I had some success runing ultimate zip with WineX, though I never used it for BH stuff. -- Oded ::.. Famous Last Words 043-Stormtroopers can't hit a Wampa at this dist... To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: postfix configuration problem
20 2003, 11:19,Assaf Flatto: To Answer one's post is a bit embarrassing but it seems I have no choice Please enlighten us ? BTW - I don't use postalias. use newaliases, and postfix will use the alias_database setting to locate its alias files -- Oded ::.. learning curve, n.: An astonishing new theory, discovered by management consultants in the 1970's, asserting that the more you do something the quicker you can do it. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: xterm and hebrew
18 2003, 15:15,Arie Folger: You can use mlterm, xiterm (xterm with Sun's i18n code), konsole or gnome-terminal if you want bidi support. Konsole has bidi support? that's new to me. at least in 3.2 -- Oded ::.. The biggest lies: 11. I never inhaled. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: kmail configuration question
Saturday 15 November 2003 21:26, : Since I am working on a loptop with only 14 screen its much more efficient to go over the headers list and only open the messages I actually want to read (its also more secure this way and faster for imap connections). For that you can install a small utility called KShowMail There is also kbiff which is part of the kdenetwork package. its very simple and just shows you the number of emails in each configured mail folder and allows you to invoke your mailer. -- Oded ::.. Hlade's Law: If you have a difficult task, give it to a lazy person - they will find an easier way to do it. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: xterm and hebrew
16 2003, 12:13,Tzafrir Cohen: You can use mlterm, xiterm (xterm with Sun's i18n code), konsole or gnome-terminal if you want bidi support. mlterm has a useful feature of being able to disable the bidi support. Also Konsole, and it has/will have gui configuration for it in 3.2. -- Oded ::.. The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new discoveries, is not Eureka! but hm... that's funny... -- Isaac Asimov To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] OSS lint-type static checker?
16 2003, 15:42,[EMAIL PROTECTED]: Anyone can recommend or warn against usage of a (preferably Open Source, otherwise customizable) lint-like tool, for static checking of C++ and/or C# code? -- Oded ::.. Shai-hulud is a good garbage collector [..] -- F. Herbert (Children of Dune) To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] OSS lint-type static checker?
16 2003, 15:42,[EMAIL PROTECTED]: So take this response and one negative-ack. I'd be glad to hear otherwise. Anyone can recommend or warn against usage of a (preferably Open Source, otherwise customizable) lint-like tool, for static checking of C++ and/or C# code? Me and a friend have looked such a thing up and down the net for quite a while but so far haven't found anything. The only thing we found that gives such a funcionality is PC-Lint for windows, which is proprietary (and saved my previous workplace its money's worth tenfold in amount of work time). There is something called FlexeLint which supposed to be a PC-Lint port which is distributed in source form (obfuscated, or so they say) and compilable on most platforms. Linux is specifically mentioned. BTW - what about dynamic checking, i.e. valgrind ? P.S. Sorry for the double post -- Oded ::.. Shai-hulud is a good garbage collector [..] -- F. Herbert (Children of Dune) To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: MDK 9.2
16 2003, 18:45,Shlomo Solomon: Has anyone on the list installed/upgraded to MDK 9.2? If so, any comments, problems, suggestions? I've put it on my laptop. works fine. LVM support in DiskDrake (had it on 9.1, but it had some problems. now it works). good power managment, ACPI finally working. KDE 3.1.3 (not 3.1.4), OpenOffice 1.1, GNOME 2.4, I think but I'm not sure - not using it. Mandrake tools have some bugs but nothing major. not a big improvment over 9.1, but it has newer software and thats what counts. If you're going to install it on your workstation, go ahead. if youre planning on a server - get 9.1. -- Oded ::.. When I reflect upon the number of disagreeable people who I know who have gone to a better world, I am moved to lead a different life. -- Mark Twain, Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Recommended MS-Outlook replacement scheduling software under Linux?
11 2003, 06:36,Omer Zak: I think that the subject has already been discussed, but things change all the time so I am raising this question again. Given that MS-Outlook interoperability is not needed but its features are needed: For E-mail, Mozilla can be used. I routinely use version 1.4 and am happy with it. I even configured it to launch AbiWord rather than OpenOffice when it is necessary to view MS-Word *.doc documents (man plugger, /etc/pluggerrc). However, what about the scheduling and calendar features of MS-Outlook? IIRC Thunderbird (and I think Mozilla mail also) have some scheduling capabilities, at least to the point of showing you a calendar and updating it from a web site. -- Oded ::.. I am not sure what this is, but an `F' would only dignify it. -- English Professor To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Xen and the art of open source licenses (Was: EULA on free software)
11 2003, 09:49,Muli Ben-Yehuda: On Tue, Nov 11, 2003 at 09:42:45AM +0200, Yedidyah Bar-David wrote: If you only want Linux on Linux, there is Xen (STFW). It doesn't run regular kernels - they have a port of Linux to it, and there is an ongoing port of WinXP to it. Xen[1] is interesing because of their claim of only a few percent of performance loss in the guest machine. On the other hand, having to run a modified kernel[2] is a big turnoff for me. And have I mentioned that the project is partially sponsored by MS research? ;-) I find it weird that Microsoft research (I assume an organizational unit of Microsoft Corporation, also known in some circles as the great evil) is sponsoring a GPLed project, given the corporation's anti-GPL attitude. Having (probable some) financial influence on the project, I think they might have tried to force them to use a BSD style license which Microsoft loves so much (it allows them to copy code directly into their proprietary products). -- Oded ::.. Famous Last Words 020-Hey, this chest just bit me! To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: EULA on free software?
11 2003, 09:25,Shachar Shemesh: Any news on free alternatives to VMWare? Boches is so slow it hurts, and plex86 never left the ground, as far as I know. plex86 has been discontinued and currently has been re-engineered to run only linux by supplying a fixed set of emulated PC hardware devices for which kernel support should be written. they have a somewhat running version (with the required kernel patches) but setting it up is difficult and at the end you have a headless box - there is currently no infrastracture for sharing the host OS head gear (keyboard, mouse and screen). -- Oded ::.. Whenever people agree with me I always feel I must be wrong. -- Oscar Wilde To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Recommended MS-Outlook replacement scheduling software under Linux?
11 2003, 15:58,Alon Weinstein:
However, what about the scheduling and calendar features of
MS-Outlook?
IIRC Thunderbird (and I think Mozilla mail also) have some scheduling
capabilities, at least to the point of showing you a calendar and
updating it
from a web site.
Thunderbird can do scheduling? Are you sure about this? Is this possible
using some extension? If so -- care to specify how?
Sorry - my mistake. its a component (I think it can't be justifiablty called
an extension) called Mozilla Calendar which you need to install. it has
versions for the standard mozilla as well as for thunderbird (which is what I
tested, hence my incorrect association).
Get it here: http://www.mozilla.org/projects/calendar
--
Oded
::..
Reasons to Run Away 12-When the DM mentions words such as: Tarasque,
Elminister, Lord Soth, James T. Kirk, Holy Handgrenade, Kaz the Minotaur,
Huma, and/or The Predator in a game session.
{.n+zwfj)mXze?{^??{.n+?^,j???i???rzfXze?{
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 08:25, Tal, Shachar wrote: I believe w3c.org has an HTML/XHTML/strict etc. validator online, so this can be verified online by users How about starting, through Hamakor, some kind of a rating / certification system for Israeli Web sites to check if they are GNU/Linux / Open Source friendly. I mean, can be viewed with GNU/Linux tools (like Konqueror, Mozilla etc.) without any special changes. This is not exactly the same thing. one major problem with W3 validator (and the people who keep refering to it as a compatibility testing tool ;-) is that it has a very high Signal/Noise ratio. It complains about a lot of stuff that browsers today take for granted and make no fuss about. OTOH, FOSS browsers are not all that superior when it comes down to standard support. oh, they do try - but at the end of the day you'd find a lot of uses of perfectly leagal *TML that break on them, and also a lot of pages that will completly fail any validator but still work reasonably well. Funny thing is - I'm having the same discussion right now on KDE bugzilla about this :-) I think Amichai's idea is very good and I think setting up such a resource would be a great service to the community at large, but I don't think it can be automated using W3 validator. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 10:22, Oron Peled wrote: nitpicking sniped Yes, I agree with all of what you said up until now. standards are important, fix the browsers, bla bla. I was just stating the facts. ... and also a lot of pages that will completly fail any validator but still work reasonably well. Reasonably well in what sense? I can read them OK on Sundays if the moon is full and my Konqi version is Y? No - you know what I mean so stop flaming. take for example the much talked about Bank Hapoalim web site. it works and is usable with gecko based browsers, but its not pretty and some texts are shown reverse. that's what I mean when I say reasonably well. I could go further and state that there are pages that FOSS browsers render exactly as the author intendeded, while at the same time if you call Validator on them you'd get screens full of errors. more nitpicking sniped The validator, only the validator, nothing but the validator! yea, yea, of course. and still you can't reasonably expect that all web sites in the entire world will be made to be 100% validator friendly. I'd still expeect that I would be able to use my favorite web browser to view them. My point (which you managed to completly miss and distort), is that while a list of sites that do not conform to W3 validator would be nice (and would probably encompass 99.9% of Israeli web sites), a list of web sites that aren't usable on FOSS web browsers, as Amichai suggested, would be much more useful (and smaller). -- Oded ::.. I'm all for computer dating, but I wouldn't want one to marry my sister. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 12:12, Shachar Shemesh wrote: yea, yea, of course. and still you can't reasonably expect that all web sites in the entire world will be made to be 100% validator friendly. It's easier to conform to one browser (the validator) than to each and every browser out there. Big mistake - the validator is not a browser. its a very simple syntax parser with no rendering capabilities. While the validator lives in its own make-pretend world where everything is either standard compliant or not, we live in the real world where there are many shades of gray. I'd still expeect that I would be able to use my favorite web browser to view them. That seems less reasonable to expect from every web site in the world. I beg to differ. in case it wasn't obvious, I didn't mean every buffer of text that can be referenced by a URL and might or might not be parsable as some sort of presentation language, but instead every web site that someone wrote and attempts to be displayable by at least one version of a software component that falls under the category 'web browser'. My point ... a list of web sites that aren't usable on FOSS web browsers, as Amichai suggested, would be much more useful (and smaller). But less justifiable, and therefor less likely to be reduced. reduced ? I think that this cause is highly justifiable and - as you noted before - since the validator can be called up by users or automaticly by scripts, this kind of list is more difficult to create as its a repostiory of human experience and hence its more important to create such a thing. -- Oded ::.. Economists can certainly disappoint you. One said that the economy would turn up by the last quarter. Well, I'm down to mine and it hasn't. -- Robert Orben = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 12:24, Oron Peled wrote: So, yes for FOSS compliant list if it includes a the correct guidline for compliance: Validate your site against the validator, and you'll save time validating against multitude of browsers/versions I'll make sure to include this guideline :-) -- Oded ::.. VAXORCIST: Everything looks okay to me. SYSMGR: Maybe it's hibernating. VAXORCIST: Unlikely. It's probably trying to lure us into a false sense of security. SYSMGR: Sounds like VMS alright. (VAXORCIST gives him a dirty look) -- from The Vaxorcist , (C) 1991 by Christopher Russell = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Re: Please recommend linux sites
On Sun, 12 Oct 2003 15:13:16 +0200 (IST), Alon Altman One more spot for Debian: It's support would probably never cease. Probably because it never existed anyway. Commercial 3rd party support and hobbist support always existed for Debian as well as for RedHat (9 and older) and will exist for a long time to come. its the RedHat commercial support we are worying about here - IMHO for no good reason: I don't suspect anyone having Linux installed for the first time in an insta-party would ever bother calling RedHat for support. -- Oded ::.. One measure of leadership is the caliber of people who choose to follow you. -- Dennis A. Peer = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Re: Please recommend linux sites
On Monday 10 November 2003 12:16, Shachar Shemesh wrote: I have personally installed Debian for several newbies. There is nothing, I repeat, nothing wrong with Debian for newbies. The only problem with Debian is the initial HW configuration process. As this takes place during the installation party, that really should not be an issue. Contrary to common belief, users (not power-users) are required to administer their computers. Installing new hardware (graphical card, hard-drive or even a new mouse), removing old software and installing new, creating more users, changing ISP - these things users expect to do for themselves (except maybe the new graphical card thing). While Debian supplies tools for all of these, and while mostly techincally superior, in terms of user-friendliness these are usually inferior to tools provided by other distributions. Q.E.D -- Oded ::.. Though I'll admit readability suffers slightly... -- Larry Wall = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 13:14, Ely Levy wrote: and personaly I very much disagree with khtml way of imitating ie behavor instead of not displaying webpage which is not by the standart I of course completly disagree. by definition a browser should always make a best effort in trying to display a web page, no matter how broken it is. As a result of this philosophy, KHTML does attempt to mimic IE behavior (the de-facto standard most web-sites adhere to) as long as it does not compromise W3 standard compliance. the object here is to give the best usability to most users and not only to evangelists. When you get down to it, there are some IE extensions that are a better interface then W3's. document.all comes to mind, but also attachEvent instead of addEventListener (the interface is better). it would be a good idea to support such (usable) extensions even though they are not defined by W3. -- Oded ::.. If they wrote error messages in Haiku ? Out of memory. We wish to hold the whole sky, But we never will. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GNU/Linux Compatible Initiative
On Monday 10 November 2003 13:15, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Isn't there a black-list at Mozilla.org.il ? i mean: http://www.mozilla.org.il/evangel.shtml Yes, and its a very good list, unfortunatly it only checks for Mozilla compliance. I would really like a list that also checks for other non-gecko based browsers, for example - konqueror Opera. Speaking of W3 validator - click the W3C valid HTML icon in this page and see what happens. it only underlines my point that its not feasable to have all web pages (even at a single site) to be at any given time 100% valid. -- Oded ::.. We make up horrors to help us cope with the real ones. -- Stephen King = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Haifux] Re: Please recommend linux sites
On Monday 10 November 2003 18:03, Shachar Shemesh wrote: While Debian supplies tools for all of these, and while mostly techincally superior, in terms of user-friendliness these are usually inferior to tools provided by other distributions. Can you please qualify your last statement? I don't see where your claims regarding Debian come from While not an avid Debian user I've played with it several times and compared to other more desktop and newbie oriented distros (Mandrake comes to mind) its hardware support tools are a joke. try Harddrake if you need the counter point. Besides, you stated yourself that the hardware configuration it problematic in installation. it didn't became great afterwards - the missing tools are still missing. As for software, apt is a very good software managment solution but very far from being friendly to noobs. synaptic and other frontends do a good job once you have everything configured, but managing sources is still a pain. Except for the replacing graphical card, which I am yet to see a newbie do by themselves While not common, I have seen wierder things happen :-) a friend of mine which is a sensible person but a far cry from being a computer freak has saved her music collection from her USB harddrive that was trashed by windows using a linux live cd, and it was the first time she ever booted linux. -- Oded ::.. X windows: Don't try it 'til you've knocked it. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GPL (was GUI language for beginners)
Oron Peled wrote: Its yet to stand up in court though. Merely linking with a library does not make your software derived work of that company! How can that be? Let's take an example. Suppose Wine is distributed under the GPL (It's LGPL, but for the sake of discussion). According to your logic, any program that is built to link against Wine is a derivative work of Wine, and therefor must be under the GPL. This is patently absured. Most of the programs that link with Wine never heard of Wine in their entire life. They were built to link with Win32 API, expecting Microsoft's version of it. How can a software that never knew about my program be considered derivative work of it? As I've said before, I think this is all about intent: did the software developer intended to include the GPLed code as an important part of the functionality of the software ? if so then its a derivative work. else its not. IANAL but the from the little I know about how courts work, I believe this is the direction a court ruling - if ever one would be needed - will take. According to this distinction, using wine to run Win32 programs does not make these programs derivative works of wine, while using Qt to develop GUI applications does. OTOH, suppose you had a third party library for GUI development that can use Qt as the underlying toolkit (a-la wxWindows), but can also use other toolkits as well. if you'd build your software using this library, it would not make it a derivative work of Qt. of course, in that case, if said library was not GPLed, then its authors might be considered infringing on the GPL license of Qt. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: RE: VMWare+DGA
On Sunday 02 November 2003 09:05, Shai Bentin wrote: I can't work with vmware in full screen mode. It complains its missing DGA extensions on my XServer. Is this a setup issue on my X? do I have to compile a new XServer with DGA extensions? What is DGA anyway? Any ideas? Direct Graphics Access, it let an X request full screen direct access to the frame buffer. It's usually disabled because when it's supported some trick that XFree86 can do in become difficult. To turn it on uncomment the # Option omit xfree86-dga line from XFree86 config I did not have that line in my config file. However I added it in a subsection under module section and also I've added another line load dga. These did nothing! The first message I get from vmware actually complains that the dga module was not found: No DGA mode found compatible with 1024x768, depth 24, bpp 32 XFree86 direct graphics (DGA extension) power on failed. I think this is a problem with your XFree86 settings - IIRC, for DGA mode the color depth and the bits-per-pixel (bpp) must be the same. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GPL (was GUI language for beginners)
I certainly agree with you that in this case, the onus of making the code open does not lie with its developers (who have no knowledge of and have never used WINE), but rather with the user who did use WINE, which is a thorny mess I have no idea how to solve ;-) No, this is absured. The user has neither means nor obligation. If the developer, who has the sources, cannot be said to have created derived work, why should a user, who has no means of changing the software at all, be held liable for anything? There is really no point in keeping the GPL license out of it, because the GPL does not mandate only developers - like all copyright licenses, it also mandate the user. Users are not allowed to just copy and use any software given to them - unless a license permits this, they are forbidden from doing so by the copyright laws set forth by their local legal system. usually that means you can't use a software unless you are allowed to do so by the copyright owner of the software. as such - its also up to the user to hold by the terms set in the GPL if said user would like to continue using software distributed under such terms. While taking it a bit to the extreme (and I don't think anybody would try to enforce it) with our hypothetic Winw, the user who tries to run Win32 application might be considered infringing on the Winw GPL license just by using it. I guess this is one of the reasons the real Wine uses LGPL. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GPL (was GUI language for beginners)
Oded Arbel wrote: While taking it a bit to the extreme (and I don't think anybody would try to enforce it) with our hypothetic Winw, the user who tries to run Win32 application might be considered infringing on the Winw GPL license just by using it. I guess this is one of the reasons the real Wine uses LGPL. Noone can enforce anything, even if they tried, anything against a user. There is no copying taking place. Of course there is ! Using the software implies copying - you copy it into your harddisk and then you copy it into your computer's dynamic memory where it can be run. this is also the reason why you have to sign an EULA when you install MSOffice. It may be a technicality, but an important one. The fact that you got your hands on a packaged software product does not mean you can use it. if that were the case, then If I copy a piece of prorietary software and publish it freely on the web, then every user who can download it can freely run it on his/hers computer w/o penalty. this is clearly not the case as Warez are illegal in most countries. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GPL (was GUI language for beginners)
The fact that you got your hands on a packaged software product does not mean you can use it. Sure it does. That's what the First sale doctrine means. Once I sold you a piece of software, I cannot tell you what to do, and what not to do, with it. if that were the case, then If I copy a piece of prorietary software and publish it freely on the web, then every user who can download it can freely run it on his/hers computer w/o penalty. No, because that's specifically prohibited by the copyright law. You are not allowed to distribute copies of the original without the copyright holder's permission (as opposed to transferring your copy, over which the copyright holder has no say). From the POV of the user, I fail to see the distinction - of course the distributer is violating tons of rules, but according to your claim the user is still allowed to download the software and run it on her computer. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Red Hat Enterprise Linux
... and Linux hobbyists will just disappear. I really hope not, I don't think I myself am going to disappear anytime soon :-) As for people who want to install RedHat at home or something, there is the Fedora Project (http://fedora.redhat.com) and you can also buy Pink Tie Linux from CheapBytes (http://cart.cheapbytes.com/cgi-bin/cart/0070010909.html). I've installed Pink Tie and except for the horrendous pink color where ever there was red previously you wouldn't know the difference. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GUI language for beginners
On Sun, 2 Nov 2003, Diego Iastrubni wrote: Here is my opinion: any one of this 3 sounds cool. I put here only the downsides of each approach. gtk: * not object oriented (looks un-natural to build gui's in no oop language) I beg your pardon? Gtk+ is Object-Oriented. And you can do OOP in C well enough. Most people who've ever used an OO (oriented) languages such as C++/Java/Python/Perl (strike what's not PC) would disagree with you here. passing a structure on every call to a procedure with a guessable prefix is not what I would consider object-oriented. it may be about objects but its not oriented towards anything. That being said, GTK+ is very usable, powerful and flexiable. its just not very easy to work with (especially in an real OO capable language) compared to the alternatives. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GUI language for beginners
On Sun, Nov 02, 2003 at 07:07:05PM -0500, Behdad Esfahbod wrote: Was waiting for someone else to mention that, but no one did. Perhaps PyGTK (Python + GTK bindings) is the best to go these days. There are thousands of small and large examples out there to copy from ;-). Ruby + GTK seems good too, but Ruby is not a language I bother myself learning, when I can learn Python (and did) instead. BTW, something that you shell scripters may like, in GNOME 2.4, have a look at 'zenity'. It displays GTK+ dialogs from command line. I did not really look at zenity, but did look at other similar stuff, and the best I found is called kaptain. Less than a real language, no fancy designer, but much stronger than e.g. gdialog. There's also KDialog which I've used a couple of time. nothing close to a real GUI tool, but if all you need is to pop a dialog box here and there then its a good choice (assuming you live peacefully with KDE that is). Another option for KDE people is Kommander which is used to design a GUI (has fancy designer) around a command line utility. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GUI language for beginners
Well it's a bit weird, for once I remember it was fully GPLed few month ago now they seem to change it so although there is GPLed version of QT for windows only academic people can download it but since it's fully GPLed I don't see how they how they can stop anyone who isn't academic from copying it and using it even if you can't download it from their site. qt: * not free in win32 Actually it is now. Free as in speech? I don't think so. Care to enlighten us? The KDE on Cygwin project has a GPLed version of QT3 ported to Win32 (I think its not a cygwin port but a native one, but I'm not sure) = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: GPL Licensing Question
On Sunday 26 October 2003 22:23, Eran Tromer wrote: I must insist, however, that the definition of derivative work, though indeed external to the GPL, is far from trivial in our case. Moreover, the GPL further muddies the water in its Section 2 paragraph 5 (not paragraph 4 as I said earlier; that was an off-by-one): --- These requirements apply to the modified work as a whole. If identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program, and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those sections when you distribute them as separate works. But when you distribute the same sections as part of a whole which is a work based on the Program, the distribution of the whole must be on the terms of this License, whose permissions for other licensees extend to the entire whole, and thus to each and every part regardless of who wrote it. --- Don't bite me, just my 2 bits common sense: The way I always read this paragraph (and everything else about the GPL) is summarized by this - your work must be GPLed if you distribute your work as a single whole and it contains a GPLed component (don't bother with the linking argument - its irrelevant). one way to go around that is to distribute the non-GPLed parts as a single standalone whole and the GPLed parts as optional additions (run-time additions is best, but compile time could also work if its safe to assume that the user is expected to compile the product anyway). see two paragraphs below the one qouted - mere aggregation. This only works if your work functions as a standalone and is usable to whatever reasonable purpose w/o the GPLed components. The last one is a bit hazy and I copied it from someone (don't remmeber who) but IMO is what will count at the end of the day (in court) - if you sell a huge financial software that can only be used to play mine-sweeper w/o the GPLed componenets, then its a no-go. more so, if your software does everything by itself but it needs the GPLed components to save the work done, the I'd say that you still need to GPL it as it is not usable w/o the GPLed components. All that said and done, I'd iterate something that was said at the start of the discussion but I think its too important to be left there - all this applys to the GPL alone - other licenses (for example - the LGPL) have completly different regulations and considerations. you must make sure that you are talking about the GPL, as often I found that people assume a certain piece of software is covered by the GPL w/o actually bothering to check. you may find out that it is instead covered by the BSD or some other more leniant licesnsing terms. -- Oded ::.. Generally, there are very few technical problems. There are, however, an abundance of political, social, and economic problems. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: WAP
On Wednesday 22 October 2003 00:57, Jacob Broido wrote: Try www.slashdot.org I recently upgraded my cell phone to a Motorola C350. Cute phone, color, intergraded GPRS WAP browser. Any Linux WAP websites any of you can recommend ? News, games, etc. Is there a WAP version for the IGLU site? slashdot.org doesn't work on me ME45 directly. I use google's wap proxy to read slashdot - just type www.google.com to go to google's web search. in there you can type slashdot.org (or any other real website address) to get to the web site of your choice through google's HTML-to-WAP translator. A direct URL to slashdot would look like this: http://wmlproxy.google.com/wmltrans/u=slashdot.org In the same manner you can go to any other web site, for example: http://wmlproxy.google.com/wmltrans/u=linux.org.il Google's wml proxy allow you to access sites that do not support WAP directly, but as all automated translation software - usability will vary. -- Oded ::.. What's another word for Thesaurus? -- Steven Wright = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
distro with 2.6 kernel ?
Speaking of cutting edge distros - I'm looking for a distro that comes out of the box with a 2.6-testX kernel - anyone know of such a thing ? Thx -- Oded ::.. The size of an avalanche is unrelated to the grain of sand that triggers it. The same tiny grain of sand may unleash a tiny avalanche or the largest avalanche of the century. Big and little events can be triggered by the same kind of tiny cause. Poised systems need no massive mover to move massively. -- At Home in the Universe / Stuart Kauffman (on self-organized criticality) = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: distro with 2.6 kernel ?
On Monday 20 October 2003 16:17, Aviram Jenik wrote: On Monday 20 October 2003 15:06, Oded Arbel wrote: Speaking of cutting edge distros - I'm looking for a distro that comes out of the box with a 2.6-testX kernel - anyone know of such a thing ? What's wrong with: make menuconfig make make install make modules_install Easier than installing a new distro IMO :-) Thing is - I want to install a new distro. I have a computer with no linux and for various reasons I want to install on it a distro with 2.6 - where the installer itself uses 2.6. If I understand there is currently no such beast, right ? -- Oded ::.. The world is a simple place, filled with complicated things. To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bloging software recomendation, please ?
Hi list. I want to install a blogging software on my website, can anyone please recommend on something you use ? requirements: - works on my Apache web server (PHP, Perl and Python are fine, other stuff I can try but only if its really really good) - preferably supports client side software that can run on linux (anyone can recomment on a BloggerAPI software for the linux desktop ?) - Must support hebrew in full RTL mode. TIA -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Bloging software recomendation, please ?
On Sunday 19 October 2003 01:53, Lior Kaplan wrote: Take a look at this: http://bl0g.sourceforge.net Seen it already. I like the name and appreciate the effort put into it, but it renders very poorly on Konqeuror, doesn't have API aupport and I don't like the design that much. Thanks. I want to install a blogging software on my website, can anyone please recommend on something you use ? requirements: - works on my Apache web server (PHP, Perl and Python are fine, other stuff I can try but only if its really really good) - preferably supports client side software that can run on linux (anyone can recomment on a BloggerAPI software for the linux desktop ?) - Must support hebrew in full RTL mode. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: A story from ynet has been sent to you
On Tuesday 14 October 2003 17:17, Shaul Karl wrote: For example, would it purchase MS Word and thus motivate MS to furthere invest in RTL languges support or would it use a new Word processor for free but pays for the creation of a new Linux market? This is hardly the issue. its not like somebody ever suggested the Israeli government to replace its windows PC with linux boxen. thinking along those lines is naive. the question is what windows based software to buy, and how compatible will it be with free software that the public will use. The only valid point here (except for the general concept which is also very valid) is that maybe by buying MS products the government supports an agresive monopol which counters accepted goals of compatability and striving for an open market with many competitors, but this is debatable. -- Oded ::.. Chism's Law of Completion: The amount of time required to complete a government project is precisely equal to the length of time already spent on it. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: A story from ynet has been sent to you
On Monday 13 October 2003 18:09, Amichai Rotman wrote:
This ynet story has been sent to you by Amichai Rotmanbrbrbrbr
Article title: font CLASS='text12'
/fontbr
br
a href= '
http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/1,7340,2788777,00.html '
target=_blank http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/1,7340,2788777,00.html
/abr
Click the link above to go to the article.brbr
(If you see no link above, then copy the address abovebr
into your browser`s address box and press enter)
First thing I like to protest agains the deplorable behavior of sending HTML
mail to the list, specificly from automatic email this to friends-forms
(which introduced other interesting aspects of email harvesting which I won't
go into). This is both rude on the general principal of it, and also as some
people on the list do fitler out HTML mail (for good cause), so they won't be
able to read this email.
And I'm not even going into hebrew on Linux-IL or URLs w/o explenations
issues, which are also valid.
And now for the real issue:
I don't care. really, I couldn't care less about what office suit the
government purchases. specificly as this is such a lowly percentage of the
total goverment expenditure on technology, but also because I think that
Microsoft deserve to be able to do buisness and the government is a valid
customer.
As long as all out going communications between the government and the public
is based on open standards and can be accessed using free software - all of
this can be achieved w/ MS software tools - I don't realy care who is the
supplier of software tools for the government. all this, assuming of course
that the government purchases the best software for the least money, but this
is really OT for Linux-IL.
--
Oded
::..
If it weren't for physics and law enforcement, I'd be unstoppable
{.n+zwfj)mXze?{^??{.n+?^,j???i???rzfXze?{
Re: Error code from a shell pipeline.
On Sunday 12 October 2003 18:38, Shlomi Fish wrote: (make | echo) || echo hello make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found. Stop. I want that if one of the (first) components of the pipeline exits with an error code, I'll know about it somehow. How? an erronouse exit code (actually, just not true) does not break the pipe. how about (make || echo oops 2 ) | cat-or-something -- Oded ::.. 'I have been told that Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology was required reading at the Xerox PARC lab where OOP was invented, but this may be merely an urban legend.' -- Bryce Wilcox = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OpenVPN, from the 1st of October supports Win32
On Thursday 09 October 2003 09:45, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oded Arbel wrote: I'm using OpenVPN to create a tunnel from my workstation to my home computer so I can get in the office network from home (because I couldn't get the RH only linux SecureRemote client to work, and that's what my company uses), and Hmm, that's exactly the situation I have to face. My workplace uses Checkpoint's VPN, I haven't even bothered to try their SecureClient on my Debian Sid box. We do, however, have an open ssh port (I have yet to try to use it, with tunnelling and stuff). Do you know how would ssh compare in convenience to OpenVPN? I expect I'd mostly need to get to the office' Exchange 5.5 server through this VPN. If I had an SSH port open I wouldn't need openvpn :-) just open an SSH tunnel on demand and you're set. up side - you don't need to have a continuisly running tunnel. down side - it's TCP, so if you have connectivity issues it might be a problem. Comapared to an SSH tunnel, openvpn is tons more complicated to setup - you need to get or make a CA, generate keys (you really don't want to use shared secrets), setup tun/tap if you don't have it, run the server on the home system and making sure it stays up, running the client on the workstation and making sure it never loses connectivity. but it beats messing around with non-portable binaries compiled for an old distribution which was never that good when it was new. Another thing - if you want to use more then one service (or even do general IP routing over the tunnel), then SSH seems like less of a good idea - you need to setup an IP tunnel (using ppp probably) and then its starting to close the complexity gap with openvpn (always had trouble getting those pesly pppds to stay up). plus, I don't think I like the overhead of SSH for routing general IP traffic. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OpenVPN, from the 1st of October supports Win32
On Thursday 09 October 2003 15:26, Tal, Shachar wrote: -Original Message- From: Eli Marmor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] It's called Outlook Web Access (although it's a part of Exchange; It is just a web-emulation of Outlook). As far as I remember, it supports SSL. There have been always features of Outlook that were not supported by Outlook Web Access, but if I recall correctly, Microsoft claims that the Outlook Web Access of Exchange 2003 finally emulates Outlook perfectly. Which brings us to the important question: will it also (by default, with no easy way to turn it off) auto-run viral-attachments,load 1x1-authenticating-gifs, perform fill-in-your-favorite-nightmare, on other OSes as well? It'll have a hard time running win32 viral executable on Linux. can't really see it doing that. on a more serious note - its conservative on what it allows you to display in-line (some might say - paranoid), I even had trouble getting it to display embedded html images inline. In addition, they claim that contrary to past versions, this one runs under non Microsoft browsers, including thin clients such as smart phones and PDAs. I guess it means that there is no dependency on ActiveX etc. I believe that is not pure marketese. A couple of months I saw a (then latest) stable build of this product, and it was all ActiveX bells and VBScript whistles. They use UA detection. I've been using OWA on 5.5 on 2000 for a while now using Mozilla and konqueror (both handled like Netscape). OWA on 5.5 was broken but usable, on 2000 its a pretty damned good web mail interface - I haven't seen many (foss or otherwise) that can rival it. the backend sucks of course, but there you have it :-). -- Oded ::.. When the tide of life turns against you And the current upsets your boat Don't waste tears on what might have been Just lie on your back and float To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OpenVPN, from the 1st of October supports Win32
On Thursday 09 October 2003 16:15, Tal, Shachar wrote: Which brings us to the important question: will it also (by default, with no easy way to turn it off) auto-run viral-attachments,load 1x1-authenticating-gifs, perform fill-in-your-favorite-nightmare, on other OSes as well? It'll have a hard time running win32 viral executable on Linux. can't really see it doing that. on a more serious note - its conservative on what it allows you to display in-line (some might say - paranoid), I even had trouble getting it to display embedded html images inline. Actually, it can always wine them to some extent. That'll be a neat trick (for OWA) as I don't remember any back doors that allow web sites to remotely execute binaries on my platform using FOSS web browsers. you need to remember that just by not running it with IE (even on windows), anything you throw at it will lose 99.9% of its potency just because you use a decent browser. this is probably what Gates was aiming to stop when he took on Netscape in the browser wars - the capability of users to get better usability through freedom. don't know what happened to MS, maybe it's complacency. Or bring upon us Linux viruses, for those pesky Lindows users who use their computers as root 100% of the time. you can't help some people ;-) -- Oded ::.. The best way to accelerate a Windows NT server is at 9.8 m/(sec^2). -- Shaul Rosenzweig = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Open-source webcrawler required
On Thursday 09 October 2003 21:41, Oleg Kobets wrote: hmm, i am not shure about all the requirments, but maybe snarf ? it has a lot more functions then wget, for example resume download. for wget's honour- I object ! wget has resume download. -- Oded ::.. The biggest lies: 13. I never watch television except for PBS. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Web Browsing Behind ISA Server HOWTO
On Wednesday 08 October 2003 16:10, dittigas wrote: NTLM Auhtentication was added to Mozilla as of 1.4 on Windows only using SSPI. AFAIK there's *no* support on other platforms. There are several projects that do NTLM authentication on linux - search freshmeat.net for NTLM. there's even a perl module for that. apparently its not that hard, just stupid. I don't understand why Mozilla haven't implemented it natively for the benefit of all users. -- Oded ::.. At the source of every error which is blamed on the computer you will find at least two human errors, including the error of blaming it on the computer. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Web Browsing Behind ISA Server HOWTO
On Wednesday 08 October 2003 19:14, dittigas wrote: On Wed, 2003-10-08 at 16:44, Oded Arbel wrote: On Wednesday 08 October 2003 16:10, dittigas wrote: NTLM Auhtentication was added to Mozilla as of 1.4 on Windows only using SSPI. AFAIK there's *no* support on other platforms. There are several projects that do NTLM authentication on linux - search freshmeat.net for NTLM. there's even a perl module for that. apparently its not that hard, just stupid. Yep. I don't understand why Mozilla haven't implemented it natively for the benefit of all users. Would mozilla be able to work with any of them indirectly? I guess - at least two projects I saw are actually an NTLM proxy (talk about a proxy to a proxy *g* ), but integration is always a bitch. I personally would have taken the relevant piece of code from some C based project and junk it in a module for mozilla, and that's it. get the premission of the author to MPL it (which I'm sure won't be a problem) and you're set. Unfortunatly, while I mourn the loss of functionality on the existensial level, I don't have any intention of ever using NTLM (the only thing getting remotly close to NTLM that I might use is OWA which handles HTTP BASIC AUTH just fine), and I'm too busy doing my own stuff. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: OpenVPN, from the 1st of October supports Win32
On Wednesday 08 October 2003 21:23, Shachar Shemesh wrote: Anyhow long story short... http://openvpn.sourceforge.net/ and get the BETA (if you need Windows support). As it is SSL - will it support UDP? OpenVPN is UDP based. its uses SSL over UDP, and as such has the very nice feature that you can unplug your computer from the net, and as soon as you plug it back in it will have the VPN tunnel back online. downside - it can't tell its disconnected, so you have to ping it all the time. I'm using OpenVPN to create a tunnel from my workstation to my home computer so I can get in the office network from home (because I couldn't get the RH only linux SecureRemote client to work, and that's what my company uses), and its running fine for almost a year now. it survived non-consistant upgrades (upgrading on one side and not the other) and a lot of other troubles, and is currently my recommended way of doing VPN over public networks. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: FTP refused on a newly installed machine
On Friday 03 October 2003 19:23, Ori Idan wrote: On Friday 03 October 2003 17:23, Shaul Karl wrote: On Fri, Oct 03, 2003 at 03:30:32PM +0200, Ori Idan wrote: I have installed a RH7.3 machine. I enabled FTP in xinetd.d and restarted xinetd However I still can not connect with FTP I have checked with rpm -q that wu-ftpd is installed and it is installed What might be going wrong here? firewall? Permissions in general? Anything in the log? Have you tried to ftp localhost? It worked when I started the daemon manualy so the problem seems to be the xinetd and not the ftp daemon. I tried restarting the xinetd service but it did not help. Anyone has a clue? sounds like wu-ftpd is running as a standalone server and not through xinetd (its been a while sinse I last used wu, but I seem to remember it having this option) BTW - how about using a different ftp server ? I always found wu software to be a bit lacking on the configuration side. ProFTPd or pure-ftpd are much better choises IMO. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Upgrading Mozilla from 1.0.1 to 1.4 in RedHat 8.0
On Friday 03 October 2003 07:01, Omer Zak wrote: The versions I have in my Linux installation are: /lib/libpthread-0.10.so /lib/libc-2.2.93.so (according to rpm -qf, both files are from package glibc-2.2.93-5). My questions: 1. Does the above mean that I have to upgrade to package glibc-2.3.2-whatever? 2. If yes, does anyone have experience upgrading RedHat 8.0 installation like this? How risky would this be? As you are already using a 2.3 pre-release, I suspect a glibc upgrade won't be too traumatic. I personally upgrade glibc on my machine all the time and while not RH based distros, they do handle it fine. its not the glibc update nightmare of RH6. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Help, Help, I've ran out of entropy!
Hi list. I'm having a problem with a server, where apparently I don't have any entropy left in /dev/random : # sysctl -A | grep random kernel.random.entropy_avail = 0 and of course - every call to /dev/random blocks. the server in question is a headless box, so of course no entropy is generated by HID devices such as mouse and keyboard, but IIRC dev/random should also be filled by disc access (of which there is a lot) and maybe network (I remember a discussion on turning off entropy feeding from the NICs, but I don't remember if it was actually carried out). The kernel is 2.4.21 with grsecurity patches, and I was wandering if anyone has any idea what I can do now - can I somehow seed dev/random by hand ? All the file systems are reiserFS, which raises the following question - is it possible that reiserFS block I/O does not generate entropy ? -- Oded ::.. When you do not know what you are doing, do it neatly. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help, Help, I've ran out of entropy!
On Wednesday 01 October 2003 15:51, Yedidyah Bar-David wrote: Hi, Debian has a package called 'reseed' that seems to do just that (by getting random data from random.org, but you can probably make it use some other random data). I never tried it myself, though, and I reseeds seeds /dev/urandom, which doesn't help me. I tried to get it to seed / dev/random, but apparently it doesn't like getting input. can also suggest that you buy hardware for that, if it's an important server (e.g. i810 boards have it onboard). Additional hardware is currently not an option for me. -- Oded ::.. Saint: A dead sinner revised and edited. -- Ambrose Bierce = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Help, Help, I've ran out of entropy!
On Wednesday 01 October 2003 15:54, Muli Ben-Yehuda wrote: On Wed, Oct 01, 2003 at 03:31:44PM +0300, Oded Arbel wrote: I'm having a problem with a server, where apparently I don't have any entropy left in /dev/random : # sysctl -A | grep random kernel.random.entropy_avail = 0 Why not use /dev/urandom? that one never blocks. 1. its lower quality 2. Its not my software, and I don't feel like messing around with the source code right now. I'll do that if I'll have no choice, but seeing as /dev/ random is important to have, I though I'd try to deal with the source of the problem first. It's possile, yes. Looking at the code (2.4.23-pre5, but I doubt there were major changes in this area in the vanilla kernels), I'm not using vanilla - I prefer buttermilk myself, but I have grsecurity patches. AFAIK, grsecurity shouldn't turn off any entropy generation - it relies on good quality entropy pool to add more randomacity to stuff the kernel does. the relevant function is add_blkdev_randomness, which works at the block layer, not the file system layer, so it doesn't have much to do with reiserfs. Then, could you please offer a hypothesis as to why my dev/random is empty ? Quoting from drivers/char/random.c for ways for you to generate entropy: As I understand these need to be implemented in the kernel, at the device level. is it possible that some are turned off or something ? -- Oded ::.. Chicago law prohibits eating in a place that is on fire. = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
